The Questlove Show - Questlove Supreme: Nick Lowe

Episode Date: September 25, 2024

This QLS is a special one-on-one episode between Team Supreme co-host Suga Steve and acclaimed singer-songwriter-producer Nick Lowe. During an in-depth conversation, Lowe discusses songs from his sprawling catalog—including the newly released Indoor Safari with Los Straitjackets. He recalls making a song he hoped would get him dropped from his label, and why that plan backfired. Nick talks about his expansion into production, his relationship with vinyl, and the importance of the studio. Nick also tells the story of one of his songs, which he wrote two decades before, catching a monetary tailwind on The Bodyguard Soundtrack. This special QLS episode was recorded live at Reservoir Studios and engineered by James Yost.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-heart podcast. Guaranteed human. A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what you're saying. Yep, that's me. Clifford Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits,

my basketball and college football journey, or my career in sports media. Well, now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, the Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfills of conversations with athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated.

So let's get to it. Listen to the Clifford show on the IHeard radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok podcast network on TikTok. I'm Daniel Alarcon, and this is my friend. This is much more famous than I am. I wouldn't go that far. But I'm John Green, co-host of the podcast The Away End with my old friend Daniel. On our podcast, The Away End, we'll share with you the magic of international football, all leading up to the 2026 World Cup.

Together, we'll find out why, of all the unimportant things, football, soccer is the most important. Listen to the away end with Daniel Alarcon and John Green on the IHart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hi, I'm Bob Pittman, Chairman and CEO of IHard Media, and I'm kicking off a brand new season of my podcast, Math and Magic, Stories from the Frontiers of Marketing. Math and Magic takes you behind the scenes of the biggest businesses and industries while sharing insights from the smartest minds in marketing.

Coming up this seasonal Math and Magic, CEO of of Liquid Death Mike Cesario. People think that creative ideas are like these light bulb moments that happen when you're in the shower. Or it's really like a stone sculpture. You're constantly just chipping away and refining. Take to Interactive CEO, Strauss Selnick, and our own chief business officer, Lisa Coffey. Listen to Math and Magic on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. On paper, the three hosts of the Nick Dick and Poll show are geniuses.

We can explain how AI works, data centers, but there are certain things that we don't necessarily understand. Better version of Play Stupid Games, win Stupid prizes. Yes. Which, by the way, wasn't Taylor Swift who said that for the first time. I actually thought it was. I got that wrong. But hey, no one's perfect. We're pretty close, though.

Listen to the Nick, Dick, and Paul show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. May 2nd, country's biggest stars will be in Austin, Texas. at our 2026 I Heart Country Festival presented by Capital One. C. C. Cain Brown. Parker McCollum. Riley Green. Shaboozy. Dylan Scott.

Russell Dickerson. Gretchen Wilson. Chase Matthew. Lauren Elena. Tickets are on sale now. Get yours before they sell out at Ticketmaster.com. Previously on Questlove Supreme with Johnny Morse. I'm going down this Nick Lowe rabbit hole.

I'm about to interview Nick Lowe for QLS. I heard in some interview that you're a fan of his, and I was just wondering where you caught onto that scene. All musicians, certainly of a certain age, all regard Nick Lowe is a great man, a great musician. And when I said earlier, when I was talking to Questlove about, I left school at 15 to be in a band with adults. That was to go to Nick Lowe's house and make demos.

for Elvis Costello's manager. That was the first recording studio I was ever in, and I was, I think, or maybe he was even 14. Jake Riviera? Yeah, Jake Riviera called me one day when I came home from school. I was still in my school uniform. I thought it was one of my pals playing a prank. One of my other pals had sent in a tape of my band

to Jake Riviera, and he liked it. For stiff records? Yeah, nothing came of it, but it was a big experience for me because I'd never been in a recording studio and I was in Nick Lowe's house. While we were there, Nick Lowe came back from an American tour. I didn't meet him, but I saw him.

I saw his cowboy boots wobbling up the stairs up to his bedroom. Honestly, very, very unsteadily and then heard a crash and then no one saw him for a few days. But I then worked with him because he hind.

Her first single was produced by Nick Lowe. the first Pretender single. And because I was a fan of Nick Lowe when we went in the studio to do the only recording that I did with The Pretenders, we got Nick Lowe to produce it. So I eventually got to work with Nick Lowe on a couple of songs.

And we did it in one take. And Nick was like, hey, listen, I know my reputation is that I just say one take. But really, the first take was the take. And we did it about four times. And he was right. One take.

But yeah, it was cool. Great man. Awesome. Thanks for sharing it. And now, Sugar Steve's one-on-one interview with Nick Lowe. Is the music too? So as you're walking in and listening to one of the most incredible, simply insane in 1978. I've ever seen live version, The Power of So It Goes, Rock Pile, to live performing.

You have many nicknames. In fact, Nick is your name. But how did you get the nickname, The Basher? You're not Sir Bashar at this point, are you? No, no, no. Arise, Sir Bashar. That was Dr. Fieldgood used to call me a basher. And because my dad was in the Air Force,

the popular sort of story is that all the Air Force guys used to have these rather silly nicknames, you know, Biffo and Biffos bought it and, you know, that sort of thing. And because my dad was in the Air Force, that was then my nickname. Most people think it's because at the time in one interview when I was producing records, I said to the interview, when I was asked about my technique, suppose technique that I had, I said, well, what I do is I tend to bash it down and tart it up later.

Tarting it up means sort of prettying it up, you know. You know, record it quickly and then when you get a good feel, you know, on the music, then you put the hand claps as you say and back in vocals because the feel is the important thing but I used the word bash it down and people thought

that's where basher came from I always thought it was bashing on the drums and the bass and loud punk sound so your new album I want to highlight this because it's great that there's a new album coming out from you which comes out September 13th Indoor Safari

so so interesting the story behind this album where you're able to tour a set of songs and then record the album once you've worked them out on the road. It seems like that's part of what happened here. And also, some of them were recorded previously as well and you re-recorded them or added things. Is that right? That is quite right. Yeah. We didn't have any plans to record at all when we first got together. We got together to do Christmas shows, in fact, and we didn't know whether it would work, you know, or be a success, the collaboration, but it turned out we really enjoyed it and

as time went on and we saw the audiences grow, it became apparent that it would be, well, it would be a good idea to have some sort of recording for sale on the merch table. We had no ambitions really beyond that. And I suppose we could have knocked

out an EP of covers, you know, just three or four covers, but it didn't seem to be much fun in that, you know, and And I'd started writing songs with this collaboration in mind. But the problem we ran into was with this simple, simple music, it only really comes together and gets a life after it's been played in front of an audience.

Then it gets a personality and it gets cool. But just going into studio and knocking out a song, even a simple one, is, well, you can be done, you know, but it doesn't really sort of fly, you know. But anyway, we did our best. The other thing is a recording studio. So we're sitting in this lovely room here, which you can, as soon as I walked in, you know, this is a familiar to me,

a place like this, they're becoming rarer and rarer and rarer. And yes, we're sitting in this, it's a lovely studio. And even though with our group, we've got a sort of modern sensibility about the way we want to present ourselves, you know, as being grown-ups, you know, but playing this young people's music or young people for our generation.

Anyway, it's got a retro, it's a retro vehicle for the songs. And so that means you need a room like this, really for us all to play live in, because it's not the sort of music you can do piecemeal, you know, like most records that are made on computers now. You know, the components are put down one at a time. And with this sort of music we do, it, you can't, it doesn't work like that. It doesn't sound any good, you know, it's got to be played live. and you need a room like this.

Well, unfortunately, most studios, they've all gone, like this, have all gone. And most pop music is made in little rooms, maybe two rooms, one with a computer in, and the other one with a kidder drums and some sort of keyboard. And that's fair enough,

but that's how we made these records, because we'd have to book a studio in one of the cities we were visiting on our tour, because I live in London, they live in the United States. And we never knew what we were going to get, but we'd cram into the little room with the kid of drums in it and the synthesizer, you know, and do our best to play these things. But so when Yep Rock suggested that we put these three four-track CDs

that we put on the merch table, when they suggested that we made a compilation album, I could see the wisdom in that, But I've really thought we should revisit the tunes Because they were they were good tunes and and I'm not prolific enough to be able to just throw them away, you know And come up with a brand spanking new bunch. So I thought we should Re-record some of these things. So it's almost like we released the demos before the Right, right. But how did you end up making the whole thing sound so cohesive? It doesn't sound like it was recorded in various this or that I

I'm so glad that you asked me that, Steve. That is down to the great Alex Hall, who is someone I have admired for a while. He's engineered and produced some of my favorite records. He's got a studio in Chicago, and he oversaw the re-recording, and plus the new tune. We did, I don't know, two or three new tunes as well. It's down to him that he gave all these tracks

that were recorded over three years, this cohesive sound. Secret weapon, I assume, is those straight jackets for this record. I mean, there seems to be a real love affair between you and that band, a mutual admiration type thing. They do instrumental versions of your songs. You give them a little mini set in the middle of your live show to do their thing. It's an incredible match, really, musically and texturally. I've seen your show with them a number of times, and it puts me in a trance.

Like, I get hypnotized watching them do their thing. They're like a machine, but they're human, and there's this preciseness to it all, but there's also this looseness to it all, which I assume is the best of, or exactly what you're looking for in a backing band. Yeah, as I say, I didn't know it was going to work. You know, it wasn't something I'd been, because I've known them for a long time, you know, before we started working together. And I always thought they were great, you know, but I didn't know that this was going to happen. this strange thing where the two of us create a third element, you know. It works so well because they're doing their thing and then there you are sort of floating on top of it all with your vocal and your acoustic guitar and it works. When we started, we had to start somewhere, of course.

And when we did our first show, we played at First Avenue, that club in Minneapolis. And the club owners allowed us to rehearse there, you know, for a couple of days before. our first show in the club, which was very nice of them. And so we had to start somewhere, and I'd already sent them a list of songs I thought could work, along with the Christmas songs,

what you were doing, you know, some of my catalogue tunes, and bless their hearts, you know, they'd learnt up the records as best they could, although there are keyboards on a lot of my tunes, my early tunes. And they've done the best to learn up the records.

And that really lasted for about 20 minutes or something before we mutually agreed that we'll forget about that and just make it up ourselves, you know, and just do the song as if we were hearing it for the first time. And that's when it started getting in gear. It's a regular Niccolo album because all the songs are good. I've been leaning into Blue on Blue. You've been playing that as part of the live set as well. Trombone is my favorite. It's one of those songs where it's like, ah. this dude just went and wrote a song called trombone, you know.

One of those things like, how did nobody think of that yet? Of course, there's no trombone in the song. Or I believe there's two versions. Yeah. One with, one without, I don't know. But I'm a huge Roy Orbison fan. Was he any influence on you in your life or on that song at all? Actually, what I sort of thought I was channeling was Neil Diamond on that

because it's sort of a trombone, come play. or song. So it seemed to... I mean, I heard Nick Lowe, but that climactic ending, you know, it feels like... I guess so, yes. I can't quite do it, you know. Exactly. You hit the Nick Lowe version of that at the end. The first time I saw you or met you was at David Letterman taping in 2008. I think it must have been a Thursday when a show does two shows. They were camera blocking or sound checking, both music acts that they were going to have to

record that day. And it turns out one was the root. and one was you. And you were probably promoting at my age. I was on stage with the roots, setting mics or whatever, and I look out to the audience. One person sitting in the audience, Nick Lowe. You know how a fan thinks, this is my chance, you know.

So I walk out there, and I mutter something completely incoherent about the Bay City Rollers and have no idea what you said, and I walked away. The second time I met you was at the Tonight Show in 2012 promoting this old magic. And you came into the Roots rehearsal room and you signed a few records for me

and I muttered something incoherent about the Bay City Rollers. More recently, backstage at a Costello show in 2023 last year, saw you backstage and muttered something incoherent to you about the Bay City Rollers. So I am a huge Bay City Rollers fan from back in the day

and you have this connection to them and I want you to tell the story of Bay City Rollers We Love You and what that was all about and then I have sort of a production follow-up question about all that. Oh, well, I hope this isn't going to sort of burst your bubble, you know, because I'm not a particular fan. Yes, you are.

I know you are. I'm here to get you to admit it. That's what this is all about. But go ahead, yeah. Well, after the group I was in Brinsley Schwartz split up, I was at a bit of a loose end in terms of what to do. Because by this time I'd fallen in with a guy called Jake Riviera, who was a, he managed another band that we were friends, the Brinsley's were friends with. And I started hanging out with Jake more and more and I'd stay over, sleep on his couch, you know, in his slightly grubby flat in South Kensington. And we both could feel something was coming over the hill.

You know, we knew that something was up. This is like 1976. Yeah, 75, maybe 75, 76. We could sort of feel it. And we had friends in New York as well who were feeling the same way. What it was was the punk explosion, which came from New York, really. I mean, London did something else with it, you know. But we could feel this change in the air.

And Jake started managing me and he couldn't get, he couldn't really get anyone interested in me so I could get a record deal. I was still with a United Artist then. That's the Brinsley's label. And I sort of had to get out of my contract with United Artists in order to do something else, go somewhere else. And I thought what I should do is to make a really terrible record

and say that this is the direction I want to go in, you know, so they say, well, we can't, do that. So I came up with this idea of doing this fan record for the Bay City Rollers. I'm really sorry, Steve, I've got to tell you this, man, because I'm sorry what I have to tell you after this. Well, I came up with this song, Bay City Rollers, We Love You, and I got a few cats into, to do the, do the record. And we, you. got some the local kids school in to sing and the chorus and handed it into United Artists and instead of them saying that oh well thanks very much Nick goodbye they thought it was really good yes they did and so they you know they wouldn't let they wouldn't let me go allegedly

they released it in Japan where they where the basically rollers were really big and it was quite a successful record, but I don't know how true that is. Okay, well, this was the first song you ever produced. I think it probably was, actually, yeah. Okay, so that being said, the production style that you did in this novelty song or however you want to qualify it, you did a great job, first of all,

of making it sound like a bass theater roller song, as well as in a later song called Roller's Show. Yeah. What I'm asking you is, do you feel in the making of that record that you might have stumbled upon, something that helped to create your later production style or the production style for rock pile or for your first couple solo albums, let's say. Did you find some secret in there,

in the engineering or in the production that maybe you liked, maybe in the arrangements? So my question is, was there anything you discovered that you carried over into your regular productions? It's a great question. You know, I've never thought about that. But there, I think there is some, there sort of was because I was really, uh, um, Gotcha. We're all about gotcha journalism. It took me a long time to become friends with Dave, Dave Edmonds. He was always was a, um, a real loner, you know.

And when I eventually got his attention, he let me sit in it in the studio and he was recording. I loved his records, you know, and he used to do everything himself. And he would invite me into the studio really as an audience, you know, of one. So, and he wouldn't talk to me much, but I'd sit there and watch him. And then it's bit by bit, you know, he'd get me to go and scratch a mic to see if it was on, you know, or drop him in, you know, he used to show me how to drop in his guitar and he was doing guitar part sitting at the desk, you know, and then eventually go out and do a hand clap, you know, or go and sing a harmony. And bit by bit, we started doing it together in a way, but I was very much the second class citizen, you know, he did it all. But I watched him

very carefully, and he was fantastic in the studio. So you could do this with analog equipment, as you definitely know, that you can make analog equipment, a record. equipment do stuff that it doesn't it shouldn't really be made to do which you can't do on digital maybe you can but I it sound it just protests in the most horrible way you know it does not whereas analog stuff doesn't and he was so great at playing the desk you know making the desk mistreating it in sure case those are the best sounds yeah he was a great influence on me so when I went to this studio to do the basic role as for a start off it was where all the London reggae records were made.

And the guy who engineered it was the guy who engineered all these reggae records. So it had a pretty cool sound. You know, the studio did have a pretty cool sound. And I was also in my bid to imitate the Bay City Rollers for the purposes of that record, you know, some of their signature tropes, you know. There was a style of British pop records at the time. Music that I didn't really like, it was all the top ten stuff. all had this sort of sound.

And I was trying to imitate it. I tried it out to see if I could do it in the studio for this record, to see if I could do a sort of mash-up of the reggae engineer with this basically role of sort of sheen, you know, which it was the wrong studio to accomplish that. But it was a little suggestion of it, really. But then I think in the future, I started to get interested in doing slightly anarchic,

writing songs, slightly unusual in some way, but trying to put a sheen of respectability on it, like this kind of corny pop sound, you know, or my version of it anyway. I was trying to imitate it. I didn't know really how to do it. But I've never thought about it to you ask me that question. Well, I mean, you can do corny things as long as you do them in a cool way. Sort of, yeah. So you go, you know, what the hell is this kind of music? Right. And well, what the how kind of music was it? You know, the Basie Rollers,

they seem to be doing their own version of like a retro thing. I think that was their producers, you know, I think they did what they were told, you know? Right, right. To be honest, we do. Bassey Rollers We Love You does sound like a novelty song, but Roller Show sounds like just a kick-ass song, especially the way it was recorded.

But since you segued a little bit into Dave Edmonds, he must be considered one of your musical soulmates. But I want to just for a second, Terry Williams and Billy Bremner. Can you please tell us a little bit more about the lesser known two of that band, Billy Bremner on guitar and vocals and Terry Williams on drums?

Yes, with pleasure, yeah. By the sort of mid-1970s, Dave and I had become more equal, actual friends, you know, I wasn't just this kid who went and... Tea boy. Tea boy, yeah, exactly, yeah. So we were more, friends and we used to

you know I was sort of effectively out of work really but we used to and Dave lived in North London but in between us was this pub called the Churchill on Church Street Kensington maybe some of your listeners will know it's quite a well known pub and we

used to meet there just about every evening and have a drink or two and we would discuss the possibility of putting a group together. Well, Edmonds was absolutely dead set against it. He said, I've done all that.

You know, I was in bands, you know, I don't want to be in a band anymore. Until he'd had a couple of beers and then he'd start changing his mind about it, you know. And then he said, well, if we did, if we did, who would we get?

So I had a couple of ideas about people, you know, who could maybe approach and he didn't think much of my ideas. is, but he, Terry Williams was the guy who first, because he was Welsh also, as Dave was Welsh. And he played with a band called Man, who were a kind of, I was just thinking there was like a kind of San Francisco group, you know, they were like Moby Grape or, or, uh, Quicksilver Messenger service or one of those kind of great.

I like those bands. Yeah, oh no, they were terrific. Man were great, but Terry was some, really something, you know. but they were very, very tight those guys. They were really, really tight. And I said, well, Terry's not going to leave man.

And Dave said, no, he's not. So therefore, let's stop thinking about it. But anyway, Terry did. So suddenly we had a drummer and we approached Terry and he was keen. And then Edmund said, well, we aren't, there's no, who are we going to get to play guitar? No one knows how to play any decent guitar, you know.

And then he went to see this group one night. They were a sort of pub group. really, called Fatso. And they were a sort of a comedy group, really. But he said, they've got a fantastic guitar player. He said, and he can see,

he got really vived up about it. And it was actually Billy, who made Edmonds agree to put this band together. They're fantastic. You know, Terry is really unbelievable. Unfortunately, he doesn't play anymore. Oh, okay.

Billy Bremner? Billy does. In fact, Billy plays in, He lives in Sweden now, and he plays with a sort of rock pile tribute group called the Rock Files or something. And they tour. Actually, they sound sort of more like Rock Pile than Rock Pile did. Many things I know it's about Rock Pile, but something interesting, there's no keyboards in Rock Pile, just like those straitjackets. And you see some obvious similarities between those two bands?

I didn't. but I sort of do now. The precision of it all and the looseness like I said earlier and the rock and rollness of it all. Yes, yes. They're quite different players but in the respect

you just mentioned there's a lot of similarities. I'm a far-feza Vox guy, you know, with organ. I prefer, I love that sort of sound when a keyboard is needed in that era, on piano of course. But I don't want to sound like a Luddite,

you know, I don't mind plugging in a synthesize, So, you know, and fiddling around until you, well, not for too long. There's something about just a guitar group and trying to imitate a keyboard, getting a part that it will imitate a keyboard, to suggest a keyboard part that is more fun in a way and quite liberating. You know, I think Rock Pile is vastly unheralded as a kick-ass band, as one of the great bands.

Because you guys have locked in, it seems like you all knew exactly what to do. to create what you were trying to create. How come you didn't just take up the guitar in the band? Billy Bremmer's a lead guitarist. Yeah. So maybe you're not as facile as he is in that regard? Oh, definitely. I can't play anything like that.

No, I'm a strummer. I'm a pretty good strummer, you know, but I am a strummer. Yeah, he was playing lead and rhythm all at the same time. Yeah, he's a really cracking guitar player, yeah. It's just incredible. So behind the scenes of, a lot of those records and Costello's records.

I'm an engineer by trade, so please tell me about Roger Baccarian. He was fantastic. He was, he was, um, he was very sort of square guy. He was suddenly thrust into this quite manic, you know, situation with this, certainly with the bands that I was working with.

He was a great engineer and one of those guys who kept his head when everyone was, you know, talking at once and freaking out, you know, and come on, let's do it now, you know. And people used to get very excited when we made records back then. And he was really great at running a really cool ship,

you know, and he was a very sort of kind of, I suppose in a way, the stories you hear about George Martin, you know, and the Beatles, he was, George Martin was the sort of square. I bet Roger wasn't old, you know, much older. He was the same age as the rest of us. But he was a very moderating influence

and a really great engineer. Yeah, I've stolen a lot of tricks from his records just trying to figure out and study the engineering on the Costello records that you produced and your own records. I was working with Elvis on a song and I was treating his background vocals like it was armed forces.

And he said, how did you get that sound? from, I said, just from figuring it out over the years. And I don't want to get too deep into talking about Elvis, even though you and I, perhaps, the two greatest producers of Elvis Costello album, sitting in one room finally. What was it like just to stand there and watch him make these masterpieces with your help, of course, his first five albums, later Blood and Chocolate? Did you know you were in the middle of something historical in rock and roll?

And what was that experience like to be in the producer's chair for armed forces, let's say? really didn't feel like that. It felt it felt totally just making records. Yeah it seemed like everyone had an idea you know and there were so many people around at that time that we knew like Chrissy Chrissy Hine for instance who comes to mind you know Joe Jackson was recording when we were doing armed forces Joe was in the daytime he was in that in the Eden studios during the day when we cross he was doing that better for girls record with that with Richard gotherer And it seemed like there were so many people had ideas, you know, and it seemed like this is Elvis's ideas, you know. I felt at that time very much like you had to serve your time in a sort of a holding pattern, waiting in obscurity, you know, doing shows and going up, going in the vans, up and down the country, and over to Germany and Holland.

We used to play in Holland all the time, waiting for this kind of voice to, I mean, I don't know if you have this. over here, but in the UK, in banks and the post office and things, you form a line waiting, you know, and suddenly a voice comes, cashier number five, please. And in this sort of irritating rise and fall voice, you know, and a voice, celestial voice says cashier number five. We have next. That's our version. Okay, well, next will do. But anyway, that's what it seemed like. And then your chance comes. And I felt, and I stepped up, I had my break. You know, my break turned up.

And I, if you hang around long enough, it will come to everyone. Everyone gets their break. And what they do with it, who knows? What are you considering your break? Producing Miami's True or something like that? In the great scheme of things, it probably is. I mean, I did Graham Parker's album. That was the first thing I did, howling wind.

It was the first thing I did. It could have been that. even have been when I got the call to join Brinsley Schwartz's group, which was called Kippington Lodge then, you know, it might have been when I got that call. But we did, we certainly did our, paid our dues, you know. You had, it seems like multiple breaks. Yeah, but the, but the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, I, I'd say Graham, actually, Graham Parker. Graham Parker and the room are Howling Wind between you and me. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yes, a great cut. A great cut. Yes. And a terrific song. Yeah, soulful song. Yeah, he's very soulful.

A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what you're saying. Yep, that's me, Clifford Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place. for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment,

and the next we'll talk about life, mental health, purpose, and even music. The Clifford Show isn't just a podcast, it's a space for honest conversations, stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger. So, if you've ever supported me, or you're just chasing down a dream, this is right where you need to be. Listen to the Clifford show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. I'm John Green.

You may know me as the author of The Fault and Our Stars. And now, I guess also is the co-host of The Away End, a brand new world soccer podcast. I'm Daniel Alarcon, a writer and journalist. And John and I have known each other since we were kids. My first World Cup was Mexico 86. I was nine years old. I watched every game. and I fell in love.

On our new podcast, The Away End, we'll share with you the magic of international football, all leading up to the 2026 World Cup. For us, soccer, football, is a story we've shared for over 30 years since Daniel was the star player on our high school soccer team.

Very debatable. And I was their most loyal and sometimes only fan. I love this game. I love its history, its hope, it's heartbreak, and above all, it's beauty. Together, we'll find out why,

of all the unimportant things, football, soccer, is the most important. Listen to the away end with Daniel Auerkone and John Green on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I feel like it was a little bit unbelievable until I really start making money. It's Financial Literacy Month, and the podcast, Eating While Broke, is bringing real conversations about money, growth, and building your future. This month, hear from top streamer, Zoe Spencer, and venture capitalist, Lakeisha Landrum Pierre as they share their journeys from starting out to leveling up.

If I'm outside with my parents and they're seeing all these people come up to me for pictures, it's like, what? Today now, obviously, it's like 100%. They believe everything. But at first, it was just like, you got to go get a real job. There's an economic component to community striving. If there's not enough money and entrepreneurship happening in communities, they fail. And what I mean by fail is they don't have money to pay for food.

They cannot feed their kids. They do not have homes. communities don't work unless there's money flowing through them. Listen to Eating While Broke from the Black Effect Podcast Network on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Hi, I'm Bob Pittman, Chairman and CEO of IHard Media, and I'm kicking off a brand new season of my podcast, Math and Magic, stories from the Frontiers of Marketing. Math and Magic takes you behind the scenes of the biggest businesses and industries while sharing insights from the smartest minds in marketing. I'm talking to leaders from the entertainment industry to finance and everywhere in between. This seasonal math and magic, I'm talking to CEO of Liquid Death Mike Cesario, financier and public health advocate, Mike Milken,

take two interactive CEO, Strauss-Zalny. If you're unable to take meaningful creative risk and therefore run the risk of making horrible creative mistakes, then you can't play in this business. Sesame Street CEO Sherry Weston and her own chief business officer, Lisa Coffey. Making consumers see the value of the human voice and to have that guaranteed human promise behind it really makes it rise to the top. Listen to math and magic, stories from the frontiers of marketing on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. When you listen to podcasts about AI and tech and the future of humanity, the hosts always act like they know what they're talking about and they are experts at everything. Here, the Nick Dick and Poll Show, we're not afraid to make mistakes. What Cougler did that I think was so unique.

He's the writer-director. Who do you think he is? I don't know. You meet the president? You think Canada has a president? You think China has a president? The law crusade. God, I love that thing.

I use it all the time. I wrap it in a blanket and sing to it at night. It's like the old Polish saying, not my monkeys, not my circus. It was a good one. I like that thing. It is an actual Polish saying. It is a lot.

It is an actual poll. Yeah. Better version of Play Stupid Games, win stupid prizes. Yes. Which, by the way, wasn't Taylor Swift, who said that for the first time.

I actually, I thought it was. I got that wrong. Listen to the Nick, Dick, and Paul show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. You and Elvis both on Columbia at that time,

and Joe Jackson and Squeeze and the police, all on A&M. So was there any kind of competitiveness between what was going on with your scene at Columbia and these other quote-unquote new wave artists that were doing it at A&M with guys like John Wood and Joe Boyd,

the engineer producers for them. Joe Boyd was really a generation before, you know, he was... Yeah, he did like Pink Floyd and stuff like that, right? Yeah, he was with that lot. And also he did... God, what was the name of the guy, singer-songwriter who...

Nick Drake? Yeah, Nick Drake, of course, yeah. He did a lot of folk rock stuff, Fairport convention. John Wood, though, was the younger one? Yeah, he was. I can't remember who he... He did all the squeeze records. Oh, squeeze records, yeah, of course, yeah. But A&M seemed to have caught on to whatever you might want to call it. We're not going to ever get to discussing...

We don't want to talk genres. Well, we're not going to, no, unfortunately. We don't want to incur Elvis's displeasure. But yeah, A&M seemed to be hip to that as well. What do most people call it post-punk? New Wave come directly out of punk? I suppose it did, really, wasn't it? the punk thing was over pretty quick and sort of lit of fuse under something else.

I think that's what we're taught is that new wave comes out of punk. But let's not go there. I have too many other questions for the amount of time. I'd rather ask you a couple more random questions, things that I've always been curious about. Something I also asked Elvis was,

why were you not at Do They Know It's Christmas? I'm a huge fan of We Are the World and do they know it's Christmas? And I asked Elvis and he said, well, I was dreadfully unpopular at that moment. And nobody thought to call me, basically. Oh, is that what he said? Yeah.

Really? Well, because good, Brad, cruel world had just come out. Yeah. No, I, no, I've, yeah. And he also said, you know, kind of a different scene, but it seems like you should have been there. Were you called? No, no, not remotely. No, I never thought, thought I would be.

But because it's very kind of you to think that I might have had a call to go and do that. But I wasn't really, I've always had a bit of an, rightly or wrongly, you know, I've always had a bit of an aversion to that, oh, we're all brothers in music, you know, sort of stuff. I'd rather put a check in the post, you know. So what's your record collection like? Do you still have your records from your life?

I do, yeah. I have, I have, but, you know, my real good pals of all, passed on really and so I don't I used to have these great sort of dinner parties around at my house so all-male all-male dinner parties we used to we used to sit around sort of listening to our own records and you know and and others besides and because they're you know because they're you know because they're gone that doesn't really happen anymore I listen to quite a lot of music now but not really, you know, I've got sort of rows of dusty CDs, you know, up there that I never listen to them anymore. I've got a really good stereo, which is pretty much unused now.

But I listen to lots of music, but like everybody else, listen to it online. You know, I just want to hear the tunes, you know, that sort of bathing in the sound of a vinyl, you know, on huge speakers, you know, in a darkened room. sounds I wouldn't mind going around to somebody's house and having that experience you know for one one off but it's not something that I if I want to hear a record I think it's quite handy just to be able to press a couple of buttons and out it comes of the out of your car

radio you know even if it's not super high-fi I just want to hear the tune you know and the lyric and the yeah sounds like you need a turn to go How dare you? No, well, like I said, I have a record label and we're all analog And so we do everything for the vinyl record at the end of the process I have got vinyl, but in boxes in my cellar

Boxes and boxes of vinyl records, but I haven't got a vinyl player Yeah I just got a CD one when they came in and that's where it's that's all come to a grinding halt now So I listen to it on like music online really I've painted a pretty desperate picture Yeah, well, I'll get a truck and back it up to your dusty garage and take care of it. There's somebody who wrote a funny song called I Love My Label. Outside of Yep Rock, what was your favorite or least favorite experiences with different record labels over the years?

Oh my gosh. Well, I think probably that my least favorite was disappointing was Parlophone, which was Kippington Lodge's label, which was the same label actually as a piece. on the Beatles records because they were on Parlophone as well in the UK. So we were thrilled to be on Parlophone but the deal

that all those bands like us there was hundreds they had hundreds of bands that they signed with the deal was pitiful really really pitiful you know like usury really

so we started off on Parlophone and after that we went to Liberty which changed its name to United Artists Right. From there, I went to Stiff. And Stiff, I went to Radar in the UK,

which is another independent label, and Columbia. And then after that, I went through a few of them, very rapidly, RCA, Warner Brothers, Little Village, I think we're on, it might have been on Reprise.

Was Little Village some take on the traveling wheelberries? Well, no, we had the same drummer, of course. Chelms. Yeah. And it was a sort of a, not in the same league, let's face it, but in, you know, it was a collection of faces, you know, sort of kind of second division faces. So you didn't mention F beat and Demon. I've never known what those are. Are those labels?

Yeah, they were run by Jake Riviera's labels. But Demon was essentially a reissue label. They had, they used to buy up, you know, jazz and R&B. records, you know, in the past. Were you on Columbia before Elvis, or was it simultaneous? I was on Columbia really because of Elvis. Elvis sort of said, if you sign me, you've got to sign Nick Lowe, you know, which is very nice of him. The Jake Riviera, you keep mentioning, he was the co-founder of Stiff with somebody named Dave

Robinson. Yes, yeah. And Dave Robinson was the producer for all the Brinsley Schwartz records. Is that right? Yeah, yes. I can't remember him doing much producing, but he definitely sat in the room. And so those two guys started a record label called Stiff,

and you were the in-house producer for that? Purely because I'd been in a recording studio more than the other two. Well, speaking of studios, so is Eden your sort of favorite home of all time with regards to your catalog? It was a super studio, but I love Pathway, you know, where we recorded a lot of, well,

Aim is true, yeah. Aim is true. But a lot of other records of I think Sultons of Swing was recorded in there. Wow. Maybe even Roxanne, the police. For a while, everybody recorded in there. I love the sound of Breaking Glass. I recorded in there.

A whole wide world, a new rose, you know, the Dam's album. And it was a tiny, tiny, tiny little room. But it just had this fantastic sound. It was freezing cold in the winter and baking hot in the summer. So you wanted to get the job done pretty as quick as you could because you could get out of there, but it sounded fantastic. Can you please tell us the story of Curtis Steiger and the Bodyguard soundtrack? One of your most famous compositions, What's So Funny About Peace Love and Understanding,

was covered and recorded by an artist named Curtis Steiger. And one way or another, for one reason or another, that song ended up on the Bodyguard soundtrack, a soundtrack which sold five zillion copies. before streaming music when people had to buy hard copies of things. And just the appearance of your composition, even though you weren't the one performing it, gave you some outrageous royalty check that bailed you out at a rough time and helped you continue on. Yeah, I can certainly tell you that. I thought you were referring to something else, actually.

Tell me the story I don't know. I'd have to tell you when the mics are off, man. Okay, fair enough. No, well, I'm asking you about the one that's more well known. I'll tell you with pleasure about Curtis. And this is what Curtis told me, anyway. He was on Arista. There you go.

Yeah. Right. That's the label that came out. Yeah, exactly. And anyway, he was told by, who was the head of Arista? I can't remember what he's called? Clive Davis. Clive Davis, indeed.

Clive Davis called Curtis in. They didn't kind of know, or he didn't know quite what direction to go in. He'd had a few hits, you know, but he was looking for a change. And Clive told, to. told him about this movie that they were planning to do, starring Whitney Houston and Kevin Costner, and said what you could start by doing is submitting some songs for this movie, because we've got high hopes for it. And Curtis said that he went in, he had a few tunes. He went in there into the studio, and they put down these tunes that he had. And whoever was

overseeing it said have you got anything else rather rudely in my view I think it's a bit rude to say someone's submitting songs for their own compositions you know have you got anything else and he said well

no not really but but we have got this song that we've just started doing in our set this Nick Lowe song called Peace Love and Understanding he said all right we'll bung that down so he did that on the session and that's the one they picked to put in the movie

and as you as you say it sold zillions and zillions and my my cut as writer wasn't actually that much but when it comes not very much multiplied by you know zillion zillions turns out to be a very tasty check indeed

and as time went on you know, as it got bigger and bigger and more and more, you know, sold one million, two million, three. I thought, no, they, please, you know, they can't go any higher than that. It was going eight, nine, ten, you know, it was going through the roof.

And so eventually, when he got up to about eight or nine million copies sold, I thought, well, I think I ought to extend the hand of friendship to this guy, you know. So I got in touch with him and said, you know to say thanks thanks there was so much you know couldn't have come at a better time and we and we became friends as a result of it I know what you told them here's what's so funny about

but anyway I did say Curtis do you I'm sorry that they picked my tune you know and I do hope that you got some kind of something out of it you know and he said to me, he didn't tell me what it was, but he said, don't worry, I was very well taken care of. So what, what that, I never probed him further than that. Right, right. But that could be just a front end thing and no back end and, you know, who knows what it was.

He tells me he's very happy. I'm happy for him. I'm super happy for him. I can sleep at night. And that wasn't like the single or even like a big part of the movie or anything like that. Just imagine the, the guy who wrote the B side of the single, which also went on the album, an English guy called Adrian someone or other, who's in a band, so heavy metal band in the 60s called The Gun. And he wrote, so he had my cut, plus he had the B side of Whitney's,

you know, can you imagine that? I've never heard. Dali Parton was making the money from that, from the A side. From the A side. But nonetheless, the A side had a B side on it, you know, so he got a double bubble, really. There was no second single from the Bodyguard soundtrack. track that you could have been the B-side on? No. Sadly not. Well, it just goes to show you, you know, what could happen with some song you wrote a long time ago. You had written that song.

Yeah, early 70s, yeah. Yeah, early 70s. So that's good. My one last question is, pinker and prouder than previous. I think it's my favorite, perhaps, outside of one or two others. That's great that you think that, yeah. Well, do you think that is my question? Well, I was trying to record in a way.

that I couldn't persuade anyone was a good idea. I wanted to do this sort of low-fi kind of thing. I couldn't get anyone to sort of help me with it. So in some respects, it worked. But I was groping my way to something that I got better at a little later on. Recording live. Yes, yes.

Because this is kind of blood and chocolate-y. Yeah, I persuaded Elvis to have a go at doing that sort of thing on blood and chocolate, yeah. Well, that came first, though. And then this was after that. Yeah, I think you're probably right. Right, yeah. Yeah, I don't know.

This one, maybe just how soon after I discovered your music that I came across this. Maybe this was the first one that had come out since I had become a fan or that kind of thing. I'm really pleased that you think that. You don't, this is not considered one of your masterpieces? I said, oh, I don't consider any of them to be masterpieces. Well, you know, a Nick Lowe masterpiece. I think that there are moments on that record, yeah. There are.

I think there are moments on it, yeah. You're my wildest dream, one of my favorite songs by you. crying in my sleep, maybe my second favorite song by you, and Big Hair. Oh, yeah, yeah. Big Hair. In closing, September 13th is the release date for, I was about to say, indoor fireworks, Indoor Safari on Yep Rock Records by the incredible Nick Lowe. So pleased and blessed to have you here today and to be able to spread the gospel of you as an artist and your catalog as an incredible discography.

That's very kind of you, man. Thank you. Thank you so much to everybody involved in putting this together from Yep Rock and from the QLS side. I am Sugar Steve and we will see you on the next go-round. Thank you, Nick. Thank you, Steve. Because the stuff we do is simply... We. Comes out as rock and roll.

Cool, thank you. Thank you very much. There's no way you can write an up-tempo beat item. New with three chords and it doesn't come out as rock and roll. And foremost in my curiousness. That was a lovely, flattering introduction, by the way, oh. And I like my curiousness. Can everyone remember the arrangement of it, all right?

Do I sound confused? It's the intro. You do it, however many bars it is. It's bang, bang, bang, bang, bang, bang, bang, bang, bang, bang, bang, bang, bang, bang. About as many as that. Thank you, Nick. Thank you, Nick. Thank you, Nick. Thank you Nick. Thank you, Nick. Thank you, Nick. Thank you, Nick. Thank you, Nick. Well, thanks ever so much, you. Thank you. I appreciate it.

You said some extremely nice things. I'll take all that out. No mind, try it again. All right, we'll get one more bash if it doesn't work. Quincy Jones told us on Questlove Supreme that it's what you take out of the mix that will define the song. Less can not only be more, it can be much more. However, a win is a win. A win. A win is a win.

Yep, that's me, Clivert Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, my basketball and college football journey, or my career in sports media. Well, now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Cliford Show. This is a place for raw, unfilled of conversations with athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. So let's get to it. Listen to The Cliford Show on the IHeard Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok podcast. Network on TikTok.

I'm Daniel Alarcon, and this is my friend. It's much more famous than I am. I wouldn't go that far, but I'm John Green, co-hosted the podcast The Away End with my old friend Daniel. On our podcast, The Away End, we'll share with you the magic of international football, all leading up to the 2026 World Cup. Together, we'll find out why, of all the unimportant things, football, soccer, is the most important.

Listen to the Away End with Daniel Alarcon and John Green on the IHeart Radio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever. you get your podcasts. Hi, I'm Bob Pittman, chairman and CEO of IHard Media, and I'm kicking off a brand new season of my podcast, Math and Magic, stories from the frontiers of marketing.

Math and Magic takes you behind the scenes of the biggest businesses and industries while sharing insights from the smartest minds in marketing. Coming up this seasonal Math and Magic, CEO of Liquid Death Mike Sessario. People think that creative ideas are like these light bulb moments that happen when you're in the shower.

It's really like a stove, sculpture. You're constantly just chipping away and refining. Take two interactive CEO, Strauss Seldin, and our own chief business officer, Lisa Coffey. Listen to Math and Magic on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. On paper, the three hosts of the Nick Dick and Poll show are geniuses. We can explain how AI works, data centers, but there are certain things that we don't necessarily understand. Better version of Play Stupid Games, Win Stupid Prizes. Yes. which, by the way, wasn't Taylor Swift, who said that for the first time.

I actually, I thought it was. I got that wrong. But hey, no one's perfect. We're pretty close, though. Listen to the Nick, Dick, and Paul show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Saturday, May 2nd, country stars will be in Austin, Texas. At our 2026, IHard Country Festival presented by Capital One. Tickets are on sale now.

Get yours before they sell out at Ticketmaster.com. That's Ticketmaster.com. This is an I-heart podcast. Guaranteed human.