The Questlove Show - QLS Classic: LA Reid Part 1

Episode Date: April 15, 2024

The first of L.A. Reid's 3-part QLS recalls his childhood in Cincinnati, playing the Indianapolis club circuit, working with Midnight Star, and meeting Babyface.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what I'm saying. Yep, that's me. Clifford Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, my basketball and college football journey, or my career in sports media.

Well, now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifers Show. This is a place for raw, unfills of conversations with athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. So let's get to it. Listen to the Clivert Show on the I-Hard Radio app,

Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok podcast network on TikTok. When a group of women discover they've all dated the same prolific con artist, they take matters into their own hands. I vowed. I will be his last target. He is not going to get away with this. He's going to get what he deserves. We always say that trust your girlfriends.

Listen to the girlfriends. Trust me, babe. On the IHart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, all. wherever you get your podcast. This week on the Sports Slice podcast, it's all about the NFL draft, and we've got a special guest. The director of the NFL's

East-West Shrine Bowl, Eric Galco, joins the Sports Slice podcast to break down what really matters when evaluating draft prospects. From hidden traits teams look for to the biggest mistakes franchises make, to the players flying under the radar.

This is the insight you won't hear anywhere else. If you want to understand the draft like an insider, you don't want to understand the draft. miss this episode. Listen to the Sports Slice podcast on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow

Timbo Slica Life 12 and TikTok podcast network on TikTok. Questlove Supreme is a production of IHeart Radio. What's up? This is Shuggesti from Quest Love Supreme. Anybody who knows this podcast is well aware that our interviews can last for hours. So

often, we split them into two parts. It also gives listeners a suspenseful reason to come back next week or check their podcast feed for more episodes. Back in 2022, we sat down with L.A. Reed for what became a rare three-part interview. Part one of L.A. Reed's three-part QLS recalls his childhood in Cincinnati, playing the Indianapolis Club Circuit, working with Midnight Star and meeting Babyface. This classic episode was taped in July 2022. Please rate, like, and subscribe to this on your podcast feeds.

Check back for new episodes and follow our new YouTube page at QLS. Good and well. You might as well get some water, dog. I'm going to make the shore for all I can't. You need more. And you need some snacks or something, bro? Yeah. All right, ladies and gentlemen, I was already told it at the top of the show,

make this quillic. Nah. Anyway. Straight up. Nah, fuck quick on this one. I'm going in. All right. Ladies and gentlemen, this is another episode of Quest Love Supreme.

How are you guys? That's nice. Yeah. Anyway, exactly. So if you know me, based on the show, you know there's a particular type of interview that we all love to nerd out on. And this is no exception. I guess today, you know, he is former super executive chairman and CEO of Epic Records, former chairman's CEO of Def Jam, former president and CEO of Ariston,

and also his own LaFace imprint LaFace records Not to mention Oh, former award-winning songwriter and producer and former drummer and probably the most

moisturized band of all time Yeah Yeah Not to what's important Not to mention I mean Look, y'all know me is going to take 45 minutes once I start reading off the accolades.

Look, you already know it, man. Like, you literally know it. Two occasions, this guy, a girlfriend, this guy, Roney, rock with you. Don't be cruel. This guy. Into the road, this guy. I love should have brought you home last night. This guy.

Not to mention the Axie sign. Name him. Tony Brackson, Damien Damien, Dame, Goody Mom, Germain Jackson, Usher. Alcast. Outcast. I can name them all. Ladies and gentlemen, we finally have him. I feel like this is the sequel to the babyface episode.

It is. Nah, yeah, this is the baby faith, the baby safe episode that was breaking bad. This is better call us all. Exactly. There you go.

Yo, this guy is so legend that he even dropped me from the label and took me back on my birthday. No? No. Yo, I got dropped the morning of my birthday. and came back the night of my birthday. Ooh, this is going to be a long one.

Yeah, it's going to be a lot of it. Please welcome L.A. Reed. I'm sorry, y'all. Thank you. Thank you. Yes. Oh, my God. By the word, that's it's accurate, but go on.

Well, you know how dramatic Richard Nichols was, so maybe Rich was just using a Jedi mind trick or me to get the album done. So positive. Right. Rich woke me up for my birthday and six in the morning, like, Amir, the Roach just got dropped off Def Jam.

I was like, no. Literally, I was all depressed. And then like, I think we met, didn't we? I called you up and I literally called you up. I left a message. I was like, come on, dog. It's my birthday, man. Please.

Oh, my God. That's my favorite story. of all, look, every, every artist has a CEO executive story, and I'm glad that's my story, because it could have been with you hanging me out the window of my ankles or something or any other unsavory CEO story. How are you? How are you doing? I'm good, man. I'm good. I'm entertained already. This is already fun. So, L.A., right now, where are you speaking to us from? I am in Los Angeles in the studio. We have a studio in Studio in Studio City, and I'm in the studio.

All right. My favorite place. Dare we ask you what you're doing in the studio? Is this top secret? No. You know, I'm always digging. And I love the idea of being around people. And I just have a lot of writing camps and some writers and producers.

come by, meet with people. I'm just always looking for music, you know. But right now, I'm actually working on Usher. And it feels so good. So this is Camp Usher time. It's Camp Usher. That's right. Usher's tiny desk performance is probably a pleasant, well-needed jolt

in the right direction of reminding people. And I'm also, I'd be remiss if I didn't mention that, the versus comedy hour also played a part. I missed it. You are. I heard about it. It's the best comedy show in history.

Needless to say, we happy to hear there may be a Chris and Usher versus. That is the dream. Four or five hours, six hours, seven hours. I think sometimes people should sit those out. That's my opinion. I don't think they're for everybody. I think because I don't know. The way that initially came to us,

I wish it would have stayed there, which was mainly about, like, two producers. Yes. Working on beats at the same time, you know, like the Buster and, what, Alchemist was the first one? Or was it not the Buster Alchemist, the Just Blaze.

Swizz and, no, the reason was Swiz and Tim. You said the first. Yeah. That was how it was popped out. Even before Just Blaze and The Alchemist. Yeah, if I remember, if we talk about Verses, how Verses started. That was what it was.

Well, I meant the pre-verses. Oh, okay. There was like, there was this thing where like just Blaze and Alchemists would do this back and forth thing. You don't remember the Buster rhymes. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Uh-huh. The Buster rhymes. Yeah, yeah.

Yeah, yeah. Right. But for me, I was kind of hoping that that was more the modus operandi where it wasn't about, you know, winter take all. But I think, you know, once the pandemic started, people just want to entertainment. And that seemed like a logical way to keep people entertained, of course, with the best A-list talent, but eventually you're going to run out of A-Lis talent. Right. And then what do you do?

It was supposed to be the classics too. It was supposed to be like up into, you know, a certain age kind of era range, I felt like, too. And they kind of, yeah. Now just think it's finding somebody that has had 10 to 15 notable hits. Yeah. Right. Which is that that was going to run dry quickly. You know what I mean?

And so that's funny because I don't always like. to bring light to it, but the truth is we're hard pressed to find artists with 15 to 20 hits. That's hard. It is. And those that have it aren't with us anymore. Right. And so the well is, I mean, we're in a place right now where it's diminished returns. And, you know, you got to let people in the door.

Like lately, I will say for my own group, you know, we've been having this sort of conversation. with the powers that be at least the last five to six years. Like you have to let us in the door. Like who the hell is left? You know what I mean? So it's sort of like I'm not saying that there was a begrudging. All right. Come in like that sort of thing.

But who could battle y'all? That's kind of hard. That's hard anyway. We're not even built like that. Yeah, that's what I'm saying. There is no. There's the roots. But we did we did get an offer once.

I guess I can mention it now. Yeah, please tell everybody because you told us. Please. the Roots and Goody Mob had a versus on the table that we weren't able to do. Really? Wow. Odd pairing, but, you know, I mean. And that is.

I mean, I get it, though. I actually get it. As odd as it is, I kind of get it. Well, I meant. But you guys don't have rivals. The truth is you don't have rivals because we don't live in an era. There's no black bands, first of all. You're the only black band in forever.

So you would actually have to go back a battle like cameo or something. No, I would have actually. We talked to our last episode was with Larry, amazing episode, by the way. No, I think probably if it were to come down to that, we probably would do like DeAngelo did, which is like have roots and a whole bunch of friends come by and do something fun. Anyway, we're wasting time here. L.A. What was your very first musical memory?

First musical memory ever? Like, ever? Your first thought of music? What, like, what's... It might be a little hazy, but I think that it was growing up Cincinnati, Ohio, in the kitchen, small kitchen, transistors radio in the window. And I think it was, it's my party. And I cry if I want to. Leslie Boring, yeah.

Yes, I think it was that. Because for some reason, I remember that name Quincy Jones. Don't know why, but I knew that name as a baby and it never left, you know. I think it was that or it was something from Motown, right? Like one of those dancing in the streets or I can't exactly. I was very young. But the one that got me, though, the one that like the life-changing moment was when I heard give the drum. or some and cold sweat James Brown.

Wow. That moment. Like that was, the world stopped. So speaking of Cincinnati, oh, by the way, case our listeners don't know,

not many people know that Quincey Jones produced Leslie Gore's. It's my party. That's his very first. Very first sit. As a pop producer. I was going to say that I, I noticed,

at least from what Buttey told me, and just from observing that anyone who's in proximity of King Records and their whole operation had their life changed, either as someone that works inside of King Records or the studio or the factory or someone like Bootsie Collins did hung in the alleyway and just hope maybe one day we'll get used or something like that. Yep. But because there's a five year, a five to 10 year age discrepancy of you and Bucci's generation. Right.

How did the James Brown Ohio effect? And plus, this also explains why Ohio is the funk capital of the United States because, I mean, basically, King Records moved their operations to Cincinnati. And basically at a time period in which the ripple effect started happening, even in other. cities like funk just spread throughout, Dayton, Columbus, Cleveland, and all over. So just as a 10-year-old, were you aware of James Brown's presence in the city? I feel like I didn't know it officially, but I felt the presence. Like the first concert I ever went to was a James Brown concert at the Cincinnati Convention Center.

And I hung outside and I met Macy O. Parker. And that was that was a big. big deal for me, like literally walking down the street outside the convention center. And also, King Records was like a few doors down from like my karate school as a kid, right? So I would go to karate school, but and wait on the bus, right? Take the bus home afterwards. And I knew that that was King Records. So I never saw a soul, but I was just stare at it.

I felt drawn to it. But then as I got like slightly older, all the musicians in Cincinnati were all so impacted by Bootsie and James Brown. But more Bootsie, to be honest, right? James was like the godfather of soul. But Bootsie was our local superstar. So everything that Bootsie did, we all, you know, aspired to do. Bootsie holds his base this way. So you hold your bass like Bootsie, right?

Or Bootsie wears these kind of shoes. or he has these everything was about whatever boots he did was the magic you know and he he was like a god to us James Brown needed booty more than booty needed James even though booty needed that guidance right yeah James Brown needed that validation of you know the next generation respecting him and what's the first song super bad very first song was sex machine sex machine was boozy very first one yeah Okay. You got it. There's,

there's an amazing, all right, so they, they did that song in two takes, and there's a, there's a really amazing, rare dialogue for James.

Like, if you listen to James's outtakes, normally it's sarcasm or, I mean, not like mean, spirit, but like if they mess up or whatever, you'll,

you'll, you'll hear them like chastise, the engineer or something like that. But when they do the second take of sex machine, There's like a 45 minute conversation of James just like, you hear him walking in the studio and telling them like, like being encouraging, almost like, which is rare for James Brown. But he's like obviously knows like these, these 16, 18 year old kids are really, really scared right now.

And he's just, oh, no, you got it. Like, you can do it. Like, which is. Oh, wow. Compared to the rest of what James does like on the other takes or whatnot. Like it's almost like he knew. that he was dealing with children. You know what I mean?

Right. So he had some sensitivity. And he was, yeah, that's great. So you're a drummer. Sort of. No, you're a drummer. I play the drums. Well, okay, well, first of all, your home situation,

what was your domestic home situation then? Like, was your family musically inclined, your parents? In my immediate family, meaning my mother, my sisters, we had a stepfather there. I never knew my father,

but we had a stepfather there occasionally. He was there. I'm being mean. He was there. But they played music because they had poker games all the time, right? So they always played music

and it was always kind of the weekends were festive. And eventually I became like the guy to play the records at a very young age, right? And I could play what I wanted to play, you know? So I played sliding Family Stone or I play war or I play, you know, whatever I wanted to listen to at the time.

And James Brown and, you know, King Floyd. I remember that song. What's in a situation where they say, let me see what you got and the first you played a good record? No, it was just like the record player would stop. And they're all into the game. So I just walk over and play what I wanted to play. I wanted to play and no one said anything.

Okay, so question. For them, for that music at that time, would that be the equivalent of, say, like, my nephew or my guy kids putting trap music on when, say, the adults in the room when it hears something older, like more Ray Charles. So, like, they love Bobby Womack. They just, like, you know, communications album, I think it was. Like, they like things that felt more like the blues,

more soul blues. and funk was the music of the kids. Yeah. Yeah. Were your people from Ohio? Yeah, everybody's from Ohio, yeah. So I have an uncle. I had an uncle.

He passed away, and he's a drummer. He is a jazz drummer, right? And I remember him taking me to jam sessions with him when I was very, very young. And he set up a set of drums in his apartment. And he lived in an apartment, so you couldn't really play. So I was just playing with my family. fingers, but I was playing James Brown at the best I could. And he was like, that's not music.

Oh, man. That's not music. Yeah, that's not music. Jazz guy. Yeah, jazz guy. Like, that's not music. Okay, I got it. So I knew early on, like, okay, I see what the purest are thinking here, you know,

versus we, that was commercial. James Brown was commercial. Hey, by the way, you're a real musicologist. Can I ask you a question? So did Miles Davis? Now, who ripped off who? So what? Yo, so what?

Miles was first. Peewee Ellis. Yes. Yeah, went on record to say that, you know, all those, and actually all those guys thought alongside your uncle, as in I'm a jazz musician, but let me just make some money on the side and play this pop stuff that I don't care about.

And then I'll have a jazz career. And basically, Pee We Ellis would basically steal jazz arrangements that he liked and incorporated James Brown. So the whole cold sweat, uh-huh, is essentially the what? But do, but do, but do, but do, do, do, right, okay. Yeah. Yeah. And so that's, that's, that's weird for me because, like, I know.

And that's the thing where even today, like, just to fight my urge to not say something derogatory to, you know, another generation about their music, you know, like, for instance, like, trap is about to be old school and now drill is replacing that. Oh, good Lord. Right. And so the temptation to not roll my eyes in the air is heavy. Right. And I don't want to be the guy that's just like performatively co-signing everything just to make me look young and me look hip. Right.

But, you know, it's weird how the timeline of music lasts, whereas something can be totally foreign to you, but seems like so innovative to the next generation. It's funny because they both share a regional commonality too, because a lot of New Yorkers, jazz musicians, because my dad is 80-something years old, and he was a jazz musician. They thought James Brown was country,

just like how some New Yorkers may think about trap and, you know, other music. That's right. Yeah. Definitely that. A win is a win. A win. A win is a win. I don't care what I'm saying.

Yep, that's me, Cliver Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes,

creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment. And the next, we'll talk about life, mental health, purpose, and even music. The Clifford Show isn't just a podcast. It's a space for honest conversations, stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger. So if you've ever supported me or you're just chasing down a dream, this is right where you need to be. Listen to The Clifford show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts,

or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. There's two golden rules that any man should live by. Rule one, never mess with a country girl. You play stupid games, you get stupid prizes. And rule two, never mess with her friends either. We always say that trust your girlfriends.

I'm Anna Sinfield, and in this new season of the girlfriends, Oh my God, this is the same man. A group of women discover they've all dated the same prolific con artist. I felt like I got hit by a truck. I thought, how could this happen to me? The cops didn't seem to care, so they take matters into their own hands. I said, oh, hell no. I vowed. I will be his last target.

He's going to get what he deserves. Listen to the girlfriends. Trust me, babe. On the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Everyone, I'm Ago Wodam. My next guest, you know from Step Brothers Anchorman, Saturday Night Live, and the Big Money Players Network. It's Will Ferrell. My dad gave me the best advice ever.

I went and had lunch with them one day, and I was like, and Dad, I think I want to really give this a shot. I don't know what that means, but I just know the groundlings. I'm working my way up through, and I know it's a place that come look for up and coming talent. He said, if it was based solely on talent, I wouldn't worry about you, which is really sweet. Yeah. He goes, but there's so much luck involved. And he's like, just give it a shot. He goes, but if you ever reach a point where you're banging your head against the wall and it doesn't feel fun anymore, it's okay to quit.

If you saw it written down, it would not be an inspiration. It would not be on a calendar. of, you know, the cat just hang in there. Yeah, it would not be... Right, it wouldn't be that. There's a lot of luck. Listen to Thanks, Dad, on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This week on the Sports Slice podcast, it's all about the NFL draft.

And we've got a special guest. The director of the NFL's East West Shrine Bowl, Eric Galco, joins the Sports Slice podcast to break down what really matters when evaluating draft prospect. From hidden traits teams look for to the biggest mistakes franchises make to the players flying under the radar, this is the insight you won't hear anywhere else. If you want to understand the draft like an insider, you don't want to miss this episode. Listen to the Sports Slice Podcast on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Slica Life 12 and TikTok podcast network on TikTok. I'm John Green. You may know me as the author of The Fault in Our Stars.

and now, I guess also as the co-host of The Away End, a brand new world soccer podcast. I'm Daniel Alarcon, a writer and journalist, and John and I have known each other since we were kids. My first World Cup was Mexico 86. I was nine years old. I watched every game, and I fell in love. On our new podcast, The Away End,

we'll share with you the magic of international football, all leading up to the 2026 World Cup. For us, soccer... Football is a story we've shared for over 30 years since Daniel was the star player on our high school soccer team. Very debatable. And I was their most loyal and sometimes only fan. I love this game.

I love its history, it's hope, it's heartbreak, and above all, it's beauty. Together, we'll find out why, of all the unimportant things, football, soccer, is the most important. Listen to the away end with Daniel Auerkone and John Green on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. How old were you when you felt that you really developed your drumming skills? I was probably about 15. And I actually liked the story. I was in a choir class. Interestingly enough, I was the only one in the choir class that didn't have to sing, right?

My music teacher was incredible. His name was Terry Brown. And he was the choir teacher. And he had a class that all the talented people in school were in this class. all the singers, all the, you know, the performers, the guys that knew how to do the harmony. And I was just drawn to the class and he liked me. And he let me hang out in the class, although I wasn't in the choir. And I ended up like standing there for hours and hours each day.

But he had a group outside of school called The Mystics. And it was a three-man singing group. It was Terry Brown. It was Gerald Brown. And I don't remember the third guy's name. And one day I'm walking down the hall. I'm about 15 years old. I always carry my sticks in my pocket.

I bet you can relate to that. Right. I just always kept them with me. And he stopped me in the hall and he said, hey, you have a set of drums? I was like, yeah. What are you doing this weekend? He said, I want you to audition. Bring your drums to Mary Junior High School.

I forgot the time. And I want you to audition. So I walk in. and there's three other, two other drummers, I'm sorry, there's three total, there's two other drummers. And this one guy, this guy, he has, he, he looked like, he looked like he was going to kill it. He had a beautiful big afro.

He had a double-based drum and the most beautiful kit in the world. And I came in with like this little rinky-dink. That's what we call it. I don't know if you guys know that word. No, we know what I know. Cool. I came in with the rinky-dick kit, right, with like one crash symbol, one ride symbol and some high hats, one time.

And this dude intimidated me. But when he started playing, he wasn't good. And I was like, oh. And we were playing. I remember the audition like it was yesterday. And we were playing the OJs. The OJs had backstabbers, 992 arguments. Same song.

Yeah, same song. Right. Right. That's Philly music, right? And when it was my turn, like, I knew those songs cold. And so I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I asked it. And I got the gig. So that weekend, the following weekend, he took me to Chicago and we played, uh, the weekend gig at a place called the Skyway. And I was 15 years old. So you were just allowed to leave the crib? My mom was okay with it. Like, I talked to her. She trusted my teacher. And we drove to Chicago from Cincinnati, did two shows and came back and had about $75. Mom was okay with that. Oh, he got real money. Yeah. Okay. That was pretty good money.

That was seriously some good money. That was awesome money. And that was the beginning. That not would your daddy pay to me here? He didn't pay. What was my rate? In 1980, I made. made $100 a night.

So at the end of the week, I'd make $600. Wow. I was rich for like an elementary school kid. That's why I brought so many records. Yeah, that's pretty good. And then by the time I became his band leader, he had me somewhere in between, I think in 83, I started at $150, no, $125 a show.

And then by the time, the very last show before I, you know, the roots went to live in London, I think. What was I making men? Maybe like 375. So yeah, but like, you know, the four days with my dad, you know, that made me very popular. Yeah. At lunchtime. Hell yeah.

It's on a mirror. When you want, like, you buy me a cheese steak a beer? Love that. All right. So in Cincinnati, are there? Are there any other notable musicians or songwriters or your fellow crew that we would know that was coming up with you at the time? Most of them you won't know, but the most important are the members of the group Midnight Star. And that would be Reggie Calloway and Vincent Calloway and Melvin Gentry and Bo Watson and Belinda Lipson.

Yeah. And they were serious. They were very serious. And they were the first ones. Oh, and there's also my friend Tuffy, who played, he's a keyboard player and he played with Zapp. Oh, okay.

Right. And he sung that song, All Right. It's going to be all right. He sung lead on that. Right. So there was the Midnight Star crew and Roger and the Human Body or Roger and the Vells or Zapp or however you might know them.

That was that crew. And we always felt the, we felt the energy of Parliament Funkadel. somehow some way. Like I remember going to club diplomat and it was a bunch of musicians that looked like they might be in parliament, right? Right. And they smell like they might be in parliament. Right. It was funky in everywhere. And it was broken and they had a lot of groups. There was one called the over the hill gang and but they all it was a whole funk movement. I just remember like it felt like they were on some tour because there was so many of these guys and they just kind of stopped at that club, played that night.

So we were around them all. But the most important and meaningful were Midnight Star. And those are the guys that we actually wrote with. And they produced our first album with my band and kind of taught us the art of songwriting. Walk us through the process of what it took for a band to get local gigs. Are you localized as in Cincinnati only,

or do you have it? so that you can go out of state and those types of things? We were Cincinnati for the most part, and then Indianapolis, which was 100 miles away. Okay. And it was kind of a strange phenomenon. When we started, when we were ready to play in the clubs, music started to change.

And this was probably like 77, something like that, 76 77 and Cincinnati was slightly more progressive than like Indianapolis which was like I said a hundred miles away and disco was taking over so there were no gigs in Cincinnati and I mean we played the clubs in Cincinnati like there were like four or five clubs that we would play weekends but somebody turned me on to a club called the zodiac lounge in Indianapolis this was life-changing So I drive to Indianapolis with my band members, go to this club, see the club owner, and they hired us to play six nights a week. That didn't happen in Cincinnati.

So now we're doing six nights a week, four shows per night, like four, 45 minutes sets per night, six nights a week. Per night, and you're doing 100 miles each way? No, we literally end up moving there. We got an apartment there. Okay. We got the gig, went back, got our gear, came back, stayed in the hotel for a couple of nights. Really bad, cheap hotel. I forgot what it was called.

Maybe it was the Rego 8, something like that, right? Or the Motel 6. If it's somewhere in it, you're in trouble. Yeah, yeah. Right, it was those. So we got a little apartment, and we ended up staying there for three or four years, about four years, playing clubs. and it went from one club to the next and all over the city. And that's where we really kind of learned.

So what was it about that particular environment that was a jackpot moment as opposed to, you know, the city that we would expect this wide open door of music to come from? Because the difference was entertainment nightly, right? And so that meant it was no longer a weekend thing that it wasn't, it was. wasn't, which weekends could, that could be hobby. Even though we were serious, that could be deemed hobby. Whereas six nights a week, that's your job. Okay. So you're saying before 77, a Monday night party somewhere wasn't a thing.

Thursday night party wasn't a thing. Only Friday, Saturdays and Sunday. Friday Saturday for the most part, right? And then, and then there might be an occasional wedding, fashion show, something like. that but but for them the clubs were only weekends and we went to Indianapolis and it was like about it's like seven or eight clubs that had entertainment every night and all the bands were competing and that's when I met some that's when I realized that there was a different caliber of musicians like in Cincinnati

everybody was funk we were all funk musicians and some people could you know maybe jazz influenced maybe a little blues influenced but we were all funk When I went to Indianapolis, which is where Babyface is from, and Reggie Griffin, you might know Reggie Griffin, and Rayford Griffin, his brother, who's like this incredible fusion drummer, right? And it was just a, it was an entire community of really, really gifted musicians. I realized then that I wasn't long for drumming. Right?

They put us to shame. It was insane. The thing is, is I would think, that if you're there for the specific duty or task to make people dance, intricate arrangements, would that matter? Unless you're trying to do like get away by Earth, when fire or something.

I mean, right. And also, what's the rehearsal regiment like? And are you guys able to nail every song that comes down the path? It's cover songs, right? Obviously, it's all cover songs. So you know, you learn all the Rick James songs or whatever is,

hot, you know. Right. And we would do that in the daytime in the basement, you know, or at the club, you know, when we lived in the apartment, we would do it at the club during the day. Eventually, we got a small house and we had a basement that we could rehearse in and try to record. But yeah, it was still all, you're right, it was about dancing, but we have four sets. So the first set, you could do whatever you wanted to do because the club wasn't crowded yet. So that's when you could do experimental stuff and try out a new song that you may have written or pretend to be returned to forever.

I was going to say, you're going to say return to forever in like five seconds. Second, yeah, you know it, right? I knew you're going to say return to forever. I just knew it. Yes, we played at it, you know, never quite telling you. All right, explain one thing, though, because I think for every musician,

they're either team weather report or team return to forever. Now, in my real life, in my real life, I've, okay, so amongst a certain

caliber musician friends I have, I've, I've gone on record to say that, you know, I feel like a bad Philadelphian because I'm not exactly 100% on the Stanley Clark

bandwagon as I should be. Right. As of Philadelphia. Like the song of his I love the most is so unhim, which is the heaven sent joint with Howard Hewitt. Right. But what was it about return to, because I was always team weather report,

but what was it about return to forever that had you guys' attention? Because literally everyone your age, anyone born the latter half of the 50s, beginning of the 60s, there's a love for return to forever that, you know, And no, no, I'm not even asking as adversarial because, yes, I love Lenny White. I love Chick-Correa, but I just never had someone explain to me what was it about

return to forever. So it was, first, it was Chick-Korea. It really was Chick-Korea. Because the way he composed, it felt like, obviously it was jazz fusion, but there was this classical element. And it was this classical element. And the way that they would play, the way that they would, like, play riffs together, you know, like, everybody's sort of playing the same riff, you know. Nobody else played like that.

Like, and they found a way to do that and be and groove and be in the groove. And I was, I like Stanley Clark, but not like Jaco Pistorius. Like, not even close. For me personally, I'm not going to get in trouble for this. But, yeah, I'm team weather report in that conversation, like, easy. Right. Easily. And Joe Zawano was way more soulful than, like, than Chick-Correa. So, I mean, he did mercy, mercy, mercy for Cannonball Adderley.

I mean, this boy, this man is no joke. So I'm really probably a weather report guy, except that Lenny White, you know, was just so bad, man. Exactly. But if I had to pick, I couldn't pick. I couldn't pick. I'm glad I don't have to. You said, you mentioned having a band, but what was the? the band's name? My band was called Essence. Wow. My band was

called Pure Essence at first and Pure Essence was, it was some kind of take on stylistically. It was somewhere between Sly and the Family Stone, Earth went and fire with

the love of fusion music, not the ability, but the love. That was a great way to Smooth it out. All right, so let's move forward to, you're in Indianapolis now, or you're in Indiana. Right. How did you, how did you meet Babyface? So he had a band, he was in a band called Man Child.

Yeah. And they were really good. And they were like stars, man. Everybody in the group was like, looked like they were six foot. and and weighed 150 pounds. They look like just like everybody in the band looked like Mick Jagger. I mean, there's a rock stop.

Look at these guys, man. And Kenny was in the band. He was a guitar player. I didn't meet them when we were in. I didn't meet him when we had the band, essence, my first band. I literally met him after we started the group of the deal, right? because a quick story was we sort of ran, my band Essence kind of ran out of gas.

We became complacent. We didn't renew. We didn't refresh. And eventually we kind of got kicked off the circuit. And this club owner, I got to tell you this, this club owner's name is Walt Manning. He owns a club called the Night Flight. The Night Flight is the hippest club in Indianapolis.

On one level, it's a DJ. and on the lower level, live band. And the deal was, if you could get people to come from the disco, downstairs, that's how you make your money. So it gave us a small advance, but we would get the door. And it'd be like a thousand people upstairs. And they play off the wall. They were playing Donna Summers.

They were playing like disco. It was in full tilt. And we were downstairs in like 15. people might come down. Half of them would, like, be people that were, we knew. And we had a couple of weeks off. I went to the club and asked the club owner, well, if I could get an advance,

if I can get $100 advance for my band, so I could, like, pay the rent and give my guys some food. And he says, there ain't going to be no advance because you're fired. And let me tell you why you're fired. You're fired because you guys suck. You're drive. You're boring.

No one comes downstairs. You need to renew. You need to rip off a sleeve or dye your hair or do something because all of this, this socially conscious thing you're doing is completely boring. You're out of step with the times. And I mean, he just read me, man. Wow. I was like, whoa.

What year was this? This would have been 79. 80, something like that. Oh, I'm like, whoa. And y'all was still hanging on to like, got to give it up, like songs from like 1979. Yeah. still, yeah, we're there and early Earth, went and Fire, like the wrong Earth,

one and Fire songs, you know. Yeah, and this guy just read us, man. And then he goes into the cash register and he pulls a $100 bill out and he throws it on the counter. He says, I'm going to give you the $100 bill, but I never want to see you again. And you don't owe me the $100, but you owe it to somebody. So pay it forward and get the hell out of here and fired us. he was drunk and he was an alcoholic, right?

Oh, I was going to say that's the best firing I ever heard. I need to use that shit. Yeah, yeah, he gave. So I got the $100 now and I go back and I think about what the man is saying. And I immediately knew he was right. I immediately knew that we had somewhere slipped. And I was like, okay, so I need to bust this thing up and start all over. And that's how we started to deal, right?

was, so I, my bass player, his name is Keio, he's my best friend also. We let everybody else go. We said, you know Keo. Theo plays on all the records with Mian Face and Whitney and Bobby and all that shit. He's really incredible, really, really talented. So he and I started the band. We first let everybody go, say, guys, we're going to end the band, and it's just not working.

It's run its course. So we went back to our hometown of Cincinnati, and he and I just sat in either his mom's house or my mom's house, and we just kind of thought about, like, who were the most talented kids that we went to school with that also had the presence of a star. Like, we started thinking about it differently. We started thinking about it beyond, like, who could, beyond talent, but that combination of talent and stardom, that's when that really sort of first came into my consciousness. And so we picked a couple of guys that we thought were really good. And we started to ban the deal. We went back to Indianapolis. Well, we sort of getting kicked off at the circuit.

And I went to the club owner. I said, just give us a week. Give us one week in the club. And I'll show you because they lost confidence in us. In that week, oh, I left something important out. The deal was a Prince copy ban. Right. copy band.

Sort of. Not a cover, but just a copy. Stylistically. Like, we wanted to look like them. We wanted to play like them. We did some of their songs. We did some of the time, some of the prints, right? And we were completely like Minneapolis kids all of a sudden.

Right. So can I ask, is, you know, and it's rare for me to ask someone who's actually of the age at the time it's happening. But when he came out, like, was it totally? a, this guy is just of a different ilk than everyone else. It was so obvious.

Like, I didn't even know whether there's records or hits or not. I didn't really look at charts and all this stuff, right? But it was so obvious that it was him. And I was and also Bootsie co-signed it. I was looking at Black Beat magazine. I don't know if you guys know that. Come on, man.

This is Postloaf Supreme. I don't know, man. You look like really young to me. We got good lotion, too. Yeah. Moisturized. Black beat right on all that. Boosie said Prince is next. He said it in the magazine and I was like, damn, I kind of thought so.

But when he said it, that was like the validation. Right. And there was no turning back. Prince was the king. I grew up an environment where he was taboo and you weren't, not even you weren't allowed to. Every adult I knew hated Prince. Right. So that just made it even more like, all right, well, let me see what they talking about.

But I just never been in an environment with someone who is an adult or of the age, like, tell the story of them seeing it and being like, yo, I like this. That's because you come from older musicians too, because my mother loves fucking Prince as soon as he popped out. Oh, my mom told me don't play that in her house. Really? Everyone thought Prince was the devil, yo. Yeah, she was like, don't play the, because. he had a song called Ancestis, everything is said to be. And she's like, you will not play that in my house.

Oh, no. Time out. You, all right. So when Dirty Mind comes out, now here's the weird thing. I mean, when Four You came out, you know, he was in Ritala magazine and all that stuff. And I have a sister who's slightly older than me. So her and her high school girlfriends were bored. And then, you know, when the second galam came out with I want to be a lover and all that stuff,

they were bored. Now, the thing is, when Dirty Mind came out, especially in Philadelphia. I swear to you, maybe I heard uptown once on the radio. Right. And besides right on magazine,

I would have never known what dirty mind was. So it's almost as if dirty mind never came out and we went right to the time and controversy. And I didn't catch up on dirty mind until after Purple Rain.

Then it was like, all right, you got to be completest and get everything. But Philly Radio was not playing anything off a dirty mind. And I think by then, like my sister's love of that type, you know, it just sort of waned a little bit. So as far as I knew, he just disappeared all of 1980. Wow. So you're saying that when dirty mind came out in real time.

Oh, my God. It was a- Guys got it and totally understood it and got it. Everything about it, the way they dressed, everything they talked about, party up and head and all these songs that we were deep deep deep into prince like deep into it and just thought he was the greatest thing ever like in my mind it was a flop and nobody was with it right he quickly was crazy recovered so we didn't you know what's crazy is at that time we was so into prince that we didn't judge whether something was a success or not because

we was just so blown away by his um first of all he was playing everything and and and doing all all that was that was that was as far as I knew that was unusual and he was on this sort of punk thing right and that was he was he was barring from new wave and and incorporating it into this sort of funk thing he was just an original it felt like an original to me was he so was it done in a way because I also know that you know Rick kind had a missed with the Guard and Love record, which, I mean, I don't know if big time really could have saved that record, but he was really, Rick James was trying to, like, really make a statement, like, here's my, my star moment and really made a pop album. Right. And what's weird

is I can't wait to get Lee Roy Burgess on the show because if you listen to the intro of big time, you can clearly hear that edit. Like, I know the Lee Roy Burgess part of Big Time. versus Rick's portion, which is basically I see Leeroy Burgess adding that. It's like an eight bar piano intro that's clearly not Rick James. Right. And then they slice, splice the rest of the song to it. But I don't know. For me, was Rick not like in your mind, what was Rick James?

Because he too was trying to establish punk and all that stuff. Rick was a hitmaker. right. Rick had the hits, you know, Mary Jane and you and I, and he had the hits, but he didn't have to start him to us, right? He was actually a hitmaker before Prince was. Yeah. Right. But we didn't focus on him. I don't know why. In Cincinnati, Indianapolis, the local bands all played Rick James songs, everybody. Some people played them better than others, but that was in every local band in their set. But you didn't look at it as innovative as I think back on it.

It was. But at that moment, I didn't think so. I thought it was just another guy making hits. I just didn't, I never focused on it. It was years later that I looked back on it and I said, wait a minute, this guy's insane. Like, you know, this guy wrote square biz. Like, this guy's like insanely talented, didn't really know it at the time. didn't quite catch it

because there was something about Prince that just appealed to us more. And you know what I think it was? Like in Cincinnati, we heard black music, but we also listened to rock. Right. We listened to a lot of rock music on the radio. And so I think that that presence of punk rock

and that presence of rock and the presence of funk, that blend, Prince kind of did all of that as one artist. So something about that that really appealed to us. A win is a win. A win is a win.

I don't care what you're saying. Yep, that's me, Clivert Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement

to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment, and the next we'll talk about life, mental health, purpose, and even music. The Clifford Show isn't just a podcast, it's a space for honest conversations, stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger.

So, if you've ever supported me, or you're just chasing down a dream, this is right where you need to be. Listen to the Clifford Show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you're you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. There's two golden rules that any man should live by. Rule one, never mess with a country girl. You play stupid games, you get stupid prizes. And rule two, never mess with her friends either. We always say that trust your girlfriends. I'm Anna Sinfield. And in this new season of the girlfriends, oh my God, this is the same man.

a group of women discover they've all dated the same prolific con artist. I felt like I got hit by a truck. I thought, how could this happen to me? The cops didn't seem to care. So they take matters into their own hands. I said, oh, hell no. I vowed I will be his last target. He's going to get what he deserves.

Listen to the girlfriends. Trust me, babe. On the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. What's up, everyone? My next guest, you know from Step Brothers Anchorman, Saturday Night Live, and the Big Money Players Network. It's Will Ferrell. Woo, woo, woo, woo.

My dad gave me the best advice ever. I went and had lunch with them one day, and I was like, and dad, I think I want to really give this a shot. I don't know what that means, but I just know the groundlings. I'm working my way up through, and I know it's a place they come look for up and coming talent. He said, if it was based solely on talent, I wouldn't worry about you. which is really sweet. Yeah. He goes, but there's so much luck involved.

And he's like, just give it a shot. He goes, but if you ever reach a point where you're banging your head against the wall and it doesn't feel fun anymore, it's okay to quit. If you saw it written down, it would not be an inspiration. It would not be on a calendar of, you know, the cat. Just hang in there. Yeah, it would not be. Right, it wouldn't be that.

There's a lot of luck. Listen to thanks, Dad. on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. This week on the Sports Slice podcast, it's all about the NFL draft, and we've got a special guest. The director of the NFL's

East West Shrine Bowl, Eric Galko, joins the Sports Slice podcast to break down what really matters when evaluating draft prospects. From hidden traits teams look for to the biggest mistakes franchises make, to the players flying under the radar,

this is the insight you won't hear anywhere else. If you want to understand the draft like an insider, you don't want to miss this episode. Listen to the Sports Slice Podcast on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, for wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Slical Life 12 and TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. I'm John Green. You may know me as the author of The Fault and Our Stars. And now, I guess also is the co-host of the away end, a brand new world soccer podcast. I'm Daniel Alarcon, a writer and journalist.

And John and I have known each other since we were kids. My first World Cup was Mexico 86. I was nine years old. I watched every game and I fell in love. On our new podcast, The Away End, we'll share with you the magic of international football, all leading up to the 2026 World Cup. For us, soccer, football, is a story we've shared for over 30 years since Daniel was the star player on our high school soccer team.

Very debatable. And I was their most loyal and sometimes only fan. I love this game. I love its history, it's hope, it's hard. heartbreak, and above all, it's beauty. Together, we'll find out why, of all the unimportant things, football, soccer, is the most important. Listen to the away end with Daniel Auer Kohn and John Green on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Wait, now I have to ask, your audiences, were they receptive to it as well?

Because this is also Middle America. It's not exactly New York. How are they adapting to? Because y'all had the eyeliner too, right? I thought babies they said y'all committed. Oh, no, we went all the way. I'm telling you, we went all the way. What was his word, glam?

Not glam. Bree. Bree. Bree. Yes. We were Bree. We were Bree. Which meant the new breed.

The new breed. Right. We were, we were our generation's version of whatever hip hop might have represented. Like, we were, but except you had to be really bold and daring and audacious and brave to pull it. off because, you know, you're going to be criticized by everybody on a musician level, on a human level, right? People are going to question your sexuality and everything, right? You're putting a lot at risk here to be a part of the movement.

Yeah. So we went all the way, the eyeliner, the Jerry Curl, everything, you know, the makeup. We went crazy with it. But you know what's crazy is we didn't even audition for our, record label. We never met our record label. We literally sent a photograph and a demo of two songs. Body talk, three songs. Body talk, a song called Just My Luck that Face wrote and a song called I Surrender. We literally sent three songs and a photograph and we got signed. To Dick Griffey? To Dick Griffey. That was your idea? No. We just, we gave it to our man. We had a manager. We shared a manager with Midnight Star. His name was Pablo Davis.

Oh, okay, yeah. And he went to turn in, he went to Solar to turn in no parking on the dance floor, which was Midnight Star's big album. Right. And so we caught a tail win because in that meeting he said, okay, I also have this new band out of Cincinnati called The Deal. And he shows them a photo, plays them the demo, and we got a record deal. Do you remember what was on the demo?

Body Talk, Just My Love. Oh, Buddy Talk, Just My Luck, and I surrender. Okay, gotcha. So the body talk that is the demo. Is that the version we know? Yes. Did you guys... The recorded version is a little bit better.

Okay. It's a little bit better. Like, yeah, because you'd appreciate this. The demo was all the Oberheim drum machine. Right. And... Oh, the, the Lynn drum. Not that one, no.

The first... There was one called the DX, the DMX. DMX, yes. Right. Okay. Okay. And, like, it was... It looked like an Oberheim keyboard.

And so that, the demo version was purely that. The recording had like real high hats and real crash symbols. That's the only difference. But it made it sound, it sounded better. Damn, I would like to hear that one there. You know what I mean? Like, you know how the DMS was, the real hot was like, it's a whole different sound, right?

Right. And it moved different. So you kind of skipped apart. Okay. How did that version of the deal wind up being that version of the deal with all the members that we know? Yeah, because baby's face said it was some fights for him. Yeah, I was trying to get back to how I met face. So that band is playing the clubs.

And, you know, unlike my first band, Pure Essence, the deal is packing them in. People are coming. Like this whole edge that we had. this androgyny that we seem to have. And this music was, it was a sensation a little bit, a local sensation. And we went from having 15 people in the room to like 100 people and 110, 115, 120. Like, and we started having lines around. It was incredible.

Like, we had a local success. If that had been the internet, we would have been trending. Like, you know, we had a little buzz. So one night I've met FACE, Kenya. at the time and he came to watch our band. And his manager introduced me to him. All I remember is us looking at each other and saying hi. And then fast forward a few months later,

a keyboard player friend of mine called and said, hey man, Kenny Edmonds wants to join your band. And I said, nah, he's not breed enough. Wow. I was like, no, he's not. He ain't got the thing. He's like regular. He's normal.

You know, you know, no, he didn't have a little. And so I literally passed on it. And then Midnight Star, I hired their keyboard player, Bo Watson. I didn't hire, I asked him to come in and play a session for us because somebody paid for a session for the deal to record. And I needed a keyboard player. So I called Bo Watson, who had known from the Indianapolis music. circuit and Bo came over and he listened and he played on the record with us and he went back and told everybody in his band like these guys are on to something so the next day the manager comes

Reggie Callaway everybody comes and hears us and they say what we love what you guys are doing we want to sign you we want to sign you to our company called Midstar Productions I was like okay this sounds good this is a little bit better than playing at the club I'm sorry I'm liking this so I go to the to the studio one night to visit them. They were recording. And there's this guy. It's dark. He's in the booth.

And I can't see the guy, but he's singing this song called Play Another Slow Jam, This Time Make It Sweet. And he's singing it. I'm like, who is this boy with this voice? This tender's voice, like, sounded so good. It comes out of the booth as Kenny Edmonds. Except he has got a trench coat. He's got the Jerry Curl.

My man is breed. He's completely breathed. And I'm like, yo, this is the dude I just said he couldn't join the band. And I mean, he's, now he is, he's suited up. And I'm like, and the most gifted of anybody I've ever met. I never met anybody that gifted, right? That could really, like, write a song and make a demo and do all the parts and sing the background

and the lyrics were like, like, really poetry. I never met anybody like him. All it took was a raincoat and some underwear. And a jerker. Yeah. No, I played. Oh, oh. Yes.

Yes, indeed. Yeah, I had the glasses, you know. And that was it, man. And that's how we, that's how that version of the band, so I asked him to join the band. And he said, what will I do? I said, well, I'd like you to be the guitar player, keyboard player, and be a writer. and like co-produce. Damn.

But you can't sing because we already have two lead singers. Right. And he was like, okay. So we went, we went, made all our demos, got a recording contract with Solar Records, and he didn't sing on the first album. Wow. That changed.

Yeah, that was a flex. Was that, you think that when he said, okay, you know, in the back of his mind, was he like, you'll be back. Yeah. He'll be back. No, he was already set on doing a solo album, honestly. Okay.

Even though he was in our band, He was already in his mind. I'm going to be a solo artist. All right. So look, I mean, we've had everyone on the show, including non-solar signies. One of you all are going to tell me a real damn story about Dick Griffey. Come on.

Come on, LA. All right. I love that, man. No, no, go, but I got you. Ask the question. Come on. Talk to me. Talk to me.

What was he like? What was he like here now? Yeah, what was it outside? We outside. First of all, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're, going to have to go to Los Angeles. Talk about the move to that. But it's just the thing is, I keep hearing like, these nearest Shug Night stories of don't mess with Dick Griffey.

Mm-hmm. What was Dick Griffey like? So the first time I met him, my first phone call, after we put up, record out, put out body talk, and it's starting to climb the charts. And he calls our house. I never met the man. He said, whoever answered, he says, let me speak to Antonio. That's how he talked, by the way. I can imitate him really good. So I pick up the phone. Antonio, Dick Griffey, the record, that body talk, the record to smash. Right. And I just wanted to welcome you to the label, everything was like kind of

right right so I went so after that fast forward a little I go to L.A. and I meet him and I go into his office with Reggie Callaway because we just mixed our album to turn it in and I meet him and but I was a side I was just like the kid in the band it was Reggie Calloway and Dick Griffey's meeting

and Dick said he wanted certain things to happen on the record and Reggie was like no we're not doing that So I immediately saw. Can you give me an idea of what his idea of what? What did he want? I don't remember what he wanted. Like, I don't remember, but he was giving creative advice. Yeah, creative advice.

Gotcha. Okay, gotcha. He was really creative, very. Like, he was. Yes. Okay. But more than that CEO way of, that's a hit. That's not a hit.

What do you say, like, the vocals are too loud or I don't like those drums or? More like this is a hit versus. that. Or you should try this producer. Or you should try this songwriter. Or, you know, putting Leon Silver's with Chalimar, you know, or like that kind of stuff. Okay, I got you. Yeah, he was good.

He was really good. So my first real encounter, my first real encounter was, first album comes out, second album. It's time to make the second album. And we make the album in Cincinnati, in Columbus, Ohio, the studio. And we sent demos into Dick Riffey. And he liked some stuff, some stuff he questioned. He had a particular fondness for Kenny. Because Kenny would sing on demos, and he was like,

he thought he was really incredible. So my first encounter was this song called Sweet November. Yes. that Babyface did for the deal, right? I always thought Troop did that first. I forgot that you all covered it. Yeah, yeah. Okay.

And so it's on the demo. And Dick Griffey hears it. And he says, who is that singing Sweet November? I said, that's Kenny. I want that on the album. I said, well, we had a problem. I said, what's the problem?

But the problem is that we made a deal when we started the group that our two lead singers, Carlos and D would do all the vocals on the album. That's Kenny singing. And he was like, well, that's a stupid deal. And either you put that song on the record or ain't going to be no record.

Oh. Got it. Kenny, your song's on the album. And you sang it. Sweet November made the album. So that was my first sort of encounter. How are you taking the unofficial I guess you're now the figurehead, the father of the group?

Yeah, I kind of always was. I don't know. It was my idea to go get everybody. I put it all on my shoulders and said, you know, if you guys rock with me, I'll do my best to take care of you. Yeah, it seems like you from, as you, when you're hearing this about you now, it makes sense that you were the one that kind of could bridge the gap between the business and the creative. Like, you knew how to talk to both sides. That's what I tried to, yeah. Yeah, because I had to negotiate with club owners.

Right, right. You know, for pay and when they wanted to deduct expenses and, you know, I had to do the tough guy work. But, and they trusted me. You know, all of us went to high school together, by the way, except for Babyface was in Indianapolis. But the rest of the band, we all went to high school together. We were all in that choir class with Mr. Brown.

And, you know, so we were all really like good friends. grew up together in the same neighborhood. So there was a trust factor there. Since you're talking about the material things album. Yeah. You know that album? This is question of Supreme, man. I'm so impressed with you, man.

I just got to tell you, man. I never met anybody with your level of musicology. That's why they can't have a verses. Yeah. You know, I don't know. But my question about material things, is, and I always, I don't know why it is, but the TomTom programming,

I've never heard a song in which the kick drum and the Tomtoms have to compete with each other, mix-wise. So I always wanted to know, all that stuff, right? Who gets the final word on a final mix? Because, okay, when I was younger, material things irked me,

because I was like, yo, those tom-toms are way too loud for this song. They were. As I got used to hearing it in my older age, I was like, all right, well, you know, I can see being innovative. But like who, who, back for those records, was it the Callaway brothers that were leaning on the production? Was it, were you guys allowed a word in edgewise?

Like, just as far as structuring the albums. Full disclosure. The first album, called Street Beat was completely produced by Reggie Callaway. And the songs were co-written by the members of our band and members of Midnight Star. Okay. When it was time to make the second album material things, we had fallen out. You and the Callow?

Right. Us and Midnight Star, we kind of fallen out. Gotcha. And Reggie didn't want to produce the second album. So Dick Griffey said, you produce it. So it was on me. I'm like, it's on me. Reggie didn't want to produce it or you guys didn't want Reggie to produce it.

We wanted Reggie, but Reggie didn't want to do it. Gotcha. And I don't know why. I didn't know why. I thought there was some it probably had something to do with money. He never said to me like I don't want to produce your record, but it felt businessy. Did he have

that option? Again, y'all still tell me nice guy's stories about Dick Griffin, but does Reggie Calloway have an option to mess up the money by saying, you know what? I'm not going to produce the second album. Yeah, because he and Dick Griffey visited my apartment in Cincinnati and we played them demos that we worked on and they collectively decided which songs we should record. So Dick gave him a pass. Yeah, he let him, he let him sit it out. So Kenny and I,

like, co-produced together. So all those decisions, loud as Tom, songs too fast, or that's all me and Kenny producing for the very first time in our lives. And following a hit record that Reggie produced, now it's on us. And it was a complete stiff. It was a complete stiff. That's a good lesson for class, though.

That's weird. It's weird for me. All right, so here, this is what I'm just learning. And, you know, I mean, I guess I alluded to the stuff I'm working. working on past summer soul. But I'm currently having made an official announcement because, you know, I will say that there was a popular dance show of the 70s, right?

And maybe other decades of which I'm learning that I'm learning that the, the host of said dance show has relationships with different uh CEOs and no no matter what the state of the record is on the outside world because there's songs that was played on this show so many times that I would instantly thought oh that's a hit one of them which being material things like all of 1984's season like if you get four spots on the most important dance portion of that show, then to me that was like, oh, you have a bona fide hit. And it was only later that I figured out that material things didn't get the same push

that body talk and I surrender. I mean, you know, exactly. It simply wasn't good. It wasn't good. Were you guys scared? And were you afraid of getting dropped? No. I didn't even think about it. You know, by the way, I've been dropped and fired a lot of times.

I never think about it, right? So this wasn't the first time. I just got fired from the night flight, right? So, yeah, I'm immune to it, you know. I love it. You ain't nobody until you get fired from somewhere. That's what you said. Yes. But no, no, we didn't think about getting dropped. all I thought about was

damn, this record I couldn't get it right, man. I couldn't get it right. I just couldn't get it right. I tried so many times, you know, because the studio, I mean, studio wasn't cheap, but we had it on lock so we could go in and mix it, press and acetate, go to the club,

play it at the club. It didn't sound right. We'd go back and try it again a couple of days, and we tried everything. And then when we thought we had it right, and we turned it in, And the label apparently agreed because they made it the single. And it just didn't work. And it was just embarrassing more than anything.

But it also put a fire in all of us. And I would say particularly myself and Kenny, it really put a fire into us that. And we're competitive people. So we were like, we can't let Midnight Star be responsible for our success. And then when we get the shot, we blow it. Right. Let's get to work. All right, ladies and gentlemen, I know you don't like this when this happens, but you know we got more in store for you.

Stay tuned for two more episodes of this epic Questlove Supreme with The Great L.A. Reed. While you're at it, feel free to check out our other ULS episode with Babyface as well. All right, see you all next time. Much Love Supreme is a production of IHeart Radio. For more podcasts from IHeartRadio, visit the IHeart Radio app. Apple Podcasts or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. A win is a win. A win is a win.

I don't care what you're saying. Yep, that's me, Cliver Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, my basketball and college football journey, or my career in sports media. Well, now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Cliford Show. This is a place for raw unfills of conversations with athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. So let's get to it.

Listen to The Clifford Show on the IHard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok podcast network on TikTok. When a group of women discover they've all dated the same prolific con artist, they take matters into their own hands. I vowed. I will be his last target. He is not going to get away with this. He's going to get what he deserves. We always say that trust your girlfriends. Listen to the girlfriends.

Trust me, babe. On the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. This week on the Sports Slice podcast, it's all about the NFL draft. And we've got a special guest. The director of the NFL's East West Shrine Bowl, Eric Galco, joins the Sports Slice podcast to break down what really matters when evaluating draft prospects. From hidden traits teams look for to the biggest mistakes franchises make to the players flying under the radar. This is the insight you won't hear anywhere else.

If you want to understand the draft like an insider, you don't want to miss this episode. Listen to the Sports Slice Podcast on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Slical Life 12 and TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. This is an IHeart podcast. Guaranteed human.