The Questlove Show - QLS Classic: Babyface (Part 2)

Episode Date: July 6, 2020

Award-winning singer, songwriter and producer Babyface talks about his early life, the importance of translating his heartbreaks into music and what it was like working with artists like Whitney Houston, Boyz II Men, Toni Braxton and so many more. Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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podcast network on TikTok. Quest Love Supreme is a production of IHeart Radio. This classic episode was produced by the team at Pandora. This week on QLS, we're really excited to bring you a second part of our exclusive interview with Kenneth Babyface

Edmins. Let's start the show. How do you determine? Because looking at your solo career from, you know, Tenderlover was 89? 89. 89. And then... Don't forget about lovers, man. Oh, yeah, Lovers was, yeah, 87.

86-87? Yeah. And, but from that to then, you know, for the cooling you, like, which is my favorite one. Like, how did you determine... Video two? Man, how did you determine, okay, this is for me and this is for my artists or other people I'm producing for. How did you balance that workload? Songs first. And whatever. I would

write a, I get asked that question many times. Why don't you keep into the road? Why don't you keep every little step? Because listen to who sung it and listen to the songs those became, you know? So I think the songs ultimately find their right homes. And for me, there's certain songs that I could do and that I could do well, and certain songs I wish I could have done better, but I couldn't, so I was honest with myself and gave him away for that reason.

What's an example of a song that you gave away? Under the road. Once I finished it, I said, oh, man. Was it your vocal that just didn't work out? Yeah, I just didn't... Well, I specifically wrote it for Boys to Man, so I was going for that old Philly sound, you know? And then when I...

And then when they started singing it, I was, you know, because I really almost kept it. But when they, those boys walked in there and started saying, I said, damn. You found a new home? It was like, you know, it was clear that, wow. That moment was clear that they, they were a better group than I thought they were. And I knew that I would want to work with them again. Question.

How many songs did you work on for the Dangerous Project for Michael Jackson? I'm hearing 20 No 10 When we got called to work With Michael Right We had just signed

Germain Jackson On the face Oh no Wow And then Michael heard a little song called Word to the Bad And all that I forgot

I forgot A R&B disc track Yeah I totally forgot Yeah Word to the Bad You wrote that Jermaine

with Jermaine Jermaine And like left eye was on it. Okay, so, so we got called. I totally forgot this story. When we signed him up, then we got a call from the gloved one and wanted to meet us. And I'm like, I had met, I had met Michael in my, you know, younger days. He didn't know that, but so we got the call that, you know, I like to meet with you guys.

So he sent a helicopter. And we went out to Neverland. And we were like, all right, we got to go. We can't not go. I know we just signed Germain, but we can't not go. This is Michael. And Germain was like, this is crazy. You told Germain you were doing this?

Yeah, he knew. No. This is, no, this is my brother. He's purposely, whatever. So. And. And so we got to Neverland and sat in the living room and waited for a little bit from Michael come out and then Michael finally came out and...

Please meet you guys. How are you doing? I said, great. He says, so I wanted to bring you guys here because I really wanted to know if you wanted to do some work with me and stuff. And so, I said, that's great. You know, obviously, we've been banned for years. So Michael, so what we want to know is that what do you want from us? Right.

Because like, you know, what have you heard from us? What do you want to, what kind of music are you looking for? And he goes, well, so I really love that thing that, what's that song that Janet does? Rhythm, rhythm, nation. Oh, no, shit. No, that's not us. Oh, my God. You're a helicopter to Rome these day.

And so I like Ella goes, so you know that's Jimmy Terry, right? Yeah, I know, I know. But I like it. And then we said, so I said, so what is it of ours that you like? And he goes, well, I particularly love that song, a crime. It's no crime. Okay. Yeah, I love the beat.

I don't like the beat. I don't like the words, but. Oh, God. He's a neg master. Okay. All right, all right. But, you know, me, Mr. Positive, and, you know, you can, I was like, okay, all right. So that gives us a direction.

At least we know kind of where to go because it didn't matter. He could have said our stuff was crap. And we would have said, well, we'll make it, we'll uncrap it. And so we got the, you know, he said, let's, go go to the studio and work. Let's put some work together and do some studio, put some studio time together. And so we went out and worked to forget what the studios we went out to work at.

But prior to that, right after that meeting, we had a, we went up to Lionel Richie's house. Pebs happened to be friends with Brenda Richie. It was very good friends with Brendan Richie. And we went over to the house and Lionel was there. And Lionel said, now I'm going to tell you something about Michael. He said, he's a nice guy. but don't get caught.

Don't get caught in the web of, you know, all the, you know, the charm and the magic stuff because you'll be working forever and never come out with nothing. So just be careful to not get caught up in that web because, you know, he's so magical that you'd be magiced out and you won't even know. So we went in there kind of with a different attitude

when we went to work with them. Because I would see the, guys that could be so hard and stuff like that, and you get in front of Michael Jackson, they'd be, suddenly they become little lambs. No matter how hard you are, you talk to Michael Jackson, it's a whole other story. Michael just, he's magical.

So we kind of like stayed strong because of that. And so we went in and we started working on tracks. I think we probably went through three or four tracks. And he'd come in, he'd listen to him. Nice. Love it. Love it. Okay.

Now you see that right there? Take this. Now I want you to, it's beautiful. But now I want you to go to a place that you've never gone before. Reach inside and go to a place that you've never gone. We were like, yeah. We got magic now. Yeah.

You're right. We haven't gone far enough. So we went back and started going further and further. And he'd come back and we fixed up the track. We know we're there now. We just playing the track. We hadn't even done the top lines yet. When we're going for the tracks and stuff like.

So he'd come in and listen. And this was like probably about the fourth day. He was supposed to come by each day. He didn't, he didn't come by to the fourth day. And then he came in and he listened to it. I love it. It's great. No.

You can see him, Dad, figure out his steps. Right in front of you. Beautiful. No, I love this. I love this. Now, no, this is perfect, but now what I want you to do is go even deeper. Oh, man. And go to a place that you never go for.

Wait, can I ask? He's right. What does that, what does that entail? Is that Michael Ease for something? Is that more patches in the song? Is it more Calville? More, more. More.

Percussion. It's like, give me something different. Give me something unique. Give me something that, you know, we haven't heard before. So patches? No, even the rhythms. It could be anything. So he just, he wasn't completely pulled in yet.

And so we ultimately did this song called Slave to the rhythm. And that's the song that we ended up with. But then he was, he was supposed to come by, studio, wouldn't come by. And then me and L.A. sat down. One day we said, you know what? We've been here a week. He came down. He came here twice.

Out of seven days, he came here twice. We out of here. So we left. We went back over to another studio. Forget the name of the studio. We went to Michael called L.A. and said, what happened? Where did you guys go?

L.A. said, nope, we got other stuff to do. We can't do it. This is our song. This is it. And we were done. and we pull it out of the project. And you were fine with it? We were fine with it.

Because what we didn't want to be is those producers that would get caught with one artist and only have one artist. Our career was built on a number of artists and we stopped at one and just stopped there. Then you just hang your flagship on one and that's what you're hoping. You go however they go.

Yeah. So we wanted to always be able to, and at that point we had started the label. And then, you know, Germain was pretty pissed at that particular point. Really? You think? That's what I was going to ask. How do you do all this and then have Laface?

Yeah. Well, that was, I mean, that was the thing. Look, we were, we had LaFace and we were supposed to be working on ours at that particular point. So when you get a call from Michael, we're like, we're not going to not, you know, we got to do Michael. And so we tried it. We went there, but we knew we couldn't stay there forever to keep doing it. And we felt like we were going to run into that. It was more of a thing of thinking,

Michael, well, maybe we don't see the same things, and maybe we're not the guys for you, so we don't want to go through this whole process. Did you feel in your heart of hearts that you had a good song? With Slave? Yeah. I thought it was pretty good, but I didn't think we got a chance to work it to make it the best.

You know, I think that with any artists that you start to work with, you're going to go through some songs that aren't great. but if you get more time with them then you will get to that greatness but you got to have that time you got to have the time to have the bad songs in order to have the great songs

so when you started LaFace I mean I guess it's impossible for any black entrepreneur to not have thoughts of Motown in their heads as in like course

what's my label going to be oh the new Motown what were your well I mean by this point at least like 92, 93. You, LA's,

you and L.A. are about to separate and you're about to produce on your own and he runs the label. Like, how did you guys come into an amicable? It was,

the label became the thing for L.A. He had to run the label. We were, it was a little hard for him to keep producing and be a writer and all,

and actually run the label. And do business. couldn't really do that. You had to make a choice. You're either going to be a businessman or you're going to be an artist. And the truth is, is L.A. was always kind of the businessman. He was always, that was his role, you know, going way back to the deal. He was like the guy that made sure everybody got to eat, going back to his days, you know, back to, you know, essence and the deal living in Indianapolis and making sure he made some deals with some people at church's chicken to make sure they could eat every night. That was his gig. And he basically became, you know, the manager of, you know, LaFace Records. It was, he had to be, he had to make sure everybody got ticking.

But how does that work from an artist? Like when y'all decided which artist would be, did it ever, did he at least say, okay, so this is this group Goodie Ma. I just want you to hear so you know. We were always on the same page in terms of, we never fought in terms of artists and whether something was good or not. That's where we were always good together is that our taste are very similar,

so we kind of would support each other. What was your relationship like with Outcast? I wasn't around as much without Cass, and so I would kind of see the guys, because at that point I was kind of like doing a lot of producing out this way and kind of making the L.A. connection, so to say. So you were working in Los Angeles

while he stayed in Atlanta. Yeah. What was it about Atlanta that attracted or made that the official? We were living here in L.A. And we felt like we needed to get out of here in order to like, you know, be a big fish in a little sea. If we tried to start a label here, then we would, they'd never know we were here. Atlanta as Minneapolis? Yes.

Yeah, okay. And so in going down there, we, you know, we were. right to go there and we got very lucky you know that the talent came to find us there's some talent that we lost doubt on you know who almost

didn't get signed to the label or who didn't who did you miss out of it? We had an A&R person that had got something that we did we found out after the fact I got to make sure that's true that the story in fact is true because it's sad if it is

but R. Kelly really Oh, what? And they, this is bull stuff, so it's bull crap. So we never got it. We never got to even hear it. But what, did he, did he, because you guys did the music together too. He wouldn't have told you y'all missed out on me.

You know that, right? In the middle of. Okay. In the middle of Cambri. That's crazy. So, okay, one of your clients that were particularly curious about, uh, who, who's done our show before? Usher Raymond

Oh yeah Says one of his career regrets Was the fact that He did not get A freshly pinned Babyface classic When he first signed to the label When

And went so far to tell us that Can We Talk was initially his song I think he still got pain To get pain To this He's like, that's my song. Yes, he believes that. He believes that.

Usher came, when Usher came, he came out of time when me and L.A. were going for suspense. Wait, is Usher like Cam and Jayzie and Dave? Oh, yeah, yeah, right? He mentioned us in this movie. Usher came in. Usher came, he's this bad little kid came and sang into the road and his demo,

and he was bad. His little kid was bad. Bad isn't good or bad? Like, badass. Gotcha. And I certainly, you know, thought he was an amazing kid. He came at a time when me in L.A. were, like, kind of like, had our issues. And so I kind of like ended up being out here in L.A. a lot.

I got a call from Quincy Jones to write a song for Tavenman Campbell. And it's Quincy Jones. I was like, it's Quincy Jones. So I wrote, Can We Talk? And did a demo of it. And Elliot heard the record, I think, and he wanted it for Usher, but I had already given it to Tevin.

And it was a question of, well, you know, Usher can sing better, and, you know, sing is good. And I said, well, but I kind of already did this deal with Quincy, and I ain't going to tell Quincy no at this particular point. So the song ultimately went to. And so the song, was never really for Usher. But from the way that

probably L.A. talked about. Usher feels otherwise. Because I'm sure L.A. said it differently. Oh, yeah. That's supposed to be your song. Right, right. I see. It certainly went that way. I'm sure that's kind of how it went. So Usher's not wrong in terms of how he

how it came to him. He just don't know the real story behind it. I see. Still. Do you? Okay. Now 25 years later. Between 94 and 99, did you personally get tired of hearing you on the radio? No, because I wouldn't listen. How?

I would, if something came on that I did, then I'd turn the radio off. I'd listen to talk radio. Then you obviously just, you never listened. Got rid of music. Yeah, so like, because during that time, because it's like, waiting ex hell is 95. And then what was it like producing? You produced everything on the way into Excel? Yeah.

How hard was that to... Was it a good idea at the time? Versus getting to the end point? It was a huge undertaking only because it wasn't about it. When I did the project, Forrest Whitaker came to me and asked me to do it. And then not only did he ask me just to do that, but he also asked me. me to score the film. And I said, well, I've never done that. And he said, that's it. And I told him, I can't do that because I don't, that's not what I do. And he said, you can do it. And I'll get

you some help to make sure you can do it. But initially, I want you to come and I want you to write the songs for this film. And I want you to watch the movie as I'm doing it and, and write the song. So I ultimately kind of took all my gear over to a studio with him as he was editing the film. And and I also watched him film of it, film it as well, and then he gave me a kind of sense of where he wanted to go, and as he'd send me scenes, I'd write songs to it. And the truth is, I think every time I wrote a song, he liked it. Wow.

And so I didn't really go through a bunch of different songs, and that was just kind of like hitting these scenes. And then we had to figure out who was going to sing it. And initially, when we were doing the music, It wasn't even, we weren't for sure that Whitney was going to sing anything at all. She wasn't necessarily, she might sing something, she might not, we didn't know. Really? And then, because it wasn't going to be a Whitney project.

They just wanted me to do the music for it. So then Whitney decided that she was going to sing something. And then Whitney decided that if I'm going to be part of it, then I get to have say so on who gets to sing, who don't get to sing. So was someone kicked off the album that we don't know about? There were some people that she didn't necessarily want to sing. There we ask who? I'm just happy SWV made it. No, she liked that.

Yeah, yeah. And so the list came up of the girls. I wrote out a list, and then I just wrote out the list, and she just kind of said, nope, nope, nope, nope, yep, yep. And. Who are the nose? Can we? I was kidding trying to guess

I said, because I know she loved Everybody was on the record Everybody was on the record Who in black music Was it a black artist that got rejected? One of them, yeah Oh, some pop artists got rejected No Madonna

I'm sure you guys went for the big guns Did you go for big non-black names? On the black movie about the black women? This is fun for us to guess this You don't have to name anything You don't have to name anything. There was another huge artist that...

Jenna Jackson. No. No. You're not confirming or denying? I'm not confirming or denying. I deny that's no, wasn't it? Okay. Oh, okay.

Vanessa Williams. She wasn't on there. She wasn't on there. Okay, that's all right. Who else? But I feel like a Mount, like, the... That's two major people. I feel like a Mount Fiji...

That could have been on. Mariah. Hello. I'm not confirming or denying. Yeah, but that makes sense. Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. Mariah was not on that soundtrack. No, she was not.

But would Tommy let her on a Clive project? Probably not. There's a baby, but that's a pill of baby. Probably not. Okay, so obviously Mariah was one. Although. It was big like that.

Am I to believe that before the Prince of Egypt project that maybe perhaps there was an idea of throwing around that Mariah and Whitney do something together on the waiting to Excel soundtrack? Yeah. Too soon.

I'm gonna give myself. I'm gonna give myself. Hold on. Hold on. Hold on. I told you, we were a bunch of dweaves. Spent too many time reading album credits. We would have this conversation if you weren't here.

That wasn't a big conversation, big piece. But there were other people that were kind of mentioning. But so the people that she did pick were people. that she actually, she liked their voices. And, uh, Shanty Moore. And, and we were, so no total. We were just kind of in search of, Yo, Total, help me saying.

No Total. No total. Y'all are never gonna let me live that down now. I'm sorry, sorry. I'm sorry. I love you, total, guys. What about us as a jam? Look, yeah, come on. Okay. Soul food soundtrack. We'll get to that. We'll get to that. We'll get to that. We'll get to that. And due time. Yeah. How long did it take work in? How long did it take work

on that because that's a lot of songs I can't even remember it was a couple of months probably how long did it take to do Aretha's song I love that that's one of my favorites really yeah

I figured she would be the hardest client she came in and sang that in three takes what? Damn so the Mavericks just knock it out let me find out like Faith Evans took 12 weeks to do her vocals she wasn't used to You know what I mean taking that one.

No, no, no, I just meant like, just throwing a record. Aretha basically will come in. You got three times, and it's way out of here, you know. So all the Mavericks are just like, yo. Shaka, too, because she does. That's how they had to do it back then. Everyone wasn't no pro tools in. And that was fun.

Chaka, I actually went to England and recorded her there in England. So that was fun. And that was, it was, it was, as you're putting the project together, you feel like it's special, which you don't completely know. And when it was all put together, it was the first time I handed something into Clive

and he had no comments. Was that a good or bad thing? It was an amazing thing. I was like, really? You sure you don't want me try to do something? And so there was questions about, you know, from a lot of different people.

of his questions. I remember I had a say this had a big debate with Andre Harrell about you know, Mary's song. Not going to cry. Not going to cry. Because he felt like that was Mary was too young to sing that song. What?

Well, because, you know, it's... Did he hear the my life album? Yeah, that will get him. Yeah. Well, he said about the years of my life. I gave all these years and it's kind of like a married divorce kind of situation. Married divorced kids. Yeah. It was like But she was the vessel for that. Like that's one of her live.

She still kills that. I was going to say, like, I think that really took her from Joyne next door to sister girl, Mary. It made her grow up and maybe they weren't ready to. It was her first pop. Yeah. Yeah. It was? Yeah.

Oh, wow. Wow. But it was about, I mean, I explained to him. I said, you know, look, the thing about Mary is that she has all this pain. and has the voice to tell the story. And so she is, as you say, she was a vessel for Angela, you know, for Angela's role in that movie. And because of that, it sold and it worked.

And so there's something about all the women that were involved with that movie, as more time goes by, how special it seems, you know, that the work that they did that everybody did, as part of that movie musically as well as the actual filming it. Sofu soundtrack. How close did you guys ever get to a milestone project

or was it just that one song? That's actually good question. I want to know what that recording Casey. Yeah, I want to know what that session was like. It was a great, it was a great session. It was so much fun. I mean, I wanted,

The great thing about doing soundtracks is you got to work with artists that you hadn't had a chance to work with yet. And to create a reason to work together and the whole milestone thing that was perfect. I purposely just kind of took a back step and was letting it be the guys between Kevin and Melvin and Casey and Jojo and just to hear their voices. They always talked about a milestone thing,

but it never really, I think it was record company issues or whatever like that. And it's always something that I've always played around with, you know, thinking about trying to do it at one point, but we just never got there. What was the advantage of producing that movie and that soundtrack, though? Because that was like your first, that was, wasn't it, when was that the first time you did both? Evan's entertainment, yeah. It was first, sorry, I was.

I was thinking it was the first time, but I couldn't remember of have plenty. What's it in terms of? That was jab young. Okay, produced in the soundtrack and the movie. Yeah, the movie. Love 40, babe. I have to say, yeah. That was great.

Like, freaking have plenty. That would have the DVD. I have watched Love 40. That's my life. Yeah. Like, I thought that was somebody else's life. Well, yeah, that's his life, too. I try to explain DeAngelo.

This is a movie about your life that you don't know about. He's still. Yeah, I heard about this. So how did that project wind up in your lap? The, it was kind of, we ran into the, I'm losing his name right now, Chris, Chris Schroo. Chris Schroo. Damn, how do you know this?

I have the DVD. Thank you. Low 40. Chris Schroo, we ran from at Sundance and we were able to kind of take that film where we took it to Sundance and was able to get it made through. You know, and that way. But we had saw the film and loved it. Thought he was great. That whole Love 40 thing was amazing.

By the way, Steve, do you know the story behind this? No. Steve engineered DeAngelo's voodoo. Nice. Not the lead engineer. Oh. Dog, you were there. I was there.

We were there in prison for six years. Yeah, I was going to say, like, Michael Jack. and took a week. You guys got the match. He got a magic. Yeah, so Love 40 was supposed to be like brown sugar, like a song about

40 ounces of love. Like literally this guy, I guess the narrative is that the lead protagonist was in love with. What's her name? She used to work at... Her name was Havelin Savage.

Right, no, no, no. But I meant The real name. The real... You really know that movie. Capitalist is savage. I got to go back to watch it. I can... If you were in the adjo, I told you.

Well, she used to date D. She knew her Maxwell. Right. No, no, no. But I'm saying that the ANR that worked at the publishing spot that D was playing at when he got signed, he and her started dating. So the movie's really based on a real life story of this kind of triangle between. this R&B singer

and the object of her affections and the guy that, like, he just basically made a movie about it. And, yeah, it's quite crazy. We're going to take some half-plenty sales up. That's what's up. You never seen it? Yo, it's been a long...

I don't think. I've actually never seen it. I don't think I didn't want... Thank you, Bill. It's a classic. It's really. It's a classic. A win is a win. A win is a win.

I don't care what I'm saying. Yep, that's me. Clipper Taylor the Fourth. You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes,

creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment. And the next, we'll talk about life, mental health, purpose, and even music. The Clifford Show isn't just a podcast. It's a space for honest conversations, stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger.

So if you've ever supported me or you're just chasing down a dream, this is right where you need to be. Listen to The Clifford show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. There's two golden rules that any man should live by.

Rule one, never mess with a country girl. You play stupid games, you get stupid prizes. And rule two, never mess with her friends either. We always say that, trust your girlfriends. I'm Anna Sinfield, and in this new season of the girlfriends, Oh my God, this is the same man. A group of women discover they've all dated the same prolific con artist. I felt like I got hit by a truck.

I thought, how could this happen to me? The cops didn't seem to care. So they take matters into their own hands. I said, oh, hell no. I vowed I will be his last target. He's going to get what he deserves. Listen to the girlfriends. Trust me, babe.

On the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Ego Wode. My next guest, you know from Step Brothers Anchorman, Saturday Night Live and the Big Money Players Network. It's Will Ferrell. Woo, woo, woo, woo. My dad gave me the best advice ever.

I went and had lunch with them one day. And I was like, and dad, I think I want to really give this a shot. I don't know what that means, but I just know the groundlings. I'm working my way up through and I know it's a place that come look for up and coming talent. He said, if it was based solely on talent, I wouldn't worry about you, which is really sweet. Yeah. He goes, but there's so much luck involved. And he's like, just give it a shot.

And he goes, but if you ever reach a point where you're banging your head against the wall, and it doesn't feel fun anymore, it's okay to quit. If you saw it written down, it would not be an inspiration. It would not be on a calendar of, you know, the cat. Just hang in there. Yeah, it would not be. Right, it wouldn't be that. There's a lot of luck.

Listen to Thanks Dad on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. All right. So you said you never got tired of yourself on the radio. But, I mean, towards, I mean, after, like, what do you say when Eric Clapton comes calling, like, is it, oh, yeah, of course. Like, yeah, you say God himself is. How does he know who I am? That's what you say. Whose idea was that?

Kathy Nelson from, MCA, MCA, yeah. How do you know that? He has the DVD. Kathy Nelson, I know her name because she was. on the CB4 soundtroth. Whatever. Anyway. Good job.

I can't wait to on my 8 billion in this episode. Right. Yo, you're like a walking to credit. He's walking discogs.com. I know. Oh, my God.

Jesus. All right. So she came on with the idea. Kathy Nelson. Yeah, she called and said that, you know, she had this idea. I had this song. Winona Judd had done the song and sent me the song.

Let me hear it. And then she said, Now I have this idea for you to do it with Eric Clapton. I sent it to Eric Clapton and actually Eric Clapton said he would do it, but he would only do it if you produced it. And I was like, well, how does he even know who I am? And then we got on the phone and he told me that he was a fan of he loved the song, When Can I See You Again?

And said that, you know, he was very inspired by that. And he thought I could do a good job with him on that. So went to England. and recorded it with. That was a crying song. I just remember when I came out and the video came out. You just started crying.

Oh, if I could change the world. Change the world. And how come, how long? Oh, Lord. Don't play that video. It's just a lot. Where'd you record that song? Which one?

The Clapton song. In England, I forget the name of the studio. That was that we recorded part of it there and then part of it here in record. Was that after, I'm trying to remember. Was that after Tickabao? I don't know.

I got my Madonna. I don't know. Yeah, Madem was before. She was 94. Okay, thank you. Was it easy recording her or? Yeah, me and Madonna got along very well. Same thing she liked when can I see you.

And so she went to work together because of that. And she came to my house at the time I was living on Sandy Cedron. and we wrote the song there at the house and actually I had a little studio in the house where we recorded part of it there. One question I always had, a project always had a question about was Tony Rich. Tony Rich.

I was afraid to ask. Yeah, because I thought it was you. Yeah, the first time I heard it, yeah. Yeah, so how did that come about? When me in L.A. were mad at each other. Okay, what happened? I can't tell that. Never mind.

Yeah. But how many artists were a reflection of it? We got to Kevin Campbell, we had the Tony Rich. But me and LA kind of had fell out. And so Pebs went to find another me, so she found Tony Rich. You did not write Nobody Knows? Nope. No, he did.

No, he did. That's why I thought it was. I had that album. I need laser shots. Whoops. You did not write that? I did not. You had nothing to do with that?

Nothing to do with it other than him being on my label. Yeah, like he has the plaque. for his greatest biter on his wall. It's like, that's like super reception. It's like, that's a good one, no. Like, that's a good fight. Like, I'm a fight with you, but you're going to get paid.

Don't worry about it. Wait a minute. I thought you wrote. So many people thought that, but no. No, or at least sing backup on it. Nah. Now, when I first heard John B, I thought that was, because they was like, yeah, that's the new John B

featuring Babyface. I was like, okay, when did John B sing? I didn't know he was on that record. When I said I was afraid to ask, I mean, the thing was like, I was like, how do you feel about working with someone that sounds so closely to you? Like, how did you, it's the Walter and Scotty situation. I didn't know that you had nothing. He had shit to do with that, Jay.

That was all Tony Rich, baby. Okay. And nobody knew it except those two. No, I had that album. I think I ordered, like, from Columbia houses and shit. Yeah, but I had that record. 12 seats for $4. That's...

Yeah. Yeah. I literally just lost my mind right now. Your mind and your thought. So I wanted to ask you with Jab Yom, what were some of the artists? One of the artists that you guys had signed, Lornea.

Lorne. Lorne. Lorne. Yeah. That's how you can say. But I like your son. I thought it was Lornea, too. Lorne, he was great artist.

Yes. And she had, I mean, she had amazing voice. That wasn't, but that was, Tracy's label. That wasn't really my label. That was like that thing. That was kind of like their thing. And I supported it. But Lornae was one of those really great artists that, you know.

I'm sorry it didn't work out for her. I think it shouldn't because she's amazing voice. And also amazing spirit about her as well. Beautiful person. The evolution of Tracy Edmonds is quite amazing. Like, she has become a role model for a lot of women, especially executives.

How do you, how do you, How does that make you feel like some of the things that you guys built? I'm proud that she was able to, you know, come from where she came from because, you know, people just, they, you know, she was in a video, so they called a video girl. And so I spent a good deal of time trying to take that off of her and give her the opportunity to prove that, you know, that she's a business person, business. I mean, that soul food was just. So it was a lot more about that, you know. women in business many times they

they will not get the same shot because they because they think that they don't know what they're doing or are it's just this you know it's a chauvinistic man's game yeah and so I think when you can when you have when you're in a position to help help someone then that's what you should do

yeah a buddy of mine a new artist that you're working with or she said you guys are working you have the Cat Graham. Yeah. She wanted me to ask you, which I thought was a great question, what do you do when you have writers block? Is that even a thing?

Do you have rights rights? Does that even exist? Yeah, you just don't write. Just let it go. Just stop. You just don't write. I thought it was a baby face pun. Yeah, all right.

Oh, let it go. No, it's let it flow. Random baby face question I just wanted to ask in the last two years. Solid. Can you tell me how solid came about And how did Ty Dahlia? How did that happen?

Ty called here and wanted to work with me. And you just... And I said, great, because I love his voice and incredible voice. And then as I met him, we just did some more work together just recently, too. But when we started to work together and then I saw how much of a musician he was. That's what I was impressed about. Does he play? Yeah.

Yeah. And good musician. And so he's very untapped in terms of what his real talent is, I think. And I think that will keep showing as more time goes by. But it was fun to do that than we just recently did some more work again. And I like doing work everywhere. So whether it's hip-hop or whether it's country or any genre. To be able to, why I feel so blessed is because I can,

work with the Thai-Dalassine, you know. And a little Wayne. Then I can also, then I'm working with Johnny Mathis. I do with Barbara Streis. Oh, shit. Johnny Mathis? Oh, God. I have a question.

What was it like, how did the Fall Out Boy project work come about? Oh, that was great too. Because that's, that seems like really random. No, that's, it's another thing where I get calls from, you know, these artists that, you know, Patrick from Fall Out Boy called and wanted to, wanted to do some work and, and went to figure out how we could work together. And so I was able to, you know, do a couple of things with them. And they called me because of the Josie and the Pussycats movie

and the music I did for the Josie and the Pussy Cats. I was going to say I once tried to do this like real serious symposium like in New York. And I had their ears and then I had to give a reference. And I gave a Josie and the Pussy Cat reference and the collective. Lost everybody. They were like, get out of here. But the thing was, y'all were really

trying to drop some science in that movie. I mean, it was beyond, I watched it on, it was on the airplane when you're on the airplane. But it wasn't the standard popcorn fair. You guys were literally trying to expose

all the magician's tricks to how the industry works. Yeah. and I almost felt like when I watched it I was like wait are you all allowed to do this like how are they not trying to get rid of you guys like what was I mean what was the

it was because because it was colored in in this comical you know have you guys seen it I haven't seen it it's a like they're literally exposing the industry it's like behind it

what's the behind the Behind the music? That behind the music documentary I did where they expose how records get on Clear Channel and all that stuff. Behind the song. I forget what it's, but this is like the movie version of that. It's a great movie, actually. And the music was funny. And so it's one of those projects I'm proud to have been a part of for sure.

A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what I'm saying. Yep, that's me. Clipper Taylor. the fourth. You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show.

This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment. And the next, we'll talk about life, mental health, purpose, and even music. The Clifford Show isn't just a podcast. It's a space for honest conversations, stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger. So if you've ever supported me or you're just chasing down a dream,

this is right where you need to be. Listen to the Clifford show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. There's two golden rules that any man should live by. Rule one, never mess with a country girl. You play stupid games, you get stupid prizes. And rule two, never mess with her friends either.

We always say that trust your girlfriends. I'm Anna Sinfield, and in this new season of the girlfriends... Oh my God, this is the same man. A group of women discover they've all dated the same prolific con artist. I felt like I got hit. by a truck. I thought, how could this happen to me? The cops didn't seem to care. So they take matters into their own hands. I said, oh, hell no. I vowed. I will be his last target. He's going to get what he deserves. Listen to the girlfriends. Trust me, babe. On the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts,

or wherever you get your podcast. I'm Ego Wode. My next guest, you know from Step Brothers, Anchorman, Saturday Night Live, and The Big Money Players Network. It's Will Ferrell. My dad gave me the best advice ever. I went and had lunch with them one day. And I was like, and Dad, I think I want to really give this a shot. I don't know what that means, but I just know the groundlings. I'm working my way up through and I know it's a place that come look for up and coming talent. He said, if it was based solely on talent, I wouldn't worry about you, which is really sweet. Yeah. He goes, but there's so much luck involved. And he's like,

just give it a shot. He goes, but if you ever reach a point where you're banging your head against the wall and it doesn't feel fun anymore, it's okay to quit. If you saw it written down, it would not be an inspiration. It would not be on a calendar of, you know, the cat. Just hang in there. Yeah, it would not be. Right, it wouldn't be that.

There's a lot of luck. Listen to thanks, Dad, on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. So I guess there was Not necessarily a silence But before you did your solo project in 2001 Face to face Yeah With the Neptunes

Like at that point Did you just feel like Okay well I don't totally have to have like 15 number ones every year Like I can Like what made you want to Let someone else produce you?

That was rough And working with the Neptune Well that was cool okay um because i wanted to learn and i i work with uh younger writers and younger producers that i like to see what they do um there's never a point where you can't learn more and um and to watch feral work and and you know because he was doing everything all in this inside and it was like wait a minute this is all you use right that was amazing um and to see him at that particular point i i I told him at that point,

I'd say I know that one day he's going to blow up because of the passion that he has with everything. And I kind of already kind of liked everything that he did. But at that point, what was different for that project for me was that I really kind of let go and let everybody kind of produce me. So Heavy D. He was part of that. And he brought in a couple of songs. And I was working with Andre Hirel.

And so I really kind of was just, letting them guide me um okay so i have a story do you know the story i'm about to tell oh jesus christ all right so uh earlier that day the roots are at the house of blues um this is like this might have been 99 i guess um and i got a weird phone call that i didn't trust and my manager's like Yo, you're going to go to Babyface's studio after the show tonight. And I was like, for what? He's like, I don't know, to work on stuff. I said, does he want me to drum on stuff?

Like, see, make sure my backlines there. I'm thinking I'm going there to drum on it. They're like to see about production. And I was like, okay, who's punking me? Like, why in the world with the world's most successful songwriter? want to dweeb with me like with one and the half hits. I'm like, that doesn't sound right. So I instantly thought it was set up.

I thought it was set up time. So you didn't? Between 96 and 2002, the kind of, no, no, the kind of what they do. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Mountain was following me. And I always felt that some, even with Biggie going, like, I always felt, like there was going to be some like bad boy retaliation about to happen. And it really got confirmed because when we're on stage doing the last, like by this point,

like Scratch and Razzell we're doing their solo parts in the show. And, you know, the show was about the end. I looked to the stage left. And I saw these three big dudes, like three big monsters, L.A. dudes at the side. And Tina's like, these guys are going to drive you to baby faces. So, and I thought, I'm a die. I'm a die. So, you know, we get off stage and they're like,

Yeah, what's up, man? How you doing? We're going to drive you to face the studio. And I knew by that point I was going to die because I was like, this is how bad boy gets me back for the what they do video. And we walked out of the dressing room. We're in the hallway. And I distinctly remember it running back to the dressing room.

and I grabbed a bag of Lays Mesquite barbecue chips because I was like, okay, well, at least want to, this is going to be my last meal before I die. And we get in the car and it's just like the mafia films. Like I sat in the middle. Wow. I sat in the middle. I flanked between these two guys.

They drive me to the studio. We go down in this sort of tunnel thing. And walking in the hallway was like, the green mile death row scene. It was 100% dark, no lights on, and I just like, oh, fuck, I'm about to get baseball bad at the death, like, this is how I'm going to die. And I opened the door, and it's Heavy D. And I was like, Heavy D?

He said, hey, man, come on, man. And then I knew it was a setup, because I was like, I didn't know Heavy D as a producer then. You know what I mean? I was like, what are you doing here? So yeah, man, you know, producing baby face. And then I was like, no. I'm like, no, man, you didn't know I produced? Yeah, man, I get down working on Jill Scott too.

And then like, he plays me all these songs. And, you know, by that point, I was like, shh. It's not a hit. Then he got you like on, you were like in another studio somewhere. You got on the phone like on another line. But yeah, I thought that I was going to. die that night. I thought baby face is going to kill me.

What did y'all end up doing? What's doing? I end up breathing the side relief and took about five pounds off of me going back to the bathroom. No, I mean, I'm talking to the, we didn't work together. No, no, no, I, listen, well, by that point, you know, we were, like, torn like crazy, so I just didn't have time to, okay, to commit to that. Yeah. But, yeah, I knew that I was being pranked because there was no way in.

hell that I was supposed to be working on a baby face record. I sound like you to one person he hasn't worked with yet. Yeah, I was about to say. I was about to say, I mean, you're both here right now. I mean, we are in a studio. The duet that you did with Raphael Sadiq, did you talk about letting other cats produce you was that in instance of that? Yeah, it was on the, it was on Ray Ray Ray, Ray.

It was on Ray Ray, Ray. Yeah, I mean, me and Raphael, we, We're kind of like the same dude sometimes. And so, like, working with him was kind of like working with myself. He... Is that a good thing or bad thing? That's a good thing. I don't, with him, I don't worry about it.

If I'm behind the microphone, the hardest part for me is being behind the microphone and singing and then letting somebody tell me if that was good or that wasn't good. And I'm like, that wasn't good. and I could do it again or whatever and so I did I did the same thing

actually I did there was an I worked with Jimmy and Terry that way we did some work together and standing behind that mic and being just the artist

I did it with Jimmy and Terry I did it once with David Foster and and that's a hard place for me to be it just I feel like I have more control. I know kind of what to do myself.

What was it like working with Terry and Jimmy? Was that super surreal for you? We had fun. We did some records that are still nice records, I think. But they weren't exactly they weren't right for the record we were doing at the time. It ultimately didn't come out. They've talked about releasing

a lot of songs. I said whenever they want to put it on the record that they do of all the artists, they work with them, I'm fine with that. But that stock record, Yeah. Okay. That sort of thing. But the actual, it was the first time actually kind of being in and actually working with them.

And we, I guess everybody's different in terms of how they do things and how they approach records. So it's always fun to watch that and see different musicians that they'll bring in and stuff. and if you keep your eyes open, you can always learn something, you know, of a feel, and learn how to play something a little bit different. One question I had about Tony, and this may have been more of an L.A. thing now that you've kind of broken it down.

When she sued LaFace, how did you guys get from her suing LaFace to now y'all, you know, doing the love marriage and divorce album? I've always been an artist-friendly person so I understood where she was coming from when she sued she was suing because there was nothing we could do about it we had a joint venture and so we didn't really make the final

answers on it so everything that was we would have gave everybody everything but we could she was under the arrester yeah and so when we wanted to pay somebody they wouldn't let us and and so we were both the TLC and the Tony Braxton situation was because when they came to us and asked for money, we'd say, yep, we agree, we want to give you.

They wouldn't let us do it. So they sued us, and then they ultimately gave them the money. Why wouldn't they let you let you pay them? Were you guys that label proper or a production deal? Because usually with the production deal, it's like, he got to get a guy, he got to get a guy. He might as well have been a production there. It was a JV, but the reality is we couldn't make the complete cause.

They handled the person. So, um, do you have a relationship with Clive Davis? Yeah, I do. What is your feeling with him? Clive is, I've, a businessman. Yeah, he's a businessman. I work with him in so many, on so many different things, um, that I've had to work with them on, you know, because it's Whitney Houston, you

know, there was, I'm working with him right now with Johnny, Johnny Mathis. That's crazy. Wait, Clive still has a label? he's at least a and ring this he's the head of this he came up with this whole idea about johnny mathis doing um the songbook um okay you know a new a new songbook that um what is clive david clive is 80 in his 80 84 maybe damn it takes a licking and johnny mathis is 82 yeah i was what's his vocal prowess like it sounds great he still he sounds great he sounds great he sounds great I saw him on, he was on Tavis Smiley, I think, one night I was watching this like a year so ago. Yeah. He sounds great.

Okay, so before we wind down, and I know every songwriter does this like, oh, my songs are my children. Yes. Gun to your head. Gun to your head. If all your songs are personified as human beings on the Titanic and they're going down in the ship. Who do you say? Which three songs are. Are You Saving?

What is your... Yes! It doesn't have to be like your biggest hits or whatever. So don't say in the road or whatever because like, oh, that got me my first house in Malibu. Maybe it might be his one of this. But I meant like, what songs like give you goosebumps or best memories of recording it or... Like, ones that still impress you? Like, I made that, really?

How did that come out of me? That is a hard question because you have to... When I think about, I have to think about it. Obviously, one of those will be a Whitney song because she's not here. So now, XL, and I'm your baby tonight, feel like very special because of that. But not necessarily because I love them more than any particular song. Ceremona. So, and I always give the question, what's the best song I've ever written?

I haven't written yet. I haven't written yet. Okay. But the truth is, I really believe that. I don't say that to sound sound cool. I say it because I look at the songs that other people writes.

Damn, I wish I wrote that one. Okay, so what three songs of yours could you like, I hate that? Like, yeah, it could have been better. Or I phoned that one in. Well, I wish I had another opportunity to work with Michael Jackson

and not have given them slave to the rhythm, but a better song. I did do I got it. Yeah, I did do that one. And it was, the funny thing is, Michael Jackson has a song

and get on the bus? That's why I just, really? Yeah. It's called like on the line or something. Got to put my, got to put your heart on the line. Damn.

And, and I loved that I had that opportunity to. I was able to, I ultimately became friends with Michael and, and found my places, find myself in places with Michael, like,

what am I doing here? Throughout my career, I find myself at places where I have to pinch myself. How am I here? So many times, whether it's just being there as an artist or being presidents, hanging with presidents, going to, I went to a trip to Nice with Michael Jackson and saw him perform on the stage,

and he had me standing in the dressing room off to the side as he would go back and forth. And I'm like, and why am I? And why am I here? Why am I here when you said to me, Rhythm Nation, I want Rhythm Nation? How did that happen? He liked that energy.

So, yeah, he did, ultimately, he said, you know, you and I, we have the same sense of humor because we're both from Indiana. Hey, there's some truth. I think there's some truth of that. Yeah, I don't know. Well, I got to say. So you didn't answer your questions.

No, of course you did. But Babyface, I really, really, really, truly want to thank you for letting us. Yes, man. Pick your brain. And I was a... In here, in your space. One of my Titanic Babyface songs would be Lady Lady, like off. I love that song, man.

I think it's like, God. You're such an R-B-Doo, man. Yo, man, that's the record. If you tank that, I'm taking at the movies. Where's your one? I never do this title right, but, you know, Shoot them up movies. I was like,

still to this day, that movie. Yo, shoot them up movies. Oh, that's glad. There is a, there is a cover. There's been a cover of Shoot Em Up movies done by Moby Dick on No Limit Records. Say what now? What? What?

It is, it is one of the worst. It covers you ever. Here in your life, I don't know what baby face is hurting. I don't know. I've heard that. No, no, it's shoot-em-up movies done by, by, Kobe Dick who used to do all the hooks for no one. Oh, that sounds like a bad idea.

I don't know if it's worse than the TJ Swan and Whitney here. Oh, my God. Yes. TJ and Whitney. I still think he's mine. This is it. This was 98. This is like, how do you have heard it?

No, no, no, you got to do. This is such a metal moment right now. You have to have heard it because he had the best pay up. No. No, no. No. No. It's just, yeah, it's just, here we go.

Come on. Okay. Oh, it's double? Yeah, no. I was ready for that good old. How do you know this, Fonte? Dude, like, yo, I was a no limit head. Like, I just, there was in college, like, I just consumed too much music as a kid, man.

Okay, that hurts a little bit. Wait to the hook. The hook, because that's what it really just gets kind of pain. This It sounds like me and my bedroom recording myself Sing along to the radio He's trying right there Oh, never

It's a video Oh, it was a video Oh my God, it was At least they had the movie I want to have a meet with salons now All right Here we go, come on Come with it, Mova

Come on Hold on, listen Here we go Hold on, hold on, hold on. Wait, wait, here's come. He tried it, he tried it, he tried it. Oh, Moby Dick. All right.

It's beautiful. Thank you, baby face for that. Thank you. Thank you for that. Wow. Again, we appreciate everything that you've done in your legacy. Yes, thank you. You are a black god.

Oh, and let me just say They're like pieces of my life in the hallway If you get a chance to see a baby face show today Like, please do because you surprised the shit out of me The way you jump in the crowd and do like goes to church It was just amazing. So I do like tell people that the show is amazing, bro. I just want to say you were probably the last artist

That everyone in my family was able to enjoy My dad bought two copies of the Waiting to Exhale Sound Track kept one in the car, one in the bedroom Wow Yeah My mom I call you I called my mom just before this to let her know that I was interviewing you and she, like, almost probably hopped on a plane to come meet us here.

My sister, she's the one that, you know, brought tender lover into the house. Wow. You know, it's like, you are the one that brought my family together, I guess you could say. Is there someone that you haven't worked with yet? That I haven't worked with you. Ah. We in the studio. Bang, bang, gotcha.

See, I. All right. We should do that someday. Yes, we should definitely work with someday. But in general, I think, I mean, there's always artists that come up that I'd be honored to work with. But, you know, I have been so lucky to have worked with so many artists that if I don't, I'll be all right. I see it. That's an awesome feeling.

That's got to be great to serve. If you never make another record ever, like, you do. You're good. You're good. Forever. Forever. So, like, Sugar's. Steve, all right, so we do our reflections at the end.

What have you learned this episode? I'm still on one of the first things I heard 40 nominations. That's incredible. I was going to say probably got a nomination even for the writer's block. Even my writer's block is sponsored by Nairz. What have I learned? What did you learn? I think I've learned that like all these songs, you're such a machine that in my mind,

every song meant something deep. and was based on something, but you're such a machine that it doesn't always, and that's all right, because it does to me. That's what I learned. Fondon, take a little more. Man, what I learned is just really just kind of reinforced

something I've always believed just for him saying that it's all about the song, you know what I mean, and just how it really is easy to give stuff away just because if you feel that it can be better served for another person, it's easy to be unselfish in that way because you just see it has a higher purpose. and, you know, Bobby could take it further than I could or boys to men or whoever, whoever.

That's just something that's really inspiring and very, very wise. Boss Bill? Jacoby. Yo, yeah, the slang, Jacoby, Bree. Yeah, yeah. Still working on Bree. She'd check out General Hospital.

It's also, really good. Check out CBS. I know General Hospital. Luke and Lori. I was going to say, when we stop this, when we leave like five, from now. What's the... Oh, we forgot to ask about it. What was it?

We covered everything, right? I feel like... We got the face artist. We got the face. We got the face. Okay. Wait. Damien Danian. No, we didn't ask about Damien. One thing, I don't... We may have touched on a little bit, but just... I guess we covered it. Yeah. Never mind. What was that? What was... Well, I was going to ask you, do you prefer writing for women or men? Because you do such a great job writing for women.

Like, I don't think there's any other male songwriter that can write for a woman the way that you do. So, like, I was going... Do you have a preference? I don't have a preference, but I know that I can, for women, it's a lot of times here in recent years, when I get someone comes in the studio, we have a conversation. And we talk a lot, and I get into, it's like a Dr. Phil moment by the time. So I go for tears in our first conversation.

Are you trying to, Barbara Walters then? Yes. What kind of questions are you asked? I go in for the relationships and everything so that we can get to a point to where we can so I can know them and I can try to write from that perspective because it gives you something

at that particular point. Sometimes you can guess about somebody and try to figure out who they are before you get to them. It's like when Whitney first came and heard the song Miracle. She wasn't ready for it. But when she heard it, she cried.

And at least she had tears in her eyes. And so she said, that's not for me. And I thought to myself, to be honest, I thought to myself, it's not for you because it is for you. You know, and you don't, the truth is, I thought you don't want to sing things that you can relate to. So ultimately, you go after songs that don't touch you.

Is that how you got her to change your mind on it? Well, later on, she decided to do the song, and I don't know what made her decide to do it. Jedi mind your. Maybe so. All right. I have one more question. Okay.

This is a production question. When I listen to, like, Jimmy Jamming, Terry Lewis, I can usually tell who their B team was for a certain era. I can never, I don't think you've ever had a, like, a B team under you, or have you? Like, just a team that, you know, you know, does most of the current, Darrell was kind of a beat team in terms of he might produce some of the vocals. Darrell's really good at produce some of the vocals. But in terms of tracks and things in the early days, we kind of like did it ourselves.

And we would really, I don't even really remember putting our name on something that we didn't do the tracks, that we put our name on it like it was us. That wasn't, we usually just gave the credit to like it was K.O. and Darrell, then they got the credit for producing it. All right. And this is like a first. You sure? No, I know.

This is a first for Bill. I'm good. I'm good. I'm good. Man, this baby face. Come on, man. I think it's in Indiana. All right.

All right. Here it is. I used to work at Def Jam a long time ago. And we went on this company retreat. And I can't remember the entire story. But L.A. was telling the story about, um, you guys took a, I think it was a deal record to a club. You guys were, like, pumped up. You guys thought this was going to be, like, the biggest record in the world.

You guys took it to a club to test it out. And it tanked. Yeah. Like, what do you do then? Like how what was your how did you feel like knowing that your intuition wasn't right on that was that particular one? What we learned is that that wasn't our gig. When Teddy came out with I won it when we heard that I won it. The first time I heard that I said oh my God this is this is changing the game and I don't know I don't know that we can compete with that and then when Teddy delivered my prerogative

on the Don't Be Cruel album was like, ugh. So rather than trying to be that, we just kind of went the other way. And we weren't trying to be dance music people. We didn't think we were going to necessarily make everybody dance for say, we were just going to entertain. And so it was really, when we were going there checking these songs

in the clubs, that was early on, that's like in the deal days, We didn't have that. That wasn't part of our thing. And so part of what happened is because of the ballad. Because I fell in love and got broken hearts, that's ultimately what helped shape us as producers and writers and that opened up the door for us.

Because even though don't be cruel, still was a love song, you know, what it was about. It wasn't let me get up in there. So, um... Who was Jackie? I'm sorry. Yeah. Who was Jackie?

Jackie and don't be controlled. And don't be cruel, yeah. And don't be cruel. Regardless to the fact that I want you, Jackie, I want you to want you to hear of the sea. But you had to stop killing. Okay. Trying to make a killer.

Okay. You're with me, Bobby B. And with a bad attitude, I can't compete. That was my name. Now you know my name. You want to be with me. You want to be with me. You're going to be the same way.

that a little girl would be. And if you want to be with, I don't be cruel. Don't be, don't be. And that's the, all my two, that'd be amazing. On me, have a fine night ago, Bill, boss bill, and, uh, unpaid bill. And by you. That's like four bills and no Steve.

Baby face, thank you very much. Thank you. Thank you. What's Love Supreme. Goodbye. What's Love Supreme is a production of Iheart Radio. This classic episode was produced by the team at Bandora. For more podcasts from IHeartRadio, visit the IHartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,

or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what I'm saying. Yep, that's me, Clifford Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, my basketball and college football journey, or my career in sports media. Well, now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Cliver Show.

This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be. heard but celebrated. So let's get to it. Listen to the Clifford show on the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcast or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow

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He's going to get what he deserves. We always say that Trust your girlfriends. Listen to the girlfriends. Trust me, babe. On the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. This week on the Sports Slice podcast, it's all about the NFL draft. And we've got a special guest.

The director of the NFL's East West Shrine Bowl, Eric Galco, joins the SportsSliced podcast to break down what really matters when evaluating draft prospects. From hidden traits teams look for to the biggest mistakes, make to the players flying under the radar. This is the insight you won't hear anywhere else. If you want to understand the draft like an insider, you don't want to miss this episode. Listen to the Sports Slice Podcast on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Slical Life 12 and TikTok podcast network on TikTok.

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