The Questlove Show - QLS Classic: Tessa Thompson

Episode Date: October 20, 2025

Star of Sorry to Bother You and Creed holds court about falling into acting, social activism, potato salad, Philly cheesesteaks and goat love.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-heart podcast. Guaranteed Human. 2%. That's the number of people who take the stairs when there is also an escalator available. I'm Michael Easter. And on my podcast, 2%. I break down the science of mental toughness, fitness, and building resilience in our strange, modern world. Put yourself through some hardships, and you will come out on the other side a happier, more fulfilled, healthier person.

Listen to 2%. That's TWO percent on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what I'm saying. Yep, that's me, Clifford Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, my basketball and college football journey, or my career in sports media. Well, now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifers Show.

This is a place for raw, unfilled conversations with athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. So let's get to it. Listen to the Clifford show on the IHeard radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. On the Look Back at it podcast.

From 1979, that was a big moment for me. 84's big to me. I'm Sam Jay. And I'm Alex English. Each episode, we pick a year, unpack what went down, and try to make sense of how we survived it. With our friends, fellow comedians, and favorite authors.

Like Mark Lamont Hill on the 80s. 84 was a wild year. I don't think there's a more important year for black people. Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. When a group of women discover they've all dated the same prolific con artist, they take matters into their own hands. I vowed. I will be his last target. He is not going to get away with this. He's going to get what he deserves. We always say that trust your girlfriends. Listen to the girlfriends.

Trust me, babe, on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. West Love Supreme is a production of IHeart Radio. This classic episode was produced by the team at Pandora. Yo, yo, what up? This is Fontegolo with this week's QLS Classic. This week, we go back to June 27, 2018, with our guest, Tessa Thompson.

Best known for her work and sorry to bother you and creed, Tessa Hale court about falling into acting, social activism, tater salad, Philly cheese steaks, and goat love. I don't know what goat love is. That sounds very Caucasian. I'm going to have to check it out and find out what that is. But anyway, this is QLS episode number 90. Enjoy y'all.

Oh, shit. You better deliver it. I'm too sleepy to be writing it right now. No excuses. Let's do it. Suprema. Suprema Ro. Supremea, Subima, Supraima,

Rolecar, Supremma, Supremia, Roca Supreme, Supreme Role Call. Tristan Thompson needs raincoats, yeah. Keenan Thompson's got jokes. Yeah. Amir Thompson's a showboat. Yeah.

Tessa Thompson's is a go. Roll call. Suprema, Supraima, Supraima, Role call. Okay. Suprema, Supraima, Roca. My name is Sugar.

Yeah. I was high on weed. Yeah. When I recorded the seed. Yeah. And when I saw Creed. Roll call. Suprema.

Sra. Sra. Srema, Srema, Srema, Srema, Srema, Srema, Rold Ciprema, Roll Call. Dear white people. Yeah. Please use seasoning. Yeah. Sincorly yours.

Yeah. Boss B. Roll call. So prima. Sra. Sraima. Roca. Supremea.

Srema. Submma Role call. Yes, I am. Now y'all know I'm excited. Yeah. Tessa Thompson? Yeah. All my sisters invited.

Roe con. She's saying. She's saying. Her. Suprema. Suprema. Suprema. My name is Tessa.

Yeah. What did you do? Steve. Really, Steve? Steve. She's such an asshole. El Cal. Suprema.

My God. Suprema. My God. Suprema. Really. She seems. So Steve's an asshole. Ashole.

Suprema. Suprema. Suprema. Supriva. Really? You're an asshole. It's ruined. Dear White, Steve.

I was trying to help. It's ruined. Dear White, Steve. Go ahead, Tesson. Dear White, Steve, can I have the microphone, please? Thank you. I'm reclaiming my time. My intro.

We can't punch in. No, we can. No, no. You can't punch in inspiration. You can punch him in the face. See, oh, you like, three more dear white people. and then we y'all even. Oh, wait.

Who made the rule up that we can't have a do-over? You. Oh, yeah, you do. Well, then it kind of loses the spontaneity if we- Yeah. You want to hear it though, right? I mean, I was curious to see how fast you, because the thing is, whoever,

my determination on how good the interview is going to go. No. No, is based on how fast you are on your feet with the roll call. roll call. Like Leon Silver is not answering questions. It was like, oh, this is going to be a hard interview. Actually, it wasn't, but you know, I'm just saying that. Yeah, but now we can't do it, do over now that you

even applied more pressure on to what it was going to be. It was going to be this spontaneous thing. Supreme. No, no, no, no, this is fucked up. No, no. No, no. No. My name is Tesla. Yeah. I live in the moment. Yeah. I'm here to say

Yeah. What I mean? I'm gonna. We got it. We got it. Ciao. No, not see, Steve. Never ever interrupt a guest.

Bad key. Steve, but what were you? That was an accident or what happened, Steve? Well, you hesitated, and I thought you were frozen. So I tried to give you the first line. Oh, okay. He was trying to man, man, splint your roll call.

I thought it was like, line. No, definitely not. But never in the history of the rest of supreme. Okay. because Steve done through us all. Anyway, ladies and gentlemen, welcome to Questlove Supreme and alternative reality. This is Questlove and we're team Supreme, Boss Bill,

it's Laia, Sugar Steve, shout out to Fontigolo and his countertop and unpaid bill somewhere on Sesame Street. But we're strong today. Our guest today is the star of stage and the small and big screen. Her credits include Creed from the Rocky franchise,

Dear Right People, Selma, Dear Right People. Yeah, I'm sorry. Do you want to try that again? No. Do you want to punch that? There's no do-over. No, Selma, Annihilation, Thor for colored girls.

And this summer she stars as Detroit and the critically acclaimed, already so much acclaim about this film. It's not even coming out to July. And they critically claim Boots Riley directorial debut and the science surrealist comedy sorry to bother you. She's also been present behind the camera

as well as a part of the Time's Up movement, slowly helping to redirect the course for women and people of color to greener pastors and speaking of which, speaking of pastors,

rumor has that she's also a goat. We would like to welcome the world's finest goat. Enthusiast? Yes. Tessa Thompson. Wait,

I got to ask. How did that whole Tessa the Goat thing come up? Tessa is Goat. So, yeah, that's a Twitter handle. I expressed that I liked goats, I guess, on some public platform. I really wish Zara was here now. And somebody started taking photographs of me and putting them next to photographs of goats that look that are dressed like I'm dressed or pose like I'm posed. And it's pretty impressive.

It's kind of scary, though. Go to Tessa as a goat because the yellow dress one? I mean, it's dead on sometimes. I think they made the outfit and then put the goat in that yellow dress and had it in the same facial expressions. Right. And then there's some people, some conspiracy theorists or some people that don't believe in just good things that think that I'm behind this account.

And I just want to say that I'm not, I have nothing to do with it. I know you're not. Okay, that's the one thing in stalking you. Yeah, like, 2,000 followers. Yeah, I went through every, every comment, everything. And I was like, okay, this is not her. It's not me. I understand.

I wish it was. I wish I was that. You drink goat milk and eat goat milk? I don't. I'm not into goat products. I'm just into goats. I got it. Save them.

I see. I really wish that. I'm sorry. Zara was here right. You're on the account right now? Yeah, you see the yellow dress? It's great, right? Oh, my God, yeah.

Yeah. Like, that's the point where I was like, wait a minute, Tessa. And then, no, no. And then some people were tweeting, like, at Desa Thompson is such a good sport. like there's this idea that I also look like a go and I'm embracing the fact but and that I'm cool with that too like my eyes are white set apart like it's fine that's funny okay let's start the interview stop I just wanted to know about the account um yeah welcome to this show I guess today you're doing like a bunch of press junkets and things because you're immaculately dressed yeah and all the

years I've known you I was like wow I've never seen this is the bet you're saying now You've never seen you look like you do when you're on television. I've never, no, I mean, you know, like I've never seen you look like you look on TV. That's what I said. She looks press junk as chic today. Yeah. She got some shit to do. Yeah, some people help me.

Who's your stylist? These guys named Micah and Weymann. They're dope. They're friends. They like were competitors, sort of. And then they were like, let's just work together. How does a starlet find the perfect style? I was always wondering about it.

I mean, that's what you, you are now. they actually kind of stalked me. They asked if I wasn't working with anyone. See, this is what you're talking about. I didn't have my proverbial clothing shit together. No, I was just like, I would just show up

like, I'll just wear this. And then they were like, you need help. Not for my life, but they dressed me for when I appear in public spaces. I meant for the Met Gallo. Yeah, they dressed me for the Meggallel. And Tom Brown, they made that dress for me. How does, okay, I was going to say

how does that work? like does a designer come to you first? Like what is the, what is the, uh, kind of the protocol for? For how? Because the Meggal is such a cool kids.

thing. Um, that the rest of the world kind of watches like through the window like, oh, what's going? But how does one, do you have to know anyone to or? There are like tears of coolness even there.

Like you're, at least for me. So when you were there, you just like watching the coolness. Okay. A little bit. But I was there. But I was there.

Yeah, because even I've reposted the picture, I think Lena, Lena Waite posted the picture of your whole crew. And it's funny because I reposted the picture. It was you. It was Janelle. It was Lena. It was,

I'm about to say, Black Panther and his sister. It was Chad. It was Latitia. It was a beautiful crowd of people. And I put it under the picture, I was like, you know, this is the photo that the press won't send out,

but this is the one that you wanted to be. Yeah, the black excellence photo. I know. Well, I think it might have been, I mean, this is my first. year, but it seems like it's probably the blackest met that there has ever been. And how that picture happened is there were a couple of us just already in the hallway. And we were like, someone started taking a picture of us. And we're like, we want this picture. So everyone

black, after dinner, meet in the hallway. And then it got just like loud and fun. And then Francis McDormon came. And then she realized everyone was black. So she was like, maybe I should leave. And then Lena Waite was like, no, you're an ally. Like, get in, sis. You're cool. but it was a young black and gifted experience it was cool it was cool because you're right in the sense of like from the rest of the world's perception there's this thing of like it's the cool kids

it feels like it's also just like who's in the zeitgeist at that moment and who's in the cultural conversation and so it felt good to look around at that hallway and be like folks that are in the conversation and like moving and shaking are all these really rad black people people of color

based on what I saw on Instagram you guys even though y'all would sort of be the perceived outcast i.e. not the Kardashians not Rihanna not J.Lo and you know like the typical

Blake lively or whatever but y'all seem way cooler and based on you know the comments like that seemed like the coolest met Galliball. Someone put up like the first year compared to

last year and it was just like it was no comparison that it was like that but um anyway yeah it's a i guess it's a good time all right so where were you born los angeles okay what part a hollywood well glendell technically was where i lived when i was little and then Hollywood and then moved to the west side to get to a better school district glendell would be world famous roller skating rink yeah yeah that's the uh what's the world on wheels Every Hollywood roll bounce, like any time that you've seen roller skating in a video or in Hollywood. It happens at that place. Faith Evans video.

I was about to say Faith Evans, yeah. Disorderlies? Roll bounce? Seriously. Roll bounce was done there. Disorderlies with Donnie Simpson as the roller skating DJ? I don't know, but yes. True story, I crashed Snoop Dogg's birthday party there once.

Oh, wow. Really? Mm-hmm. Was not an invited guest. You got in. Did you know that it was happening? Yeah, I heard it was happening. And I was in another bar with my friend, Shelby, and I was like, let's go.

We're just going to shoot our shot and get in there. You seem like the type of person that knows that if you do something with confidence, it just happens. You can get away with murder. I also had, this is the thing. I was like 17 or, yeah, 17 or I was not 21 yet and I had a fake ID and I was out in Hollywood. Oh, the death row years. Dangerous Snoop years.

Exactly. Not Uncle Snoop years. Okay, listen. So I was walking with two girlfriends from my. and Snoop Dog was going in the back door of a Hollywood club and he had like 26 people with him. And he was like, yo, yo, and told us to come. And I was like, it's Snoop.

Like, we got to go. And we didn't go because we were like, do we go? Do we not go? So I was like, it's happening now. I'm going to go to your party. I want him. I didn't really meet him. I just like rolled around.

It was really fun. But that's your first. You look scared to me. Because like, death row era Snoop is way. No, but he's now, no, I didn't go then. I went to his birthday party and I think that was like he was Snoop Lion then, so we're fine. Oh, yeah, Snoop Lion is.

Yeah. Oh, that's, that's kindler, gentler Snoop. Yeah, kind of. Wait, how long has he been Snoop Lion? That was like for a year. He's not anymore, so. Oh, he was. Snoop Lion like, what, 2007?

No, it's like 2012. Oh. He don't matter. He's not. He's not mad. He's, he's got to be. Yeah. So in Glendale.

Well, I'm going to try and act like I don't know your history already, but for our listeners. Yeah, because I don't know shit, please. I don't know anything. Yeah, well, I was still mind-blown that your father's chocolate genius. Yeah. How's he doing, by the, he's really good. Okay. He's really good.

He moved to New York when I was, my folks went together. He moved to New York when I was like seven or eight. And so I would come here all the time. By coastal? Yeah, it was by coastal. So he came here for a while because he'd just signed a record deal. And he was like, supposed to be here for. music and then he just fell in love with the city and eventually fell in love and had my

little brother and my little sister so I grew up between here and Brooklyn and my folks were in Fort Green for like 15 years your father being Mark Anthony Thompson chocolate genius yeah I was gonna say tell me something about his music like how would people remember chocolate geniuses to be uh huh he was part of a black renaissance like in the early aughts yeah and I think made work like he has one record called black music and I mean he's sort of a musician that's hard to categorize and I think so often, particularly for like black musicians, they want to

box you into the space like you're in R&B artists and that maybe isn't you. So he kind of wanted to talk about that. He likened him to like a early Martin Luther, Cody Chestnut, somebody who is kind of like out the box. In the early odds there was Saul Williams

Martin Luther, Cody Chestnut. Chocolate Genius. At some point I mean, even I guess Rassan was sort of He was still making stuff in the late 90s early ought so He was in that circle

I mean it wasn't an official circle But sort of like the The alternative Alternative black like there was left to center of black Yeah Of Niels and there was even the left to center to that So what is that like being growing up being the daughter of a left left left left left left artist Did you you guys ever

listened to Lightspeed Champion who was like the before Blood Orange Yeah My dad like sort of Occupied that space before Other people were occupying that space In terms of not just like

Sonically the sound but also Chocolate Genius was this creation So yeah Dad was a pioneer in ways Yeah kind of I think I don't know I think that He would say something different probably But I don't know

It was cool because it meant Like being in New York, I was, you know, like, especially Fort Green at that time. I mean, it's still cool, but it just felt so rich. It was before sort of like, before gentrification. So, you know, we'd be outside on our stooping, like, well, Steph would walk by or, like, Rosie Perez or, you know, Spike Lee or it just, and I would go, you know, with my dad to the public theater and, like, see plays. and it just, you know, I was like 16 at the time, so it just felt like, well, I want to be a part of this world of people making things. It's such a difference in the culture from Glendale to Fort Green, right?

Yeah, wildly so. So at the time when you're witnessing this, were you yourself thinking about a career in music or anywhere in the arts? Like, what was your talent as a kid or a teenager? I always acted in school, but I didn't think. about it as a career. I always thought that I would, I don't know, that I would like be a teacher or be a lawyer or going to politics. I don't know. I felt like I wanted to make a contribution in some way. And maybe because of my proximity to being around artists, I just felt like, I don't know.

Is this possible for me? Is this something that I could do or will do? So what was the moment that you had the inspiration like, okay, this is what I'm going to do? I think it was just like in a time where I realized it was such a compulsion that it was like such a thorn in my side that it wasn't going to let me go. And at that point, like I didn't go to college. Like I dropped out. You know what I mean? Like there was nothing else I was qualified to do. I was like.

Where did you go to college? Well, I went to community college and then I was supposed to transfer to Berkeley. And I like just decided not to and took a semester off and started taking class. and I just, I don't know, I was performing so much. I was doing theater in L.A. It just was all I really cared about. It was the only thing I cared about that the idea of like being bad at it felt crippling to me. Everything else I could sort of dabble in and not be that good at and move on.

Wow, that's crazy. Like, because as productive and as busy as you are right now, I would have thought like this took meticulous planning and you had vision boards. And you did, when you repeat mantras and, you know, posted notes, 100 million records more than thriller. But you're just like, you know, it was a thorn on my side. I decided to. Well, yeah, maybe I'm underselling it. No, I don't, I didn't have, I didn't have vision boards.

But I think I'm, the other thing too, just like, truthfully, I felt like there's just more interesting work to do. now if you look like me. When I first started, that wasn't necessarily the case. So I think I, not that I had ambivalence towards it, but there was a part of me that was like, is this sustainable? Like if I, can you make a living? Can I make a living at this? And also, is this going to be able to captivate me and like hold my interest?

And so, yeah, I think there has been an evolution. I was going to say that maybe around the time. and Thor came along that I realized because I'm not go to front like I'm a Marvel head. I mean, I've seen a couple Marvel films. But in my head, I don't know the history of... I can't pronounce her name.

Valkyrie. Valkyrie, yes. I don't know the history of her, but I would imagine that maybe initially that that role was Witten. What's wrong with my R's? My R's, man. I'll just be a rabbit.

That role was witten for... Elmer Fudd. Yeah, it was written for, I would imagine, for a white character. Yeah. Oh, was it? It was written, it was written for a white lady. A big white lady. She's a big white lady.

And they wasn't happy about this black lady. Whoa, call. Anyway. No, but the fact that all of your roles, um, you seem to masterfully steer your career

in a place where it's not typical at all especially for black actresses. I know worthy black actresses. Yes. I know worthy black actresses that because roles are far and few between

they might have to compromise some shit and do you know, where's the it, where's the potato salad part three? You know, straight to the DVD or just something to keep. Yeah, it's a real movie. No. No, it's not. Where's the potato salad? Yes.

No, it's not. Part three. Well, part three, I don't know. There's a sequel. Where's the potato salad is a real film? Yeah. There's actually really one hilarious scene in the film. Wait, you watched it? Yeah, watched it. And what year was that made? I don't know, but Jalilil White is this is in it.

Hey, man. Trust me. When the interview's over, I will show you the That's funny thing you ever seen. Yeah, true. Yeah. Is it funny, like, bad funny? The scene I'm going to show you is fucking hilarious. Like, genuinely hilarious.

It on Netflix? All right. I think I rented it from Netflix when they were still sending out DVD. I want to see it. Wait, slight rabbit hole. All right. But, are you on? But P.S. Why can't we have it?

Why is that a problem? It's not a problem. I love dude where's my car. Yeah. You have a point. We just, we're trying to. Do what I mean? It's just, we're coming up.

We don't have enough, right? We don't have enough content. We don't have enough. We don't have enough representation. As far as I was certain, there's not enough of those films. There's no balance. There can be news where in my car, but then there's Mississippi burning and all this other stuff. But I think when it comes to black films, I think we have too many serious films and not enough.

No, we have earnest films. Like common. Ernest films. But you're still rude. But we don't have a lot of. Wherever you were going with that is rude, sir. No, that's more boy. Common knows.

I call him Ernest. Learn this goes to camp. But what I'm saying is we don't have enough, like, silly comedies aimed toward younger kids, you know, the teenagers. There's not really that many of those. Right now? Right now, yeah. There used to be, though.

They used to be, yeah. I don't know. But, like, I think Nick Cannon's probably feeling that, like, his production cannot become. As far as the funny. As far as funny stuff. Like, silly, dude wears my car for black kids. And that's not funny. Dope.

Dope. Yeah, I wasn't too funny. No. I like dope. It was dope, but it wasn't funny. You don't like that? Why? I was mad.

at the, it's going to sound really, really anal. The band scenes, I hated the band scenes because the music didn't match the band. But band scenes are always tough in movies. Well, no. We're the two that looks at the finger in. It's not even that. It's the fact you've got Farrell's tinny drums and plinky sounds and you've got people with actual guitars and keyboards sitting there.

It just, I couldn't watch it. I'm sorry. Did you miss the plot? What about the plot and the acting? It was too distracting. It was too distracting. I hear you. Damn.

Sorry. Yeah. It's funny. We have the same outlook, but I was willing to let it go. I didn't even negate that, okay. Did you do a Twitter? I like when you do rants about things, like Instagram or Twitter rants. Did you do any rants?

No, I didn't. About dope? No. About plucky sounds and. I do those. You were like. I believe your first, I believe your film. This is a witt of win-hack-wit.

will you stop I don't understand I mean I don't understand Gina Rob Riega is about to lose her invite to the picnic she'll be the new she'll be the new

ghost where's the potato solid yeah but that's a real film Steve also the Rosco's chicken and waffle comedy is also a real film well Rosco's is a real film

Roscoe go back home or whatever that's the Martin joint would. No, there's a Rosco's chicken or waffles. All right. See, all you have to do is... You live in L.A. As soon as I'm going to go home, where's the potato sales on Netflix? I will watch five seconds of it, so then my whole feed is like

because you liked, you know what I mean? And that's when you get all the deep cuts. All the deep cuts are like, this is a film? Wait. Wait. Wait. Wait. Wait. But I like... You cape for white potatoes. No, no, that's not what I'm saying. Have you ever had Japanese potato salad? First of all, what? Day of day.

Who told them to do that? Okay. Why can't they do that? They do that. They do that. Have you had it? No, I haven't, but it sounds delicious. It's delicious.

It's like eating a cloud. Like, it's very mashed. It's really good. I'm sorry. It's good. Where do you find this? I don't know. In Japan?

No, there's no potatoes in Japan. Huh? There's no potatoes in Japan. How do you know this, Steve? Mansplaine, white's plain. There's no cheese either. No cheese really? But the job.

Japanese love cheese. They love mayo, too. Where's your source of information for this, Steve? From eating in Japanese restaurants. Wait a minute. Some people have been in Japan. This is about to be the most ignorant. All right, I'm taking my show back.

Yeah, that rabbit hole is going to get. Because the small is ruin that. No, I'm taking my show back. So what you're saying is you prefer? I did not say. Because for the record, do you prefer the Japanese potato salad over the yellow? No, I didn't say that. I didn't say that.

I just said that I don't dismiss. I don't think the potato. salad always has to be yellow. I don't want fruit in my potato salad. But if you're coming to the cookout. But American potato salad should be yellow. How about that? Can we agree on that? Yeah, that's fine. Yeah, you got me thinking. No raisins. No raisins. No, no raisins. But also, I don't mind like a different kind of mustard sometimes, like a whole grain like a, oh, not you. You can mess around. As long as it's yellow. You can play with the mustard. Yes, I agree with you, Bill.

Y'all can't see what he's doing. I only get my black card revoked. Don't get your black card revoked. Ain't no place chucked out. He has to help any invested, so she can let her go with that one. We give her that one because you win it. We fell down an incredible rabbit over here. We did. We did.

2%. That is the number of people who take the stairs when there is also an escalator available. I'm Michael Easter. And on my podcast, 2%, I break down the science of mental toughness, fitness, and building resilience in our strange modern world. I'll be speaking with writers, researchers, and other health and fitness experts, and more, to look past the impractical and way too complex pseudoscience that dominates the wellness industry. We really believe that seed oils were inherently inflammatory. We got it wrong. Many of the problems that we are freaked out about in the world are the result of

stress. Put yourself through some hardships and you will come out on the other side a happier, more fulfilled, healthier person. Listen to 2%. That's TWO percent on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Do you remember when Diana Ross double-tapped Little Kim's boobs at the VMAs? Or when Kanye said that George Bush didn't like black people. I know what you're thinking. What the hell does George Bush got to do with Little Kim? you can find out on the Look Back at it podcast. I'm Sam J. And I'm Alex English.

Each episode, we pick it here, unpack what went down, and try to make sense of how we survived it. Including a recent episode with Mark Lamont Hill, waxing all about crack in the 80s. To be clear, 84 is big to me, not just because of crack. I'm down to talk about crack on day, but yeah, yeah, yeah, literally. But just so y'all know. I mean, at this point, Mark, this is the second episode where we've discussed crack. So I'm starting to see that there's a through line. We also have AIDS on the table right now.

Thank you for finishing that sentence. I don't think there's a more important year for black people. Really? Yeah. For me, it's one of the most important years for black people in American history. Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win. A win. A win is a win.

I don't care what you're saying. Yep, that's me. Clever Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated.

One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment, and the next we'll talk about life, mental health, purpose, and even music. The Clifford Show isn't just a podcast. It's a space for honest. conversations, stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger. So, if you've ever supported me, or you're just chasing down a dream, this is right what you need to be. Listen to The Clifford show on the IHeart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. There's two golden rules that any man should live by. Rule one, never mess with a

country girl. You play stupid games. You get stupid rises. And rule two, never mess with her friends either. We always say that trust your girlfriends. I'm Anna Sinfield, and in this new season of the girlfriends, oh my God, this is the same man. A group of women discover they've all dated the same prolific con artist. I felt like I got hit by a truck. I thought, how could this happen to me? The cops didn't seem to care. So they take matters into their own hands. I said, oh, hell no. I vowed I will be his last target. He's going to get what he deserves.

Listen to the girlfriends. Trust me, babe. On the IHart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. How do you? How do you? How are you able to navigate and stay active in a town that doesn't cater to you? Structurally to you. I think maybe I have my dad to think for that in a sense because

I feel like I got to see my dad be an artist, do his thing that felt really singular, and not make concessions. And sometimes it meant that we were eating really good and stuff was great and we were shopping. What color do you want it in? Like, I don't got to choose both. And sometimes that wasn't the case, you know?

And so, yeah, sometimes you make money and sometimes you don't because you just aren't going to do certain things. But will we ever see you in a Tyler Perry or Will Packer movie? I've been in a Tyler movie. Wait, which one? For Color Girls. That's right.

Okay. You're cheating because, I mean, really you were in for color girls and who could say no to the movie version of for color girls no matter who did it. And I'm gonna say, like I said to Miss Felicia. If Woody Allen did it, if Miss Debbie Allen would have done it. I said Debbie, oh. You said if anybody directed it. If anybody directed it. I just always I got to throw a monkey man training there.

Yeah. I wish, you know, and seeing as Stewart had directed it like she was initially supposed to to do. I know. And her treatment sounded so beautiful. It was the, it would have

propelled her past or at least equal to Ava levels right now. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, man. But you know what?

I truly believe if the film were being made today, she would be the choice. Yeah. And this is no shade to Tyler. It's like they wanted

to get that movie made. That's crazy when you think about it in retrospect because at the very least, I mean, that we put her in the least, but Ava would have been the director of that.

that movie, Ava or in Zinger. I'm just saying, like, today in popularity and in sense of female empowerment. Yeah, and also the cultural conversation, which is, like, for us, by us, we want to be able to tell our own stories. If it's a, you know, it's not that men can't be involved in telling our story, but, like, if it's a female-centric film, like, yo, let a woman tell it. And they couldn't even give it to Debbie Allen. That just makes me, man, your sister's right there.

She's done her people for it? Yeah, she did, Amistad? She did? Yeah. Give us free. How did I not know that? No, she was a part of Amistice. Or, like, Cassie, Amman.

I'm not to television. Casey Limits. I'm not about I've been pronouncing her name wrong this whole time. Damn, wait. Say if what a culture for us, please test her how you pronounce her name. Well, now I'm nervous that I'm

pronouncing it wrong. Well, you gave it the fancy. It's Cassie. It's Cassie. Oh, I was calling her Casey, so you're right. It's Cassie limits. Okay. Question.

My dad ones told me that it's not Chade. Yeah. That's true. In Nigeria, I think it's Charday. No one knows that, though. Well, the funny thing is like Outtitles. Her album titles pronounce.

Charde. Why does it does? Why does everyone say shot in? Because it's a sense. And also, did you guys see that I was trying to do a. Yes, I'll see you channeling. The four of us can see it. Now we got to physically describe what you were.

No, we're about to take pictures. We'll take pictures. We'll take pictures, yes. Oh, my God, this is like, Wayne's World meets. Let's just throw everything out there. What did you have for breakfast this morning? Potato salad. No.

Whole grains. No. I had, um. I'm embarrassed. You're from Cali. I know. I had McDonald's for breakfast. I had rye.

I had rye toast with some avocado, some saute greens. It's very L.A. It's just very L.A. I don't need eggs. I've never had an egg in my life. Never in my life. Not scrambled, not omeleted, not I have had a bite of frittata.

That's it. How? Kish? Never, no, a bite of a quiche, that's it. But I don't. Yeah, so breakfast is a hard thing for me. When do you don't like yellow potato salad? Why?

Because the egg in it? Well, the eggs don't make it yellow. Yeah, it's the mustard. Amir's not blackety black. Yeah, I'm not. I'm not. I'm sorry. He's bougie. I know.

A boozy is fuck. But this is the thing. Can you be, like, if you're truly a foodie, you don't want your potato salad all that yellow. I don't know what you're saying, Tess. There is a limit. I mean, there's a limit to the yellow, but you better equal it out with some relish. You know what I'm saying? Like, oh.

Hello? I want to see if we can do a whole 90-minute episode based on potato salad. I feel like I'm walking into dangerous territory, but I would prefer celery. Oh. I love you so much. This episode is going to be super lit. Finley sliced, but I don't know. Do you cook?

I like the crunch. Yeah. Okay. The crunch? See. Okay. Why don't they put cucumber and stuff instead? You're getting.

Now you're pushing it. I hate celery. Okay. I think it's... I don't think it serves a purpose. It's the crunch. It's the crunch. It's the crunch.

But put some other crunchy shit in there that don't taste like shit. Celery doesn't taste like anything. Wait, is your publicist losing your mind in her mind right now? You know what is speaking of publicist? I've always thought, don't you feel like sometimes when food has a moment, like certain that it has a publicist? Yeah. Like, assaie or like what's shit?

Or kale? Or kale? I'm like, who the fuck is pistachios? I was like, who's that brady? And also, who's the publicist for Romaine? Because Romaine right now, can I eat it? Is it safe? I don't know.

They need to talk to the publicist for kale because kale was killing it. I know. Cale's acting like it was new. Cale's not that culturally relevant right now. But it was. And my grandmother was like, what are you all talking about? Wait, we don't care for kale?

We've been caved for kale, but we weren't calling it kale. It was just greens. Oh. Oh. What are you promoting right now? All right, let's get back to it. Can I just ask a Valkyrie questions as you asked a Valkyrie question? I just wanted to know, and you probably can't really answer this question.

Well, first of all, how did you feel about Valky not being in the Avengers movie? And then, isn't she going to be in the second one? Because it seems like they might need some help. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah. I was cool with not, you know, I was doing other stuff. I was happy. She lives.

She lives. Have you heard any word that she's going to be resisting? Okay, never. I don't know if y'all, y'all seen the Avengers. Yeah. Okay. I've seen it. They're going to need some help.

I still haven't seen Black Panther either. I'm bad. What? Would you say, Lauer? No. I haven't seen Black Panther. I'm the only black person in the world that has not seen Black Panther yet. Wait, why?

Because I was busy. Doing what? Yeah, the headaches and stuff. I get it. I get it. But just. It's still out. It's on DVD now or Blu-ray.

Yeah. Really? I did not know this. How does it? It's funny. I was thinking since it was kind of, well, Valkyrie was before Black Panther, but as a person in the Marvel scope of things, how did that feel? Like, just that Black Panther was existing.

And your Marvel world, because that's, you know. Man, exciting. Also just because, like, Ryan, obviously is involved in Michael B, so, and Chad, who's a friend of mine. It just, and the film is, I think, so incredible. And I think sometimes it's a tricky thing when you do these big movies. you're like, there's this sometimes implication inside of the industry that, like, you have visibility, but in some way you've, like, sold out or you're diminished in some way.

And it just felt like it's so cool to see Black Panther mean so much culturally and, like, push boundaries and open doors and be a big old movie like that. It's sort of legitimized why you do movies that occupy that space, you know? Mm-hmm. Yeah. I feel like it helped people look forward to Valkyrie too because Mm-hmm Any truth to the rumor

that they might consider your demand for an all-female kind of You know, the thing is It's been spoken about So much in the press And I've asked Kevin Faggy I'm like, do you feel trolled by me?

Like are we cool? And he's like, we're cool. I think I... Did you pose it to him Or did you just post it? No, like we asked him So we were at this Marvel like 10 year anniversary photo shoot thing and it was like a circle of just women talking and we were

like oh this would be so cool like I wish we could do a film together and I was like well don't we just ask him so we went up to him and we're like we should do this shouldn't we do this and then the past heard about it sure yeah that's exactly like literally yeah I would at least think that at least for today that um even if not for the the reasons why they should do it but they could see that this would be such a monumental moment. Yeah, and also that it's commercially viable. I think that's the other thing. Are they still being controlled by like the sexist troll?

No, no, I don't think so. I think it's that their thing is like super well crafted and they have ideas in terms of every phase. They just have mapping and they have ideas about timing and rollout. That would have to be like five movies later. It's really masterful, so it's, I don't think it's that. And they also want to feel like they're never, you know, they have such an incredible relationship with fans,

but they don't like the idea that they're ever pandering to fans. And so if they make a film, they want to make it because they really believe in it, and it makes sense in terms of the scope of the whole universe. It's just a matter of somebody coming up with the right story. Yeah, I think so. And also in terms of, like, I think they're always trying to find cool crossover,

and that's happening anyways with Captain Marvel. and like, you know. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Were you into the Marvel universe as a kid? No. Not at all. Not until the...

So how do you... Did you feel as though you had to, like, okay, I got to do my homework and... Yeah. ...s satisfy these fanboys. Kind of, yeah, because I didn't really know anything about it. And then also, because, like you said, it really was not written for someone like me. So it was, you know, really... You know?

So, yeah, so I felt like I really had... I had to understand the character in the world. What was the, because of the, what appeared to be the physical grueling process of the film as far as your action scenes and stuff. How much physical preparation did you have to do? A lot, which was tricky because I was making annihilation. I made annihilation and then I wrapped that

and like three days later I was in Australia making Thor. So it was hard to balance those, but had to learn like sword work and fighting. and I'd never done any of that stuff before. And then also just, like, put on a lot of muscle mass. Yeah, you were... Wait, you had to gain weight. She was real.

Yeah, I gained, like, 15 pounds of just, like, muscle, baby. See, I thought I was giving you the grip. I mean... You thought what? No, that's legit me, man. Okay, I'm impressed. Yeah, I, that was not... Because...

Because I was strong. I could do a bunch of pull-ups. Because don't it cost more money to put the muscles on you, you know, through video, than to actually just put the muscles on? Yeah, but sometimes, you just, I mean, they VFX those whole movies. No, I really did. I did work really hard.

Forgive me. And I ate a lot of stuff. Potatoes out. No. I try to bring him back to it out. We can move past. We have other things. But this is what I want to ask you, because the more and more you get into these

commercial roles, like, you know, the Marvel, the Westworld, you are, of course, a big activist, period. I won't just even just say with the women's movement. Have you felt somebody trying to kind of put the clasp on you yet because you are now you're this major commercial actress in a way? You mean in terms of how I use my voice or what I say? Yes, yes. No, I think I've just had like a couple of experiences where I'm like, is social media

the best place to do that? And I think we're also in this space right now of like internet activism and it's not enough. And I think the experience of really like some of my. experiences with times up and actually like organizing and doing the work is just more powerful than talking about what you're doing sometimes. You've been auditing people. I appreciate that. Letting people know who is really about them.

But now I'm just mostly, I just want to talk about goats because it's like a safer space. It's just a safer space. I don't think you caught that much. I mean, I don't think you caught that much flag because a lot of people agreed with pretty much everything that you've been saying. Yeah. And it made me follow you more, to be honest. Oh, really?

Yeah. Yeah, I did. Between that and the essence speech, I was like, oh, I got to go back and get me some test at times. But see, that's the other thing in terms of the essence speech. Like, those are conversations I want to have and I'm available to. Like, colorism in this industry is real. And it's like has benefited me, obviously, immensely. And because of that, I feel like a responsibility to acknowledge it and to have nuanced conversations about it.

And I do that privately inside of my space. There's certain roles I don't take. there's certain things I won't do because of that. But I think engaging in a more public conversation is something I'm willing to do. I think it's just hard. You know, in terms of like, also, it frustrates me that, like, what journalism has become, that you could look on someone's Instagram and take something they say in a comment and write an article about it, like, it feels unfair.

And I'm newly sort of navigating what it is to be a public figure in that way. and... I think most people are. Yeah, all of us, right? So we just live in public in a new way and it's not something that I'm particularly interested. I'm not fond of it. And I'm not, frankly, I'm not good at it.

Like, I'm not, I'm going to say what I'm going to say. I'm scared of that, yeah. I'm petrified by it. So it makes me want to take like a step back and just retreat goats. It makes you like retreat as you're about to post something. And you're like, well, should I, I don't, that feeling of even that is uncomfortable.

Yeah. But I feel really like Disney, like, Disney, Marvel. like I've been astonished like no one's like hey like you know we need you to shut the fuck out no okay I'm sorry hey man no it's just the way she said it how she said bill let's do it again you to shut the fuck up I'm gonna need you to shut the fuck he as you said at the end of that speech I'm sorry since we just in I'm in the speech because I took notes and everything you said at the end of the speech at the essence speech that you said at the end of the speech that You were hoping that you guys could have follow-up meetings to that and whatnot?

Yeah. How has that been going with the sisters? It's been good with the sisters. So one thing that's exciting to report is probably, so in terms of the structure of Times Up there are kind of spokes. There are subgroups. And I would say one of the most like vibrant, active and engaged subgroup within Times Up is called Woke, Women of Color. Shut up. Yeah.

And it's lit. like it's like it's just very like robust and um and real and I think there's a lot there's just a real acknowledgement that without that that we're such an important piece and historically I think feminism too often has sort of ignored the voices of women in color women of women of color and hasn't been inclusive don't even know it that's funny Tesla because I have to tell people all the time I used to hate when the Hillary Swank trailer would come on for her women's rights movie or whatever. And then it would come on right before, like, the Housewives of Atlanta. And I'd be like, so, do these white ladies know that we can vote for another, like, almost 70 years?

Yeah. You know, like. Yeah. How easy was it to navigate your way in the Hollywood women's movement? You guys gathered almost in the hundreds. I know that you guys were. but how hard was it to one explain to people that weren't aware of the different levels of obstacles that we face? Yeah, exactly.

Because I know in the beginning it was sort of like, kind of kumbayash, but then I talked to, you know, people out of the chat and they were like, you know, we got to explain to this one. Yeah, it's. And there was something that meant well. Yeah, for some, there's a steep. learning curve. I mean, real talk, like there are certain rooms that I was absolutely invited into because of what I look like in the sense of like, yeah. And safe, right? Did you call it out? Like, this feels like tokenism or? Yeah, well, I was really lucky, like, in some instances that someone else called it out for me, like, like being in a room and Jane

Fonda being like, this is unacceptable, like, there just has to be more. And then that there started to just be a conversation around like, who's not in the room and why? and then also like once you're in the room, like once you have a seat at the table, are you really, is your voice like legit heard? Because a part of that when everyone is included is like it just gets harder actually to do the work. It doesn't get easier because everyone is coming

from a different point of view, you know? And so you have to really like, you're going to be at the table longer probably when everyone is invited. So yeah, no, I called it out, but I think there was a real, cognizance you know a cognizance and I probably have like I don't have a ton of I don't know clout clout no bad yeah and bad and I don't I have less to lose I guess

you know what I mean on the subject of the women thing is interesting how I asked Rosario Dawson the same thing because even there's a their color tears and there's also like subgenres of this industry like earlier we were just talking about how a certain company just pulled our Kelly music. And I said to Rosaria, I said, you know, when you guys finished with the movie industry, you know, this music thing is a whole other animal. Yeah. I mean, so is the fashion thing when you really think about it.

Like, they, it's a whole other animal. It's more ground, street, like. So how do you guys feel about it? And I guess you would know that as well because even in Janelle is involved as well. Yeah. But it still feels like on a movie, TV type situation. Yeah, it is. And Chanel, she was saying this because we had a meeting and she was saying like,

it's tough in the music industry because there isn't the same sort of like enemy to rally around that there wasn't Harvey Weinstein. There isn't this like public enemy number one that you sort of take down. And in some ways, I think that that makes sense that it doesn't gestate the same kind of like intensity. But it also felt like a problematic thing in terms of the Harvey conversation because people don't want to acknowledge then that like there's a systemic issue. Like when you talk about, you know, a gross abuse of power, you have to also acknowledge just like the imbalance of power, which is just as gross, you know, and victimizing.

And that is like much harder in some ways to take down than a Harvey. On the subject of the archerickly thing, it's hard too, because like we were saying he touches so many things. There are so many other artists. He's written for and produced. Like, it's like how far as women do we, for lack of a better term, take these dudes down? because there's so much.

And yeah. And it's also not just these dudes. It's also just like this system. And there are also like women that support that system. It's not just men. You know. Because women, a lot of women have profited.

I know you're saying for profit, but do they support it or is it just a thing of like, I can't fight it so I might as well roll with it. Enabling. It depends on a woman. Don't you think? There are certain women who have benefited to the system. Yeah.

So there's this really rad woman that works with Times Up, but worked with the Annanberg. Her name is Stacey Smith. And she talks about women that support the patriarchy. This is so nerdy, but she says that they have high social dominance, which means that you have like a vested interest in protecting a system that empowers you.

Like the overseer. Exactly. So that they're, so that, yeah. So sometimes people will say like particularly these conversations about like just hire more women. It's like, but what kind of woman are you hiring? Because just hiring a woman isn't enough. 2%.

That is the number of people who take the stairs when there is also an escalator available. I'm Michael Easter. And on my podcast, 2%. I break down the science of mental toughness, fitness, and building resilience in our strange modern world. I'll be speaking with writers, researchers,

and other health and fitness experts, and more to look past the impractors, and way too complex pseudoscience that dominates the wellness industry. We really believe that seed oils were inherently inflammatory. We got it wrong. Many of the problems that we are freaked out about in the world are the result of stress. Put yourself through some hardships, and you will come out on the other side a happier, more fulfilled, healthier person. Listen to 2%. That's T-W-O-Persent on the I-Hart Radio app, Apple Podcasts.

or wherever you get your podcasts. Do you remember when Diana Ross double-tap Little Kim's boobs at the VMAs? Or when Kanye said that George Bush didn't like black people. I know what you're thinking. What the hell does George Bush got to do with Little Kim? Well, you can find out on the Look Back at it podcast. I'm Sam Jek. And I'm Alex English.

Each episode, we pick a here, unpack what went down, and try to make sense of how we survived it. Including a recent episode with Mark Lamont Hill, waxing all about crack in the 80s. To be clear, 84 is big to me, not just because of crack. I'm down to talk about crack on day, but just so y'all know. I mean, at this point, Mark, this is the second episode where we've discussed crack. So I'm starting to see that there's a through line.

We also have AIDS on the table right now. Thank you for finishing that sentence. Yes. I don't think there's a more important year for black people. Really? Yeah. For me, it's one of the most important years for black people in American history. Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple.

podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what you're saying. Yep, that's me, Clifford Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined.

And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment, and the next we'll talk about life, mental health, purpose, and even music. The Clifford Show isn't just a podcast, it's a space for honest conversations, stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger. So, if you've ever supported me, or you're just chasing down a dream,

this is right where you need to be. Listen to the Clifford Show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok podcast network on TikTok. There's two golden rules

that any man should live by. Rule one, never mess with a country girl. You play stupid games, you get stupid prizes. And rule two, never mess with her friends either. We always say that trust your girlfriends.

I'm Anna Sinfield. And in this new season of the girlfriends, oh my God, this is the same man. A group of women discover they've all dated the same prolific con artist. I felt like I got hit by a truck. I thought, how could this happen to me? The cops didn't seem to care.

So they take matters into their own hands. I said, oh, hell no. I vowed. I will be his last target. He's going to get what he deserves. Listen to the girlfriends. Trust me, babe. On the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

Being as though you haven't had to. designs on acting younger and you just quote wound up in it and I'm certain that you didn't think like early in your acting career like doing the Veronica Mars days or whatever that you be doing all this social activism and stuff. I don't know if that's true though. I think I I think that was the thing for me where I was like I don't know if I want to be in the pursuit of something I admire I don't admire like I think I've always wanted to be involved in in activism in some way and even when I look back I didn't realize it at the time but when I look back at Veronica Mars, that character, you know, like, she would say lines like, you know, someone said, why are you standing around here stalking? And she would say, what, you mean standing all black? Like, even that character wanted to sort of subvert ideas of, like, the sassy friend on a television show or, like, the very first part I ever played was an episode of Cold Case where I play a queer woman in 1930, you know, who can't live with her partner because that wasn't available to her at the time.

So I feel like the things that have always compelled me have lived in that space. By design or subconsciously? By design or by Kismet or I don't know. All right. Well, as far as your work, I definitely want to talk about, how did you prepare for your role as Diane Nash and Selma? Well, I got really lucky in the sense that a lot of the leaders that were still around and available to talk to us did, and then I read tons. I couldn't meet Diane before we made the film. There were some complications around that.

It's complicated, I think, when you're telling a story about people that lived during that time, and you also want to have a balance of being able to take artistic license and tell the story that you need to tell. and so it yeah biographies are a little harder to do if the person's They're hard to do But Diane

After seeing the movie Was super happy with it She told a really funny story That she You know She did ask her In terms of who she liked And she just like

I just want someone cute Which was She's just being funny But I did I went to Chicago Where she grew up And you know Sort of trace her steps

And talk to a lot of people That knew her And Yeah You know found as much as I could about her. Speaking of prep work, cheese sticks.

Yeah. Wait, wait, wait, wait. Can I just say you, I'm claiming credit. Wait, but Selma, Salma just wanted to ask you because I know you're going to creed. Was that your heaven? Being around, being with Ava, being with, you know, being telling that story,

those actors, that cast, Oprah. I really hope the answer is yes, Because if the answer is no, she'll be like, it's not going to end of her world. No, it won't be the end of my world. But you guys see my, he's like body language. Like she's like, she's like, just. And the sense of who we imagine Tessa is, in my head, I was like she was happy. I was happy, but it was funny because we had a lot of conversations to cast.

Like, we would talk about like, what kind of, what part do you want to play? And so often it would be like a character that's existed. Like so-and-so wants to play Lena Horn and so-and-so wants to play James Baldwin. And that's great. and I have a list of people that I'd love to play. But I also am like, what about just playing a fictional character that's iconic? And so that's my heaven, too, like, to get to play something that isn't real. Do you screen right?

Like, do you have aspirations of... Yeah, I've been writing a little bit, something I kind of want to do. I was talking to Greta Gerwig. I sat next to her at the Metball, and we were talking a lot about writing. She has such, like, incredible things to say. Sometimes you have this idea that you just, like, you have to wait for something. lightning bolt and the truth is it's just like work in diligence and sitting down and like committing to write something and be bad at it for a while and get better.

I love her approach to like I'm a big fan of her. Me too. The mumblecore. Me. Were you ever a part of that? No, so this is the thing I really wanted to be. So I went to this period where I was like, I'm going to make a mumblecore movie. Like that none of them have existed for us except for medicine for melancholy, which was my

introduction of course to Barry Jenkins. It's a movement. Greta Gerwig, who she directed, she was up for director this year. For the girl. For Lady Bird. But she did Francis Ha and everything. It's weird now because it's sort of like

she's the commercial darling and the newbie on in the commercial world. But she's been around forever. She's been. I've seen her face before. Mumblecore, I mean I guess you can say it's a brand of, is it Brooklyn? It's sort of like 20-somethings. Oftentimes it's

oftentimes the film takes place in a very short swath of time where like nothing happens but everything happens. I think it got the word mumblecore, sometimes non-actors are in it because the sound design sometimes wasn't good. So that's sort of how, but there's a whole movement. It's mostly like dialogue more than plot. Exactly. It's, it's, I would say that, no, no, no, it's our, it would be the American version of Dogman 95, where Dogman 95 was, like there was a film challenge of, okay, a bunch of Danish filmmakers said that, okay, we're going to make film with natural light, no soundtracks.

It's almost like a bunch of students or knowledgeable filmmakers, uh, challenging themselves. Filmmakers. You, you bring out the three-year-old of me. Stop, okay. Meanwhile, I'm like, you're not talking about that dog, what that Kevin did. It's a really interesting genre way. No, I'm not talking about Dogman of the movie. Dogman 95 was...

Yeah, it was like a movement in the 90s of filmmakers challenging themselves to these restrictive ways of making film as a way of... The equivalent of walking on top of Empire State building drunk with your eyes closed, blindful. But see, the interesting thing, so the genre is really, I mean, apart from Barry Jenkins, medicine for melancholy, it's all white. filmmakers and I remember like this was before I really knew about like Charles Burnett like and you look at his film and you're like he was doing the very same thing but doesn't get credit and I mean he's not he's not mumblecore but just like being like I'm gonna make a film with what I have available to me right you know and use non-actors and and tell a story that's contained that I can do and make beautiful

images and not have it be plot driven but yeah there was a period when I was really like do I need to make a movie? Also because I was playing parts where I was like, I was stuck in this period of working on television and really dissatisfied. And so I first found Greta in that time. And so to see her, to see what she's done now, to see it enter this space where she's being acknowledged, it's just so cool.

Yeah, it takes a while. I see that for you. Thanks. Not that I'm trying to, you know, push my vision off. My dad will love you for it because he's like, Anytime I get new stuff, he's just like, cool, cool, when are you going to write? When are you going to make a movie? Now you know you have a producer here that will give you the money for it.

No, please. Okay. You know what I'm like, dude. Jesus. No, but it's a movie. You always need more money. Yeah, don't you always need more money? One day I'll be at her door like, yeah, tell her Amir Thompson.

That's two day, but yeah. I hear you. A mirror from the tonight show. That's like, I'm like Westworld Marvel movies. Use Questlove. Like maybe she'll. No, I'm trying to inch. for a hint towards a job here.

Okay, Philadelphia. Yeah. Now, no, no, this is not what the question that you think it is. Okay. But when you told me that you were going to start researching your role for, I'm about to see Rocky. For Creed. Rocky 8. Waki.

Yeah, for Waki, wait. But I remember distinctly, distinctively telling. you what you shouldn't do. You did. But you were also, do you remember you were concerned for my well-being, my safety? Yes. Why? He didn't want me on broad and eerie, like out in these streets.

Were you on broad and eerie? Dude, she did the very things that I told her not to do. I went to straight there. You went to North Philly. Yeah. She won the Maxis. Oh, you got you a cheese day? Yeah.

Yes. That's not even my favorite place, but that's good. What's your favorite place? Fuck Maxes two times. Yeah. Oh, yes. I know. You still have this Maxis.

What happened with my eyes? Oh, fuck them. They didn't give you a free one. Not, dog, they, like, they don't know who. Not that. In Philly, you know they don't be knowing you. Here's the deal. No, you're right.

You're right. You're right. But here's the thing, though. Like, if you're going to treat me like an asshole, be consistent about it. Like, I want you to be consistent about it. But don't three seconds later find out I am who I am. And then you start chasing my car down the block. Like, bro, wait, wait, we didn't know.

Oh, shit. They're just down the street. I have always listed them whenever any international magazine that ask me, like, name your cheese steaks. They are number one. And I even, you sad enough. So when she said, like, you know, what's, why I go to Ishgibbles. Larry's. You're Ishka Bibbles?

I'm chicken cheese steak. No, I'm chicken cheesecake too. So, yeah, as far as chicken cheese steak, Ishka Bibbles got it. Okay. Well, I mean, I'll give Ishikibbles. Did you know what I am now? I'm mushroom cheese steak. Or satan cheese steak.

Well, there are places. There's all. Gavendas. Gavendez. Gvindas. Hipstiti veg. Oh, I haven't been there yet. Yeah.

Yes. Oh, I'm about that life. Who are you? I'm L.A. now. So I'm with you. I'm in Possible Burger. Oh, my God. I'm in love.

Um, Mommy. Oh, my God. Thank you, Amiens. I've also never had a hamburger in my life. Really? Huh? A turkey burger? I've had a turkey burger.

Don't get your black. Oh, that's not fair. That is not fair. I'm playing. I'm playing. I'm playing. I'm playing. Well, I was just saying that,

me telling you what spots to avoid in Philadelphia to research your roles, you did the exact opposite. Because that's... What made you do that? Because I was like, then that's some real Philly shit. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You're trying to prevent me because you don't think I'm ready. So when you went to Chicago, you went to Cabrini Green?

No. Oh. That's what I'm saying. Yeah. But it's a different movie, right? Like, it was a different movie, right? Like it was a different type. It was, yeah.

I'm just saying that, you know. Did you talk to any funny girls? Would you go, would you go to Aethan Butler? Damn. Yeah. To be honest with you, I don't think I've been to Aethan Butler. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So I'm just saying, like, I would be like, yo, you know, this spot's school.

You might not want to go to Aethin Butler. Nobody's fucking with Tessa Thompson. Like, at the end of the day. I don't think so. I don't think nobody's fucking with you. Really? I don't know. I think so.

Okay, I'm just, well, you did it already, so congratulations. And now you're doing it again, right? Yeah. You're in Philly as we speak, doing another creed. I was at Max's the week before last. Are you and Ryan back together too? Is he back in Creed, too? No.

A new filmmaker named Stephen Cable Jr. A really dope dude made this film called The Land. It was at Sundance? Sorry, I'm laughing at Amir's face. No, I just don't like messing with any formula that's not broken. So I didn't know that Ryan wasn't doing Creed too. He's not. It'll still be great.

It's going to be great. Stephen Campbell Jr. is a great filmmaker. You don't have to... Oh, I was saying, I have to vote a people. Is Rocky in it? Mm-hmm. Cool. What is that?

Two actors I want to ask you that you work with that I... First of all, Jeffrey Wright and Lekeef Stans film, I just have to know how is it acting opposite of those two men. Are you thirsty? Yes, she is. When it comes to... Well, hold up.

I'm not thirsty on Jeffrey Wright. Jeffrey Wright is everything as far as an actor to me. He's everything. Your talent thirsty. No, I'm not, don't do. I'm not, hold up. Now, I'm Lakeith thirsty because he is one of the only black male actors that I know that prophesizes about the black woman.

So in that sense, yes, I am in love with Lakeith Stan's field. But I get some on the regular, so I'm not really chasing. But I'm curious as an actress, what's it like with Jeffrey Wright? I mean, he's so good. Like, he's so good. And he's like, yeah, it's sort of like a, not a master class, but he's, yeah, he's just, he's just really, really, really good. That's all I can say. It's like a pleasure to watch him.

Have you ever been intimidated by a fellow actor that has such a pedigree or such a level of acting or effortless? Yeah. Ed Harris. He scared me. Wow. Oh, yeah. He's intense. I was a little scared to work with him.

Really? Yeah. I was a little scared. So is it in terms of I must deliver this perfectly or? He just scared. So I went to the Sundance Labs one year and I workshopped this film that I just came out

at Tribeca, this film called Little Woods. And Ed Harris was the acting advisor which would mean you'd be shooting these scenes and the acting advisor comes in to see how things are going and gives tips. And he just doesn't mince words. So I was like playing the scene. I had this idea that this character had

really sort of stiff spine And anyways, I had this idea. And he came in and I could just hear him at the monitor like, stiff, stiff. And he came over to, like, give me a note. He's just like, he just says what he feels and he's so impulsive and he's so gifted. And then the first day that I came to work with him on Westworld, he just said to me, I voted for you, by the way. He, like, liked my working creed.

And that made me so proud, but also, like, just intimidated me because I was like, oh God, I have to, like, be good today. But he's, he's so good. Yeah, he's so good. I'm such a fan. And Lakeith, can you tell the people how close he is to this character in Atlanta in real life? Because I know a lot of people really think that in Atlanta he's not acting. But as far as sorry to bother you, he is an actor.

He's an actor. He's so gifted. I mean, I think he brings a lot of himself to Darius. And I think he ad-libs and stuff. But, you know, who is nothing like his character that I think people are. assume is Brian who plays paperboard. Oh, yeah. I met Brian.

He's like, that's a whole different human. Like, he's a shape shifter. And not that Lakeith isn't, but Brian really like it's night and day. We saw it on This Is Us too, yeah, because Brian did This Is Us. Oh, he did? I haven't seen that episode yet. I'm still in the first season. When Grandpa's by, I live for that.

I was like, yes, goodbye grandpa. So he's one of Grandpa's old friends. You'll see, it's really good. Yes, from the past. No, boy, spoiler. Actually, season two and y'all are just late. We're in season three of This Is Us. No, I'm just like...

Oh, my God. It would have been a spoiler if we didn't live in a binge watch world. Let's just... Okay. It was like a two-season... This is us. I wasn't planning to watch the show. It's too emotional for me.

I watch it. You would love it. And I think it would help you. You don't know why I stopped watching it? I think it would help you. Why? I think it would help you. It started like right around the same time my father died.

That's right. That's what I'm saying to help you process it. This is the thing. The show is earnest. And I like that. You don't think it's earnest? It's human. I actually believe it.

I don't believe it's earnest. Like, earnest tries. Oh. And earnest means well, but earnest, maybe a ground rule double. Never home run. But I feel... That's your deaf.

That's your deaf. Yeah, I don't know about your deaf. Oh, definition. Yeah. Okay. I think earnest means well, but. Heartfelt? Are they synonymous?

I believe in this is us. I believe in this is us too. Me too. I believe it's like it's real. It evokes emotion. Because there's some earnest things that I roll at like, oh boy. And it's real life conversation. And some of these conversations we're not having, but we should.

Like the fact that the white daddy went and got the training to raise the black boy and oh my God, it was. Yeah. They're just more. I think they're too progressive. They're progressive at times. It's like, oh, some people aren't ready for this. It heartens me, though, because it's a very successful show. And I'm like, that's cool that America is into that right now.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Right? Yeah, yeah. Legit. Yeah, yeah. Because sometimes I can be, I don't watch a lot of, like, television, like network television, but I watched that and I was like, all right. I was shocked because when I happen to be at the upfronts.

Upfronts is basically in the shortest way possible. It's sort of a convention for advertisers. And they come to see where. which shows they're going to invest in. So all these networks put together these little workshops, like NBC will rent out Radio City Hall for maybe two days. And the president will come in, and then J-Lo will come in with the Thursday night lineup,

and Jimmy Fallon will come in and do some comedy. And you're basically watching day after day. Monday night, our lineup will be, and the voice. And as an advertiser, you're like, okay, I want my product on the voice, and this particular show, and I think I like this. And they introduce what the new shows are going to be.

I swear I actually, until this moment, did not know what the upfronts were. Like, I have participated, but I didn't realize it was for advertisers. Hell yeah. Thanks for that. Anytime you watch TV and you see commercials or product placement. Product placement, yes. Upfronts are, they get in early. So, like, and sometimes it backfires.

So think of like when Michael J. Fox was returning to comedy with the Michael J. Fox show, advertisers were excited. So they all lined up like, okay, this looks like it's going to be a ratings winner. And then they put all their money into the Michael J. Fox show, and then it busted after a year. Right. So that's sort of, who

infamously, I think Kevin Hart's show got dropped. He found out that his comedy on ABC that his show got dropped right before he's supposed to go and stage that. Oh, that's how cool. Yeah. So that's the downfall of up front. Anyway, so at the up fronts, I saw this as us

I was sort of like, oh, I don't know if this is going to work for NBC. You don't know if this is us. And then it worked. It was up. So can I ask, how did knowing Boots Rally, Wally? Wow. This is ridiculous here. Okay.

Knowing Boots Riley the way that I do. I'm extremely shocked at the amount of. of instant support that he had. I knew that he had a friend in Pat and Oswald and that he had a friend in David Cross. Yeah. And David told me how he almost, this project almost passed him by.

Like I think like, his assistant saw the script and read a little bit and was like, yo, you really need to read this. Yeah, yeah. David was going to pass on it. Like, yeah, I got your script. I'm busy. And then the assistant was like,

you got to do this shit. How were you all convinced? And I never knew that he had this this level of talent in him. I think this script was so singular and he had been trying by hook or by crook to get it made any which way

like he made a record by the same title, sorry to bother you to entice people to make the movie. He's just like he had such a clear vision and he also has such um hutspah.

Yeah, it took hutzpike her. That's all it takes. It's all it takes. Liliatish. Yeah, but it... Like, he really does, you know what I mean? Like, he's just, like, he's, he's gutsy

because he comes from a place of just, like, belief. And, yeah, it's, that's sort of intoxicating to be around. But the truth is... From cynical Hollywood, though, you just say, like, oh, rapper for 20 years, really didn't make it to the mainstream level. Was he have to offer me? Like...

But I think, don't you think we're in a time right now where, like, everybody's looking for the outlier to, like, ban, with because so how did it come how did it come across your radar well funny funny enough he wrote me a letter two years ago and offered it to me and then essentially rescinded that offer by then asking me to audition for it because in the space of two years he felt like I like popped off too much to then be in his like indie movie yeah um and so he asked me to audition so I I've I auditioned and I wasn't in the same city as him or lekeith so we got on a Skype call and then he felt like it

really instantaneous and he couldn't say no to me. I don't even think that happens to any direct, like, it's... What do you mean? That's luck, I mean, on his end. But, uh, what, how do you feel, I feel as though this will be your real moment. The script is literally unlike anything I had ever seen or dreamt of. And then I also think in terms of like, I, I really love films like, um, you know,

being John Malkovich or Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind or like Michelle Gondry's films like, I like, you know, weird shit and I just felt like that was always a genre that wasn't going to be available to me because, like, I don't see any black folks in those movies.

I saw the trailer for Sorry to Bother You and I was like, I've been waiting for a black film like this for like 25 years. Yeah, legit. So that's how I felt like that when I got that scripted answer to call that, like, I just had literally been like, cool, I'll never get to make a film like that

unless I make it. And I don't know. I don't know that I will. And so it's like, yeah, that's how I felt. So boots are Spike Chilis. Thank you, Jesus. Thank you. That is awesome.

Well, I know we have a gazillion more questions for you, but we have to. I love, I really like being here, guys. Can I also tell you that I love the magic, whatever influence, I don't know if it is, but the power of you and Janelle together has opened up her and her way to her fans to watch an evolution that is just a gift. Yeah, I'm really like, I'm so happy for her and so proud. Like I, like, outside of, you know, I just really love the record. Like, I listen to the record.

It's weird sometimes when it's like someone that you're close to and your friend, you're like, I'm geeking out on your stuff. But I legitimately just like really love the record. Yeah, it's kind of cool. I used to do it to him all the time. Yeah. So I feel that way about it. So I'm just like so proud because I just think it's like such a beautiful record and so dope. And then also just in terms of her evolution

She's in a space where she really like is allowing her work to be more personal And that's like just setting herself free But in doing that you set a lot of other people free so it's cool That's what's up well thank you Miss Thompson All right well on behalf of boss Bill unpaid bill Fontegolo Sugar Steve it's Alia

It's Alia Wow My R's and my L's, man. I'm paying for this. It's Laia. And Tessa Thompson. Thank God there's no R's or L's in your name. This is Questlove, signing off for Quest Love Supreme.

We will see you on the deck to go around. Questlove. Bye. Questlove Supreme is a production of I-Heart Radio. This classic episode was produced by the team at Pandora. For more podcasts from I-Heart Radio, visit the I-Hart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. 2%.

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