The Psychology of your 20s - 234. I had a mental breakdown
Episode Date: September 27, 2024Let's talk about what's been going on with my mental health recently and what's changed. This is a rather vulnerable episode so please check in with yourself before listening. Lifeline (AUS): 13 11 ...14 National Suicide and Crisis Lifeline (US): 988 Samaritans (UK): 116 123 Mental health resources (worldwide): https://www.helpguide.org/find-help Follow Jemma on Instagram: @jemmasbeg Follow the podcast on Instagram: @thatpsychologypodcast For business: psychologyofyour20s@gmail.com See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Hello everybody and welcome back to the psychology of your 20s, the podcast where we talk through some of the big life changes and transitions of our 20s and what they mean.
for our psychology.
Hi everybody.
Hello.
I'm not going to do my cheery little intro today.
I assume that you already know what we're talking about,
given that you clicked on this episode,
and you probably also have guessed or assumed that
this episode is going to be a little bit different,
a little bit more vulnerable, open, dare I say, chatty,
maybe not chatty, just honest.
And, you know, I feel.
felt really strange making this episode compared to my usual content.
You know, you come here to learn about the psychology of your 20s and the psychology of
flirting and breakups and career anxiety and transitions.
We're not going to be really doing that today.
We're not going to be really having that.
I'm not going to be having that usual structure and scientific approach.
I want to just take a moment to really get you guys up to speak.
feed on what I've been going through.
You know, for a long time, I've been doing this podcast for a very long time.
And along that journey, I've been, I would hope, transparent around what is going on in my
own personal life.
Sometimes I've tried to, you know, create more of a distance or a space between my personal
life and what I talk about on the show.
But it's very hard for it not to kind of infiltrate and come to the surface.
the topics and the ideas and the opinions that I express are all derived from personal experience.
And because of that, it felt strange just moving on with regularly scheduled programming
and not talking about something pretty serious and hard that I've been through recently,
which is that I basically had a mental breakdown.
There it is.
I said it out loud.
I had a really, really rough time this past month that has completely really shaken me to my core
and has kind of made me reconsider my place in the world, made me reconsider mental health in a complete new light,
spiritual health in a new light, you know, this decade in a new life.
And I really want to kind of share what that was like, what that experience.
was like going through it for those of you who might be going through something similar.
And like I said, I really debated talking about this.
It is so just inherently vulnerable.
But, you know, I've spoken about breakups.
I've spoken about grief.
I've spoken about, you know, losing family members.
I've spoken about my physical health.
And why does, you know, the ball have to stop there?
Why do we then tend to shy away when it comes to talking about?
our mental health with the same openness and authenticity and honesty that we would discuss
all these other topics and all these other experiences of this decade.
This is my reality at the moment.
It's something that I'm going through.
And as sad as it is, unfortunate as it is, I also know that there are many of you who are
probably going through this as well.
and you feel so completely, entirely alone.
And so whilst like this podcast is obviously about providing science and evidence in this
self-help space and giving you like factual wellness content, it's also about community
and it's also about being able to see your experiences reflected back in thousands,
if not millions of others.
you know, whatever you're struggling with, I think there is a huge comfort that comes from knowing that you are not alone in that experience, that there is someone somewhere, elsewhere, who is navigating the same challenges as you are.
The big problem I find, or the big hurdle I find with talking about, you know, mental health very explicitly and, you know, not just saying, yeah, I have mental health struggles, but being like, no, I've had,
a full, you know, mental breakdown, prolonged depressive episode, massive anxiety,
is that you do still recognize the stigma that is attached.
Even in this space, even though I've made, and you know, this is my career, I talk about
psychology, talking about psychology and talking about the very real lived experience
of mental health is quite different and is opening yourself.
up to a lot of misunderstanding. And that's something that I've kind of accepted in talking about
this today is that, you know, people could listen to this and just be like, hi, like, what is she
talking about? Or maybe people will listen to this and be like, well, I'm, you know, I'm not going to
listen to such an untrustworthy narrator from now on, you know, she's not talking about mental
health in like, you know, in like a guarded way. She's talking about it very openly and
with great realness and that can be really confronting for some people.
So I would just ask for grace.
This episode is not structured.
It's going to be a bit of a ramble.
And I've kind of accepted that some people might be shocked to hear this.
Some people might be confronted.
So just check on yourself as to where you are.
And if you think this will be helpful, please listen on.
If you just want to know what it's like, I guess,
or to see or to be able to provide help for someone else who you know who might be going through
the same experience, that is really my ultimate goal here is to provide a lived experience for you
to reflect on in your own life when you confront scary topics such as, and scary ideas,
such as the ones that I've been working through.
If you have been listening for a while, you'll know that every now and again I give like a mental
health update because this is like a mental health podcast and a few months ago I even gave like an
update where I was like I'm doing so well I'm thriving I'm living my best life I'm like going off
my antidepressants like everything is good we're making forward progress and then things changed
as they very often do with our brains and our minds and our perception and our and our health
you think you're doing really very well but one of the realities of living with a mental health
condition is that kind of in the back of your mind you always know that there is there is a time
that will come where it could get worse and so even if you are feeling amazing and fabulous and
enjoying life it's a there's a hesitancy there is a sense of like tiptoeing around that
experience like oh how long is this going to last how long am i going to feel like this because you know
that the other shoe might eventually drop you know you might get bad again and you hope not but that is
the case and that is what happened with me i went from being super super happy and then there was just this
slow descent and always in hindsight can you see the path that you've taken right in the moment
you just want to survive and push forward you're hoping that it's like home
or contextual or it's just because you're really stressed and then the stress fades and then
you know the days go on and it's like oh i just can't get these thoughts out of my head my biggest fixation
and the thing that really culminated in me really kind of just not being able to cope for a while
there had to do with thoughts and anxieties around death i have very intense death anxiety
feels weird to say that out loud. I'm sure some of you may have realized that or guessed it,
but it's not something I talk about that much because, to be honest, talking about it,
it like puts it, like you squarely have to face it and it's right there and it's like
an incredibly terrible, inevitable fear. It's, I think, the most profound fear to fear death
because everything else in life, you know, you can kind of avoid or you can,
change your behaviors to avoid and death is one of those things that you just can't and you have to
try and find a way to create a meaning in a finite life and to, you know, have some form of
comfort or vision or value or life philosophy that lets you push forward. And I just kind of lost that.
I just no longer could access my purpose and my meaning and my life philosophy around why are we here, what are we doing here?
Life is just this big inconvenient, meaningless thing and it almost felt like the universe was like collapsing in on me.
Like I'd be lying in bed and it was just like the absolute terror of knowing that this thing that you're terrified of is going to happen to you.
and then the equal terror of knowing that, you know, there's nothing you can do about it.
And no matter what you think about it, like it doesn't change, what's going to happen.
And yeah, so gosh, dark, very, very dark.
And I think it's something that we all have at the back of our minds, right?
Everyone knows this.
There are just times in your life where you feel more, it's kind of like, how do I explain it?
it's like there's this weird fuzzy film like a fuzzy transparent curtain between you and
thinking about death and most of the time you know we've got our back turned to the curtain and we're
enjoying everything that's in life and then other times you turn around and you you peek behind the
curtain and it's just so just incomprehensible um that it really starts to get you down and
then for me things come up around time and meaning and love and connection and fear of seeing
people I love pass away and you can see how the ball gets rolling real real quick really really
quickly I think the only time I haven't had these fears has been when I was someone who was quite
spiritual and religious you know and suddenly not suddenly and I just am not anymore it's just
part of the life journey and the transition that I've gone through where I just no longer saw
myself in the home of religion. I see its value. I see the value of spirituality, but it's just the
current structures that are presented to me. Like I just don't really relate to them. I'm kind of a
woman of science. Sometimes I don't really feel like it makes sense. And I think that that
detachment from a spiritual understanding of my life really has contributed to these cycles of
really existential negative, incomprehensible thoughts. The point where I really started to realize,
like, oh no, like this is not going the way it should. And I've gone through this before and it's like,
you can really, there's like a, it's like a, it's like a flight path, right? Like there's like a
a journey and you can like see the roadblocks and you like kind of know what.
coming and you know that like once you get to a certain stage it's like you know shit like there's
no turning back and when I realized that was when I was in Bali before I went to Bali I was so busy I had
so much going on that it really meant that I couldn't really think about anything bigger or more
profound than the present and what was happening right now and then I went on vacation I went on holiday
interestingly I was really excited of course not interestingly obviously I was very excited I was very excited to
just like spend time with my mom and my cousin and my auntie and relax by the pool and drink pina
calatas and go on hikes and like see the sites and go to the markets and actually what ended up
happening was all the things that were keeping me anchored to the present and by that I mean my
stress was lifted and suddenly all the thoughts that I'd been trying very hard to push down
and suppress came flooding in and I did not have the tools to deal with it.
I spent, Bali was amazing, but I spent a lot of time in my own head, in my brain, overworking
and overthinking, concepts, ideas, big ideas about the universe and the world and purpose.
and life and God and religion.
Not a fun place to be.
I think those thoughts have their time and place,
but they should really be explored when you feel mentally prepared for them.
My problem was that I hadn't provided myself with the space or the mental capacity
to think about it, to think about it when I needed to think about it
at a time when I was more able to deal with how confronting it could be.
And so I always say this, you can avoid and you can avoid and you can avoid and you can
avoid but it will come up at the most inconvenient time and that is what happened then i went to new york
i remember walking around the streets of new york and just being like i really wish i could be having
fun right now but everything feels so impermanent and everything just feels so tragic and terrifying
and it's kind of like you cannot see the world except for from this place of finality and this place of
I don't know, that everything will eventually be gone.
And that imbues all of your experiences.
Everything that you perceive is imbued with this tinge of like sadness,
even sadness for the fact that one day this will be gone, you know,
even though right now it isn't.
It's very, very like mentally complicated.
And I think it really comes from like a detachment with the present.
I made an episode a couple of weeks back, maybe like a month now that was like
the power of staying present.
really that was me trying to remind myself of that power and trying to reinforce my own habits
when it came to this but by the time i got back to australia like things were not going well
things were not working out for me and i entered this pretty dark place where i could not really
make sense of reality not in the sense that i was like experiencing psychosis or anything but
it just was like everything was very clouded.
Everything was overruled by constant repetitive thinking in a thought spiral.
It began to really make me want to withdraw.
I think my biggest fear when I'm going through a bit of an existential mental breakdown,
whatever you want to call it, is passing it on to someone else.
I know this sounds very, very strange, but sometimes I believe, you know, that my thoughts could be
contagious and that you're going to say something to someone that they've never considered before
and it's going to really scare them. And that is what really scares me is that I could
plunge someone else into this situation and this dark, downward thought spiral. So I stayed
silent about it for a while, very silent at my own detriment. Then I started telling my boyfriend,
but it was kind of with a laugh and a giggle and, you know, like, oh, my crazy brain. Anyhow,
I don't want to talk about it. Let's move on.
It always fascinates me that I know what to do, right?
I have the tools, the strategies, I know how to work through a situation like this.
And one of the main pillars and one of the best things you can do for yourself is to open up and is to share the burden.
It's a lot easier said than done.
You don't feel like you have the right almost.
You don't want to let people in because that would require you acknowledging that your situation is bad.
that is how I'll say it because that is how it was and then it was like almost a flip switched we went out one night
went out drinking with like my best friends it's like I should be the happiest I've ever been in the
world ever been at any time like I have the most beautiful friends I'm in this beautiful city
and I woke up the next day in a panic and my whole body was shaking and I was stuck I was stuck I was stuck
in my mind and I was stuck in this thought and it's almost like walking through a day and it's just
like death death death death pretty freaking hard and that's when I realized that I really needed some help
luckily my mom was in town so she ended up canceling like all of her work engagements for the
rest of the week and stayed with me and my boyfriend stayed with me well we basically lived together
but he would come back from work every single night and just hold me because I didn't
didn't want to leave my room. I didn't want to leave my house. Everything was just confusing and
overwhelming and loud. Loud is probably the best way I can describe it and lonely and isolating.
You just feel like you are floating in space and no one else can understand your experience and
you're just absolutely terrified and you don't know how you're going to get back to like the
mothership of reality and the mothership of rationality.
as well. So my mom came and stayed with me for a week and then passed the baton over to my dad
who came and stayed with me for another week. And that two-week period involved me not being able to eat,
not being able to sleep. And then when I did sleep, waking up in a sweat and shaking, just not
wanting to leave the house, genuinely just being in a catatonic state. Like I would just sit in bed and stare at
the wall. Trying really hard to do work, trying really hard to go to the gym and to go to my pottery
classes and to see friends. And it was not possible. It was not happening for me at that time.
The other thing was mental health access in Australia and I'm going to assume this is everywhere.
It's absolutely abysmal. It's literally abysmal. I called a crisis line, which I'll openly admit,
I think crisis lines are amazing lifeline. If you're in Australia, I'm sure there are.
other crisis lines in the U.S. and the UK and elsewhere, life lines are incredible, but this
experience was not incredible because I called this woman and I was like, I need to see a
psychiatrist, I need to see an emergency psychologist. I need help with something, please. Like,
what do I do? It was like, I knew what to do and I, even I could not get the help I needed.
Like, I was trying to find a psychologist. I was trying to find a psychiatrist. It was like six
month's wait period. I can't wait six months. Like I'm suffering right now. I like that's unreasonable.
That's just unreasonable, but I also understand the pressures on the system. You call psychologists to be like,
oh, I don't want to take your case. Sorry, I don't have a space. I don't have a space. There was one center that I
called. And I'm not going to name them, but oh my God, were they just absolutely terrible.
They were absolutely terrible. And I called them and I was like, this is what's happening. And they were like,
sorry we can't help you and I was like can you refer me to someone else they're like no and then later on
my mum called them back up and suddenly they had an appointment for her but not an appointment for me because
you know I understand it like respect your boundaries respect your peace but it was one of those things
where it's like am I untreatable is that what you are implying and not accepting my case because you are
a private clinic you get the system but yeah I called this helpline and I'm asking for help I'm like
this is what I need. And she genuinely said to me, oh, you know, are you on drugs? I was like, no,
it's an important question to ask. I was like, no, not on any drugs. Are you having like withdrawals
from alcohol? No. And then you could see that she was like a bit puzzled and she was like,
have you watched any scary movies lately? I could not believe that she asked me that question.
I was like, no, I haven't watched any scary movies. I'm mentally unwell. Like, I know what's wrong
with me and it's not because I've watched Green 4.
Like it was just this very eye-opening experience and a re-acknowledgment of how terrible and
poor our systems actually are.
How, and if, you know, I'm someone who is, I don't want to say an expert, but I talk about
psychology for a living.
I also used to work in Australia's mental health system.
I helped design some of these systems.
like design, especially for children, and I cannot navigate this system.
Who in the world is meant to be able to do that?
Who is meant to find the help that they need?
And eventually she was like, oh, you can go to the emergency room.
And the emergency room is the worst place to be if you are someone having a crisis around
death anxiety.
Literally terrible suggestion from her, but I appreciate she was probably very overworked
and they're doing the best they can.
They talk to hundreds, dozens of people a day.
who have very unique experiences, so full respect to her.
It just wasn't the help that I needed.
And it felt like a stalemate.
It felt like an absolute stalemate.
I could go on and explain more of what that experience was like,
but it was just genuinely so devoid of anything exciting.
There's nothing to report.
Like it's sitting in bed, crying every 30 minutes,
staring at the ceiling, not talking to any of your friends,
not really wanting to eat, not being able to sleep,
just complete physical and mental exhaustion
is the only way I can explain it.
The person who helped me, so so much who got me through this,
was, well, three people was my parents and my partner.
I cannot imagine how stressful it would have been
just having to watch someone not want to do anything,
not want to move, not be able to get the help that they needed,
just be so terribly overwhelmed for like this extended period of time.
But they were the ones who were like, nope, we're going to set small goals,
we're just going to leave the house today, we're going to go for a walk,
we're going to go to the animal shelter and play with some dogs.
My mom was even like, maybe I should get you a dog.
And I was like, part of me, like, it was so funny.
I was kind of coming out of it by that stage and I was like,
hmm I probably I know that that is probably not a great decision it's like don't go food shopping when you're hungry don't have a baby when your relationship is falling apart don't get a dog when you're having a mental health crisis that is the three cardinal rules and they were the ones who really got me through it they were the ones who took phone call after phone call who found anyone someone who could see me as soon as possible which was still into like was still two to a two to a
three weeks away, but that was the closest that we could get. They went and, you know, filled my
medication scripts for me, filled the fridge with food, cooked for me, made sure that whatever I kind
of needed, I had. And then my friends, my, oh my gosh, my friends, it'd be so interesting and
funny that I would be just sitting out in my backyard, crying about how meaningless this world
felt and yet people would show up and show that they loved me and isn't that the most meaningful thing
ever my friend meg dropped flowers at my door my friend sarah took me on like was like oh i'll come and do
anything for you like she tried she called me like basically every single day my friend kate like
checked in on me sent me reels like my like my friend stuff like all of them were just so there for me
and made sure that they that i knew that i was in their thoughts
and that I could talk to them, that I could reach them.
But they also respected the fact that I kind of needed to hermit.
To be fair, I didn't need to, but that was my inclination,
that was my instinct, was to hide away.
And they respected that.
And they continued to reach out.
I think it's a big problem when someone is really going through it with their mental health.
Like if you are their friend and you know it,
but you expect them to have to reach out for you,
it's like, well, that's not going to happen.
That's just, that is like the least, the last thing that they're thinking about.
It's like asking like a friend with like, you know, a fractured spine to like come and go for a walk with you.
It's like that's not what they're thinking about.
That's not something that they're capable of checking in with you.
Maintaining friendships is incredibly difficult and it's not that there isn't a desire and a need and a longing.
but when everything in your life is just completely devoid of meaning and love and a sense of joy
and you just feel completely broken, like those friendships as much as you do care about them,
like you don't think about the consequence of not talking to someone for a month.
You don't think about what that's going to do to your relationship.
You're just trying to get through it.
So it's a good reminder, and it was a reminder for me.
Like if you have a friend going through a rough time, just reach out.
It's not embarrassing.
quid, you know, they just might not reply to you, but at least they have that message. And there's
no one who I've ever spoken to who's been like, oh, I wish that someone hadn't reached out.
I wish that I had less support. I wish that I'd known less people loved me. Like, it's not how it works.
So that was like a really valuable, valuable lesson. Another valuable lesson was for me,
medication is really, really important. And I do think that a lot of my problem is problem.
condition is derived from something biological.
And I know that there are a lot of different suggestions to do with this and to do with
the efficacy and the success of SSRIs or antidepressants.
Just do what works for you.
There is a lot of research and there is a lot of new research that says that other things
are also really useful and more cognitive mental therapies or talk therapies are useful.
For me, that is not the case.
look at my life and everything is actually quite spectacular and I'm very, very lucky to have what I
have. For me, you can almost notice like a biological shift because nothing else in your life really
changes and then suddenly you're just in this pit and you don't know how to get out. So the medication
was really, really useful and it was like, it was so strange but I was almost like setting myself
many daily goals. But this time it wasn't for like moving ahead in my career and it wasn't for fitness.
It was like, just leave the house. Just do one essential task today. Just call one person. And slowly and surely
you start to climb the ladder out of the hole. And then you fall back a little bit. It's never going to be
linear. But you ride the good times. You ride out the wave of the good times. That's the difference between normal life
and I think going through this is, or going through anything that's very difficult and very, very hard,
is that in normal life, you kind of just don't really notice when things are just even a slightly bit better than they usually are.
You kind of just take it for granted.
But when things are going not that well, every small thing that makes you smile,
every moment where you just have a bit of peace and silence in your brain, oh my gosh, that's all I ask for.
That is a blessing and that is something that you feel incredibly immensely grateful for.
So I really rode those happy waves.
Even if it was for three minutes, if it was for an hour, I was fully present in that moment.
And then, you know, I did finally get to see someone.
It was still a long wait.
And sometimes I think I'm like, no, they're not going to be able to help me.
Like I already know everything I need to know.
Not true.
And it's not just about knowledge and information.
It's about a different perspective and it's about having someone neutral who can really help you out.
So I'm feeling a bit better now.
I'm slowly coming out of it.
I'm still having hard days.
I was at my pottery class last night and these dark thoughts came back and I got a bit of an adrenaline jolt and a shock and felt the need to like run away and hermit again.
But I pushed through.
That's really all you can do at this point.
it's when you get to that point of being at such a low,
low stage and just rock bottom mentally and psychologically,
and I'm sure I'll probably be there again.
You just,
you take everything that you can in every moment and every skill
and every resource that you can muster
and you take that and you put it towards just feeling even 1% better each day.
And that's really, really tough and it requires strength.
But like that example from last night,
Like you just, in some ways, have to ride the wave of the good and the bad and just let the thoughts come and let them move on.
So I'm still not 100% back to normal.
I don't know.
It might take a little while, but things are looking up.
And I wanted to be open and honest with you that this is the reality of living with mental health.
It's probably, or maybe your reality as well.
And we don't talk about it.
and we don't acknowledge it, and we don't see stories of it in the media
unless it's someone depicted as going quote-unquote crazy,
unless it's someone depicted as being violent.
It's not, that's just such a simplistic view of mental health.
It also looks like me, someone who knows the system,
someone who talks about this all the time,
still being confronted with incredibly hard thoughts to manage
and not really knowing how to get out of it,
not knowing a path forward.
You are not alone.
You are not alone in that experience.
I absolutely promise you.
Please reach out to anybody and everybody.
Reach out to those who love you.
Reach out to mental health services.
And also, if you are someone who struggles routinely with their mental health,
the best time to get care and to get health care and to get a health care and to get a
a therapist or a psychiatrist is actually when you're feeling well because you cannot predict when
these waves will crash over you. You cannot predict the cycles. You cannot predict when you might
slip and fall back into this kind of dark space. So this is your reminder. Even if you're listening
to this right now and you're like, I'm actually doing really, really fine. I'm not triggered at all,
but I know I have been in the past and I have been before then. Get help when you are
healthy, it will prepare you for times like the one I was in where it's an emergency and you don't
have the systems in place. I know it's easier said than done and sometimes that's not even
available to us, but if you can, it is insurance. You cannot afford to not look after your mental
health. That's something that my mom said to me. She's like, you are someone who cannot afford to do
this. This is like having a chronic illness. You wouldn't let your diabetes get to this point. You
wouldn't let your, you know, if you were diagnosed with cancer, you wouldn't skip your
follow-up appointments and to see if the cancer come back, if you're in remission or like, you
wouldn't do that. So don't do it with your mental health either. It's just as valuable.
I want to thank you for, I'm going to thank you in advance for your kindness and for your respect.
I know that it's a private situation, but I hope by making it a bit more public, people feel seen,
people feel heard, people know how to support their loved ones, and you don't feel alone,
because that would have been very, very useful for me during that time.
If you have any further questions or, yeah, I would love to hear from you at that psychology podcast.
You know, on Monday we will be back to regularly scheduled programming.
We're going to talk about right person wrong time.
So we'll be moving on.
We're moving back to what we normally talk about.
Thank you for giving me the space.
to just talk at you for half an hour about my mental health.
It's actually been quite therapeutic.
So I appreciate the mental load that you took on of listening.
Make sure that you are following along to hear more episodes.
And if you enjoyed this episode, maybe you didn't.
Maybe it was quite dark.
I apologize.
But if you enjoy the podcast in general,
please leave a five-star review.
I'm going to leave some links to some services in the description.
If you need them, please don't hesitate to use them.
That's what they're there for.
even if you think that what you're going through isn't that serious.
I don't think that's for you to decide.
I think that objectively, if you're struggling, you are struggling.
So those services are there for you.
Please use them.
Please, please reach out for help.
Be kind to yourself.
Be gentle with yourself.
It's all of our first times alive.
And we will talk soon.
2%.
That's the number of people who take the stairs
when there is also an escalator available.
I'm Michael Easter.
And on my podcast, 2%.
I break down the science of mental toughness,
fitness, and building resilience
in our strange modern world.
Put yourself through some hardships
and you will come out on the other side
a happier, more fulfilled, healthier person.
Listen to 2%.
That's TWO%.
On the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcasts,
or wherever you get your podcasts.
On the Look Back at a podcast,
For 1979, that was a big moment for me.
84 was big to me.
I'm Sam J.
And I'm Alex English.
Each episode, we pick a year,
unpack what went down,
and try to make sense of how we survived it.
With our friends, fellow comedians, and favorite authors.
Like Mark Lamont Hill on the 80s.
84 was a wild year.
It was a wild year.
I don't think there's a more important year for black people.
Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app,
Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
Hey, what's good, y'all?
Listening to learn the hard way with your favorite therapist and host, Kear Games.
This space is about black men's experiences, having honest conversations that it's really not safe to have anywhere,
but you're having them with a licensed professional who knows what he's doing.
How many men carry a suit or armor.
It signals to the world that you're not to be played with.
And just because you have the capability that does not mean that you need to.
Listen to learn the hard way on the AHA radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast.
In 2023, Bachelor star Clayton Eckerd was accused of fathering twins.
But the pregnancy appeared to be a hoax.
You doctored this particular test twice in so-ins, correct?
I doctored the test once.
It took an army of internet detectives to uncover a disturbing pattern.
Two more men who'd been through the same thing.
Greg Gillespie and Michael Ranciani.
My mind was blown.
I'm Stephanie Young.
This is love trapped.
Laura, Scottsdale Police.
As the season continues, Laura Owens said,
finally faces consequences.
Listen to Love Trapped podcast on the IHeart Radio app,
Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
This is an IHeart podcast.
Guaranteed human.
