The Prestige TV Podcast - ‘Succession’ S3E2 Precap

Episode Date: October 22, 2021

Chris and Wos team up to preview Episode 2 of Season 3 of ‘Succession.’ They discuss how certain characters have grown from past seasons, the strategy Shiv utilizes this episode, the new alliances, and what they’re looking forward to in Episode 2. Hosts: Chris Ryan and Wosny Lambre Associate Producer: Erika Cervantes Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Head into the Ringerverse to stay up to date with all things superheroes and nerd culture entertainment. Hosted by a rotating lineup of superfans at The Ringer, including Mallory Rubin and Van Lathen, shows will provide instant reactions to blockbuster releases, insightful backstories on canon, and mind-bending theories, as well as fresh takes on the latest news and rumors. Check out The Ringerverse on Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts. This episode is brought to you by Sweet Cream. The day doesn't ask for permission.

Lunch window? Gone before you saw it coming. You deserve a break that actually satisfies. Sweet Green's new wraps have got you. Real ingredients? Zero shortcuts. Everything you love in one hand. Think green goddess chicken.

Garlic aoli. Crumbled bacon. Corn salsa. 40 grams of protein. Made to keep up with whatever comes next. New sweetgreen wraps hit different. Order now at order. Sweetgreen.com.

You said this place was steps from the water. We just haven't found the steps yet. How much did we save? Enough. Enough to get lost. Or you could book a stay with Hilton. Welcome to your oceanfront room. Just steps from the water.

The Hilton sale is on now. Book on Hilton.com or the Hilton app and save up to 20% to get the stay you expected. When you want savings, not surprises. It matters where you stay. Hilton for the stay. Hello and welcome to the Prestige TV podcast. I'm Chris Ryan.

I'm joined by Borg. Big Waz, what's up, man? I'm good, just really super excited about this season of succession. I did want to share a little bit of life news with you, Chris. Nothing important, but I was in Northern California this past weekend for a wedding in a town called Black Hawk. Where's that? Is that Silicon Valley Adjase?

Yeah, something like that. Healdsburg kind of, like a Bannapa? What were you doing? So this wedding was on somebody's estate, and I don't even think a state does it justice. It was a fucking compound. Yeah. And, you know, like, I'm sure you've probably been to, like, the random B&B rental or, you know, event space rental in, like, the hills somewhere where it's just, like, really nice property. The place that I was at this past Saturday makes those places look like a trailer park.

in West Virginia. Like, it was ridiculously opulent. Like, the basement, if you could even- No disrespect to any of the people in West Virginia who may be listening or any of their United States senators who also may be listening, Joe Manchin. I know this is your favorite pre-cap pot. Right.

And I was just like, yo, this is, like, there's so many levels to wealth in America. And I'm just like, this is just a level that I've literally never, ever encountered. in my life. You know, like, you hear about how expensive it is to live up north these days. And to just imagine how much this plot of land

is actually worth just basically made my brain want to explode. And so, of course, you know, I'm consuming concession. I'm going to rich people's weddings. I'm considering my own meager status in the world. Just a fun weekend all around, Chris. You know, here's the thing is, like, I have a lot of questions for you about the first episode of Succession,

and we're going to be talking about where we think things go in episode two. But one of the things that I always wonder about this show, especially when they get their frequent flyer miles really rolling on it, is like, do, is it possible to get so rich you don't experience jet lag? Because Shiv gets off the plane from the Balkans. Just looking better than I've ever looked after like a full night's rest and like a shower and a shave. Like she's just like, I'm here.

The hair looks great. The outfit is pressed. I like is flying private that beneficial? Like can you just skip the jet lag? Yeah, apparently not having to take your shoes off and your belt at TSA does wonders for the glow of your skin, Chris. So you should try it sometime or at least do a friend of mine who, you know, again, way richer than I'll ever be,

was like, yeah, I don't even, you know, I don't even do private all the time, but what I never do is TSA. I do the joint where they just drive me straight up. After everybody got on the plane, I go to my first class seat and I'm done. So there's an extra level to like global entry TSA or you can just skip the airport? Yeah, you just drive to the freaking, the gate. Okay. It's insane. Glad we're all playing by the same rules.

Let's talk a little bit about episode one first. I want to know, did you just turn it off after Carolina got out of the car? Brough, that was crazy because we spent so much time talking about her on our first preview pod. And of course, she's boom, right there in the first scene. Just a classic, a great...

You felt heard. You felt seen. Of course. A great succession scene where, you know, Kendall does what he does. And obviously, we're going to talk about how utterly clueless this dude is. But like, she goes to great.

She's like, Greg, did you know about this? And Greg goes, no, totally. Caught me by surprise. I have no idea. I want to learn more, though, all of this. And she looks at him like, fucking idiot. Of course she knew. Dumbass.

It was just great. Just like gets us right going into the season. I like how they're now setting it up for everybody constantly has this opportunity to eject on the Kendall project. You know, like, if you're in his orbit, if you're kind of in the car with him, if you're on the phone with him, if you've worked with him in the past, if you're an ex of his, you're just constantly like evaluating the viability of this dude's, this dude's status, his ability to pull this off, which I think is ultimately going to be what this season is about. Like, we've had these brief, you know, in the first season, Kendall tries like the board, the boardroom coup in the second season, obviously, ends with Kendall shiving his dad in the back, not. to put it, no pun intended. This season, it seems like it's going to be a more protracted battle.

I'm curious about where your allegiances lie. In terms of just being a viewer, in terms of just who you want to spend time with. Let me give you the way things have kind of settled out here after the first episode. You've got Logan, Frank, Carl, Hugo, and Tom in the Balkans with Logan in an airport hotel in Sarajevo. Then you've got Shiv Jerry Roman on the way back to the States kind of jockeying for who gets to be Logan's CEO. if he takes a step back.

And then there's Kendall and all his various hangers on, plus Ken and Jess. But he's got like the PR people. He's got Lisa Arthur, the lawyer. Who do you think socially you'd be most interested in rolling with? And who do you think morally you'd be most interested in ruling with? So when they're on the PJ on the way to Sarajevo and Frank is cargles, yeah, you're like, you know, excited about the trip and Frankles. Oh, yeah. I'm just so excited to go to the Balkans for it.

an extended stay. Like everybody, like this is, oh, it's just a great place to visit and be the fucking Balkans. Like, it's the definition of being in exile. Yeah. Being like just away from everything that you know when you're used to. I just felt that to be so hilarious. And I know we talked about Carl and Frank being these grizzled vets, right? Like these hardened dudes.

I just love that exchange that they had on the PJ. Now, you know, It's hard to take a moral stance as far as who you want to see take over. But, like, if there was any justice in this world, yeah, it'd probably be Jerry and Roman taking this thing over. Roman, as you so beautifully put in the previous episode, Chris is like, he's actually shown some, like, growth and development in understanding and leadership and what it takes to actually carry out. most of these missions. And Jerry, more than anybody else, has shown itself to be the most competent person

in the company. Sure. Even more so than, you know, even Logan, right, who is like, you know, kind of getting older and longer in the tooth and is not as, as sharp as he used to be about these sorts of things. Jerry has demonstrated herself over the course of two seasons in one episode

into season three to be the most competent. However, watching Ken just have the car just stacked in your favor. You have the hand. That's why all of these people are lining up behind you. You know, that's why Sanalathan's like, yeah, like, this is obviously the side that I'm going to take here. Because, like, they got this dude dead to rights.

And that's why the PR company is like, well, with you. Yeah, they're like, no, this is so easy. Like, they're like, no, this is easy. And of course, he cuts them off immediately. But they're like, it's so easy. So, but watching Ken, he's so obvious. obviously unfit to get this done. Watching him slowly but surely ruin this is what I'm most invested in.

Watching Kendall blow the 3-1 lead is going to be incredible content. Do you think you'd be a good ghost tweeter for Kendall? Like if you were up against the Bojack guys as like, you know, the voice of Kendall's revolution, do you think you would do a better job than them? Yes. And the reason why, and I think we're going to get into this, Chris, is because Kendall so desperately wants approval

from 20 million constituencies. And a lot of those constituencies, Chris, is what I call the Blue Check aristocracy on Twitter, who, although I loath and hate them, I'm very familiar with what they like, what they need. Those hazy IPAs, that's right. And so that would be so easy to achieve.

So yeah, I know for a fact I could do the PR messages, especially, you know, what you find is like these people want to believe in the goodness of our most powerful overlords so badly. And so it's not hard to craft an image for a guy who's already powerful that he's also human. And so therefore the status quo is more than justified. That's all these people won anyway. I was just trying to figure out whether or not Kendall would be the kind of person who was tweeting things like, to be clear,

this is not normal about stuff. Like was like kind of a real normie resistance dude or like trying to position himself as that. Or if he was like, was he like, I want to be a little bit of an edge lord and have a little bit of like a surreality to my, my Twitter voice. Kendall just has to be a way star,

roico, Ben Rhodes. You feel me? Like, like, yo, like, this is straight. You know, like, this is, that's stupid. But all this other stuff is straight. Of course I should still be the, you know, the nepotism, uh, inheritance beneficiary, right? Like, of course I should be that.

It's what my dad did that was messed up. I'm going to come in and make it great. Like all this other stuff. Yeah, everything that's not me and what I had my hands on is BS and I'm the great one. and all of me and my cronies are the great ones. That's such an easy sell to certain type of crowds. Logan's openly appalling, but the way the show kind of satirizes Kendall's use of buzzwords,

you know, of the clichés of like the tech media world, of his kind of like hat tip to, like, his sort of like gesture of being like, I want to be involved with like, I want all these super powerful women around me, but never letting any of them speak. Right. is actually like almost more effective.

Yeah, it shows you basically, it's showing you Kendall's stupidity, but also like, it's also giving us a window until like, well, there was this potential that Kendall could have been, you know, a decent boy king. But like, as we know, week after week, like nothing around him and the way the world works around him would ever actually allow for that.

But they give us these glimpse, of Kendall's, you know, whatever, billionaire version of progressivism with the people he wants to appease and have around him. And like, you know, when he's in a car and he's calling Naomi, like, I did good, right? I did good, right? I did good, right? But what if I am the best? Yeah.

You know, he shows up to his ex-wife's house. And she's like, look, you did something. I don't see, I don't, I've never known you to ever follow through on serious things. and actually being like somebody anybody can count on for anything of substance. No, but this is legitimate what you did. That one thing you did was legitimate. And, you know, that's what was so dope about the episode to me, Chris, is that most importantly, it proved us right from the previous episode we did.

When it's like when Kendall has one thing to do, he was able to do it. Like, all right, I got to find the perfect time to stab my dad in the back. I found it and I did it. Now that he has to actually start doing more than one thing, it's completely falling apart. Yeah, he has no plan. The nod that Rava gives him is the nod that anyone, if you've ever been at a party and you see someone like talking about their life

and their accomplishments in a really kind of like edge of coked up way. And like somebody else is just like, yeah, for sure, for sure. And it's like, I don't know if you heard my podcast. I just did one the other day. It was, you know, it's not a big deal. It was just about Squid Game. And somebody's just like, cool. That's awesome.

Like, I also have a job. Let's talk a little bit about what these people want. Because I think one of the things that's sometimes hard to track in a traditional way is the immediate motivations of any of the characters. Like, in any given moment, Shiv and Roman specifically might be, I don't know, philosophically aligned with Kendall, but like practice. aligned with their father. And it seems like, you know, in those opening scenes in the airport lounge, when they're kind of like, what are you thinking? And it's like, what am I really thinking?

I'm thinking it might not be the worst thing to think that he's toast. And that kind of like, thought process made external is hard sometimes to track in the traditional way that we watch TV where we're like, this person obviously betrayed this person and now needs to make amends or now needs to go through with it or whatever. Do you find yourself ever tripping up over, like, what does Shiv want in any given moment? Or do you think that ultimately all of them just want the power? Yeah, so I think the show has shown us that the characters have grown to, I think in season one, it was obvious that Roman and or Kendall and Shiv to a certain extent,

but not as explicitly as it became in season two, they all wanted to be the first in line of the succession plan, right? I think what Roman and Shiv have astutely sort of figured out is that even if that's your aim, you have to have a wider view of things in the sense to know that I need to be within proximity of it in the first place if I'm ever going to ascend to that seat. Right. Like I can't get if I don't get it directly, the way that I don't get it is being completely out. So an understanding of building alliances that allows you to be within the circumference

of the power is what you see Shiv do ultimately at the end of the episode where she's like, all right, you know, my dad wants to be an idiot and treat me like a piece of whatever. It seems like Kendall has the inside track on taking this thing.

All right, let me go do the Kendall thing. Even though it's not going to immediately allow for me to become the CEO and the head of this thing, But she understands that she has to be in the game if she's ever going to get there. Yeah. And I think, you know, Roman understood that immediately where he's like, yeah, let Jerry do it. Obviously, she's good at what she does. I form an alliance with her, but that puts me in the seat.

That puts me in the passenger seat of the power rather than completely out by backing somebody who loses. And by the way, that person who you're backing who might lose might be yourself. Sure. You know, I think the show has made these characters understand that like sometimes it's not going to be you who does it, but you need to be around it. Yeah, nobody really wants to just fill out the cabinet. It seems like everybody is like, ultimate eyes on the prize is to be the CEO of Waystar Royco at its most powerful. It's not about like being CEO. It's not about being president of this or that.

Only Tom seems to have limited kind of ambitions for himself. But ultimately, I think he's doing the same thing that you're talking about, which is a lining himself with Shiv and making her kind of work for it a little bit now by being like, you know, when she's like, I love you and he's just like, cool, thanks. Like, I think that he's trying to like displace the power and, and change the sort of dynamics there. About damn time. Yeah, standing up for Tom. I mean, watching him just get cucked season after season was starting to become a little uncomfortable, man.

What did you think of the, uh, the tug of war for Lisa's services? Because I thought that was really effective both to show. That was probably like the most honest Shiv has been in a while. you just get this little snapshot of her being like, I actually need a lawyer for me, not for, not on behalf of my brother or on behalf of my father. I want to start setting up my own,

my own ascendance here. But, you know, that reminded me, I don't know, did you see marriage story, the movie of Scarlett Johansson? Of course. And, like,

there's all that competition for, like, once you visit the lawyer, that lawyer cannot work for your opponent. Yep. I thought that was a cool, it was a cool little trick. Yeah. And what the,

what the lawyer, Sana'a, who, you know, very dope to see her on this show. I'm interested to see the cast of characters that this show is able to attract. Now it's become this sort of cultural sort of touch point. But again, I think there was just a sober assessment that like, look, this whistleblower angle, very workable.

And so I'm going to take the Kendall call. Like, this is, I've drawn the line in the sand, and I'm taking the Kendall call, and this is the side that I'm choosing. I thought that was just, you know, the lawyer being smart. Cynical, you might say, but smart in reading the tea leaves and being able to do that. And it's so funny how, like, the circumstances work out in the sense that Logan basically sideline Shiv because the perception is that she wasn't able to close it when in reality she never really had a chance, right?

So now Lathen's character chose a side. before Shiv even got in there to pitch. And it's just like legal precedent states or whatever that I can't, now that I've engaged with Kendall can't now work with you. And so Logan sidelines her, which then drives her into the arms of these people anyway, of Kendall and Sinai Lathan anyway, right? Like that's so dope like how that domino effect sort of falls.

Like, Shiv gets kills for being somebody who can't get something done, but this was out of her hands. and now her and Kendall are going to form an alliance of convenience, right? I thought that Tug Award was interesting. And just so how it illustrates how these decisions often happen in ways, it's not like the players had much choice in it, had much agency in it, right? Like, it's not like Shib could have went in there and done a better job and been in a more favorable position within her father's camp.

She didn't have the chance. And because Logan just has a one-track mind. he's just like look you fuck this up by get out of here yeah you know like he he can only think in those terms you know it sets up all this other stuff

so that's dope the way they they sort of conveyed that yeah it's cool like my favorite kind of scenes between characters are always one where in the tug of war for like I guess power in a very general sense

is being like shown to us in real time but this show is kind of excellent in in the way that they show the tug of war for power can happen across the ocean or happen from an airport hotel and an ex-wife's apartment or the bathroom of a PJ

right or the bathroom of a PJ when Hugo's like you're trying to find a vein I love all these tertiary characters who were along for the ride Hugo is really glowing up I really like I can't remember it was Carl or Frank who was talking about the Tiananaman accommodations that Royce our Boyko had made

I'd love to see a spinoff show about the Tiananmen accommodations. You know what was funny, though, there was that point where Rob is kind of like, yeah, I haven't gotten a chance to watch your speech today. And I think I talked about this a little bit with Andy on Sunday night on the watch, but do you ever think about whether or not

what's happening that we're seeing on the show actually matters to any of the other people in the world of the show? Like, you know, you look at like what's trending on Twitter right now, and it's like Megan McCain is trending. I don't care why. I'm not going to click on it. Right. But it's like she's like, you know, he's like trending for however long over Tater Tots,

but his ex-wife doesn't take the time to like watch the video. I wonder whether or not like part of the funny part about this show is it actually like doesn't even matter the people outside these rooms. You know, I think the smartest people in and around the show, in and around the main thrust of the show have been those who wipe their hands clean of the family. Who just like, yo, y'all do this. this hit y'all own leisure, I don't have nothing to do with it, right? Like, the pierces were smart not to let Raystar Royco take over, right?

This is a mess. This is ridiculous. Like, you know, Rava is smart to have divorce, Ken, to have moved on, to like, all the shit you and your family do, I don't care. Like, I'm a person in the world. People know that I used to be married to you and then I have children. So people are going to tweet me. people are going to text me, people going to email me like,

yo, did you see this shit? But like, so I know what's happening, but like, am I engaging in it? Am I invested in any of the outcomes? Of course not. Right. It's not like when, like, it kind of reminds me of when the whole DeAndre Jordan situation happened.

And like it was like there were tweets about like Mark Cuban driving around Houston crying. And I was trying, and you would try to explain that to anybody who didn't follow the NBA religiously. And they were just like, what are you talking about? as like a hostage situation. And I was like, no, no, no, we just call it a hostage situation. Yeah. And you know what, and the thing is like you got to think of even somebody like Stewie,

who again, one of the smartest people on the show every single time he's holding the better cards than Kendall or whoever he's dealing with, Roman, you name it. Even him and his collaboration with Kendall, it's only in so much as they get to take the company over and clearly, clearly shove Kendall under the bus into the side. Like, there's no actual desire to engage with these people. The smartest people on the show know that you don't want to have anything to do with this family and the inner workings of it. So we kind of are now back to a place where we were around mid-season, season one where Kendall had kind of assembled and then failed to execute a boardroom coup. One of the things that kind of came out of this first episode for me, though, is this idea that the two halves of this Civil War, I guess, need one another.

that without one another, they're just not as strong or not as stable looking. And despite what we just said about whether or not anybody actually cares about what's happening with this family, like the idea of perception is really important and that like it seems like Logan is lessened by Kendall's absence,

but also by sending his children away, you know, whether that was an act of protection or an act of self-protection, I don't know. What do you think about this idea that like the Roy's cannot actually pull apart from one another? Yeah, I think Logan and Kendall are, because they're so

they operate on different polls where Logan doesn't give a fuck what anybody thinks and Kendall just like I tried to compile a list of people Kendall's trying to appease his ex-wife

Naomi, Twitter, Vanity Fair. It's like all of these ridiculous constituencies where it's like he's too much in the weeds on perception

and how to operate within this modern world and Logan is from a world where it's like, fuck that, I got money. I can make anything disappear, right? Which also is no longer the reality. And so I do think there needs to be an understanding of when to kill, when to show vulnerability, when to be, you know, when to persevere and be hardened.

I think they do sort of need that balance. But obviously, the family's too dysfunctional to actually understand that truth. And I think that's what the show is obviously shown. It's like, these people are too dysfunctional to. even make this work. So it's like with with that list of people that Logan's trying to appease, you left out any friends. Like he doesn't have any. No. You know what I mean? Like and it doesn't really seem like any of them have any friends. Like Roman was boys with that guy at the theme park for the one day where it was kind of like a right a lockdown situation and Shiv thought she was

friends with Lisa and it has like kind of had dalliances or whatever. But it's not like Kendall I guess Stewie would be the person that Kendall would call. Stewie's not his friend. Right. So it's like he's basically trying to appeal to his ex-wife. His current girlfriend who's essentially his drug buddy, but I guess they're sort of keeping each other clean now, which doesn't seem like it's going to work out great. She's a sociopath, by the way. Naomi, let's talk about her. How are you feeling about Naomi? Not a fan.

The idea that you would walk into this lady's house and basically Rick James put your boots up on her white couch, I just, I find that to be abhorrent. Like, that's crazy. Yeah, but I thought that like I agreed with. Andy when he was talking about the wine bottle where it's just like that's just ultimate rich person shit they wouldn't even have a conception of something that was special and was being saved for an occasion you know what I mean I guess I guess except for the fact that like this is the dude's ex-wife mother of his children like there's just a certain level of deference that most people would pay in that person's home right like in their home this like I'm not

talking about out in the streets where it's like all right whatever screw you You used to fuck my man. You know, like, I understand not doing that in any other context, but if you show up as a guest in somebody's home and you're just opening their wine willy-nilly, so you and you, so you and that person's ex could enjoy a dinner in their crib without the, like, it's absurd. It's absurd. It's crazy. So we've got Naomi, we've got Greg, Rava, Lisa, the PR,

folks, Kendall in an apartment. Logan's in this airport hotel in the Balkans and the kids are on their way back or in the States. Shiv has now told her driver that there's going to be a new destination. I think we can safely assume that that's going to be to the Kendall pad. What do you think happens next? What are you looking for next episode? More. Okay, so Shiv is going to come in and she's going to immediately help improve the intelligence of the operation. Yeah. You think It's like the intelligence quotient is going to go way up, having Shivs show up when, you know, the first scene is it's literally Ken, Greg the egg, and Carolina who's like, I'm getting the fuck. I'm getting out of this car. I'm getting out of the car in the hometown Manhattan traffic.

Like, like, done. I'm out of this. So we go from Kendall, who is so high, so pleased with himself, so high. off of his own supply, and Greg the Egg, who's just like clearly way out of his depth to, you know, now they have this high-powered law firm and, of course, Shiv coming and, okay, it's going to sort of balance it out because we know Greg the Egg and Kendall doing this on their own, left to their own devices, completely and utterly doomed. That's something us as an audience can see from a mile away. So the smartness quotient goes up.

And, you know, I think what the show is going to do, because, you know, you're watching Logan, the president's like, not taking a call from you. Yeah. Logan's like, well, I'm not talking to his fucking babysitter. Yeah. He has Jerry called Kelly Ann Conway. That was like, it's not working. So, you know, a lot of his friends are backing away from him. He's in exile.

Like, this dude, like, he's an exile. Yeah, he's in a non-extradition country. He's afraid that he's going to get arrested. Like, the deck is. stacked way against Logan right now. I think the show is going to find a way to sort of balance that, you know, that power and balance as far as who can win and who can wrestle control and who can more effectively shape the narrative going forward.

So I think we're going to have to see a balancing of Logan completely having his head on the chopping block and Kendall and Greg the Egg's sort of bunker being completely out of their depth. Yeah. I think it's going to be like an incredibly indebt. intense second episode. And then they'll have to naturally have some kind of pressure release for like the middle part of the season a little bit.

Although typically Succession has in that episode six, seven area, usually like a really high stakes thing happens, like whether it was safe haven in the second season. I think Prague happened in the first season, the Bachelor Party. So we'll have to see. Wise, thank you so much for talking to me about Succession. You can listen to Sean and Joanna on Wednesdays. Me and Andy go live on the watch feed. Well, we're not live, but you know, you can listen to it right.

after the episode goes on Sunday nights on the watch. And Woz is on group chat and you can watch them on full court fits. So thanks so much for listening to us. Prestige TV podcast is a wrap. Thanks to Erica Svodz for producing us today. Spring just slid into your DMs. Grab that boho look for that rooftop dinner. Those sandals that can keep up with you.

And hang some string lights to give your patio a glow up. Spring's calling. Ross, work your magic.