The Questlove Show - Questlove Supreme: Brian Alexander Morgan

Episode Date: October 21, 2020

This is one of THOSE Questlove Supreme episodes. The unexpected, sleeping, "damn that was good" episode, much like our guest, Brian Alexander Morgan. How is it that this man's music was the soundtrack to an era in your life and yet the name sounds kinda familiar or not at all? Yet, you know all the words to Weak, Rain, Right Here, Anything, I'm So Into You and so many more. Listen to the story of the man who created these anthems and how it led him to landing on Drake's latest, right now with Quest and Team Supreme . Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-heart podcast. Guaranteed Human. 2%. That's the number of people who take the stairs when there is also an escalator available. I'm Michael Easter. And on my podcast, 2%. I break down the science of mental toughness, fitness, and building resilience in our strange, modern world. Put yourself through some hardships and you will come out on the other side a happier, more fulfilled, healthier person.

Listen to 2%. That's TWO percent on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what I'm saying. Yep, that's me, Clifford Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, my basketball and college football journey, or my career in sports media. Well, now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifers Show.

This is a place for raw, unfilled conversations with athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. So let's get to it. Listen to the Clifford show on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. On the Look Back at it podcast.

From 1979, that was a big moment for me. 84's big to me. I'm Sam J. And I'm Alex English. Each episode, we pick a year, unpack what went down, and try to make sense of how we survived it. With our friends, fellow comedians, and favorite authors.

Like Mark Lamont Hill on the 80s. 84 was a wild year. I don't think there's a more important year for black people. Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Questlove Supreme is a production of IHeart Radio. Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to another episode of Quest Love Supreme. I'm your host, Quest Love. We have Tim Supreme in the house. We have a lot of you doing out there. Doing good. Orange guys and all. Yes, yes, yes.

Still here. I'm not on fire. Okay. Yeah. It's good to hear. We have Fontygolo. You're going to have right now. Yeah, cooling, man. Cool. It's raining out here today. So we'll be chilling off. And Sugar Steve.

Greetings. Hello, everybody. Team Supreme. I love you. You love you back, Sugar Steve. You said that's like Michael Dexon. Like, I live on my fence. That was a Sugar Network. Hello. I like that. Yeah, exactly. Okay, so ladies and gentlemen, I will say that today is one of those, those, I guess you can say the special deep cut episodes of Questlove Supreme, which we'll explore and the sect work and the history. Some of our favor to otherwise wouldn't receive their flowers while here. And our guest is that person in my book.

His resume is extensive and legendary. I wrote down your resume because there's a lot. A lot of them. It's official. It's a lot. To Drake. To Tamar Braxton, to Faith Evans, to Jojo, to Ann Nesby, Eric Bunae, Martha Walsh, Ursa, Lercia, Labor Hathaway.

But, you know, it's without no doubt. That is work on the Bonafide classic LP. It's About Time by Sisters with Voices, SWV, which he made as Mark, creating hit after hit, classic after classic, John after John. In my opinion, weak is probably neck and neck with lift every voice and sing. Ooh. As a man. As the Black National Anthem.

Actually, I think Week edges it out because unlike Lift Every Voice and Sing, I know the bridge to Week by heart. It's at least a sister anthem. It's at least that, right? Hey, you know. But yeah, what more can I say? Ladies and gentlemen, we've been waiting for this one. and please welcome to Questlove Supreme, Mr. Brian Alexander Morgan. Thank you.

Thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you. Love all you guys, fans for life, fans forever. Forget it. I'm huge, huge, huge fans of everybody, so thank you. So where are you right now, bro? Where am I right now? Is that what? I'm at home.

Okay, I don't know, East Coast, West Coast. Oh, oh, oh, L.A. Yeah, my bad. LA, the valley, out here in the valley. You know, you know, you know. Yeah, I think last time we hung out, it was when you were in Sacramento. This was, God, it was after,

it was after Fornishing Show and Sass Smith was like, yeah, yeah, yeah, big shout to side, man, side knows everybody. And she's like, yo, y'all want to go, Brandon out of the Morgan wants us to come back. I was like, word? What? Hell yeah.

So we went to crib. Yeah, that was, God, that was, 10 years ago. It was easy. And I was a huge fan of what you were doing then, just loving it. Bro, I had no idea you knew who we were. When I got the career, that's when I realized how much of a head you were. Oh, man.

I went in your kitchen and you had CDs in your cabinets where glasses should be. Yes. Yes, sir. He really bought that life. Yes, sir. And I'm a huge little brother fan, huge roots fan. Black Dog, one of my, oh, my God. We can talk about pins.

Oh, my God. I've been from day one. I was a fan of Quest. credits just from day one because he appreciated because he appreciated credits. I caught it all. I was like, okay, there they go. Man, look. Thank you. That's real talk all day. Do we, I believe, did we not, I don't know if we met at our very first show. We had a show in Sacramento like back in 94, 95. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. I think I met you and Raphael Sadieck the same day at the very first root show in Sacramento.

And y'all killed in there, that nightclub, right? Yeah, I remember that. Okay, so I do remember. Yes, sir. Yes, sir. And then I saw you again. Next time I saw you again was years later, and I had on that Donnie Hathaway joint, that Donnie Hathaway shirt. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, good.

Okay. I know that you, well, your home base was kind of Sacramento. Yes. You were born in all places, Wichita, Kansas. Describe growing. growing up in Wichita. How long did you stay there before? Wow, man. You know what?

Wichita is some of the hottest talent you'll never hear, is what I like to say. Because when you're there, it seems impossible to be on joy, at least back then, not now, because you could do anything on the internet now. But when I was there, listen, Charlie Wilson,

Roger, Zat, all that Midwest funk, all that stuff is the holy grail. because we perceive them as people who got out of the Midwest. Like, okay, even Babyface and all that stuff from Cincinnati, Cleveland, pick a thing, it's rude boys. There's always that Midwest funk, Shirley Murdoch, plus you go way back, you know, of course, Ohio players and games. So there's always been this element of whoever makes it out of there,

we feel like, oh, the gods made it out. For example, Charlie himself, Gap Band. They had been struggling for years before that, before they finally broke through. So I feel like me being for which time, I was just another one in that long line of, oh my God, he made it out. So what was the music environment like in,

what's your first musical memory from your childhood? Oh, man, I can tell you that right off the top. Michael Jackson, of course, the purity of Michael's voice on I Want You Back, ABC, I'll be there, touch me beyond beyond, right? And then you add Stevie Wonder to that and the progressive stuff he was doing on those keys really got my, I wasn't playing yet.

I didn't start playing until I was like 10 in 1970, 76. But between 70 and 75, man, it was Stevie, Donnie Hathaway, Michael Jackson. Those were the three voices that really changed my life. Now, later on in the late 70s, it was the Clark sisters. That changed everything. That turned, that was a paradigm shift. In 79, when it is my living in vain,

everything changed again. But I don't want to get ahead. myself. I can tell what, no, I can tell by how you stack your harmonies. I can see that influence in there. You hear that?

Yeah, no doubt I hear that. So, yeah, are you from a musical family or like? Let me give it up to my pops. He made a record when I was like two and 68. And it's a 45 quest and I still had it.

And me and my dad is the only one left. My mom's gone. My sister's gone, rest and peace. But my father and I, he thought he was Jimmy Hendricks back when Jimmy was, you know, the shit.

So I grew up in a house that was, he was playing not only the Sly and the Family Stone stuff and the funk stuff, but he was also playing Hendrix and Santana and all those rock joints. He loved Led Zeppelin. So I'm a truly amalgamation of all of that, bro, all of it. My dad thought he was Jimmy, seriously, with the fringe, swearing the friends. We had beads in the house and, you know, it was that. Oh, beads before you enter the room? Yes, sir. I thought it was the only black.

No, we had them too. We had beads. You already know. You already know. 70s beads. Absolutely. You know, but my dad was a guitar player, man. And that's the only musician that I ever saw first in my life was a guitar player.

And he had rehearsals at the house, too. That also was mind-blowing to hear musicians play in your house. And your house is only a two-bedroom house. It was very, very impactful to a little me. What did your folks do for a living? My, crazy, crazy thing. thing I got from my dad reading reading my dad worked as a librarian at a at a huge big metropolitan library in which i like the biggest in the city and he drove a bookmobile to the hood to the hood

books letting black kids come read in the bookmobile so that was a huge influence on me as well so you're well read i've heard i've seen that on television so was that like the book version of the ice cream man totally just drive up to the hood drive books to the hood drive books to the hood and you know what's crazy? Like, I don't think you could do that now. It's like, it would be like, people would be like, what the hell? But no, it was. Bring the book man, the fruit man and the bookman back.

Bring it back, bro. And you know what? And thank God for it. Get your Huckleberry Finn. No. Or get your mouth of eggs. Yeah. Yeah.

Get your dollars of power. Get your. Get your Elyn Harris. Yeah. No. Hey, I kid. You go. Hold it.

You live in Paris. Big influence. That's it. Back to the influence. My mom, though, what she did, she was just a secretary at a construction place, but it was her church going that was the where my mom and dad converged. My dad was absolutely not religious. And all about African this, African that.

My mom was completely Jesus, Jesus, all church all the time. Opposites connect. And you didn't, you were like saying in the church or playing Church and none of that. Of course I did. Oh, you had? Okay. Okay. That's the, that's the training right there, the beginning. But now, I got to keep it 100. Because everybody listened, I got to keep it 100. I grew up

Baptist, and so it was all about Andre Crouch and James Cleveland and the Hawkins. Which we love, but check this. It was when I went to the Kojik Church for the first time, right? And heard that Clarkson stuff. Yeah.

You know, it heard that little swag on the keys and the organ, but you know, drummers was really, really, drumming. I was like, oh, so I kind of switched over a little bit. Well, time out. Explain that to me. So what's the difference in, you're saying in Baptist Church, it was just very traditional. Yes. Neatatatat's gospel. Boom. Yeah. Yep. And you were allowed to be more. So is this a non-denominational in church

or what was the second church? No, no, no. The Church got in Christ. The Church of God in Christ, yeah. Learned as the Cogic Church or Pentecostal. They They had a history of literally trying to play records that sounded like, you know, the streets, for lack of a better word. Okay. I have an obsession with collecting next to Jamaican music. I have a really large collection of like early 80s gospel. Gospel acts trying to turn secular songs into gospel joints. Like I got a second time around by Shalimar.

That's hilarious. Oh, my God. Yeah. I have so much. I'm going to do it on my DJ sets one night. Like just do it, bro. You know, upside down by. You've got to be kidding me.

Oh, dude. All I do is collect like really bad cover songs and gospel secularizing songs into Christian. There's a really good one for the Jackson's. Can you feel it? But yeah, it's like. Wow. Let me give you another thing about that particular subject. There were certain producers at the time that were capturing it, though.

They were really nailing it. Like this guy, I got to give me mad props. Bill Maxwell. He used to produce the Andre Crouch records. Them joints sounded like earthwind and fire productions. You hear me? Like pristine, ridiculous, funky, punchy mixes. And as a kid, you know, like the late 70s me, 13-year-old me, I was 13 and 79.

That's when I started paying attention to mixing and the production. So you talk about off the wall was out at the time. And Isma Living in Vain came out at that time. Stevie hit his stride with hotter than July 80. So a lot of things was happening in that mixing part. So my very first time in the studio

making my own record was like 81 and it was gospel. But of course, I was trying to do what was in the streets too. So I did the joint. It sounded like Cheryl Lens got to be real. Think it didn't? Really?

Hell yeah. Absolutely. You got to copy that joint. I need that. I need that. That's insane. Yeah, I'll get you that. And I got a lot of gospel stuff

that we did in that era. But trust me, when I tell you, it was, it was from a good reference point. Thomas Whitfield in Detroit, production, pristine on Vanessa Bell Armstrong. By the time, by the time commission came out in 85 out of the I was going to say, can you explain? All right, so here's the deal. I grew up, like my era of musicianship,

especially with all the cats that I encountered in my age range, take all the jazz cats out. So those who were non-jazz cats, you were either. a prince head or you are commissioned head. Aha. And of course, you know, every cat I know now that's deep on gospel chaps. Commission is their foundation. Can you explain to me like a majority of R&B musicians first generation from like 1990 to like 2001, 2002?

what is the obsession with commission? Like, what was it about them that just grabbed? Was that like the closest y'all could get to secular music that mom and dad would allow in the house or whatever? Like, or live, were they just some next level craziness? Great question. I can answer it like this. For me, speaking from my generation,

literally coming from, like I said, the Hawkins and Andre and those guys in the late 70s into the 80s when drum machine became a thing, production literally changed because of prints, right? So commission, now remember, all we had before that was the winemes with voices like that. And they were incredible. And again, but you're still talking live band.

That's Phil Maxwell again. Same producer. Same producer as Andre Krauss. That one guy gave us all those brilliant Andre Crouch records and all those brilliant winings records prior to Quincy signing them, okay? So that production standard and that whole vibe came right into the 80s with drum machines and all the stuff that we grew up on Quest.

So, like, what happened was when we first heard Fred Hammond's voice, we likened it to the Wynans. You know, that big, powerful voice coming like from Marvin Wynens, but we had never heard it from such a young person prior to Johnny, besides Johnny Gill, you know what I mean? Right. You feel me?

And shout to Johnny, that's my guy. But Fred was a young boy in commission back in... Yes, 85. See, the Fred Hammond I know is Uncle Fred Ham. No, no. 85, the very first album,

get familiar with all of their whole catalog. Because what happened was, it changed our lives. But what they did that I liked about them was that they not only had the gospel chops, but they had a David Foster flavor all through their whole mix. And I'm not joking.

I'm talking about the Chicago. Yeah, DiMah DX-7. Yeah. All day. You know that. You know that. You know it. But look, but with the chops,

but with the chops of a, of a, you're my inspiration by Chicago. Yeah. Yeah. So that was the difference between the Wynans and Commission. Commission gave you that those kind of melodies. That wasn't that way with tomorrow with the Wynens? That was later.

Well, no, they were on it, but they weren't young. Okay. You feel me? So Commission was young. I get it. And that changed it because when they saw young people doing it, I went to their show so I could see the audience change. You know what I mean?

like all of a sudden they went from older people vibing on the whinens and the Hawkins and the, all that to boom, young kids that would have been otherwise in a club at a hip-hop thing are all of a sudden at a commission thing. They were jamming commission. That's right. And so, but now,

but they got hip though. So Tremaine Hawkins and them got hip. Clark sisters got here. Everybody got hip and was like, yo, they started doing stuff that they could fall down on Tremaine is a direct result of that. And 85. That's right. That's right. That's right. That's right. Right.

And because they got hip to the kids was picking it up and they would put it in the club. And you brought the sunshine was the biggest, biggest, biggest joint of that type of thing. But that was just following Stevie. But I'm saying as far as really young people, commission is the paradigm shift is what I want to say, Quest. Y'all got me downloading a bunch of gospel. Yeah. Oh, it's a lot.

Yeah, I was going to say, you know, there was some gospel in my crib, like, and I see what you're saying. André Crouch's perfect piece is a great example. Good record. of that of that uh yeah of of of that and i think my dad had the the hawkins family album which marius white actually did the first song with them or something like that so they got joints bro they got joints holy one have you heard germane's holy one oh my goodness you got this certain first album i've heard very the first album with uh look at me oh look at me okay yeah holy one is on there Is that one there?

Yeah, I know that whole album left and right. My parents went through a really weird Christian phase for like a good four years. Yeah. Dope. Yeah, for every Prince album that got broken, I had to, you know, be exercised with a Tremaine Hawkins record. I got you. Stick a pin in this. When I got to Sacramento, because I'm jumping, I'm not jumping ahead to my Sacramento and how I got there.

But when I got there, one of the first people that I got to meet was Fred Hammond and Mitchell Jones from commission because wayman tisdell was a sacramental king and also an incredible musician and i was yeah he was there he had albums yeah well yeah no they was a athlete they was coming to his house yeah yeah he had to know him as a musician yeah wow oh yeah he was definitely a major athlete um and came out oklahoma so we had the gap connect charlie connect but trust me when i tell you all those people came through wayman's house and i met them over there yeah yeah yeah yeah just want to tie wow yeah so what was your what was your uh What's the first concert you ever attended when you were in a... That's a great question.

Oh, man. The most significant one would have to be the victory tour opening day in a... Wow. You were there too. Yes, sir. Yes, sir. You went to the opening night? Open a night.

The striped pants. Absolutely. Yes. Stripe pants night. Absolutely. Well, I believe a Democratic convention was also in Kansas. for that period. And, you know, I did enough begging.

But my, my dad and my mom and I, like, that's amazing. Amazing. I went to the third night. Will you by yourself, like, by yourself? No, my mom, my dad, my sister. My dad, uh, this is one of the times where like one of his brain-haired schemes worked, which was he was like, we're going to scalp the scalpers. I was like, what's that mean?

He's like, we're going to wait five minutes into the show. So you got to be on immense faith to leave West Philadelphia. drive all the way to Kansas City. Wow. And we're just sitting in that, you know, and I'm 12, man,

so my nerves are all, you know. Yeah. I ain't paying no $30 for no ticket, but I bet you all get them down to 10. Wow. And you did. In about two minutes before the show,

bam. Wow. We got, we got four victory tour tickets for 10 bucks. My God. He was the original stuff. Look. Damn.

Straight up. Straight up. Yo, that's crazy. And guess what? There's some footage somewhere floating around of Mary Hart from Entertainment Tonight interviewed my ass. What? Nobody said her name in a minute.

Respect Mary Hart. No, they said her name and it's not good. Oh, man. Canceled to? Yeah, she's out of here. Shut up. Are you all, bro. I wanted to be her what I was a little.

Hey, man. You got to choose a side right now. People just to see side. Right. Bro, that's, I did not know that. You guys are hip to me to sometimes. I did not know that. And, yo, I love her husband.

So Lisa Gibbons, all right. Yeah, yeah, go to Lisa Gibbons. Wow. Crazy. Okay, too much. Wow. So what was it like in, what was your band situation or your, like, your high school situation? Like, were you in any local bands at the time or?

Yes. And you know what? What was your development moment that brought you to musicianship? Totally crazy. Okay, so starting in the church, I saw this 13-year-old little girl playing keys. It was the pastor's daughter. That was my first. wow, a young person can do this.

So that was huge for me to see her doing that. And then when they added drums at our church, it took them a while to let them do that because they were so conservative. But once they did that, my mom, look, my mom was the church secretary. So Pete, this. So the drummer would always leave his drums at the church.

So when my mom would go to do the secretary stuff on Saturdays, I would go with her just to jump on that dude's drums. Okay. Okay? So I started out drumming before, I could play keys. And that changed my whole life because I was like, man,

drumming is like the thing. I thought that's what I thought I was going to be doing. But then I kept getting on those keys trying to, you know, how you pick out melodies and stuff. And I got better and better at picking out melodies. You know, I was like, man, maybe I'm supposed to play. So I just started listening. And then I got embarrassed by better players than me.

And I was like, whoa, I'm nowhere near. I got to get my, you know, step my game up. These cats are playing Herbie Hancock. I'm in here playing soon and very soon. What the hell? You know, it's good to know that I thought I was the only one that went through that that whole thing. Like there was a period, maybe like two months where I drummed in my local church.

Uh-huh. But, you know, I was trying to play funk rhythms and whatnot. They actually had to have a meeting or whether or not my playing was uplifting the Lord or like that's how strict they were. Oh, my God. So, because the thing was when I would play all the, you know, they'd be like, Like, I try to play like Suckham Cs by a popular breakbeat inside the music. I love it.

And it's like the kids knew so they started doing the waff and everything in church. The deacon's like, sit down. Look, and hence, that's why I left the particular church I was at. And I went to play for a Cogic church. And when I got to the Cogic church, I had my full-on keyboard and drum machine in that bad boy. When we play You Bought the Sunshine, it sounded like you brought the sunshine. Wow. Wow. You feel me?

And then all my commission stuff, I programmed it the night before Quest, programmed all the beats and fills and crashes and everything. And so when I played a commission joint, it sounded like the record. Yeah, what was your weapon of choice? What were you using? Absolutely a lindrum all day. Wow. You got a lindrum that early?

I got a lindrum. And soon as it came out, I got it in 83. I think it was 83. They had one out in 82, but it was in California. but it was in California. My friends had it. I heard about it, but I got one in 83.

Yeah. How many lawns did you have to mowed to get that? You know, listen, here's the good news about how my development happened. In Wichita, there was this white guy named John Miller. John Miller owned what would be the equivalent of the guitar center in a major store.

Okay. He had his own music store like that. So he had all the new keyboards, all the new drum machines earlier than everybody, right? And so, but he also had a recording studio, a 16 track recording studio. So this is what happened. So he said, I used to go in there

and just play on all his gear because, of course, being broke, poor, that's where I got a chance to play. So the people, especially the white people that would, and this is Kansas. So the white people that would come in there and hear me playing on stuff would ask, you know, what my name was,

what am I doing? So John got hit. He's like, yo, you know what? I got a studio I want to promote. And if you come in there, and I'll give you free studio time if you can go in there and do some work. I did a demo in there, bro.

That gospel demo is the demo that got me my record deal on Warner Brothers. Wow. Wait, what? Yeah. Wow. Yes, sir.

Yes, sir. That demo I did in that studio got me the record deal that Beni Medina signed me to in 87. I did it in 85, 86 by 87. Jay King came through Wichita, Kansas, and heard that demo. Man, I cannot wait to hear your Jay King stories. I've been waiting, and waiting for some Jay King, you know. Yes, let's go.

Dick Griffey's story. We got to get Jill's Joe King. So this is to give people some context. So this is Timex Social Club. Yes. Club Nouveau. Yes.

This is that. Eventually Tony, Tony, Tony. Absolutely. All that. Foster and Miguel Roy. Yes, right. He came from all that. Okay.

And that's my people. So how did I get from Wichita to Sacramento? Just that way. A friend of my name, Steve Williams. I got a shout out my boy, Steve Williams, because Steve Williams was the person who was the biggest club Nouveau fan I ever met. in my life, like a full on stand, right?

And of course, I was arrogant. I'm snooty nose, Fred Hammond, Clark's sister's guy. Then people can't sing. What are you talking about? Yeah, I was, I was very, I was a quest love, very snob situation, like, because I know Quet, Quest can snob out.

But you didn't think Samuel had that voice like that? No, no, bro. I'm talking like, when I'm talking singing, we're talking about the female, the female in the group, you know what I'm saying. So, look. Oh, come on. And I'm not trying to be funny.

I'm just saying I was just that, that arrogant guy, you feel me? So I wouldn't even paying no attention to the freaking Club Nouveau at that time. Now, and rumors, I thought that was a joke. I was like, is that a joke? I thought somebody a novelty record, yeah. Yeah.

Talking about, how do rummaged? I was like, okay, what is that? Eddie Murphy? What the fuck is this? It wasn't a joke? And then, no, it was because then, because if you remember Roaches, he made Roaches. Yeah, look at all these roaches. That was the joke. But long story short, the guys that put that put that record out was Jay King.

He put that on label and that joint blew the hell up and went pop. And all of a sudden they were on tour with Run DMC and motherfucking Beastie Boys, okay? When that happened, I was like, wow, this is a real record, right? Never thought nothing else about it. That was 1986. And I still got my gospel demo. We're trying to get signed to A&M records. We had a little manager, and they was trying to get a sign to A&M because John McLean,

signed Janet, had just done the fall down. record of Tremaine. With Tremaine. Right. So we thought, hey, it was me. And when I say we, it was a group called Cache d'Ivois that I was in. How do you spell it for Fonte? How do you spell it?

What? That's like a light green drink right there. Cachet de Beau. I'm gonna need you to spell and it's fine. And it's your spell it. And it's like hypnotic. I don't get it's a part of it, has me. Cache de voir.

Listen, I was trying to be all in it. Since Jay King found me. me and sign me, I was trying to be all in the French thing, Club Nouveau, and you know, I just said that stupid shit. It just meant, right, right, right. It just meant unique voice, supposedly. And it was spelled C-A-C-H-E-T-D-O-I-S.

Oh, wow. Wow. Like W.B.D.B.B.A. That's right. That's right. That's right. Oh, well, I love my niggas. And you know what? Shout out to my. girl LaShelle Mathini, who I grew up with,

my home girl from Wichita. She was in that group with me. And rest of peace to James Williams, who was also in that group, he passed away. That, but guess what? Jake 1 just sampled something from that very album, only last year. Wow. That unreleased Warner Brothers album. You know, can you feel

me? Like, people find, they find stuff, bro. Wow. That's so dope, man. Ain't that crazy? But anyway, long story. So back to J. King. Okay, so Jake King blows up with TimeX Social Club. They It's all out. And then the only thing left is Denny and Tommy and Jay King.

And then he puts in Samuel and Val. That becomes Club Nevovall. Okay. All right. So now I'm still in Wichita. My first visit to L.A. was trying to get signed to A&M with John McLean. John was actually interested and we thought we had a deal on the table. So I'm kind of feeling a little cocky and thinking that, oh, John McLean said he's interested.

So when I get back to Wichita and I'm just in this in-between time, my friend Steve, the Club Louvreau stand calls me from Jay King's hotel room late like two in the morning something crazy and he calls me and I'm still living with my mom so she's like who in the hell so I answered the phone his name is Steve Williams Steve goes hey you got to get down here I let Jay King hear your demo that same gospel demo and then Jay King snatches the phone and be like come get this motherfucker he's fucking up my pussy but I do need you let me but I do need to let you to let me take this tape I said, and I was like, whoa, I don't know, bro. And the only thing I had seen was bad press about them fighting.

About him, yes. Right? Right. With Timex Social Club. Yes, yes. Listen, let me tell you. You listen to the Radioscope, obviously. And I read black.

Radio scope. Wow, Radio scope. Lee would always interview. Lee Bailey, right? Lee Bailey. He would always interview the lead singer Timex Social Club. We would like just throw Jay King under the bus. worse than that though I would read like blackbeat and right on and shit right

come on man so look so but here's the thing that changed my mind talking to him I saw an image and the TV was on random it sounds like I'm making it up but it's not it's true Joan Rivers had her first show on Fox and she had a little talk show I'd be damn when that shit played on repeats in which there's Joan Rivers talking to Jay King and Club Nouveau and handing them a gold album. Wow. I was like, uh, whoa. Now, do I want to stay here in my mama's house or do I want to worry about whether

Jay is a crook or not, right? And so I said, man, let it take the tape, bro. Take the tape. And he said, and he said this to me. And he made a promise to me. He said, bro, I promise you, I'll have you a record deal in two weeks. This, this tape is phenomenal. Ben and Medina is going to love it.

And you're going to be, be ready to leave, Wichita and move to Sacramento, which is where he lived at the time. And this was 1987. He absolutely, I was washing dishes one day, phone rang, picked up that thing on, you know, old school phone off the wall, put it on my shoulder, kept washing the dishes. Jay King said, you ready to leave? I said, who is he? This, Jay, man, get to pay your mama's bills, you're moving to

Sacramento. You guys are signing the Warner Brothers. That's how I got in the record business. Wow. Yikes. Now, the cat, you mentioned Samuel that was in that group. Was that the same Samuel? So you like what you see, Samuel? So you learned the program? Absolutely. With the program.

Oh, yeah, absolutely, for sure. And that was, you know, that was the Club Nouveau part of it. When I got to Sack, I met all of those dudes. They were still recording Tony, Tony, Tony hadn't happened yet. Can you answer this for me? Where the hell is Tommy, Denny right now? I talk to them. I talk to them all the time.

Tommy follows me on Instagram, and Denny is out here. I think he's managing Dem joints, the producer. Oh, wow. Yeah. Wow. Yeah, yeah, yeah. My folks. Yeah, and we're talking about

for kind of we're talking about Denzel Thomas McElroy and Denzel Foster that's right producers for In bold Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Absolutely. Wow. So I mean, that's a, So you get to Sacramento. I get to Sacramento. Is this your first time in California ever? No, no,

that was my second time because I had just been in L.A. trying to meet with John McLean the year before in 86, in 86, right? How did that fall through or it was just like quick meeting

and nothing happened? It fell through because this is my only Dick Griffey tie ever in my whole life. It fell through because the guy that we thought was our manager was a crook. And he had been doing business with said

Dick Griffey, some kind of international shipping weird something. He went to jail. Wow. And when he went to jail, we had to go back to Kansas. Right. Yeah. So the Jay King coming through was a literal

savior of my life. That was a lifeline, yeah. Yeah. Because Is Jay King from Sacramento? He actually is from Sacramento, yeah. Okay, so I was like, have y'all noticed that no one, no black artists not born in the 60s that gets to our show?

It's like they cannot even get to California without running to either Lonnie Simmons. Or Dick Griffin. Or Dick Griffin. Or now Jay King, like it's completely, with the good side of that. story is also Clarence Avon, but it's like you're going to get, you're going to run into four people in your journey. That says a lot about them though, no.

To success. Or epic failure, one or the other. Oh, my God. Wow. That's crazy. But yo, here's the thing, though. The J-King part of my experience taught me a lot because not only did it get me in the studio and kept working, but unfortunately I did very horrible drum sounds during that era. Don't go find that cashie album question.

Talk about the drums. You know I'm looking for it. Oh, God. It's horrible. But look. I'm hit up Jake. I'm hit up Jake and get it from him. Jake was in it to me.

That bad boy is on discogs. It's horrible. They're selling it on, what you call it, too. eBay or Amazon? Amazon. The shit is on Amazon. So, anyway. So it never was released.

It never, won't have officially released it. Never. But I have it on CD. Gotcha. You know, we got it that far. Cover about to be released on the schedule. and everything. And then Jay, like, pissed off the top brass and they dropped his whole shit. Wow. So, yes, describe Jay King as CEO. Because he was on the come-up. Yeah, he was.

And then he lost it. So what happened? I think, you know what? Like, and the jail tell you this himself. When he was young, Gur, he had a serious, like, energy problem. He could not control his energy, like, meaning like, if he got pissed, he let you know. He did not edit himself. He did not care. I remember one time a security guard said something crazy to him as we was walking through a mall. He went and got a gun.

He said, like he was triggered. Like, this guy was not the one to play with. Seriously, seriously. And that's five foot one, right? And that was it. Maybe I don't know. Okay. I don't know.

But I'm telling you this. People did not play with Jay. Jay was about his business. and he definitely, but one thing he was to me was like a kind of an older brother and he was protective and he nurtured me. I gave him, and you know what he also did? He left me alone.

He left me do my thing and it's doing. And I'm telling you right now, those years taught me the most probably because it was the time where I thought I had made it, you know, when you get signed and you think you made it. And then all of a sudden, man, look, that was just the beginning. You know all about that, Fonte.

So it's just, it was crazy. But when we got dropped, because of his actions and now I'm stuck like not having product out and I thought my dream, listen, when you think your whole dreams are over at 22, you know what I mean?

It was devastating. It was devastating. But Jay was so much a volatile person that it made it difficult to deal with in the moment. Yeah. But you figured out your rhythm. He reminded me of the way he talks,

he talks just like Jay Prince. which Yeah, yeah, I know what you mean. Like a very quiet slow. At least the interviews I saw, which something said, don't mess with that guy. Right, scary.

Did you ever have any? Oh, go ahead. Go ahead. I was going to say, did you ever have any, what was your interactions like with Benny Medina at that time if you had any?

I did. I had several. And you know what? This is one of the funny stories about Benny. He at that time, he was really trying to transition into television. So he was kind of over it in a lot of ways.

He was already over the record thing because he was really about to do fresh press of Bel Air because he started that immediately when he left. But what he was for me was just a real honest person. Like he was like, nope, that sucks. Yep, that's dope. Nope. And one time I used to make these phone messages on my phone

in Sacramento where I would do all these big ass productions quest. I would do like whole productions just to say that I'm not home. Oh, we all did. Yeah. Right, right. You know what I'm saying? Right, right. So I had this one joint and it was funky as hell.

And he called me, Benny called me. I was like, what the hell? Benny McDena's calling me. He went, yo, that's your first fucking single right there. Wow. And he literally chose it for the album that never came out, but it was a song called Wrong. And he said, man, that's just a single right.

So that happened. And then I didn't see Benny for decades until, like, he was trying, I heard he was trying to find me throughout the whole successful SWB period in the 90s. He never could find me. And when I finally saw him again was recently at an L.A. read book signing. It was me, him, and Usher, and L.A. Reed, and that was probably

2016. He hadn't seen me since 88. Right. How's he doing, man? She's still like good health and everything. Oh, yeah. As far as I know, Benny's great. Yeah, I mean, when you're that rich. Yeah, well, you're managing J-Lo. Man, J-Lo, you know, daddy.

Babyface, you know, please. So, yeah. There's another legendary person that enters your sphere and I don't know much about him or like I know his music well and that's Robert Brookins. Oh, man. Like, how does he enter your story? So when I got to Sacramento, I found out that there was this rivalry between Jay King and

Robert Brookins. Robert Brookins had been a child star in the San Francisco. He's from Sacramento as well. So they were like from the same hood. And it was like, you know, I'm going to be famous before you type of thing. So Robert was a genius, really, on the keys, vocals. I mean, talk about Fred Hammond. Robert sounded like Fred Hammond before Fred Hammond.

Wow. Okay. So Pete. So when I get there, it was only a matter of time before I would meet Robert because I was always, he was like a legend. And I hadn't met him yet. I was only 22. I kept hearing about it. And then when Jay would talk about him, it was always, fuck, brother.

I beat Robert's ass. So I was like, what is the deal with Jay King and Robert? So they had this rivalry. When Robert Brookings met me, it was by accident. I had this girlfriend. I was seeing the time. Her name is Donna. Donna answered the phones for Robert's office, front office.

So one time, I wrote Week, and I wanted to play Week for her to see what she thought of it as a female. I went into her office. She introduced me to Robert. That was my first time meeting him. And he didn't know nothing about me singing or playing and none of that stuff. When I pushed the button play on week, my demo of week, Donna, I looked up, her ass was in tears. Robert was like, that's too many motherfucking words.

That's too many words. That's too many words. He said, why are you saying something word? Make it most simple. That's too many. I was like, if only Robert had to know the bone thugs was right around the corner. But look. But look, what Robert did at that moment, though, he showed me a couple of chords.

He showed me he was working with Jackie Jackson at the time. He took me to Tito Jackson's house here in L.A. He took me under his wing is what he did. And that's how I ended up on his second album. I'm doing backgrounds on there on a song called United. But Robert literally what he really was trying to do was take Jay King's thing from Jay King. You feel me? He's trying to get me squarely in the Robert camp.

He's like, and what you doing with that, you know, J.K.? The liggins can't sing. They can't that. He's like, you're too bad to be in that camp, bro. What's you doing? And I think he tried to show me the like the life, Hollywood life with the Jackson's and the death. And he was also playing keys for Earth, When and Fire eventually.

Robert was doing everything. Long story short, you know, rest of people. Wow. Okay. Yeah. I know he passed away like 10 years ago, I think. Yes, yes. But we ultimately became very good friends.

and he was... He's just one of those cats where I always knew about or, you know... Yeah. That never, you know, got a shine or really got the light of day, but I always saw his name on credits and all that stuff.

That's funny, man. Listen to a record by him called, In Our Lives, In Our Lives. Check that one out. Okay. Yeah. I will look that up. Did you sing your demo for a week? I sure did.

I sang all the demos for all those songs. Wow. Oh, yeah. 2%. That is the number of people who take the stairs when there is also an escalator available. I'm Michael Easter, and on my podcast, 2%. I break down the science of mental toughness, fitness, and building resilience in our strange, modern world.

I'll be speaking with writers, researchers, and other health and fitness experts, and more, to look past the impractical and way too complex pseudoscience that dominates the wellness industry. We really believe that seed oils were inherently inflammatory. We got it wrong. Many of the problems that we are freaked out about in the world are the result of stress. Put yourself through some hardships and you will come out on the other side a happier, more fulfilled, healthier person. Listen to 2%. That's T-W-O-Persent on the I-Hart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care which I'm saying. Yep, that's me. Clipper Taylor the 4.

You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment, and the next we'll talk about life, mental health. purpose and even music. The Clifford Show isn't just a podcast. It's a space for honest conversations,

stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger. So if you've ever supported me, or you're just chasing down a dream, this is right where you need to be. Listen to the Clifford show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes,

follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. Do you remember when Diana Ross double-tap little Kim's boobs at the VMA? Or when Kanye said that George Bush didn't like black people. I know what you're thinking. What the hell does George Bush got to do with a little Kim? Well, you can find out on the Look Back at it podcast. I'm Sam J.

And I'm Alex English. Each episode, we pick it here, unpack what went down, and try to make sense of how we survived it. Including a recent episode with Mark Lamont Hill, waxing all about crack in the 80s. To be clear, 84 is big to me, not just because of crack. I'm down to talk about crack on day, but yeah, yeah. No, we don't have plenty.

But just so y'all know. I mean, at this point, this is the second episode where we've discussed correct. So I'm starting to see that there's a through line. We also have AIDS on the table right now. Thank you for finishing that sentence. Yes. I don't think there's a more important year for black people. Really?

Yeah. For me, it's one of the most important years for black people in American history. Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. So how long before. before you're able to at least get back up on your feet again. Once the Jay King deal goes, like, did you try to tell Benny, like, why don't you just sign me directly or like you were already under contract to? Listen, when Jay did what he did, I think, in that building, it was a rap for anything having to do with that. You feel me?

Yeah, any from that tree was done. It's a wrap. And I'd had the power as a young kid like that to be walking up in those rooms and talking about anything. shit, we fucked up and went and tried to get a manager to get out of the J. Jay Dill and that backfired on us. It was, it was all bad. I was depressed. How long did it take you to be free of him? A couple years, man, like a couple years.

And then even after that, though, I was just struggling just to be able to be a working musician. So all of a sudden, I start taking, I start taking any calls, any calls of anything, I would take it and go do to work. That's how I got Stevie Wonder gig. and the Bobby Brown gig in 1990 and 1991 respectively. Can I show you that story? Yes. Okay.

So this is what we live for. Pete this. So now me and Robert at this time had fallen out because Robert made me buy a car that I couldn't afford and put it in. He said he was going to co-sign for it, but then he didn't do it. Then I was stuck with the thing, so I was mad. So I was like, not feeling Robert. And then Robert, I also had done multiple songs for Robert that he was supposed to pay me for,

and then he didn't pay me for them. So I was really, really mad at Robert in this moment. Understand that. For his albums? No, for these artists. It was the, okay. It was some people that he was working with. But I had demoed, I had written and demoed them,

and he told me he was going to pay me X amount, and he didn't do it. Well, remember I had Donna working in there, so Donna could tell me what was really going on, right? So Pete, so what I found out was that he really never was going to pay me, okay? So I was, I was heated. So now I'm down to L.A., hustling for gigs and shit. I get a call from a guy named Derek Allen, bass player. He plays baseball.

D-O-A. That's right, D-O-A. Yeah, yeah. You know D. So shout out to Derek Allen. So Derek was Bobby Brown's musical director for his Woodlandoff to be tour at that time. He did College Girl on Bobby, the Bobby album.

That's exactly right. Check you out. So yeah, that's exactly right. So look, he hit me, and my man, Dennis Austin was in the band. He's a keyboard player, dope dude from Sacramento as well, Derek's homeboy. They called me and said, Brian, we need somebody that can sing and play. Can you do this Bobby Brown gig? I said, what's the gig?

We're doing the American Music Awards. We're doing a medley of all its hits at the American Music Awards. Okay? Now this is 1990. Now this is a quest. You were asking how long it took? This is about a year after we had gotten dropped when this is happening in 1990. Okay.

Okay. So I take the gig. I get the gig. I get down to LA. And I do the gig. It was amazing. I met Val Young, who's also a legend. Shout out to Val Young.

I know you know that. Yeah, I know Val Young. Vow was on the record. That's right. And Gab Band. But check this. Yes. So it's me, Val, and this other guy named Harold, we're doing the backgrounds for Bobby.

Bobby, for reasons I won't mention, could not really do this. We already know. We've been on the show. We already know. Couldn't do the show, okay? Live, like it was supposed to be. So Dick Clark said, you're not coming up on here. You know, Dick Clark did not play.

He's like, you're not coming out here messing up my shit. Go, go record it. You got to go record it. So we went to a studio. Is that bad? It was bad. So we recorded the whole thing in the studio. Now, when I was supposed to leave the next day to go back to Sacramento, I'm in the hotel room.

I'm getting, my bags are all packed. I'm in the hotel lobby waiting on a cab or something. And look, I jump on the piano and I start playing what? A commission song. And it probably was running back to you or something like that. So a guy walks by me and he goes, yo, you know that, what you know about the commission is saying, man, come on. And so we start doing two-part harmony to it in the lobby at this hotel. Wow.

I look up and I was like, bro, you are Keith John, huh? Wow. It seems with Stevie. Yeah, Stevie. Oh, Pete John. Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes. Yes, yes, yes. So, Pete.

So I go, bro, and before I can say anything else, he said, what's your name? I said, I'm Brian Morgan. And he goes, not Brian Alexander Morgan. And I said, wait a minute. How do you know my name? bro. How do you know my name? He said, bro, that cachet album, Stevie plays it on the bus all the time. What? I even get it. What? Because they gave promos out all the time. I said, what? He said, check this out, bro. We're having a rehearsal.

Stevie's doing the Grammys, and we're having a rehearsal for it. Do what would you like to audition for it? And I say, what, of course. I said, what y'all doing? He said, we're going to do. We can work it out. The Beatles joint. Because Paul McCartney is going to be there. I said, Oh my God. Yeah. So I did it. I went to the form, align around the form,

everybody doing 20,000 runs warming up. Keith John walked me in, got me into that audition, and I got that gig. So if you look at this, you can YouTube it. 1991, I think it is. I know that performance while.

Yeah. Oh, wow. That's right. And I'm in there. That's me, right there. That is crazy. I told me, you're the arm B.

Forrest Gump out here, because that's what, that's, this is how he came. Yes. Yes. Yes, that was a conversation. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you very much.

Hey, but you, yo, but from there, back home and broke, right? Right. Okay. And it's cool to be on TV, and your mama was like, look at my baby on TV on TV with Stevie Wonder. But, you know, Stevie didn't call me after that until about four years later when the girls were out. But when I went back home, something, I'm going to switch. I'm going to make it easy. Just transition for y'all.

I was like, I cannot be broke no more. I got to write something for somebody that I already know. has has a standing you know what I mean so I in 89 Martha Wash had out everybody everybody and I love that joint right right and I've always been a house head and a dance head so I was like man I can write I can write a joint for Martha and then all of a sudden when she had out um everybody dance now that I was like yeah right so that's 91 so I'm like this is my opening because she got a record deal on RCA as a result of her getting

suing C&C. So she got that deal. So I said, that's my opening right there. She got a brand new album and she's going to need songs. So I went home. I had a, listen, what I had, Quest, this is the equipment I had. It's pathetic. But I made these joints on it. You made it work.

Go right. I had a motherfuckerucking 909. Rolling 909. That's house. You need that. I needed that. And then I had a horrible Elysses H.R. 16B. Remember that joint?

Wow. Yes, I know that joint. Oh, my God. for percussion, right? You made it work. Bro, I midded them joints together and used the 909 for the kick and snare stuff and the HR 16B for the percussion stuff, right?

And them two joints go together sound like a whole new drum machine. So boom. And then I was like, I did my best, everybody, everybody, right? And it's a song called Give It to You. It went number one dance for me and Martha on RCA in 1992, early 1992. But it got me in the door at RCA.

The A&R person of the Martha Wash record was Kenny Ortiz. Kenny Ortiz. Kenny Ortiz. That's how we get to SWV. Wow. That got you in the door. Got me in that door, and I didn't. I had only done two songs on the demo for Martha.

She liked them so much. This is what Martha Wash said to me when she heard them demo songs. She said, I don't know who you are or where you come from, but you're doing what we want. The A&R guy has not given us what we want until he played us you. Can you please do, can you do more? So I ended up doing five joints on that on Martha's debut on RCA, five songs on there.

And that literally changed my life because I was able to, A, get a new car, B, say fuck you to Robert Briggins, C, say to Jay King, I'm out here, I'm still working. And I was never a malice towards him because I knew that if it wasn't for him, I wouldn't even be there.

So I would never talk shit about Jay. But at the end of the day, I was just like, yo, I'm working. And I got an apartment and I started working. And if I didn't have that money that I made for Mark to Watch, I couldn't have bought my first MPC that I did. I'm swooned to you and all the rest of the stuff on. Wow. So that, okay.

All right. Got it. Got it. Now, all right. Go. How do you develop this stuff? What came first? The songs or did the songs come first or you meeting the ladies of SWV first?

Songs first. Remember, I told you I did a week before I ever met him. I did that. Right. Okay. 89. And that's when when the whole thing. fell apart with Jay and then Shantay Moore came into the picture.

And then that's kind of, I wrote that out of a sadness about... You were writing that song for her record, or... I wrote it about her, and I was writing it for Charlie Wilson. What, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, boom. Week was about Shantay Moore? You didn't know that? No, no. No, no.

I didn't know that. I didn't know that. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, bro. Yes. Wow.

Speak on it. I had a huge crush on Shantay, bro, and I could, but that was Jay's woman at the time. Shanty was J's woman at the time, big time. Of course. Before Shantay's got a man. This is way before Shanty's got a man. Oh, yeah, wait a year.

Oh, no, yeah, this is Shanty. Shanty has a big. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And you know what? And it was just about boundaries, and I knew they want to cross no boundaries with my, you know, that's my boss. And J. King was still crazy.

Don't get it fucked up. So. So, oh, Mr. Big. Right. But with that voice stuff. Because she looked like that and she got that voice, though. Oh, my God. And that was her.

Oh, my God. I didn't even make the connection. Bro. She's the voice. Yes. Yes. Yes. Bro.

So long story short. I tell the body. Still Charlie Wilson fan, though. Me, think of where I'm coming from. So Wednesday lover had been my favorite Gab band song. Man. At that moment. Say that moment.

Right? Yes. Every now and then. I was like, oh, God. I got to write something for. So that was, Wednesday lover came on 88. So I wrote week in 89. It was only a week a year later, not even a whole year later, right?

So I'm thinking Wednesday lover, I got to do something at least as strong as that, right? And so, but Chante was the fuel for the subject of it because it was just about unrequitted things you can't, you know something's happening, but you can't do it enough about it type of energy. Hence the whole, I don't know what it is, but this is, this is crazy. You know what I mean? Why is she not exclaiming this from the rooftop? What was her reaction to knowing that? She didn't know that then. She was knowing it now.

She definitely knows it now. She's known it for years. But back then she had no idea. And not only that, she was trying to get the hell away from Sacramento and Jay too. She had a whole other life she's about to live. But my point is, thank God I wrote something so honest.

Yeah. You know what I mean? From my heart. And she was the inspiration for it. And I'm not ashamed to say. You know what I? What was her reaction now? What was the Gab Band song that was

Wednesday lover. Yeah, man. Wednesday lover. That's the one. That's that shit is hard. Oh my God. Wait a minute. You two are an anomaly. You're so puzzling because I know that's not on, that's on the round trip record.

That's right. There's nothing else on there. It's horrible. Who is listening to round trip nobody. In 89. That like, even I'm going to get you sucker wasn't on there. like man right right bro that brought me to attention

so Wednesday lover what for my generation I think when Jagged Edge covered it yeah that kind of sent a lot of people back like oh this is a cover and then you know we checked that one it was the same thing when Mary covered I'm in love like that was a lot of

that was a Gap Band record a brilliant Gap Band record brilliant that it kind of just went under the radar and honestly I stepped up after Gap Band 8 So I, no, no. Listen, they were on Capitol and were about to get dropped and it was a whole lot of screwed up stuff happening at Capitol at the time. It wasn't a good, it wasn't their fault. That was a bona fide smash. It should have been. But capital, no money was put behind it. It was just horrible. But that record just did something to my heart at the time. So when I wrote weak, I was coming from that space. Like, it's got to be dope enough for Charlie to do it. Now, the ironic thing is I never even gave it to him. Wow. Because so much stuff started happening in a different direction for me. Like Martha happened and it didn't really blow, blow up like I hoped it would.

But we got the number one dance record out of it and then it kind of went away. But when I met, when I heard Coco's voice, though, this is the connection. So when Kenny Ortiz was like, when he was finishing up, Mark the watch, he's like, B, I got these girls. I'm going to need you to write some stuff for these girls. And you hear that all the time from A&RD's and be like, oh, God, here we go. But wait, he FedEx the joint, a cassette to me back in those days. I opened the cassette up. I put it on.

Soon as I heard Coco's voice, I was like, oh, my God, that's another Shirley Murdoch. all day, right? So when you put my energy, which is a Charlie Wilson heavily influenced thing with a Shirley Murdoch, now you got a potential computer love about to happen. You're so scientific with this journey.

That's hilarious. Yes, it's the truth, right? It is. And I knew it as soon as I heard it. So I'm like, okay, so that demo that had been floating around of week of me, I knew in the back of my mind, Coco would murder it, but I was trying to get a solo deal for myself. So out of all the stuff I sent Kenny for them, I didn't send him that. Wow.

I sent him right here. I sent him some other stuff. And I did not send him weak. Now, listen how he found out about week. Before you do that, who was working on their music that got to you? Because I'm under the impression that you did all their music. Like, how did their demo get to you and what was on that demo? Like, what was the music?

That's a great question. There was a guy that, what they were working with called? Donald Brown, Donald Bolden, I think if I'm saying it right, he passed away. He was the, there's a song on the first album called a couple things he did on there. Look on the credits and check his joints out, but he's on the first out. But that's the stuff I heard was from him. But now what I learned on Coco's voice at the time, I was like, man, she's got to have somebody to be able to control what she's doing because it was like very church, you know, it's all over the place, church, church, church, and I live in wild.

I was like, if I could, if I could harness that and tame it, it's going to be dope. and I knew that. But here's how Kenny found out about weak and went crazy. Back to Jay King. At Jay King's office, when I worked there, there was this janitor working there named Jeff Bowens. Okay? So Jeff Bowens would clean up the office after everybody would leave.

But what we didn't know was that he would also help himself to tapes and cassette to that. Oh, shit. Okay. So now, that was 89. Cut to 92, 91 somewhere in there. Not even 92 is 91. I get a phone call from Kenny Ortiz. He's at a meeting at RCA Records in Hollywood.

He goes, nigger, you have been holding out on me. How in the hell am I hearing this song from Jeff Bowens? Because Jeff Bowens was now an A&R person at RCA Records. Wow. So creepy. Wow. And Kenny Ortiz goes, that sounds like my dude Brian Morgan. And Jeff Boyan goes, Brian Alexander Morgan.

And he goes, hell yeah. And Kenny goes, I'm working with you. this nigga right now on motherfucker mark and watch. And so Kenny called me and go B, are you crazy? You've been holding out on me, bro. You got to cut this on SWV. You got to cut this on

them when you finish mixing Martha. Please come to New York and cut this on them when you finish mixing Martha. I said no, because I was like, bro, I'm trying to get a deal myself. You hear me on that joint? Why don't you sign me? He said, B, later. I need them on that record now.

And he said, because he wanted to do like female guy. Mm. Oh. Yeah. Okay. Okay. So, but who, who, who

influenced Aaron? Charlie. So we still back at Charlie. Right? So when I get back to New York, I agreed to it after agreed to drop a little coinage. Uh, on that demo, right?

So, yeah, we went in there. We in the studio called Homeboy, which is legendary. Robinette shortly after we did that did show me. after we did that did Show Me Love in there. Show me love. Okay. Or Andrea Martin, whichever one you believe.

And, um, oh, is that the, is that the story that Andrew Martin is singing that? Yes, Lord. That's what that's the, yeah, that's what, that's what? That's a big, big, big, I saw it on the internet, man. And then Andrews, y'all gotta Google it. She sings it. And then when you hear her sing it, you can be like, holy shit, that shit. Wow.

And she, yeah, bro. So anyway, but Fred, Fred, shout out to Fred McFarland and And the guy that on Homeboy, Nat, forgive me. Nat Foster, forgive me. Y'all worked there. Fred and Alan George, Jesus. The writers of Show Me Love. But we recorded there.

Salam Rimi recorded a lot of joints in there. That's a very famous room. Ask everybody about Homeboy recordings. Ask them about that. So anyway, history. So got that cut. Coco hated it. Was difficult to record her on it.

But the good news... This is how every hit starts. Right, right? But she'll tell you... Yeah. Well, let me ask you. Well, I was going to say you're basically being set up kind of as a blind play date. So, like, how do you even start to nurture the relationship of trust and whatnot?

Like, do you just immediately day one to start recording these joints? Do you, like, spend time with them for, like, Jamilus spent two weeks with Janet before they even hit the studio. Man, that is. So with you, what was the process to gain the trust? That was that is a great question. And let me tell you the answer is not good. Because that level of commitment that Jam and Lewis, and I'm a huge fan of Jimmy Jammin Terry Lewis,

my guy, they influenced me producer-wise, like almost more than everybody. Right. My key style, my base, left-hand bass is Jimmy, we talk, we talk very often. That's my guy. But they spent the time with Janet like that to do that. I had no such luxury. I got these three girls thrown in my face with attitude, of Yen Yang, right?

Like all this whole New York attitude and they was like, they didn't know me, they didn't care. But what the difference was with me and Coco was, she had been used to running these hip hop producers crazy because they couldn't sing. And they couldn't tell her what to do because they could not reproduce it with their own mouse. I walk in, I did the whole beat, the whole record, and everything,

and I also can sing this shit. And I can sing it, yeah. And I can tell you how to sing it. So that changed the game for her. And she resisted it big time, like in a, big way. Like it was very hard to get anything done. However, once she got it done and I was

satisfied with how it sounded, that's what you hear. So can I guess. Did you have to go line for line? And what you're basically saying is, and I've heard this story before, the story of we once had Linda Perry on the show and she was talking about how

you know, Christina Aguilera when she first got beautiful. You know, of course, Christina, thought she was going to do some, you know, Zillion runs. And all that runs stuff. And, you know, just as a way for her to learn the song, she's like, all right, put the mic up.

Let me just sing this real quick. And I'll come back in two weeks and not this join out. And she's singing in her dry voice. And Linda knew this is the take. But I'm going to let you struggle for three weeks and make you think you want to top it and didn't do it. So, like, but what's the, what's the, you know, I've made it known on this show that I hate nothing more than recording vocals

with artists, but how do you, like, how do you get them to just straight up chill and go? That's a great question as well. Listen, with me and Coco, it was very, very easy in one sense because she surrendered because she wasn't a person who could ad lib. She wasn't an improv person at all And she was really fearful of it Like she would be so terrified That she might have to create an ad lib

Or do any that stuff So in order to make her feel more comfortable I would just do every single thing That I wanted her to do Just give her licks It literally like I would just sing it down The way literally that I wanted her to do it I'm talking about every single thing

Listen to I'm sorry to you at the end Even down to the Even that I sang that like every single run Every single thing So really what you're hearing when you hear those records, is just me doing it first, and then she does it. And it was so, it worked so well.

It's like it was magic how it worked. Like it was like I was able to have a female voice be my voice. Does she feel like she was being inauthentic if she just followed you verbatim? No, because she was so young, that wasn't, didn't cross her mind. Now, I'm sure, now here's what I felt like happened later. Coco, you tell me if I'm wrong because I know you're going to see this. She probably got really sick of people that are like musicians and singers.

asking her questions about shit, about how we did shit and whether or how they do this and how we do that. And it was really just, she just copied the demo. It was not a big, a big answer, right? But the whole thing was it was always back to me. So I think as a person, young person, is trying to develop and be who they are. It would be a know, I could get that.

I see that it could be annoying to constantly be reminded that somebody else gave you all your licks or somebody else. And too, when you go into a studio with another producer, and they're expecting you to do what they've heard you do before. exactly you can't you can't replicate that shit but she learned and that's where I think her learning process started right there and she'll tell you that too

shout out to Coco she'll tell you those those hard sessions taught her how to do all that stuff that eventually came to her naturally can I ask a question real quick because I noticed that I just I'm sorry just because I noticed that you keep saying Coco and for SWV fan like we all know that

Coco's voice is like po-p-pong of course she is the but how did the work low work in the dynamic work with the group because at the same time as the SWV fan, you still was like, I want to hear Tage, I want to hear Lili. Like, how did that? And you know what? On my records, I know their place or? Listen, I made sure that they were on every one of my joints, all my hits,

but we just having a discussion about this recently. Kenny Ortiz would always try to get me to re-record Coco doing the girls' parks just as a safety, just in case. And I didn't believe in that because what I like, I loved their blend. The true authentic blend from Cocoa Ties and Lili is you can't replace, just like you can't replace Queen. That sound of those guys' voices together is their sound.

You can't replace backgrounds. 106. That blend of those people. How long were they together before they got to you? I think a couple of years. And that's why their blend was so smooth and so perfect. So what I would always do was record them individually so I could have control of each note. and I would make sure

they were blended into the record properly so if you listen to every one of my joints they're always there they're on my joints but harmonized it but never like a solo like you know oh you leads well no that came later

because remember most of my joints were on the first album where we just trying to find our feeling right because Lily sounds amazing on that Faith Evans joints that she did are you kidding me on the second album and Tosk they all can sing this is sister right exactly that's exactly it's truly sisters with voices but at the same time. The placement

of what they do on the hit records is as important to me as the lead. Because everybody loves those backgrounds. You kidding me? So fun. So, but every... Or if it's a... Everyone sings. Come on, bro. Everything

they do, I was telling Lili this, who felt underappreciated. It's not real. I'm like, no, you can't sing none of those songs without those backgrounds. Without them, yeah. With the things you do. So, on, man. For you having them singing unison, like, because I love how they're, the way that you stack their background vocals. Mm-hmm.

It starts off unison and then it, it, it, it blossoms into harmony. Is that the Clark sisters influence? Absolutely. Absolutely. Like, all day. Thank you, Twinkie, Elberneva Clark. Yes, ma'am, sir. That's exactly.

Let me an example on the SWV record of when you do that, because it's just for the layman that's listening. Okay. I'm so in. And then saying you. You is harmony. Yes. And then back to you. I don't know where I'm going to stay unison.

And then you don't go harmony again to. To confuse. Yeah, baby. That's right. You give us something to look forward to and back and forth with it. That's all we say. Yeah. Okay.

Commission, commission too. Same thing, commission. That's a style, man. Yeah, Leah, George Clinton would all often say if you look at frungadelic records, like look at Flash, Flashlight, they would always sing in unison because he had a theory that, he once gave a theory about like how, you know, when you're in an Irish pub or whatever, and people sing the song, they get drunk, like they all sing together. Yes, they do. What do you call it a Greek chorus? Greek chorus, yeah. Right.

I love it. It's more down to earth and it's more inviting to make you want to remember the song if everyone sings in unison, like in the same voice as opposed to like some take six. Everybody's trying to pick out a note. Right. Yeah. When he wasn't in a take six,

you just want to watch them like, wow, they're amazing. But you feel like, I can't see that. Never, Lord. Need him now.

Yeah. But yeah, that's the thing. Like SWV harmonies where they had just enough unison to make people feel like, oh, I can sing this too. Yeah.

And then you had a little spice in there to let them know. You're fucking with me. And rain. Wait. I have another question. Production-wise, and I always wanted to know this. What makes it's about time somewhat, I guess, revolutionary is also in the production because you could easily succumb to what was happening in that time with New Jack Swing.

you know I'm certain that like guys the future TLC's first record like everybody was using you know James Brown's think about it looping all that stuff like or that post Dallas Austin like basically the boomerang soundtrack like that sort of that post public enemy yeah one hundred and 19

noise just noise yeah but I for this album to come out in 1992 it is very unnew jack swinging like it's right right it's almost a bridge to yeah I was going to say like the Kenny not feel like wait a minute

this doesn't sound like in vogue or TLC or whatever was you know the time you're competing with Dallas Austin and Teddy Riley and what right if I'm going to be honest made you purposely go the opposite direction with the production as we

when we see started, I'm so into you didn't exist. So remember that, right? So when we started recording, we started from week and then went into the only, the first uptempo we did was right here. So technically, I'm still slightly new Jackie on right here, my original right here, if you listen to it, but I was trying to do it in a breakbeat kind of way. Right. So, but Pete, right. But I knew, I knew from coming to New York, coming, being in New York and being in the energy, I was around, see, Fonta, I was in the heads sessions. I was. I was in the heads sessions. I in Eric's sermon sessions.

I was in sessions that didn't have anything to do with R&B. So my instinct was, I got to go harder. I can't just do New Jackson. I mean, that's the pop sound and radio. Fuck that. I want to do something that's different because the reason why Guy was so hard was because they did their thing in their style. Yeah, right.

These girls got to show their thing in their own style. They can't be New Jack Swing because then they're trying to be guy is what my mind would be. So I'm like, no, this is me, right? So by the time, as we recorded, and you listen to the record, because I'm going to keep it really 100. There's two new jack swinging things on there. Think you're going to like it. You're going to like it, bro.

Come on. Come on. But that's the remnants of what had been. You can hit, think you're going to like it almost doesn't even first. We did those first. Yeah. Yeah. I like that song.

I mean, I definitely see the new joke, but that was not a bad song at all, but I appreciate it. But I'm saying that happened when I first met them. And then my whole, once you got Quest asked about the comfortability factor. By the time, as far as getting to know them and who they were, by the time we did, I'm Swindu You, I had recorded them many, many times. So now they trust me and they trust what I'm going to tell them to do. And then we had that level. So when we get to I'm swan to you, I knew that this was going to be the ones for me, even if it never

succeeded. I said, personally, I think I nailed this one because it's my own sound. and I purposely went straight with the straight 16th thing because it was so unnew jack. It was the not, it was absolutely not new jack. I was going to say 16 on the high hat. I was like, very unusual. I was like, if this works.

Can you tell the right here story? Uh-oh. Wait, is there some controversy about that right here story? Oh, God. The remix. Oh, yes. Oh, God. Oh, I just wanted to know about right here.

Oh, okay. No, no, no. Tell me what I don't know. I don't know. Everybody has a story about it. But here's my thing. All-Star, the one that did the bulk of the work on the record, is my man. Now, I didn't know that Teddy did anything on it at all until I became aware of it through Kenny Ortiz and Teddy them saying exactly what he did.

And we're talking about the right here, human nature remit. Right. Just to be clear. Gotcha. So just to be clear, everybody had a hand in it. but the truth of the matter is the whole beat itself was done by All-Star then touched up by Teddy and others

with certain things. Teddy recorded her vocal, Coco's vocal on there. Some other Teddy's... Got the sample cleared, obviously. Right. And Teddy did, I guess there's some other guys that work with Teddy in the studio as well. They got at me on Instagram.

Those are all great guys. Everybody's cool people. I'm just saying the germination of that song. and that production and that beat was done by All-Star, the person who grabbed the same. Who also did the anything remix. And who killed it, right. Wait, even the drums, because I could have sworn them drums was Teddy.

Even the drums, because I could have sworn the drums were Teddy. No, Teddy's drums are on, I'm swooned to you. His remix on that. Have you heard that? It's so rough. So the do-do-d-d-d-d-d-d- Yeah, yeah. He didn't play that on the first. He played the other one.

You're telling me that swing. Here we go. No, that that is All-Star. And then they told me what sample he used. Wow. And I'm just going to say this. I'm just going to say this. This is how I got, because I mean, I'm just like, y'all,

I wasn't sure who did what at this point when I hear some, you know, Teddy, they say one thing, Teddy's people and his guys that did it with him. No, I'm, man, we was there. We did this, this, and I can't argue because I wasn't there. But here's what I told All-Star, who had told me that he did the basic beat. I said, All-Star, tell me this then. Because I'm like, you quest. I'm like, let's get down to the germination of this whole what you just did.

like, okay, where's that beat from, bro? And he broke it down and told me the samples. And I went and checked it against what he told me. And that is it. So I said, if y'all, and I went on Instagram and said this to those people who was claiming that they did it. I said, tell me what the samples are that made that drum loop. Just tell me.

And then it's like, look, I don't remember that show me. And I was like. Well, wait, more importantly, what were the comments like when he rocked it on versus. Oh, man. Was it snark delicious or? Well, that's how all this. That's how it came to fruition, right?

Yeah, man, that's how this all happened because when that, when that, oh, okay. I'm mad late. Yeah. It was date night that night. I didn't see that part of. Well, listen, when he opened his whole thing with that joint. Oh, so he had a story for it and everything and people were ready with the receipts. No, no.

He just opened it as if it was his. Yeah. Yeah. That's what he did. And so, and I was like, whoa, whoa, whoa, you know, that one? Hold on. And then I called All-Star because I wanted clarity. I was like, bro, before I say anything on this internet about anything, tell me once again, who did what on this joint?

For real. Was he losing his shit when he was. All-Star was laughing. He's like, these people are hilarious. He's like, bro. Okay. So there's obviously the Dina Ross presents the Jackson Five story, you know. Right.

Exactly, right, right, right, right. Value. I felt for a hook line singer. I'm like, yeah, well, Teddy's work with Michael Jackson. He got the sample cleared. Okay, yeah, I get it. And that's not why the sample cleared. Trust me, the girls had been just number one with Week, a million selling single, number one.

And this is at the time that Michael had just done his Oprah interview. So the publicity wasn't the greatest. And being associated with something really, really black, like a number one pop girl group that has song called Weekout. And that's why the follow up is right here, human nature, with number two. and Michael, those girls went crazy. Number two, pop. It would have went number one if it went for Mariah's dream lover.

Wow. Damn, that's right. Yeah, that wasn't the same. And I remixed that, by the way. Shout out to myself a remixing dream lover. Moriah called me after that. Shout out to myself, son. Hey, Brian, what did you think

when you heard Jojo's version a week? I know that shit kind of knocked me out. Well, I did it. I produced it. So. Shit. Oh, fuck. Shit.

Oh, shit. Second time around, baby. It's the only reason I love her so hard. still to this day. So thank you. You're welcome. Vincent Herbert called me on that one and said, listen to this. I put the phone on my ear.

I just heard a kid singing. She said, she's 13. I said, what? And he went, and she's white. I said, what? Right. And that's Vincent Herbert, three boys from Newark. That's right.

Yeah. Vincent, Tamar, for people who are on the light and the music. Exactly. So, Vincent, yeah, yo. And Amir. They flew me down there. Yeah, playing. Flew me down to L.A., and I cut that on Jojo.

How long did that take? Was she, like, it just seemed like she just had it. Oh, man, that was nothing. That was like, oh, my God. Yeah, she did that. And she's been singing it ever since. Sorry at the Taco Tuesday that my boy, uh, killing it. You saw that on Instagram.

A year ago she was doing it. I was like, I was happy. And my boy Steve Mackey's house. Hell yeah. Shout out Steve Mackey. Jaylo's vocal coach. Hello. Okay.

Matt, I still maintain that the original version of anything is better than the remix. That was. Thank you. So much, bro. Listen, dude. I mean, I love the remix, but, man, that first, when I heard, when you just hear you talk about that album, about the, you know, the S of your record and how I can hear now,

as you talk about it, how, you know, the things you're going to like it, that was kind of New Jack Swain, but yeah. Anything, when I heard that, I was just like, nah, this, stay on some other shit. Yeah, man, and let me tell you how I wanted to, I really approach that one. Coco, at that time, I was impressed with, she was, um, her own, she was solid in her divaism. Very, very early, right? And I'm just working with Mark the Watch.

I'm on the hills of Mark to Watch, an actual diva, right? But I was like, Coco is a little young diva in training, for real, for real. So I said to myself when I thought about how that album... That said Camomile! When that album starts, bro, you got it, man. I was like, I need a joint that not only sets up the whole mood, but it's got to be a joint that sets Coco's voice. out there like that.

And I was thinking about Diana Ross's, how the slow intro is on, Ain't a Mountain High Enough. Ain't a Mountain High enough, right? You feel me? Where it's just the slow build and it builds up to the boom, boom, boom, bam, bam, right? But I wanted it when it came on to be so sexy.

I was like, what can I do atmospherically, Quest, to set up a sexy thing? So I sampled, I turned on my water faucet in my apartment, and I sampled the water dripping. Then I sampled me dropping a 50-cent piece into a glass. And so I got that plop that I wanted. And I was like, all these, and then I breathed into the mic. I was just going, ha, ha, ha.

Yeah. So all those sounds, I said to myself. You didn't use the library records that the studios, right? You just. No, I was in my apartment, bro. I was like, nobody's joint is going to sound like this because it's so just me, literally making up sounds. And so by the time I put those keys to all those weird and all those snap and all that

breathing and stuff, it created a mood. And it's the perfect mood for Coco's voice to come in. and do what it does. And look how good the background sound on that. There they are again. Leanne and Taj, killing it. Yeah,

no, I love that song. And the unison and harmony thing theory is still an effect on that. But my mind is just for you. Come on. Come on. 2%.

That is the number of people who take the stairs when there is also an escalator available. I'm Michael Easter. And on my podcast, 2%. I break down the science of mental toughness, fitness, and building resilience in our strange modern world. I'll be speaking with

writers, researchers, and other health and fitness experts, and more to look past the impractical and way too complex pseudoscience that dominates the wellness industry. We really believe that seed oils were inherently inflammatory. We got it wrong. Many of the problems that we are freaked out about in the world are the result of stress. Put yourself through some hardships, and you will come out on the other side, a happier, more fulfilled, healthier person. Listen to 2%. That's T-W-O-Persent on the I-Hart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win.

A win is a win. I don't care which I'll say it. Yep, that's me, Cliver Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became. bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite

athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment, and the next we'll talk about life, mental health, purpose, and even music. The Clifford Show isn't just a podcast. It's a space for honest conversations, stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger. So, if you've ever supported me or you're just chasing down a dream, this is right where you need to be.

Listen to the Clifford show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. Do you remember when Diana Ross double-tap Little Kim's boobs at the VMAs? Or when Kanye said that George Bush didn't like black people. I know what you're thinking.

What the hell does George Bush got to do with Little Kim? Well, you can find out on the Look Back at it podcast. I'm Sam J. And I'm Alex English. Each episode, we pick it here, unpack what went down, and try to make sense of how we survived it. Including a recent episode with Mark Lamont Hill, waxing all about crack in the 80s. To be clear, 84 is big to me, not just because of crack. I'm down to talk about crack on day, but just so you all know.

I mean, at this point, Mark, this is the second episode where we've discussed crack. So I'm starting to see that there's a through line. We also have AIDS on the table. right now. Thank you finishing that sentence. I don't think there's a more important year for black people. Really? Yeah. For me, it's one of the

most important years for black people in American history. Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. So what I want to know is that once this album really hits paid dirt

and becomes your lottery ticket, well, one, how does life change. But can you talk about the phone calls that come in after, like the artist that you had to turn down and whatnot? Wow.

What is that, what is that downpouring of water feel like? How does your life change? Again, I was being that kid from Kansas who always lived in those credits like we do. When I tell you, when

Charlie called me and said, I want to come by, just come by the house. You know, I'm in tears there. They're like, oh, my God, my hero's coming. And then we sit down and jam and get on the drums and the keys and back and trade back and forth. He's on keys. He's on keys.

He's on keys. Recording it, videotaping it. I got all that footage. It was amazing. But when Stevie called and said, what are you doing with that girl's voice? How are you doing it? Can you come down and hang out? What?

And I was like, and I said to him, do you? You remember me? I said, I was some background so we can work. He did not remember that, okay? But the point was, now he's calling me and I'm there, man. I'm like, this is crazy. Who another one that called? Oh, Ray Parker Jr., one of my heroes, came up and flew up in his plane and came out with me in Sacramento.

Just stupid stuff. Man, all the heroes you can think of that you want to call that you love, they called. And Mariah called, and I went to meet Tommy Motola and her. That's how I got dream lover. Clyde Davis called and signed a girl group that I had at the time. And he wanted me to do my production deal with them. It was amazing. What was the name of the girl group?

They never came out, but they were called Oliver Twist. All of Her Twist. How do they spell it? No, no, no, no. How do they spell it? Just like it, just like it down. All of her twist. Oh, my God.

Oh, wow. Hey, we had some joints. We had some joints on there. Wow. All over two. Yo, I want a collection of all the groups that didn't make it with these, with these these damn things, but. Hilarious, right?

So, man, so on the second record, man, oh, before we go to second record, I just got a nerd and give you your props. There's a bass line, a bass you play on anything. It's a lick. Do do, do, do, do, do, do, do. Yes, sir. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. You feel me? Because you know why that, you know where that came from?

I always hanging out with waning with his accuse, with his, with his, Yeah. So I did that as a nod to Wayne and Tisdell like, yo, bro, I'm thinking about you right here. That's you. I just wanted to play it with my hands on the keyboard. Like, let me play this thing like a fretless dude would do. Yeah, yeah. Thank you for noticing that, man.

No, that's like my favorite part of the song. Yeah, by the way, Wayman Tisdell is on that first album. He did a... That's what I need. That's what I need. That's right. Yeah. And Danielle Tisdell.

So man, what happened on the second record when they did, because you did the single, the, the single, well, no. No, no, no. Before I'm getting ahead of myself. Layla, let me love you. Yeah. I heard that. I was like, yo, this, why isn't SVV doing this shit?

Look. What went down with the second album and the girls? My six degrees of separation is crazy. Quest, check this out. Do you guys know who Jeff Foreman is? Yes, he was Layla's method. A&R. A&R, yeah, we had her on the show like years ago. So when I got that Warner Brothers deal way back in 89 and I was thinking I'm about to come out on Warner, I met Jeff through a friend here in L.A.

He just was a friend. But what I learned was that Jeff Foreman's brother is James M. Tumay. What? Damn, that's right. Yeah, right. So, yeah, yeah. So James and Tumey's kid brother is my buddy, my best friend, Jeff Foreman. Shout out to Jeff Foreman.

Also shout out to DJ Kalil who Jeff Foreman mentored and gave his first gig. Jeff Foreman introduced me to Layla right when he signed her to Virgin Records in 1990. So that's why I already had a relationship with Layla four years before Let Me Love You. Ah, got you. Isn't that crazy?

And so by the time when that came out, were you and the girls, were y'all beefing? Like, what was your relationship like? No, no, no, no. Let Me Love You came out in between the second album. I didn't know that there was- 94. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

The beginning was 95. Right, so I spent, after I did, let me love. Right, but I did let me come out when I waself Half-Life came. I remember. Exactly. Yeah, it came out in 96. I did, Let me love you in 94 and Usher crazy in 94. Okay.

And they both came to Sacramento and recorded up there. That was an Usher's first album that Diddy A&R, the whole thing. But Pete, after that, Layla, first of all, came to Sacramento and murdered that. That's one take. That lead vocal and let me love you is one take. Really? She was smoking a cigarette playing my Gallagher machine. When I walked up on her, said, you ready to do this vocal?

She said, yeah, let's knock it out. Put a cigarette out, got on that mic, sung that entire vocal from top to bottom. Really? Killed it. Yes. So let me love you a special to me. I really, really love her on that. I totally forgot you did crazy on the Usher album.

I forgot about that record. I don't like talking about that one. That was my first Diddy experience, and it wasn't great. Really? And let's talk about it. Well, I mean, in a nutshell, as much as I tried to not swing on my debut what I'm swimming to you and all that, of course, it was a big East, well, East Coast, West Coast thing going on at that time. And did he just had been just put in charge of that kid, Usher. And I was like, yo, this is how I hear this tune.

And I did it really straight. Well, he didn't like it and wiped it and had Chuckie, Chuckie Thompson was one of my good friends, redo the whole track, really. So I never could listen to it because that's what happened to that. However, Usher called me recently after we saw each other that book tour, LA's book thing. LA region, yeah.

He's like, yo, do you still have a copy of that old way we did it? I was like, hell yeah. Usher's like, let me get a copy of that. We want to do that in my live show. Wow. Wow. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

So that made me feel better. And Babyface liked my version better, by the way, too. At the time when it happened. I got to check that. You got to see me that. Oh, yeah. It's crazy. Yeah, I love that first such album.

I mean, he was, it's totally not age appropriate. He shouldn't have been singing that shit at 12, I have an old he was. Yeah, yeah. Well, I do like that, right. Thank you, Ben, Matt, so, so when they do new beginning, what's your status with the group at that time? I come out, just like we did on the first album. I come out to New York.

I'm hanging out. I'm working. We had, you know, in all the spots, hitting all the studios, quad, we recorded half of it at Quad, you know, where Tupac was. It was very energetic and good. I thought it was going good. I knew something was going to be weird when their management kept saying, hey, they got to write.

They have to write on these songs. They have to write. Here we go. So I was like, okay, you know, if they can contribute, I'm not mad at it. Of course. If you can write, right? Right? Well, nothing really ever materialized from the writing.

And so I didn't think nothing else about it. Well, the record gets done. And then all of a sudden, none of my joints are singles. And I'm like, uh-oh, this has been a concentrated effort. to sideline me, really, because they just probably didn't. They were like, yo, he made all the money because he wrote and produced. Because he wrote and produced it, yeah. Yeah, so they was like, they just tried to side.

But they knew they couldn't take me off the record because they needed my sound. But at the same time, they didn't release anything that I did as a single. Did they write on any of those other songs that you didn't do? I don't think so, especially certainly not the ones that hit. Like, you're the one. Oh, maybe they wrote on your other one. Did they write on that? I don't know.

But I know Allstar was responsible for killing it. And but see, Allstar was a part of the original success via the remixes. So to me, that made sense. That was a continuation. You know what I mean? But at the end of the day, same subject things. You're the one. It's the same thing.

It's the subject of, I'm sorry to you. It's the same subject again. You feel? So even this time around with the proven history, like there's not a more of a bonding between you guys. It's just strictly business. And that's such a great question.

Hey, let's not ruin a good formula because there's nothing harder than doing your second album and having to prove that. Good. point, you know. Yeah. No, it went the exact other way, unbeknownst to me. I had no idea that it was so hostile towards me until it happened. And when you call the album New Beginning, you're trying to tell me something. Damn, so how long did that circle back take? Because y'all are, you know, y'all are back to good, beautiful relationship. Oh, been good for a long time. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But I mean, but then, but they left that particular manager was the, they was, was the reason for all the drama

sounds like between them, between the messenger, it was, it was back. It was bad, yeah. I was so happy to see y'all get back together for rain, man. Like, when y'all, when they did the release some tension, like, yeah, yeah, yeah. I was so, I was like, yes, S.R.R.E.B. is back with Brian. But you know what? It wasn't because I chose to. Really? At that moment, a little backstory quest, yes?

Yes. This is what we do. All right, Pete this. So, I was so hurt by the whole not releasing songs like Fine Time that people considered should have been a single, the ballot, or what's, What's it going to be? That's what I'm here for. I got five solid joints on that album that I thought at least one or two of them could have been singles and so do most of the fans. So I was like, in my mind, I was like, okay, I'm done with them.

I'm moving on. So Brandy, I was focusing on Brandy because Sylvia Rhone reached out and gave her and Merlin Bob. I know you guys remember that name, Merlin Bob. Yep, I don't Merlin. I met Merlin. They reached out and gave me a production deal, a song deal, rather. And they're like, yo, we're going to do like a five song deal with you.

Can you give us some joints? I was like, hell yeah. And I was like, but I want to work on Brandy, though. And she's not really, you know, she was on Atlantic. She was on Atlantic. So she said, well, that's in our family. Word. So I wrote three joints.

One is called Don't Change. One's called Rain. And the other one was a third one that I have never titled it. It was just a third joint. So look. So I let them hear them. They're like, yo, that's crazy. You need to get in with Brandi right away.

So I'm in New York. They put me in Daddy's house, the studio. And we go in in there and we're about to cut it. And I remember distinctly, Kelly Price was working with Diddy in one room. Di Angeletti might have been in another room. And I was in this room that me and Brandy was supposed to potentially start cutting rain in. I remember playing rain for Diddy. He said, eh, that's right.

And then, yeah. And then, you know, I just, and I'm still not over my, I'm still not over my crazy thing. Oh, crazy. I'm about to say, yeah. So I'm thinking, I'm going to get him with this one. And he's like, eh. Anyway. So I get a phone call and this ANR guy, Anthony Morgan at RCA,

he's like, yo, check this out, me. Please don't cut that on Brandy. Wow, wow. And I was like, what? He's like, yo, man, that's the SWV joint. So it has circulated in the, in the, you know, somehow it's circulating. You're the most circulating talked about songwriter producer. That's not, no.

of pre-social media. Crazy, right? So Pete, so then the next... Ripple effect, man. Wow, that's amazing. It's crazy, right? But when Rodney Jerkis... Janitors and A&Rs.

Listen, when Rodney Jerkis took over the Brandi record, he, and this is the Boy is mine album. So I think, and Rodney will tell you this, he loves rain as well. But somebody, I don't know who got it, who's here, but it ended up being, we're not going to cut this on Brandi. Yeah. So then all this is.

He has their own ring, which is angel in disguise. Okay. Come on, come on. So Pete. Now I see it. You see? So look at, so I'm cool because Sylvia and them already broke me off for these songs. So I'm like, oh, that was just a demo that I just got paid a couple hundred thousand for.

It. Awesome. And so then I said to Anthony Morgan the next day, you know what? Okay, I'm here. We can cut it on SWV. And that's how that got on that. Wow. Wow. So during that session, what was it like with you and Coco?

Nice to each other. Yeah, we're all still cool? Or how was it? Now, understand this. By this time, a whole new paradigm shift had happened. Missy and Timberland are a part of the equation now. Because they've come out with their stuff. Can we get pretty?

That's right. That's right. So. Woody call soundtrack. Absolutely. And so Missy called me to hang out on the set of the rain video, which ironic, both these songs I'm doing have to do with water and rain. I went and hung out because she had cameos

at the end of that video remember 702 is in there Taj and Lili are in there Yes who's not in there Coco Missy and Coco were beefing at the time I was some bullshit Wow Yeah some stupid shit

Probably some ego shit But anyway So Coco was not invited To the video of that Missy Elliott video Which I was So I went and hung out We recorded the vocals

To the backgrounds to reign On Taj and Lili At Electric Ladyland Hello a very important place. Sure did. Okay. And then we did, I did, uh, Coco's lead vocal at right track.

Remember right track? Yeah. I know right track. Yeah. So, so those, those are my two days of recording in New York. Wait, there's no male voice. Wait. That's me.

That's me from the demo. Let your love is follow me. I always wanted to know who that was. That's me. That's me, of course. All right. And there's also you singing, uh, because I never thought I found someone to love. Yes.

Always on my mind. Yeah, yeah, yeah. We can't forget about it always on my mind. Tribute to my hero, Charlie Wilson and the gap band. And for your love. Turning all day. And I did it unabashedly, very clearly. And by the way, just for this, while we're in this moment,

Quest, I've made sure after I saw, you know, your Charlie thing on the other show, I was like, yo, I felt like he lightweight kind of came after me on weeks. I made a lot of money on week. And it was basically, he thought it was another record. Truth of the matter. Right. I never thought about that record. I was only thinking about Wednesday lover, the one me and Fontaine are talking about.

And so, but he, but it got back to him that I said that and he called me and he, and he thanked me. He's like, yo, bro, no. He said this, you are a gap band by your damn self. That's what I was up. Wow. High praise. I praise.

It's huge, right? And so I was like, man, I love you. And I got this joint for him called Better Man right now. But if he does it, woo, it's crazy. Quest, we got to start sharing. Okay, yeah. So once Rain came out and Missingham came out, Now we're in a new whole paradigm shit.

Thank God I got to play Rain for Timlin right in the studio. As he was mixing down, are you that somebody? Holy shit. Wow. So in the studio, I walked in, I kept hearing, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't. And I was like, man, I don't want to play this whack-ass ballad shit. Let me do it.

Okay. And you know who brought me there to that session was Static Major, rest of peace? Yes, rest in peace. Static from play, man. Daddy bomb me there. Wow. And everybody else from player. All my homies for player too, man.

Smoky, smoky, everybody, though. It was crazy. Black, man. And so, again, that was a moment in time. I would never forget. And I played it for Tim, though. And you know what he said? Because his ears are incredible.

He went, I played him my demo version versus the album version. And he's like, your demo version sounds better, bro. And I said, I know, right? He said, man, the drums are fatter. He just got it right away. And guess who else was sitting there? Jimmy Douglas?

I was like, I know, Jimmy. Yes. Oh, God, Jimmy Douglas. You feel me? So, I mean. Yo, man, he's the greatest dude ever. Ever. I love Jimmy, man.

Me too, man. God, man. Crazy. But anyway, that's, you know, that's how rain. And look how the ripple effect of rain has been so crazy. I can't even tell you. Like pulling me back. Yeah.

Come on, bro. My favorite chingy jam. It might be my only changing jam. Yeah. I was like one call away. I did like one call away. I can't sing that right now. I don't even know that one.

Call away. It was with, it sounds like pulling me back. I like that, exactly. It was with, uh, who was on the hook on that?

I think Jason Weaver. Okay. Jason Weaver on the hook. Nice. That's the two chingy jams and that's about worst. Y'all know, it's out right now on Rick Ross, Summer Rain.

Yes. Out right now. Oh, shit. I got her. Now you're going to make me listen to Rick up that one. That's right. So can I ask, uh,

from the, Pistor's point of view, how easy was it to... To clear that? Yes. Very, very easy. Because at the time, in 97, it wasn't a whole lot of people sampling Jocko or doing anything having to do with Jocko at all. So it was very easy.

It's just weird because, like, I almost, like, you know, there's some samples out there. They're so quasi-obscure that you might be tempted to be like, I can get away with this. You know what's crazy. I didn't even sample it, by the way. Let me say this. I did not sample it. Let's get that straight. You replayed it.

It was replayed. I know that. I know you temperate. That's the thing. Like, when you, when you're creating something, like, you know, all the times, I'll put it this way. I'll say that 80% of what I do. Well, yeah, but just like 80% of the output I do usually starts with a sample. Mm-hmm.

Wait a minute. And then I'm manipulating. What? Oh. I don't. I mean, I'm not snitch. I'll tell you after we start. I want to know that.

I want to know that. That's one of my favorite. What I'm saying is it'll start with a sample and then I'll make the decision on whether or not I'm going to ride with it all the way out or if I'm going to freak it so that no one knows what it is or whatever. You know, and then I dress it up and then I take the sample away and then blam. It's a it's a song on its own. But Portrait of Tracy could be one of them things. where it's like, yo, this is mad familiar. I mean, yes, you definitely stuck with the melody or whatnot.

But in the beginning, did you definitely say, like, I'm going to make a joint of portrait of Tracy? No. And let me tell you this. I'm going to do this story right here. It's really quick. It's very quick. The only reason I even know about Jocko at all is because of Layla Hathaway.

And so when I was doing, Let Me Love You, like you described with Janet and Jimmy and Terry, I went to her apartment. We hung out, trying to get a vibe just between us, right? energy. He pulled out all this vinyl. One of the vignals was the Jaco debut, the black and white joint with Porta and Tracy. Yeah, the black and white were just him on the cover. I was intrigued with the cover. So when I pulled out and I saw that Herbie Hancock did the notes, I was like, oh my God. So when I started listening, listen, when Portrait of Tracy came on, it's my whole soul and spirit was just snatched and transformed, right? So I was like, oh my God. So when I went back

to Sacramento, before I even did, let me love you, I did my homework. I went and bought that CD. So I just lived with it. Now, when I heard it again, I listened to it. I was like, Oh, that's crazy. If I ever use that, it's going to be dope and then forgot all about it. Four years later, 97, 96, whatever, but three years later, I'm in the shower. A hook comes to me in its full entirety. Never happened before in my life. A whole hook with the words and everything came to me.

As I was showering, water's always involved in my shit. So I fucking, the whole rain down on me, glad you love this wall like rain. It just came to me. And I said, hold on, man. Hold on, hold on, hold on. In my mind, I heard it clear as day. I said, if that jaco thing works with what this hook is, it's going to go together well.

So I ran to my studio with a towel on, put the jaco joint, put the jaco joint on, and I took it as divine intervention when it was in the same key. As I heard the dim. And when I went, I said it, I sung it out loud in my voice. I was, there ain't out on me. and I put the record on and went, do do do do. And my hands went up.

I turned on that NPC. I did that beat right then and there. That was an N. A TOW? Yeah, absolutely. Wow. In a towel. I said, no, no. I'm doing this joint right now.

I didn't want to lose the feeling of what I felt. And I'm going to tell you some of my sample that I never told anybody in Raine. This is a beat. They ain't got nothing to do with no melody, nothing. There's a beat on Michael Jackson's, solo album where he redos Bill Withers Use Me. So you got to check this out.

It starts with a beat. Use me or ain't no sunshine? I mean, ain't no sunshine. It ain't no sunshine. It ain't no sunshine. It ain't no sunshine. At the beginning, I'm sorry. You know what I'm talking about.

On drums. So when it goes, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom. Boom, boom. Right, right. If you listen to rain, there's a little tiny thing. I didn't want my beat to feel so stiff on the MPC, right? So my beat is, do. Bum, bum, bum, bum, bum, bum, boom.

That little boom, boom, boom, ba. Is the drums. Okay. Okay. I love it. I love it. And that gives you that real human feel in there. So when people try to recreate it on whatever devices that they have,

they forget that human element. They always miss it. That's probably James Gadsen or some damn body, but it's like, do, boom, boom, boom, boom. you know what I mean? And I did that and then I just played the keys. And then when I wanted to sample Jocko, but something told me no because I didn't want to stretch it and have it sound all weird. So I called one of my favorite bass and guitar players over to my house of Sacramento and he just replayed what I wanted him to play. And I didn't want all the notes.

I just said, dude. Yeah, I was going to say every bass player worth a grain of salt, like that's their entry into the world of jazz. You got to know, Teen Town by Jock or Weather Report. And you got to got a new portrait of Tracy. Damn right. Like modern jazz. Like, that's just without saying. But you know what?

The first person assembled it was Master P. Nick, what? What's doing? Hold on. It's called, you just don't know. It was the only, only like nine months later. And it's called, you just don't know what you did to me. I missed that one.

And Pete this, though. That, him doing that without getting permission, paid off my publishing debt. Wow. To Universal at the time. Way back in, by 2000, that record, because he sold four million albums. That was on his album called The Last Dawn.

It was on the last song because that was the double CD. That's right. Damn, I forgot about that record. And he sold four million albums. So way before Chingi, Master P did it. Within a year of me putting it out, right? Pay off my whole, all of a sudden, I knew what I had gotten from them as in advance,

like in 98. And then in 2000, it was already paid off. I was like, wow. Yeah. And it was because of that. Okay? So,

so one big, uh, uh, is it, is it ever, as you look back over your career, is it ever a part, I guess where you're at now,

where you still have the yearning, like to be an artist, that'd be all the, just the great things you've done as a producer, is it still a part of you, that yearns to just like put out your own music and still sing because you still got it. I mean, you still got the chops and you can still do it.

Not only that, I am doing it. And I finally got myself into a position financially where I can do it and do it right and do it right. So that's exactly what I'm doing right now, like putting something together for you guys and the fans that love all the stuff that we talked about, plus stuff I'll be slipping out to certain people. I'm totally doing that. And with artists I find, that's what I just gave Quest, those exclusives that he can play if he wants to because it's a couple new artists on there or and then some old me and

Coco's on one and then this new girl Nefertiti Avani is on another she's a badass writer and a dope-ass singer check that out joint called do it again I think you guys are gonna appreciate what we got going and I'm about to put out a lot of stuff that I wanted to do on other people that I never did do like those other two songs that I did on Brandy yeah I want to put those out so I'm trying to get I'm just grabbing folks and putting them on joins and I call it bams rare remix and unrelixt and unreleased. I love it. You're going to put that usher join there too, right? I'm going to put the original crazy. No, I'm going to put the new crazy with this new dude that's a crazy singer. Oh, right. That makes it's cheaper. Yes. There you go.

It's a whole other joint. Hey, hey, it's trapped out. It's dope. It's dope. Can you talk about a well, I know that there's not even, I won't say resurgence, but you worked on with Drake. What was that situation? How did that situation come something to be. Came to be, wow, you know what's crazy. I learned about Toronto is that they're Detroit adjacent. And let me tell you something. The Toronto fans as far as SWV goes are voracious.

They know their shit. Like I was shocked to know that Noah like 40. Yeah, I was about to say Noah 40s, man, their biggest champion. Them dudes know their shit. So when they reached out, I have been working with DJ, Kalil who was one of my best friends here in LA. Thank God.

I love him to death. And he's the guy that said, man, just move to L.A. Stop playing, just moved to L.A. Because I was just kind of like not wanting to live in L.A. ever. And why is that? Because wouldn't it be easier for you to go to where

the water well is? Pervertibly speaking. You know what's funny? That would be true usually. But since I had made such of my own little lake in Sacramento, it was easier. to just stay in it. You know what I mean? I was a small, in my own little,

I created my own thing there. And I was doing my dance stuff. I was just doing my thing. But when Chris Brown re-did, she ain't you in 2011 to right here. And it did so well. And then pulling me back in 08, it was just all these little things kept telling me,

man, maybe I do need to step my toe back into it. Just because I had, I had, this is what happened. I was over the fact that we couldn't seem to get any traction with black artists and that it seemed like that all the black stuff, was getting done in white face. Let's talk about it. And that was frustrating, and I was just over it. So I started doing dancing.

And I only was being done in white face. It was being called pop, and it wasn't being called R&B. Exactly. And right, and then you all of a sudden relegated our chart. All of a sudden looked like the gospel chart used to look. Right. What is wrong with you? Are y'all kidding me right now?

Did somebody say white face? I'm right here. He's back. I'm going to say. I'm going to say. I love it. Quest, you hear me,

though? So like, I dipped out. And you know why? Because my mailbox money was so crazy I could afford to. I wasn't really tripping on what was happening.

That's the dream right there. That phrase is amazing. My mailbox money. Listen, I'm telling you something. Pulling me back was a big pop record. Let me tell you. Shout out to Jermaine DePree.

Shout out to Jermaine Dupree. And a big nod to Jermaine Dupree for real because a lot of producers don't want use some other producers stuff. That was huge that he did that. And I want to thank him publicly right now. Thank you, Jermaine. Love you.

And then again, with Chris Brown, when She Ain't You, and that did well. So that was the year that I decided I'm going to move to L.A. That was 2011. I actually did it in 2012. And DJ Khalil is the person who received me with open arms and, you know,

because he told a story about, It's About Time album that brings me to tears. He was playing basketball thinking he was about to be a basketball star riding on the bus. And they gave them promos out for free to a lot of people that he knew in the business. And he put that on as a college basketball player, put it on the headphones on a bus. He said by the time he got that through playing that, It's About Time, it changed his life. Wow. And then the fact that Jeff Foreman is the one who mentored him and gave him his first gig in television doing music for, what's that show?

It's an entertainment tonight show called The Other One. Access. Access. Access. That's how Khalil became. I got back in his life because Jeff Foreman was working with him. You know what I mean? So I don't know if you guys believe in divine stuff like that, but to me.

Absolutely. That right there was, it's a lot. So long story short, thank God I got in it. Khalil had already worked with Drake. So he knew what that camp was like. And I was like, man, I want to get down. I think 40 found me from somebody. I don't know how he found me, but he.

found me and he asked me if I had anything original and I did and that's how the song nine got done because I already had it and I sent it to them and him and boy wonder touched it up and that's how that got on there turn a six to nine now and that's how I ended up on views and as a result I think the producer in 1985 who's amazing himself we started working and that's how I ended up on the Khalid on the way record and on that could if y'all listen I'm just I'm just I'm just doing my best Jimmy Jam imitation on the keys. All of that. All of that.

The keys, baby. The nice roads cords, you feel me? Everything I miss at home warmth and all that. Yes. I'm trying to give it to you. It's so crazy to see all that stuff come back around, man. And I'm hopefully bringing it.

I'm trying to. You feel me? Like, Kille, the Quest. What do you think about the on the way record? You familiar? Oh, the Killijuan? No, I don't really fucks with it. Yes, absolutely.

Oh, word. Okay, good. I wasn't sure if you look. Okay, good. So that's how that happened. Oh, let's do reverse of that. Nah, nigga, I ain't feeling that shit. No.

Hey, I'm hoping you like... Now, Khalid is dope, though. Now, Khalid is dope, though. That record he got the talk record he got with disclosure. Crazy. That shit hard as fuck. Yeah. Crazy.

He don't do no wax shit. Everything he does is cool. And you know what I'm saying? And shout out to Tunji. Oh, yeah, Tunji. Oh, yeah. Tungi. Yeah.

And I'm black, yeah, six black. All that. That's the homie over at, uh, it, it's cool, Tungi and Josh, them, the homies. Absolutely. And, and thank you, Tungi for making sure that that all went down with, with, with, with Calee. I mean, I'm, so. So where you are right now. And, you know, I guess as evidence by, especially with where we are in 2020.

Mm-hmm. And as we witnessed, uh, especially watching the Monica and Brandy, uh, uh, sort of, of resurgence. It's, I almost feel like there is finally there's respect with a K. Put on the name of

really good R&B. Like, do you feel as though this is now? Did you, was there ever point where you felt like it was a little hopeless like, well, yeah, this doesn't exist anymore? Because, you know, I'll go to the iTunes charts and I'll be shocked that like,

you know, like get lifted by our by John Legend is still like the, still in the top 10 of the R&B charts on iTunes. Like, it'll amaze you how deserted that, you know, those charts are right now. But, wow. You know, do you wish or envision a day where it's like, okay, we could bring the art form of singing back?

I think Bruno has brought it a long way with records like, lucky for me that's what I like. When you, I mean, them kind of joins my people out here, my guy Mars, James Poplaroy. Yeah, yeah, man. Shout out to all of the guys of 1500 and nothing. James Polleroy. Everybody like that, to me, understand where it comes from.

And so when they do it. Victoria and Monet is another one, too, man. I don't know if you. From Sacramento. Oh, she is from Sacramento. Okay. Absolutely. Yeah, absolutely.

So they get it. They totally get it. And so I think they're bringing it back around. And I just happen to be here, still here doing it. And I'm just happy to be doing it. So now, to me, it's more exciting than ever to be doing it with the authenticity that I have. You know what I mean? And I still have the understanding of today's stuff and what it is.

You know, I'm not one of them old heads that don't get it. You know what I mean? I get it all. No, man. You know, when we hung out, man, that was the thing I was just so surprised by because you were, you know, a producer that like I grew up listened to, but yet we still listen to the same things. Absolutely.

You had, you know, you had like donuts. And I was like, yeah. Oh, Bill? You was like, yeah, man. Like, you was, you know, so I think that was something that just the lesson I took from you. Right. From that, from that meeting was just how important it is to, and I tell, you know, artists all the time, you don't have to like new music, but you do, I think it's important to understand

it. Absolutely. Why it works. And understand why people gravitate. to it. And that was something I always amired about you. Like, you just were I mean, you was up on everything. Like, you knew all the shit I was listening. He was like, yeah, I got that.

And you know, hey, let's see. You was right up on it, man. Absolutely. And I'm a DJ, and that makes it, you have to know. I mean, how can you not know are you trying to spend? I mean, I'm, and I play dance. I play hip-hop. I play house. Like, you got to know what's what? I see your sets. No, you only seen that in my seat. Dude, I've seen your sets.

I mean, I'll be fucking around, man. I can never do what you do, but, you know, I love you. No, man, it's you being creative. That's everybody that you see DJing right now in the age of quarantining is, is, you know, you know, trying to get the creative juices working. I love it. I love watching DJ sets online to, you know, to see what people are into and what they play. Because you guys are so damn intimidating.

I'm like, oh, fuck it. They go, they done seven hours before I even get the fuck up. I was like, I ain't seen you pop up on my live, man. What's going on? You know what's crazy? After so much, I started doing. doing this album trying to get it ready for you guys. Okay.

Okay. I need to do more of that. Focus on your work. It's on your work. Yeah. But I'm so happy just to even be in the conversation about stuff that we love like this, bro. Like it's still here doing it. You feel me?

That's my most important thing. I'm like, man, thank God I'm still here actually doing it. A hundred percent. You know? It's just a blessing. We appreciate it. We thank you for coming on the show with us, man. This is-

Man, thank you guys. We've been trying to make this happen a long time. Yeah, I told you I was going to get it. I got you, bro, Brian. You got, man. So I ain't heard no call from like, yeah. I'm like, bro. I'm working on it.

I'm on tour. That's what you were saying, man. I love it. I love it. He was, he had spoke for me. He had spoke for me. You know what Dave? Because we made it happen.

I love you guys, man. Thank you so much. I hope this is a jump off of a whole lot of stuff to come. Once again, Brian Alexander Morgan, the great on Quest Love Supreme. We have a lot of here. sugar Steve, Franticlello Unpaid Bill

somewhere out there in the world Thank you very much for listening Thank you Thank you, thank you Thank you Thank you.

Thank you. Much Love Supreme is a production of IHeart Radio. For more podcasts from IHeart Radio, visit the IHeart Radio app,

Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. 2%. That's the number of people who take the stairs when there is also an escalator available.

I'm Michael Easter. I'm on my podcast, 2%. I break down on the signs of mental toughness, fitness, and building resilience in our strange modern world. Put yourself through some hardships, and you will come out on the other side a happier, more fulfilled, healthier person. Listen to 2%. That's TWO percent on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what you're

saying. Yep, that's me, Clifford Taylor the Fourth. You might have seen the skits, my basketball and college football journey, or my career in sports media. Well, now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfilled conversations with athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard,

but celebrated. So let's get to it. Listen to The Clifford show on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. On the Look Back at a podcast. From 1979, that was a big moment for me.

84 was big to me. I'm Sam Jay. And I'm Alex English. Each episode, we pick a year, unpack what went down, and try to make sense of how we survived it. With our friends, fellow comedians, and favorite authors. Like Mark Lamont Hill on the 80s. 84 was a wild year. It was a wild year.

I don't think there's a more important year for black people. Listen to look back at it on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an IHeart podcast. Guaranteed Human.