The Press Box - The Great Rom-Com Debate (Ep. 355)

Episode Date: September 27, 2017

The Ringer’s Amanda Dobbins and Shea Serrano ask and answer three essential questions regarding the romantic comedy genre: Is this creepy? (1:20); Is this a rom-com? (16:20); and, Who belongs in the Rom-Com Hall of Fame? (25:40). Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh, and welcome to a very special episode of Channel 33 on the Ringer podcast Network. I'm Amanda Dobbins, an editor at The Ringer. I am joined by the great Shea Serrano. Yes, sir. And we are here to talk about romantic comedies. And the reason that we are here is because Shay and I, a couple weeks ago, wrote an article about Home Again, the movie starring Reese Witherspoon. And it turned into a long opus about romantic comedies, which Shay and I both love.

Correct. So we answered a lot of questions in this piece. Questions like, what makes a romantic comedy and what is the best part of romantic comedy and what is the best meat cute? But we realized that there are many more questions that we did not answer and also a few things that we deeply disagree on. And so we wanted to air those disagreements in public. So we are going to do an entire episode dedicated to romantic comedies. I should specify that we're going to be talking about romantic comedies from the last 30 years. So things from about when Harry met Sally.

Yeah, from there going forward. No disrespect to the romantic comedies of the 30s and 40s. No, definitely disrespect to those. I like them, but, you know, not today. Maybe another time. So we have a couple segments. All right. The first segment of questions that I would like to answer, and I'm going to pose these to Shea, it's called Is This Creepy?

Because as some of you may know, romantic comedies, while delightful and life-affirming, also tend to hinge on really kind of screwed up romantic situations where if you took them out of a movie, you would think that someone was acting questionably. Questionable is a generous term. Irresponsibly. Yes. Definitely. Okay.

So she, I've prepared these questions for you. Okay. You're just going to decide whether they're creepy or not, and you can explain your reasoning. Oh, man. Okay. Is this creepy? Standing outside someone's house playing the song you had sex to on a boombox over your head. Yeah, that one is.

is definitely a creepy thing to do. Yeah, so that's a say-anything. I don't know how that's romantic. Would you want somebody to do that? No, I have always found say-anything to be very charming because John Cusack is charming. He's great. But otherwise, everything about it is too much.

I think it depends on the song also for me. What's an okay song? If she showed up and we had sex and we were listening to like DMX, then yeah, go for it. But something very sweet. No, thank you. If you hadn't had sex to the song, it was just a regular song, and you're trying to get someone back, and you're just holding a boom box outside for a while. Right.

I guess we don't even have to put it to a boom box. If someone is sitting because, you know, that's a dated reference. It's obviously very specific. If someone shows up like... You're holding a speaker. Yeah, I was going to say with her Bluetooth speaker. And kind of stands outside your house and it's like, I want you back and I'm playing Whitney Houston. How do you feel about that?

Do you feel moved or violated? I feel like what I'm going to do is I'm going to go to the picture. I'm going to go to the window, I'm going to take a picture, and post it on Twitter, and make a joke of some sort. Right. But then do you end up with a person or not? I don't think so. I think that that move is just a little too thirsty for me.

I agree with you. I need distance from this. I want you to go home and we can talk tomorrow. That's past feeling like you're being chased. Yeah. That's like there's being chased romantically and then being chased by like a monster. And that's what that one feels like. I will say in the scheme of kind of rom-com.

grand gestures, it's pretty limited. It's not like a flash mob, which I would be, I would never speak to anyone who organized a flashbub. Really? If someone organized a flash mob for me, I would leave immediately. Like the flash mob would not even be done and I would run away. I would be down for the flash mob. Why? Because with the boombox thing, there's no preparation or anything.

Let me just get the radio and play it. But with a flash mop, that's like weeks of planning. And I respect that. And if you're going to put that much time into our relationship, then I'm in. Okay, you've made me feel ungenerous. You should absolutely feel ungenerous. I would be so mortified.

I would honestly just want to melt into the ground. Yeah, it would be hard to watch, but afterward you would have to look at him and be like, that was kind of like a cool thing. As a measurement of someone's commitment and ability to work for a relationship, I suppose it's nice. And a boombox is kind of an afterthought. It's just like.

Yeah, I'll just do this real quick. Okay. It's still a little creepy though. Both are creepy. Yes. Here's the next is this creepy. Falling in love with someone because of a radio call-in show and then dumping your very nice fiancé Bill Pullman to go meet him at the top of the Empire State Building.

It's you. It's me. I saw you in the street. Are you Annie? Yes. I don't think that's creepy. I think that's just a sign that maybe that relationship wasn't as strong as we thought it was. Which I don't understand because Bill Pullman is great.

Right. I would absolutely marry Bill Pullman if I had the chance. Yes, we'll come back to that shortly. Especially like late 80s, early 90s, Bill Pullman. Yeah. So I don't think that that's a creepy thing. I think that's more of like there was something wrong in the relationship. Maybe he had cheated on her.

I think your assessment is right that maybe something is wrong there. I would say that the whole fixating on a voice on the radio that you know very little about and upending your whole life to go find the voice on the radio is probably not healthy. Yeah. Again, I keep going up. back to it. That's a situation where when you're in a relationship that isn't that great, you look for stuff like that. Like, you just automatically fall in love with the woman at the grocery store. Okay. Because you're looking for something. Okay. So it's a coping mechanism. It's not creepy.

Yeah, exactly. Okay. Not creepy. That one is not creepy. Okay. Our producer is telling us that we need to explain that they broke up amicably. But I don't want to talk about that. I want to assume that he was cheating on her. Or there's something wrong with that relationship. I think it's just more interesting. Yeah, I would say that people can break up amically all of the time, and that doesn't mean that the relationship wasn't flawed in some way. I mean, it's nice. Nora Ephron doesn't like messy stuff in her movies, so you're supposed to feel good about it. So there's no darkness in it. But if you want to think about it for two seconds, which is kind of the tagline of this whole segment.

If you think about this for two seconds, then something's going on here. Yeah, definitely. So, you know, maybe they just, maybe they weren't meant to be. They clearly were not meant to be. Meg Ryan does have a habit of being in relationships where she doesn't love people in Nora Ephron, romantic comedies. It's basically her out every single time. You've got male, sleepless in Seattle. Even when Harry met, I guess when Harry met Sally, they break up because they don't have sex on the kitchen floor anymore, which has always stuck with me as a line. That's one of those things

that only works in the movies. The nice breakup? No, no, having sex on the floor or like taking a bath with someone. It's never great. You're always like there's one person who you have the faucet digging into your back because that's the side that you got. Yeah, that's true. No tub is large enough to accommodate it. It's also, you know, not that many people have kind of the movie sex showers in their homes with the bench. I don't either. I've never had a bench in my shower. It's true. But the kitchen counter, kitchen floor, they didn't even show the sex on the kitchen floor and when Harry met Sally. Good. I don't want to see Billy Crystal having sex. I know. Well, it's the other guy. It's the slightly hotter guy that she didn't have sex with. Oh yeah, that's right. That's right.

I don't mean to disrespect Billy Crystal. It's just kind of they were casting for a specific type of guy. All right. The next one. Nursing a stranger. through a coma for love. I was never engaged to Peter. We never even met until that day on the tracks. It's just when we were in the hospital room. Everything happened so fast, and I couldn't tell you the truth. And then I didn't want to tell you the truth because the truth was that I fell in love with you.

Yeah, that's a creepy one. That's a very creepy one. What do you think, in San Diego? What are you thinking there? That's obviously while you were sleeping. While you were sleeping. I like they didn't call it while you were in a coma. That's true.

Way different. That's great. That's true. Yeah, that was a bad move on her part. Because she lied about it too, right? She pretended we're in a relationship and that's why I'm here. Yeah. It was this whole thing.

That's a creepy one. That's a very easy call there. And then doesn't she end up with his brother? Yeah, she ends up with his brother. Right. Who's Bill Pullman? Who's Bill Pullman. So it works out for Bill Pullman.

Bill Pullman had an upgrade. Yes. Absolutely. It's not the most honest way to get into a relationship. Lie in your way in. And I guess we're supposed to think because she ends up with the relationship that's founded on love instead of like lies and comas that it's okay. Right. Yeah.

What's the guy's name in real life? Gallagher, right? Peter Gallagher? Very intimidating eyebrows. Yes. I don't understand why you would pick him to pretend to fall in love with. He's got a certain time. So she falls in love with him from afar because she is, I believe, a subway.

Yeah. She does a token operator. And she sees him every day going in and out of the subway. They do a decent job. He walks to the subway with swagger. I will say that. I don't know. I couldn't go past the eyebrows.

Okay. All right. That's creepy is what we've decided. Yes. Okay. Here's another one. Reverse catfishing. We can decide whether this is reverse catfishing. Okay.

But it is certainly lying to the woman you put out of business so that she'll fall in love with you when you reveal that you've been writing her these emails the whole time. Which is a summary of maybe a top five for me. You've got mail. I wanted it to be you. I wanted it to be used so bad. Yeah, that's a good movie. I think that's more sleazy than creepy.

It's dishonest. It's very dishonest. I don't think creepy, though. I don't get creepy from that. Is it reverse catfishing? It's a version of catfishing. Okay. Yeah.

So in case you haven't seen you've got mail, the terms are that Tom Hanks and Meg Ryan meet in a AOL chat room in the early days of AOL and start up in an email correspondence. But they don't know anything about each other other than their screen names. top girl in NY152 because I've seen this movie many times. And so then in real life, they meet each other in the business arena because Meg Ryan owns a bookstore and Tom Hanks owns essentially a Barnes & Noble, not called that. And Tom Hanks's large book chain puts Meg Ryan's small bookstore out of business. Okay. So that ends that. That ends that. Ruins her life. Ruins her life. And then Tom Hanks realizes

that she is shop girl. She is the woman he's been e-mailed. with. And it's like, here's what I'm going to do. I'm going to make it right. I'm going to become friends with her in real life, convince her to love me for myself, then I'll reveal that I'm the guy. Instead of trying to hide who he is in real life, he's trying to hide who he is on the internet so that when he reveals that he's the same person that he is on the internet, I guess another problem is that it works. Like if you're Meg Ryan and someone puts you out of business and then- She's making a lot of bad decisions. And then shows up at your house with Daisy.

and it's like I'd like to be your friend. I think nine times out of ten, you're kicking that person out. Absolutely. This is the beginning of another movie relationship where she leaves for some crazy reason because this is just clearly not going to work out. This is one of the few rom-coms where you watch it

and you're supposed to be at the end saying, like, there's no way that this becomes a lifelong thing. That's true. But it's Tom Hanks giving the speech, so it works out. Tom Hanks is great. Tom Hanks giving that speech. Juliet, Lippman, and I did a very, every watchables have you got mail?

I think we spend 10 minutes talking about how good Tom Hanks is at the moment that he is trying to convince the woman that he put out of business to love him anyway and that literally no one else on the planet Earth could get away with that. Probably not. But Tom Hanks nails it. Let me ask you something.

How can you forgive this guy for standing you up and not forgive me for this tiny little thing? I'm putting you out of business. How I wish you would. He's really great. Is Tom Hanks handsome? Yes. He's handsome?

Yeah, but not in like a male model way. He's in a... So he's ugly. No. There are different ways. There are different categories. He's handsome, but not in a handsome way. Well, and Tom Hanks is so handsome.

He's just, he has a different quality of handsome. I think he's cool. I think he's very trustworthy. He's a very trustworthy face. But I don't know that I can call him handsome. If he walked into a room, you'd be like, wow, that guy. I would be starstruck if he walked into a room, but I would not be like, wow, that guy's hand. Charisma goes a long way on these things.

In a very like L.A. type situation, I was here visiting and I just happened to see Seth Myers in person. He was like walking by. And he's incredibly handsome in real life, which I was not expecting. He's got a great build, awesome teeth, nice eyes. He's very polite. He says hello when he walks by. I don't think that that happens with Tom Hanks. I feel the similar type of, I would be very much starstruck and like, yo, that's Woody that just walked by.

But I wouldn't be like, yo, I would be like, yo, I would. I want to like hold his hand. I would bet a lot of money that you would. My life is now dedicated to engineering a situation in which Tom Hanks walks into a room and you lose your mind. All right. Because you will. You would immediately just hold his hand. All right.

You might be right. That's fine. We'll make it happen. All right. Here's the next one. Are you ready? All right. Marrying your ex stepbrother, which is clueless.

Mel, I want to help out Mel. He's the only one who cares about me. That's not true. He's not. Are you saying you care about me? Josh. Yeah, that's creepy. That's that Game of Thrones creepy.

Okay. It's ex-stepbrother. X-Step brother. They don't share any genetic material. They don't. The movie Clueless makes it seem like Josh, played by Paul Rudd, and Cher, played by Alicia Silverstone, were only stepbrother and step-sister for like a year, max.

Very brief relationship. Right. In fact, I think she says, you were married to his mother for like half a second. So how long do you have to be someone's stepbrother or step sister? For half a second. For half a second. Half a second. It's a hard line for you.

It's over after that. Because there's no way for you to tell the story of you meeting each other without being like we were stepbrother and step sister at one point. It just can't happen. It's like if you have a piece of pizza and you dip it in the toilet. If you just dip it real fast, it was still in the toilet and you can't eat it no matter how fast of a time. it was. So it's done. No, no, no, no. That metaphor doesn't work because the toilet water is changing the essential quality of the pizza. It has like a physical effect. There's no physical relationship between

a stepbrother and a step-sister. There's no genetic sharing. It's a construct. You dipped in a toilet. You dipped that relationship in the toilet is what you did. It's definitely happened in real life many times. Absolutely. Especially if Paul Rudd is in it. He's handsome. Paul Rudd is handsome. Okay. And I would probably, if he was my stepbrother, make that same move, at least you did. So situationally, you're okay with it, but in general it's creepy. If Paul Rudd is involved, go for it. Okay.

Anybody else besides Paul Rudd? That's just a good life rule, I guess. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay. I think what we've decided is that all rom-coms are creepy. They're creepy. There's no way around it. With the coma one, probably the worst.

Yes. While you were in a coma. Okay, so our next segment is the very simple, is this a rom-com? Yeah. And this segment was born out of we had this conversation a lot while writing the piece and we still talk a lot about it in the office, which is just the definition of a rom-com is not fixed. And people seem to have different definitions of what a romantic comedy is. Right. And so we're going to make some tough decisions that cannot be reversed.

Okay. So we'll start with clueless then. Okay. Because that was the first one I thought of when you, as soon as you started talking about this creepy situation, is clueless really a rom-com? I would vote yes. Okay. And here's why. Hit me with it.

It is also obviously a satire. It's a Jane Austen adaptation. It's a teen comedy. It's a lot of things. But I don't think of a romantic comedy as a genre that excludes all other genres. Something can be a romantic comedy and a teen movie. Something can be a romantic comedy and like a New York movie. The key to me for romantic comedy is pretty, it's pretty simple, actually.

It's a structure. It's two people who don't realize they like you. other at the beginning and spend most of the movie dancing around that fact and usually bickering with each other. But basically spend most of them unaware of that fact. And then they get together at the end. Right. That's it.

And that is what happens in Lewis because they're stepbrother and step sister, which means they definitely don't realize that they like each other and they bicker a lot, but there is a certain amount of chemistry to them from the very beginning. And then they get together pretty much at the end. All right. I'm going to disagree with you. Okay. A great deal here.

That's great. Oh, a great deal. A great deal. Let's review the rules we set in place from the article. I have it pulled up here. All right. So if you're going to be in a romantic comedy, you have to have a few things in place. You have to have a protagonist who, whether they know it or not, needs to find love,

which is what you're talking about here. You need to have the thing you talked about where there's like a – they don't like each other in the beginning, and then they end up du-legging each other. And you've got to have some jokes in there as well. But I think one thing that I didn't mention in the article that I'm just now realizing, as we're talking about it now, is I think one of the secretly essential parts of a romantic comedy is that the main relationship in the movie has to be between the protagonist and the person they're supposed to fall in love with.

And I think that's a box that eliminates a whole bunch of these movies. So the movie has to be about the relationship. Right. Okay. So that's why I would say something like bridesmaids. Yes. Isn't a romantic comedy. No.

Because the main relationship is with Kristen Wig and Maya Rudolph. Right. And not Kristen Wig. and the guy. I forget his name. What's his name? Chris O'Dowd. He's funny.

Very charming. Yeah. So that's why, like, Brise made to me is not a romantic comedy because it doesn't satisfy that rule. I need that rule above all other ones.

I need for that to be in place. It's a different movie without that. I can accept that. Okay. So you would argue that Cooless is more about sharing herself than it is about her finding Josh.

Absolutely. Because she's only like 17 years old. She doesn't. 16. Because she fills her driver's chest. Yeah. 16 years old. Which is another thing.

thing we forgot to talk about the age difference between her and Josh in that particular movies. We'll move past it. Yeah. He was like in college, right? I didn't even put never been kissed in the is it creepy category because that's just that's creepy. It's creepy.

It's tough. It's a tough one. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So that one's out. All right. I can accept that. Okay. I think it has rom-com.

It's like leaning rom-com. It is. How about that? It's leaning toward rom-com, but it's not rom-com. It's like fusion. V-plot rom-com. Okay. I'll take that.

Okay. All right. I'm going to give you a plot and then you just tell me if this is a romantic comedy. Is this a real plot or is it a plot that you wrote? It's a real plot. Okay. Okay. So you've got a leading man.

Matthew McConaughey. Heard of him. Fantastic and Ronca. Just a great rom-com. Leading man, also a great secondary character when like the female is the lead. And he's great in that role. So you've got let's plug him in there. And let's say he's a lawyer.

Okay. He's working on the case of his life. Okay. Okay. And we need a female protagonist. in there to fall in love with. So let's take Sandra because she's excellent. Yes.

And she ends up being like an assistant to him on the case. Sure. Sure. And while working on it, we get some chemistry going on there. Absolutely. Can this be a romantic comment? Because he has to solve his case at the end. What is the, remind me what the nature of the case is? I don't want to say yet.

Right. So it has potential. Okay. Though I don't love the boss secretary aspect. But that's a big part of it. They have to work together. Yeah, that's true. Isn't that the main one you love with Hugh Grant and Renee?

Yes, that's true. Yes, but she doesn't end up with Hugh Grant. It's the same as I think. In Bridget Jones Diary, she goes and she becomes a TV presenter, as they say in the UK, and then marries the lawyer. Right. Can I tell you what movie this is? Yes.

A time to kill. I kind of thought that's where you were going. And that's why I asked what the nature of the case was. I was like, is there another movie star? Matthew McConaughey and Sandra Bullock where they're both working in the legal profession that's a romantic comedy. It's her worst romantic comedy. Yeah, so that illustrates your point of there has to be a tone and there are jokes. Yeah, it's got to be in there.

Is Wedding Crashers a romantic comedy? Oh, interesting. No. No, because it's as much about Owen Wilson and Vince Vaughn as it is about Owen Wilson and Rachel McAdams. Why hasn't she been in more? More romantic comedies? You know what, Shea? after we wrote our piece, I went back and rewatched the film Morning Glory, which stars

Rachel McAdams, Harrison Ford, Diane Keaton, and Patrick Wilson. Okay. And I think based on the rules that we just discussed, it is not technically a rom-com because it's more about her work relationship. And she works at a morning show with Harrison Ford and Diane Keaton. And it's about her finding herself and being successful. And then she also gets to sleep with Patrick Wilson, which shout out to her. But I think that's probably the closest that Rachel McAdams has gotten to a romantic comedy.

It is a true delight. I loved it. You got to go rewatch it. But I think it didn't do that well. Notebook was 2004. And that's when Rachel McAdams became Rachel McAdams. And that's kind of the end of the great romantic comedy boom in Hollywood. After about 2006 or 2007, they aren't really making romantic comedies anymore.

Right. For a lot of reasons that I disagree with. But I think she was probably a little late. Is Princess Bride a romantic comedy? I'm going to vote no again because it's a romance told in a funny way. And then there's kind of the comedy around it in the grandfather, grandson, retelling. Right, right, right. But the actual story, it's more of a fantasy parody than it is a romantic comedy.

Okay. Because they love each other the whole time and they're separated. It's not their fault that they're separated. Why doesn't he just tell her early on who he is? Because then you wouldn't have intrigue. Is that creepy? Probably a little. Is that creepy that he did that?

Yeah. That's like the real life version of the Tom Hanks thing with the emails. Yeah, it's true. He tells her that he killed her fiancé, her beloved was he. I killed him. Also, she should probably recognize him, but that's a different situation. I'm just going to point that out. We're suspending a lot of disbelief in that particular one.

All right. Is the breakup starring Vince Vaughn and Jenna Branson? Is that a romantic comedy? I just had a wash of kind of visceral. discomfort throughout my whole body because that movie makes me... It's so good. I am so... It's good, but I'm so uncomfortable.

And no, it's not a romantic comedy. No? For two reasons. Okay. Number one, it's about a breakup. It's about a breakup. Number two, I'm so uncomfortable, as I just stated, just even thinking about it. And as we said, part of a romantic comedy is the tone and wanting to...

Part of it is the tone and enjoying watching it and it being funny. And it's funny, but in a... dark biting all of our hatred is spilled onto the pageway the worst impulses of humanity way all right the way it ends yeah is they break up they break all the way up they're separated Vince Fawn's tourism business is booming they get the boat they're taking land see and air they're on that path and he runs into her on the street that's that's how the movie ends and they share a little moment and they're kind of flirty and they smile and like Like, what happens after that?

I think you're supposed to think that they're mature and they've learned and they are able to say hello to each other and have healed and go on with their lives and don't get back together. Okay. In real life, they definitely sleep together. And then it's another three months of, you know, terrible back and forth. Okay. Which is just never get back together with someone who's put you through this level of breakup is what I have to say to everyone listening. That's fair. What I don't understand is I think they both misplay that situation because neither the,

one of them really wanted to break up. She definitely didn't want to break up. That's what the whole her part of the movie is about, her trying to like make him understand that. Right. He definitely didn't want to break up because he's heartbroken when it happens. Right. But as you said, sometimes relationships don't work for reasons that we don't totally understand or can't see. That's too bad because they're good together. Yeah. They're good together. Jennifer Anderson is in my rom-com Hall of Fame. Great segue. I'm putting her in there. Let's do that. She's not in mine. She's, I'm already mad. Okay.

We're going to build it eight people in there. Okay. And you're going to get to pick four and I'm going to get to pick four. Okay. And we'll go one after the other. Okay. And you go first. I'm just doing this because I know it's going to make you mad.

Trey with Hugh Grant. Let's do it. He's number one on my list. Okay. Okay. Are you ready? Yeah, make the case. Four weddings and a funeral.

That's a good one. It's extremely charming. It's pretty good. It's pretty good. It's pretty good. And the floppy hair and, you know, it's where you don't actually get that many romantic comedies that are focused on the male character. So that's nice in a way, different perspective.

Right. Some great speeches. It also just kind of put him squarely in that lane. So he made a million rom-coms. And we got Bridget Jones Diary. Delightful. And he's the cat in that. He's not even the main character.

He's playing against type. But I loved it anyway. You get Notting Hill, a classic. Mm-hmm. With the great Julia Roberts. Excellent Julia Roberts. And the immortal speech, I'm just a girl standing in front of a boy asking him to love for. I'm also just a girl

standing in front of a boy asking him to love her Fantastic That's a Julia speech show That's not a... He doesn't get credit for that Yes, but he's there You know, rom-coms are like The reaction is as important as

The original statement There's something about science and Isaac Newton That I couldn't quite get to there But it's like, it's the general idea All right Okay And then my kind of most underrated romcom of the last 30 years is two weeks notice starring Hugh Grant and Sandra Bullock.

Right, right, right. Which Hugh Grant kind of plays the air to some sort of real estate fortune. He's basically a Trump figure, but not terrible. And Sandra Bullock comes to work at his company as a lawyer. Oh, another Sandra Bullock. See? Yes. But she's not his assistant.

She's his lawyer. She does work for him, though. And, you know, it's kind of like opposites attract and they fall in love. It's a total delight. Okay. So that's four really essential romantic comedies that I have listed right there. Yeah. You know, I have a couple of problems with Hugh.

Oh, God. Okay. First of all, he's just not that handsome. Strong as Vito. And it's fine. You and I have different tastes, and that is what makes the world go around, that everyone is attracted to different types of people. But he's adorable.

There's a difference between adorable and handsome. He is adorable. And he's cool and about a boy. Oh, that's right. I forgot about it, boy. Lovely in that movie. But he's got this sort of like, he's got weird teeth. He's British.

Well, sure, but like, it's still weird teeth. Yeah. I'm American. I'm not used to it. No, I think you put him in the movies that are set in Europe and he's like, oh, he is very clearly handsome in that setting. But if you put him on the screen of Will Smith or George Clooney and it's a runaway, like, that's the ugly friend. Plus, he's got weird posture. He's always sort of hunched over a little bit.

The British kind of. I like that on assuming but also very charming vibe, which he has. Here's the thing about if you're in a room with George Clooney, who I agree is extraordinarily handsome. But George Clooney is so smooth and charming and kind of rat pack era that it's, I would be embarrassed. Like I would just start blushing. I wouldn't actually know what to do. I would not ever be able to interact with George Clooney. I actually can't wrap my head around.

a world in which like George clean and I would just never be together. Right. That makes me uncomfortable. But Hugh Grant is accessible in a charming, handsome. I get it. You get it. Right. I think the best argument you can make for Hugh Grant is that there just aren't a lot of guys who are better than him in that role.

If we're just putting it out there like that. That's his best thing is he's playing in a weak division. He's in the Eastern Conference throwing that out there. All right. So he, okay, so that's yours. That's mine. Okay. Let's call him eighth place.

That's so rude. Since we already mentioned Aniston, I'm going to go with Jennifer Aniston, who I think might be my second favorite rom-com person of all. She's very good at sort of bouncing around the emotions. And she's also funny, which I think is cool. And I also feel like if she needed to beat somebody up, she could, she would do well in that situation. Name her top three romantic comedy roles for me. All right. She's the one.

Okay. Picture perfect. Okay. The object of my affection. These are all pretty depressing rom-coms. Yeah, they're pretty depressing. They're all, because her character is always really desperate. I'll throw some happy ones in there.

No, that's fine. I mean, you're allowed to, I think part of the reason that Aniston doesn't immediately pop to the top of my head is because those kind of, quote, realistic romantic comedies are not realistic, but kind of the bummer romantic comedies are not at the top of my list. Right. Because I just feel sad for her. So I think that's why. But she's very good in them. You could also make the argument that Friends is like a 10-year rom-com. And she's spectacular.

And she's the best one in Friends. Yes, absolutely. And she always has the best hair. I can make peace with this. I'm not going to say rude things about your pick like you did about mine. Also, just go with it with Adam Sandler. Oh, yeah. Surprisingly good.

Yeah. The Switch with Jason Bateman. That's the one with the turkey baster. Yeah. Okay. I have some issues there. I think we can put that one to the side. Okay.

All right. She's my first pick. All right, you've got three left. I accept. Let's go quick. Okay. All right. Meg Ryan.

Yeah. I was waiting for you to not say Meg Ryan so I could point out that she was the one reacting to the Tom Hanks speech that you talked about earlier. I was going to make a very clever point. But you just made it. That's good. Yeah. I mean, when Harry met Sally, sleepless in Seattle, you've got mail.

If we could put Nora Ephron on the Mount Rushmore. I don't put directors in there? I don't think we should. I don't think we should. But she's in there. But Meg Ryan is a stand-in for Norah Fron. And I adore those movies. She's a proxy.

Yeah. Here's a Meg Ryan question for you. Has she ever been the star of a rom-com? Has she ever been the best one in a rom-com? I think you could make a strong case for when Harry met Sally. She's better than Billy? Well, she's got the famous orgasm scene that I'll have what she's having. Yes!

Yes! Yes! Oh, God. I'll have what she's having. That might put her over the time. Yeah. I mean, that's kind of the all-time. Yeah. All right.

You got... And that kind of starts rom-coms as we know it. You're fair. I'll take an easy pick here. I'm going to go Julia Roberts, who I think is the number one, greatest of all time. That's true. The Jordan multiplied by LeBron. We haven't talked about my best friend's wedding at all.

I don't think we're going to get a chance to. Okay. Which is good because that should take at least four hours. Okay. That's a four-hour podcast. So Julia is my second pick. I've got Aniston and Julia Robertson. I'm feeling pretty good about my team versus Hugh Grant and Meg Ryan.

We're blowing you all off to screen. Wow. That's so rude. All right. I'm going to take Hanks. That was a good pick. You stole that one out from under me. Right.

Sorry. All right. But Sleepless in Seattle and you've got mail. I need a guy on my team. So give me McConaughey. Okay. I need it. You know what I need on my team?

Because I've got two stars. I need the picture frame. I don't need the picture. I need a frame. Okay. And he's just exactly that. Yeah. Also, I need one scene where he's like at the beach.

That's true. That does really help. I always like the scene in the movies when they're like surprised that a person is really fit. It happens in just go with it. When Adam Sandler's trying to woo the one girl. Right, right, right. And then Jennifer Anderson is like, I'm also here too. But yeah, I need that with McConaughey.

And he's, I mean, I need that with a guy giving him McConaughey. Okay. There's my third. All right. My final, Reese Witherspoon. My girl. She just took my, you took two of my four. Did I?

I'm sorry. Well, that's good because we liked Home Again, though it's maybe not a traditional Romcom. I loved it. Sweet Home Alabama. Legally blonde, which is not technically a rom-com, but, Has rom-com rising. Okay. Reese is a better version of Jennifer Aniston, I think.

It's true. I like the movies a little more. And then Reese can be a little hard-edged, but she also has the sunniness that you kind of want when you're sitting down to watch a two-hour movie about people falling in love. Just as a funny chin. It's true. That is like, that's charming when she smiles. And you're like, hey, I feel comfortable right now. Yeah.

Okay. Reese is a good pick. And I'm very, very excited that we make. made it through there and Renee Zellweger did not get picked because I'm out on Renee. Against both Jerry McGuire and Bridget Jones, sorry? Yeah, Hugh Grant is better than her in Bridget. Tom Cruise is better than her in Jerry McGuire. Wow.

She just, I don't know. She's reacting. She's reacting. She is reacting. She's there and you had me at Hello. She's squinting her ass off in those movies. She is reacting. But you can't have.

Reacting. You can't have Jerry McGuire without you had me at Hello. And that's her. You had me at Hello. You had me at hello. But I think you could get four other actresses to give that same line in that same sort of way. That's true. Now, Jerry McGuire was, I think, her best movie, better than the other ones,

because she sort of turned it back just a little bit. It just made the most sense to me to see her in that role, but she didn't make mine. I'm going to go with Sandy. Give me Sandy. Yeah, of course. Give me Sandra Bullock over Renee. I like this lineup. I've got Sandra, I've got McConaughey, I've got Julia, my ringer, and I've got Aniston.

I'm solid. And I've got Hugh Grant, Tom Hanks, Reese Witherspoon, and Meg Ryan. I would watch that movie. Let's put that together. I need a double rom-com. Has that ever happened? We had two relationships going at once? Never in a true rom-com sense.

There's always one relationship. They're always the best friends who are having a hard time. You know, I did have Judy Greer on my second tier if I needed to draft someone else. Because Julie Greer is a great best friend in many romantic comedies and she should be honored for her contributions to the genre. But it never really works out for the kind of B plot in the same way it does for the A plot. Who do you have on your alternates? Give me four alternates. Well, you used most of them.

Judy Greer was kind of my best one. I had Julia on there too. Give me Jennifer Lopez. Yeah. Give me Gabriel Union. surprisingly good. Like, you don't realize it until you go through her IMDB page. You're like, oh, man, she's been putting in work.

That's true. Give me Adam Sandler. Yeah, not my. Give me Adam Sandler just all the strength of the wedding singer, which I think is the best version of a movie that was exactly half comedy and half romantic. They did it better than any other than train wreck almost got there. Train wreck was closer than I thought it was going to get, but it didn't quite pull it off. Adam Sandler's in there off just the strength of that. Also, is Punch Drunk Love a romantic comedy?

It's too serious. I think it's just... It's too much going on with the pudding? Yeah, it's a drama with romantic elements. Okay. Or dramedy with romantic elements. All right. I wish we got more Freddie Prince Jr. in this conversation.

There are a lot of people we forgot. We forgot. Again, not enough time, not enough words. All right. So that is it for our very special romantic comedy episode of Channel 33. on the Ringer Podcast Network. Thank you all for listening. If you disagree with everything that we said,

Shay is at Shea Serrano on Twitter. So you can let him know. Nope. Thank you so much.