The Prestige TV Podcast - 'Little Fires Everywhere' | TV Concierge

Episode Date: April 27, 2020

Bill Simmons explains to Amanda Dobbins why even though Reese Witherspoon's latest TV project, 'Little Fires Everywhere,' is very bad, he watched every single episode. Hosts: Bill Simmons and Amanda Dobbins Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

TV concierge, my name is Bill Simmons. I'm with Amanda Davins. We both suffered through a show called Little Fires Everywhere on Hulu. That was a big Hulu project that was a captivating watch for the following reason. I thought it was one of the worst television shows I've ever seen. I enjoyed every minute of it. And the season finale went to levels that I just was not prepared for. Amanda, are you glad you watch the show? I'm glad to know about it. It is one of those transcendent train wrecks that really has to be seen to. be believed or disbelieved, as the case may be, because especially the last three hours, I just yelled, what are they doing? What are they doing? What are they doing at the TV? And that's fun. Yeah, I agree. It was also fun to watch with other people. I watched every episode with my wife and my daughter. We made jokes the whole time. It was a peanut gallery show. It's a show that it's unclear how the wheels came off at what point in the creative process. It was based on a book. Reese's production company did it. She's playing basically,

the same character as the Big Little Lies character except more evil would you say that? Yes definite shades of Madeline but just no development whatsoever. She's like the McCauley Calkin character from the Good Sun

which is actually not a movie that I remember. I just remember the poster which is McCulley Calkin making that like I'm evil smile which Reese Witherspoon does 20 times in this show. Would you have tried to tuck Reese out of this one because that's kind of where I landed right about halfway through episode

two. Like why? What was special about this character? Why was this a different choice for you than Big Little Lies character? I didn't understand it. I go back and forth on this. Reese is very important to both of us. We are in the Reese Witherspoon Support Club. You are like a founding member as I understand it. And I want good things for her. So in that sense, yes, I would have tried to talk her out of it because this didn't work out. I do. kind of like that she's self-aware. Like, she clearly knows that we all think she's really uptight type A

Southern lady. And so she keeps seeking out these characters and then tries to like make them as evil as possible and have fun with it. I appreciate that. But I don't really think she assembled the correct team to explore that world with.

Agree. So if you're Reese's husband and you're like, okay, so she's played two shows in a row here, uptight, everything seems perfect on the surface lady who cheats on her husband and doesn't really have it that many regrets on it. Should I look at the mirror here? Yeah, I would be asking some questions. Though, Twist, you pointed out an interesting and important plot point, which is that Reese's character cheats on her husband, who's played by Joshua Jackson, aka Pacey, and we will get to him.

Yeah. But there is one episode where, like, Reese's character goes to New York and meets, like, her former boyfriend who she has an affair with. And I was like, I want this to be the whole show. Like, I just want to see what happens. I don't even care about the Carrie Washington character, who we have not discussed yet. Just show me Reese having an affair and then her kids are mad and it's like unfaithful too. I would love it. Right.

But except the thing when Reese becomes the unfaithful, her sex drive is overpowering the character person, they never go full tilt with it. And it always seems kind of awkward and weird. Like it was a big little lies when she has. She's having, oh, no, not Big Little Liza, the morning show when she's like, I'm going on a run. I'm going to go on a sex run here and have sex with the bartender in the back. And it was just like, oh, no, why, Reese? No. But she also has sex in Big Little Lies.

Remember with like the guy who's directing the community theater play of Avenue Q? And she's like, I must have sex with this guy because of my commitment to the community arts. Yeah. It's never clear whether people want to have sex with Reese's character who's always completely loathsome to hang around with. That part never makes sense. Carrie Washington, another person near and dear to my heart who I support fully. I feel like I've been with a long time from I've owned Stockton, this person. I say this with all due respect.

She's terrible in the show. I don't know what happened. I don't know why she is treating every scene like it's the fences scene with Denzel and Viola Davis is crying. Every scene is the most important acting experience she's ever had. And nobody at any point were like, hey, Carrie. Maybe dial it back 20%. Yeah.

So I would like to offer a partial defense of Carrie Washington, who I agree is not good on this show. There are two things. This show is theoretically about how Reese Witherspoon's character and Carrie Washington's character become kind of interested or obsessed with each other and then their families become intertwined and then terrible things happen. Except they have no friend chemistry whatsoever, which I'm sure they like each other in real life. And I love both of these people, but you don't really buy that these two characters care about each other. Number two, Carrie Washington gets asked to give the most ridiculous

speeches in every episode. She suddenly has to explain like a major sociological concept to every single other person in the show. And it's it's not her fault that it's bad writing. You know, I have seen her deliver preposterous speeches on scandal, like preposterous. plot. But because Shauna Rhymes knows how to write a speech, you enjoy it. And this is like, she didn't have a ton to work with. That's why I did the big caveat before I talked about how bad she is on the show because it's like, I don't think she knew what to do. So her solution was like, I'm just going to overact in all my scenes. I'm with you. It never, I mean, are the many faults of the show. It's unclear why Carrie Washington and Reese Witherspoon would ever have

interacted at any point in the show. It's always awkward. It's always insulting to Carrie Washington character and it makes no sense. And by the way, this is the stretch of the show when it actually seemed like it had a chance to make sense. I mean, when you talk about the wheels coming off the last three episodes, it's indescribable. It really is. I would actually urge people to watch this if they hadn't seen it. I've never seen a show like this.

The thing is, is you can't understate how soapy this show is. Like, people scream, that's my baby at other people on this show. every single episode. Like multiple times, there's not even one, that's my baby plotline. There's like four, that's my baby plot lines. There's also, Carrie Washington's character is supposed to be an artist with all respect to Carrie Washington. Some of the worst art I have ever seen in my entire life. There's a really tremendous reveal involving one of Carrie Washington's art projects and Reese Witherspoon's character, we'll just leave it at that. Every single time you think it's going to a place of, oh, I guess we're going to talk about a thought, or maybe these two characters

will have a moment. Instead, it's like next level soap opera. You stole my baby nonsense. Yeah. So I guess if it had been sold to us from the get-go as this is like the most well-done lifetime movie miniseries you've ever seen, it would have made more sense to me, but I don't think that was the intention. I think they felt like they were doing a really weighty show. about women's choices, women's control of their bodies, about adoption, about racism. I feel like they felt like this was going to win 19 Emmys. I really do. I agree with you. And I think that's the problem. And I also, it's not to say that soapy shows can't have ideas or can't be about stuff, which they can. I think you and I are both fans of

like a lot of really trashy shows that also have something to say about the way we live our life. But the problem with this show is that it doesn't know it's soapy. Like every single time someone yells, that's my baby. It's like they're doing the braveheart speech. And instead of, and they really think that they are exploring serious issues at a high level. And they just, they don't really know how to execute it. It kind of reminds me of morning show as well, which is another show that you and I loved or loved to hate watch, which the issues just kind of get away from them.

It's hard to be Aaron Sorkin and write TV. dialogue about things. Well, and I think that speaks to this incredible year. Reese just had Big Little Lies Season 2, which was, in retrospect, just bad. We wanted it to be good. Merrill Streep's in it. But now that I look back, I'm like, would I have rather had that seven hours back? Yes.

Then Morning Show, which was almost irredeemable except for episode 8, that one great episode had. Other than that, it was terrible. And then this show, it's like, Reese, who's picking your projects? fire your production company executive. Start over. I guess she's picking them. And this one comes from Reese loves to adapt books.

And that's been her thing for, you know, Reese Ruther Spruen reads like 100 books a year or something, which is a lot of books, more than I read. And so I think she thought that this would be a lane for her. But it really just is Big Little Lies Season 2 all over again. Like, do you remember that there's a custody battle that's like a court case for the last two episodes of Big Little Lies Season 2? And nobody wanted to watch it then.

And definitely no one wants to watch this one. This one makes Big Little Ice Season to look like Kramer versus Kramer. But we get Josh Jackson as an attorney. Josh Jackson, who, how many episodes? There was eight. First seven mails it in. He's just like, I'm on cruise control. I'm still running on fumes from the affair.

I'm not working hard. I don't want to break a sweat. And then the last episode, he's like, I'm going to bust it out. I'm going to actually act in this episode. And he's actually pretty good. I have no idea why he's in this. I don't understand where I'm supposed to leave his character as I leave the show. Like, what?

I have no idea what's going on. One of my notes was literally is Pacey asleep because he honestly is just, he's just not even doing anything. And it's pretty great casting. This show is set in the 90s and they like try really hard with the 90s references. Really, really, really, really hard. You know what? I enjoyed when two of the teenagers discussed whether they should.

have sex at the prom based on when... Nine out to it out. Yeah. Yeah. And they argue about whether it was the prom or spring fling. So also casting Joshua Jackson, who was Pacey, an extremely formative 90s teen heartthrob to me personally and many other people of my generation is great. And then they just put him in the freezer for seven episodes.

They give him literally nothing to do. Two things before we go. So what was redeeming about this show? Everybody on the show is basically unlikable except for Carrie Washington's daughter, Pearl, who I really liked. And I also liked the actress. And so if we're going like winners and losers, she's a winner.

And I think Izzy, the youngest daughter that Reese Witherspoon had that she hates, who ruined her life, basically, who has a lot of issues. I thought she was good, too. Those would be my only two winners. Honestly, I don't think anyone else wins on the show, not one person. Yeah, I thought the teens were good.

I also thought Carrie Washington was good with both of those teen actors. In those scenes. Okay. Yeah, they had a nice, So I guess Carrie Washington working with the next generation is a winner. I agree. I don't really have any winners at all. I don't know what to say, especially about the ending.

Shaker Heights? Shaker Heights, winner? All right. I don't think so. I don't mind giving away the ending because odds are anyone listening to this is probably already seen the show or stopped watching it three episodes in and it's trying to reevaluate their life. They hint at a fire in the first episode.

So we know the house sets on fire and there's some drama of, like, okay, who set the fire, which is supposed to keep us kind of locked in. The other big plot is this waitress that Carrie Washington worked with who abandons her baby, just abandons it. Rosemary Witt picks it up. Rosemary DeWitt becomes the mom. And then I'm supposed to feel bad for the mom who abandoned her child and should now get it back.

I don't know what was going on with that plot. Yeah, they try to make it about postpartum depression, which is a real issue. But again, the show is not. not equipped to explore any of the complexities of any of these issues. And they actually let this poor woman who is the mother who had to suffer postpartum depression. They have her storm into a cocktail party and scream, that's my baby. I have said, that's my baby as many times as the show has now.

But it's that scene, I couldn't believe I was watching it. Well, they had a multiple, that's my babies. And then in the season finale, they had a, where's our baby? A lot of exclamation points. It did lead to one iconic moment with Reese, where the older daughter who gets into Yale and she's yelling, everything's, the family's breaking apart. And she goes, I'm not perfect. And Reese goes, you are perfect. And just like screams in at top of her lungs. But it's like a dog was so register only like dogs could hear it. It's so high. She commits. Rees Witherspoon is like, I will play this person as evil as I need.

to. And I do respect that about her. The actual finale of how we found out how the fire was set, which we won't spoil, just on the rare chance that you haven't seen it, was even more. I was like, I'm ready for the most absurd reveal that we could possibly have. And it's like, no, no, it's going to be 20 times more absurd. This was an utter train wreck. And then you have Hulu who also has Mrs. America, which I think is a fantastic show. So good. And you have. And you have you have Mrs. America, what it? And then it's like, here's Little Fires everywhere. The worst show anyone's going to come up with in 2020. So, congrats to Hulu. Do we hit everything?

One more thing. They use 90s music, except they won't play the original 90s music. And every single music cue is like a sad woman singing, you ought to know by a lot is more set or like sex and candy. Marcy's playground. Remembered them? That's when Reese Spoon and Joshua Jackson have sex on their scheduled Wednesday and Saturday. And Marcy's playground. But it's not. Marcy's Playground, it's a cover, is playing. I just wanted them to play the 90s music. And off that thing, I'm so glad you brought that up. The theme song for this show, the opening credits, is the worst theme song I've ever heard

for a major 12-inch show ever. It's like, like these violins coming flying in. It is atrocious. This show is so bad. I urge people to watch it in groups. That's my TV concierge's recommendation. Yes, agree. Have people to talk to.

Before we go, any advice for Reese's next move? because my advice would be not to play a character like this again, just maybe take a four-year break? My advice would be not to do Little Fires Everywhere, season two, which has been floated. No. Don't do it. No. Don't do it.

Floated by who? Satan? By the sh- Please don't do Little Fires everywhere. All right, for TV concierge, I'm Bill Simmons, that was abandoned diamonds. Every day, we'll have at least one of these coming on this feed. So stay tuned for that.

Thanks for listening.