The Questlove Show - Historical Records: Claudette Colvin (feat. Roxane Gay)

Episode Date: December 20, 2024

Nimene creates a stirring hip-hop track about the civil rights activist Claudette Colvin, who, as a teenager, refused to give up her seat on an Alabama city bus months before Rosa Parks’ famous protest. Featuring an interview between New York Times bestselling author Roxane Gay and a 6 year old named Stella.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-heart podcast, guaranteed human. A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what you're saying. Yep, that's me, Clivert Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, my basketball and college football journey, or my career in sports media. Well, now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast,

The Clifers Show. This is a place for raw, unfills of conversations with athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. So let's get to it. Listen to the Clifford show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok podcast network on TikTok. This week on the Sports Slice podcast, it's all about the NFL draft. And we've got a special guest.

The director of the NFL's East West Shrine Bowl, Eric Galco, joins the Sports Slice podcast to break down what really matters when evaluating draft prospects. From hidden traits teams look for to the biggest mistakes franchises make to the players flying under the radar. This is the insight you won't hear anywhere else. If you want to understand the draft like an insider, you don't want to miss this episode. Listen to the Sports Slice podcast on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Slical Life 12 and TikTok podcast network on TikTok. In 2023, Bachelor star Clayton Eckerd was accused of fathering twins. But the pregnancy appeared to be a hoax. You doctored this particular test twice Ms. Owens, correct?

I doctored the test once. It took an army of internet detectives to uncover a disturbing pattern. Two more men who'd been through the same thing. Greg, a lesbian. Michael Mancini. My mind was blown. I'm Stephanie Young. This is Love Trapped.

Laura, Scottsdale Police. As the season continues, Laura Owens finally faces consequences. Listen to Love Trapped podcast on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, what's up y'all? This is Questlove. Get ready to check out an episode of historical records, executive produced by myself and the story Pirates. It's an explosive fusion of hip-hop and history, tailor-made for music-loving kids and families. You're that correctly, something the entire family can listen to and enjoy together.

In this episode, Host Nimini creates a hip-hop track about the civil rights activist Claudette Colvin, who, as a teenager, refused to give up her seat on an Alabama City Bus months before Rosa Parks' famous protest. Get your kids. Sit back and enjoy historical records. The show that proves that in order to make history, you have to make some noise. Neminine. I'm here in my top secret underground bunker. As usual, I'm with my team of sound engineer raccoons. Tina, don't be rude. Say hello.

Now, follow me, everyone. And just a heads up, I walk very quickly. Some say that the way I walk is nearly running, but we have no time to waste. Because today's historical figure is Claude Ed Colvin. Luckily, the conditions for historical research are perfect. It's a beautiful day inside my top secret underground bunker. It might even be a beautiful day outside my top secret underground bunker. To be honest, I wouldn't know. I haven't been outside in weeks.

What? You want me to go outside right now? Wow. Tina, when you're right, you're right. Going outside is critical for my mental health. We have a lot to do, but I sure take a quick moment to look outside and feel the sun on my face. Okay, I'll just peek out this emergency exit and... Ah!

The alarm has been trapped! Why did I do that? To make history, you got to have struggle. To make history, you got to show boys cannot be quiet, loud as a riot. To make history, gotta make some noise. Listeners, welcome back to historical records where we conduct highly experimental experiments combining history and hip-hop. Today's episode is about the trailblazing civil rights activist Claudette Colvin. Also, I just tripped the alarm.

The alarm has been tripped. There may be an intruder. No, no, no, there's no intruder. It was me. I cannot take your word for it. Oh, come on, disembodied robot voice. Please reset my system in one minute, or the authorities will be called. Oh, no, I hate bureaucracy. Also, one minute?

That's not a lot of wiggle room, and I don't even know where to turn off the security system. Tito, what are we going to do? Wait, we have a security sensor. I passed it yesterday. That must be where we have to turn this thing off. If I'm remembering correctly, it's directly below us about 40 stories down. Come on, raccoons. We'll take the stairs. You're right. We won't get there fast enough.

We'll jump down the garbage chute and it'll take us straight there. Raccoon, you go first. Now, to fold myself in half and fit into the garbage chute. Oh, that's nice. Tima, how nice is this? Am I right? Okay, no time. turn this thing off. You have 20 seconds to reset the system. Ah! All right. Let's open up the breaker and see what we're working with.

Oh, no, that is a lot of plugs and wires. Recommendation, do not unplug the wrong wire. Not good. Tina, any ideas? I got you, honey. Mama? What are you doing here? Well, sweetie, for one, I thought I helped you turn off the alarm. Trust me, you do not want to deal with all that paperwork. You're right about that.

I just got to pull out the right plug. Huh, I did not see this coming. Mama, you sure you know which one to pull? It's this one, I think. Successful shutdown. Now give me a second. I got to boot it back up. We don't want any intruders getting in here.

System reset. Intruders don't stand a chance. Mama, how in the world did you know how to do that? Honey, I set up the whole security system. You did? Yes. You had a lot on your plate at the time. Okay, I want to hear way more about that.

But right now, I'm running a little behind, and I have to track down one of my historians. Of course. I'll see you later, okay, Mom? Bye, honey. I'm proud of you. Listeners, keep up with me. We're walking to the library.

And while we're on the move, I need to level with you. The good news is that I have a truly sick beat lined up for today. The slightly less good news is that I really do not know much about today's historical figure. I mean, I know Claudette Colvin was a part of the civil rights movement fighting for equal rights for black people in America, but obviously I need more than that. And here we are at the gigantic library. Gosh, I love it in here. So now we just need to find Lee so she can give us some historical help. Help! That was a weird echo that sounded nothing like me. Anyway, like I was saying, because I don't have enough info right now, I guess you could say I'm stuck. I'm stuck. Okay,

I can't be the only one hearing that bad echo that sounds nothing like my voice. Nimini, I'm not an echo. It's me, Lee. I'm trapped under a giant book. Whoa! Look at the giant book! I'm coming! One, two, three.

L! Ew! Oh, that is much better. Lee, I know you like to bury your head in a book, but that was a bit much. It was actually really informative until the emotional weight of history and the actual weight of that huge book became too much. Oh, anyway, are you ready to immerse yourself in history? As long as you don't mean trapping ourselves under that book?

Absolutely. Well, then step into the history simulator. Lee, with respect, I wish the history simulator didn't look like a gooey alien pod. I'll consider that feedback for my next simulator. Okay, where are we hitting? To see a very brave young woman who refuses to give up her seat on the bus. Claudec Colvin. Wait, wait, wait.

I thought that was Rosa Parks. Rosa Parks refused to give a proceed, but Claudette Colvin did it first. Well, that's a twist. I had no idea. You know what? Before we go visit Claudette Colvin, let's bop around a bit. Get the full context. I like it.

1964, here we come. You bet we are. Those four dudes in suits. Those four dudes are the Beatles. And this is their USA Day Day. On the Ed Sullivan Show. There was so much exciting stuff at this time. You gotta warn me when we're taking off, Lee.

Also, where are we now? Not just any spaceship, the first one to ever land on the moon. Um, actually, Houston, hold on a second. It seems a weird alien pod just appeared on our spaceship. Uh, whoops, we gotta go. Nimini, we're taking off to March 25th, 1965. Whoa! Lee, this crowd we're in is huge.

There must be 25,000 people. And we appear to be marching toward that official-looking building. Incredible guess, Nimini. There are 25,000 people. And that building is the Alabama State Capitol in Montgomery. Hmm. Why do I feel like we're witnessing one of the biggest moments of activism in the civil rights movement? Because we are...

You see, four days ago, about 3,000 people had gathered in Selma, Alabama, 54 miles away, and began the march to the Capitol. That's a long march. And you're saying most of this crowd joined the march along the way? Yeah. For four days, people came out all along the march route, dressed in their Sunday best to sit on their porches

and wave at the marchers, cheering with support and admiration. And at each town, more marchers of all ages join the group, waving American flags, and making front page headlines in the newspapers. And once this huge crowd gets to the Capitol, What do they do?

They're going to deliver a petition signed by black voters demanding an end to discriminatory voting registration practices. Wait, so you mean to tell me that even though black people have the right to vote in 1964, some people would still try to stop them from voting? Exactly. Many states would use racist strategies like intentionally confusing and misleading literacy tests to prevent black voters from successfully registering. That's horrible. It was, which is why activists were organizing and fighting to draw attention to their cause. And luckily, this march did just that. It did, but even that was a struggle.

The first two times they attempted a march to Montgomery, they were met with violent resistance from hecklers and state police. Awful images broadcast on black and white TVs, shocked people in households across the country, and even motivated the president to provide U.S. Army troops and the Alabama National Guard to protect the marchers on their third attempt. It sounds like it took so much organizing and fighting. Um, is that Martin Luther King, Jr. giving a speech? Indeed it is. Oh, I know this part.

Oh, and it gives me chills every time. This is where Dr. King says, I come to say to you this afternoon, however difficult the moment, however frustrated in the hour, it will not be long because truth crust to earth will rise again. How long?

Not long, because no lie can live forever. How long? Not long because you shall reap what you sow. How long? Not long. Because the arc of the moral universe is long, but it bends toward justice. Wow, Nimini.

You really know that speech. Mm, absolutely. I have the whole thing memorized. But where does Claudette? Colvin come into this? And how did a southern city like Gumry, Alabama, become the center for the civil rights movement? Phenomenal questions. Let's stay in Montgomery, but go back a little further and take a look. I don't know where we are, but I don't know when we are. And why are black and white people drinking from different water fountains over there? It's 1955. 10 years before the voting rights

march, a time when people were separated by the color of their skin. This is called segregation, and according to a set of laws called Jim Crow laws that have been around since the end of the Civil War, it's legal. That's about 100 years of laws invented to make life harder for Black Americans. There are separate drinking fountains, elevators, hospitals, bathrooms, bathrooms and break rooms, swimming pools, churches, lunch counters. The list goes on and on. And buses. Black Americans were forced to sit in the back of buses. And in Montgomery, 40,000 black residents ride the buses. That's 75% of the total riders in the city. And yet they are legally forced to enter through the overcrowded back door of the bus, sit in the back seats, and give up their seats for

any white passengers who want to sit down. But if we're in 1955, didn't the federal government at least order schools to be integrated in 1954? Everyone should be allowed to go to school together, right? Absolutely. That's what the law said. But the reality, in Montgomery and almost everywhere in the South is that some white people were still fighting to keep people apart. And the school's black children are forced to attend are almost

always the least funded with the poorest quality supplies, books, and classrooms. How are those kids supposed to learn? Luckily, there's an organization called the N-A-CP, the National Association for the Advancement of Colored People. The branch here in Montgomery was the first in all of

Alabama and was founded way back in 1913. Cool! I know about the NAACP. Their goal is to educate and organize folks in the community to fight back against segregation and other types of discrimination so that black people can get the respect and opportunities they deserve. Precisely, and recognizing the needs of black children in Montgomery, the NACP started a youth group, and guess who they put in charge of shaping young minds? Rosa Parks? That's right. And what's really wild is that the thing Rosa Parks is most famous for

was actually done by a 15-year-old girl from her youth group. Claudette Colvin. Ha-ha, bingo! Wow! It's all coming together! But Lee, why didn't Claudette Colvin get to be as famous as Rosa Parks? Well, even though she was the first to do it, the movement knew that she was super young and had.

had other things going on, like being a kid. So the movement chose to set up Rosa Parks to be nationally recognized for protesting on a bus. I truly had no idea about all that behind-the-scenes stuff that made the civil rights movement possible. Yeah. Even though Rosa Parks' famous protest seems spontaneous, everything was meticulously planned.

Same with the march to Montgomery. It took several tries and a ton of organization. Thank you, Lee. That was incredibly helpful. I think I have enough information now for the song. Will you take us back to my top secret bunker? Of course. We're back.

Yes. Oh, and I'm late for a recording session. But luckily, I brought my skateboard, helmet, and knee pads, and I'm ready to roll. Bye, Lee. Thank you. Dynamity! Okay, listeners, keep up. We are once again on the move.

Left, right, down instead of stairs. Hop, up, up, hop, hop, hop, hop. Oh yeah, still got it. And here we are. Oh, look, the musicians are ready to go. Time to make another epic, shining song for the ages. And this time, Nemin's on the mic. Claudette, that's my name, Miss.

Alabama, born and racist. Montgomery, to be specific, hope you don't mind these honorifics. 090539, the birth date of a future leader. Civil rights, activist, a catalyst to be. Montgomery Bus Boy got began when me Montgomery bus boycott? That is correct.

A lot of people don't know about this juicy tidbit. Couldn't be the face of the movement because I wasn't rich and because of my complexion. I'm never in the press. Just think I was only 15 following my routine and a segregated seat years after that occurrence. I couldn't find work and I moved to New York and you got into nursing. It began with me.

I almost before rose up and it began with me. Did you know? Did you know? I wouldn't give up my seat. My dad left Mama's wallet was thinning. See, I was born Claude Ed Austin. Then I went to live with my uncle and my aunt and that's how I got the name calling. Had a little sister, E. I was the oldest.

Lost her to polio. God only knows my pain. I was sociologically estranged. Book of T, Washington High School. I started going there in 195. I was in the city, a place I couldn't walk to. So right in the bus is what I had to do. It was 1955. I didn't give up my seat. They called the police and they arrested me. But I had been learning up by my ancestry and then the youth council with the AA-C. So I said, I know my constitutional rights. There is an empty rep. So this isn't right. Jim Crow says black kids

To the cross from the whites, we always gotta be behind them And this I don't like. Pull me off the bus, I didn't fight or bust. I didn't feel fear because I was young and tough. They put me all of my friends went to find my mom And it began with me. Year later we had brought a versus Gail, I was one to five plaintiffs.

Talking about how the law had failed all of us And we wasn't gonna take it at the federal court They made their decision The Supreme Court, they made their decision They said bus segregation was against the Constitution And they ended it permanently and it began Mary Alabama declared March 2nd A win is a win.

A win is a win. I don't care what you're saying. Yep, that's me, Clifford Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes,

creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment, and the next we'll talk about life, mental health, purpose, and even music. The Clifford Show isn't just a podcast, it's a space for honest conversations, stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger. So, if you've ever supported me, or you're just chasing down a dream, this is right where you need to be. Listen to the Clifford Show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or we're

wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok podcast network on TikTok. There's two golden rules that any man should live by. Rule one, never mess with a country girl.

You play stupid games, you get stupid prizes. And rule two, never mess with her friends either. We always say that trust your girlfriends. I'm Anna Sinfield. And in this new season

of the girlfriends, oh my God, this is the same man. A group of women discover they've all dated the same prolific con artist. I felt like I got hit by a truck. I thought, how could this happen to me? The cops didn't seem to care. So they take matters into their own hands. I said, oh, hell no.

I vowed. I will be his last target. He's going to get what he deserves. Listen to the girlfriends. Trust me, babe. On the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Igor. My next guest, you know from Step Brothers Anchorman, Saturday Night Live, and the Big Money Players Network.

It's Will Ferrell. Woo. Woo. My dad gave me the best advice ever. I went and had lunch with them one day, and I was like, and Dad, I think I want to really give this a shot. I don't know what that means, but I just know the groundlings. I'm working my way up through, and I know it's a place that come look for up and coming talent. He said, if it was based solely on talent, I wouldn't worry about you.

which is really sweet. Yeah. He goes, but there's so much luck involved. And he's like, just give it a shot. He goes, but if you ever reach a point where you're banging your head against the wall and it doesn't feel fun anymore, it's okay to quit. If you saw it written down, it would not be an inspiration. It would not be on a calendar of, you know, the cat.

Just hang in there. Yeah, it would not be. Right, it wouldn't be that. There's a lot of luck. Yeah. Listen to Thanks, Dad, on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. That was incredible. And while the circumstances couldn't be more different, it's really got me thinking about my own life.

Funny how history can inform the present, huh, listeners? Hey, Tina! Of course, the personal history room. Where else would she be? Yes, Tina, I know we have an interview lined up in five minutes, but I've got to do something first. Now, do you mind if I borrow your scooter? Me-N-A-N-A-N-A-N-A-N-A-N-A-B-A-B-A-B-A-P-P-A-P-P-H-H-H-E-K-H-E-K-H-E-K-H-E-K-H-E-K-H-E-K-H-E-K-E-K-E-K-E-W-E-E-W-E-W. Oh, it's me as a teenager.

Honey, that's a picture of me. Wow. We really do look alike, huh? Strong jeans, baby. Anyway, Mom. I wanted to ask more about you setting up the security system. I still can't believe you did that. Well, getting a top secret bunker up and running is no small task,

and I was thrilled to be able to pitch in. So I pulled some permits, got the security system running, hired Tina and the other raccoons, and taught them how to use all the sound equipment. Just some behind-the-scenes details. You low-key paved the way for my dream. You're not the first person in this family to love history and hip hop, and I thought your idea to combine them was genius. I had no idea you did so much to make this happen.

In my experience, whenever something big happens, it takes a lot of people to pull it off. I'm learning that, yeah. And not everyone can be the face of a movement. Some people have to set up the security system. Thanks, Mom. I love you. And I really appreciate your support. I love you too.

Oh, look! My old rollerblades. I'll use those to get to the interview. Don't forget your helmet. Here. Great call. Okay, listeners, it's time to go meet two totally extraordinary people. Down the hall, and left, and right.

And avoid the stairs this time by using the elevator. Not sure why I didn't take the elevator before. But, you know, you love and you learn. And speaking of learning, we have arrived at the room where I have video calls. Today, we're meeting two incredible people. Hi, Roxanne and Stella. Can you kick things off by introducing yourselves? My name is Roxanne Gay.

I'm a space cowboy. And, no, I'm just kidding. My name is Roxanne Gay. I am a writer, a teacher, and an editor. My name is Stella Carolina, and I am six years old. My favorite thing in life is TV. Hi, Stella. Stella, what were you hoping to learn from Roxanne about Claudette Colvin?

Why do kids learn about Rosa Parks but not Claudette Colvin? That's a great question, Stella. You know, there are a couple reasons. One, when Claudette Colvin refused to give up her seat to a white woman, she was a teenager. And at the time, and quite frankly, even now, people don't always take kids seriously. So Rosa Parks, when she refused to give up her seat, she was older, she was a professional. She had, you know, the right skin tone. She had the right kind of hair.

And so leaders of the civil rights movement thought that Rosa Parks might be a better person to represent the entire movement. But, you know, that doesn't take away from what Claudette Colvin did. How much has changed with civil rights since Claudette Colvin was a kid? When Claudette Colvin first refused to give up her seat on that bus in Alabama, things were really different. And we still deal with racism and other. forms of bigotry now, but most of the laws that made it possible for Claudette Colvin to be arrested no longer exist. We no longer live, ideally, in a segregated society. Everyone gets to live together and share our communities together. We are more able to point out injustice when we see it. And I'll

tell you what, cell phone cameras have done an incredible amount of good, because now we can provide evidence of the issues that we deal with, particularly with police and other sort of forms of public racism that we see on a day-to-day basis. So things are getting better, but we shouldn't get comfortable because we have so much left to do. Like how much to do? You know, I think about that every single day. Every single day, I wonder like, hmm, is this something we're going to solve in my lifetime? I will say that we have to continued to fight for civil rights until lawmakers can no longer decide which rights were allowed to have. And so right now we have quite a ways left to go.

But at least we know where we're headed. Della, do you have any questions for Roxanne about her work or career? How are you, Roxanne, part of making change now? Well, one of the key things I try to do in my work is to talk about the issues that I find to be most pressing in ways that everyone will be able to connect to. And I always try to bring attention to the people who are taking the really big risks by protesting and sometimes even having to engage with law enforcement and doing some of the really challenging things that can come along with living the life of an activist. How can I be an activist? You know, one of the best ways that you can be an activist,

especially at your age, is to pay attention to the news. And, ask questions about the world and the people that we elect as our leaders and the issues that we should all be caring about. Wow. Does this mean that anyone can be an activist? Anyone can be an activist. All you have to do is care about yourself and other people and the world that we live in. If you do that, you are already well on your way to being an activist. I already do that. Yes. See? I mean, look at you. You're an activist already. And I think that's amazing. I think more people should be willing to be an activist because there are a lot of problems in this world.

And it's going to take all of us to solve them. This has been so great. Thank you both for being here. Thank you for answering all my questions. Well, thank you for asking the questions. It's been just the highlight of my day talking to you, Stella. Thanks for joining in today and for going on a journey with me to learn about the great Claudette Colvin. And a giant thank you to today's guests, Stella and Roxanne Gay.

Remember, parents and teachers, you can download a free activity related to today's episode by visiting storypirates.com slash historical records. We'll be back next week to make another historical record. Until then, remember, to make history, you got to make some noise. Bye! Historical Records is produced in partnership with Story Pirate Studios, Quest Loves 2on5. Entertainment, John Glickman, and IHeart Podcasts. Executive produced by Amir Questlove Thompson,

John Glickman, Lee Overtree, and Benjamin Salka. Executive produced for IHeart Podcasts by Noel Brown. Producers for Story Pirate Studios are Isabella Riccio, Sam Bear, Eric Gerson, Andrew Miller, Lee Overtree, Peter McNerney, and Nimine-Ware. Producers for 215 are Sean G, Brittany Benjamin, and Zara Zolman. hosted by Nimini Ware. Our head writer is Duke Doyle. Our historians are Gabe Pacheco and Lee Polis.

Music supervision for 215 by Stroh Elliott. Scoring and music supervision for Story Pirate Studios by Eric Erson. Sound design and mixing by Sam Bear at the Relic Room in New York City. Song mastering by Josh Hahn. Theme song by Dan Foster and Eric Erson and produced by Eric Erson. Production Coordination by Isabel O'Ricchio. Production Management. by Maggie Lee. The line producer for Story Pirate Studios is Glynis Bralt. PR for Story Pirate Studios is provided

by Naomi Shaw. Episode artwork by Camilla Franklin. This episode was written by Duke Doyle. The song Claudeette Colvin was written by Nimine Weir and produced by Stro Elliott with additional production by Eric Gerson. Special guests, Roxanne Gay, and Kid Interviewer Stella. This episode features performances by Barbara Curran, Tessa Hirsch, Peter McNerney, Lee Overtree, and Lee Polis. Special thanks, J.T. Sue. A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what I'm saying. Yep, that's me, Cliver Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, my basketball and college football journey, or my career in sports media.

Well, now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Cliver Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. So let's get to it. Listen to the Clifford show on the IHeard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok podcast network on TikTok. This week on the Sports Slice podcast, it's all about the NFL draft.

And we've got a special guest. The director of the NFL's East West Shrine Bowl, Eric Galko, joins the Sports Slice podcast to break down what really matters when evaluating draft prospects. from hidden traits teams look for to the biggest mistakes franchises make to the players flying under the radar. This is the insight you won't hear anywhere else. If you want to understand the draft like an insider,

you don't want to miss this episode. Listen to the Sports Slice Podcasts on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Slica Life 12 and TikTok podcast network on TikTok. In 2023, Bachelor star Clayton Eckerd was accused of fathering twins.

But the pregnancy appeared to be a hoax. You doctored this particular test twice, Ms. Owens, correct? I doctored the test ones. It took an army of internet detectives to uncover a disturbing pattern. Two more men who'd been through the same thing. Greg, a lesbian. Michael Mancini. My mind was blown.

I'm Stephanie Young. This is Love Trapped. Laura, Scottsdale Police. As the season continues, Laura Owens finally faces consequences. Listen to a Love Trapped podcast on the Eyehorpe. Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an IHeart podcast. Guaranteed human.