The Ramsey Show - Do the Right Thing Even When It’s Hard

Episode Date: September 19, 2025

🤔 ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Think you’re good with money? Take our Money in America quiz!⁠⁠⁠⁠ Rachel Cruze and Dr. John Delony answer your questions and discuss: "Can we recover money that our brother stole from our father and his estate?" "When is the right time to ask someone I'm dating how much debt they have?" "We inherited my grandparents' house on our land. Should we just tear it down instead of remodeling it?" "I'm buried in over $400,000 of debt and feel like I can't live" "I'm about to get a divorce, should I pull from my 401(k) to buy my husband out of our house?" "Should I keep inheritance money in my name only or both me and my husband?" "Are there strategies to overcome anxiety from investing?" "How do we get out of my car loan that has an 18% interest rate?" "How do I pay off my debts as a single parent with no help?" "We're about to purchase a home with my parents. Is it okay if our name is not on the deed for tax purposes?" "How do I get my aging mom to be responsible for her finances?" "I'm getting $850,000 in cash from an inheritance. How do I invest this well?" Next Steps: ✔️⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠Help us make the show better. Please take this short survey.⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 📞 Have a question for the show? Call 888-825-5225 weekdays from 2–5 p.m. ET or⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠send us an email⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠. 📱 ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Get episodes early in the free Ramsey Network app! ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 📈⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠Are you on track with the Baby Steps? Get a free personalized plan.⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 💵 ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Start your free budget today. Download the EveryDollar app!⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 🛡️ ⁠⁠Get trusted insurance coverage that fits your budget.⁠⁠ 🎟️ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Two Weekends. One Life-Changing Experience. Get away with your spouse in Nashville. ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Connect With Our Sponsors: Stop paying more and start shopping smarter at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ALDI⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠. Get 10% off your first month of⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ BetterHelp⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠. Go to ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Boost Mobile⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ to switch today! Learn more about⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Christian Healthcare Ministries⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠. Get started today with⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Churchill Mortgage⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠. Get 20% off when you join ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠DeleteMe⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠. Go to⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ FAIRWINDS Credit Union⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ for an exclusive account bundle! Find top health insurance plans at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Health Trust Financial⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠. Use code RAMSEY to save 20% at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Mama Bear Legal Forms⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠. Visit⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ NetSuite⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ today to learn more. For more information, go to ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠SimpliSafe⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠. Use promo code RAMSEY for 18% off at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠The Nokbox⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠. Get started with ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠YRefy⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ or call 844-2-RAMSEY. Visit⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Zander Insurance⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ for your free instant quote today!  Explore more from Ramsey Network: 💸 ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠The Ramsey Show Highlights⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 🧠 ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠The Dr. John Delony Show⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 🍸 ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Smart Money Happy Hour⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 💡 ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠The Rachel Cruze Show⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 💰 ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠George Kamel⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 🪑 ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Front Row Seat with Ken Coleman⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 📈 ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠EntreLeadership⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Ramsey Solutions is a paid, non-client promoter of SmartVestor Pros. ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Ramsey Solutions Privacy Policy⁠⁠⁠ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

brought to you by the every dollar app start budgeting for free today normal is broke and common sense is weird we're here to help you transform your life from the ramsie network and the fair wins credit union studio this is the ramsie show i'm rachel cruz hosting this hour with my good friends and bestselling author, Dr. John Delo. What up? And if you want to give us a call at AAA 825-5-2-2-25, we are taking your calls about life and money. First up, we have Sarah in New Jersey. Hey, Sarah, welcome to the show. Thank you. Thanks for having me.

I appreciate it. Absolutely. How can we help today? Okay, so my dad passed away a few months ago, which, hallelujah, he's with the Lord. And my oldest brother has power of fraternity. He's had it for years. he's the executor and the trustee. Okay.

He said that there is basically nothing left to inherit, and my other brother and I know differently. So we want to know, is there anything that we can do to try to recoup what Dad wanted us and our children to have? I actually just talked to some people who have experienced something similar, and yes, but it's going to require getting law enforcement involved. Okay. Sarah, how do you know that there's something else?

Was there another document? Was it just what he told you verbally? Or how do you know something else is there? Right. In 2017, I saw a document, an investment document, and that had at least $250,000 in an estate. Okay. And then between his pension and Social Security, he would have added minimally another $250,000. We're thinking more like $3,000 to $4,000, $100,000 over the last seven years.

Okay. Okay. And when he passed away, did he have any liabilities? Did he have debt? No. He was completely debt-free. How about the home? He lived, no, that was my brother's home. Oh, so he lived with your brother. Right. Okay. Oh, I'm sorry. Yes. He and my mom lived with my brother for seven years. Okay. So is there a chance that your brother decided that this is what he was owed for having taken care of him or trying to backpay himself or something? Um, no, because my dad paid him rent every month. Okay. Have you seen, have you seen the will?

Uh, yes. I had to go on to the county and get actually get my own copy. And we did not know that there was a trust, um, except that we finally saw in the will that there was a trust. And the only money he put in the trust was a account with about $30,000. Because I think most of my dad's other money was basically cash in, in his account. So, you know, my, my, my, my, my, my, my, bigger concern here is I is your thinking to Rachel's point it's something like 2017 you saw this like who knows if your dad and your brother thought it was a good idea in 2019 to move everything into crypto and he lost at all who knows oh no no he did not I know I know you think he didn't but I'm telling you right now when documents come out and families sit down

around the table there's always that's why Dave Ramsey for years have been saying let everybody in your family know on a regular basis what the status of stuff is. Right. Because people think and they assume, and you probably, if you're like me, have already spent what you think the number is minus your third. In your head, you've already allocated that. And now it feels even a heart, right? Oh, you haven't? I do that all the time, man. No, because I've dealt with my brother for years. Okay. So what's your brother saying to you, Sarah? When you and your other brother come to him and say, hey, where's our inheritance from dad? What does he say?

Well, he told my other brother that in 2021, that dad gave him money for his divorce sentiment and to pay his attorney. And my brother said, where's the rest of the money? And he goes, oh, dad said I could just have the rest. Yeah. So you're going to have to call a non-emergency line and let them know. And they may direct you back to the court. house, they may send out a, because here's what it is. It's theft. Oh, oh, yeah, I know. I know, but think about,

this way. It's as though he stole a bicycle from you. Right, right. But he stole money. And it's, you're going to have to go sit down and they're going to do some sort of forensic accounting and somebody's going to have to get on the case and it's going to take weeks, end or months or whatever, but they don't have to go through it all and figure out where that money actually is. Right. Okay. So you think we need, okay. Well, and I think we asked you that, Sarah, we did ask you this, but I can't remember I'm sorry what you said. Yeah. You have seen the will, correct?

Oh, yes. I've seen the will. And what is supposed to be owed to you? What does it say on the will? The will says that it's supposed to be split between the three of us. Okay. Okay, the total amount of what was. So, yeah, so what you're going to have to do is figure out what the total was at his death, everything.

And since there is no death, there's nothing else to pay. So it would be that total. Right. And you have not seen that, correct? No, oh no, because he's supposed to, of course, give us an accounting, and he has not done that. And usually they have two years to do something like, I mean, every state's different. The folks I was talking to, there was two years, and it was to settle the account, right, to sell all the assets and then divvy them up and all that kind of stuff. Right, yeah.

But now the will is a poor over will, so everything is supposed to go into trust. And the trust says that he's supposed to get half of it, and then the rest is split between the two of us. Do you guys have an attorney that's working with you? well that's where we're that's where we're going from this point whether we need to get an attorney or do we go right to the police you know what i yeah do that first rachel you're right don't go don't go don't call local sheriff's office yet go get an attorney and let them know what you're working through yeah you'll pay him some you know retainer up front to be able to go through everything that's the right move that's the right move um yeah but yeah so i mean and is this in character for your brother like is this not is this shocking to you are you thinking like oh my gosh or is it like oh no i'm not shocked that he's doing this. No, it's not shocking to me. I realized many years ago he's a narcissist. But unfortunately, my other brother was devastated that he would do this to us.

And he said, what kind of a Christian man is he to do this to that and, you know, our families? Yeah. So that's, you know, because he professes to be a Christian. Well, we got, we have to be, you have to put that stuff aside. And, yeah, I would get an attorney to file a legal motion to give you access to the, to the, to the, to the. To give a full accounting of the estate, yeah, of the state. Yeah. And my prayer is Sarah that, yeah, this all gets worked out.

And there is close to half a million in there, you know, and your dad's legacy lives on. But also the cynical side of us that sit in this chair. And we hear every story imaginable. To John's point earlier, I mean, leave a little bit of a realistic idea too, Sarah, that who knows? Like, you may get into this and think, oh, my gosh, this whole story that. I made up in my head of what I thought actually isn't even reality. Yeah, he may show you the receipts and say, hey, there was no money in that account. I don't know what you saw, but there's nothing there. Or it will say this account was liquidated on this date and that money was deposited in this account. Right. So it's

easy, it's an easy trail to follow. Yeah, for sure. There should be a good paper trail for it. And by the way, maybe telling your brother, hey, here's the deal. We know there's money in an account. We're about to hire an attorney. This is going to become a criminal matter. You can do what's right. Yeah, it's illegal what he's doing exactly. Or, um, we're going to go down this road. You're going to end up in jail for stealing hundreds of thousands of dollars. So right. Yeah. That's what I mean, because my brother and I have discussed all these different things. I know, can I tell you this? Stop, stop talking about it. Go act. Y'all are making yourselves crazy. That's why I called you. Yeah. Because I thought before we act, I want to call you and see what kind of, you know, and that's, that's, that's kind of what we've been

thinking. Yeah. No more stories. No more like, can you believe, I thought it was a Christian. We're not doing any that. We're just going to. Call the attorney before the day's over. Yeah. Oh, yeah. No, absolutely right. Oh, Sarah, I'm so sorry. I'm sorry for the passing of your dad and that money gets caught up in relationships.

It blows up families, it does. Absolutely. So, Sarah, I'm really, I'm sorry for you guys. And I hope you get clarity. I hope you get the answers that you're looking for, for sure. So thanks for calling. Here's the deal, America. The big wireless companies are literally banking on you overpaying every single month.

But not Boost Mobile. Boost flip the script. You get unlimited talk, text, and data for just $25 a month. $25. That's it. No contracts. No fine print traps. Just real savings that stay in your pocket.

where they belong. And if you're thinking, well, George, that sounds too good to be true. Here's the mic drop. They've got a 30-day money-back guarantee, so you can try it risk-free and see how much you save. Go to boostmobile.com slash Ramsey to make the switch today. That's boostmobile.com slash Ramsey. Restrictions apply. See boostmobile.com slash Ramsey for details. Up next, we have Matthew in Pennsylvania. Hey, Matthew, welcome to the show. Hey, guys, how's it going? We're doing well.

How are you? I am doing so great right now. So great. Fantastic. I'm so glad. What's up? Yeah. First of all, sorry if I sound like a very overhype.

I just love you guys so much. I've heard about you guys so much. I've seen so many of your videos, and I'm a big, big fan. So this is just a true blessing. It really is. Do we love it? We have to hang out with George Campbell backstage, and he's such a downer, so it's good to hear somebody that's, like, positive, man.

It's great. Oh, man. I love George Campbell, too, but I love Dave and, you know, Jade also. Like, they will tell it straight up. That is true. Seriously. Yeah. Rachel are too nice.

So what's up, dude? How can we help? Awesome. So this is a two-part question for me. I am 26 years old, and I've had some thoughts about, you know, potentially dating again. I did. I was in a relationship, but I moved off that a year or so ago. But, you know, going forward to my next relationship, I just wanted to know, like, how do I deal with the relationship and also, like, financials also? You know, how do I ask the question? How do you feel about dead and when should I ask that question? First date, dude. I'm just totally kidding. Don't do that. Don't do that. Matthew's like, can I really see your tax returns to know?

There's ramesy weirdos and then there's those that ask about debt on the first date. Don't be that person. I mean, I don't know. John's the relationship expert, but I would think Matthew, you know, as you're dating someone, important conversations hopefully are being had in general,

right? Learning about the person, understanding them. You're hearing about their family, their likes, their dislikes, what they think about spirituality, you know, what do they value around money? I don't know. I see it always, you know, people ask this question for me. And again, maybe it's because I talk about money all the time, so I'm super comfortable with it. But to me, it's just part of building a relationship. It's a part of a person. And as you get to know that person, you're going to know and ask questions and be curious about that part of their life in general as you're dating. And to John's point, it's not usually on the first date. But if you continue to go on dates, you know, I mean, it's like, what are you

talking about? We should be having good conversation, right, of getting to know the person. And that's just part of a person. I'll say this too, Matthew. This is something I learned and I was surprised by it. When I was doing my counseling practice, I'm back in graduate school, I remember being caught off guard by clients would come in and tell me literally everything. They'd tell me about their sex intimacy lives on session one. They would tell me about traumas. they tell me about everything in their life. And if I ever ask them, hey, how much money are you making? What's your financial situation? How much do you owe other people? Nothing. They wouldn't have that conversation. And so it is a such a, our culture has turned it into such a binary, you're a

winner or you're a loser based on this number. And so it is, for people like me and Rachel, we just kind of talk about everything all the time, but it's a sensitive question. Yes. Okay. So you're saying more though, John, in like what you have, what you don't have, your number, all of that. But, I mean, I don't know, but when it comes to values of like, oh, hey, because he's asking, you know, about debt or like, you know, different things. It's not necessarily about what they have. Now, if you get into those numbers, which you need to, that can probably feel more personal. But from a values conversation, do you think it still is like touchy? No, I think to, let me put it this way. I would not not date somebody because they owed

money i would not not i wouldn't not marry somebody because they were in debt um if they said i have student loans i'm never paying these back i think that's stupid i don't care about any that kind of stuff then we're going to talk about values right um but i think there's an entry point into so do tell me about your job are you are you are you successful do you like where you are you what are your dreams for yourself that turns into well i owe this much money like oh gosh how quick you're going to pay that stuff off. And it can be a fun, inquisitive, curious conversation. And then if that person says, I'm never doing that, you can be like, oh, I'm one of those Dave Ramsey crazy people. What's that? And you can kind of talk through that. I don't like own anybody

anything. And that's a way to get into a values-laden conversation. My fear is always that people who are raised, who come from Ramsey households or who discover this thing and get so passion about the freedom they feel. It's the first thing to talk about. like hey do you know are you getting out of debt what your what baby step are you on and they're like what are you talking about and so i i i don't want you to sit down with a person you've gone on one two or three dates with and be like all right how much money do you make um and begin going through like george camel or rachel cruz questions are you going up to the match of your 401k right are you are you funding your 401k fully like those questions would be bananas in the first

or second it'd be like saying like hey tell me about your ex-boyfriend what were the three favorite things and your free things you hated the worst of like you wouldn't do that right but there's ways to get to some of those answers as you're learning about each other. And yes, it will naturally come up, but particularly focus on the values part of this conversation. And then when you start thinking about like, I think this person maybe is the one, then you start getting into the nitty gritty. Yeah. We're talking about merging households and budgets and I don't want to marry somebody if we're not going to share a checking account. Like that's when you start having those deeper, more like, are we doing this or not conversations?

Matthew, you said you want to jump back into the dating. Did you find that money was a barrier in past relationships at all, or you're kind of newer to this and you're thinking, okay, how do I navigate that part of my life with this new knowledge of how to handle money? Well, I've listened to you guys for some time now, and I've heard a bunch of stories about how, oh, one couple started dating, but then it didn't go the way they wanted just because of the financials or like how one, how a couple got married, you know, but then like one's a spender, one's a saver. or the other way around, and it just turned into some sort of a nightmare. Well, that's going to be every relationship. Every relationship is going to have people that bring different strengths. I'm a spender, and my wife is a planner and a saver. And if I owe money, I can't sleep at night.

A mortgage doesn't bother my wife at all, not even a little bit. And so when we sit down, I know that I'm a spender, she's a saver. I know that debt makes me clinically nutty, and it makes me, makes her, it doesn't bother her. And so we're bringing both of our uses to the table to say, as for us, the household that we're building, who are we going to become? My wife knows she married somebody that just doesn't want to owe anybody anything. Great. Okay, cool. I know that I married somebody that is going to say, hey, we made a plan. Let's stick to this plan. And I'm glad to have that accountability. So if you're trying to find someone who saves, just like you save,

you're destined for a pretty boring life. But you want to have somebody that has the same values as you do. Yeah, that's really important, Matthew, because, yes, some of the calls we get on this show, to your point, there have been, you know, extreme circumstances that are heartbreaking, that, you know, whether it's financial infidelity or one spouse just continues to spend and is not saving at all for retirement. The other spouse feels like, oh, my gosh, I'm not safe here because I don't feel like we're going to have any money. And like, all of those, again, are the product of other things happening underneath the surface that they never really addressed to begin with. So I do think it's really important that you are putting weight to this subject in life because it can make

her break a relationship 100%. But what John's saying to, make sure not to get legalistic in the sense of because I, and I'm like, John, I'm a spender. Winston's a saver. Winston has the excels and the Excel sheets and the five-year visions and the, I mean, the Excel sells with the formulas. It's crazy. Like, I'm like, okay, that's great. I don't want to look at that. I get a migraine. Like, no, thank you. It's fine. But again, our values and where we're going as a couple and a family are exactly aligns. But how we're doing it maybe from our habits or the way we look at money, maybe a little different, but it's not detrimental. It's just who we are. And you don't want to lose that either. You don't want to lose who you are because that's the beautiful part of a marriage, as you both

bring yourself. But again, it's the deeper conversation of the values, Matthew. Here's the way I'll say this. There's a difference between values and beliefs. That's good. People who are married have to. share values, but you want your beliefs to be different. I don't want to, I don't want to read, it helps if they're lined up. That's great and cool. It makes things less volatile. But the reason I read new books is try to learn new things. So I can, I have a belief about something and I get to change my belief. That's why you listen to this podcast. That's why you, you have friends. You read parenting books. You read parenting books. I believe this. I don't believe that.

But our value is we're always going to talk to each other before we make a decision. We're a family who believes in this. We're a family who, you see what I'm saying? So identify those values and when you're dating somebody, you want somebody that's aligned on values. But when it comes to beliefs, I'm of the opinion that the more fun, the more varied the beliefs, the more fun you can have if you're both anchored into the same values. And that leads to a richer, fuller, more adventurous, and more wisdom-filled marriage. For way too long, I struggled with sleep and woke up groggy after tossing and turning all night. But now I look forward to bedtime and I wake up bright-eyed and bushy-tailed thanks to Casper,

a company that's been perfecting better sleep for over a decade using durable, high-quality materials that actually last. My whole family now sleeps on Casper mattresses. Yes, even the dogs have their own Casper dog bed, to no one's surprise. And it's not just one man's opinion. Casper customers keep their mattresses for years, and four out of five customers recommend them to friends. And with free delivery on a hundred-night trial, Casper is no gimmicks. A mattress you can trust, backed by quality that lasts. So go to casper.com slash Ramsey and use promo code Ramsey to receive 25% off all mattresses and 10% off everything else with Code Ramsey. That's casper.com slash Ramsey. Exclusions apply. Well, 20206 is just around the corner.

How is that possible? It's crazy. Time just keeps flying. Is that true, the older you get, time flies? I think it was Dax Shepherd that was talking about. He thinks it's because the reason time feels like it goes faster is when you're five, waiting until Christmas is 20% of your life when you're 40

it's so true it's like a much smaller percentage of your life and it just and I was like yeah that could feel I get that's probably it I feels right because it's wild when you look up you're like oh my gosh we're about to start decorating for Christmas like it's coming she's coming can't I believe that 2025 is almost over you guys 2026 is upon us and the 2026 Ramsey goal planner is here and it's packed with monthly content from jade myself and john to help you stay on track when it comes to your relationships, your faith, and your money. And we sell out every single year.

They're actually almost sold out. We got an email talking about it. They were like, we're towards the end of all the inventory that we have. So do not wait on this. Grab yours for 4997 at Ramsey Solutions.com slash store. Or if you're watching on YouTube or listening on podcasts, we will leave a link below. All right. Next, we have Isaac in Virginia.

Hey, Isaac. Welcome to the show. Hey, how are you doing? Hi, we're doing great. How can we help? So my wife and I inherited my grandparents' house on our family farm, and we've looked into renovations and stuff forward, and we're running into issues of it's just going to cost so much

to renovate and do an addition. We can do a new house cheaper. And so we're like, okay, we'll fix it up a little bit rented out, and we're running into problems with, I guess, family wanting us to know, and build a new house and not wanting more houses on the property, I guess what would the advice be as far as moving forward there? Do we push to the right financial thing, or do we just tear it down and build a new one on the same spot? Any time a family, anytime a, I'm saying of a couple, I would say a person too, but you and your, you and your wife, right? anytime you feel like you are hemmed in with an either or decision do we either make a foolish

financial decision or spend more money than we can afford right now to do a thing to keep family happy or we blow everything up and i always want folks to back up out of that either or situation and artificially put three five 10 other variables on the table just to go through the exercise of we're not trapped in a this one or that one. Very few decisions are either or. Okay. And there's always more context there. My first question for you is,

did your grandmother, did your grandfather, did they let you know, hey, we want you to have this land and this house? Yeah. Okay, tell me about that conversation. They didn't want us to buy a house, what, like 13 years ago when we bought the house were in because they were sure they were going to die really soon. Okay. And so they said, like, we want this to be y'alls, right?

Yep. Okay. And what did you want? Well, that's where we always wanted to be. But, like, five years ago, for $300,000, we get a renovations and additions, we get at a dream house. Now you're looking at $6,000 to $700,000, which we could afford, but it's just, to us, it's just foolish. It's not like our income hasn't grown as much as happens right. Yeah, exactly.

Right, right. So how is your family chirping and all? this um so well in order to build a new house still on the property i would have to put it on land that i own 50 50 with my father that's and he's he's had a rough year um he and my mom left after 42 years and so he's he never liked being pushed on anything before and uh he really doesn't want to be pushed now so you if we're honest another variable on the table is you don't really have this option yet. I don't have that option, but then it's like, well, we're going to tear it down maybe and build a new one because I can build a new one cheaper than I can

renovate or do it. Change square footage and finishes. I can build a brand new house and not have any compromises. You could, but if the co-owner of that land says, no, you can't. Well, no, the house, the house says it is, I own outright. Okay. But you're saying if you keep it, rent it out and built a new one, then where the new one would, that was our initial plan. Okay. Okay. but now we're to the point of just tearing it down and building a new one on the same site so could option three or five or ten or whatever wherever we are could it be to do nothing for one year and just relax for a second let your dad heal a little bit let the smoke clear a little bit maybe because it feels like there's this impulse we got to do something we got to do something

we got to do something and you really don't yeah we don't we don't have to we're just kind of drowning where we are and I live I don't live on the farm as it is now and so Like my life, my kid's life, our overall family life would be better. Is it like, do you want to live in that house in general? Like, do you want to move on family property? Yeah. So you do. So the idea of being in that house, if it was a dream house, that's great.

You guys are all good with that. Yeah, it doesn't have to be in that house. You want to be on the farm. Okay. And we like the house as it is with the plans we have for the addition and stuff. It's not like a McMansion. Could you live in it for two years? Yeah.

Is it livable? Could you just live in it for two years? Yes, you could. You'd have to upgrade the flooring. We've already started doing some demos. I mean, if you did paint and carpet, could you live in it? Like, plumbing-wise, all of that. Okay.

So what I would probably do, if that's where you guys want to be. We just were worried we'd never do anything if we did that. Yeah, but that's a problem for future you, right? Like, you'll, like, fix the carpet, make it livable. You'll exhale and be like, all right, we're going to do this for 24 months. And we're not going to owe anybody anything. We're going to sell our house. Get out from drowning.

You'll actually probably make better decisions doing that. I promise you. living in it than saying, oh, let's just make the biggest best thing we could ever do renovation-wise, you'll probably end up saving money, honestly, once you're in it and saying, okay, what do we want? But also, Isaac, like, this is always the sticky part when family gets involved with property and all of this, right, is that this was inherited to you and the land, right? You own the land as well, correct? I own the land the house is off. And how many acres is the land that you have now that came

from your grandparents? I have 10 acres, but it's the outbuilding. It's just a parcel. It's just a parcel. And no one else, who, who, how big's the farm? Where is everyone else living that's speaking into this decision with you? My father lives next 60 yards away from my grandparents' house. Okay, different plot of like property, though, right?

I mean, he owns that, is what you're saying. Who else? Who else is on the, on the farm? That's just us. So then who's mad that you would tear it down? and build something new. My father. Okay.

All right. Well, there's... So I would move in for a month, or I mean for a year, for two years. Because here's the problems I'm hearing that you need to solve right away. Right away. And the life you have right now, you're drowning. Yeah. You have a life raft right here.

It's not a boat, but it's a life raft. It's a free house. It's a free house. Let's put five grand in it and paint it and get the car, the flooring updated and maybe even get the kitchen counters redone. and let's exhale for 24 months one year or two years and then let's get dad dad's in a season of deep grieving

who is he what's going all that stuff having you right there having the grandkids around that might give him some extra life and then y'all can begin talking bigger picture if it comes down to it in a year or two

you might say dad this is mine I'm going to tear this down and build it and we're going to go rent a two bedroom apartment until that day comes but my hope would be through a relationship you don't get there

but Rachel's right if you go run in right now with a dream without having lived out there without having just experienced the ups and the downs and the winter I've done all that

I mean I grew up in my father's house Okay okay okay that's fair that's fair Yeah yeah no I hear you So where are you guys financially Isaac how much debt do you and your wife have I don't know the total We have a separate farm business But that's business

Consumer debt Like do you guys have credit cards car loans like where are you guys at oh no we have like two payments left on her car my truck's paid off we have our mortgage basically and I think she has a little bit of student loan but I think it's we paid off by the end of the year okay there's a lot of I think's in there Isaac so you guys okay how much but I do know her student loans are all but done and we have two car payments left on its flight perfect how much you guys have in savings um less than yeah before you go knocking anything down, you need to know the numbers. Okay, so I would be looking at savings. Isaac,

how much equity do you have in your home? If you sold it right now versus what you owe, how much would you all walk away with? Low side, like 125. 125. Okay. So I would, for you, for your sake, Isaac, you need to get your financial take in order. You need to be able to rattle of these numbers, you and your wife, on the same page. It's a, it's a great, if it's a house that you guys can live in, I would sell yours, go ahead and move in, and then from there figure out, do we cash flow renovations and or do we tear it down and build something with a reasonable mortgage? Hey, quick reality check. AI isn't just for sci-fi nerds and Silicon Valley tech bros anymore.

It's the new weapon of choice for every scammer with fast Wi-Fi. and bad intentions. Identity thieves could be using AI right now to steal your info in ways that would have sounded impossible just five years ago. We're talking voice cloning, deep fake videos, filing bogus tax returns, draining your bank and retirement accounts, and even home title fraud. And it can happen fast, so most people don't find out until it's too late. So as someone who has had his identity stolen before, I don't mess around. I use Xander ID theft protection because it keeps up with today's threats without the crazy price tag other company's charge. You get real-time monitoring across your whole financial and digital life,

and if something does go down, they'll give you the full white glove treatment. Like 24-7 restoration services by pros based in the U.S. and up to $2 million in stolen funds and expense coverage. So you don't need to live in fear, but you do need to be smart about protecting your identity from thieves. So go to zander.com or call 800, 356, 4282, and get yourself protected today. Up next, we have Cam in Ohio. Hi, Cam, welcome to the show. Hey, how are you guys? Hi, we're doing well.

How can we help? Hey, so I just feel like I'm always buried in debt, buried in stress, anxiety. I have a pretty good job. It's a sales job. I netted about $140,000 last year. My wife does her own thing, and she makes about $25,000 a year. We have debt with a main mortgage. We owe about $276,000 there.

I have a second mortgage that I owe about $130,000, and then we have a truck loan for $18,000 and a car loan for $6,000. All of our payments combined monthly are about $4,500 a month, and I just want to know what the best way is to start getting out of debt and be less stress. I've made some mistakes financially in my life that I want to get out of, and I just don't know what the best way to do it is. I mean, we have about $11,000 in our savings. I have, I dump $600 a month into my Roth IRA to max that out every year, and I also pay $100 a month for life insurance for my wife and I. And so I just, I feel buried.

and I don't know what to do. I want to tell you this before we turn over to Rachel, she'll walk you through. She'll give you 100% if you follow the path. It'll work, okay? But I want to tell you, we take calls, taking thousands of calls over the years.

There's a, there's a particular tone that somebody, when they call in, that you can hear it in their voice, they're done. They're done with the stress. They're done with anxiousness. And I can hear that in you.

And it fills me up with joy because I know I can give you a path out of this thing, okay? you just have to be willing to surrender and say what i've been doing is not working i make too much money yes to um be this sick into my stomach all the time are you in yeah yeah i am in that's awesome man awesome right um cam what is the second mortgage for is that on your primary home like a he lock or do you guys have a second property yes so it's on our primary home so we bought our home uh five years ago with a good interest rate we have a 2.8 percent interest rate on that but then it had an unfinished

basement and needed a roof. So I got a second mortgage to finish the basement and put a roof on it. Okay. And when did you guys do that? How long ago? A year ago. Okay. Okay. So I would lump that mortgage, both mortgages into baby steps six. So our seven baby steps is really walking through how to get out of debt, get to a place where you're saving for retirement, and paying off the mortgage. So if the basically a he lock, right, that you took out, you, you, you borrowed money on your house. If it's more than 50% of your income, we lump that in to a second mortgage. So what I'm to be thinking through with you right now is the, the car payments is really what you have. I mean, it's about $24,000 in vehicle debt that you all have. Now, you have $11,000 in savings, which is

great. You're funding $600 in retirement. You're doing that, you know, you're, you're, you're named off a couple of things, which are all good things, I would just reorder how you're doing them because you're trying to do 18 different things at once and you're not getting traction. Is that right? Is that how you feel? Yes. Yes. Okay. So what I would do if I were you, I would pause all retirement, including the Roth, because you're putting $600 a month, is what you said, right, to max it out, which is great. But that's nice if you have $600 to give when you don't have all these payments, right? So I would pause all retirement. of what you guys are doing. And do you all have kids? One, yes. You have one. Okay. And is your wife, is she home

with the kid? Okay. She works out of the house doing nails, but she likes to be a stay-at-home mom. Yeah, good for her. Well, she's bringing in, yeah, some great money doing that. That's awesome. About two grand a month. I mean, yeah, that's a great side hustle. So if I woke up in your shoes, I would pause that retirement. I would throw 10,000 of the 11,000, which is going to make you really nervous at the car. So I'd pay off your truck today. And then you would have 14,000 left on your truck. Now, how much is the payment for the $6,000 car? 250. Okay, so that frees up $250. So even in this call, we just freed up close to $900 a month that you can now throw extra at the truck, which you'll have, again, $13,000 left. So I would work to pay this off completely.

and you guys make great money. I mean, you're making $165. So, I mean, I would do everything to get this paid off, gosh. I mean, maybe in the next six months or something, you know, to have an aggressive goal. Because the faster you guys can do this and get some traction under you, the faster you're going to see some wins. Because what's great is you freed up that $250 payment. Once the truck's paid off, how much is that payment a month? 3.30.

3.30. Okay. So then you get to that point. and what you're able to do then is go back or have some savings, go back and rebuild your savings after the cars are all paid off to about a three-month. I would probably do three-month emergency,

three-to-four months for you guys. And then you can press play back on retirement and then the big tackle then is going to be these mortgages. And I would keep them separate for now because I'm assuming your first mortgage is going to have a better interest rates. We're not too concerned about interest rates, but on something like this, I probably wouldn't consolidate at this point.

I'd probably keep them separate and start paying off the 130, get that paid off, and then the 270. So you kind of emotionally feel like you have $400,000 of a house to pay off in Baby Step 6 is what that's going to amount to. So with my savings at $11,000, I had like 20 the other day, but I was listening to you as a show. I took nine of it and I dumped it on our car to pay it off a little bit quicker. But I also, about six months ago, picked up my real estate license. And I have a couple deals right now that if I close on them, I'll be able to wipe my vehicle debt out completely with that. Okay. So would you still deplete that 11?

Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. And here's two things I want you to feel, okay? Number one, project out nine months to where you don't owe anybody anything. Okay. yeah to get there in that time frame it's going to be miserable no going out to eat

y'all you're all eating whatever you got left in the fridge somebody going to to the grocery store and getting bare minimum at 730 at night after a long day of work like that's what you're signing up for it's going to be miserable and you continuing on this path for the next nine months is going to be miserable so what you're choosing is you're choosing your heart it's people like to think like i don't want to do this because that's too hard i'm just going to keep living my life which is miserable. And so I'm going to choose my hard that's going to get me to where I want to go.

That's number one. Number two, I want that anxiousness of we only have $1,000. All we have is enough money in case one or two of our tires blows out with the cost of tires these days. It is designed to be just,

take the edge off, like just the sharpest, dull that tip of that, of that pointy knife of fear just a little bit and to fuel you, because I promise you, if you only have a thing,

thousand bucks you're going to hustle on those two on those two um real estate deals because you want that the moment you get those things paid off you're going to start building back your emergency fund and then you're going to be your own credit card and that's what three months in an account if you got 20 30 grand and you've you've done two deals and you're able to knock that out with that money i'm telling you man you will sleep you'll laugh different in your house your marriage will be i mean everything changes yeah and then you'll knock this dude then knock out 10 real estate deals plus your income, and you're out of your house in the next 36 months, too. It becomes this snowball effect.

Powerful small wins. Cam, do you guys do a detailed budget every month, doing your wife sit down and say, here's exactly where the income's going to go? We haven't. That's why I've made a mistake because we started making really good money. And I told myself I wouldn't grow into it, and then guess what I go? I've got the same thing.

All of us are there. Life's all creep. No, I know. So seriously, Cam, I mean, I think it'd be a really great exercise because you've, I know how you feel. Like John said, I can hear it in your voice. You feel out of control. You're like, oh, my gosh.

Like, there's, like, our money's going everywhere. I feel like there's no, you know, all of it. But I'm telling you, if you do a plan, if you guys sit down and do a monthly budget, we're going to give you every dollar for free for the next year. Kelly will pick up when we're done with this call. And what this is, it's not only a budgeting app, but it's going to be able to ask you about a 15-minute questionnaire at the beginning when you sign into the app. And what it's going to do is going to give you all these recommendations,

and it's going to walk you through this whole process of what we've done on the phone, but it's going to extend, which is wonderful. So again, you just need a plan. You guys need to sit down. You need to live on nothing. You need to live on nothing. This is going to be a challenge for you, but it's going to be good for you and your wife to do. Throw everything you guys have at these cars.

Get them paid off. Throw everything at an emergency fund, gets it built up. And I'm telling you, Cam, you're going to feel different. You're going to feel different, even just that. So hold on the line, and Kelly's going to pick up. You've worked hard to control your money. You've been budgeting with intention, building a plan, and creating a secure future for your family. But there's one area most people forget to protect, their online data.

So I use delete me. because y'all data brokers collect and post personal information like your home address phone number and even your kids schools info they do it without your permission and once it's out there it can be used by scammers AI spam tools and other people that you would never want to have access to your life so think about it you wouldn't hand that info to a stranger at the grocery store so why let it sit there online for anyone to find it well delete me helps you take control back their team of real live privacy experts, find your exposed info, removes it from sketchy websites, and make sure that it stays gone. Then they send you a report so that you know exactly what they've taken

care of. So protect your peace and the life that you're working so hard to build. Right now, Ramsey listeners get 20% off at joindeletme.com slash Ramsey with code Ramsey at checkout. Do it today. That's join delete me.com slash ramsie and code ramsay. Welcome back to the Ramsey show in the Fair Wins Credit Union Studio and we have some breaking news. We are so excited about this. There is now a co-branded Ramsey and Fair Wins debit card. that is now available on it. It's got dead as normal.

Be weird. So all of your purchases that you make. You're putting the number up there. Is it on the front? Oh, no, it's all right. And I think it's, I don't think it's like a real. I don't know. I don't think it's real.

Okay. This isn't mine. Yes, it is. No, it's not. Mine's coming. Mine's in the mail. I got the email. Mine's coming, I think in the next like three business days.

Can't wait. But the fair wins. Yep. Where's the, where's our area? I was trying to get the camera for YouTube so you can see it. It's beautiful. So great. But Fair Wins is incredible, you guys. It's a credit union that's partnered with Ramsey, and they want what we want for you, which is working the baby steps. You want your financial partner, your bank, to be for you in this process of getting out of debt and saving. And Fair Wins Credit Union does that. So they are absolutely incredible. We are so excited to partner with them and the new debit card, which will be, yeah, coming here way soon. Can I tell you what I love about the debit card? Dave and I were talking about this. I love this is a way to literally change the way servers and restaurant folks think of Ramsey folks and people are getting out

of debt. I want it to be when they see that card, they know they're going to get so generously tip. Like a good tip. Yes. They're going to like, oh, these are, these are amazing people. And it's a way to, without making a big fanfare, to be like, hey, we're weird. And because we've been weird, we can honor you and take care of you in a pretty remarkable way. So I would love for that to be the generosity message that servers and, hot dog cart people or whoever's taken like that that's the message that permeates the folks who are running around with this card i love they want people with this card because they know they're good people that's awesome so great generous people yeah so you can go to fair wins dot org slash ramsie to

sign up for the smart bundle and that includes the ramsie debit card so we're so excited about that all right let's go to susan in missouri she is up next hey susan welcome to the show how are you all doing Hi. Hi, we're doing great. How are you? Oh, trudging through life right now. Okay, what's going on? A couple weeks ago, my husband asked me for a divorce. Oh, gosh, Susan. I'm sorry. He's pretty serious about it. Of course, I don't want it, but that's just how life is. And right now, we don't have any debt. We all our cars are paid off. All of our collections are paid off. The only debt we have is our house. house. Properties worth about $400,000, we have to take a little bit. And we only have $159,000 left on it. Okay. We have about $84,000 in savings. And he has a traditional pension and I have a regular 401k. Yeah. He's hard and said that he's not going to touch my

401k as long as I don't make a claim against his pension. Whoa. What? Yeah. How much is in your 401k? About right now, about 375,000. Okay. I put in 19% and my company matches 12. Okay. Here's where I said, whoa. He walked in, unbeknownst to you and just said, I want a divorce.

I'm tired of being married to you. And then sort of flexing on you. If you don't do this, I won't do that. Yeah. There had been a couple signs coming up and I saw them. and then we had a argument one night, and it wasn't anything, like, serious, and he said, I'm done, and he left three weeks ago. Well, before you start making handshake deals with him, I would sit down with your attorney

to make sure this is all right and fair, because if you've been paying all the bills for 20 or 30 years, and he was able to, and his pensions worth $7 million, or, you know what I mean, like it may not be apples to apples, before you start shaking hands and saying, this is, this is cool I won't do this but you do that sit down with an attorney that's that's one thing but right now I'm more concerned about you know if you do get to that point I want to I want to save the house I want to stay in the house okay what has he said about that with you guys have you talked about that at all no he's not returning any phone calls or speaking at this point so I can't get to that question yeah but your goal is wanting to keep the house right okay

and I've done some of the simple math as far as what you know the cash we have and savings, selling off, we've got some classic vehicles, selling them off. And I've come to the realization that I would probably need about $50,000 to pay them off, to buy the whole property outright and still retain the loan. It's a $19,000 loan. The question is, you know, I do have that $375 in my 401K. Would that be, I mean, that's the only place I can think to go to get that to pay him off. Because taking out, you know, like a second mortgage wouldn't make sense because the first mortgage plus a second would be well above, you know, what I could pay every month for mortgage payment. So you're saying you wouldn't be able to afford the home without taking money out of your 401K? Correct. The mortgage right now is about $16.50 a month. And, you know, I always try to state the rule of, you know, one-third of your income for your housing.

Yeah, but taking, borrowing from your 401k in this situation, because all of this is hypothetical right now, he may just sign the house over to you and be gone. But if you had to write him a check for 50 grand, you taking that from your, what I'm going to tell you is, it's not a humongous, it's not bad, but it's not a humongous 401k, you're going to be taking that out at 30 or 40% interest. It's like going to a bank and asking for a 40% loan. You can do that. Yeah, how old are you, Susan? 46. Okay. Yeah, no, I would not touch the 401 case, Susan. I would figure out a way within the equity and the payment plan back to him. If he's willing to negotiate, and this will be probably your attorneys, I'm assuming, you know, doing a lot of this kind of mediation, yeah, to figure out how you can keep the house and have a plan that's reasonable for your income. But yeah, it would be, it would not, I could, I would not feel good to say, take money out of your 401k and be hit with that amount of fees and taxes and all of it because

it's before 59.5. Right. And I will feel good about saying just don't. Yeah, don't do that. Yeah. I would rather see you either if he walked out and say, okay, then I'm keeping the house. And if he says absolutely not, I want this and this and this. At the very least, we're going to put this on a payment plan. Cool. Then I'll pay $400 a month for the next however many years. And, He probably wouldn't even live that long, but I don't have $50,000 in cash. You just walked out of my life. Yeah, yeah, he absolutely wants to share the house. Well, he's going to want a whole bunch of stuff, but he just left his wife.

Yeah. And so here's the thing. When somebody files for divorce, the day they file for divorce, it becomes a business transaction. Right. That's it. And most people want to preserve the relationship. Well, there's this. And I still want to be a.

it is a business transaction and that's heartbreaking and you have to be honest by the way you have to be really honest about I know that this has blown your life to smithereens but if you can't afford the house payment plus the taxes plus the taxes they're going to keep going up in your local area

if you can't afford the house you can't afford the house and that's another layer of heartbreak the 1650 well I mean it's going to go up to 1750 because we just have an increase in our insurance but that is a doable number for me as far as being able to pay. Well, that's going to be the hope is that you can figure out a way to get to be able to pay him what he needs and then figure out how to stay in the house and maybe do a lower payment plan and over and be able to pay him off fast.

You know, we want you, we want you out of that. I don't want you in that forever. I know. I'm being ridiculous. Yeah, no. But the idea is like what can you do to be able to stay in? And that's what I would fight for, but I would not borrow from the 401K. Buying a home these days can be a real dog-eat-dog situation.

Just when you think you've found the right house, somebody else swoops in with a better offer. So you need an edge. Homebuyer edge from Churchill Mortgage can help you win against the competition with the ultimate triple threat for homebuyers. One, your pre-approval is handled by real humans, not just a computer, so you're positioned like a cash buyer even without the cash. Two, sellers love a sure thing. So Churchill backs your offer with a $10,000 seller guarantee. If your loan falls through, the seller gets $10,000, which takes away their fears about financing

and gives them another reason to say yes to your offer. And three, Churchill secures your rate for $9,000. days, so you don't have to worry about the interest rates going up while you find the right home. It doesn't cost you anything extra, and if rates drop, so does yours. Automatically, with Homebuyer Edge from Churchill, you're not just another buyer, you're a top contender. Go to ChurchillMorgage.com to arm yourself with the ultimate home buying edge today. That's Churchillmortgage.com. This is a paid advertisement. Homebuyer Edge and Seller Guarantee are available for qualifying borrowers and select loan size only and are not available in all

seats or locations. NMLSID 1591, NMLS ConsumerExcess.org, Equal Housing Lender. calling in from Georgia. Hi, Monica. Welcome to the show. Hi, thanks for having me. Yes, absolutely. How can we help today? I am set to get a large inheritance from a family trust,

and I was advised to keep it separate from my husband and keep it in a separate account and not spend it on anything that was, not like in my name. Co-mingling it with your husband. Are you guys about to be divorced? No. Okay.

Is he cheating on you? No. Do you love him? Are you halfway married? Who gave you this advice? I'm fascinated to know. An attorney. Yeah.

Yeah. And to my friends that are attorneys, the people who come into their offices are dividing up assets or they're solving these ugly problems. And so I understand. that that comes from when all you see is problems that it's easy to say like hey here's a potential problem i get that um but yeah our our philosophy is yeah is that you guys are one you know in every aspect so he gets an inheritance you get inheritance your that means your

household gets this money not just you as an individual um again unless there is something happening you know abuse addiction whatever it is then there is a reason um how much is how much are you getting? Anywhere from like one to three million. Okay. Yeah. And the only debt that we have combined is a mortgage on our home, but I'm not on the loan. So it was advised for me not to pay off basically his loan.

Again, from an attorney. Yes. Okay. So there's two schools of thinking, Monica, that happen in the financial space when it comes to marriages. There's one extreme side, which sounds like what the attorney exactly would say, right? That when you get married, you keep your assets. Anything you build from the marriage on is yours.

It's all his. Your paycheck is yours. His paycheck is his. His debt is his. Your debt is yours. You basically live like two. You're basically... College roommates.

Yeah, your roommates are like a business partner, right? That we are separate in this part of our lives. So that's one school of thinking. Another school of thinking where we tend to lean or where, you know, I do, I know John does, is that your marriage is bigger than a financial transaction. Your marriage is saying that you and I are one in every aspect of our lives. And we are doing this life together. That's why we chose to get married to share a life, which means we share parenting,

we share household chores, we share our money, we share our expectations about sex. like whatever that is within side the marriage, like we share these things because we are doing life together. And when you do that, what ends up happening is there's a deeper level of unity and connection that's created because you see yourselves as one. Like you see yourselves, you know, as I'm doing this life with you as a partner and I'm not keeping this one part of my life separate because I don't trust you fully. And I say that with an asterisk, which I said the beginning of this call, you know, if there is something, a big issue in the marriage that you have to protect yourself, then that's one thing, right? Again, addiction, abuse, like whatever that

may be. But overall, Monica, we just see a quality of marriage, people that have a very deep quality connection. There is something about that transparency, that vulnerability to say, I'm giving this part of my life to you, and you're giving that part of your life to me, and we're doing this together. So I guess at the end of the day, Monica, you guys get to choose what kind of marriage you want. But we see the benefit from not only a financial aspect to getting ahead quicker. Financially, you get ahead faster when you work together, but also from a relational standpoint. There's data on marriages about people who share their finances and they have better outcomes on a number of different metrics. Yeah, I mean, we share everything for the most part

and I've never made a payment on our mortgage. So I feel like, do you all have kids together? Yes, we have kids and we are happily married. How long have you all been married? A decade, 10 years. Okay, so the court would say you have participated in this house. Yeah, no, I understand what you're getting at. My family has like a pretty large trust.

So this would just be like one disbursement. So they were under, they were basically. advising me with a family attorney to keep it separate or to have him basically sign off on some things that like it's not his even if I pay for things that are ours. And so what you're choosing to do if you make that call is now I'm uncoupling our unity here and this is going to be mine and then we're going to go about having our regular life. yeah and i don't even think he cares either way that's the fun i promise you this will become a deal yeah i promise you because it because money flows the value at which you live your life is how

money flows so what you're you're setting up a value system within your marriage monica you are here's what it says it says there came a dollar a number there came a dollar amount when i didn't trust you anymore and here was the number one to three million dollars that was the line and everybody always wonders like how hot would the person have to be or how bad but he found out it's one to three million dollars was when you said okay you can't participate in this i'm going to create a separate thing and i know you're getting wisdom from other people right but that became the number that the unity in your marriage was worth yeah well that's not the case exactly exactly so i want to i want to i want to provide an alternative voice than the one you're getting which is basically i want a i want a

basically a pre-up now in the middle of my marriage I want to add an addendum to our marriage contract that says anything I get now over here from this account whether it's a job whether it's a trust whether it's I wrote a book and it becomes what that one's that stuff's going to be mine you can't touch that and then we'll go back to to regularly scheduled programming

I'm telling you right now it'll alter your marriage yeah and the house that you all have that's in his name did he own that house before you got married no he just bought it that way have you all talked about that before um no the house is titled in both of our names i just i'm not on the loan oh that i mean that doesn't matter yeah no i i could pay off i could pay off the house but it's under his name is what they're saying well yeah but the title's yeah but it's y'all's

house yeah but you're both on that yeah no yeah that's y'all's house and you may want to say hey we just got three million dollars woohoo let's go let's go have a retreat and That's what's so hard, Monica, I think, is where I'm having a little bit of difficulty is instead of seeing this gift that you've got from your parents who did incredibly well and they're passing on their legacy, you know, that you're not looking at your husband and you guys aren't kind of celebrating inside. Like, holy crap, we got $3 million. We are celebrating.

No, you're not. You're not. I mean, you're not, though. You're not saying, gosh, we get to be out of debt. We get to do all this together. We get to, this is our life. Our kids. I mean, we get to create all this.

It's not that, it's, hey, make sure you, Monica, make sure you sign this paper that he can't freaking touch it. He can't touch it, this is mine. And anything I buy with this, Monica, you just said, he can't participate in. Like, does that not sound, like, really sad to you in a marriage? It sounds, like, very, very cold, but that doesn't really shock me. Yeah. It doesn't shock you that that's the advice you're getting?

No, it's just, I think that, like, a worst-case scenario planning is kind of, like, like the background I come from, where my husband's side of the family is very much, like, together and what do you want, Monica? What kind of marriage do you want? No, I want the one-minded, one track. I just, you know, I figured I'd talk to somebody who doesn't have any skin in the game. Totally. You're talking to two people that's what we would do in our house. And let me tell you, Dave and Sharon Ramsey, we have a state meeting plans every single year and not once have my parents nor have I had any feeling towards any of the spouses that this over here the only time I see it that I can actually very much understand it's not in

our case but some family businesses there's voting stock and that the voting stock stays with the family member the blood family if there is a separation that I understand because you don't want to co-mingle next yeah yeah within something like that that makes sense and I think there's some complicated estate planning out there that but man that kind of I don't know why Bob, that really hurts me where I'm like, it's not that we're winning. It's that I'm winning over here and you don't get to win. Yeah. And so your family may not like it, Monica, but you and your husband get to choose what kind of marriage you want. And if they don't agree with that, that's up to them. That's their issue, not yours. But going forward, I would, I would employ

you to, you guys work together in this and you'd see yourselves as one because that creates a beautiful marriage in life. If you've listened to me for more than five minutes, you know that being normal with your money is not a good thing because normal is broke. And I want you to be weird. That's why I love what we're doing with Fair Wins Credit Union. Our friends at Fair Wins just launched a brand new Ramsey debit card, and it says debt is normal, be weird. right on the front. I love that because every time you swipe it, you're choosing to live differently with no credit card payments and no debt. You see, Fairwinds has been helping people like you

ditch debt faster and bill wealth for years. They're not trying to shove credit cards or auto loans in your face like the big banks do. And they've worked with us to create the smart bundle for Ramsey fans. It includes a no-fee checking account, a high-yield savings account to supercharge your emergency fund, and now the Ramsey debit card to help you stay focused on the baby steps. We're excited for you to try it. So check them out today at fairwins.org slash Ramsey. That's fairwins.org slash Ramsey, insured by the NCUA. Our question of the day is brought to you by why refi. You've tried budgeting, you've tried making minimum payments, but those defaulted private student loans are still weighing you down.

And why refi may be able to help. Learn more at yrefi.com slash Ramsey. That's the letter Y, R, eFY.com slash Ramsey may not be available in all states. Today's question comes from Bethany in Connecticut. Bethany writes, I'm 46 years old with no kids and no debt. I'm an aggressive saver in CDs and money market funds. I have $250,000 safe for retirement and a three to six month emergency fund. I only spend money on the necessities and get by as cheaply as possible. Everyone says I'm doing a good job of saving money, but mental health-wise,

I have a hard time getting into the market due to anxiety and OCD. How does someone manage mental health while also managing their market? Are there helpful strategies such as only looking at one portfolio once a quarter or once a year? Is there a way I can do it myself? I don't want to be completely hands on, but I don't want to give up all control either. It's a great question. I think a lot of people have some fear around putting money in the markets. And usually that fear comes from not knowing enough because I guarantee you, Bethany, I think

you're smart. And I think if you sat down with a financial planner and actually looked at some of the investments that you could do, whether it's mutual funds or index funds and you're able to see the pattern of the market, you're able to see a long-term track record with some of these funds. I think it will give you more peace to know, okay, my money could be making a lot more, or double what it's making now in CDs. But there is a level of risk to it, sure. But also, you're 46 years old. And you probably aren't going to touch any of this until, you know, the next 15 years.

That was the big switch for me, which was my SmartVestor Pro, I'm fortunate. I will say that. I'm very lucky that was also a college roommate of mine. And so when we were going back and forth with this years ago, he finally said, hey, if you're thinking you're going to take this money out at some point in the next few years, or if it starts going down, you're going to pull all that. this out and pay the penalties, I'm not your guy. And that for me was, oh, if I, if I invest money in retirement, this thing's on a 40 or 50 year ride. Me checking this every month, me honestly

checking it every year is a choice to be falsely optimistic or falsely pessimistic because I'm 49 years away, 25 years away. So for me, I'm an anxious person and I'm also an anxious investor. I like the idea of like investing in real estate so I can go see it right I can go touch it I like the idea of having extra cash in the bank right but when it comes to investing I had to make the decision this is going to be a ride I'm going to get on until I retire yes and when I made that decision I honestly don't look at it very much at the details what's what's the market because it doesn't matter it doesn't matter to me right now because I'm playing a 20 or 30 year game and so my smart investor pro to be honest with you we work together on goals we

we check in but he'll text me and say hey you're about to get an email from our company don't open it because he's known me forever he's like you're going to freak out you're going to act stupid or whatever or hey the market's up 21% just remember that's like it's it's a he's a he's a psychologist more than he's a money guy for me right 100% and so bethany that's how I handle it I just don't don't check I know the people who check it up and down every day I just know when I made that choice I'm on a ride that's going to be a however many year a multi-decade ride I'm not going to lose a ton of sleep over it in the short term. 100%.

Yeah. And we look at ours just once a year and kind of re-evaluate, where is everything, how are we feeling? You know, but it's, but that's it. I don't, I mean, unless it's for work and I'm trying to figure out, you know, if the rates went down or I don't know, you can kind of just keep a pulse on it. But I don't do it from an emotional sense of my own money either because it's, yeah, it's the long game. And Rachel, I don't think this is an anti-Ramsie sentiment. I think when you pay your house off like once you've got

when you're on the other side of Baby Step 6 my wife and I like I was like hey I feel more comfortable with more than six months cash she's like okay but it's a we are consciously choosing together to not make to make less on that spread right it could be making this in the market

it's only making this in a high-yel savings account but it feels good to have some cash available that's a that's a margin that I've bought myself that I pay two or three percent a year a tax on and I call it my sleep tax. But, like, I think if you get there, if you decide, like, hey, I'm putting money, I'm putting 15% away for retirement. I'm doing those things. I want a little bit more money.

I don't owe anybody anything. I'm fine with that. Totally. I'm fine with that. Yeah, absolutely. That's good. All right, let's go to Sarah, who's in Texas. Hey, Sarah. Welcome to the show. Hey, thanks for taking my call. Yes, absolutely. I had a quick question. Me and my fiancé, we're in a bind. So we both have car payments and we're both upside down. So combined our car payments are about $1,800 a month. Golly. Yeah, I know it's stupid. I know.

Are you driving Lamborghinis? What do you drive? I'm curious. No, just basic, you know, a GMC Acadia and an F-150. An F-150 is a 2015, and the Acadia is a 2021. Terrible interest rates. Did you get these at like a sub-prime? I mean, did you buy them off a lot?

It's like a handshake deal off a lot somewhere behind the line? No, car dealership. it was just the credit was so bad so he had his truck before i got my car my other car that was paid off i loved it it was just down in the dirt and the engine was smoking when i pulled into the dealership okay sarah what i want you to separate these out tell me your car how much how much my car is my oh i owe 32 on it still okay um my payment is 1100 because we got behind so we had to do this promised to pay thing it was 815 but now it's bumped up to 1100 okay um 2015 f-150 he still owes 20 000 on it and his payment is right at 700 okay how much you make a year so combined we

no don't combine it don't combine it you me myself right around 55 ooh okay how about him uh he's about 52 53 okay what could you sell your car for today. What does Kelly Blue Book say? I think it's like 17. Have you looked? I have. Okay. And an individual, not dealer? So not as an individual. I haven't.

Okay, so I would do that. So I would give it a couple thousand more because you can usually get more from an individual. A dealer is going to buy it as close to wholesale as possible. So what was the first? What did the number you said for the dealership? 17. Okay. Let's just bump it up to 20 just for fun, okay? How much could he sell his for? I think his is valued at like eight. From a dealer.

From an F-150, do you wreck it? No, he did not wreck it. F-150s are made of gold these days. So both of our cards have about 100,000 miles. His is about 100. No, that's not. I almost guarantee you a 2015, F-150. Yeah, 12 to 15,000.

Or you think even more. They're expensive. I buy, I like trucks, and they're so, like, it's like cartoon money. No. No, dude. I thought that's what it said. So it's also a two-wheel drive. I mean, there's going to be a bunch of nuances here and there, Nick Naxson. We don't have to go back and forth if it's extended cab or a single, like all that stuff.

I could almost guarantee you, I could be wrong, that it's worth more than $8,000. Unless it's been wrecked, it was underwater. I will look into that. Yes. Yes. And private party, too. Yep. Okay. Even if there was somebody that owns a lawn crew that will roll up and give you $10,000 cash for it. Like, it's, I haven't seen a truck worth $8,000 in a long, long, long time. Okay.

So, yeah, we'll be a little bit more. And you're in Texas, you know. I mean, they give you a truck with your birth certificate. Yeah. I haven't dug too much into him. Okay, so Sarah, golly. Okay, so, man, okay, so for you, and I'm going to talk, I'm going to, I'm going to separate the two because you guys aren't married yet. Once you're married, we combine it all together and right off into the winds.

But for you specifically, yes, getting rid of this car is huge because it's more than half of your annual take-home pay. You know what I mean? Or half of what you make. And so we have way, way too much car, which I know that's why you're calling because you're feeling it. Yeah, well, we both are. So all of our finances are combined. We have four kids together. Okay.

Okay. Dude, just hang on the line. We're going to hold you over because I want to unpack this one. Yeah, and we'll walk through some of this math with you, Sarah. We're going to go to a break, but we'll be right back. Thank you. All right, welcome back. We have Sarah on the line from the last segment.

She was calling in because they're car payments and car loans. They are feeling it. So she owes $32,000 on hers with $1,100 going out every month in a payment. And her husband owes $20,000 or I'm sorry, her fiance owes $20,000 on his. He makes $52. she makes 55 and just kind of trying to figure out the math here to get them out of these payments. Does that sound right, Sarah, so far? Yes.

Okay. And are both of your credits shot? Because you mentioned that. Yeah. They are. Yeah. So we have completely stopped paying on the credit cards because even the minimums is like, okay, well, we're not going to pay our rent. So we rent right now for $2,000 and daycare, $700.

It's everywhere. Okay. your rent is 2000 how much you guys I mean you're running your household as if you're married someone asked this how much do how much hits you pretty much how much hits your checking account every month after taxes after insurance everything I would say right about 8,000 8,000 for both of you yes okay okay well that's yeah then the um the $2,000 rent that's in line with it for being about a fourth of your take home pegs that's what we're wanting shooting for so that's not completely out of control but then again you add on these car payments

and everything else on top of it it's a lot so um have you guys have you guys gone down to maybe a local credit union or a local bank and talk through a loan process because the ideal situation again your credit shot so it may not work um they will not refinance but it no no not a refinance just to get a get a personal loan and i would get a 25 000 loan for you and pay off the difference of 20, go get a $5,000 crappy car for just the time being. And your husband, you know, do the same if he's able to. Because I mean, honestly, what John was saying about trucks, I mean, I'm praying he can get more, but he may only need like a $6,000 loan to get it paid off to get the difference if he can sell it. And it's not a ref, it's just we're paying this thing off. We're done with

them. Yeah, yeah. But I would rather have a $20,000 loan than a $32,000. Right. So we're just kind of moving it, but lowering it at the same time, which means you're getting rid of these cars and driving crappy cars. Do you guys have any, you don't have anything in savings? No, nothing. So we just started y'all's financial peace last week to our church. Oh, good. Okay. All the steps are hitting us and we're like, ooh. Yeah. Well. Yeah. The thing I think you have to metabolize here is this is, you've got these car payments. You all have done things that aren't wise with money we all have. you all have to metabolize to truly get out of this

a mess it's going to be 36 months of not a lot of fun yeah and if you're willing to do that you can get out of this and that might mean you're taking a second job he's taking a second job

and you're like I don't have time to that and I would tell you don't have time not to because I can hear you drowning and you're going to find yourself this car is going to fail you before you pay it off and you have to roll that has been in the shop

that's right you have to roll the negative equity and you're going to end up on $50,000 on a on a 79 used like whatever Volvo right so it's like at some point you and him have to say we're drawing a line here we're not going to go out to eat we're going to take second jobs we're going to maybe move apartments it's $500 instead of $2,000 we're going to do that for three years or two years so we get out of this once and for all and if you don't have that level of burn it to the ground and grow something beautiful out of the ashes if you don't have that you're just going to keep playing a shell game yeah that's right yeah there has to be an extreme

change. I mean, it's almost a 180 at the way you guys have been thinking about money, doing money. I mean, all of it. It's got to be a complete different shift. And you guys are in Financial Beach University, which I'm so thankful for. But we're also, if you hold on the line, Kelly's going to pick up. And we're going to give you our all new every dollar. And we're excited about this because within the app, you're not only able to budget and create a monthly budget, which will be so great for you, Sarah, and to sit down for you guys to look and be like, hey, we are literally, this is our plan for what we're spending on groceries, lights, rent, gas for the car, and that's it, take care and insurance. And like, we're paying for nothing else. We're not

Amazoning. We're not going to Target. We're not going to Target. We're not going to decorate anything. Oh, that looks nice. Doesn't matter. We're not doing anything, but we're literally putting every penny we can find towards this debt. And when you start to have that motivation, it's incredible. And to have an app like every dollar that not only can you do the budget, but also it's going to look over your entire financial plan because with every dollar, we're adding in so many coaching elements, and it's going to look over your entire financial picture. And people are finding thousands of dollars of margin in just 15 minutes. So for all of you listening, we have a premiere coming about the all new every dollar on September 25th, where you get to see real

success stories and how you can be the next one and how you can plug into this and start your money journey. So if you want to turn on your YouTube notifications to get notified when the premiere drops, make sure to do that. And again, that is going to be September 25th is where the all-new Every Dollar premiere is here for you guys, and we're really, really excited about it. So Sarah, again, Kelly's going to pick up and we will hook you up for a year's worth of that every-dollar subscription to get you guys in and moving. So we are cheering y'all on. All right, next we have Crystal in Oregon. Hi, Crystal. Welcome to the show. Hi, thank you for having me. I'm honored. Absolutely. How can we help?

I am a single mother of one and I own a home I have an LLC in cleaning houses and then I coach high school basketball on the side but I have a credit card that's just eating me alive okay wow good for you crystal good for you that's awesome way to take on the world I was a basketball coach for a few years is one of my favorite jobs I've ever ever had it's way more fun than being a YouTuber it was awesome yeah it's very rewarding okay so tell me about this credit card what's going on I think I had a few years that were really difficult, so I feel like a lot of it is food to feed my daughter and I and things like that. I'd say I haven't used it in about a year, but it doesn't go down. Okay. How much do you owe on it? I owe about a little over 9,000. 9,000.

Okay. How much do you make a year? I make about 58. 58. Okay, good for you. That's great. And what's the payment each month? the payment right now is like 330 okay perfect but then the interest on it is like i think it's like

200 so it's like i'm only paying off 100 of it here and there yeah extra okay um after you pay all of your bills crystal like from um you say you have a house so your mortgage lights everything do you have any margin left over um i have a after like all the bills with my house and everything i have a after like all the bills with my house and everything, I have $1,000 left for food and gas. For food and gas. Okay. Perfect. Okay. Um, so yeah, I mean, a couple of things, Crystal, I mean, you can, you know, that $1,000, I mean, there's, um, for food. I mean, food's expensive. It's hard, but if, I'm just thinking through, if you can find a thousand dollars a month, you can get this paid off in nine months, right? Meaning, I don't know if there's extra. work you pick up a little bit on the side, cutting expenses where you're like, listen, we're having peanut butter and jelly and spaghetti every day. Like, that's what we're doing for the next five months. Like, we're cutting the grocery budget. Like, we're cutting where

we can. We're adding extra because I'm honestly sitting on this side of the phone call, I was expecting, I was holding my breath when you said, I was thinking 22 to 30,000 on the credit card. That's what I was thinking. So when you said nine, I was like, okay, Crystal can do this. Crystal can do this. You really can't. And here's the thing. Here's what I hate about this. It may be that you have to go and say,

I can't do my side hustle of coaching this year because it only pays $2,500 for the season. I got to go get job X. And because I got to make $6,000. Yeah, the basketball, the basketball paid, my daughter goes to a private Christian school. So I took on the basketball gig to help pay for my portion of sending her to that school.

Okay, there you go. So here's the thing. It's going to be every day. decision you make is going to be a trade-off. Yep. And do I want to keep this thing around for two years and pay $400 a month on it? Or do I want to just grit my teeth, make some really deep cuts, and be done with this thing in seven months, and they get on with my life?

Yeah. Yeah. And I think my biggest question was, is that I do have a PERS account from a previous job that's at about $7,300 right now. Is that something I should consider cashing in to help pay this off? A what account? A PERS. Okay, I don't know if I'm familiar with that.

I don't know what that is. That's a price of Georgia. No, I don't know what that is. As long as there's not fees attached to it or you get penalized or something weird. But yeah, if you're able to get that. And hey, stay on the line, Crystal. Kelly's going to pick up. We're going to give you an Aldi gift card. Aldi is an incredible place to shop for your groceries because it's so inexpensive.

It's amazing. And the quality is great. And they gave us some gift cards. So Crystal, stay on the line. We're going to give you an Aldi gift card to help at least for this month. Get your launch out of here. Absolutely. We've all done dumb things with money. I've done them with zeros on the end.

One of the biggest mistakes I see people make with money is not having a plan for it. You've got to have a plan. You've got to be intentional and you need to get a budget. You have to tell your money where to go so you're not wondering where it went. Our budgeting app, every dollar, helps you do. just that. It's the easiest and fastest way to make a monthly plan for every dollar you've got coming in and going out. Now's the best time to get started before the ridiculous holiday spending season gets here and sucks you in because you didn't have a plan. Don't let that happen. You're done making that mistake. Go download every dollar for free in the app store

or Google Play today. Welcome back to The Ramsey Show in the Fairwinds Credit Union Studio. I'm Rachel Cruz with Dr. John Deloney, and we're going to go to Gail in Pennsylvania. Hi, Gail. Welcome to the show. Hi, good afternoon. Thanks so much for taking my call. Absolutely.

How can we help today? my husband and I we are 55 and we are about to be selling our home and we are purchasing a home together with my parents will all be living together in the home and we have a great relationship and want to enjoy some years together and then as they need help as time goes by, we'll already be there, and that is simple for all of us. So my dad is a disabled veteran, and with that, has an exemption from property taxes, which is about $10,000 a year.

So if my husband and I are on the deed for the house, then we do not have that exemption, and we would pay those taxes. or we can not be on the deed and save that tax amount each year. And I know I've heard Dave talk many times about if you're not on the deed, it doesn't count. And I get that. But I was wondering if you would have anything other to say in this case. I would, the way you're setting it up,

I would probably have, get a, this would be overly formal. I would probably get a lease, a renter's lease, and say I'm renting a room from the owner of this home. Okay. And at some, when, and if your father decides that I'm going to deed this house over to y'all, that might be the cleanest way to do that. And if you've got sibling, just prepare for that to be a nightmare when y'all entangle all that. well i'm i'm an only child so okay so you wouldn't even have to worry about that that would probably be the way i would do that

so what what does the what does a rental lease do for us it allows you to it i mean you could just move into his house right that's essentially what it's going to be gail from like a legal standpoint you're going to be a 10 in his house yeah so basically your parents are buying a house and you and your husband are just moving in

with them is what that is. And then if you end up paying part of the mortgage, you are paying into an asset that you don't own legally. And so what John's saying is some type of, I mean, I'm assuming you guys are going to help with the mortgage, right? Or are they just going to buy a house and you guys are just living there and then you get to live there for free because you're taking care of them? Is that the... Well, so there won't be a mortgage for it. When we sell our home, we're going we'll contribute 150,000 toward it but there's no mortgage there's no there's no ongoing payment other than utilities and upkeep and all but 150,000 dollars of your money though is going to be in this asset that doesn't have your name on it and so I don't know the tax implications but legally

you're giving your parents a hundred and fifty thousand dollar gift for them to purchase a home okay because y'all are going to feel like it's all working together but if you want to do this so you don't have to pay property taxes and you're all going to buy one house together then legally yeah you're giving them a hundred fifty thousand dollar gift they're going to buy a home and they're going to let you live in there rent free or they're going to charge you rent for it and and here's what here's i would say the reason i would i would recommend a lease is two reasons one if um can i just give you some worst case scenarios just just because this is what we deal with. Mom passes away and dad has dementia. And he says, get out of my house. I don't want y'all here. Or I'm trying to think of worst case scenarios. He rear in somebody and they sue him and they want to take this.

Like, I want there to be a... There's no protection for you all. There's no protection at all when you just give $150,000 this way. I would prefer you to have $150,000 in, a high-yield savings account and you'll pay rent towards this thing every month but I do get the idea

that y'all don't want a mortgage but it's illegally y'all are giving them a gift and I don't know with their tax implications if they're going to have to pay taxes on that gift I don't know how that's going to work and I would meet with

probably in a state attorney gale just to get a wording within a will that when they pass or when one of them passes you know what that looks like it's just a domino effect that we see

that we see right um that we've already done that part with the estate attorney and have have those that's great so that's with the death aspect but then i mean as john saying like things can happen when they're alive um you know that that could affect the house that something happens to them a situation legally um medically i don't know what it is and they need to sell this house mom suddenly gets remarried four months later and all like and the only reason we say those things is because those are the calls we get and i know it and you're it's easy to be like that will never happen. And it usually doesn't happen. That's just the calls we get all

the time. Sure. We have addressed a lot of those with the estate attorney. Okay. Yeah. So at the end of the day, if your name's on the deed, it's not your house. And so I would feel comfortable living with my parents under this arrangement, but I want to sign a lease agreement that says, I'm renting this room for $100 or this part of the house or whatever for $100 a month or $100 a year. I don't care what the number is. And also, I don't ever want somebody to come back and say, hey, we think y'all are committing tax fraud or you're taking advantage of X, Y, or Z, right? A system, yeah. Yeah. And I mean, again, from a legal standpoint, your parents would be able to do whatever they want with this house because their name is on it, that you have no

ownership in this. And so if that's the, and I don't know why this may be wrong. I don't know. there's a little bit of more peace because you all are older. I don't know why. It just feels like there's probably less complications. Then it feels a 25-year-old couple moving into their 50-year-old parents' house.

100%. Yeah. So for some reason, the age gives me a little bit more piece of the stage of life you guys are in because we do get calls with young couples that want to entangle themselves

with parents and all of them. I'm like, you have a whole life ahead of you that's about to get really messy, really fast. And let me say one more thing. And this is not directed at you, Gail. This is just in general. The more you try to game a system and go around things and undercut things to avoid paying this, or I want to not pay that, so I'm going to do this.

I just want to ask what's, at the end of the day, I'm going to ask myself, what's my integrity worth? And if I know this is actually my house, but I want to take advantage of your thing. So I'm going to put someone else's name on it for it. I'm going to put someone else's name on it, but it's actually mine. I'm going to say my integrity is not worth $10,000. $1,000. It's not worth $1,000 a month. Do I want to write that check and property tax every year? God, no. But my integrity is not for sale. And so that's just something to think through. I don't think that's you in this situation, Gail. But if I know, actually this is my house, but I don't take advantage of a government benefit because of your military service. So you put your name on it. We're going to do all this rigamarue. Part of me kind of feels kind of gross about it. Part of me kind of feels gross to me. I think there's a VA benefit that's amazing and wonderful. And it's a part of me. It's the taxpayer, I'm glad we have that. Yeah. Yeah, and I went and do this arrangement right now,

Gail, because of that specifically, right? That maybe when they get, when they, when they do need your help in 10 years, maybe you guys make some arrangement then. But yeah, that's a great point, John. You spend hours researching before making a major purchase like a home or car, but it's also a good idea to put in the work searching for the right insurance coverage. To protect your biggest assets, I recommend using Ramsey trusted pros. Whether you're looking for car, home, or any other type of insurance, Trusted providers have been coached and vetted to serve you like we would.

Find what you need at ramsysolutions.com slash insurance. Listen, everyone needs insurance, but it can be hard trying to find pros who aren't just looking to make a buck, but agents who really know their stuff and care about you. And with Ramsey trusted insurance pro, you are never going to deal with a sleazy business or slimy salespeople because they're all interviewed, vetted and coached to make sure that they are market experts who have your best interests at heart. So go to ramsysolutions.com slash coverage to find the type of insurance that you're looking for and connect with a Ramsey trusted agent, or you can click the link in the description if you are listening on podcast or

watching on YouTube. All right, let's go to the phones. We have Abby in Oregon up next. Hi, Abby. Welcome to the show. Hi, thank you for taking my call. Absolutely. How can we help? So I have a complex situation with my mother. I'm an only child, and she has struggled financially most of my adult life. She's now almost 70. And she doesn't have any retirement. She's currently unemployed. She hasn't yet started taking Social Security

because she's waiting for the full amount at 70, which is in February. And she's been inconsistently employed for years and years. So I don't think Social Security is going to be a lot anyway. And so now I'm facing two issues. One is short-term. She's come to me for the first time saying she's totally out of money and is trying to figure out how to pay her bills this month.

And then long-term, how to set boundaries for the fact that she's just not going to have much income for the next, you know, 20-some-odd years of her life. And I don't know how to support her. while, you know, having healthy boundaries, I guess. And she also has some mental health issues involved with OCD and hoarding and stuff. So there's lots of complexity to this. Yeah. And Abby, you're an only child, you said?

Yeah. Oh, man. Yeah. Does she live near you from like a distance? Yeah. About an hour away. An hour away. Okay.

And how are you financially? Where are you at? I'm stable. my husband and I just moved to kind of a simpler home and downsized a bit so we could pay off debt. And I've got a little bit of debt left. I'm trying to pay off, but I make a pretty good income. And now that we have lower monthly expenses for everything else, they should have that paid off in about a year and a half to two years.

Okay. So how much do you guys make a year? Combined, we're about 150. 150. Okay. And what's the debt left on? I have a truck. that and a camper trailer that I do travel nursing.

Okay, okay. And so that'll be paid off in the next year. And then you guys will be debt-free. Correct. And then just the house is left in the house. We only owe in Oregon. It's really, I mean, houses in Oregon are pretty expensive. So we only owe about $94,000 on this new house.

Oh, good. Okay. Well, that's, yeah, that's really encouraging. Okay. So, Abby, like this is, I appreciate you, you haven't encouraged to call. There are millions and millions and millions of adult kids who are facing this same dilemma yeah and before you get into the solution part of this conversation how

do I get healthy boundaries what do I do about this call I think you and your husband need to sit down and be honest about how are we going to care or not care for my aging mother yeah that's a harsh way to say that conversations this last month okay but I think it's because if if you know deep down I'm not going to let my mom go into a, under a bridge and into a shelter. Right, right. And I'm going to move her into this back bedroom here. Then that frames what boundaries look like. What if, hey, mom, we're going to give you this much money, but you're going to live,

now you're going to live by my rules, right? Like the reverse of how you grew up, then you can have a different conversation. If your boundaries are, you made your choices, mom. I don't care about you, whatever. I wouldn't wish that, but it's your life, right? I want you to be honest about your stance on where's your line's going to be. Otherwise, you end up choosing resentment over guilt. And she doesn't deserve that.

Y'all don't deserve that. It's just a way to set your house on fire from the inside out. And so coming up with this is the boundary is going to be, then you can begin to say, okay, mom, I'm going to pay this bill. Or you know what, you're letting your lease go. You're going to move in with us now. or I'll give you this much money or I'll pay the bill directly

we're going to pay $200 a month and we're just going to make this a regular thing like you'll get to start having the more practical conversations after that yeah that makes sense I think I'm trying to find kind of a middle ground which is always easier so than done but I don't know if there is one here

do you think there is one so she she owns her home just recently paid it off but she doesn't have the money for property taxes coming up. How much is that? Around 4,000-ish

somewhere in there. She just switched her home owner's insurance to monthly so she could pay that slower, which was good. But her house is practically condemnable. She hasn't had flowing water for years.

You can't move around in the space. It's not a safe space, but I've tried over and over again to get her to leave, and she won't. Um, she has this grandioseady in her mind of what she wants her home to look like someday. And so, um, you know, unfortunately, that's her only asset. You know, if she could, even as it is, she could still get, you know, in Oregon, she could get $250,000 for that house. And so that could be a source of income if you invested it.

Um, but I can't convince her to do that. And there's even like really great, um, we don't have section eight here. We have like a voucher program where, people get a voucher and then can live wherever they want to rent but she doesn't want to rent she wants to own but 250,000 won't buy you another house here very much very well but you have to exhale and know my mom's not well yeah and so I'm trying to address a situation an irrational situation I don't mean that like in an erratic bananas right but like somebody who is not critically thinking well who's cognitive processing is well trying to solve that that problem with data and facts isn't the solution yeah that's what i'm running into the solution is often i care about you and here's if you want this money here's what that's going to look like okay because she's going to she's going to get a mathematical uh reality forced on her one way or the other yeah they're going to come take her house she's going to get behind on on property taxes or neighbors are going to call for all the stuff in the front yard and they're going to take her

home or um she's going to get your support and begin to make some changes and i'm afraid it's going to say but if abby because yeah i mean i'm with you abby i'm like oh my gosh because i'm asking you john yeah if abby if you can't reason with her logically like you're saying is there just a natural unfolding of real consequences of the real world you don't pay your property tax mom so they're going to take it and like do you know i'm saying that's why that's why i started a call with Abby you all are you and your husband have to decide not if but when it comes to it are we going to let her move in the back bedroom because that's going to be our option right if she loses everything right and you can sit down and maybe she'll hear that i doubt it hoarding

especially in elderly populations is a that means she's in a really tough spot right she's been struggling for a while and so sitting down and having a heart to heart isn't going to get us there right if she could get on some medication if she would get some support and all that but you may have I'm confident y'all have been down that road for years and there's to no avail, right? Yeah, I'm still trying, but yeah. Yeah. Would she respond to the words, Mom, they're going to come take your house? Yeah, I've tried that.

Okay, okay. They're going to condemn your house and they're going to take it away because just the fact that she hasn't had water running for a couple of years is a huge red flag for the city. Absolutely. So, I mean, they could easily come condemn it tomorrow and then she lose everything. And I've been trying to tell her that, but it doesn't, it's not. through. And so I feel like it's hard for me to make any, like, true progress forward with her because she won't do any of the things that make sense. And so I'm stuck trying to do it her way, but then do I just put money into a sinking ship that isn't, like, if I just pay

her bills for her- Because it's not even good for her to stay there. It's unhealthy and unsafe for her. Right. You know what I mean? So there's a part of you that's It's kind of like a blessing in disguise if something happens to the home. And then, you know, Abby could, and her husband could be there at that point. Assuming that she would even move in with you guys, right? Yeah. We take the voucher program and go somewhere else. But yeah, I'm going to suggest to as best you can.

This is hard, because it's your mom, right? Nobody wants it. But traffic in reality. What is true and what is real, not what is what we want to happen. Hey, what's up? Dr. John Deloney here. The new dates have dropped for the money and marriage getaway over a Valentine's Day weekend in 20206. This is your chance to hit pause on everything in your life and reconnect with your spouse over a long weekend in Nashville, Tennessee. Me and my friend Rachel Cruz will be digging into topics like sex, money, communication, and more.

This weekend is happening on February 12th through the 14th and early. Early bird prices start at $749 per couple, but the prices will be going up soon. Get your tickets today at ramsysolutions.com slash events. Thank you so much for listening and watching the show. We so appreciate it. And one of the best ways to spread the word is to share the show with your friends, with your family, on your social media platforms, all the things. Because as we get the word out about the show, more and more people hear about it, listen to it, and hopefully get control of their money, which we love. But we always appreciate you liking, subscribing, reviewing, sharing the show, all of it.

We appreciate you guys. All right. Next up, we have Jesse in Wisconsin. in. Hi, Jesse. Welcome to the show. Hey, thanks for taking my call. Yes, absolutely. How can we help? Okay. So recently, within the last couple months, I had

my grandfather passed away. I'm sorry. Thank you. It just me and my dad as next to kin. He had gifted us in his assets with money cash-wise. It was like $850, I think. And then he also owns

80 acres of land up in up in Wisconsin. My question is, is all of the assets and all the money is going to be put into my name. Not your dad's. Not my dad. Because of my dad has kind of lived like a rough life, if you could say. Okay. So without money coming back and getting taken for taxes, back, whatever, it's all going

to go into my name. But my question is, is it best for me? Because my dad's going to live off this money for the rest of his life. It's just the way that's going to be. It's the best for me to put... Bro, can I just stop real quick? That's going to put you in a really awful position. Yes.

This is one of those ideas that looks good on paper, and man, you are now basically your dad's dad. Dude, it's been like that pretty much forever. I understand what you're saying. I hate you're in that position, man. I hate that for you, brother. Yeah. I guess what you're saying is my thing was to put into my name

and then do I reinvest the whole? whole, his whole half, because we can make more money off of it that way? Or, you know, do I kind of take so much out, pay a penalty on it, pay a penalty on it, and put it into CDs or some kind of quick money. Do you understand? Not really. What do you mean you're going to get a penalty on it? Well, so there is a Roth in plenty of accounts.

I guess I don't know. Do I reinvest all of it, or should I take some out and kind of get rid of the problem like what you just said? You know what I'm saying? Yeah, I mean, I would keep it within, if you can, shelter it tax-wise, with the Roth, all of that. That would be ideal. How, what is the $850,000, what is it divided up in? What is it all sitting in right now?

Well, he has a financial guy here locally where I'm from, and it's, and I think half of it, most of it was in a Roth, and then he has it into some more aggressive stuff too. I'm actually going to meet up with him tomorrow to kind of like finalize all the paperwork. but that was like my question do I keep reinvesting it and just throw it all back in there or I mean is it better for me to take some out well I mean some of it you can use for your life to get you ahead financially things like a home if you have debt

so where are you Jesse financially I own a house I own two houses I don't have any debt I've kind of paid everything off I don't have any debt even on the homes no mortgages I have I have I have One mortgage on my house, I'm down in another town, and I own my other house up in another town and locally. Okay, where are you living? Are you in one of those houses? Are you living in one of those houses?

Yes, I'm living in one, and then the other one I bought, I'm kind of refixing up. My grandmother passed away about three years ago, and she had given me, she left me her house. Okay. So I'm living in that house right now with no, I mean, I just pay taxes. Okay, okay. So how much you have left on the other mortgage? Like 83,000. Okay. And the home that you're fixing up, are you planning on selling that or you are?

How much would it go for? About 150. Okay. That's great. And how much do you- Where's your dad live? Wherever. I mean, sometimes he's a different girlfriend right now, you know?

So what expectations, financial expectations, is this money going to have to supply for him? I'm trying to make it I'm trying to be the smarter one I'm trying to make it the most of it you know what I'm saying I know but here's a problem you're using big

I'm going to make the most I want to do the best I want to try to get the growth you have an actual true math problem in front of you and the more specific you can be about that that math problem which is your dad

the better off you can plan for this thing here's what I mean if you decide in your head I'm going to put $425 for my dad and I'm going to keep 425. That's what me and granddad shook hands on. And your dad goes into acute liver failure and it's going to cost you $3 million to get a liver transplant

or whatever. You're going to have a hard choice to make, right? Or if he blows through it all in two years. Right. And he has nowhere to go. Are you going to let him live on the street or is he going to move into your back bedroom? And so it's you having that root level conversation

and then saying here's the dollar amount. Right? Yeah. Yeah, okay. I mean, I guess, yeah, but with that 425, let's say, is it worth keeping it in there? He's 60, 61 years old. Does he need your money? Is he asking you for it?

Well, he's going to need it. Is he working right now, Jesse? Does he work? No, no. He doesn't. No. How is he paying bills right now? I mean, I think he does, like, well, like, side jobs or something like that, you know?

Okay. But, no, there's no, like, full-time people. I mean, honestly, okay, so you're, so you, there was a handshake with your granddad that said this money is going to go in your name, Jesse, because you're responsible, but this part of this money or half of this money is supposed to go to your dad to make sure that he doesn't live on the streets, right? This is his. It was 50-50 on the will, but me and my old man had made this agreement where we're just going to put it into mine.

Okay, then you, if it's in the will, brother, keep it separate. Keep it separate. I know. There's a part of me, Jesse. I don't like the idea of you feeling, you having to be the caretaker of your dad. There's a part of me. Tell me, John, I don't know if this is right. But, I mean, my knee jerk is to say, Jesse, split it down the middle. Your dad takes his portion. He gets to decide what to do with it. But you're not the bank anymore. Once the money's gone, dad, it's gone.

So you can either choose to invest it, live on it wisely for the rest of your life. Or if you squander it away, like, you can't come to me for money. Like, this is it. This is the, like, right? I would just like keep it short and simple and clean instead of you holding all of it and trying to pay your dad dividends and when he needs it, he comes to you and you're kind of like the bank,

like that feels off to me. I would almost go, I would almost go 50-50 and let your dad deal with it. It's one or the other. It's 50-50 or you understand I'm going to be his full-time caretaker. But you're trying to do both. Right.

I think just, you know, I guess you said, like figure out that conversation first and then, you know, invest just by half. Because if you invest, you know, the majority of it, we should be able to, you know, it should be okay. I need to have that conversation first to make sure I don't want to be involved, you know. Absolutely.

100%. Yeah, 100%. And you can even say, hey, dad, I'm going to meet with a financial planner. Why don't you come to the meeting too and see what they have to say? And you take your half, you get to make a decision on what you want to do. I'm going to make a decision with mine. And maybe it's the same decision. Maybe you both decide we're going to invest it.

But I would keep it still separate in the investments. Because if he starts messing with it and, you know what I mean, pulling money out. I don't like the idea of a 61-year-old man. coming to his 40-year-old son saying, hey, I want to buy a car. Yeah, that's the thing, too. If I'm going to take that money out, I'll just take out some money at the giggo, get in a car, you know, house and stuff, and then reinvest whatever else. But you don't need to do that, Jesse.

He needs to do that with his half. Yeah, no kidding, right? I got a lot of stories about that. I know. Here's the deal. You don't want to be as caretaker, but you are living in the reality that you kind of have to be as caretaker. Right on.

Okay. And so you have to decide, I'm either going to go all. all in on this role, or I'm going to sit down and have a hard conversation with my dad and say, Dad, there's $425,000 in account. I'm not managing it for you. And when it's gone, it's gone. Don't come to me for it. Right.

And I'm going to talk to that financial guy too. And like I said, me and heaven be there. And we're going to just, you know, otherwise, you say it's going to be just a mess. Yeah. It already is a mess. You've been putting an incredibly awkward situation. And I hate this for you. But I also want to applaud you, brother, for being trying to be a good man to your dad.

sure for sure so jesse if i if i were in your shoes and i had half of this money i would pay off whatever debt i have including the mortgages um i would take some cash out if you don't have cash just as an emergency fund and stick it in a high yield savings account and then yes i would leave the rest in investments and that could be index funds mutual funds don't do anything crazy jesse don't do crypto don't go and like do some skiing thing over here like keep it simple mutual funds index funds, let it grow at 10%. Your money will double every seven years if you leave it alone. So just do that quick math and just know where it can grow to. Our scripture of the day comes from Proverbs 192.

Desire without knowledge is not good. And whoever makes haste with his feet misses his way. As a rock star, I have two instincts. I want to have fun and I want to change the world I have a chance to do both Bono that's pretty good

I feel like he does that What band was he in? I'm just kidding I was gonna put you on the spot there I'm not good with music but it is you too right No it's cold play I'm totally kidding yeah it's you too

Okay I was like oh man That's a very classic I was I'm terrible I can name the backstreet boys but that's about as far Yeah, kind of the same. Kind of the same. James Child has passed out

in the... I'm really proud of you, Rachel. I'm sorry, James. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. And he does a lot of great stuff. I feel like he is definitely a philanthropist at heart. And financially. And in action. Thank you. And in action, yeah. With his money. He is. It's great.

The old Bono. Oh, man. All right. Let's go to Darren in Oklahoma. Hi, Darren. Welcome to the show. Hi, thanks for taking Mark Hall. Huge fan of the show. Oh, thank you. Thanks for calling in. How can we help? So I'm 50. My wife is 46. I'm happy to say we are completely debt-free.

Good for you all. On a personal side. So all of our personal finances, our home, all of our cars, no credit card debt. It's all paid off. Now, we also, we have an LLC, and we own 15 single-family homes. nine of those single-family homes still have small mortgages on them. And when I say small, most of them are less than $10,000. Okay. Some are, you know, around the $20,000 to $30,000 range. But all total equity-wise in those rentals is about $1.5 million.

Okay. My CPA is telling me this. As these mortgages are getting close to being paid off, My CPA is saying, look, you know, you've enjoyed this cash flow for, you know, for all these years. And because you have these mortgages coupled with the expenses that you have with the rentals, with insurance and things like that, taxes, you know, you've enjoyed a luxury of not having to have a very high tax burden. As these mortgages start getting paid off, your tax burden is going to increase. So his advice to me is, as these mortgages get down to $4,000 and $5,000, go borrow $10,000 against that house to keep that mortgage going, stick that $10,000 in your checking account or do whatever you want with it because that money is not taxable. Therefore, your tax burden over the next few years is going to continue to stay low because you have these mortgages to help offset that income.

now I've kind of on a personal side I've kind of lived by Dave's principles for the last 20 years of hey you know all this debt needs to go away and that's what we've done on a personal level but from a business standpoint what my CPA is telling me makes sense however because of how I've conditioned myself for the last 20 years to be you know completely debt free it's it's hard for me to do that. So, you know, what are your thoughts on that? If Dave was sitting here, I think he'd say fire your CPA. You know, I kind of figured that might be his response. Yeah. And when he's talking about saving on the taxes, is it because you're not able to write them off? What does he mean by that? Or the income coming in, it changes your tax bracket? What's he saying? That's it. Because without those mortgages to take off of that taxable income, it's going to change. my tax bracket. That's correct. So he says, you know, borrow this money and reinvest back into the houses if you want to because that money's not taxable. And whereas if the mortgage was completely

paid off and every dime of that is going into your pocket every month, then your tax bracket goes up and you're going to be making more money on it. Sure. Right. But also, you know, the way the taxes are staggered, and again, your CPA knows the numbers. I understand this. But it's not going to be, the full I mean the full amount like it's you once you hit that bracket yes the things the income above that bracket will be taxed at that new tax level but to avoid the taxes by taking on more debt is what we would say that you're continuing to take on risk and you're continuing to live in a system at which people own you I mean you don't own it free and clear at that point and so taking the hit on the income to pay

taxes to be free I mean I take that all day versus is freaking trying to play this game where I'm borrowing on this and borrowing on that. I've been hearing about this for months now. So take one of your houses. I'm going to play this out mathematically. Take one of the houses that you own. Okay. Is it $100,000 house, $200,000 houses?

They range from about $100 to $200, yes. Okay. So you're doing mostly low-income housing, right? You got 15 of them? Well, in this area, that's considered a fairly non. nice home. Northeast Oklahoma, you know, $200,000. I mean, I've got a $3,000 square foot home on the golf course that's paid for free and clear that I paid $310 for. So amazing. Okay. Really nice. Okay. So 310, what do you rent that house for? Oh, the $310 is my house. Oh, okay. The $200,000,

I've got a $200,000 rental. I rent it for $1,500 a month. $1,500 a month. Okay. So, that one has no mortgage no mortgage all right so what do you pay annually on taxes on that house about a thousand dollars okay so total tax burden on all 15 homes is about six grand the complete tax burden that's correct taxes in oklahoma or dirt cheap okay so if you had 15 houses and you went and borrowed $10,000 on them and you put that money in a checking account what is 15 times 10 150k what is 150k 50k what is 150k times 6% which is the minimum you'd get a loan for mm-hmm points out yeah $9,000 you need to fire your CPA dude because his little trick just cost you

three grand what you're paying an interest to the bank you see what I'm saying you're outweighing the interest of what you're going to, yeah. Then you're paying more in interest to the bank in taxes. If you were in California and your taxes were 700%, right, and I'm being ridiculous, right? Or in Texas. The property taxes are astronomical in Texas. Right. Then you might be able to prop this game up.

And I'd still make, I still think there's a mathematical case where I'm right. But in just your situation, you're paying six grand total on all the, all the property taxes against these places. Are you talking about earned income tax? It's the income tax side. All right. There you go. So I'm, yeah, but still, I'm like, you know, from the tax bracket, which I don't have in my head right now, you know, you're offsetting the 6% to your point, though, the interest you're paying versus if you're going to bump up a few percentage points to pay extra. So, I mean, like when you know, when you actually run it out, well, what is it?

What's the difference, you know? Because you're paying something to. to loan this to get to take money out of this home to loan to loan it right and so sure the fees and interest and you know and all of the yeah and so at the end of the day what are you really saving because you know while these houses are great you know they're not you know 800,000 homes that you're renting out right that you're going to be take you know correct so here here I hear this all I hear this all the time I hear and I'm just going to get an egregious name right Elon Musk doesn't have, doesn't make a salary.

He owns this much like hundreds of millions of dollars of stock and he goes to a bank and he takes a loan out against that stock and then he gets that loan and he gets to spend that interest free. Okay. And I'm hearing, I'm going to move this over here. You're playing, you got 15 houses. It's just not a small, you got a good business going. Yeah. I'm telling you at least off the front, off top of my head and I can't do the math. I did the math on the property taxes.

I don't on the earn income tax. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But I'm not playing that game for one reason. I don't keep up with it. 100%. I want to own my houses. I don't mind paying the taxes. I'm not going to play a game where I loan this bank money

and you borrow money for me and I'm going to give it to you. 100%. I'm not, dude. I'm going to pay the taxes that I earn. All right. Thank you guys so much, John. Great hour of the show. Thank you, America, for listening.

And remember, there's ultimately one way to financial peace. And that's to walk daily with the Prince of Peace. Christ Jesus. Thank you.