The Questlove Show - QLS Classic: Black TV Writers Roundtable Pt.1

Episode Date: November 8, 2021

Breaking down the state of Black hollywood, acclaimed writers, Tracey Ashley, Diallo Riddle, Bashir Salahuddin, and Angela Nissel get real with Team Supreme on part one of this two-part Black TV writers' roundtable. Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-heart podcast. Guaranteed human. A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what you're saying. Yep, that's me. Clifford Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits,

my basketball and college football journey, or my career in sports media. Well, now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, the Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfills of conversations with athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated.

So let's get to it. Listen to the Clifford show on the IHeard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok podcast network on TikTok. This week on the Sports Slice podcast, it's all about the NFL draft. And we've got a special guest. The director of the NFL's East West Shrine Bowl, Eric Galco, joins the Sports Slice podcast to break down what really matters when evaluating draft prospects. From hidden traits teams look for to the biggest mistakes franchises make to the players flying under the radar.

This is the insight you won't hear anywhere else. If you want to understand the draft like an insider, you don't want to miss this episode. Listen to the Sports Slice podcast on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, for wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Slical Life 12 and TikTok podcast network on TikTok. When a group of women discover they've all dated

the same prolific con artist, they take matters into their own hands. I vowed, I will be his last target. He is not going to get away with this. He's going to get what he deserves. We always say that trust your girlfriends. Listen to the girlfriends. Trust me, babe.

On the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I got you. Korsloaf Supreme is a production of IHeart Radio. This classic episode was produced by the team at Pandora. Yo, yo, what up? This is Fonte, Fon Ticolo, and I'm here with you. This week's QLS Classic. This week we go back to February 7th, 2019 with our Black TV Writers' Roundtable, Part 1.

In this episode, we break down the state of black Hollywood with acclaimed writers and very good friends of mine, Tracy Ashley, Diallo Riddle, Mishir Saladin, and Angela Nissel. They all get real with Team Supreme on part one, this two-part Black TV Writers' Roundtable, and it was a lot of fun. So check it out. KLS. Yeah. Supra, Supraima, sub, sub, sub, sub, subprima roll call. Suprema, sub, sub, subprima roll call. Black writer's symposium.

Yeah. Request love, you heard? Yeah. Trapped in a room? Yeah. With nine nerds. Rocawn. Suprema, sub, sub, subprima role call.

Suprema, sub, sub, subprima role call. My name is Fonte. Yeah. I ain't no phony. Yeah. I'm just here to help Angie. Yeah. Pay her alimony.

Roe Call. Supriva. Suprivo Roe Call. Still was younger. Yeah. Before Laiae was born. Yeah. I used to watch on TV.

Yeah. Scramble born. Roe Kong. Suprema. Subrema, Subrema, Role call. We're in Supremma, Submira. Thank you, Doctor. Such year and Dialla.

Yeah. Man, I almost forgot. Yeah. Oh, now I remember. Yeah. Hubble got you. Rocahn. Suprema, sub, sub, sub, subprima roll call.

It's Laeam. Yeah. And I'm here to impress. Yeah. All these folks in him? Yeah. With my writing prowess. Roecom.

Supriva, sub, sub, sub, supremo roll call. Supremma, sub, sub, sub, supremo roll call. My name is Tracy. Yeah. me Trey. Yeah. I worked all day. Yeah. So I can earn my pay. Roll call. Supremma. Suprema. Suprema, sub, sub, sub, supremo roll call. Supremma, sub, sub, sub, subprima roll call.

My name's Bashir. Yeah. And I was late. Yeah. But there's a lot of black people here. Yeah. So shit is great. Go call. Get it. Suprima. Subima. Subprema, sub, sub, sub, suprema role call. Supremma. Supremma. Supreme a, sub, sub, sub, subprima role call. My name's Diallo. Yeah. And here we are.

Yeah. Pulled up and says a sound. Yeah. In my shiny new car. Roll call. Suprima, sub, sub, supremo. Roll call. Supremia.

Subrima. Subrima, sub, sub, subprima, roll. I'm happy to be here. Yeah. If I say some dumb shit. Yeah. Then blame by shear. Ro call.

Suprema. Subima, sub, sub, sub, supremo roll call. So prima roll call. So, sub, sub, sub, subprima, roll call. Suprema, sub-supraima role call Suprema, sub-sup, Suprema roll call. Ladies and gentlemen, this is a special Black Hollywood symposium of Questlove Supreme.

Shout out to Barney Miller. From last comic standing, the Wanda Sykes hilarious, The Neighborhood with Sedgek the Entertainer. The Last OG, it's Tracy Ashley. Hey! Hey! Yes, from Chocolate News. Late Night with Jimmy Fallon, please come back.

Maya Marty, Southside, Marlon, Rise, the last OG. It's Diallo Riddle. Yeah. Lick a shot. Lick a shot. From Glow, Superstore, Gringo, Kirby, Enthusiasm, Snatch, The Tonight Show, and Late Night with Jimmy Fallon, The Mindy Project, Bones, Grace Anatomy,

Arrested Development, so much more, and yes, the last OG. We have, I ran out a theme. I'll do it again. Anywho What's up? Saladine. Saladine. Saladine.

I just want to say I've known Questlove for like 20 years and he still can't say my last name. I can't say most words. Anyway, Bashir Saluddin, ladies. He was good. He said most words.

Yeah. And ladies and gentlemen, finally, from OK player. Now, y'all, from the boom docks, from Scrubs, death from Tilex creators, the Jellies, and the last OG. Give it up for the one and only, Angela Nissel. You know, stress.

At the time when I... Okay. When I requested this show, I thought it was going to be like this very serious... Hell no. A special edition of What's Loves to Bring. Yeah, like the Meredith Baxter-Bernie. Yeah, the different strokes. Dudley goes to the bike store.

Dudley goes to the bike store with the pedal. Mr. Gump. Gordon jump. Instead, I see the alcohol here, so I realize this is drawn. Oh, we're live at the sunset sound. Shout out to Sunset Sound. We're in the famous studio three. Yes.

With Prince and, you know, all of his classic albums from 82 to 87. Also, Led Zeppelin, the doors. The Doors recorded the Doors here? Yeah. So the Doobie Brothers also. recorded here and so many others. Toto. Oh, Toto's.

What did you do it? The Jackson's. Imagine Dragons. Wait, you said Toto or Toto? I'm joking. I'm joking. I'm joking. All right.

You said total, right? Not Toto. Oh, yeah, not total. Well, hold on now, but where did Toto? What did Toto record? Let's do the next podcast there. We're Toto. Where did total record?

I'd be like, they recorded kissing you right here. Well, I know that boss Bill and Fonte would be very happy. I'm with it. I mean, not so much. Anyhow, no, I like Total. I love Total. Okay. We're not talking about the cereal. Kima Kea-Kisha, Pam. You read the book. I actually always talking about the cereal.

I'm cool. I'm only doing that because I know that you guys. I had a girl crush on Keisha. I'm my first. I'm sorry. We should talk about Total. Hey, you know, SWV's first name was TLC. Wait, seriously? Yeah. How do you know that? I know a lot of random facts. Nine nerds in a room.

All armed. All the Army nerves. Nine nerds in a room. Okay, so why did we all gather here today? Free wine. Okay. Who's paying for this wine? Actually, shout out to y'amese.

He got it from somewhere for free, but we appreciate that he gave it to us. He could have gave it to anybody, but he gave it to us. Shout out to the plug. It came in a box and it's really delicious. Yeah. Oh, the box of wine. The box of wine.

So, damn. Now I'm about to bring the mood down. No, let's talk about the state of black. Hollywood and writers. Oh, I need some more wine. Hold up. Hello. Hello. Can you hear Tracy that bottle of wine? Just give you the bottle.

Stay to Hollywood. Take the whole wine and save them the last time a black woman ran a network half. Okay, well, since the four of you, since the four of you have the last OG in common. Good show, by the way. That's crazy. All of us have worked on that show. It's hilarious. All of you have watched the last OG.

What was everyone's specific role or what role did you play in? You can go around the room. in that show since you all have that in common. From who got the first one? Who got the call first? See, all the one by Shire, we were on the first season. Yeah, season one. We were consulting producers on the show.

Jordan Peel. Can you explain what consulting producers are? You know, it's really just... Is that like... People who show up sometimes. Okay. I'll be honest, it's a little arbitrary. The titles are sometimes kind of conferred

based on the level they want to give you based on how much they want to pay you. But really, we kind of all do the same thing. going when we all talk about it we all try to figure out how to make a show better it's not really actual like unless you're like a writer assistant sometimes consulting uh producers they only come in a couple of days a week uh but between we didn't have that we didn't have that we didn't have that privilege yeah we had to come in every kind of like will smith's uh west philly homeboy consultant that was always credited at the end of the freshman bill there oh yeah yeah by the way i met uh harry smith last night

so uh shout out to mr harry smith from ms from uh no wills will smith's will smith's brother Oh, Harry, as an Ellen and Harry. I'm enjoying the show already. I would like to say that I'm co-executive produced on the last OG, so for the first time I found out that I got paid more than men. Hey. They only took you high long like three years. Five thousand bucks.

Big shouts. Shouts out to them. I know that there's a major difference. We'll be a major difference in season two than season one. Can you tell the difference between the two without burning bridges or getting fired? Watch season one. No, I'm kidding. Well, take us through the process of how a show runs.

Woo. I mean, it's what basically happened is I know that in season one, there's only two people left over. Tracy, you can help me. Yeah. Because Tracy actually opens up for Tracy Morgan on the roads. Oh, wow. Yeah, so she could actually, might be able to tell you more about the differences in season one, season two. Sure, sure.

The only thing I can, well, I wasn't in the room, so I can't speak. I think these two could speak. to it. I was in the room. I was in the room. There's only two other people that I know Mark Theobald and D.R. Kirkpatrick that came back. Yeah. Patrick, shout out. Shut out. They got, overall, the entire writer's room. Excuse me? Yeah. The entire

writer's room got over. Yeah. Pretty much. And by the way, that happened. Who did that? I would say, Tracy? Wouldn't you, Tracy and Jordan? I'm not sure. A lot more brown. Yeah, that's what I hear. That's definitely more brown. Yeah. Completely changed. Well, when Bashir and I I arrived like Miss Copacric was just she was very excited to see us yeah it was it was a very different kind of room okay yeah um and and no offense to anybody was in that room but it was nice

to have like a little injection of us and that by the way that was also when jordan's uh movie was blowing up so he couldn't be there every single day so god yeah it was uh yeah and i mean like i think it kind of shows because when uh basher and i showed up the uh scripts had you know one p o and I think that we help, you know, bring it to a PLV that worked a lot of hours is what he's trying to say. Yeah, we run a lot of midnight oil. A lot of time. Do you think that it was just assumed that because Tracy came from 30 Rock,

where, you know, the element of Tracy Morgan was allowed to be shown in that particular way? Well, I also know that Donald Glover wrote all of his dialogue for that show, but that it was okay. their eyes to a lot of science. No, no, no, no, I didn't, I learned. That's new information. I didn't know that. You didn't know that, you didn't know that Tina Faye hired Donald Glover specifically to

write all of Tracy Morgan's dialogue? TV shows are really, I'll put it this way and all the writers in here can agree. It's really mysterious. So like, even when somebody wins an award and they go on stage, that actually might not be the person who contributed the most of that episode. That's right. So you really don't know who does what until somebody like, you just now tells us. Yes, I will get cursed out online for an episode

and I'll be like, it has your name on it. People will understand I literally wrote two sentences in that episode. I just thought it was common knowledge that That's not coming about it. For real? I know he wrote on the show. I didn't know he was hired.

And also, where we're a war. Gouldling. Listen, listen, we call it a writer's room. That's a full movie. Donald Glover. On the Sabbath. I have heard different things about who. I will say I have to heard different things about

who wrote what on that show. But I've never heard. I never heard that. As much as I've heard of it. Tracy. I never, I didn't know that. Yeah, as much as she tore me. I did not know that. You work in 30 Rock, so you probably have information that we don't have.

Could it possibly be slightly incorrect or? No. Okay. Okay, I'll make sure. Yes. Okay. No. Okay, because we got some people here.

You're saying two different things, Questlow. Well, because y'all tell me two different things. Anyway. Tell us what happens in the writers room. No. I'm saying, I'm saying, I tend to listen to a woman who worked with the man who if he's never said that. Okay, but I think. I think industry-wide, we call it the writer's room for a reason, right?

Like, everybody usually gets a script, but all those scripts go back into the writer's room, and usually everybody contributes to it. So, you know, and every show is different. So, like, there might be some shows where, like, if you do the first draft, most of what's in there is you, but, you know, like on most of the shows I've written on, like, the person who gets the script credit, like, it's a little bit, it's the room's project. because everybody has the task

and it's actually interesting because it's very different at Jimmy Fallon because as you know we were there like the writers really... Writing shows are done different. You have to take a lot of ownership of your bits. SNL's the same way so like we, Diyall and I used to write a slow jam and like they weren't like a couple

other times other writers wrote it. For the most part it was like y'all go write that but when you get into a writer room on a narrative show it really is the power dynamic changes the who writing what changes what voices change who's writing for what characters changes. It depends on how the showrunners run in the room.

By the way, that's the irony is that on variety shows, everybody's, all the writers are in the credits at the end, right? On these other shows, and by the way, it might just be one person who wrote that sketch. The opposite is true on a regular show, when in fact it's sort of like the truth is the opposite. Because on a variety show, like one person might have written the sketch, everybody gets the credit. Regular show, one person gets the credit.

Everybody wrote the script. one of the questions I have is when a show is established at the beginning of the season, is there an overall arc that you guys have to follow? Like in other words, if say Ange and Diallo are designated to write episode six and you're in a room together and you have to decide what's going to happen that episode, like what if you just decide that, okay, I'm going to shoot this character off or this person is going to break their leg in this episode and then, like, how is an art carried out and what creative freedoms are you allowed to bring to your episode?

Yeah, I mean, if it's a serialized episode, I mean, if things track over, if you're following stories over different episodes, no one writer, you follow, what happens, whoa, okay, what happens is you track. I'm better in writing and holding things. in my hand. What happens is you track what's going to happen each individual episode before you start assigning episodes to individual writers. So what happens

is you might get the episode as a writer that kills off the favorite character. You can't say, no, no, no, I don't want to do that. You know, that's just what happens. Oh, that happened many times. We would go, in the room, you work it all out. You know, we work it all out. We know the jokes. We know the direction.

We know how the character's tracking, what their emotions are, where they're going. And I've actually actually tried to go off script and tried to like put my own thing in there. And, you know, no, that's a no, no, no, I'm a staff writer. So these guys are all way ahead of me, right? So as a staff writer, they're like, no, no, Tracy, you need to follow what was in that room and track it.

I'm like, yeah, but I felt like when I was writing this, that Tracy would actually say this. And they're like, no, you got to stay on track, stay on course, because if you go off, the rest of the, the rest of the show is now off. I think in a lot of situations, though, if it's a, in the best version of this, it's a lot of discussion. So it really depends on the tone set by the showrunner, whoever's really the boss in the room, who's the Kenya Bears in the room?

Because that person, if they're really great at their job, they're entertaining all these ideas. So if she comes and, if Tracy comes and says, hey, I want to kill off this character, it's a discussion. It's not like a no. And they might be like, you know what, that's dope.

Or like, if Tracy comes and says, like, I feel such an affinity to where Tiffany Haddish's character, I really, this episode where she goes and visits her mother, like I should write that one because I feel strongly about that one. I want to put something special on that one. If the show is functioning the way it's supposed to,

that tends to be listened to. And you tend to let people do what they're good at, especially with the first past. Even with the characters, though, like the show I'm on, the neighborhood, it's about, you know, a white family that moves into an all-black neighborhood, I believe, in Pasadena.

Is that a CBS show? Is that a Cedric to entertainer? That's correct. We got a black show on CBS. Tell us what it's about. With Tashina Arnold. With Tashina Arnold. CBS doesn't do that.

Tell us about it. It's a really big deal, and they are extremely excited about it. And we literally, I don't want to give too much away, but in the room, it's split, half and half, half, half white, half black. And it's interesting to hear the things that we are learning about each other that we're putting in the show. One little thing I'll tell you, we talked about washcloths. Oh, yes. And how white people don't use them? Thank you.

We did not know that. Yeah, white folk don't use watchcloth. Brought it up in the room. And one of the writers was like, What? They used their hands? What do you do with that? I go, you wash.

No wash class. Yeah. Wait, you do like the Safeguard commercial where you just watch with the soap? My bar soap is my bar soap. No. And so, you know. This was how the room was. No one, each side could not believe.

You know you don't get in your crevices like that. Like you're not scraping any dead skin. You're just really on the surface. And if you're using dove, you're really not getting anything. That's what the discussion. This discussion, right? And this is not what this episode. The episode is not about that.

It don't. You need you some peppermint soap and you need you a lupor and you need it now, Steve. Some Dr. Bronis. I'm sorry. Yes, you will learn so. There is nothing that is off limits. When you introduce your wife or husband, you got to warn them like people in the room might know a little bit about you.

Or you tell the room like when I introduce my significant other, don't tell them what I said about her underwear or his. Like, they will know. everything about you. So I was going to say, similar to what Jimmy said the first year of doing the Tonight Show, was that everything in your life will be introduced in the writer's room. That is true. Oh, my God.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Mother-in-law gave you the Cracker Barrel jacket. Oh, yeah. That's right because your husband is. My husband is white. Yes.

Can I say that here? Yes. He's, wait, what if we were like, no? We got that slide here. You can't say that here. She could. I understand the struggle. Fonte, come back.

We're good. We got to stay Fonte. Wait, walked out the room. No, my mother-in-law bought me for Christmas one year. A blouse. Excuse me? Your husband really white?

Yeah, he is. Yeah. Yeah. Why, but I don't want. It's called a follow-up joke. What? Follow-up. But she bought me a blouse from Cracker barrel.

A blouse? Yes, exactly. And that's, I was like, it blew my mind. I'm like, are you for real? And that heard her feeling? feelings, right? So yeah, I'm the asshole for doing that. I'm the asshole in the family. So then after the holiday, she came up to me. She's like, Tracy, I'm so sorry about that blouse. I bought you from Cracker Barrel. I said,

why? She said, I did not know Cracker Barrel didn't serve black people back in the 60s and the 70s. And I was like, that's the reason why. She like did research. Yeah. Like to. Why? Why? They're like, oh, nigger. No, you think you're about to get some brink. Crackerbrill is anonymously titled. Seriously. Yes.

How about that? I'm like, who the fuck is buying antebellum blouses out of Crackerberry? I can't believe it. By the way, we went to the Super Bowl in Indiana one year. We were at Fallon. And we ate at Cracker Barrel. I had never had Cracker Barrel. It was the first time I haven't had Cracker Barrel.

And I was like, I don't know why people are fighting to eat this shit. Wait. It is pretty good. This news to me. They got clothing lines. It's pretty good. I believe that. They got a record label.

Yeah, they got a record label. Who was on our show? Kenny Rogers. Right. When Kenny Rogers was on our show, he was on Cracker Barrel label, and they gave us Matt's what? They have a lot of money. Wow.

Wait, here's the weird shit though. When Jazzy Jeff got married. Okay. You know, Cracker Bargerberg, they catered it? Listen, Will's gift. to Jeff was the wedding was in Jamaica so he had them come down and cater

and that's Jeff's favorite spot I am officially protesting hidden beach I don't want my money going to that burning my copy of who is Jill Scott right now that's hysterical I know she wasn't digging that compromises boo it was her wedding I know that's why I said compromises

I didn't know that about crack. I never ate a Cracker Barrel, so I didn't know. So what did you do with the blouse? What did you end up doing with it? She felt so bad about it. She took it back. She felt so bad about the Blas. And I felt bad.

But I just couldn't believe, like, she really gave. And she told me, nobody usually tells you when they give you a Christmas game. I got that from. She's like, I got it from Cracker Barrow. She was really proud. So at first I'm like, is she trying to say something? Or, you know, like, you know. Where is she from?

Indiana. Indiana. Indiana. We're in Indiana. Maraville, Indiana, right next to Gary, Indiana. And also next to Chicago, right next to Chicago. M.V. They don't know.

They don't show. You don't care what's going to know. It's messed up, man. It is messed up. A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what I'm saying. Yep, that's me.

Clever Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated.

One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment, and the next we'll talk about life, mental health, purpose, and even music. The Clifford Show isn't just a podcast. It's a space for honest conversations, stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger. So, if you've ever supported me or you're just chasing down a dream, this is right where you need to be. Listen to The Clifford Show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok.

There's two golden rules that any man should live by. Rule one, never mess with a country girl. You play stupid games, you get stupid prizes. And Rule 2, never mess with her friends either. We always say that trust your girlfriends. I'm Anna Sinfield, and in this new season of The Girlfriends... Oh my God, this is the same man. A group of women discover they've all dated the same prolific con artist. I felt like I got hit by a truck.

I thought, how could this happen to me? The cops didn't seem to care. So they take matters into their own hands. I said, oh, hell no. I vowed. I will be his last. target. He's going to get what he deserves. Listen to the girlfriends.

Trust me, babe. On the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. I'm Ego Wode. My next guest, you know from Step Brothers Anchorman, Saturday Night Live, and the Big Money Players Network, it's Will Ferrell. My dad gave me the best advice ever. I went and had lunch with them one day, and I was like, And dad, I think I want to really give this a shot. I don't know what that means, but I just know the groundlings. I'm working my way up through, and I know it's a place that come look for up and coming talent. He said, if it was based solely on talent, I wouldn't worry about you, which is really sweet.

Yeah. He goes, but there's so much luck involved. And he's like, just give it a shot. He goes, but if you ever reach a point where you're banging your head against the wall and it doesn't feel fun anymore, it's okay to quit. If you saw it written down, it would not be an inspiration. It would not be on a calendar of, you know, the cat. Just hang in there. Yeah, it would not be.

Right, it wouldn't be that. There's a lot of luck. Listen to thanks, Dad, on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Okay, so what else happens in a ride or not? Lots of therapy. Well, can I ask, can I, without, without, physical fights? Oh, yeah. But wait, without without opening up any Pandora's boxes for your jobs.

No barrel of crackers. Was the exodus of the initial writers of season one, were they okay with not? No one's okay with getting fired. Aren't they white? They got jobs now, right? I really don't know any of the ones that I don't know them. I mean, Diallo and Bashir doing all right?

I think in our case We always knew that we wanted to come on for one season But we had another show We had a show at Comedy Central That was something that we had created South Side South Side We just got back from Chicago by the way

Like two weeks ago, three weeks ago So for us it was more of a timing thing We couldn't do season two of Last OG And do our own show So we actually went to Jordan We were like look we got a Comedy Central show He's like I know what that's about Go forth

Well, I meant more from the standpoint of maybe the white writers that were replaced with more black writers. Look, I think that with that show, I don't know who listens to the podcast. Maybe they do. I think it's safe to say, no, I'm saying these particular writers, I think it's safe to say that at some point somebody pulled them aside and was like, look, you know, Tracy doesn't necessarily feel like you have the voice of the show. But, you know, also most TV shows, we're going to find somebody else. You know, this happened to found every TV show, the first couple years is figuring out who actually belongs on the staff. Like The Simpsons, you know, my favorite show, seasons three through eight, you know, there's a reason that season three through eight are the seasons that I always say are the best seasons. Because those first, they were like figuring out like, oh, and then, you know, Conan shows up.

And then some other, you know, Al Jean shows up. And then they figure out, like, all right, these are the voices. Oakland Weinstein. It's really going to take us to the Oakland, Weinstein show up. No, I watched, like, the first season of LastOG, and I even told Angie, like, I thought it was, I like, I liked the show. But to me it just didn't seem to have a tone. Like it would have like these really supposedly comic moments and then like these really dark. That part was intentional.

And let me just say this because, you know, we in one of our conversations with Tracy, I'll never forget he said, like, one thing that he liked about Donald. He actually did say like, you know, Donald used to write for me and now he's got his show that I feel like is poignant but funny and does its thing. And he was like, I want this show to be you laugh in one moment. minute, you're crying the next. It just didn't, yeah. That was by design. I will also say about white writers that are writing for black shows. It's amazing to me how all the white shows I've been on, most of the time I've been

the only black writer. But whenever on a black show, there's always a ton of white writers. But I will say that a lot of times when right writers come into a black room, it's a shock for them that they don't know everything about the culture. Literally, if you have to, if you're writing about black people in Brooklyn, don't assume that it's going to be like writing for, or whatever the hell you used to write a note. You know, like, study up on.

You know what I'm saying? Who is that writer? It's like greatest theme song. Study up on that. Like, it's like, if you were writing a doctor's thing, go talk to some doctors. But I'm amazed at how many white writers do come into a room. And it's like, I don't have any black friends, but I'm here. You know, so that's.

I mean, that was John Amos's thing back in the 70s, right? Like, he was just like, I can't believe this is the writer's room on my show, but I'm I'm a push back as much as possible. They killed him. Yeah. But that was, that was Estarol's show. I mean, really. She was the real.

He was like, I'm tired of DJ. Let's talk about that after this. She was the one who decided. Oh, God. I'm divided by chapters. Any time you're out of the mutton. Have we decided with all the lyrics are? Keeping away when you can.

It's the Chowline song. It's the Chowline. Easy credit, Ripple? Easy credit. Wait, who wrote this? Is this Quincy Jones? Stretching and surviving. Hanging in the child line.

Hang in a javin. And we look who we got them. I think it's standing as a child line. It's hanging in the child line. Hanging in a child line. Shout out Chappelle. What the fuck did the child line look like in the 70s? Soup line.

Oh, I'm sorry. Wait. Who wrote this? We wrote that song. Jim Gilstrap and Meelestrap. Binky Williams. And Jim Gilstrap used to write for...

What else they write that we would... He played guitar on You All the Sunshine of My Life. Bingney? That's Pink Dog's Band. Yeah, Jim Gilstrap, he's a guitar play. You know what? By the way, what a great gig. I think that's him singing

the first verse of You All the Sunshine of My Life. It is. Yes. Jim Gilstrap. By the way, what a great gig. That theme song, they probably have mansions on top of boats on top of mansion. Yeah, but what they're doing now?

Because we ain't gotten those themes. They have mansions on top of boats. What about someone whose dream was to write a theme song? And they grew up and now we ain't got that. That's over with. That's over with. Why don't we have themes on for one? Advertising.

You're talking about this today. You're actually talking about this today. I watch a lot of cheers. It's on Netflix. And it's funny because I remember when this happened in real life. And then on Netflix, it's funny to see that show had like a minute and a half damn theme song. And then half of it were like, you know what? This is too much time to be wasting.

And then it came all the way down. They cut the whole middle out. It's really about space and content. You're fighting against commercials. and you're fighting against a B storyline which you really need to give the A storyline air. So there's just no room. And so to be like,

and then we're going to lose more space a minute and a half to some singing that has nothing to do with the plot. I mean, I miss the outro themes they used to have. That happens right. That's a long start. That'll never happen to here. That happened to us on Scrubs.

You used to say it started off. We had a whole song like, I'm no Superman. And by the seven seasons, it would be just, man. Man. Yeah. Wait, so can I ask the rumor question in?

What was, to your recollection, what was the first sitcom that caught you? Family ties. What? For me, yeah. In fact, I started wearing a tie and carrying a briefcase to school. Yeah. Yeah, it kept me on the street narrow.

My favorite episode was, my name is Alex P. Keaton. Oh, yeah. That's the one we does the 30-minute speech. Yeah, we went to the therapy. By the way, has not age well. Really? Yeah, I read a whole post about it and they like posted some clips like it's super self-serious. I don't think any of that shit is age way.

It was good, but it's. Cheers is great. It's over the time. Well, okay. Wait, can I get my answer for all my question? Wait, hold on. I want to know because I know Dialo answered. But by she here, Tracy.

When you said the first show to caught you, do you mind if I ask you, what do you mean by that? Like as a kid, to your recollection, what was the first sitcom that you were like, you sat, you laugh, you was like, this is the shit. This is the bomb. I prefer. This is bumping. Probably, well, I think probably the Cosby show, actually. The only thing about that show was I used to, I did not like that show growing up because my family was not like that and I felt very much cheated.

I was like, what the fuck? They said shit like this outside of Chicago. But I recognized, even when I would laugh in spite of myself, so I recognized how great it was, but I was also like, this is, man, the lawyer, the house and shit. Where did that happen? Crackheads outside. This is wonderful. Brooklyn.

I didn't know Brooklyn had parts like that. I'll say mine was definitely good times. I love good times. That was the show. I remember thinking, God, every episode, they got to get rent. Every episode. That writer's room had to be great.

That is so funny. Think about it. They had to do every episode. They needed to pay rent. And what did they do? A talent show. They always had some talent show. Well, you know, a lot of them.

Michael was seeing you and I. We know that was at the wedding. When you're a long time. and in love. We're young and in love. I was watching that show recently because it's on Me TV, which I watch when I go to my mom's house. And MeatTV is like, it's called memorable entertainment television,

but it's really excuse to shows from the 70s. I just want to say that I didn't realize how much, because it was a man, every single episode, they have like a terrible crisis that they lose. Kids fall down that television. Oh, God. Kids getting burned up with iron. It's horrible.

You know that the, you know that the Cosby show got rejected a bunch of different places when you take it around. because he would not, every network was like, but you've got to put him in the ghetto. He was like, no, my black family is going to be in a very wealthy. They were all like, well, just do it in Harlem. He's like, no, we're going to do Brooklyn. Make him a janitor.

Make her a school teacher. I did not know that. Wow. No one's going to choose me of drugging these white women. Nobody's going to relieve. So eventually he drugged Brandon Tarticoff. I got to admit, I fell off the bandwagon,

and watch my first Cosby episode day before yesterday. We watched it together and we had to do that. I got a little. The show is great. To be honest, I never stopped watching the guys. Well, it wasn't that I was protesting. I just didn't know that it was on TV one.

Amen. It's on TV one. And it was coming on bounce, I think. So the syndication never actually stopped, did it? No. Black's litigation. Not really. But it's not on iTunes anymore.

They were supposed to stop. We hear the reruns up black television. All the streaming. Black TV was like, fuck that. I can't get on iTunes anymore. It's on Netflix. What are you going to say? I'm the man.

Nobody gave a shout out to what's happening. I'm the only one of one to be dating. Is that was your shit? Yeah. Well, besides watching a Jefferson being like, these kids ain't mixed. That's hilarious. I don't even feel has a big problem that casting mixed people.

They still can't do it right. And you're feeling like way. Like, I don't feel it. That's hilarious. We have Michael McDonald on the show and he was breaking down the The Doobie Brothers. Classic. That's my favorite episode.

Yes. Of what's happening? At your Al Dumbar. Like, man, yeah, I love that. That's when the Doobie brothers had liked the cafe or whatever, right? The bootle and performing. I grew that episode. Yeah, that was the one for me.

I feel like back then we gave permission to, for things that just didn't really, when you think about it, when rerun dropped the recorder. And the whole auditorium. It were literally like right in front of the movie. Like the whole auditorium. smooth criminal lean right in where you run's direction. We always talk, that's another thing we do in the writers and we always talk about

how easy it must have been back in a day. Just be like, all right, we just want to get some people stranded on an island. Right. Well, I can't even just... Oh, that was supposed to be a one season show. I didn't know that. And they it was too big a hit. Yeah, it was supposed to be one season of show. We talk about how much money people used to make in writer-run. You know, everybody I know nowadays has 15 jobs if you have any kind of talent. I mean, the star of the show,

season five will have an apartment. Like, for real. Like, the money is not the same. Let me see, if you were a writer- four seasons, you are straight. So is the goal to get... You don't need money for a minute. Tracy got to get to her call girl appointment after this. Bitch.

She's not the only one. This would be easy. Oh, that's really convenient. It's a reason I was late. I'm heading right to West Hollywood, girl. Gas money got down. Can I ask, the profession that the four of you are in, is there an instant pressure to always come up with a line?

Like, when you're dealing, I'm treating this like porno. Like, when you're dealing with civilians, like just regular people that don't work on your show, do you have to hold yourself back from always saying the joke? Ang's down. Like, Ange is always, but that's the thing. As long, I've known Anns for so long, and you always have the punchline. Like ready. And it's...

And I wasted so many. No, but I meant like in your... Can you ever just relax and not go for the punchline? You catch us at hour 12 in the writer's room. Yeah. I mean, even if I found it, like, that writer, I wouldn't describe it as like a happy room with like joyfulness and joy. Well, no, no, no.

I meant the punchline as in you're always humorous. Because I visited a... Man, men, men, men. Chuck Lori? Two and a half men? So I visited the set of two and a half men and it was during a break and I saw something that just blew my mind. Like I guess the director stood in the center and then all of his writers went it in a circle. That's what we do.

And he's like, all right, I need someone to go. That's what we know. Go. That's not funny. Go, go. That was Tuesday night for me. This past Tuesday. And by the way, that definitely happens more on multi-guid.

Like I was on Marlon, whenever we would call break, Marlon would like sit somewhere on set and then like all these people who weren't even I mean like some of them were writers and some of them were just Wayanses like they would just converge around him and then he come out with like 20 new jokes but that happens on single cameras too I mean I've never been on a single camera

where you weren't shooting a scene and then they were like all right can we do some different jokes in the same but is there a pressure because just the way that the director is treating them it's like if you came with a no yeah really really next no oh yeah and by the way some writers really perform in those environments like some

people you're like oh that dude's a killer you know oh she's always got she's always got a punch line ready to go like a good one yeah i love that that actually that actually gets me going because it's where we that happened tuesday night that happens every tuesday night when we we tape you got to be ready and a line that we thought in the room was going to hit didn't hit show runners turning around okay be thinking about this line and all of us are thinking you should be thinking about that when you're watching the too right the writers should be watching that being like all right we're definitely let to punch up these five lines that's right before he comes over here or she comes over here and ask. Do you sometimes question

the intelligence of the target audience of the show? In other words, the writers, you guys might be Harvard material. I think that's a terrible excuse. If you're like, oh, well, they're just not smart enough to get it. I've heard that said. I've heard it said a lot.

On certain TV shows. Yep. But it's never the truth. Like, the quotes of certain TV shows. Not having, to me, like, not having faith in the audience is not having faith in the art. Like it's, it's insecurity. Like, if you can be funny, then motherfuckers will get it.

Yeah, it's interesting. But then you see the Nielsen ratings come back and then the network. People don't understand that sometimes what we write, we'll want it to be a certain, we'll write a certain thing. And then by the time it goes through a studio, a network, and then they'll say, we can't say that because we have advertisers. You know, it'll come out and it'll be five times watered down. So, okay, you brought it up. Who has a Nilsen box? I've never been in my, all my life. I don't know nobody.

I have no idea. I've never gotten one. Like, not a Nielsen box, but we used to have to do the journals and stuff. We knew you knew somebody. Black family was a lot of that. It's always somebody in Midwest. We did one of those too.

My mom made us write down every black TV show. But the whole thing is we sent in late so it didn't count. Oh, my God. Oh, no. You should have been late. I know. We were sitting there writing two. The episode of That's My Mama was great.

Like, 1989. You're like, damn. You could have kept some people employed. Like, two, seven. Even if you didn't write, watch it. I was always lying on mine because, you know, couldn't write down that I was watching real sex at 10 o'clock on Friday. Scramble.

They're like, Real Sex has a 0.1 again. Are Nilsson still used now? Yes. Yeah, everything is used. Have they figured out a way to figure in... Is it in the yard? Yeah, they have live plus... Live plus 3, lie plus 5, and then lie plus 7.

What's the difference? That's the number of days it took for people to watch it when it was sitting on their DVR. Oh, wow. So it's built into our cable. So, yeah, but they don't measure after Live Plus 7, interestingly enough, because advertisers don't care if you're watching it 12 days later.

Like, they want you to go see, you know, rampage this week at the movies. You know what I'm saying? I was at a meeting for, and I found out that they're even, Nelson ratings are also using, like, Instagram? Like, they're using the streaming. They said that just started last year.

Well, engagement is another way they measure. Like, there are TV shows that get terrible ratings. but they are in season six because they're always being written about and they have a huge people online. They might win an Emmy. Ride or die for them online and people like, we tweet about it crazy, they want to talk about it. So you're like, this other show that I like has way more ratings

but is going away because people aren't talking about it. And they'll wonder why they had seven characters killed off of that show so they could keep a for it in the budget since they're not getting the rating. Then people would be like, damn it, you ruined my show. Well, we had to keep, you know, the budget down. Do you guys feel the pressure to keep like a social media situation and be present? I don't, but Yeah, you like, your life goes.

You don't have no, you don't have no, you don't fuck with social media. Damn, how you do that? Wait a minute. I want that life. Yeah, what's that life? You never had a Twitter? I used to have everything.

I just got rid of it all. I had everything. What made you just say fucking? I'll be honest. I heard, I heard Kendrick Lamar talking on the radio. Okay. When he's, when his, uh, what's the one that came up before? Pampapar.

The one right before that. Good Kid Mac City? When Good Kid Mad City came out, he was on the radio, and he was just talking about how, like, he had this epiphany that, like, he's like, every minute that I'm like, on social media is a minute that I'm not working on my art. And he's like, I got to stop doing that. And I thought to myself, because I wasn't where I wanted to be in my life at the time.

And I was like, this young man is on something. Now, I will say, check back in with Bashir a year from now and see if he's still no social media. How did you two meet? Because you're kind of like Ernie and Bert in my head. Thank you. I appreciate being Ernie. school did you guys go to?

Harvard. You're not, Ernie. We met, I do love pigeons. I feel like you're perfect. I do love pigeons. I do love pigeons. I do love pigeons. And oatmeal.

I have a 16-month-year-old now, so I watch a lot more Sesame Street than I used to. And I'm like, oh, that's my son. John Legend's singing with the muffins now. This is all right. This is okay. We met an Acapella group. Has it aged well.

We made an Acapella group called Brothers. Because that was the best name on the planet. The best name the smart black kids at Harvard could come up And we all wore maroon vests and we sang like boys to men. It was a disaster. How many y'all wasn't? In brothers? There were five of them.

No, no, no. It was like 11. No, no, no. There was a core five. Here's the thing. We were like Wu-Tang. Here's why he's saying that because there was like 11 members, but like only five would show up to the gigs.

Because nobody gave the shit. Only you got to here again. Oh, damn. I'm all right. Anybody give a shit about brothers. You're our alto tonight. All right, man. You got to sing man-on-man for the fucking

Bay Fish Company. And we're y'all, y'all English majors? Not by the impressions. What? Y'all, Y'all English majors, or was it something. I majored in, uh, he was pre-med.

I was pre-med. I was from the hood and I went to Harvard. So my parents wasn't trying to, I went to Harvard. My parents weren't trying to hear me, be like, I'm being an actor. Yeah. So I had to pretend I was pre-med for like four years. I was an, I was an econ major. You know, I thought I was going to Wall Street.

And, you know. And both of y'all graduated. Hell yeah. Yeah, we graduated. And to this day, people were like, hey, man, you're a Darby at all, man. You got to be a millionaire. And it's like, hey, getting there, man. People are like, all right.

A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what I'm saying. Yep, that's me, Cliver Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show.

This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment. And the next, we'll talk about life, mental health, purpose, and even music. The Clifford Show isn't just a podcast. It's a space for honest conversations, stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger. So if you've ever supported me

or you're just chasing down a dream, this is right where you need to be. Listen to The Clifford show on the IHeard radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. There's two golden rules that any man should live by. Rule one, never mess with a country girl.

You play stupid games, you get stupid prizes. And rule two, never mess with her friends either. We always say that trust your girlfriends. I'm Anna Sinfield, and in this new season of the girlfriends... Oh my God, this is the same man. A group of women discover they've all dated the same prolific con artist. I felt like I got hit by a truck. I thought, how could this happen to me?

The cops didn't seem to care. So they take matters into their own hands. I said, oh, hell no. I vowed. I will be his last target. He's going to get what he deserves. Listen to the girlfriends. Trust me, babe. On the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

What's up, everyone? I'm Ego Wode. My next guest, you know from Step Brothers Anchorman, Saturday Night Live, and the Big Money Players Network. It's Will Ferrell. My dad gave me the best advice ever. I went and had lunch with them one day, and I was like, and Dad, I think I want to really give this a shot. I don't know what that means, but I just know the groundlings. I'm working my way up through and I know it's a place that come look for up and coming talent. He said,

if it was based solely on talent, I wouldn't worry about you, which is really sweet. He goes, but there's so much luck involved. And he's like, just give it a shot. He goes, but if you ever reach a point where you're banging your head against the wall and it doesn't feel fun anymore, it's okay to quit. If you saw it written down, it would not be an inspiration. It would not be on a calendar of, you know, the cat just hang in there. Yeah, it would not be. Right, it wouldn't be that. There's a lot of luck.

Listen to Thanks Dad on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. But can I say something really that my personal opinion is if you're an artist, I really feel like college is like, might be a terrible decision. I agree. I know a lot of people, I won't name them at Harvard who I think would be really big right now in society as artists, but they just decided to go to class instead of saying,

fuck that, let me go get this hustle. I just, I agree. I agree, maybe. To have to say college, you have to just. It's a lot of parents that's listening like, please, motherfuckers, seriously? That's my two cents. I mean, people feel differently.

I agree, too. You got to be real about this. But your parents are a musician? What the fuck are you doing in college? I don't want my kids to listen to this. I don't want my older sons to hear any of this. What the community college takes you Of course.

Yeah. You don't actually teach that at Harvard. Accounting, marketing. They don't teach accounting at Harvard. They don't teach that. Yes. But you need a backup. Personal finances.

What is what my mama told me was I always wanted to be a comedian. She said, baby, you need to go to school. You know to go to college. And I'm from the South. So I went to a community college for two years, Miami-day Community College. All right. You from Miami? I grew up in Miami.

Opalaca in the hood anyway. Good night. Obolaca. You know Opelaca. I used to go to Central High School. Lock and Flaka, too. I know Miami. So, yeah, I went to Miami Day for two years, and then I was on the speech and debate team, and that's how I knew I would get out of Miami.

I wanted out of Miami back then. It was so bad back then, and so I got a scholarship to a college in Ohio, never been to the Midwest, Heidelberg University. I was going to go there. I was going to go there, but the speech coach, he was at Eastern Michigan University. So I went and got in there And then he quit And he said if you come with me

I'll get you a full ride So I went with him And I got a full ride I'm with you I'm with you sound the way you sound Because one of the things That I think about all the time We talk about the pressure

You could get fired from A writing job at any time I'm going years without work And I'm like I went to University of Pennsylvania I have a medical anthropology I don't know how to do shit Except right

Is that what you now is Yeah Medical anthropology I forgot you went to you Penn Smart ass About it Ivy League Like, literally.

I can't even do my own taxes at this point. I don't know, you know what I'm saying? We don't. We didn't learn. I didn't learn any. But you know what eye opening is to that point is the number of people who I went to college with to this day who will be like, Diallo probably gets more than I do because he's more engaged like reaching out.

Oh, man, that writing shit seems to be going well. So like how does one get into that? I'm like, you went to, you did recruiting when you was 25. When I came to L.A. and star, you was recruiting and you had a job at Goldman. So I don't know to tell you at this point. Go back in time or work 20 years. All right. Let's take a break.

Shout out to rest of peace to Alan. Thick. Alan Fick didn't write this. Didn't he? Different strokes, man. I wrote this one too. Both of them. I'm looking it up.

Warren and Jeanette Dubois. Five dollars. Yeah, Jeanette DuBois. I'm sorry. Look it up. I mean, Who wrote this one? Dan DuBois and Orrin Waters.

Candid Dubois rose? That's her singing. That's her singing. It's okay. She was getting paid. It was like him wrong. Jeanette Dubois and Jeff Berry that wrote it. I could be wrong.

This is a long-ass theme. I mean, they were burning through minutes of content time. They're like, okay, the script is eight pages, y'all. We got to make some cut. It's only 41 seconds. But, you know. That's a long time. So, by the way, can I just say, can I just say you were playing Barney Miller earlier?

So I had to look at Hal Lyndon, still alive. Really? Yeah, I figured. I was like, that has to be out of here. He's 87. Here's something I did not know about the Jefferson theme song. I was like, no, it's forgotten me. The co-writer, the Jefferson's theme song also wrote River Deep Mountain High.

Really? Oh, wow. The Do Run Run Run. The Tina Turner song, right? Then he kissed me. Jeff Barry. Wow. I thought you were going into a birthday store.

Getting paid. It makes sense. Makes sense. All right. So, Bashir and Diallo, would you mind sharing with us the experience of trying to develop a show for HBO? Yeah, the whole experience of brothers in Atlanta.

Oh, man. Shout out of brothers in Atlanta. Damn, y'all just looked at the floor like y'all wanted to pour some liquor on the ground. Pour some liquor. I mean, it's like losing one of your children. Yeah, it really was. And by the way, we did two pilots for that place in four years and two months. So that was four years and two months under life.

And acted on shows on HBO too. Of course you can't do that too. Okay. You definitely don't have any of it. I'm sorry. Because that would be illegal. Okay. I'm so proud.

I will say that I'm so proud of brothers in Atlanta, it's so fucking funny. Fonte is in it. It's just... But it's still funny. So what's the process of trying to start a car that... Well, I will say HBO's process, I think, is evolving, but it's typically a longer process. We were there developing for two years, which is on the minimum side. There are other people there who've been developing for up to six years.

Well, there was also that one project that was there for eight years. Eight years of development, which is, I think, a testament to their sense over there that everything needs to be slowed down to the point we can examine it a lot to make sure it's great. Sometimes that works. We see some of the shows, obviously, like Game and Thrones

are incredible. Sometimes that process that they have leads to, I think, we were also there during a period of great executive turnover. Like, we were there for three different presidents of the network.

So when we arrived, there was one person who was president. She was a big champion. We did a pilot there called The Reporters, which I think conceptually is still one of the best things we've ever done. Yeah, so, okay, yeah, because I never saw that one.

Best thing in the world. It's about these two black reporters. Basically, we took all the president's men and we put ourselves in the roles of those reporters and I don't think it's any industry secret anymore. The concept of the show was essentially that every conspiracy theory that black

people believe in, we were on the hunt to find out if it was true or not. And the joke of the series was, giving an example. Is Tupac alive. Okay. Every episode was us examining a different sort of like, you know, because one of them actually came out of Fallon.

That's right. The original one is, oh, go ahead. Yeah, no, it was the search for James Brown's gold. So when Eddie came on, when Eddie Murphy came on Jimmy Fallon, right. He said that like, you know, he was blowing up as a young comedian. And he met James Brown. And James Brown was like, Eddie, you're doing so good, man.

You know, but don't put your money in a bank. And he was like, well, what should I do with the money? And he was like, do what I do. Hey, man. bury that shit in the woods. And it was like, what if you forget where you're buried? He was like, hey, at least the government won't get it.

So we were sitting at our desk at file and we were like, what if somewhere in Augusta, Georgia, in the woods, there's like tons of hidden treasures. So our characters would just go in search of all that stuff. It was a really sort of unique concept for a show. We also came at a time when like girls was really starting to take off for HBO. So I feel like they steered us in a way more like girlsian.

Let's do a very grounded show. Yeah, I mean, we just, to be honest, we just, you know, when I'm learning, because now we're at Comedy Central and South Side, and it's like night and day, it really comes down to support. We just had had a support. Like, we didn't have the support. You have to have the support the person at the top. And eventually the person at the top changed, and they supported other shit.

And we were still there. We were like, uh-oh. Well, that president, just to finish the story, that president left, new president comes on. He's like, hey, I love you guys. I don't like the pilot you did for her. do a pilot for me. So that was another two years of our lives.

That was the brother in Atlanta. It takes that long. It takes that long to develop. No, it doesn't have to. But that's the age. That was the age. Their way is long. I don't know what the process is now.

Well, it's going to change because they got to put out like 10 times more content. We shot a great pilot with, uh, with Fonte, as he said, and, uh, Jayden Smith and Maya Rudolph and Big Boy from Alcast. And it was a great pilot. It was all about being in Atlanta. Actually, at one point, Donald was going to be in our show. At another point, he was like, hey, I'm. After I come off tour, I'm going to do my own Atlanta show.

We're also big fans of Atlanta. I think, like, the same way there are a million white shows that take place in New York and LA. You can have more than one black show that takes place in Atlanta. I will say one thing that's a little, that was difficult and frustrating for me was, you know, back in 2012, Diallo was telling the network, like, hey, Atlanta, Atlanta, my hometown. I'm from there. We got to do a show in Atlanta. And they just, you should see the blank stairs. We would get meetings.

And to the point where we had to wait until 2015. where GQ published an article saying, hey, Atlanta is a city where, like, music is important. And then we had to, like, walk that into President of HBO's office. It's like, see, we've been saying for three years? Like, this is a real thing. It was frustrating not being able to convey that. With this Columbus to discover Atlanta before they would let us shoot and show.

And then they were like, hey, guys, Atlanta's a good idea. So now how do they feel with the success of the other Atlanta? I don't know. I don't talk to about. Have you had a, I just told you so? Or, like, no, man, we haven't had time to say I told you. So I will say that. you know there's a I'm happy for anybody who gets to

anybody black who gets to create a show so like people ask me about other black shows and even if I don't love those shows I'd generally be like I love it because it is so hard to get an idea that is pure through the crucible it's so hard to get that champion so you're telling me just because

a show was greenlit does not mean hell no so yeah no so brothers in Atlanta Okay, so this is the end of the story. So Brothers in Atlanta, we shot the pilot, and it went to series, and we hired a room full of writers,

and we wrote the entire first season, and then we were like, okay, so what are our production days? So they're like, we'll get back to you. And we'll get back to you stretched out for six months of our lives, and we're out here in L.A., like just waiting. And then they called us one day, and the new person was like, I think we're going in a different direction.

So I'm curious, who was the same? sounding board. What do you mean? Who was the judge in the jury with the hands on the guillotine to whether, you know. Oh, it's the president. It's the people at the top. But you know, but those decisions are made by the people who work in the building who are in competition with each other. So

if we've been there for four years and somebody's coming in with something that there's new and hot and they like, and there's only so much air time on HBO, now you're in the competition between like well, are we going to put out this thing or this new thing and then that's, well, that was somebody else developed that. I mean, there's a lot of that in networks.

well, somebody else developed that project, and I don't care about that project. I got this project. So we sort of ran into some of that turbulence. The same way at any network, when the previous administration developed something, and then those people are flushed out, the incoming people often say,

and this is some real talk about the industry. No, it's just like, attention. It's the same. No, shit. Yeah, like, well, if this thing hits, it's going to make my predecessor look good. Yeah, it doesn't really help me. It doesn't help me, so I'm just going to push it out the door.

Can I just tell you guys, that's for most jobs, entertainment people? Yeah, that's crazy. Yeah, we're saying. But not everybody out there knows that. It did make me thinking because Fonte, you said that's what happens in the record industry. I think what we went through, by the way,

I had a really good talk of Raphael Sadiq about it. He was such a good person to talk to. Anyway, because he worked with us on the Maya Rudolph thing. But it made me think about like, how many great albums have I never heard because some fucking executive pushed it out? But then it also means that like some artists

have to have that tenacity to be like, well, I have three albums that are incredible that are never coming out. now I gotta go make a fourth one. That's fucking, I can't even, I mean, I can't imagine it because I've had to do it, but it's incredible to think about the volume of good material that one person has like kept back from the world. Yeah, no, you have to really think of like if you're, I think if you're an artist just now, you really have to have it in mind.

Like, when people say you're in it for the long haul, in your mind, you might be thinking the long haul is like four years. Nigel, that shit is more like 10, 50, 20. You know what I'm saying? As somebody who has judged some of the diversity writing contest and watched people's career, I mean, some of the scripts that, I mean, some suck, but some are amazing. But then you see people's, especially for black women, I'll say, in half an hour comedy. And we haven't. How many those?

Like, too. We haven't run a network one since the 90s. So it's a very sore spot. Since living single? Yes. Shays done. Yes. No, what about a great anatomy, no?

It said half an hour comedy. Which I care about because they know I'm right out. Yeah, no, I mean, we haven't. And it's like, I mean, there's guys. There's like, you know, even cable, there's Saladin and there's Princess who's running insecure. But just for a woman to actually have a voice in half an hour. And I've watched this young lady. And a lot of times what happens is they'll hire diverse writers because they get them for free under a program per year,

fire them and they have to start every year at the same level as a staff. I just found out about that. But the other thing that they'll hire, like, even if somebody, man and woman gets a job and is like, this is your show, it's greenlit. What America doesn't know is that the network then go behind and hire this other person to come in and basically sit over your shoulder for the whole time and try and direct and control

what you do because they are more in tune what the network actually wants. And I've seen a lot of frustrated people be like, they have this BWRourke with this other writer and they don't even get black people. And it's just like but that's the condition under which you get to put your show on the air. So that happens

often. So like during the time you were saying that, you know, years would go by or wherever, would go by before you had a job or, you know, when you were between jobs, how would you support yourself? How do you eat as a writer? eBay, I know how to do that. I mean, I wrote the broke diaries. I mean, but honestly, this is what happens a lot of time.

There's so many stories about being, a lot of times there's not a lot of, this is the first show that I've worked on, and I've been out here for 17 years where I've written for a lead black woman, you know? And a lot of times people will think that it's a black girl. She could only write for black women. I'm like, I've lived in a white and a man's world my whole life. I had to learn and navigate this. Like, you literally on paper, I'm the whitest person on earth.

Like, Ivy Green, you know? It's like if you didn't, Angela Nissel, what the hell is that? You know what I mean? But it's very, it's, unless they feel like your voice will contribute, they literally look at, a lot of times on these liberal half an hour comedies, they only look at people of color through a people of color lens. Like even when you're pitching, they'll be like, okay, here's our Latina character. She's going to take salsa lessons.

And you're like, if she's Latina. She's Latina, she probably don't need to take less. Yeah, no. I've had such interesting comments with black women about getting staffed on shows. I remember one girl saying her go-to strategy is getting her hair put in cornrows because then people know that she's the authentic black when she comes to the... And I'm not joke. She was like, I do it every year and it works.

She was like until before that, you know, and it's... Have you watched any of the... Either you two ladies, have y'all watched the love is at all? Because it kind of shows like the process of... No, yeah, but I heard. that does show what she went through. You too, watch her in J-Diala. Is that on Netflix?

It's on own, right? And it's the story of Mara, and I thought, oh, about the salon. I watch Greenleaf. Yeah, I haven't watched Greenleaf. That's the motherfucking show. Y'all sleeping on Greenleaf. My mother's, I love it.

I just asked about that because they show her being a staff writer for Martin back in the day before she became who she is, Mara Brock Akekele and supporting her husband. To me, those are the most interesting parts of the show. Yeah, yeah. Showing the Martin.

Yeah, the love story part is, it's like some BDSM shit. But like it's... Now I'm in. Yeah, it's just weird. Is that her new show? Yeah. Yeah. Oh, I audition for that show.

What? I never heard back. What were you? Seriously. And now I'm here. What happened, y'all? What happened? Oh, on the show?

Yeah. What happened on the show? What did you audition for? I don't even remember. Oh. I thought you was joking. No, no, I told her. I audition for that show.

Because I've had to meet with Mara and her husband. Right. Yeah. Who are like the dream team. Yeah. No, it's like straight up. It's an awesome. But that show is about their assent through.

Their early days. That's crazy. And they tell it through the story of them being older. So two older actors tell them the story. Yeah, Clark Peters, and I cannot remember the ladies name. Lester Freeman from the wire, and I can't remember the lady that plays the older. But Vanessa Bell Calloway is on there, too. Yeah, Vanessa Bell.

I'll watch. I'll watch. Love her. I love her. But when I was in the OG room, that was my first, that's my first writing job. First time ever writing in the room. I've been a comedian for 20 years touring all across the country. got on the tour with Tracy and he was like,

I want to put you in my room. I like the way you write, like your jokes. So I got in the room and I thought that was just how it was. I thought this was normal. And then Andrew's like, no, you never see this many black writers in one room. I thought this was, because I loved it. It was like I was home. We had

so much fun in the room. We were so loud that the other rooms would come over to see what we were doing. And they would say, hey, can you guys keep it down over here? I think they did. I think they did one of the say that. But when they open the door

and see all these black people, they're like, okay, we can't. We can't really say that. We can't say nothing. We're funny and we squab. Yeah. It was good. But I thought that was normal. And I heard all these stories like, no, this is a first. But you have to have a successful show with somebody like Tracy who the network is now

in tremendous financial business with must listen to like Donald and FX to be able to get to that place where you can have those types of rooms. Because again, it's like they meddle in every little part of it and you have to have somebody at the top who's just like, don't do that this is what's going to be.

A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what I'm saying. Yep, that's me, Clifford Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform

became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered, conversations with some of your favorite athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment, and the next we'll talk about life, mental health, purpose, and even music. The Clifford Show isn't just a podcast, it's a space for honest conversations, stories that don't

always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger. So, if you've ever supported me, or you're just chasing down a dream, this is right where you need to be. Listen to the Clifford Show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. There's two golden rules that any man should live by. Rule one, never mess with a country girl. You play stupid games, you get stupid prizes. And rule two, never mess with her friends either.

We always say that trust your girlfriends. I'm Anna Sinfield. And in this new season of The Girlfriends, Oh my God, this is the same man. A group of women discover they've all dated the same prolific con artist. I felt like I got hit by a truck. I thought, how could this happen to me? The cops didn't seem to care.

So they take matters into their own hands. I said, oh, hell no. I vowed. I will be his last target. He's going to get what he deserves. Listen to the Girlfriends. Trust me, babe. On the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

I'm Ego Wadam. My next guest, you know from Stepbrothers, Anchorman, Saturday Night Live, and the Big Money Players Network. It's Will Ferrell. Woo. My dad gave me the best advice ever. I went and had lunch with them one day. And I was like, and Dad, I think I want to really give this a shot.

I don't know what that means, but I just know the groundlings. I'm working my way up through, and I know it's a place they come look for up-and-coming talent. said if it was based solely on talent, I wouldn't worry about you, which is really sweet. Yeah. He goes, but there's so much luck involved. And he's like, just give it a shot. He goes, but if you ever reach a point where you're banging your head against the wall and it doesn't feel fun anymore, it's okay to quit.

If you saw it written down, it would not be an inspiration. It would not be on a calendar of, you know, the cat. Just hang in there. Yeah, it would not be. Right, it wouldn't be that. There's a lot in luck. Listen to Thanks, Dad, on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. All right, so the room.

Of course, you know, in the past year or so, the Me Too movement has at least started to steer or the, I'm sorry, or the idea of Me Too has started to, I don't know create some dialogue about respect in the writer's room and in the board room or whatever but at its worth

can you tell us Angela what how toxic who I mean what's interesting to me first about the Me Too movement is that when I was on scrubs there was a black writer's assistant

and she actually bought a lawsuit against the friends writers for some of the things that they said. I have, I remember that. It's a famous. You know, and it's, um, it actually got rejected. The whole thing was that. Never worked again. Yeah, she never worked again. She had to retire from the business. And they stopped hiring

black women as well. They stopped. Literally, I was told to my face. Thank you for saying that. Because I was told to my face by numerous white men. Wow, you're lucky. You already have a job because we ain't hiring no black women after that. And then like I said, since the 90s, we haven't run one damn show. They literally said that. Oh, they can say whatever they want to say to you.

What was her claim? I don't want to misquote, but it was some of the things that they would say in the room. I mean, they would talk. Sexual stuff. Sexual stuff. And this is not stuff that I have not heard. I've heard it over and over. And I've always been told by the white women, one, keep your mouth shut, you know, which is what everyone does.

And I've been, and especially, even looking at the Me Too movement now, I'm rolling my eyes at tracely across the room because every black woman who has come out in the Me Too movement, And it's like, even the only one that Harvey Weinstein talked back against was the black. He's like, oh. He did not. He did not. He did not. He didn't.

Yon go, hell, though. He didn't deny any of except for that one. He was like, I was like, hey, don't be absurd. Wait a minute. Wait a minute. I might jack up on some plans for the black woman. Come on. Come on.

It's like, come on. You go through this knowing that if I speak up, nobody's going to have my back. You know, so it's, um, I always feel bad because she was. was the one, if anyone was one of the first people to speak up, it was her. And now she had, she not only, they sued her for the cost of their legal defense. You know, motherfucker. Where she had? I want to put her on the shoulder. And they talk about that case all the time. It comes up a lot. It comes up in our HR meetings to this day. Those awful two-hour meetings we just had a meeting, a network meeting came up there. Yeah. So she came before this, the Me Too

madness. Oh, this is like late 90s. 90s. 98, 99. 2000. I didn't start out here until 2002, so it had to be like... Early 2000s. Yeah, yeah. Wow. So I remember, but yes, they did, like you said. They said, we're not hiring. Do any of you know where she is or who she is? I mean, you could... I'm sure she never worked in the...

I know some people who have tried to reach out to her. She went into the military, which I would do too if I had all these powerful men trying to go. But that's all I know. And I know that some journalists have tried to reach out to. She got her training on. She got some skills. But, but, Ann, talk about two in the room the difference between like, because, you know, it's jokes, right? You can tell sexual jokes and whatnot.

But when it becomes offensive, like what would have made her be like? Because you've experienced some shit in the scrub's room. Yes, I will say that what makes you cross the line? I will say that in these jobs, I always liken it to going on to a construction site. I put on a different hat. I put on protective gear when I go in these rooms. And I give as good as I get. But there are certain things that I've heard in rooms like.

What does that mean? That means that if you're going to sit there and talk about my ass, I'm going to make up shit about your dick and I'm going to sit there and I'm going to talk about your mom and your brother and all that other shit. I'm going to make you crawl under the motherfucking desk. Like, for real. I'm just You know, like, you can't be, in my opinion, you can't be like, oh, it's scary.

You can't be no bitch and it. Literally, I'm not going to go into a room and talk about, we talk about how, one of the things we talk about the last OG because there's a white guy there. And I said, you know, white guys, it's so funny when they try to have sex with a black woman, they're always trying to compete with what they think black men do. You know, so I go into a half an hour spiel about having sex with white guys.

I can't put out that much on a table where have people visualizing my vagina and not expecting them to come back with a joke about it. So then what is crossing the line? Crossing the line to me is watching a basketball game and using the N-word and looking at me and expecting a laugh. Wait, what? Wait.

Really? Yeah. And then, but then getting into the whole thing. Wait, they felt that safe to say, niggott. Again, like. Like it was no repercussions? We heard earlier that they felt safe enough to say, we're not going to hire another black woman after this one black woman messed up.

What if someone said we're not hired another white man? But yes, of course, yes. These are all things that happened. And you can't go to HR because. HR looks out for their company. HR is not going to look out for you. HR ain't your friend. HR is the company.

But it also, I mean, the other reason you don't go to HR is because it'll hurt your, like if you want to stay a writer. If people are going like, okay, we got to hire another room. If I'm like, oh, well, that person who they hired last time, they went to HR based on some jokes that was made. You basically went to internal affairs. Yeah, then it's like, why would I bring that person? I mean, even the black kid didn't have a gun.

It kind of hurts you. By the way, even with the Me Too movement, I'm pretty sure we've only seen a very small snippet of people who have stories. There's a lot of women. Probably every woman in Hollywood has a story about some shit that somebody did. But, you know, again, there's a cost-benefit going on. People are going like, eh. Is it worth me? It's worth it not working.

Yeah, I don't want to, it's sad to say, but I don't want to be the person now after I see what happens to that other girl that anyone ever says it. Well, you know what, Angela is the reason they're not hired any more black women, you know? It's sad, but I don't want to be that person. No, as black people, we always have the thing about that. We always have the thing in terms of the collective. Like, if I do something, it ain't just me doing it. I represent 30 other niggas that don't even know me. And, yeah, that's what's fucked up.

But every room culture is also different. Like, some rooms, you know, and it's absolutely sexist. It's absolutely racist. But some rooms are just like hard rooms, period. Where, depending on how the showrunner is, like, I've definitely been in a room, but I've seen two even white guys viciously going at each other and everybody's laughing and I'm like

like, yeah, that's just Like going to each other like personally Like like getting real personal Oh some like your wife shit And like oh whatever that's why your wife You know whatever that would be But like some showrunners Encourage that because they think it makes

The show better to have a feisty room So it actually it's like sometimes People want that Thunderdome atmosphere Yeah true You know really? Yeah people who we've worked before Like I've heard directly from some very famous producer that his assistant was like

well he likes it when the writers compete a lot and they're really kind of cutting each other's throats and I was like really I don't like that it's not fun to go to work every day knowing like this person says something to me that I'm going to talk shit about him and then almost come to blows with this person and fight this person you know in a building

but I will say for the most my personal experience is that most writers rooms have a general like you like the people that you're in the room with and it becomes like this sort of weird family where like you say said, all secrets kind of come out on the table and you typically grow pretty close. I can't speak on what it was like to be in one of those all-male rooms in like, you know,

the early 90s where every dude, every writer was a white guy. I don't know what that's ever been like. I've never been in that room. It's amazing. Me and Tracy were talking before we started recording today and we were like, it's the real world knew that they had something. We are trapped in a room with each other for sometimes up to 12 hours a day. sometimes we sleep overnight with each other. And unlike on TV, on the real world, all these shows,

but we are forced to talk to each other about topics that we think will engage America. So it's like, and we are going to disagree. And if you have a good room, it's very diverse and everyone has diverse opinions. So that's why sometimes fists will fly. Sometimes people will say things and people will call out people's dead moms. It gets super real. I had to hold back one day. Remember, Angie?

I had to hold back. I got up. It was something I just didn't agree with that we were doing with our female character. And I just like, I was holding it in. And I think I said, y'all going to get letters. I think that's what I said. I said, y'all going to get letters. And I just got up.

Y'all got outboated or? No, no. It was kind of a misunderstanding. But I'm glad that that happened because the showrunner then said, oh, did you think I meant this? And then other people in the room said, well, that's what I. thought you meant. Yeah. So, and I thought nobody in the room at that moment had my back, but then everybody was like,

no, we were right on the same page with you on that, you know, but they say you're not supposed to do that. How receptive are, like, in the rooms? Because I'd imagine now being that, you know, with like black Twitter and, you know, how like shit is instant, you know what I mean? Like, how receptive are people or, I guess, whether it be the showrunners or the producers or the higher-ups or whoever, how receptive are they to y'all's, like, feedback of saying, Like, yo, we're going to get clapback.

Yeah, like, you're going to be on bossop the next morning, nigga. Like, you don't want these problems. Do they listen to y'all on that kind of shit? Depends. I mean, so much can change by the time it's on the page to the time that it's on the stage. And then sometimes by the time, black Twitter says something, we're like, oh, they're going to hate this because we already filmed it. You know? Yeah, yeah.

So it's, it depends. I think sometimes, like, I try to fight for that in the room, you know. You don't want to be, they call the wet blanket in the room. You don't want to be that person. But, you know, certain things, like if I feel really passionate about it, sometimes what I'll do is I'll just talk to that showrunner alone, you know, and we'll talk alone. Because sometimes in the room, something might, you know, it might pop off. So I just go and say, I'll wait until I can talk to him privately. I would assume that post the Roseanne situation that most writers room know that black Twitter or the internet, social media, has the power to get you canceled in a millisecond.

was it before them they were just like oh it doesn't make it doesn't matter I don't know I think these conversations always said in fact I'll even say there times when me and Bashir don't agree about a line of dialogue you know like so I don't even think it necessarily has to be a white black thing like there can be sometimes when like two black people disagree about like what's going to set off black Twitter well no no I don't mean a white black thing I just meant the power of the the instant feedback from an audience that I mean I'm going to I'm gonna be an outlier here and say, I think people are extremely attuned to that.

But my personal feeling is it is terrible to be attuned to that because it's gonna stop you from taking bold strokes, making bold decisions. And you also have to look at the Genesis and Origin or something like, there's something on our new show that's a little bit controversial, but a black writer pitched it. It was a room full of black people there

who laughed when he pitched it. I was there, you know what I'm saying? So it's like, it's almost like there's a line between if it's coming from us versus if it's like a white TV show with a black character where it's like, well, there's no agents. there, but it's also case by case. And I apologize for being repetitive,

but I personally do feel like if you live your life constantly worried about what's Twitter going to think about this, then I don't know what kind of life you live in. I completely agree. I'm with you because it's also, sometimes I'll see that Twitter get so excited just seeing black faces on the screen and I want to scream at Twitter, there's no black writers

on that show. There's no black gaffers. There's not even a black man on the craft food service tables. Black folks, just the mascots for the show. Yes, yes. And so it's I sometimes wish that And a lot of people on Black Twitter perhaps have their own agendas when they rail against or for a show. You just got to be careful with that show. Yes.

So I agree with you totally by sharing it. Could I just say also, to that point also, I myself have prejudices. Like, I was talking to this black woman at this event one time and I was asking what her favorite TV show was. And I thought she was going to be like, well, you know, insecure and Atlanta and like name all the shows that are like the shows that people were talking about. She just named a bunch of random shit that I didn't even know it was on the air. And I myself was like, see, that's my prejudice. because I assume because she was a black woman that she's only watching TV shows

with a strong black female lead. And like, no, she was like, she was like the flat, well, no, but see, but here's why, though, because when you were in these meetings, when you're talking to these executives, that's all they talk about. Well, you've got to have this person on the show because there's a black woman,

so you have to have a black woman in your life? Do you take that into account too? Does it just become so light tonal vision? Not at all. Actually, no, not at all. What I'm saying. Not at all. Does he have black women in his life?

Exactly. Shout out to my wife. Thank you. Shout out to the wife. I'm right, you're invited. But I was just want to say that I think listening to TV executives, you would think that only people, people only watch stuff where they themselves

are greatly represented on screen. And I think our feeling, and what we struggle with at HBO, our feeling was that no, black people are too diverse to be put in the box. You cannot tell them what they will like and what they won't like. You can't predict that.

You have no idea what a black audience will like. Which is crazy because coming from your experience, you can't tell an executive like, trust me, I know, I know like mad black women. They're like the numbers say. Those numbers are subjective. You know, now I feel really bad that me and my mom fudged that Nielsen thing. They're like, look at this thing and says 2-27. Go on and turn to a minute anyway.

Turn a minute. Damn. Take a break. Okay, I figured the jam was coming. I was playing a jam, but then I thought you were on a thought. Oh, no, now. Go ahead. Here we go.

Ladies and gentlemen, I hate to be the bare bad news, but that is all for Questlove Supreme this week, but don't worry. Tune in the next week, you're going to hear how this conversation is, all right? Okay, we'll see you next to go ahead. Peace. Questlove Supreme is a production of I-Heart Radio.

This classic episode was produced by the team at Pandora. For more podcasts from I-HeartRadio, visit the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what I'm saying. Yep, that's me.

Clivert Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, my basketball and college football journey, or my career in sports media. Well, now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifers Show. This is a place for raw, unfills of conversations with athletes,

creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. So let's get to it. Listen to The Cliford Show on the I-Hard Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, Follow at Clifford and at TikTok podcast network on TikTok. This week on the Sports Slice podcast, it's all about the NFL draft.

And we've got a special guest. The director of the NFL's East-West Shrine Bowl, Eric Galko, joins the Sports Slice podcast to break down what really matters when evaluating draft prospects. From hidden traits teams look for to the biggest mistakes franchises make to the players flying under the radar. This is the insight you won't hear anywhere else. If you want to understand the draft like an insider, you don't want to make. miss this episode. Listen to the Sports Slice podcast on the Iheart Radio app

Apple Podcasts for wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Slica Life 12 and TikTok podcast network on TikTok. When a group of women discover they've all dated the same prolific con artist, they take matters into their own hands.

I vowed. I will be his last target. He is not going to get away with this. He's going to get what he deserves. We always say that trust your girl. Listen to the Girlfriends. Trust me, babe, on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an IHeart podcast. Guaranteed human.