The Prestige TV Podcast - Recapping the Premiere Episode of ‘We Own This City’

Episode Date: April 28, 2022

Bill Simmons, Chris Ryan, and Wosny Lambre recap the premiere episode of HBO’s 'We Own This City.' They discuss how the show feels like 'The Wire,' the absence of humor, Jon Bernthal’s performance, and more. Hosts: Bill Simmons, Chris Ryan, and Wosny Lambre Producer: Jessie Lopez Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Wazney Lamberry. We broke down winning time where we decided. We also want to talk about we own the city, which premiered on HBO Max, on Monday it is the spiritual it's either nephew, I'd say nephew or cousin to the wire

at the very least of the wiring. Yeah, it's got five or six people that were on the wire including a couple shout out to Pood. Big ones. Yeah. It's only six episodes. It's set

within the last five years. You know, the wire ended in 2006 range. And I got to say, guys, nice to be in this little Simon Pelicanos world again. It just is. Oh, so good. So, Bill, like, I'm watching this.

And I think I'm like 10 minutes in. And I was like, damn, I think I need to text Chris about getting me these screeners. Like 10 minutes in to this pilot episode. It's like that feeling of being back in this world. I don't know how to describe it. It's more than just like riding a bike again. I'm just like, all right, we're back. We're back in this atmosphere.

We're back in this culture. It's just nice to see the streets again. Oh, it's so freaking good, man. So good. And then they throw Bernthal in it on top of it. Yeah. As if we weren't going to like this anyway. Bernthal walking around the ring showing off the belts.

Like that's what he's doing in that first speech. So this is the thing I love about this show is even though it's like, I'm like fucking on Google looking up like different counties in Maryland to try and figure out who's got jurisdiction over what, like an idiot. Like, you know, like it's already I'm just like gone on this. But the thing about this, we own this city that I kind of like is like visually and chronologically, a little bit of swagger. You know what I mean? Like it's not as like straightforward as show me a hero, as generation kill, as Deuce and, I mean, Deuce had some time jumps, but like the wire was like straight naturalist. Like every single episode was just like this next chapter of the story.

We're already crisscrossing across three different timelines with this with this show. And that like whole opening scene where it's like the Bernthaw speech, but the director is cutting to like all these different shots to kind of contrast with what he's talking about. So, so fucking good. God damn. Tapping into some recent stuff

and it really, like that Josh Charles scene when he pulls over the car. What a fucking scumbag he plays. Or Berthal just using his baton and breaking the guy's bottle as he walks by him. Just for no other reason

other than to intimidate. Established dominance. Subtle stuff that is just really smart. A ton of good actors. Oh my God. Carolinas. back. I did a tweet about this today. Josh Charles going all the way back to Dead Poets Society, but feel like he's been in our lives for 30 years. Carolina, who you guys started club Carolina.

I applied. I was you quickly moved the end. Berthal. We got Marlowe and Lansman and O'Dog and Poot. And then Andrea Zuckerman is running an organized crime drug enforcement task force. Just if I wasn't in enough from 902 and O. Great to say. her and she must be friends David Simon or something, but it just, it does feel a little wiry. I got to say, it does. Yeah.

I mean, it's also going back closer to like, you know, when Bernthal's cop starts is what year is that 05 when he starts or is it? So it's going back towards that era and, you know, I just feel like there's nobody who does the intricacies and complications

of police work like these two guys. Like, is it didactic sometimes? Yes. Is it, are there scenes where people are talking about societal ills in very explicit ways just to make sure you get the point? Yes. But does anybody ever show how fucking hard and complicated and and strange and weird police work is like these guys know. There's just the there's just the one of one. So it's like this thing where basically like what our modern conversation about policing lacks is like people can't thread this. needle of like, these communities need policing very badly. However, there's a certain type of policing that comes with some of this stuff when you talk about austerity and different things that just, you know, provides a fucked up product, right? And the wire and now we own the city, get into the ends and outs of that. And my favorite part about it, and you guys are going to laugh because I related to the ultimatum, a reality show.

I just watched on Netflix, which is the most insane shit I've ever seen in my life, but bear with me, folks. Like, with every single thing that happens on the ultimatum, there's a corresponding song. We're literally not just the instruments

make you know how you're supposed to feel like the music itself. The lyrics are like, now it's over. And, like, after somebody broke up, right? Like, where literally you're being told how to feel about every single thing that happens. Whereas, like, in the wire,

and we own the city, there's no music. There's no soaring, like, stuff happening. It's just like, you watch the scene, and you're left to figure out what you're supposed to think about what just happened. That's what I love the most about this. It's like, we're not demonizing the police. We're not valorizing them.

We're not figure it out. And I love that about this show. The scene that I thought was incredible to that point was was when the second time, Herschel makes an arrest in this episode. And he's like, He touched me and he bangs on that guy. And his partner, his black cop partner is just like,

I switched the call from a wagon to an ambulance because I'm not getting like prosecuted over this. Like you, like, and it wasn't like, because we have to have a conversation. Not that you shouldn't, but it's not like, it was like, we have to have a conversation about the racial implications of what you just did. He was like, I'm not doing paperwork for you.

You know, like, I'm not getting caught for you. And so it's just like a much more like kind of nuanced in some ways depressing depiction of it. they do such a good job introducing all of these characters over the course of an hour, and you actually have a sense of who's who, who's on what side. They're recognizable people. There are all kinds of super diverse, they're different sizes. And for whatever reason, you can watch this in an hour,

and you're juggling 20 people in your head, and they're all fully formed. Like, we've talked about, like in Winning Time, it felt like Winning Time took four to five episodes for some of the characters to kind of ease into the character, which I think is pretty standard for TV shows. They always talk about that with Mad Men, like Mad Men or The Sopranos. Episode 5, 6 is when the actors really settle in

and then good shit starts happening. Simon just, his shows just don't, they're just always fully formed. So there was that. And then the thing, the decision that they made in this that I thought was really interesting was just not to have comedy at all, to not have the two cops in the car,

about donuts or any of the stuff that Carver and Herc used to do on that show or, you know, some of the comic relief McNulty being hammered stuff. That stuff's out. The wire was like, Van Oaks just talked about this way down the hole. Like the wire was like stealth, one of the funny shows in all time. Yeah. And just, you know, little bursts. This show has no interest in being entertaining.

This show has a mission. It wants to accomplish the mission and it's doing it. Yeah. I don't know if we're going to get like the McNulty. bunk fuck scene while they're looking over a crime scene like this show feels like it's doing a lot more like

it's got like somewhere it's trying to go much faster than that but I did find like just like the like the little details like when that dude is like big Wayne big Wayne like when they find all the guns like I just was like God damn it how do you guys get this

stuff they're doing and they're doing the all the pieces fit part of the wide though because like in the scene where, you know, the dirty cop dude, the black dude with the fro, is like, how the fuck did you guys get on to us? Yeah, mama do. Yeah, yeah.

And they're basically like, bro, like, we're not, it's not that we're that clever, but it's like all of these chain of events had to happen. And they're piecing that together with one of the first things being the two trackers on the car. Whereas, like, they assume, well, you know, it's funny, the white cop, homie with poochers.

partner doesn't assume that it's another legit police investigation. No. They're just like, another cop had to put this on here. And they understand that the department is dirty. He understands that the departments are dirty enough that it didn't have to be for police reasons. It could have been for non-police reasons.

So he just is like, yeah, we'll just throw it in here and see what happens. And see if anybody comes to get it. Yeah. I just love the way this whole thing. Like, again, the subtleties that Chris talks about. about where the only reason the dude even asked for the tracker bag, he's like, yo, those are expensive. Yeah, it's good.

I got to fill out paperwork. Yeah. We're a poor police department. Like, man, it's just, they're nailing it. Even in the pilot, they're nailing so many things. Chris, it sounds like Waz, this is a two-part question was. It sounds like you like your dirty cop content. Oh my God.

I'm going to say, is that a yes? Of course. It sounds like we might have a third for the internal effect. Rewatched. Oh my God. Richard Gear and Andy Garcia. I've seen that movie. Please, please put me on.

I watch that movie. That's the standard for Dirty Cup movies. Can we talk about Berthol for a second? Well, he's basically, he's channeling gear and internal affairs, right? He's doing the 2017 version of it. He's channeling fucking Daniel Day Lewis. Like, this guy is like, he's like, the scene at the end where he's like, do you know who I am? Like at the end of the episode.

And then Lansman comes in and he's like so pissed at him for looking him into the eye because it's like he's like I'm not sorry. And he goes back out. He's like this fucking guy. Right. This guy. Oh my guy. Like Bernthal is just like such a physical actor. Like the way he, they walk up on that raid early in the episode.

And he puts the gun behind his back and he's just like swaying back and forth as he's walking. It's like how do you already got this dude's walk down. You know? It's the above the law, dirty cop who has lost all. sense of reality of where the rulebook is and is running the streets and just feels like he's never going to get caught. I'm always in when that's the character. Also what I think is interesting, man, a lot of people don't understand this, but like

Bernthal is from D.C. And if you know anything about the area, like D.C. and in Baltimore are like 30 minutes or 30 miles apart, but they're basically two planets apart. as far as like culture and not only just their self-perception, but like how they perceive each other. But he's nailing this Baltimore shit somehow. Like he, it feels like the Baltimore of it all is in his freaking bones, which I think is really impressive.

Because if you ever talk to like DC people, they'd be like, yo, man, like Baltimore is just, it's different. It's different. There's no relation there. But Berthall being from that, area and just like just understanding Baltimore that deeply is is almost it's it's almost to the level of marking mark in the department that's a good at out they drafted the local kid yeah let's talk about the timelines because that's probably the biggest flaw with the show for me

I might just be old and dumb I watched it twice I mean it it was one of those things the second time some stuff made more sense to me I had a hard time you're being Basically, you're following it through the Bernthal haircuts. And that, I guess, is how that's the roadmap for us. But I thought it was... It was a pretty high attention show. They do one cutaway where it's like, this is Bel Air, Maryland. This is two years earlier, like 2015.

So now you're like, okay, 17 is when he's giving the speech and doing the gun task force raids. Then two years earlier is when they start to get onto the gun task force with the tracker. And then there's also the scenes from earlier when like Bernthal's first on the streets. So like they kind of like there are signals, but you basically do have to follow Bernthal's facial hair. And you have to pay, this is not a, I'm going to scroll through my iPhone. No, because you got to watch those little.

You have to fucking watch the show. The forms that they're filling out. So when is Bernthal breaking that guy's 40 ounces? I think that's when he was first on the beat. Okay, that's when he established himself as a prick cop. Yeah, yeah. Which is also a nice throwback to the wire in the brown bag speed. You know, like...

Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. That is a callback. You let a guy with a brown bag. That's him showing at least a little level of deference to the police and what they're doing. And Berndtall's like, no, fuck that. Fuck the brown bag. I'm going after this dude.

Would you be... Would you timeline it or color correction at all when we go backwards to at least help us a little bit? I think it would be helpful. I mean, I think it's a lot, especially given the... amount of TV that's on right now, like, to ask people to be, like, going back through episodes of TV. I thought, like, I read a couple of useful recaps. I was like, okay, this happens, did this happen? Yeah. This happens. But it's unclear, like, I think the part that we didn't even mention is Wami Masaku's character, the civil rights attorney for the Justice Department,

who's investigating the Baltimore Police Department. She's a helpful, like, guide through step-by-step what's happening because she obviously gets put on to her soul. Yeah. But is that happening in that's happening in 15. I'd say that's where I get lost. Okay. And that's why you could even throw a little timeline on the left or give me a little color correction so I have a better sense of where we are. And I think it's a little bit of an unforced error,

but I also think Simon could give two shits. He's like, this is my thing. You're either smart enough to follow along. And if you can't catch up, see you later. I don't care. This is how we're doing it and you'll catch up, which is fine. Are we okay with how they're using,

Carolina. I know she's very important to all of us. I thought it was a little muted by her in episode one, but I feel like there's some lurking, lurking stuff with her. Do you want to make the official club Carolina statement on this matter? Yeah. I, what you guys decide? Okay, so I think they're doing a good job of the subtleties between how a lady DA would dress, or investigated with dress as opposed

to somebody who works at some corporation. Then there's a PR person or whatever. She's just way dressed down, stripped down. But I think she's still giving her Carolina, like...

She's biting her time. She's got... She knows she can hold this guy's attention. Let's just put it like that. All right. Because he was like, oh, you slink. You got me. She's like, I got you.

Right. I think everybody's going to have like more stuff to do as we go on. I mean, this FBI investigation seems like based on the trailer, like the crux of this entire thing. I wonder how hardcore do you think? Oh, have you watched more than one episode? No, I'm actually, I'm pacing myself out. I'm a man of the people. I like to watch them one and I was like, this is like my Super Bowl.

Like I need to like really savor this. I'm not going to like watch five and then forget what happens. Yeah, I'll be interested to see if they start doing the. people having dinner scenes and stuff like that, or if this is just a straight shoot procedural, all we care about is how we're going to get from point in point scene. But even in doing that, it's like the other county cop that they go Fitzpatrick or whatever,

and he's like, yeah, tell them what's about my bar top pet tab. Like all these little details about that. Like that's such a perfect fucking Irish cop who's like just like grinding away. Like it's just so, it's so good. Well, so here's my question for you. Why only six episodes?

Why not 24? Why not 30? Why do we have to leave this world? I don't understand. You know why? Because I think David Simon is trying to tell an essential story about policing in America

and he wants it to be as real as possible. And it's adapted to Zaria. It is as real as possible. Yeah, and it's adapted from Justin Fenton's. He doesn't want a winning time this thing. That's why it's not, he thinks it's too important to winning time it. I get it.

Add embellishments and do all of that. That's that's clearly why Because this shit, I could be here Forever Forever If it wasn't based on real source material I wonder A, how long the show would have been on

And B, do you start pulling back RealWauer characters? But then you can't turn Marlon into a cop Yeah, you can't have that. But you'd have to toss that aside. I'm saying like if it really was an actual successor,

you could have gone back in that world, which made me think like, all right, if they're rebooting the wire, what's the reaction from general public? And maybe this is the thing that leads to that. What does the wire look like in 2025? I don't think David Simon will ever do that, man. I don't think so.

And I don't know. And how interested with guys. They said that about macho and karate kid. Guess what happened? And I wonder how much these guys, the actors themselves, especially people who aren't like Snoop or, you know, some of the people that they just plucked from Baltimore would be in coming back and redoing these same exact characters.

I think, you know how freaking actors are. I'm a creative. I like new challenges and all this other dumb shit. Well, they also killed off. Unless it's a part of the movie, of course. Or they're all in jail, yeah. Challenges. Yeah.

I guess, you know, the good thing about the wire. And I think out of every great show we've ever had, I think it's the most rewatchable. Even more than The Sopranos. Like, the Sopranos, especially from the first couple years, it does feel a little early 2000s-ish in some ways. Like it does feel that the wire is just like,

you're just entering this universe. And it doesn't matter what year it is. I will say that I've already, like, since I rewatched we own the city like once. And it's like, I'm like, this is, this has like a lot. You can chew on a lot here. Like if you go back, it's not boring.

I'll say this about the Sopranos Bill is somebody who is now a transplanted person in L.A. Like, it makes me homesick for, like, you know, indigenous whites of New York. That's why I kind of like the Sopranos more. Like, it reminds me of being home. It really does. Like, that's why I like going back to the show

because, like, people don't talk like that and have that sense of humor and, like, behave that way out in Los Angeles. for better and for worse, to be quite honest. I'm going to text you guys. I'm going to text you guys video from a fight at the Nets game. And like bridge and tunnel New York City people. Oh, my God.

I'm just like, oh, my goodness. And it's like, this is the New York that like these fancy schmancy, artie party people don't want you to know about. Like, this is actually New York. It's not just the net or the moment. It's this for sure. Chris, do you think the city is going to catch on?

What's the destiny of this show? It's on Monday nights on HBO Max. They chose not to make this a Sunday HBO show. I think that's smart if they're trying to build up the service. But at the same time, it's an HBO Max show. And, you know, I think if it was Sunday night, 9 o'clock, I think it would have been a bigger deal. Yeah, I don't know.

I mean, pairing this with winning time, having like a block on Sunday would be cool. Honestly, man, like, if I could answer that question, I would be so rich right now. If I could tell you why this thing is catching on, but this thing is kind of falling on deaf ears. There's so much television on right now. There's too much TV on.

That's why I think this show will, you know, there's going to be podcasts like this one. There's going to be pieces being written. In a perfect world, I would have preferred this to like one of Barry saw and this to come out at like not the same time. Well, how about July? Like, how about not during round one of the NBA playoffs?

Right. We didn't need more content right now. So, yeah, it would have been like, July 10th would have been amazing. But I get it. They're trying to keep the service going. So you've only seen one, Chris? I've only watched one.

Wow, so how many of you watched? I've only watched one. I ain't get my screeners yet. Okay. I'm going to talk to Chris Ryan off the bottom. Go one at a time. Go one and a time. Okay, yeah, yeah, let's do it.

One at a time. But I'm going to watch our predictions. Because I don't know. I haven't researched. I actually don't know what's going to happen. Well, we know some of the real that stuff that happened. I know. I've read like somebody.

did a really long magazine profile on the dude that they ended up killing in the car accident or whatever. The dirty cops lose is what actually happens. I wonder how they're going to handle that. By a random fuck up. By like they pulled over somebody, got in a car chase, made the motherfucker crash.

Yeah. Yeah. So it's going to be dope. Just put it like that. Just put it like that. Yeah, I guess my advice, because I've tried not to read too much. about the real life stuff because I want to watch it.

And then after I'm done with the six episodes, I'm going to dive into the real life stuff. But other people, they just want to know. See, with this, like with this and girl from Plainview, like I read one magazine profile, however long ago, and that was it. And so I could watch those. Elizabeth Holmes shit, I read too much.

You need too much. Watch too many things on cable news. I'm just like, I can't. I can't do it. I can't. So with this. But the ultimatum, it's just. You know nothing.

The ultimate you had your toes the entire time. Phil, I've never really been a reality TV person but that show broke my brain

in ways that like, who, incredible. My wife and daughter also, I'm totally as well. All right, we recommend we own this city.

And you know, the important thing is that we've, we found a third for Dirty Cop Paloza. Please, I need that.

I need that because Bill, Dirty Cop July. Don't tease me, Chris. Richard Gere in that in that movie is like John Morant in the fourth quarter last night. It's his greatest performance. Some people would point to like Pretty Woman or America Jiglo, it's like clearly internal affairs.

That's the greatest he's ever been. Menacing, brooding Richard Gerey. I'm like, who is this dude? I love what William Baldwin's wife calls him. Or Wayne Baldwin calls his wife and she's kind of like she seems a little to distress. that it's because she's riding Richard gear in their bedroom. Okay, honey.

Save it for the fun. The movie's insane. You're doing the show before the show, Bill. Yeah, sorry. All right, prestige TV podcast, produced by Jesse Lopez. Thanks to him. And who knows? Maybe we'll see you next week with more we own the city.

I know Van Lathen, this show is on his radar. We may have to do a four-leger, a four-person, four-hoster. So we'll see you then.