The Questlove Show - QLS Classic: Spike Lee (Part 2)

Episode Date: November 2, 2020

In part 2 of 2, Spike Lee talks about his later films, including the miracles around the making of Malcolm X, getting snubbed for awards and what Jungle Fever was all about. Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what I'm saying. Yep, that's me. Clifford Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, my basketball and college football journey, or my career in sports media.

Well, now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifers Show. This is a place for raw, unfills of conversations with athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. So let's get to it. Listen to The Clivert Show on the I-Heart Radio app,

Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. This week on the Sports Slice podcast, it's all about the NFL draft. And we've got a special guest. The director of the NFL's East-West Shrine Bowl, Eric Galco, joins the Sports Slice podcast to break down what really matters when evaluating draft prospects. From hidden traits teams look for to the biggest mistakes franchises make to the players flying under the radar. This is the insight you won't hear anywhere else. If you want to understand the draft like an insider, you don't want to miss this episode.

Listen to the Sports Slice Podcast on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Slica Life 12 and TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. I'm Daniel Alarcon, and this is my friend. This is much more famous than I am. I wouldn't go that far. But I'm John Green, co-host of the podcast The Away End with my old friend Daniel on our podcast The Away End. We'll share with you the magic of international football. all leading up to the 2026 World Cup.

Together, we'll find out why, of all the unimportant things, football, soccer, is the most important. Listen to the away end with Daniel Auerkone and John Green on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Questlove Supreme is a production of IHeart Radio. This classic episode was produced by the team at Pandora. Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to part two of QLS Classic with the Great Spike Lee. We have so many questions about his illustrious cinematic history. You know, we're just nerds here

at Quest Love Supreme. We hope you enjoy part two of our journey. Spike Lee. Let's go. Let's go to Mobetta Blues. Again, another film, the last time my father scored were my films. Mobert. Was he able and, he was ready and

willing to be actually in the film? Because that was like his first life. Yeah. No, he was. Was he in? But do you have a small part she's got. I'm going to say part of the, part of that score, did I not hear some of those score motifs in later films? The, because I felt there's one particular score piece that I heard. There's one piece that Terrence Blanch wrote that we used later. Yeah, I was going to say it's also in.

It was the thing, it's called Song for Soweto. I love it, yeah. And that's the one. he's playing on the Brooklyn Bridge. Yes. Terrence Blancher wrote that. Okay. So here's a thing note. With those scores, with the school day score, do the right thing, and

Bramford, with school days, do right thing, more better blues, in the orchestra. My father's score, you had Terrence Blanchard. I mean, you had Terrence, so for more better blues.

When you hear Wesley, that's Bramford. Then Zell is Terrence Blanchard. So they were both given the actors, you know, how to be a musician, how to play those instruments. This is what I want to ask you, because there's a scene that you do that not many musicians notice, but because I was coming up and starting about to enter college and stuff,

I'll say that it's weird. Even though I don't pick Mo Better Blues as like, okay, that might be my spike leave film of choice. It's just like maybe it chose me. but so there's the scene where Denzel interrupts so there's a point if you watch Wesley and it's done and it's even on the soundtrack

it's like how did you is it written in the script that okay Denzel's character is going to interrupt Wesley's sax solo yeah because that that's all done the playback so we had had to be in the script, so we recorded it. So at one point, did you say exactly five minutes and 34 seconds, I want you

to interrupt? It wasn't exactly, but the script says, yes, I mean, structurally, and for a dramatic Denzel, his character but Gillum has been humiliated. And so

these two brothers who were at odds want to show Shadow Henderson's his humanity, his love for his brother. So he's like picking him up. Let me save you. Saving him. I'm not even talking about the end.

I'm talking about the very beginning. The very beginning. Not even the battle. And that's this thing. You're not talking about that scene. I'm talking about him? No, it was so minuscule at the very beginning when you're egging on Denzel like, oh man, he's sowing for 36 bars.

Like, go out and get him. Go out and get him. And then. We worked that out in the recordings, too. Because all this stuff is done, done, done. You know, the playback. I realize you were on some next shit because in lesser hands, I felt like that scene would have been an interrupted scene.

I don't know. Just as a musician, I hate watching music misrepresented. Same way I hate watching basketball films. Really? Yes. Even though I went the dog that the... Airblood. Somebody shoots.

There's a cut to the basket and the ball goes in. So why were you not allowed to call it a love surprise? Oh, Alice Coldtrain did not like the profanity and sex in the film, in the script. So I said... You let her read it first? Yeah.

I mean, that's... She requested that. But as long, all I didn't care about the title. I just wanted Love Supreme. That's weird. Because when... Doing that period... Because we...

It's funny because every film we had like, we make jackets, the crew jackets. The Ku Juga said love Supreme I was going to say, why do you, because like with rappers, we will send the clean version of that song for the sample to get cleared. I cannot do that the junk, Coltrane's wife.

Yeah, but in the name of art, you know, older people don't. I cannot do that. Yeah. But I think most, in fact, a friend of mine who I went to school with, Patty Hales, she's one that came up with the, the title, Mo Better. Wow. By this time, not that I'm adding,

but I will say I, too, I'm a fan of the Spike Love Scenes. So by More Better Blues, the numbers had come up. You know what I'm saying? Like from school days, from Jungle Fever. What do you mean numbers? Numbers, like as many scenes. It was more. It was more sex.

More sex. More sex. It was Denzel and Sinda. And then it was Zendezza and Wesley. And then it was joy. And he knows the scenes. What's the question? The question is, what is your love scene philosophy, I guess I would ask, right?

Because they are so a part of your movies. People think those things are sexy, but they are hard to shoot. It's hard. People uncomfortable. And you shot your sister. So what is that like? Yeah. What is that like?

She read the script? Yeah. Denzo read the script and they were cool. I was cool. And so the scene where she delivers the baby, how did you all do that? Yeah, how did you? I was thinking that.

I was thinking it you asked. I was thinking it. We had, we went up to Harlem Hospital. And we knew about the, we went to the doctor and say, when is somebody can be born this day? Hmm. So they can predict, you know. So we had several people who signed up and we got the call.

We rushed to the hospital and filmed the birth. I was going to say by this point, you had leverage because you were Spike Lee. And it was a Harlem hospital. They ain't know no better. Well, I'm just saying that by that point, I doubt like you got that. I mean, I'm sure you've gotten your share of nose from the Hollywood system, but like... But they, the whole hospital is fine. They said, as long as you get permission from the moms and the family, who pooled it.

People film births all the time. So if the people that, you know, if they approve it, then they approve of it being used in a film, then what's the problem? But I'm certain that I would get, well, not. I'm sure that your Joe Shimo filmmaker would get fuck out of here. I'm not, you know, as opposed to... Finding you parents. It's an honor to, oh, God, Spike Lee's... I met her too.

Okay. One day, said, you know, I was in Moe Better Blues. Say, yeah, what role? You film it being born. Oh, shit. You made the kid. She was like a teenager. That's crazy.

That's weird. I wanted to see, like, has the VCR thing. Like, this is my first. Like, she'll be coming out. Immoralized forever. Man, nothing. that film, I didn't expect it to take the turn that it took at the end. And every musician, man, that shit is haunted.

But here's the thing, though, Amir, that doesn't come from music. That comes from sports. So you just... What I did, because, you know, any athlete, now let's say most athletes, whatever sport it is, they started playing it when they're a little kid. And so at a certain point, you say, I'm going to try this. This is what I want to do. So just like musicians, athletes, whatever sport, they spend all their time developing the skill.

So what happens? I always thought about these athletes who are very young, blow out their knee or their arms. I want you to save my life. You know, and then they're like 20, 25. And you've been retiring, yeah. So I just, that premise of a career and an injury, I just moved that to music. To a trumpet player. That's still one of the hardest things to watch for me.

Yeah, that was another movie that I saw it as a kid, but seeing it older, that was when it really got. I was like, fuck. And musicians, they turned their head. Yeah, it's hard. The trumpet hit that mouth. Ooh, child. They turned no musician to me. They look like, oh.

I actually played trumpet. Because they know what, you know. what this thing. Whoa, timeout. What? I played trumpet in like through middle school. I was like first chair, all state band, all that. Yo, can you be a guest on your own radio show

so you to find out about you? How come I don't know this? I thought I told, yeah, yeah. Like, you Grammy nominated freaking acting. Not me, man. You do everything. You know he missed a Humble Tea. Hey, man.

I got keys. Got a feeder. How did you do? discover Sinda Williams? Audition. Robbie Reed still? Robbie Reed. Who?

So we got to get Robbie Reed on the show. Does she just have her ear to the street or? It's a combination of both. You have to go find new talent. Does she have interns that like No, you go to you find new talent also people sending her agents

are sending her people too. So it's a combination of both. Wow. That was her first film, Senator Williams. I mean, fast forward years, years later, but were you proud when you watched the new edition story? Because that was really great casting, too, that she did. Well, Robbie?

Yeah. She did do that. That's right. I mean, she's a top executive at a BET. No, I mean, she's done great. I mean, Ruth Carter, one of the top costume designers. Again, her class of Hampton, two Academy Award nominations for Malcolm X and Amistad. So Ruth's doing her thing, you know.

Speaking of Academy How did you feel about That was a very awkward thing Like did Kim Bassenger Oh oh I know you're talking about Why didn't you explain it? Yeah I remember

Yeah I remember watching the academy It was basically like Kim Bassenger Just went off script and said that You know It was like the very first Oscar so white moment Where the glaring omission of Do the Right thing getting nominated for

Best picture And it made literally everyone We had two nominations Danny got one for Supporting. Supporting actor Yeah but he lost another Denzel When Denzel cried

With the tear Right Oh yeah Glory Glory The blurry tier And screen play And screen play

Yeah So you know She just may mention that You know You know It's the glaring omission of And I almost feel like Even

I mean back of She said the name. She said that? She said, Duderank. Yeah, she said it. Like, she really went off script and went rogue, but I was just like, hmm, she didn't get blackballed.

Let me find out they just, not re-tribed that in. Like, yeah, let's script it in just to, you know, keep them at bay and to keep them satisfied and not protesting us and whatever. But were you in the audience? I was there. How did you feel? Were you shocked? I was shocked.

Because you lost the driving misdates. Was that the year? Drive Miss motherfucking Dave Shut up I like that movie Wait Steve you're a real Best picture of the year

That's what's up Driving Miss Daisy Were you Was due the right thing up for the Palm to Or that year Or was that for jungle fever? No we lost it to Was that jungle fever or No no it was due the right thing

We lost to Sex Lies of a videotape Wow So was that the we was proud Another movie I haven't thought about in 30 years Exactly. Was that the We was Rob here? Dan, you're damn near the Kanye of, you're pre-Kanya.

Kanye is the spike of his... No wonder you ain't show up to get that drawn. Look, look. Fist up. So with Jungle Fever, I know that Comfilm Festival was so moved by Samuel Jackson's performance that they invented Best Supporting category. Never had it before.

Just made it up. Right. So they decided to have supporting categories so that Sam could win. Did he win or? No, he won. They made up a... He better win if they made up the only league of category.

It was so outstanding. I mean, Sam, I mean, that, for me, you know, people might talk about that Tarantino. Paul Fiction. Yeah, but it was really jungle fever. Yeah. And Sam has even said that himself. Was he actually still going through, or fighting his addiction at the time? No, he was clean.

He was clean. Okay. Yes, but he just, I was the last one to find out. You didn't know? I didn't know. Wow. So how much of that role is scripted? Like, I really, I kind of want to even go, like, scene by scene.

It's weird. I'm like, how much did he improv? A lot. The dance. Like, the, c cuck, cacquick, you know I'll do it. I swear that's going to be a rock on. I swear it's going to be a role for. Here's a thing, though.

So, again, this is Hallie Berry's first film. So while we rehearsed in rehearsal process, he's taking Hally to all his former spots. Wow. She told me that I interviewed her what she said he taught her how to be a crackhead. Damn. He was taking like so that, I mean, that's I mean, do the right thing. Here's the thing

I'd like to say real quick because I know we got to move ahead, but people, we all know what a misdirection play is in football right? The misdirection and jungle fever was the interracial relationship between

and Annabella Schiora and wealthy character. The real story, which a lot of people miss, is the effect of crack on black families. That's what Jungle Fe is about. See, I thought it was about religion and black family, because to me... That thing comes with Ozzy and Ruby. But also, we also get the whole thing

with Marvin Gaye Sr. Right. And Marvigay Jr. That comes directly from that. Yeah. I did not. I felt that the, that story. That's where it came from.

Marvin Gaye's senior killing his son, Marvin Gaye. Because I felt like that was the father. Maybe the son was the crack story and the Holy Ghost was the interracial relationship. As far as like subplot lines, whatever. But dude, no scene has ever scared the shit out of me more than Taj Mahal. Charlie Murphy. Yeah, he was. How, was that a set?

Yes. No, that was. an old ballroom, I think an Abyssinian ballroom, which is in, it was just in decay. But what I do is the great songs, I just make a mental

checklist, and I said, one day I'm going to use living for the city. I just got to find the right scene. But motherfucker, I'm going to use that. Yeah, in a way it matched up with the lyrics and the, oh, it was a And the touch of, I don't know if it was maybe on television at the time, but when I've seen it, as he got closer to the crack house, there was more of like a green tent of, I don't know if you guys used a filter or not or...

What kind of TV do you have? I've seen it in the theaters first. The Sony Twitter trial? And that, well, Sony, what happened to TV? I ain't, I smoked the TV. How many extras was that? How many extras were? We just had a thousand.

What? In the Taj Mahal? God damn. We wanted that to be like that famous scene from Gone with the Wind, where all the Confederate soldiers are like underground and injured. Did you have to pay them all? Yes. At the point, the SAG rules, of the certain point,

that they have SAG members after that. you reach that number, then you just don't have to be sack. Some non-unions like me. Non-union. I take that $50. Really? But that, that, that, that, that, and then I, the thing, it's a great scene.

Yes. But then after Wesley Leagues, where the whole, when, when divvian and the crack hole goes in his pocket, goes in his pocket. And sees it, he, he's been holding on crack. Like, I've been out here sucking dicks for you. I mean, like, and she was. She made that up? She was, yes, she was smacking the shit out of the sand.

Then she came around and then she was like, now smoke this shit because she's seen that he was in place. Smoked the shit. Yeah, I mean, that's the, that's one, I mean, tragic care. How many hours did that take? How many hours was it? That was one day, that whole scene. An entire day.

In there. Damn. When did you know that like Ruby Dee and Ozzie Davis just believed in what you were going to do? That's an amazing accomplishment. Well, my father had done this thing called, I forgot to play, but he did the music for it and they were in it so I've always known them and loved their work

and just I've been blessed to work with Ruby D I mean with first as you mentioned before school days coach Odom didn't do the right thing the mayor Ruby mother sister

then you got them playing together husband and wife and jungle fever then Ozzy and get on the bus. But then we brought his people to remember Don't forget this.

We bought Ozzy back to redo his eulogy. Yeah, that's right. He came back and steal it and redo that. So Giants, giants. By that point,

Spike Lee, the media star, I mean, you were constantly on nightline, seeing you on Phil Donahue, seeing you on... Donahue. You were like, you know, the point where you're like the black spokesperson or the angry, militant black spokesperson. And I remember doing your Donahue appearances that you were, you know, a little myth

that you were being asked, like, where are the drugs? Like, how come you haven't dealt with the crack epidemic yet? and where the, you know, how come there was no crack and do the right thing? Wall Street. I mean, that was a big criticism of do the right thing that the streets were clean that, that there was

no crack and stuff like that. Because we can't live in that environment. That was a conscious decision. That was another film, which was jungle fever. But I made, I made the comment because Wall Street, you know those marvels snowing. All right. I mean, there was

There's no, any of that stuff in there. But did you feel the pressure at that point like, okay, I got to do a crack movie now? Or, you know. No, it wasn't the pressure. It was just seeing the devastation of crack. I mean, we are still dealing with crack because we had a generation of people who are beautiful black people grew up without parents in the homes. Yeah. And they had.

It took the mothers. It killed the moms. Like every other drug was kind of like social, whatever. Yeah. Crack took mama out. Took people's soul. Yeah. I mean, we've always had drugs.

It's going to be a her in and stuff like that. But crack, this thing was devilish. The infamous, uh, sister girl scene. I forgot what you called it in Jungle Fever. Yeah, I forgot what you called. Oh, they're going on there. One day, I'm going back to the vaults. I want to see the full scene.

What do you call it in the film? Don't go in there. That's the, you had a special title for it. Told them, don't go in there because they're having a... Yeah, you did. I forget the title, but was that scripted? No, no. That was not scripted at all.

They were not supposed to sit around and talk. You just let the cameras run. Yes. Talk about all the backs when you ever had in your life with black men. That was motherfucker like a shit. So basically it was a day on Twitter. Before Twitter. Wait, so then that was each their individual real experience?

Yes. Wow. So Teresa, when Teresa was like, I'll date them all and, you know, oh my God. That could have been a movie alone. We released that for two hours. Wow. Okay, I have to play devil's advocate because I know that there's been criticism of your representation of women and how they're scripted. Right. Which I was asking like, well, damn, that seemed pretty realistic. But they were. it. So how, especially with Phyllis Yvonne Stigney, who I always felt was so underutilized. Like, I was the brown. At no point did you think like, okay, I have to give her a piece so that she can. No, I saw Phyllis that her one man shows. I mean, one woman shows. She's hilarious. She's a great talent. So that's why, you know, put her down. Right. But I felt like, especially she stole that scene.

Like, aren't there more scenes for her? She's going to have a movie. movie by herself and you know it's but it never happened is it hard to really write for is it hard for you to write for women and

I think it really depends on the character are you concerned with their development as much as your your male characters oh yes I think I think it got a lot much better once I got married to the time Louis Lee

when was she hate me was that post marriage or prepping that was pre-marriage. Okay, okay, you're right, you're right, you're right, you're right. Shaby, okay, you're right. Shaby was pre-marriage? No, you can definitely look where I got married as, as, uh, before and after. And so I would definitely say that my women, my betrayals of women were more fuller and more layered after I got married. Damn, so girl six then. How long was Malcolm X in your pocket

before you finally felt the need to unleash it? As far as the script was concerned and you wanting to because I can imagine that you had Malcolm X in your pocket. No, it wasn't that, that wasn't the case at all. The late producer, Marvel Wurper, bought the rights to the book from the late great Alex Haley and the late great Dr. Bette Chabas. Was it instantly yours or you had to campaign for it? No, he been trying to make that thing for 20 years. Shit.

And so finally, it was announced that Norman Jewelston was going to direct the film with Denzel and I started saying in the press hell no and then the Marvin work got in touch with me and said Spike stop to stop speaking in the press and I'm going to arrange a meeting between you and Norman Jewison very fine director was soldier story yeah and he did the night with City Portier and I explained in Norma Jewison why I think that I was a right director for the film and to his credit he graciously bowed out because he had the gig. He had the gig.

He had the gig. Denzel was going to play Malcolm X. So that thing was together before me. Denzel will play Malcolm X and Norman Jewelis and director film. Was the final product your vision? 100%. Yes, that's why it was three hours. Was there any scene that you're like, damn, if we could just only... No, it was three hours.

It couldn't be any longer. I mean, could you... Here's the thing, no. We, I always saw this film as an epic film. I mean, Ernest Dickinson and I, we were very lucky that somehow there was a restoration of Lawrence of Rayba, right when we were in pre-production at the Ziegfield.

And we said, that's the shit we got to do. So we wanted to tell the autobiography. his life and not just pick a certain this and that. No, we want to show the evolution of a man. Malcolm Little, Detroit Red, Malcolm X, El Haas, you know, to show the whole evolution and many, and you can't

show his transformations from this person, that person, in a two-hour film. And so trouble began from the very beginning because we never had the correct budget, enough budget, for the shoot that film. What was the initial one? budget. It wasn't enough. I forgot. Were you given rat budget?

In other words, Cypress Hill's first album is 61,000. Meanwhile, Metallica's black album was 4 million. Was there a Hollywood double standard? No, it wasn't a double standard. It just wasn't enough to do the epic film we wanted to do. And also, Warner Bros. did not want the film to be that

length because three hours, that's one less screening in the theater. Funny story, not funny, but the first time we screen the film for the two heads of Warner Brothers, co-chairman, it was Bob Daly, and I keep forgetting the other guy's name. Anyway, the first time they saw the film was the day of the L.A. riots. shit. Whoa. Wow. And to their credit, they both stayed

and that was a four-hour cut. But the secretaries were coming in throughout the whole thing were notes or something like that. So it was ironic that the first time we showed the film the Warner Bros. LA was up in flames.

Damn. Do you remember any of the celebrities that didn't help? No. Here's the thing. Because we heard Oprah and Jordan. Let me get the story. So I will not cut the, so Warner Brothers wants the film to be two hours.

I say, look, it can't be two hours. And so I know that Oliver Stone is getting ready to finish JFK is in pre-production. And it's the Warner Brothers film. So I say, how long is JFK? They say it's two hours. They don't know I know Oliver Stone. You all think that you're too, Al. I said, yo, Oliver, how long is JFK, the spike?

It's three hours. Don't tell those motherfuckers. He didn't curse. He said, don't tell him I said so. So, wait a minute. JFKs me three hours, and we can't be three hours? I wouldn't, I wouldn't cut the film. So Warner Bros.

Let the Bond Company take over the film. Oh, no. And so then all the people post-production got a letter saying you're no longer, you're fired. Damn. So we had no money. I got paid $1 million for Malcolm X. I put that money into the budget. Right.

Towards a film. And so in the eight, nine months in pre-production for Malcolm X, I kept thinking about what Malcolm talked about self-reliance self-determination self-reliens self-determination and I kept thinking about that did it hit me like a motherfucker tongue of bricks

I got people I could call I got their number and here's the tricky thing it it was not going to be investment in the film it cannot be a tax break. It just had to be a gift. The first thing I called it was Bill Cosby.

So a call, Bill was up. And he said, what do you want, Spike? So I told him. He knew it. So he said, I'll put the check in the man. I said, no, no, no. So I'm coming over now. So I jumped on the subway.

Hmm? Where do you live? up east side You went to him Yeah So Got on the subway He was like

I don't believe you I'm gonna get a cash He opened the door He opened the door Had the check I snatched the check Didn't even come in the house And ran to the bank

Before I'm sorry I'm sorry I'm sorry Ran the bank Before he could cancel That shit So I made a list

Okay So we had Janet Jackson Did you have a relationship with her That you could ask her? I had a number You're not She just asking strangers for a million bucks He's Spike Lido

So Janet Prince Tracy Chapman Wow Miss Oval-Wry There's a woman A African-American woman Who's an entrepreneur

Her name is Pegger Cooper Kafferz from D.C. So there's two more people on my list Magic Johnson Now I have one more Press my list Michael So the only thing that people said

Please do not discount Please do not You know disclose How much? How much? So I said my mother's grave No one's ever gonna know So I called my last call

My main man money So Michael Jordan is very very competitive Oh wow You want to know how much everybody else gave. No, I just mentioned the range of what magic game. He want to make it rain in the club the most.

He said, fuck that. You get this. Ah! So, that money enabled me to rehire. Yeah, that's dope. My people. And we kept it quiet.

So there was no interaction between myself and the studio for months. And on Malcolm X's birthday, May 19th, we had a press conference at the at the Schaumburg Library, 135th Street in Lenox where we had a press conference and announced the names, these prominent African-Americans who came through out of goodness their heart. So the vision, so the world could see our vision of Malcolm X. And the next day you know what happened, Warner Brothers started putting us back on the payroll. Oh, man. True story. So how long... Okay, can I ask you, who is the hardest pitch?

Because it's weird, because, like, I have a hard time getting people to come to my DJ gigs. But it's like, as a virtual stranger, I mean, I have a hard time getting people to do interviews for the show. You know, so it's like, how's your pitch? is it lengthy or is it just like for black people education what's up it's like it's nation time wow it's nation time

and nobody was scared that their name was going to be attached Was this your first conversation with Prince like who was your first like Did you have that's what I was asking I knew everybody Not like friends but I knew enough that I had that number And it wasn't like

Look here's the story How did you even get to Prince to be like Yo I got to ask him because he's kind of elusive. I don't remember, but I got his check. I talked to everybody. People, because it had been in the press, though. I mean, it was in the press.

I mean, the whole thing of Malcolm X was huge. I mean, about the whole making, all this stuff. And the hats were already out at that point, by that point, too, right? Yeah, you know, so it was known. And then the fact that it was known that they pulled the plug on the money. And so people I know People understood what was the stake

Okay And they would just say How much you need And so here's the thing though So I have a list Everybody asked in the list Came through

But every time No one said no No one said no How come you didn't go To the other Michael That's about the That was the dead Matter of fact

The two other Michaels Who became Muslim Tyson Tyson Who both were Muslim At some point Because at a point Because at a point

I had my money. Okay. So you didn't want to go over just... No, no. I just, I didn't want to be greedy. And you knew that you needed nine million more? That wasn't a million. It wasn't a million. It was a nine million. I just knew I needed.

So every time I would ask, I would go up and get more confidence, getting to pepper my step. So it's like a scale. Every next call, I'm asking for more. Are you hitting your chest? I'm asking for more. Like self-determination, self-reliance. And these pront of black people came together and gave us the money

to make the filming way he wanted to make it. So Tracy Chabin wasn't like, okay, well, maybe I'll need two videos. No one. No, it was all loved. It's all love. It's all love. It had nothing to do with me. It was about Malcolm X.

It was about Malcolm X. Even more importantly, how did you get them all in the room at the same time to shoot that last, the credit scene, where they're all, they weren't the same room. Oh, you just made it seem?

No, we just, wherever we could find them, we put a, hat on him. A hat on him. Wait, is that an X-Men? I swear I didn't know past the I am Malcolm X. And credits. It just looks like when Revolution is playing by Arrested Development.

Who's wearing a hat? Janet. No, Michael and Magic are together. Right. Okay. The way you cut it, though, I just thought everybody was in the room at the same time. I was more impressed with that. I'm like, damn.

No, that was different times. Does Prince got a Malcolm X hat at his crib or something? Did you give him a baseball cap just in case he worn him? Prince doesn't wear a hat. I know. He didn't want to fucking with that. But that was, I mean, because I don't know what's going to do.

How did you pull off the Mecca scene? We were the first. Yes, I know. We were the first people ever allowed to bring a 35-millimeter camera into Holy City of Mecca during Haj. And so we just had to hire a Muslim crew. Why? Why? Why would they say they let you do it?

Why? they respect Malcolm X as a Muslim. And again, who's pitching them? I don't know. It's just the amounts of miracles. One of the social producers, Fernando Soolerton, somehow he talked the high Islamic court and to grant his permission to shoot it.

Was there resistance or, is there a sex in the film? Is there? They, they, we had to send the, I mean, look, I'm not going to mess around with the high Islamic court. So thank, thank a lot. they gave us permission to shoot it because you cannot recreate what we did when that stuff, I mean, come on.

On the other side of the coin, how did you avoid the ire or anger of the nation? Oh, easy. In pre-production, I flew to Chicago and had a meeting with the minister of Farrakhan. Uh, got you.

What am I? I don't want no problems. So I got in a plane flew to Chicago and sat down with the minister and the minister was really not concerned how he portrayed Malcolm X. I was going to say he was more concerned

with Elijah Bahamas. He was only concerned about Arnold Elijah Muhammad. And he said, Spike, I wish you well. But if there hopefully you will do the right thing. He didn't say that.

But you let me know no other term terms. It could get up. But could, possibly. Well, was he cool? Because you gave a couple of gems in the movie, bro. I mean, but. It's...

He could have went deeper. There was two. He liked the film. He did say, Spike. I saw him eventually after you see it. He did like the film. Didn't, who played Elijah Mahoney? Al Freeman.

Al Freeman. Rest of peace. Wasn't he nominated for Best Supporting actor? Should have been. Was any... Was any... Only, the nominations were Denzel and Ruth Carter. Okay.

And Denza and Denzo lost Al Pacino for Centerva Woman. Another movie. Wait, wait, wait. That's the NBA makeup call. Because Pacino is a great actor that did not win for Godfather 1. Godfather 2. Serpico.

Oh, okay. Training Day. The afternoon. Okay. Right. And so Denzel's young. You'll be back. Boom.

Trainage. Center woman. Anyway. The center of a woman was stupid, though. It's a makeup call. You disappoint me, Steve. I thought you had a good punch line. I like it.

You're such a classic film there. But look, Pacino did not win for Godfather. One Godfather. Serpical, do the right thing. Excuse me, a dog day afternoon. Right, right.

At least one of all she should have won. Right. Two at least. A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what I'm saying. Yep, that's me. Clever Taylor the fourth.

You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated.

One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment, and the next we'll talk about life, mental health, purpose, and even music. The Clifford Show isn't just a podcast. It's a space for honest conversations, stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger. So, if you've ever supported me or you're just chasing down a dream, this is right where you need to be. Listen to The Clifford Show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok.

There's two golden rules that any man should live by. Rule one, never mess with a country girl. You play stupid games, you get stupid prizes. And Rule 2, never mess with her friends either. We always say that, trust your girlfriends. I'm Anna Sinfield, and in this new season of the girlfriends... Oh my God, this is the same man. A group of women discover they've all dated the same prolific con artist.

I felt like I got hit by a truck. I thought, how could this happen to me? The cops didn't seem to care. So they take matters into their own hands. I said, oh, hell no. I vowed. I will be his last target. He's going to get what he deserves.

Listen to the girlfriends. Trust me, babe. On the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. This week on the Sports Slice podcast, it's all about the NFL draft, and we've got a special guest. The director of the NFL's

East West Shrine Bowl, Eric Galco, joins the Sports Slice podcast to break down what really matters when evaluating draft prospects. From hidden traits teams look for to the biggest mistakes franchises make to the players flying under the radar. This is the insight you won't hear anywhere else.

If you want to understand the draft like an insider, you don't want to miss this episode. Listen to the Sports Slice Podcast on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, for wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Slical Life 12 and TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. Malcolm X was so crazy. I remember it's just so crazy to be sitting here with you.

It came out when I was in seventh grade. Did you cut school? No, even better. I tried to get my class to go see it. And I almost got it done. But something happened and the principal was like, nah, and it ended up in the paper. It ended up in the paper. The house niggas?

Not all the other thing. No, real, I think it was a house niggas, real rap. The school I went to. Mazza, they get ready. He can be able to take the, go see. We're going to go see cut school, play hook. Go see Malcolmaker. No, straight up, the school I went to,

Menna Hall Middle, it was like, it was like a school that was in the middle of a very affluent neighborhood in our city. But it's still Carolina. And, I mean, yeah, but niggas got money in Carolina. I wasn't saying that. I was just saying, you know. Yeah, but it was, you know, so, but I was like,

yo, we should go see it. We could make it a class trip and all this shit. And it was happening. And then all of a sudden it just got shut down. And I remember reading it in the paper. So apparently something went down with the principal or some shit, but they were like, nah.

Nah. I ended up going to see it myself, of course. So were you fine with the parting of you and Ernest at that period? I don't know why you'd stop working with each other after. Because Ernest, from the day he came to film school, told me I'm going to be a director. So I always knew that day was coming when he would, you know, direct the film and continue on that path. See, we were just like, give me five years and then. No, we never talked about it.

about it. You know, women's, but it, it was, it, it, at Malcolm X,

I knew that was going to be the end, that he was looking to direct. But did you, he couldn't do both. I'm sorry. That's how we wanted to do. And so look,

I mean, I want people do what they want to do. Right. But aren't you afraid that the formula will be different? Like, damn, like you,

you have such a good marriage and such an identity with these shots. I work with great deep peace, Malik Said, wow. Ellen Curis. a whole bunch of people, you know.

So we had a great time together. You know, we'll always have those films. And he's doing what he wants to do, which is direct. What did you think of juice? Loved it. This was it. Damn. It just hit me that you never worked with Tupac.

And now I wonder what would have come of it had Tupac acted in one of your films. Well, I mean, he had a, he had a. Ernst and Ernst and Ernest and. At all? I don't think I ever met him. Why? I don't really remember meeting him. Wow.

Because when I came to the set, he wasn't there on the juice. No, have you ever met Tupac? I don't think so. I don't remember. I remember Pop was dissing in the interview. Like, this was a while. I mean, it was on B2. Right.

He was dissing everybody, right. He was saying because I didn't support him. You didn't come to the premiere or juice or something like that. No, I wasn't around the set. I mean, me and Ernest, We're like, we grew up together. I'd have to be on it. First of all, when I'm on, when I'm, when I'm, when I'm, when I'm not directing the film, I don't go to us.

I just, I just feel awkward on all the people's sense. I don't go. And also, you visited graffiti bridge. Anyway. He said it take, I wanted to be Prince. You couldn't stop that? You couldn't stop that from happening? I wanted, when Prince calls for you.

Right. You go. Right. Is that how y'all got girls sick or how you got him to do the music? Oh, yeah, I had this script and I said, look, I send this script. I want to use all your songs. So, okay.

And he said, can I choose a song? Yeah, go ahead. But he wrote the theme song. The title, yeah. So I guess for Crooklyn, well, even though it's the story of your mother, that could have been more emotional. The Lee family. Story to the Leaf family growing up in Fort Green Brooklyn.

A hundred. A hundred percent true. Like, was it anything that was in those arms? I mean, the dog didn't pop up out of the, the, the, casual convertible. But, like, the character that you played with the glue and the dude, the neighbor down. But I'm just saying that even though you're talking about your family. That is really semi-autobiographical. But to me, it was like a lighthearted, okay, it wasn't.

Back in the days. Yeah, that could have been your romantic comedy or you're just your lighthearted. We want to do something after Malcolm X. different. That was the first time I said my daddy cry after he saw Crooklyn because he was born and raised in New York and he was like...

The scene in Crooklyn where she goes south down south and the... What was the thought behind that? Well, it's Alice in Wonderland. She's in a strange place and she doesn't... You know, it's crazy

because people were... I was confused at all right. TV's... They were knocking... I was confused at first, but I... What the fuck is? Focus! Focus!

Straight that shit! No, it took me a minute to figure out what you were going for. Yeah, yeah. I love that. That's one of my favorite movies. What did he's braids? That came on HBO the other day. They're brazing things and beads and the veil.

You know what? People, if I took score, people, people come up to time they, they, of all the the things I've done, people say Crooklyn more than any other film. I want to do the right thing. More than Malcolm X. Just on the street. Just strangers, they say crooklyn. Yeah, because we were all kids at one point.

Yeah, and it's like a, not a working man's film, but, you know, I feel like your initial arsenal, the first five or six were so larger than life and epic. And, you know, again, you had the pressure of being our spokesperson and you had to cross every team, dot every eye. I was going to ask, like, is there, I mean, do you have writers block? And I'm parallel to this, the songwriting. Like, okay. So obviously, Malcolm X is your thriller, your Purple Rain or whatever. Like, when you're trying to follow up a film, are you just like, I'm out of ideas? Or I just, like, where do you go to?

Well, I've been to your crib before. But here's the thing, though, is that I've done films that I didn't direct. I mean, excuse me, I didn't write. The clockers. So the original script, a crookin was called Hot Peace and Butler. It was written my brother Sankey and my sister, Joach. So he brought it to me. I said, I want to, you know, rewrite it.

And so that's where that, that was the origin of that. So I always have, I have a bunch of stuff to make. So it's not the thing about writers, but it's about getting the money to make those films. My question for you, the one thing I've always remarked. about you and I don't know how you do it you always seem to be like right on time like timely so like particularly I'm thinking of 25th hour I mean that came like right you know on the hills of 9-11 how how did that come together well 20th hour was a novel written by david bonyoff of games of thrones fame and the novel takes place before 9-11 uh okay so Edward norton I got the deal

to make it take place post-9-11. So that's how that happened. Yeah, that's one of my, I think, in my opinion, that's one of your underrated joints. I mean, people, they talk about do the right thing and all the early, but 25 hours, that one really spoke to me. I thought you really did a great job.

I was capturing the city post-9-11. Like, it just felt so empty and, like, it was fucked up. I loved it. Thank you. You know, look at the Barry Pepper, Edward Norton, the late, Philipsy Moffin, Rosario,

Brian Cox had, I mean, the cast was killing. But don't you think every person, because that's funny, that Fonte says that's his favorite, but I feel like every person who's a Spike fan has their list of the classics, and then the ones that I think people slept on, like I think people slept on Miracle at St. Anna. You know what I mean? But it seems like you have those two lists of, you slept.

Yeah, and then the under, yeah. Well, here's the thing, you know, you really, it's like music, you know. We sleep on albums, you know. You sleep on plays. and you just got to hope that sooner or later, you know, people get it. You know, and that's all you can do as an artist. You know, you just put it out there.

And once it's out in the public, you know, really, what can you do? You know, you can't really, especially if you don't have millions and millions of dollars behind you to push it, you know. You just got to leave it out there, you know, see what happens. Yes. I'm slightly, and I'm jumping ahead of,

lot of films because I felt that one of the films that has proved itself very accurate in time. Yeah, yeah. Actually, in this very room that we're in, you came to me 16, 17 years ago with all of these menstrual toys in a bag. which I still have You pitched us Bamboozle And

Passed you a question Yes Did you guys take a lot of heat For playing Alabama porch monkeys Once Nas tried to Oh yeah I do remember that

Against us Because Why? Okay Because We had backed up JZ It was like

We chose sides During that Nas JZ war And We chose when we did Jay Z's Unplugged. But you didn't,

you, you weren't choosing sides, though. We were supposed to be Switzerland. Yeah. But the thing was, when we did take over, like, we started doing their music. Y'all did, the Uchiawali. Yeah, y'all did. Right, we started doing, like, Nause music.

So, like, really, like, you know, put the dagger in the heart. And so, you know, he had words for us on Hot 97, but we didn't, we didn't catch words. However, when, And what's his... Who played I'm about to say

Not the Dutterman. Mumma, Malcolm, oh, Roger Grimba Smith. Yeah, yeah. He had visited the Fallon set and on like day one. He happened to be like in the NBC building

and he had a... He said, hmm. Okay. Right. Oh, oh. And I was like, come on man. He was like, mm. Oh, boom.

Bear foot pregnant. Roger, man, come on. Matter of fact, we did barefoot pregnant for Spice Walkout. Oh, shit. The very first time he was on late night with Jimmy Fallon. Is that an original song or is that a cover? Yeah, we just made it up on the spot.

I've been waiting for that to show up on the last 16 years. So when you saw the root, did you think, porch monkeys or what did that go? So the thing is, Here's the thing was, it was like, I was wondering. Did you guys regret it? No, hell no. Here's the thing.

I was like, at first I thought, come on, man. Like, when, all right, here's the deal. You, I didn't know if you were doing a school days on us. But for some reason, the trailer for the roots, and we had to put on blackface and all that shit. the trailer for the roots and wearing those jail suits The trail for the No, no, the

Our dressing room trailer Oh, oh Was three blocks away From where we had to shoot at that school Being so In black face With no context Whatsoever

I didn't know that And you know This 1999, 2000 was our breakout year So You know Pre things fall apart, you know, I was like the guy with the weird head or, yo, you have the Snoop Dog haircut or here comes, pooh, pooh, but I was definitely Quest Love at that point. And there was a

thank God social media wasn't out. Oh, man. At that point. Yeah. It was like, it was like, you must have broke people's hearts when they saw y'all walk up. There was okay. No, they were just confused like, what the hell is this? And, um. Because I had the red lipstick. Right. So it wasn't even like y'all could do the dead presidents with the white you know what we get to set doing it for a week just doing it without context

of people just think of there were no cell phone back then and none of that stuff and by the last day I was like let me find out Spike's trying to school days us and so when I saw the film I was like damn this is a hard pill to swallow

like what's the likelihood because I knew by that point the only menstrual we really truly had to worry about was like you know UPN had that home boys and out of space and yeah there's the secret uh diary of desmond fifer yeah yeah that's stuff and oh my god's a funny slave show i was like right a slave rom-com i mean we were excited because this is like our first feature thing but in the back i was like yeah maybe spike went over the top with this one but then maybe five years later i was like oh just like they said in bamboozle now next year.

Oh, yeah, that's right. Just like bamboozle. But then by year 10, I remember hitting up like, I was like, yo, do you find it strange that all the things that Spike was talking about back in 2000 is slowly happening now? It's like bamboozled and idiocacy are like two most prophetic films. Yeah, they're documentaries. Drop Squad. I don't know.

I just wanted to say it. Yeah. So, I mean, you, I mean, if you have the dart in your hand, I would say that, you know, you weren't exactly 100% maybe you were kind of like 61% back in 2000 now I'm thinking

that bulls are that damn now I'm thinking that you went a little light like you didn't go heavy enough well did you really foresee that we wound up in the post menstrual entertainment hell that we are in right now where it's I saw it coming

and And what I wanted How did she come in though? I mean. Tyler. It was just The creator? Nah.

Oh my God. Tyler Collins? I was like that record. Why are you doing this album? I totally forgot what you're talking about. I just think I've always felt that you could tell who we are as a people bar music. That really tells, you know, who we are.

Damn. We are in a music. And I just, And I just saw going south and, uh, literally or, no, no South slander, no South slander. I'm not doing that. No South slander. I just, I just, I just, I don't know, brother, don't cow.

I mean, Fonte. You live down south, but come on, bro. I live it, but I know you from Queens. No, no, no, no. You know, we got to, Queens Bridge. We adopted you. We adopted you. you, bro. I'm Carolina born and raised, man. I ain't going nowhere. I knew you.

It was North Carolina. North Carolina. We claimed you, man. We claimed you. Okay, that's cool. I just saw it. Where's your heart line? My heart, it still lies and south. You have a northeast liberal. You are. I'm a northeast liberal. You have a northeast liberal. Oh, okay. Maybe. I just think that it was going, you know, down, not south, but down. And that we were losing, we were forgetting who we are. We're great people. come from great ancestors and we were losing that for the fame of money and fame praying at the on our knees praying at the altar the almighty dollar and this was a examination of this character de la qua who lost his soul trying to be successful and then

once he got woke it was too late it was too late and it was also when that film was made it was a hundredth anniversary of film and it was the fifth

birth of a nation it was a hundred and it was the 50th anniversary of television so I wanted to show how these two mediums have the based our ancestors our people

who we are but that same film can be made about the basement of Native Americans, women. So it's how, I mean, if you look at the films of John Ford

and John Wayne, look at the Native Americans and Savages. And this whole humanization of people through the powerful memes of television and cinema, and that's why we have that very, very hard,

hard, hard montage at the end, which is really painful to see, but I felt that, you know, we need to... Why is it that your people, Jewish people, talk every day about the Holocaust, and that's great, you know. We should deal with our own Holocaust, too. And that's what that film's about.

But even... I was going to say, what was the... You had a question? Yeah, you said Holocaust. That means I get the floor, right? Yeah, that's true. I'm pointing to you. I was pointing to you.

It's just coincidentally maybe, or I don't know, my favorite one of your films. Vambles? Yeah, with the, just the most direct message, most in-your-face message. All right, Malcolm X, and then that's the truth. That's the truth. I believe you. I believe you. So it was a very, very, I mean, just like this stuff that you talked about, those, those, the memorabilia.

the jolly nigger bank and all that stuff that is it was a real thing those are real things yeah and I invite everybody to go to the National Museum of African American History and Culture where they have a crazy display of the history of the menstrual and all that stuff well did you

okay so even more than just the menstrual angle reality TV just with reality TV and the viral nature that we are in now snuff film too The snuff film, yeah, the live streaming.

Snuff film. Oh, my God, yeah. The girl killing her sister in the car. I mean, look, like you. Eric, the murder Eric Gardner is a snuff film. Yeah. And we go on. All of those are people?

I mean, I mean, all of them. I mean, Eric, these are snuff films we're seeing. Because after a certain amount of views, it's. Yeah. Wow. To kind of. Did I interrupt you? Oh, well, the only, the question I have.

And what about 118 black? Oh. Oh, what is a certain? Like, what if you get a search? Kill me. What, too? What are you killing me? What was the decision to shoot?

Because you shot that on digital. Many DVD. You told my question. Yeah. What was it a budget thing? It was two things. It was artistic and budget term. You wanted to shoot the performance on digital tape and everything and everything else on

film because most TV shows are filmed on tapes. That was Ellen Curis, again, was. the DP did a great job. So that was the decision to do it like that. Oh, no. Now, you're talking about, I actually did skip school to see that.

Can I just say, I love the, the end for the end title song. Misrepresented people? No. What was it? Shadowlands by Bruce Hornsey.

Yeah. I was in. Great, yeah. Great, great song. That's a good soundtrack too. Yeah, Stevie. Miss. Speaking of soundtracks.

How did you? you and Stevie get together for Jungle Fever? Oh my God. I'm just all white girls crazy. Did you, had you already chosen to do the living, the Taj Mahal scene with Living for the City? Yeah, but that was the only song that was not written for the film. I was asking, like, did you ask Stevie after you had made that decision?

No. Got him out of his son. No, I wrote to the script by since he's script and he said, please do the songs for this. He said, okay. Wow. And everybody told me that he would not do it in time, but he came through. I was going to say, how did you, because one, he had no records ready between 88 and 1995.

The script was transcribing the Braille. Wow. And we would send him scenes. And, you know, Steve goes to movies all the time. And he came through. One of my favorite songs on that album is a count. chemical love. You remember that?

Yeah. Some people crave physical love. Don't drive drunk on that one? No, that's wrong. Yeah, that was a woman in red. Woman in red. Yeah. Yeah, me and my band, the foreign exchange,

we covered if she breaks your heart. Yeah, that's right. I forgot. That's from Jungle Farm. I totally, damn. All right, so if we get on the bus, did you knowing that the event, how much in advance did you have before you were like,

okay. Yeah, that's what I'm saying. Like, it was so on time. No, that we had like, really right probably two months before to shoot it I mean they came to me so let's do this film we're shooting 18 days they came to you who's they

oh I forget I'm bad with names now but they said we got this film we want to shoot it or road movie and you didn't write it no Reggie Rock wrote it okay Reggie Rock Bythwood

yeah he wrote it oh Gina and her husband okay oh I I didn't know it. Okay. Okay. So it was a road movie. I'm trying to get everything out there.

I know. We really didn't touch. Wait, where is Girl Six in the, we skipped Girl Six? We kind of did, but I just had a Teresa. I always say Randall Russell.

Randall. Teresa Randall question because she had such in Malcolm X and in Jungle Fever, like especially Jungle Feaver, like, especially Jungle Fevers. And of course, Malcolm X more, still small. But like, why her? Like, I don't know. She, I mean, it's very hard for black women.

to say that in the mic I couldn't hear you guys it's very hard for black women to sustain long careers and very talented very attractive and I don't know what happened but I mean I mean

bad boys but I mean she Father MC what? Fan body excuse me That's why he is fan body right now He's fan body yeah Jesus The story of Macah Pfeiffer, is it the story true about him taking pictures at the Walmart and bringing them to you for, yes, for she got, not, yeah, clockers, clockers, wait, I don't know this story.

Mackay's cousin. What's that story? Mackay accompanied his cousin to the audition and we asked him, do you want to audition? You're here. So he came in and he got the role. Wow. Okay Seeing you or seeing Robbie

Does she do all your I was in the room Oh okay Okay Robbie like pre-screened stuff But you know like I was in the room When I saw Mackay

Said who Because he didn't come for a dish He just came because His cousin said Like come with me Wow And look at him now So

For he got game First of all What irks you about Basketball films That I don't Fake That me the average person Wouldn't know

I'm not saying fake news, just don't look real. And here's the thing, though. Where I sit in Manswear Garden, I do not want players on the Knicks or opposing teams say, Spike, that movie is bullshit. So the last scene of Denzel and Ray playing, that was a real game. Oh, yeah. It's scripted, this famous, famous story,

it's scripted that Ray's Pose to Win 11 Zip. Denzel wasn't having No Denzel was on Fordham's JV team His coach was P.J. Carissimo Oh shit And Denzel

says he's an athlete So his thing was like Fuck what the script says I'm scoring least one basket And it'll be a moral victory And so Denzel started throwing up Some humble shit It was going in

And Ray out was shocked because this Ray's first film is what you've got to do the script says. So Ray says, Spike was up. He's not supposed to get any basket. I go like this.

What you want me to do? So after that, Ray said, fuck that. And then doesn't score another basket. But it was a moral victory. And it was better for the film too. That, that,

that, that, that, that Jake Shillisworth got those Basquez. Wow. The scripted,

Ray's Jesus Poles won 11 zip. Wow. And, and, and Ray did not know that Denzel

could play. I didn't know that Denzel could play. I didn't know that. He played a Fordham's JV team

on the DJ Carlissima. That's crazy. So how did you, I mean, just what is it as a non-sports junkie

asking you guys? Shocker alert. No, I'm not. I'm not a sports person either, so what am I missing in sports films that you see? Or you look at sports films the way that I look at music films, like, okay, his finger is not right. It's fake. It's not real.

Because Eddie looked real, real. Earl Monroe from Philadelphia. Okay. It was a basketball consultant on the film. And we just wanted, that's where we cast real players. We cast real players so we get the, you know. Now, how much patience did you have to have with your? actors who didn't have that much

experienced acting. Ray Allen. Oh, we had one of the world's greatest acting coach to Susan Batson, who was there every day with him. So, I mean, I think Ray did a great job. I thought he did a good job, too, yeah. And just that whole, again,

for me, it's more than a basketball film. For me, that's a father and son's story. I'm going to get to the end. I swear to God, I don't know. Okay, it's like seven more movies. I don't know. I've seen Summer Sam maybe at the right time. But I don't know.

It's not like, you know, it wouldn't be in my, or my Spike type of top three. But for some reason, you know, I'm picking that in my, I love that film. Yeah, I love a movie too. Why? She hate me. I like thrillers.

I wish you would do more thrillers. You know, it's just, it. Yeah, and in fact, you got Jimmy Breslin to, like, do it. Oh, that was crazy. Yeah, the beginning and the end. He's like the book. Yeah. Because Dea Berg was telling Sam, he was writing letters to Jimmy Breslin.

I mean, that's why we want him to be the book in. And, you know, he just recently passed. Got blessed us all. Great guy, great guy. So my question for Inside Man is, Was there a, not again, I don't know if there's ever pressure, but I mean, Inside Man, you made your Hollywood film. Your, you know, your opening, the opening was marvelous and all that stuff.

So for you, was it just like, okay, I want to show Hollywood that I know how to make, I'm going to play their game and, you know. Not really, because it was a great script. And it was a chance to work again with my man, Denzel Washington. And I like that genre. And we screen dog the afternoon, like numerous times by the great director Sidney Lamet. Sydney Lamette.

So it was a fun film, Russell Gorvitz, first-time screenwriter and the twist up the end. We know we would get it. get people. The funny thing about that film is that that it was critical to find

an actor would stand up to Denzel. Because most actors, you know, Denzel could run over you. How easy... Chewetel? No, Clive O'clock. Clive O'er.

And the way he does is a quiet attack, too. He was great in that movie. How easy is it to direct Denzel. Is Denzel of a... You can't tell me nothing? No, no. You let Denzel do his thing,

and then there's certain things that, you know, who listen. But, you know, he doesn't need you to say, do this, do this, this. You know, that's disrespectful. You know, you never do that. Is it?

Yes. But even though you get the final word? Well, I mean, and we've never, ever had an incident. I mean, it's like, sometimes he said, Spike, I think I got us, okay,

and sometimes I said, I need one more. cool, let's do it. But, you know, we, we've, it's always been, me and him been, been mad, mad, cool. But I want to get back to the other point is that Denzel is so powerful that he makes all the actors shrink and he's intimidating. So I knew I had to get an actor.

It was like there's not going to be afraid of Denzel. Like, Clyde was like, fuck this. I'm a man too. Like, you're not running over me. And you needed that. That happened? Yes. Well, I was just imagine that if you have the script. You kind of see it in Magnificent Seven a little bit.

Like, you can see it. But I mean, like, if you have a script and say, like, there's a scene where I have conflict with Denzel's character and I have to argue, you're saying that he's so powerful of an actor that I might. Intimidation. It's like if you're playing on stage with somebody just, a monster. Yeah. I get it. But I figured that a wiser, and I'm not judging. I'm just saying that I figured that a wise veteran actor would.

want you to shine with them or is it just like... No, because it might be that your character's role that you've got to do your thing and so if somebody to stand up against you, it's going to be like a slaughter. And that's why, because you had to have

this conflict where they were like head to head. And if someone was weak or soft... You won't believe it. You won't believe it. And that's why it was thank God we got Clive Owen

So can I ask, were you Did you know that Denzel had it in him to do Training Day? Because when I watched that shit I was like, oh God Who knew? I never knew. How come you weren't tempted to show that? Because the films I did

Didn't, that wasn't the role. I mean, you see some of that and he got game known. Yeah, yeah, he do. Yeah, but he was also at the mercy of, you know, like he was on his knee, not on his, but preferably, or he was on his knees and humbled because he was in prison and trying to broker a deal.

Yeah, but when he came out, though, he was smacking my other than look. Oh, yeah, that throat punch? That throat punch works, yo. And I'm not going to say how I know that that film punch works. I mean, statute of limitations is over. But, Amir, here's the thing, no.

But, Amir, here's the thing. I'm going to repeat this, though, is that I knew Denzel had that a train day, but what film would that that would that that that would not work than Mo Better I'm saying like yeah I mean could you come up with a vehicle that would make he's like that Detroit Red

oh come on now yeah oh yeah with the gun he was pure gangster yeah hit the upside in the great bar to just close in Harlem Linux lounge yeah Linus lounge they even took the sign down it's crazy

We won't beside the guy's hair with the bottle. Oh, he's definitely gangston. That's American gangston. That's just, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, would you. Would you ever have, do you think it's in you to come up with a fifth vehicle, fourth vehicle for you and him to work in? I'll be the fifth. Yeah, we talked about, I'm sorry, I forgot. We talk about all the time, you know, just got to, I just be the right, right, first of all, you got to get him because, man, he's, this, he's, this just, he's, he's, he's, he's, he's just stacked.

like at JFK me I mean like you got movies the next two years and shit were you really proud at the defenses I mean that was his yeah to my expert got robbed again but for him doing it from direct yeah just the product itself but I know that he also did the great debaters yeah they did great debaters yeah but as a it felt like he director yeah he was more that was like his passion project did he direct antoine fisher too or did or what did it yeah That's what you found Derek Luke. Oh, shit.

I forgot. I was it. He directed Antoine. Number three. Would it never mind. D. D.D. is the total package. All right. We can go on forever.

I'm going to try and hone the shit home. I'm going to rapid fire this. Okay, so as a musician, there are songs that I wish I had written. As a director. What songs? I really, it got really under my skin when I first heard. Alcassus Spodioli dopolicious

It's not a hit But I just wish I came up with that Well it's in the hearts of But I really wish I had my hand in that Because I've got something to say That's all I got to say Shut up Fonte

But are there Movies or projects that you Well besides Jackie Robinson and James Brown But those films that I didn't direct. Specifically one film that you wish you directed,

be it success or failure, that you wish you had your version of it. I wish he directed Ali for the record. I was directed. I interviewed for it. I didn't get the job. Wow. Who did you have to talk to?

For colored girls. We are... Stay on topic. For Malcolm A. I'm saying, Ali? Yeah. Was it Will. Who was the consecutive?

Was it Overbrook? I had to speak to Will and James Lasseter. Yikes. You know, that's interesting. Never mind, I'm not getting anybody in it. That's, yeah. Because they're both, I was just thinking that's interesting. They're both brothers.

It's Overbrook. They had to, you know, and they chose. They chose Michael Mann. Exactly. So I was just thinking that's interesting. I mean, it wasn't, I mean, it was a, I mean, the studio had to say to. So you wish that.

Ali was your... I would like to direct that phone. I would like to direct Jackie Robb from James Brown, too. I wish you had done a James Brown movie. I still think there's others to do. A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what I'm saying.

Yep, that's me. Clever Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement

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Listen to the Clifford show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. There's two golden rules that any man should live by. Rule one, never mess with a country girl. You play stupid games, you get stupid prizes. And rule two, never mess with her friends either.

We always say that trust your girlfriends. I'm Anna Sinfield, and in this new season of the girlfriends, Oh my God, this is the same man. A group of women discover they've all dated the same prolific con artist. I felt like I got hit by a truck. I thought, how could this happen to me? The cops didn't seem to care, so they take matters into their own hands. I said, oh, hell no.

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and TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. We didn't talk about your documentary work at all. Whoa. That could be a whole lot of... Yeah. We let down 15 other movies. So we won't get into it now. If you could do a director cut of any of your movies

Which one would you do? Wait, is there a four-hour Malcolm X? We knew that it was never going to be four hours But that was the first cut that we showed to Is there a version of it unscathed? Is there a four-hour cut? Somewhere out there?

The thing is Warner Brothers. You don't have a copy for yourself. You don't keep a demo, you don't keep a cassette on the Right, we were, that was the last thing we would think about then. Damn! trying to get the shit made but uh for the documentaries i mean i'm very proud of them uh the two katrina uh god willing creek don't rise and then the four little girls jesus story about four little girls so while we're in pre-production uh we found the the post

more than pictures of the four little girls and i kept praying and praying and praying should I include these photographs and find us made decision we have to show how hate looks like how the clan looks like how these murders look like how these are redneck racists look like and so we included the photographs and I did not tell the parents that we included you know they were shook were they still alive by them Some of them. Dan's parents were. And they were shook, but they understood why I did it.

And this, who we are as a people. I mean, you know, it's amazing that we as black people don't go off. Man, who fuck is you telling? I mean, we're talking about PS, what's it called? PTSD. We had that from slavery. That's still with us. That is still with us. And we're not, a lot of us aren't mentally, you know, we're not right.

Because we're still dealing with the vestiges of slavery and watching television and seen as being shot down like dogs and then cops walking away. Like nothing even happened. And, I mean, it's crazy now. Today, I know this is not going to be, this will be seen dated, but today that they passed, you know, getting rid of Obamacare. I mean, and these guys, they have no heart, no love. They're just cold blood of murderers because people are going to die

if they can't get the stuff they got through Obamacare. So what? They're poor. don't want to give a fuck. So what? They're poor. And that's why I got to give a shout to man,

Jay-Z. That album, I got to give it up. You know, I've always been a fan. But this new album, I mean, it's amazing. Have you ever worked with Jay

on anything? I did one thing for him. There was a short film called to be Jay-Z for one day. It was for his rock aware Well, other than that, that's it. Oh, man. Yeah, but did your son listen to that album?

I wonder, because I know. Yeah. Okay. Oh, yeah. My son, man, he's on it. Okay. He's hip and music shit. Because folks, you know, sometimes they say that's a little bit of an older person's album in that one.

No, but there's certain things that my wife and I town, you know, they'll ask questions. So we have to break it down to them. You know, there's something they don't know. My daughter, too, who just graduated NYU. Oh, my former intern. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. How's she doing, man?

Where'd she graduated? Yeah, mate, he's working at MTV, the new RTL show. Okay. One question I have for you was about your remakes. How do you determine what the remake? Because when you did the Sweet Blood of Jesus, which was the Gondja and Hess, that was a very odd. I mean, choice. Yeah, Spike, odd.

It's odd movie to begin with. Yeah, really odd. So how do you choose? I've never seen that very early on. When I was in film school, it was written by a really underrated black filmmaker, playwright Bill Gunn. And I saw it on a film school. And I always loved that film and thought about it. You know, how would we do that today with this whole religious, you know, impact, you know,

and then going back to Africa and stuff like that. And it's not a horror film. and I never saw Dr. Hess as a vampire, but these are people who need blood, and we usually use blood for a lot of other things. So that film was great about that film was shooting Martin's Vineyard, because I've always wanted to shoot a film at Marlon's Vine.

I never even heard of Maris Viener. One of my classmates, there's always been a large black community, In the malles vineyard up and down the East Coast, you know, professional black folks. And my friend was from Philly, John Wilson. One, we were in school, we said, you should come to Mars. I said, I have a house. My grandma's house of Marla's Vineyard.

I said, Marla's Vineyard. I went there and loved and I said, one day, Lord, if they ever get any money, I went by a brownstone in Brooklyn, season ticket to Knicks and a house. Would you consider doing the Kickstarter route again? Like, for that? No, that was only. Quit stealing all my questions, man. That was, I can't do that again.

But what people might not know, we were using the strategy of Kickstarter. As marketing. To make them, no, no, to make, she's going to have it. Right. I mean. You invented Kickstarter. You know, so we just didn't have the technology. And so it's always been my thing, like, you got to, you got to, whatever you got to do, you know,

show of killing somebody. and going to jail and still be honest, you got to do what we got to do to get the films made because this is an industry, the art form where you need money. And now with the technology,

people making films with their iPhones. Yeah. You and Tyler Perry or maybe Tyler Perry had beef with you. He had words for you. And he was very vocal at one time saying,

well, if you think my movies are bad, You know, why don't you try to help me or whatever. What would you say as a director, in director speak, what could make his movies better? Me and Tyler Perry are cool. All that stuff has been squashed like four or five years ago. So, I mean, it's, it's really, you know, nothing to dig up. You know, we're cool. Okay.

He's doing a thing. You know, we got love for each other. And, you know, we, I flew down Atlanta. I said, yo, we got to speak. got in the plane Delta went to his house we sat down

we talked you know we said well whatever we discussed we'll just keep between us and say well cool and that was and that's what happened

I wish you could have that conversation before colored for colored girls but that's fine that's good and I'm glad you're talking about you know I

I wish I can't wait for the day where he's just producer and not star I actually liked him as an actor. I liked him as an actor and

a girl, baby girl. Oh, yeah, when he was the lawyer. Oh, when he played like the man. Gone girl. Yeah, but I just had to sit through the trailer for Boo, two, so, boom. Boo, too. Oh, they're doing two?

There's a second one? Yeah. What is it? Boo, too. Boot too. Bia Halloween. Oh, man. Lord.

Hold it back, Spike. Is your friends? They're doing Halloween? They're doing trailers for Halloween films already? I saw it when I went to a New Girl's trip. It's July 1. Yo, Black Panther don't come out until next year. Black History Month.

That's when it comes out? Shut up. That's going to be lit. So, well, yeah, I'm just saying that I can't wait for the, where he's just producer and that he finds, and he's just the, you know, Arthur or the curator of other talent to come in and. Precious. A studio head. Speaking of which, okay.

a studio, basically, to Redstone the shit. Did you and Eddie Murphy ever have a kumbaya conversation moment? Just never found the project. Wait, what?

No, he just never found. Oh, never found some of the work together. Because I know he was excited. I know Chris Rock told, when he was on the show, he spoke of Eddie Murphy and all of them coming to see

She's got to have it. She's got to have it and, you know, having a screening of it. But just during that period, like, did you guys ever, did he ever try to invite you to be in the black pack and that sort of thing? Oh, funny story. During due the right thing, halfway through he said, Spike, I want to give you guys a party. That's when he lived in that. What was it called? Bubble Hill.

Bubble Hill. We tour his house up. We put these clothes out. my floor. His toilet was broken. Oh, shit. I left when people started jumping in the pool naked. I said I got to get out of him.

Do the younger guys, the young cats come up like with Ava, she, you know, Ava Dubeenay and like Ryan Cougal, do they chop it up with you? Did they come to you for advice or game or whatever? My man did when he was doing Rocky. He came to my office, NYU. But here's the thing, though. You know, like, look, people have my number, so people want to speak.

I'm available. So it's not like I'm trying to, you know, whole around the shit. Like, what about with your cousin Malcolm? Yeah, I mean. By the way, congratulations. Yeah. Yeah, girls' trip.

That's universal deal and girls' trip. Yeah. Big shout out to my. First cousin Malcolm Lee, my father, his father, brothers, and he's doing this thing, doing that thing. What's the age gap between you two? Like, were you guys? When I was in, in fact, when I was in NYU,

I was living in his basement. Oh, wow. In Crown Heights. So Malcolm was in high school when I was in grad film. Were you the reason why he got in the film? That's what he said. That's what he says. Okay, I can take that.

I mean, his cousin was a big movie director, so it was an influence. Okay. But, you know, he's done it on his own, you know, so power to him, you know, happy for him. That's what's the last couple of projects that you saw? You was like, I'm appreciating this voice. Well, my two films I saw last year, I'm not your Negro, Roebuck. and OJ in America.

Oh, man. Those are my joints. I mean, those were monumental. Did you see Get Out? You loved it too, but I loved it. But for me, I just, those two films I mentioned before, I'm Not Your Negro and O.J. in America. Did you see Moonlight?

Yeah. What was your take on it? Like the two, but my two favorite was it. Those were the ones. I mean, just my preferral. You know what I'm my preference I'm not sure Negro need to view So yes

Yeah I saw that I actually saw that one time I was up here we were taping Yeah I'm just always curious to hear Just what you know the movies that we like As consumers but you as a director Like what you see in it You know the new joint though is Dunkirk

Is it like that? Is it? Is it? Yeah you gotta go Christopher Nolan is no joke So I wasn't big on interstellar But I heard Dunkirk is like that

Do we need to do the 70 millimeter? Yeah, you got to see the IMAX. Okay. 68th and Broadway. Okay. Seven million. Oh, that shit. I mean, I heard they earned their 93 Rotten Tomatoes.

That shit is... Look, Christopher Nolan is a serious director. I mean, he's dope. And there's hardly any dialogue in it, too. Oh, what? And no blue screens. All that shit's real. Oh, see.

No green screens. Wow. Okay. I'm going to take... Yeah, I'm letting y'all perch. All right. Because I'm getting the last question on this show. How can I see the entire last hustle in Brooklyn,

aside from just the clip in the off-the-wall documentary? One day, I'm going to have to go back, do color correction, pick up the sound. But the thing about that music was never cleared, you know, it was all disco music. She's got to have it. The Netflix series. When is that dropping?

Thanksgiving Day. All 10 episodes. Family viewing. Black Excellence binge day We will do that We guess Yo DeWanda Miller I recently fell in love with her

Underground shots fired I don't even know the sequence of the casting if you were third or whatever But why her We were after that Okay okay So what made you decide she was no Dope

Yeah she's like Dope You know who's gonna be You know who's gonna surprise people in this Who? Fat Joe Oh, word. Joe.

Wow. Fat Joe. I'm telling you. Let's here for Joe. I'm all the way up. His character's called Winnie Win. And he plays the MC owner of a burles club called a Hot and Trot. Wow.

Fat joke. How many episodes? Ten. I directed them all. Is it hour? Half hour. Half hour. Half hour.

Okay. Thanksgiving Day. Netflix. Can you give us like the premise or like what's the kind of? Well, it's really an updating of the original film, but now it takes in a gentified Ford Green. Gentified Ford Green. So is there a Mars Blackman and the Nola Darling?

Yes. Mars Blackman is now Black in Puerto Rican. It's played by the great triple threat Anthony Ramos from... You used to have a ponytail. From Hamilton. Yeah, I was going to say, Anthony Ramos. Oh, from Blackish. Is this the same good?

No, no, not. Hamilton. Hamilton. I know the dude from Hamilton is on black as y'all catch you. That's your boy. One day I'll take you. Oh, never been to see Hamilton, sir. I'm not that rich.

I'm so sorry. You know the producer of it. I was told not to ask for tickets. He played Hamilton's yet Hamilton's son. When did I ever stop you all before? Y'all know me for 20 years. So, I see Faye Laugh. Large black is now Afa Buiqua.

Black in Puerto Rico. Wow. Fonte? Oh, well, this is last one. Red Hook Summer Nola Darling's I was like sad to see I was like damn like she really

just is the church lady that's like that's real life Ah So that was based on a real character Or That's Tracy Camilla John's real life now Yes She's a Pentecoster preacher

Fannie Oh wow Wow Wow She see her picture on it Yeah So she What do you say

No she's No, she looked. She changed her life. So she left movies and... Found the Lord. Wow. Where did he go? The only reason I've consented to do this is because I wish to clear my name.

Wow. That's in it. We brought that back. Oh, so Tracy, he's in the... She has a cameo. Okay, that's dope. Bill, anything you got left? I think I'm...

Oh. Miracle of St. Anna? You got any questions about... Okay, I want to go back to 25th hour with the nightclub scene with Bra. Yeah, do. Did you choose the song? I choose all the music in my mind. Did you choose it before you shot it?

Or did it come afterwards? No, Bra's one of those songs where I knew. You knew it? Okay. Because I have to use it somewhere. Like that was just so, it was so perfect. Who was on the cipher, right? Was it the D.

Oh, Cipher Sound? Yeah, yeah, yeah. He was mixing that. Like that's comedian. extraordinary. That's what I've heard. Yeah. He's a career

and the comedy world. And Rosario was dancing that. She was mad at me. Yes, she was. No, we weren't. We was happy. Spike, how much long

we gotta keep fucking dancing? Fuck you, Spike. Okay, I'm done. I have no more questions. But the first first time I saw Rosario was when I filmed kids. Yeah.

Yeah. Same here. Yes. It's like sweet. I was salty partner. So. she hate me. I'm going to start by saying

thank you for Carrie Washington and Diana Ramirez. I too enjoyed that that situation. We all did. Anthony Mackey. Anthony Mackey. Yes. Any regrets? I always thought it was interesting that so many lesbians wanted to have sex with one man. It was

lesbians. She feels like it was your Midlife Crisis film and that was your Porsche. That is That's true Instead of an affair Yeah

Let me just make a movie That is exactly how I feel I don't know if it was proper to say that Maybe make a movie like stuff I got to admit Like that's when I was like Oh damn Carrie What's it happened for?

Like that was not Carrie Washington From Save the Last Dance Not at all So That It was a film we wanted to do at a time What people think What I really liked about that film

Was where we had the Chewytale character Yes, that's right. He was in it. Was he the guard? He was the guard. Yeah, yeah. That's awesome.

Frank Wills. Here's a thing, though. If you watch CNN with this whole stuff happened with the White House, all these guys are half dead. They're talking about Watergate, John Dean, all these motherfuckers. They never talk about Frank Wells.

It was this guy, this brother. If he didn't catch those crooks, the whole warding thing would never happen. He paid the price for me. He's dead. He died painless and every time they talk about Wardigate, they never mention his brother, Frank Wells. But look, I'm not ashamed.

Here's the thing, though, I say this all the time. All the films I've done, the only thing I ever regret. Don't answer that because that needs to. Let me finish. Let me finish. The only thing I ever regret was the rape scene. And she's got to have it. Okay.

Because that was immature and made light of such a horrible act that one can do another human being. That is the only thing I regret. That's interesting because I remember, we watched that in a class in college. And I remember we watched it. And it was a mixed crowd. It was men and women. and the teacher our professor came up and she was like

after we were discussing she's like so what do you think about the rape scene and like half the class was like huh like that was a rape? That was a rape right? Yeah like it's just odd just I mean to hear you say that you regret it like because I didn't read it that way. Did you read? No, I was trying to think I was like I can't even remember it to be.

When I first saw the 18 I just thought it was in passion love scene right right and then when I started reading more and stuff then I realized like oh that's supposed to be a rape scene. Yeah. I read the screenplay first before I saw the movie. And so I knew. You went in here. You got the apple.

So there's no regrets about she'd hate them. None whatsoever. None whatsoever. What about like specific shots? Are there specific shots you wish you could shoot over? You guys are kind of stepping in my time. Wait, can I just ask my final question? Ask it.

Steve, do you have anything? Oh. Yes, Mr. Lee. What can I as a white person to help you to help you make your films? Nothing. And I'm the end, Quest I'm Supreme right there. That was one of Malcolm's regrets

that he told that the white co-ed student that. I watched your extras He regret he told her nothing That is the one your extras I didn't see the extras What did he wish he would have said Go back and talk to your people

And enlighten him Yeah there you go Steve Learn Yeah I told her white girlfriend Who's starting to date black dudes You can't do that if you ain't seen No Spike Lee movies That's the way I'm

Contributing You can see the collective I roll in this room Right now All right so Spike Spike Like, thriller, yes or no? Are you going to...

It's not up to me. It's up to the estate. Was the estate happy with bad? They loved it very much. Was the state happy with off the wall? Yes. So... You got to wait for...

Have you had a conversation yet or it hasn't come up yet? Well, we had conversations, but they're not... I don't think they've got other stuff they're doing before. for, uh, they get to thriller. What's the question? I'm sorry. What's up for grads here? What's, what else is in Michael Jackson's arsenal that is coming out on film?

If you listen to me, I'm, I got some TV shows, stuff like that. Oh, okay. Nice. I'm asking Spike Lee if he's going to direct the thriller documentary. Okay. I want to because I would, if I was able to, if I was blessed to get to do, trilogy I'm done because I mean to do to do thrilled that'd be a trilogy for me trilogy I'm done let's someone else do dangerous John singles let's someone else pass I'll be happy to pass the baton

on but I'm dangerous as a new jack classic in my eyes no I mean I'm just saying that would be the only one that would be John Swilton to do it because he did the video for a member of the time okay yeah John singles he'd do that actually yeah it's actually three part um okay This is kind of my rapid fire. Okay. Oh. Oh. Yeah.

No. No. I'm just running. Can you name me three directors that came under the leaves of your tree or on your family tree that you've enjoyed their work? Three African-American directors that you've. Malcolm Lee. Mm-hmm. Ernest Dickerson.

Mm-hmm. D. Rees. Ah, she did Pariah. Yeah, she was my student at NYU. Those three. Now, three acting students or three first-timers that didn't have any history in films that have now blossomed into actors.

Like, who's your starting three squad? Like, the three students that you're proud of in the acting world. I didn't teach actors. Well, not acting, but, you know, that you've... That you gave you their first film? Yes. That are now like, hey.

Like a Hallie Berry. I was first. You're going to say, John, that wasn't. I mean, Hallie Berry, Rosie. Jummel Otheevo's Queen Lativa's first film. Ah. That's right. She wasn't.

Yeah, she was the waitress. Yeah. That's just the black and catfish. You remember that line. All the sisters were over and that team. So those three, you're the proudest of that they've, okay. Now, the same question but for crew, because I know that besides Ernest Dickerson, Malik Saeed.

I can't imagine all the cementographers and lighting and editors. Malik started as electric on Malcolm X, and now one of the best DPs, Ellen Curis, who shot Somersam, full of girls, bamboozled, my newest D.P. A gentleman named Daniel Patterson, a more house man also, was my student in YU

who shot up all the episodes for She's got to have it. Who? Side question. Yes, I even have side questions to my final question. No one's surprised.

Who's been your longest ally employee that's been with you since, has there been someone that's been there since the beginning? like your editor or your costume designer or your craft services right i mean there's people that i work with but there has been like every single film so you know a lot of times when i'm shooting

some they have another film so uh okay what what three actors have you yet to work with that you were like i want Sean Penn is one wow damn i could you have work together uh See, I could have seen Sean Penn in 25th hour as well. Sean Penn. You'd never work with De Niro. No, never. You know who's... Will you ever work with De Niro?

Hopefully. Okay. You know whose potential be a great actress, Solange. Oh, wow. Wow. I think so. I see that. I see that.

Whether she wants to act and that's another thing. But I think that she is a great... Sean Pins and Sala Lines. Great potential. Morgan Freeman ain't getting on. Morgan Freeman. I was just nothing against Morgan Freeman's great actor. It's just funny because I was like, who has he not been around for him?

No, but you haven't worked with Morgan Freeman. Nope. We, that did not happen. But I don't think it's required that you work with a. Shut up, Steve. I'm just saying he was in that movie. He just had to be a black actor or actress. No, that was just a random legendary black actor that's, I was like, oh, that's,

the one that he works a lot but you said that I mean you know I liked the I was too young but I wish I could have worked with Paul Newman that film uh cool hand Luke is a mother yeah yeah yeah that's

you see that uh yeah yeah I've seen Coohan Luke not in phone check it out yeah he was talking Steve he was oh I'm sorry did you ask that because it was a white film I didn't he was on his head

I like Paul Newman. My head is... That was the one with he ate like the 40 eggs, right? Yeah, yeah. Okay, so I don't know if directors can divide their scenes like their songs from an album, whatever. But in your arsenal, what do you feel are your three most important scenes?

Okay. Your three most important scenes like... I'm happy more than three. You got to give me three. Gunsy hit, three. I'm burning. all your other rules. Yeah, didn't we know.

His house is burning. Shut up, Steve. I would say Mookie thrown a garbage can through the window. Absolutely. Assassination, Malcolm X. Okay.

And that scene in 25th hour when Edward Norton was talking into the mirror. Oh, okay. Tricky. I thought the I could swear to your number

number one would have been the Taj Mahal scene. Oh, oh, yeah. Living from the city. You said only three, though. Okay. But the fact that that wasn't even your... I got it, I mean. Okay.

No, I'll take those three. Again, the expanded version. That was your songs. The three albums... The three films that when you're gone... Of mine? If we look at your canon, what are the three films that you want

representing your work? Wow. For me, that's, that's, it ain't nothing, I get it. It's like picking kids, right? Pick your three favorite kids. You have 26 of them. Well, here's the thing, though.

You say you love all your children the same, but you might not like them. Right. And that's like that color of darkness. But I would just say, I've done so many films that I leave it up to I'm telling you I can't pick three

Gun to your head man I can't pick three Gun to your head House on fire I can't pick three Universal House Burning all the reals You can't pick three

Okay I'm asked the opposite I'm asked the opposite You got to kill three You got to kill three What three films Do you kind of wish What three films do you kind of wish

I'm cool if nobody sees that as I said before the only thing I wish I could do over is a rape scene and she's got to have it because everything I've done

for good or bad is the experience that helps me for what the next film is so that's the way is is learning how to hone your skills

you know good bad and different every time out you learn something new different circumstances and if you're smart the lessons that you learn you apply that

to the next film he's not gonna answer your question what is the most overlooked Spike Lee film in your opinion I got a lot of those like the one you think that most people

really should see or see again well I don't think people saw Miracle St. I was going to say, yeah. Oh, man, really? I don't think people saw Bambusal.

Here's what they know. I lived it. There's two categories. How many people did see it when it came out? Right, right, right. Versus people discover it, you know, later on. So bamboozle goes in that character where people discovered it. Discovered it.

Miracle of St. Anna. What was... It was a novel. Oh, so it was based on an album. A novel by James McBride. I almost entered the... Who wrote the color of water. Almost answered the casting call for extras for that movie.

Oh, for real? I had a homie that was in that. He was one of the extras in that. Did he go overseas? Yeah. Theric. No, Theron. Oh, he ain't going to remember the name.

Sure. I know that he would remember it. Okay. But, uh, there's a name called Thirik. Therriq. Therran. Theron. Something.

I can't, I don't want to. It's embarrassing. You called him your friends. We got them tea. I mean, we had to cast these guys to play the Buffalo soldiers. But none of them had passports. Because we had to go to Italy. It's like scrambling.

You know, to get the passports. That's why I didn't. Trust me. Single black girls are all about it. It's at the top of our list now for requirements.

He must have a passport. I got it now. Yeah, he was telling me that was real. He was like, yo, like, he's like, man, we had the cannons was going off. And he was like, it was real. Like, there was really, like, in combat.

And he said for, like, when he came back, it took, like, he kind of had PTSD after the shoot. Like, it was like, he was be going to sleep and he couldn't, you know, he'd still be hearing the shit going off. It was crazy. Yeah. Okay. This is my final.

My final, final Final question This two-part Spikely episode Absolutely It might No, first of all I appreciate you for doing this spike No, thank you

This has been fucking amazing man All low He bought macarones for you So that's a good Well, I brought it for everybody But y'all didn't appreciate the shit Because we black Because we were too busy talking

And bad people don't eat Really macaroons You want that on the air You know? I'm gonna say it. Five million people don't have Don't offer no black person on Macomb. Edit. Okay.

Anyway, Spike. There's a game that we play on the show. Yes. Which one? This is your final question of... This is exciting. What is it on beat? Right.

Not ready. Spike. And this is like... Four million dollars. Can you please tell me what's the original sample of this song? Oh, God. No, it's an inside joke. Ladies and gentlemen, thank you, Spike Lee, for coming on.

Questlove Supreme. On behalf, Frang Tigolo, Sugarsteeve, Boss Bill, Unpaid Bill, and Laiaia. This is Questlove, signing off. Spike Lee, thank you so much for answering all my questions. Thank you, thank you very much. It's a little girl from Brooklyn, a doctor now? Sorry, that was my last. Okay, I'm sorry.

You just had to have the last words. Teacher. He's a teacher, okay, thank you. Sorry. Anyway Tell DeHarras Yes Yes

Yes Anyway Until next week Y'all If we're still here Yes And macaroons for everybody Don't listen to lie here

This is Questlove signing off Only on Pandora This is Questlove Supreme See y'all next to go around Thank you Yo yo yo yo

I'm gone with the win Because it is Survival of the fittest When the shit hits the fan I got my shank in my hand Black man With the permanent tan I come from the villa

Never ran Damn I'm feeling the other part of Hit me when I represent the FAP Straight from the bill till didn't play the building I mean literally when I say y'all make a killing For my cipher see I'm finning the buster pipe Original heads represent the Brooklyn all night

You or die I'm saying is you or not Bring your click So we can get stone like family sly B to C in the bush Fighting the team Rock in the Rock in the Rock, giving the bush Questlove Supreme is a production of I Heart Radio This classic episode was produced by the team at Pandora.

For more podcasts from IHeartRadio, visit the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what I'm saying. Yep, that's me,

Clifford Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, my basketball and college football journey, or my career in sports media. Well, now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, the Cliver Show. This is a place for raw, unfilled conversations with athletes,

creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. So let's get to it. Listen to the Clifford Show on the IHeard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok podcast network on TikTok. This week on the Sports Slice podcast, it's all about the NFL draft. And we've got a special guest. The director of the NFL's East West Shrine Bowl, Eric Galco, joins the Sports Slice podcast to break down what really matters when evaluating draft prospects.

from hidden traits teams look for to the biggest mistakes franchises make to the players flying under the radar. This is the insight you won't hear anywhere else. If you want to understand the draft like an insider, you don't want to miss this episode. Listen to the Sports Slice Podcast on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,

or wherever you get your podcast. And for more, follow Timbo Slice of Life 12 and TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. I'm Daniel Alarcon, and this is my friend. He's much more famous than I am. I wouldn't go that far, but I'm John Green, co-host of the podcast The Away End with my old friend Daniel. On our podcast, The Away End, we'll share with you the magic of international football, all leading up to the 2026 World Cup.

Together, we'll find out why, of all the unimportant things, football, soccer, is the most important. Listen to The Away End with Daniel Auerkone and John Green on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an IHeart podcast. Guaranteed human