The Press Box - Ep. 96: 'NFL Draft Podcast' With Chris Ryan and Matt Borcas

Episode Date: April 22, 2016

Mays and Mallory break down the big Eagles-Browns trade with resident Eagles fan Chris Ryan and resident Browns apologist Matt Borcas (22:00). Then they discuss the "draftnik nonsense" of "red flags" (39:00) and the "bluechip battle of the week" (47:00) featuring Reggie Ragland and Darron Lee, and wrap it up with a mailbag to examine Josh Norman's next move. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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To start using Seatgeek, Download the free Seatgeek app or go to Seatgeek.com. To the Ringer NFL Draft Podcast, my name is Robert Mays. I'm a writer at the Ringer. And joining me, again, I guess that's the way to say it, is Mallory Rubin. Mal, how are you? Hey, bud. I'm just dandy.

How are you? You know what? I'm pretty good. This week, the past two weeks, there's been no shortage of stuff to talk about. The league is giving us plenty of fodder, and I don't mind that whatsoever. The news cycle is in full churn. Teams are insane. Apparently these quarterbacks are like the second coming of, I don't know, I don't even want to say like Joe Montana and Peyton Manning. It's more like Jesus and Harry Potter. I don't even know what people think these quarterbacks are, but this is just baffling. Carson Wentz does have a weasley-esque feel to him. He sure does. So if we're going to go that way, some wizard-tinged commentary. That's probably the way to go.

Do you like that Harry Potter knowledge I just dropped? Are you proud of me? I'm so proud of you. I'm tempted to ask you which Weasley brother you think he is most similar to, but I know I got nothing for you. He's got a little bit of a little bit of Bill in him, maybe. I don't know, maybe a little Charlie. Is that Dom Maw Gleason?

Who plays Bill? Yeah, it is indeed. Great work. You're crushing it right now. Look at me. So proud of you. Harry Potter knowledge is everywhere right now. Before we get to the trade, before we get to all the craziness, one thing I just wanted to hit right off the top.

Earlier this week, a man named Bill Barnwell released his first podcast for ESPN. I know him. We are friends. We used to do a podcast together. And I just wanted to thank everyone that reached out. And with congrats to him and also lamenting the fact that that meant he and I were not doing a podcast together, that means a lot. Just know going forward that I want to echo what he said on his show, that whatever happens is, going to be different than stuff has happened in the past. We're both very excited for each other,

and we both hope that you listen to our respective shows and whatever iteration they exist. So thank you for being decent people, and I hope you continue to be. That's really all I want to say, Mal. Very well said, buddy. Barnwell is very dear to all of us, and we wish him nothing but the best. All right, well, let's get into no more sun mentality. Let's get into some actual craziness and some lack of logic and a bunch of weird shit that I can't really put my finger on quite yet. the Philadelphia Eagles, who already have two quarterbacks, decided to trade a bunch of draft picks to move up to the number two pick and presumably pick another quarterback.

So I was shopping for furniture when this happened, which was interesting. I was in an Ashley home store with my mother and just started screaming expletives and being very excited because this is insane and I love it. What was your first reaction when you heard this? We were recording after the Thrones and Eric Weinberger. Okay, awesome.

Eric Weinberger, the president of our company, came in onto the set and said, just want to let you guys know and then told us about the trade because, of course, Andy and Chris are Philadelphians and our huge Eagle fans. And Eric wanted to make sure that they found out right away. And the reactions were pretty priceless. I think it took a little while for it to fully dawn on Chris. We're actually going to get to hear his thoughts in a little while, get the fan perspective on both sides of the deal from Chris Ryan and Matt Borkas, our resident Eagles and Browns enthusiasts. But that was how I found out.

So I was thinking about dragons and sword play and magic and glory. And then I was thinking. You're always thinking about that stuff. So it's not really a huge change. Exactly. It was just another afternoon. That's exactly right. So, you know, this is essentially the conversation we had.

last week about the Rams trading up and the Titans trading down. It seems like a really smart deal for one side and a really questionable deal for the other side. Here's my first question for you. You were okay with the Rams decision because by going up to number one, it would ensure that they got their guy, right? No matter what, if I'm quoting you correctly here, your take was that if they loved one of those two quarterbacks enough, it was a defensible decision. So that same logic by definition cannot apply to what the Eagles have done here because they don't get to choose their guy. They have to essentially take the leftover quarterback. So because of that, do you feel positive about this deal, negative about this deal? Is there any way that you can defend it?

I can defend it if you want to believe what Howie Roseman said earlier this week. He said that we're very sure we're going to get the player we want. So if you are the Eagles and you love whence and you're sure the Rams are taking golf, then it's not that much of a difference than what the Rams are doing. They're getting the guy that they want. And if that's the case, I don't love it necessarily, mostly because this is an opportunity cost situation. I have to be born well now. When you have three quarterbacks on your roster and you're paying one of them $12.5 million like you're paying San Bradford this year, it disallows you from doing other things. Josh Norman gets his franchise tag rescinded yesterday.

I don't know if the Eagles would want Josh Norman, but the $12.5 million you're paying Sam Bradford and whatever you just paid Chase Daniel doesn't allow you to go after Josh Norman. It doesn't allow you to carry over your cap to next year. So if you didn't like any of these guys, I don't understand putting so much money toward them. Maybe they're thinking,

would have let Bradford walk out there this year, take his licks as part of this offense that is very devoid of weapons, and we'll bring Carson Wentz along slowly. That's fine. But I don't know. It doesn't make a ton of sense to me. But if you really are convinced that Wence is a high-quality starting quarterback for a long time

and you didn't think you had another way to get one, then it's similar to what the Rams are doing. I just, I don't know. It seems like a lot. But if you look at the actual numbers, if you expect the Eagles to be a borderline playoff team and expect the Browns to be one of the worst five teams in the league, both of which I feel are fair,

then it's not that lopsided in terms of value if you just look at the chart. So if you want to go by charts, then I think that it's kind of defensible. So I guess we should say, because we are fucking morons and haven't yet, the Eagles get the number two pick in 2016 and the fourth round pick in 2017. The Browns get the number eight pick this year, third round this year, fourth round this year, and then a first in 2017 and a second in 2018. Here's my question for you, the follow-up on the point about the chart being sort of even. What about when you factor in the Byron Maxwell-Kiko-Alonto trade that allowed the Eagles to move up from 13 to 8 in the first place?

Does that change the math? In terms of what? I mean, it certainly allows them to... How much ultimately went into moving up, right? You could sort of if you're determined to judge this harshly, when you step up, take it back a step further and you're looking at what they had to do to even get in position. to get to eight in the first place and then move from eight to two, didn't they really give up more than just what they are giving up in this one particular transaction? Yes, you could say that, but I also really don't mind them trading Byron Maxwell.

I think getting his contract off the books is probably a good thing in the end, no matter what it took. And the fact that they got to move up is almost a, it's a found, you know, there's found value to that. I think that their cornerback depth chart isn't that. horrendous. They probably could use one more player there. But outside of that, I don't mind what they did. So I don't even factor that in at all when I'm thinking about whether they should or should not have done this. Okay. How about a little game here? I'm going to read you a Howie

Roseman quote. And then I'm going to present to you my slight reworking. You know, I'm an editor. It's my job to kind of just fine-tune some language, see if I can improve it. Do you think that I have found the truth of his of his words here or not. His original quote, by making the initial trade with Miami earlier this offseason, and with this trade today with Cleveland, we feel that we have put ourselves in the best possible position to draft an impact player. We will now focus our energy on the next step. All right, here's my edit. You know, a little suggesting in Google Docs, little track changes in Microsoft Word got us here. By making the initial trade with Miami earlier this off season. And with this trade today with Cleveland, we feel that we have put ourselves in the best

possible position to ruin our football team. We will now focus our energy on hoping Chip Kelly fucks things up in San Francisco even more than we have here. Is that what he meant to say, you think? I don't think they really fucked up their football team with the first set of trades. Those were fine with me. They still remained fine to me, even the, and the DeMarco Murray one, too. I think he was just trying to write the wrongs of last offseason. Those are all good by me. I don't know. I, I, I don't know. They're not satisfied with what they had a quarterback. And that is another piece of the Chip Kelly era,

the fact that Chip Kelly wanted Sam Bradford to that degree. They clearly don't think he's the guy. And if you, like the Rams, don't think the guy's on your roster and you feel like you have to go get one and this is your only chance, then it's, I understand the argument. To me, the funnier Howie Roseman quote is from last year when he said in March that the history of teams trading up in the draft does not normally go well for the team trading up.

Amazing. He said that at the Sloan Analytics Conference, and strangely enough, he said that to me. So as I saw that quote parroted all day yesterday on ESPN or wherever. I was like, oh yeah, I remember that. He did say that. That's incredible. It's one of those things where circumstance, everything else, it's hard to say what is the in the vacuum best choice.

Circumstances change. So. his job security is maybe different. The way that, I mean, he is back being the GM of the team. It's just there are so many things you have to take into account. And at the end of the day, if you don't think San Bradford's the guy and you want to go get somebody and maybe have him sit for a year or two, then this is what they wanted. I think they want Carson Wentz and it looks like they're going to get him. What about your man, Chase Daniel?

When's he going to get his shot? That's the worst part of this. That is the worst part of this. I don't understand that is the thing I have the most trouble with is that you're just kind of throwing money. at Sam Bradford to have him be the guy that holds the keys until Carson Wentz is ready to drive as he gets his learner's permit. That being said, there's no way they could have known this is the exact reality. You can't operate under the assumption we're going to be able to make this trade happen.

It still just looks kind of silly right now that when they draft Carson Wentz, they're going to have on their roster, San Bradford for $12.5 million, Chase Daniel for $5 million, and whatever the number two draft slot. first year salary is. It's a lot of money tied up in quarterbacks when only one of them can play. Any chance they trade Bradford? Who's going to want him? I mean, I think that right now, his base salary is $7 million. He had a $5.5 million signing bonus. So I guess it's not that expensive and prohibited for a team to do that. But I couldn't see a team doing that. Who are you thinking? Like the Jets? Well, yeah, what about another team that wears green and white?

God, Sean Fennessey would walk off a bridge. We would definitely have to take really good care. of him and nurture him and doad on him, that would, that would be, that would be a tough one. I think you're right. So one more thing about the Eagles side of it, though. One more side about the Eagles, though. This is going to be a weird thing to say, but it is what I'm looking at it, offensively, it all comes together if you have the quarterback, so I think that their needs are not as pronounced as they might look on paper.

I still don't love their skill position players. They don't have any, so that's a little bit concerning. but when you look at the defense, I think this defense has a chance to be like one of the best three or four in the league. Wow. With Jim Schwartz as their defensive coordinator. So if you're just thinking we need a solid offense and a really good defense, I still don't think, weirdly, I feel like they're a team without a ton of holes,

especially on the defensive side. Bringing Malcolm Jenkins back, signing Roddy McLeod to really good safeties. They could use some help at corner and especially a little bit more depth. I love their front seven. I think they have one of the best two or three front sevens in the entire league. And I think Jim Schwartz is going to turn those guys into monsters. So in the end, I think that you're just losing out on being able to take some shots at skill position guys that they don't have. But if you have a quarterback, your skill position guys are automatically elevated.

So I don't know. I'm trying to talk myself into this, I guess. It's not as easy as I thought it was going to be. How about the brown side of it? You feel good about what Cleveland did? I think you have to, just in the sense of getting more. bites at the apple, but it's so weird. If you look at pretty much every major top 10 trade in the last 10 years, most of them include the Browns. They were the team that traded down when the Jets

traded up for Sanchez in 2009. They got the haul from the Julio Jones trade in 2011, and then the awful trade they made to go up one spot to get Trent Richardson, which holy shit was that bad. But then vindication because they trade him to Indy and get another first round pick. And then two years ago, they're the team that suckers Buffalo into trading up for Sammy Watkins. So now for the next year with Philly's first round pick will be the fourth time in six years they've had two first round picks. That is incredibly good franchise management. You know what's not incredibly good franchise management? Getting no good players out of any of those drafts.

I mean, it is, if there is any sort of proof that Cleveland as a sports city and this franchise as a football team is cursed, that's all you need, is the fact that no one has had more chances than this team in the last 10 years and none of them have worked out. It's unbelievable. Well, with the Brown-Berry-Depidesta brain trust in place, you feel better about the odds of those picks actually panning out this time around? If we're looking at this as not a ha ha, let's laugh at the Brown situation, but as an actual systemic, what are the real core problems? All of the change there from coaching staff doesn't allow you to develop players. If you don't have continuity from one year to the other among your coaching staff, then developing players after you draft them is going to be very difficult. So what they really need more than anything else is the chances, which they now have with that brain trust, and a little bit of continuity to allow those players to develop. So if Hugh Jackson and his staff can stay there for three or four years

and maybe try to nurture these guys in a certain specific system, then maybe this does work out. But if you're really hitting the reset button again, which they just did, this is a good start. This is the money ball thing in the NFL. This is the NFL's version of money ball. That is the undervalued asset is future draft picks. So in that regard, they're very much starting off on the right foot.

Yeah, I mean, look, you've been with us for a few weeks now, right? And your first newsletter item, the headline was, this is your pre-draft reminder that the Browns need way, way more than just a quarterback. And they listened, right? So it's, I think I have to assume that for Browns fans, and again, we'll hear from one shortly, it has to be refreshing to not be in a position to once again miss on the quarterback to collect some bodies and to hopefully increase the batting average of which of those pitch actually pan out. There is no reason for them to say if we don't love one of these guys and think he's a 10-year starter that can make the playoffs consistently and win us a Super Bowl, that they should pick one of them.

let Robert Griffin get the hell kicked out of him this year, picking the top five again, have another first round pick again next year that you assume will be in the 20s if Philly is close to the playoffs. So you're picking at 3 and 24. That's not bad. That's the way you rebuild a depleted roster,

and theirs is certainly depleted. So it's a win for Cleveland. It's a risk for Philly. It's not all that dissimilar to what we talked about last week. And if you really think that the Rams are taking golf and you love Wence, then it's really similar. So, but that's where we are. The other question I had for you, though, Mal, is outside of these two teams, where's the impact?

Like, who is, who wins and loses because of this outside of Philly and Cleveland? You know, I think the answer is very similar to the one we gave last week. It's basically every other team in the top 10 that wasn't looking at a quarterback. So, like, you know, I'll just play the shameless homer card here and once again talk about the Ravens. Like the Ravens are going to get an incredible defensive player, a guy who should have gone in the top four, maybe even in the top three. I mean, it is suddenly, still unlikely, but suddenly potentially possible that Jalen Ramsey is a Raven, which is like really not even something I had allowed myself to consider before this moment. And, you know, maybe that is just one bridge too far on the dream scale. but, like, Miles Jack is probably going to be a Raven.

That is beautiful, glorious. Get out of here with your micro fracture concerns. This is, like, such a beautiful fever dream that is now potentially my life. And it's amazing. What about you? We'll get to Miles Jack later. He's our prospect of the week. That's what we in the radio business call a tease.

I think, I totally agree. I mean, I hadn't even pictured Jalen Ramsey in a Ravens jersey, which is surprising. because I love picturing players in Ravens jerseys. You guys have the best uniforms, maybe my favorite uniforms in the league. Oh, my God. I don't know why it is. I just love picturing guys in those uniforms. The all black ones?

Oh, my God. The all black one is great. I wish the black jersey were the primary jersey. The purple needs a little work. When I'm picturing them, it's only into all black ones. Let's be clear. The purple never even enters into my mind. I totally agree with you.

You know, a team like San Francisco gets a better player, a team like the Cowboys get a better play. The other guy that I would throw out there is Paxton and Lynch, because now is when teams get desperate and insane and stupid. So if there's a team that really feels like they need a quarterback in this draft, a guy that can start maybe not right away but close to right away, then Paxton Lynch becomes that guy. And there's a chance he becomes this year's version of Blaine Gabbard, which in 2011, what we saw is the Jaguars went from 17 to 10 to pick Gabbard. and they traded with Washington. And that's what you could see here.

You could see a team, you know, if whoever's at, Tampa Bay is at nine, right? So if Tampa maybe wants to trade back and they have James Winston, they're calling teams like the Jets at 20 and saying, what do you want to give us if they really do want a guy like Paxton Lynch and ensure that they get him. So there's a chance that because of this, Paxton Lynch gets pushed up a little bit in a way that he wouldn't have otherwise. The other interesting one to think about is the other team that recently made a big trade to move back, the Titans, like if a couple more things happen with teams moving up for someone

like Paxton Lynch, if the quarterback domino effect continues, could the Titans, is there any possible scenario in which they are? They still get Laramie Tunsell or 15? Or Stanley, Ronnie Stanley, right? Like the consolation prize at left tackle. Formerly someone who was looking like a maybe a top six pick, could he, could he be there for them at 16, at 15? I mean, it wouldn't necessarily be insane. We talked about this last week. It's, again, it's the guys in your fantasy draft taking players you were never even considering and that allows the guys you want to maybe fall to you. So who knows, man.

I don't think we're done either. Like, what are the chances that we see two or three more trades in the top ten? I think that's probably going to be the case because now teams are seeing possibilities. The same way we couldn't see Jalen Ramsey in a Ravens jersey, I'm sure that, you know, there are teams like, I don't know, whoever, the, uh, somebody picking at like 13 or 14, you know, like the Raiders. and they're seeing like, oh man, I didn't even think that guy would possibly be available at eight or nine. So now the gears are going to start to turn with teams and it's going to maybe lead them to do something brash,

which I'm in favor of teams doing things that are brash. I don't know. I love it. I love it. Okay, I think it's time that we hear from the resident fans. Let's check in with Matt Borkas to get the Brown's perspective. And let's check in with Christopher Ryan to get the Eagles fan perspective. Joining us now, the man that.

the man the myth of the legend the newest ringer hire Matt Borkas buddy welcome back to our team welcome to this podcast it's an honor to be here it's an honor to have you here um you know this was a bit fortuitous with the timing of the announcement of your hire because now you as our resident lunatic browns fan can join the show to talk about this insane trade so My first question for you is, what does it like to be living inside of the movie Draft Day? And who is this year's Fonte Mac? It feels like deja vu to be living inside the movie Draft Day because when it came out, that was right around the draft when the Browns took Mansell. And that felt like that movie.

So here we are again. I've ever seen the movie Draft Day? Is that because you feel like it is your real life and you just, you don't need to see your real life represented on the big screen? Yeah, it hits a little too close to home. But I know like the movie, but. So you don't feel like you're able to look at the new brain trust in Cleveland and clearly identify the Kevin Costner figure? No, but I have to say I feel about as good about Kevin Costner being the Browns GM as the current. brain trust. So we'll see.

Okay, so let's talk about that new brain trust for a second here because when the trade went through, you texted me and essentially said, did the Browns just do something smart, right? So that seems to be the general consensus here is that, hey, the Browns actually did something smart for a change. Is that your feeling about this trade in particular and about the new front office in general, that they're actually going to do smart things? I think the trade smart in theory, of course, if Carson Wentz turns out to be a star, then that's going to be a hard pill to swallow, much like the Browns passing on Ben Rafflesberger was, or even more recently passing on Derek Carr.

But the roster is pretty depleted. So just like the Titans, it's hard to argue with the strategy of stockpiling as many picks as you can. But the Browns have been down this road before. They've had multiple first round picks in three of the past four drafts. And what they have to show for it is pretty grisly. They've got Brandon Weeden, Trent Richardson, and Johnny Mansell, who are no longer on the roster. Robert and Cameron Irving, who look like busts. And Gilbert might not even be on the team by the time the season starts in September.

And then Danny Shelton looks like he might be okay. Which is all to say that that tempers my excitement a bit for the trade because they've done this before and they haven't hit on the picks. So as much as you might want to separate, I feel like they have to hit on the picks for it to be a good deal. Okay. So you need a little proof of concept before you're willing to fully buy it. Yeah, I mean, like I said, I like it in theory. They just have to do it in practice. Okay.

So let's talk about what it might look like in practice. what are you actually hoping that you see this year? Do you think there's any chance they trade down again? What do you want them to actually do with the picks that they now have? I think that's highly likely. I want Elliott at number eight, but I feel like the Brown's front office isn't going to be inclined to take a running back in the top 10.

So I think they're probably going to either take Ronnie Stanley or Conklin from Michigan State, especially if the rumors about Joe Thomas being on the trading block are true. If they don't take either of those two, they might go for DeForest Buckner just as a best player available pick if he's still on the board. But there's a lot of talk that they could move down to 13 if the dolphins want to come up for Elliot or they could move down to 15 if the Titans want to come up for either Stanley or Conklin. And I wouldn't be surprised at all if they moved down again.

So what do you want to see them do at quarterback? You want to see them address that in the middle rounds? Or are you feeling good about RG3? Okay, about RG3. What I absolutely don't want them to do is to take Paxton Lynch at either 8, 13, 15, or anywhere in the first round. That talk is starting to gain some momentum and it's incredibly scary. If they did that, it reminds me of when the bills took easy. J. Manuel or when the Vikings took Christian Ponder, just because you take a quarterback in the

first round doesn't mean that they're worthy of a first round pick. And I think Paxton Lynch would be a pretty bad reach there. A harder thing to do would to take a flyer on one of the second or third tier guys either in the third round or maybe the fourth round. My guy is Cardale Jones, which isn't a biased preference at all. I'm shocked. I'm shocked that you're pulling for Elliott and eight and Cardale. We're talking about a guy with Cardale who last year people thought he could have been a first or second rounder at worst. I guess you could make the same argument about Christian Hackenberg.

But I feel like with Hackenberg and Cook and those guys, their ceilings a lot lower. And if you're going to roll the dice in the middle rounds, I'd rather take the guy who might be good or he'll suck, and they'll know that pretty quickly. And they can take Deshaun Watson next year, Josh Rosen in 2018. Josh Rosen in his hot tub. For the listeners who might not know, Matt Borges is a buckeye and thus has unsurprisingly mentioned numerous buckies. He is also a Notre Dame fan and has thus unsurprisingly also. mentioned Ronnie Stanley. Shameless, shameless, shameless sports fan. But I wouldn't want Ronnie Stanley at number eight. So that's me being fair there.

Last question. Very quickly, let's talk about the Josh Gordon thing, because I know that this has been hard for you. I know that you were very excited about the prospect of his return. Where are you right now? Physically, mentally, emotionally? Physically, I'm fine with respect to Josh Gordon. Hopefully it stays that way. I think anything the Browns were ever going to get from him, either this season or going forward, was a bonus suspension last year coming off the one in 2014, and he had another one in 2013, I believe. It was just like, fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me. So I wasn't getting too excited about him coming back, although every year I'd always take him in my fantasy draft and hoard him

and hope that he came back. So at least that won't happen this year. I think he can apply for reinstatement in August, but I think it'd be pretty naive to expect him to come back at that point, which means that the Browns need a receiver either in the first round or with the number 32 pick if they don't want to have can I hazard a guess

can I hazard a guess here? Are you hoping they get Ohio State's Michael Thomas or Notre Dame's Will Fuller? No, I like Coleman and Dotson and Treadwell all more than those guys. Fuller and Thomas are good.

I like the bloodlines with Thomas being related to Kishon Johnson and Fuller's a burner. But But my preference would be Treadwell just because Q Jackson himself called the Brown's current crop of receivers, the Smurks. Between Andrew Hawkins and Taylor Gabriel, there's not a whole lot of height to go around there. So they need someone who's halfway decent size to go up and catch balls. So I think that could be Treadwell.

I wish Dotson were a little taller, but sadly, he's not. Well, buddy, you're our burner, and you're just tall enough for us. So thank you for being wonderful. Thanks for joining the show. We are delighted to have you back on the team, and we can't wait to read you on the ringer.com as soon as the ringer.com is a website. Can't wait. All right. Bye.

And now we are joined by Chris Ryan, who I can already sense just the seething anger coming out of this side of the phone. How you doing, bud? I'm tired of talking about general managers in Philadelphia sports, okay? I don't care any more about Sam Hinky, and I do not care about Howie Roseman. I might have a little bit of chip PTSD, you know what I mean? Like, I was a real chip apologist, a true believer. I think he got jobs a little bit over there. But the idea that we have just, I don't even know, I can't even, I'm not, I'm not topic, Shea. I'm not Robert Mays. I'm not Mallory Rubin. I don't know if this was a lot of stuff to give up. for Carson Wentz.

And maybe he is going to be Ben Rathusberger. That's great. I can't wait. You know what I mean? But this is very similar, it feels like, to the deal we could have made last year for Marriota. So why didn't we do it then? What? All right.

The Mariotta deal included like 17 players and a lot of draft picks. Who? This, it seems like a lot to give up. Do you like Fletcher Cox? Sure. He was part of it. I think he's good. He's good.

I would have rather had Marcus Marriota at the end of the day. I'm just sitting here taking pictures of Chris screaming like a lunatic. You guys continue. Mays, this is what it's like on Philly Sports Talk Radio. Welcome to my world. I'm sorry, buddy. I can't really imagine what your life has been like recently. Guess what?

He doesn't even have any. Jason Peters has one foot. Okay? He is literally a pirate with a peg leg. They have nobody to block for this guy. We have $30 million invested in Sam Bradford, Chase, dot Daniel, and Carson fucking Wentz. Like, what is that? We traded to Marco Murray and Byron Maxwell.

I know that those guys weren't good last year, but if they believe that Peterson is going to get things back to normal and have like this much more like streamlined, pro style offense, no big mistakes, no like banging your head against a tree stump type play calls, then why not like slightly. shuffle the deck. This is not a, is this a good division? Am I wrong? Is this like a great football division? We could be in the playoffs. But no, it's like how he needs to put his stamp on this team because he's been waiting in the wings like Grimer Wormtongue for like three years, try to jump back up in

Jeffrey Lurie's face and take over the kingdom again. And this really is the last nail in the coffin of the chip era. It's everything now. Every single choice that was made last year has now been a real. race from the face of the earth as Sam Bradford sits there and gets the shit kicked out of him while Carson Wentz holds a clipboard. I know it's just been a long time since this team. This team seems to be just be suffering from an identity crisis.

You know what I mean? And so are other, there are a lot of Philadelphia teams suffering from identity crises right now. I mean, the Phillies in some ways are the easiest team to get behind because they're just going young. And you can just find these kids and like them. But like I've watched now five years it feels like of the shuffling of the deck and I experienced Nirvana when we had Michael Vick, LaShawn McCoy, Deshawn Jackson, Chip McCleckleck, Chip Kelly playing like sitting off fireworks in dudes closed palms and it was awesome. And ever since then it's been bad. Ever since then it's basically been like bleeding to death. And now I have this dude who people are trying to convince me on by like check out this gif.

of Carson Wends throwing into double coverage on some frigging cow pasture in northern Iowa. Yeah, it's funny that... And don't tell me about future quarterback classes. I like that dude from Miami. Who's that kid? Brad. Brad? Kaya?

Yeah. What's up with him? Why can't we have him? Brad Kaya's great. What's up with the kid from Michigan State, right? Connor. Connor Cook? Yeah.

You got to wait one more year for Brad Kaya. I'm all set with the Michigan State guy. Yeah, it's pretty funny that we were like two. Two years removed from Chip Kelly using an atom bomb on the Washington defense. And now you have an offense that essentially is going to try to kill people with a thousand stabs of an oyster fork. It's a little bit of a different feel. Also, just like what's the point of having, like, regime change? It's just to me this whole Chase Daniel, San Bradford, Carson Wentz thing just reeks of like there's still nobody is sure who's making the call here.

Peterson brings in Chase Daniel. I get it. San Bradford needs like player insurance. but why re-signed Bradford? I guess, I mean, they could still trade him. I mean, they could still trade him to the Jets. They could still trade him to the Broncos. They could still trade him to the Niners.

You know, I mean, they could train him anywhere. But I... The Brock, the Bradford thing is the worst part of it to me. If you wanted to do this and you weren't sold on him as a quarterback, then bringing him in for $12.5 million, it doesn't make any sense. Because now, if you don't bring him in and you sign somebody else for pennies, and you got $20 million in cab space, why isn't Josh Norman an eagle then? Yeah.

It just, it prevents you from doing other stuff. I agree with you. I understand your frustrations here, buddy. I actually was just at a place right now where, to me, after they re-signed Bradford and Daniel, I was just like, so we're good at quarterback. Like, we're fine. The Jets don't even have a quarterback, and we have three now. You know what I mean?

It's just like, we're good. Get Laramie Tonsle, get Conklin, get Ezekiel Elliott if you want to. Do whatever you got to do from eight. You know, get, I mean, Jalen Ramsey's dropping, Bosa. Somebody get, all those guys are studs. And now one of them is going to be a raven. Thank you, Philadelphia. That's crazy.

That's crazy. Oh, man. This is amazing. Please watch After the Thrones on HBO Go and HBO now coming Monday. This is my red wedding. Peace out. Later, bud. All right, and before we get to one of our other segments, let's get to one of our sponsors.

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but let's move on to one of our favorite segments, which we didn't get to last week, because the trade craziness was just a little too pronounced. Draftic nonsense versus actual insight. And I don't want to spend a ton of time on this, but one thing I wanted to ask you about that I've been thinking about a lot this week is just the idea of red flags with players.

And what kind of stuff should scare teams off and what kind of stuff shouldn't? And one of the things that kind of prodded me about this was Seth Wickersham's profile of Robert Kim Dice on ESPN.com this week. And, you know, Kim Dice is clearly the guy that has been, had those red flags stake in him over this entire process.

Somebody that, you know, the window situation, we all know the answers. So the story more or less was talking about, does we, do we go too far? Do we go too far with this process? Are there things that should be off limits? Are there things that are way to emphasize by NFL teams when it comes to predicting success with guys based on personality traits, past transgressions, whatever? Kim Dice in the story was kind of just framed as a free thinker who made one mistake. and in reality is somebody that is a decent dude but doesn't necessarily fit the militaristic

corporate America thought process of football. So my question to you, Mal, just overall, what about guys in this process that you hear would scare you? Is that what you hear about Kim D.J is something that would scare you off? Or are there other things that you feel are way more important? So it's such an interesting question. It's such a difficult thing to talk about because we are in the same position that the teams are in, and I think that's what bothers me about all of this. It's like we don't actually know these people, right? And so that's what's like so frustrating when you sit back and you read this stuff. It's like to pass judgment on a person based on a tweet or like a Snapchat or whatever, it's just, it's something about it seems really unfair.

You know, there was a great line in the, in the Wicker-champ piece. The quote was, he's a test case of what happens when a weird guy meets a weird process. And I thought that was so perfect because, like, being weird isn't the same as being bad, right? And, like, there are plenty of guys over the years. I'm sure there are people in this draft and plenty of people in past drafts and in all walks of life who are awful people and who actually do bad things and are dangerous and unpleasant and not people you want to, you know, pour a ton of money into. obviously, but also just be around, people who have actually done bad things, you know, domestic violence, crimes, criminal activity. But like, you know, being a free spirit, I mean, there was there was a quote in here also. One team scouting report reads, quote, he thinks he's a philosopher. And like,

they're using that as like a, like, it's a bad thing. Like, why is being a philosopher a bad thing? Why is being spiritual and introspective and thinking about the world and life a bad thing? You know, one of the threads throughout that entire piece was like concerns about Denzel, the older brother and the influence that he has. Like, you know, I don't know Denzel. I don't know Robert. Like, I know that there are college age kids all across the country who hang out with their friends in a room and drink and smoke. And like, not all of them have the misfortune of falling out a window or having a TMZ article written about them. Not everybody lives under the microscope. But like, you know, I mean, it's one of the things that we were actually having an interesting discussion about in the office.

recently with Josh Gordon. Like, on the one hand, I get where people are coming from when they say, why can't this kid just like follow the rules? Like, he understands what the rules are and he's being paid to follow them. The flip side is, you know, there are states in our union where smoking marijuana is legal. There are people all over the country who do it even though it isn't legal. Like, if these policies applied at the ringer, we wouldn't have a staff, you know what I mean? It's just like, I don't know.

I mean, I don't want to like, I don't want to, the danger here is basically to go too far in the other direction and to deify people who we don't know, right? You can make the same mistake in either way. And I think that is just why it's challenging to talk about and think about. And I can only hope that people are thorough and cautious and that they actually look for things that might really matter and not just things that are different or strange or unusual. because being different and strange and unusual is part of what makes being alive interesting. So I'm going to throw out a few names here. And when we talk about character issues and whatever that bullshit means, these are kind of the guys that came to mind first for me,

guys that fell in the draft because of this kind of stuff. One, Greg Hardy. Craig Hardy was the number one pick in the draft coming out of Old Miss at one point before his second to last, after his second to last season, Sports Illustrated said he was the number one pick in the draft. Right. He goes in the sixth round. It ain't because his ankle was bad. I'll tell you that right now.

Another guy. Arian Foster gets a second round grade from the competition committee. He doesn't get drafted. It's not because he fumbled a lot. It's because, like Robert Kim Dichet, he was a philosopher and people don't like that. How about Tyron Matthew? Tyrone Matthew was the best player in college football for like two years. He goes in the third round.

Obviously, the success of this. these type of guys runs the gamut. Greg Hardy is somebody you wish is not on your football team. There's a reason he's not on a team right now. Arian Foster goes undrafted and was one of the best two or three backs in football for the entire time he was there. And then you have a guy like Tyrone Matthew who his problem has been injuries, but when he's played, he's one of the best players in the league.

So it's a matter of what kind of teams are really to take a risk. And if you are, do you feel comfortable projecting this person three or four years into the future. Not what has he done before, but is this going to be an indicator of future performance and future actions? Right. So I don't know. It just seems like there's a team that's going to take a chance on Kim Dice and say, we understand that people are people and that we have to respect that. And this guy is incredibly talented and we're willing to take a risk. The Tyron Matthew example is so interesting and so apt in this case because like what is character, right? When we talk character, what do we mean? Like, there were plenty of talking heads, plenty of analysts out there

who would have said around the draft, Tyron Matthew has character issues because he failed drug tests and he got suspended. Tyron Matthew is doing more right now to protect. I mean, you could talk about the work he's doing for PETA to protect animal rights, which honestly, like, I'm not joking here, like, means a lot to me. But like, what about the work he's doing in the city of New Orleans to fight for youth and safety and quality of life and to try to give young kids a role model and say, this is what a young black man can be and should be. That is character. His character is exceptional.

He's being held up now as a role model and a leader. And this is a kid that three years ago people were knocking because he liked to smoke weed. Like we just all need to be a little more open-minded. And again, I do feel like it's important to stress. that there is the danger, of course, in going the other way and saying, ah, you know, this stuff isn't a big deal. And then, of course, sometimes it can be. Like, we don't know these people.

It's hard to say. But do your due diligence and try to find out who someone really is. This is a guy who, did you listen to, did you see the video clip of him after the Will Smith shooting? Did you, I mean, did you? Yeah, it was incredible. The guy is like, it's impossible to overstate what he's become just from an ambassador for the league for that city. for his franchise. And it's cool to see.

And that's the concern. What scares you off and what doesn't? And he's somebody that they're, you know, Steve Kime and then that staff took him out to dinner right by the stadium before the draft. They talked to him. And the guy that they saw is the guy that they see now, the guy that we see now. And that's a question. You know, do our team's going to think is one mistake this kid made when he was 21 and the

fact that he's a little quirky, is that enough to scare us? off. And there's a chance that it is, but the way I'm leaning right now, it's not. And some team's going to draft him in the second round and be very thrilled about it. I'm with you. All right, buddy. Let's stay on the defensive side of the ball, move back just a tiny bit, and get to our blue chip battle of the week, which I think is one of the more interesting comparisons through this entire draft. And that is the two move off-the-line line linebackers not named Miles Jack that many people have penciled into the first round. and their names are Reggie Ragland and Darren Lee

and when you watch these two guys they probably couldn't be more different. Right. So first things first, in college and just when I mentioned those two names to you, what would your first thought have been about each? Ooh, well, you know that I have a soft spot for Alabama defenders, so I immediately would have started replaying Reggie Ragland highlights in my mind.

I love both of these guys, but as you said, such an interesting contrast to styles. I mean, Raglan stood out to me as one of the best defenders in the country the last couple of years. Lee was always somebody at Ohio State who had flashes, flashes of brilliance, flashes of incredible athletic potential, but never really rose to that level of elite difference-making defender who you trusted to take over and win the game. You know, in terms of the styles, I mean, Raglin's the old school guy, right? He's the saving style linebacker. His mistotals, a mistackles total dipped this past season, which I think is worth noting. You know, he's not the fastest guy out there, but he's strong and he hits hard.

And I'm curious to hear one of your thoughts on one of the knocks against him, which is that because he played behind such an exceptional defensive line, you sort of don't necessarily really know what his true playmaking ability is because he had such a buffer from the guys around him. You know, Lee, he's the space defender, right? Former high school quarterback, which is really fun and interesting. He knows how to move, right? He knows how to move around a football field. He's fast. He's agile.

He can cover. He can tackle in the old open field, but he's smaller. He almost looks more like a safety. He's not that forceful tackler that Raglan is. So there are really different guys. my hardest was Reggie Ragland here, but I can certainly see why a team would fall in love with Lee. It's so interesting watching them, just the types of players they are. So Ragland, yes.

I think that you should take into account who was in front of them, but I don't think it should be the most important thing. He makes plays. He takes on blocks himself. He's very physical. It was a play in the Tennessee game where he just laid in, or it was the Michigan State game, excuse me, where he just laid into the right tackle and then spilled back inside to me. make the play. That has nothing to do with who the defensive linemen are. That's a dude who knows how to

take on a block and how to make a play. And those show up all the time. The knock on Ragland is the speed and I understand it. But his 40 time isn't worse than Lance Briggs' his 40 time was. It's pretty much the same. If you can play football and you know how to move functionally, that's the most important thing.

And he does. The question for him is going to be whether he can cover people. And that's going to be a concern. I watched him try to cover some tight ends and some age backs out of the backfield in man. did not go extremely well. So if you're worried about him from that perspective, then I understand where you push him down a little bit.

I don't like Lee that much from what he is now perspective. He's really soft. He's not physical. He doesn't take on blocks well. Every tackle he makes the ball carrier gains about two or three more yards. He's grabbing on to guys and holding on for dear life, which I hate out of a linebacker. With both guys, I think their hidden value is actually,

rushing the passer, which is not something you'd really think about when it comes to inside linebackers, but both of these dudes have weird value in doing that. As a true freshman, Darren Lee, it's seven and a half sacks. So that's something that, again, it doesn't jump out right away when you're evaluating guys like this, but if you're a team like the Jets and you blitz a ton, he has some extra value there. He knows how to get to the quarterback and has the type of explosion to do it. With Ragland, he was a defensive end in a lot of sub-packages.

Right. Which that is another weird added value. So if you're not confident Ragland can cover people on third down, why don't you put him on the edge and see what he can do there? So there are both guys that I could understand where different types of coaching staves would see them as attractive for different reasons. In the end, I'm going with Ragland just because what I see right now is more attractive to me. But again, this is a projection business.

when we're talking about the draft. And I can understand where a coach that sees the measurables that Darren Lee has at 4-4-ish-40 and say, give me that guy, I'll figure it out later. Right. The other thing that I love about Raglan, though, and this is, I guess, like, the classic intangible, is that he occupied that quarterback in the defense role at Alabama, which, you know, I think shows a certain level of mental awareness and focus. and leadership and trust that you have to have to occupy that role in a statement defense.

And I think that should give a lot of teams faith in his ability to adapt quickly, to learn, and to be able to adjust to whatever he's seeing. Yeah, and that's huge. And being able to be that guy in that defense, which has a lot of disguises and things that most college defenses don't, that adds value as well. The one thing I would say just to kind of put a bow on this, talking about Lee, people shouldn't mistake speed for coverage ability. Those are not the same things.

Being able to move fluidly and understand how to cover people in space is much different to be able to run fast in a straight line. And when you watch Lee, he's decent in man coverage, but he's not aware in zone coverage. He gets lost a bit. And that's going to be a problem. He's going to have to be well-coached. He's not somebody that's going to be able to step in

and just be a functional past defender as a linebacker right away. So I wouldn't conflate those two things. Just because he's faster than Raglan doesn't mean he's leaps and bounds ahead of him, especially as his own past defender. You know who neither of these guys is, Mays? Huh. Miles Jack. That is correct.

Miles Jack is a functional past defender as it currently stands. We don't need any coaching for him. He's also our prospect of the week. Yes. Mallory, I watched a lot of Miles Jack in the last 24. hours and I have a pretty scorching take for you. You're in love. Miles Jack is the best player in this draft.

Miles Jack is the best player in this draft. I understand why people love Laramie Me Tunsell. I don't blame them. But when I say Miles Jack is the best player in this draft, what I'm saying is I think that outside of the two quarterbacks, which if they're good, they inherently have the most value, I think Miles Jack has a chance to be the most. valuable player taken in this draft. Even if you think Laramie Tunsel is a better left tackle than

Miles Jack is a linebacker, I still think out a play-to-play impact basis. No one will have more of that from this class than Miles Jack. What about, what about Ramsey? You put Ramsey one peg below Jack? Yes, I do. Wow. Because I don't know what Jalen Ramsey does in the NFL. Is he a corner? Is he a safety? The fact that we haven't answered that yet worries me a little bit. I know exactly what Miles Jack is, and that's a dude who tears down the seam after whoever he wants. It's a guy who I was watching their game against Virginia from this year, and he was covering wide receivers out of the slot, and just moving with them on slant routes like he was a cornerback, and then wasting people in the backfield, like two plays later, that just doesn't happen. There aren't guys that

are supposed to do that, and he does it with regularity. I got so overexcited watching him. I was just making audible sounds while watching it at the coffee place. People have to be so weirded out when I'm doing this in public. And with him, it's really hard not to. It's very hard to control myself. He is incredible. He was one of our, back at Grantlin when we used to do the running franchise called Triangle All-Stars where we just celebrated not only.

Triangle All-Stars, that's right. Not only players who we were good, but players who we were essentially obsessed with. We had a really fun moment two seasons ago where we picked Miles Jack. as our Triangle All-Star at linebacker and at running back because he was that good at both. He was the Pac-12 offensive and defensive rookie of the year in 2013. Think about that for a minute. Think about how long it's been since we've seen a player who is just that dominant of an athlete and that smart of a football player, that naturally gifted to be able to go and impact the game

in that many ways. Now, look, obviously an NFL team that invests high. and Miles Jack as a linebacker is not going to gamble with his future, especially given the knee injury concerns, by putting him in the backfield and letting him coat the football. However, it's worth talking about because it does highlight what an incredibly versatile, gifted player he is. Now, at linebacker, amazing reaction time off the snap. So energetic, so bubbly. He just has such a present. He just has such a present. You just call him bubbly? He's bubbly. He's fun.

He is fun. And there's something exciting about watching a fun football player. Like he's magnetic. Your eye is really drawn to him when you're watching. So good in coverage, so good against the run. He shows a lot of promises a pass rusher. He's the most versatile player in the draft. I still give Ramsey a slight edge because in my mind, I have been just sliding him in a corner this

entire time. And I think he has the chance to be a transcendent corner. but I certainly get your point about why the lack of clarity there is a demerit. But back to Jack, I mean, it's sort of as simple as this, right? There's nothing he can't do on the football field. The only question is whether he will be on the football field. Is that sort of a fair way to kind of wrap up the assessment? There's really, that's the only thing to think about right now,

is whether or not some of these reports that we're hearing have any basis in reality. And it's come out this week. Actually, I think on Monday or so, Jason Lockenforer wrote about the fact that there are a lot of execs coming out and saying that it's disgusting what teams are leaking about Miles Jack because it's just not true. He, I mean, look, he certainly doesn't seem to think it's true, right? His most recent quote, I have no issues with it. I'm not worried about it at all. I'm just focused on getting in shape now, honestly. I honestly don't know where these reports are coming from. Me personally, as far as my knee goes, it's absolutely fine. I've been working out for teams. I think you guys have seen the videos and stuff. So on my end, everything

is fine. I don't know if this is a smokescreen or whatever it is. At the end of the day, whoever wants to take me will take me, so I'm not worried about it. Whoever wants to take him is going to have an incredible football player. And look, here's the other thing. Let's say that there are some long-term concerns about the health of his knee. It's football. Injury risk is an inherent part of this. Like you're never taking a player with the guarantee that you're going to have that guy on your team for 15 or 20 healthy years, right? He tore his meniscus. We're not talking about some Marcus Latimore stuff here. Oh, God. I mean, yes, he got hurt and he needed surgery, but I'm guarantee you he's pretty much 100% healthy. Remember last year when I was like,

oh, what about Todd Gurley? Was he going to come back? Who gives his shit? Do you see him play football? He's going to be fine. I'm with you, man. I think it's also cool to think that, you know, if Jalen Smith gets healthy and comes back in 2017 and returns to this prior form, that two of the best players who came out of this draft could be linebackers. That's really fun. I love it. I absolutely love it. Where do you think he goes? I guess that's the last question about this. I mean, is it a situation where Dallas says you will be buying a... McLean's on a one-year deal. What's up?

I think you will be buying a black Miles Jack Ravens jersey. That's really what I think. Get out of here. You're just trying to talk yourself into this. Miles Jack plus CJ Mosley. Let's think about this for a moment. I am thinking about it. It's incredible.

You okay over there, bud? You're doing all right? I just need a private moment. Yeah, it's exciting. I go watch his Al-Maw. Bowl Bowl from last year or from two years ago in that game against K State and watch that interception he has up the seam and then tell yourself that you don't want this guy on your team. That's all I'll say.

All right, Matt, let's get to our Twitter questions for this week. Going back to Miles Jack and Jalen Ramsey a little bit, Sean Murphy asks, if you could trade your healthy knee for Miles Jack's bad one, would you? And I want to change this a little bit because as we established, Miles Jack is fine physically. Jalen Smith is reportedly not. We didn't get to this at the top of the show because the trade. But he's going to miss reportedly the entire 2016 season, and teams are worried about nerve damage in that foot.

It's very sad. But in a parallel universe, if you could trade your knee for Jalen Smith's and you had a little bit of nerve damage in your foot and you're going to have it forever, would you do that. Oh, in a heartbeat, it would be an honor and a privilege. Oh, it would be an honor and a privilege to give that kind of gift not only to Jalen Smith, but to the rest of the world. I mean, listen, Valer Doherris, right?

all men must serve, all women must serve. I am here to serve also in the interest of full disclosure. I have a sort of, I'd say, an unusual amount of joint pain for a 29-year-old, so I'm already experiencing a lot of daily discomfort. What's a little more? This would really only hamper your ability to walk around the wizarding world of Harry Potter. Outside of that, I don't think it would change your quality of life very much. Here's the thing, though, I don't plan on walking. I plan on of flying on my firebolt. Or just like going around one of those little motorized carts?

I think that's probably a more realistic option. Sounds luxurious. All right, let's move on. One of the other big pieces of news this week, obviously, the Josh Norman stuff, the Panthers rescinded the franchise tag on Josh Norman. Bob at RPM 3232 asked, what is the impact of the Josh Norman news on this draft?

And then he asked me if I think Brian Pace will make a run. The Bears are reportedly a team that reached out with an inquiry about him. I think most teams with Cap Space should do their due diligence and do that. That's a lot of dues. You're welcome for that. The Bears are clearly a team that has a cornerback need. They need cornerback help. There are a lot of teams down the draft that also do. The team that makes the most sense for me just from a need perspective and a fit perspective, football-wise, is Pittsburgh. But I just don't think they're going to have the type of cap space necessary. Right.

The front runners are Washington and San Francisco. So if San Francisco felt like they really needed a cornerback and you're sitting there at seven, maybe they don't need to take one. Right. That's what Free Agency does. It allows you to cover up your needs by getting players that you know are established and you can kind of project who they're going to be in your offense or defense, and then you take the best player available.

So I think that's what it does. It takes a team that has a desperate quarterback need or cornerback need, a lot allows them to fill it and then maybe take a slight left or right, depending on where they are in the draft and what's still available. Does that sound right? It does. And again, this gets back into the idea of the draft domino effect, the ripple effect, because if the Niners do sign Norman and they don't draft a cornerback, then those elite prospects that we discussed last week, some of them tumble, even if all of the top guys, that top tier that we discussed last week, week, all of them go before Carolina picks at 30, and the Panthers want to address cornerback

there. They have a ton of options. I mean, we haven't even talked about the guys in that second tier of this position, but they're also amazing players. Virginia Tech's Kendall Fuller, Miami's Ardy Burns, Notre Dame's Cavarry Russell. I guess there's some talk about whether he's going to really wind up a corner or safety, but he's a great athlete and an interesting guy. LSU's Jalen Mills. I mean, this is such a loaded class that any of those guys, I don't think they'd feel like consolation prizes. I think they'd be excellent fit. But if that ripple effect does take place, maybe a guy like McKenzie Alexander or William Jackson is actually still sitting there for Carolina at 30. And you're not going to miss Josh Norman that much.

And you're not going to miss what you would have had to pay him if you have one of those young studs. It's interesting. But that's kind of the thing with Carolina, right? Because they did this, because they're not willing to pay him, they clearly don't view corner as a high-priced asset. So envisioning them taking one in the first round, even if they don't have one, not so easy. So I'll be curious to see what happens. He's a good player. I think that he's a little pumped up because of that front seven in that scheme. But the team that gets him will be better. It's just a matter of whether he'll be worth it. All right, Mays. Our last question today comes from

Zach Herman, who says, how highly do you rate NFL team's ability to evaluate talent? So we're rating the rating ability, essentially. Is it positional? For example, are linebackers easier than wide receivers. This is kind of a safety, you know, who's the safest choice positionally. I think there is an element of that. I don't think it's the way it used to be. There was a thought maybe five, six, seven years ago that if you drafted a tackle high, that was a safer pick than drafting a receiver, quarterback, things like that.

That's not really the case anymore. I think that's because of so many spread offenses in college football and offensive line play not necessarily translating as easily. I feel like there are still positions that are safe, but it's just a matter of what you're looking for. I think Geron Reed is going to be a really good NFL player for a long time. I don't think he'll ever be a star. And I think guys like that, you can feel pretty safe about saying,

this guy knows how to play the run, he's going to be able to do it for us. It's almost like rebounding in the NBA, how rebounding is the most translatable skill. If you have a high rebound rate in college, you're going to in the league, but how much does that matter? I feel the same way about defensive linemen and ability to play the run. It probably translates, but are you getting a star in that way? So there are skills and things that go over, but I don't think it's easy.

I don't think it's easy to say this guy's going to be a high-level player. It's easy to say this guy's going to be a functional player. Well, I think it's safe to say that the hardest thing to assess is quarterbacks, because apparently two teams think that Jared Tinyhan's golf and Carson, insert your your favorite Chris Ryan soundbite here, Wence, are worth taking? One and two overall. What a world. What a country.

What a draft. It's been great. There's really not a more exciting way I could envision the last two weeks going down. So I'm glad we got to experience it together, buddy. Oh, me too. It's been a blast. I think you're right. It probably will continue to be a blast.

I'd expect some more moving and shaken. And we will be here to discuss it if and when it happens. Yep. Make sure to go check out everything else on Channel 33. Go check out a jam session with Juliet and Amanda. Bill talked to Louis C.K. this week. Everything that's going on right now, a lot of exciting stuff. And we hope that you're back next week.

We're going to have a couple different types of shows. We're going to have a preview show. We're going to have a few different voices on the pod. So make sure to look out for them. And as always, we really appreciate you guys listening. And, of course, make sure to watch After the Thrones on HBO Now, HBO Go, whatever your preferred HBO platform is this coming Monday. It's Game of Throne times, Mallory.

We are very excited about that. Chris and Andy are coming. Mother's Day is quickly approaching, and if you're like me, I can never figure out what to get mom, let alone where to get it. Luckily, we have GIFTagram. Listeners of this podcast can get $20 off their first gift on GIFTagram. Just download the GIFTagram app on your iPhone or Android device

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