The Press Box - 'Jam Session' — At Home with Meghan Markle, George Clooney, and Serena Williams (Not At the Same Time) (Ep. 348)

Episode Date: September 6, 2017

The Ringer's Juliet Litman and Amanda Dobbins discuss Meghan Markle's Vanity Fair cover story (5:00), George Clooney's renewed availability (21:00), and Serena Williams's new baby and decision to remain living solo before marriage (30:00). Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Welcome to Jam Session. I'm Juliette-Litman. Very big week. I'm in Man ombands, and I'm excited for all three of our topics. It's a lot. We're going to talk about this George Clooney Hollywood Reporter story, which I'm just over the moon about. It's a lot. We're going to talk about the Vogue Serena Williams story that we never got to because of

Dumb Taylor Swift. And we will be discussing right now the Vanity Fair cover story about one Megan Markle, the potential future wife of, of Prince Harry. Juliet, this story has been in the world for 36 hours, and it's been physically painful to not talk about it with you in public. I know. I know.

This was huge. Huge. I can't believe the, first of all, the photos are great. I think she looks really beautiful. Great styling, great makeup. Completely agree. I think this is important to say up top. She looks great.

She really does. Like, just beautiful. And it's like a natural makeup style. That's the way that this guy likes. to shoot Peter Lindbergh. And it really like, she looks so beautiful. Yeah, and you can see all her freckles on the cover, which looks, I mean, it's a really, really beautiful photograph, which we don't always say.

Is that really rare, Amanda, for freckles on the cover of a magazine? I think, yes, she talks about it a bit in the piece of that, like, kind of people often want to retouch them. And I think it generally, just think about, you don't see them that often. So I think at this level, they made a choice to definitely. show them. That looks great. Why do freckles have a bad rap? I don't really get it. I don't either. I mean, you know, I have, I have them. Messed up beauty standards. You look great. Thanks. But I never thought of them negatively. Like, it's just weird to me that it's like a bad,

that people are just like, don't want to show their freckles. I don't know. I have no problem with it. I think they're cute. Yeah. So she looks fantastic. Also, I think putting Megan Markle on the cover of your magazine is a great choice. Congratulations to Vanity Fair. Completely agree. that said I have some concerns. Okay. Not about Megan Markle or the choice to put on in the magazine, which I said, which I think is great. I'm afraid that we have jinxed and engagement. And by we, I mean Vanity Fair.

I'm really concerned. What if they're already engaged and we don't know? Well, here's the thing. Until we know they can back out. So that's my concern. Until they sign a wedding thing, you know, anything can happen. They haven't been together that long. She confirms that they met in July 2016, which means they got serious very quickly.

Yes. So I think it would be a little soon for any responsible couple to get engaged, much less one who has to deal with the whole royal family thing. Here is my concern. And again, the only person, the only group of people to blame in this situation would be the royal family. But the royal family has historically not taken well to press and specifically not taken well. to women dating heirs to the throne and speaking to the press. It doesn't go well. The most famous example of this is actually,

Julia, did you know that before Prince Charles married Princess Diana, he dated her sister? No, I didn't know that. He did. He dated her older sister. And do you know why they broke up? No, why? Because she gave an interview to the press.

Oh, my God. I did know that. Wait, so then he just went to the other sister? Yeah, I mean, it's really screwy. There were some people in between. He kind of dated, he dated around. He really took the whole I'm the next King of England thing to the full level in terms of dating as many women as possible. Wow.

Really worked it. Wow. But yeah, he did date her older sister Sarah. She gave an interview. He dumped her. And then eventually he married Princess Diana. So obviously that was in the 80s. A lot has changed since then in the world and also specifically in terms of the royal family's relationship to the press.

Plus, Harry won't ever be king or very unlikely he'd be king. That's true. I think he gets when Kate Middleton has her third child. Congratulations to them, by the way. Wow. Buried lead. Anyway, I think the third child will kick him out of the top five. Anyway.

Yeah, it will. Yes. So that was in the 80s or maybe even the late 70s. And a lot of things have changed since then. But when you think about Kate Middleton and what you heard from her before the engagement. Literally nothing. You heard nothing.

Absolutely nothing. The first time that you ever heard Kate Middleton speak was in an extremely awkward sit-down interview that she and Prince William gave immediately after their engagement. And she's wearing that same blue dress that's in the engagement photo. And it was fascinating because it's almost 30 minutes long and you have just never heard this person speak. I actually just learned something about Kate Middleton that I've been meeting to share with you. Yes.

Did you know that in the fashion show in which Prince William famously means, met her or so I saw her for the first time. That's like a very, you have to try out for that. Like you can't like just be in it. Like it's like a very choreographed, like fancy, posh thing to do at St. Andrews. Like it's like it's not for everyone. You have to try out. How do you try out? I don't know. It's like it just sounds like a campus event. Are you judged on basic appearance or do you have to have a catwalk stride? I'm not sure. I didn't ask these important follow up questions. Okay. So I'm sorry. However, it also like they like they, they wear so. certain designer every year.

Like it's like, I always thought it was like just some like random like undergrad event. Like, you know, I went to plenty of stupid fashion shows. Like are familiar with many of them as like sorority events. But this is not that. This is like fancy. I didn't know that either. Also, I love how Kate Middleton is still referred to as like middle class when her family is like definitely rich.

And always has been. Yeah. I mean, it's weird British class stuff where if you don't actually, if you weren't born with a title, then you're not your middle class, which is nonsense. Anyway, back to Meg. Everything about her in this article just doesn't scream royal family. Like she, in a good way, if you ask me. But like she just doesn't, I don't know, she's got way more personality than we ever have known a royal to have.

Yeah, that's true. I just think the major problem here is that the word Harry with an exclamation point is just the biggest word on the entire Vanity Fair cover. And I would like to know when she was told about that. And I am curious whether she was because if you're her, you can see being pitched on Vanity Fair as a style icon. And obviously she is more in the public spotlight and there's only so much you can do once there's this level of tension on you. And she does a lot of charity work. And she has there's a reason to do it. I kind of understand how it happened and I'm sure that she got approval.

But I bet they didn't run the cover line by her. I bet they didn't. She didn't really calculate the level of Prince Harry. that would be in the piece, and I am concerned that it will backfire. I do not want it to backfire. I'm very nervous. I'm with you. I'm rooting for Megan. She just seems so delightful. Yeah. It's also just clear in the story that they spent about 45 minutes together, Max. Yeah, they don't see, it doesn't seem like they seem to see each other that much. However, for some reason the way, she refers to like, just like my boyfriend. She doesn't ever say Harry. At least they don't quote her that way. But she just like says,

like, my boyfriend. I find to be kind of sweet. I'm sure she didn't say his name. I'm sure they honestly ask two questions. That's what it reads like to me, 45 minutes and two questions about Prince Harry. Yeah. And then everything else was like honestly about the damn bread, which is how you know that there was not a lot of time or content. As soon as someone is reviewing the bread in a magazine profile, your eyebrows should go up. You should have some reservations. Do you, are you familiar with this writer, Sam Cashner? I'm not really beyond, he seems like a contributing Vanity Fair editor. He does profiles from time to time. But I don't know. I didn't specifically know. his other stories. Because my take was this red very British. It was almost like giving her the

Sunday Telegraph profile treatment, which I thought was just sort of strange. I don't know. Coming on the heels of the Angelina Jolie Vanity Fair profile, these are both like pretty empty. And, you know, we've talked a lot about the value of like a glossy celebrity profile at this point. And this one is just like straight up PR for the royal family, in my opinion. Like there's more hairy biographical informational than their information than there is about Megan and it's just so much more like you said like about him than it is about her and they could have done a lot more about suits you know as an avid suits watcher I didn't feel as represented appropriately yeah I would agree with you I think and that's pretty much my concern is that this is not a piece about her which I think kind of the stodgy press royal family people might understand. This is a piece about their relationship. And I doubt that's what you sign up for.

And I think it's a shame because she's interesting. And we want to know more about her. And clearly Vanity Fair knows that. But I understand it from Vanity Fair's perspective. They know that everyone is just obsessed with the fact that Megan Markle is dating Prince Harry and you've got to sell magazine somehow. Yeah. But they're very clearly making a decision to write about that instead of about the person sitting in front of them. Yeah.

And it could just be that they didn't have that much time and didn't have that much to talk about. The details are slim. It is hard to make a lot out of a lunch if you're just sitting there. Though it does, he is in her home, right? Yeah. Yeah, he goes to her house in Toronto. Yeah, you could do a little more about the home. I want to know what her home looks like.

Yeah, he kind of alluded to it by saying it was like very Southern California and a lot of wood. But like, give me some interior shots. Like, I guess that's, the pictures are amazing, but I would have liked some home ones instead. Yes, I agree. Anything about her, any details, instead of just a recap of all the things that we wrote in the, that we read about in the British tabloid. Speaking of, I spoke to a British-based friend and jam session listener. Yes. Who offered me the British perspective.

Two things he wanted to tell me. Number one, ostriching, which is a term that she uses in the piece and says it's a British thing, is a term which, as an English person, this friend of mine has never heard. Oh, my God. Love it. And then also he says that quoting the Daily Star as evidence of the trolls is an irresponsible strawman because he's kind of, they quote tabloids that we wouldn't take seriously in the U.S., like in touch and star, et cetera. Right, right, right. So he was, he enjoyed the piece. He thinks the photographs are great and ostriching is not a British term.

That's what we've got. I was hoping it was. I really liked ostriching. I mean, I think we can use it. It was a vivid term and I understand it. Totally. And maybe, you know, I don't think he speaks for everyone, but this is the feedback I got and I wanted to be a responsible correspondent and share it with the world.

Another one of my, well, thank you from that. Thank you. Thank you very much. Another one of my takeaways was that I felt like this was doing a lot of damage control for Prince Harry and kind of like it mentioned a couple of his scandals, but not all of them and made it seem like he only had a very short period in which he was known as a party boy, whereas I would say he's still known as a party boy. Yeah, until maybe a couple of years ago.

He's definitely trying to use this relationship as a segue into, I'm responsible now. You know what I thought was really interesting is this came out less than a week after the anniversary of Princess Diana's death. The 20th anniversary of Princess Diana's death. And so it's been very interesting. We've had kind of a couple months of Princess William and Harry speaking more publicly than they usually do and certainly more publicly about their memories. mother than they ever have. And the timing was, I assume the timing was intentional. Obviously,

they couldn't put this out ahead of time. But I wondered if in that sense, this is part of Prince Harry's attempt to end the Diana conversation. Like, that's over now and now it's the next chapter. Because the same reason that they announced the pregnancy. Right. The timing of that, obviously, she's ill and she's having extreme morning sickness. But classic Kate, always having extreme morning sickness. I feel bad for her. I must, you know, I think it's earlier than the 12 weeks. But yeah, I did wonder if the timing was a little bit kind of that's over and this is the new

chapter of our lives. He must feel so confident if that if that's the move, though. He's just like, let's not talk about my mother anymore. Let's talk about my hot new relationship. Yeah, I don't know. I guess he's not included in it, which is another. notable thing, not that he would be, but I have to imagine he knew about it. Oh, definitely.

There's no way she does this without the permission of the royal family. Or at least with the permission of the Will Kate Harry Royal Family. Yeah. I wonder if it gets all the way up the flagpole. I think it must. It's so high profile. I feel like it must as well. It must as well.

But as I understand it, they're kind of warring factions within the various royal family members and their staffs and their approach to the press. Yeah, it's not all kind of one monolith. Tell me more. So obviously this could be changing, but this is the dorkiest thing I'm ever about to say, but we're just going to lean into this. Yeah, let's do it. I was reading a little bit about Prince Philip retiring from public life and kind of the ways in which he had tried to adapt and update the way the palace works because there are just so many people who work for them. And somewhere in there it said that they, with Phillips' blessing, I believe, had tried to centralize the press departments and run every press request for all of the royals from the queen on

down through one department. And it went really poorly and there was a lot of infighting. And everyone got really snippy at each other. And so they undid it. And just completely decentralized it again. And now it's everyone's own little kingdom and they make their own choices. Oh, interesting. Yeah, I don't know whether that's completely true. And as you point out, this is extremely high profile. So something this big would probably go past the Buckingham Palace officials. But I don't know.

It's interesting. I'm curious to see how it plays. Are you surprised that it was Vanity Fair and not like Vogue? I'm not at all because Vanity Fair has always had the royal relationship. Vanity Fair had the Queen Elizabeth cover a couple years ago. Oh, right. They actually got her to sit for a portrait with. her corgis.

Oh yeah, I remember that. God. The corgi thing is weird to me. It's just, I guess it's nice. Shout out to her. Shout out to the queen. Yeah. God save the queen.

Indeed. What do you think about an American getting back into the royal family? What is back in this situation? Well, Prince Edward, who's portrayed in the crown, season one, had an American wife, and then he had abdicate.

But, I mean, it's not the same thing, Harry's not going to be king. Right. Also, okay, so Wallace Simpson. Okay, that's what we're talking about. She was never let into the royal family. A point of contention, like I'm just nerding out here, but a point of contention was that she never got the designation of her royal highness.

Right. Which means that you're a member of the royal family. And that was one of the reasons that Edward the 8th, I think. Yeah. Edward the whatever. The Duke of Windsor, as he became known after he abdicated, was really pissed at his family. So I hope it goes best. better than that. I think it'd be great. I really hope they get married. I think it would be

really fun. I like her. It's a fun gossip story and it's certainly what the royal family needs to look to seem like they are of this. Modern. You know, to look modern to kind of to be relatable or, you know, whatever word you want to use. Totally. I'm with you. I just love her. I don't know. She's just like very easy to like, I think. She just seems like kind of regular. Yeah, she does. She seems, I think this profile, the one silver lining about, not the silver lining, but the good news about this profile is that it's pretty, she's very good at not saying very much and kind of giving the empty answers that Royals are famous for.

So in that sense, she's on the right track and that's going to go well. But I wonder whether they'll be mad about the cover line. She's just wild about Harry. It's in very big letters. It's really big. It's much bigger than her own name. So couldn't they have gotten some kind of pun in there? What do you got?

What's your best pun? Happy or happy with Harry. Something just a little bit more lyrical than wild about Harry. It's like, what is this? What is it, 1994? I guess so. I mean, it's always 1994 in Vanity Fair, but it's true. I was watching Notting Hill last night,

and I think that that's like the kind of thing, the kind of cover line they would have had is like a fake Anna Scott magazine. Yes, that's true. However, we are really excited. about it and have been talking about it for several minutes now. So in that sense, they were effective. I think it's really, really, I think it's an effective cover. I'm excited she's on it. I just hope that the royal family can get it to act together and not be upset about it. What a run for Vanity Fair from Angie to Megan. Very, very, very exciting. Great work by them. Yeah, it is impressive. And didn't they

have another one that we were talking about recently, too? Well, they have the Elizabeth Holmes story, which for my money is the greatest piece of reporting. Yeah, that was phenomenal. The last year. Has anyone seen her recently? No. How's that going? I think she's in hiding. Yeah, I would be too.

Oh, Serena. Serena before that. Oh, yeah. Yeah, that's what it was. Yes, right, right. We're going to talk more about Serena in a minute, but first, let's talk about hotel tonight. Juliet.

Yes. If you're like me and you're not so great at planning ahead, I've got great news for you. There's this awesome app called Hotel Tonight that helps you find amazing hotel deals at the last minute. It sounds counterintuitive, but unlike flights, hotel rates usually get cheaper at the last minute. Hotel Tonight helps hotels sell their unsold rooms, allowing them to pass those deals along to you. These aren't last resort places, they're actually cool, top-crated hotels that you want to stay in.

And with so many awesome partner hotels in a ton of different countries, Hotel Tonight can help you find a great hotel almost anywhere. It's perfect for a spontaneous getaway or finally going on that trip that you've been wanting to take. Even the apps, even though the app's name is Hotel Tonight, you can book up to a week in advance. All it takes is 10 seconds, just three taps and a swipe. So get in on these killer last minute deals and download the Hotel Tonight app now. All right, we are going to talk about Serena, but first, a big story dropped today, Wednesday, September 6th. Can't believe it's September. A profile of my number one, my main man, Dr. Ross, George Clooney.

It's very exciting. So this is the kind of the opposite of the Vanity Fair cover story in that the photos are minimal. And the interview itself is a lot more candid than George Clooney has been in sometime. Yeah. Also, I just want to say the photos are not related to his movie. They're not even like only of George. Right. That's true.

It's an inside look at George the dad along with his wife and his kids. Amal Clooney is one of my favorite celebrities out there, even though I'm. I know very little about her and maybe never heard the sound of her voice. I think I watched like an Instagram video about her once. I think I've like only heard her speak like one or two times. Yeah, at the UN or something anyway. Yeah, yeah. It just filled me of happiness because George Clooney seems really happy.

What were your favorite parts of the profile? Wow, so hard. I certainly enjoyed when he was talking about how he beat Obama in basketball. I like when he said that he's good He's a diaper guy He's good with changing diapers Yes I thought that he actually

I was really worried that he was going to be like a really embarrassing woke white celebrity Talking about politics But I actually thought he spoke Pretty well without being embarrassing Or offensive or naive So that made me happy

Yeah I would give them A B plus is what I would say. He was thoughtful about it and engaged, and there were a couple moments where it's kind of like, if we're going to go at this level, then let's get it right. The point where he's like,

if some of these Republicans and some of them I'm very good friends with actually stood up to Trump, we'd be in a better place. Well, stand up to them, George. Like don't tell me about it. Name names. Deal with it on your own time. Yes, that as well.

And it's a little wishy-washy about, I would have liked his support of Black Lives Matter. to be fuller. But yes, I agree on that as well. But as far as like woke celebrities go, he was pretty good, I think. Yes, I would agree with that. It's interesting. So his movie that's coming out this fall.

Very, very, very afraid about the movie. You are. Yeah, it's called Suburbancon. Yes. And it stars like probably two of my 10 favorite working actors, Julianne Moore and Matt Damon. And it's kind of like a reclaimed Coen brother's script from the 9th. 90s that they updated and it's about like racism in like a Levittown essentially. And it's apparently very dark and angry.

And I just I just don't know if George Clooney and Grant Heslov are best suited to be making this film. I would agree with that. There was also another warning sign in that they were filming during the election. And there's a very telling line when I believe it's a Julianne Moore quote. And she says we came back to work after. the election results and the film just kept kind of getting darker and darker. And so November of last year was hard for most of us, was extremely difficult.

And I think everyone worked through some of the initial reactions in interesting ways. But you don't, you don't want that to be your feature film. Like that first raw reaction, I think. You want to have some time. There might be value in it. I haven't seen it. I don't know. But it did make me nervous that kind of,

if there wasn't time to process it and make the best statement about it that it could be interesting. Right. Yeah. That definitely seems like there's some sort of foundational, like, George Clooney's political figure going on here. Like at the very end, talks about how the Clooney's had taken in a refugee from Iraq and sent him to the University of Chicago and, like, really emphasizes how he has, like, a profound sense of injustice and, like, wants, like,

fight for what is right. And, like, that's the kind of thing that you talk about when you want people to know that you, like, have a platform and an agenda. Absolutely. I was honestly very surprised that he even, the piece takes place at his home in Lake Como. And I was very surprised that he allowed a journalist in the house. I was very surprised that he allowed a journalist to meet the children, to speak to them all that indicates a level of openness that certainly has not been there for his past films. Yeah. which, you know, it's very hard to sell a film these days and people will do more than they used to.

But I agree with you that I was, I kind of picked up on the political positioning vibes as well. And it's like, part of this is to kind of establish the next phase. Yeah. Of his career. Yeah. And also, in addition to like the political stuff, I was just like, oh, so you know this reporter really well. Like there was no chance this wasn't going to be extremely flattering. just based on the way that the reporter A wants you to know that they know each other

and just like how much access he gets. Like it's pretty wild. Yeah, it's really, like I said, it's an extraordinary amount of George Clintony talking. I haven't heard George Clintony talking this much in a while. I know. It's like, how much time did you spend together? A lot. I mean, he's at lunch at the damn house.

Everyone's getting lunch again. All the journalists are being fed again. This is very exciting for us. And a seated meal. Yes. A dinner. With the whole family? Yeah.

Yeah. So I guess he really, he wants to sell this movie and I suppose he wants people to vote for him should he ever decide to run for office. I guess so. I'll vote for him. Although I don't support celebrities being political figures, but I don't know. Maybe if George earns it. His dad did run for office after all. That's true. He's from a political family. Here are some particular details that I wanted to highlight. Oh, please. This is great. So I, he has told the basic engagement story before, which is that he was down on his knees for a long time waiting. But the specific, he tells it in great detail in this story involving kind of where he hid the ring and how he sent her to go find the ring.

And he was waiting for a specific song in his mix of Rosemary Clooney songs. I think that's weird because that's his aunt. So I consider that strange. You did? Yes. You weren't touched by that? I thought it was a nice personal touch. I just thought it was kind of weird.

I also like the way he says it. He said, I had a playlist with my rosemary songs on it, and I was waiting for this song. Why shouldn't I? Why shouldn't I take a chance when romance passes by? Yeah. That's thoughtful. That's not. It's true. It's thoughtful, but I just think it's weird because of his aunt.

I also like that he knows the song that she said. She finally said yes. He's like, I was 20 minutes of me on my knee waiting for her to say yes because she was so shocked. She only said yes when Goody Goody Goody came on, which isn't very romantic. it's kind of mean. So you met someone who set you back on your heels. Goody, goody, goody. I like that he knows the end song, too.

That's just good storytelling. It's true. I mean, he honestly seems like the world's most charming human. I actually, I'm uncomfortable even talking about it. I just love him so much. So he's your Gosling. He's my Gosling, yeah. And it's partially because I love ER so much.

And Dr. Ross is obviously the best doctor. Oh, that's right. How can I forget about the ER connection? That's where my love for him comes from. I have to say that I didn't really understand the exact circumstances in which he purchased the Lake Como property. Were you aware of these? No, it wasn't. This is a great part of the story.

So in the article, it explains that he and his tequila bro, Randy Gerber, were on a motorcycle trip across Italy. And one of their bikes broke down and they went to Lake Como. It was like a non-goth version of the Rocky Horror Picture Show where they show up at this house. And then he was like, well, I need to buy this after he's been taken in. while they get their bikes fixed. Really, really great. And then he bought the house next door. Yeah.

So let's... One more thing. Yes. He and Obama are just texts, our friends now? That kind of might be mad. I'm just, I think I miss Obama, so I get mad when I feel like his life is good and he's not tortured by the state of the world. Yeah, I agree when he describes the evening that they spent at George Clooney's home in England,

George and Amal's home in England, which they're really living well. Great. The former president spent a night in early June remaining for a five-hour meal. Sounds amazing. Bantering and playing hoops, which is when Clooney says that he outshot Obama. One thing I can tell about George Clooney that I really support is that he likes a long, leisurely meal. And I do too. That's a great night in.

Yeah. I agree. It seems like he's living a fantastic life. He's camera. He really just has everything going on that he wants. and he's great at changing diapers. So congratulations to George Clooney. Also, I guess it won't matter if his movie's bad because his life is so good.

Do you think it'll affect his political career? It could, yeah. If he botches the themes in this particular film? Yeah, but I don't believe in this political career anyway, so it's okay. Okay, so you just think he should be at Lake Como having five-hour meals? Yeah, basically. And changing diapers. Yeah, so it sounds like things are going great for them.

I was a little curious about what the state of her career is now, but however, the kids are still really young. So she's probably like just still on her own maternity leave. Also, if you don't have to work because you're married to George Clooney, who just got $200 million, then like only do volunteer work is what I would suggest. Let's talk about that. I was very pleased to learn how much she took home from the Casamigos tequila sale. Me too. 200 mil is a lot. It's amazing.

And then they estimate, and we should note that this is estimated, that he makes another $100 million. He could make up to $100 million from those an espresso commercials that make no sense. That's so wild. He's doing pretty well. I just can't imagine being that rich. But I'm happy that it's someone that I love. It's George. Yeah, it seems like he's doing great.

It was really interesting. I have to assume that he intends to have some sort of public role. It may not be politics. He may just decide to... Like be a George Soros or like a Warren Buffett. Yeah, that could be it as well. Totally. Okay, so which couple do you find cuter?

George Clooney and Amal Clooney or Alexis O'Hanian and Serena Williams? George Clooney and Amal Clooney. Oh, good. Thank you. So there was a Vogue story we didn't get to talk about because Taylor Swift took up all the air. But now we're going to discuss it because, first of all, you love tennis. I love tennis. And second of all, there's a lot of good little more.

of serena in there. Yeah. And third, also because we should know, Serena had her baby last week. Yes, she did. So congratulations to them. This is very exciting. And the piece is about them preparing

for the baby as well, a baby girl. So here's, I loved this piece, this piece by Rob Haskell in Vogue. And it's about Serena. And it's really lovely. She's extremely charming. And I walked away from it,

convinced that she will never actually marry Alexis O'Hanian. What were some of the data point? Okay, data point number one, which I can't stop thinking about, which is that they do not live together and they are not going to live together until marriage, which is Serena's choice. I don't really get that. Why does she want that? So I think some of it has to do. My understanding was that it was a religious choice because she is a Jehovah's Witness. And she says in the piece that Alexis didn't grow up religious and really go to a church, but that he has kind of been along on that journey with her and has been receptive. and she's really appreciated that.

And I have to assume that the choice not to live together comes from that. But I am curious whether that is kind of hiding some other reservations. Sure. Here's the thing. Here's the thing. If you're Serena Williams, you have been the best tennis player in the world for going on 20 years. You have been extremely successful and have been in a charge of your life. and of a lot of other people's lives for a very long time,

much sooner than most of us are. And I would imagine that it is hard to suddenly just have a partner in all that. I get it. It takes some time. Maybe you don't want to jump right into living together. You don't want to jinx the whole thing. But it seems like it's time. It seems like I'm worried that she's a little closed off.

There are some other signs in this. Also, like, now the kid is here. Just like, don't you want to be in the same place? They don't even live in the same city? he lives in San Francisco and she is in Palm Beach. I feel like that's more normal than we think for famous people. Maybe. You know, I feel like, do Kim and Kanye, who are expecting, by the way, what a week?

They don't really live together, do they? Kim and Kanye? Yeah. They don't? I don't think so. Oh, I assume they're traveling. Oh, but like, I don't know. He hasn't been traveling for the last year.

Okay. That's true. All right. Here's another one that I think is a bit strange. Okay, hit me. Juliet. Yes. Are you familiar with Serena's longtime coach Patrick, Patrick Martoglu?

No, I'm not. Very handsome guy. Okay. Tell me more. Okay. That's important to know because it leads to set number two, which is that it is rumored and this profile pretty much confirms that she and Patrick were romantically involved at some point and are no longer. She just seems like an incredible force of nature. I kind of like can't wrap my head around it.

Right. So I agree with that. So here's the thing. He's still her coach. And she's asked about this in the piece. So Williams mentions another crucial point in Ohanian's favor. He has passed muster with Patrick Muratoglu, her coach of the past five years. And though neither has ever discussed it publicly, her romantic partner for a portion of that time. Damn. That's good. Then here's her quote. She's literally talking about it. Once we got over that little hump of weirdness, it was fine. She explains. I'm really good friends with most everyone I've ever dated. I don't like bad blood. Okay. You know you got bad blood. Sorry. Imagine how is this guy still in the picture if she's marrying Alexis?

Would you be, I would not be able to support this as Alexis or, frankly, probably as Serena. It would be too weird for me. Definitely too weird. Even like anyone, yeah, definitely too weird. Although if they're not around each other that much, like maybe it doesn't matter. Yeah. And I understand he's our coach and tennis comes first.

Though, I mean, there's maybe the problem tennis comes first. I don't know. Alexis seems really nice. He seems really, really obsessed with Serena, and I give him so much credit for that. Yeah, we all are. I feel the same way. I wish them well. But I just, I don't know.

Also, here's another one. They didn't find out the sex of the baby before she was born. Here's a quote from Vogue. Alexis thinks we're having a boy, but I have a strong suspicion that it's a girl, Serena says. Two weeks after we found out, I played the Australian Open. I told Alexis, it has to be a girl because there I was playing in a hundred-dury weather and the baby never gave me any trouble. Ride or die, women are tough that way. So, number one, that's a fantastic quote and Serena being my right is transcendent and that is why she's the best.

But also, I just kind of, you know, she's predicting the right sex. He doesn't know what's going on. He's just flying in from San Francisco on the weekend. I just don't see it, Juliet. I don't see it long term. I wish them well. They're going to be the basis of the rom-com revival in America. Because this is just, it just screams rom-com.

It's like all I can think about. It's true. He really likes her, so maybe he'll just hang out. I hope so. Maybe it'll be a nodding hill situation. And as I said, I watched it last night. Can't get it out of my head. I hope Serena gets whatever she wants.

That's kind of where I am. It's kind of great that she accurately predicted that it is a girl. I know. That quote's really great. The whole thing is very charming. She talks about being brain nervous, about actually giving birth. She makes fun of Cherapova again just because not makes fun of, but dismisses, which is because she can. Oh, and to bring it full circle.

As you know, in a celebrity profile, there are always a few quotes from famous friends or directors who the actor has worked with or, you know, They're called secondaries, but they are other famous people endorsing this famous person that you're reading about. This has the two greatest secondaries right in a row that I've ever personally seen in a celebrity profile. What are they? Here we go. I wish people could see her silly side, says Kim Kardashian West. She is obsessed with karaoke, which personally is my biggest fear in life. I remember a dinner in San Francisco before a DNC fundraiser.

Raina sang, Obama saying, Kanye sang. It was legendary. That's not even, that's just in the quote. We've got more coming. But if you're just name-dropping Obama in a quote from Kim Kardashian-West, and it's so good. Okay, ready? I'm ready. Can you guess the second person in the paragraph? Beyonce. Megan Markle. Oh, shit. The actress Megan Markle, another friend, says she will be an amazing mom the very best because she is so attuned to balancing strength and sensitivity. Plus, given that she is pretty epic at karaoke, I think she'll put her signature Serena spin on singing lullabies for the baby. So here are the two things we've learned.

Serena Williams is friends with every cool, famous person on the face of the earth. It seems like everyone just wants to be down with her. And number two, the karaoke thing is apparently very real. I'm just, they both brought it up. So it's a great piece. I'm very excited for Serena. I'm very excited that she was right about having the girl. And, you know, if she wants Mary Alexis O'Hanian, I hope she does.

And if she doesn't, I hope she finds her own way and does what she wants to do in life. I am on her side. May everyone find the love that George and Amal share. And Serena and whoever she chooses to be in love with. Exactly. Thanks for listening to this very special, unintentional couples edition of Jam Session, Celebrity Couples. Thanks to Hotel Tonight as always And listen to all of the Ringers podcasts