The Psychology of your 20s - 439. How to chase your dreams, and when to slow down ft. Grace Beverley

Episode Date: July 13, 2026

TW: Discussions of miscarriage/pregnancy Grace Beverley is a founder, an entrepreneur, and a seasoned professional when it comes to pursuing the ideas your have, but also knowing when to slow down, recover from burnout and let yourself be vulnerable.  In today's episode we discuss her journey from studying music at Oxford to launching over five businesses, and her next chapter as a parent. We talk about:  The best career advice for your 20s How to start a business and her biggest lessons from early failures Why love should make you feel safe  Her pregnancy loss story  The importance of being vocal about what you believe in  How to recover from burnout Listen now! Watch on Netflix: HERE Follow Grace on Instagram: @gracebeverley Shop TALA: HERE Follow Jemma on Instagram: @jemmasbeg Follow the podcast on Instagram: @thatpsychologypodcast Subscribe on Substack: @thepsychologyofyour20s For business: [e-mail]  The Psychology of your 20s is not a substitute for professional mental health help. If you are struggling, distressed or require personalised advice, please reach out to your doctor or a licensed psychologist.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Hello everybody. I'm Jemma Spike, and welcome back to the psychology of your 20s, the podcast where we talk through the biggest changes, moments and transitions of our 20s, and what they mean for our psychology. Hello, everybody. Welcome back to the show. Welcome back to the podcast. It is so great to have you here back for another episode as we, of course, break down the psychology of our 20s, there has been one special individual that we have wanted to have on the podcast for a long time, someone who has had such an interesting career trajectory and life that I think contains so many lessons for others in their 20s. She's basically lived many lives during this decade, which is a testament to her work ethic, but also, I think just our general ability

to evolve time and time again. You may know her as the founder of Tala, Shredi, the productivity method or if you are an OG fan for her workout guides and plans. She is also the host of the podcast Working Hard and Oxford grad, a genuinely all-around cool person who we know and love. Grace Beverly, welcome to the psychology of your 20s. Thank you so much. Also, you're so good at reading. You must have loved when they came to you in class and they were like, can you read this sentence please? You did not stutter once. Well, I practice. No, I do. That's amazing. Reading comprehension. I'm going to put that up. Reading comprehension. On 10.

When Hendwood, we were saying like before we started that when I read out the intro, you're like sitting right next week. Is it like somebody singing you happy birthday? Yeah, but then also saying like 10 nice things about you afterwards. Yeah, it never ends. Yeah, it is a lot. Okay, briefly introduce yourself. Tell us a little bit about who you are as a person and then we're going to do some ice breakers. Perfect. So I'm Grace. What am I going to say about myself? So I am an entrepreneur, I guess, is probably like the most all-encompassing way of referring to what I do. But it's, as you say, has evolved over the past decade or so.

So I started my first business when I was in my first term or semester. I don't know what you would call it at university. And I have since started three more businesses. And I do a lot of investing and advisory work as well on other businesses that are kind of of not in a similar space, but essentially, like my expertise is around consumer businesses and kind of how they can appeal to their customers and grow over time and all of that. So I do a lot of that work. I also have a podcast.

I do socials, I guess just generally showing what I am doing in my day-to-day. And my day-to-day job, I would consider the work within the businesses because that is what I do day-to-day. Sorry, by the way, if I'm very gurgly and acid refluxy, I'm afraid. There's literally nothing we can do about it. There is something inside of me. There is a giant baby. It's just like encroaching upon my esophagus.

And yeah, I just... The baby doesn't like the podcast. The amount of Gaviscon that's in my bag, I can't even tell you. Really? Yeah. Pop one in when you need it. When you guys hear a break, you know what we're doing. I love that way of describing you because you're a very busy woman.

And before we get into what makes you busy, we're going to do a quick little. icebreaker. We ask these kind of questions of all of our guests. Are you ready? I'm so ready. Okay. Three to one. Favorite fast food order. Okay. As you can tell, I'm really going to find out. Stop the question. Fuck. It's hard because I was veggie until quite recently. And like that's not very well, you know, catered for in fast food. So now like everything, every time I do try fast food, it's like a whole new world so I don't know if it's my go-to

you know I'm sorry no it's okay I'm really bad at being concise this one I think will be easier oh please last last thing you ordered online

oh so I'm renovating at the moment and I have been honestly Etsy's market value has gone up by about a trillion this week based on me alone stock tip

yeah sorry this is a stock tip you know Etsy's value Grace is on the shops. Grace is on the shops. Get investing in that. Not financial advice.

But I, yeah, I've been all over the trinkets. It's basically because we're so close now, I feel like I can actually start to buy the little things. I mostly want to save the little things for when you're in and you're like, oh, I could use something for that corner. But the things I've been going for generally like art, little like bookends, vintagey things I'm finding. little, I got a label, a vintage label for like the laundry room door, which I liked.

So yeah, just a hell of a lot of little trinkets. Yeah, and are you so excited every time a package comes? Or you're at this stage where you don't know what it's going to be. Well, I've ordered them to the house and I'm not currently in the house. So it's Christmas next Wednesday in case anyone does know. Okay, last sunset you saw. Oh, sunset. I went on a little girl's trip.

few weeks ago, my girls' trip baby moon, we shall call it. It's not actually, it was for everyone, but that's how I was taking it. Last girl's trip before popping out a baby. And we saw some beautiful sunsets there,

and it was just so lovely. It was kind of, we were in this gorgeous village where you just walk down and you just sit at a restaurant, you order some calamari, you get, everyone gets an appraisal spritz apart from me, you just have a,

nice little chat and like a game of cards while the sun is setting and that is just that's where I belong. That was God's plan for us all along. Were you in Greece? Yes. Oh, delightful. Yeah. What would your friend say is your most annoying habit? Oh, where do I start? Very bad at going with the flow.

Me and the flow? Not good friends. Which is great because it does mean for every trip or whatever like you know they're like oh trip made out the group chat if i'm in the group chat if you think this isn't making out the group chat you are very much mistaken first of all second of all it unfortunately will be run as a military operation um so yeah it depends how much you like that like great because you can i guess put your feet up um but you never know what's going to happen when you open your whats up there might be 20 polls there might be a spreadsheet

there might be a little tick box you have to fill in There might be a Google Doc. There might be a Google Doc. Yeah. It's too much. Yeah. Wait, when you and your husband go on trips, do you plan them? No.

See this. I know. I love it. I know. Guys. Sorry to post. But I, one of my favorite things about my relationship is that in the big wide world, I am like, you know, I'm feisty. I'm running around doing all my independent things.

When I'm at home, I am baby. when I am in that relationship, I am I baby Yeah, I baby no do things Baby feet up Baby Tommy Tickles Baby, baby get fed

free time day Baby, baby get fed well Baby don't know what airport going from What terminal, what time plane And that as someone Who is like so aggressively type A And organises every single other thing in their life Like that is, I never thought I could have that from a relationship.

Because I did kind of come to terms of the fact that I was like, this is just who I am. I can't expect anyone else to have such high standards of organization because obviously you're taking it too far. But lo and behold, here he came. There he was. There he was. Flying around the corner.

And now I get to be baby. Yeah, the best. Okay, two more. Texting or voice notes? I'm big on voice notes. I just think there has to be a regular cadence of them and I think that I don't know

I think they need to serve a purpose so for example if you're going quickly back and forth in the workday is it helpful to have a voice note no because I'm in a meeting you've made it very hard for me to multitask I've got to listen to the meeting exactly and that I can't do that

okay and a book you think everybody should read okay we were just going through some of the best books I'm having a really good reading year and I think it's only going to go from strength to strength if I'm able to read in maternity leave, which my Kindle's a good old one handhold. So I'm, you know, hoping. I just read Broken Country, which, oh my God, was so good. I honestly, so I was on my actual Baby Moon, as you can tell. I had to have multiple friends, Baby Moon and husband Baby Moon.

When's the solo one happening? Well, yeah, this is it. it's right now. It was my trip to this office. Yeah, it was my trip to Farringen. And yeah, I just did not move all day. I was completely transfixed. It was so well written. I have quite a strict over four rule on good reads, not because I'm a snob, although you could argue, but because there are so many books out there that if I'm busy, the chances of me, like if I can just heighten the chance of me enjoying the book by it being above a four. Because I think what I used to fall into the trap of a lot is like these really overhyped books,

they still won't be an over a four if they are badly written. Like I am so sorry to everyone, but like I really am not a Kaleen Hoover fan. And most of them are not over a four on goodreads. And therein lies the lesson. Therein lies the lesson. And I, yeah, so I generally just go for above a four and I have my whole want to read list. and then I can just filter it by the average rating. This is a mathematical affair.

Yeah, I don't know why I've taken your quick-fire questions. I kind of like it. I kind of like I try to expand them into the entire podcast. But yeah, sorry for taking it so far. That's all right. You know what? I feel like we're warmed up now, though. Thank you, me too.

We know a bit more about each other. We kind of already did. But, you know, the audience does. Let's talk about what you're here to talk about, which is business and life and work. when did you first start putting yourself out there online? Because that's kind of the beginning of this whole story, isn't it? Yeah, it absolutely is. And I think that like one of the, maybe one of the misconceptions people get about my story

is because it all started so long ago online. I think the assumption is that like the following was built first. And then it was like, oh, let's throw businesses on top, which totally fair. Some of them were because I obviously didn't start off all businesses at once. That would be absolutely insane. and I am a little, but like not that far. Not that far. And I started my first business and my first year at university.

Well, actually, I sold my first products online within kind of six months of starting my socials. And they had just been started as like an anonymous account where I was just posting about like my fitness journey. So I was interested in staying disciplined and going to the gym. And that was not something that I had within my wheelhouse. it just wasn't something that I was capable of doing and so I started the account as I guess like an accountability thing while I was in my last year of sixth form I don't know what you would call it yeah just like the last year of like high school kind like year 12

not if you like it's the two years after if you left at 16 so like the 18 one yeah yeah um and I yeah I just started up the account as I said it was anonymous I didn't show my face all of that um started and then started selling products on there a few months later. And then by the time I actually went to start what I consider now, like my first business, I was about a year later. And I guess I just had like a year experimenting with the, because the first products I sold were digital ebugs and, or just ebugs. They are digital. And essentially, I guess I'd kind of played around with that, that year being like, oh, okay, well, if I put it 20% off or like a flash sale then more people come in or I put it like a bundle deal and people buy

you know people are more likely to buy two than one or like you know you do a limited thing whatever so I kind of like come to terms with how some of these things work and so then by the time I started the business like a year later I kind of realized that that was a viable option and by that point I'd gone from having like one or two thousand followers to having I think around 100,000. That's crazy. Yeah. And so that's when I started that.

Okay, this brings me to some follow-up questions. Did you show your face first or did somebody realize it was you first? Oh, they realized it was me. Yeah. Was it like, which is so I kind of showed my face out of like, well. Here I am. There we go. Games up.

And who was it? Do you remember? Oh, yeah. There was a lot of Chad school. And I think also because I was, so I'd only joined that school a year before. So I wasn't, it was a school, obviously like with high school, like people had been there since they were like 11. I had not. And so I was already kind of like new girly.

And then just, yeah, word got around. And I remember coming back to school after because it was like after the Easter holidays. And I'd been like, you know, doing my posting and all of this. And then I just remember coming back in and being like, I hear whispers. It's like gossip girl. to the gossip girl real life fantasy. And it was very like what the fuck because I think that now

even at the time people not everyone had personal Instagrams like it wasn't really like we were on Facebook like people didn't have personal internet well a few people did but it wasn't like you'd be posting the toast you just buttered like it wouldn't be like this is me it's like a sepia filter

yeah like as in unlikely to even be a selfie like come on and pull yourself together whereas there was me being like don't want to the gym today here's a salad you know. Yeah. So it just wasn't that well regarded, I would say. That sucks. But you made, I feel like you got the opportunity to basically have like a playground to understand business on your own. A hundred percent, very low risk as well. I always, I think that there's like a lot of narrative online around like,

take the leap, quit your job, do this. And it's like, I was very fortunate to be in the position where I never needed to do that. Because A, I started with digital products, which have basically zero sunk cost. like you don't really need to pay a lot to get into them. You just need to do the work on it. And like I paid 50 quid to a friend who was a graphic design student to like make them look nice. Before Canva. Before Canva. Pre-Canver in the world PC.

And essentially that was, yeah, because I was like, it's an e-book. It needs to look nice. But other than that, like there's no marginal cost. So if two people bought it, it's cost me the same to produce as like one. So like every extra thing you sell is just cash. And so, yeah, it was like I never needed it. And then also I went on to university. Like, I've never been full time.

There was never a moment where I had to be like full time in the business. Yeah. Before they'd actually, you know, I then had three years of university to really like work it out. Yeah. That's crazy. And you went and studied music. Yeah. Which I think a lot of people may not know.

Maybe. And what was it was like, I was doing some digging on the Wikipedia page. Oh, yeah, you got some digging on the thing. I was like, I got it. That's what she's for. I hope you did the nice donation link to Wikipedia. Yeah, I always do. I always feel bad.

They're always like, we're begging you. Yeah, yeah. We will chat down tomorrow. And I'm like, donate two cents. I'm like, oh, be rude not to. I always do it. But what do you think about studying music and like the arts helped you with business? Oh, I don't know if that much.

I think that the main, okay, main things I think I really learned from. the like music background. Worth saying as well that my degree was specific, it was all essay-based, so it wasn't actually like performance-based. I imagine you having to sing like for your exams. Okay, time of me, yeah, exactly. Time for you'll sing so, maybe.

And that's an A. Thank you. But no, it was all essay-based. So it was like the areas I specialized in were like politics and philosophy of music. So music's used in like during censorship eras or like whatever. Anyway, so I think that the two main things that it taught me were, one, it was a very, because of the university I went to, it was a very high workload course. So essentially it was, I had like 10,000 words a week for three years. And then none of that counted. Well, it counted in that if you didn't do it, you were getting kicked out. But it didn't count towards your grade until the last month. Oh my God. Yeah. And you were consistently examined, but not for. for like your place rather than...

So you can stay here, not even for like your grade. Exactly. And so then it's all like culminates in this big horror. And then the other thing I think that music and that musical background I guess really taught me was like, I think you face so much rejection doing music and the arts generally. Like there will always be people who are far better than you, like always. And you have to work so hard and put in so many extra hours and it's not very well. It definitely wasn't where I was like. considered like cool or prestigious or reputable or like whatever it might be. And you did that at the

same time and like had to spend so many hours outside of school and university like doing the extra. And then you were just constantly shut down, shut down like the entire time. So it teaches you to have a very good relationship with rejection because literally just constantly like I don't remember a, like this is not due to be a self story. But like as in like I don't remember a single time where like, well, there were probably like two, three times total where I went for something and actually got it. And it was, you know, the thing I'd really work for most of the rest of the time. Like you do a fuckload of, am I allowed to swear?

Yeah. Well, thank you. Thank you. I feel like I can do it for England. Exactly. I'm really good at those. Like, essentially where you do a fuckload of work and then you don't get anything for it.

And in fact, you're kind of shot down and they're like, you know, the rest of your life. They're not going to be like, oh, you're really bad at this. But like, you're kind of being consistently told. like other people are better than you. And I think because I did that from so early, like I worked at a cathedral from when I was eight, which essentially was like like 20 or so hours on top of schoolwork every week of music.

And then like from that point onwards, it's like it's actually just like a, I think the main thing it taught me is just like a crash course in being happy with rejection or just like being okay. And being able to work really, really hard and then get nothing shut down over and over again. which is huge in business and huge in entertainment.

A hundred percent. And just like, I think a very good life skill. Like you have, we see all of that, you know, TikTok stuff, for example, on like rejection exposure therapy. And I think actually I saw it a lot. Like I, where you come across people who maybe haven't had as much rejection and therefore the rejection they do have really, really shuts them down. And that's a totally natural reaction. But actually, if you're consistently, like, even now, there have been so many things that, I mean, you know, obviously it wouldn't be public,

but like so many things that I've interviewed for or tried out for, like, whatever it might be, that I would really want. And it's like, if it just comes through and it's a rejection, it's like, oh. Yeah, great. Next. Yeah, exactly. I've been doing this recently where I've been like emailing, emailing guests that I really want. And they are ridiculous guests, ridiculous.

But I'm like, otherwise the answer is no. Yeah, so let's go for it. There's 100% of the shots you don't take And I will say the other week I was like Simone Biles' assistant said no and she actually emailed me back And I was like that's a win Yeah exactly

It was like an email back was a win And I genuinely was like Throughout all this rejection Like the fact that I've gotten through And somebody's even maybe she didn't My favourite is when they come back with something That like it's actually unnecessary colour On top of the rejection

It's like oh yeah yeah we really don't like This type of thing We don't like Oh okay but we're not prioritising this kind of exposure Right now. Actually, we just don't like you. Your podcast at all. She's actually got really, not to run bars, but like, she actually has really terrible

experience of you and, yeah. But it was really nice. They sent me this lovely email and I was like, that is the biggest win. A direct no was the biggest win. And I was like, this is great for my character. And I think that like for anyone who maybe knows that that is an area that they haven't got enough exposure to, like purposefully putting yourself in that track, I think is one of the best things you can do because until you're used to rejection, you're going to

continuously be scared of it and also probably have an underlying fear of even going for things where you think you might be rejected, whereas like we know that like the surface area of luck thing, for example, is all around like putting yourself in positions where you could get lucky, like not that way. Yeah. But like, what are you got? You could do that too. But like essentially where like we've said it, like you miss 100% of the shots you don't take. So if you're not putting it, yourself in those environments. You don't know whether yeah, they wanted someone with these 10 qualifications and you only have three

but actually they decided you were better at these other things. And like you never would have known if you hadn't put yourself there and if you're scared of rejection that's going to be very hard. Yeah, it's a huge thing to learn. Listen, and you're there for heart-wrenching

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I'm Munga shit together, and I'm back with a new season of the podcast, Skyline Drive. This time I'm diving into a rabbit hole of peptides, organoids, blood boys, blue zones, and brain replacement to try to understand what this longevity obsession is all about. And what it really means to live, forever for all of us.

I learned about some rad science. I can make a brain for you, and then we can test what draw is the best for your brain, as opposed to his brain. Here's some hard truths. I would expect Indians to age faster, but I did not expect it to be almost a four to five-year acceleration. And get myself into a world of trouble. I'd say probably start bone smashing.

That doesn't work. To make it look more defined. They say it works. I don't know. Listen to Skyline Drive How to Live Forever on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Mainstream media is full of cruel depictions of the unhoused,

stories that shame and blame and paint the unhoused as a monolith. We The UnHouse is the podcast that's changing that. I'm Theo Henderson, creator and host. and for years I've created a space where the unhoused and their advocates can tell their own stories. In the last few months alone, I've interviewed unhoused parents, immigrants, mutual aid organizers, veterans, the LGBTQTIA plus community, and the policymakers who make the laws that impact the unhoused existence. We'd be in house is a two-time webby and signal award-winning show with many exciting guests on the horizon. Tune in this week for my interview with Dr. Jill Wichler,

a street doctor turned influencer whose work with the unhoused community has made a huge impact online and in her community. Listen to Weythian House on the IHard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. This is Michael Rappaport, and my podcast, the I Am Rapaport Stereo Podcast, is unlike anyone you've ever heard.

We're a variety show, and if you're looking for strong opinions, funny opinions about sports, entertainment, politics, pop culture, and whatever else catches my attention, then subscribe now. This kid, Jafar Jackson, is as good as Rami Malik as Freddie Mercury, and it's as good as Timothy Shamaulay as Bob Dylan. And I say that with love and respect for both of those actors. And I don't know how many Oscar nominations they give out, I don't know if it's five, six for best actor. 150% this kid Jafar Jackson should absolutely positively get nominated for his portrayal as Michael Jackson. Listen to I Am Rap Report on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

Speaking of something that wasn't a rejection, maybe, but I think was a great success. When did you get the idea Fatala? And where did the name come from? Oh yeah, I can tell you. It was a very boring story. Sorry. I'll try it was throw it out. Let's go. So yeah, I started Tyler in my final year at university. Actually, before that, like the month before that month I told you about where everything counts towards your degree. So that was really smart. Why? Did you do that? Well, because it was meant to. Yeah, exactly. I love it. Suffering, kink. No, it was meant to essentially launch a good while before then. It just kept getting pushed for a number of different reasons, like manufacturing delays, a number of these different things. And then I was just like, we just have to get it out because I'm paying people.

and we just, we need to launch, basically, and it just happened to fall at the worst possible time. But, rewining back, I got the idea for the business about a year before, I guess, like, I was very much, like, within the space. Like, I was wearing a lot of active wear. I was, I was a student, and I went to the gym. So, like, obviously, I was wearing active wear most at the time. And I had really strong opinions on, like, how things fit and how things felt. And I felt like a lot of, I felt like a lot of designs were.

within the industry, we're either like super revealing, which actually I don't find that flattering on me. We do, you know, gorgeous, like, strappy bras and like all of that. And they look amazing. But I think that, like, I, it felt like it either needed to be teeny tiny or it needed to be kind of frumpy. And I wasn't, I was like, actually, that's not where I like to kind of sit in terms of the designs I go for. But also, one of the main things was that I'd moved away from fast fashion consumption in my day to day life. So I just wasn't, I wasn't like, I don't know, I used to, terrible, but I used to like have contracts with like PLT and a number of different fast fashion houses and all of that. Like with my fast fashion houses was really like blowing them

up in the LVMH like direction. But yeah, yeah, the houses. Yeah. And they're runways. Yeah, exactly. But I had essentially had contracts with them and that was a big part of my job. And I literally stopped that overnight. Like I canceled on my contracts. I lost like 75% of my income because I was just like, this is not something I want to stand by. I really don't like it. I feel shit every time I post about it. And then I kind of moved away from it in my day-to-day, like, actual consumption. And I just realized that activeware was like a glaringly big gap in that way because you don't, because you think of it as like a necessity for the thing you're doing.

You kind of look less at it being like a cherry on top. And therefore you're like, oh, I'm not really thinking about the materials or who's made it or any of that. And so I had realized that I've moved away from that my day to day, but not necessarily my active wear. And then the biggest solutions that I was finding for my day to day, which were things like rental and pre-owned and like amazing ethical brands, all of this, were either not really available in activeware for reasons like pre-owned and rental. People aren't as keen on for activeware. They do exist, but like, you know, you probably, well, you probably, like, that's the thing. Like there are solutions for it, but it's probably not going to reach a mass market change level. No. And then also with the ethical brands, there were some brands that had done some really amazing things.

But again, they were like, they were probably about 50% more price-wise. And so I wanted to look into creating an option that was granted, like not about being small and artisanal. It was kind of, can we do better at scale? So like, can we have some baseline assumption? in terms of like what we are and aren't going to do in terms of fabrics, in terms of factories, in terms of dying processes, in terms of sampling, in terms of packaging, in terms of all of these different things. Because I think people think of, you know, those types of things in terms of just materials,

whereas it's actually so much more behind the scenes like 0% to landfill pledges, not restocking during sales and therefore just, you know, trying to sell loads and loads of stuff at sale price, like all of that. And so we kind of, I wanted to create an active web brand that ticked those. boxes and also was like you wouldn't see a difference in terms of like fit. Yeah. And it wasn't 50% more expensive. So it took a long time because that's quite hard. And I think that, you know, there are a lot of ideals around what you would want from lots of brands you shop from. I think realistically, a lot of the time they haven't been done for a reason because it's like

not maintainable. But we, yeah, I kind of got to starting that about a year before it ended up launching and then launched that, as I said, in May of 2019. And now we're here. Seven years later. That's crazy. And she's thriving. She is thriving. I was there the other day.

Oh, were you? Yeah, when you were in Australia, I sent you a message. Oh, yeah, yeah. I was like, checking up on your first baby. Well, thank you. They was, you know, your top members are really nice. Everyone's love. Yeah, she was, I want to give her a shout out.

She had red hair. That's all I remember. Oh, was it at the Carnaby Street store or the Westfield one? The one in Carnegie Street. She was delight. There you go. Everyone's amazing. Yeah.

So sweet. Again, I mean, like, obviously is separate. But like we, with the store expansion, for example, it was like, how do we create an in-person environment that reflects are online and kind of like who we are in HQ and all of that? Like really feels in that way rather than just being like, yeah, we'll just hire these people in as quickly as possible. It was like, no, it's like we're like a, you know, we're like a girl's girl brand. We know how we want you to feel in the clothes. We know how we want you to feel in the shop. So, like, we've got to represent that in the physical space.

Other thing I liked about the Tala store, and then we'll move on. There's a right now. Let's just do a whole podcast on this. I really liked that, like, you guys had all the sizes out. I was like, oh, thank God. Yeah. And a big conscious decision. Oh, great.

I was like, this is amazing because I hate when you go to a store. It's like, so do you have, what's the biggest size you have? Yeah. can you get it for me? And it's like, it just kind of always sucks. Yeah. I don't know. It's not a good feeling. Yeah, of course. And like, you know, there have been lots of, I would say, like, learning curves. Because again, it's like you go from running like what's an online store where everything is in one warehouse. It is getting shipped out from one place. And so everything's in one place to even like everything new you launch, needing it to get to one store. But you also need like the exact right size ratio. You don't know who's going to come in that day. And like,

knowing that you need, like you can estimate it, but like how many of those pieces do you actually need in the store across how many sizes, different colors, like all of this. Like it's, you know, I'm sure we won't have got it right for everyone. But it's a, it's been a massive, like, learning curve and I'm very proud of, like, the reviews and kind of love we get from how people feel when they're in there and that. Let's take it down. Let's take a turn for the worst. Yeah, no more compliments. Yeah. No more good stuff you're doing for the environment, women's self-confidence.

What's been the biggest, like, oh, fuck. moment of running a business. Oh, there have been so many. They are every day. They are relentless. No, I think, I mean, I actually do think that, like, that is one of the most defining parts of having a business is, like, you are constantly just, like, on the floor. Which is like, why?

Like, more and more of this. Like, my propensity to deal with stress now, I think is so high. Actually, for the bad reason of the fact that, like, shit is thrown at me every single day. Like, big, big stuff. you know and I think that's just part of having a business and then you add in more businesses it's kind of like just increases the cadence of these types of things coming up um there are many different ones like there have been big oh fuck ones like in like 2020 2021 tarla very nearly went by by um and that was like a good year long battle like to and within that like I can't remember how long it

would have been, but it would have been like around two months of like working out whether we're going to make payroll every single week and being like, that would be the most stressful part I can imagine being like, it's okay if I go bankrupt. Yeah. Well, it had times when I was literally like, I would pay salaries out of like my Monso account. Like as in like, you know, I had like one payroll that we weren't going to make and I was like, fuck. And I sold my car the next day to like someone I found online, which was literally like a, what was it? It was like a, they'd come to your house and they just buy your car for you. And I was like, I don't even know if this is legit.

But it was like, as long as I bought the money in my account before they, before they leave, I was like, sounds like my solution for the week. So yeah, there have been like big, like big, terrible, like prolonged very life, um, ruining at the time kind of, um, things to go through. Um, and then there were the small ones every day. Like, there's, you know, the other day we had our, um, like, I hope we did. like a hotel, Tala. It was kind of like a... I saw it was so beautiful. Thank you.

It was gorgeous. Thank you. It was essentially like a campaign that we did like what Tala would be like as a hotel and then hosted some people there. And, you know, even on the first day of that, like we sent two of our team members early to set everything up with like all of the stock and the decorations and like the cute little touches and everything. And five out of ten suitcases got lost and ended up like floating around Europe. And like the whole reason you send people early is that they can like set things up. It's just a little bit of chaos. Yeah. Yeah. So, you know, that type of stuff happens all the time. Same with I went out to New York Fashion Week. We were doing a New York Fashion Week activation and I was there for 48 hours before

I had to go somewhere else and I literally landed and my one suitcase that I had with me was lost and they were like, we can get it back to you in 48 hours and I was like, perfect. We've got our New York Fashion Week thing tomorrow. So it should be sooner. Yeah. Please and thank you. Have we considered teleporting? Yeah.

Did they pay you for that? I actually don't think I ended up getting any compensation. This is a random hill I die on, but airline compensation. It's so bad. I could start a business on it though. Oh yeah. I will always get compensation from airlines. Really?

Oh, I'm good at a sternly worded email around something like that. Oh no. I have beef with probably every airline bar one. I'm not going to go away. into them, bar one. And they sponsored the podcast and I love, that's the only reason. Oh my God, really? Yeah, literally. I had any, actually, I'll tell this story that I won't name names, but an airline who I had like the most despicable experience with, with my dad randomly, was like, we really want to sponsor the podcast and I was like, no. And my team was like, you really should do that. I was like, I would never. I would never stop my soul. Because I, yeah, anyways. Yeah, also then when I flew,

to my next place. They literally, I was like, don't fly out to New York, keep it in London. I'll just get it when I'm back in London because I only need it for the next 48 hours. And then literally, as I flew off to the next place, it flew from London to New York. I was like, okay. I know. And it's so hard because it's like, I also will say I'm like, every single person who works for an airline, I'm like, I love you. Oh, yeah. I'm like, you guys do that probably a very hard job of like the only time people want to talk to you is when they're really mad. So it's always via email, but it's stuff like that where it's like their policies and it's like, policies just fuck them over. We need to fix this.

We'll move on from airline politics. But that was my favorite problem of your question. Yeah, we can go on for ages. That's going to be our part two episode. Come back for the part two. Hey, I'm Rubikar, the host of the podcast, Encore. Check out our brand new episodes featuring music from the show that everyone is reheating as we speak. Heated rivalry. Join me as I go behind the songs that brought Shane and Elia together. I'll tell you, the stories of Fice, My Moon, My Man, Wolf Parades, I'll Believe in Anything, and tattoos all the things she said, and how they all became a part of this global phenomenon. Stream encore on IHeart Radio, crave, or wherever you get your podcasts.

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Mainstream media is full of cruel depictions of the unhoused, stories that shame and blame and paint the unhoused as a monolith. We The InHouse is the podcast that's changing that. I'm Theo Henderson, creator, and host, and for years I've created a space where the un-housed and their advocates can tell their own stories. In the last few months alone, I've interviewed unhoused parents, immigrants, mutual aid organizers, veterans, the LGBTQTIA plus community, and the policymakers who make the laws that impact the unhoused existence. Whedian Houses a two-time Webby and Signal Award-winning show with many

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You have such a natural talent for business. Have you ever been like, I'm done with that? And what do you think you'd do instead? Oh, so I'd say there have definitely been times where I've considered walking away. Not recently and not since I've kind of got my life balance a little bit more on track and therefore like moved away from burnout and um you know there are still little bits and times where I'm like for fuck sake but I do genuinely absolutely love what I do and I feel very privileged to be able to do what I do and also I've built my career I've like kind of reverse

engineered my career towards exactly what I want it to be like I kind of fell into being an influencer at the one point and then was like this is I do not like again massive privilege but it's like I do not like the day to day of this I do not like needing to to be liked in order for my career to be working like doing well. I do not like needing to show my personal life for my career to be doing well, all of these things. And so literally built myself an office job in the businesses. And like so I do think that I've like my job is made for me. Like it's very tailored to me. Um, which I feel very lucky for, for about because of, all of. There is luck involved. There, there'll be luck. Baby be lucky.

Baby-luffy, yes, sometimes yes. But I think that the, you know, it absolutely takes it, it's tall. And I think that there have, you know, there have honestly been so many times where I'm like, what, why have I, like, why? Why did I need to make it so hard for myself? Just because, like, there's not really a reason to take it this far. Like, why four businesses? Why not one business?

You know, why, like, why did you need to do this? But I think realistically, as I've said, it's all built. for me and it's all been built around me. Like I've built it that way. And I feel very fortunate to, like I think one of the biggest privileges in life is being able to do work that you love and that you genuinely love because like everyone needs to work or most people need to work to be able to actually enjoy it and feel like you are day to day able to use your brain and kind of engage in the way you want to and be able to make my mind. from it. Like, I feel like that's very, very lucky.

It's such a good reminder as well. Yeah. And so yes and no, you'll probably find me some days where I'm like, yeah, absolutely, I need to get out of here. Back to the choir I go. Yeah, exactly. Broadway and I'm coming. Yeah. I like something that you mentioned before, which is, you know, you've spent your entire adult life online at this point. How do you keep parts of you just for you? You've obviously made a conscious decision about that in many ways. Yeah. So as I kind of alluded to then, I made a decision at one point to basically decide I was like, I'm not going to be an influencer, which you could absolutely still put me in that box now. I probably wouldn't though, to be honest. Thank you. I don't know. I think that like the

as a tangent, like the negative correlate, the negative kind of connotations of influencer is very much directly correlated to the fact that it is one of the only industries where women outperform. Oh yeah. And make more money than men and all of that. I don't think influencer is a bad term, but if it's not what your job title is. Yeah, no, no, of course. But as in like, I think that, like, I try and get comfortable with the fact that, like,

technically it is what I'm doing and, you know, certain areas. And, like, probably the only reason we have these negative connotations around it is because women outperform in that area. And therefore, naturally, it's easy. It must be easy. It must not be worth anything. And it must be so easy and it must be all of these different things. Anyway, um, I, um, I,

kind of decided that that wasn't for me in that I didn't enjoy the day to day, as I said. So I built myself, you know, I deleted all my videos off YouTube overnight and kind of that was where my main earnings were. I stopped really posting properly online

for like two, three years. And concentrated on building businesses. I was like, I want to build these into what can actually sustain me and the team as a job. So doubled down on that. And I think that, that, you know, that has enabled me to be in the fortunate position where I don't need to share

anything that I don't want to share in order to make income. And so I feel like I'm in the nice position now where I can share what I'd like to share and what I find would be helpful to share and feel happy doing so. And I feel much more happy doing so knowing that there is no obligation. Yeah. And so I think that actually has I don't know, probably in a weird way recently, like some people over the past few years have been like, oh, I think you're sharing more. And I was like, yeah, no, I probably am

because I don't feel like backed against a wall in a way where I'm like, oh, God, I've got to give you this vulnerability so that you actually like me. Like, it's an exchange. Oh, yeah. And I don't want that. Like, I don't want to need to give you all of the five bad things that are happening in my life for you to give me basic human respect.

Yeah. And so I think that I'm, I guess, in a happy place around that now. It's organic. With that in mind, there has been things that you have shared online that are very, very personal. And it's obviously come from an organic place for you to share it, including a miscarriage you had last year. Did you think about not sharing that? Yeah, absolutely. And I didn't share it for a good while after it happened not a good while, like a few months. Yeah, wow. And I think that I was driven by a few reasons for sharing it.

I think that, like, one part of it was, like, definitely, and I wouldn't stand by this. This is a good reason for sharing. But I definitely, like, it was meant to be a really intense work month, and I still worked a lot. But I think that, like, I just hadn't been myself and hadn't, like, done things to the best of my ability that month. And so I kind of felt like I was like, oh, by the way, guys, this is why I've been so shit. But that wasn't the main reason for sharing. the main reason was more the fact that I found it so insane how there was so much taboo around it and how it was automatically like you're pregnant, yay, oh, you miscarried, oh, let's not talk about that.

Like, that is, the blame is on the woman, the kind of, I don't know, the onus for everything that's on the woman. The taboo is on them. They mostly can't tell their workplace because there's still loads of associations around it and they don't know if they're actually going to get the support and if that's just going to make them feel even shitter. and whether it's something that they even want to say because then their employer knows they're trying for a baby like all of these different things. And I kind of just wanted to talk about it because it was actually so fucking hard to go through

that I just was like, I can't believe that this in any way is made to be, like, made out to be, not necessarily like my fault, but kind of like, we shouldn't talk about it, because it might embarrass other people or it might make people feel awkward. And I even had that from like some people quite close to me when I was like

never even like saying the word or acknowledging the thing or even like asking how I was. Like it was very, you know? And I just thought, God, that's crazy. Like people for years and years, decades, haven't said anything about it ever. Because it's just a taboo subject. And I just thought, I don't like taboo subjects that are taboo and create. shame for the woman when there's no reason for it. And it's like this final frontier of grief almost that we are yet to really have any good language for speaking about. Like we don't have

great language for talking about grief in other areas or mental health in other areas or anything. But for this one, it does feel like really you don't see anybody talk about it. Yeah. And that must have been really scary for you to step into and be like, if I don't see anybody talking about it, how are people going to react? Yeah, no, absolutely. And I think that I do believe that when you have a platform, you do actually have some sort of responsibility to, well, you have more propensity to make the world a place that you would want it to be.

So you have a sort of responsibility to, okay, well, no, you don't need to share things that you don't want to share like that. I don't think is owed to the general public. But I do think that if you can do something to make the world a place, that's more reflective of the place that you'd want it to be, then, like, why not? And so, yeah, it was a decision at the time because I wanted to, I wanted it to be something where you can say that without, like, I felt like I couldn't even say it without, like, ruining someone else's day. And I was just like, I get that. But at the same time, like,

if I need to disclose this to you for some reason, I need to not go into overdrive of like, oh, I'm so sorry, but it's also fine. It's fine. You know, like, you don't get, you know, It's okay and it's like, that's really difficult. And every time you swallow it, it's like, I'm so worried about burdening this person one time. And it's like, and I burden myself every day. Yeah. Every single day. Were you worried about a particular kind of reaction?

Was there one that scared you the most that people might have? I think I, because it was so fresh in terms of like emotions. And I think it, you know, it will be for a long time. I think I was, I'm always worried about like the internet having like fuel with which to, you know, throw at you when is. desired. So like, for example, I did a post a few weeks later that was like talking about the risk of reform coming into power in the UK and the different impacts that would have on essentially society in like various different ways. And someone commented on that being like, you should be concentrating more on keeping your babies alive than talking about this,

which I'm laughing about. Obviously, it's an abhorrent comment. But it's also so outrageous that I was literally like, I literally saw it while having breakfast with my husband, and I literally like choked. And I was like, oh my God, you're not going to believe this. And I was just like, to be fair, as you can tell, like that type of thing doesn't really affect me because you've got to be so fucked up

for that to actually make it anywhere out of your keyboard, like for you to be pressing your brain cells. Even your brain, like, unless that's a violent, intrusive thought that you literally cannot keep under control, like the fact that you've now put, that onto paper and like got that out is just I have to feel so sorry for you because you must be so miserable and I know people say that it's like they must be miserable they must be miserable it's like I don't believe that all online commentary must be from people who are miserable but it's literally

like wow like wow you must be so hurt inside about like I don't know who didn't listen to you when yeah like wow I almost see that as like sociopathy no yeah I genuinely want this person I want to them in a little cage and we'll just, like, what's wrong with you? Yeah, literally. Let's have a look around. Like, that's, that's a, I actually, very few things leave me speechless. Oh, that was, I was, I was just like, what was your husband's reaction? Because yours was like, oh my God, was he just like, he was quite angry about it. He was like how, I think, I mean, he'd obviously gone through it as well. I think he'd, you know, seen me going through that and then was like, fucking hell. Like, that is terrible. But I thought it was so.

bad that I actually found it hilarious. Like, as in, like, I send it to some of my friends and I was like, oh, my God. And my friends were sending me paragraphs back. Like, this person is like, blah, blah, blah. And I was like, guys, I'm laughing. Yeah. As in like, I'm literally laughing. Because you can't go that.

It's a horseshoe. Like, come on. Yeah. So deranged. That is just like, you actually, like, you have more problems than I have if you are sending that message. Anonymous account? Probably.

Yeah. Probably like Psalms 13 in the diet. Yeah, literally. Love thy neighbor. sorry not to laugh at the end of what was a heavy conversation sorry in listening song voice shit

done it again done it again something you're going to be thinking about yeah I know I'm going to go home and be like dang it sorry not to not to make you feel I just think that comment's crazy and you're expecting again now and I get so many questions about becoming a mother in your 20s I haven't had that experience yet

and I don't actually get to talk to many people who had. So what is surprising you most about that whole chapter in your life from finding out you were pregnant for the first time to now carrying your second child? I think what's been surprising me most generally is like how outrageous and varied and intense all the different symptoms of pregnancy are that are 100% kept under wraps for a reason. And I would have 100% still decided that I wanted a baby and that I wanted to be pregnant. But at the same time, like, the fine print is not clear. And I... I think we, like, again, it's like, our sex education for women is so terrible.

Sorry, I'm not crying. It's acid reflux. I want more sex. The roller coaster. I want more sick. Like, the sex education for women and actually probably more for girls is like so, so terrible and so fixated on like, don't have sex, don't get pregnant. Like, okay, well, what about when we're talking about, like, if you choose to get pregnant,

or you find yourself in a situation where you are pregnant, like what's actually happening, what are all the different symptoms? Like there are some fucked symptoms that are absolutely kept from you. Like, the, I think it's the average woman ended up with 3.1 decade teeth after pregnancy. What?

The baby just takes all the nutrients from you. Or your calcium, everything. Like everything from you. There's like all sort, like, your ab split in half. Sometimes they'll have to be surgically put back together. But like all of this, I honestly think I'm anti-PR for pregnancy. and I don't mean to be that way, because I do think that, like, if you would like to be pregnant, then hopefully you're able to get pregnant.

I also do just think that it is presented to women as, A, a necessity, be a kind of, well, this is just the way it is. And mark my words, if the symptoms were on the other gendered foot, there would be better research, there would be better medication, there would be better management. all of these different things. There would probably be paid pregnancy leave, like all of these different things. I just think it's not been made clear. And I think that anyone who wants to have a child would still decide to do so. It's just that there is not a lot of well-spread educational information. So I'd say that's the biggest shock in case it's not clear by my general demeanor. It's like people will climb the mountain, but they should know what's on the mountain first. They're still wanting to get to the top. Like, I still would have done it. But at the same

time, like, you don't need to be lying to me about, like, all the things I'm going to go through. And of course, that is somewhat our responsibility to find out. But at the same time, like, it's a major medical event that's essentially considered just, well, yeah, you're a girly pop. Yeah. Sorry, don't have any teeth anymore. Well, exactly. The baby took them. Yep. That's crazy. My boyfriend went to the movies the other day, and he came back and he was like, white-faced. he was like, do you know that women poop themselves when they give birth? And I was like, yeah, he goes, 75% of them do. Yeah.

And I was like, yeah, I know. And he was like, they need to tell more people about that. And I was like, that's what the ad was for. That's also the least of the problems. I was going to say, I know, he went on a whole Google page and I was like, and this is why that's important as well. Because often the burden is on you experiencing it as a mother. Women around you hearing those feeling scared.

never like men, just knowing the woman's experience? Well, it's slightly tied to that. I was part to say read an article. I watched a TikTok, right, the other day? Thank you for your honesty. It was very, very interesting. And it was essentially about the research gap between men and women when it comes to parenting and why it creates default parenthood

and why it creates, therefore, like, essentially the uneven society in which we operate where women are expected to take on a significant amount of unpaid labor in comparison to men, particularly when it comes to things like parenting, but also housework and all of this. And it was essentially just saying how like women, because pregnancy is happening to them, will take on the burden of education around birth, around pregnancy, around parenting, around like babies' health, all of these different things. And then they take on that burden. And that naturally isn't replicated in the men because pregnancy isn't happening to them.

Like, ideally they would see it as such if their partner is pregnant, but it's actually not naturally the case. even I'd expect in some progressive relationships and therefore there is this research gap which means that by the time you have the baby the woman spends a lot of time educating the man and maybe correcting on certain things like oh you're meant to support the head

or you're meant to do this or like whatever it might be which results in the default parent becoming the mum despite the fact that you both had a baby at the same time and this obviously naturally then goes around in circles in terms of who does more parenting child care like all of these different things and I think that's so interesting again because it's like pregnancy is seen as a women's issue and it's not advertised thoroughly

at all regardless. So what are we going to do about it? So what are we going to do about? Well, Grace is going to make some TikToks. That's what are we going to do about. Like, Grace is going to make everyone hear about it. I can't remember what that meme was, but it was like being the opposite of someone who suffers in silence. Like you will be forced to, or like, you know, quiet interest or all of that. Like, you will be forced to hear about what I'm interested in and what I'm reading about. Yeah. I'm afraid. I want men to make those TikToks as well. I feel like, I just think that would be just so valuable to be like, here's what I'm learning. I know. I want to find some. I like them. I like to repost them. Good on you. She's finding the good five. Yeah, exactly.

I'm Ruby Carr, the host of the podcast, Encore. Check out our brand new episodes featuring music from the show that everyone is reheating as we speak. Heated rivalry. Join me as I go behind the songs that brought Shane and Elia together. I'll tell you the stories of Fice, My moon my man, wolf parades, I'll believe in anything, and tattoos all the things she said, and how they all became a part of this global phenomenon. Stream encore on IHeart Radio, crave, or wherever you get your podcasts. What's up, fam? I'm sports journalist Ari Chambers. Hey, what's up y'all? It's your girl, Sam J.

And we're the host of everyone watches women's sports, a new podcast from Together in IHeart women's sports. Because let's be real. Women's sports is giving us way too much to talk about these days. The highlights, the rivalries, the breakout stars, the moments to take over your entire timeline. And the conversations that start during the game and somehow keep going all week. Every week we're breaking down the biggest stories across women's sports. We'll give you our takes, our debates, and probably a few disagreements. We'll talk to athletes, celebrate big moments and get into what's happening on and off the field, court, track, and beyond. Because we're not just interested in what happened.

We're interested in why everyone's talking about it. Because everyone watches women's sports. So if you're already a fan, or you're just getting into the game, there's a seat for you right here. Listen to everyone watches women's sports. On the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast.

I'm Munga shit together, and I'm back with a new season of the podcast, Skyline Drive. This time I'm diving into a rabbit hole of peptides, organoids, blood boys, blue zones, and brain replacement to try to understand what this longevity obsession is all about. And what it really means to live forever. for all of us.

I learned about some rad science. I can make a brain for you, and then we can test what draw is the best for your brain, as opposed to his brain. Here are some hard truths. I would expect Indians to age faster, but I did not expect it to be almost a four-to-five-year acceleration. And get myself into a world of trouble.

I'd say probably start bones smashing, That doesn't work. Make it look more defined. They say it works. I don't know. Listen to Skyline Drive How to Live Forever on the IHeart Radio app,

Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Mainstream media is full of cruel depictions of The Un-Housed, stories that shame and blame and paint the Un-Housed as a monolith. We The Un-House is the podcast that's changing that. I'm Theo Henderson,

creator, and host. And for years, I've created a space where the unhoused and their advocates can tell their own stories. In the last few months alone, I've interviewed unhoused parents, immigrants, mutual aid organizers, veterans, the LGBTQTIA plus community, and the policymakers who make the laws that impact the unhoused existence. William Houses a two-time webby and signal award-winning show with many exciting guests on the horizon.

Tune in this week for my interview with Dr. Jill Wichor. A street doctor turned influencer whose work with the unhoused community has made a huge impact online and in her community. Listen to Wey and Housed on the IHard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. This is Michael Rappaport, and my podcast,

the I Am Rapaport Stereo Podcast, is unlike anyone you've ever heard. We're a variety show, and if you're looking for strong opinions, funny opinions about sports, entertainment, politics, pop culture, whatever else catches my attention, then subscribe now. This kid Jafar Jackson is as good as Rami Malik as Freddie Mercury,

and it's as good as Timothy Chamalais as Bob Dylan. And I say that with love and respect for both of those actors. And I don't know how many Oscar nominations they give out, I don't know if it's five, six for best actor. 150% this kid Jafar Jackson should absolutely positively get nominated for his portrayal as Michael Jackson. Listen to I Am Rap Report on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. I am Rapaport podcast. I have two more questions for you about motherhood and then one more question. So that's three.

Three more questions. You're good about it. I know. Thank you. Another thing on my resume. You're having a girl. What are you most excited to do with her? I don't know.

I think one of my biggest life aims. And I think this maybe surprises people because I think we do group particularly women into boxes. You're like, you're a career woman or you're like a mumsy woman or you're like this. But like my biggest like aim in life is to have a close-knit loving family. Like that is just like my driving force and I feel very excited about the opportunity of building that with my husband and building it to be exactly what we have hoped. And I have no doubt that it's going to be very, you know, there are going to be many things that don't go to plan. But at the same time, like, I just can't wait. Like I can't wait for my life to get a bit smaller for a while.

I really, I think I've concentrated for a very long time on not making my life as big as possible, because that's not been the driving force, but like reaching everything I want to reach in life and like kind of really working so hard to get there. And of course I'll continue to do so. Like I feel very strongly about being very open about the fact that I will be going back to working full time. And I think that it's insane that anyone who would know me or see what I've done be, surprised at the fact that I will have child care or the fact that I will, you know, be working on any of these things. But I just think that like, I really can't wait for the concentration just to be a little bit simpler. And like I just know, like, all I care about generally is as much as, you know,

I care about work and all of this. Like, that's kind of one side. The main things I care about are like relationships and the people around me. And I just can't wait to. build our little. Oh, little family. I actually saw this quote from Steve Kroll, I think you'll love, which is he was talking about how when he had a kid, he was like, everything in my professional life got easier. Because speaking of failure, he was like, I didn't care if they didn't like me or if I failed because I had all this to grow home to.

Oh my God, I'm so excited for you. I want to finish the episode with this question, which is, what is one piece of advice you have for people in their 20s? that we haven't spoken about today. So much. There's so much I want to say. Can I split them up? You can do as many as you want.

I feel like you are a treasure for an hour. So we're going to start part two now. Okay, career-wise, I think that there's a lot of focus right now on getting as far as you can in your 20s and being as big as you can in whatever sense that might be. So, for example, if it is impressive in your industry to be freelance rather than to be within a company, there's such a rush to get there. There's such a rush to like get those accolades or establish those things that make you be taken more seriously. I honestly could not recommend enough and I wish I'd done more of this. Learning as much as you can on employers' money. Like upskilling, trying new jobs, working in different types of teams, talking to as many. people as possible about their jobs. Like, your career is much longer than it's made out to be on TikTok. And that's not me kind of patronising and saying like you, but like that is a lot of the

media we're consuming and we're seeing, you know, success looks like this at 30. Your career is going to be a hell of a lot longer than 30. And if you want to enjoy it and have longevity and all of that, the more you can do to truly learn as much as possible and to put yourself in. And to put yourself in, like what about imagining an amazing life at 40, 50, 60? That might not be about working all the time, but how are you going to get there? Is it going to be jumping ship at 23 when actually you don't know enough to do that? No, I believe so strongly that we're,

it's very glamourized online to sell a certain dream around a certain type of career and actually the best careers are built over time based on accumulating expertise and contacts and network overall. and skills and passions. And so focus on that rather than like a big shiny title or a big move to freelance rather than employed or whatever it might be for your industry. I think that's very important career side

and I think that's often missed. Then on the other side, general life, I just think that I don't let anyone make you feel like you're behind. Again, we have such a focus on like 30 under 30, you know, your life ending then, like all of this, I'm so fucking excited to turn 30. Like, there's so much I'm looking forward to that I just, like, I think this 20s is like a hot pot of kind of just being thrown in there and be like, achieve as much as possible and like find out who you are and like make some friends and falling up and get married and

have a baby and like all of these different things. And it's just like, again, life is long, hopefully. And like, you're just at the beginning of it. Like, don't let other people's need to rush make you rush. Because I think as well that we have like this warped perception of time. And if you're aiming to do X, Y, Z by 30, then, okay, you get to 30 and then what? Like, what happens then? Don't give yourself that like Olympic gold medal syndrome where you're working towards all these things or you're like just staying in a relationship because you don't want to be single at 30.

And then you get to 30. Okay, now what? You're pushing for another year and another year and another year. You're only at 34. So, like, as in like, start thinking long term. and start thinking about what you actually enjoy and what you want your life to look like rather than what you want other people to perceive it as. Oh, I love that advice.

Thank you. Especially as somebody whose career is dead at 30. Psychology of your 20s. Oh, my God. What are we going to do? What have you done? I know, I really screwed the preach on that one. Thank you so much for such wonderful, wonderful advice and such wonderful candor.

You're genuinely just a delightful person to talk to. Oh, thank you so much. That's very kind. As are you. Thanks, girl. I honestly think that when people have a sudden, I'm going to give you one more compliment. Are you ready? Yeah, yeah.

Then you can go out. I really do think that you see somebody online and you're like, oh, they seem really nice. And there's always, I don't have this feeling, but there's always a thing of like, I wonder if they're like that in real life. And it's like, you are somebody I can say for people listening who are a fan of grace, like 100% like that, if not better in person. You just have such, you just exude such a brilliance. So I appreciate you coming on the psychology of your 20s.

Thank you for having me. You and the baby. Me and the baby. The first baby on the podcast. What do you have to say for yourself? Just acid reflux. I'm going to leave everything in the description where to listen to working hard, where to buy a piece of Tala's workout gear.

I honestly swear by it. Your cinch singlet tops. Oh, yeah. That's so amazing. I have like three colors, brown, black, blue, if you want to buy my wardrobe. I will leave. Shout my wardrobe. And yeah, everything else that we can find you at.

As always, guys, thank you for listening. If you've made it this far, leave a little baby emoji in the Spotify comments down below to wish grace. Congratulations and good luck on her, on entering motherhood. Impending birth. I know. I didn't want to be like, on impending birth. And as always, you can also watch episodes like this on Netflix. You can follow us on Instagram, substack.

It's all going to be down there. But until next time, be safe, be kind. Be gentle to yourself. We will talk very, very soon. Hey, Portlandia fans. Carrie Brownstein and Fred Armisen here. The Dream of the 90s is alive in podcast form. We're launching Podlandia, AEO rewatch,

our brand new podcast where we revisit every episode of Portlandia together, breaking down sketches, going deep on our iconic characters, and pulling back the curtain on how it all got made. And we'll also be joined by the people who helped bring it all to life. Guest stars, collaborators and friends, including director Jonathan Chrysall, the mayor himself, Kyle McLaughlin, legendary musician Amy Mann, and many more.

Kyle is going. going for it here. You fully improvised, not just words, but a song. Well, I thought you're all going to write a song. I remember you thinking that. Listen to Podlandia. A.O. rewatch starting July 16th on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Mangishatigula, and I'm back with a new season of my podcast, Skyline Drive. This time I talked to scientists, biopunks, curmudgins, blues owners, super seniors, and Goa's top cryotherapy lab to try to understand this. obsession with living forever and what it means for all of us. And I get into a bit of trouble along the way.

I'd say probably start bone smashing. That doesn't work. Make it look more defined. They say it works. I don't know. Listen to Skyline Drive, How to Live Forever on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. This is Michael Rappaport, and my podcast, the I Am Rapaport Stereo Podcast, is unlike anyone you've ever heard.

If you're looking for strong opinions about sports, entertainment, politics, pop culture and whatever else catches my attention, then subscribe now. This kid Jafar Jackson should absolutely positively get nominated for his portrayal as Michael Jackson. Listen to I Am Rap Report on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. For years, the Unhouse has been presented as a monolith in mainstream media. Weedian House is a podcast that's changing the narrative. I'm Theo Henderson, and I created this show why I was unhoused on the streets of Los Angeles. We've grown into a two-time Webby Award-winning podcast, the only podcast that shares unhoused stories and news from the unhoused perspective.

Listen to Wey and Housed on the IHard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. We've all been there. We've had seasons that have shaken everything. The question is, what remains? remains when the shaking stops. Hi, I'm Gary Valenzheno. And on my podcast, Unshaken with Gary Vee, I sit down with amazing personalities and we talk about the seasons that nearly broke them,

the lows that carried them to their highs. Listen to Unshaken with Gary Vee on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an IHeart podcast. Guaranteed Human. Thank you.