The Psychology of your 20s - 269. How to care less about others opinions

Episode Date: January 24, 2025

Everyone has an opinion, but are they all worth listening to? When we're not careful we can get carried away by imagining what people may or may not think about everything from our outfits, to our life choices, to our social media presence, to our relationship decisions. When we do, we become less in touch with our authentic, true self. It makes it harder for us to take action on what we want, and easier for us to go with the crowd. In today's episode, we talk about why that is, including: ' The evolutionary purpose of considering others opinions of us The psychology of approval seeking behaviour  The influence of our childhood  The consequences of relying on external validation  How to decentre others opinions The 5/5/5 rule + much more Listen now!    PREORDER MY BOOK: https://www.psychologyofyour20s.com/general-clean Follow Jemma on Instagram: @jemmasbeg Follow the podcast on Instagram: @thatpsychologypodcast For business: [e-mail]    The Psychology of your 20s is not a substitute for professional mental health help. If you are struggling, distressed or require personalised advice, please reach out to your doctor or a licensed psychologist. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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We always say that trust your girlfriends. Listen to the girlfriends. Trust me, babe, on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Hello everybody. Welcome back to the show. Welcome back to the podcast. New listeners, old listeners, wherever you are in the world. It is so great to have you here. Back for another episode as we, of course, break down the psychology of our 20s. Today, we're diving into a topic that I think resonates with about every single one of us, and that is how to care less about what other people think about you. Let us be completely real and transparent here.

This is a lot easier said than done. We all know that worrying about the opinions of others will rob us of our authenticity, It will make us less happy. It will, you know, disturb our peace of mind. And yet there is this little voice inside our heads whispering things like, what will they think of me? What if they don't like me? Is the world going to end?

Will this choice make me look good to others? And it's not our inner critic. It's something else. It's our inner need for approval. Our inner animal primal version of us who wants to belong. and not upset others. And the problem is that it can become a real mental barrier. If we let it dominate the choices we make in our 20s, our behavior, our decisions, and

ultimately our lives, I think during this decade, it's quite a fragile time where we really are just trying to figure out so many big questions. And sometimes we rely too heavily on what other people think is best or what other people think we should be doing. And when we are fixated on these possible or actual judgments, it's like we have to hold up every life decision to a different light, under a different light, and think, how's this person going to see it? How about this person? Am I still going to have their approval? And this often happens before we do anything, even without us knowing. But deep down, oftentimes, we already know who we are.

We already know what we want. We just have to fight against this weirdly misplaced instinct to be validated by others before we truly are able to trust ourselves. And I really do think it comes down to a lack of self-trust. We don't trust that we know what's right. And we don't trust that we'll be able to survive the potential negative judgments of friends, of family members, of random strangers. So in this episode, I want us to really dig deep into the psychology of why. Why do we care so much in the first place? Where does this instinct come from?

And how does it impact our search for self-esteem, for purpose, for authenticity really, in our 20s? And most importantly, most importantly of all, how can we start letting go of this need for approval so that we can live the lives that we truly want? We're going to talk about evolutionary psychology, childhood experiences. I also share, of course, some practical tips to help you shift your focus inward, to trust your own judgment, and to really strengthen your sense of self as well as my famous rule of fives that I swear by. And hopefully by the end of this episode, you feel inspired, you feel equipped to prioritize your own opinion and to truly honor who you are without being weighed down by the noise. of others. Really, this is the episode that I wish I had when I was younger. All of this information

is things that I've had to learn and that I wish I could tell a past version of myself, but now I get to tell you guys, which is honestly just as good. So without further ado, let's get into the psychology about why we care and how do care less about what other people think. So this has been on my mind quite a lot recently, and the reason being is because I I launched my new podcast mantra a couple of weeks ago. And for those of you who haven't listened to it yet, it's basically a weekly show where I dive into some kind of inspiring affirmation or reminder for you to bring with you throughout the week.

So the one we did last week was I cultivate peace within. I embrace growth and change, that kind of thing. And it's just a place for me to kind of express wisdom and be a little bit more philosophical and a bit more grounding compared to the psychology of your 20s, which is more science-based. And before I announced that show and launched that show, I had this huge fear that so many people were going to turn around, look at me doing this and say, oh, we hate it. We hate that you're doing that. That's not what we want.

Boo, like, just stick to what you know, stick to what you're good at. And it really got into my head. I was like, is this a good idea? Should I even be doing this? And the thing was, no one even knew that I was. Other than my team and my wonderful support network, no one who is a listener of the show who doesn't know me knew that I was putting this out.

And yet I was putting words into their mouth and they were the words that I most feared, that I would be judged, that people wouldn't like it, that I would be criticized. And it got to the point where I was almost like, oh, this is just such a bad decision. like they already hate it without ever actually even having shown anyone. And it really got me thinking around how many opportunities and how many things in your life

have you not done or have you stopped yourself from doing because you're imagining what other people think before they even have the chance to think it or say it. And that's really the conundrum that we find ourselves in a lot and it holds us back. Just having that experience made me realize how many other areas of my life, I have already been held back by other's opinions, real or imaginary, and how I wish that that hadn't been the case. Before we get into how to stop that from happening, I think we need to just know the basics, which is why. That's the million dollar question, right? Why does this happen? Why do we care? You could know what it's costing you, and you still can't ignore it. The reason this voice,

the voice of others, the voice of some ambiguous hater or person, feel so omnipresent has two really important explanations. The first is a very evolutionary explanation. We are tribal creatures who previously relied on the approval and acceptance of others to survive. And so to make sure we aren't alienated from our social group, which would in the past have ensured immediate certain death, we've become very attuned to what other people think. And this part of us, it really originated and developed way before civilization was as large and expansive as it is today. It originated and evolved and developed when we did live in very small communities, where the opinion of your neighbor, the opinion of the person in the hot next door,

was significant for your life. So those parts of the brain that are responsible for triggering our fear of rejection or of a They are part of what we call the old brain or the reptilian brain, which is why they feel so almost instantaneous. It's why they feel so out of our control because they are meant to function almost automatically. The other part of our brain that really plays a role in this is the frontal lobe. These two areas, they have taken a long time to evolve and a long time to take place and they have also been around. for many, many, many generations. And considering how rapidly society has grown

and our networks have expanded from maybe 50 people to literally hundreds of thousands that we can access online and how, you know, that's only been in the last 20 years, basically these old parts of our brain haven't caught up with the context and how easily it is to be judged at basically any given moment online and in a much, much larger society. How I explain it is that the old part of your brain

that is used to caring about the judgments of others and being very socially attuned, that is like trying to run a complex computer game on the first ever MacBook. You know, the system is obviously going to get overwhelmed and that is your brain trying to manage this hyper-social modern context of a thousand opinions on, you know, a system that developed when that wasn't the case.

So the second explanation for why we care, which is very much a link to what we just spoke about, it's to do with our self-esteem and how our identity in part really is reliant on the opinions and approval of others. Even from a very young age, we sense and we know that if people like us, life will be easier.

And we will feel good about ourselves because people will be kind to us, They'll want to help us. They won't outright harm us. So it's in that way that sometimes our acknowledgement and our fear of other people's opinions is sometimes a protective mechanism. There have been studies showing that from as young as maybe two years old, we are aware that we are being evaluated by others. And by around five, we actually begin to change our behavior in certain circumstances

based on what we think others will like or will be favorable towards. So this interaction, this is called approval seeking behavior, wanting to be liked, wanting to be seen as good, wanting to be validated and rewarded by another person. In order for that process to kind of take place in order to seek approval, you have to firstly acknowledge that other people have opinions. And secondly, you have to be able to make a decision as to whether you want to let that opinion dictate your behavior based on what you think the outcome will be for you.

And when we become very obsessed with other people's opinions, implicitly, we believe that doing so is going to help us more than it will harm us. I don't think that's the case. I also don't think that it will come as a surprise that excessive approval-seeking behavior in adulthood is linked to early childhood experiences. particularly what we call adverse childhood experiences. So if you were highly criticized as a child, if you were neglected by those who were meant to love you most, you were ignored, you were bullied. Approval is something you want more than anything else

because you know what it feels like and how terrible it is to not have it. You know how cold and solitary and lonely it feels to not. be liked and to not be told that you're good. A 2021 paper actually that I found when researching this, it looked at bullying in particular and it linked childhood bullying to greater approval seeking behavior as adults and specifically a lot more people pleasing and self-sacrificing behavior as well. Approval seeking as an adult I should probably tell you what that looks like. It's basically what we would describe as caring too much about what other people think what other people think but it's not an inward process it becomes an outward process so you end up relying on others opinions to help you make

life decisions so if you are left with a big decision about what you want to study where you want to move what job you want to take what to do in your friendships and your relationships you may be unable to come to that decision yourself you have to check with as many people as possible about what they think is right. Your actions also change based on how you think someone will react. You become, your emotions in particular about something become very much dictated by what someone else thinks first. You may find yourself rejecting opportunities and experiences that you really want because you worry whether others will approve and you might even feel ashamed or like you need to excessively explain yourself if someone questions or dislikes your work, your actions.

your decisions, any of those things. All of this links back to letting the opinions of others dictate your life. I would also like to point out, and I've already mentioned this, that sometimes this is also born from a lack of self-trust. Basically, we are no longer able to provide ourselves with validation or approval. We don't trust our opinion on ourselves, so we require other people to be able to confirm or deny our worth. And, you know, I really wonder why we get to the point where we are willing to trust a stranger and what they think more than ourselves, more than someone that we have known our whole life, who knows everything about us more than anyone else.

At some point, though, you do have to make a choice. Would you rather people like you or would you rather like yourself? I think it gets to a point where this is really what it comes down to. And actually, it's bigger than that. It's would you rather actually live the life you want? Wouldn't you rather give yourself the space to figure out what's best for you without trying to fit into someone else's box? There was a quote I read the other day that I think captures this perfectly.

It said by being concerned about what other people think, we avoid the short-term pain of rejection or the possible loss of status in exchange for the long-term loss of missing out on a life truly worth living. So let's talk about what happens when we invest too heavily in other people's opinions at the expense of our own. The first thing we are likely to experience is a dependence on external validation, which will make it hard to do things purely for the joy of doing them or because we want to. In order to keep up our supply of external validation as well, we kind of become like

addicts. So we might develop people pleasing tendencies and end up feeling very used, resentful, exhausted. We may avoid conflict or suppress our needs in order to maintain others' approval, despite feeling worse about ourselves in other areas of our life. This also, crucially, makes our self-worth incredibly unstable because the opinions of others, they aren't something that we can rely on. They're fickle. People change their minds all the time. Their approval of us is often based on what they want, not what's best for us. I think about this in the context as well of celebrities who go from being darlings to being hated overnight when public opinion turns because it is incredibly fickle. It is not something to be relied on. But also on a more individual level,

if you're not a celebrity. When people realize that you rely on their judgment and that you want them to like you, this can also be really in some ways used to manipulate you into saying yes, into overdoing, overgiving, just being and giving them too much of yourself at the expense of you. We also end up over-analyzing others' perceptions of us, and that can lead to really heightened anxiety,

particularly in social settings. like caring about other people's opinions is a hallmark of social anxiety because we imagine there is this big spotlight on our every move and that, you know, one misstep will result in a disaster. And when other people's opinions become a fixation and a main worry, this also slowly erodes our authenticity because we want to be liked more than we want to honor ourselves. One of those things feels more important to us. and that can lead to a disconnect between your values, your beliefs, your preferences, your likes, and your behavior. I don't think I need to tell you that what you're left with is really nothing.

You just end up being an amalgamation of what everyone else wants you to be. So there is a distinct feeling of emptiness and a lack of fulfillment that comes along with this. There was a 2017 paper written about this called Authenticity. as a predictor of mental health, and it looked at 706 students, and it found that those who practiced authentic living, who could name five of their personal values, they reported being not as easily swayed by external influence. They were happier, they were more satisfied with their lives,

because they just had less noise around whether what they were doing was right. Two more impacts of this, but I'll keep them short and sweet, because I want to mainly focus on the solutions. A fear of criticism or rejection specifically. It also might prevent us from taking risks, embracing opportunities, which I think is something that is essential during this decade. And finally, there's been evidence to suggest that it may mean

we actually make worse decisions. So we either don't make a decision or when we do, it's not the one we actually want, because we're making decisions that don't align with previously expressed goals. or desires, and we second-guess ourselves. And it kind of feels like we're being guided by two separate and competing forces. What we want and what others think we want. And I imagine it like a tug of war where both sides is equally strong.

So the thing in the middle, which is you, remains stagnant. There was a 2012 article, another one that I found published in the Journal of Human Behavior and Human Decision Making. And it also examined what happens when we let others not just dictate, but make decisions for us through their opinions and it turns out that when we follow what someone else thinks we can do we often end up a lot less happy because often they don't choose without interests in mind they choose what they think is best based on their philosophies based on their expectations of us and our happiness and

their appreciation of our values and what we want just doesn't matter to them as much we know ourselves I want you to remember, you know who you are. You have been with you since the beginning. So we have to learn to trust that we will be okay if people don't like us. And if we don't do things the way that they want us to do them. And there is a real power in that, but there is also real genuine peace. You know, I'm saying this is someone who used to be so worried about it, especially when I was in

uni. I just was changing myself constantly based on who I was around and I never knew who I was ever. So how do we move past that instinct even when it feels impossible? What does the psychology tell us about rewiring our opinions and our attitude towards ourselves? Well, we are going to talk about all of that and so much more after this short break. 2%. That is the number of people who take the stairs when there is also an escalator available. I'm Michael Easter, and on my podcast, 2%. I break down the science of mental toughness, fitness, and building resilience in our strange modern world. I'll be speaking with writers, researchers, and other health and fitness experts, and more,

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With all that we're discussing today, I really don't want it to come off like I'm dismissing the sting of being disliked and that I'm saying that it's not painful because it is. Feeling rejected, criticized, even hated, it's an incredibly painful experience. Specifically, it elicits social pain. and I wouldn't blame anyone for wanting to avoid that if they could. So if you are someone who is struggling with it, I'm not sitting here being like, be stronger, you're just so weak-willed, grow a spine, absolutely not, because I know how insidious that feels like, that urge to be validated by others feels like.

It's just so innate in us, and I really struggle with it at times, especially when I get troll comments or negative comments, they're not something that I easily forget, even if I try really hard. So it would be facetious to suggest that it doesn't cross my mind or that I'm perfect or there is any one person who doesn't care. Actually, I think someone who doesn't care at all would probably have a slight problem because there are times when you should really consider what other people think and feel about a situation.

That's how we experience empathy. So not caring at all. it's also not a great thing but what i would like to remind myself and you as well is that people who think truly negative things about others and who then go on to express them i wouldn't want to live even a day not alone like you know not even in their mind in their shoes i wouldn't want their life So why in the world would I let them dictate mine? It would be a very dark place to live inside the mind of someone who brings that kind of negativity to the world, who says those things, let alone thinks them. It would be a very hard life to be someone who deliberately tries to tear others down.

And if they are thinking all of those things about others, what happens when they turn the spotlight, back onto themselves. You have probably heard of the saying, hurt people, hurt people. There is a lot more truth to that than you may know. The study you support that people who criticize others are often more insecure than you or I. So there was a really amazing paper in 2018 on ostracism and aggression. So aggression particularly online. And it found that people who have felt excluded or rejected in the past, they are more likely. to express negativity and aggression, particularly verbal aggression towards others. And the people they most turn this hatred towards is those they feel have a higher status than them.

It's why the age old saying is often proven to be true. People always hate those who they think are doing better than them. And you want to know why? You want to know why they do that. It's because if they can't be where you are, the second best option for you, for them is for you to join them where they are. If they, you know, can pull you down to their level, they can still feel like they've won because at least you're not ahead of them, making them feel any more insecure than they already feel. So these groups of people, these ultimate

haters, they make up their own class. I like to call them the insecure critics. But if we want to dive even further into the research, you would also find that the majority of the people, they're time, the average Joe, most people aren't really thinking about you at all. So this was revealed in a study by three social psychologists. Their names were Gus Gooney, Erica Boothie and Mariana Lee, and they did their research on what they call the thought gap. And this explains how we tend to think that we take up more space in someone else's mind than we do. And the reason we think that, the reason we have this thought gap is because we only have direct access to our own thoughts. And what are we thinking about more than anything else? We're thinking about ourselves.

So we naturally, subconsciously, without knowing it, assume that other people must be thinking about us too. And they must be thinking the same thoughts. They're on the same page as us. Therefore, we overestimate how much they truly notice. It's a common cognitive and social bias that brings about a lot of implicit self-scrutiny. And there's even more research on this as well. And it shows that we actually tend to implant our own securities onto others' thoughts. And we assume that they can see all the things that only we can notice. You may also know this as the spotlight effect. And I had this experience with a friend recently where this was very clear to me. We were looking through pictures from her birthday party and there was this truly beautiful photo of her like smiling with a bunch

of our friends her hair was like impeccable she had a beautiful outfit on her makeup was like stunning everything i literally saw the photo and gasped because i was like you just look so great and she immediately was like oh my god no can't you see my double chin and can't you see my arms like don't let anyone post that and of course i hadn't noticed a single one of these features because others don't search for our insecurities the way that we do. And I want to just say that one more time, other people do not search for our insecurities the way that we do. So these are just a few reminders if you're in a spiral

or you feel bombarded by imaginary or real judgments from those around you. Let's move on to some more practical tips, though. My first big tip if you struggle with caring too much about what other people think, other people think, is I want you to make an opinion hierarchy or rank the kind of opinions that you are likely to encounter. So at the bottom of your ladder, at the bottom of your scale, it should be complete strangers. Complete strangers, their opinions do not matter. They have no clue who you are. They really aren't invested in you as a person. They don't care about your growth. Your existence means very little to them. So their opinion ranks on the bottom. They are

more likely to care about what you can do for them and how making you feel bad can make them feel better than they are to actually want what's best for you. The second tier is acquaintances, then it's colleagues, then it's friends, then we have the silver circle, close friends. I'm talking friends that are honorary family members. And then finally also in that silver circle, it's family members who trust and also your partner might be included here. as well. That's the inner sanctum. That's the silver circle though. We also have the gold circle. Who is left to belong in the gold circle? It's you. You and you only. I want you to draw out this diagram or this image, however you see it in your mind. I want you to draw it out. Put it on your mirror,

somewhere in your car, front page of your diary, whatever it is, as a reminder of how other people's judgments rank compared to your own. I think the big problem with spending too much time thinking about the thoughts of others is that we end up becoming detached or disconnected from our own opinion about something, including ourselves. So our intuition becomes injured because we're letting too many voices interrupt. So what I really want you to do is opposite to what your gut feeling is saying. And I want you to actually let yourself acknowledge.

the opinions of others, let yourself really lean in, let yourself really absorb it, don't ignore it, and then ask yourself, okay, but what do I think? All of this aside, I've listened, I've given you your time, I've listened. Now what is my opinion? And which one is going to make me happier to listen to? Think about it in the context of an outfit. That's a very simple enough example. You might ask all your friends, what do you think? What do you think about this look? 50% of them might say, I hate it. 25% say, yeah, it's fine.

25% say it's really beautiful. I like it. Let those perspectives sink in and then turn around and say, all right, time to ask myself. What's my opinion? And based on that hierarchy, what do I choose to do here? This also is important because it allows yourself to be exposed to just, judgment without letting it, you know, kind of penetrate the armor, knowing that you can listen

and not be hurt by it. These opinions through this process will start to feel less and less important to you as your opinion and intuition become louder and louder and louder until you don't need to ask for validation about not just outfit choices, but everything else in your life. That's really what the people who you see who are just crushing it are doing. There's people you see who are so authentic and true to themselves and they have great style and they've always focused on something and they're deeply committed and they let mean things bounce off them. They have in some ways done this exercise in the past, even if they don't realize it. Second, if you want to start turning inwards for validation rather than outwards, it's really important to strengthen your

sense of self and your identity and make sure you remind yourself what is important to me. I'm going to ask you right now, what are three things that are really important to you right now? I'll give you a few seconds. The thing is, if you don't know, if you can't name them, I think your identity needs a few renovations, it needs a few additions. You want to have that strong, personal, internal home that you can come back to. Also, I think focus on being a good, authentic person rather than just an agreeable person. You can be someone who is kind, self-assured, who has amazing things going for them, and also who can stick up for themselves. You can be someone who still, you know, listens to their family, listens to their friends, does ask for advice and does seek counsel. But also, when they

have a gut feeling, when they have an instinct, when they like something, they know how to act on it. really what it comes down to is don't let yourself doubt yourself any further. Like don't do that to yourself. Don't, you know, second guess yourself. Don't feel like, again, the opinion of a stranger is more worthwhile than yours. Instead, I want you to commit deeply and without compromise to what you want and what you want to do and what you care about. And make sure that if someone asked you, what do you care about, you would know how to answer. You'd know how to respond. Make an investment in yourself by choosing one goal, one hobby,

one passion you want to work at and make yourself a good life full of things that you care about way more than others and that you could continue to do even if the world hated it. You know, I just don't let your life just be, you know, work, come home, watch TV, order takeaway, maybe hang out with your friends on the weekend and let everyone else stick. dictate what you do. I just don't think that's a strong foundation for a good life. I don't think it's a strong foundation for a good sense of self and it will make you easily swayed. It will make you feel like you don't know how to do things. You don't know what you want. You don't know what you like. But are you giving yourself enough new experiences and external stimulus and excitement to actually

give yourself the chance to know what you want? Finally, finally. I will. want you to adopt the 555 rule. Basically, the 555 rule looks at other people's opinions or thoughts of you. I don't know. I keep using the item like your outfit one a lot. It just seems easy. You know, you're not fit enough. You don't look the way. You're not attractive. You don't look how I want you to look. You're never going to be successful. I don't believe in you. Whatever it is. That someone has told you at some point in your life. It looks at the opinions of others and it says, will it matter in five days? Will it matter in five months?

Will it matter in five years? And crucially, will it matter if I don't listen? Obviously, if you take something deeply to heart, it will still matter in five years. But if you just treat someone's opinion with complete neutrality, will it matter? And the rule of five says that the only things we should concern ourselves with are issues or problems that will still be impacting us in five years time.

So what I'm talking about there is genuine feedback that someone is giving you in good faith to help you improve your life. That is what will matter in five years time. A family member saying, you know, I don't think like this way of going about your life is harming you. That's an opinion you should listen to. Or a boss saying, hey, if you have so much potential, but if you don't do this thing, if you don't fix this thing, if you don't expand this part of yourself more, you won't get ahead.

That's an opinion you should listen to. But, you know, mean, snarky criticism from a co-worker, strange look from lady on train, someone on the internet trolling you, opinion of old friend from high school, that's not five-year-worthy. So they can be acknowledged and swiftly dismissed. My last tip, and it does kind of link to that one as well, is choose your people wisely. choose people to be around you who you aspire to be like, who respect you, who you respect, who will help you course correct, but also who encourage you rather than bring you down. There is no backhanded compliments, there is no worrying what they'll think. We all know the experience of having a friend who you can never quite tell whether they want to see you fail or whether they want to build you up or whether they just want to.

want something from you. Like, there is some people who are like that. And again, I want to remind you, they deserve love, they deserve respect, because they're probably going through it themselves. Like, if your existence brings out that insecurity in them, it's because they were already insecure. So really choose people who you know are going to elevate you, who will never make you question what it is about you that is authentic and pure and true to you. And I think that that makes you more confident in your own decisions, more confident in who you are, because you're not worried about the immediate threat or possibility of upsetting someone or disappointing someone.

So those are just some of the tips that I wanted to give you today. Honestly, I could give you millions more. Everyone else, everyone really has their own ways of thinking about it. Some people like to imagine a big giant orb that surrounds them that other people's opinions bounce off of. Some people like to get quite existential with it. They like to, you know, really focus on the fact that we get one life. No one's going to remember you and that is actually a really helpful thought and it's quite nice to imagine the kind of liberty and peace and freedom that comes with no one really ever being able to remember your actions. So it is really about

finding out what works for you. But at the end of the day, really building up the parts of you that are going to be strong and that are going to be foundations for you, no matter what anyone else thinks, feels, says, believes, whatever it is. So I hope you enjoyed this episode. Please, if you've made it this far, leave a little cloud emoji in the comment section and leave your thoughts on what you learned from this episode whether you think you can apply it to your own life. I love seeing how far people get and it's always really cute to be like, oh, hello, my finishes, my people who are committed to the episode. So again, thank you for listening. Also, if you haven't yet listened to Mantra, if you liked this episode, I really think you're going to like Mantra. It's basically

pep talks for your week that can ground you. So I'll leave a link in the description. Make sure you were following along on Instagram at That Psychology podcast. We do episode summaries. We do polls all the time. I ask you for your opinions on episodes. So it'd be great to see you over there. And until next time, stay safe. Be kind and above all else. Be gentle to yourself. We will talk very, very soon. Hey, what's good, y'all? You're listening to Learn the Hardway with your favorite therapist and host Kear Games. This space is about black men. experiences, having honest conversations that's really not safe to have anywhere, but you're having them with a licensed professional who knows what he's doing.

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