The Questlove Show - QLS Classic : Joan Jett

Episode Date: October 11, 2026

In this classic episode of Questlove Supreme from 2022, Joan Jett spoke about growing up moving between Pennsylvania, Maryland and Los Angeles, and how songs like T. Rex's "Bang a Gong" made her want to chase her dreams, even after a guitar teacher told her "girls don't play Rock & Roll." She recalls forming The Runaways as a teenager, starting with four bus rides to jam with drummer Sandy West, and the low point after the band broke up, which ended when she met Kenny Laguna and later turned a little-known Arrows B-side into the hit "I Love Rock 'n' Roll." Jett also discusses her influence on Riot Grrrl, her Rock & Roll Hall of Fame induction, her new acoustic album, and her plans to keep stepping outside her comfort zone—maybe even with an R&B record. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-heart podcast. Guaranteed Human. The Hard Rock Bet Casino app is here, Ontario. And with a name like Hard Rock, you know you're in for an experience you can only get here. Exclusive games, an exclusive progressive jackpot, and the kind of trust and security you can only get with Hard Rock. And now you can enjoy the things you can only get here anywhere. Hard Rock Bed is here, Ontario. Download the app.

Roll with us. Must be 19 years of age or older to play. Ontario only. Please play responsibly. Concerned about your gambling or that of someone close to you, visit connectsonterio.ca. Lisa, tell them about our new show. We have a new podcast. It's called Don't Lie to Me.

I'm Lexi Youanu. We're two best friends, 22 years apart, but so close at heart. And I'm Lisa Di Giulio, the old one, which means we have wildly different references, occasionally different opinions. And at this point in my 50s, I've lived it all. Now in my 30s, being the founder of new shoes, good taste is my business. Listen on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Lacey Mosley, author, actor, stand-up comedian, creator, and host of Scam Goddess Podcast. The True Crime Comedy Podcasts, all about robbery, fraud, and those who practice it.

Each week I bring on an amazing guest. Ooh, I scammed them. What? I can talk to you for an hour. You're a generational yapper like me. That's why I had to make yapping a job. And now you can catch full episodes of my show on YouTube. Start listening to Scam Goddess on the IHckels.

Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. The guy I'm got it. Questlove Supreme is a production of IHeart Radio. What's up, y'all? All right. So every weekend, as we prepare to give you a new episode of the Questlove show, we are showcasing moments from Questlove Supreme Catalog. Damn near a decade.

Fonte, Faye, Firea, Sugar Steve, Bumpe Bill, and Boss Bill and I use this platform to interview the greatest music, comedy, film, books, and activism. The show evolved a lot over the years and really became a place of joy as Questlove Supreme went to Zoom over the pandemic. Please enjoy these episodes and get information in the description.

QLS forever. Ladies and gentlemen, what's up? This is Quest Love Supreme. Wait, I believe, is this our first Quest Love Supreme back together since, since what? Like, last April? Since the Oscars? I feel like I've not spoken to you guys.

Yeah, I think this is the first one. Maybe we did like one episode or something like that. But yeah, I was about to say, like, it's been a long time. We've been doing a bunch of 101s. But I'll start off our episode, people, by saying that because the ungodly amount of hours that I've spit at the Winwood train station or taking the 105 and the 103 bus to my insurance job to pay for a demo, I feel just a little bit. bit more connected to our guest today than any other guest that's been Philadelphia adjacent. I'll put it that way. Now, I got excited.

I get excited when any Philly adjacent guest comes on to Questler Supreme. And no matter how much New York tries to claim you, I know for the fact that you did hard time at Montgomery County. Oh, yeah. You know, once in Philadelphia, and always Philadelphia. Anywho. Philly and I lived in Pittsburgh and I lived in Erie. Oh, Yins.

Lots of different. Yeah, Yens. The first person that's used Yens. My mother is from Pittsburgh. So, yeah, I have definitely a share of fair share family members that, you know, have educated, educated me on just life in Pittsburgh in general. I'll say that our guest today, of course, is a legendary singer, legendary songwriter, producer.

Let's not forget, a kick-ass guitarist, a member of two legendary units. The first, of course, coming to us as a member of the Runaways, a band who pretty much defied all logic and stuck to their guns and pretty much had inspired a generation of musicians and creators around the world. And, of course, the second band needs no introduction. Of course, I'm speaking of her namesake, Jonjet and the Black Hearts class of 2015 rock and roll Hall of Fame.

What could I say without her? You know, I don't even want to limit it to just there's no riot girl movement. There's just there's a whole portion of hard rock and punk and a lot of post late 80s, early 90s bands that formed in L.A. that really wouldn't exist it without our guest today. So without further ado, welcome Joan Jett to Questlove Supreme. So were you talking to us right now? Were you speaking to us from? I'm home in New York out on Long Island at the beach.

You're still Long Island, then? Yeah, well, yeah, I live at the beach. Yeah, I'm like right on the water, though. All right, you know what I just, I discovered in the pandemic, And I keep telling everyone, especially New Yorkers of this, and they don't believe me. New York doesn't realize they have their own Mahal and drive and they have their own Venice Beach. Now, you know, I've not, there was a point where I think the main train was going to shut down that leads to Williamsburg. Causing, you know, it was going to shut down for like two years, whatever while they did reconstruction, causing a whole borough to live.

literally relocate elsewhere. Like restaurants started shutting down. And all of them basically relocated to Long Beach. So when a friend of mine made me visit out there, I didn't know what to expect. Like I was personally expecting, you know, kind of, you said Hawkins like, post-Benson Herssey's, you know, whatever.

No, I went out there and it's like, yo, It is the shit. It was pretty beat up. Like when I moved here in 1979. Oh, so you're like a loyalist. You've been there through everything. I moved here right after the runaways broke. Pretty much right after the runaways broke up, which is 79.

Then I met my partner, Kenny Laguna. What do you make of it now? Because like literally it's like if I didn't have to be in Manhattan at like the drop of a dime, I would actually move out to Long Beach. Like it's, it's, it's, they totally, I don't want to say just re-gentified it, but they literally just. They did. They did.

Yeah. Okay. You know, they're making it. I don't know what you want to call it. Nice, end quote. Yeah. Nicer. Yeah.

I wasn't, I wasn't ready for that. So. But when I moved to, it was, uh, they just opened all the mental institutions or something. So when I got here, there were crazy people walking all over the place. and you could have bought my apartment for like 20 grand or something. But, you know, those days are long gone. The price is definitely going up. Yeah.

And now people want places like this. So even more so. Yeah. Anyone's like trying to sell their house right now in Long Beach can easily kick in high six figures to almost a million. Definitely. That's where it is now. People are like headed out there. So I start off of each episode with.

the question. What do you remember what your first musical memory was? I can't be positive, but it would be either. Well, just one that you remember, not the technical one. All right, all right. Singing Mary had a little lamb at eight months, what I mean. But I think of my father playing classical music or my parents listening to Johnny Mathis or something like that, Frank Sinatra. Okay. How long did you live in, uh, well, technically you're born in

Well, Wimwood, right? Yeah, I was born in Lankanah Hospital. Lankanah, yes. So wherever that is. Yeah, it's quasi. But I moved very early. I moved that like six months old and moved to Pittsburgh. So I can't really say I grew up in Philly.

I was just born there. So when you have memories of your childhood, what's the city you think of? Maryland. Oh, okay. I moved to Maryland from Erie, Pennsylvania, when I was eight, when I was eight. So I lived in Maryland, Rockville, Maryland, from eight to 13.

So really formative years, you know, when you come into your own, I guess, you know, going from being a kid to puberty and, you know, all those big changes that happened from, I'd say, to eight to your teen years. What effect does that have on someone that, you know, where you don't have actual roots, like you kind of move every other year,

every two or three years. Like, what effect does that have on you as far as like? That's a good question. I wonder how much of it I'm doing psychology on myself. I was thinking about this the other day. How much of it was my lifestyle from a very early age, from being on the road, you know, just constantly moving. And also, but growing up that way too,

never really being in one place very long. Longest was Maryland when I lived there five years. So maybe you don't. feel secure in making friendships or any kind of relationships. So, you know, I don't know, maybe I tend to keep people at arm's length. Okay. You know, it's not that I'm unfriendly. It's just I'm not good with intimacy, I suppose.

Hmm. That's real. Do you have siblings or like, what's the, no, it's, it's not as a real answer. Well, I'm not good at faking it. Hey, man. I fear you. I have a brother and I have a sister. They're both still live in California.

My brother's in San Diego. My sister's in North Hollywood. Are you the baby in the middle or the oldest? No, I'm oldest. Okay. I'm the oldest. I'm out of here. Oh, instantly when you knew.

You know, when I was 16, pretty much. You know, and I left and formed the band. And it's not really at home much more after that. I think I see the repercussions of that now later. But I don't know if that's my lifestyle or if it's from not really having that connective family thing. As the result of moving, was that because you were an army brat or just? My father was, you know, my father was an insurance man. So traveling insurance, traveling insurance man in the olden days.

Is that a real thing? was at a hostel. Hey, I went out to... Either way. I went out to... To, uh, one would to sell insurance. So I don't know. Maybe I was like working with, for your father.

Yeah, yeah, but I guess, you know, they'd have areas and they'd go and... I don't know if it was a door to door. I really don't know. I didn't, I didn't discuss it with them that much. But that's, that's what my mother told me anyway, traveling, traveling salesman. Okay. So we moved around. Yeah.

Do you remember the first... album that you purchased with your own money? I should know this, right? Or single, or single. It probably is an Osmond Brothers record. Thank you. You know, oftentimes, I will... Maybe I shouldn't be that honest.

No, no, no. This is the show for it. Yeah, you're getting too honest now. I was going to say most people get stumped with this because I think for a lot of us, the answer is always going to be an uncool answer. You know, I think for the... Shut up, Steve. No, I'm thinking of my own as the least coolest, but yeah.

Well, no, I, you know, I would naturally tell people like, oh, yeah, Jackson 5 or whatever, but the real answer was Neil Sedaka, but how's that going to look in print, you know what I mean? Not great. Might have been the Jackson 5, too. I mean, you know what? I just got done watching the movie that you won awards for. I've been, it is so great. And it reminds me of growing up

because I feel like the music I grew up listening to was a lot more diversified and a lot blacker than people would even know, I suppose. It just seemed to be a lot, a lot of all those songs, all those bands that were in that, very familiar with it all. But it feels like stuff I watched as a kid. Right. You know, I don't know.

I loved it. Thank you. Yeah. You know, I think for a lot of people, you know, especially with this movie, the kind of the underlying or the undertone of it all is basically like this was, you know, it was easily lost in history. It's set in some of his basement for 50 years. So, you know, for it to get out, one was the miracle. but, you know, to also just let the world know about, you know, contributions to culture. But thank you, thank you for example.

I appreciate that. Absolutely. But even more than just the music, I see, you know, what they were saying about the change, you know, that they were right upon this change that was happening in society and just the way people looked at themselves and stuff. And it was, you know, really quite poignant, my thought. And really on the, you know. I appreciate that.

Did you come from a musical family, like a cousin or any of those things? I really think everybody, I think if you gave them, no, to answer your question, no. Nobody, not that they actualized, but I believe because my family all tended to be creative, but never actualized it. You know, they were too fearful or didn't think it was their place or, you know, look, I know my dad loved art and he loved to draw or paint. And you should have done that, you know. And, you know, my mom, all those things. My brother, I know that he would have liked to play an instrument, but didn't pursue it. And I'm sure my sister, you know, she's an artist too.

She makes things with their hands. So, yeah, they all have that thing, but didn't really get the chance that I kind of just grabbed and took. All right. So what was the entry of, or at least the moment that you felt like, Okay. This is what I want to do, like the curiosity factor. What was that moment for you? Hearing songs like Bang a Gong by T-Rex. Just hearing certain songs on the radio all right now by the free. Because there was something that was a little out of tune with one of the guitars on the rhythm guitar. And something about that made me want to go, I want to make those sounds.

It was something that connected with my bones, you know. with my crotch. And even as a little kid, I knew it. I didn't know what the word was, but I knew that it resonated deep inside me, you know? And I wanted to make those sounds. So I think, though, I'm just lucky that the way my life moved, because it could have been anything,

I could have moved on to another thing that I love. I mean, I loved horses. I rode horses for a while. I mean, the guitar, my family, I got this guitar. I tried to learn how to play it, but I didn't really have anyone to play with, so I kind of just learned the basic chords and put it down. Then my family moved to-

Like the Sears catalog guitar? Yes, it is, yes, it is. Everyone starts off with- Yeah, okay. Yep, yep. And then my family moved to Los Angeles. So now I'm like, okay, now I'm going to a place where there's got to be other girls

that want to do what I'm doing. There's got to be in Los Angeles. there's got to be other girls that want to play mock and roll. And, you know, I was right. And I'm sure if I'd really looked around Maryland or, you know, any of the big cities are going to D.C., I would have found it too.

But I just wasn't thinking that way because all my magazines that I was reading geared me towards Hollywood. Okay. For you, though, you know, how usual or unusual, especially in your formative years, like, was guitar encouraged or, you know, oftentimes,

or was there someone like, you might want to do piano or the clarinet or like something that a girl would want to do? I did do in school, you know, but I wasn't very good at it. And I wasn't that interested. And now I wish I had, now I wish I had paid attention, you know, and that I'd learned to play

just so I could read music. But, you know, just to be able to play other instruments. It was made to feel quite, inadequate. I just worked with the trombone Shorty and he made me feel like bro. You see that guy on, he's a little

little kid with a big trombone, you know? But now he's an older guy, but he's just, you know, he's one of those prodigy people. So did you just learn to play just mainly by ear or you still don't read music now? Just ear? That's what's up. Just heard, yeah, ear

with my records and stuff. Were you encouraged? Because I think that Yes, no. Especially with anyone with a woman grabbing an instrument in the 60s, in the 70s, hell, even 80s almost. I'm certain that there has to be some sort of figure there that says women can't do that. And women, you know. Everybody said that. Nobody encouraged me.

Nobody. Only my parents, you told me when I was a little kid that I could be anything I wanted to be. So now they couldn't turn around and say, well, You can be anything except a guitar player. So, you know, they just thought I'd grow out of it, that I'd phase out of it and go into something else, which I think might have happened had I not moved to California and been able to find other girls,

then maybe I would have gone on to something else. But that didn't happen. And I went to L.A., and nobody thought it was a good idea. My guitar teacher said, Girls don't play rock and roll, which I knew right away what he meant. But they want you to play acoustic instead? Yeah. Like follow Joni Mitchell.

or, you know. Yeah, pretty much. Pretty much. But I knew exactly what that meant. Girls don't play rock and roll. So what are you saying to me? You're saying, you're not saying girls can't master the guitar because I'm in school. I'm playing clarinet.

There's girls next to me playing violin and cello, playing Beethoven and Bach. So you're not saying that we can't master the instrument. What you're saying is rock and roll is sexual by its nature. So if women are playing rock and roll and sing. mocking roll, they're singing about sexuality and they're owning it. And we're not comfortable with that. And I knew that as a kid, even then I knew that, that just you weren't allowed to it, but it had something to do with sex.

And I was just like, no, you know, because this is so not about sex for me. I want to be able to do this because I want to do it. You know, Mick Jagger rides out on a big inflatable penis. I want to do it to Rolling Stones do. You know, it had nothing to do with that. It was about fairness. I know it doesn't make sense, but it was about quality and the right thing, what's right. I mean, I'm not hurting people, you know.

Right. I'm playing rock and roll for Christ's sake. Give me a break. So that's the kind of fire that would fuel me on through all this stuff. The Hard Rock Bet Casino app is here, Ontario. And with a name like Hard Rock, you know you're in for an experience you can only get. Get here. Exclusive games, an exclusive progressive jackpot, and the kind of trust and security you can only get with Hard Rock. And now you can enjoy the things you can only get here anywhere. Hard Rock Bed is here, Ontario. Download the app. Roll with us. Must be 19 years of age or older to play. Ontario only. Please play responsibly. Concerned about your gambling or that of someone close to you, visit connectsonterio.ca.

Lisa, we should tell them about our new show. Oh my God, Lexi. We have a new podcast. It's called Don't Lie to Me. I'm Lexi Yuwanu. We're two best friends, 22 years apart, but so close at heart. And I'm Lisa Di Giulio, the old one, which means we have wildly different references, occasionally different opinions, and at this point in my 50s, I've lived it all. I'm not going to get anyone fighting. That is wild. I learned that about you today. Now in my 30s, being the founder of new shoes, good taste is my business, and I've always got something to say. If men were just honest about this, there would be so much more peace in the world.

We're going to talk about dating, relationships, beauty, getting older, and a little wiser. We're best friends, but we don't always agree. Because you told us how accommodating you are. Obviously, I would do what I think I could do to fight the fight, but there's only so much fight I can fight. Don't lie to me. Don't lie to me. Don't lie to me. Don't lie to me.

Don't lie to me. Don't lie to me. Liar. Listen on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts. or wherever you get your podcast. I don't really care. I'm Lacey Mosley, author, actor, stand-up comedian, creator, and host of Scam Goddess Podcasts.

The True Crime Comedy Podcasts, all about robbery, fraud, and those who practice it. Each week I bring on incredible guests like Conan O'Brien, Iowa Debris, Lamorne Morris, and Nicole Byer. Ooh, I scammed them. What? I can talk to you for an hour. You're a generational yapper like me. That's why I had to make yapping a job.

And the scams run the gamut. I'm talking about scams from the 1800s all the way up to today. I also warn you and keep you safe against scammers. Call your grandparents. Tell your parents to stop clicking on links, please. And now you can catch full episodes of my show on YouTube. If there's a scam, I'm here to protect you. And I'm also here to laugh with you.

So if you like fun, if you like comedy and you like learning and protecting yourself from criminals, start listening to scam goddess on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast. or wherever you get your podcast. See, I've never had the pleasure of having a conversation with anyone who, you know, is pretty much either first out the gate or at least in the pioneering stages of starting a movement to even ask them what their mind state is, you know, because oftentimes, you know, our greats leave and, you know, before we get to ask them about their process. And so, you know, I always wanted to know if, because even when I was in the high school, like someone, I think I was honest with one teacher, like, what I was going to do.

Like I'm a startup band with da-da-da-da-da. And, you know, I went to high school with boys to men. And they were just, yeah, they were like on fire. And, you know, sort of like, well, you know, are you guys going to be boys to men popular? Or you're just going to be one of these local acts. And, you know, I wasn't thinking of met deep about my process or anything. Right, right. I think he tried to talk me out of, like, pursue my career.

Yeah, see, I don't understand that about people. This is what I want to know about people and dreams. You know, you're sitting there shooting the shit with your friends and you say what you said, that you want to play, and someone tries to talk you out of it. Right. Why is everyone geared to try to talk you out of it as opposed to saying, yeah, man, that sounds interesting. then go for it. At least if you don't make it,

you gave it a shot. You gave you a dream a shot. What is that about people? I think some people get offended or they get intimidated when they see that your dreams don't include them. And so they just try to shoot the shit down,

you know what I mean? Right. It's like if I run a hamburger stand, the last thing I want you to do is become a vegan, you know what I mean? Like, don't do that. You know what I mean? Yeah, yeah.

But I also think that oftentimes we're just, I think in America, we often train ourselves to do the safe thing. Like, I think hopefully my generation is the last generation, what you'll hear, like, fall back on something safe. Like, I definitely heard that from every uncle. COVID in the show, that ain't shit safe, cause do what you want to do. Yeah, right, right, totally. Exactly.

So what, okay, so you're a musician in Los Angeles and you're young at the time. Had this been, you know, 20, 2007 or whatever, you would have the aid of the internet to help you. But what is the process of finding what you're specifically looking for, which I assume are women that play instruments and are passionate about it just as you are? So what's the process of searching for them? And at any point where you just like, at least in the runaway stages, were you like, okay, anyone male, female can join? Or for you, was it like, I have to find all women? No, and for the runaways, it was definitely an all women thing because, you know,

we hadn't really been done or, you know, if it hadn't been done, I'd been done years earlier with full grown women, but not teenage girls. And so I just had this thing and I wanted to do it. do it. And I didn't see a good reason to change that plan, you know, and give up so easy, you know, saying, oh, this might be hard. But, you know, it's hard to think back and realize how different it was then than it is now and how easily you can reach out to people on the phone, on the internet. Right. I mean, you're talking, we had rotary phones, you know, we're talking about phone booths. We're talking about you didn't get a hold of people. You know, if you got a hold of somebody,

You met them at a certain time on a certain corner, or at a certain place. You know, there was none of this. So Fonte right here, Fonte is probably, to his fan base, probably most known for being one of the first musicians to really take advantage of the, I'll say the positive aspect of internet colonization. One of the bands that he started was a group called. foreign exchange in which where's a

Nick now he's in Wilma's Nick right but where's like to ask me at the time he was in the Netherlands and uh right we just recorded that we met on okay player on media site and uh we just started trading files online back and forth and uh we completed album we didn't meet each other until it was wow and that was in so they didn't even meet yet before they made a classic album you know what I mean and so yeah so you know what is the process stuff. How do you find these, these birds of a feather, if you will? Yes, in that time. I believe what we did is we put an ad in, what was it, the LA Weekly. Okay. Maybe. And we went out to a lot of the clubs that I would hang out at. And I would just survey the crowd and look for girls.

Wow. This is around 74, 75? This would have been 75. Okay, so you're like 16, 15, 16. Like after August, after August 5th. So, all right, this is what I have to know. You're in California. Were you a driver? Did you have a car? Oh, I didn't drive, no.

Buses. I took a lot of buses. And also my mother was, you know, sort of complicit in all this. So she would drive me to rehearsal. She would take me to the club. sometimes and picked me up late at night. Yeah, yeah, she. So clubs weren't sweating like, I mean, of course, now we live in a place where you got to show,

you know, damn near 12 forms of ID to get in anywhere or else your license gets up. But the club I went to was for teenagers. There was no booze. So my mom didn't worry about that. So there was no booze there. And I don't think she was really thinking about drugs or anything like that. Who were your, were you any? Any of your contemporaries also sort of in that movement

that later became names themselves? No, not really. Once like Sherry and Lita, your band members sort of like coming to play. How did you know that, okay, this is it. They're the ones. Well, we didn't have that many choices, number one. You know what I mean?

Okay. So it was more like, do we want to try? Well, first it was the drummer, myself, Sandy West and I, we met. Oh, Sandy, right, okay. Yeah, and so we were solid as hell, Sandy and I. I took four buses to her house in Huntington Beach.

Four? Yeah, four bosses. And I set up in her rec room and we played, you know, some just basic Chuck Berry rock and roll progression and said, you know, it was really good. Sandy played with a lot of guy, you know, high school band kind of things.

And so she was used to playing with bands, but usually guys. So we really locked in and we called Kim Fowley, who was our producer. Right. Who became our producer and said, hey, check it out. Put the phone down, played for him.

He said, it sounds great. Let's go find other girls. So it was really, you know, from there, we started looking. We started looking in clubs and I think put an ad in a paper and stuff like that. Who came out with the name of Runaways? I did. Okay.

So already you're at your marketing plan. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah, I've been thinking about this for a little while now, you know, a couple months at least. Did you guys have a daily regiment or was just like when ever time was free, then we'll rehearse or whatever. Yeah, I really tell the truth. I can't remember. Like, how can you be a kid and also start this very adult thing?

Like, were all parents involved, like encouraging of this? No. Our parents were involved, but a couple of the girls were a year younger than me. So they were like in 11th grade. So they still had school to deal with. And yeah, not all the parents were thrilled about it. But in the end, I don't know. I guess they didn't want to fight their daughters or something. But for school, I got pretty good grades. And I took my GED. I was already in 12th grade, but I wanted to get out a little bit early, so we could go on the road. Okay.

I always wanted to know, I guess, to me, the initial incarnation of the runaways, like, why weren't you the lead singer? Or why didn't you want to be the focal? Yeah. I was way too shy at the time. And, you know, I was way too shy. I had no confidence. You know, I just I had no confidence

and was just really shy. It was amazing that I could do what I wanted what I was doing, you know, just getting on stage with the guitar. But did you have your voice then, or you just kept it as secret? I sang background vocals. Yeah, I could sing. Yeah, I could sing. I did wind up

singing half of the leads on the first Runaways album because Cherie didn't want to sing. the rock and roll or the rock and roll harder songs. She felt that she didn't have the voice for it or didn't feel comfortable singing some of them. So the one she didn't feel comfortable singing, I sang the leads and I sang backup on a bit of a bit of a bit. So I did have a voice, but I just wasn't comfortable being the focal point.

Gotcha. So at this point, at this point in developing the band, who are you looking up to? because again, you guys have ushered in, you guys ushered in an era and, you know, pretty much your band's existence just basically starts a domino effect on, again, people that come tend to 15 years later. But, you know, in 75, 76, when you guys are doing this band, like, who's cool to you?

Like, are the Stones and Zeppelin sort of like, ah, that's old, whatever music like who who's grabbing your attention like well I know I was disappointed with the stones and they started doing like you weren't at Exilemon

stream first yeah I no I wanted them to you don't like some rock and roll you know I didn't like them doing some girls yeah well it was it was fine but you know I don't know

I guess I wanted them to be playing something that I could really rock out to, you know, whatever. No one stays rebellious forever. I know. I know that. There's a good seven-year. I get it now. Before you start doing your classical record or whatever. No, I get it now. Believe me.

But I think a lot, I think I really started looking to the punk rock stuff right away because the Ramones came out, I believe, in 1975, late 75, right? Right. Very first Ramon's album. and all the punk rock stuff I was reading a lot about and I really gravitated very quickly to a lot of those bands because I felt, you know, kinship with a lot of them. I mean, there's always like groups or artists or albums

that are always on someone's canon, like their top five records of all the time. You always see the names, whatever. And I've never, sometimes you don't do the investigation of it. And, you know, of course, I've always seen the Ramon's name. everywhere. And finally I'd listen down from from top to bottom like two years ago and realized like how how genius and hard it is to really convey emotion and lyricism in less than two minutes. Hey ho, let's go.

Yo. That shit a jam, though. That shit jamming. Exactly. So for you, where you seem that there was a science here, like, you know, the type of rock that you were, you were fed as a child is way different than the ideas that you're about to dispew onto the world. Like, for you is like, look, we got to, don't Boris get to the course, two minutes flat. Well, no, you got to see, the thing was,

didn't really transfer that much into our music. It might have translated a little bit to my songwriting, but, you know, as a group, as a band, most of the girls weren't, really into punk rock the way I was. You know, they were much more, they liked heavier bands, you know, more like, you know, the more mainstream popular ones. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

You know, that's heavier stuff. Rainbow, you know, pretty blackmore, that kind of stuff. So, you know, we didn't really see eye to eye on our hangout music. So we didn't, you know, we had to come from a place where we met in the middle. So, you know, I just always considered what we did to be basic rock and roll.

What was the division of labor as far as the songwriting is concerned? And what you're going to cover or who's going to write what? Like, who's the primary songwriter of the group? Was that your job? I think it was me for the most part. It was me. I wrote either songs with Kim Fowley as a lyricist or I wrote songs by myself. I think I wrote a couple with some of the other girls, but not too many.

And yeah, so I guess I was the primary one. Back then, like, it was sort of hard for you guys to break out in the States, but yet, you know, your, the magic's working instantaneously when you go overseas. Like, how much of a mind fuck was that to kind of, because that's very similar to hip hop. Like, you know, my band had to move to Europe for five years. Right. Just so that, you know, and quote unquote, Paula Hendricks. and then come back to the United States

like that sort of thing like Right In your mind Was it a dream deferred or like wait What's going on here or What were your feelings on? I thought well you know A lot of different

A lot of different feelings Yeah one part of me I had wished that we had the same sort of response In the States But it was so different around the world And Japan was like all girls Right And like the Beatles, like mania, people fainting, girls fainting.

And I think it kind of scared a couple of the other girls. I was exhilarated, but, you know, people were rocking the car, and we'd never really had that kind of experience at all. I mean, anybody in their right mind should probably be scared, but I didn't get too scared. And then in Scandinavia, another place, all girls, all wearing real pacifiers. and suck in on these past, and fuck, yeah, tell me about it.

Yeah, I didn't get it. And I never found out what it was. I guess it was just some kind of fad or fashion that they were doing, but pretty wild. And just none of that cherry had on a particular photo shoot or something. No, no, no, no. They were giving us the ideas, you know. Okay.

But then in England, you know, England gets, you know, they, I think they got the runaways of a lot, more than Americans did, but they still, you know, the English love to take the piss out of you. So we took a lot of shit, but there were a lot of people, I think, there that liked us, too. We did well in Germany, and I think Europe did pretty well, but we didn't tour there a lot, so I don't know face-to-face. And record stales, I can never go by, really, because, you know, who knows? So in retrospect, what would you categorize the genre, you know, are you guys at the

forefront of the LA punk movement, were you just hard rock? Were you kind of the torch bearer for what will eventually become like the glam metal scene that would happen 15 years later with those groups in LA? I mean, I always just called it rock and roll. And I think what we did, I think what we did was punk rock to its core, you know, just doing, dictating what you're going to do and doing it and not listening to what anybody says. I mean, I thought, and doing that in the context of how society treated you at the time, I think it was the ultimate punk rock stuff.

You know, even for the girls, it didn't want to claim punk rock. They were being punk rock just by what they were doing. They didn't have to play it. So you guys pretty dissolved almost as quick as you came aboard. Do you remember how eventful or uneventful the last, night of the group was before you realize that it's not happening anymore? I don't remember if it was, I know it wasn't a happy time and we knew, it was a New Year's 78 into 79 was our last gig. And we knew it was our last gig because we had decided to disband

after that because I didn't want, you know, I felt like I said, that musical separation was there between girls who want to play heavier music and me. And so I thought, man, I don't want to get fired from the band I started or something weird. So let me just quit and we'll just, you guys can do your thing. Well, I can assume that Lita was one that wanted to do the heavier stuff, right? It was not animosity. It was not, you know, it was not in anger or anything. We weren't going, fuck you, fuck you.

Right. You know, it was just like, since we had been friendly, we didn't want it to be weird. And it's just like, just let me, I'll just go. You guys do your thing. You know, it's weird. Before I got to admit that, uh, And watching the documentary, I didn't realize that, quote, that leader Ford was the leader ford in the runaways. Because I guess my dealings with leader, any time there was always a person that wanted to give, I'm not even making any new general comparisons.

But if there was anyone that ever wanted to give like hip hop the middle finger with a quote, it was always leader for. He was leader for. Really? I knew her more for her disdain of hip hop than I did for like what she actually did. Yeah, no, for real. Like I guess I should say I'm not surprised, but. Yeah, like I don't like for her quotes of like why she hated hip hop. So I always knew that whenever I hear the name leader Ford, I'm like, uh-uh, what happened now?

But then when I started the thing, I was like, oh, she was a runaway. I get it now. I don't want no guilt by association, though, because. Hey, man, we all. You made light a day. I used to watch that movie every day after school when I was in, like, third grade. So we did.

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We're two best friends, 22 years apart, but so close at heart. And I'm Lisa Di Giulio, the old one, which means we have wildly different references, occasionally different opinions. And at this point in my 50s, I've lived it all. I'm not going to get anyone fighting. That is wild. I learned that about you today. Now in my 30s, being the founder of new shoes, good taste is my business.

And I've always got something to say. If men were just honest about this, there would be so much more peace in the world. We're going to talk about dating, relationships, beauty, getting older, and a little wiser. We're best friends, but we don't always agree. Because you told us how much. accommodating you are. Obviously, I would do what I think I could do to fight the fight, but there's only so much fight I can fight. Don't lie to me. Don't lie to me. Don't lie to me. Don't lie to me. Don't lie to me. Liar. Listen on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever

you get your podcast. I don't really care. I'm Lacey Mosley, author, actor, stand-up comedian, creator, and host of Scam Goddess Podcast. The True Crime Comedy Podcasts, all about robbery, fraud and those who practice it. Each week I bring on incredible guests like Conan O'Brien, Iowa Debris, Lamorne Morris, and Nicole Byer. Ooh, I scammed them. What? I can talk to you for an hour.

You're a generational yapper like me. That's why I had to make yapping a job. And the scams run the gamut. I'm talking about scams from the 1800s all the way up to today. I also warn you and keep you safe against scammers. Call your grandparents.

Tell your parents to stop clicking on links please. And now you can catch full episodes of my show on YouTube. If there's a scam, I'm here to protect you. And I'm also here to laugh with you. So if you like fun, if you like comedy and you like learning and protecting yourself from criminals, start listening to scam goddess on the IHeart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. As a 21-year-old, are you feeling like, okay, well, I did that? What do I do now for you? It's just like on to the next. Like, did you? No, I was feeling like there's time to die, is what I was feeling like.

I was feeling like the whole city of L.A. was laughing, going, we told you it wouldn't work. We told you girls can't play rock and roll, you know. And I just was, I was not taking care of myself. I was drinking too much. My dreams were crushed, you know, and I had no friends. You know, it was like everybody was gone. You know what I mean?

They disappear in that level and you're just alone with your. thoughts and your beer or whatever it was I was drinking. So how long did the sort of the feeling of funk last before you started your, I assume that, you know, starting the Black Hearts was your eventual? Yeah. Well, actually, I met my partner, Kenny Laguna. My songwriting partner and my producer and manager because nobody else wanted to deal with me. We met to write songs for a movie that I had contracted to do before the runaway.

broke up. I had to write six songs for a film. And so my manager at the time, a guy named Toby Mammis, knew Kenny and knew that he had worked with a lot of bubblegums bands in the 60s and knew that he could write songs

quickly and should be easy to work with. So he called them and said, would you come out and meet Joan to do this project with her? And so Kenny did. And we met and hit it off and really became good friends the first day. I don't know what it was that he saw in me, but he thought I was the real deal, I guess. And we wrote some songs.

And then I said, would you produce these songs that we wrote together? And he did. And then, you know, as we continue, I didn't have anybody to manage. me and so he had to took that on too thinking it would be easy that he could get me deals and this and that right but no he started getting knows you know he knows a lot of people in the business and people just told him no and then i think it got to him where oh my god this is real and and then he got pissed because then he saw this sort of you know just prejudice and misogyny you know straight out bullshit.

So I think, you know, lit that fire in him to help fight for me. So it took about two years. First of all, whose idea was it to recover or to redo I Love Rock and Roll? I don't think many people know that that's a cover song. Yes, yes.

I saw that song when I was in England with the Runaways, and I saw this band on top of the pops called The Aeros, and they were playing the B-side to their hit. And the B-side to their hit was, I love rock and roll. I don't know what their hit was. The B-side was I love rock and roll.

And I'm like, wow, that sounds like a hit to me. And I went out to the record shop and bought the 45 thinking, you know, the runaways, maybe we could do this and it'll be a hit. But then I was reminded that by the other girls that we had done, we'd covered Lou Reed's rock and roll

on the first album, on our first runaway's album. And, you know, I guess didn't want rock and roll and every title and every album kind of. So sort of blew it off for a while. And I just held on to the song. And then after the runaway, thought, here we go. See, life lesson. You got to go what you got.

Yep. That's the second time you learned that lesson. So how different does life turn for you once that song makes you pretty much a household name? Well, just I think the fame level rose and we had more people at our gigs and stuff and made a little bit more money. Finally, it could make a little bit more money. So those things change a little bit. But, you know, for the most part.

But is that also a scary feeling? Because I think oftentimes when someone gets to success, the first thing in their head is, oh, God, how am I going to sustain this? How am I going to make it last? What's the next single? da-da-da-da-da-da. Yeah, there was part of that, but I wasn't so far up there that it was, you know,

when you're number one and you're, I don't know, I guess, you know, on one level, you can't stay there forever. And I guess, you know, you have to have your next one. I guess initially we knew that next one was going to be, which was crimson and Clover. Right. And what was it about that song

that made you want to choose that? Damn it. I take my only question as the day. Okay. It's a great. Go ahead, Steve. You want to say it? Go ahead.

Go ahead. What made you want to cover Crimson and Claver with the James and Ashandales? No, answer the question. I had to turn the light on. Go ahead. And when I, when I met Kenny and I knew that he played those songs and I'm like, so you played the monie mooney money. Dun, da, da.

He's yeah. And I'm like, okay. So I want to cover Crimson Clover. I just thought, you know, it'd be weird because I didn't want to change the lyrics. And that was just the way I was. I wanted to, you know, push the envelope a little bit because I just wanted to. But the original recording so, so I guess, psychedelic. And so what was you guys?

My reason for doing it. I mean, because Tommy's, Tommy's, like, when he's, I guess, Kenny told me when he asked what, what is it about? You know, it was about LSD, you know, Crimson and Grover. So it wasn't about really a her. So specifically. So when people ask me what I'm singing about, it's like, well, I mean, I guess I'm singing it more literally,

but not specifically at anybody, you know. It's just being put out into the world is that, is those sentiments, but it's not directed. specifically at a person. So at that particular point, coming into the early part of the 80s and whatnot, do you have a peer group? Are there,

is there a trusted circle that you can pal around with? Like normally, you know, birds of a feather flocked together as far as like people liking each other's music or whatnot. Like, was there a tight-knit community in the sort of the LA rock community

by this point for you at least? Or were you still like? No, I was. I was gone. Isolated it out of there. I was out of there, but in 79, I moved. Came back to New York. Okay. Went to New York. So even in New York, like for that, is there, it was, I mean. No, I didn't hang out. I didn't really, you know, I was always going to say, like, everyone was sort of going new wave in New York and you're going straight rock and roll. Like, were you a fish out of water and like, were you sort of upholding a tradition that you felt? would soon sort of take a backseat? You know, I don't know that I thought ahead that much,

that I planned it out or thought about, you know, what's the future of rock and roll or a lot synthier, you know, that there was a lot of scent music going on. Well, I mean, were you going to the Lower East Side and in the early 80s to see groups like bad brains or any, like, were you at all interested in the movement? that was happening in the lower east side. Right, right.

I was, yes, I was interested, but I was working too much to be. I was on the road the whole time. I don't even know if I was around most of the time. I mean, literally on the road all the time. All right. Pretty much from 1980, 365. Through pretty much, I mean, at least through November, and then, you know, depending on what the tour was,

we were always working. And then be off. through January and then start working again in February. It was pretty brutal and I didn't realize that until the pandemic hit. Okay. And then and then nothing was happening. And then I realized how much of my life I had been on the road constantly and all these other things we talked about, about, you know, feeling separate, you know, and being isolated.

And but I did, you know, I definitely have friends that I knew once. Once I was settled in New York and I had a routine and I still have that sort of core few. I can count on my one hand level of friends. Yeah, that's real life. Yeah. Real people have two to three people. Wait, I always wanted to know this. Okay.

So from my point of view, as a record collector, All right, I'll explain to you, Fonta, well, you probably know already. But like for me, boardwalk records is almost akin to like Malico Records. Oh, wow. And so. I know exactly what you mean. That said, I always wanted to know what was it about boardwalk records that made you choose that as your label? Because I knew that sort of as kind of as as a second tier label for acts that was.

were popping in the 70s for soul music. Like I know that Ohio players wound up on boardwalk records for like their 80s catalog. I remember the five stair steps morphed into the invisible man's band for the 80s or whatnot. Kenny would know so much about this because I think he knew Neil Bogart before we got involved. Oh, wow.

Oh, wow. You know, so Kenny knew him pre-pre. boardwalk. I didn't know that Neil Bogart started boardwalk records. Yes. Yeah. That explains the Ohio players. Besides Costa Blanca, yeah. And yeah, and he just liked me and really liked

me a lot and wanted me to be able to put out my record. So he said, you know, we'll put it out. And he did and he died like the week before it went number one and never got to see the number one, which really bums me out because he was such

He died in 81. Yeah. Oh, man. Man, I did not know that. But, yeah, he was a real believer. And, you know, one of those guys that, you know, always looked great. It was all sharply dressed and just, you know, believed in me. And believed in Kenny, I think, more than anything.

Yeah, everyone that describes Neil Berggard describes it as, like, the last true, like, one of the last creatives. and that was a suit, at least. Right, right. I mean, I know a suit's a suit, but whatever. Yeah, but I don't know. For me, though, I would say that, like, you were so ahead of your time. Was it weird to sort of have, not a comeback of source, but just to see a lot of these. Well, no, no, no.

I'm just saying that a lot of these bands that started popping in the mid-90s, late-90s, started name check and like Joan Jen and Blackhards or even with your work with the runaways like for you did you not ever think that the day would come on which you would see kind of flowers yeah influence of your

people that like grew up on your music or especially like when the riot girl with Kathleen and yeah well that was always done yeah because they totally did tip their hat to me and I knew it because, you know, they told me so. And it was, it was great. It was great to see that.

I mean, I always knew that whether or not people admitted it, that we'd have some influence, you know, in life and to music and that. And it's really nice to see it confirmed and see people say it, you know, and not just girl bands, but some guys too. And that's really nice. Yeah, I was going to say plenty of times where, like, Kirk has name dropped you or, you know, or I know that Grohl was definitely a big fan. I was there at the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame when he joined.

Oh, man. What a night. Yeah. That was crazy. So how did, how did, you know, was that, was that surprising to you when you got the news or, you know, I know, I know often times every, every person I know that gets inducted in the Rock and Wall Hall of Fame has the same sort of like. Nealistic, if it happens, it happens, whatever, you know, that sort of thing. But for you, was it, when you got the news of you getting in, like, what was the feeling behind it? No, I thought I was very happy, you know, of course I thought, but see, I'm used, I'm kind of used to not being up for awards my whole life.

It's not really been what my career has been about, like nominated for a lot of different things, you know? Right. It's not what's happened. So just the fact I got nominated, I thought it was. was really nice, but I thought, you know, I don't know, man. I don't know if I'm going to win this, but, and I'll still, I still believe this to my core that because Chris said it on stage that night, that they had, they felt they had no choice but to put me in, then they forced their hand. So whether, whether I would have really

gotten in or whether it was that, I don't know. I'll say this much because, you know, I'm, I'm, part of that, I've been part of that, well, you know, I call the recreation of the 12 Angry Men scene, but there's like 35 of us arguing back and forth. You know, your name has definitely been, at least from my first year there, which I think was like 2011, has constantly been like champion and argued and debated. Well, that's good. Well, you know, we were joking about it's only a matter of time before you do your classical record or your soft album

but you know the latest album you released is your acoustic work and you know how how did that feel for you like for you is it a thing where you need a new challenge

and no it was really it was a way to just we wanted to give the fans something different we I'd never look because I had had such a weird relationship with guys telling me,

my guitar teacher saying, girls can't play rock and roll. I always kept acoustic guitarist really at arm's length. I never owned one. I never wanted to own one until about, you know, maybe 10 years ago, maybe a little bit less than that. You mean 10 years ago you finally like gave in and was like, all right, let me try acoustic guitar.

Let me just have it because I can't always hear my electric guitar. You know, if you're trying to write a riff and you really need to, hear something. You know, so I just had it, but not a good one. You know, this is a little shitty one. Then a couple years ago, we did a documentary called Bad Reputation. Yes. It came out.

It was all about my career and my life and stuff. And when we did the premiere, they wanted us in L.A., they wanted to see if we could perform a couple of the songs in the theater. And I knew we couldn't set up electric and we suggested that maybe we try some acoustics. So we did it, but with the whole band. So it was myself, my guitar player, acoustic bass, and our drummer. And we, you know, played bad rotation and a couple of the songs, and it felt really good, actually. It felt a lot better than I thought it was going to feel.

And like, you could transfer the energy. It was just going to be different than electric, but it still worked. So then, last year, 2021 and 2022, is the 40th anniversary of both Bad Reputation album and I Love Rock and Roll album. Because one came out, they both came out in 81, I guess.

Something like that. So we wanted to do some extra things for the fans and maybe record some acoustic stuff. So we thought, oh, we did that stuff for the premiere, let's go in the studio, record a few songs. Once we got in there and started playing songs, we really just did everything we could do live. we just once we started recording

we just kept going and we didn't really plan on having an album's worth or two of material but just wound up there and thought what the hell put it out how do you how do you feel about it like you're

I feel good about it I feel it's fun it's different we play some on stage like we'll do our electric show and then come and then do, instead of an encore, do like three or four acoustic songs. And it's been going over. We just started like a month ago, a half ago doing it and see how it would go over live

because, you know, I don't know unless I'm in front of people. So they seem to like it. So we'll see what happens. And we'll see what happens with the stadium tour. You know, we're going to see if we can work some into that. And if it works great, if it doesn't. What are those guys like now, like Motley Crew? I don't know.

I've met Jeff Leppard. We played with Def Leppard before. Okay. But I've never played with Motley Cruz. So I don't know. I have no idea what to expect, but it should be interesting. You know, it's weird to me.

I learned this with Blue Oyster called the Deaf Leopard's album covers were more scarier than Def Leppard was. Yeah. The thing is, like, if Mutt Lang, you know, like, Mutt is too, he's too polished. Yeah. He's too polished and clean to really like, I'm telling you, it's more the album covered. Exactly.

Like, if you listen to the love bites, whatever, like, just fucking harmonies. Like, it's just more enhanced California harmonies to me. You know what I mean? And so, I don't know. It's weird. I never truly saw. I mean, of course, you know, they create one anthem that will probably play in every gentleman's club. now to the end of time.

Look how you know that, yeah. No, I just mean, you know, sugar has a kick-ass riff to it, but I've never considered death. I mean, I don't consider death lever at metal the same way they don't consider the police heart rock. You know what I mean?

Yeah, well, people are loose with their terminology now, you know, don't you find? Well, yeah, sometimes you were just lazy. Yeah, exactly. Right now, like, where, with this storied career. And is there anything that you have yet to achieve or yet to accomplish that you wish to?

Oh, I wouldn't know who to say specifically, but I'm always interested in doing new and different things. I just actually did something, did I mention that with Trombone Shorty? Yes, yeah, yeah, yeah. So, you know, it's, It's new for me. I'm not always great with that because I'm good with knowing, you know, being comfortable and doing what I know and that kind of stuff.

So I have to try to get better with, you know, just jumping into the unknown and not being so. Getting out of your comfort zone. Yeah, yeah, but being okay with that and being, you know, you're going to live, you're going to be okay. Don't worry. I don't know. I think I'm ready for my.

my R&B album now. Let's go. Hey, just get it. There it is. Let's go. Joe, thank you very much. Yeah, for, for joining us and doing this with us. And, you know, we appreciate your work.

I've been a long-time fan of yours. Oh, thank you all. It's been a real pleasure, definitely. For sure. Thank you. I've been a big fan too. Yeah, be safe out there, John. Yeah, you guys take care, okay?

Absolutely. Let's show. Joan Jett on Quest Left Supreme, and we will see you guys. on the next go round. All right, thank you. Much Love Supreme is a production of I Heart Radio.

For more podcasts from IHart Radio, visit the IHart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. Lisa, tell them about our new show. We have a new podcast. It's called Don't Lie to Me. I'm Lexi Youanu.

We're two best friends, 22 years apart, but so close at heart. And I'm Lisa DiGulio, the old one, which means we have wildly different references, occasionally different opinions, And at this point in my 50s, I've lived it all. Now in my 30s, being the founder of new shoes, good taste is my business. Listen on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

I'm Lacey Mosley, author, actor, stand-up comedian, creator, and host of Scam Goddess Podcast. The True Crime Comedy Podcasts all about robbery, fraud, and those who practice it. Each week, I bring on an amazing guest. Ooh, I scammed them. What? I can talk to you for an hour. You're a generational yapper. like me.

That's why I had to make yapping a job. And now you can catch full episodes of my show on YouTube. Start listening to Scam Goddess on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. In February of 2024, celebrated illustrator and children's book author Patra Mathers and her husband Michael mailed letters to dozens of friends and family members to let them know they had died by suicide. Dear honies, this is goodbye. By the time you get this letter, both Petra and I will be dead. Next stop, Wonderland. Why did they do it?

And what did it do to the people they left behind? Listen to Death of an Artist on the IHeart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an IHeart podcast. Guaranteed human.