The Prestige TV Podcast - ‘The Bear’ Season 5, Episodes 1-4: Let It Rip

Episode Date: June 26, 2026

Van Lathan and Charles Holmes plug the drain to recap the first four episodes of ‘The Bear’ Season 5. (0:00) Intro (1:03) Previously on … (7:57) Instant reactions (15:33) Is Carmy better off without The Bear? (20:54) Syd as a leader (22:14) Why Richie is such a fascinating character this season (24:31) Has ‘The Bear’ become more prickly? (31:57) The restaurant’s existential crisis (35:29) The lack of celebrity cameos this season (so far) (39:45) Carmy and Syd’s partnership Email us! [e-mail] Follow us on IG and TikTok! Subscribe to the Ringer TV YouTube channel here for full episodes of ‘The Prestige TV Podcast’ and so much more! Hosts: Van Lathan and Charles Holmes Producers: Kai Grady and Devon Renaldo Additional Production Support: Justin Sayles and Jacob Cornett Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

What is up, y'all? Welcome to the Prestise TV podcast. I'm Charles Holmes. He's Van Lathen. Together we're known as the Midnight Boys. And we're back as we are every single year for this little annual tradition of covering the bear. Yeah. A little housekeeping before we get into it.

Don't worry, y'all. Rob and Joe will be back this weekend to continue their coverage of Cape Fear. For right now, we're going to the bear. How are you feeling, man? This is the final season. Anxious. Anxious. Because look, here's the thing about the bear.

This show just shot out of the gates like a canon, right? And it had a weird type of success. A type of success that shows in their first season rarely get, like people were adopting some of the slaying from the bear. It made stars out of people. After the bear came out. Halloween costumes. Halloween costumes.

It really penetrated culture, right, for that first season. See, wait, let me ask you this really quick. Sure. Because I was thinking about this, can you name another TV show maybe within like the last, I don't know, like five, six years that has minted this amount of stars? Like the pit is a huge show, but I haven't even seen for that cast. It is like Jeremy Allen White is a star. Ebben is a star.

Iowa is a star. Lionel was in Project Hell Mary. Everybody's running. Everybody's running and working, yeah. Yeah, it is that to me is incredible. but watching this final season, when I realized, I was like, oh, the bear as a show weirdly, the narrative of the show followed the trajectory of it,

where it's like the first season is a surprise, second season critically acclaimed. All of these people are becoming stars. But as the show gets bigger and bigger, we get cameos, celebrities want to be on the show. People start turning against it. In the Emmy race, they're like, oh, how is it winning all these comedies?

It's sweeping comedy awards. It's sweeping up. It's not even a comedy. And it almost kind of predicted where we're at with TV, where it seems like it's impossible to be a hit show in 2026. It seems like you get one or two seasons, and the audience turns on you immediately. Well, I think to a degree it's always been like that

in the post-Sopranos, Mad Men, prestige area. So basically the streaming era. So basically the streaming era, it's always, it's difficult, right? It's difficult because of the way you have to put the stuff out. It's difficult because of what the stars want to do now, of what it means to be a star now,

maintaining your narrative and your energy throughout an entire season is this relationship with your audience that used to be a lot more reflexive in years past, right? And now it's different. Now you kind of got to try. And with the bear,

the bear is still dropping in bulk batches, right? It's still a binge. Every year it's still a binge, which that also kind of, to me, is inconvenient to the stars of the show because you get all the bear at once, you talk about it for a short time, and while that's good for their careers in terms of the movies that they do, they're not buoyed by the success of the bear throughout a whole summer. Yeah. They don't get to be stars of the bear for three or four months.

It could be stars of bear for like a week, two weeks. You look at Widows Bay. Matthew Reese, I cannot open Instagram or Twitter or go anywhere without like an interview because that show starts, no one's really watching it. And then it's like the heads are watching it. By the end of, you know, or the beginning of this summer, you're like, people are like, are they going to sweep the Emmys? And to your point, when it's a batch drop, it is the stars and the creators almost get all

of the acclaim, but they get all of like the duration. Whether you love it or hate it, it all comes in one week's well. And also like, you know, I'm sure that their careers are so popping. I'll go back to your question in a second. I'm sure that their careers are so popping that they kind of maybe want to

be done with the show a little bit. They probably want to put it in the rearview mirror and go try other things. Jeremy and Ellen White has a social reckoning coming out. You know, I ask him everywhere. She's just going off Broadway. He's going to be in doomsday. Evidence of the thing. So all these people.

are all moving to working line. We've talked all about them and what they're doing. So maybe they want to be free of this. But there is also something that like, if you make a couple of bad choices, right,

if your Bruce Spring scene movie doesn't go well, if people are wondering now whether or not you are a movie star, right, if you're Jeremy Allen White, if your show we're running in a more episodic fashion, your show would be able to satiate people a little bit. They'd be able to get back in touch

with what they like. And also, to your point, the reaction to the show is different because season three of the bear didn't go so well. And part of that is because people watched them all at the same time they didn't have to sit with them. But as far as making stars, no, except for maybe Game of Thrones, right? Game of Thrones is, yeah, the last time. But the cast is so expansive that you can't compare it to this show.

Well, maybe also Atlanta. I would say Atlanta, Argoleet. Yeah, Atlanta. Atlanta is there as well. All of them got huge, huge zazzy beats. Lakeith Stanfield, Atlanta is definitely one. But Atlanta is very similar to the bear in that regard. To where those stories are contained, that narrative is very tight and very clean,

and it's so specific that you can take somebody from that and say, this is how I make them this huge actor and this other thing. With this final season, I was wondering, because we're going to get into the episodes really, really quick. But I realize the other reason I feel like the actors might be, maybe ready to say goodbye is I'm like this must be such a hard show

to film. That intensity, those characters just kind of being locked in that space where everybody is frantic, everything is burning down. I was like, dog, this is a family, but after every season, after these four episodes, it's like, God damn, are they putting these both fuck? It's tough.

They're putting them through it, and they're also putting the audience through. It's an intense show. Like some of the best episodes of the bear are when they just take the MPA sign off of the car and mash down on the gas and just go.

And when you catch your breath, the credits are rolling. This particular season is just everything is hanging on the balance in every single fucking scene in these first four episodes.

It feels like all the relationships are hanging in the balance. The restaurant is hanging in the balance. not just the survival of the restaurant as a culinary artistic entity, but the survivor of the structure of the building. You could see an episode of the bear where the whole fucking restaurant crumbles down on Karmie and Sid and everybody dies. Like that's how the fucking, you know what I'm saying?

They're over a single. Yeah, they're over a single. So the question that is different from the first season to now is, is this show still enjoyable. You know, like the first season, it was insanely enjoyable, right? But as the show built its narrative and things continue to happen, it's sometimes a tough watch. We get into the actual episode, all four directed by Christopher Storer, and they do something

that I was like, oh, okay, you're going there. And I've only watched the first four. But through these initial episodes, I'm like, oh, this is contained. in a way that reminds me of the first season. Yeah. It's not, we're not doing the second, third season thing where it's like, oh, we're going. Sid is going here to get inspiration and we're having a flashback episode and we have forks and we have this and that.

These four episodes are all, our time has run out, quote unquote, we're back where Karmie in the finale of the last season gave the partnership to Sid. He gave it to Richie, said I quit. And in these four episodes, we're on a one-way track of like, we have one meal. Right. We need to prove that.

And by the end of the fourth episode, it's like surprise. The critic who's going to give us a star or not is coming. And I was like, oh, that is so interesting after building this narrative. Whereas you see Brie Larson in this. You see Bob Odenkirk in this, almost stripping the narrative back

and making it this family, in this cursed restaurant. What are they going to do? I found fascinating. It's fascinating specifically because of your journey with the characters. You get to a point in this particular season where you're not sure what you want for them, which is an awesome place to be with characters.

Like Game of Thrones, you got to a point to where you didn't know who you wanted to win. Yeah. You know who you thought was going to win. But the show got to a point to was like, well, who do I want to win? Do I want Danny to win? do I want John to win? Do I want

Circe to win with everything that she's been through? I didn't, but do I want? Right now, I don't know what I want to happen to the restaurant. It seems as if

they would all live free or fuller lives if they were apart that they're asking too much of each other, but it would also seem like such a profound disappointment

for them not to have a 15, 20 year run with the restaurant. But inside of all of that, man, for this little restaurant during this rainstorm at this particular time, we're only through episode four. The stakes just seemed so high that I can't relax with any scene. And it's even the Sopranos, which is a show that was about a guy who like oftentimes

kills people. They gave you a time to relax sometimes. And these four episodes, they didn't give you very much leisurely TV time. Because we start, we're like, all right, it's torrential downpours. It won't stop raining. the fucking pipes are bursting, the basement is flooding, people are falling through the roof, they're over a sinkhole,

they're looking to see who has the air rights, can they build a hotel? And even Uncle Jimmy basically has lost three-fourths of his fortune. He's off with a new character cheese and computer trying to figure out, do we have the air rights to this place? Because they're realizing, like, no one wants to buy a restaurant,

especially one that's going to sink into the ground in the next five or ten years. So he's like, can I sell this and make it a hotel? There's not one character throughout this entire four-episode stretch who was in a good place. Even Marcus, coming off of this big accolade, Best New Chef, is feeling it now. He's almost becoming a little carmy in a way where it's like he's now trying to prove to his father. He's like, this might be the only chance I get. And I'm like, that is a very, very interesting place to put all these characters. But to your point, I was like, I watched this before bed and I was like, stress.

I was happening. I was just, oh, fuck, I feel caught on. I mean, you know, as you watch the show, as you see things happening, you realize one thing in these first four episodes. This restaurant is the thing that connects these characters that we love. The prelude to this show is some type of story or understanding of Karmie's family, right? The idiosyncrasies of that family, the absurdities of that family, right? But it starts and is oriented around the death, or at least dealing with the death of the person that seemingly kept that family together. Yeah, Mikey.

So Mikey kept that family together. So the question then became, what keeps that family together now? And it wasn't together when we first got there, when we first started with them. It wasn't together at all. They had all the bones and the skeletons of that same family that Mikey kept together, but everything was going. Then this restaurant comes. And not only does it bring the Brazzado family back together, right? It brings them back together.

Mom ends up coming back into the fold. The sister comes back. Everybody is together again, right? it creates a new family. And the restaurant takes the place of Mikey. The restaurant is now the thing that glues these people. And it feels like if the restaurant meets the same faith that Mikey does, that everybody disperses again.

But once again, you don't know if that might not be the best thing for them. But for me, I don't want to see this family that I've spent these years with like end up the same way that they were when we first found them, which is dismembered from one another in different places, not just physically, but also emotionally.

I mean, watching this season, because it's always been there, but it was even more pronounced, because sugar at one point, is kind of describing the plight of the restaurant. Yeah. Restaurants are a terrible fucking business.

They're impossible to keep open. And as I was watching this, I'm like, pardon me, feels like Christopher's store and his team are using the bear, the restaurant, Carmisid, and everyone's plate to really talk about what it is to do like anything creative or anything with a team where it's like, if you're a championship basketball team, you win the fucking championship the next day, what are people talking about? How are they going to keep it together? How are we going to pay all these people?

When you're on a successful movie or even a bad movie, you're like, oh, we're a family. we are pushing this boulder up a hill for eight months a year. However long, you make the thing. And whether it's a success or failure, that family might not be able to stay together. And watching these episodes, I'm like, oh, I feel like Christopher Storer almost is going through that in almost a meta way, where it is like you build this restaurant,

you build something successful, and you have all these stars and you have all this attention and you have all these Emmys. And at the end of the day, what are you doing it for? Are you doing it for a star? Are you doing it so you can show off your cooking skills? Right. Or it's like, even if you are doing it for family,

I was reading this very interesting interview with Evan Moss-Backarach where he was talking about how much the bear has changed his life and how much he loves this show. And the interview ends with, but it needs to end. And he did not say that in a way that he disliked the show or that he has any resentment, but it was a level of him like, oh, I can't imagine what it is like being on a rocket ship like that for this long and being like part of my life has stopped

because you feel it with Karmie where it's like, I don't know whether to believe Karmie or not. Has he fell out of love with cooking or is he like for me to become a better person, I need to get out of here. I think the thing with Karmie is Kami, what I am getting from what I'm watching from Karmie is that

Karmie thought and he was trained as a chef to never, ever, ever accept any limit. Like it's a creative endeavor. What are the limits on Steven Spielberg? What are the limits on Martin Scorsese? Where are the limits? They have no limits, right? They take us to different galaxies and universes.

They take us inside of our own communities to underbellies and secret societies and people that we don't know are there, right? And exploration of the mafia, which is a secret society. and uncover all of these things. There's no limit to it. And the way Karmie was raised up in cooking is there was no limits there either. There were no limits to what you could accomplish. There were no limits to what you had to sacrifice, which is a part of the game, right?

And he kept pressing upon everyone to think bigger, to go harder, to try more, to stretch yourself and push yourself. And Karmie is coming to terms with his limit. He's coming to terms with the fact that his talent might not match this breakneck ambition that everybody else has. Family might be more important. Like serenity might be more important. He also might be just telling himself that.

He might get to a point to where he thinks that that is the case for him, but it's really not, right? He might just be so beaten down by it that he doesn't know that he'll never, ever, ever be happy, not being the man at that restaurant and waking up at 2 o'clock in the morning trying to figure out recipes. But it was interesting because he has that talk with Richie. Right. Where Richie is basically like,

it was so funny because there's someone who wrestled in high school. I felt it very, I felt it very, Richie was just like, dog, that's a solo. It's a solo sport. And you got your ass kids. It's, and what I find so interesting about Carby is there's this level

if he comes back in the first season, and he is almost this little tiring where he's not wrong. The restaurant is fucked up. The books are fucked up. It cannot exist like this. It cannot survive like this. And Richie being the one like we are out of gas.

Right. We need teamwork. You have been trying to do fucking backflips and show us how much you've learned and how much you can do. And I'm telling you right now for us to get where we are. I think even Marcus says it,

where it's like that free jazz moment, whether you're playing football or soccer, where it's like you might be the man, you might be the ace, you might be the person that can take us to the promise land, but there's a part when you're great of letting go and being like part of greatness is raising the floor of everybody else.

So even if you're not having your best day, you're ensuring that everybody else is. Because like you see Sid in these episodes being overwhelmed as a leader, being like, oh, now I'm the person who has to deal with someone falling through the roof and telling this person to do that. And I'm like, oh, even Carmies in the wings being like,

damn, she's become a little carmi. Well, I mean, she is, at the same time, it's just obvious that there's a part of this that she's much better at than him. Like, he is a much better cook with utensils and recipes and she's a much better cook with people. Yeah. She's a much better cook with ideas.

is. Like, she's a much better cook with organization. It's interesting that I didn't know that in a restaurant, everybody called each other's chef. Right? And I think that I didn't understand it for the full run of this show

and I understand it now. Because everybody's responsibility in that type of environment is so through the roof. Everyone's intensity level is so through the roof that bestowing that title on everyone

is an understanding of how much everybody is bringing and that there's this gigantic shared load to lift, right? Load to lift. I didn't just say loads. You know what I'm saying? Don't play me. And so now I see it. And now I'm seeing her with the capability

because maybe he's a little bit burned out to lift more than him, to empower people in the way that he can't. He calls everyone, chef, but doesn't feel like he really means it, right? He can hear how hot the stove is. He can hear it. He can hear how hot the stove is. Turn around, turn that down a little bit.

He's used to micromanaging things because he's wearing it all. Is there a chance that when Carmi gives some of his burden away, that he'll be more comfortable where he's at? Is that the true end of this show? Carmi being comfortable in his own skin somewhere because it doesn't seem like he's been anywhere else he's been. I mean, it's also like that burden of that type of genius. that Karmie has, where very rarely is the most talented person in the room the best leader.

Right. And when you look at someone like Sid, you're like, not only does she have the ability to cook on a similar level as Karmie, she has a thing that he doesn't, which is like, I can empower everybody else in this room. Tina or Ritchie or everyone else, she, like, you even see it in these first four episodes being like, I'm trying not to curse. I'm trying not to yell. She is like, you see her struggling with, how do I go from the Bearsado reign, the carmy reign of the way I communicate with everyone is cursing, yelling, fighting, throwing shit

to a place of like, no, we're a family. How do we get to what Marcus is talking about, that free jazz moment of everybody is so talented. If there's trust in this kitchen, we're going to survive. And maybe it's only for a night. Maybe it's only for a week. but we're surviving instead of being in a war zone. Because there's even a moment where, like, she goes,

why is, why'd you design it like this? Yeah. I don't know. Right. Part of me I was thinking, I was like, I think that's how it was designed in the other places he was at. Right.

He never thought about why it was designed that way in these Michelin restaurants. He was just going, this is how you need to cook. And for since, she's like, but that's not how our team runs. You weren't thinking of our team. Just doing what he was programmed to do. I want to talk about Richie,

Because Richie also is such a fascinating character in this final season. Because in the same way that like now he's almost more, and maybe he always was more emotionally intelligent than Carmeet, his last evolutionary leap is, who am I without the quotes? Right. Without the Michael Man movies, without the suit, without me trying to impress upon you how much I've read and learned. like after Forks, what I think is interesting is like for most shows,

Forks would be the moment where Ritchie becomes this self-actualized being that cannot do any wrong. And you realize, oh, he's tipped over almost too far into like, no, you need to lead in your own way. Like you, because it was so funny when he's having that speech. Originally I thought he was talking about the original beef when he's talking about the perfect restaurant. And then he's like, he ends up being like, no, I'm talking about the Bearsado family.

And I'm talking about those Sundays at their, at their crib where you could come over as you are. Whatever food was in the fridge is what was served and they would never kick you out. And I was like, oh, this is where Richie needs to get. He doesn't need to recreate the beef. He needs to recreate the family that to your point earlier gets fractured once Mikey dies. Yeah. It's fractured once Mikey dies. doesn't exist anymore.

There's nobody to hold it down. Karmie has left along before that. Their mother is not in a position from an emotional standpoint to be that rock for everyone. She actually stresses everybody out. And so they're kind of splintered, right? And Richie, whose stability was in that family,

mostly, is kind of on an island. And he was the slowest one to change in all of this stuff. him and Sid almost killed each other, right? The slowest want to change. But now he has become the rock. He has become the rock for them. Ritchie is now a character that whenever he opens his mouth,

like I expect wisdom, because he's really had to look at himself and evolve. All of this is happening. Everything is wet. This is a loud four episodes. This is a frantic four episodes. This is an episode where, let me ask you this, Did you laugh?

There are a couple of times that I laughed, but I didn't really, this four episodes to me is not great proof positive for the whole bear as a comedy contingent. So I largely just don't care about whether the bear is a comedy or not conversation, but to answer your question,

I didn't laugh, but I was almost happy I didn't because I was like, these four episodes did the interesting thing where I'm like, oh, the creators are trying to like excise something. They are trying to, this season I was just like, oh, I was trying to put my mind, like my head in like Joanna Callow,

Christopher Storer, the showrunner, co-creator of this. And I was like, like I said in the beginning, to me this season feels like what happens when you finally make the thing? When Eben Moss-Backack was talking about the beginning of the bear, he was just like, we thought this was the red-headed stepchild. Nobody thought that this was going to be a big thing. This was, it was coming out around a time where it was like Disney Plus had like the Mandalorian and all the MCU and the MCU TV shows.

And you have this thing that's the bear that's like this indie comedy. And almost throughout its run, the bear has not only become more ambitious, it's become a little bit more prickly. And to me, these four episodes were a little bit more prickly. where it was like, and I could, one of the moments was interesting when Sugar is talking about her mother with Carvey. And they both say something that is like, you never want to say to people, but I've had this conversation as someone who has addiction that runs in their family where it's that thing where it's like, oh, you kind of want them to fuck up. Not because you want them to hurt themselves, but because this person has let you down so many times before. You want them to hit rock bottom.

The feeling of like, because I've had that feeling where it's like, I've been disappointed by this person. so much. And when you have a long space of time where they haven't, and they're showing you that new version of themselves, there is that thing where it's like, oh, I don't want to forgive you. Yeah. Like, the hurt is so much, for me to forgive you, I have to let some things go that I will never, that will never be right. And I was like, oh, that's interesting because I'm like, through that character, what they're really talking about is just like this family and the bear as an institution. For Karmie to let go, he has to realize your brother OD, you're never going to get that like

one last conversation with him. Your mom, you're never going to get those years back with your mom where she was like the perfect version of like, you're never going to get the version of the beef that you wanted. Like if you remember from the early seasons, Karmie didn't. want to leave, Carmi wanted Mikey to want him to stay there. And it's like, it's interesting that I'm like, that's a very prickly concept of like, to your point of like not just Carmi, but all of them, can you let go? Like, are you healthier if you let the family go?

If you let the business, if you let the business die or do you fight tooth and nail to keep it alive as long as possible? Profound things you're saying there. Forgiveness is unsafe and it's why people are bad at it. But it's particularly unsafe if you're doing it for the other person. Yeah. If you're doing it for yourself, then it's not unsafe. It's actually therapy.

Everyone in this particular family, their safety was together. When they were pulled apart, they realized how unsafe they really were because they're so intense what Richie was kind of talking about. With any of these characters now, that's the thing that bothers me. We start this show with Tina talking to her husband. we start the entire season with Tina talking to her husband and she's talking about what she stands to lose

man that's a really important scene it's a really important scene because you know a show goes away the bear comes back every single year but the show goes away for a little while and you forget what the show is about you forget what's supposed to happen like you know House of the Dragon

is back and I'm like okay where are we at what happens what's going on there's a lot that's happening but when she goes you know This is my family. She doesn't want to lose them. She doesn't want to be in a situation where she's not working with them ever again because it won't be like this again. That's what the show is about now.

And so all of the stuff that people are talking about, when you can choose not to forgive your mom if you want, but you only got one mom. So if you don't choose to forgive your mom, then you're not choosing to have a mom no more. You can choose not to give it all to the restaurant want to get all to your friends, you can choose, to micromanage, you can choose. But once it's gone, it's gone.

It's not coming back. Every hug is one less hug. Every day is one less day. So when you're in something and it's good and it's working and it feels like it's where you're supposed to be, what are you willing to do? What are you willing to sacrifice both personally and professionally to stay there? Are you really sacrifice money, time? Are you willing to sacrifice years off your life for something?

that's perfect or something that works for you. That Tina scene, why I loved it is I'm like, no one really prepares this for you. What do you join the workforce? But I've had jobs like this where I'm like, I hated the job. I hated being a fry cook. But then I'm like, damn, I spent three years with y'all.

Like, this is a family. We're never going to have this. When I was at Rolling Stone, there was a moment where it was like, I felt like Tina where I'm like, you wait so long to get to this place and you're working with people who helped get you there. and the minute you leave to your point, Dan, we never go on for work drinks like this.

We can get drinks later, but it's never, we not leave in the same office, we're not fighting the same wars. I'm going to have to go do it again. I'm going to have to make a new family. I'm going to have to use my skills and build this all over. And I don't know where it's going to end this season,

but it's a fascinating question of like, to your point, I think a lot of the, I think as important as the bear is for everyone, Marcus might be better off going to Copenhagen. When you see Luca is like, hey, I got my Copenhagen boys come in, like, did it and not. He's like, no, I got to work here.

I had this thought, I was like, Marcus, you're the best, like, new chef, you're like, there's a life out there for you. Probably would be more successful in Copenhagen. I look at someone like Tina, where I'm like, Tina, you can go work anywhere now. And it's like that push and pull is a very, very huge thing. You don't know. You don't know if you're, you don't know if it, maybe what she's describing is comfort.

Maybe she needs to be uncomfortable. Maybe this entire run of her life working at the beef, changing over and learning new skills at the bear, is so that she could go and live her best life. You don't know. Or maybe her best life is right inside that restaurant with the leaky pipes. You're not sure. It's scary. All of it's scary.

Is the stuff outside the restaurant working for you, like with computer and the, you know, them going to try to get the permits or like whatever and all of that stuff is the is them being the sort of existential threat of the bear uh commerce money what has to happen structures legitimately is art versus blueprints it's not working for me fully but i will say as someone i one time i had to like go on good morning america for some reason and there was this chef and it was like before the, it was before like the Super Bowl and he was like teaching,

like this is like an award-winning chef who had like a popping restaurant in New York and he was teaching all the host how to make like nachos and we're like, we're chilling in the back room and at one point I go, why do you do this? Not like looking down on it, but like,

yeah. And he goes, bro, let me tell you, I've had an award-winning restaurant packed out, gets closed, and what I will tell you is I'm like, this is the shit you got to do. He's like, you know where I'm working now? And I'm like, where?

He's like, I'm working at a hotel. And when I was watching this, I was like, what? And he's like, I have an award-winning restaurant now that I'm the head of that's in a hotel. And you want to know why? The hotel is basically offsetting everything with this restaurant. So I get to cook. I get to make all this fancy shit.

And in my off time, I go on Good Morning America. I go on the Food Network, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. But he's like, restaurants are really, really hard in these cities, New York, Chicago, L.A., whatever. He's like, there's a reason why so many great restaurants are attached to hotels. And it was like, that was a moment where I'm like, even if this story's not working, I'm like, I was like, oh, this is something that's true. This is something that you could tell the creators like Stora Callow. All of them are like, have talked to chefs and are like, yeah, this is the ever. of dining of all this shit where it's like,

it's the same thing with Ebra and the franchising where I'm like, yeah, that's the less sexy part of the show to me. I don't know if it's working, but it is important to have it there because this show is not the wire, but there were moments in the wire where they are like showing you the foundation of how this entire thing is built.

Yeah. And I think that's what, this show has always been good about, where it's like, even if it's not working fully, I'm like, oh, I'm like, would Carmie and Sid want to run a version of the bear that's underneath a hotel? Right. Would Carmie want to actually franchise this place? Would he be good at it? And I'm like, when we even, when you look at careers and like Hollywood, I'm just like, damn,

every director now got a fucking podcast. It's hawking this, hogging that. And I'm like, I'll ask you, I'll throw it back to you. Would the show be as realistic if it flinched away from these moments of like who owns the building? How much does it cost? Because I've also talked with people who have owned restaurants before. It's like people don't want to buy restaurants. It's a fucking crapshoot.

Like not just owning a restaurant, but like the building of like there's oil, there's water, there's leaks. There's like, there are fucking fireheads. Yeah. So yeah, to answer her question, A little bit. But what is working about the season, I will say, I'm so glad we don't have celebrity cameos. We haven't as of yet.

As of yet. Yeah. I think it has upped my appreciation because I'm just like, guys, this is a family. This is a sitcom at the end of the day. Yeah. I enjoy spending time with our people in this kitchen. And to your point, I think when it's like about everything outside,

because I don't know if you watched it. I watched the Gary episode with, with Evan Moss-Backarack and and Mike. John Bernthaw. Yeah. Good episode. I'm glad that they did not tack it on to the season. Right.

In a final season, I wanted to be about Karmie, Sid, Richie, like, Tina, Marcus, like in this fucking kitchen. I think you're right. And I think what you said earlier

about the show being this indie darling and being up against all of these big, huge streaming shows on Marvel, Disney Plus, whatever, and it cutting through, it's kind of like when your favorite band has that one gigantic song, you know, and then it's like, it was funny. No doubt their first album comes out and it doesn't do anything. And then they dropped Tragic Kingdom. And I think Tragic Kingdom sold like 13 million albums or something like that. They go crazy. So eventually you get to the point to where, like, you know,

no doubt records are being produced by Timberland and stuff, you know. And that's not a diss to Timberland. That's just saying that, like, once you get big, you feel like you got to stay big. Yeah. And how do you do that? Well, that's where you get a John Cena cameo. I thought the Brie Larson stuff really worked, but even still,

even some of the episodes that we don't look at as cameos, like all the family stuff is like, look at all these people on the bear. And not only that, those people want to be on the bear now because the bear is not just a show that is star making for the people that are on the show. It's a show that if you're going on the show, it's star making, it rejuvenates your star. Like it got to a point to where Seinfeld made a bunch of stars. Then it was a big deal for stars to go on Seinfeld, to go on friends, to go on the Cosby Show. It becomes something that is the home for big stars.

That works better other places than it does on a show like this because it's so intimate. It's so many people in so many rooms and they're talking so much. And when John Cena's talking to me, John Cena's talking to me, right? But when Jeremy Allen White is talking to me, Carmie's talking to me. And that's what's important. But I think, and this is the gift of the curse, when they revealed Bernthal was Mikey.

That worked. Well, yeah, because Bernthal is different. Like when they reveal Bernthal's, Mikey, first of all, that's a little different. Bernthal is a guy that, like, is such a, he's doing a good job in his career in being John Bernthal, but also being whoever he is, because he is such a character actor. Berthal plays leads. He plays on the side of people. He can slip into something like this and slip back out and not dominate or take over.

It's John Burnthal is a part of this. So he is, that's a good point. But he is a unique actor and a unique talent in that you can orient a story around him or you can just sprinkle him on top and make your shit better or make your shit bad, bad shit crazy depending on what he wants to do. But when you got Malaney, I thought Malaney is great in the Fish's episode. He's so funny, but I'm like, that's Brie Larson and that's Maloney. Yeah, you know, it's different.

And like, once again, this show also has so many smaller, brilliant, characters. Facts are such great characters and fit in this world so well, you want more of those guys. You don't want to sacrifice any time with those guys for anybody else that you're used to seeing on Instagram. Ebro, that was when I laughed. When Ebra kept going, when he started to say,

what he said? I'm not going to be intimidated by his blue eyes. Right, yes. Also, the Karmie Sid dynamic, which I feel like the show was sacrificing, is really working again in this season. It's back to almost like first season Carmen Sivvon. That's why I like these first four episodes

when they, even that moment where she's like, can you give me a little space? Yeah. Right. I was just like, these two. And it's like a big thing part of this was like, oh, are they in love, this and that? And I'm like, no, I think what people were actually reading

into is that those two performers, Jeremy Allen White and Iyo have such chemistry. They have great chemistry. They can hold the camera. And it's like, I think that's even when people think about their like movie careers. I'm just like what we were actually seeing in those first, that first two seasons of the bear is like something magical that almost,

that is so hard to happen where it's like, damn, it is so hard to find two actors who are this effortless together where you feel like not only they, the characters, these people have known each other for a lifetime. And that's actually, if we wrap up,

that's what I will end up missing about the bear, which is like we could talk about the ups, the middling, the downs or whatever, where I'm like, I can't think of that many shows in this streaming era who produced this many characters where I'm like, I love Richie. I love Carmen.

Like facts, like these are characters. I'm like, damn. They family. My family. All right, guys. That has been our first episode for the last season of the bear. We're going to be back with the next four episodes

very, very soon. Make sure you tap in with Joe and Rob because they will be continuing their coverage of Cape Fear this weekend. And a special shoutout as always, I want to say this. Kai, our producer, dog, he's too big for us now.

They got this motherfucker on the watch. I'm saying? They got him on prestige. He won't even pick up my phone calls no more. Well, look, I'll tell you this, Kai. Never forget where you come from. Time. We'll see y'all later.

You know,