The Questlove Show - Mickey Guyton

Episode Date: June 1, 2026

Black Music Month kicks off in a major way. Mickey Guyton joins Questlove for a deeply personal conversation about carving out space as a Black woman in Country music, from her church roots in Texas to performing on global stages like the Super Bowl and in China. She opens up about her religious upbringing, perfectionism, anxiety, creative burnout, and finding her true audience among marginalized fans who feel seen in her story. Along the way, Mickey and Quest geek out on Brandy, karaoke etiquette, gatekeeping in Country music, and what it really costs to pioneer a lane that didn't exist before.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Our podcast is called Hey Jonas. We've here since everyone has a podcast, we wanted to as well. And we've had some incredible guests so far. And now our good friend, Nile Horn, is joining the show. How's it going, boys? Hey, Niall. It was the same thing with Slow Hands. The whole answer is not about anything else really, is it?

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with our guest today at of all places the Essence Festival. I knew then that I wanted to have her as a guest on the show. Our guest today has definitely created

a lane for herself where I guess one seemingly really didn't exist and one fascinates me about her story is not just you know, all the accolades that she's had, the Grammy nominations, or the TV appearances, the high-profile appearances, magazine covers, yada, yada, yada, yada. But it's the journey

that sometimes the path to finding your voice means that you got to get it, you know, out of your comfort zone and step into a space that wasn't exactly built with you in mind and deciding that you're going to own that space and be there anyway. And that, you know, there's a lot of commonality. I guess I felt commonality, just in my experiences. So I definitely wanted to have this conversation. And her music, especially with songs like Black Like Me, remember her name, of course, sparked.

Conversations that country music basically has been on my sideline view, sort of avoiding. She miraculously hosted the CMAs. ACMs. Oh, ACMs. I'm sorry. Yeah. Is there CMAs?

It's all, they all sound the same. There's ACMs and the CMAs. It's the Academy of Country Music Awards. I did not know the difference for you. Yeah. Okay, I got it. Of course, I was there to watch her sing the National Anthem at the Super Bowl. She's built a global audience.

We're definitely talking about China, something that was not on my bingo card. We're just going to talk about the journey of our guest today, the one and only Mickey Guyton. Thank you for coming on the question. Love show. How are you today? I am so good. You know, I am a huge Questlove fan, so it is an honor to be able to sit here and speak with you. Really, you are a legend in my household. I appreciate that. Thank you so much. So right now, where are you speaking to us from? Are you at home or on the road? Yeah, I'm actually in Los Angeles, California. I'm taking a little bit of break since I've been, I came back from China. So I'm here in Los Angeles, California. you got it okay well i'll just ask and i guess i shouldn't be surprised being as though for the last 30 years i can definitely say that the roots have been like at least in 12 very

specific places like the lincoln center whatever like we're the first yeah the pop act to be there you know you would think like so late in the game like how are the roots playing places that some of these big platinum artists haven't played but i mean surprises abound what in China that is common with what I would know as country culture or just... Absolutely nothing. There is nothing in common. I guess the biggest country song in China is Country Roads, Take Me Home by John Denver. That song, believe it or not, is massive out there.

A lot of people learned English listening to that song. So that song is very endearing to the people out there. But even how I even got out there, I got out there. It's just so random. And I would never, ever, ever do something like this. But it was this show called The Singer. And so I went on it. And it's like basically like master chef, but for musicians.

So it's like professional musicians all over the world, including China. Oh, wait, you're the contesting. You're not the judge. I was not a, I was a contestant. Chante Moore did it the year before me. Wait, what? Yeah, Jesse J did it in 2018. So even established people can...

Yeah, it's the craziest thing. It gives you a whole different audience that you would never be, you know, open to, especially on my side of country music. And that was kind of my reason for doing it. I was like, well, why can't I bring country music out to China? So who presented this opportunity to you? you. They found me. They came to you and said, would you do this? Yes. And at first I was like,

absolutely not. Is this a scam? Is this a scam? Is what I thought it was? Right. I was like, there's no way. Like, what are you talking about? Right. And when I saw that Chatea Moore did it, I was like, you know, why not? Why not? Let me try to do this. Let's see what this is all about. And it was the craziest experience of my life. So what was the results? Did you see an instant change and yeah it's a change and the audience that i was performing for like it gave me a whole different audience to sing for like you can think about it every week i was singing in front of like about 150 million people it was like the super bowl every week it was crazy it was there's so many people in china and there's so many avenues of being heard and i was just trying to find

another additional space to be in front of. And that was my motivation. It's crazy. And it's, I mean, you look at the way the world is going, and especially with a lot of artists in Asia, like you've got the whole K-pop movement that is massive. Like, there's, you know, like, I don't think we paid attention to as much as we should have

to that whole area. And I think every single artist should do that if you have not. You know, on my side of the fence, especially with hip hop, I mean, you know, That's all of Asia's like our third biggest market. Yeah. But I just never, you know, I kind of felt like country music was limited to, in my minds, you know, kind of the Mexican Dixon line.

But it's worldwide. I never knew this. Never knew this. It is not worldwide. You're very much so spot on. It is not worldwide. Like this is uncharted territory, you know? You're pioneering the shit out of this.

Okay. That's good. I guess so. And I've had, you know, people like the CMAs. No other country artists have ever considered doing the show or... I think the one that I could really see being successful out there is like a Casey Musgraves. I'm not sure. I don't have the data to be able to tell you.

I don't know. I just saw it as a huge opportunity for me. I just was like, wow, that's a... And so I did a tour out there, just like a test tour to see what that was like in February. And it was absolutely incredible. Like there's a whole world out there that you can be a part of. And I guess I'm pioneering that too. There you go.

There you go. Could you tell me what your first musical memory is? Man. The very first thing you remember about music and either two, three years old? It was definitely church for me. I remember just being in church and singing in the. angel choir than singing in the celestial choir, that was my very first memory of music. How old were you when you first started singing in the church?

I was probably about five or six. So I think around like six or seven is when I started having memories of church. And what city did you grow up in? I grew up in, so I grew up all around Texas, but Arlington, Texas and Waco, Texas, Moody, Texas, really small towns, that's where I grew up. What are your general memories of childhood? I'd say you go back in time to your earliest days. Like, what are the first things visually that you see? Even if it's the smallest thing, not like going to a fair, just your curtains maybe.

I don't know. Visually, you know, I definitely, my room, my bedroom was a big memory for me. I'm an introvert, so I spent a lot of time in there. Like, that was something I really loved. My grandmas, those are huge memories. Those are a lot of times my first, like, thoughts, like the gravel roads in Crawford, Texas, or the gravel roads driving up to Moody, Texas, that long stretch drive that we would drive to go see my grandma. The roads going to see Riesel, Texas.

Those are a lot of my memories. What was the domestic situation in your house? Are you the only child? Did you have siblings? Oh, yes. I have two siblings. I have three siblings. I've got two sisters and a brother.

Where do you fall in? I'm in the middle. I'm the upper middle. So I've got two younger sisters and my brother's the oldest. But really, I'm the oldest. You know, there's always the eldest daughter. The eldest daughter is the thing. It's the most mature one.

Yeah, for sure. It's me and my youngest sister. She's like an old woman too. Do they have musical talent as well? Or is this just you? My whole family. sings besides my mom. She would hate for me to say that, but my mom can't sing at all, like, at all. But we all, we all, we all, we all, sang. But I was the one that pursued it the most in my family.

You said you traveled all around Texas. Is your father in the military or like? So my dad, I don't know what the equivalent of that is. He was an engineer and he was VP of customer relations of a company called my dad was he did well for himself um it's encore it's i don't know what where where are you at my room i'm in new york right now whatever the electric company is that major most new yorkers use that was what my dad was in texas okay i got it what television show would you say best describes your childhood as a kid i mean was there a character on a television show that you imagine that you were related to. I mean, it sucks like what has happened to that family, but we were like the Cosby's for

sure. Like that was. The Huxibles are still alive. Okay, great. The Huxibles. The Huxibles. We were like the Huxibles. Yeah, like that.

We were like that or, you know, definitely family matters, family. We were definitely like that. That was what our family was like. Okay. Blue collar, hardworking. My mom didn't work. My mom was a homemaker, but that was our family. Okay. And mind you, so this is one of the episodes in which I'm torn between because I want to know everything about your career.

Yeah. But I also, I'm hyper aware. And I think this is another commonality that we might have. Like oftentimes when you're in a position in your career, you're instantly tagged as the person that has to be the spokesperson for everything. Thank you for saying that. And so sometimes I just want to know silly stuff that you. You never get asked before. Yeah. Yeah, I appreciate you for wanting to do that because that was kind of a thing for me. Yeah, I know. You got to ask about anything clickbaity, like, what's your opinion on this? What's your opinion on this?

And, you know, if you're like, I have, I feel no, I am Omarion. I feel no ways right now. There you go. There you go. So that said, is there, this is rather than random. do you have a weird food combo that you swear by? A weird food combo that I swear by. Yes.

I'll tell you what. So my mom, she's dealing with like some like gluten allergies. So she's trying all these different meals. She got a sweet potato and put this like avocado like spread on it that was really, really, really good. I don't know what was on it. I have no idea, but it was like a baked. It was a baked sweet potato and they put this like, I don't know, this really flavorful, like avocado spread thing on it. And I tore it up.

It was really, really good. And I've been thinking about it a lot. And it's actually a really good food combo that I was really surprised. All right. I'm going to look for that. However, if you could eat one meal forever, what would it be? Like, what is your? If I could eat one meal?

forever. One thing forever. What is your all-time favorite? So my family, they used to make this meal back in the day. It was called ground meat, beans and corn. So it's ground meat beans and corn. I've been eating this since I was a little girl. So it's ground meat. It's like the black beans in that little black jar, black can with corn, drain the corn, and taco seasoning. And yeah, and she So that's not chili and that's not a sloppy joke? And it's not a sloppy joke. And it's not a Brownie beans and corn. I think they call it bullshit is what they call it. It's a southern thing, but it is really, really good.

That's something I used to eat all the time. And I still eat. What song reminds you of high school dances? Oh, man. I don't know why this song reminds you of probably because it was in love and basketball, but what was that song that was in love of basketball? God. You know what I'm talking about?

Michelle and DeGotelo's, you made a fool of me. No. I was like, that's depressing. No, no, what is it called? I want to be here. Wait, I want to be your man by Roger Troutman. Yes. I never danced to it in a high school dance at all,

but that song always made me think about a high school dance. You know, being as though I went to school with boys to men, I just realized something. We've never had a high school dance at the creative and performing art school. Wow. What? Yeah, I've never. on that? I've never been to, I mean, besides the prom, besides junior prom and prom,

like we've never had like sop hops or high school. I just think I did either actually. All we had was like homecoming. I went to Mansfield High School. Yeah, we had homecoming. We had, uh, we didn't even have that. You all have homecoming? Oh, wow. Yeah, it's, it's weird. Like, we did everything. But that's a Texas thing, like Texas, like homecoming. In Friday night football games and stuff? Yeah, the mums, those big mums that people would wear. Right, okay. I don't know what that is.

Never know what that was. I'm going to show you a picture of a mom if you can't look at one. I will Google Mum, M-U-M? Yes. Okay. And they're so ugly. But these are the things that people wear. Yeah, M-U-M.

Like, this is the stuff that people would wear. Oh, wow. So, wow. And the bigger it was, the more that guy really cared about you. Yeah. I know. It's like a dress that's a corsage. It was a status thing.

If you had a big mom, like, you were like the person. I know, I know. And that's a tradition thing. Like, you're looking forward to going to your first mom dance. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Have your dress, everything. You had Homecoming King, Homecoming Queen.

Wow. Okay. I know. I'm on it. People in the South will know what I'm talking about for sure. In high school, who was your celebrity crush? Oh, man. I definitely had a crush on probably Kobe Bryant.

Okay. I loved that group, immature, but Marcus Houston. Right. Okay. Nice. Or then they became I mature once they got over there. Clever? Oh, my God.

I totally forgot about that. Did you have an embarrassing, AOL or AIM name? My parents were super, super strict with us. I never got to do any of that. You didn't? None of it. No.

Really? Like, no. Yeah. When did you first, like, get acclimated with, like, life one line? I never did the chat rooms. I never did that. Ever. I know.

I know. That's shocking. But I, my parents were like, absolutely not. I was not really sheltered. They didn't let me do anything or go anywhere. Hey, they had me like. I'm also a sheltered kids. So there's a lot I didn't know that I found out long after my high school days.

Don't you hate that? Like there was like so much that I missed out on. I've said this story before, which maybe like the last time I saw Bismarkey before he passed, he was sitting in on the Tonight Show. And even though he was joking, he's like, Dad, Quest, like, when did you become a suit? which like, you know, if you're creative, the worst thing that someone could tell you is that you're a suit, meaning you're such a straight edge,

you know, like I've always been the odd guy out of anything. Well, my next question to you was, have you ever cut school? One time. Wait, but was it, was the senior cut day? Because that doesn't count. No, no. I really, and it wasn't cut school the whole day. It was just one class. Yeah.

And you got away with it? I got away with it. Oh, okay. One time. Okay. Why did you have to cut? Well, I didn't have to. So I became, I ran track.

Okay. And there was one guy. He was like the track stars. It was Enrique. He was like the distance track guy. Yes. Okay. And I were really great friends.

And we cut school that one day. He was the one guy that had a car. And we all cut, I think it was like maybe like the last class. the day. Oh, early? An extra hour? I know.

I know. Like, so that, does that even really count? No, lame. No, extra hours good because... I was really, really lame. I was. You're every kid in America.

I have to be home. If the Oprah theme was coming on and I was not home. Yeah. That was punishment. That was punishment. So, yes. Like, the door hinges are coming off. Like, my door is coming off the hinges.

Like, I won't have a door to my roof. Oh, no. privacy. Your parents did that? Yeah, that happened to me before. Yeah. They did that to me for like a month. Yeah.

Wait, what kind of trouble did you get into? I don't even remember. I was probably on the phone past 10 o'clock. Got you. Yeah. Yeah. It's just terrible. Dude, you know how many times Tariq would call the house?

Like, Tariq knows, everyone knows not to call my house after 9.30 p.m. Look, my dad's like 6'4 and just a very, Scary man. I mean, I joke, like, he was a Joe Jackson drill sergeant father. Yeah, my mom and dad were very much on that, too. Yeah, people knew my parents didn't play, but, like, Tariq would routinely call me to, like, play me some rap song. He just heard that it would be like 10-01 or whatever.

And together, I'll be like, hello. And he'd be like, hello. To-Ras. I got to call, yeah, I got to call you tomorrow. I'm sorry. I do, too. I thought my husband, I got the exact opposite. Like, I got such a, you can't tell that about him now, but how he was, like, he was wild and on loose.

And how, when did you guys first meet? We first met when I was 19. He was my best friend, stepbrother. Okay. And I didn't like him back then. I didn't even think about him like that. Oh, damn. He was just so rough around the edges.

and I, like you, was not. And so I just never thought. And then here we are. It's always the person that you least expect. It is. I like when that works out. I do too. I like what.

That has never worked out in my favor. I mean, nothing worked out of my favor, to be honest. But this one did. Pride is like love. You feel it in your heart. IR. Radio. Canada's number one streaming app for radio and podcast. including IHeart Pride Canada, your favorite hits and must have party bangers,

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As we get ready for the Men's World Cup this summer, listen to American Football as part of the MyCultura podcast network, available on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, I'm Hoda Kotby, host of the podcast. Podcast Joy 101 with Hoda Kotby. Together, we're going to have meaningful conversations with the world's most fascinating people. Like when actress Olivia Munn shared how she overcame fierce health challenges.

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Our podcast is called Hey Jonas. We're here, since everyone has a podcast, we want it to as well. And we've had some incredible guests so far. And now our good friend, Nile Horn, is joining the show. How's it going, boys? Hey, Niall. It's the same thing with Slow Hands. Slow Hands is not about anything else, really, is it?

You know, or taste so good can't be about food. You do the same, Nick, with some of the stuff that you've done. You too, Joe. Drop what you're doing and listen to Hey Jonas on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your podcasts. Is there a fashion trend that you regret ever following in your life in your teen years? Oh, my God. Like, when everyone was wearing those super, super low jeans where their ass cracks were sticking out.

I was like, you're from Texas. Were you a walking house of Darion? I couldn't afford the house of Darion, okay? Like, that was not at my price. Oh, that was a luxury. Okay. I didn't know it. Yeah.

You know, maybe like the, like, you know, in the South, like Doc Martin sandals were a huge thing, where they look like turtle shells on your foot. I guess there's a lot of shoes that look like that now. But there are these specific Doc Martin sandals that I couldn't afford. So I went to Walmart and got the Walmart version of them. And I'm really regretful that I followed that trend. Anything Abercrombie and Fitch, I'm regretful of that too. Really? Okay.

Yeah. That's your fashion football. Yeah, for sure. Can you describe the first concert experience that you had? I'm trying to even remember. Like I said, I didn't get to do a lot in my life. I definitely went and saw Mariah Carey. And one thing I always did at any concert, I went to,

I went to like a Justin Timberlake, Chris Jaguar, and I went to a Keith Urban concert. And I think the one thing I always did was turn around and look at the lights when they would have that moment where people would. Look at the audience. Yeah, I would always turn around and look at the audience. That's something I would always do. Like that every single time.

It was just such a beautiful experience to feel like, oh, that could be me. Okay. Well, yeah, you're playing the seasons of manifestation. So usually when people grow up in the church and music, and especially down south. It's always a gospel. Well, I was going to say, what was the secular music role in your household? Were you loud to listen to regular music or a lot of... My mom had that on lock.

Like, we had to listen to gospel or some kid. There was... It's so embarrassing some of the stuff in my life, man. Let it out. Let it out. There was this, like, I was just very much so that I was the start of that, like, right Christian nationalism thing that was going on. Like, that was the life. Weren't we all?

My God. Your parents were raised by their parents, raised by their parents. Yeah. Have you seen, if you've not seen this documentary, it is so triggering. Like the religious trauma,

my God. It's called Jesus camp. It is on Hulu. Yeah. If you, it will like make your eyes start twitching because of like, I'm like,

I was in that, like the vacation Bible school, you know. Yeah. Summertime, they would try. to have us organized trips to Haiti to become like future missionaries. Yeah, praying to God, like, I am a sinner, Lord.

I'm six. Yeah. I am a sinner Lord, like, forgive these thoughts in my head. I'm going to tell you how I got out of it. They took me out of it. So when Tarika and I finally got our first record deal, and I came to church, like, right when, like, our videos started to get played on, like, MTV and the elders of the church, I could tell by the little judgmental look on their eyes.

They were like, so, Amira, are you uplifting the Lord in this music of yours? Yes, I am. If ever there was a symbolic version of Check, Please, that was that moment for me. where, you know, I'm glad I had that moment. Like, literally, see, this is the thing. You're, you're not, you're pioneering, but I think the reason why you resonate with a lot of us is because, like, we see ourselves in your journey.

Instantly, like, anything to do with someone that's isolated in a very specific situation, I hone in for it because I, I know that feeling. I know that feeling of, you know, of code switching. My code switching has to code switch. And this is not even just in hostile environments, in liberal environments, in black environments, in my family environment. No, I'm not selling out.

I'm still, you know, like there's so many things that I have to do. So I understand those things. Wait, when did you move to Los Angeles? So I moved right at a high school, right at a high school. I was 19. And you were that compelled to, like, go out, follow your dreams? Yeah. What was it about L.A. that called you?

The sun, it seemed like it was the, you know, I looked at, like, all the different places where music was. I looked at Atlanta. I looked at New York, and I looked at Los Angeles. Nashville was not even a thought for me. And so I saw that as the easiest of the three. as far as music, because I didn't want to be in Atlanta, because that was still too close to the South for me. And I was just kind of running from Texas, from the religious.

Well, wait a bit. Okay, you're from Texas, and I've gone on record to say that if there was any place in the world, if I had to move and leave the Northeast, Philly, New York, that's my home base. Austin, Texas would actually be my second choice. Yeah. Clearly, see, I hate the term liberal because Austin is awesome, though. You're human.

Yes, you're a non-oppressive human. Even in those blue-friendly cities like Austin, that never appealed to you like, let me just move to. Well, Austin, at that time didn't even have the music scene that it has now. Like the scene now is like it's like it blew up like Nashville Like Austin and Nashville at the time I guess the reason why like Nashville was even called Music City Was not because of country music

Those two cities at the time like from my recollection I wasn't hearing like music scene like that But clearly you felt some sort of oppressive Yeah Anything in Texas I was like get me out Just get me out Got you And you know

There was acting and stuff like that too Like there was just an entertainment Hub that I felt like Oh I could do something there How was Secular Music Received in your household Now most people in your profession

Were not allowed to listen to Anything secular Oh 100% That was me Same okay I had to listen to Don't say DC talk No

Oh, absolutely not. Absolutely not. And we're like, that's a whole other thing too, man. I get it. Okay. But, you know, I listen to a lot. Like, BB and CC Wyethers were heavily on rotation at my house. Like, heavy.

And that leads to Whitney. So you can sneak your way to... Yeah, like, I snuck in a little bit. My grandma was a huge... She loved Dolly Pardon. So when I would go over her house, she would have Dolly Pardon, Kenny Rogers VHS tapes hanging on the back for a door along with Roots.

So that's what I would watch when I went over her house. Okay. And so then I discovered Brandy, obviously you. Like the 90s, what a time. What a time. There were so many just great,

great songs and great music. Okay. Thank you. Okay. This is what I always wanted to know. Are real singers allowed to do karaoke. Absolutely.

Are you a karaoke person? Absolutely, but I don't really sing. Yes. I sing. Are you a supporter? No, no, no, no, no. I cannot stand going to karaoke and you have that one person

that is like... And you got to kill shit. Yeah, when someone kills shit at a karaoke, that's not fun of me. You ruin it. Like, you ruin it for everybody. I like karaoke when someone can't sing. It's the best.

My go-to is Britney Spears. All right, so Britney's your... Britney Spears is my... That's your go-to? She's my go-to. What song? Sometimes, oops, I did it again. Those are, like...

And I don't do a whole voice. Like, it's a... That brevy... Yeah. Oh, yeah, I don't... You can't... You don't really sing on karaoke. Like, that just ruins it to me.

Okay, I understand that most singers, professional singers, tell you, like, you got to sing from your... Is her thing more of her nasal throat thing? Like, can you tell when a singer's singer from their gut versus, I'm always hearing that you should. Cristi Aguilera is gut and throat to me. Well, she has to come in the door like the Kool-Aid man. Yeah.

You know. Yes. She ends somewhere of the rainbow paddell bell version as her first note instead of, you know, her last note. You know, the last note. Right, right. Brittany Spears is, I don't think it's nasal. I think it's in her throat. It's so much air.

So I think there's... Do you know why that's a rule? Like when vocal trainers or coaches say, you know, you must sing from your diaphragm as opposed to your throat. Like, are you just never supposed to sing from your throat or people say it's an amateur hour if you're singing from your throat and not your diaphragm? You know, I mean, I'm not a Jesse J type singer, so I don't know. I don't want to, I don't know what's right. I think whatever sounds amazing and what you feel, you know, I'm, you know, I'm not a technical singer like that. So I think whatever you feel, I think there's so many different great voices, whether you can belt or not, that I think are so great.

Like there's some people that just have incredible tones and vocals. I was just thinking about Amelroo before we even like she was everything. She's a great man she's one of the great. Like a great like I think she has such a combination of everything like the tone, the throat,

the belt, all of it. The notes. In high school she was killing it man like she's definitely what was that song that she released that like had everybody to choke hold in like 2004. So many. Like I know one of her, it's a song that always gets played at weddings. Well, I mean, there's, see, I'm a deep cut person. Yeah. So even though like there's for real like in, uh, am I now blinking on all Amel songs? Oh, we're all blanking. It's fine. Oh, get up. Make me whole. Make me whole was always my favorite. Yeah. Get Up is really, really, really good. Yeah. She really gets to display her real though. For real. For real. For real. For For real. For real, yes.

But also, I think with real singers, like, the filler songs are where they really get to display what they are. Because oftentimes, if it's the single, whatever, you have to sort of follow this restrictive rule of what is compatible for radio and public consumption. And then the other seven songs, you can do whatever you want to do. Like, I judge people based on their nine singles. Yeah. Yeah. What song are you not embarrassed, but what song do you love that is like, oh, God, people will kill me if they know, like, I love the song so much. Oh, man, you know, Jesse McCartney had me.

In your feelings? Oh, my God. Yes. What was it about Jesse McCartney? He had that one song, I don't want a pretty face. I don't want anyone. I want my love to go away I want you because you're beautiful

That song is so good And it could be a country song now Which is crazy So Beautiful Soul is your Yeah, I love beautiful soul I even love I'm like this one really That one, that freaking one wish

By Ray J. Did you watch verses? I did not watch verses That was one for the history books Oh man, that song. He used to be a crush of mine when I was little. Like, I would watch Brandy music videos just to see her brother. Really?

I'm going to tell you something. If one thing absolutely incenses me that people really aren't up on, well, you know, I say this all the time about Brandy's first album. Brandy's first album was such... One of the most. Incredible. It was a game changer simply because, like, I think that most people think that, you know, that, okay, kids or teenage music should be more bubblegum based or whatever.

And she was breaking, like, so many harmony rules that, like, I only reserve for people like Prince. Oh, my God. And I'm like, yo, what does this 14, 15 year old know about crematic? Like, I don't even know you could do, like, chromatic background. vocals and even the first song on the first album. So when Ray J got a deal. Was that baby? That was the first song, right?

No, no, no, no. I mean, the first song on the first album, which is moving on. Oh, moving on. Every go-round, she would add a different harmony on top of it. So by the end of it, you know, we were sitting in the van like, yo, like the roots were very much the musical snobbery that everyone thought we were in the first five years, like, judging everyone. I maintained on 10 toes that, you know, when we first heard, Mary DeBledge is my life.

We were angry. We're like, wait a minute. Like, singers aren't allowed to sing over stuff we wrap over. Like, why is she singing over beats? Like, where's the bridge? Where's the arrangement? Where's the coder? Where's the modulation?

Like, I was ready to modulations. Yeah, I'm ready for, like, singers have to be in the box of. real music whereas rappers get to take from records and sample it. And so, yeah, like, it took about a month for us to really get over the fact that Mary J. Blige is singing over stuff that we would go for first. And I just thought that was like against the rule. Like, you're not supposed to do that. But Ray J's first record, man, the one that came out in, I guess... Like back in the day, yeah.

Yeah. Like, it was... such an incredible album that got ignored. And that one song, what did he have? Oh, my God. Well, he had a single called Let It Go, which was just, it was killing, but it because it would, like, literally, it was like if the roots got to produce somebody, like that would have been the album.

Keith Crouch, Andre Crouch's nephew, produced both Ray J and Brandy's first album. And they just changed so many rules. I consider those like really like Neo Soul, like pre-Neosol albums before there was a tag on it like in 95. Like I consider those records. And I just hate that though that he really put out an incredible debut that the world won't get to know.

I think I always remembered him for his ad lives. He was so good at his ad lives. That was something that I always remembered. Because, you know, like, his singer is, like, you have to be able to, you know, ad lib to songs. I even remember maybe there was an interview, like, back in the day where Brandy was like, you know, I get a lot of that from, like, Ray J. He helps me with that. And I was like, what? Really?

But that could be, I could be misremembering. So don't quote me on that one either. Okay, well, I'll ask you because usually, okay, so I'm always in a situation. where if I'm backing someone and we get to the last course of the song, you know, God bless his soul, DeAngelo would be the type of guy that he would never run out of riffs or anything. And I always wonder, is there an anxiety? Is there an anxiety in the last 30 seconds of a song in which you're supposed to ad-lib and, you know, do some vocal acrobatics? Now, it's one thing if you're in a nowhere town, if you're in Kalamazoo, Michigan or whatever.

Yeah. Like, who's watching you? But if you're in the Grammys and you're looking at the- The anxiety and it's like singing in front of people like you or like Brandy. So how do you get out of your head before performance? I'm never out of my head, ever. Like that is a huge anxiety for me. I would like, it is a huge thing for me.

Really? Yeah. I'm a very insecure person. So do you have a pre-show routine, like two hours before a show, what is happening? Is it quiet backstage? About 15 minutes before the show, I need it quiet. Like, I just need to, like, thinking about a point in my life where, like, you just have to let things go. Like, we as artists, like, I can't imagine being someone like Beyonce who is literally,

the biggest artist in the world. And her pushing through and, you know, I don't know. You always hear stuff, but I hear like how high the bar is set for her. I can't imagine living like that and wanting that perfection. As a front person, is it harder singing the song or the in-between song banter with the audience? What is... I can talk now. If you need me to talk, if you need, if there's an awkward moment, anything like that, where I need to fill something in while they're figuring, you know, a technical difficulty or something like that.

Like, I'm cool with that. As far as bantering is concerned, I'm pretty good at, like, talking to people in the audience. To this day, like, and you would think, you know, I've written books and all that stuff, but when it comes to giving speeches or just, like, small talk with, with an audience. Even DJing. Like, I don't think once I've ever said, I think, I think there's Questla, DJ, I mean, I quiet on that. Now, DJ and I, no.

No, well, I'm just communicating, I feel, is the magic sauce for how we get to know you, you know? Yeah. And so sometimes that's crazy, because you're, like, talking with you on here. Like, you're really fun to talk to. You're talking to a six-year-old. Like, there's life from when I was born in the 70s,

and then 2020, the old me went away. And then new me showed up in 2020 when the pandemic happened. Isn't it not crazy? Like I think everybody there was like a new. Oh. The me in 2020. Everybody. You know, for the first two years, I had a shame of, you know, just in general, I think as

humans, we are programmed to feel bad for feeling good. Anything that makes us feel good. There's guilt. There's guilt we feel. Yeah. And so, yeah, it probably took me two years just to get over that hump and get to there. So, yeah, I think all of us changed during the pandemic. Yeah, that's so crazy that you're saying that about the, like, feel bad for feeling good because right now I'm taking, like, I've had some personal issues that I've been dealing with and my family to the point where I've just had to, like, take a beat.

I knew I needed to take a minute because I didn't have any thoughts in my head. Right. Like nothing. Like, you know, usually if I'm working, if I'm doing whatever, I'm keeping myself up till, you know, 4 a.m. And I still will wake up at 4 a.m. like clockwork. I don't know why that is. But I would have just like thoughts of like how I could be better. Oh, I'm shit.

That what I did that day or like all these constant thoughts and now nothing. Like I have nothing. Like no ideas, no nothing. And I knew that that's when I needed to take a minute. I have been nesting. I have been decorating. I got a fish. I was going to say, are you a cat person or a dog person?

I have two cats, two dogs, a fish named Titan. He's a little beta fish that I really like. And I've been feeling really good. And I was like, should I be feeling like this? Should I be like, I need to be doing this? I need to be figuring these things. and where my next opportunity is at and what I can do to be better

and what's this next thing that's in my head. And it's okay to just take a minute. You're actually doing the right thing. Pride Month Toronto. Pride is an opportunity for you to create your own space, to celebrate your existence. IHeartRadio is proud to be an official sponsor of Pride Toronto Festival and we won't stop.

Celebrate pride. Turn up the love and listen to IHeart Pride Canada. Your 24-7 radio stream and the only playlist you need for your Toronto Pride celebrations. Pride is so great because it gives a whole bunch of people this visibility that they've never had before. We have a ton to celebrate Toronto. Happy Pride. Iheart Radio. I love the sounds. The buzzing from the stadium, the chanting from the fans, the announcers calling the place soccer, football, at home. Why do I watch the Walk Up? That's like asking me, why do I breathe? I inherited that fandom from my mom.

I like watching it with my dad. It's a connecting force. From Futuro Studios, I'm Fernanda Chavari, and this is American Football, a show about soccer culture in the U.S. and its underdog roots. We go beyond the game to the people and the stories that make it great.

A soccer game is a festival. It's not just a game. It's your culture. I took an elbow to my head, which cracked my skull. It is an American game. The Brazilians don't like hearing that, though. Are they the only ones that don't like that?

Nobody likes that. As we get ready for the Men's World Cup this summer, listen to American Football as part of the My Coutura Podcast Network, available on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, I'm Hoda Kotby, host of the podcast, Joy 101 with Hoda Kotby. Together, we're going to have meaningful conversations with the world's most fascinating people, Like when actress Olivia Munn shared how she overcame fierce health challenges. I've gone through breast cancer and then helped my mother through breast cancer.

And that was more difficult. There's a lot of people who understand postpartner depression. I was not prepared for postpartum anxiety. Listen to Joy 101 with Hoda Kotby on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. All right, listen up. The Jonas Brothers here. Our podcast is called, Hey Jonas. We've here, since everyone has a podcast, we want it to as well.

And we've had some incredible guests so far. And now our good friend Nile Horn is joining the show. How's it going, boys? Hey, Nile. It's the same thing with Slow Hands. Slow Hands is not about anything else, really, is it? You know, or taste so good can't be about food. You do the same, Nick, with some of the stuff that you've done.

You too, Joe. Drop what you're doing and listen to Hey Jonas on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your podcasts. All right, so this is a question I've been dying to ask. So we are about a year and a half, maybe two years. post what I would call a Cowboy Carter deluge or Watership moment. There's at least a group chat. Like in my mind, the best of my imagination is that there's kind of a secret X-Men super friends of RV, S.HV or Britney Spencer and Willie Jones and

Kane Brown Shibuzzi and you and Yola and all the, throw Darius in there. Shout out to those who I didn't commit to memory, but the post-Cowboy Carter moment shining a light on you guys. Now, I've heard of you pre-Cowboy Carter. Yeah. You know, I just thought it was Charlie Pride and Darius Rucker. I didn't think that black people were in the country,

even though I know the banjo came from Africa and all those things. So are there any artists bubbling under that you're aware of that we should be looking out for and has that moment in which getting that exposure to a whole new world, like, was that a real thing? Was it as real as I thought it was? It was definitely as real as we all thought it was, but in the same breath as just real as we thought it was, you know, there was the overwhelming veil that was lifted that shows that country music stills

they're ready to accept. You know, the way that the country music community accepted post Malone versus, you know, Beyonce versus Shibuzi, like those are very eye-opening

things, you know. Little Nas X, too. Little Nas X, too, but it seems like, you know, but it does seem like, I mean, this is a tale as old as time, like black women, no matter how successful you are, no matter how powerful you are, they will accept a black man or a white man, obviously, from whatever, more than they'll accept a black woman. Like, that's just, it just is. You know, like you have, I mean, prime example is like Jasmine Crockett trying to be a senator.

Yeah. She's well overqualified. Yes, I know this. But still, people can't accept. or fathom black leadership from a woman. And nor do they know that black women were single-handedly the reason why the very few wins that we got in democracy? Listen, I was part of the 92%. I was on the middle of tour and I flew where I was registered to vote just to make sure that I could vote and flew back and did what I had to do.

And that was like, I mean, that's very indicative in this Beyonce, Cowboy Carter. and post Malone argument. I mean, granted, Post Malone did really go through the Nashville channels. And I don't know if that would be different for Beyonce, but Beyonce doesn't have to. Beyonce doesn't do literally whatever she wants to do.

You're going to be an amazing support system for people, you know, that come after. And, you know, often I say that being a pioneer, like there's two people in the industry, in my opinion, The pioneer and then the person that comes after the pioneer. Yeah. That gifts just gets to enjoy all this. Oh, my God. Oh, it's great.

And you're in the back doing the carpentry. You're laying the red carpet down and right. You're laying the foundation. There was a person laying the foundation before me. You know, there was Linda Martel. She laid the foundation before me. You know, I. Do you still feel it?

Yes. Very much so. Oh, again, we don't, I don't want to make this about that because this has been such a break. We don't, but I just always wanted to know. I definitely have to be honest. I definitely, I think it's very important to be honest with this whole conversation because it has to be real. I mean, country music does it barely accepts women. I know.

Like, they'll say, oh, we have such and such and such and such. It's always three and they just switch them out. Right. It's no different. If anything, it's even worse. And like the way that you see This is such a hard conversation But from my observations

The way that this administration sees women Is the way the country music sees women Of course And the women that support the system The house master's tools And they support their oppressors Right They fight for the system

More than anybody And I can't help them They've got it If that's what they want to do, if they want to continue to be oppressed, that is not on me to be fighting for that. Okay. So in a world where there is a remote control. Yeah. And you get to press pause and literally sneak into the master system and change just three things.

Yes. So that when you press pause again, that becomes part of the regular fiber and memories are erased. what three things do you desire to change that I'm not aware of? And maybe I am aware of it. There's an underlying gatekeep. And it's like the things that happen between closed doors. So here's the weird thing. All right.

The foundation of all this is that my best friend in high school and I started a band and we just wanted to be famous and play all the, the places and all those things. And then, as I told you, even before the pandemic, around 2015, this other thing started to happen where

I realized like, oh, I have other talents. Yeah. And then for me, the sort of the rival moment of me as a filmmaker, like my whole imposter syndrome, like, well, I'm really not a filmmaker. And then like you went an Oscar, then it's like, oh, shit, I might be a filmmaker.

So, suddenly I started to get all the power I dreamed of having and the fame and all those things. I got it for filmmaking. But secretly, I go home at night and cry, like, feel like a failure because I'm like, wait a minute. Which is insane to me. I'm glad I'm not the only one, though. Well, dude, the grass is always green on the other side. So for me, it was always like, damn, what kind of world do we live in where, like, you know, I can call Spielberg like,

that and get a meeting and get things to happen. But the world knows me as this music savant. The world knows me as this 200,000 record collecting master of music disciple of the best musicians ever. Like, why can I compile 14 songs on a particular album that will take me to the place where, oh, man, I wish I was doing that. Damn, like, I don't want that opportunity. And it took me the last six years to learn that I was in my own way. But asking you this, I also realize, and Jimmy Jam taught me this, is that someone is going to have to infiltrate and sneak on the inside to change the system. Yeah. The way the system is now, and, you know, and I almost see the country world as its own bubble.

It is. And I watch you and I'm just like, man, like the things that she has to keep internally just to see her career through so that she can get the power to even change the system, I know you have to go through this unspeakable, isolated journey with yourself that probably not even your husband can understand. And he's probably your best friend in the world. Yeah. So is it worth it to really step into the house of. of the system to try to change it as yourself. Like, what do you have dreams of as far as, like, the legacy part of this?

You know, I get, I mean, it's kind of like what you said. Like, I build the foundation and then this person, which I mean, I believe, like, Beyonce did like, you know, I worked so hard for something. Beyonce did come through and she, like, shattered the ceiling. She broke the ceiling. Like, I was over there tapping on it. She just, like a rocket ship, she came and blasted that.

But it's like there's one thing I don't have the ability to do and that's change the hearts of people. Like, I can't, you can't change the hearts of people. Like, if that was something I could go in there and, like, change, that would be it. And I don't have the ability to do that. Do you see a generational difference in, like, for hip-hop? There's definitely some rules of hip-hop that I knew. Gen X is not like Gen X was very big on this whole like,

Yo dog, who's the gay rapper? Like that was like such a major thing. Whereas like now in 2020 like, that's like, yo, how could we be so Neanderthal and ask backwards to make that our point of priority? But, you know, I realize it's generational. And now that I'm looking at Gen Z and soon it'll be Gen Alpha and Gen Beta and, you know, so on and so forth, do you see somewhat of a generational change for the better in younger people? Because also, if you grow up an impressive household, I would imagine that at least some of you.

Like, country music is still, like, it seems like I've stepped back in time. Like, they say country music is 20 years behind everyone else. I mean, in this case, maybe 40. Like, they're still back with our parents and the boom. era. So it's 19707? That's kind of how it feels. It feels like we're there. I mean, it feels like we're still in 19, you know, like even like, yeah, like 1992 with, you know, no secular music at all. Hopefully, when all said and done, like your career will at least push us to the millennial.

God, I hope so. Pride month, Toronto. Pride is an opportunity for you. you to create your own space, to celebrate your existence. Iheart Radio is proud to be an official sponsor of Pride Toronto Festival, and we won't stop. Celebrate Pride. Turn up the love and listen to IHeart Pride Canada. Your 24-7 radio stream and the only playlist you need for your Toronto Pride celebrations. Pride is so great because it gives a whole bunch of people this visibility that they've never had before.

We have a ton to celebrate Toronto. Happy Pride. Iheart Radio. I love the sounds. The buzzing from the stadium, the chanting from the fans, the announcers calling the place, soccer, football at home. Why do I watch the World Cup? That's like asking me, why do I breed? I inherited that fandom from my mom.

I like watching it with my dad. It's a connecting force. From Futuro Studios, I'm Fernanda Chavari, and this is American Football, a show about soccer culture in the U.S. and its underdog root. We go beyond the game to the people and the stories that make it great. A soccer game is a festival. It's not just a game. It's your culture. I took an elbow to my head, which cracked my skull.

It is an American game. The Brazilians don't like hearing that, though. Are they the only ones that don't like that? Nobody likes that. As we get ready for the Men's World Cup this summer, listen to American Football as part of the MyCultura podcast network, available on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, I'm Hoda Kotby, host of the podcast, Joy 101 with Hoda Kotby.

Together, we're going to have meaningful conversations with the world's most fascinating people, like when actress Olivia Munn shared how she overcame fierce health challenges. I've gone through breast cancer and then helped my mother through breast cancer, and that was more difficult. There's a lot of people who understand postpartner depression. I was not prepared for postpartum anxiety. Listen to Joy, 101 with Hoda Kotby on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

All right, listen up. The Jonas Brothers here. Our podcast is called, Hey Jonas. We've here, since everyone has a podcast, we wanted to as well. And we've had some incredible guests so far. And now our good friend, Nile Horn, is joining the show. How's it going, boys? Hey, Niall.

It's the same thing with Slow Hands. Slow Hands is not about anything else, really, is it? You know, or taste so good can't be about food. You do the same, Nick, with some of the stuff that you've done. You too, Joe. Drop what you're doing and listen to Hey Jonas on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your podcasts. Hypothetical question.

The person you are right now could travel back 20 years when you are a teenager seeing your girlfriends on 106 in Park promoting their music, 3LW. Yeah. A group that you. you were a founding member of. I don't want to know what it felt like to sit there and watch them on television, kind of live your jumpstart, your dream.

It was wild. But what would you now, if you were given 60 seconds to literally time travel, I'm big on astral traveling and time traveling and dreaming. If you could go back 60 seconds, the first time you're watching, 3-0 promises, promise this, on, on TV. You don't know how much I love that song. I love that song, too. I'm not going to lie.

I really did. I listened to that song. I did. But at the time, and look, I had the same thing with Motown, Philly. Motown Philly was coming on every second. My dad was not making me feel good about my life watching my schoolmates become these celebrities. Yeah. Yeah.

And it's, you know, like that could have been, like he was very much a backstage dad. like that. What would you tell yourself in those 60 seconds that you don't know at the time when you're watching your girlfriends, air quote, live the dream? And that's 60 seconds, I would say, just hang on, your time will come, that you were kept from feeling. Like, when I watched it all go down, like watching what happened to Tori. Like, that could have been me. Would you have been power? No, I would not have been. No, no, no, no, like when they broke up.

No, no, I know, I know. Yeah, no, I would not have been on power. I got you got something that I will never have. That girl, that girl, she's got something that's just so amazing. But, like, I, like, I, hold on, your time will come. But at the time when it was happening, were you like, oh, man, like, what the hell? Like, this. It's so weird.

Like, I did feel, I mean, FOMO was not a word. Yes. But I did have FOMO about it when I watched it. But I also felt really cool that I experienced a little bit of it. I was only in their group for a summer. Like I was not really in their group. I was like maybe a month. Like I was not.

It's like you can say. And now I can say that now as a grown ass woman. But back then, you know, it's so weird. Like it's hard to remember how I felt. But yeah, hold on, your time will come. There you go. That's what I would say. Hold on.

Your time will come. What is your songwriting process like? Or at least in the road to getting your record deal and whatnot, how much agency are you given to really express how you feel? Because, you know, again, the way you enter my life, everyone is like, yo, you hear the song. You know, they play black like me and all these things. How autobiographical was better than you.

you left me. Like, is songwriting the release that you get because you can't express to us or feel safe to express to us? I have a really hard time with confrontation because, you know, I grew up in the because I said so era. Yeah. You know, I definitely was punished by a belt. And I would never get to explain myself. I never got to express how I was feeling. Only speak when you're spoken to. Yeah, you know, and I understand our parents. I mean, you're doing what you were told. But now, if you're going to tell your kid to do something,

there needs to be a why, and you need to explain it, and you need to allow your kids to explain themselves. So because of that type of discipline, I don't express myself in the moment, well, at all. If there's confrontation, I shut down and I'm silent. Can I ask, do you get, I get this a lot, do you get accused of being passive aggressive? Oh, passive aggressive, like you don't care. And like my husband, he's a lawyer.

So he can express exactly how he feels at the very moment. And I am just like, and I just shut down. And then people think that you don't care. And it's just that I need to process the 15 things that you said to me. I need to go take a shower. And I need to talk to myself. and speak out loud what I would say, and then I can come back to you.

Sometimes I even have to put it in a note. I can't even speak it out. I have to write it down, then read how I feel about it because I can't. Mickey, like, you, I mean, I'm already a fan. And I don't mean that just like I said, I was like, yeah, I'm a fan.

But now I'm really shocked at the commonality thing is that it's confirmed, all this things. I'm in a new relationship right now. So even then, you know, I'm trying to readjust this post-therapy, Amir, and learn how to communicate and

because I will hold a grudge. Oh. And I take it out. I will take it out on myself before I take it out on other people because... 100%. And that causes so much suffering. Oh, real stuff. Like sickness. Yeah.

That's where cancer comes from. Oh, 100%. Yes. And so, wow. That's, okay. So... The one time I stood up for myself, like, in front of the president of my label at the time, it took so much out of me.

I was sick for three days. I couldn't get out of bed for three days because that release of energy was so overwhelming. Like I was sick. I was nauseated sick. What was your label's response to first hearing black light? They respected me. I didn't yell. I didn't do anything.

But the lead up of me telling this boss, this white man. that stop, as a black woman, stop saying my songs are R&B when you are putting trap beats and all of your songs on country radio. Like, stop it right now. Like, you can never say that to me again, is what I said. Yeah.

Do you remember your first professional gig? Yeah, my first professional gig, as far as touring, I had opened up for Brad Paisley, and that was scary. How was that? It was amazing. He was fantastic. One of the kindest human beings ever, like so lovely.

But I remember... How was his audience? Well, there was one point we were out there and this guy was holding this Confederate flag. He went right up to him. And every time he came around, like, you know, Brad would have to leave on the other side. like he wanted no part of it. Like he wanted none of that. Like he hated it.

But I had to see it, you know? He felt horrible. That's not how he thinks. That's not what he believes. Like I'm these, wow. Let me tell you, some of these people, man, the hatred in their heart, I'm like,

are you a spawn of the devil? Like, you're a spawn of Satan. Have you, okay, so now in building your audience, is your audience truly your audience now? Like, is there a feeling of Satan? It truly is my audience. Like, I can talk about any and everything. I've got a heavily gay audience.

Okay. You know, like, anybody that feels marginalized and accepted is my audience. Are you the character and what are you going to tell her? Yeah. Okay. But the song was written by all women, and we're all the character of that. Well, yeah, I know there's a composite, but it's one thing. Like, there's some songwriters I know when which you know that they've,

not giving up, but you know, you hear the cynicism and their songwriting. But, I mean, because of that sticks so almost closely with this could be a dream deferred. Yeah. Like, how do you tell someone to hang on to a dream, but this could be a dream deferred? And I always wondered, like, even in you're pursuing that, like, is, I'm not asking about your peer group, but even like with family members or do you have a friend circle that you can lean? lean on like a yeah actually one of those people that I really lean on and you know I mean maybe we're similar in this but I don't trust a lot of people because as soon as you give them who

you really are people will never say that they'll never do that but they always use some of the hardest moments against you and I would never do that to anybody like so it's really hard for me to open up I have a very very very few people that really, really, really know, like, my deepest insecurities, my... Vulnerability. All of them. And one of those people over the years that I've, that has gotten a lot of that, that I've called crying before.

And I don't like crying to people. The only person I'll do that, too, is like my mom or, like, my dad, I hate crying in front of people. But that's Britney Spencer. Nice. Well, I mean, you're going to... Look. as a person who, again, like, we take it out on ourselves first before we let the world see it.

I highly recommend this. Like, I've just allowed crying in baseball maybe like four years ago. Like, no, but it was to the point where I didn't know how, literally didn't know how to cry. Like, I was so good at holding it in, yeah. That literally I became world famous for just having no emotions, you know. But there's so many emotions. is you just like sometimes like and I'm at a point like even crying like in front of people like it's I have to be really really really really really really really upset like to do that.

I got you. All right. My last three questions. Are you a bucket list person and what is the bucket list that you really want to accomplish? You know, I used to be a bucket list person, but I not a bucket list person anymore. But there has to be a dream that you want to achieve. Yeah. You know, I, it's so weird. It's so weird. Like, I had all these, you know, I thought I had all these things I wanted to achieve.

Like, I was Grammy nominated while I was pregnant. And I was expecting, like, to be Grammy nominated. And then I had to, you know, go to the Grammys after just giving birth. And, like, I was emotional. and I was pumping at the time and, you know, like all the things that happen when a woman has a baby. And like winning a Grammy was the one thing. Like I wanted so, so, so bad. But the thing that I've seen as I've gotten older in life, and, you know, people have so much, they hold so much value and like things and like trophies.

And it's like, but what does that mean? Yes, it's an accolade, but what state does it really, really have in your life? And I think after giving birth to my son, almost losing my son, like, that's the only thing that matters to me. Like, it really is. Like, I've gone and done some of the most amazing things. I've seen at the Super Bowl. Like, that was a dream. And I did achieve that.

And afterwards, I was like, well, still feel like myself. The grass is always going to be green on the other side And then whatever you achieve You'll shrug it off because there's something else Yeah Of the pike that you want Wait, okay, so I don't know if this is still A dream for country artists

But have you ever played the grand old Opry? I have played the grand auphrey Is it just the lure of playing the place or like It is So the Positors You know, they got nominated back in seven of seven years at the Grammy. Yeah.

They told, you know, they were the first, I guess, black women to play the grand or opera. So what was the feeling like? It was definitely magical at the time. Like, I was so nervous. I'd spent maybe four or five years in Nashville at the time, pounding the pavement. I had management at the time. That was, I don't want to say this, but I feel like they were.

like having two older white men try to understand a black woman that they were putting me in i'm a i'm a circle and they were trying to fit me in a square right and i had dealt with so much of that so when i finally got to sing up the grandal opera i don't know what you would equivalent that to it's like surviving the apollo that yeah it's like like if you you know if that's how you were discovered. They write, it wasn't Jasmine Sullivan on Apollo.

Like, if that was like the way for you to get, you know, discovered and get your chance, it's kind of like that. It's like a right of passage into country music. And it's just this,

I don't know how to describe it. It's just something that's, it's a tradition in country music that, you know, a lot of people with Dolly Pardon, Charlie Pride, like it's a history thing. Got it.

What is the hardest creative block that you've overcome? I think the hardest creative block that I overcome. I think it's right now. When I say I don't have thoughts on my head, that's what I mean. I would do anything to be you right now. Like, even as I'm talking to you, I'm thinking about editing this film and I've got to make this phone call. And I'm going to get to make sure my plane tickets are ready. Thank you so much.

I want to know what that's like. It's quite lovely, really. like to just Well, is there a fear that you can't come back or? Yes, there's that. There's a huge fear of that for sure. And I'm taking that thought and I'm putting it over there because I've worked my ass off.

You'll be fine. For a very, very long time. And I do. And I am starting to get thoughts in my head. And thoughts that I'm like, okay, is this stupid? Is this dumb? And then I'll say it in a meeting. And people are like, oh, I like that idea.

And I'm like, oh, so I'm just trusting this creative block moment of just letting it be what be. Well, I think that's a good thing. And I think you'll be focused. All right. So my last question to you is, when all is said and done, what's the one thing that you really hope people say about you? I hope people say that she. saw me, like really, really, really saw me. You know, this industry, this world, I feel like people are so narcissistic.

And me, me, me, me, me. That is something that I hate so much about society, about the individualism is, it's a beautiful thing to be able to have that freedom. But it also stops people from seeing other people. And I hope that people say that about me, that she really saw me. And like really, really saw me. Well, Mickey Garden, I appreciate you in your artistry. I definitely see you.

Thank you. And I'm not even trying to cosplay that, you know, I came in under country's DNA. A lion's share of all the country that I've been listened to is sort of sparked off with you and me not knowing that black people were in this spaces at all. or if I had anything. But, you know, just in following your story and your journey, I mean, I'm cheering for you in the authentic way,

not the Tyra Banks' anger way. That was wild. Oh, my God. I'm cheering for you for real. I'm rooting for you. I understand so much and appreciate what you go through. And even the things that I don't even fathom or wish upon. another human being. I mean, I really appreciate that you are there in the trenches,

really building a safe space for someone to come in 2030 and 24 and still be here to do it. You know, and so I'd hope that you take these brave steps and also take time out for yourself and to just thank you. I could have just said thank you. and that's it. Thank you. All right, people, this is the Questlove show, and we will see you on the next program. Thank you.

Questlove show is hosted by me, Amir Questlove Thompson. Executive producers are Sean G., Brian Cahoon, and me. Produced by Brittany Benjamin and Jake Payne. Produced for IHeart by Noel Brown. Edited by Alex Conroy. I heart video support by Mark Canton Logos, graphics, and animation by Nick Paloie Additional support by Lance Coleman

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