The Prestige TV Podcast - ‘The Bear’ Season 3, Episodes 9-10: Controlled Chaos

Episode Date: July 6, 2024

Charles and Van dress in all black to recap the ninth and 10th episodes of ‘The Bear’ Season 3. They start by discussing how Carmy might be becoming the very thing he despises and the potential fallout from the Chicago Tribune review heading into Season 4 (4:15). Later, they talk about whether the series sidelines its side characters this season (27:51). Hosts: Charles Holmes and Van Lathan Producer: Kai Grady Additional Production Support: Justin Sayles Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hello, my name is Dave Gonzalez, and I haven't read any of the books in George R. Martin's A Song of Ice and Fire. I'm Joanna Robinson and I've read every book in Georgia R. Martin's A Song of Ice and Fire. And I'm Neil Miller and I have also read those very heavy books. Years ago, we hosted a Game of Thrones podcast called A Storm Spoilers, and we're thrilled to head back to Westrose to cover the second season of House of the Dragon on the Trial by Content feed. We'll be using our book knowledge to dive deep into each episode and answer your lingering questions. So send us a raven every week to Trial by Content at Gene. email.com. Follow and subscribe to trial by content on Spotify or wherever you get your podcast to

join us on Thursdays where these two will explain to me which Targaryen is right. This message is brought to you by Apple Card. Hey, you could be earning 2% daily cash back on that purchase. And that one. And even that one. That's because Apple Card users earn 2% daily cash back on every purchase, including everyday items they buy online or in store when using their Apple Card with Apple Pay. Not an Apple Card customer? You can apply in the wallet app on iPhone. Subject to credit approval. Apple card issued by Goldman Sachs Bank USA, Salt Lake City Branch. Terms and more at Apple.com slash benefits.

The playoffs are here, and you can predict the action all the way to the finals with Fandul predicts. Predict the spread, total points, and even the game winner. Sign up and get a $25 bonus. Offered by Fandual Prediction Markets LLC, a registered futures commission merchant, 18 plus. Bonus is non-withdrawable and expires seven days after receipt. Trading derivatives involve significant risk and may not be suitable for all investors, your activity with our consumer protection tool. Restrictions apply. See terms at fanduil.com slash predict slash bonus dash offer dash terms.

Welcome to the prestige TV podcast. I'm Charles Holmes. He's Van Lathen. Together we're known as the Midnight Boys. And we're back to discuss the final two episodes of the Bear season three. It has been a long journey. Van. How are you feeling?

I am feeling good. Tired? Tired. I mean, I'm inspired, though, bro. This show does have that, does have that quality a little bit. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like, it's been not quite a track meet

to get to the end of this show, but it has been like a 400 sprint. Yeah. Like a long sprint. I would agree. Kai, get your ass back here. What's up, y'all? Guy.

Hey, man. How are you feeling? You know, the Midnight Boys, whenever we're on Prestige TV, we put you through the ringer. How are you feeling about, you know, just where we're headed on this last episode of the Bear prestige coverage, at least for no? I'm feeling great. I mean, it's sad that it's already over, you know, you guys come over here and have some fun for just a little bit and then you're gone again.

So, you know, they're a bittersweet. Don't bullshit me, Kai. Don't bullshit me. You have the fucking fantasy. You on the NFL fantasy pod. You know what I'm saying, paling around with them. You want prestige. You don't get a fuck about the Midnight Boys anymore.

Stop, stop it. Stop it. Don't do this. Guys, some programming reminders, all right? If you like what you've been hearing on the prestige TV podcast between Van and I, make sure you go over to Ring orverse YouTube, like and subscribe. We have a bunch of fun. Show me, Steve, me, Van.

If you want to hear Van delve even deeper into the bear, head over to a little podcast. We like to call the Bill Simmons podcast, all right, where you were a guest this week. And last but certainly not least, July 17th, El Wright Theater. Oh, my. Ring averse, live.

Yeah. House of R. Midnight Boys. Doing it. We back. Can't stop. Guys, we were planning what we have in store for you. Ben, I think the fans might be,

they might not be ready for it. I'm not going to be ready. It's going to be too much. It's going to be too much fun. It's going to be too much interaction. I'm telling you right now, if you come to the live show, you get to be one of the Midnight Boys.

That's all I'm going to say. Hell yeah. All right, with all of that out of the way, let's break down episode 9 and 10, apologies and Forever, directed by Christopher Storer, written by Alex Russell, and then the finale is directed by Christopher Storer

and also written by him. In apologies, Carmie invites Sid to the ever funeral service, but struggles and ultimately fails to apologize to her for the dysfunction of the kitchen. Cicero tells Carmie that if the Tribune review is negative, he'll have to pull the plug on the restaurant. Tip urges Richie to attend

their wedding and Sid realizes from Pete that her partnership agreement at the Bears less than what she'd get for leaving to work with Adam and the facts visit Claire at work to try to get her to reach out to Carmie. And forever, Carmi Sid and Richie attend their funeral service forever. Carmi finally confronts the chef David Field

for the abuse he suffered under him, but Feele says it made Carmie a better chef. Terry reveals to Carmie that she's closing ever so she can live a more balanced life. And then at an after party hosted at Sid's apartment, she has a panic attack after seeing the Beef's old review And then to wrap up season three,

we finally get the review from the Tribune and it seems to be a little mixed. Before we got on this pod, we were just doing Midnight Boys. We didn't want to do any prepod, but you said something that I want you to kind of expound on. We've been a little bit down on the last few episodes of the Bear,

but in your opinion, the penultimate and the finale of this, I don't want to say save the season, but to you maybe opened it up again and kind of put it back on track. Can you kind of explain to the audience why you think that way? So the penultimate was a decent episode of television,

which did what it had to do, which was set up the finale, right? I thought there were some great scenes in the penultimate that raised the stakes a little bit of the season. And we were talking about the fact that the season itself sometimes seems like it didn't have any stakes, but there was actually like nothing on the line. When things are starting to come to a head with Sid, when we realized that the review is crucial to the future of the restaurant,

Richie's situation. We even get a situation with Claire where it's a funny scene with the facts but they put Carmie out there in a way that he wasn't capable of putting themselves out there. Funny stuff, heartwarming stuff. That was a good episode.

Ever, to me, was a great episode. Not one of the greatest ever of the bear, but a great episode and it did something that was very important to me to save the season, which is it made you excited about another season. Yeah.

So what it was able to do was in the show at a place where you're now like, I have to know what happens. I think for some people, their criticism of the bear was that there hasn't been enough, I have to know what happens in the show. People that I've talked about the fact that the show's always been about the characters,

I hear that, and that's true. But it didn't seem like we were going anywhere. and something else. The scene between Karmie and the chef David Fields is it? David Fields, yeah, played by Joe McHale. Played by Joe McKell. It's such an important scene

and such an amazing scene that that scene coming at that point in a lot of ways validates a lot of the other stuff that happened in the season. Karmie is essentially facing in that scene who he could become or and what made him. Or to be honestly, in the eyes of Sid, what he might already be.

What he might already be? Where it's when Sid has a panic attack at the end of the episode. And it's something that her father kind of was like warning her about because if people have forgotten, when Carmen finds Sid, she basically had to quit her business. I think she had a catering business because things happened too fast. she was taking on too much and broke down everything. And I found it very, very interesting that as Karmie is talking to Joel McHale's character, David Fields, and he's trying to reckon with what that toxic environment and what that

abuse did to him. And he's trying to find some clarity, even when he's talking to Chef Terry. Now we have Sid, who is essentially becoming a little Karmie, where it's just like something about the bear and the beef and her. time there has kind of warped her perception of food and a relationship to it. Both characters by the end of the finale feel like broken people, like just more so than even were at the beginning, you don't get that sense of like, are they going to make it? It's like, oh, is, is this just it?

Obviously, Carmi and Sid food means so much to them. But I like, I ended this season like, damn, does it even matter if Sid goes to ever or not now? Not ever, but the spinoff restaurant. The question now is becoming, can these people's relationships and emotions survive their ambition? Yep. Starts with Karmie. It works his way to sit, and it moves all around.

Can their relationship survive their ambition? And there's another question in there. Are they supposed to? In the scene between David and Karmie, it's weird because Karmie is looking at this person and going, you broke me, you were terrible to me. And David is looking back in him and going, yeah, but... Look at you. I made you.

I gave you what you wanted. Yeah. I made you better. Quote, quote, quote, better. You wanted to be, you wanted to be excellent. You wanted to be excellent. And you're excellent. So in that there's, Carmi,

I thought that Carmi would react to his validation of him saying that he's good. I thought Karmie would react to that, but he still couldn't. He couldn't, number one, because he wants an emotional validation that this guy is obviously not capable of, that he was terrible to him. And he also already knows that he's excellent. Yeah. And his excellence is less important right then than what it cost him. This is a fungo bat.

You know what that is? A fungo bat is a bat that you used to hit ground balls to people. Okay. In baseball. I think I've talked about this before. I used to do this thing where I would flip my glove before I would fill the ground ball. My dad hated it.

He absolutely hated it. So what he did was he got the fungo bat and we went behind the gym in my house where there was not a lot of grass but a lot of dirt because we used to play football back there. So the ball was coming at you. And he hit ground balls at me to where I couldn't flip my glove.

I had to get my glove down. over and over and over again. I remember one time I heard a dude watching and goes, God damn, he's killing that, nigga. Like, she's just lasering them. Like hitting them, and the better I got with my glove, the less skips he would get me.

Sometimes the ball would be coming right at me. I just catch it, right? Yeah. Hitting them, hit me. You know what ended up happening? I stopped being afraid of the baseball in any way, but I was afraid of my father. Like there was a trade-off.

Like, you could hit a baseball, you could scream one at me. And if I couldn't get to it with my glove, I blocked with my body. I had no fear of the ball. But I became afraid of him. Because, like, seeing what he would be willing to do to take my fear away was like, oh, my God, this guy's an animal. The question is, do you want to field the ball or not? Yeah. do you want to?

And the question that we're asking is also kind of a generational one, which in the 90s and in the 80s, we had guys like Michael Jordan that didn't fucking care how they were perceived. Michael Jordan is doing the last dance, and he's talking about his career and how people looked at him. And he is fucking crying. Like, Michael's not okay. He's crying.

It might have cost him his marriage. It might have cost him a relationship with his kids. It might have cost him a lot. He's looking at. that people, he's saying, you never want anything. You don't know what it's like and what you have to do. And as a 60-year-old man or in his late 50s, he's crying about it. You're like, God, damn.

But then everybody else in the documentary, there's still hurt. They're still slights. And they're still slights. And they still look at him like he's God. But that's what's interesting about this episode, because you start to see the generational shift, especially in the finale, where all of the chef, these are real chefs in the world are basically talking about the toxic environments that they came up in and not wanting sharing their war stories and not wanting to repeat it. And I think it's Luca who says it when he sees

David Fields where he basically is like, well, he used to be the best, but not anymore. And you're just like, I was like, oh, is that what's happening with Carmi? Where it's like what Sid sees in Carmi is that he is chasing this generational way of fine dine cooking. where it's like you will yell, you will be exacting, you will do whatever you need to get a perfect plate out there. And already the chefs that are coming back to ever, the chefs that have been through a lot of the same things that Carmi has, are now building restaurants where it seems like

they're not trying to repeat that same mistake. But to Carmi, he's like, for me to get there, I need to be like Joel McHale. Like, I need it for some reason. And I think the genius thing about these last two episodes is they mirror each other. because Sid is waiting in the beginning of the penultimate episode for an apology from Carmi.

And Carmi can't do it. And then when Carmi... It's not even that he can't do it. He doesn't even know to do it. Yes. He doesn't even... I mean, it feels like he wants... But he's past the point.

He can't say he's sorry to anyone. He's not enough of a person. But that's the reason they were mirrors to me because it was like, Joe McHale's looking at Carmi. Like, what... fucking great point. He's like, wait, what do you want me to apologize for for making you great? And it's the same thing with Carmie. Instead of apologizing, he's just like, you should come to ever. And Sid does it like, Sid is like, well, of course I would want to come, but like that's not what I need from you right now.

And Carmi's just like, what are you talking about? You're going to be surrounded by all these chefs. I'm going to open this world to you. I'm trying to make you great. And in that moment, all Sid wants is the apology of like, see me. You're changing my food. I'm not your partner. This is all your. ego and to him he's just like we're chasing excellence what does it mean and it's so funny that carmy can't see it in himself but i'm just like bro you have literally become the one thing that you hated most of this world carmy can't see it in himself probably because he doesn't see it as a one to one but this is another thing where the like time matters carmy was there five 10 years before whatever it was things were different to them to the new people that are in that to us sid he is

just like David Phil. Yeah. To him, he doesn't have anybody. That's not the way it happens anymore. People don't just, you can't get away with that. You can't get away looking at somebody and going, you just fucking not good enough. You suck.

But there is a way to belittle someone and to take away their agency that makes them look at you as the villain in their story. There's something else that happens. Karmie's flashback to the French laundry where the chef, there is taking such care with him. So tender, like almost like a son being like, just walking him through this.

Because what is he, he says something to the effect of like, yo, you're going to be here, you're going to learn and you're part of this legacy. Once you get out of here, you will be equipped with this. And it's so funny that that is illustrating like, oh, that's how you do it. Chef Terry even. Like her flashbacks earlier in the season, she's not yelling. When Carmie starts shelling, she's like, chefs, no. She demands, like, tranquility and quiet.

And it's so funny. I'm like, Karmie wasn't raised like this. I'll say this. From what I understand, Karmie went from French Laundrie, then to Noma. Yes. And his last stop was with David Fields. Yeah. According to that guy, he was a good chef when he got to him.

Or an okay chef, and he made him into a great chef. So part of Karmie's deal right now and part of what the, show ass, getting into something personal in the second two, is what's effective and how it affects people. Because it seems like to David, David is going to be reassured by that. David's going to look at Ever, he's going to look at French Laundry, two restaurants. I got into looking at the greatest restaurants in the world, all of this stuff. It's interesting, yes.

I looked at French Laundry won a bunch of years. He's going to look at those places and go, I got something out of him that those places couldn't. I mean, he even looks at the, because this is a real restaurant that exists. When he's looking at Ever and he's looking at all the things hanging, he's just like, they still have this year. He looks down on the place. He's like, to your

point, I do think that he finds some pride in, we see the profile of of Carmi being like the best chef in Chicago. I think he does take pride in the fact that, like, I turned you to the best chef of Chicago. What the fuck do you want from me? I was it, when I got to TMZ, it was like, I don't like people screaming at me.

You know? And it's interesting because I've had this same thing I've gone through what Karmie has gone through. I don't like people yelling at me and I was especially in front of other people. Yeah. And I remember I had to talk to one of my

producers about this. If you know how things ended up at Team Z, maybe this is not the best story to tell but I share everything with the audience. I remember I told him I was like, when someone's in my face yelling at me, do you know what my body is saying? And he's like, what? So my body is saying, attack this person. My body, from where I

I'm from my body, from where I come, I'm from the who. I'm from the who. Nah. Like, my body is saying, hey, you're in danger. Like, this person is about to swing on you. So, like, I'm getting, I'm heaving. My heart's starting to race. Like, my blood is up.

Like, we're on the basketball court. That's one thing because I'm already like that. Yeah. My blood is already up and it's like, whatever. And I'm already like that. So I'm like, I'm saying, I'm like, I would, you can't do that. Like, if you got something to say to me, say it. I'm not above being coached.

But there's a way I'm not going to respond, right? And then I leave there and it affected me. And I had to take a step back and realize what he told me. He was like, man, this is effective. This is going to get the best out of you. You're going to come in here and know what's on the line every single day. And I was thinking to myself, well, I don't want to do that. Like, I don't.

I want to make a decision about how I want my life to be. it's not going to be on the cutting edge of celebrity news and caring at 730. After I leave here, what's going to happen the next day in the office? I'll never be that guy. Like, I made that decision. But there are people that do want it. They want the greatness that comes with their specific thing. I want to be great and other things, just not in that.

And they always have to make decisions about what they're willing to sacrifice, not just around them, but within themselves. as well. Karmie doesn't even see the sacrifices that he's making. He's about to lose it. He could lose the restaurant. He hasn't even, I don't think he's even visited his niece yet. Hasn't visited his niece?

The facts came to the hospital. It was very, we didn't see Karmie. Claire Bear, the whole nine. And when he's having that conversation, he's looking from validation from the only person, or not even validation, because he does get validation. He's looking for him for, in a moment, emotional lifeline from the wrong person.

I mean, so what's funny about the episode, and I think it's like, this is the reason that you bring in an actress like Olivia Coleman. When he has the conversation with Chef Terry, everybody else is looking at this funeral of ever, like, look at what we lost. Carmies, like, I thought this place would be here forever. It's important to him.

He's like, this, once you have a restaurant like ever, why wouldn't you try to keep it forever? And Chef Terry is, like, almost treating this funeral like a birth. She's treating, like she's talking to me like, I basically didn't have a life. I'm tired. She feels free. She's like, oh, I can go to parties now. I can hang out with my friends.

My life and ambition is not wrapped up in this fine dining establishment. And it's so funny that it's like, Karmie can't even really digest what she's saying because the minute he goes to his phone, he's checking the Tribune Review. And it's like, it's funny where it's like, Chef Terry's really giving him the secret to not happiness, but maybe contentment of like, hey, while you still can have a life. But that would never work for him because there are two different parts of their career. He, the episode before, was looking at Nobu and the other guys and talking about legacy. I mean, I think the next season is going to be Karmie.

It's going to be what you say right now. It's going to be Karmie deciding between legacy and life. Do you want love? Do you want contentment? Do you want a restaurant that people can come to and have great meals with their families and make their own memories? Or do you want to dominate the food space and continuously push yourself and push yourself and push yourself and push yourself until you run out of gas? People get mad at me if I'm getting this wrong. But the review that Sid looks at on her refrigerator in the finale,

the four-star review, I believe, is from the Tribune, from the Tribune, from the review. the first season, right? And it's so funny that, like, they got a stellar review. It's just a little clipping. And Carmi went through all of this turmoil tearing down this, the beef, this legacy institution to get a mixed review. And it's not even, like, the review, like, we only see words. The review isn't even scathing. But sometimes I'm like, oh, I've written a lot of reviews in my life.

sometimes I feel like the middling reviews hurt more, like hurt the artist more. Like if it's a scathing review, you could be like, oh, they're just an asshole. They didn't get it. When it's like, oh, this person is great, but this is one, two, three, that they fell short on. I think human nature is to be like, oh, this is more honest, actually,

because that's the stuff that artists feel all the time. It's like you can give artists 99.9% compliments, but it's that 0.01 of like, actually X, Y, Z was not up to standard. Like, that's going to hurt them more. Yeah. And it's, but I want to ask you, this is, I don't know enough about, uh,

the restaurant world or the Tribune or everything. But do you think all, all of this would be writing on one review? Because we see what looks like other reviews, cuts to other reviews throughout this season, where it's like, Karmie's getting glowing profiles. Some of the reviews are,

aren't great. Some of them are just like, this is the best new restaurant in Chicago. And I was like, would the entirety of all of this really be writing on the Tribune? Because even Cicero and Computer, after Cicero has that talk with CarMe, the computer's like, bro, did you tell him? Because it almost seems like it's not really about the review. It seems like Cicero is about to pull this shit. Well, Cicero is running out of money. Yeah. So, I mean, the fact that Cicero is running out of money, it's going to put his future of this.

It's all about survival and what it is that you want to do. even Cicero, what he's doing is out of a sense of indebtedness and guilt. Because he doesn't, and he's had, like Cicero, the character has gotten way more screen time, I think, in a great way because he feels guilt that he didn't do enough for these kids. And I think Carmi especially is the one where he's just like, oh, he sees like, oh, I was not there for him. And like this restaurant, all this money is his way of not apologizing. No, that's, no, it's his way of apologizing. They called it square. Yeah.

In that scene, which was another great scene. And since there even now, I wonder what Cicero feels like. The question is now, can they build? Forget about owing. Can they build? But it's a collaborative thing. And everybody has such strong individual motivations. it seems as if for some of the people,

it's more about how they are going to let other people into their lives. Can Carmi let sit in? Can Cicero and can Carmi let his mom in? Can he let his niece in? I mean, even Richie, like, Richie says something that I'm like, oh, this is a microcosm of the entire season. He's talking to his wife, I think her name, the character saying is Tiff. She's like, when can I come in?

When can I come in? Not until it's perfect. And it's like, oh, this actually might be the problem, where the beef was never perfect, but that imperfection was part of what made it an institution, something that people could go.

I don't know about you. Sometimes I want to go to a diner that I know is imperfect, that I know sometimes and just like, this isn't the best food, but it has character, I feel at home,

I feel the warmth. You don't go there because it's perfect. No, I'm just like, I don't want the best burger in the world right now. I'm like,

it's 9 p.m. at night. Sometimes I just want, like a burger, a shake in like a coffee and just like to be in this spot. Between Carmie and Richie, there's a scene where Richie's walking into Ever and he sees Carmie staring at the wall and staring at all the pictures there.

He doesn't say anything to him. When Richie wants to go and connect with people, he connects with the staff that's inside of there doing the forks and all of the stuff that he remembers. And when he gets there, he's so happy to see him. They are so happy to see him.

There is warmth. There is conversation. He wants to stay in the back with them while the service is going on. He's not one of those chefs. He's one of them. The scene makes a clear distinction between him and Karmie. And the fact that he doesn't go over to somebody and go, hey, this is like a deal. That's where Richie's character as the master of the friend of the house was made. It was made there. So the fact that he doesn't go over to him and go, hey man, this is a big deal or how you're doing or whatever, whatever, whatever.

He walks past him to a place where he feels comfortable and he feels seen and he feels like he learned something and got something. It was another important scene in this episode without actually even having the character say anything to each other. I mean, another important scene where a character doesn't say anything is Karmie sitting at the table with all those chefs? All those chefs are sharing their war stories.

Like Sid is asking them questions. Luke is asking them questions. They're having a ball. Karmie does not say a word to anyone. These are his peers. These are the people. He's finally surrounded by people who can understand him on a level

that he loves food. This should be the only place he wants to be in the world and he's silent. He can't even enjoy the camaraderie that all of them have. He's absorbed. He's absorbed in ever. He's absorbed in David Fields.

He's just like, I, and I was like, oh, Karmie's the lone, one of the loneliest characters I've ever seen on TV. And he's chosen it. He's, and it's like, even when he gets up to the point where he's breaking free, where it's like, he has Richie, he has Claire, he has Sid, he's surrounded by family. He does everything in his power to push these people away. And what I want to ask you, though, is, because I agree with you, these, I knew that these two, last two episodes hit me more because instead of pausing, it'd be like, man, I can't watch another

one. I was like, oh, like I want to know what happens next. This episode is brought to by Borris Head. What if we told you the taste of deep fried turkey is now available at your local deli? Well, Boris Head just did that. Bursting with flavor, perfectly seasoned with that indulgent taste that usually means pointing your whole day around it, presenting the friars turkey breast only from Borris Head. The backyard tradition now available behind the counter. Visit your local Della today, discover the craftmanship behind every bite. Borshead committed to craft since 1905. Some things work better together.

Like Nars's soft matte complete concealer and radiant creamy concealer. Soft matte complete concealer erases and blurs imperfections with full coverage. Then radiant creamy concealer evens and brightens with a luxurious texture and radiant finish. Two concealers. One flawless look. Perfect for a no foundation base. NARS, better together. Visit Sephora to shop now.

This episode is brought to you by Two Good and Company coffee creamers. Howdy take your coffee, piping hot, ice, strong, frothy. But if you love rich, creamy goodness and delicious flavor in every sip, try Two Good and Company creamers. They're made with farm-fresh cream and real milk. Each serving has just three grams of sugar, 40% less than the leading coffee creamers. Two good creamers are available in sweet cream. roasted vanilla and lavender.

So which one are you trying first? Find two good creamers at your local retailer in the creamer aisle. A failing that I do feel like is that I don't know if characters like Marcus got enough to do this season. They didn't. Even Richie to a certain extent. They sign line Richie. They sign line Marcus. They sign line some of the other members of the bear.

The show was real heavy on a couple of characters. They signed line a couple of other people that we like. And even Tina, where it's like we got a whole episode of Tina, but it was in the past. And I was wondering for you next season, what does the bear need to do? Because it seems like basically we're on a razor's edge of like whether the bear will succeed or not. Maybe it'll be closed down. Can the bear get away with a season where there's not as much cooking or it's not in the restaurant? It's not because we didn't get that this season.

And I'm starting to wonder, I'm just like, have they said everything that they want to say about the bear and being in the back of the house, in the front of the house? Because this season did feel like they were more interested in everything around the restaurant than actually the restaurant. I think next season has to be or will be about us preparing to let go of the characters and feel like they're in a place where, we're comfortable seeing them go. I think, think about if this was the end of the show, think about how concerned you would be for Karmie. Think about how concern you would be for Sid. Think about how concern you would be for Ritchie.

Think about how concerned you would be for all of these characters as this was the end of him. I really do think the next season of the bear, partly is going to be about getting us to a point to where we feel good enough with these characters to say goodbye. not that they have it all figured out not like necessarily a happy ending but an ending that

helps some of them come to terms with the realities of what they want like if Karmie wants to be David Fields we have to see him make that choice and dive hair first into it and stop trying to have one foot on both sides of offense but it seems like even in because this show is very intentional

I think they they were intentional in the fact that the window is doing successful. Like, it seems like the only thing in this company that is making money for them is what they were always selling, which is the beef sandwiches? So I'm like, is there a version of the bear as a restaurant that's a happy medium

between the two? Because it doesn't seem like this is half the beef, half the bear. It seems like this is fine dining the bear, we're chasing a Michelin Star, and then we just have this window where we're selling sandwiches. And part of me is like, is this carmi coming to a realization that it doesn't have to be black or white. He can have more of a gray. He can build a restaurant that's not chasing a Michelin star and is more of this community.

And is not just like, fight, fight, fight, fight, fight. We need to have a star. We need to have the best reviews. I need to be the best chef in Chicago. I think his decision will also depend on what happened with the review. You looked at the review and it was really well done the way that they, gave us the review, because it's obvious that he's not

completely okay with it, but it did seem to be a mishmash of things, right? I feel like the review and how the restaurant is perceived, at least at the beginning of next season, will inform which way Karmie goes. Okay. And which way the restaurant goes?

And like, what is the show trying to say? Is the show trying to say, you can come home again, but you have to come home the same way you were? Or is the show trying to say you can come home again and build a new home?

And take elements of your past immersion with what you learned and be content and awesome in the place that you are and that you are deserving of abundance of love and success. Is the show trying to say, hey, this is the world,

you got to choose? Or is the show trying to say, hey, you can be, in a situation to where, I think about guys like Bradley Bill, right? I'm serious. At the end of his career, Bradley Bill's probably going to get a lot of shit. It's already started.

He's made a shit ton of money, and he's never really won. But if you're Bradley Bill or some of these other guys, you've got to feel really good about your life. I mean, you're a competitor, right? But you've made an amazing amount of money doing what it is that you love. you have a great family you've never been in any trouble you're doing so

good and at a certain point that has to matter now there are some guys that play in the NBA or other sports that it won't matter to they don't care they got to they got to win the championship they got to get the MVP

and it's kind of weird that that's what we respect we respect guys that sacrifice it all for greatness but I mean you hear every single time Shaq brings it up. I'm like, he'll be like, dog,

I was a piece of shit, and now I'm alone. Like, I just, I was not a good dad. I was not a good husband. And you, like, you hear the way he talks about him. I'm like, damn, was it worth, like, would he have given up a championship to be like, oh, man, I could do it all over again? You know what I'm saying?

Where he's like, it's, and that's with Carmie where I was just like, even if he does get a Michelin Star, and Richie never talks to him again. And he doesn't have a close. He doesn't have Claire. He doesn't have Claire. He leaves and goes to another restaurant. Doesn't matter?

And he, like, how would that be enough for him? And it's unclear with the character right now. And another reason why I keep going back to that scene is because what he was asking for from that guy, it would have been one thing in that scene if the, it would have been, he wanted that guy to say that he was a great chef. He said that with almost no trouble. He said that with almost no trouble. Hey, you're an excellent chef. He said that with almost no trouble.

If Karmie would have been like, I just want that guy to think that I'm good. That's not what he wanted. He wanted something emotional from him. So he wants something emotional from the guy that gave him structure and he wants structure from the people that have an emotional connection to him.

He's in a weird place. Well, also because this is the thing, and this is the greatness talk we keep coming back to, Carmi has gotten to the point where there are profiles on profiles, reviews on reviews that are saying you're a great chef. David Fields is saying you're a great chef. He made it about one.

But now he's at the end where he's just like, oh, his life has not changed. The bear is losing money like the beef. His family situation is not what he wants to be. And you're just like, oh, the thing that Carmi is like bumping up against is just like, oh, it'll never be enough. being the best, even if Karmie got a Michelin star, I guarantee

you he'd be like, what is it going to take to get two or three? You know what I'm saying? If the bear is a success, he's like, well, I want another restaurant and I want this. And I'm like, oh, chef Terry was trying to tell him in that moment, live your life, have friends, go to parties.

And it was very, very interesting to me that chef Terry, who does not even know Sid ends up at her apartment. All the people to end up. Everybody's having the time of their life. And Carmies alone walking on the sidewalk,

reading a review of his restaurant. Mm-hmm. By himself. And you're like, did Sid not invite him? Everybody is celebrating. Everybody is having a good time. They're singing that song. I don't know that song.

Everybody was singing the song. I do not know this. Like, I'm not supposed to know that song? Probably. Shout out the watch. They always be like, yo, this is the song. And I'm just like, I'm not white. That song is from the 90s.

I looked it up. I don't know that song. And they're all singing it pretty, and they're all singing it, they're together. I don't know that record. I don't. But they're all singing the song.

They're having a great time. And Karmie is going through it. Miserable. Yeah. Now, for our last Kai's corner of this season, Kai. A song is called Laid by James. Oh, dope.

I don't know James. I don't know James. You know James. Cah? Never heard it in my life. It's before my time, Van. So, Kai, in the finale, Chef Terry was, you know,

mixing up, mixing up some shit with all the food in Cid's refrigerator. What was the first concoction they made? It was... There were like the ego waffles. An ego waffle

cream cheese caviar situation? Was that what it was, man? I couldn't see. She was just using it off. Look at Kai. Kai. Kai looks fucking disgusting. Kai. It's sick work.

Would you try an eggo waffle cream cheese caviar? No, absolutely not. I'm out. Would you try caviar? I'm intrigued enough to give it a try.

I don't think I'd like it though, to be fully honest. Do you like seafood? I do like seafood. I like shrimp. Oh. That's like my gut-to. What are the seafood do you like?

Sometimes crab. I don't like salmon. at all. Hate salmon. Salmon's terrible. What about halibut? I think I like halibut. I haven't had it in a long time.

Sushi? Will you do some sushi? Oh, no, it won't do sushi. Wait, what? Kai, you won't do any sushi. No sushi. You've never had it? Not even a sushi roll?

I've had it once. Didn't work for me. Surprise. From where? Was it like some gas station sushi? It might have been bad, honestly. It was like years ago. It's got to be like a better part of a decade now.

Kai, we got to get you more adventurous. What I'm realizing this season? Like, dog. No sushi, really. Is there something that you think would fall within what I like that's in sushi? Like, I feel like... No, it's like, if you go to a really, really nice sushi restaurant, they're making it in front of you,

just like get some nice fatty tuna. You know what I'm saying? A nice piece. It's divine. Sashimi, you don't do shishimi either. I don't think I've ever had that. I don't know what that is. It's...

I'm keeping a buck. Van, can you talk to him, please? Kai, look, let me tell you what I'm going to do, Kai. I'm going to make you a promise right now. My promise is that I'm never going to talk to you about this again. No, we have one more season. Yeah, we got to get back in the bag. Kai, let me tell you something right now.

Just fucking enjoy eating cinnamon toast crunch and pringles for the rest of your life. Okay. Okay, that's what you like. I'm not going to even try to talk you out of anymore, Kai. We're doing one of the greatest food shows ever made. No, no, no, no. Kai is too powerful at the ringer now. He's going to be in rooms.

People are going to be inviting him to dinner and shit like that. You don't want to be walking in there. You ever see the movie Big? Or he walks into the party and they got the food and they give him the food and he bites into it. And then he spits it right out in front of the people's faces because he's not used to adult food. That's Kai. That's Kai. And I'm not going to try to change you.

No, no, no, no, no. I'm not going to try to change you. Bro, because we're going to, we need Kai in these rooms. You know, the Black Illamnati is recruiting. Just bring some chick filet in the room with you. All right. Some chicken tetheres. Yeah.

Some shrimp. I'm down. Shrimp, chicken, tins, or shrimp? Wait, do you like shrimp, shrimp? Like, shrimp, or do you like popcorn shrimp? I like popcorn shrimp. That's what I'm talking about. All right, man.

Get your shit up. That's it. What did you think about the end of the show, Kai? I liked it. I think that I'm still, like, kind of mixed on the season as a whole. But I think it ends in a way where I was like, as soon as that to be continued hits, I'm just like, ah, they got me. They got you.

Yeah, they got you. I'm just like, ah, we're a season four. The first two. seasons of the bear were both 10 out of 10s or maybe the first one was a 10 and the second one was a 9.5 out of 10. Then this one I would say was an 8. An 8 or a 7.

I was about to split the difference to say this was probably like a 7.5. 7.5. I'm on a 7.5, 8 and remember you guys, there's a certain quality that the show has is so well made that it can't be too much lower than, but like 7.5 8 I can see it.

I was so there at the end that I'm closer to 8. Yeah, but also I got to be we have to, as a society, just let TV shows be TV shows. We get so emotionally invested in this shit. People act like the bear, maybe taking a step down is a crime against humanity.

And I'm just like, yo, Nali's making this shit hard, but I'm just like every season is not going to be a 10 out of 10. It's not. Like, it just, I don't care what TV show it is. There are going to be lesser seasons.

Yeah. And also, I do believe in the creatives enough where they've laid enough groundwork where I'm like, oh, if season four is the final season, I think we are set up for greatness. Yeah. I didn't get back there. So, guys, thank you.

We did it. We did it. Thank you to Kyle on the boards, Justin Sales, for everything he does for prestige TV. You know, my running mate, my cousin, fucking Van Lathen. Yo, we'll be back whenever the Bear season four comes back. Yo, thank you for rocking with us, cousins. We'll see y'all soon.

Hey, Mama. for making all my favorite recipes. Hi, Ma. Thanks for your unfiltered advice. Hi, Mom. Thanks for always being by the phone. Hey, Mom. Happy Mother's Day. When you ship UPS Air at the UPS Store, your items arrive on time or your money back. Guaranteed at no extra cost, exclusively at the UPS store UPS store U.S. retail locations. Visit the UPS store.com slash air shipping for full details. Terms and conditions apply.

Send your Mother's Day gifts at the UPS store and we'll get your gratitude there on time. The right window treatments change everything, your sleep, your privacy, the way every room looks and feels. At blinds.com, we've spent 30 years making it surprisingly simple to get exactly what your home needs. We've covered over 25 million windows and have 50,000 five-star reviews to prove we deliver. Whether you DIY it or want a pro to handle everything from measure to install, we have you covered. Real design professionals, free samples, zero pressure. Right now, get up to 50% off with minimum purchase, plus get a free professional measure at blinds.com. Rules and restrictions apply.