The Rachel Cruze Show - How to Use the Enneagram to Save Money

Episode Date: March 29, 2021

Some of us are spenders and some of us are savers, and we all have room to grow! So, in this episode of The Rachel Cruze Show, we’re talking about how to save money using the Enneagram, how to cut your expenses, and more. You’ll learn: How to save more money based on your Enneagram type Eight ways to cut your expenses in half How your childhood affects the way you approach money today Resources: Minno Start your free trial of Ramsey+ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

knowing what that bribe is along the way, meshes that logical and feeling together. And it has to create more of a marathon mindset. Like, that's what allows you to keep going. Hey guys, welcome to another episode of the Rachel Cruz Show podcast. I'm so glad that you're here. Well, in this episode, I'm going to interview best-selling author and Enneagram expert Ian Kron.

And we're going to talk about the thinking brain versus the feeling brain and how each Enneagram type uses them when it comes to saving money. Then I'm going to answer a question from Jessica, and she asked her question through our Ask Rachel email. And her question is all about raising kids when her and her husband didn't grow up

with a great relationship with money because they really want to change their family tree. And I know that's a lot of people's motivation out there, so we'll talk through that. But first, let's talk about how you can cut your expenses in half. You heard that right, in half. So take a listen. Well, around here, we're always looking at ways

for you to save money. So let's talk about eight ways to cut your expenses in half. Number one, switch cell phone carriers. In many cases, just doing this one switch, you guys, you can save more than half of your monthly bill. Like, so much money, so much money. But what it takes is to shop around. Now, I'm going to give you a list of some carriers to look into. And listen, you may not recognize some of the names, but the great thing is they use networks from bigger names. So it's pretty fantastic. And again, they're very fantastic. And again, they're low-cost cell phone plans. Tllo, which piggybacks off of T-Mobile's network.

It starts at $10 a month. Red Pockets, it uses the same major services that you know about, and it starts around $10 a month. Ultra Mobile, it's $30 a month, and it includes more data than all the others. Air Voice, this is on AT&T's network, and has unlimited calls and text for $30 a month. Yahoo Mobile runs on Verizon's network and gives you unlimited calls, texts, and data for $40 a month.

Unbelievable. So, the cell phone, great place to cut your monthly expenses in half. Number two, trade in your car. Okay, I'm not the only one who says this. People do this, you guys. I'm telling you it takes such a weight off their shoulders when they don't have a car payment. You know, they have a nice luxury SUV with a nice luxury car payment. sell the SUV, get a used car, and again, it hurts for a little bit.

It's like, ugh. And you can give the luxury SUV back again, okay? But for that moment, you don't have a car payment, and it's amazing. Number three, meal prep. If you spend like $500 a month eating out at restaurants, why don't you commit to next month cutting it down to $250. Cut it in half. That way, this is going to force you to eat at home and meal prep. This is what we do in my household. Every Sunday night, we love it. look at the week ahead and say, okay, what's going on every night of the week? And we plan out. We say, okay, chick filet this night, eating in this night, we'll make Mexican, or in this night,

we'll do Greek. Okay, that night we're going out with friends. Like, you just plan out your meals and know ahead of time, because here's the deal. If you don't plan ahead ahead, you're going to get home to be 4, 4.30, and you're thinking, what's for dinner, and you can't figure out things to put together, and you just end up just getting food to go. So, planning ahead of time, it helps, again, with the sanity and knowing what to buy at the grocery store. So you're not frantically walking down the aisles and spending more money. All right, next step is review your subscriptions and memberships.

So think beyond just Netflix and Hulu. Think about all the random reoccurring charges that you possibly forgot about. The apps that you bought to maybe the year, you know, the year's coming up and it's going to charge you like a bunch of money right there to get that app for that new year. Or workout classes.

gyms, if you're not going to gym, iCloud storage, magazines, maybe you're paying for data on your cell phone and you're not using it. Be thorough, because I promise you can save money. Next is shop at thrift stores or Poshmark. So this is

great because you can find some really quality pieces and nice brands for a huge discount. Like several things on this list, you might be tempted to discount some of this because you've never heard of it, but trust me, go in and look. When you try something different, you get a different result. And that's what we're wanting

right now. And again, you can find amazing clothes, bags, shoes, all of it. Some of it brand new with tags and great condition for a fraction of the cost. Next is to give homemade gifts or handwritten notes. Now, I'm very aware this won't work for everyone, but think about all the talents and gifts that you have. So if you're a great baker, maybe you bake a cake for your niece's birthday instead of getting her gift. Maybe if you're great at words, you have beautiful handwriting, just write a really sentimental, kind note. If you're great at photography, get your siblings together, take a picture. That could be your Mother's Day gift. So when you're getting out of debt, especially be creative on gift giving because I'm telling you, this is one area that is a money suck. Refinance your mortgage.

Ever since COVID hit, mortgage interest rates are really, really low, which means if you need to refinance and get a lower interest rate, that is going to be the best plan because your monthly mortgage payment is going to be lower because of it. So first, you need to make sure that you're going to break even after the closing costs that go along with the refinancing. So depending on your lender, where you live, and the amount you borrowed, closing costs for refinance can range anywhere from three to six percent of the loan amount. So if your loan is $100,000, you could end up paying $3,000 in fees. at a minimum. So they roll that into the mortgage, and you want to make sure that what you're saving

on the interest of the refinance, again, that that that amount that's going to cost you to refinance is lower. So in general, you'll come out ahead if current rates are at least one to two percent lower than what you have now, and you're planning on staying in your home for a long time. So it will give you time to make up for those closing costs. If you currently have an adjustable rate mortgage, Yeah, you want to get out of that. Refinanced to a fixed rate mortgage. All right, another way to cut your expenses in half is to shop at Aldi.

We're talking about Aldi again. Again, not sponsored. But so many of my friends, people on my team, that my Facebook community have all agreed making this one switch of where they buy their groceries has made a huge difference. Now, my Facebook group, you guys are really great at saving money.

I mean, you have some great tips. So here's some of what? what you had to offer. Hope says, raise the thermostat in the summer and lower it in the winter. Every degree is a 1 to 3% savings on your utility bill. So they have saved 10% by doing this. Brianna says, I turned down the water heater, changed all the light bulbs to LED, started line drying laundry, whoo, turned off lights more, planned to run errands to use less gas, and did swaps with other items. Girlfriend, well done, well done.

Brenda says, research all of your insurance options for the best price and value. Yeah, doing that guys can save you a ton in the long run. And Donna, great quote. Use it up, wear it out, make do or do without. Donna, such a poet. Great way to save money for sure. Okay, you guys, if you want some accountability as you cut your expenses and control your money, make sure to try out the free trial of Ramsey Plus.

So Ramsey Plus, there's nothing like it out there. This is a place where you can budget, you can track your progress on the Baby Steps Tracker, and you can keep up with all the latest Ramsey videos where we teach you tactically how to manage your money. So I'll put the trial in the description for you. Make sure to check it out. Honestly, this is a thing that will walk with you,

will guide you through this process of learning how to take control of your money. Easter is a big deal for our family. We love it. So whether it's the traditions of the Easter egg hunt or the Easter baskets that they get on Sunday morning, it's all so fun. But also, we try to be really intentional with teaching our kids what Easter really is all about. And that is why I love Minnow. It's a Christian streaming service created just for kids. So there are so many Easter episodes that talk about the Easter story. And there's even an Easter family devotional. And Minno gives me all the tools I need to help answer my kids' questions and talk to them about the good news. So celebrate the Easter story in a new way with your family and download the Minnow app or visit go minnow.com. That's G-O-M-I-N-N-O dot com. And enter Rachel at checkout to get your first month for free. Well, I am excited about this episode because my book, it's all about knowing yourself, knowing your money. And once we can really understand ourselves, we can change

our money habits. And so part of knowing yourself is having that self-awareness. One of my favorite tools on the planet for self-awareness is the anagram, which leads me to one of my favorite people who teaches about the anagram all the time. Ian Kronk. Ian, welcome back. Thank you, Rachel. But you're like a regular

now. I know. I feel like, you know, I should be on the payroll. I love it. I love it. So I wanted Ian on today because I, we've talked about this on the show, how personal finance, 80% behavior. It's 20% head knowledge. So I can sit here and just do this at the

the camera all day long to give you all the reasons why you should do something with your money, why you should say, why you should get out of debt. But the problem is that 80% behavior, who we are, is a massive part of not just ourselves, but our money journey. And so taming that part of our head and our heart is a big one. But we were just talking off camera and I want you to just kind of explain it. It's fascinating. The thinking brain, the feeling brain, kind of the psychology of all of this. Yes. So, Every human being has a thinking brain and a feeling brain. Now, the thinking brain is maybe the seat of reason, right?

And so it can come up with all kinds of good reasons for why you should do something like save, right? Yeah. Or quit smoking or lose 20 pounds or et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. And it will say, because it's healthy, because you'll be safe in retirement, because it's responsible. You give a long list of reasons, but the feeling brain, which is not a bad, you need it.

I mean, the feeling brain is really important. The feeling brain is going to say something like, yeah, but I don't feel like it. Like, I know those are all kinds of good reasons, but I don't know. I still want to buy this email. And I'm really having trouble saying no to it. And I might have buyers remorse later

that my thinking brain will get mad at, but I'm going to do it, anyway, right? Yes. And oftentimes people think that the thinking brain is stronger than the feeling brain, because it has good reasons. No, not true. We're emotional people.

We are, and we make all your decisions essentially are made emotional. They are. Most of your life decisions are made emotionally. Absolutely. So you have to figure out a way, if you want to save, how to get your feeling brain on. board with the reasons for why it's a good idea. Yes.

Right. Which is so important to tame because it can be so strong that feeling brain. And every time you look at the feeling brain and just say, because you should, the feeling brain kind of says, watch me. Just watch what I do. Watch me eat that cookie or that second or third. Right, right. Or watch me buy this a car I can't afford or buy this house I can't afford or because that

feeling brain is. also very impulsive. So how do you get the feeling brain on board with your spending goals? Yes. And saving goals, right? It's important. Yeah. So each aneagram type. So we've done shows before. I'll link the other shows down below you guys so you can understand what each type means. We have a, I think, an episode on that. So let's go through them. Okay. Let's figure out, okay, the one through nine. Yeah. What do the ones need to get their feeling brain and their thinking brain connected? Right. So let's talk about ones. You want it? The perfectionist. The perfectionist. Now, I would say that of all the types, I have this feeling that ones have the easiest time saving. Okay. They're responsible. They want to be good. They are meticulous. They would be budget oriented. They love things to be ordered in order, right? Yes. And they would feel like it wasn't good not to save. However, we're all human. And so even once. Even ones.

Even ones are going to have their own struggle with saving, albeit maybe less than other types. What would convince their feeling brain to get on board with their savings goals? It would be, as I talked to one today, they said, if I knew that I could take some, you know, percentage or portion of my savings and dedicate it toward improving, which of course, it's big for ones. Perfectionists are really, they love improving things. this room in my house. And my goal would be to go room to room to room over time and improve it to make it more to my liking

so that it was just perfect. That's great, yes. So I think, you know, there's an example of where the one is saying, here are the good reasons why. Oh, and feeling brain, by the way, I don't want you to undermine this. So what I'm going to do is I'm going to reward you or give you, I'm going to bribe you a little bit and tell you that we can take some portion of this and dedicate it to a goal that is in alignment with your personality bent. Which would be the improving for the one.

Improving. Now, let's talk about twos. Spoke to a two friend of mine. And he said, I have a group of friends that I would love to get together with every year. Remember, this is the most relationship-centered number on the Enneagram, most interpersonal number. He said, if you told me, I told my feeling brain, every six months, you can get together with this group of friends for a weekend away where we just hang out. together and catch up and do all the stuff too's love.

Yeah. I think it would incentivize me to save. That would be something that is so aligned with my personality's drives. And not just saving for the trip, but saving in general, it's okay, I'm going to put X amount away. Yes. And if I do that, then I can bribe myself that over here, I can spend a little bit of that money and go and do something relational. Yes, but I think you can't put it five years out.

That's right. Because the feeling of brain will go too long. Yes. Yes. I cannot wait that long. I need it soon. I need it soon. Yeah, the feeling brain does not have the patience of the thinking brain. Okay. So you're three. I'm a three. Yes. All right. All right. You tell me what you think. How would you convince your feeling brain that it's a really good idea to say? What would you reward that feeling brain? I know. I was thinking the one, my number one right now, maybe it's stage of life. I don't know what it is, but getting away. Okay. And it can be with friends. It can be with Winston. I don't care.

I don't care. But the idea of leaving my normal routine being somewhere else for even a short period of time, even two nights, is like so life-giving to me right now. Why? I love it. Why? Outside of having children and all those other things, what is it? What would happen? I can unplug.

Like the thought that I can like tell people that I need to tell, hey, I'm not going to check email for two days. I love it. It's like, it's so good for me. Because I'm not like that. I'm usually always connected. So the fact that I'm like telling myself, I don't have to be connected for two days. Right. I love it.

Okay. So we have a mutual friend who just bought a lakehouse for this very reason. Oh, really? This person is a worker, worker, worker, worker, driver, driver number three on the anagram. Yes. And for this person to be able to drive an hour and a half to the lake and have no work. Right. Now, that's a pretty self-aware three who knows I have to learn how to be rather than just do.

But for him to say, I'm going to go away to someplace where it's my being place is a big reward. Yes, that would be for me. I'm a four. What's yours? The individualist. Okay. So I was thinking about this the way over. If I tell my feeling brain, and I've done this, you know, there's that beautiful guitar you really want.

And or, this is a confession, I have an expensive fountain pen collection. This is a fountain pen collection. Like a writing pin? Yeah. But it's a fountain pen, right? It's a fine ink pen. Okay. All right.

They're quite expensive. Okay. They're not like your average bick. Oh, I'm getting down. Okay. Like, we're talking. Not a Sharpie. Not a Sharpie.

I don't even want to tell you what they cost. So I'm like, do you write with it? Yeah, and it's just aesthetically beautiful for a four. Do you know what I'm saying? It's like, and it's unusual and it's special and it's unique, which is important to the individualist, right? Yes, yes. And it looks beautiful. on my desk and my feeling brain goes, ooh, I might be able to hang around for that program.

I would save. And if I told my, I'd have to tell my feeling brain, okay, but if we save and meet this goal, we get to get X, right? A unique thing. It's probably what that is. A unique and special thing. Oh, that's good. And or I can hang this guitar on my wall and everyone we go, ooh and I love it. You know, let me play it. All that kind of stuff. Okay, now, five, so you're married to a five. Yes, Winston's a five. I spoke to a five and they said, okay, two things would incentivize me. One would be some kind of learning experience. Uh-huh.

Right? Yeah. A book allowance. Yes. It could be, or this person really honed in on this, some new gadget. Oh, golly. Don't even get me. Right?

Right. And some of those gadgets are not. Oh, they're not cheap. They're not cheap. No, no, they're not cheap. But if you said to this. to the five, there's nothing wrong with wanting that. No, no.

But saving is a priority. Oh. But here's how I need to get my feeling brain on the team. Yes. And not being on the opposite team. And when they get their gadget, they lay out all the instruction manuals. Oh, yeah. And they, yeah.

Oh. And if it breaks, they go on Google and insist on repairing it themselves. I can't even, I can't even, Ian. You have no idea. And you know, it's very, I'm very thankful for that. My washer, Winston, YouTube did it. Ordered the screw, the special whatever hinge. And he was like, it was his best Saturday ever.

Loved it. I'm a four on the Enneagram, and that is as an elitist type, I tend to say, I'm going to the art museum and I'm calling someone to come over and fix the washing drawer. So I'm going to call you. Call Winston. And he can fix any. I mean, that's the thing that I love about him, though, is he can fix it on. So that is, yes.

Let's move on to Sixes, and then I'll say something at the very end. So the Sixes, the Loyalist, Concerned with Security and Safety. right, in the face of what they perceive as a very chaotic and scary world. I called my daughter-in-law and I said, all right, as a six, what would it be? What would you have to tell your feeling brain? She said, well, just the other day,

I bought camping equipment. And then she said, I thought to myself, gee, when I get some money, I'm going to buy a heater for the camping tent. In the event it gets too cold outside. And there's some other dry pack she wanted to get in case it rained outside, right? And it was just interesting that where she would spend her money was on solving or answering her worst case scenario thinking. Oh, that's good.

It's going to rain. It's going to be cold. And she said, it's always related a lot of the time towards safety. So you tell the feeling part of your brain, you want these things that are going to help you feel more safe. in a world. And they may be expensive, maybe not, but if you save feeling brain, we can get those things. Yes, that's good. Create that safety. That's six. That's a good bribe for them. Called my son the seven, right? The enthusiast. Oh, they love, the love, the new, the unlimited possibilities in the future, right? Yes. The next escapade. So I said, what would get you to save?

He said, well, two things. They're very very. fast. He said, if you told me I could buy this, he lives in San Francisco, and there's some cool new scooter that's out there. And I have seen a picture of it. It is very cool. And you said to me, my feeling brain, you know, you could get that and not feel bad, but you have to spend the next six months. Here's the goal. And then you can apportion this much toward the purchase of that. He said, I think I could get on board of that. Or a trip to Bali, one of the other. You know what I mean? Whatever the case may be. But it's some kind of fun experience. Like, that's what the seven needs. They need the, yes. That would incentivize them. The fun of life.

Yeah. That's good. Then the eights, I called my other daughter, Kaylee, and I said, okay, what would it be for you? And she said, if you told me I could get a, some incredible mountain bike so that I could do a century race, which is 100 miles. that would test my limits, which is what AITS love, right? They just love, oh, I want to push myself and test my limits and, you know, just leave it all on the field and then some, right? Oh, yeah. They're challengers. They love the challenge.

Yes, right? And she said, if you could convince my feeling brain, my feeling brain would probably go along with that, right? And then what you want to have happen is that feeling brain and thinking brain to integrate, to mesh, and to say we're on the same team. Yeah, we both. And there's nothing wrong with wanting these things. That's right.

There's nothing wrong with it. It just has to be done in harmony with the bigger picture of saving. Yes, yes. Right? So good. Nines. My other daughter and my wife. My daughter, as I told you before we started the show, she said, I love things in my life that

create comfort and a sense of peace. So her goal is a little bit bigger. She wants to start a clothes boutique. She actually is a fantastic clothes designer. She's really great at it. And she said, the reason I want it is I imagine myself drinking herbal tea and folding clothes with, I can hear the music, just a stress-free life. So anything that would create less stress. Peace.

More peace. That part, that would make my feeling brain go, what did you say? peace? Oh. I'll do that. I'll do that. Yes. I can save for that, right? Now, we have long-term goals. We have short-term goals. People have to figure that out for themselves. Sure. So, you know, but I think little goals, little rewards along the way are important. Very much so. Yeah. And you guys, like applying that, like we're saying just saving in general, but even through the seven baby steps, like once I get my $1,000, once I do my baby step one, then little, and again, little, because your baby steps one through three, little reward.

But then debt through the baby, and then through getting out of debt, right? Like, okay, once we pay off these five debts, the five smallest debts, okay, there we'll just, it will scratch that itch, whatever that little thing is. Right.

But knowing what that bribe is along the way, meshes that logical and feeling together. And it has to create more of a marathon mindset. Like, that's what allows you to keep going. Like, you can't just white knuckle your way your life with your money. Yeah, you won't. Your feeling brain will not let you go the long haul like this.

This. It won't. It's going to say to you, I'm not getting enough satisfaction for this. Yeah. That's right. So finding that satisfaction. Yeah, for the long-term winning. Yep. I love that. See? It's like, yes, knowing yourself, you guys, I'm not kidding. Like, that is such a big deal. And when you can get on board with that, when you're married and you know your spouse's number, if you have teenage kids, especially knowing how they're wired and getting them on board as a family, like all of it, being aware of who we are helps us win in the long run. Yeah, knowing your fundamental desires. Yeah.

Right. Mm-hmm. And knowing that that's what has to be addressed in the feeling mind, right? Yes, yes. As a two, my fundamental desires for relationship. Mm-hmm. Okay. How do I address that?

Yep. Right? And make that possible and make it easier for me to save, right? Yes. Those are the kinds of questions you should be asking. 100%. 100%. Yeah, because I even laugh at my dad and we laugh about it on the show all the time because he has a

thing, he says, just change. And he like, does this clap thing. Just change. Yeah. And I'm like, that works for AIDS in a way. Some people don't just change. No. No.

Yeah. It's not that easy. So what are the things in your life that you need to, not just understand about yourself, but things to put into place to allow those changes to actually make progress instead of just white and not going your way through. And this is it. Unshame your Instagram type and how to bring that thinking brain and feeling brain together. Ian, thank you.

My pleasure. I always love these conversations. Me too. Go to about the anhegram and our money, it's just, it's so good. So fascinating. Okay, so where can everyone find you? Well, they can go to eNMorgoncron.com. And there they can learn about my IEQ9 enneagram assessment, about my book, The Road Back to You, my podcast typology.

Such a great podcast. They can learn about my new course, True You, which is fabulous, I have to say. So fun. I bet. Oh, I bet. Yeah, it's been doing so great in helping a lot of people. And of course, at Ian Morgan Cron on all my social channels. Yes, I love it. Well, love all the work you do, Ian. We've said it before, and I'll just reiterate it.

You know, we don't say the integraim is gospel, but it is an amazing tool to help you understand yourself. And for me as a believer, it is. It's unpacked so many things, the not so good parts of me, to be redeemed, and to seek and look at it and all of it. So it's amazing. So the work you do, I love it. Yeah, love it all.

Thank you. Thank you guys. Check out Ian, his book, his course, podcast, all of it. Thanks. You bet. One of my favorite episodes is when I get to answer your questions. So this question comes from Jessica. Jessica sent her question to Ask Rachel at Dave Ramsey.com.

And her question is, any advice on how to teach our kids about healthy money habits? My husband and I come from homes with an unhealthy relationship with money. We really want to change our family tree. Well, this is great, Jessica, because I love the fact that you pointed out how you guys were brought up. because I feel like a lot of people kind of just start in the present and in the current situation they're in and try to go forward. But going back and looking back on how you grew up is a really

important starting place. So when it comes to money specifically talking about the childhood classrooms that I talk about in the book, Know Yourself, Know Your Money, but everything from the anxious money classroom to the unstable, unaware, and secure, being able to pinpoint your parents' money habits and realize, okay, this is how they communicated about money, verbally and emotionally, because you're going to get to see, okay, here are things that I've taken consciously or subconsciously from my childhood and have implemented it into my life and I'm doing it. Or maybe you saw things that you didn't like and you said, okay, I'm going to do the exact opposite. But thinking through, okay, this is how we grew up, both of us in different classrooms, probably with spouses. And then

here's how we want to come together. So you guys coming together and having a unified front, I think is the number one way to teach your kids healthy money habits. When parents, not that you're going to get it right all the time and not that you're never going to have a money fight or a money disagreement, no. But the fact that together you're a team, when you can show that united front to your kids, that brings so much security and safety to them, not just in money, but in every part of life. So looking at you guys as a team is really important, which means you got to be a team. You and your spouse, anyone watching, if you're married, being a team and being one is so crucial, not just to your financial health, but for your kids

and what they're saying. So that united front is number one. Number two, more is caught and tot. So if you're having these changes in your life and you're creating healthy money habits, you're creating a habit of living on a plan and being on a budget, you have the habit of questioning, why do I want this purchase? You have the habit of saying no to yourself at times. You have the habit of giving and being generous. Like when you have these type of healthy money habits, your kids are going to pick up on that. Like, you can talk to them all day because we're going to talk about that a second. But honestly, just your actions speak so much louder than words. And that's such an old saying. But it's true. So more is cough and taught. And then number three,

talk about it. So don't be afraid to have a conversation. And I think this is one of the best things my parents did is they would say things like, man, we would love a nice suburban. I remember my mom wanted the suburban, and they talked about it. She was like, I really want the suburban. But could they afford a suburban at the time? Nope. So they get an astro van? Yes, they did. A blue astrovan. I'll never forget that dang van. But yet, that's what they drove. And then what happened about three years later, mom got a suburban, and it was great. But like, they brought us in those conversations. They didn't burden us with it. It wasn't like, oh my gosh, kids, we get out of this. But it was like, man, I want that. But what that does is that shows that you're human. And I think parents sometimes

can elevate themselves with their kids where they don't bring their kids in. They don't bring them into decisions or conversations or feelings or emotions or any of that. They almost just kind of push themselves away. But bringing your kids in and having these conversations is huge. So the fact that you're even asking the question is amazing. It honestly is because you're aware of it and you're being intentional. And lastly, Jessica, I would say let your kids handle their own money. So this is big because they're able to learn what works, what doesn't work, make mistakes under your roof. All of that is so, so key. So let them work, earn money.

So commission versus an allowance. And then when they earn money, teach them to give, save, and spend. So that tactical way of letting them again handle their own money. This is a huge learning curve for kids to have versus the first time they ever handle their own money or look into a checking count or anything is when they're 18 or 21, when they're out on their own. No, start this stuff early. Thanks so much for asking that question because it is an important part of this money journey. It's not just for you. It's not just for your marriage, but it is about changing your family tree. So if you guys have any questions, you can ask on any of my social channels, so Facebook,

Instagram, Twitter, YouTube, or my Facebook community, or ask Rachel at daveramc.com. You can email your question and I'll be answering some of those in the future. And I love it because, again, money can be a very confusing and intimidating subject. but being able to break it down and talk through it, I think it's one of the best ways to learn. So, well, Jessica, I hope that helped you when it comes to the situation because, again, a lot of people on this journey, they want to change their family tree,

and a lot of people didn't grow up in a household where money was talked about. So, again, guiding our families is a really important part of all of this. Well, I want to thank Ian Cron again for being on. I always love having him on as a guest. And if you guys have not hit that subscribe button, make sure to do that. And if the spirit leads, you can leave a review. All right, thanks you guys for listening.

And as always, make sure to take control of your money and create a life you love.