The Prestige TV Podcast - ‘Mayor of Kingstown’ Season 1 Postmortem

Episode Date: January 11, 2022

Cellmates Chris Ryan and Shea Serrano break down Season 1 of ‘Mayor of Kingstown’ (spoilers ahead!) and talk about their top five moments from the show that they can’t believe made it onto their televisions. Hosts: Chris Ryan and Shea Serrano Associate Producer: Sasha Ashall Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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40 grams of protein. Made to keep up with whatever comes next. New sweet green wraps hit different. Order now at order.com. Hello and welcome to the Ringer Prestige TV podcast. My name is Chris Ryan. I'm here with my cellmate, Shea Serrano. What's up, Shay? What a baby boy? Oh my God. We're going to talk about Mayor of Kingston today. It's the Paramount Plus show from Taylor Sheridan and Hugh Dale. Yeah, we are. Starting Jeremy Renner. It concluded its first season,

possibly its only season. I haven't seen anything about a renewal on Sunday. You know, this show kind of flew under the radar. Renner was in Hawkeye at the same time on Marvel, pretty much. So there was a lot of, like, overlap, a lot of Jeremy Renner on the screen. and it was airing around the same time as Yellowstone was concluding its fourth season and 1883, these two other Taylor Sheridan shows were launching. And, you know, I checked out this first episode, Shea, when it came out.

I was like, man, this is pretty hardcore. This is a really, really, really, really gritty crime drama. I don't know whether it's going to connect with people. And I literally don't know anyone else. I'd rather talk about this show than you, because you and I share a depraved proclivity for jail dramas, and this is the jail drama of all jail dramas. So I remember she, I was texting you. I was like, we checked this out. I was kind of bothering you about it. And then it did seem to click with you, right? So tell me a little bit about what you felt about the first season. And obviously,

we're talking about, we're going to get into this entire season on this episode of Prestige TV. So we're going to definitely spoil some stuff. So if you have not seen it and you think you're going to check it out, just put a pin in this pot and come back to it. But we're going to, from now, on we're spoiling mayor of kingstown so shay what was what was your vibe with mayor of kingston we're gonna spoil every single thing my vibe with mayor of kingstown was when they started advertising it i was super fucking pumped about it like as soon as you saw the trailer you're like all right let's let's go i'm in sign me up so i like to do a thing when the when the when there's a show that's coming out that everybody is not going to be talking about every single week like succession

For example, you can't not watch Succession the day that it comes out because there's no chance. Everybody's going to be talking about that night. Yeah, there's no chance you could be on the internet if you haven't seen it yet and not have everything ruined. But with this one, I didn't see anybody talking about it. So I said, all right, let me bank some episodes. Bro, when are we going to find Mayor of Kingstown Twitter? I need it. I need access.

I need access to that because it's got to be the gnarliest place in the world. But I saw nobody was talking about it. And I said, all right, let me save it. up like three or four. And so I waited, I waited a month to go watch it. And then I did the thing when you're like kind of watching it, but you're also doing something else or on your phone or whatever. And you're just like, catching pieces of it. And you're like, this isn't too bad. All right, cool. And then when you and I started talking about it, I was like, oh, all right. Let me go. Let me rewatch every episode leading up to the season finale. And when you watch it and you're

paying attention to it, it's just so much more fun. This is a show you have to put your phone down and just like, it's not a complicated show. You're not going to miss anything by looking at your phone. But what you, like when I say you're not going to miss anything, I mean, you're not going to miss like a plot point. It's pretty simple to keep up with. But what you do miss is you miss the momentum, you miss the buildup to a thing. A perfect example is in one of the later episodes, maybe the last, the second to last

episode, Jeremy Renner decides he's going to go kill the Ginnity from Limitless. He's going to kill the white supremacist, Sue Torridor. tortured his girlfriend, yeah. Or tortured his friend, yeah. Yeah. And if you're not watching the show, you miss the whole, like, because he doesn't say anything. He's just like, come on, we got to do a thing with a girl in the car.

And then they drive. And he's like, just tell me if this is a person who did it. And he walks out and she freaks out and he just gets out and kills everybody. Yeah. And if you're not watching the show, you miss, like, you missed a punch of that. So this is a show you need to have your phone away for it. But yeah, when I went through and rewatched it like that, it was just so much more fun.

It's very, very sons of anarchy. Yeah. And I like it. Yeah. So the way I would pitch this to people if they haven't seen it, is that it's Michael Clayton for jail. And that Jeremy Renner plays this guy named Mike McCluskey, who is the, he's actually not the titular mayor of Kingston.

The mayor of Kingston was as, well, there is a mayor. We don't really meet him. but the mayor of Kingston in the world of the show is played by Kyle Chandler, his brother. And Mike is kind of like Kyle's right-hand man, but is like, sorry, is Mitch's right-hand man, but it's not really like, I don't think, as beloved as his brother Mitch is. And their job essentially is they work out of this storefront office in Kingston, which is this Michigan town that is essentially a jail town. It's got a prison in town and all the business, all the people who live in the town,

work at the prison. And their job is, you know, at various points, like they've described themselves as like inmate advocates and stuff like that, but essentially they're fixers. So if something is going wrong inside the prison, they can help with that. If something is going wrong outside the prison, they can fix that. And their job is essentially to keep the peace. So there's the cops, there's the prison guards, there's the warden, there's the politicians. Then there's the gangs outside of prison who control the stuff that's happening inside

the prison. We mentioned the white supremacist. There's also the Crips. There's Mexican guys. They're they're trying to like basically keep this this fragile piece. Essentially this like you said, Shea, like you can't really look away from this show because if you do, you miss something that while you're watching an episode might feel like a minor plot point or a minor detail. And then it winds up the entire season hinges on it. So we can kind of start from the beginning. I think what Shay and I are going to do, we're going to chat a little bit about the season in general. And then I can't stress this enough to people. This show is fucked up. This show is like, you mentioned Sons of Anarchy. It makes Sons of Anarchy seem pretty tame to me.

I don't know. You were much more, you were deep in Sons of Anarchy so you could tell me. Do you think this show is darker than Sons of Anarchy? It's not darker than Sons of Anarchy, but we have to clarify, we're talking about like the last, three seasons of Sons of Anarchy, the last four seasons maybe, is when it really went sideways. And when they were like, the cartel shows up. Right. And they're just throwing human heads around. Like that kind of stuff is happening.

But Sons of Anarchy, it starts out pretty wicked. It starts out with a warehouse fire that like ends up killing a few people who were locked inside. It's dark. But this one definitely picks up where Sons of Anarchy left off. And there's like, we're just going to start here. Yeah. And get deeper. And I think that the violence and some of the sort of like, I guess the tone I would

describe as very Sicario-like, you know, like the attitude of these guys is essentially, of everybody involved in the show is essentially that like we are living in hell. And like there is nothing we can do about it. Everybody is corrupt. Everything is cynical and dark. And what basically Jeremy Renner's character, is trying to do is like save hell from going overboard until like a just complete inferno he's like everybody here is completely evil and like everybody here is self-interested so don't ever think that

this is about like rehabilitating people or doing anything for the community or anything like that like this is just like so basically what happens is early in the season you know everybody who kind of and i think one of the reasons why this show didn't get written about as much as maybe it should have been or could have been, is that something happens in the first episode that's this huge twist, right? So we can start with this. And I was going to say that this is one of the, we have a, Shane and I each have a list of five things that we were like, you can't do that on television. Or I can't believe that was on television.

And my number one one is you killed one of the main characters in the first episode of the show. That's my number one time I wrote it down right here. I might let know, but Kyle Chandler dies. Kyle Chandler gets executed in the first episode of the show in a botched robbery at a his office. And, you know, this is, this is pretty bold. Like, I, I, we've seen this happen occasionally on shows where there's basically stunt casting. I don't want to give away anything that happens on other TV shows, but you basically have like a big name actor or actress come in,

and then something happens to them early in the season, which throws people off because they thought, oh, I thought this was a show starring this person. I definitely was not expecting this. No. And I had been looking forward to watching Renner work, with Kyle Chandler. Like, I thought that would be a cool dynamic throughout the season. 100%. But I have to say, like, you know, when you do something like that in the first episode, the coolest thing about it is that then you're like, anything can happen in the show.

I was so disappointed when that part happens. Because prior to that moment, like two or three scenes earlier, they have this great scene where Kyle Chandler, the older brother, the one who's in charge of everything, the charming one that everybody loves. They make it a point to be like, look how much everybody likes this guy. Yeah. And then they have Jeremy Renner who's like the muscle, basically, the grunt. You do the work.

I handle all the smart stuff. But they have this really great scene where they're talking on the phone and Kyle Chandler's like, are you by the lake? And he's like, yeah. And he goes, meet me at the beach. And then they're both just standing on the beach and you have Kyle Chandler and Jeremy Renner. And the camera's just on them. Fresh face and we're looking at their faces. then we're looking at them from the back and then the faces again and they're making like some comment

and Kyle Chandler makes like a little funny joke about it being a Monday and when you when I watched that scene I said I fucking can't wait to watch 10 episodes of this of these two guys yeah just going because all of the advertisements for the show he's in everything Kyle Chandler's in everything and you're like oh this must be like the thing it's these two they're going to work together and then here we go they do a really good job of just like keeping you off balance the whole time the guy shows up to rob the money from Kyle Chandler's office. And Kyle Chandler's like, he specifically says it, I wouldn't put up a fight to save my own money. I'm sure so I'm not going to risk my life to save somebody else's. And then the guy just shoots him in the fucking head. And I was like,

you got to be kidding me. But yeah, same as you. As soon as that happened, you're like, well, nobody is off limits. Yes. Not nobody. Nobody is safe. And that's a cool feeling to have in it. But I don't know if it was worth it is the thing. Yeah, I mean, it's interesting to think of like a do-over where, because the thing is, is that it's not like then Mitch, it's not like then Mike McCluskey, the Jeremy Renner character spends the rest of the season hunting down who did this to it. That's what I thought was going to happen. Yeah, I thought it was going to be like this season-long, like, mystery about, like,

who is this guy? Why did he do this? What was Mitch into that they didn't know about? The Kyle Chandler plot line gets pretty much handled in episode two. You know what I mean? immediately. Yeah, it's pretty much taken care of. So there was almost like this like mini movie that's the first two episodes that is the Kyle Chandler stuff and then that's over. But yeah, like I think that there would have been like it would have been a different show if this had been sort of like these

two brothers making their way in the world and dealing with their mom and all this other stuff. And you know, shout to Kyle Chandler for doing the show anyway. Like and just just for showing up for like two days work. That lake scene you're talking about is really funny. Greenwald always points this out. where it's like, it's the Simpsons thing where the dude buys the boat called Live Forever and then dies next. There's definitely a lot of Kyle Chandler being like, man, I can't wait to retire.

So the season essentially hinges on a fairly straightforward chain of events, but when you're watching it in the moment, especially because of the way the show is kind of shot and the way it's sort of told, it's almost like you think that it's going to be episodic. That basically Mike McCluskey,

the Jeremy Runner character, is going to, like, solve a problem every week. And it has elements of that. But essentially what happens is, and this is going to be the second thing I was going to say was the craziest thing I've seen, or the just, I can't believe this was on TV, is the third episode.

So the third episode is one of the wildest things I have ever seen them put on TV. It's titled Simply Murder, by the way. It's the title Simply Murder. Yeah, like, this is a pretty, this is pretty dark. So, sorry for, if this upsets people. But basically what happens is a kid dies in a meth lab explosion

in the first scene of this episode. And the rest of the episode is essentially Mike against his will. Like he's like very, very loath to do this. But Mike going around and organizing like the execution of the meth dealer by a bunch of people inside the prison by like a couple of the gangs. And the cops are like, tell all these guys to take care of this dude when he gets to prison and we'll look the other way when they're dealing drugs or when they need to like get something into the prison and it's essentially

like this unholy alliance made between the prison guards the cops on the outside and the gangs on the inside and the gangs on the outside and Mike McCleskey's like this is going to turn out really bad because one day they're going to ask the cops for something that the cops don't want to give it's a great scene and it's it's kind of an amazing episode it's fucked up up and it's like, I can't, I don't, if you turned this show off when this happened, like, I can't blame you. But this episode also then sets up basically everything that happens after culminating with the prison riot. What did you think of the way that they kind of set up the drama of the season after Kyle Chandler exits the stage? I like that a lot. I really like the way that you

described it as the first two episodes are like a movie of itself. Here's what we're going to do. Here's the guy who's the mayor. Here's his grunt brother. We're going to get rid of the brother. we're going to position the grunt as the new mayor of the town. And everybody's skeptical about him. Yeah. That's the first two episodes. I really like episode two when it ends and the woman comes up to him and he's like decided he's not going to take it over. And she's like, please help me.

They said you could help me. And she's like going back and forth and his brother, Kyle, the good brothers with him. He's like, don't do it. Don't do it. And then finally he just turns and he's like, what's her name? And then that's it. And you're like, all right, cool. You took over. That's right.

So I really like how you described it as. But yeah, then the thing happens in episode three where the meth lab fire thing happens. And Jeremy Renner's telling him, hey, he's telling all the people in charge, don't do this. He has this really like heavy line there where he says something like, you're going to have 3,000 people who feel like you owe them a favor if you do this. And he's talking about all the people in prison, which is really great. But then they do that. And then from there going forward, it does feel like episodic, like they're putting other things in place. And then you realize, oh, this all started.

And at that moment, everything were building to that. I liked it a lot. I liked that they did it like that. Because what I didn't want to see is I didn't want for every episode to be like, now I have to find a gun. Yeah. And now I have to, you know, I don't want to watch that. I didn't want it to be like every episode, somebody comes to the office and is like,

my friend in the inside needs this or like, can you help my dad or my uncle with this? I wanted it to have a kind of serialized long form story that it stuck to. and they bring in a couple of different elements. There's like, Aidan Gillen plays a character named Milo that we're going to talk about a little bit. And then there's like a serial killer plot line that they bring in.

There's a bunch of stuff that they kind of start with and then stop. But for the most part, the rest of the season is Jeremy Renner basically running back and forth, literally, because all the scenes are essentially Jeremy Renner gets a phone call,

a guy's like, yo, I need to talk to you. He drives over to see this person. It's either the guy, who runs the Crips or the guy who runs the sort of Aryan dudes or whoever and he's basically constantly

negotiating between them and the prison guards and shit just goes so sideways. It goes as sideways as it could possibly go over the course of the season. Episode three is absolutely wild stuff though. So like there's some great, great Taylor Sheridan

dialogue in it, but I just wanted to point out that this is the episode that starts with Rob. Stuart's every picture tells a story is the music over the opening montage and then it ends honestly with the dude getting executed in prison with the doors the end playing which is the music from the end of apocalypse now and the end of this episode is essentially the end of apocalypse now like when brando gets killed it's just like dudes wailing on this guy as for prison justice and it's the original sin of this season it's just it's just one of the wilder episodes of TV that I've ever

seen. It's so, okay, two things here. Number one, Taylor Sheridan, who I just really enjoy his work. Because he does a thing where he doesn't explain anything. He just drops you in. Like this is what made Chiario so good because he drops you into this world. You're with Emily Blunt. And she's trying to figure out what's going on.

And you're right there with her trying to figure out what's going on. There's no scene where they like pull you aside. They're like, okay. And then they explain stuff. That's what's going on here. you get a little tiny bit of it because it's TV you sort of have to, but mostly they're just not explaining it. Like you don't even realize until halfway through the season that that Jeremy Rinner was like in the white supremacy neo-Nazi gang. Yeah. Like, you know what I'm saying?

Like it's just they're little pieces there that when you go back and rewatch it, you go like, oh, that makes sense. But at the time, you miss it. So there's, there's that going on. All the lingo that they use, especially in episode three, they start really breaking it out where it's like this dude's going to go, it's all about like what, part of the prison they're going to put this guy in and like there's a normal way like he would go to county and then he would go to protective custody and but the but the prison guards are like no we're going to put him in the gym or an ad seg like it's all this like yeah and they never stop to explain what's happening you just kind of understand oh they're going to expose this kid this guy so that he

gets got when he gets into prison yeah yeah yeah so there's that going on yeah what's one of the things that you think are like is like a one of the you i can't believe this was on tv moments Well, so the kid is the, is, was another one on my list. That was in my, my number five spot. Because it's one thing to like, in the scene, you see the guy who, the kid is in the trailer, he's playing, the mom is on the couch and the guy is like running around frantic. And it's clear that this is like a meth lab or he's got the supplies there. And then the guy accidentally sets a cigarette down and forgets about it and the leaves.

And then once it ashes the weight of it away, it flips backwards off of the table. and next to the acetone and then there's this giant explode. So they show that happen. And that's one thing. You've seen that in TV shows before. But then they show when the police are there at the scene and you hear one guy and he's like, oh, fuck.

And then you look and there's a shot of the body of the child, an 8-year-old, 9-year-old kid, like if you put like a fire to a spider and his legs curl in, like the kid looks like that. And he's charred and there's flames still like, he's like a campfire that hasn't quite gone out yet. And they show it to you. They show you a cooked eight-year-old boy. And you're just like, what the fuck?

And that's in the first few minutes. And they don't even freak out about it. They're just like, well, that's the thing that happens here. But they're like, and they're like, now it's on. Yeah. Kyle Chandler dying in the first scene. I mean, the first episode was when my hands were on my head. I was like, oh, fuck, everybody's, everybody's in danger.

But this was the moment where they're like, we're going to show you some fucking hardcore stuff on Paramount. Paramount. They did the Sonic the Hedgehog movie. That's what we're talking about. And they're like, well, guess what? Here we go. So I have another one that kind of plays into a lot of what happens in episodes two and

three. And then this guy plays a character, a relatively important character, but he's kind of on the side throughout the season. and that's the leader of the Kingstown SWAT team, Robert. Yes. Oh, God, this guy. I had never heard of this dude. I think his name is Hamish Headley, is the actor. And so he plays this character named Robert,

who is essentially like on a kill squad. This guy basically like quote unquote serves warrants, but most of the people he serves warrants too, he like winds up killing. He is a veteran that is essentially, essentially like an armed, he's like an arm of the police department that is essentially there for like military activity.

But this actor that they found, he's got like this broken nose look. And he, I like that look. Like the way he kind of carries himself and everything is just so, uh, so charismatic and so like,

it seems very real. It just, I definitely believe that this guy came back from Afghanistan, brought a lot of like his military training and, at this job and is also like working through some of his own demons and it's just amazing. It's like a really amazing little character that's just off on the side. And that's something this show does really well is like almost every character is interesting. Yeah. It feels like

you could you could do three episodes with just him if you want to do. Like what's this guy's home life like? How does he process this? They have the scene when they go find the guy who kills Kyle Chandler in the beginning and they walk in and they find him on a couch. And here's Here's where his name is Sawyer in the show, I think. Sawyer is like, they walk in, they've got all their guns, point to him, like seven people. And he tells the guy, hey, pick up that gun right there. And the guy picks it up real slow. And he's like, no, no, grab it like, you're going to shoot it.

And he grabs a handle. And he's like, now raise it to the sky, to the ceiling. And he does it. And he's like, now slowly bring it down toward me. And the guy knows what's going to have it to see it in his face. And then they just, da, da, da, da, da, da, da. light him up and then he just goes thank you and then they walk out it's like what the like what the fuck what the fuck so that that whole element of it it's like i want to get into this a

little bit with you because i think people might hear us talking about this and they're like wow it sounds like these dudes are pretty like jacked up on like all this on all this violence and obviously there's an element of that just like there isn't cicario but like cicario i think that the reason why I respond so much to Taylor's work is because it's never just one thing. Like, it's never just like, isn't it cool that the police are armed like this

and just can dole out justice? It's not like a fantasy about like the military state. He actually is like, a lot of the characters voice a lot of opposing viewpoints about prison, about violence, about justice, about whether or not like, Anybody can truly be redeemed.

And I think that it's worth noting that, like, nothing on this show happens without somebody saying, like, this shouldn't be, this shouldn't be the way we do things. Like, this is fucked up. Yeah. Same as you. I always like that about, about Taylor's stuff. Sicario is the easiest example when there's like a bunch of,

if you're just watching it sort of glossy eye, there's a bunch of cool shit that happens. You get Benizio del Toro just running around being coolest shit. Josh is in there being cool as shit. Emily, Daniel Coluio. There's like a bunch of cool people doing interesting things. But really, when you pay attention to the show, it's like he's taking the top off of it and be like, look at all of this rot. There's rot inside here.

And that's the same thing that he's doing with Kingston. He's like, these are the people who have to be here because of how rotted everything is. And if they weren't here, I don't know if it would be better or worse, but it would be different. And that's what the show feels like all of the time. Every single time you're like, man, just fucking do a nicer thing or a better thing. They don't. They never do. But they don't celebrate it.

Jeremy Renner is never like, it has to be this way. Yeah, no one's ever like, you did it, Mike. You're the best. You know, like it didn't. Yeah, every. And I don't think that the show itself, while it indulges in violence and it indulges in sort of, I think a really like hyper-masculine point of view. I don't think it's like endorsing it. You know what I mean?

I don't think they're like this. If only guys like Mike McCluskey or Robert the SWAT guy could like run the world, we'd be in a better play. It's not like that. They're just like this is like the reality of the story we're telling. But we're acknowledging that this is all pretty fucked up. What's another thing that you couldn't believe was on TV? All right.

I couldn't believe Kyle Chandler gets killed in the first episode. I couldn't believe they showed a cooked eight-year-old child. I could not believe that either. I couldn't believe it. I just couldn't even look at it. My next one, slightly different vibe, I couldn't believe I was watching Jeremy Renner make friends with a bear.

That's a thing that happens in the show. He makes friends with a wild bear. Like buddies, they become friends, Turner and Hooch style. It's amazing. A bear! Who he feeds French fry grease. French fries and bacon grease.

He just throws it out there. And then he waits and then the bear shows up very few episodes. So there are very few lighthearted moments in this show, like at all. It's just not that. It's not what that. There's no like funny, like, and you watch a wire every once in a while. There's like a funny thing that happens and you feel good for a second.

It never happens in Kingston. The closest you get to it is in the at the very end when the woman who Mike has rescued, the high end escort, he's now stashed her away in his cabin in the woods that nobody knows about. And she's there. and the bear shows up. And now, as a viewer, you're like, oh, it's the bear. It's Mike's friend.

It's Mike's friend, the bear. But she doesn't know that. She just sees a fucking bear walk out. She's terrified. She's hiding in the house, holding a knife, crying to herself. And you're just like, oh, that's, don't worry about it. It's cool. It's Mike's buddy.

It's fine. It's fine. So I would say that the one other, like, lighthearted, mildly lighthearted part of this show is the interactions between Jeremy Renner's character. and a guy named Bunny who runs the Crips out of, uh, out of like the front lawn of some projects. And this guy is played by,

um, an actor named Toby, uh, Bantefa. And I really enjoyed all of their scenes together. And their scenes together, uh, actually wind up leading to my other,

like, I can't believe this is happening moment, which is Jeremy Renner temporarily adopting a black hockey player. Yeah. And just taking him to his hockey player. match because this kid is like the cousin or the nephew of Bunny and Bunny's like I need you to do me a favor take this kid to go play hockey like I never leave here but like his father's a fuck up or

something go take him to go play hockey and he goes and takes this kid to go play hockey and the kid gets like into a hockey fight and all the other hockey dads are like taunting him and stuff and Jeremy Renner just goes apeshit and winds up like fighting the entire hockey arena and then afterwards is like I'm bringing back half of the Irish mob. Yeah. As a father of son, Shea, like, you have to, like,

maybe you could get Mike McCleskey to start taking your kids to sporting events. I would love that. I would love if Mike was available. You just feel so safe. He straight up fought like 20 guys. Yeah. The best part about it is Loki,

he's also smoking at the hockey game. Yes. Yeah. And then he uses the cigarette to, like, burn the guys in the face. You're like, Goodness gracious. Goodness gracious. Yeah. So I really enjoy that.

I also like the fact that, like, as he's taking the kid home, there's no lesson. He's like, no, next time I'm bringing the Irish mom. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's a perfect little example of what the show does. When it gets bad, there's nothing to be learned. You just have to get badder. That's all we're going to do. That's it. What's another one for you?

Yeah. So another one of the, I just couldn't believe that I was watching this, is when you see the people who made this show. You have coach Eric Taylor. He's, I'm in. You have Jim from the town. Yep. I'm in. You have the guy who directed Training Day, Antoine Fuqua is one of the EPs.

I'm in. And then you have the guy who made Ticario and Heller High Water and Yellowstone and like, amen. Like, just to know that those four people were in on this show, what else do you want? I couldn't believe when I saw the list of. names on here. I just got so excited. I felt like when I was watching the trailer for like smoking aces or something when I was in college. I'm like, this is all the people. This is all the people at once. Just the roster in general you were excited about. The roster. The one person you

didn't mention, which I thought we should mention. And they kind of set this up more for a season two thing is Milo or Milo he's referred to who is this, I think, either Slavic or Russian gangster who's living, who's in a prison in Kingstown and still has like a mob on the outside and he's the one who's basically trying to entrap Mike McCluskey with this girl Iris.

And then his money is what got stolen from the Kyle Chandler character. It's all very complicated to get into and they don't really explain everything. There's also like that's where the weird subplot about the 26 dead bodies in a field comes up for like an episode.

We haven't even talked about that. Which we didn't even get into, but that's like apparently the work of a serial killer. I don't understand how that bus got buried. I don't understand like all the parts about that because they pretty much they'd start with that and then the next episode they're pretty much onto the prison riot. Yeah, they're just done. Don't worry about that. Don't worry about that part. But what did you think of Milo as like the big, the big bad? I, I liked them because I like Aiden, Aiden Gillen. I think he's like a fun character to watch on TV or in movies. Like he gets He's not afraid to be like campy on purpose with it.

I really liked, he doesn't like do much for the whole time. You see him barely talking. You don't see him like even moving until the last episode when the, when the riot is going on. And he's just sitting there while the riot starts out. And then they got the keys. Yeah. And he knows which every key, which keys does what?

Yeah. Yeah, the guy's trying to open the door and he's just like, it's the blue one. And it's like, how do you know? I pay attention. And then that's it. And then the guy does the key and it opens the door. And then he tells him, hey, there's a used a black key in the thing over there and you can get some guns.

And then he just joins up. I thought he was fun. It'll be cool to see him do a little more in there. But I think that's an interesting part of the shows. You're watching all of this like terrible shit happen. And there's no like central bad guy out in the world facilitating it. No, because they keep killing all of them. Yeah.

It's just happening. Like fuck. They never run out. So that leads me to basically my final, I can't believe this is happening, which is just the two-episode prison riot. What a moment. Which kind of like sees a lot of what Shay and I have been talking with

about converge into one place. So essentially this tension has been building and building. There have been some like incidents in the prison. There's still this like feeling that the prison guards and the cops have reneged on their side of this bargain where they asked the various gangs to kill this one inmate, but now are not. kind of coming through with some of the concessions that they were supposed to make to the

to the inmates and then it all pops off where a guard gets killed and then a riot starts afterwards and you're like oh wow they're going to do a prison riot and they do the prison riot of all prison riots it takes two episodes it is super gnarly it's orchestrated by this character named Paul who's like essentially like I'm never getting out of here but like, this is my revolution. You know, he's like, I understand. And, like, I'm like, I'm like basically the message that you can't treat people like dogs and expect them to behave like humans.

And, you know, it's pretty harrowing. Like, it's, it's one of the more graphic, violent depictions of this kind of thing that I think I've ever seen on screen. You've also got this, like, subplot of Mike McCluskey's detective brother is, like, stuck inside the prison and is kind of blinded. And he's rescued by Rob. the SWAT guy who this is the thing where I was just like

this is wild to me is Robert goes up to him, he like shoots his way into the prison, rescues these two cops who have been stranded inside of it and is like, I can basically get you out of here right now like the way I came in but we're going to go out like the front door

shooting because if you don't, you'll like never forgive yourself. And as like, I'm just saying if I was like in a prison riot and a guy was like there's the quick way or the hard way, I'd be like Give me out. Let's take the quick way and I'll worry about my levels of regret later on in life.

Do you know what I'm saying? Yes, I do. I know exactly. I felt the same way when he tells them you're going to regret this. No, the fuck I won't. Give me out. You see, I'm not doing so great right now. I'm in tears.

I'm dead. Just get me out of here. What are we doing? You know what we haven't talked about is Van Peebles. Oh, yeah. The prison guard. Oh, the prison guard. So, okay, so we mentioned earlier the thing Tyler Sheridan does where he doesn't explain anything.

And this is a perfect example of that. So in the opening episode, this young guard who's like the nephew of an older guard, he gets trapped by, he gets tricked into mailing a letter. That's all we know. They're like, oh, they got him. He mailed a letter. And you're like, I don't even know what that means. And then you find out later on, this is like a scam that they run on the guards where they try to talk you into melling a thing out. Yeah.

And then you mail it out. I had to watch this a couple of times to understand. Yeah. I didn't catch it until the second time. And then they mail it out. And then you realize inside the envelope was like drugs. Basically it's like money coated in drugs. And then they use that to blackmail you because you traffic narcotics.

Yeah. Yeah. But every time they show that guy on the screen, he's like fucking up. Like every single time he's doing the wrong thing. Every single time. It got to the point where like the. near the end of the season, when they started showing him again, you're like, but some bad shit is about to happen right now.

And sure enough, he gets caught up again. He thinks everything's great. They move him over to the women's prison. And then he just gets fucking super hustled out of his own life. It's crazy. Dude, it's so crazy. So my favorite part of the show, I think, is the way it depicts how many things in this particular system

in the prison industrial complex hinge. on like belief in the thinnest of thing, like lines. So Jeremy Renner's character talks about this a lot, especially in that episode that Shay and I refer to episode three. And then later on too, like when they were kind of dealing with the fallout from it, where he's like, he's speaking on behalf of the guards where he's just like,

this is just a job to these dudes. Like these dudes don't care if you deal drugs. They don't care if you beat each other up. They don't care if you make meth in your cell. It's just a job. but if you fuck with them, you give them a reason to care. And he's like,

just don't give them a reason because then it's like you'll never see the daylight again for the rest of your life, essentially. And on the flip side, it's like the inmates are like, this whole thing is just because like we allow it to happen

because we outnumber you, we're stronger than you, and we have less to lose. You know what I mean? And essentially like we're giving this depiction of the guards where a lot of the guards are like out of shape. they're coming from like pretty sad homes like they're like they're basically like trying to scrape

together overtime like they're not you know like all this stuff and it's just like a really really harrowing kind of portrait of like man this whole thing is like barely hanging together yeah yeah the when you walk away from the season it's clear that that the people who created this show part of the reason they created it is to be like hey prison doesn't work prison as it stands right now does not work. This is not, it's just making things worse. They do a really good job

in that movie Shot Caller of like establishing the same thing when one of the inmates is talking. At one point they refer to Jeremy Renner was a shot caller on the yard. Yeah. I was like, I thought of you. I was like, shameless

has just done a fucking end zone dance. My ears went up. But yeah, in the movie Shot Caller, one of the inmates explains, he's like, they just work here. We live here. And they just lay it out bare like that. And the same thing in Kingstown is like anytime you get dropped inside the prison,

it's just like, there's threats from every single angle. There's no, there's no safe harbor anywhere in there. Like, not at all, not at all. All right, the last thing that I have for the thing I couldn't believe I was watching is I figured you were going to go broad with the two episode prison riot, which was outstanding. So I went specific. Within the two episode prison riot, we watched.

an uncountable number of people just get shot. Just murdered. Yeah, dead. Just shot dead murder. It would be one of the most horrific things to ever happen in America if this like, wait. Like I understand that there have been upheavals at prisons before. This would have been like having like a fucking small war. That's exactly.

And that's what they do in the show. They have the helicopter come in and they're doing like a newscast and he's like, they describe some previous riot. And they're like up until today when this happened. And then as he's talking, they start shooting. at the helicopter, the prisoners. And he's like, oh, fuck. Okay.

But so the thing I couldn't believe that I was watching is there's a part in there when one of the inmates, just a nameless person, you've never seen this guy before in the show ever before. But this is after that guy, Robert Sawyer, has gotten his team in position and they're about to come up out of this, like, the underground into the prison to take over. And this guy doesn't even know that they're down there, but he opens a door that, like, leads down and right when he opens it, they're all standing right there and just, they shoot like a hundred times.

But the shot that you get of it happening is we're watching it like we're in the room with an inmate. So you just see his back. His whole back just goes. Just get Swiss cheese like a hundred. Like there's a point where the SWAT guys are trying to, they're going down a hallway to go outside finally. And they just like there's just like 10 to 20 inmates try to jump in and they're just like,

they just shoot all of them. It's just, it's so violent. It's so much. Just watching, because it's like, dude, it's, I don't even know how to say it. When you watch somebody gets shot on TV or in a movie, it's like a second long. Yeah, this is very, very long. It's like eight seconds. Imagine getting shot for eight seconds.

What did you think of the character, Paul, the one who's like orchestrating this entire thing? Oh, I liked him. Yeah, he was cool. He's, he's a cool looking guy. He's scary. he has a great line about the whole like, we're sending a message and the message is me or whatever. And you're like, yeah.

And he immediately dies after that. But still, I thought he was great. But man, watching that guy's back get blown out like that. I know. That whole, like that and like when they like have all the guards like on basically our crucifixes, it's just wild. I thought after I watched when they, when they kill the guy in the prison,

the guy who blew up the trailer by accident with the kid and the mom in there. And then when you see his murder scene, because he gets killed like five times. He just goes from station to station and they're all taking turns, killing them. But they do the thing where they all have shanks and they run upon him and it's like,

like, da, da, da, da, da, da, da, da, da, da, da. Like just stabbed him a hundred times or whatever. And then when they do the overhead shot and all the knives are like around him? Yes, yes, yes. when I saw that, I was like, well, I'm good. I'm going to be okay for the... Like, nothing else that's going to happen in here is going to be as bad as that.

I know. This is the problem is we watch stuff like this, and then when we watch like Free Guy, we're like, uh, whatever. We can wrap it up there, man. I hope they do a second season of this show because I think that there's a lot of really good stuff to do with it, but I wonder whether or not, like, they would learn stuff from making the first season that they could take into the second season

and make it even tighter, um, make it even better. and yeah, I just thought it was like, honestly, it's my favorite Jeremy Runner performance since Hurt Locker, or maybe the town. Like, it's so good. I think he's so excellent in this role and he does the Sheridan Dialogue really well.

So I hope that they make more. I'm not sure what kind of audience a guy. It's definitely like, it's not for the weakhearted. No, it's not. I don't even know if it's for like the stronghearted. It's not for anybody. Like, I don't think it's just there. This is one of these things where it's like

you get to the end of you're like, I can't in good conscience recommend this to anyone. You should go watch Abbott Elementary. Yeah, right, exactly. Thank you so much to Sasha, who essentially was in prison with us today to record this podcast, and she produced us today,

and we will be back with more prestige TV podds. This week, I know that there's Station 11 stuff and we have a bunch more playing. Thanks so much for listening.