The Ramsey Show - Don’t Give Yourself an Excuse To Go Into Debt

Episode Date: June 6, 2024

💵 Sign-up for EveryDollar today - The simplest way to budget for your life! Dr. John Delony & Jade Warshaw answer your questions and discuss: "My kids don't make enough to pay their bills," "What's the right time to upgrade my house?" "I feel like I'm a financial burden to my husband," "I don't feel motivated to pay off my house," "I can't afford to put gas in my car" "Talk me off the ledge of buying this car..." Support Our Sponsors: Churchill Mortgage Zander Insurance BetterHelp Next Steps 📞 Have a question for the show? Call 888-825-5225 Weekdays from 2-5pm ET or click here! 🏠 Find a Ramsey Trusted Real Estate Agent 📖 Beat debt and build wealth with the new The Total Money Makeover Updated and Expanded 20th Anniversary Edition!   Listen to more from Ramsey Network 🎙️ The Ramsey Show   🧠 The Dr. John Delony Show 🍸 Smart Money Happy Hour 💡 The Rachel Cruze Show 💸 The Ramsey Show Highlights 💰 George Kamel 💼 The Ken Coleman Show 📈 EntreLeadership Learn more about your ad choices. https://www.megaphone.fm/adchoices Ramsey Solutions Privacy Policy

Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions in Nashville, Tennessee, it's the Ramsey Show. I'm John Deloney, joined by Jade Warshaw, and we're talking about building wealth, your workplace, people you love, people you're in relationship with, your in-laws, all of it. 888-825-5225. We're taking your calls live. It's 888-825-5225. I'm John.

This is Jade. And we are ready to rock and roll. Let's go out to Madison, Wisconsin and talk to Kathleen. What's up, Kathleen? Hi there. How are you doing? Thanks for taking my call. Of course. Thanks for calling in. What's up?

Well, I was just calling my student. I have two children. They just both recently graduated from college. Both have significant debt, student loan debt. These are Parent PLUS loans, by the way, for a total of $400,000 with both of them. And they're not able to make their minimum payment, so I'm picking up the slack. And also I have other financial concerns as well. Why did you sign for a Parent PLUS loan? Because when you go to college, that's what they tell you to do. Okay. So what does it look like, you picking up the slack? What does that mean?

So the loans are split into two different, my son's and my daughter's. My daughter owes probably around $300,000. Is he a doctor? No, they're both engineers. And they both have jobs now, and they both make pretty decent money for being right out of college. What do they make? What does that mean? My daughter makes about $60,000. My son makes about $55,000 a year. That's not a good job for an engineer who owes $300,000.

Right. Are they single? Do they have families? They are both single. Okay. My son does live with his girlfriend, and she's also an engineer. But I am picking up. My daughter does live at home with us, my husband and I, and she's paying as much as she can out of her paycheck, you know, every month.

She, her, her loan is probably around 4,500 a month and she probably pays about 4,000 and I pick up the other 500. My goodness. Um, my son actually just got a job in April. So he had been a year out of school without, he was working for my husband who is, he's self-employed, but making minimum wage, just over minimum wage, about $18 an hour. Tell me a little bit more about the inception of this. When you picked up these Parent PLUS loans, because typically a Parent PLUS loan is the parent is signing for it,

therefore the parent plans to pay it unless you've stipulated something else. What was the original agreement? Was it, hey, we're taking these out because we're going to pay for it, or we're taking these out and you guys are going to pay them back? And by the way, it's going to be this much money. Yeah, that was the agreement that they would pay them back. And did they know how much they were taking out at the time? Yes. So my daughter, I mean, there's a lot of, you know, a lot of things involved, but my daughter actually went to a private school for eight years. My son went to a public school for seven years. We had some deaths in the family.

Okay. And then my next question is, was there any piece of you that said, hey, don't do this? Or you guys were like, yeah, just tell me where to sign. Yeah, you can blame the system. But at some point, you know, $300,000, mom. Yeah. Well, you know, at first, you know, you're going to go to school for four years. Okay. It's going to cost this X amount of dollars and then you don't make it four years. Now it's X amount of dollars. And my daughter did say to me about five years or six

years into this, like, I don't know if I can finish school. And I said, well, it's too late now. You have to, because you have student loan debt that you have to pay and you quitting and not getting a good paying job is not going to pay those. So at this point, can you answer this question for me? Are you paying the $500 because your name is on this and you're trying to protect your credit and protect your whatever? Or are you paying on this because you feel um that you should help because if we're just looking at it as it is if the agreement was and if i called you know your daughter and son today and said was the agreement that you would pay these back and they said yes that was the agreement and so they corroborate your your story then they just need

to pay them and that's that on that now if you're like hey they can't pay them and this is jacking with my credit then i'd say okay yeah you made your bed you have to lay in it and so yeah you have to fill in the gaps because you were part you were a co-conspirator on this and so there's really no there's no way out of this other than somebody pays these loans and they're at fault they're at fault because they said hey yeah i'll pay them back but mom and dad y'all are at fault too this is not good yeah it's not good yeah i agree i i mean i think a lot of things need to change with the higher educational system yeah but hold on i'm not there to do that yeah yeah kathleen and it's like well they just told us to. They did, but man, y'all signed them.

And I think until you take ownership of this, and it might mean you have to go get it. I've definitely taken ownership. Do what? I have definitely taken ownership. I mean, I am paying the student loans back. I just, I guess, like I know that they need to be paid. And like if they can't pay them, then I'm responsible for that. I know that. But hold on.

You have created a world that your kids are dictating what you do, and that's how we end up here. Okay. And at some point, as my friend Henry Cloud says, they have to get some problems. And they can say the words, we can't pay these bills because they know you're going to pick up the slack, despite the agreement y'all made. If they didn't have you as a backstop, they'd have to figure

something out, which means your son would have to get an engineering job making more than 50 grand. And he'd also have to deliver pizzas and instacart on the weekends and you'd have to live in a one-bedroom apartment yeah yeah i i mean i think they know all of that but they're not doing it and you're picking up the slack and they know that and until you sit down with a converse with a conversation say okay you got two more months and then I'm not sending another penny. Y'all are on your own. And they're gonna go, yeah, right. And then it happens.

I mean, until you hold that boundary, they're not gonna, I mean, why would they, right? And they haven't their whole life. I know a number of parents when I was working at the university system, Jade, that would sell their kids. You got four years. Oh yeah. That's all I'm paying.

And if you need to go to year five and six, it's on you. You better get that. You better get your grades done. You better get your work done because I'm paying for four years. That's it. Yeah. I think it's good when you put the steam on a little bit, especially because your name is on these. I remember kind of similar, but not really similar. You know, my husband and I had student loans and many of them, his mom signed for. And so she was like, you need to pay these loans because I'm trying to buy a house and this is making my, this is messing with my credit. And so there's part of it that's like, it just is what it is. And I mean, I remember us going back and forth being like, listen, you signed for these too. So you're going to have to be patient.

This is just created a, it just creates a rift in those relationships that unfortunately really doesn't go away until they're paid off. That's exactly right. And I don't think there's going to be any urgency for these kids to pay these off as long as they're living in your house, making half of what they should be making out in the marketplace because mom's going to bail us out. I think you have to step up and say, here's a boundary. And I've never held boundaries like this for you, you too. And these are new, but these are going to be in stone. This is The Ramsey Show. Buying your first home is a big deal and sets the stage for your financial success. So work with a mortgage advisor you trust, not just some random website. Churchill Mortgage is Ramsey trusted because they help you avoid hidden traps and expertly guide you through

every step. Learn more at churchillmortgage.com. This is a paid advertisement. NMLS ID 1591. NMLS consumeraccess.org. Equal housing lender. 1749 Mallory Lane, Suite 100. Brentwood, Tennessee 37027. The live like no one else. Cruz is back. This is not Rachel Cruz. This is a... What'd you say? That was the... Dude, we should have a sound effect company.

We're amazing. Join Dave, me, Jade, and all the Ramsey personalities for seven days in a boat. Ship, John. On a boat. I'm on a boat. I'm on a boat. Ship, John. On a boat. I'm on a boat. I'm on a boat. Seven days at sea,

March 22nd through the 29th, 2025. We're going to have special guests like Stephen Curtis Chapman, Manit Chuhan, Deanna Carter,

and tons and tons more. It's going to be straight chaos. For those of you who are baby step four and above, the ultimate debt-free celebration.

So, John, we have all of these special guests i have one more really just a really great reason for you to go on this cruise like if you're looking for entertainment i've got that what's that i have the the quintessential cruise story but you can only hear about it from directly from the camel's mouth if you come on this cruise and it has to do john with a cruise that i once went on where everybody guys if you don't know i used to work on cruises i once went on a cruise where everybody there was nude it was a nude charter i didn't know it when i went to

perform on the cruise and so 2,500 people seven days at sea seven five thank god it was five days if you want to hear the craziest stories you've ever heard let's chop it up at dinner time and 500 people. Seven days at sea. Thank God it was five days. If you want to hear the craziest stories you've ever heard, let's chop it up at dinner time, and I'll tell you. But you have to go on the cruise in order to hear it. I can also tell you this. When Jade tells the stories, her eyes, like her rods and cones have been burned out of her skull.

It takes me away to that special place for sure. Listen, the VIP upgrades are already sold out. Everybody's going to be wearing clothes. That's right. Thank God. And it wasn't, it's not George Campbell's mouth. It's actually a Jade. No confusion there.

Many of the cabin types are all sold out. If you're trying to get your pick of cabin, like one with an ocean view, you got to get your deposit in now. It's going to sell out. It always sells out the last one sold out before the world shut down and so we are slapping it up flipping it and reversing it it is the live like no one else cruise it is back book your cabin at ramsey solutions.com slash cruise it's going to be kind of rad it's going going to be awesome. Turks and Caicos, St. Thomas, San Juan, the Bahamas. Everybody in the club's getting tipsy.

It's going to be so good. Let's go out to New York, New York, and talk to Dave. What's up, Dave? Hi, John. Hi, Jay. Thank you so much for taking my call.

You got it, man. What's up? So I have a little bit of a work dilemma. I found out that I'm eligible for a severance, a voluntary severance package program, and I'm debating whether or not I should take it. Do you like your job? Well, I like my team, the job itself. I'm not really too interested in the field,

although it's what I've been doing for most of my professional career. And in hindsight, it might not be a lot of money, but I'm currently debt-free, and I would feel pretty confident that I would be able to get another job if I were to stay in the same field. Why don't you do what you actually want to do? I guess that's, I guess that's part of it is I'm not too sure, you know, what career I would want. Um,

I know that if I were to stay in the field, I currently work in, I currently work in tax. I'm an accountant. Um, and so I I'm debating whether or not I should take advantage of this program, even though I've only been with this company for a handful of years and move on to something else, or if I should stick it out here. What would you have done if they never offered you the severance package? Would you be looking? Originally when I took this job, I realistically didn't see myself staying for more than five or six years. To what? To what end?

The end goal would eventually be to get a job and move and relocate out of state or find something more remote. Get a job doing what? Right now, what I'm currently doing and hopefully try to transition to something else once I have a better picture of what that is. Is there something financially that's on fire in your life that's making a bigger chunk of money look good to you? No, not particularly. I'm debt free. Okay. What is the severance package?

So between the severance package, stock options, and unused PTO, before taxes, it would be around $32,000, $33,000. Okay. What do you make a year? Course salary is $93,000. Okay, so they're paying you four months salary, basically. Yeah. Here's my bigger concern. It sounds like you keep waiting for your life just to show up for you,

and that's just not how it works because if you're going to quit this job and go work something that you you don't love the job but you love your team and they dangle a couple of months of salary in front of you and you bail but you're not bailing towards a different career that you actually want or management that you want or a different state than you want but you're just going to go to another tax place in the same town all the only risk you have here is you're you're gambling 30 something thousand dollars on having a team that's awful versus the known and so if you were telling me this is going to be my break i'm going to take four months and retool i'm going to work really hard. I'm going to, we're going to give you a Ken Coleman's get clear assessment. Like what do I actually want to do? Um, how is AI going to impact

just basic tax work? Do I want, is this job going to be here in five years? Right. You need to ask those questions and then get serious about taking steps towards what's next. If you think your company's going to close down around you in the next six months, then yeah, I would take the first exit off, off the ramp. If you have another job lined up and you're ready to rock and roll, I would take the first exit off, take the 30 grand and run. But all you're telling me is, no, I don't really like this, but I'm just gonna take their money and keep doing the same thing somewhere else. And I'm pretty sure I can get something else. You see what I'm saying? It just

kind of feels like wet bread, just milk toast, just eh to eh to eh, and I just don't think that's a good path for anybody. Yeah, yeah, it's really the, I guess it's the unknown that's the fear for if they're offering something like this now, then do they anticipate layoffs or terminations within the next year or two? Is it something that I should take advantage of right now?

That's kind of where my mind was going, to be honest. I wanted you to ask more questions around this offer. And I think that's one of the things I would go back and do. If you have a leader, you know, you said you like the people you work with. So hopefully you have a leader that you can trust and say, hey, tell me more about this. What's coming in the future? If I don't, Is this you guys trying to take care of me now before things get worse? And just have a couple of candid conversations because that'll tell you a lot as well as opposed to kind of guessing and being afraid to ask. Will they be honest with you?

Yes. Okay. I think Jade's guidance is wise. Every place I've ever worked as a senior leader, when we offered buyouts, it was always a precursor to, if this doesn't solve our problem, we have to go to the next level, which is letting people go. That was 100% of the time. I can only speak of my experiences, but it happened at multiple places. I don't see why it wouldn't be. Otherwise, what's the point? Yeah, exactly. That was my thought process. And so it's unknown of their underlying tones of the business is doing poorly and they're offering this to employees. And is this something I need to take and then jump ship before I'm out of a job? And here's how I would not walk up to my supervisor and say, Hey, I'm thinking about taking this money. Because then you've already set sail.

Now their job is to talk you into following your instinct because they don't want someone on their team that is halfway in. I would sit down and say, hey, this is really strange. I love working here with this team. And the whole idea is making me uncomfortable. We all work in numbers, and so we all know how math works. What's the real picture here? And then hopefully they'll tell you, yeah, it's pretty dicey. And a good supervisor would say, you're going to be fine no matter what. I would hope you stay.

Or a good supervisor who loves you, who knows it's getting dicey, will tell you, hey bro, take the train out of town. It's a good run. But I love Jade's wisdom here. And dude, I just want to lean on you, man. You only get one life, bro. And the more you just like in five or six years, I just hope it changes. It's not going to. It's going to be the exact same life in five or six years unless you actively right now seek to change it.

Hang on the line. We're going to send you Ken Coleman's brand new book and the Get Clear Assessment and get you hooked up and get you thinking about what comes next. 888-825-5225. This is the Ramsey Show. One of the questions I get all the time is, which life insurance company should I use for my term life policy? A valid question since there are hundreds of companies out there with rates all

over the place and riders and add-ons that are simply a waste of money. You need to get this done and make the right decision. That's why the only company I use and have recommended for over 25 years is Zander Insurance. Zander is a broker who shops the top term life companies for you and finds the best rates available from the only plans I recommend. They also save you time. Whether you want to work online, over the phone, or via text, their team will cater to your needs and help you make the right decision. This is an absolute necessity, and Zander has made the process easy and convenient. Call them at 800-356-4282 or visit zander.com for instant online quotes.

What up, what up? I'm John. This is The Ramsey Show, joined by my good friend, Jade Warshall. We're taking your calls on money and life and work and relationships and your mental health. All of it. 888-825-5225. Let's go out to the SLC and talk to Will. What up, Will? How we doing? Hey, John. Hey, Jade. How we doing?

We're doing all right, man. How about you? Well, I could use you a little bit better. What happened? Trying to figure out where I go from here. What happened? So, I run a business. We've been doing this for about two months now. And it's a distribution company.

And so what we do is we distribute sod around all of the Salt Lake Valley. Cool. And yesterday I got home from my morning deliveries. I parked the truck and went home to go get some lunch. And I get a call from one of the neighbors saying, are you on site? And I say, no. And they say, well, your truck's on fire. And so, yeah, so I rushed over there.

I can see smoke from my apartment. Wow. You know, yeah. So it was, and by the time I got there, the whole thing was just gone enemies do you have enemies out there i don't know i i really don't know bro hey listen i've seen this movie it's a rival sod company yeah probably what it is it's game on so what happens the truck's on fire truck's on fire i roll up and you know cops and fire departments everywhere trying to put it out um luckily no one was hurt and you know i keep thinking i keep thinking that this was probably the best place for it to happen you know no like

on the side of the road at my you know know, at my, at my base of operations, no one was hurt or anything like that. Truck was fully insured. Um, so we're good there, but. Okay. So how can we help? Yeah. Other than just being sad with you.

So my question is, where do I go from here? Um, I'm, I'm financially speaking. So, you know, cause I know this is going to is gonna i my assumption is that i i assume the truck was worth about 70 000 it was fully paid off okay so it's worth 70 what's the insurance giving you i assume it was worth 70 i bought it for 35 um but i felt like it was a good deal at the time and i know know trucks that are worth that much. What's insurance giving you? I don't know yet. The adjuster talked to me this morning. We're just waiting on claims for the adjuster to come out, look at it, and determine what the value was on it. So they need to turn that around real quick and tell me you have a business contingent on this truck,

and then I'd go rent a truck for the time being. Yeah. So what I've been doing is I've been subcontracting out the truck. I still make, I still make a margin on the product itself, you know? Um, and so like, so I've just been kind of in full truck shopping mode. Um, but my question is, I guess fully on, on, on a more just level, you know, I'm, I'm kind of looking at this as kind of a baptism by fire, I guess you could say, and kind of saying, how do I set the business up from here to succeed? Don't do anything stupid. And you're about to, so don't. Yeah, I don't think one, it's almost like one thing doesn't have anything to do with the other.

You know, the truck's on fire, insurance is going to come out, they're going to give you, if you said it was fully covered and you had the right coverage, you're going to get the money you need to replace it at value. And here's the thing. Let's pretend that they don't give you as much as you feel like they should have. Still only spend what they give you on the next truck. This is not an excuse to go into debt on the next one. You said that you got the other one at a crazy deal and he went, really, it was only worth, you spent $35,000. So hopefully that's what they'll give you and you can spend that again. Well, and also you call it a great deal. Dude, it caught on fire. It wasn't that great of a deal, right? Yeah, fair enough.

So it wasn't that great of a truck. So maybe spend $50,000 if they give you a check for $70,000. Spend $50,000 and put the other $ other $20 in a bank account for your company. You, though, are about to go buy a $120,000 truck, aren't you? No, no, no, no, no. I am not. I am not. My mindset's always been frugal. I do not.

Okay, good. I don't like spending more than my worth. So then what's the other part of the question when you're saying, how can I set my business up to succeed from here on out? Tell us where you don't feel like you are succeeding and then we can help you out. Well, I guess the big thing is financially. I just want to know how do I structure this business to succeed. So I'm fully out of debt. All I have is accounts payable and my lease. And that's about it.

Okay, good. I just want to make sure that I'm on the right track. You are. You are. You just got hit in the right track. You are. You are. You just got hit in the mouth. That's it. You're moving at the speed of cash. The best possible thing that you can do is move at the speed of cash and not be tempted to do things.

I'm going to put it like this. Do things to prove that you have a business, which is buying things that you don't really need, buying a bunch of equipment or merchandise or office space that you don't really need, buying a bunch of equipment or merchandise or office space that you truly don't need, hiring people before it's time, just so you can be like, I've got employees, like all that stuff. As long as you're moving at the right time

and you're not doing anything for show and you're moving at cash, I think for where you are and what you're doing, I think you're right on track. And just keeping good books, like making sure that you know your numbers, that's the best you can do. And let's flip this around. Let's say you were like most small business owners in America who's starting a business. You would owe $50,000. You would have bought an $85,000 truck that

burned to the ground. They're going to write you a check for 40 grand and you'd owe $40,000. Yeah. So you can't see it because you just watched your, your truck, your livelihood burn up in front of you the other day. Jade and I are sitting here saying you're doing this exactly right. You had a fully insured paid off truck just for this moment. So that if it catches on fire and explodes in the neighbor's driveway,

you're just going to get a check for another one. You're going to go get another used truck and keep right on going yeah you're doing it right okay and maybe i just need a little bit of reassurance on that you just watched something pretty traumatic your whole business looked like it burned up in front of you i know i i think it's kind of ironic i've been starting the story of joe for the last like week and this is kind of what happened. And we always tell people, when you start a business or you start trying to get on the same page with your partner with money, expect Murphy to show up.

He's just going to test your boundary and see how honest and committed you are. Yeah. No, I totally agree. By the way, there's no chance they give you a $70,000 check. Here's what I want you to be careful. I knew that. That's why I'm over-evaluating. Okay, but here's what's going to happen.

They're going to write you a check for $60,000, which is, what, $20,000 more than you paid for it? $30,000 more than you paid for it? And you're going to feel like they stole $10,000 from you, and it's going to leave a bad taste in your mouth. Just be very open-handed. What's the truck actually worth when it exploded? And then take that money and go buy yourself a cash truck.

Okay. And then keep right on going. How's your business doing? Yeah. Are you making money? You know what? I can't complain. I think within two months, we've grossed about $150,000 so far. And so as far as the small business goes, I can't complain. What's your net? Yeah, what are you netting?

Net, I believe as of right now, we're about 85. Okay. 85,000 or 8,500? 85,000. Okay. How many of you guys is it? It's just me. It's just me.

I'm a one-man show. Okay. And what are you taking home? Are you paying yourself? Are you taking everything out of the business? Are you reinvesting? Like I say, I live as frugally as possible, so I just make sure my bills are paid on the outside.

I pay rent and food on my personal side and my personal vehicle, and that's about as far as fuel and stuff like that. But that's about it. Hold on, homie. You made $ made 42 000 in your first two months as a small business owner yeah that's better than i'm i can't complain grateful for where i'm at yeah hold on i want to hear you celebrate it i can't complain i hate that attitude say dude i'm actually crushing it i did my research i'm doing i'm serving up my community i'm serving a need a glitch in the in the market and i'm making it happen say that you know what i'm making it happen there you go there you go

making forty thousand dollars a month dude that's good money. No matter where you are. No, I agree. I agree. All right. Well, keep at it, man. How do I get on the right page? You're on the right page. If you're hiring, holler at me. Just shoot me a direct message because that's really good money.

But, Jade, it's easy when things go sideways to feel like it's all coming down. 100%. Plus, he's a brand new business owner, so he's just shaking in his shankies anyway. Dude, good on you, Will. I'm proud of you, man. I'll send you George Campbell's resume. He's probably going to want to... Actually, he's not really an outdoor guy.

Nah. Nah. He would hire you, though, to put down his sod. He definitely would. No question. This is The Ramsey Show. We'll be right back. This show is sponsored by BetterHelp. This is the season for Halloween.

It's October. We're wearing costumes and we're wearing masks. If you haven't started planning your costume yet, get on it. And while you're thinking about it, I want you to be honest. A lot of us hide ourselves. We hide our true selves behind costumes and masks all the time. We do this at work. We do this around our friends. We do this around our families. We even do this when we look at ourselves in the mirror. I know because I've been there multiple times in my life and it's the worst. If you feel like you're stuck hiding behind masks and costumes all the time, if you find yourself hiding from your true self, I want you to consider talking with a therapist. Therapy is a place where you can be honest, where you can talk to somebody else and reflect and learn,

and you can accept all the parts of yourself over time and start living an authentic life. Masks and costumes should be for Halloween parties, not for our emotions and our true selves. And if you're considering therapy, try calling my friends at BetterHelp. BetterHelp is 100% online therapy. You can talk with your therapist anywhere so it's convenient for you and your schedule. Just fill out a short online survey and you'll be matched with a licensed therapist.

Plus, you can switch therapist at any time for no additional cost. Take off the costumes and take off the mask with BetterHelp. Visit betterhelp.com slash DELONoney to get 10% off your first month. That's BetterHelp.com slash Deloney. Hey, welcome back to the Ramsey Show. If you, like the rest of us, are wringing your hands at the state of the world economy

and your frustration about how your neighbors are spending money that they don't have and Congress is spending money you don't have, here's what you can do. You can sit in your house and watch all the news channels and get all red-faced and scream and yell and solve nothing. Or you can start to change how your house operates.

And if you want to provide a gift to your neighbor, you can do something as simple as sharing the show, subscribing to the show, putting like a thumbs up, or I don't know how they do it on the internets these days, but just letting the folks know the five-star reviews, whatever it is, letting the internets know, I like this show and other people should watch it. And it puts it in the algorithm and it gets it to your neighbors and to their neighbors and to their neighbors. This country is going to change household by household, kitchen table by kitchen table. And that's how we get it done. So like the show, subscribe to the show. It doesn't cost anything, but like 10 seconds of your time. And it makes a

huge difference for people getting this popping up on their feed and then going down what we call the Ramsey rabbit hole. And suddenly they decide, Hey, I'm going to change my household too. So thank you so much for supporting the show and the way you do it. It means the world to us, but more importantly, it means the world to your neighbor. All right, let's go out to Greenville, South Carolina and talk to not draw, but drew. Hey, drew. What's up, man? Hey, how's it going? We're doing great. How about you? I'm doing great. Thank you guys for all that you do.

Thank you, man. What's up? Yeah, so I have a question. My wife and I are deciding when would be a good time to upgrade our home and how we should go about doing that. We currently, my wife stays at home, and she homeschools our four kids and they're all under the age of 10. And so I'm the primary income. She does a little bit of work on the side to help supplement the income there. We do not have any debt. We have the emergency fund that's fully funded, and we're, you know, so in that baby step four, five, six area.

Okay. What's your income? Yeah, our take-home is around 130 a year and so we're currently in a house and our what's left on that mortgage is 229 okay and the house is probably worth about 285 somewhere in there but our house is only about uh 12 to 1300 square feet and uh having four teenagers in a house that small um does not does not uh really look attractive to us so what are you trying to do to it yeah i you mean i'd like to at some point point sell it and move into a larger home within the next two or three years. Okay, so we're just moving up. We're not like doing additions or anything like that. I like it. Yeah, we thought about an addition, but I'm just not sure it makes sense.

It's an older house and just not sure it would be the best fit for us. So you owe $285,000 on the current mortgage. Did I get that right? No, $229,000 on the current mortgage. I think it's worth owe $285,000 on the current mortgage. Did I get that right? No, $229,000. $229,000. I think it's worth about $285,000. Got it. Okay. And so how much are you trying to move up? Like what are you trying to spend here? You know, as we've been looking in the housing market, I'm thinking somewhere from $4,000 to $4,500 is probably where we need to be. Okay. And so is the plan that we're going to take the winnings from the sale of this house, which is not going to be an incredible amount after fees?

Right. What do you think you'll take home after fees? Yeah. I'm hoping maybe around 35 to 40, but I really would like to do this in the next two to three years. So I wanted to talk to you guys about how can I use the next two to three years to be able to make that gap greater between what the house is worth and what I owe. Obviously I can pay it down, but what's the, what's the best path for me to be able to get in, to upgrade into a home in that price range we were talking about? I think it's twofold. I think that yes,

continue to make extra mortgage payments. You've got that margin there. And in that way, it's just a forced savings account, right? Which I kind of like that because it's different from piling up money in an HYSA because then you think, oh, I've got this money here. You know what? We do need a new vehicle. You know what? We do need to take a trip to Europe. And so it's easy to kind of look at that money for other things. And so in this case, technically, you guys are on baby steps four, five, and six. And so I would act in that way and put extra payments towards the mortgage and continue to do that. Now, if it did make you feel better to say, yeah, I'm also going to stack up some cash

for a down payment, I'd probably do both of those things. And so that you've got both of those things there. Simultaneously. Yeah, because I think you've got the margin to do that. And then, I mean, I think you know our rule of thumb. You'll know that you're ready when you can get this $400,000 house when you're able to put the write-down payment down that allows this to be no more than 25% of your take-home all in.

And that's including things like homeowners association fees. Yes, okay. And the ideal mortgage is a 15-year. What are you in now? Currently, we're in a 30-year. And yeah ideal mortgage is a 15 year. What are you in now? Currently, we're in a 30 year and yeah, definitely not ideal. We, you know, we kind of just came into Baby Steps 456, so we want to start throwing money at the mortgage. But yeah, and we don't have a great rate. We had to move at a time when it wasn't ideal. But so we're you know, we're hoping maybe in the future to be able to refinance or maybe if we buy an upgrade that if we move into when we move into a 15 year mortgage, that the rates will be lower.

Here's what I want to challenge you on. And this is just, you know, take it, take it or leave it. The whole point is to be debt free. That's the point is to be free, to live free, to live in a home that you pay for. And I do worry about, I mean, you guys make a good income right now. You owe $229,000. That's not crazy. I would hate for you to refinance into, I would hate that you go into more mortgage for a longer term. Because so many people say, oh, I'll get the 30 year and pay it like the 15 or I'll get the 30 year

and then when I'm ready, I'll refinance. But life, life's. And the next thing we know, something else kind of takes that priority or it takes that place. And that's the only thing that I would caution you against on. There truly is a piece of this where you may not be ready to upgrade simply because of that alone.

Yeah. Because of the, you know what I mean? So weigh that out with your wife because the affordability part does include the style of the loan, you know? Right, right. Yeah. And I mean, it may just take a couple more years of me having a lot of kids in a small house. You'll get to know each other real well. Drew, you sound a lot like me, so I don't want to project my experience onto you,

but you've got a lot of different ideas all happening at the same time. Yeah. I think I'm going to refit. What if we just put an apartment on top of this garage and i'm also going to spend my spare minutes scrolling um the housing market in town and i'm going to spend a little bit of time being frantic about our rate i'm also going to be a little like what if we just i'm going to look up high yields yeah you're reading me you're reading me like a book there okay so that's me and here's what we do we're like the running back who just

runs um east to west side to side 100 yards but we only make three yards down the field we don't go anywhere and we make our wives tired we make our kids exhausted so here's what i would love you and your wife to sit down and this is the only way my wife and i have been able to find peace in these type of journeys let's have a number we're going to have saved up before we move, period. Okay. And if you decide, all right, I'm going to buy a $400,000 house. I'm going to get 80 grand down payment. I'm going to have no PMI. Like what do we have to do to get 80 grand? We're going to sell this house. We're going to hopefully get 40 for it. That means I got to make $40,000 in cash in an account. Ready? Go. And now we're not looking at other things.

We're not spinning our wheels. Our whole house is focused on getting this number in that account. And then it's going to trigger the next move. Now we're going to go buy a house. You see what I'm saying? Yeah, that's great. Yeah. I would just offer this to you guys too. My wife and I have been using EveryDollar now for four to five months, and it has completely changed how we communicate, completely changed how we budget. And we're like, I mean, it's like a competition every morning. Who can drop the expenditures into the bucket? And who's, you know, are we, is anything in red?

Wow. We love to hear that. Dude, that's amazing, man. That's amazing. We could even pay for that kind of commercial. Thank you, Drew. Thanks to you, America. This is the Ramsey Show. We'll be back. Live from Ramsey Solutions in Nashville, Tennessee. It's the Ramsey Show. We help people with their money, with their relationships, with their work, with just about everything. I'm John Deloney, joined by my good friend Jade Warshaw. And we're taking your calls on your money, your mental and emotional health, your relationships, your work, everything. 888-825-5225. That's 888-825-5225.

Let's go out to Phoenix, Arizona. God, it's hot. Talk to Brenda. Hey, Brenda. Hello. Hello. It's a pleasure to speak with you. Thank you.

You too. Hey, is it 1,000 degrees right now? Not yet, but it's just about there. Okay. Oh, my goodness. It's 999. Good grief. I don't know how y'all do it.

All right. So what's up, Brenda? So my question essentially is how do I not feel guilty or selfish for wanting to sell my house? Why would you feel guilty or selfish? I need more. Yeah, tell us more. Sorry, I just got nervous. We got you. So the house is mine.

The house is mine. It's in my name. Sorry. Hey, Brenda, take a big, big, deep breath, as deep as you can, all the way to your guts. I'm going to do it too. Hold it. Three, two, all right, now let it out.

All right. Pull your shoulders all the way down. I can hear them up by your ears. Pull them all the way down. Yeah. So the house is mine. There is seven of us. We're a household of seven, essentially. We have my two boys and then my boyfriend with his three boys.

If I decided to sell my house, it would be because I want to pay off my debt and it would bump me into baby step four, five and six. It would cause everybody to move. and essentially my boyfriend would have to do his thing, but he'd have to pay more out of pocket as well for his living situation. So selling my house would really only benefit me in this picture. Why hasn't he married you yet? He won't. Okay. How long have you been together three and a half years okay he has forced you to take care of you and so all you're doing is what a responsible adult would do when another adult says i don't want to have i want to make a commitment with you i want to play house and i want to make a commitment with you. I want to play house, and I want to have all the benefits of being with you without commitment.

And he's forcing you to have to take care of you as a single mom. Right? Yes. Yes. Your instincts are right. Okay. Yeah, I mean, there's no's no John stop me at any point but in my mind I'm like there's no there's no together there is no us so why do you want me to operate out of an us you've

made it very clear and so that's kind of where I'm at the two kids so you said he's got three boys that are his and you've got two boys that are yours yeah you guys have any children together no listen no you know this is a major red flag and i am okay you know for me it's it's a no brenda there's something else going on what is it um no it's just i i think i just need that needed that validated um and in talks that i've had i've asked him to move out already and he's just kind of ignored that request so i'm just like well maybe i should sell my house but that's what i'm telling you there's something else going on here what is it if is he safe um he's a bully yeah no no we're safe um we just don't i mean like you said he hasn't committed he won't commit he's made comments that he will never put a ring on it so i know that that's there

um i just don't like the idea of moving and uprooting my children but you don't have to uproot your family you You can call the police and have them remove somebody from your home. Yeah. No, no, no. It's not unsafe. It's not an unsafe situation. No, no, no, no.

Anybody who's... He's broken up with you. He won't leave. That's a bully move. I'm not saying that he's screaming at you and beating you or something, but I'm saying that if I've asked a male to leave my home and he won't leave,

it's because he knows and you can't make me. That's after the dot, dot, dot. I got you. You see what I'm saying? I have bigger muscles and you can't push me out of here. And that's what 911 is for. Yeah. And I know that sounds ridiculous, but Jade and I do this for a living.

Deal with hot-headed men that think they can push women around. Yeah. He has broken up with you. He has looked you in the eye and said, there is no future for us. But I'm going to live here. I'm going to get what I want, when I want.

And you're going to pay for my sons to grow up in your house. Yeah, I think in his eyes, he hasn't broken up with me because he thinks everything's fine, even though I'm the one telling him I want him to move out. Do you see the disrespect there or the just the lack of even hearing or seeing you um I definitely feel it yeah your gut's right okay you have two two strangers uh validating you but I if you want to sell this house and get out of debt um we'll talk you through that but I don't want you selling your house to get out of debt, we'll talk you through that.

But I don't want you selling your house to run away from him because it's your house. Well, I mean, financially, I should sell it as well. The mortgage and housing expenses take up 50% of my income. Okay, yes, ma'am. Sell the house. Sell it. So I just felt like if I sold it, I could could pay off all my debt and what will you do rent rent an apartment or rent a house i'd probably rent a house for two years okay um or so have

you priced that out because rent is super high especially in phoenix it right, but it's less than what I'm paying now. How much less? I'd have, my mortgage is $3,400, so I can probably get a three-bedroom house, I think, for $2,500. Okay. And what's your take-home pay every month? I grow, take-home, well, I grow with $100,000, so take-home is probably $6,000, $6,500. Okay. Yeah, I want you looking at those numbers really closely we're going to set you up with every dollar so that you can see those numbers because I want you knowing exactly how much money you bring home every month um yeah that's going to get you closer you do very cool I have the premium version I just don't have I didn't have that number in front of me. Okay, no worries. No worries. Yeah, I think that renting is a good idea, I think, to get you out of this.

Because long term, unless you told me, yeah, I see a path, Jade, to where in a year this will be different for me financially. But if you don't see that, then yeah. How long have you lived in the house? Two and a half years. Okay. Okay. Yeah. Are you going to make any money on it?

Yeah. I do that. Are you going to make any money on it? Yeah. Yeah. It should come out with about $150,000. Okay. Okay, great. So let me confirm what your boyfriend says about you. Yes, you're being selfish. You're taking care of you.

And that is 100% the position he has put you in. And as a mom, that is your job to take care of you and your boys. Period. Thank you so much. When you sell this house, I want you to get the best possible help and get top dollars. So I want you to go to rs.com slash agent

and find one of our real estate pros to help you with this, okay? They're going to get you hooked up. Man, I got all kinds of thoughts. I'm going to keep them to myself. Keep them to yourself, John. This is The Ramsey Show. Welcome back to The Ramsey Show.

I'm John Deloney, joined by Jade Warshaw. All right, today's question of the day comes from Shauna in Canada. Yeah, she says, I'm seeking advice on how to explain the benefits of combining our accounts to my husband. He brings in the majority of income as I'm a part-time teacher and mom. He often has to electronically transfer money to me, which I've explained feels degrading. I want us to be a team, but he refuses to budge on linking our accounts. What should I say to him? I feel as if I'm a burden. I am so sorry. Oh gosh, I'm so sorry.

It shouldn't feel that way. I have things I want to say, but John, you say it. Okay. I was going to say, I thought I saw a twinkle in your eye, but it was rage. It was mad. It was anger is what you saw. Yeah. You know, first off, I just want to affirm that. Yeah, you're right. You should be combining accounts. And I love that you've, it sounds like you've used a great vocabulary in explaining the way this feels. You're saying, hey, this is degrading to me. I feel like I'm a burden to you. It's not just like we should combine our money and you're keeping us from doing that. It doesn't sound like, it sounds like you've expressed yourself well on this. And I hate that he has disregarded your emotions.

This is a case for counseling and counseling alone. And I'll let John get into the rest. I mean, I just think anytime you look at a romantic partner and say, this thing that you're doing is degrading to me. And they look at you and go, I don't care. romantic partner and say the thing this thing that you're doing is degrading to me yeah and they look at you and go i don't care then your relationship has fundamental foundational issues this isn't about money and in savings accounts you're beyond that this is about power and um i feel like i'm just a bill that you have to pay every month you are you are well then there's a

part of me and i'm i i don't like reading into people's situations when i don't have all the information but i think we've done this long enough that we kind of start to know it always for me there's this piece of it like okay but then what are you hiding it's always what are you hiding always you know if you don't want me to see this if i can't have access to it if i have to ask you what is it that you're trying to keep me from? Or what are you spending money on that you don't want me to know about? That you don't want me to see. Yeah.

Right. And anytime you're in a relationship with anybody, mother, daughter, father, son, romantic, work relationship, if one person in that relationship feels like a burden, I mean, not to get too dark, but that's one of the three legs of the stool when you're doing a suicide assessment. If somebody says, I feel like the world is better if I'm not here. The greatest gift I could give the people who love me is to not be here because I'm a burden, right? So I'm super sensitive to that word. And when somebody has to keep asking their husband hey I'm taking care of all the kids and I'm teaching we need some grocery money

well hold on let me let me electronically send it over let me Venmo it to you yeah man in my guts that hurts man well you know let's let's take a moment and talk about this on a grander scale because obviously

shauna yeah you guys got to get into counseling and just to be clear like there's some very clear boundaries that need to be put in place john why don't you give her a couple more clues on like what these boundaries need to be and kind of like timelines well i think i think the conversation is hey i've i've looked you in the eye the person that i said um i commit my life to um till death do us part i've told you that the way we are handling money and the way you are um choosing to treat me is degrading yeah and i've asked for a partnership here and you've said no i'm unable to communicate this any further i'm gonna go see a counselor i'm asking you to come with me because we have some fundamental communication

issues. He's going to say no. And if he says no, then you have to have your, or what? Yeah. And most couples, most people don't like to go there.

The, or what? Because here's what I promise you. She knows, Shauna knows there's other things going on here. Yes. This is never just about the money. This is a part of a bigger picture

the way he treats you the way he talks to her the way he doesn't show up the way he says mind your business this is an entire picture um in this tiny little this little these few little sentences here it is and so shauna you have to be willing to look in the mirror and say i'm worth not living my life under the thumb of somebody that treats me like a burden. And that means I have to be worth shining the light on all this nonsense and shining that, turning that light on may cost you everything. It may cost you the marriage. He may say, nope, I want my, I want to flex and I want to treat you like a child more than I want to be a partner with you more than I want to be married to you, be your husband. Um, and maybe she turns all the lights on and he says oh my god i'm so sorry

yeah and he comes to that's my hope right i hope so well let's let's zoom this out to reach a little bit of a broader audience because there's something you talk about a twinkle in your eye when i see that a couple has to electronically transfer money to and from each other like i talk to couples all the time john that maybe they've just both agreed yeah we don't want to share transfer money to and from each other. Like I talk to couples all the time, John, that maybe they've just both agreed. Yeah, we don't want to share our money. We like doing our own thing. And they're Venmoing each other for rent and Venmoing each other because they went out to a nice dinner and he paid and now I have to pay my half. That right there, nothing, nothing strikes me as more absurd than me laying in the bed with my husband at night and rolling over and say hey did you remember to venmo me that 30 bucks you owe me yeah 18

dollars we went to arby's yesterday 18 bucks remember i mean nothing puts just the kibosh on romanticism quicker than saying hey you owe me 30 for my roast beef sandwich or holding holding holding the the human that y'all created together yes and holding the baby and going hey by the way i need you to give me 30 bucks for the water bill because uh yeah or what happens it's so it's madness what happens if okay you you have the worst possible day of your life right you get fired and you come home you you know you just all the confidence is drained out of you. And then on top of all of that, you have to realize, how am I going to pay my wife for rent? Right.

How am I going to pay my wife for rent? Hey, I got you for the next two months, but you're going to have to. Or what does it look like? Let's go a step further. He makes $200,000 a year. She makes $60,000 a year. She makes $60,000 a year. He wants to go to Ruth's Chris. He orders a steak and she gets the side salad because she can't afford.

How does this work? It's a paper mache home. It's not real. I can't imagine anything more divisive and anything else that would just put so much separation and create almost like a class system in your own home than not combining your money where your money is. Your heart is also. And I think, I think ultimately Jade, that's the challenge in the chaos that is modern day marriage.

I think it's never been more important for kids. I think it's never been more important for kids I think it's never been more important for us as just individuals the idea of marriage is is becoming so so important yeah and I honestly think we don't know how to do it and I don't think we understand the depths of what that covenant and what that commitment actually means and I I do I get it that people are like whoa you want to go all all in yeah it's like that's the only way that works and people go part of the way in and then they're upset that it didn't work and of course it didn't work because the only way it works is to go all in

and that's also the only way you get really really hurt and that's that's that's the other side of it right that is true you got to go all in and it's hard and it's scary and we don't have a lot of models for what that looks like but at the same time if if you have the guts to look at your wife with tears in her eyes after she gets home from teaching and taking care of the kids and looks at you and says um i need some grocery money and you're like well i'll see let me see if i can venmo it over to you god help you man man i god help you that's that's horrible it's all i'm gonna say all right i i say it all the time and sam's like jade why why are you telling folks this but i say it all the time i'm like listen if i ever came home like Sam Warshaw would never even try it. Number one. Thank God.

No, he's a great human. He's one of the best guys I know. But if he ever said to me, Jade, you know what? You have the babies. I'll take the bank account. Here's what would happen. You would never see him again.

Here's what would happen. I'd get a call at my house. Hey, John, I need you to help me hide a body. And I'd help you, but I like Sam. I'd be like, Sam didn't make it. I'd help you, but I like Sam. I'd be like, Sam didn't make it. I'd help you, but I like Sam.

I wouldn't like that. He would never try it. Thank God. Well, and I've never thought of it. I've never thought of what you just said, but can you imagine? I'm trying to imagine laying in bed at night. The shades are drawn, and I look over, and I'm'm expecting like, this might be the night. And,

uh, my wife says, Hey, I need $48 for groceries. Can you just Venmo me real quick? And then you say, yeah, but you already owe me 14 from last week.

Hold on. We went to Chick-fil-A three weeks ago and you owe me 695. And we out. Light switch on. Putting on golden girls. Share your accounts. If you're going to share your DNA, share your accounts if you're gonna share your dna share your accounts this is the ramsey show welcome back to the ramsey show i'm john deloney joined

by jade warshall triple eight eight two five five two two five the house, selling a house. The Ramsey Way makes home ownership a blessing instead of a burden. The Ramsey Trusted Program is the only way to find an agent you can trust to keep you on track with what we teach here at Ramsey and get you the best offer on your house or find the right house for you. I know I just did it. I used a Ramsey Trusted real estate agent recently and she was amazing. We send you some of the top agents in your area who we trust. You review their stats,

interview them and decide which one you want to work with. Ramsey trusted agents have years of experience and will help you make wise decisions when it comes to pricing, marketing and making or choosing the right offer. Go to ramseysolutions.com slash agent to find a Ramsey trusted real estate agent

for free. It doesn't cost you anything. RamseySolutions.com slash agent. Do it. I just did it. It's good enough for the Deloney family. It's good enough for you to check it out. All right, let's go to Los Angeles, California, the city of angels and talk to Jesse. What's up, Jesse? Hey, John. Hi, Jade. What's up, Jesse? Hey, John. Hi, Jade. What's up, man? I'm new to the show. Been listening to you guys for a couple of weeks now. Welcome to the cult, my man. It's awesome. I was reading the baby steps or going through them and I realized I was in step

two and four at the same time and kind of put me in a pickle with my dad. You like so many. All right. So sit back. We're going to give you some Kool-Aid and we're going to drink this and then we're going to get it squared up for you. So tell us what's going on. So I have a truck.

I, this is where I feel like I'm the king of backwards. I bought a truck, sold my old, I had an SUV. I ended up having a little, currently I have equity on it or I'm upside up on it. It's worth, I owe $16,000 and I can get $41,000 for it. And that's for a truck?

For a truck. You owe $16,000 and you can get $4,100 for it or $41,000 for it? No, $41,000. Jesse, well played, man. All right, man. Okay, so what's next? So my question is, should I sell it and then start tackling my debt with the net $25,000 that I would get out of it? Yeah. How much debt do you have? I have about $50,000. Okay. So yeah, definitely doing that deal.

Let me go back to the first thing you said, where you said you're at baby step two and baby step four at the same time. That means you have debt, but you're investing? Yes, I was investing 15% of my net every check. Yeah. If I were you, I would pause that so that you have more money to pay off the remaining $25,000 of debt that you have and you can knock it out super quick. What's your income?

I'm grossing maybe $2,500. Dude, good for you, Jesse. You're crushing it, man. What do you do for a living? I'm a procurement for a big box company or a big warehouse. Dude, good for you, man. Congratulations. Well, thank you.

I'm tired, but I still feel like I realized I was sick and tired of being sick and tired. Awesome. So that's where I was like, well, I'm listening to you guys. I'm like, wait a minute. One thing I did hear you guys mention in the previous segment,

if it's not half of your income, I believe, for the truck that you owe should be okay. Yeah, so we look at your full income and it shouldn't be more than half of that. And yeah, you know, you owe $16,000, but that's a rule of thumb, which means there's other things that play into that. Listen, you can do what you want on this, but if the goal is to get out of debt quickly so you can start investing again, then yeah, I would sell it. Yeah, that's definitely a goal.

What's that truck do for you? It doesn't do anything. That's the other half. Hold on, it does. Dude, I've got an old beat-up truck, and I would love a new one. You know why? Because it kind of makes you feel awesome, doesn't it? Okay, yes.

Okay, it does. It does. It's kind of awesome, right? And so it gives you, like, you feel a little bit cool on those Los Angeles streets when you're sitting there parked for four hours a day on the highway, and you're just staring at the people below you. It there parked for four hours a day on the highway and you're just staring at the people below you it kind of feels awesome yeah and so you have to be honest about what you're giving up and you're giving up that you have a great truck it's worth a whole bunch of money and you're going to give all that up for for freedom because if you don't if you're not

honest about that you get rid of the truck and that haunting feeling i just gave up something that that that makes your ego feel good, and you're going to go try to make your ego feel better in other ways. So you're going to start just chasing it. You're going to play whack-a-mole with it. If you just go right through the middle of it and say, yeah, it's cool to have a rad truck. It really is.

And I'm going to sell it because it's even cooler to have peace and freedom. So I'm going to buy a used Corolla and just straight roll the streets of Los Angeles California my Corolla and everybody's gonna be like Jesse we we know what you make Jesse why are you driving a Corolla you say cuz I'm free you see I'm saying yeah yeah you got kids yeah I don't okay I do have a not a Corolla but a Nissan which is equivalent to the Corolla. Done. Is that paid for?

Is that a Nissan? Is the Nissan paid for? It is paid for. Listen. Dude, that truck. Bye, Felicia. Sell it this weekend. I'm on it.

Bye. I've already been getting appraisals, and that was like, I nod, and I was like, I'm going to call, I'm going to call, and you guys just pushed me over. I'm proud of you, man. Yay. I'm proud of you. I'm proud of you, man. Yay! I'm proud of you. I'm proud of you. And you're talking to two people who love our lives,

who make good money because our boss is overly generous with us, and we all drive older cars because, seriously, nobody cares. No one cares. They really don't. Yeah. Nobody cares. I appreciate everything you guys do. You guys are awesome.

I appreciate you, man. I appreciate you. Congratulations, dude. You're about to be free here anytime soon, man soon man all right let's roll out to um philadelphia we were born and raised on the playground where we spent most of our days and talk to brandon hey brandon what's up hey how's it going good man what's up uh so i am 27 years old. I started my company and bought my home when I was 21. I'm currently making about $250,000 a year, shooting for $300,000. I'm the only employee of my own business, but I was able to save up $150,000 and I have that sitting in a money

market mutual funds collecting 4.2% interest right now. Nice. So I have about $35,000 in debt outside of my home, which I'm definitely paying that off. I was going to do that today, actually. Nice. And then I have about $125,000 that I owe on my home. Now, my question is, because my home is locked in at 3.2% interest, I'm making more

interest having it sit in the money market. I also get that home as a business write-off. Does it make sense for me to pay it off? In our world, it does. In your world, if you're very, very concerned with the math, it may not. Have you ever lived in a debt-free, a paid-off house? No. So having been on both sides of that ledger, I'm going to tell you the sole tax that you're paying, you don't even know that you're paying it.

Because here's what you can do. If you pay it off and you don't like that, you can go down and take a HELOC out on it and invest that money. And get the 4.2. Yeah. See what I'm saying? And I don't think you will. I think if you pay that off, you're going to go, this is awesome.

No way in the world would I take out a HELOC for 150 so I can get 4.2% on it. Because you don't know what your body is carrying around being a sole provider of the only employee at a business that you are crushing it on, but that your amygdala knows at any day if I lose two of these clients or three of these clients, they take my house from me. Yeah, that's why I live pretty frugally. I live as if my worst months, basically. So if I do lose an hour or two. Take that off the table. Take it off the table.

Yeah. They can't take your home. They can't take anything. And then you know what you're going to do? You're going to be a lot more selective about the clients you choose, and those clients are going to make you a lot more money down the road, and you're going to serve a lot more people down the road. Yeah.

Is that fair? Yes. I mean, you're talking about two percentage points, right? Basically, give or take? Mm-hmm. Yeah. Bro, I'd pay that thing off today. You could be debt-free by the end of the afternoon.

Instantly. I'm excited for you. Does that sound crazy? Yeah. For 27, I think it sounds good. I think it's pretty dat gum can be 27 years old pay it off house making 200 grand a year in your own business living his life like it's golden you have won my good man pay it off today you're debt free today congratulations man

this is your freedom dance this is the ramsey. We'll be right back. Welcome back. This is The Ramsey Show. I'm John Deloney, joined by Jade Warshall, 888-825-5225. Let's go out to St. Louis, Missouri and talk to Jen. Hey, Jen, what's going on? Hi, I'm good, John. How are you? Good, good, good. What's up? So I'm going to be straightforward.

The question is, my boyfriend doesn't want to get married. Should I move out? How long have you been together? We've been together since the end of 2019. A little background, I'm a single mom of two. I've got a four-year-old turning five, seven-year-old turning eight. We moved in late 2020 after a year of dating and divorced from their dad, separated when my daughter was like four months old. So it was a pretty overwhelming decision to move in together, you know, just protective

over them trying to make the right decisions. But I had hoped that, you know, things would progress to marriage by now. You know, you hear Papa Dave, I just started listening to the show when we moved in together, say, you know, you don't want the arguments over the mustard, and now here we are. You know, it's a sensitive topic about marriage and commitment. So it's, you know, just feels hard to know what to do next. I've done this long enough that I think I'm right, but I'm also humble enough to know if I'm wrong, okay?

So I want you to shoot me straight, okay? Yeah. I can tell by your voice that you know the answer, and it doesn't really matter what Jade and I say. I think he's been pretty clear. He doesn't see a future with you, and he's going to ride the train as long as it will be and you're terrified of being a single mom again and it yeah i mean is that fair um i think it's fair he'll say like he just doesn't see any rush for it what's the push

it's minus it is he's content and if i push forward i'm prioritizing that over relationship with him hold on that's that over relationship with him. Hold on. That's just, that's Gaslight 101. Because when you love somebody and they look you in the eye and say, I feel unsafe, and you love them, you do whatever you got to do to help them feel safe. And you told them that.

And then he says, you're prioritizing how you feel over how I feel, and that's not what love does. Love takes a knee and says, I got you, and you hope that that person does the same for you, but he's playing you like a fiddle. But here's the thing. Here's the thing.

You know that. Why don't you trust yourself? That is a good question. This isn't the only place he does that to you, is it? I'm not sure, but it's just... Jen, that means yes. You don't have to talk about it on there. I get it.

I'm never going to tell somebody to move out. I'm not going to do that. You have to own that decision. But I'm telling you, if you were my sister, if you were my daughter, I would tell going to tell somebody to move out. I'm not going to do that. You have to own that decision. But I'm telling you, if you were my sister, if you were my daughter, I would tell you to run. And by the way, that's a great way to think about it. You've got kids. What would you tell your kids to do?

Yeah, I've brought that up and he kind of spins it from the other point of view. I'm like, well, you'd never force your son to marry someone. I'm like, well, no, but I question like why this is going on. What's the opposition to being married? I'm not sure. It's hard. I mean, how do you come from a, you know, a broken home or something? It would make sense to me. I had parents divorce myself, but, um, you know, I'm, I'm not sure other than it's a commitment and you're locked into it with someone. Is it the kids? Let's just be honest here. Is he afraid of having to be dad?

I'm not sure. I mean, obviously, he's already kind of playing that role right now and has kids of his own. They're all pretty well bonded together and everyone gets along fairly well. I mean, as much as you can expect in a family situation see i don't buy that either because i know some just staggeringly amazing dads who came along and it's not just as good as you can imagine um because you can expect no it's pretty amazing i'm thinking of my buddy Barrett who stepped into a messy situation and has become the most amazing father to three wonderful kids. And so I know it can be done because I've seen it done over and over and over again.

But it takes somebody walking in saying, come hell or high water, you are my wife, these are my kids, and I'm all in. Not, are you kidding me? Are you going to rush me? Jeez. It's been five years. It's been five years. There's no rush. these are my kids and I'm all in. Not, are you kidding me? You're going to rush me? Jeez. It's been five years. It's been five years.

Half a decade. And you know what I mean? Yeah, yeah. And here's the thing. You know all the things Jade and I are saying. You know it. What happened in your first marriage? A lot of lying. And I'd question things and get told I was wrong. And eventually an affair that we worked through and then an affair that just kind of tore it apart.

And who growing up told you that what you thought didn't really matter too much? Oh, I think probably both parents, children are to be seen and not heard. Okay. And so I want to honor your nervous system right now. Your body has learned over the course of your entire life that what you think, what you feel, what you know to be true is probably wrong and you need to shut your mouth and be quiet about it.

And I want you to hear Jade and I say you are free from that from this point forward because it's not true. Yeah. Being seen and not heard kept you safe as a kid and it's crushing you as an adult woman, right? Yeah. Okay. Those things that keep us safe as kids often ruin our adult relationships. And so you learn as a kid, be seen, uh, don't just be quiet and be out of the way. Your kids don't deserve that in their mom. You don't deserve that day to day.

And if you're with somebody that's requesting that of you, then yeah, think long and hard about the duration of that relationship. No question about it. For sure. It's hard to see the path forward though. There's not one. He told you there's not one. He said everything's great. And by the way, though. There's not one. He told you there's not one. He said everything's great.

And by the way, from his perspective, it is. He has a place to live. He's got somebody sharing a bed with him. I mean, he's got everything. Why in the world would he change that? He gets his way all the time. Yeah. And whenever you're like, hey, I think this, he's like, well, that's dumb.

What about me? And you're like, yeah, you're right. Sorry. Yeah. He has no reason to change. None. And the only way he will change is if you say, I'm going to look in the mirror and believe

for the first time in my life I'm worth more than this. And I'm worth somebody looking at me and saying, till death do us part, I'm with you. If you had to give your best guess, because you know this guy, and if you said, hey, if we're not getting married anytime soon, I'm walking, is he begging you to stay or is he saying, don't let the door hit you on the way out? No, he's pretty much like, well, that's your decision.

If you chose to leave, that's on you and I can't stop you. So, you know, somebody who really loved him wouldn't choose to kind of walk walk out as the vibes they get as the great jay-z once said you need to dust your shoulders off or brush your shoulders get that dirt off your shoulder yes Felicia you're gone yeah he told you that yeah he said I don't if you leave I don't care I'm so hey forget him he's not on the phone with me yeah Jen why I mean it's it's it's scary out there it's financially scary it's hard to you know have two kids alone and anytime something comes up carry that that weight on your shoulders yeah now we're getting into real talk yeah the idea of being a single mom and going to a one-bedroom apartment and sharing it with Now we're getting into real talk. Yeah. The idea of being a single mom and going to a one-bedroom apartment and sharing it with two kids is terrifying, right?

Yeah, for sure. What do you make? I make decent income after tax, biweekly. I have this prepared, about $2,500, but it's biweekly, so there's two that are a little higher than that, and their dad does actively pay child support. And what does he pay for the child support? It's $400 biweekly.

Okay. So you're like almost $6,000 a month? Yeah. Okay. A little more than that, I think. Okay, great. You can find a place to live for that. Yeah.

I don't know. Like COVID and everything it just it scares you because like employers did the furloughs and everything so you never know what's going to come i do but you do know what's true right now what's true right now is you have somebody that doesn't respect you and doesn't care about what you think or feel yeah you know that to be true today yeah do you owe a lot of money are Are you pretty good financially right now? I had pretty good debt free last summer. No, no student loans, no credit cards and paid off my, my car. So I've been working on the emergency fund. And so now it's kind of this like,

am I baby step three B or baby step four? There you go. Well, you're, you're doing all the right things and we're so proud of you. Hang on the line. I'm going to send you a copy of Building a Non-Anxious Life and Own Your Past, Change Your Future. Be my gift to you. When she does this, it's going to make a great statement to her kids about what is and is not acceptable. And that's what's really great about this. And it's scary every step of the way. Call anytime, Jen. We believe in you.

We believe in you. We believe in you. You're worth being well. This is The Ramsey Show. What's going on? What's going on? This is John with my good friend Jade Warshaw, and this is The Ramsey Show live from Nashville, Tennessee, where we help people with their money,

with their relationships, and with their work. 888-825-5225. We're taking your calls on just about anything you've got going on. We have experience. Already, we've just got our own opinions. And that might be about worth what you're going to pay for it. But we'll give it to you anyway. 888-825-5225.

Let's roll out to Seattle, Washington, and talk to well, well, well, my Michelle. Hey, Michelle, what's up? Hey, you guys. I love it. This is so fun. So I guess I'll just start with my question, and then we can just unpack from there. So I just need help. My husband and I are navigating the decision.

My mother-in-law has approached us and his brother wanting monthly financial help so that she can live a little bit easier at 75. Okay. Wanting or needing? I would say it's a want. What does she want? Trying. So she's struggling just to make ends meet. She's making it meet, but she's not able to, I would say, live comfortably. And I think she wants to be able to maybe work a little bit less

and just enjoy life at ease versus living paycheck to paycheck. How much money is she wanting from you guys collectively? So her biggest wish in the world would be to have her mortgage paid off. Mine too. Okay, thank you, same. Hi, same, me too. So she's got a couple hundred thousand dollars balance. And so anywhere from $1,600 to $2,000 a month between the two brothers. So we would be pitching in somewhere between $800 to $1,000 a month towards her lifestyle. My, oh my, oh my.

So what if she sold her house and moved into an apartment. So that's where I'm kind of questioning. So we have asked her and she's completely against it. Because she won't be as comfortable? Well, there's that. And then there's also, you know, that's where her and her husband moved to. And about 15 plus years ago, she lost her husband to cancer my husband's dad and so there's a lot of just sentimental and um that's what's holding her there and her house is worth quite a nice chunk of change which would change her life yeah what's it worth by the way um on the low end i would say 1.5 mil okay so i just want to get full clarity you said that she's making ends meet but she might not have the money to do extra special things right so she can you know go out to a nice dinner or is it yeah is a nice dinner like a steak dinner

or she can't get chick-fil-a oh no she can get chick-fil-a it's you know nice things and she's just getting tired oh i'm listen i'm michelle talk to john for a minute because i i gotta sit over here and be quiet i have a heart to help i want to help everybody i know you do i know you do. I know you do. Hey, listen, I want to honor family, and I am taking steps right now to be able to take care of my mom and dad if and when that day comes. I totally get it, okay? And there's also I'm sitting in a $1.5 million house.

I make enough money to do whatever I want to do, but I kind of want to do more of what I want to do and less of living in reality. And so this isn't about taking care of mom. This is about mom wanting her cake and wanting to eat it too. Right? Right. And she approaches us as, well, this is an investment for you.

This is going to be your inheritance. Ooh. And I'm over here like, well, I ain't guaranteed nothing. If you live for 20 years, then you might need medical help or care or assisted living in the future. That's right. That's where that's going to come from. And that's also hanging something over your head that you never asked for. You're like, I never asked for you to leave me anything in your will. Right. Totally. Yeah. And by the way, it's not an investment. Paying for dinners and meals is not an

investment no um yeah this is a this is a hard one and here's it's gonna be hard on two fronts it's gonna be hard one because one of your either your husband or his brother's gonna cave and so it's gonna this kind of request from a parent is so selfish because it will split the family. It is not selfish if parent can't eat. It is not selfish if parent doesn't have a place to live. I'm all about that. I'm sitting on my $1.5 million house. And I can continue to say it's sentimental, even though a husband passed away 15 years ago.

But this is more about, I'm in a $1.5 million, this'm gonna this is my lifestyle right hey what's your husband want to do he's he's up in the air but he's you know he's understanding the reality of the situation of you know she's not you know up a creek she's got a way through this and she doesn't have a way through it she's got a yacht through it yeah it's not like she has like a like a canoe that she's trying to paddle up a river she can she could take a yacht do you have 1.3 million dollars i mean we we've done pretty well i mean i i think our net worth is somewhere just just under two million okay um and we're new to this program. And to be honest with you, money has been the biggest stress in my part of the marriage because I held onto it. And until I found your show, I started opening up to my husband about what this burden and stress was. And, you know, when we're making decent money and, you know, we don't have money one month, I'm just like, how is this

happening? So we're both on board. We're brand new to this thing. We're trying to shuffle our life around to like fit into the baby steps so we can actually have a goal to retire and have something on the horizon. That's a pin in it. It's not a fantasy or a dream. You, you have, um, you said you have a net worth of $2 million, but what's your net liability against that net worth? How much debt do you have? Yeah, so I've got $290,000 on one of my mortgages that we own outright, the other property, and then about $60,000 in consumer. Okay.

And then you have money laying around, obviously, because you've got $2 million. So what's liquid that you can get to? Like, what do you. Okay. So that's a little bit sticky. Um, because I just recently, um, closed out my late mom's estate. And so I got a modest inheritance, um, that is not included in that 1.8. And that's just kind of sitting in a money market because I'm still emotional right now. So that's about 260 is liquid. Okay. So you guys are really close to being able to really pay off your debt, all of your debt

in this other mortgage and be completely scot-free, basically. Yes. all of your debt in this other mortgage and be completely scot-free, basically. Yes. So with, yeah, crunching numbers in the next, you know, handful of years, it'll be completely steamrolled. But consumer debt, yes, this year, 2024, we'll never touch consumer debt again. Yeah. I mean, you've got 260 sitting in a... Yeah. Can you pay it off right now, like today? I know. Yeah, I can. Yeah. And then that that leaves 200 and I know you've got money elsewhere too but not to get into all that but then you only owe 290 on this other mortgage and it's your second home so there's money to make this happen you got to get with your husband and decide what you want to do what you don't want to do but here's the thing you're not doing anything out of

guilt and you're also not going to do, what is it? The guilt and resentment thing, George? Yeah. Choose guilt over resentment every time. Because if you start giving money, you're going to start getting frustrated and you're going to have a month where things are tight and she's going to be calling you from the steakhouse and you're going to start to resent her. And that's not fair to her. What's fair to her is you and your family and hopefully your brother's family have boundaries this is the ramsey show 888-825-5225 i'm john deloney joined by jade warshaw jade um that last caller and that got us buzzing in the hallway man that was different john so i don't want to talk to the sweet woman who called because she's kind of like second removed right this is her husband's mom's mother-in-law i guess my the conversation i want to have is to parents out there yes those who would look at their children as a roi you owe me or as a lottery ticket or as a lifestyle play for me yeah instead of saying

i got to the end of my life me and my husband built this world or me and my wife built this world we have a 1.5 million dollar house we're referring to the previous call we did it thank god now we can sell this house we can buy500,000 condo and put a million dollars in the bank to take care of me as a widow for the rest of my life. That's one of the joys of real estate. It's a way to build wealth. For just this moment. Yeah. Instead of saying, hey, you know what? I'm kind of getting tired of working.

How about everybody give me $1,000 a month so I can stay in this million dollar plus property and continue to go out to fancy dinners and to do what I want to do. In many ways if we're just looking at it dollar for dollar in many ways it's the same as if she had 1.5 million dollars in a retirement account and was like I don't really want to touch this I don't want to take a draw off it. All my kids y'all are doing good so everybody send me a check. Yeah the money's the money whether it's in a home or sitting in an account it's just she don't want to get to it. Right money's the money, whether it's in a home or sitting in an account. It's just she doesn't want to get to it.

Right. For sentimental reasons or whatever. It's like, hey, this is still real money and real wealth that you have here. You just don't want to access it. And so it's at everybody else's expense. And I guess the flip side of that is there's got to be something else in a relationship like this. Because I want my mom to have the best. because I want my mom to have the best and I want my dad to have the best and so there has to be something along the way in this family dynamic that people aren't running to take care of the situation right well I don't think anything's

on fire no not only is nothing on fire there there's still, there's roses in these gardens, right? I mean, things are nice. I mean, unless you have, you know, unless you have a terrible relationship with your parents, most kids want to help their parents out, especially if they, even if they can't financially afford to do it, it's like my mom needs them. They'll put themselves in harm's way and put their financial family at risk to help their, you know? So I don't think it's even a thing of like, Oh, what kind of child are you? It's, I think we want to help, but I think it's also, but you have money. You have a million dollars, right? Yeah. So there's, you know, I, I asked John during the break, I'm like, am I some kind of Scrooge?

Like, am I crazy? Cause I was like, not, not even having it. No. And occasionally we have, I mean, today we've got a full studio audience. And occasionally you look up and the whole audience is just mouth agape. Shaking their head. What is happening right now? And so, yeah, it's one of those rare moments.

I think everybody was like, is this for real? And unfortunately it is that folks want to prop up their lifestyle. They don't want to own reality. Here's reality. And this is the conversation. That's why, you know, what we teach here day in and day out here is so important because you do have to think towards the future and you have to think, you know, there's going to come a time, you know, if you're listening and you have kids where the roles are going

to be reversed and you're going to be, you know, the old parent. And do you want to do the same? Do you want to put your kids in the same position that you've been put in right and that that tracks on many layers here like so many of us i know my generation uh grew up where parents don't really talk about money and it's just like you don't ask us how much we make and we don't you know they don't talk about money and they don't talk about sex right and so just gets paid and y'all just appeared in our home right let's stop talking and now we're in our 30s and 40s and 50s and it's like i'm like my parents are they doing okay are they not doing okay and we're wondering if we're gonna have to take care of them and so it's like let's not do

that to our kids let's get our financial house in order and let's pay off our debt and for the love of god let's please invest some money so that when your time comes because it will come nobody works forever that you know unless you leave out too soon you know the time is going to come where you can't work and are you going to do the same cycle again and now you're calling your kids and saying i raised you the least you could do is you know kicking some money for my chick-fil-a well let me promise you in this situation uh let me back up. Here's my promise. If mom doesn't have a place to live, dad doesn't have a place to live and you give him a place, there's going to be some hanging your head a little bit low, but it's gonna be some gratitude.

Absolutely. Thank you. In this situation, when needs are beyond met, when mom is a millionaire and she's calling for lifestyle stipends, that number will move for the rest of y'all's life together. That's a good word, John. It will be a thousand bucks and then it will turn into 1500 bucks and it'll be, I need a new car and it will be, I need a new roof and it will be, I need a new kitchen. It will continue to move because it was never about the money.

It was about this external grasp for prove to me how much you love me. And as soon as that's met it just that that finish line continues to move and move and move and so drawing boundaries there is so hard so hard because she's gonna make it y'all's fault and you got to draw those boundaries choose guilt over resentment every single time that's right let's go out to atlanta and talk to stephan Hey, Stephanie, what's going on? Hey, thank you so much for taking my call. You got it. What's going on? Okay. So my husband and I are in baby step three and I need y'all to please be on my side. All right. Team Stephanie go. Yes. Okay. So our disagreement is on how much we should have in our emergency fund.

Okay. And at the end of the day, by the time we do all of our expenses, it comes down to our food budget. Okay. We agree on what our monthly budget is, but our situation, we're a little different compared to other people. I guess you kind of put us in more of like homesteader prepper like okay you're talking my language keep going keep going you should see my deep freeze let's go i

got two of them so there you go so in my home i have depending on whether it's meat grains whatever anywhere from nine months to a year's worth of food at all times, and we rotate through it. Okay. He thinks in our emergency fund, we should not have any funds allocated for food because we have our food storage. I disagree because even though our kids are fairly young, I've got two boys that are,

they're not teenagers yet, but they're starting to eat a lot. Split the difference, Stephanie. You guys are splitting hairs. What's your food budget every month? Okay, so I have a thousand a month. Okay, so take 500 when you're thinking about your budget

because three to six months of expenses is basically your basic budget. It's not your budget with all its bells and whistles. So when you're thinking about your budget, because three to six months of expenses is basically your basic budget. It's not your budget with all its bells and whistles. So when you're calculating that number and saying, OK, what does it just take for our house to tick and run and run smoothly if we both lost our jobs? Then, yeah, when you're counting up that number, instead of putting a thousand, put five hundred and call it a day. What's wrong with that? I agree with that. He thinks there should be nothing but i said it either needs to be half or the full all right so you're both kind of crazy uh yeah both kind of

crazy what's the hey let's legitimately time wise what does this equate to savings is this you say for an extra month i mean what are we are we talking here? Uh, so time-wise, if we split the this in half, it's like an extra two months. If not, it's an extra four months. This is not worth your marriage. It's not, it's not. He's already married to somebody that needs a year's worth of cow and deer in the freezer. Let him have this one. Let him have this. I mean, at the end of the day, what's it worth? No, it's just making sure we're on the same page. And actually, if you really want to know, he was the one that was like, you need to call in and ask them.

Or you could throw a wrench in the plan and say, listen, if we don't save this up, what if, like, we've used our last month of savings and the electricity goes out and all of our deer and antelope that's in the deep freezer goes bad? We're going to wish that we had saved up that grocery money. Here's the thing. That's like my biggest fear is like the freezers are going to like. Most people who are like, I'm prepping for the end of time. I got a year's worth of cow in the freezer. Dude, they cut the power. That's the first thing that

happens. And every time I mention that, people are like, wait, wait, wait, what? The first thing they do is cut the power. You lose all of it. I mean, you need a root cellar. That's what you need. You need to be vegetarian like Jade because you don't have to deal with all this chaos. But I do

have a couple of deep freezers and I'm with you, Stephanie. But split the difference. I mean, you're stepping over $100 bills to pick up nickels when it comes to your marriage. It's not worth the fight. Let's just split it half and half. Both of you are nuts, and y'all can find peace on the other end. That was awesome. You're awesome, Stephanie.

We'll be right back. This is The Ramsey Show. I'm John Deloney, joined by Jade Warshaw, 888-825-5225. Let's talk about EveryDollar, the best budgeting app in the land, in the world, as some people might say. And I agree with that statement. Because we are on Lord of the Rings. That's right. EveryDollar.

Let's talk for real about this thing. You need a budget, right? And there's a lot of them out there, but they don't do what every dollar does, which is making it very easy to stick to your monthly budget and also providing the guidance you need the Ramsey way so that you can stick to your budget and accomplish your goals. That's what this whole thing is about. And so the best way to make the most of your money is by creating this EveryDollar budget. It truly does help you stick to your monthly budget. It makes it so simple to plan your spending, to plan your paychecks. You can

track your expenses and you can save money for the things that matter most to you. What I love about EveryDollar is it's an app on your phone or you can do it on your desktop. And I always say, John, that EveryDollar fills in the communication gaps with your spouse if you're married. It's real tough. It's like, yeah, I forgot to tell you I went to Publix. But Sam can open up the budget and see, okay, somebody went to Publix. Usually it works like this. Hey, John, you forgot to tell me that you went to Publix. Or Guitar Center in my wife's case. Guitar Center. Let's be real. That's your Hey, John, you forgot to tell me that you went to Publix or Guitar Center in my wife's case.

Guitar Center. Let's be real. That's your reality, John. Yeah. But it's this app and you can open it up. It's in real time. You can see what's going on. And it wants you to track your transactions every single day.

So you build up this daily habit to where every day you're just looking at your money, which is so good. You keep a pulse on your spending and make progress towards your goals. So if you're just looking at your money which is so good you keep a pulse on your spending and make progress towards your goals so if you're interested in that download every dollar for free again that's for free you can do that in the app store or google play if you have an android i don't know about the android all right androids are good androids are good are they yes look at christian in there. Christian in there. Are you the only one Christian with an Android?

I am sorry for you. I'm sorry. Hey. America Christian, that's what I'm talking about. Let's go out to Dallas, D-Texas, and talk to Elizabeth. Hey, Elizabeth, what's going on? Oh, not much. How are y'all doing?

We're partying, dude. That's not true. We're at work, but you probably are too. What's up? So my question is, I'm trying to figure out what the best way to get my family out of this hole is with an anticipated car accident settlement. Okay, go for it. Well, there's kind of a little bit of a backstory. So I'm married, but I've been single since January of 2023. I have three kids, and I'm not getting any financial support whatsoever right now. Okay. Is the divorce in process? Just take them forever? So he doesn't want to be with me, but he doesn't want to get divorced. I obviously want to because there's no point in the tie, but I can't afford to.

Here's the deal. It's the opposite. It's actually he can go do a bunch of things that can destroy you. Yes. Yes. That's a huge worry of mine. Yes. So when you say it's too expensive, is there not an attorney that you can pick up for five or 10 grand?

I know that's a lot of money, but, um, this is a, this is a scary position for you to be in. I'm 100%. There is. Uh, the only problem is, is I, I was kind of in a college town, so everybody wants, you know, five, four or five grand up front and I have nothing like no money at all. Okay. Okay. Okay.

And it's scary because, you know, I'm expecting a car accident settlement and I'm not divorced. So that also scares me because I feel like he's going to try to get it away from me. Yes. Is the car in your name or is it in both of your names? No, I bought it before we got married. Okay, so the car is 100% in your name? Yes. Is the car in your name or is it in both of your names? No, I bought it before we got married. Okay, so the car is 100% in your name? Yes. Okay, then the settlement should come to you.

You should be fine. Okay, so what about lost wages? Because I was out of work for six months because I dislocated my hip, so I wasn't allowed to work at all. Okay, is that coming to you? The attorneys have told me that I'm going to work at all. Okay. Is that, is that coming to you? Uh, they, the attorneys have told me that I'm going to get lost wages.

So, okay. Well then I would not hear. I don't think if he tried to come after this money, I don't think there's any way he'd get it. Elizabeth, I can hear you're scared to death and you are projecting problems into the future and you're worrying about them in the present okay yeah i would much rather you do you have an opportunity to go earn

some money right now so i've been working um where are you i'm self-employed as a contractor doing what um construction remodeling flooring showers, showers, small... Are you making any money doing that? Currently, no. In the next couple weeks, I'm anticipating the job is going to pay me four, almost five grand,

except I'm also behind on my rent. Elizabeth, you have to stop this. You got to go get a job at McDonald's and you got to get a job at Walmart today.

I know you've got a lot of skills, but you're drowning and you're scared to death and you got to get a job at Walmart today. I know you've got a lot of skills, but you're drowning and you're scared to death and you got little kids and you got left and the guys drowning you on the other end of the teeter totter because he knows you can't afford anything right this second. Yeah. And you're spiraling and you're spiraling. You've been spiraling for over a year now. And the only path through this is through this. And I'm only telling you that because I love you and you can make $20 an hour in Dallas, Texas at both of those locations.

And then as far as the situation goes with not having a vehicle, I mean, I have a vehicle, but it's technically totaled from the car accident. Well, keep driving it. I am. I just can't afford to put fuel in it right now. Because you have to get around. I know you got to go get a job. You have to go work. Do you have any buddies that for the first two weeks before you get a paycheck can just drop you off? I really don't have any friends.

I had a friend, but she kind of just disappeared. How are you feeding your children right now? I get government assistance. I get food stamps. And I've gotten that ever since he moved out just because of not being able to do that, you know? Yeah. When is the check coming in? I get a debit on the 12th of every month. No, no, no. When does the check for the check coming in? I get a debit on the 12th of every month.

No, no, no. When is the check for the settlement come in? Oh, it's supposed to be within the next 30 days. Okay. The biggest temptation you're going to have is to go blow every penny of that. And what I want you to do, here's the deal. You're going to have a choice to make okay you're gonna have a choice as to whether you go finance a new car whether you go get some nice apartment for a minute because it's going to be a big check

or if you get a friend somebody you trust and if you don't have that, then you go find a pastor at a local church, or you call and find a counselor on government assistance for $50 an hour. But you find somebody that will walk with you with this money. And if you play your cards right, you're going to put this money in a high-yield savings account, and you're going to get enough money to get an apartment, or you're going to be able to pay on the current apartment you have and you're going to be able to put gas in your car you're not going to go buy a new car even though yours is ridiculous and it looks silly and it's been totaled but it still drives and you're going to go get two jobs and you're going to work and you're going to work and you're going to work and this breaks my heart for

you but you can look up in nine months and have worked two jobs and kept this money in the bank, and you're going to have a radically different outlook on life. And I want you to take $5,000 of this settlement, and I want you to get an attorney and get this divorce finalized. Yeah. Okay. I agree with you. I definitely agree. It stinks. I know with you. I definitely agree.

It stinks. I know it stinks. And I know this is going to feel like a lifeline. It's going to be like, oh, man, I've got it. I'm made. And it's going to go faster. It's going to go right through your hands like water if you don't have a plan. And the plan has to be your standard of living that you have right now goes up 1%.

Gasoline. I'm not buying anything new. I'm not buying new clothes. I'm not buying anything. I'm buying gasoline and toothpaste and deodorant and soap. And I'm going to pay rent and then I'm going to go get a job. And then I'm going to go to the next level and the next level. We're playing a two or three year game here.

Yeah. That man left you in a bad hole, didn't he? Yeah. By the way, if you get it finalized, the court will make him pay you child support. And I know single moms all across the state of Texas

just laughed when I said that, but at least it will be court ordered, right? Yeah. I'm so sorry, hon. Hang on the line here. Hang on the line. I'm going to hook you up

with Financial Peace University with their course. It's going to tell you how to handle this money when it comes to you. And I'm going to hook you up with the EveryDollar app. I know you don't have any money in the account right now, but in 30 days, you're going to have a lot of money in that account. And I want you to steward it wisely. Hang on the line. We'll get you taken care of. We'll be right back. This is the Ramsey Show. Today's scripture of the day is Isaiah 48, 17. I'm the Lord your God who teaches you what is best for you, who directs you in the way you should go. The great and mighty George Carlin says,

Some people see things that are and ask why. And some people dream of things that never were and ask why not. And some people have to go to work and they don't have time for all that. I love George Carlin. The goat. Alright, let's go out to Minneapolis. Not Minneapolis, but Minneapolis.

Thank you, John. I've been working hard on that. And talk to Patrick. What's up, Patrick? Hey guys, how you guys doing today? We're rocking on to the break of dawn, brother. What's up, Patrick? Hey, guys. How are you guys doing today? We're rocking on to the break of dawn, brother. What are you doing?

Good, good. So I just had a quick question for you guys. So I believe it was like a couple years ago, I was with my dad and he had put me on all of the credit cards that he had. And I guess my question is, how am I able to get myself? So are you an authorized user on these credit cards? Oh, yeah. Okay. So yeah, let's get off those. Yeah. For anybody listening, if you're an authorized user on a credit card, all you have to do

is call up the number because you've got your own card you can spend and it's affecting your credit all you have to do is call the number and say i don't want to be an authorized user anymore and you have the ability to do that so it's it's literally that simple um and i would do that did he pull your did he pull these credit cards in your name or are you on his credit card i am on his credit card okay that makes it easy that makes it easy then you can just roll that off yep just call him up and say i'm an authorized user on this account and i don't want to be anymore fantastic that on that yeah good call patrick hey and good for you for getting off your dad's stuff yeah let's separate this and be all growed up all right

let's go out to kansas city missouri and talk to the mighty bryce hey bryce what's up man how's it going guys excellent what's up with you man so i guess i have a question here i wanted you guys to slap some sense into me so i'm thinking about buying a new car. Just don't. Just don't. Just kidding. Go ahead. So it's a 2022 BMW M340i and cars is kind of my passion. But I just really wanted someone to talk me out of it, I guess. I make about $80,000 a year. I have about $3,000 in debt. And I wanted to put about $10,000 to $15,000 down on the vehicle. And then do payments for the rest? Correct, yes. That's a great idea.

I think you may, you want us to talk you off the ledge? Is that what you're calling for? So I guess, I guess I just know that I could put that money somewhere else. So I've got two roads to go down. I really want this car. It's my passion. But I've got this other road where I know I could take that money and build my wealth. Well, what do you think is the wise answer?

And what do you think that we're going to tell you to do so you're going to take me or you're going to tell me to take the road um to invest that money into something smarter um but yeah we're going to tell you we want peace for you flat out we want you to have financial peace we want you to be able to leave an inheritance we want you to have a good life financially we don't want you to be slaved to a lender. I think, you know, even if you're, you know, relatively new to the show, I think you can kind of get that even from listening to a couple hours of the show. But yeah, if I'm you, you've got $3,000 of debt to pay off. And if you've got 10 to 15,000 to put down on this vehicle, you can pay off your debt. And then with whatever you have left, which is at least $12,000,

can't you buy a car in cash? That would be so amazing to have a cash car. You already have a car, right? Yes, I do have a car right now. What do you have? That's the debt I have, actually, that $3,000 in debt. So I have a 2014 Mercedes right now that I've had for about five years. What's it worth? It's worth about $13,000, $14,000.

So can't you sell that car and get 10 for it and then put your other 15 with it and buy a $25,000 car in cash? So the idea was, so I have about $30,000 in the bank and I was going to take 10 out of that. I was going to sell the car I have and use 10 from that and do possibly $20,000 down. So 15 to 20. Not down. That's where we're differing. You and I have two different schools of thought. I don't want you to go into debt ever again. Not for depreciating assets. Yeah.

It's going down in value. And the borrower is slave to the lender, period. Yes. And if you want to talk about better things that you could be doing with your money, whether the payment, let's say the payment's 500 bucks a month. Do you know what that is over the course of time? You're locking yourself into a life of car payments because you had a car payment before. Now you're going to have a car payment again. And before you look up, you will have had car payments for 20, 30, 40 years of your life.

And I don't have to tell you if you plug that into an investment calculator, the millions of dollars that you're throwing down the drain. And you don't even have to. Like some people get locked into car payments because they feel like they don't have the money sitting around to get out. You've got $30,000 sitting around to never do this ever again. Yes. Tell me about this word you keep using,

which is like, it's like a newfangled word that is super hemorrhoid inducing for me. Passion. They're my passion. Oh, they're my passion. Tell me about this passion of yours. So it's just, it's really the only thing in my life that I don't, that I absolutely love is cars. I don't really,

I mean, I'm 24 years old. I've got a job. I don't really have many hobbies. I don't really play any video games. I don't play any sports. Cars is, is my thing. And I know the number one thing that you guys talk about is to, uh, not have a car loan and to be paying $500, $600, $700 a month on a car. That's why I'm second-guessing myself. And you should be. Yeah, you should be. You should be. Listen, I could tell you right now.

You want to know what my thing is? What's that? Million-dollar houses. Yes. My things are guitar equipment. You know? I'm not even that good, but I just love buying it. Trips to Europe.

That's my thing. Like, I think we all have a thing that's like, yeah, I would love that. That would be great if I could do that all the time. But there is a little thing called reality and we should live there. There's another word. It's an ancient Greek word. I think it's Greek and Latin and English at the same time, and it's called maturity.

And it's called being able to separate, like, what I really want versus what is reality, what I have. Yep, yep. And I know that if I don't end up getting this vehicle and I put this money somewhere smarter, my future self will thank me for that. It sure will. In the moment right now, I just, I don't know. Listen, hey, you do know, you do know.

There's two types of dumb choices you can make. There's the dumb choice where wise people have done it before and warned you and said, dude, if you do that, you'll die. Like, don't do it. I've done it before. It's not good. Right. And you have the opportunity to learn from that dumb choice or do it anyway. And then there's a dumb choice where you're like, it's my first rodeo. I don't know any better. I thought I was doing right. And it still turned out to be a decision that was dumb. Right. Don't make the first dumb choice. We're telling you, we're telling you, dude, if you do this, you'll die.

Like, don't do it. Like, financially, it's not good for you. John and I have both made, we've done everything stupid in the book when it comes to money. And we're telling you, you are going to regret this and you're not going to die, but you're going to regret this.

Here's the other challenge. And I'm not saying this to make fun, okay? This is me being as honest as I can. I want you to challenge yourself to get more hobbies, to get some guys to hang out with, to start doing some other things. Because if you notice, Jade and I both rattled off multiple things

that if we were just given the Wild West worth of money, we would go spend stuff on because we have multiple passions across multiple different things. And that's just the idea of a well-rounded person. If you find yourself at 24 and you are fixated on a thing so much so that you're going to act on it against your best interest, that's called an addiction. Okay. So I want you to begin to expand your horizon, go to races. That's all cool. But also go to comedy shows, go watch movies,

get some guys and go bowling, learn how to fish, do some other things that don't have such a multi thousands and thousands of dollar entry point into finding joy. And the things you get good at are the things you're going to get passionate about over time. Go practice some other things, man. And thanks for letting us pick on you, Bryce. We love you, dude. And that's a great car. You just can't afford it. Hey, thanks for listening to us, America. This has been The Ramsey Show. Hey guys, I'm Rachel. And I'm George. And you've probably heard our voices before on The Ramsey Show.

And do we have a surprise for you. Yep, we have our very own show, Smart Money Happy Hour, where we talk about pop culture, current events, and of course, money. George, it's a great show. And what else do we talk about? So much, Rachel. Not enough, and yet too much. We talk about guilt tipping, because tipping is out of control, and I won't stand for it anymore, which is why I'm sitting. I'm glad you're taking such a stand. And we also talk about something else I'm passionate about, Disney adults. Oh, George. Why is it a thing? Listen, some adults still find the magic.

Sure. We also talk about toxic money traits and girl math. And if you don't know what those are, you have to listen to the podcast. Yeah, there's a lot there, you guys. It's pretty fun. We keep you relevant is what I'm trying to say. We help you out. So pull up a chair to the happy hour you wish your friends were having. We promise you won't regret it.

And if you don't have friends, we'll be your friends. We will. We're great friends. So make sure to check it out on Apple, Spotify, YouTube, or the Ramsey Network app.