The Ramsey Show - Financial Stability Starts With Changing How You Think About Money

Episode Date: May 25, 2026

❓ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Have a money question? Ask Ramsey is here to help.⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠��⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 📈 ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Are you on track with the Baby Steps? Get a Free Personalized Plan.⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Rachel Cruze and John Delony answer your questions and discuss: ‘How do I stop living paycheck-to-paycheck?’ 'I'm in $20,000 of gambling debt, how do I stop this addiction?' 'How do we tackle $189,000 of debt with a baby on the way?' 'How do I budget when my legal fees are more than I can pay without debt?' 'My broker is telling me I should make high-risk investments' 'How can I protect our investments from my husband's gambling problem?' Next Steps: ✔️⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠Help us make the show better. Please take this short survey.⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 📞 Have a question for the show? Call 888-825-5225 weekdays from 2–5 p.m. ET or⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠send us an email⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠. 📚 Our Memorial Day Sale is here. Get 2 books and assessments for $20. 💵 ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Start your free budget today. Download the EveryDollar app!⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 🏠 ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Get organized and prepared to buy or sell a home⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 🦸 For help with investing, get connected with a SmartVestor Pro Connect With Our Sponsors: Get 10% off your first month of ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠BetterHelp⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Go to ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Boost Mobile⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ to switch today! If you want your car to keep going and going, trust ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Christian Brothers Automotive⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠. Find a local shop and get an exclusive Ramsey discount of 10% (up to $250) off Learn more about⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Christian Healthcare Ministries⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Get started today with⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Churchill Mortgage⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Get 20% off when you join ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠DeleteMe⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Go to⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ FAIRWINDS Credit Union⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ for an exclusive account bundle! Debt collectors hassling you? Take back control of your life at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Guardian Litigation Group⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Find top health insurance plans at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Health Trust Financial⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Use code RAMSEY to save 20% at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Mama Bear Legal Forms⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Visit⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ NetSuite⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ today to learn more. Get started with ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠YRefy⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ or call 844-2-RAMSEY Visit⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Zander Insurance⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ or call 1-800-356-4282 for your free instant quote today! Explore more from Ramsey Network: 💸 ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠The Ramsey Show Highlights⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 🧠 ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠The Dr. John Delony Show⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 🍸 ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Smart Money Happy Hour⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 💰 ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠George Kamel⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 🪑 ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Front Row Seat with Ken Coleman⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 📈 ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠EntreLeadership⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Ramsey Solutions Privacy Policy⁠⁠⁠ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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So we're here to help you transform your life from the Ramsey Network in the Fairwin's Credit Union Studio. This is The Ramsey Show. And I'm Rachel Cruz hosting this hour with bestselling author, my good friend, Dr. John Deloney. And so we'll be taking your calls about life and money. So give us a call. The lines are open at AAA 825-2-2-25. And if you can't get through, because usually they're all booked up, keep calling, keep trying. You can even leave a voicemail.

But we want to get to your questions. All right. So let's head off to Denver, Colorado, starting us off this hour, is. it Kevin. Hi, Kevin. Welcome to the show. Hello, hello. I just have a few questions. You see, I am in the army and I moved here recently. I am married. I'm 20 years old. And I have my own house back where I moved from. And I am expecting, my wife is pregnant. Oh, wow. And she had to stop working.

And see, before the Army, we had an income of around, we brought home around $10,000 a month. And I guess we got kind of used to that. I have a newer vehicle. And, you see, now that she's pregnant, she actually stopped working. And we have to pay rent here in Denver. and, well, close to Denver. And then we also have to play our mortgage and then the vehicle payments. Okay.

So right now I'm actually losing about $1,000 a month consistently every single month. Okay. And I got to figure out a plan. We do have a little bit of money in the bank, but I don't quite know what my first step should be. Are you currently on base somewhere? Yes, I am. You are, okay. How much is rent?

Do they charge rent? I mean, well, it depends. They do, they do. It's $2,000 even a month. For base rent? For rent, yep, yep, for base rent. It comes out of my paycheck. What's your housing stipend?

It's, they give me $2,200 and I believe $75, and they take $2,000 out for rent. Can you just use that for? your mortgage? I can, but then I won't, I can't, I have to find somewhere else to live here. And I can't go into the barracks because I can either live in the barracks or I can get BAH, which is the money for a housing. Yeah. So I can't pay for those places. I missed it. Where's your, where's your house that you own? Tennessee. Okay, you got to put that on the market today because you're broke. Well, you don't have anything. There's, there's no well to it, brother. You can't afford it? You got to sell your cars. You see, well, we have, we have three vehicles. We have two

paid off vehicles and one that's not paid off. It's a 2021, I owe $30,000 on it. What's it worth? What's it worth? It Kelly Blue looks for $40,000. Then sell it today. Right. And then you pocket $10,000 and are the other two cars driveable? Yes, the other two cars are driving. Okay, that's great. bit older. That's fine. That's fine. Yeah. So that. And then Kevin, for the home, let's just pretend John's world is reality, because I think it is what he just painted you, was this of selling the house, how much would you guys walk away with because of equity in the home in Tennessee? If you were to sell it today versus what you owe, what would you walk away with? Well, I built the home myself when I was 18. I started it at 18. It's a barn dominium. And the living quarters was done and all of that. But

it's not fully finished. And that's why selling it might not be a good move because if I did sell it, I'm not even sure if I can get what I owe out of it because it's not fully finished. Because it's not finished. I owe 200 and 12,000. When are you going to finish it? Well, I was hoping to take leave and to hear them the next few months and go home and finish it. But that leaves me with, I have right now 30,000 in the bank.

I also have a motorcycle that is paid for, and it's worth around $10,000 as well. So I could probably, if I sold that, I might be able to come up with $45 or $50. Okay, so if you sell the car, you get $10,000 from that, sell the motorcycle $10,000. You have $30,000 in the bank, yes, that puts you at $50,000. Do you have any other consumer debt, Kevin? any student loans, credit card debt, personal loans, anything? I do not, no. Okay.

Just my mortgage. And you guys are $1,000 in the hole every month is what you're telling me with this mortgage. Yes. Okay. And why did your wife, why did she stop working? Was she, like, severely ill from the pregnancy? Well, that originally, yes. But then we actually moved from, she moved from Tennessee.

to here in Colorado. Okay. And when is she do? She has a softer job. She is due in September. Okay. I mean, it sounds harsh, Kevin. I mean, I worked up into 38 weeks.

And if she's medically able to versus like on bed rest or something from like a medical perspective, she needs to be working. She needs to be at a coffee shop. She needs to be at, I don't care where it is because you guys need a thousand dollars a month. And she could bring that. She could bring that for the foreseeable future until she has the baby. And then in September, you guys got to look up and say, okay, we got to figure out how we're going to get a thousand dollars. Because you can't stay in this and you can't keep grabbing from your 50,000.

If you do that, it's obviously eventually, it's going to be, yeah, it's going to be gone. When do you, what's your mortgage payment every month? It is 1,500 even. Okay. I'm just telling you what I would do if I was in your seat. Money's just getting thrown. Yeah. Brother, like, you're in a very solvable problem.

The challenge before you is, and I'm going to use this word to be provocative, okay, but you have a fantasy about your life. And it feels good to have, always have this place in Tennessee that one day I'm going to dot, dot, dot, dot. And then one day after that, I'm going to dot, dot, dot. What I want to do is bring you out of that picture you've painted for yourself down the road into your current situation right now. you happen to be sitting on a couple of lottery tickets, a $10,000 one that you sell a motorcycle, a $10,000 when you sell a car, and you got a new baby coming, and you live on base.

And, like, I would take $20,000 and pay somebody in Tennessee to come finish this place out and put on the market and pocket $200,000 in equity. It's a great point, Kevin, to listen to John in that because the 18-year-old, that was two years ago, before you were married in the army and a baby in a baby on the way. Yeah, it's a different life. Your life has changed, Kevin. And the sooner you can reach that reality, the more stability you're going to create financially in your family.

But as you continue to hold on to this 18-year-old and the dream that he had, you're going to continue to feel this force, this tug a pool in your heart when it comes to your finances. And it's not worth it. And you can always go and do something great. It's not like you can never have a foreign denial. Let me just tell you, dude, I've got a place on some land.

in Tennessee. And actually it's being worked on right now, Rachel Cruz's husband is working on it. Like he's the GC. He's the GC on it. And it's awesome. And it took me 20 years later than I thought it was going to. And let me tell you, it's awesome. And the best part, it's mine. And nobody can take it from me. Statistics show that half of Americans don't have enough life insurance or they don't have any at all. I don't understand this, John. Why don't people want to? want to take care of their family. They think they're going to die or something? Well, I used to be one of those guys. I didn't even think about it. And one of my buddies said, hey, the only reason to not have life insurance is if you hate your wife and kids. And I immediately

went and got term life insurance. That's a gut punch. And oh, you're telling me, and for decades, Dave, I've sat across people who've lost a spouse. They've lost somebody important to them. Me too. They don't know what to do next. Me too. I mean, you're going to have a crisis here. And, you know, you got two options while you're sitting and talking to a young widow. She's concerned about how she's going to invest all this money properly and not mess this up, or she's concerned how she's going to eat tomorrow. That's exactly right. These are the two options.

Take care of your dadgum family, man. Term life insurance can replace income, pay of dads, cover funeral expenses, so your family can actually have the opportunity to just be sad, to just miss you. That's exactly what it's supposed to be. It's saying, I love you to your family. Term life insurance. Jeff Zander and the team of Zander Insurance makes it easy and affordable. I've used them personally for 25 years.

they're the only people I trust. Go to Xander.com or call 800-356-42-82. Up next in Indianapolis, we have Grants on the line. Hi, Grant. Welcome to the show. Hi, how are you? Hi, we're doing great. How can we help today?

So recently I have gone to a bit of debt because of online blackjack. And I was curious what's the best way to go. about a mindset shift and the best way to attack this debt. It's a lot. That's a growing, yeah, a growing thing that we're saying is online gambling whether it's sports or not. How much debt is it? It's around 13,000 in credit cards. I also owe 5,000 on a car and 2,000 in a personal loan.

Okay. Are you married? I'm not. I'm single. Okay. How old are you, brother? I am 23. Okay.

I don't think a mindset shift is going to help you here. And I'm going to tell you, like, I'm biased, okay? I'm just watching online gambling destroy a generation of men, especially young men. And when I say destroy, I'm not saying that, I'm not saying that flippantly. It's melting people. And so I, it, it, you know, it. You used to have to go to Vegas to gamble. You used to have to, it's like you can just get cocaine in your pocket now, right?

And so I would at 23, if you were my friend, if you were my son, I would tell you to go see, go to Gamble is anonymous. Go to a meeting and start treating this as seriously as I think you should. Yeah, no. Definitely had a lot of family and friends be there for me, but they're not experts. Yeah. They keep telling me the same thing. Yeah.

And if those closest to you love you enough to say, hey, you need to go see somebody or you need to go get a handle on this thing, then let them love you in that way. And we could spend a whole one-hour show, a whole three-hour show on the ins and outs of addiction. Just know this. I like, when I'm watching the fights with my buddies, I like, I'll put five bucks on this guy. I like that. It's fun. And when Rachel and I go to Vegas, like, I like to go to Blackjack. tables and stuff like that. I intentionally don't have it on my phone because the folks who make

those apps, they're better than me. They just are. And they know how to hook you. They're designed to keep you on them. They're designed to incentivize you to never put them down. And now with prop bets, man, you know this. It never ends. Yeah. Right. So all I'll let's say is a ton and so I lost it all. Yeah. And you're up, just knowing you're up against a machine that is designed. designed to eat your soul. And when you when you recognize that, I mean, that's one of the 12 steps. I'm powerless, right? I can't, I can't defeat you. So I can't go to this bar anymore. The problem is the bar is in your pocket now. And so deleting all the apps today, getting this debt squared up, and then go into a gambler's anonymous meetings and make it a regular part of your

life for a season. It won't be forever, but make it a regular part of your life for a season and begin to answer the question, what am I trying to distract myself from? right why am I not okay in my own skin and the pathway through that is honesty and openness in front of other people and there's no hack around that right right grant how much um from the just the financial side I'm curious how much do you make a year uh I make 68,000 I'm an accountant okay um and you have 5,000 on your car is the personal loan was that, did you take that out and use for gambling too or was that for something else in life? That was telling me paying my rent this month because it got that bad.

Okay, gotcha, yep. So I'm wondering from the financial aspect and John obviously can talk so much about that addiction side, which actually I kind of want to loop back to in a little bit, John, but for you, Grant's what it would look like to get a handle and some quick wins financially in the positive realm, because it's been such a negative connotation with your money with all this debt and the stress that this whole gambling world has caused, that I'm wondering some quick wins for you financially and how that's going to, I think, give you some confidence of moving, at least in the right direction, right? Some of that action, because it is, you have to change, obviously, and be aware and all that

with the addiction side. But I also think like, right, some positive movements going forward. So I think getting on a detailed budget and I think cutting some things out lifestyle-wise just to get some margin this month because to pay your rents, right? Just to get your head above water, I think it's going to be really good. And then start paying off some of this debt. And maybe you're working extra.

You're working weekends. You're working nights. But you're really shifting your energy towards the positive side of financial. which is actually going to look more sacrificial. The positive brings the sacrifice. But I want that for you. I want you to get ahead of this from the financial aspects, you know, as you kind of tackle the, that emotional side of it, John's, because we see this grant. You're not alone. The growing from like the sports betting to the gambling, I mean, all of it. It has grown so much because of all line. And what, like, I know there's probably not one source, but what would you say for people listening, John, that are just like grants? Like, what is that? What is that? thing. Is it that, yeah, you're just not comfortable in your own skin. You're having to find excitement somewhere else. It's going sideways. Like, what's the... I think it's a... And Grant, jump in here if any of this doesn't sound honest, okay? It doesn't sound right to you. But Rachel, I think we're at this weird apex of humanity, if you will, where we don't have to solve for

basic things anymore. And there's a sense of aliveness that has left all of our bodies, right? I hear this a lot with married couples who would classify themselves, not in a great but in a fine or good marriage and somebody has an affair yeah and what they always come back is I felt alive again I felt 22 again and so instead of doing the hard work of asking yourself what makes me feel alive in my day in and day out and by the way none of us are going to feel alive 24 7 365 but right right we have a culture where we just like grant graduated from college got his first accounting job goes to work comes home goes to work comes home and And you begin to just get that, your life gets gray.

And then all of a sudden, there's like a, there's a hit over here. That's right. You have this excitement. And then so this, this crossroads here of all of us are dead in our own skin. And then you throw into, well, I'll solve it, right? We don't, we have an allergy to boredom. We have an allergy to routine. And then now we got these magic wands in our pocket, man, that can take us on any ride.

Pornography, dating, swipe rights to online gambling. and it's just, it's destroying us, right? Does that ring a bell, grant? No, that sounds 100%. I mean, I would say it started out with kind of what you were saying earlier. I like to throw five bucks on the fights. Yeah. It's just something I like to do.

And then got my first job and then we just wrapped up the business season, obviously, with tech season wrapping up. And it was just go to work, 10 hours, come home. Yeah. And then eat food, go to bed. Yeah, and you get on that repeat cycle. Yeah. One of the paths out for you, and by the way, this is a nightmare.

I'm not saying it's going to be easy, is I want you to start being intentional about making some friends, some real. And I'm in my 40s, and I've had to go do this as a discipline. I'm going to go put myself in situations where I'm going to be other people in the real world doing real life things. and not sitting around singing kumbaya on a coffee shop, that's what I'm talking about, but like something silly, like I'm going to join a bowling league, or I'm going to go do Toastmasters,

or I'm going to start a Saturday lawn business with a kind of a friend, and we're going to become friends, but you've got to put yourself, I'm going to join a softball league, I'm going to go to a comedy club, like I'm going to do something where I have to rub shoulders

and do a thing with other people because the days for you as a 23-year-old, your whole life has been curated from the time you're in kindergarten to middle school to high school. And then in college, you were with the people in your own major. And then you graduate, man. You walk across that stage. And now it's you versus everybody for the rest of your life.

And you can just go into your one-bedroom apartment. And, man, life gets real isolated real fast. That's right. So, man, we're going to hook you up with the every dollar app. And it's a budgeting tool. I think it's the best one out there. But it's a tool that you can use to get a handle on your money on a daily basis, on a weekly basis, a monthly basis, and beyond.

And then, yeah, be real brave today and make a call and go to a meeting this evening and then get up early tomorrow and go to another meeting in the morning. And today's day one, brother. If you run a business, you already know this. Bad information leads to bad decisions. And right now, AI is everywhere. But AI is only as good as the data behind it.

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That's netsuite.com slash Ramsey. Are you sick and tired of working so hard, but having nothing to show for it? Well, that is normal. And you guys, normal sucks, you know? Being normal in America today with your mind. money, it's broke. It's paycheck to paycheck. And we don't want that for you because you don't have to live that way. And our every dollar budget app helps you find extra money every single month and build you a personal plan to beat debt and build wealth. And in just 15 minutes through some of the

questions kind of investigating your life, if you will, you can find thousands of hidden in hidden margin. So you will feel like you got a raise. We are here to help expose not only your financial habits, but also places that you can save money so that you can find margins so that you can get out of the paycheck-to-paycheck cycle. So don't live normal when you can live like no one else. So start every dollar for free in the app store or Google Play. All right, let's go to Elizabeth in Hartford, Connecticut. Hi, Elizabeth. Welcome to the show. Hi, how are you? Hi, we're doing good. How can we help today? So I recently got married and we actually found out that we are expecting a baby at the end of December. Oh, congratulations. Christmas baby.

But it's thrown a big wrench in things because we were on this debt payoff journey. And unfortunately, now we're going to have a lot of expenses that's going to eat up a lot of our income. So currently, my husband and I make about $170,000 combined per year. And luckily, I just landed another job which in a few months it's going to bump me up about $17,000 extra, which is great. But we have about $189,000 in debt, about $24,000 in credit, about $17,000 in car loan and about $150,000 in student loans. Okay. What's your degree in?

I have a master's in business administration. So right now, on paper, it looks really good that we make decent money, but our minimum debt payment and our bills alone per month eat up about $5,500. And now, even though I'm getting this extra raise by the end of the year, I don't have the ability to kind of stay home. So we also have to add in average daycare costs per month for a newborn where I live is about $2,600 a month. Yeah. That we're going to have to add in along with other, you know, costs for the child and groceries, which then decreases our amount that we have left over per month.

Yep. Which usually we put towards debt. So now it's kind of, my husband and I are, you know, in a spot where we're not really, we don't really, know what to do. We're not agreeing. It seems like a really bad time to have a baby. And we just don't know what to do. Yeah. It's an awesome, awesome time to have a baby. Okay. I'm serious. It's awesome. Yeah. And I know it's scary. It's awesome. Okay. I was going to say we don't ever stop anyone from getting married or having babies. The debt stuff is important. Don't get me wrong. No, no, I hear you though. But you're also like, wow, that, that paused the plans that we were so

debt set on. Okay, what was, because it sounds like you guys were on track, as you said, you were in, quote, unquote, the journey before you even thought that you were pregnant. Had you guys estimated a calendar date when you would be debt-free when all $189,000 was going to be paid off? Well, my husband was using that every dollar app very religiously. So he's kind of, he was kind of more in tune with our debt payoff. Okay. But obviously some things came unexpected, which, you know, unfortunately we had to put certain expenses on a credit card, which increased the balance again. And sometimes it just seems we take five steps forward and then ten steps back. Let me challenge you on that.

What happened that a couple making $170,000 had to solve right away via credit card? Like, why did we have to put something on a credit card? Yeah, what happened that popped out of nowhere that you'll have to solve right away? We had an unexpected lawyer cost for a custody disagreement with my son and my ex-husband. Okay. So how much money was that? $4,000. Okay.

What I would love y'all to wrap your head around is this idea that we never borrow money, period. And here's what that means for y'all. That means you get a bill and you say, cool, next month, we're not going to send any over-overage to debt. And we're going to take the $5,000 extra or the $7,500 extra, and we're going to pay this off next month. Okay. But what, like, changing your psychology around it, because for y'all, $4,000 is not an emergency because you can solve it next month. Right? And you would have got a 30 days past due notice and a threat, right?

And y'all would have written a check and when you would have moved on your life. But psychologically, y'all, it feels like you went 100 steps back. Mm-hmm. I agree. So saying I'm never going to borrow money again, it keeps you calm when the world throws stuff at you. Because you're like, well, that's not an option for us. So I can pay you $2,000 this month and I'll pay $2,000 next month and we'll be good. Right?

You get what I'm getting at. Not to throw a Dave story in here, Elizabeth. But I remember dad talking, and he used to say this in the old FPUs that they would, when him and mom went bankrupt. And it was like, well, right before, actually. But they would draw a line or write out everything. And when the money ran out, a big red line went across the, you know, the yellow pad. and he was like, and I knew that X, Y, and Z creditors, when we call on, and he's like, and I would just answer, and they would just yell and yell. And he's like, I have no money to pay you. You can call me next month and we can have this discussion, but I have no money. Like, it was that like, I know people are going to be pissed and people are going to threaten and whatever, whatever, but we are not borrowing money. And so it does. It forces this. You just slow down.

Yes, this kind of extremeness. And then what I think it does to Elizabeth in some cases, force. versus some level of creativity where the credit card there's no that's not creative it's just sitting there and you can just use it right but it's actually like

oh crap well is there something we can sell could you do X, Y and Z overtime it actually forces you to come up with solutions and so there's a there's a mentality there that John is spot on. Can I ask you a question Elizabeth and I want you to say no

you've missed the mark completely and I'm all good okay is there any of this with the divorce from the past quote unquote, and I'm saying this in air quotes, your student loans, and now, quote unquote, you're pregnant. Are you feeling some guilt here? Because if you are, I want you to let that go.

Yeah, I don't really feel guilt as much because, don't get me wrong, I used to be a compulsive spender, so I've been able to pay off like $70,000 in credit card debt over the last couple year. Oh my gosh, great job. So my husband is really kind of because he is very, follows Dave Ramsey to a T, listens every day, wants to follow the steps, and I'm kind of adjusting my way into this.

And now we're at this point where we were getting on a little, you know, we're going on our journey and then all of a sudden something gets thrown into it that kind of, we don't really know how to navigate it. Straight through it. Yeah. And Elizabeth, he'll know this if he's like an avid listener, because we talk about this a lot, that when you are pregnant and you are specifically on baby step two, you're paying off debt, because if you're doing it, you have $1,000 and that's it.

But if you are expecting a baby, we call it stork mode, where you do want to put cash aside to have a bigger emergency fund during this. And some people have a dollar amount they go to and they go back to the baby step. Some people just take the whole pregnancy and just stockpile money. And then when baby's here and you're good and baby's good, they take all that money and throw it at the debt and just pay off a ton, you know, within that next month. So depending on what you guys are going to do. want to do, but I will tell you, you guys need some savings, though, for this, for this pregnancy.

Yeah, we only have the $1,000 in our emergency fund right now. So that's going to be your goal, I think. And you guys can, again, you can pick a number that you want to have, or, you know, again, or you just say, yeah, between now and the rest of the year, we're just going to stockpile money on the side. We're good with that. And then you press play to pay everything off. You just have to promise you will not go buy a brand new minivan with $50,000. Yeah, even my husband is like, maybe we should sell. our car, maybe we should do this. I'm like, okay, let's, you know what?

Get some background. I don't think it's as dire as you think it is, even close. I think this was just an adjustment to your picture that y'all had. Yeah, but hey, if he could get 23 for the $17,000 car, sell it and go buy a $5,000. I take $17,000, right? I mean, there are some moves, Elizabeth, you guys can do to make some big progress. But I can tell you from a lady that's been pregnant to a lady that is pregnant, having some cash above $1,000 is going to be going to bring you some peace.

and then I think that's going to put you more on that journey to pay this off and attack it. But I'm glad you guys are working together and yeah, and that you're quote unquote adjusting to the Ramsey way. I like that. This show is sponsored by BetterHelp. All right, May is Mental Health Awareness Month. And according to the National Institute of Mental Health,

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Go to betterhelp.com slash Ramsey to get 10% off your first month. That's BetterHelp. H-E-L-L-P.com. slash Ramsey. All right, let's go to Jim in Phoenix, Arizona. Hi, Jim. Welcome to the show. Hi, thank you for taking my call.

I have a question for you guys. I've been working the baby steps. I went through a divorce about five years ago. I racked up some debt, and I am about a month away from being able to pay off the last of my consumer debt. Oh, wow. Congratulations, Jim. Thank you.

And, you know, now that the light is kind of at the end of the tunnel, my ex-wife just notified me that she's moving out of county. It's about an hour and a half away, one way. We have 50-50 custody right now. And her plan is to commute the kids back and forth, which it's not really going to work. That's a lot of time for them to spend in a car every day. And so I've been looking for legal advice. and every attorney I talk to wants a retainer. You know, I have my $1,000, and I just don't, you know, they're all telling me they accept credit cards.

I don't know how to pay for this. I don't know how to navigate it. I don't feel like it's not like I'm buying a new car or something. I just don't know what to do. Yeah. Yeah, I would let them know your situation. How long would it take you to get $5,000 bucks? So right now I've been saving about $1,000 a month.

Okay. that's been going towards your debt it's all been going towards the debt yeah yeah so you about a thousand dollars okay how fast is she going to be doing this move do you know uh yeah it's going to be within the month um school is just ending yeah and she's also quitting her job to live with a live in boyfriend and requesting an increase in child support yeah who um the best option i could give you is to sit down with an attorney and say, kind of tell them what you're doing. And that you're, I mean, literally say the words, I'm paying off my debts from my last thing from my,

from a, I'm on the Ramsey plan. And most of the time, they'll roll their eyes or they'll laugh. And you could say, here's my pay stubs. I'll get you paid. But this is time sensitive. But man, I mean, I'm just telling you as a dad, I would go to the ends of the earth to keep this from happening. So as a guy who's sitting in the Ramsey chair right here, I wouldn't beat you up if you went over to a credit union to pay that.

I can't tell anybody to borrow money, just because it's got so many downstream consequences, but someone's trying to take your kids. Someone's trying to break the law and take your kids. And there is an entry fee to that. Because I know every state is different, right? But county to county, you can't do that, right? I mean, is she violating the divorce decree?

So the divorce decree did say that we're not supposed to move out of county without notifying the other parent, which she did. And it's not so much that she's an unfit parent. It's just that that's a huge burden to put on the kids, especially with moving one of them's in high school. And the other one is starting junior high school. Yeah. Would you be willing to take 100% custody? I would be willing, yes. Okay.

Because I'm just wondering when you get a lawyer on your side, is there going to be something? something that they can do, you know what I mean? Or like, is it in the divorce decree that it's like, well, there's nothing, there's nothing legally that you can do. Yeah. Or is there? That's my question. We had agreed on custody. So that part of it was was pretty amicable during the divorce. But now it just doesn't seem like a real, a real possibility with that much distance between us. Sure. Do you have anybody, and I'm always, again, I live in such a gonzo world, brother, that most of the people I sit down and talk to, whether in my personal life or on my show, like, it's because they're in a tough season.

Something bad has happened. But man, there's the data on living boyfriends and kids is no bueno, right? So you'd have a case to fight it, what you're saying. I would, I'd fight it to the ends of the earth. When you've sat down with attorneys and discussed them taking you on, have they told you you have a shot or not? Most attorneys will be honest with you. I have been told that they think I have a really strong case

and that's immediately followed by we need 5,000 now in another 2,030 days. Yeah, that's usually what I hear is a $5,000 retainer. Do you have a friend that can write a letter just to stop the move at this point or no? No, she's actually already moved most of her stuff. I was sort of the last one to find out about it, except I had a heads up from the kids. Okay. And so I have you told her I'm going to go fight this in court? I haven't.

She expressed that she wants to try to do it outside of court, but provided that she gets an increase in support. Yeah, but she's not, I mean, she's trying to hold you hostage and that's not going to fly. Yes. Yeah, she's living in a fantasy world. Are you all able to sit down and have coffee? Actually, you know what? I wouldn't do that. I would send it via email.

I would keep all my communication in writing. Okay. But I would let her know the terms or, and I would put what she has asked you for. You're trying to get an increase in child support for, to trade an increase in child of money for me to have time with my kids, and I reject that. And you didn't give me due notice of when you were moving out. And I, like, I would put all that in writing and let her know that you're contacting an attorney and to hold tight.

Okay. Yeah. Yeah, you're not crazy, brother. No. And especially when it comes to our kids, it's like a child that's sick or something. You're going to do whatever you can to help your child. Right? I mean, like there's, there are those moments. Yeah. So I would say fight the fight. The only, if there was a word of caution, and it's only because we've seen and taken these calls on the other side that people fight in court. And specifically with divorce, not always just custody things. And it's a four-year-long thing. And they pay. you know, hundreds of thousands of dollars out and they end up losing it, whatever it is, right? And there's like, there can be an endless cycle in the legal world with fees and attorneys.

But if she's quitting her job and moving into somebody with somebody who has no rent and asking you for an increase, she doesn't have any money either, does she? No. She will have none and she's going to be totally reliant on this guy that she's not married to. And I wonder what happens the first time they have a fight. Of course. 100%. Yeah. And it's not a stable home for your kids.

Of course. and you know that, but she doesn't have $500,000 to fight you. To keep you in court is what you mean. Yeah. Yeah. That's a good point. So her family does have money and I've had people tell me you don't need an attorney for this. You can do this on your own and that was my plan initially but I realize I'm so emotionally like involved in this.

I just don't know if that's a good idea or not to try to do it on my own. I just know too many trust. I know too many of my personal friends who've gotten burned trying to do things on their own and I know too many great attorneys who make it their life's a mission to take care of people in your exact situation

someone who's getting taken advantage of and the kids are the fulcrum of that taking advantage and man they just make it their life's mission to make sure kids are taken care of and that's what you're trying to do here I don't even hear one ounce of vindictiveness

in your spirit I hear you want to take care of your kids and yeah Jim do you think if I mean now I'm just I feel invested in this story If you push her from a legal standpoint or if you chose outside legal counsel, would she give you majority custody, do you think, to keep the kids close to their school and from a lifestyle perspective?

Or do you think she'll fight you on that? I think it's money is her motivation right now. And I don't even want anything from her. I just want the kids. Yeah, absolutely. But it doesn't make any sense that she's trying to bargain with her kids and try to give you more time with them. but she wants money. Like that doesn't make sense.

Yeah, and the kids have also expressed to her that they don't want to go there and she tells them she doesn't care. Yeah, of course. Yeah, brother, I would sit down with an attorney with somebody that you've got some friends or colleagues that have used in the past that has a good reputation for being trustworthy

and not just trustworthy that they're going to fight for you, but trustworthy, they'll look you in the eye and say, hey, brother, I don't think you have a case. And the best attorneys I've ever sat down with have said, I don't want to take your money because you're not going to win here. And I always really appreciate that. But yeah, again, I'm just telling you dad to dad and Rachel as a parent.

Like, we'd go to the ends of the earth for our kids. For sure. And Jim, I think it's so wise on your part, so self-aware to be like, I'm so emotional right now that I don't think I could probably make great decisions. I need help. I need someone. And that's what we talk about. It's like, where can you outsource people that you trust to help you in situations? Financial and otherwise.

Yep. And I'm assuming, by the way, I'm assuming that you're working this, this. Ramsey planned to a T and that you've sold everything you can sell. If I had guitars, if I had a car in the garage, if I had a writing alum, I'd sell everything I had. Yep. To avoid going into debt. But, yeah. Jim, you're a good dad.

You're a good man, brother. Yep. Call us back if you need us, but we'll be praying for you guys. Yep. And pray that it works out for you. Hey guys, health care is one of the biggest stress points in your budget. It's confusing. And most of the time, it feels completely out of your control.

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Go to CHMinstries.org slash budget and use promo code Ramsey. That's CH Ministries.org slash budget and use promo code Ramsey. Welcome back to The Ramsey Show in the Fairwinds Credit Union Studio. I am Rachel Cruz hosting with Dr. John Deloney this hour. So give us a call at AAA 825-5-225. All right, let's go to Daniel in Los Angeles. Hi, Daniel. Welcome to the show.

Hi, how's it going? Hi, doing great. How can we help today? Question. I'm 54, my wife's 53. You need some hope here. We want to buy a home. Business is bad right now.

We got about $31, $32,000 in debt. Income's not coming in the way used to come in. And so we're just looking for some hope. You know, being 54 and 53, we really want to buy a home and be able to retire with some wealth. Yeah. What do you do for a living road? It's really tough right now.

I'm in the commercial truck business. I saw commercial trucks, and right now it's slow. Typically, it's a very, very, very good business. I'm talking about making over $300,000 a year. But right now I'm at about 108 after taxes, I mean before taxes. And it's really expensive to live in L.A., California. Yeah. And my, my, my, my, uh, my, uh, my, uh,

outgo on a monthly basis about eight grand a month and, uh, towards what? It's expensive. I'm sorry? What do you spend an eight grand a month on? Uh, car payment, uh, rent, uh, life insurances for, uh, being my wife, my daughter, uh, car insurance, fuel, um, food, um, all the household necessities. It's about eight grand a month. What's your total? What's your total debt load? 31, 32. Just on credit cards? No, no. What's the car? Is it 32? It's all just in car? It's 28 in car and then a medical bill. That's about $3,000 right now. Okay. If you sold your car,

what would you get for it, private party? I have no idea. It's a 2023 Dodge Durango. I have no idea to be honest I think we checked I don't know to be honest you have never checked You're probably upside down on it Yeah I think we are And I know I think we're going to turn around

With commercial truck business But It's just bad right now You know Yeah well yeah let me ask you that Is there talk in your industry Is there writing on the wall here Or is it just with all the stuff going on overseas

And the Every business like know is talking about how AI is going to impact them and gas prices. Is that what's contracting your business right now? No, AI doesn't affect us. I mean, we're, you know, we deal directly where it's, it's, I deal directly with businesses, with business people. It's just the market right now. It's just that coming out of COVID, it's been really, really bad. But that was that was five years ago. Yeah. And that's what I mean. Since coming out of COVID, it's been really, really bad. During COVID, it was really, really good. And we just haven't been able to,

turn around. You know, I mean, I do have my customers that call me. Here's my big question then. As a 53-year-old, what I don't want you doing is waking up and being 58 and saying, it's going to turn around. When you had a chance at 53 to sit down on your wife and say, hey, we have some hard choices to make. A, do we have to live in one of the most expensive places on the planet? And not only is expensive just to live there, but then they also take half your paycheck every month. Mm-hmm. Do we want to stick in this business and keep riding it out? 108,000. So if you're at 108 at this, you know, in the middle of Q2 or at the beginning of Q2,

you're going to end up at 200 for the year. That's still a great salary. It's just an adjustment from what you were making. No, no, it's 108. It's 108 period for the year. Yeah. So you've lost two thirds of your salary. What the thing is, I moved from the old dealership I was at.

I'm in a new dealership managing that at the commercial department. and so I required them to give me a guarantee of $12,000 a month for the first six months, and then the remaining six months after that $6,000 a month. And then, you know, above that, my commission a percentage of what I require. But here's what I'm saying. You're a good salesman. And if you know how to be a good salesman and you know how to lead salesman, you're going to have a job anywhere.

But your job and your particular thing that you're selling is you're going to be down two-thirds. And if you've been struggling for five years, I'm just telling you, as a guy, You're older than me, but not by a lot. The hope is decreasing. Yeah, it's a time to sit down and have a really hard conversation and say, do we want to move to Texas where we don't have any state income tax? We're going to move to Tennessee or Nevada somewhere. And we're going to...

It's very hard to do because we have a special needs child. That's what I'm asking. That's what I'm asking. Who lives with my in-laws, who live in-laws, they raised them. My wife, when she was there, she was unresponsible, didn't take care of her son. My in-laws are aging so bad. They still watch them, but eventually... probably in about a year or two.

They're not going to go to watch them. So Daniel, so I think what's hard is what John's saying is if you keep doing what you've been doing, you're going to keep getting what you've been getting. And you just don't want to look up three, four, five years down the road and you're in the exact same position financially where you're not able to buy a home. And so if our goal is to get our head above water financially, if our goal is to be homeowners, if our goal is to retire with dignity, then at your age, you guys got about 10 years, right, 10 to 15, depending on if you can work even longer, to say, we got to, we got to figure, okay, so we got to figure this out. So if there are some non-negotiables, that's fine, right? There's a non-negotiable. We're not going to move is what I just heard you say. So like, as much as John and I would convince you to X, Y, and Z, you're like, nope, we're not. Okay. Then what are some other negotiables? I mean, I tried doing Kelly Blue Book for you, Daniel, and I made me enter my email and all this stuff. I don't know how many mileagees were on your gerango. I was like, dad gummit. I wish I could find the price for you.

Because honestly, the last six months or so people calling on the show, unless you rolled over negative equity, we actually are seeing some people are like, no, I owe 23, but I can sell it for 30. I mean, you may be, I don't know, but look and see, hey, if I am even 3,000, 4,000 underwater, you can go get a loan for 8,000 at the credit union, sell the car, go buy a $4,000 car, and get rid of $28,000 of debt. Like, there's some moves you can make that can be very significant for you guys, Daniel. I mean, you guys are paycheck to paycheck, and a car payment freed up is what? How much do you pay on the car per month? 800 bucks. Yeah. That's pretty nice to get that back in your pocket when you say.

Yeah. Yeah, it would. And Daniel, think about this. I'm going to round the math off. Okay. Can I, can I add? Yeah, go for it. I am extremely good at what I do.

I mean, very good. Of course. But right now it's just bad. However, and this is not, it's kind of sad. I mean, obviously we had eaten fires here a few years ago in California, and that's going to start picking up the market because of the fact that contractors just start buying trucks and vans, you know, for, because it's going to start rebuilding. They're already rebuilding.

So I know that'll affect the business in a positive way, but I'm just so frustrated, angry. Okay, but you got to act. You know, you've got to act. All right. And so, like, I can't get, I can't motivate you. You have to decide you want a different kind of life. And let's run the math out. I'm going to, I'm going to round the numbers off.

But let's say you work for 15 more years and you make a hundred grand. You're going to have $1.5 million. $750,000 and that's going to go to the state of California. And 750 are going to be in your pocket to spend how you want to. If that's okay with you, then so be it. What are y'all going to do with that 750 grand? I don't want the, I want more. Okay.

And Michael Phelps is a great swimmer, but if I throw him in the middle of a raging river, it doesn't do him any good. You can be the best person at your job, but if the market's gone, the market's gone. So take those skills and have the courage to go somewhere else. You only have hard choices ahead of you. Make the hard choices that are going to get you where you want to be. Like sell the car, like reduce spending, like get a new job possibly. As a mom, I plan for everything.

I plan the budgets, snacks, lunches, backup outfits in the car for the unexpected. I mean, everything. Because moms handle a million details every day. So don't skip one of the biggest ones. What happens to your family if you're not there tomorrow? You guys, a lot of people put off making a will because it can feel a little scary. But here's what we all need to realize. Planning for the future isn't fear.

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So go to mama bearlegalforms.com and use promo code Ramsey to save 20%. Mamabearlegal forms.com code Ramsey. Next up we have Cecil in Augusta. Cecil. Cecil? Cecil? What I say, Cecil? Cecil, I'm so sorry.

Yes, hello. Hey, what's up, man? Um Okay, Cecile, can I just say Can I defend myself for not reading it correctly? Rachel read your name as Cecil. Because I literally was just having dinner with friends and their daughter. That is her name.

And so we were talking. So when I saw it, I just went to there. I'm sorry. Forgive me. It's cool. Cecil. Cecil, I'm sorry. You're a dude from Augusta.

Hooked on phonics did not work for Rachel. I'm talking to you. I got it. Whatever. So what's up, brother? So, um, Recently, I've had a very large string of unfortunate situations. My income has gone down drastically, and my expenses have gone up drastically.

And I'm just drowning, and I don't know what to do. So what happened with your income? So I did a lot of sidework on the like DoorDash as well as I did a lot of just paying and help. people in my area and recently with the gas prices and other things I had to slow that down. Okay. And as soon as I slow that down and my income starts getting lower as well as some changes at my primary job where my income dropped significantly. What happened there? Oh.

Hey, Ciesel, can you speak directly? your phone, maybe step to where we can hear you a little bit better. Cut in a little bit. Okay. I had to take a class for my work, and I get a differential based on the weekends, and my income went down by maybe $800 every two weeks. Did you fail the class? No, I passed the class, but the class isn't going to upgrade my income at all,

and I'm out of it now, but that led to the downgrade. just while you're in the class, but now you're out of the class. Can it go back up $800? It has gone back up $800, but the rest of it has gone down, and also my car has gone out, so I can't even do the sides even a little. Okay. What do you do for a job? I work as a CNA. As a C&A? Like a nursing assistant. Oh, okay, okay. A certified nursing assistant.

My guess is that there's a market for that. Could you go get another job somewhere else? Unfortunately, not without my car. I have rides to my weekends because I only need a certain amount. I pretty much work 17-hour shifts Saturday and Sunday. Okay. And then just one eight-hour during the week. Okay.

What are you doing the rest of the week? the rest of the week I am doing school work I am in college to change my career into accounting okay how much school do you have left I just started okay how old are you I'm 21 okay um I don't think you can afford to go to school I think you have to I think you have to be working 40 hours or you go or you go at night and it takes you a little bit longer um But you got to put the hour. And I know you're putting the hours in on weekends, but the formula you have laid out for us. And what it sounds like is without door dashing or having a side hustle, you're not able to pay your bills.

Is that correct? I'm able to pay my bills, but the problem is my car has gone out. Your car's gone out. What does that mean with your car went out? I'm a mechanic also on the side. and it's something that I don't even know. It's a head gasket leak, but there's also something else going on. Have you gotten an opinion?

Yes, I have. I have gotten a couple. How much have they quoted you? Anywhere from three grand to six. Three grand to six. Okay. Okay. And you don't have a car right now is what you're saying.

No. Okay. And it's not running. at all. It's just, it's done. It's done. I can't even make it anywhere. How much money do you have on the side? If you're making all your payments and stuff, how much money do you have, saved up? I don't have anything saved up. I have a string of separate emergencies from health care.

Okay. Yeah, I mean, what I mean, at this point, it's, it's extreme enough that I'm like, all right, do you move in with family? to save on rent. Or do you bring it to and from? Bring in a roommate, Uber to and from work. It's going to cost you your first hour of work there

and your first hour of work home, that's six hours in between. And if you're working 60 hours a week, you know what I mean? Like you could, this will shift pretty quickly. I just think you're just trying to do too many things at once and you're not able to get ahead.

And so something has to give right now. So I would do, if you can do school at night, don't go into student loan debt though. But if you're able to cash, flow it through school, do it at night, or press pause on accounting for now, get your head above water, get an emergency fund, get a car that is running, and then out of a place of strength, make a change in a career or to, you know, for school. But it doesn't sound like you're in a place to do that. You need to be working 60 to 70 hours. And again, yep, if that's an Uber to and from

until you save that, it may take you a month or two. Or to pay a coworker five bucks to come pick you up and drop you off or whatever, pitching on gas or something. Yeah, absolutely. And Rachel, we're getting this, we're getting calls a lot over the last six weeks, maybe the last three or four months,

where people want a certain thing to be and it's not. And I've been there myself, you've been there, I want so badly for the car just to turn on, it's not. Or I want so badly to get a degree and get out of this current job I'm in, but I can't.

Or I want this, but this is, And I feel like so many people right now across the country are just stuck. They were living such thin margins and suddenly student loan payment kicked in or suddenly the gas prices went up just past where they could keep floating there. Exposes everything. Yeah. Or their jobs are cutting back hours or they can't they just got a degree and AI is taken away the first bottom layer of hiring. And so they can't even get into a position. The reality is if you're faced with what I wanted to

to be true isn't anymore. The longer you stay there, the more anxious you get, the more depressed. Like that's just your body trying to take care of you. And man, Rachel, if I could tell people one thing, it's just take action. Just take a step in a direction towards, I've gotta stop going to school.

I don't want to be really, grieve it, grieve it like crazy. Or I've gotta take on a third job. Or I'm gonna have to start asking people for rides and I hate asking for anything. Or I gotta start Ubering to work. It's gonna cost me an hour and a half of my work day to get there.

and I don't have to get back. Okay, that's what I've got to do right now. Or I've got to move in with family for a season. And I'm embarrassed. I'd have to do that. But delaying what is real, what's right in front of you for, I wish it was different, doesn't get you anywhere closer. And in fact, what we're finding is it's just putting you further and further behind.

Yeah, absolutely. And I think acknowledging the outside factors are very real, right? The changing job market, very real. The housing market, very real. You know, you can plug in the gas prices, right? I mean, like, you can plug in external factors that are happening, but John, the people we see that are winning. And we're meeting them in the lobby. We have a great, we have a great audience today. They've been shared a little bit of their stories. You know, when we have a caller on the debt-free stage,

you know, doing their debt-free scream, like, I will say the common denominator with people, and they don't always get there the first day stuff starts happening. But the common denominator of people changing their lives is realizing I'm the answer. External factors are going to happen. Things are going to happen that we can't control, right? That is, We became good friends. I feel like you started here around the pandemic. Like during COVID, and I remember you'd say it all the time, like control what you can control.

During that time was a strong message. But it still rings true today of like things are going to happen, you guys. The external factors are real. Maybe you started out in student loan debt and the person next to you didn't because their parents paid for, whatever it is, right? Things are going to happen. But it's the people that look up and say, you know what? I'm in charge of my future.

And I have to make decisions. I have to choose things that I don't maybe not want to do. I don't want to work the extra job. I don't want to sell the, car. I don't want to, but I'm going to choose to actually do something to the action, put it in the action, and actually start to see things shift. And so it's up to you guys. It really is. And those are the people that win John. Those are the people that call us and you're like, like we're debt free or we're almost at a debt, but you know, this is happening, whatever it

looks like. But it's beautiful because you start to see that shift and you can feel it in their tone. Get to reality as fast as you can and take action. Okay, guys, let me ask you something. What would to take for you to switch your bank because if you're still earning next to nothing on your savings, you need to check out Fairwind's credit union. And I know what you're thinking. It might sound like a hassle. Moving your direct deposit, updating bills, getting a new debit card, feels like a lot. But here's what most people don't realize. Staying where you are could be costing you hundreds of dollars every year. Y'all, the average savings account pays less than half a percent. So let's say, for example, you've got $20,000 saved. You might earn around $70,000.

a year. But with a Fairwind high-yield savings account, earning 3% APY or more, that same money could earn you over $600. And that's real money that you can use towards the baby steps. So don't let temporary comfort keep you stuck. Check out the smart bundle from Fairwind Credit Union. You get a high-yield savings account, a no-fee checking account, and the Ramsey B-Weird debit card. Go to fairwins.org slash Ramsey to learn more and make the switch today. That's fairwinds.org slash Ramsey, insured by the NCUA. Buying or selling your home is a big deal, and you want an expert in your corner fighting for you to find the best deal possible for the right price.

The Ramsey Trusted Program is the only way to find a top agent that you can trust, who will make your home a blessing, not a burden. And it's easy. Just compare agent profiles, interview them, and choose the right ones to work with. To find a Ramsey local trusted real estate pro for free, go to ramsysolutions.com slash agent or click the link in the description if you're listening on YouTube or podcast. All right, let's go to Gerald in New York City. Hi, welcome to the show. Hi, how are you doing? Hi, we're doing great. How can we help?

First of all, reality, what a concept, right? Who would have thought? Who would have thought we'd make a job out of it? I have a shirt that actually says that. Funny. So I have I'm retired 63 still. I'm set. House is paid for, no cars are paid for, no debt. I have a pension, Social Security. My wife still works.

So our investments are, I'm working with Fidelity and the broker wants us to, because I made the mistake of saying that we don't plan on touching anything for at least 10 years. and he he thinks we should be in 100%. And that's really my question is, is it wise to really at where I am in life? And I did all the right things in life. And I'm okay. And on top of that, I should also say this. So I have like $450,000 in cash.

And he thinks we should put at least $300 of that into the market as well. Well, my first, I'll let Rachel talk about money. My first red flag is, anytime you're talking with having a relationship with a professional, whether it's an attorney, whether it's a tax person, or whether it is an investment professional, you should never think I made a mistake of being honest. Like, that to me is a big red flag.

If you can't sit down with your investment professional and say, here's what I want to do and here's what I'm thinking, of course you pay them to give you their opinion and their perspective, but they work for you, right? And if you feel like, oh, man, I shouldn't have said that to them because now they're going to try to snake my money or get me into some high risk, something or other, man, I would say walk out that door and never go back.

That's just how I'm perceiving it. Okay. Again, reality, what a concept. Yeah, right, right, right. That's not reality. That's just how I'm perceiving. Well, I think, I mean, you've done well for yourself financially, and you've done well for yourself professionally.

You're still married. So I would tell you that your gut is probably a pretty good, got a pretty good BS meter on it. How much you have with him right now? Yeah. A little under $600,000. Okay. And what is it invested in right now?

I was at $6040, and I just bumped it up because I literally just met with him. 6040, meaning what? Be more specific when you say 60-40. What do you mean? Well, I guess so 40, I guess, more in the bonds and the safe things. Oh, okay, okay. And what does he have you in stocks? Is it like index funds, ETFs?

What is it? More index funds. Index funds, okay. It's all fidelity stuff. I'm letting them manage my money. So they are definitely charging me for that. I am quite aware of that. There is nothing.

Well, I mean, a broker fee. the same thing. Yeah. Yeah. Well, what's, when I'm running these calculations, what's crazy is if you just left it, if you had transferred the 40%, yes, I would not recommend having money in bonds and suites. I have $0 in bonds. Unless you're a 98-year-old and you're like, it just makes me sleep better at night.

I'm like, that's great. Whatever at that point. But you're a young 63. And so I just did a quick calculation. If you had that $600,000 and you just left it alone, like you said, maybe you used some of it, but just what it could grow to, by the time in 25 years, it'll be $7.2 million. If you went, quote, unquote, aggressive, meaning it was just in the market, which isn't even necessarily aggressive. You could do more aggressive type funds.

But if you're just in, you know, the S&B 500 and index funds and all of that, like it's pretty wild. where it will grow. And CDs, some of them, depending on the rate, won't even keep up with inflation. So I'm with him. I would not do 60-40. I'd do 100%. And then to the- Yeah, which is what they were saying. I would do. That's what I mean, that is- Dave's a little bit older than you, and that's how he does his. Yeah, I'm not telling you anything different. So I would- I'm just glad Dave's not here today because I would have been nervous talking about. I know. He would have been proud of you, Gerald. You've done so well.

Yeah, you've done great. You've done so good. Okay. The four, I work my whole life, but doesn't mean I don't have fears. No, it's fair. I'm scared of him, too. I'm with you. My question is, my question is, Gerald, if you, if you guys don't really necessarily need to touch that money, is that because your wife still plans on working or you guys can live off Social Security? Well, no, because I have a pension. I have a pension and Social Security.

I bring in $10,000 a month. And my wife is still working for at least another few years. She's bringing in $2,500 a month. Okay. Everything is paid for. Yep. So you don't need the money is what you're saying. I did all the right things kind of in life.

Sounds like you did. But I did most of the right things in life. Yeah, it's great. I mean, I have a lot of cash and, you know, I don't want to use names or anything. But, you know, I heard someone say until, you know, our president is out of the office, I would keep cash because cash is going to be king when everything drops. You can jump, jump in and drop it in and then. Maybe.

I mean, we don't have a crystal. Maybe. We don't know. And nobody does. No, because it did. go down after the irate and now it's back up and above what it was so i'm like no yeah i i think the longevity of investing takes out these weird little dips and stuff that we get because of an administration i mean personally and i like cash i i have more cash than normal and it has nothing to do

with anybody in office it has to do with them kind of a lunatic okay so gerald we got to do what you're comfortable there i guess with that aspect yeah sure yeah yeah we have we have we have probably the six months or more just in the regular savings. Okay, Gerald. I have my cash is in the Amex and in the money market. All right, hold on. Gerald, let's wipe everything clean for a second, okay? If you lost all of your investments, it went to zero dollars.

And you looked up and your cash went to zero. You have a paid for a house, paid for vehicles, a pension and social security. Here's what I'm telling you that. Here's what I'm telling you that. you did good you did good okay here's what I'm hearing

I'm hearing a 63 year old guy who is waking up every morning and saying what's my purpose now what do I do? Yeah exactly okay and if you get up every morning and you fret over your money

you're a millionaire I'm not doing that I'm not going to do that okay then you're going to have to do something you're going to have to join a bowling league or join some weird club in in New York

you're going to have to do something right Get a group of guys to go throw seed at pigeons. I don't know what you do in New York, but like, listen, you've got to have to get a gang. Otherwise, you're going to, like, your body will fall off a cliff. I'm being serious. No, you're right. I work out every day.

I know, but you work out alone. You work out alone. I want you got to get. Well, if you saw my gym, you would understand why. Because I have a gym at the house. I am not fine. We did things right. It's all I'm going to say.

I'm eternally grateful. It's because of my beliefs and everything. everything that just I feel that I know I know but listen on this call Gerald you've told me I think I've done everything right enough that leads me to believe you're still wondering if you did everything okay if you're if you did a good job yeah and so I'm telling you did a good job and I'm telling you you've got at least 20 years left if not 30 and so they better be going for that 100% and stop messing around well your money yes but right now you're fine financially you're more than fine. If you did nothing, Gerald,

you're fine. If you do nothing. If you do nothing right now, you're good. I want you, I want the next 30 years. I don't want you sitting on a couch with your phone out checking internet articles and fretting over your money. I want you out having fun. Yes, and from the financial

aspect, I want more bank for your buck and I think you'd be making a tons more in the market. So I would move that 40 over. So if you did nothing, that's fine. But I think you could be way more efficient financially by being in there. So Yep, in the market. And then if you want to keep on to the $450,

that's a lot. It's a lot. Maybe a quarter million. You could scratch by, right? That's right. And then go get a gang. Go do some fun things. And you've done great, Gerald.

We're proud of you. You did good. You did so good. So great. The Ramsey Show question of the day is brought to you by Y Refi. If private student loans are in default and you're not sure what to do next, why refi can help you explore refinancing with a low fixed rate and a payment plan based on what you can actually afford. Go to y-refi.com slash Ramsey. That's the letter Y-R-E-F-Y.com

slash Ramsey may not be available in all states. Today's question comes from Renee in Nevada. My husband has a gambling problem and has money invested in a retirement account. How can we protect that money so he can't withdraw it? He agrees with me that we have to protect this money so he cannot access it. Can we put it in my name or another kind of account? He has withdrawn around $40,000 in the last two years and there's about $85,000 left in the account. Gosh.

It's a second gambling. People who care about people. We got dude, I am as First Amendment guys as they come. I am a leave me alone guy as they come. But access to gambling is destroying families.

It's just destroying teenagers. It's just destroying college students. It's destroying society. We have to draw some lines there. It's just, it's out of control. man. Jeez. And I mean, honestly, from Renee, I mean, not 401Ks. I mean, they have to be in your specific name to get the tax benefit. And I mean, I guess you could talk to your, if you guys have a financial advisor and have some kind of documentation that says, but he could still log into his account. I mean, I don't know. There's not a way to like, I mean, in a trust or a living trust or

something, there could be some like legal loopholes. But you can't take it. out of your name. I guess he could possibly put, you could come up with a password on the account that he doesn't have. That could be good. So he can't walk around and get it. Rachel, I don't like,

this really puts Renee in the seat as, as the mom. And putting responsibility on her. Or as the police officer. It's, in many ways, gambling. So if you have an addiction to cocaine or to alcohol. One of the first things you do is you get rid of all the alcohol and then

you have to decide I'm not going to be in places where alcohol is, which it's just tough for folks going through alcohol rehab because they lose their friendship, their friends, they lose their, you know, cheers. They were places where everybody knows her name, right? It's hard. If you're struggling with disordered eating, it's a different thing because I have to make peace with food. I can't just cut food out. Similar with gambling, you can delete all the apps and stuff, but you have to make peace with money because that's how the world works.

You still have to use it and interact with it. You have to interact with it. Have some sort of relationship with it. And so, Renee, if it's a very short period of time and you're trying to step up while he's getting in rehab and he's getting help, good and great and grand. But if this is not a long-term solution

for you to become the police officer of the family finances, especially, yeah. Well, because that's, I mean, a little bit of the addiction world. I've heard you kind of talk about this, that no one else can fix you. Like, so you can put things in place that are wise and smart. Put hurdles, but he has to decide. Yes, that's not going to be. Yes, that's not going to solve you.

Yes. Yeah, yeah, yeah. He's got to go, if it's at this level where he is withdrawing from his account and he's looking at you saying, I can't stop, he needs, he needs. He needs to go to an inpatient facility and disconnect himself from the planet for 30 days or 60 days or 90 days and get the help he needs. because this is not a long-term solution here. But short-term, I mean, short-term, I have given the password to Amazon Prime to my wife before. I gave her my debit card for a season. I just carried cash when I was out of control.

But I wasn't struggling with gambling addiction, right? I wasn't addicted to anything. I was just being a brat. Oh, and you know what? It takes a level of humility, because we had a call earlier in the show about this to admit to something, right? It's the worst.

And to go get help. And I know you've probably seen this, John, more than me. I've had only a few people in my life do like true 12 step and been in it. But there's some of the of the deepest, most wonderful people that I know. That walk through recovery. Yeah. It changes you. Like addiction and shame feed on secrets.

And the beauty of a 12 step program is you walk in and you say, my name's John and here it all is. Here I am. And you're surrounded by people who are like, yeah, here's us too. And you realize they still like you and they don't kick you out. And you realize you're not the worst thing you've ever done. It's hard. Ian Kron, one of our friends, he wrote a book. And I'm sorry, Ian, if you're listening.

I can't remember the name of it. But it was a little bit like the 12th step. Everybody needs a 12 step. Yes. And he was like, those meetings are more like church. Yes. Than some churches today. Than most churches today.

So saying all this to say, Renee, that your husband, if he chooses something, it just sounds intimidating. When you just said, like, go to an outpatient. I even was like, okay, yeah. But then you go back to your, and you're like, no, that's where change is. And those people that walk that change actually on the other end of it all, I don't want to say they're like better people, but it's, they're a, they're something different about them. They've, they've had to, they've had to mind.

And I've known folks who've gone to multiple different rehab centers. It doesn't always work the first time or the second time or the fifth time. But there's something about saying, I'm worth the investment in getting well. So good. Renee, I hope that that's helpful and that encouragement to you guys. And for anyone out there that's hearing this. All right. Let's go to Atlanta, Georgia.

And we have Amanda on the line. Hi, Amanda. Welcome to the show. Hi, thanks for having me. Absolutely. How can we help? So I have a question, and maybe I'm looking for a little of validation with a decision. I am a single mom, and I'm wondering if I need life insurance to take care of my child, if something were to happen to me.

But the, and I know the immediate answer might be yes, but my son has a trust, and then he would inherit all of my assets as well, in addition to survivor benefits. Okay, what was the trust from? His father's passing. Oh, okay. Oh, I'm sorry, Amanda. Okay. How much is in that trust? When it's all settled, it'll be about $600,000.

Okay. How old's your son? Four. Okay. And then what assets do you have that he would inherit? About a million in property and... Property, okay. In retirement.

Okay. I mean, when you look at that, numbers-wise. I mean, you could pan it out and just think, okay, for his life, college, living expenses to whoever's going to be taking care of him, right? I'm sure you have a will and all that in place. You know, is that enough? And I think you could, you could make that decision. The reason I still lean towards having some term life is, honestly, it's so in expensive Amanda that it's I think it's honestly worth it because if something were to happen to you so tragically if you did have I mean how much money do you make a year um between 150 and 200 okay so

if you had you know a million and a half on you or something um I think when you look at a policy like that it's going to it is going to be so inexpensive um that I all I think I think I would and I may just do like a 10-year term until he's 14 because again that kind of gives you some runway and the only reason I say that is I just re-uped Winston and I both did and we're self-insured everything's paid off for baby's step seven but when we ran the numbers I was like it's so inexpensive that if something were to happen it is just like it's just that extra cushion that extra piece of mind for him and again you probably you don't have to do a long term policy and shop it around if you go to xander Zander.com, Zander Insurance, or, you know, Ramsey Solutions.com slash Xander.

We've been working with them for over 30 years, and they're an insurance broker, Amanda, so they will, so you type in all your info, and they basically shop around all the top companies and find the competitive rates. And most of them, you don't even, you don't even have to do all the, all the, what is it, like the, where they check in on you and they get, they do all your blood work. Yeah, some of them, you don't even have to do that. Like it's, so simple and so inexpensive that. I as a mom I would sorry it's a very long answer I just want to give you my why here's what I would do it Amanda and you may have had some of this lived experience when did your husband pass away

last year oh man what was his name? His name was Robert was he awesome yeah so here's why I would I've sat with people whose spouse has passed away

and they have quote unquote a lot of money, a lot of assets, but they have no cash. And they've got real estate, they've got trust, and they need groceries and gas, or they need tuition payments or whatever. And so I like the idea of having a policy that pays out relatively quickly so that if your son is 17 and he's heading off to college, he doesn't have to worry about selling a million dollars worth of land and estate and stuff like that. He can continue on with his life and then deal with the assets later. That's just, that's my opinion. I would have it.

Welcome back to The Ramsey Show and the Fair Wins Credit Union Studio. I am Rachel Cruz hosting with Dr. John Deloney. And we are taking your call. So give us a call at AAA 825-5-225 to talk about your life and your money. All right, let's go to Henry in Tampa, Florida. Hi, Henry. Welcome to the show. Hey there, guys.

I just want to say, when I was a delivery driver in the UK, I would binge listen to the Ramsey and Dr. Deloney shows. Yeah. Bye-bye. Oh, my gosh. I'm very happy to say, long-time listener, first-time caller. Thank you. Henry, well, glad you're calling in. How can we help?

Okay, so I'm 25, and I just moved here three weeks ago from the UK. Welcome. Wow. Thank you, thank you. I just got married two weeks ago to my amazing wife. Awesome. Is she American, too, or were you guys both from, you say England? No, yeah, she's from Florida.

I'm a Brit who cannot do with heat. I would not choose Florida. I have a choice. Good luck. You're heading into the summer months. Oh, I know, I know. I'm dreading it. I'm just happy to have the air conditioning. So basically, until I get my green card in what could be about six to 12 months, I'm not allowed to work. So after upcoming paperwork fees, I've got about $16,000 in my savings.

I'm just wondering how I can spread slash invest those savings to give me a decent amount of growth, although I'm not, it's not coming from an income. I guess my first question is, man, I've heard of green cards taking a lot longer than six or 12 months. Do you have a good path? Yeah, it's six to 12 months is, of course, just the estimate, but that's based on what the processing times are right now. So it's an optimistic one, but it's what we could potentially be looking at. Well, that's us, US folks. We're the optimistic bunch, right?

You're already drinking the tea. I love it. And is this the only... I've got lots of experience with that. Actually, we don't drink tea. We drink coffee. So we... You're drinking the coffee.

Yeah, I'm sorry to hear that. Okay, so Henry, yeah, for the investment side, I mean, are you guys wanting to use this money? I mean, you guys are newlyweds? Yeah, do you need it? Purchase a home. Are you going to use it probably in the next four to five years? Okay, in the next four, five years, yes, currently we're living with my now in-laws, so we're in a pretty good position in that sense.

My wife's working, so that's great, and she's got savings as well, but I'm just trying to see how to basically, like, build upon my own savings, because I just don't want to be leeching off my wife. I'd rather it be the other way around. Well, you listen to the show along, so I've got a reputation. In fact, Reddit always beats me up for, I'm a hard. I'm hard on men. But I'll tell you, I mean, you, man, I can't believe I'm saying this, but you've got somewhat of a pass. I mean, actually, you don't have the pass, right? But, like, but, I mean, legally you can't. But my concern for you is taking six months to 12 months. I'm not worried about you all financially. It doesn't sound like. You got a place to stay. Your wife is working. I'm more worried about. Yeah, what you're going to be doing. Oh, so when I do end up working, so next week I'm going to meet about, going to a meeting about doing volunteer work with a social media team at a church because I do photography, videography, and editing.

Excellent, excellent. I'll be building up my portfolio until I can work. Dude, I'm so glad you're here. Yes, it's awesome. We talk to so many people who are like, I'm just stuck and I don't want to do anything and hear you, like, you're doing it. And you have an excuse to not do anything genuinely. Yeah, and you're doing exactly the right thing, which is. I want my opportunities. Gosh.

That's awesome, Henry. Just sit on the side of the road with a billboard and say you have lots of opportunities. Here, look at me. I'll tell you what, I'll just, I'll set the billboard up because I can't deal with the Florida heat. Yeah, sit in the shade of it. Yeah. Yeah, so from an investment standpoint, Henry, honestly, because of where you guys are and the fact you're probably going to need this money, it sounds so boring. but I think I just put it in a high-ield savings account.

Yeah, I would too. Because, I mean, it'll grow three, maybe four, probably more like three percent, three, four percent. And you'll make a little bit off of it, right? But if you invested at this point, I'm nervous that you guys are going to need it. And sometimes writing out the market in less than two to three years,

you don't always, you know what I mean? If the timing's off, you don't have that longevity of the growth in it in the investment. So I know it sounds boring. but I think I would just set it in a high-yield savings account because I think you guys, you're so focused that I could see you guys moving forward so quickly on decisions because you're going to have the ability to, and I wouldn't want it stuck in some investment,

and you're trying to time the market because you know you have to get it out. Okay. What do you want to work? When you get this green card, what jobs do you want to have? I'm terrible with all this stuff. Well, I'm wondering, what do you want to do? Just as a long-term job. Yeah.

Primary work in social media. Like I say, I do photography and videography. So, yeah, I'm going to be working with this social media team at this church, too, basically. Awesome. Because they're a little bit behind on social media, so to just get them up with the... Sure. I love that. Henry, you're an awesome.

Well, and if you're able to find even a six-month or 12-month gig with somebody who will sign a work visa over for you there in Florida, and I imagine Florida has more experience with. with work visas, but you might find a company that will pick you up and sponsor you until you get your green card. So it's an honor to talk to you, brother. Well done, Henry. All right. Let's go to Raleigh, North Carolina, and we have Tyler on the line. Hi, Tyler.

Welcome to the show. Hi, how are y'all doing? Hi, we're doing great. How can we help? Hi. So I recently graduated from college in December, and I am also new to the Ramsey sort of baby steps program. Welcome to the call, brother. graduated. Yes, thank you. So when I graduated, I graduated with student loans, car payments, all that.

Okay. Fiddling up to like $105,000. Oh. And yes. So between now and then, I've got it down to $90,000. Good for you. That's four months. But I'm looking to see, as far as my student loans go, I work for the state. And so there's a public service loan forgiveness. After you work for 10 years, you get all of your student loans wiped. So I know about the depth of all and targeting the smallest thing. And that's definitely my biggest thing. So it'll be the last thing I target.

My question would be once I get to... No, I wouldn't wait. I wouldn't wait. Do not wait? Okay. And here's my two reasons. One, this is me calling balls and strikes. The Fed has picked up the number of applications that they're processing, right?

So there was years when I had former students who were part of the debt repayment program working with the state and they were it was like one percent we're getting picked up yeah and everyone else is getting rejected they have increased that okay but here's what i want you to think through number one 10 years is two elections away from now right 10 years ago would you've predicted today no nobody would no right and so a who knows who's going to be in office in 10 years and what program they're going to say, I'm not honoring, I will honor, whatever. Congress passes it. Right. I mean, like, yeah, who knows? The second one is 10 years ago, I was two states,

four houses, and three careers from where I am right now. And I would hate to have thought that I couldn't be in the seat I'm in right now because I was tied to a $90,000 federal repayment program at where I worked, right? So I want you to be in control of your life. And You're crushing this debt. Just get it knocked out. And by the way, if they decide six months after you pay it off that they're going to wipe away every student loan in the country, know that you were a person of integrity. You sign your name to a piece of paper.

You said I'll pay you back. And you kept your word to yourself if nobody else. So the classic debt snowball, Tyler, no debt consolidation, no loan forgiveness, just smallest to largest. And you're killing it already, $15,000 since the beginning of the year. Well done. Hey, guys, Rachel Cruz here. And I love summer.

There is more fun on the calendar, more time with your people, and way more chances to make memories. But you know what else there's more of? Spending. Oh, between the extra groceries and gas and camp fees and family trips, it all starts to add up so fast. And before you know it, money stress starts to steal the fun out of everything. And that is why I love the every dollar budget app, because it helps you plan your money,

track your spending, and find more margin in your budget so that you can put extra extra cash towards the goals that matter most. Enjoy your summer without the money stress. Download the Every Dollar app in the App Store or Google Play and start for free today. All right. Let's go to James in Springfield. Hi, James. Welcome to the show.

Hi. Hello. Welcome, welcome. How can we help today? Okay. So I have a decision on the table in front of me today and it is a job change situation. So I'm doing, we do okay. Me and my wife, we make about 72,000 a year.

We make about 1750 an hour. We get a $1 an hour shift differential on the weekends. But for the last three years, we worked this job with no, like we don't get any PTO, no vacation, no benefits. It's like barebone. They actually just implemented a sick. like occurring sick time or whatever. What's the job, dude? In home care.

We do. We take care of people. Are you all 1099? No. Your W-E-2 employees? Yeah. With no days off and no sick leave? No, we do have, we do accumulate sick days.

We can accumulate up to like 56 hours at night. But no vacation. So there's no benefits. This company has nothing for you guys. Yeah, yeah. And honestly, with where we're at, we live in a town of like 800 people. That's kind of the norm, which is unfortunate, but it's just how it is. It is. Okay. All right. How can we help today? So I've been considering, and I got a call today, and I've got a decision put on the table in front of me on whether or not I want to take this job working in a CNC factory for, they do contracts for Boeing defense, which makes me really happy because I like stuff like that.

Wait, CNC factory? Yeah, yep. I remember a CNC Music Factory. That's one of James' favorite bands, but that's not what you're talking about? No, no, no. Like a computer parts machining, yeah, for F-14s and stuff like that. For airplanes. Very different than C&C Music Factory.

Okay, all right. Yeah, yeah. So my big question is, is like, me and my wife have been working here for the last three years. It's really allowed us to, like, kind of examine. get our lives together, you know, like we're consistently making good money. You know, we homeschool our kids, so it's kind of tough for us to both work and find something that works with our schedules and stuff like that. And going into this new job, I would take a little bit of a pay cut, like close to 50 cents

an hour, but I'm also, like at this job that I work now, I get overtime and stuff. And I would be not only losing all my overtime, but I'd be losing like five hours. I'd be like 35 hours a week. and I really like the idea of the change and I'd have a set schedule like at this job we don't have a set schedule I mean I could have Monday Tuesday Wednesday off or I could have Thursday Friday off I could work 12 hours four hours a day just all over the place and so it's kind of like I guess the big benefit for me of the new job would be like consistency for my kids you know not happen to get them up out of the house at 11 o'clock to do shift change for sure better quality of life it sounds like but less hours. Yes, exactly. Is there a pathway for getting a raise? What does that look like in this company?

Whenever I, this is kind of the other reason why I'm really on the sense about it, it's like anytime I try and ask about that kind of stuff, this guy just came in from Kansas City and bought this place, and he's been like trying to get the numbers up on it. He just signed some long-term contracts with Boeing, which were very promising and stuff. But whenever I talk about raising, he's kind of like, well, you know, nothing set in stone. I don't really have a...

He's got to make sure that he gets his numbers up before promising anything. Okay. Yeah. The business was kind of drowning when he bought it. Okay. So is the question, is it worth the jump? Because it'll be a decrease in pay, but a better lifestyle from a consistency standpoint. Is that what you're asking us? Pretty much. Because right now, me and my wife would take home on average, probably 53 to 55, depending because I get overtime and mileage and stuff.

Yeah. Yeah. How much would it be then if you took this job? I'll probably take like a $6 to $800 decrease. Okay. Is it offset by... We're also trying to pay off a lot of, like, not a lot of debt. We don't have a ton of debt.

What would it feel like making, yeah, I mean, could you guys live off of $4,800 a month and be okay? Our gas, groceries, bills, and like every single dollar that has to come out of our account adds up to right about 4,000. Okay. Like, it feels tight, you know. Right.

For a, and then what debt, what consumer debt do you guys have? We have a car loan that's about $7,000. Okay. We have credit card debt all together. We're about to pay two of them off, but that adds up to,

I think, right around 2,700 or something like that. And then we had two vehicle incidents. I didn't want to file insurance claims because it was minor damage. So I did use a firm, which I knew I shouldn't have, but I did it and fixed one of my cars, well, both of my cars with the parts and stuff from that. So a firm, I think I have $3,000 probably. All in all, I think I'm under $12,000 total debt. Gotcha.

And I'm also in school. right now. Golly, y'all have a lot going on. What are you studying? Accounting. Are you cash flowing? Well, Pell Grant's paying for a lot of it. I'm out of pocket like $600 a year.

Okay. Great. Yeah. I would be okay. I mean, it's 12 grand, so I'm like if you guys, and you got 900, that realistically, right, if you're going all crazy, you know, and you're only doing what you have to do, needs versus once during the debt snowball, just pretend that you could throw

900 at it. And if you worked extra James, which I know you would have a full work week with this, but if you went and worked weekends, could you work for your old... No, no, operative. No, okay.

I might be able... Could you do home health one or two days a week? Yeah, so I was going to say on the weekends. Surely they need you. Well, I mean... I'm just trying to see how you can make it... Okay, so here's the thing. If you could find an extra $1,000 a month on top of that $900,

you guys are completely debt-free by September October. Completely. So I'm like, make- Okay, perfect. So if you can find that extra $1,000 that would have been there if you stayed in this job, if you could replace that with something else, I think I would be okay with the move. But there's a part of me that I'm like,

I think you make better money at this job. and I know it makes life inconsistent, but for another six months and then take on more overtime with that job and make more. I'm like, could you get out even faster? Sorry to cut you off. Go ahead. No, go. The thing that has me pausing for you is listening to you talk about the home health job versus talk about the CNC job. Your whole cadence and tone changed.

You sound excited about the CNC job. But the other variable is you're going to school for accounting. So you're not, this isn't like a career move for you where there's been several jobs where I took a pay cut because it was going to get me where I wanted to go. And every time that's worked out to my benefit, but I was going to something, not from something, right? And so for you, it sounds like you're just, I mean, home health will burn you out. That's a tough, tough gig, especially with a company that doesn't seem to care much about you outside of the workplace. and so I can imagine you wanting to just stop doing that and you found the first ship out of that, you know, out of that harbor.

But man, if you ride it out for a couple more years, you're going to set yourself up totally different and then go do the job you're going to college to do. You know what I mean? That's kind of like where I'm at is like I could take this job now, short-term struggle, I suppose, but more of a path. Because like even when we got this job, they were like, there's no opportunity for a raise.

The only reason we got raises was because minimum wage increase. in Missouri, and that was a nightmare in and of itself. Right, right. You know, my other option is do I just stick it out here? I have a projected, I just finished my first term of classes in like nine weeks. Because I'm doing like a self-paced. How long take it down to school? September 27, probably, give or take.

Yeah, you're talking a year and a half, I would say put. I know that's hard to hear, but you're taking a pay cut for something that's not getting you 18 months of stability and you're going to throw everything back up with a degree in accounting. And by the way, before I took one more class in accounting, gave them one more dollar, I would make sure in my local area there's going to be jobs for accountants that you can start working to use that degree once you get it. You spend hours researching before making a major purchase like a home or car, but it's also a good idea to put in the work searching for the right insurance coverage. To protect your biggest assets, I recommend using Ramsey trusted pro.

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Let's go to Hillary in Fresno, California. Hi, Hillary. Welcome to the show. Hi, thank you for taking the time to speak with me. Absolutely. How can we help today? Okay, so it's kind of a concept that I would love to get your guys' opinion on. So I started listening to you guys about a year and a half ago and just to be contentment and joy

and things that have just come from changing our mindset of not trying to keep up with the Joneses or look at what's next and all of that has just completely changed our life. And so as my husband and I are sitting down and just planning for the future, we are trying to decide how to help our kids, basically. And I recognize they're little. We don't have to make this choice or these decisions for a long time. But, you know, we're doing the 529 accounts. And we live in California, so it's ridiculously expensive here

and just imagining what a house is going to cost once they're ready to buy. And the thought of like, okay, well, we could start investing to have account set up to help them with that. But then I just think about my husband and I, and we're doing pretty well. And the pride that I have when I look at us and I look at my husband and the scratching and the clawing that we did for our careers and our finances, like it was me and him and God against the world. Like we started saying nothing. Yes. And I'm just thinking like, am I robbing them? Would I be robbing them of that?

Like, I want my daughter to look at her husband with the pride that I look at my husband with. you know, but I also don't want to be like, okay, you're on your own kids, figure it out in this ridiculously expensive state. So we're just trying to get, figure out how to balance that. I've got some opinions. What do you think, Rachel? Okay, quickly, two thoughts. I think regardless as if you help them with the house or not, they're going to run into some crap in their lives, regardless. It may not be financial, but they're going to run into some things. And I think if they have the character and maturity of what you're raising them to be, they're still going to be looking at.

at each other as spouses and be like, we just took on the world. And it may not be a money issue, but it could be something else. So I think it's more the character of the person that's there. And then my second thing, kind of along with the characters, is I would pray, because once and I have these conversations, Hillary, too, with our kids, that we raise them in such a way that we don't have to turn a switch at 18 years old to be like, oh, crap, now you've got to be responsible, you got to think about other people. You've got to be generous.

You got to learn that money won't make you happy. you got to learn that stuff. You know, like that switch doesn't just flip when they leave your home. It is an act of who they are. And as parents, you walking life with them while they're under your roof. And then when you launch them into the real world, the prayer is, they're not going to be perfect, obviously, but the prayer is that they have a level of insight into money and contentment and hard work. Because you all have maybe manufactured some of that while they're under your roof so that they learn and understand how to handle money.

so that if they are given some financial gift, whatever that looks like, it doesn't ruin them. It magnifies who they are. So those were my two thoughts that came up. But John may have other thoughts. I love what you said, and I did owe everything Rachel just said. Hillary, I want you to teach them how to scratch and fight and claw. And because you're right, it's kind of like you're a professional MMA fighter, right?

And you and your husband, and you going around and fighting all their fights for them will keep them from having broken bones and bruises. but they won't be tough when they face the real world. And so what is that going to look like for y'all that's going to be different? Like in my house, I could have bought my son a truck. He just turned 16. But he worked for two years to save up to buy his truck because I wasn't going to give it to him. Right?

And he knew that years ago. And he treats that truck. And it's my old truck. And I gave him a great deal. Obviously, I did all the parent things, right? Gave me a great deal and all that. he loves that truck and he takes care of that thing because it's years of his life he invested in it and so i want to teach him how to scratch and fight and claw and i won't have the money to buy him a

house when he graduates right but man he'll have the tools in his toolkit and so some of that is as he's gotten older i've talked more about our household budget with him in fact our 10 year old daughter we just started she leaves lights on everywhere right we just started talking about the light bill and here's what here's what the light bill cost and now I'm watching her go through she's now she's turning off the lights when I'm in the middle of doing something

she's like dad it's expensive right and that's a little bit far but I want our kids to know how the world works and that way they're I don't want to give them bruises and I don't want to manufacture broken arms for them but I do want them to know how the world operates and as their parents

whether we have nothing or we're in a season of abundance and they're going to know that life isn't free and that means they're going to not having a loud but they're going to get paid for jobs. And I love hearing my 16-year-old came in the other day, and he's like, I need to put gas in the car. And my wife said, there's three weeks where the dog poop you haven't picked up in the backyard, go get on it, right? And so he's like, oh, yeah, that sweat equity equals gas in the truck, right?

And so he's going to learn those lessons so that when he goes out there. But you are dead on a two people who get married, them two plus God plus the world. That's it. And the other thing I'll tell you is the data is pretty clear, the greatest gift. parents can give their kids is to love each other recklessly. And that gives kids something to anchor into as they head out into the world. And so it sounds like you and your husband are doing a great job already. Yeah.

So I think the goal, Hillary, would be that you teach them in such a way while they're under your roof, how to do things and how to have the dignity and the self-efficiency of learning work and where money comes from and all of that. So that if later, because part of our message is changing your family tree. And part of that does look like You know, we've got people to show and they're like I need it when they're 70, right? That's right.

So, yeah, and we've heard people that are like, I'm the last one to ever be in debt and I will do X, Y, and Z. But I do expect them to have jobs and whatever. Like, I don't know, whatever the formula is. So my goal would be, because once I talk about this, that if there is anything in the future that is given, if we pay for their tuition for college, if we pay for their wedding and they don't have to pay for their wedding.

Like, whatever that thing is, that that doesn't, ruin them, right? And if it ruins them, then the character was never built in the first place. And so, yes, have the dignity of creating their own paycheck. They need to be, yes, out in the world, because it's good for them. It's good for society, right, to be hard workers and all of it. I just don't want something dependent any level of a financial gift to ruin them. I really, that would be like a character flaw. Does that make sense? Yeah, it does. And again, they're little, but we are working pretty hard. on, you know, they do chores for money and we're doing generosity and all of those things.

Totally. Yep. The gifts just kind of won't even matter. That's right. And we did 401 Dave in our house. We had to pay for all half of our cars. That's what we plan on doing with our kids. John's already lived through it with Hank.

Yeah, it's 401 dad. And I love it. And here's another thing, Hillary, what I have found besides chores and things like that. And I'll tell you, in our house we divide up, there's some things that you do in our house because you're a part of this house, right? I'm not going to pay you for being a human. Yeah. And then there's other things.

that are jobs that either I would hire out or that I have to do. And so I'll pay somebody to do it and you might as well take it. Dave was always like, I don't want to create little union workers. Every sock you pick up, you expect a quarter.

He's like, no, sometimes you just have to pick up your crap. But I'll tell you, one of the greatest things I've seen, and this is something I stumbled into, is my son and I started going to breakfast once a week back when he was in fifth grade. And watching him,

watch me tip. that's when he got the idea of money because he would watch it started with hey how much you how much you want to give as a tip and he'd say $2 and it's like let's do more and he would watch them the waiter or the waitress

they would smile one time at Christmas they chased us out in the parking lot to give us hugs like him seeing and my daughter and I too seeing what generosity looks like and how it's received that for whatever reason has been the biggest shape shift

in that oh, we can be a blessing to other people. I want to be a part of blessing other people. What does that mean? Well, that means you got to work real hard. So you have your needs taken care of so that you can bless like crazy. And so all to say is there's a bunch of little things you and your husband can do. Even when they're young to begin to teach them about how y'all handle money and they're going to mirror what y'all do out in the world.

Yeah, and the importance of money and where it is, the role it plays in your life, Hillary, which is going to be good. It's not a tactical lesson, but they're going to see the importance of it or the, hey, it's just a tool to create a life that we love. All right, let's cut to the chase. It's easy to get discouraged about crazy house prices and interest rates. But when you have the right real estate agent to help you buy and sell the right way, you'll have confidence to make smart decisions. Ramsey trusted agents aren't just experts who guide you through buying or selling.

They're people you can trust to have your back from the first call to closing day. Find a Ramsey trusted agent near you at Ramsey Solutions.com slash agent. That's Ramsey Solutions.com slash agent. Our scripture of the day comes from Hebrews 416. Let us then approach God's throne of grace with confidence so that we may receive mercy and find grace to help us in our time of need. Norman Vincent, is it Peel? I don't know. Tell me, John. You know, according to you, it's PLA.

You know that. Those names, they can be heard sometimes. Vincant PLA. That's right. He said, empty pockets never held anyone back. Only empty heads and empty hearts can do that. Norman Vincent Peel is a famous ice skater. Are you being in for real right now? No.

Oh, gosh. I was going to fall for it and be like, oh, I had no idea. Is he an author? He's a writer. Yeah, he was a... Yeah, he's an author. Oh, he was a American Protestant clergyman and an author, yes. He's a writer.

Clergy, man. Fancy. Do you know what clergy means? Our, our scriptures of the good days. Claire gay, man. All right. Let's head to Denise. It's not thermometer.

I can say this name. I can say this name. Denise and Houston, Texas. It's D. Nice. This is D. Nice. In H-tone. A.A. Ron.

That's a great skit. That's so good. Okay. All right. Denise. We're coming to you in Houston. What's up, Denise? Hi, Denise.

Hi. Hi. How are you? I guess I'm okay. Now better that I'm talking to you guys. All right. We got you. I was just in Houston this weekend. It's my hometown and I love it. And Denise is my sister's name. So we feel connected to you already. We got you. What's up? Okay. Awesome. Well, I'm a spouse of a disabled vet that recently received our 100%.

But in the interim, I occurred debt personally and business-wise. occur about 35,000 in business-wide and probably about the same and personal debt. The company I used to work for went bankrupt two years ago, so I decided to do my own business, which was a boutique. But now I think I'm ready to go back into the workforce, because the tariff actually made my business, you know, kind of, sale somewhat. I'm still doing it part-time and I just need advice. I'm a great sales consultant so as finance manager and yeah, I just need some guidance. Okay. And it's $35,000 in business debt.

And then you said $35,000 more on personal? And personal, yes. Okay. What's the personal debt? What break that $35 down? Credit cards. Credit cards. Okay. And loans. Was it used, were you using that on the business? Or was that just like personal? You were just using it for life? Yeah, I was using it for life while we go through trying to get the 100%, you know. Yeah, where are you at on that?

My husband. I'm just, I was paying what I can. Like a lot of them are being default. I just recently, you know, negotiated like one or two of them. But yeah. Okay. But I'm, yeah, it's just, I don't start Ubering, but I know I need to go back into the workforce. Okay, but you're still part-time at the boutique and you own the boutique, correct?

Yes, correct. Okay. How are you working part-time? Do you have other workers that are there when you're not there? No, I don't. I don't. Okay. With all the merchandise and everything you have in it, if you ended up selling it or liquidating everything, do you know what you would get out of the business? Well, that's what I started doing, but then I got overwhelmed. Yeah. I paused it for two weeks because I've just been really, really overwhelmed. But I think I need to go back to trying to liquidate it and go.

Yeah. Because what's it making a month? What does it bring in a month? It was bringing like at least six grand. But now because of the tariff and all that, Maybe two. It's bringing in two grand, and that's profit after your expenses and everything. Okay, so you're not going in the red. Well, that's profit because I paid.

No. Okay. So it's two grand. And is that, sorry, with you working part-time making two grand with all of it, if you think you went full-time, would you double that? Or probably not just with the amount of foot traffic and stuff because it's a boutique? I probably would. I guess I just got nervous and overwhelmed and overrunner.

Mm-hmm. And yeah, because if you brought in four grand a month, if that's what you made. And if that was, I mean, I guess you'd have to bring it home and pay taxes on that. Yeah, it's still not a ton. What is your husband work? No, he's a disabled cat. Okay. How much does he get in disability a month?

He got disability. He has his pension and stuff. I think about five or six thousand, which he's taking care of the other. the bills. The only bill that I need to pay is my card note, which is a corona. And what kind of set me back, not just a tear if I got into a bad car accident, which set me out of work for a month. Sorry. Okay. Well, I think... So one of the best, I think, actions for you guys is even the way you're explaining how you guys are paying bills in the household. It kind of sounds like he takes care of this. I take care of that with his salary, my stuff, all of it. I want you guys to

look more holistically and say here are the bills of the household regardless of who drives what car or whose credit car whatever as a household here's where we're at and as a household here's the income that's coming in how can we most efficiently use this household income to tackle not only the household bills but also get us out of debt and I do wonder if there's more of a yeah that holistic approach might help I don't know, Denise, because I'm wondering if you do, I probably would, yes, either look somewhere else or go full-time in this boutique and see if you can make four grand. Because if so, that's 10 grand a month you guys are bringing in, you know, if that's the case, which is not bad. That's good. And you guys can make some headway on some of this debt if that's the case. So I think you kind of have to plan out and put your business hat on and just say, okay, realistically, could I profit out four grand out of this business or more?

and if it doesn't look realistic because you're saying tariffs and all of this, when you look at your expenses, if it just feels like it's going to go into the red or your effort is better spent in another position and another job because you could double your income, right, if that's an option, then looking to liquidate everything in the boutique,

yeah, what you could get out of it. So I would kind of map out those two plans, see and shop some jobs outside of that boutique living and just say, okay, what's out there for me realistically and what could I make? And I would say if I worked here full time at the boutique, could I double, triple what I profit?

Okay. But Denise, like, tell me if I'm wrong here. You don't fully know all the money your husband has coming in, do you? No. Okay. I think part of the scary thing for you right now is you're doing all this alone. Mm-hmm. Yeah, because I've been a single mom, I guess, on my life.

Yeah. So, and I get, you've been grinding your whole life. Are you married to this guy? Yes. Okay. I would love it if you sat down tonight and said, I want us to, for the first time, go all in on each other. And I want us to put all of our money in one account.

I want us to put all of our debts on the table. I want to put all of our income on the table. And I want us to look at how the total picture of our financial picture and how are we going to work out on our debts. I guess I've never been in this position before. I know. I know it's scary. And I'm so used to doing it along. And it's tiring.

It's exhausting, huh? Yes. I was a single mom, but I will say my daughter is in grand school. I did so much to get her there. You did good. Yeah, you're a good mom, Denise. And I haven't, I did it almost alone, which was very important. Yeah.

But here's the thing. I want you to allow your husband who looked you in the eye and said till death to his part, I want you to allow him to love you like you loved your daughter. You're worth being loved now. Yeah. And so both of you all fight this thing together. And Denise, hang on the line, and Christian's going to pick up. We're going to give you every dollar because it will start walking you through the baby steps, the debt snowball.

You guys get a budget together and sit down together and start mapping this out. So it's a good tool that may help start that conversation. But thank you so much for the call. John, great show. Thanks to everyone in the booth in our great audience today here in Franklin, Tennessee. And remember, there's ultimately only one way to financial peace, and that's to walk daily with the Prince of Peace, Christ Jesus.