The Ramsey Show - Cut Debt out of Your Life! (Literally)

Starting point is 00:00:00 Hey guys, Dave Ramsey here. Me and Dr. John Deloney are coming to a city near you on the Money and Relationships Tour. It's happening soon, so don't wait. Get your tickets at ramsysolutions.com slash tour. Music From Ramsey Network, this is The Ramsey Show, where we help people build wealth, do work that they love, and create amazing relationships. I'm George Campbell, joined by my friend Dr. John Deloney, number one bestselling author, and we're here to help you take the right next step for your life and your money. Give us a call at 888 825 5225. Sarah's up first in Dallas, Texas. How can we help Sarah? Hi, how are you? We're doing great. What's going on? Great.

Starting point is 00:00:56 Well, so I am married, possibly separated from my spouse. I stay at home and he is a breadwinner. I've raised our children and I am not allowed to see any of our financial information, bank accounts, credit cards, passwords, nothing like that. Yikes. What do you mean you're not allowed? I know. He just says, that's how I was raised, I make the money, and he does have a lot of, he does very well. I don't care if he makes a dollar or a million, it has no bearing on your involvement in knowing what's going on financially in the family. I know, and he just says, I won't, he owns commercial real estate. And so he tells me,

Starting point is 00:01:48 it's too much for you to handle, stay in your lane. So we call that financial infidelity. Mm-hmm, that's what I've told him. And he just shakes his head at me. My therapist has said the same thing. And he just says, that's how I am. That's how my parents were, and I'm not changing.

Starting point is 00:02:03 All right, then here's the thing. Most people don't get that clear of a response. Now you have a choice to make. And I wish it wasn't this complicated. I mean, I wish it wasn't this simple, but it truly is. He's told you he's not changing. Yeah, and by the way, if you file for divorce and they do a forensic investigation into his,

Starting point is 00:02:24 all of his slash y'alls, because you're from Texas, y'alls money, it's all gonna be put on the table. So he can be a grownup adult and be an actual married man who loves and honors his wife and his kids and like share the family finances together, or he can put it all on the table with the help of an attorney and a forensic accountant that he's going to pay for. So this is what has happened is we,

Starting point is 00:02:51 this is very different from what I've been told is we did come up with a post-tumor agreement about two years ago and in his mind it was if we separate you will get this amount of money if we separate you will get this amount of money now stop talking about it not stop questioning me and so he says that if I go and investigate with this forensic accountant that he will take that money away and he will try to take my children more. Yeah hon you need to go talk to somebody today. I've spoken to an attorney and what they've said to me is this is quite a good post-membranial agreement. I would be very comfortable, honestly, for the rest of my life.

Starting point is 00:03:41 He has a lot of money in cryptocurrency that I know he's hiding. And I know that's really tough to investigate. I don't understand what you're asking. If you have an exit strategy that's going to take care of you for the rest of your life and take care of you and your kids, I don't know what you're asking. So should I just take the post-nuptial agreement and let him get away with it? I can't give you that. That's between you and your lawyer.

Starting point is 00:04:06 I can't, I mean, I'm not looking at it. I don't have it. I don't know what you're dealing with at home. I just know you're in a very abusive situation and it's hard to see the forest from the trees and I'm telling you that you're worth more than the life you're living right now. And everybody thinks he's the sweetest guy. Doesn't matter. Doesn't matter.

Starting point is 00:04:24 Doesn't matter. Doesn't matter. Doesn't matter. Doesn't matter. Doesn't matter. Doesn't matter. I also have a disability that I'm unable to work. So I'm just real fearful that, I don't know, he just... Listen, what you're doing is you're, you have a lot of what ifs and a lot of oh thises and that's and then in 10 years and in 15 years, I want you to go sit down with an attorney, not him on, don't send the post up to a friend of yours who happens to have a law degree, hire a lawyer and go sit down and talk and say, I need to know what rights I have.

Starting point is 00:05:01 Here's my disability, here's my situation with my kids. I know my husband's hiding money, here's the post-nup and the attorney's job, because you're hiring them, is to advocate for you. And sometimes their advocate, like them being an advocate is, hey, this is the best deal I've ever seen on paper, take it and run. Sometimes they say, we're going to dig in and we're going to burn everything to the ground because this is a terrible deal. that's their job is to fight for you think they can find cryptocurrency because I know that's so shady it's a

Starting point is 00:05:31 weird dude you're like you're you're you're stepping over $100 bills to pick up nickels right now mm-hmm like you're worried about the the how the the thread count on the beach towel you're gonna wrap yourself up with if you swim to shore like let's get to shore first what about him hiding I know he hides money with his business partners they're like well hundreds of thousands of dollars and put it in each other's accounts and like I say that's I mean what do you want me to tell you? I don't... I think this is you starting to realize how angry and resentful you are

Starting point is 00:06:13 living this life this whole time while he hid everything. But the truth is like John's saying it has no bearing. You have your agreement on what it says will happen and that's what will happen if you take the agreement. And so he may have hidden money offshore, I have no idea, but it doesn't matter right now this is about you and your kids and your health and your safety. And if he's got a bunch of a couple of business partners and they're all laundering money and being shady and shifty and they get a knock on the door from a federal investigator or from forensics accountants and they get served for all of their last seven years of financial transactions and every

Starting point is 00:06:52 electronic transaction they have made, every electronic communication they've made, every email, every text, every signal, every WhatsApp, everything and by that it's all discoverable then maybe they pucker up real quick and tell them to change his tune. Here's the thing, you won't know any of that just sitting in your house and spinning and spinning and looping and looping and looping. And that's what you've been doing for a long time, right? Yeah, about five years now. Yeah, let's stop. Let's take action. Start of... Either make peace with this is my life and

Starting point is 00:07:20 this is what we get and he treats me fine, I just don't know how the money works. And maybe he does, I'm confident he doesn't treat you fine because this isn't the behavior of somebody that treats their wife fine. Or... He thinks he's amazing to me and he does everything else nicely but that. And then when I ask him, he gets real defensive. Okay. So here's the deal, the ball is in your court and you wondering about, well, what about this? What about this? What about this? That's just a way to numb yourself from the reality that you are holding the next move you make. And if that next move is nothing then set the ball down and just decide I'm not going to ask questions about that. It is what it is what it is. Well we're getting divorced, I mean it's happening because he doesn't want to hear me complain about it anymore. Have you already filed?

Starting point is 00:08:04 because he doesn't want to hear me complain about it anymore. Have you already filed? Or has he filed on you? No, but he's moved out and it's just the next step. Okay, if you're going to file, then go hire an attorney. Do not get a friend who has a buddy who's got a sister who went to law school. Hire an attorney, a good one in your community, and someone who will fight and advocate for you. And then sit down and lay it all out on the table. Right? But here's the thing for you and for everybody listening it's the and I get it it's fear it's scary and like freeze

Starting point is 00:08:34 is one of the ways our bodies like try to keep us safe I totally get it but there comes a moment when I'm gonna stop living like this and the only way I can do it I can't think my way out of this mess I gotta act I gotta go do Michael Easter wrote a great article recently just go do something right and in your case call an attorney who's ready to go to war for you and sometimes in war they say hey we need to retreat let's just take what we got and let's move that might be the right case but you won't know until you make that call taking care of your health doesn't have to cost a fortune that's why Field of won't know until you make that call.

Starting point is 00:09:05 Taking care of your health doesn't have to cost a fortune. That's why Field of Greens is in my house. Field of Greens is made from fruits and veggies selected by doctors to support your heart, liver, kidneys and metabolism. And here's the best part, they're so confident your doctor will notice your improved health, they offer a money back guarantee, no questions asked. Try today and get 15% off at www.fieldofgreens.com. Welcome back to the Ramsey Show.

Starting point is 00:09:38 I'm George Campbell here with Dr. John Deloney and we're going out to George in New York City. What's going on George? How can we help? Are you with us? How's it going? Good, how are you? So I'm calling to ask and get your opinion

Starting point is 00:09:54 on how much you should be spending on engagement ring. I've saved up about 20 to $25,000. God almighty, that's too much. Think so. You must really love her. Are you loaded? I make around $200,000 a year. I'm 29 years old, I have no doubt.

Starting point is 00:10:15 Wow, way to go. All right, well, I'll tell you the general parameter and it's, you know, my hot take is spend as little as possible. That will still make her feel loved. and it's, you know, my hot take is spend as little as possible. One too. That will still make her feel loved. I don't, there's no data that shows that a nicer ring bodes for a better marriage. In fact, there's, the data shows the opposite.

Starting point is 00:10:33 It's the opposite, yeah. But generally, at Ramsey, we would say, hey, one month salary is plenty. Which is a little bit, you've saved even more than that. So are you making, what what 15,000 a month? Yeah, roughly. Okay. So I'd set a budget if that's 15,000. Hey, you do you, you're debt free.

Starting point is 00:10:52 You can pay cash, right? We're not going into debt for this and go, here's what I'm gonna find the nicest ring I can for 15 grand. Is she involved in the ring shopping? Yeah, I mean, she's been loosely involved. I mean, the big question is also, do I get a real or lab grown? And you know, I think the reason I'm calling this or doing this call is I'm not supposed to

Starting point is 00:11:14 think what others think, but I definitely be going against the grain with people in my circle, not getting a real diamond. That being said, you know, and I think she means that she said she's okay with the lab grown and it doesn't take a fool to put, you know, $25,000 in a future value calculation and see that it would be a million dollars in 40 years when we're, you know, sure. Looking at the opportunity cost of this ring. And the other piece is, you know, you gotta pay for an expensive wedding now.

Starting point is 00:11:45 You buy a $25,000 ring, you gotta have a $250,000 wedding to match. And now we need a million dollar home. Cause now we gotta keep up a certain lifestyle for the people in our circle. And you said it. And a pony. I don't know why you need a pony,

Starting point is 00:11:59 this sounds like what you need. But you see where we're going with this? There's a piece of this where you have to detach from what your friends think. And if your friends care that deeply about what kind of ring you got for the woman in your life, you need better friends. God, dude, I know. Yeah, totally.

Starting point is 00:12:15 Where did you get this, like, maybe I'm crazy. My wife would leave me if I had bought her a $25,000 engagement ring, because she would have said, you are not somebody that I can trust to be a good steward of our finances moving forward. Like tell me about $25,000 for an engagement ring. Where did that number come from for you guys? I mean, it's something that I came up with. I have about $500,000 worth of assets like something that I could do and still very comfortably have an emergency fund

Starting point is 00:12:53 What are your assets? Yeah About fifty thousand dollars in cash or cash equivalents and then about $200,000 and like 401k IRAs comes, and then the rest is like brokerage accounts and mostly ETFs like Boo. Okay. You can do what you want, brother.

Starting point is 00:13:17 Are you guys planning on buying a home together one day? Yeah, absolutely. And that's obviously something that factors into this decision as well. Yeah. It just seems like why have this... That's a down payment for some people. Yeah, 100%.

Starting point is 00:13:32 What has the conversation been like with her? Because I feel like she may have expectations at this point based on what has been said. I mean, I've said like we should seriously consider the lap-run option and she said, she's you know, basically hinted that that would be okay. I think it's me internally. I obviously don't want to disappoint anyone. Yeah. What is it, I mean, sorry for keep pressing pressing this is just new territory for me, okay?

Starting point is 00:14:08 Why do you feel like you're gonna be a disappointment? No, no, no, not a disappointment. Like I... Listen, I love her very much. I want to give her everything that she deserves and I want her to be happy with it. I also worry about like diamond prices are going down significantly. Like I buy this thing, it's not gonna like not that I'm ever gonna sell it but like I would hate to buy it and 10 years from now it's like everyone's buying lab-grown ones anyway. Who's gonna know if it's lab-grown or moissanite or made of you know a ring pop? Who's gonna

Starting point is 00:14:42 know other than you two? Exactly. I'd go, hey, let's shop. What kind of rings do you like? And then we go, okay, hey, that one's out of the budget. Cause I can also imagine, again, this is just me. I would not feel comfortable carrying around a $25,000 appendage, a piece of jewelry that I can

Starting point is 00:15:08 lose, that I can trip and fall, that I can break, that I can scratch. I would feel so paranoid all the time. I would never be comfortable in my own skin. I'm assuming she doesn't have that challenge? I mean, I don't think she would, but obviously I would. I'd be freaking out. Obviously the insurance is another, you know, proposal. Ah, geez. That's a lot. It's between you two at this point.

Starting point is 00:15:36 I don't think she's a vain person who wants a $25,000 ring, nothing indicates that, but I do think your friend circle has too much influence in your life and your impending marriage. And so does your Instagram feed. I just think you need to get some other perspectives and voices in your life, but bigger than that, dude, knock your lights out. You want to buy some expensive jewelry, you got the cash.

Starting point is 00:15:55 I want to see your cash position improve because this takes half of your cash. And it's what, 5% of your entire net worth you're gonna spend on on a ring on a ring So I want you to have some more cash which means Pull something but dude you do you boo. Whoo. Yeah. Thanks for the call George. There's no easy answer there It's it's largely dependent on the couple and again We're not here to tell you what you can can't do with your cash But just two knuckleheads opinions who have been married a good while now. I'm uh, John's going on how many years for you John? 23, 24 something like that a long time, long long time. I'm at 7 and I can tell you the ring has never come up

Starting point is 00:16:33 in conversation. I can tell you, can I tell you this? I actually brought it up recently. I told my wife hey the ring I bought her was when I was a school teacher and I would like to upgrade it. That's the word the kids use. And she said, I'm going to ask you please don't do that. Like I don't want to deal with it. I don't want to carry around something fancy. I love this thing.

Starting point is 00:16:55 It means what it means to me. And I'd rather spend our money elsewhere. And obviously I married somebody who's practical and pragmatic, but also, yeah, it became kind of what this last call was about. I wanted to buy a new ring for me, right? I want her to look nice, whatever, but I mostly want to buy it so that I can be like, look, I got my wife an upgraded ring and this, you know what I mean? And that's a different, different ball game. Yeah. I mean, personally, I would just rather spend 5,000 on the ring and go on a really

Starting point is 00:17:24 nice honeymoon and cashflow the wedding and have some down payment money. That feels like a better, you're setting yourself up for a better marriage versus having something flash you to go, he loves me this much. That's crazy. That's a tough one. That's a tough one. This may be antiquated.

Starting point is 00:17:37 I know we have some recently engaged ladies in the booth right now who may have a differing opinion, but I just think- Kelly, can you just thumbs up or thumbs down? Are we crazy? Are we crazy? Sort of. Well, she keeps saying, I know she has... She's got that real diamond, Jon.

Starting point is 00:17:51 She said she wanted the real thing. We're talking to the wrong lady out there. Oh, yeah? $20,000 though? Too much? No. There's a limit. There's a limit emotionally, financially, and here... He makes $200,000, but in New York City, that might be a down payment yeah if you're lucky and so there's just there's a piece of me where you got to look at the opportunity cost and I know life is more than opportunity cost but we have very clear data that the marriage isn't better because you spent more on the ring and so therefore I

Starting point is 00:18:21 go what's the point of the ring what was original, why did we come up with this idea? Oh, that's right. It was like De Beers and Kay Jewelers decided, oh yeah, three months salary on a ring. That's what you should be spending. Well then Jared was out in the back, like smoking a cigarette and he's like, wait, wait, wait, hold on.

Starting point is 00:18:37 Hold my beer. One year of just, I don't know what Jared was doing, but. Like I. Just gotten out of control. And then the whole lab room verse, I want the real blood diamond John It's a symbol that says Now and forever. I'll be right here till death do us part. That's it. Man. It's nothing more than that. That's what it means

Starting point is 00:18:55 It's not like there's more forever if you get a bigger diamond, right? It's just forever. Or you love me more or $25,000. Yikes. This is The Ramsey Show. There's a time in your life and in the baby steps for renting. But you don't want to do it forever. Because when you rent, you're still paying for a mortgage, just somebody else's. Plus, rent means instability in your budget. Because it always goes up, never down.

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Starting point is 00:20:04 That's ChurchillM Churchill mortgage.com. That's Churchill mortgage.com. This is a paid advertisement and MLS ID 1591 and MLS consumer access.org, Eagle Housing Lender 1749 Mallory Lane, Suite 100 Brentwood, Tennessee 37027. Welcome back to the Ramsey Show. Hey, check this out. Investing can be overwhelming and confusing and it's not something you can get in a 60-second social media post. If you're unsure of where to start or afraid to make a mistake, our Investing Essentials virtual event is going to teach you everything you need to know about how to get started and how to maximize your

Starting point is 00:20:41 investments. Hear what we're saying. Get off the news clips that are throwing all these soundbites at you. Get off TikTok and Instagram for your long-term investment strategies. Actually sit with somebody who's been investing for a long time and who was going to open up their playbook. It's happening March 4th and March 5th. Tickets start at $199. It's hosted by Dave Ramsey and George Campbell. $199 bucks. Sounds like a lot. If you end up making a few tweaks and you end up

Starting point is 00:21:09 with millions of dollars over the next 10, 15, 20, 30 years, there will be a drop in the bucket money well spent. It's also the only place that Dave's gonna get personal with his playbook on real estate investing, explaining how he's made hundreds of millions of dollars in property investments. And by the way, this isn't one of those scams where you leverage this and you flip the tax and slap it up, flip it and reverse it. This is an actual guy who owns hundreds of millions of dollars of real estate. He owns it. He doesn't have some bank that's leveraged to another bank and a partridge in a pear tree. He's going to teach you how he did it.

Starting point is 00:21:45 You can invest with confidence and start building wealth. Get your tickets today at ramsysolutions.com slash events or click the link in the show notes if you're listening on podcast or watching on the tubes. Well said. I'm pumped for this. I'm lucky I get to just hang out next to Dave as he does this. So I would pay good money for that. Five hours with Dave over two nights,

Starting point is 00:22:06 would you pay him $1.99 to sit with Dave and ask him all of your investing questions? And that's the cool part. You can actually submit your questions if you're part of the event, email them in, we'll take them as they come in live. And it's gonna be a really good time. Dave is gonna unpack it with formulas

Starting point is 00:22:19 and how he analyzes every investment with real examples from his portfolio. Well, and he doesn't like it when I say it like this, but he's the reverse of almost anyone I've ever met. And that is, the only other people I've ever met like him are kind of like professional fighters who are super gentle and kind because they can beat up everybody.

Starting point is 00:22:39 And so they're so kind, they have nothing to prove. And so when you meet them and you're like, oh, you're a fighter, like, ah, nah, nah, nah, no, no. Like it's, they're very dismissive like that. Dave is like that in, on the radio, he's like, ah, shucks, right? He's good will hunting. He's a math savant who pulls these things together and has formulas and equations. It's when he started doing quadratic algebra and he's like, all right, we're going to go into the board. I was like, you lost me brother. But he, there's a method to this madness and it's not just an angry guy popping off.

Starting point is 00:23:07 It's a guy who's done the math. And more importantly, he's lost it all. And even more importantly, he's actually done the work to own hundreds of millions of dollars of real estate. He owns it outright. He's not leveraged up to his eyeballs like most people in his situation are. And he's able to teach, here's why I'm doing what I'm doing. And most people are like, oh yeah, but what,

Starting point is 00:23:26 all right, here you go. Bluff called, here's all the math, here's my portfolio, here's how and why I do this, here's my ratios, and it's 199 bucks. It's a ticket to the mind behind the madness. Well said. Ramsesolutions.com slash events. Don't miss Investing Essentials.

Starting point is 00:23:44 It's happening next week. All right Maria's in Orlando up next. You're welcome that singing is free. What's up, Maria? Hi guys, so I just have a quick question. I am on Baby Step 2 and as of yesterday, I've paid off seven out of my nine credit cards. Way to go! As of yesterday, I've paid off seven out of my nine credit cards. Way to go! Yes, thank you. I'm so excited. It's about $25,000 to $26,000 that I've already paid off.

Starting point is 00:24:12 Congratulations. And thank you. And my question is, when I first started, and this was probably about five months ago, I put them in a drawer in the very, very back in a box to not see them because I was scared of cutting them up But now I'm like, okay, they're paid off Do I just cut them off and let the base close them because two of them that I paid off within like the first month I had not used them. I just had a balance They showed up as clothes

Starting point is 00:24:43 About three days ago and I didn't even notice that they were closed. Do I just, my plan was to cut them up and call the banks and be like, hey, close my account or do I just cut them up and then just let the space close them up? Cut them up right now. Do you have them on you?

Starting point is 00:24:58 I don't, I'm on my way home. I'm gonna be there like 15 minutes. Can you promise America that you're gonna cut them up and that you're gonna DM me a photo of the cut up cards as soon as you do it? I will. Okay. Yes, I promise. We have proof now that you said you would

Starting point is 00:25:11 and you're a woman of your word. So yes, cut up the cards. It has no bearing on the account. It's just you burning the ships physically saying, I'm done, I'm done. Letting my life be run by lenders and the sick games they play to get me into the points and rotating cash back with 25% APR.

Starting point is 00:25:28 You're done with that. You're too smart and successful to deal with credit cards. Yes, I definitely agree. So do I still call the bank and tell them to close the account or do I just let them? Yes. Close all of the accounts. Okay. All right. I'll do that. Everybody's going to tell you about this. Your credit score is gonna crash. It's gonna go to zero. Oh my gosh, do you know what we're saying?

Starting point is 00:25:49 It's all coming down. Yes. They're all gonna tell you that. You wanna have a fun game? It's called Guess George's Credit Score. Ready, go. Ooh, this is fun. Is it zero?

Starting point is 00:25:58 Yes. As close to zero as you can get. It's just indeterminable. Yeah. So it's not that I have a bad score, it just doesn't exist. I disappeared in the eyes of the credit bureaus because I paid off everything, closed all the accounts, including the mortgage.

Starting point is 00:26:10 And so when you do that, you'll have no score. And what you'll find is everyone made up some crazy story about how hard life would be without a credit card and how dangerous you are for using your own money through a debit card and how you'll never be able to rent a car again and buy an airline ticket in a hotel. And then I just did it and I went,

Starting point is 00:26:27 oh, they didn't even batten. I was hoping to put up more of a fight at the counter. And they just went, oh yeah, yeah, debit card's fine. That works. We'll take your money. Okay, all right. Well, I will be getting home in 15 minutes and taking care of business.

Starting point is 00:26:40 Woo! And I will DM y'all the pictures. Perfect, can't wait to see it. Taking care of business. Way to go, Maria. I feel like we got one win in today, John. That's good. I needed that. I needed that. All right, let's go out to Brian and see if we can help him in Syracuse, New York. What's going on, Brian? collecting a SmartVestor Pro. So I went on your website recently and had quite the candidate pool reach out to me. So I know they should have the heart of a teacher, that their values should align in my values and goals.

Starting point is 00:27:11 I know the four buckets I should be investing in, but outside of that, what qualifying questions should I be asking and what does that conversation look like? Great questions here. So you're in baby set four? Yeah, four, five and six. Yep, and for some more background, I've been contributing to a 401k for well over a decade, So you're in baby set four? Yeah, four, five and six. Yep. And for some more background, I've been contributing to a 401k for well over a decade, but now

Starting point is 00:27:30 it's time for a 529. And when I went to set it up, it wasn't as clear as those four buckets, you know, the growth, growth and income, aggressive growth international. So that's where I was like, you know what, maybe I'm a little over my head or maybe it's time to pay someone to help me manage these because I'm a bit of a tightwad, but if they can help me and it makes life a little easier, that's kind of where I want to go next. Absolutely. Well, you're asking great questions.

Starting point is 00:27:52 I'm proud of you for where you're at and reaching out to a pro knowing, hey, I want to know that I'm doing the right thing instead of just hoping and guessing. And a good financial advisor will actually teach you and help you understand and leave the ball in your court to make the decisions. And they are truly there as the guide. You're the hero when it comes to your investing journey. And so ask them, hey, how do you operate? What's your investing philosophy?

Starting point is 00:28:14 What kind of services do you offer? You know, beyond just helping me choose a few funds, like what is this relationship going to be like? How are we going to communicate? How often? How do you get paid? That's an important one to know. Can I ask you another weird question?

Starting point is 00:28:29 Like, do I wanna hang out with you? Do I wanna call you? Do we vibe? Do we have some chemistry here? That's an important part of it. Yeah. You don't like him, don't worry about it. That was part of my thought.

Starting point is 00:28:39 Like my Smart Vestor Pro, he was a close friend of mine before. In fact, I didn't even know he was in the program. I didn't know he was a part of it. But he knows me well enough. We make jokes. He'll send me an email or a text message to say, hey, you're about to get an email.

Starting point is 00:28:55 Just don't open it. Because he knows that I overreact and I panic and I get all like, ah. But that's a level of, I want that guy to be, I don't know if he'll be my friend, I want to keep it a professional relationship, but is this somebody that I like and somebody that I innately trust, right?

Starting point is 00:29:10 I think that's just really important. They're taking care of an important part of your family's future. That's it. Yeah, totally. It's part art, part science. Do we vibe and do I understand everything laid out here in the relationship? There you go. I love it.

Starting point is 00:29:23 Is there anything that I should avoid? I mean, you wanna avoid anyone who's selling you crappy products. And so if you jump on ramsaysolutions.com and click on trusted pros, I guarantee you they're not gonna be pitching you on whole life and annuities for a young guy. And so that's one thing to look out for.

Starting point is 00:29:38 Are they really just an insurance salesman, a wolf in sheep's clothing, or they actually financial advisor who's licensed to sell me investments who has my best interest at heart. That's the key, man. Great questions. RamseySolutions.com, click on Trusted Pros.

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Starting point is 00:30:47 expenses contained in the prospectus available at timothyplan.com. Read carefully before investing. Mutual funds distributed by Timothy Partners LTD and ETFs distributed by Four Side Fund Services LLC. Welcome back to The Rams You Show. Our question of the day is brought to you by WireFi. When the payment on your defaulted private student loan is as much as some mortgages, it's hard to get ahead. And that's when YREFY can help refinancing

Starting point is 00:31:12 to a low fixed rate loan built just for you. You can find out more at yrefy.com slash Ramsey. That's the letter Y, R-E-F-Y dot com slash Ramsey. May not be available in all states. Our question comes from Lucia in New Jersey. What is the question, John? It's okay. I was distracted there for a second. It was a soft toss. Yeah, it felt like you threw it pretty hard.

Starting point is 00:31:37 The Ramsey Show question of the day, here we go, brought to you from Lucia in New Jersey. My sister's going through a divorce and has to refinance her home to remove her ex-husband from the mortgage. She asked if I would add her as an authorized user on my credit card but not to give her a card so she won't be able to use it. She says it would just help her credit score so that she can get a better rate when she refinances. I've never done this so I'm not sure if it will affect my credit score which is in the 800s. Do you see any red flags with this plan? Too many to

Starting point is 00:32:10 count. All I see is all red flags. No I would not add her this is not going to be a blessing to either of you. I hate that she's going through this it's going to be tough but here's the good news as her credit score improves as she makes mortgage payments and stays out of debt and stays on time with all of her payments, her credit score will naturally improve and she can refinance to a better rate down the road,

Starting point is 00:32:33 but I would not add her as an authorized user. Her credit history will become part of your credit history and affect both of you. And if you make any poor decisions, God forbid, then that will also affect you negatively. And so I would say, listen, I love you a lot. I cannot bring you into my financial world and tether you to it. There's risk for both of us and I'm not comfortable doing that.

Starting point is 00:32:54 And let me just put this out there. I know this is, it's one of those things where you say something like this and those who don't need to hear it, take it to heart. And those who do need to hear it won't hear you anyway. If you need help financially from a friend, say I need some money. Like that's the cleanest, clearest way to say I need some help.

Starting point is 00:33:15 But asking them to co-sign to hear it. Will you be an authorized user on a credit card? But you keep the card. Now you're asking me to be your babysitter, to be your mom, to also be your financial advisor. And when you need a card and I won't give it to you, then I get to be your punching bag. Like you are choosing to disrupt the friendship

Starting point is 00:33:35 and kind of blow it up. I'd rather a friend come to me and say, hey, I'm gonna pickle, I need X amount of dollars, than to come up with some scheme as to, like this is how it could work and won't affect you, but it'll help me. It just causes problems down the road. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:33:50 And the other part of this is you might actually be hurting her by artificially propping her up and keeping her in this house that she really can't afford. That's right. The answer might be she needs to sell the house because it's too much for her to take on on her own. And that's not a fun thing to do, but it might be the truth she needs to hear.

Starting point is 00:34:06 And so you can be a support for her without attaching her to your financial world and dragging each other down. Great question though. Cherokee's up next in Vegas. What's going on Cherokee? Hi, how are you doing? We're doing well, how can we help?

Starting point is 00:34:24 So I have a quick question. Before I dig myself into a deep hole, my boyfriend was diagnosed with brain cancer. So sorry. He'll be diagnosed. So he's going through radiation, um, and chemotherapy right now. Um, so I'm the one that's really bringing in money right now. And, um, he was surviving off of unemployment for awhile. Um, whenever he went into surgery, that stopped around December, January, um, into December, early January, but now I'm getting a little

Starting point is 00:35:05 behind on bills on behind on my car payment and I'm kind of struggling to get another job because I work, um, eight 30 to five 30 and, um, most people want me to work about two to three days, but at least a day during the week. And I'm really struggling to find hours that are, um, overnight. Um, so it's wondering if you guys have like any insight on something I can do. Um, this is going to be me being really callous. Okay. Okay.

Starting point is 00:35:41 You've got to take care of yourself. Yeah. And you have to make sure your four walls your bills your heat your water your transportation Clothes on your back. You got to make sure those things are steady before you have any business jumping in and helping somebody else Hmm and I know that's hard to hear what I I'm concerned on multiple levels. So when that we get sick did you not have a job the have health insurance anything like that and that's not a judge request another millions of americans stuck there uh... he did have a job uh...

Starting point is 00:36:17 he he he he was going to work he everything was fine and then right whenever he got the news he tried to go about it in a holistic way but it just it didn't work out so he had to go through the surgery and then they kind of just dropped chemo and radiation on him because he's been through this before but he didn't have to go through that but since he's older that's the route that they decided to take. So who's paying for this? Is he insured? Yes, he is insured under his mom's insurance. Under his mom's insurance?

Starting point is 00:36:51 How old is he? Yeah, he's 26. So he's only he's insured for until he turns 27, right? Well, that was they did drop in from the insurance, but his mom works with like a private business owner, so they were able to get him back on there. So her boss has him on there because they know the situation that's going on. Who else is in his community right now other than you? Does he have family around?

Starting point is 00:37:20 Yeah, he has his mom and dad are still together. You can't be his full-time caretaker through this. And his full-time funder. You have, here's the thing, you have no, this is gonna sound awful, okay, I'm just being as direct as I can because I love you. You have no, you're dumping money into this situation with like, you don't know the medical history, all you know is what he tells you. You don't know the medical history all you know is what he tells you you don't know where this thing heads

Starting point is 00:37:46 I'd much rather see his family circle up and support him and love him through this and you be The person that you can't the girlfriend the one who loves him the one emotional support exactly financial but you were playing all the parts of his life and That's a tough tough thing for you, and you can't even pay your own bills Yeah, it is getting pretty tough. So that was my next, kind of what I was thinking along the lines of, because his disability does come in in April, so that will help a lot,

Starting point is 00:38:18 but I release it up in July and I'm trying to figure out what my next step should be because our apartment is too much and I feel like I'm trying to figure out what my next step should be because apartment is too much. And I feel like I'm making okay amounts. And I'm trying to figure out, I don't know what my next step should be. I think he needs to move back home and get some care from the family. And you go out on your own. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:38:38 Yeah. It's just too big for one person who's got to work one to two jobs just to pay the rent on their apartment. And he can't split bills with you right now. He's not in a place to do that. Yeah. And you've got two people who are leading from a place of weakness and you can't carry the weight for him. Yeah, he doesn't need to feel bad.

Starting point is 00:38:55 He's got brain cancer. He needs to go get well. And I get that's easy for me to say. Of course he's got to feel bad. Any self-respecting romantic partner would feel bad. But like he needs to heal. Yeah, and that's what I told him. I think that's why we're kind of like,

Starting point is 00:39:14 you know, we don't really know what to do. His parents have been hoping that it's kind of doing a strain on everybody. Yes. You know, we're in a separate house from his parents. You're gonna be no help when you get evicted and your car gets repossessed and you can't even go to work. You're gonna create even more problems

Starting point is 00:39:30 if you continue this. Yeah. So you need to make sure that you're well and he needs to focus on him and get his family involved. And you can be a supportive girlfriend on the sidelines, but I would not intermingle our finances at all. What's his medical prognosis? He has an astroglycoma, I believe.

Starting point is 00:39:52 There's another thing in their names that he had another one four years ago, but I think the one that he has now is an astroglycoma. What's the prognosis? But I think the one that he has now is an astroglycoma. So it's not... What's the prognosis? Yeah, that's a whole different kind of... How's it looking? Cancer. The doctor said anything?

Starting point is 00:40:12 Oh, they said that he's doing really good, you know, with the radiation. It's starting to get to him, but he's almost done, but he will be on chemo, but everything is looking up so far. Okay, that's good news. Yeah, listen, I honor you for loving him and trying to take care of him. I love that, love that.

Starting point is 00:40:30 But man, if you go underwater, everybody drowns. So he needs to go back home with his family. He's not your husband. He needs to go back home with his family and get back on his feet there. And y'all can decide what the long-term relationship is gonna be between you two moving forward. You shouldn't own a gun. You're not willing to shoot. In moments of self-defense, a Berna launcher lets you protect yourself in a non-lethal way. That's exactly why Berna launchers

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Starting point is 00:41:43 directly to your door plus Ramsey fans can get 10% off an exclusive bundle which includes a Berna pistol co2 cartridges and ammo and other Berna products like safety alarms defense sprays and body armor are also 10% off for our listeners. Just go to Berna.com slash Dave to learn more. That's B-Y-R-N-A dot com slash Dave. From Ramsey Network, this is The Ramsey Show, where we help people build wealth, do work that they love, and create amazing relationships. I'm George Campbell here with Dr. John Delaney, host of the Dr. John Del Delaney show. We're taking your calls at 888-825-5225. Peyton will kick us off this hour in Atlanta, Georgia.

Starting point is 00:42:32 How can we help Peyton? Hey, good to talk to you guys. How's it going? Great. How are you? Good, good. So, a little bit of background here. So I'm 27 and over the last few years, I've begun to come into an inheritance at the same

Starting point is 00:42:44 time that my birth family has resurfaced Become a little bit tricky Just because you know, I was I always knew I was dealt an amazing hand But you know kind of seeing you know, what could have been has been pretty emotionally jarring someone doing, you know number one But you know, what's the response way to handle this? Because I don't think doing nothing is an option, but at the same time, wanna make sure that I kind of do justice to my grandfather and my parents

Starting point is 00:43:10 who have kind of changed my life and my family's life, putting me in this situation. So tell me a little bit more. When you say your birth family, are you adopted? Yeah. Okay. And so your adoptive grandfather, he's the one who's leaving you the inheritance? So I was adopted at birth to a family. So there I consider, you know, my family because I grew up with them. So that side of the family is where the inheritance is coming from. Birth

Starting point is 00:43:37 family is, you know, found out I was the oldest of a sister who's 19 and pregnant and two other male siblings and then my birth mom of course. Got you. And how much money are we talking here? So my grandpa was smart so he stepped it in around like you know metrics like graduation date and you know age and a couple things so it's up to 750,000 now. It'll likely cross over a million in the next few years.

Starting point is 00:44:06 So it's pretty significant. Tell me why you feel or where the feelings are coming from that you have some sort of allegiance or you owe or you need to put some money on the table for your birth siblings. I think if you have that old adage right, you know, to whom much is given, much is expected. Yeah, that's not that adage doesn't apply here at all. Not even close. That's that's what a guilty person tells themselves. Yeah. Why do you feel guilty? I mean, I think especially, you know, being the oldest sibling,

Starting point is 00:44:42 you know, kind of seeing I think my sister, you know, probably has the, you know, the drive to kind of get her life on track. So it's, it's, you know, wanting to support, you know, I saw my, my parents and my grandfather do, you know, good, good things with kind of the situation that they, they created and put themselves in. So I'm kind of navigating, you know, I know I could make a difference, you know, and, you know, it wouldn't necessarily change my day to day, so it just hasn't seemed reasonable at this point to do nothing, but then there's also been some stuff

Starting point is 00:45:11 initially that I tried to give that didn't necessarily go where I wanted it to, in terms of my mom kind of repurposing some of that in a way that was less than ideal and it didn't actually get to my sister. Well, that's the thing is you have no control of this money once it's given, zero. And bro, you are setting yourself up for a catastrophic world of hurt. I 1,000% agree with you.

Starting point is 00:45:43 I'm just trying to put myself in your shoes. If I found out I had a whole other family and I got adopted by a family who was so great and they took me in and they, like you said, like I had an amazing life and I won the lottery and my other brothers and sisters were adopted out and they did not get the shake that I got. I would feel a sense of I owe or obligation and I need you to hear me say you don't owe anybody

Starting point is 00:46:10 anything. You can choose to give and those are two very different motivations. If you think you owe, you are constantly going to be, it's a bottomless pit, it's a hole that can never be filled. If you say, hey, I won the lottery with my adoptive family, I got such amazing life and I want to do that for other people, then that's when you can sit down with your sister and very similar to how your grandpa did it, who's very wise, hey sister you're ready I'm gonna pay for college tuition but I'm gonna pay directly to the school. When you're ready I will cover three years of daycare for your kids so you can get ahead financially but I'm gonna pay directly I'm not gonna give that money to anybody. You can love them deeply and support

Starting point is 00:47:02 them and also recognize that they're terrible money managers. All three of those things can be true at the same time. Yeah. Here's what I don't want you to do. I don't want you to give your mom $25,000 when she doesn't have the skills to handle $25,000 because then you're gonna end up presenting her and that's not fair to her. You get what I'm saying? Yeah, I hadn't thought of it that way but that does make a lot of sense. You'll hand her like a live snake, she'll get bit

Starting point is 00:47:35 and then, you know what I mean? Like you gave her the snake, like I wouldn't do that. And you're gonna have to weather people coming out of the woodwork for your money. You're about to be Bank of Peyton once they find out that you're just giving away money like a game show and they're gonna be coming back. And Peyton will bail us out and how dare you?

Starting point is 00:47:57 And oh, you got this and we- You did it last time, why not now? Why are you so stingy now? Can't believe you, you don't even remember your raise and you don't even remember where you came from, right? They're not your real family. You're gonna hear all that stuff, dude. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:48:10 Have they asked for money? Or is this just your own survivor's guilt talking? So that's the thing. My mom, when she was, before I found out she was doing things I didn't want with it, she would make up excuses, but my sister has always pushed it away.

Starting point is 00:48:27 She's on her own, she's got a newborn, obviously very young, and that's kinda where, that almost makes you wanna give more, right? Because she has a similar thing of like, you don't owe me anything, I just wanna have the relationship. Is she a single mom? Yeah.

Starting point is 00:48:42 And what needs does she have right now that you feel like you could help with? The kid has special needs, so I know that that's, like they're below poverty line, so it's such a stark contrast. So is that childcare? What would you exactly help with versus just writing a check?

Starting point is 00:49:01 That's what I was thinking. A grocery gift card, what would you wanna do? I think childcare would be the most impactful thing is it would free her up to kind of take the steps necessary to stabilize her life, whether that be education or. Can she do that living in your in your birth mom's home? They live in a different state than I do currently. No, no, no. But can your sister thrive under your mom's roof? Oh, no. They have a very toxic relationship. So maybe offering an apartment like down the street from, I don't know how much money you want to put on the table here. I don't know what you do for a living. I'd want you to make sure you invest this thing so you're taking care of

Starting point is 00:49:39 yourself and your future family long term. But I'm with George, I think you, if you throw a checkbook at a problem, often everybody loses, right? It just becomes full of waste and it becomes full of, well, what about this? And I feel like this, when you spend money to solve a particular problem, you get different kind of results.

Starting point is 00:50:02 I will pay for you to move and I will pay for one year of an apartment right down the street from me and that's going to cost $25,000. I'll put that on the table if you want to get out of mom's house. Now we're talking. Right? Yeah. And that's a finite cost and she doesn't have to feel guilty for just being on the take

Starting point is 00:50:20 forever and but it's an actual problem being solved right now. Yeah. The more specific you get the better and you can remain in control if you do what John said take forever, but it's an actual problem being solved right now. Yeah, that might go like that. The more specific you get, the better. And you can remain in control if you do what John said and go, I'm going to give directly to the need versus just throwing a check at it. But you're a noble guy and I got nothing but respect for you, man. Good luck with your decision.

Starting point is 00:50:39 But you don't owe anybody anything. You get to give, and that's a totally different spirit. You know, one of the first things I discovered working in the financial world is how absolutely devastating it is when the breadwinner of a family dies. And there's too little life insurance or none at all. Grieving families are suddenly left behind scrambling to pay bills and trying to make ends meet. I also discovered that there are a lot of rip-offs in the life insurance world like that whole life crap posing as an investment opportunity. What you need is level term life insurance usually 10 to 12 times your income which is the smartest most affordable way to protect your family. The key is finding an independent broker who represents a ton of companies and works for you not for the insurance company.

Starting point is 00:51:28 This is exactly what my friend Jeff Zander and his team at Zander Insurance are all about. They shop the term life companies to find you the best options and they've been around for over 95 years. So you know they'll be there when you need them. Zander is the real deal and that's why they've handled all my personal insurance for over 25 years I trust them and you can too visit Xander.com For instant online quotes or for a more personal touch give them a call at 800-356-4282 Running a business is freaking hard. It's easy to get caught up in the daily challenges and fears that keep you stuck.

Starting point is 00:52:12 That's why I want you to reserve your copy of our new book, Build a Business You Love, where we share the proven system that helped us break through those challenges and build Ramsey Solutions from a card table in my living room to a 250 million dollar company in the process. When you pre-order today you're going to get more than three hundred and fifty dollars in bonuses for free including an enhanced audiobook experience, early access to the Build a Business You Love ebook and instant access to our hiring playbook so you can start transforming your business right now. Build a business you love ebook and instant access to our hiring playbook so

Starting point is 00:52:45 you can start transforming your business right now. Build a business you love the essential guide for every business owner like you that wants to grow yourself lead your team and scale your business. To reserve your copy go to ramsesolutions.com slash store ramsesolutions.com slash store Welcome back to the Ramsey Show. Do not miss the upcoming Money and Relationships Tour. It's Dave Ramsey and Dr. John Delaney like you have never seen them before. Go on the road baby. Hey, we're bringing the Ramsey Show and the Dr. John Delaney Show.

Starting point is 00:53:22 We're crashing them together and we're bringing them live. Which means unfiltered, unscript, and packed with wisdom and laughter. All the stuff you think, I wonder if they edit that out. The answer is yes, and that's gonna be live. And that also makes me nervous, because there's lots of phones out there. In the audience, they choose the content of the night

Starting point is 00:53:39 before the event. Yeah, we're talking, we might do live, we might do Q and A's, we might do all kinds of stuff, but yeah, there's gonna be audience participation into how this thing goes, and so it's gonna be a blast. It's just as off the rails as our shows can get sometimes, that's gonna be the live event with us bringing the Ramsey Show and my show live.

Starting point is 00:53:57 They're headed to a town near you. Louisville on April 21st, Durham April 23rd, Atlanta April 25th, Phoenix on May 5th, Fort Worth May 7th, and, Phoenix on May 5th, Fort Worth, May 7th, and Kansas City on May 9th. Get your tickets, ramsysolutions.com slash tour. And if you're tuning in on YouTube or podcast, just click the link in the show notes.

Starting point is 00:54:15 Be sure to say hi. I wish I could go. They don't wanna fight me. You know, I'd love to drive out to it. Maybe me and Rachel will crash in Atlanta. That would be a blast. Just show up. That would be actually fun. All right, Skylar is in Fort Worth up next. What's going on, Skylar? Maybe Rachel and I will crash in Atlanta. That would be a blast. Just show up. That would be actually fun.

Starting point is 00:54:25 Alright, Skylar is in Fort Worth up next. What's going on Skylar? Hi, how are you guys? Doing great. How can we help? So, back in college I had made some poor choices. I ended up moving in with my parents and starting over as a single mom. Well recently we moved to Texas from California

Starting point is 00:54:46 and my parents, now that I'm in a better financial situation, my parents want me to put a mother-in-law suite in the back of their property. And I thought it was a good idea at first until I found you guys. I'm only in baby step two and I am having a hard time trying to communicate to my parents that I don't want to go into more debt for something that they want.

Starting point is 00:55:09 So they want you to pay for the building of this in-law suite? Yes. So that you can live in it? Yes. What's it gonna cost? So we've looked at different things. We're gonna go with the container home style, which would be at the end of it, like 170. We live out in the countryside,

Starting point is 00:55:27 so we would have to get septic. I'd have to get the power line pole. Why don't you just leave? Can't you just go live on your own and rent an apartment somewhere? So, I ended up getting an apartment. I can't move in until March 19th. I don't know.

Starting point is 00:55:41 I'm scared to tell my parents, because they think I'm gonna put the house on the back because And they want to make a plan to get me to get twenty thousand dollars So if my dad's initial plan was to have me take out a personal loan for twenty thousand not touch it for a year Then use that to put down for the house and then have the house over estimated twenty thousand to pay off the So are they using you as part of their financial schemes? Sounds like it, yeah. Okay, you just need to go.

Starting point is 00:56:07 I don't understand. I mean, you need to say, hey, Mom, Dad, it's been great. Thank you so much for letting me crash. Me and baby are gonna go get our own place. You said you're in a better place financially. Can you afford to rent your own place? Yeah, so the apartment I did find, I can't afford it. They just, I can't afford the apartment.

Starting point is 00:56:24 I just can't afford childcare. They helped me with childcare, afford the apartment, I just can't afford childcare. They help me with childcare and this was the way that... That's what I was wondering. Are they watching baby all day? Yeah. Yeah, so he's five now, so he goes to school, but they watch him in the morning because I leave at 5.30 in the morning. Sometimes, depending on how the volume is because I work for, I deliver mail, I sometimes don't get home till like 8 o'clock Are they gonna cut you off because of this Skylar I have no idea okay

Starting point is 00:56:52 Here's what you hear because I made some really bad choices, and I'm so scared yeah, and I don't want to kick you while you're down But it wasn't smart to sign a lease have you already signed a lease no I did not sign. Oh you didn't okay? Thank God all right smart to sign a lease. Have you already signed a lease? No I did not sign a lease. Oh you didn't? Okay thank God. Alright. The earlier you learn this the the better off your life is going to be. That doesn't mean your life's going to be easy and conflict free but that means you're going to have this elusive thing that everybody wants and nobody has. It's called peace. Okay. The only way through these challenging conversations, these hard moments is right through the middle of it. Okay. Most of the time, how old are you? I'm 28. 28? Okay. Most of the time if this is your first time to actually I honestly stand up but actually say hey I don't want to do that and by the way you get a pass

Starting point is 00:57:41 you can say I can't afford to do this and I'm not going to do this. I'm not taking any more debt. It's not a matter of you're a millionaire and you have to say, hey, I don't wanna do this. But I would recommend writing down what you wanna say. And then having an in-person meeting with your mom and your dad and read it to them. Okay. And I want you to stop leading conversations. The first

Starting point is 00:58:05 introduction to me and George was I made some mistakes when I was a kid. You've got to stop leading with that. You're more than that, okay? Mm-hmm. Do you believe me? Yeah. Okay, you're more than some college mistakes. We all made them, right? And tell me about this little one you have. Well, he's five. Is he amazing? He's like the best. He is like a carbon copy of me, I swear. Well, God help everybody, just kidding. Okay, so can we stop calling him a mistake?

Starting point is 00:58:40 Yeah. Wouldn't have drawn it up that way and you've been through hell and back, 18 to 19 to 22 how ever old you are right now, but dude You got a rad little five-year-old Okay, let's stop leading with there's something wrong with me and let's lead with hey mom and dad I I don't want to go into debt and and put on an apartment on the back of your house I'm so grateful for your hospitality If that's the only option, then I'm out.

Starting point is 00:59:06 Yeah. Have they always been there for you? Yeah. Okay, then I think that's what you lead with. You guys have always been there for me and I have to. I have to stand up on my own, but I still can't do it fully without you. I still need help.

Starting point is 00:59:19 And if you all choose to not have childcare, I'll figure something out, but just know I have to stand out on my own. Okay. Okay. Okay, and you gotta go through the middle. There's no hack to that, okay? There's not like a secret. What are you making delivering mail?

Starting point is 00:59:33 My salary is 65,739. 65,000 a year? Yeah. Good. And you said your hours, they range from 5.30 in the morning to 8 at night Depending yeah, so I have to leave the house at 530 because we leave about 20 minutes away. My start time is at 615 So do you even see your son? For like a few hours on at the end of the day if I get done in time because most of the time I'm usually

Starting point is 01:00:04 done about four o'clock but when the days are really heavy I don't get done to like close to eight. I'm wondering what does child care cost around you if you were to put him in daycare? I would have to get an ambulance because there is no daycare. Okay but he soon this is a temporary problem. Soon he'll be old enough, he'll be in school, this will all be behind us, right? Yeah. Okay. Well just know this is not forever. This is a season and it's gonna be hard and it's gonna be uncomfortable but you're gonna be on the other side more mature, more independent, standing on

Starting point is 01:00:43 our own two feet. Do you still wanna stay living with your parents if they didn't have this backyard idea? Yeah, I would've. Okay. It's just, it's something that I can remember, especially my dad talking about wanting since I was little. So this is kind of his way to get that.

Starting point is 01:01:02 Because here's the thing, sometimes, and again, I'm overly sentimental, sometimes our parents are doing the best they can to love us, and they'll come up with all kinds of crazy schemes to try to keep us safe. And sometimes when we struggle and stumble and fall, when we're 18 or 21 or 23, they look in the mirror and they blame themselves.

Starting point is 01:01:22 And so, you know your dad more than I do, and it's easy for me to sit over here and say, maybe he thinks this is the best way out. And the greatest gift you could give him is to say, no, no, no, no, I'm gonna get my own place. I'm gonna start branching out. And I still love you, I still need your help, I still want your influence on my kid's life,

Starting point is 01:01:40 but I'm not gonna do this. I'm not gonna borrow any more money. I'm tired of being in a hole. Okay. And if he honors that, cool. If he says, then how dare you, whatever, then you've got your very clear message that it's time to go.

Starting point is 01:01:52 And maybe rural, you know, wherever you happen to be, rural, central Texas isn't the place to be. And it's easy to talk yourself into a trap that I'll never make more money than this. It's all I've got, it's all I'm worth, and that's not true, none of those things are true, okay? Hey, you're not the silliest, dumbest mistakes you've ever made, you're way, way more than that, okay?

Starting point is 01:02:15 Okay, thank you. Appreciate your call. Can we send her something, Jon? Yeah, let's send her everything. Building a Non-Anxious Life, FPU, every dollar. Kitten Kaboodle. I think that'll that's a good start and she'll let us know if she needs anything else. We're here for you Skyler. Hang on the line, we'll pick up and get you those resources. This is the Ramsey Show.

Starting point is 01:02:39 Have you gotten one of those texts recently claiming to be the USPS with some sketchy link to update your address. It's annoying and a little terrifying. And you probably think to yourself, I should do something about this. But where do you even start? Well, as your nerdy friend who does the research for you, I found the solution. They're called Delete Me. And here's the reason they come in the clutch. The internet is packed with data brokers, which are these shady companies whose sole purpose is to collect your personal info and sell it for a profit. Enter DeleteMe. DeleteMe swoops in, finds your info on these sites, and removes it on your behalf. They even send you a report with all the details. And so far, for me personally,

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Starting point is 01:03:50 That's joinedeleteme.com slash Ramsey. Okay. Picture this. You sit down to do your taxes, but instead of stressing out, you're actually ahead of the game and filing with an affordable software that makes your computer shoot confetti when you're done. Okay. Not that last part, but Ramsey Smart Tax does make filing easy and

Starting point is 01:04:07 doesn't make your bank account cry. Ramsey Smart Tax is a hundred percent accurate software that's honest about its pricing and is backed by a company who's been in the business for over 50 years. So go to ramsysolutions.com slash smart tax to take advantage of early bird pricing and stress-free filing. That's ramsysolutions.com slash smart tax. James is up next in Dallas, Texas. James, welcome to the Ramsey show. Hey, guys. Thanks.

Starting point is 01:04:36 Really appreciate you all having me on. Absolutely. How can we help? So my question is, I'm going to give you a little background. We, me and my wife just paid off about 550K in debt. Yeah, dude! Whoa, congratulations. Yeah, thank you. It actually all worked out really great.

Starting point is 01:04:54 I think God had his hands in there, mixing some things up and opening some doors for us. So we're relocating. The reason I went to sales, we're relocating to Austin, opening up a Chick-fil-A out there. We have about 80 K left in debt other than our house, um, that we live in currently and it's about two and a half hours away from Austin where we're relocating to, uh, my question is, do we sell the house to pay off the remaining,

Starting point is 01:05:19 um, mortgage and then the 80 K in decks, they have a little bit of equity or do we continue to rent it out? Because I feel like we don't have too much longer to go on that mortgage if we kind of just throw money at it once we get there. What are your thoughts on that? Well, I'll tell you, regardless of, if you have consumer debt,

Starting point is 01:05:38 regardless of if you have the mortgage still left on it, I would tell you to sell it. Okay. I would not keep it as a rental and live two and a half hours away and be a long distance landlord. And the easy way to look at this is this way. If you lived in Austin,

Starting point is 01:05:52 would you buy an investment property in Dallas, Texas? No, no, I wouldn't. And so I would sell it and be done with it. And guess what? It's also gonna leapfrog you through the baby steps, get rid of this debt, put you in a stronger place financially and give you less headache and more peace. Yeah, that's where we were leaning towards.

Starting point is 01:06:12 We just didn't know, with it being so close, do we belong distance tenants or is that too much risk to hold? I don't know if it's too much risk. You're about to run a Chick-fil-A. Like, I mean, you manage a thousand employees and all kinds of, I don't think it's the risk thing. I think it's just like- The hassle factor. Yeah, it's just an absurd way to live your life, right?

Starting point is 01:06:34 It's just chaos. And I would ask for what, right? Like for what? Kind of how it's been. And if you want to buy real estate down the road in the future, you want to pay cash for an investment property near you, go for it. You'll be able to do that.

Starting point is 01:06:45 What kind of money will you guys be making? About 200K, and that's with my wife and I included. Awesome, are you gonna be owner operator? No, not currently, that is the goal. So two or three years from now, we're gonna try to pursue relocating back closer to family where we are now and buying a Chick-fil-A nearby.

Starting point is 01:07:06 Awesome. I'm thinking that it's looking like we should be able to do that. And of course it's not guaranteed. Yeah. I just didn't know you a Chick-fil-A is like, I mean, it is, it's Fort Knox to try to get a Chick-fil-A. I didn't, you can't just go buy one up. Yeah, no, but he's part of the Navy SEALs.

Starting point is 01:07:21 You're part of the gang that gets married every six months or two years or five years, right? That's opens them up. They say it's harder to get into a Chick-fil-A than it is to get into Harvard, is what they say in the Chick-fil-A world. I believe it. Yeah.

Starting point is 01:07:33 I just thought of four jokes that I didn't make, by the way. I want everyone in America to know I'm wisening up here. Pratt and Dunn. That's called maturity. I'm maturing right before your eyes. But yeah, dude, and here's the other thing. Is there a possibility that you rent for a year in Austin before you settle out everything?

Starting point is 01:07:48 Yes, that's our idea. We're gonna go scope out the area, rent, save up some cash so that we do have an up-down payment when we decide if we're gonna either stay there or relocate back. That's kind of up in the air, but renting is our main priority going down there. Wait, hold on. So you might go down to Austin for a year, open this place up six months.

Starting point is 01:08:08 I know you never know how long these deployments are going to be. But then- It'll definitely be two years minimum. Okay. We have another store opening up about, that'll turn us into a multi-restaurant. The operator will be a multi-restaurant operator, and so I'll be over both of those. Okay, great. And we're trying to, it will for sure be there two years, three to five is when I will most likely try to apply depending on how ready we feel.

Starting point is 01:08:33 Yeah, I would sell the house. I'd sell the house. Yeah. Okay. Because dude, think about it this way. That's another presidential election from now. Who knows, man? Yes.

Starting point is 01:08:44 Who knows? Right? So I would cross that bridge when we get there. Absolutely. It's amazing. And once you guys are in a better financial spot be sure to send John and I some sandwiches. We'd appreciate it. Yeah there's this elusive, we gotta get, just you know the card I need James, you know the card I need. There's a special card. I know what it is. There's a special card, hook a brother up. All right, Francois is in Los Angeles up next. How can we help Francois? Hey, how's it going?

Starting point is 01:09:08 Great. What's going on? Well, I live here. Dave will be very happy. I have zero car payments in the family. I've never paid for a car except cash. Good. So everything we own is owned.

Starting point is 01:09:23 If I can't put the cash down, I don't drive it home. Wonderful. It's a great way to live. Yeah. So I have a small, very small business compared to some of the guys that call in. I have a marine repair shop here in San Pedro, California. I've been open for seven years. Pretty much started it from scratch. I'm 50 years old so I have about 25 years experience and the business grew very quickly for the first three, four years. You know we're born again Christians so we don't rip people off and mess around with their money. And I've been renting for the last few years. Two years ago we moved into a big

Starting point is 01:10:07 property because my landlady sold and it's literally the only property we could find. And it has been very hard on us because the rent tripled. The gross at the time was around 150 and that was just me on my own and we have a serious amount of demand. I went through eight people last year at my shop. They came in and tried to fit in and from drinking problems to just incredibly bad at trying to do the job or just late or not on time, it's impossible to find skilled responsible labor. And I am in a position where we've been verging on bankruptcy the last two years because I've been trying to

Starting point is 01:10:53 build the business up and train people who have just turned out to be pretty awful. So what is the business making today as it stands with the work that you can take on? I'm stagnant. I think I am floating between around $130,000 to $150,000 a year, which is about as much as I can cope with mentally and physically doing this alone. So you're maxed out on your own at that level without good help? I am maxed out. If I had one extra pair of hands, I could probably almost double that. Okay.

Starting point is 01:11:24 And what's your rent now? My rent currently is about 5600. Yeah it's high. I mean I have literally, so initially when we moved in the property was about three four times the size of my previous and I thought okay there's always a demand for storage so So we'll try storage. And that literally did not happen. I don't know why. Then I tried boat rentals. We invested in some boats to get into the boat rental thing.

Starting point is 01:11:52 And it's just been very slow. I'm currently sitting here with about a hundred, $120,000 worth of inventory that we've been trying to sell, but the economy has just been so so poor. So we're asset poor, the rent's been killing me, it's been very hard to find qualified, not even, I don't care about certification, I just need someone that can A pitch up on time and do the job. Just a warm body at this point would do. Hey Francois, what was your take home pay

Starting point is 01:12:23 last year? Oh, I don't even wanna know. I did my tax return for 2023, which was the worst. And I'm not gonna lie, it was $11,000. Okay, don't lie, dude. There's no shame here. We're just three dudes just sitting around having nachos. Shocking. So after all expenses, you were making like $5 an hour.

Starting point is 01:12:42 Somewhere around there, yeah. It was brutal, brutal. Can you sell this thing and go get a job, job? You're killing yourself, dude. You're dying. I know, I know, I know. You're dying. And I know this is a dream and I know you have to,

Starting point is 01:12:57 you have to grieve it and you have to be sad about it, but dude, you are dying. I've thought about it. I've contacted some brokers because we only have five-star reviews. I'm one, let me just put it this way. I'm contacted some brokers because we only have five star reviews. Let me just put it this way. I'm one of two shops in this town. The other shop, the guy is a total crook. But listen, Francois, this is not an indictment of you or your character or your business.

Starting point is 01:13:17 You're a good guy. No, no, I get it. You're a good man. It didn't work. It's not working. And your soul, like you have a stroke for $11,000. If it's $11 million, I you having a stroke for $11,000 if it's 11 million I might trade my brain for 11 million dollars But that was the thing is like the last year. I probably did better than that Well, but even 10,000 or 25,000 that's still half what you can go make at Starbucks You know what I mean between the California tax and the soul tax you need to get out of this thing

Starting point is 01:13:42 Yeah, just get out and exhale, get a fresh start, and then go do something that's gonna bring your family some income, but also some peace, man. And you've got 25 years experience. I think anyone would be lucky to have you. And so I'd be looking around your industry to see who's hiring and what value you could bring to them. This is The Ramsey Show.

Starting point is 01:14:02 Hey guys, I've got a big announcement. George Campbell and I are bringing back Investing Essentials, our two-night virtual event deep diving into investing and real estate. Learn step-by-step how to get the most out of your 401k mutual funds and real estate investments, because there's no better time to get the clarity you need to invest with confidence. Watch live on March 4th and 5th. Get tickets today at ramsysolutions.com events.

Starting point is 01:14:34 Welcome back to the Ramsey Show. Reminder that this is the last segment for this hour unless you jump over to the Ramsey Network app. It's the only place to get full episodes of the Ramsey show. You can download it for free using the link in the show notes or just search Ramsey Network in your app store. If you're on radio, stay tuned. The show will continue as promised. Well, John, sometimes on the show, we don't know if the callers actually follow through with what we told them to do or what they said they were going to do.

Starting point is 01:15:03 And so we had a caller earlier named Maria who was asking, Hey, should I cut up my credit cards? I'm working on paying off these debts. I got most of them paid off. Is it going to affect me if I cut them up? We said, no, go ahead and cut them up. Do it now. She said, well, I'm on my way home. I don't have the cards with me, but I will. And I said, promise, send me a DM with a video of you cutting them up. And she delivered. She slid in to George's DMs head first. That's the kind of DM I want to see.

Starting point is 01:15:27 Just cut up credit cards. So here we go. We have the clip that she sent in. Let's play it if you're watching. Yeah, yeah. Oh, beautiful. The capital. Maria. One AMA.

Starting point is 01:15:36 This is what I want to see. American Express. There was like seven cards. Can we play that again? I think there's like seven or eight cards in this pile. Yeah, there's a huge pile. Remember she said she had nine or something like that? Oh my goodness.

Starting point is 01:15:47 That's so beautiful. There's no site more beautiful than just a pile of credit cards. There you go. That represents freedom. You're breaking free from broke. You're bucking the system. We love to see it. So thank you for that, Maria.

Starting point is 01:15:59 All right. Switching gears, John. One of the top things that you talk about is wills and insurance. I do talk about wills a lot. And that's just off air, just behind the scenes. When we hang out. I'm paranoid about insurance and I just can't wrap my head around people

Starting point is 01:16:15 who don't have a will, which is 70 something percent of Americans, which is staggering to me. And so I wanna cover some top myths about wills and insurance real quick, just to clear the air, help people understand the importance of this, and it is crucial for effective estate planning. And no, you will not die sooner by talking about this stuff.

Starting point is 01:16:31 I'm gonna be your hype man and- Oh, good. I always wanted one of those. I always wanted one of those. On the background, some of these are- If I was a rapper, you'd be on stage with me, hyping me up. You'd be like, who's that guy?

Starting point is 01:16:40 That'll be me. Myth number one, young or single individuals don't need a will. Here's the reality. Regardless of age or marital status, if you're an adult with any assets at all, a bank account, property, a pet, a will ensures that your wishes are honored after your passing. That's all it does. Without a will, it's a mess.

Starting point is 01:16:56 The distribution of your belongings is determined by the state, aka the government, which may not align with your preferences. They're not great at divvying this stuff out, dealing with it in a timely manner. So if you want it done the way you want it done, get a will in place. It's super easy to do. Myth number two, creating a will is super expensive.

Starting point is 01:17:15 Reality, attorney fees for drafting a will can range from 300 bucks to a thousand bucks, and there's way more affordable options now with online services like Mama Bear Legal Forms. They've been a great partner with us since who I have my will through, and they offer legit wills that are done by lawyers at a fraction of the cost. Another myth, John, identity theft

Starting point is 01:17:32 isn't a significant concern. Identity theft is a crime, according to Dwight Schrute. According to Dwight Schrute. Yeah, it's a growing issue. Get this, in 2023 alone, 15 million Americans experienced identity theft, and that resulted in a total loss of $23 billion. It's a growing issue. Get this, in 2023 alone, 15 million Americans experienced identity theft. And that resulted in a total loss of $23 billion.

Starting point is 01:17:50 That's a 13% increase from the previous year. And I think that number is gonna keep going up over time as we deal with more digital life, the digital world with crypto and AI, and you have your info and 19 more accounts. And so you gotta get identity theft protection. And that's the next myth. People think that's unaffordable.

Starting point is 01:18:09 Individual plans typically cost between 10 bucks and 40 bucks a month. Family plans range from 13 to 60 bucks monthly. Listen, your subscriptions add up to more than what it would cost to get this protection. So get that in place. And finally, the last myth, if you can rebuild your home with cash,

Starting point is 01:18:23 homeowners insurance isn't necessary. Yikes. Even if you have sufficient savings to rebuild after a disaster, which by the way, 99.9% of people don't. Purchasing homeowners insurance is very wide. It's gonna protect your savings, it mitigates financial risk,

Starting point is 01:18:38 allows you to preserve wealth for other purposes. Dave Ramsey has homeowners insurance on his property and every single investment property he owns because for the price you pay for that premium, it is totally worth the insurance company taking that risk instead of you. So there you go. If you're unsure, you have the right protection in place.

Starting point is 01:18:55 We have a free coverage checkup that makes this super easy. Go to ramsysolutions.com slash checkup or click the link in the show notes. If you're listening on podcast or YouTube, well worth your while to get that covered check up ramsysolutions.com slash check up. And dude, I always feel like, especially when you and I are on together, George,

Starting point is 01:19:14 the Instagram YouTube-y, influencer-y world is so full of people who are just not telling the truth. They're dishonest. Yes, just liars, just complete liars. So here's the deal, just for people at home, George and I both have a will. We both have identity theft protection

Starting point is 01:19:33 and we both have homeowners insurance because we're not insane. Let me just say it that way. I just, this is stuff that we do in our own homes so we're not trying to sell you something. We're just telling you, dude, this gives us peace for our wives and for our kids and God bless you. Get a will, people, and get identity theft protection and please, please cover your biggest asset with homeowners insurance. Beautifully said. ramsaysolutions.com slash checkup is the place to go. Get it done. Do

Starting point is 01:20:04 not delay. Jenna is up next in Rockford to go. Get it done, do not delay. Jenna is up next in Rockford, Illinois. What's going on, Jenna? Hi, thanks for taking my call. Sure. So my husband and I, we paid off our mortgage at the end of the year. Yeah, and then a week later,

Starting point is 01:20:19 he found out he was getting laid off. Oh my goodness. Yeah, so he's our, he's a soul. Good timing, I guess. So, he's our piece of soul. Yeah, can we cheer? Can we cheer for a second? Yeah, we can cheer.

Starting point is 01:20:30 Yeah, absolutely. We work to first show you about it. It's heartbreaking, and so we'll weep with you, but we'll also cheer. You don't have a house payment. Yeah. So, he will be working until June. That was so disingenuous.

Starting point is 01:20:42 Okay, I'm sorry, I'm talking over you. Go ahead. No, that's okay. So he'll be working until June and then he'll be done. So we have been job hunting and that's a fun area to get into again, but we have a 401 and an HSA that we're maxing out. And I'm wondering, should we pull back on that

Starting point is 01:21:03 and start kind of saving up some more money on the side? We do have a six month emergency fund, fully funded. We also have like a family vacation we were hoping to go on in the fall, but should these things be like, should we just stop doing that? Should we pull back? I would say you don't need to pause investing right now.

Starting point is 01:21:23 You have a six month emergency fund. And then if you have vacation funds, other sinking funds that are for more fun stuff, I would just hold on that until we know that he has stable income beyond June. Okay, so. And then once he has that job lined up and he gets that paycheck, let's push play. Let's restart the sinking funds.

Starting point is 01:21:40 Let's take the vacation. But for right now, I don't, it's not an emergency situation where you need to just pause everything you're doing, don't invest a dime and just stack up cash. Cause you have a six month runway beyond June where your expenses are gonna be covered, plus the vacation funds.

Starting point is 01:21:58 Okay, so do we just kind of keep living normally as if he's going to get a job and that we have income coming? I would tighten up the budget. I would not be living luxuriously during this time. I would look at the budget and say, we're gonna live on a bare bones budget. We're gonna keep investing, but we're gonna cut things where we can.

Starting point is 01:22:16 We're not gonna eat out as much. We're gonna just live like we know this job is going to end, cause it will. And I hope that by June, he's got something lined up. That's some pretty incredible runway you guys have. Like this is, there's a lot of blessings here that you guys are in the financial spot you're in, that the job wasn't an immediate loss,

Starting point is 01:22:32 that he's getting paid through June, right? Yeah, yeah. And on top of it, we're hoping for a severance. And so we're hopeful and we're so, so thankful for this opportunity. Yeah, we just- What kind of work was he doing? He's in IT. Okay great. Surely he'll be able to find something. It's a little bit dry out there right now. We've been looking. We have a few headhunters that have been helping us,

Starting point is 01:22:56 but it's been almost two months of looking and it's been a little bit scary to see that there's not as much out there as we thought there was. Yeah. Yeah. Can I ask a question of George, Jenna, on your behalf? Yeah. All right, George, for those of us who run a little bit hotter when it comes to being anxious, what are your thoughts about taking the money I was putting in my 401 and my HSA and maybe just stocking it away in a high yield savings account until this thing clears? And then once I can make a lump contribution, if we find another job in five months, but

Starting point is 01:23:30 again, I don't know how much money that's actually going to be practically, but if it ends up being the $25,000 or $30,000 that I would have invested out and I've got it and I have to have it, is that bad form? No, it's not bad form. The HSA, you could do that with the 401k. You're not going to be able to just lump some back in because it has to come from those paychecks each time. It's not bad form. The HSA, you could do that with the 401k. You're not going to be able to just lump some back in because it has to come from those paychecks each time. So you could ratchet up your 401k investing

Starting point is 01:23:50 to make up for it. So if you wanted to take down the HSA for now, you could do that. And again, there's going to be severance. They have the vacation money on top of the six months. That probably is looking like closer to 12 months. I feel pretty good about it, especially the fact they have no mortgage payment.

Starting point is 01:24:04 So that's where I'm like, they have more wiggle room than they think now. There you go. That puts this hour of the Ramsey Show in the books. The right questions are the key to unlock personal and professional potential. That means if you're not where you want to be, you are not asking the right questions. I'm Ken Coleman and this is what my new show, Front Row Seat, is all about. Over my career, I've had the distinct privilege to interview successful people from all walks of life and to coach over 10,000 professionals who wanted more. What sets successful people apart is a never-ending desire to learn and grow. Each week I'll be joined by industry leaders and world-class experts to have a conversation about how to get better,

Starting point is 01:25:12 move up, and lead well in work and life. But the best part of this show is you get to be a part of the conversation. Live in studio we'll have a group of professionals just like you who have the power to ask questions and steer the discussion in real time. It's an opportunity to get real answers to real questions, like how to make the right decisions, have hard conversations, live a balanced life, and discover your next steps to grow. Join us every Tuesday for conversations that are guaranteed to surprise, challenge, and

Starting point is 01:25:41 inspire you. Check out Front Row Seat wherever you get your podcasts.

The Ramsey Show - Cut Debt out of Your Life! (Literally)

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