The Ramsey Show - Freedom or Debt? You Get To Choose

Episode Date: May 7, 2024

💵 Sign-up for EveryDollar today - The simplest way to budget for your life! ☎️ Share your thoughts on The Ramsey Show & more! George Kamel & Dr. John Delony answer your questions and discuss: Why self-awareness is a superpower, "How do I stop giving money to my ex-daughter-in-law?" "Who should pay for our mother-in-law suite?" "What's the best way to get my finances in order?" "I'm afraid my husband will lose all of our money" "How do I set boundaries with family about my inheritance?" Support Our Sponsors: BetterHelp NetSuite Zander Insurance Next Steps 📞 Have a question for the show? Call 888-825-5225 Weekdays from 2-5pm ET or click here! 🏦 Take Your 3-Minute Money Assessment - Get a personalized money plan! 📈 Dave Ramsey's personal playbook on investing and real estate. 🎓Your grad doesn’t need another gift card. Give them the gifts you wish you’d been given, like the tools to help them take control of their money and find work that fulfills them. 💰Enter the $3,000 Ramsey Cash Giveaway today! Enter daily to increase your chances of winning weekly $500 prizes or the $3,000 grand prize.  Listen to more from Ramsey Network 🎙️ The Ramsey Show   🧠 The Dr. John Delony Show 🍸 Smart Money Happy Hour 💡 The Rachel Cruze Show 💸 The Ramsey Show Highlights 💰 George Kamel 💼 The Ken Coleman Show 📈 EntreLeadership Learn more about your ad choices. https://www.megaphone.fm/adchoices Ramsey Solutions Privacy Policy

Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, it's the Ramsey Show, where we help people build wealth, do work that they love, and create amazing relationships. I'm Ramsey personality, George Camel, joined by not one, but two compadres today, Dr. John Deloney and my good friend, Ken Coleman. And there's a reason we went full SportsCenter today with this setup, because we are celebrating the launch of my friend Ken Coleman's brand new book, Find the Work You're Wired to Do, which comes with access to his amazing Get Clear Career Assessment. And I'm telling y'all, if you are trying to win with money, you've got to be winning at work. And that is something that my friend Ken harps on. Ken, I have my results and we'll get into that, but I want to talk about why the relationship between work and money. Yeah. Well, let's first look at what David said for decades, which is that your income, presumably from your full-time job, but I guess, you know,

we did three part-time jobs, whatever it is, but your income is your greatest wealth building tool. That's where you take that money. If you use the baby steps as we've taught, and you're smart with your money, you live on less than you make, you live like no one else, later you can live and give like no one else. And so it's making the most of our income. Strikingly, it's not just something Dave has said as though it's some truth he's pulled out of the air. We did the largest study ever of net worth millionaires, over 10,000. Both of you guys know this. And the third largest group of net worth millionaires in the United States were school teachers. And I think to a person in this country, no matter what side of the aisle you're on, I

think we could all unite around teachers should probably make a little bit more money. And so teachers aren't not wealthy, but what teachers are, are people that are on purpose. They've got a mission in life. They're serving. They're really investing. If you think about it in the next generation our greatest resource our children and so because of that high sense of mission and purpose they live on less than they make and they invest it like you and Dave teach and so that really crystallizes this idea of how

important the income is but don't miss the whole teacher part of that story. And John, you get this. You're talking with people all the time. Mental health is at an all-time low, and it's coming from a lot of directions. But the workplace is one of the big drivers. One of the huge drivers. And so how is it that you can,

how can teachers or anybody become net worth millionaires doing something they're miserable at doing? And we see a lot of teachers leaving, but a lot still have a high calling in it. So the idea around meaning and purpose in the work is a huge driver to you being able to be disciplined, to be healthy enough, to actually live on lesson you make and ultimately yield the results of investing over time. So that's how work and money are inextricably tied together. And we found that as people build wealth, they love what they do. We didn't find many wealthy people who were like, I hated what I did, but I did it for 30 years and I became a multimillionaire.

96% of net worth millionaires said they enjoyed, loved their work. And there's something to that. In fact, I'll throw it to John. What's the psychology behind that? I was about to say, I'm glad you called out like something like teaching. We often think that the work we're quote unquote, we're called to do means it's pain free. We like it every single day of our life. It's never dramatic. We're never worried about losing our job or our customers going away to another business. That's not it at all. It's when you find the work that you were put on this planet to do, and you go all in to learn how to do it and be the best in your craft,

you'll overcome any obstacle to see it through, right? And i think you you just won't keep sticking around if you keep there's there's those that famous psychology experiment they could never do in the modern era where they're electrocuting dogs they like they just after you get electrocuted enough you just don't move you just take whatever life gives you and you just live that quiet life of desperation and it's those that can figure out no no i i i know i have a purpose i've got a way a path forward i'm gonna go i'm gonna go make it happen yeah that's it right there and so there really is It's those that can figure out, no, no, no, I know I have a purpose. I've got to weigh a path forward. I'm going to go make it happen. That's it right there.

And so there really is something to having some enjoyment in it. We all understand we've got to be adults and go work and take care of our family. But at the same time, this notion that I can't do something that I really enjoy. And, of course, as you know, what we teach in this book and in all the methodology that we've developed here at Ramsey around work is that there's actual design involved. And then things that I suck at, somebody else is great at. Thanks for pointing at me. Well, you're great at things that I'm awful at. And here's the thing, the things that you enjoy drain me, right? And so this idea that we all have a place where we can kind of fill a role. And again, John, back to the psychology of this and what we really are trying to explain

is it's not just a money play. The money is the immediate play and you can really win with money if you're winning at work. But there's this idea that everybody wants to make a difference. You just kind of long to, did I make a mark while I was here on this planet? Relational first, but certainly occupational. And so we want people to understand that. But the biggest picture is, is if I'm doing work, I'm good at work. I enjoy work that creates a result that I care about. Guess what? I show up

motivated. I'm willing to hustle to John's point. I'm willing to deal with some suffering, whatever that looks like, because there's a bigger thing at play here. And that's where we win with money. And the byproduct is career success and professional growth and a bigger income. And what does that come to? That comes to freedom. Everybody wants to be free to live the life they want to live. And the more money we have with responsibility and values, we have options. Yeah. When you spend a third of your life at work and you spend 4,000 hours, you know, going through high school and it's all leads to this path where we go, I think

this is what I want to do, but no one's really taken some deep thought. We're not teaching anybody how to figure it out. Yeah. And that's what we've done with the Get Clear stuff. This is simple methodology. And when you can use what you do best to do what you love to produce results that matter, boy, that's a really good feeling, even on the worst days. Because you can have a really crappy day, but also go, I'm still making a difference. And that's key. And so it's self-awareness. That's what this book, The Self-Awareness Tool for Professional Growth.

It's a superpower. John can tell you this from his field. The key to getting healthy is an awareness of what's really at the source of the problem right and i also think um and ken and i you and i haven't talked about this but i think this is also good for supervisors because people are leaving oh businesses and droves because their leaders are terrible like we have a leadership crisis that's right um and we have choppy waters ahead and if you have a good boat driver you can can get through choppy waters. If you don't, then it's going to be a mess. And so I think it's important also for leaders to know, what are the people that work for me good at?

What do they love doing? And how can I move some of these tasks so that this person lights up every day and this person lights up every day and I'm not drowning everybody with my top-down processes? That's a great point. It's a cheat code. It's a cheat code. Ken and I, we had a decade of struggle trying to figure this thing out That's a great point. It's a cheat code. It's a cheat code. Ken and I, we had a decade of struggle trying to figure this thing out and get to this point, and you've cracked this code to help people. I wish I had this 10 years ago. So I have my

Get Clear Assessment results here. I want you to read it out loud. So real quick for time, his top three talents. George, we're talking about imagination. Vaping with a cherry flavored vape. I knew he couldn't resist communication and discernment

and perfect hair perfect perfect hair now the things you love doing most are promoting leading and creating and ultimately what you're driven by

is creation you nailed it you read my mail how does that come out give us a 30 second of how that purpose statement shows up every day at work for you

I'm communicating I'm here promoting things that I work for you. I'm communicating. I'm here promoting things that I'm passionate about, messages I'm passionate about, and creating is what fuels me. When I leave work knowing I created something, a piece of content, a video, that's what fuels me. So go check this out, guys. He has cracked the code. Who you are, why you're wired that way, what you want to do professionally, how to get there, the Get Clear Career Assessment, along with find the work you're wired to do. It's a combo. You need it. Give it to someone you care about in your life, a spouse, a child, a parent, and they'll figure it out. RamseySolutions.com slash store. Big congrats, Ken. Thanks, guys. Appreciate you having me on. Have fun today. We will. Thanks for visiting us.

More of The Ramsey Show coming up. 888-825-5225. We'll be right back. This show is sponsored by BetterHelp. This is the season for Halloween. It's October. We're wearing costumes and we're wearing masks. If you haven't started planning your costume yet, get on it. And while you're thinking about it, I want you to be honest. A lot of us hide ourselves. We hide our true selves behind costumes and masks all the time. We do this at work. We do this around our friends. We do this around our families. We even do this when we look at ourselves in the mirror. I know because I've been there multiple times in my life and it's the worst. If you feel like you're stuck hiding behind masks and costumes all the time, if you find yourself hiding from your true self,

I want you to consider talking with a therapist. Therapy is a place where you can be honest, where you can talk to somebody else and reflect and learn, and you can accept all the parts of yourself over time and start living an authentic life. Masks and costumes should be for Halloween parties, not for our emotions and our true selves. And if you're considering therapy, try calling my friends at BetterHelp. BetterHelp is 100% online therapy. You can talk with your therapist anywhere, so it's convenient for you and your schedule. Just fill out a short online survey and you'll be matched with a licensed therapist. Plus, you can switch therapist at any time for no additional cost.

Take off the costumes and take off the mask with BetterHelp. Visit betterhelp.com slash D'Loni to get 10% off your first month. That's betterhelp.com slash D'Loni. Welcome back to the Ramsey Show. I'm George Camel, joined by Dr. John D'Loni. Open phones at 888-825-5225. Tammy's on the line from Tampa, Florida. Tammy, welcome to the show. Hi, thank you. Sure. How can John and I help? Well, I'm just needing some assistance with stopping giving my ex-daughter-in-law money. Okay. I have an awesome tip for this, before you even ask your question.

Yeah. Okay, you ready? Yep, go ahead. Alright. Do you have a pen and paper you can write this down? Sure. You'll remember it. Okay. Alright. Stop giving your ex-daughter-in-law money. That was

incredible, wasn't it? That was genius. That was incredible. That's called trolling, Tammy. Don't fall for it. So why can't you stop giving her money? Well, I did. I've been giving her money for a long time trying to help her because she's a single mom.

What's a long time and how much? Since my husband died in September and probably about $4,000. Total, four grand since September. Yeah, I've paid her rent since January, it's $800 a month. Where's your son in this? Um, he is not in the picture at all. So he is paying support. In your life or hers? He's paying her child support $25 a week.

Okay. A week. Where is he? He's in North Carolina, and he's dropped out of her life or everyone's life. Is he legally supposed to be paying more than $25 a week? No, that's what the courts awarded him. So he's indigent. He's not working.

Is he struggling with addiction pretty bad? Not addiction. He's a transgender. Okay. He's just not in a picture at all. Okay, he just dropped out of his life. So are you giving money because you feel guilty? A lot of it is, yeah. Well, because she's a single mom, I don't want her to go under.

And this is your grandchild still. It's not an ex-grandchild. It's still your grandchild. Yeah. She's raising my grandchild. I gave her a car. I gave her my car. And then I bought a car so that she would have a reliable vehicle because she was going under with the used car dealership. Sure. Well, if you want to keep giving her money, then why do you want to stop giving her money? I don't have it anymore. There you go. I'm 59.

I want to retire someday, and I can't just keep giving her money. But the latest was Sunday night when she messaged me that she's going to be evicted if I don't help her pay her rent. Is she working full-time? She works two jobs. She gets food stamps, child support. She no longer has a car payment. I mean, I don't know where her money's going.

Here's the deal, though. Unless you want to file with the Child Protective Services in that local area and take custody of this kid because the kid's not safe, where her money goes isn't any of your business. And I know that's hard to hear, but it's not. Yeah. And you've been giving her money, thousands and thousands of dollars, and you've probably had a ton of conversations about your son who's transitioned.

Like you've had tons of conversations with her. Y'all are close. And she's going to keep calling you in the middle of the night because she knows you'll bail her out of whatever situation she finds herself in. Yeah. And so until you say up front, front hey i don't have enough money for me and so from this point forward um here's the last five hundred dollars i got and this is it and she's gonna call you again because she doesn't believe you and you're gonna have to hold firm to that boundary you're gonna have to be sad you have to be upset you're gonna have to be angry at your child you have to be

angry you have to be frustrated all of it to be upset. You're going to be angry at your child. You have to be angry. You have to be frustrated all of it, but you don't have any money to give. Yeah. That's, thank you. Yeah. And it seems like there's a lack of trust on your part because you don't know what she's doing with this money and you don't think it's going to the things you want it to go to. That's sort of correct. I don't understand. She works like two towns over. It's an hour away. Why not get a job closer to home? Why not? I just don't know where her money's going, and it's always an excuse, and I'm just tired of the excuses. I just don't want my granddaughter out on the streets, and now she's going to be evicted in three days. Are you in a position to take temporary custody of your granddaughter for a while?

I've told her, yes, she can come stay with me. I mean, I haven't done anything legally. I'm not sure what I need to do legally, but I've told her I can put up my granddaughter. I just, I can't have her in my house. Sure. Of course. What does she say to that i'm i'm waiting for a response i just sent her a long message today saying let's stop communicating in messages because that's how that's how my teenage son communicates with his friends and we're adults and this is too big of a deal let's make phone calls okay okay let's pick up the phone and call and say i'm gonna come pick up my granddaughter and she can stay here until you get on your feet again.

If that's what you feel like you need to do. Okay. I like that. I think I agree with that. And she may say, I hate you and I can't believe this. Or you may bail her out for three weeks and then she'll come over to the house and say, oh my gosh, you took my kid. Like who knows what's going to happen in the back end of this deal.

But at least for three weeks, that little girl's got a safe place to put her head. That's what I want. I just want her to be safe. Yeah. And I'm not trying to take her child away. I just want her to get on her feet and stop wasting money. Of course. But listen, you don't get any say into her budget.

You don't get any say into where she lives and where she works. That stinks, but you just don't, right? Yeah, I know. And we want the, man, I can't even imagine being in the situation you're in but just because it hurts doesn't mean it's wrong you don't have a pain-free path forward here you have to choose the one that's going to hurt and also lead you to where you want to be which is right now a safe place for your daughter and you you're bleeding cash that you don't have and have you grieved your husband's loss?

Yeah. I mean, it's, you know, I think that maybe it's just being taken advantage of since my husband's passed. Okay. It's tough, you know. And he would probably, he's rolling over in his grave seeing me give our money. It's okay. Hey, you went through And he would probably, he's rolling over in his grave, seeing me give our money.

It's okay. Hey, you went through a period of having to survive, and you're still breathing, and you're good, and now we're going to start making some harder and firmer and more safe and rational choices, right? Yes. Yeah. Forgive yourself, man. I can't.

My life would end if my wife passed away. It would stop. And I would hope to give myself some grace on what I did the next few months. It would just be, I can't even wrap my head around that. So I'm going to give you some, give yourself some grace. You've been trying to keep your family afloat as it's kind of drifting apart from you. Thank you. I'm proud of you.

Okay. Thank you. I'm proud of you. Okay? Thank you. And now you got to put your oxygen mask on and make sure you're in a stable enough place so that if you do end up having to take custody over this little granddaughter or whatever you choose to do or your child comes home,

whatever you got to do, you're going to be at a more stable place to do that. I agree. Okay. I'm proud of you. And George, the one thing I always tell parents in this situation is don't um don't pull a gotcha meaning if you've been giving money for month after month after month after month and it's up to thousands of dollars in my opinion that warrants a conversation not just an overnight cutoff right because somebody has begun to lean on that money

and you have shown up time and time and time again it's worth a conversation and that can be an uncomfortable one um because she's gonna say hey this is it i don't have no more money oh it's just gonna let us like it's all her fault right i can't control how your budget how you spend any of that stuff i'm just telling you i don't have any more money right it's worth that conversation and then you got to hold those boundaries firm because those waters are coming. We're going to see if they're going to hold. It's so hard. And I know a lot of people, not this particular situation, but a lot of people are going through some version of this where they're trying to be a good, nice person. It's

turned into this enabling. They have to have the hard boundary conversation and it's a close person in their life. How do you even begin that? Well, I'll take it one step further. It's not only like we talk on the show, we often oversimplify it, right? Like you just cut that person off. What if I cut that person off and they have my granddaughter who's four, right? Like it complicates things.

And so like we talked about in that call, what's the end goal? The end goal here is I can't give you any more money. And the end goal is I need my granddaughter safe. Okay. Well then maybe she's gonna have to come live with you for a couple of weeks. Cause that's the only option, right? Is anybody want that? No, but that's, that's the next right thing. So I think it's, it's sometimes it's as simple as telling your 25 year old kid, like you got to move out of the basement. Often it's sitting down and saying, okay, what's the best thing for the children involved in this deal? And what's the reality?

My financial reality, I don't have more money. I can't give you anything else. I'm going to have to be calling you for money. And you've got to make those hard decisions and think through all the ramifications of that. But none of it is easy. And I think we all want an easy path. None of it's easy. It's all hard.

And you've got to go do it anyway. So good. Well, Tammy, thanks for the call. We're wishing the best for you. Hope this ends up with a good situation for you and your granddaughter. This is The Ramsey Show. We'll be right back. What does the future hold for business?

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Welcome back to the Ramsey Show. I'm George Camel, joined by Dr. John Maloney. Listen, it's May, it's graduation season, and a grad in your life just spent more than 4,300 hours in class, and we are guessing that nobody figured, you know what, we should teach them how to handle money. How about that? So before you stick a crisp $100 bill inside that graduation card, why not give them a tool that you wish someone had given you? And we've got tons of great gifts for grads in the Ramsey store. Gifts for teaching a grad about money. How about this? The Total Money Makeover. Dave's all-time best-selling book. It's helped more than 10 million people get out of debt and build wealth

and my number one bestseller breaking free from broke exposing the money myths and traps out there it's sort of like financial peace for the next generation it's riddled with jokes and humor i put the cookies on the bottom shelf that's like saying like i just came out with a new record it's kind of like sergeantppers for the next generation. Pretty much. Good job, George. Good job. That's what Harry Styles is to me.

Good job. So lots of gifts over there. If you're looking at grads trying to work on their job search, check out Ken Coleman's brand new book. We talked about it earlier, launched today. Find the work you're wired to do. It includes the Get Clear Career Assessment. So this is very actionable for that grad in your life.

It will show them the work that they would enjoy doing, helps them narrow down the search. So check out all of those. Questions for Humans are all up. That's a good one, too. Building on Anxious Life. They finally put it on sale. They've never put it on sale.

About time. I know. I'm not paying retail. Never. So go to the store, man. Pick up some good stuff. Our loss is your gain. Go to ramseysolutions.com slash store.

Shop till you drop. The grads will thank you. And put a $20 bill in there along with the gift. I think that's always a kind thing to do. They like cash too. Yeah. Put some coal in there. There we go.

John's real angry today. I'm 100 years old, I guess. I wouldn't even know where to find coal. Does Home Depot sell coal? The little Brits has some. The little Kingsford briquettes, does that count? Yeah, it's charcoal. Okay.

Man, that was the most outdoorsy, manly thing I've heard you say. Let's go to the lines because I prefer talking to strangers than John. Cindy is joining us in Richmond, Virginia. How are you doing, Cindy? I'm fine. Thank you for taking my call. I have kind of a complicated question. We have a complicated answer, most likely.

Great. Hey, wait a minute. You're in Richmond, Virginia. You know where there's cold, right? No, I don't. She was so excited. George thinks it's at Home Depot. All right, go ahead.

Go ahead. Okay. So six years ago, my mother moved in with my husband and myself. She sold her home. She built onto our home. She put $100,000 in our home for an apartment for her. I'm her full-time caregiver. And now my husband and I are moving and we want to take her with us. And the house that we have bought does not have accommodations

for her. So my question is, is who should fit the bill to make our house accommodating for her? Does she have the money? She has the money. She lives off Social Security for, she gets about $1,000 in investments. Do you have siblings? I have a sister. She is hands-off. Okay. But is she going to be entitled to this money and be really upset that you spent it? Because I'm feeling like your mom put her $100,000 in,

and so whatever y'all got out in equity of that home, you just absorbed that and made that your money and that would be money i think sounds right to go to y'all chose a house it's not accessible and so that that sounds like that's where that money would go so okay because you've absorbed that equity right right? We did. Yes, we did. And I'm sure it didn't increase the value by $100,000. It wasn't dollar for dollar, but I am assuming it increased the value somewhat to add on an apartment, right? Yes, it has.

It has. We've made a lot of, you know, upgrades to this house, and I know that that has put built-in you know financial equity in the home sure um I I just you know it's a hard question because I am her 24-7 caregiver I do it for free yes okay um except I'm sorry she she does give us a check for $350 a month, and that's, um, for gas, because she has a lot of appointments. She's a heart patient. Um, that's for, um, her insurance, that's for her phone and utilities and food. Okay, Cindy, can I... I do... Yeah, go ahead. I'm sorry. We only have a...

We don't have a ton of time. I would be much gentler in this approach, okay? But so it's going to sound like I'm coming at you pretty hard, but I just have to ask this question. It sounds like you are getting frustrated in your role

and you're looking almost for back pay. Like you deserve this and she're looking almost for back pay like you you deserve this and she deserves to pay for it you know that that could very well be i don't think that's right i think y'all came to an agreement and y'all chose y'all chose another house and yeah i mean you chose another house you get to do whatever you want to do but the house that you chose and the choice you made to be your mom's 24-7 caregiver, those right now are incompatible. But those are both choices you made after your mom put $100,000 into your old house. Yeah.

I know that's, tell me if I'm wrong. Tell me if I'm being unfair. You know, I don't know what's fair, but I want to be fair because I'm a Christian and that's how I live my life. And I just, I don't know. I'm completely exhausted. Okay, let's say that. Like, that stinks, man. Like, what you're doing is really hard. My oldest best friend on planet Earth is a paraplegic and his brother takes care of him.

His mom takes care of him full time. That's exhausting. No thankless. Nobody's there to work. Yes. Right? Yes. It's exhausting.

And when you get exhausted and you don't have people that you spend your life with, it's real easy to start saying like, well, I deserve and I should have. And those things make your heart hard. And then you start thinking, well, I'm going to bill mom for, see what I'm saying? It's just one step and one step and one step. Right. And I don't want to do something that is wrong by my mother. She has been a good mother. She is a good mother. And for the circumstance that we're in, she has made it as easy as she can. Sure. You know. Have you already bought this house and you've already moved and all that stuff's running and gunning? We're in the process of moving. So you're already

sold or have you not closed yet? We have bought a home and we are almost ready to put our house on the market that we're living in. So whatever happens with the proceeds, I'm guessing you're going to have a— what number do you think you'll have at the closing from the sale of the house? I think we're going to—I'm hoping that we're going to close around $700. Okay. Do you have a mortgage? This house is paid off. Okay. So outside of fees, you will take every penny and put it in the bank, and you're going to roll most of that over to the next house?

What's the next house cost? $589. Okay. So you'll be able to pay cash and afford a $100,000 addition. Yes. Or a remodel. I like this plan. I like the plan. If it doesn't send you guys back, you're not going into debt for this.

You have the money. I would leave her investments alone because chances are one day you're going to inherit whatever she has left. Or worst case scenario, you're going to get sued for the money that your sister thinks you spent. Well, I hadn't thought about that. If you use a portion of mom's investments, now she passes, sister goes, whoa, they already took $100,000 out of their inheritance, so I deserve that back. And then they charge mom another $75,000 to make the new house ADA accessible, and now it's $150,000, right? See how it just gets messier and messier and messier. Yeah. I would find somebody to go sit with, whether it's a couple of friends,

whether it's a counselor, whether it's somebody that you can just exhale and say, I didn't see this is how my life was going to be right now. And I'm tired and I don't like it. And it's right. And I know what I'm doing is holy and good and all that. But I'm also allowed to say, I don't like it. And find some people you can say that to and get it work through that stuff, man. Cause this is hard what you're doing. You're a good, good daughter. But when you get into the shoulds and I'm owed, man, you can make some gnarly decisions that you can't take back. I've been doing this show for over 30 years and some of the saddest calls I have taken are from situations that are completely preventable. Yeah. And what's so hard is I feel like one of those,

especially the ones that I'm like, oh, it's terrible. People that call in and their spouse has passed away suddenly and they don't have life insurance. When you have to think through how am I going to pay my bills? How am I going to eat next week? Yeah, in the middle of all that grief. It's just, it is, it's terrible. So life insurance is the one thing,

especially as a mom with three little kids that I'm like so big on for people to get because it's inexpensive. Zander is the place that Winston and as a mom with three little kids that I'm like so big on for people to get because it's inexpensive. Zander is the place that Winston and I actually get all of our life insurance. And it doesn't cost much because Zander shops among a gazillion different companies. It doesn't cost much. You just have to admit that someday you're not going to be here. You got to say it out loud and you got to say, I'm going to say I love you to my family

by taking care of them and taking the time to put this stuff in place. The cost of stinking pizza to get a free quote, call 800-356-4282. That's 800-356-4282 or go to zander.com. This is the Ramsey Show. I'm George Campbell, joined by Dr. John Deloney. If you're listening to the show, do us a quick favor, wherever you're listening or watching, hit the share button and share this with someone in your life who might enjoy it. Leave us a kind review. Hit the subscribe or follow button. All of that helps us reach more people. It helps the algorithms love us, and you are the best marketing we have. So I appreciate all of you who have done that. It

is working. We are seeing the numbers grow, and it means the world. Tyler's up next in Charlotte, North Carolina. Tyler, welcome to the show. Thank you, guys. What's going on? Honestly, I have a, I would say, a base platform that I'm trying to build from. I just recently had a two-year-old son, so that's kind of motivation in a lot of different manners. I'm trying to build credit, looking at buying a house, things of that nature. But I'm basically starting at the complete bottom.

What does that mean? I started to read Dave Renz. Like you have no financial literacy or are you broke or both? Financial literacy. I'm not sure exactly what I'm doing. I work for the post office so income is decent um are you married you know i have no sir okay are you a single dad yes sir okay how old are you 32 hey welcome to the gang man what's up, guys?

Hey, look, man, if you knew how many questions I asked Dave off air, because I don't know either, man, you are right where you need to be, and I'm glad you found us. And someone who's 52 is going, oh, I wish I was Tyler, learning this stuff at 32. That's awesome, man. Put down the shame and baggage you probably feel that you should have been doing better things sooner.

It's okay. All right. So let me free you. So let's talk about your financial picture and what your goals are. That helps us kind of assess where you're at in the journey. And then of course, I'll give you some tools that will kind of lay out the Ramsey plan and foundation. So how much are you making at the post office? Roughly $3,200 a month. Okay. And what does childcare look like for the two-year-old? I'm paying about $750 in child support a month. Okay. Now, what debt do you have? None, besides maybe a few medical from years ago. Okay. And how much money do you have in the bank?

About $2,300. Okay. This is much money do you have in the bank? About $2,300. Okay. This is a good start. That I can just set to the side, yes. So you're better off than most people in America. And I know that sounds crazy. That's how bad things are. But you're ahead of most people.

Okay. What's your rent every month? I actually don't have it. I did a while back, but then I moved out. It was time for me to step out on my own. My family was like, all right, let's go. So they kind of pushed me out, and I'm starting fresh. So do you have rent or a mortgage right now?

Not in a bad way. Do I have rent for a mortgage? Do you have rent or a mortgage? Oh, negative. No, sir. So what's your living situation? I actually live with a friend. They've been gracious enough to open their door and give me an opportunity to build.

What do you mean to build? Like to build your financial life? Yes. Okay. So are you paying them any rent, or is this just free, just being a bud? Yes. Now, I will help out between two three hundred dollars a month and or fixing things around the house or just random things but it's not a hey i need this amount they're they're secure in themselves okay well i think long term i want to i want you to have a place for yourself even if that's just renting yes for a few years as you start to save

up a down payment to become a problem i. The problem I'm running into, because I did look into apartments recently, is it falls back to credit score. And I have never established credit, so I have no credit score. I don't have bad credit. It's just no score. When you say running into a problem, here's the truth. I've rented many apartments. I've called different apartments across the country. I did this on my YouTube channel. I did this in the book and my fine print podcast. And it turns out almost every single person was like, yeah, do you have a stable job? Yeah. Do you have a criminal background?

No. Okay. Well, you might need to pay an extra 500 bucks deposit. And I go, oh, okay. That's it. So that's the truth. A lot of it is fictionalized in our head or they go, hey, we're going to run a credit check and you go, oh gosh, and you get scared off. They're looking for delinquent bad credit. They're not going to

be concerned if you just have no credit history because you don't have debt. And by the way, Tyler, both George and I have bought a house with a manual underwriting with a credit score of zero. You can do that too. And our partners at Churchill Mortgage, they've been doing this for decades. They are the number one experts in manual underwriting with a no score loan. So I don't want that to scare you into doing what most Americans do, which is go, I got to build my credit. Let me get a credit card or seven. Let me go get a car payment because that helps my credit score. And then you wake up going, I'm in no financial, I'm not in a better financial place than I was. And I have a 750 or 800 credit

score big whoop and so i think you're actually doing better than most if you don't have a credit score right now here's something i learned about the credit score tyler and since you don't have a lot of financial literacy this blew my mind and i'm gonna tell it to you early if i gave you five million dollars in cash right now it would not change your credit score one bit. If you went and opened up a credit card and ran up $5,000 and made your monthly payment three months in a row, you'd have a great credit score.

Who would you rather be? A guy holding $5 million in cash or that other dude? Cash. Exactly. The credit score just as simply as a, it's a marker for how good you can dance with debt. And if you just decide I'm going to dance with freedom instead,

the score is kind of irrelevant. Okay. Okay. Okay. So that solves it. Now you go, well, what should I be doing? Well, the Ramsey Baby Steps give you a great filter. And right now, outside of clearing up that medical debt, I would just go ahead and call them and say, hey, what do I owe? See if you can settle for the, you know, how much is this?

Do you know? Have any idea? Maybe $1,500, $2,000 minimum to maybe $4,000. Okay. Well, you've got, let's say you have a $1,000 starter emergency fund that, you've got, let's say you have a $1,000 starter emergency fund that gives you $1,300 to play with. What if you said, hey, can I settle this debt? I've got $1,300.

I need it paid in full and I need it in writing. I bet they'd go, yeah, that's fine. Let's clear that out of your life. You don't need that package. Don't give them

your checking account either so they can tell you. That is part of the plan. I just, I didn't know which step that would be. I'm halfway through Dave ramsey's baby steps book right now great okay so that's your step one is to clear up that old collection debt you have a thousand dollars in the bank now we move on to step two paying off all debt you don't have that let's move on to

step three three to six months of expenses fully funded emergency fund and for you that might be 10 grand okay and so your next step would be, how much of my income can I push towards savings and not spend it? And that probably for you with your expenses right now will happen pretty fast. Yes. And so the next step after that is let's begin investing. Baby step four, invest 15% of our income. I'm guessing you have an employer retirement plan through the postal service? Yes. And you're not currently investing? Not yet. A lot of that was within your first 60 day window, and I was so busy with the job, I didn't actually get into it yet. That's totally fine. I can start at any time. Well, start it once you have a fully funded emergency fund. That's

when you can turn on that dial for 15% in that retirement plan. Then beyond that, it's saving for the kids' college. And obviously in all of that, we got to be saving for a house. That would be Baby Step 3B. And we'll give you some more resources on that to help you take that next step. But it's very clear. It's one thing, focus, intensity, and you're going to do one thing at a time. But I want to encourage you that you're in a better spot than you think you are, and credit is not the answer to any of your problems. Awesome. You're the solution, man.

So hang on the line. I'm going to send you a copy of my book, Breaking Free from Broke. I spent a lot of time pouring through the research and the data and the objections, talking about credit scores. There's a whole chapter on that, talking about credit cards, to kind of unlock what John's talking about, about solving for freedom instead of playing kissy face with banks and lenders your whole life and then wondering why it doesn't feel like the American dream. And I think you're going to be able to rise above that with these tools. So hang on the line and Austin and Kelly are going to pick up. We're going to

send you a copy of Breaking Free from Broke. You've already got the Baby Steps book, probably Total Money Makeover, if I had to guess. A great book to get you fired up uh and you'll get there man that's exciting it's kind of nice john when you we talk to someone who's sort of fresh they think they think that everything's coming down and they realize no you're pretty good actually most most people call in in their underwater you're just you're on you're on dry land you're not in the mountains but you're on dry land dude and there's no unplugging from the matrix. You don't have to deprogram all the crap and beliefs and myths.

You just go, I don't know what to do. Tell me. They're going to be way better off than the people who are stuck in their own limited beliefs, believing the debt system is the path. It's simply not.

And listen to the show for 20 minutes and you'll see how that's true. That puts this hour of the Ramsey Show in the books. Thank you to my co-host, Dr. John Deloney, all the guys and gals in the booth keeping the show afloat, and you, America, will be back before you know it. Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, it's The Ramsey Show, where we help people build

wealth, do work that they love, and create amazing relationships. I'm George Campbell, joined by Dr. John Deloney. Open phones at 888-825-5225. You call in, we'll talk about your money, your life, your relationships, your emotional health, all of it right here in front of you on the show. Chelsea kicks us off this hour in Phoenix. Chelsea, welcome to The Ramsey Show. Hi, George. Hi, Dr. John. Hey, how can we help today? Okay, so I'll just lay it out and I guess we can go from there. I'm 30.

I am in about 102 to be exact K in debt. And I decided to not renew my lease last summer. I converted my car. So I'm living in my car full time. It was by choice, but now I feel like it's something I'm depending on to try to pay off debt. And I'm pretty much, I feel like I keep making the same dead-end choices. I come from a family who all are in debt. No one's financial literate, and I really want to make that change for myself and not keep carrying that burden. But this is my first time really realizing that I need help and I'm confused, don't know where to start, how to organize all of this

so that I cannot run into this again. Do you have a support system at all or are you all by yourself, hun? By myself. I live in Phoenix, just me and my dog. I moved out here a couple years ago. All of my family is back on the East Coast and I'm just figuring it out. What is in Arizona? I originally came here for a job. I got laid off from that job and thankfully I did get another job three months later as of March 23.

So I've been with them for about a year. Hold on, hold on, hold on, hold on, hold on. Yeah. Honey, you live on the street. Yeah. What's in Arizona? this is not a life for like if you're my sister if you're my friend i don't i don't want this for you what's in arizona nothing anymore since i'm not with that job the current job i have now is remote

um and i decided to do like you know a little bit of travel and road trips and take advantage of that to kind of figure out the next step, really. Okay. What is so—and tell me. This isn't a judgment question. This is just me asking. What is so unsafe about going back to the East Coast and staying with a relative or a friend for six months to get your feet back under you? A lot of trauma, PTSD. Okay.

If it's abusive, don't go back. I'm wondering. That's what I'm digging at. So if it's a mess, don't go back there. Okay? Not safe? Yeah. Yes and no i'd rather i'm the type of person to figure it out on my own

i can't move back into an apartment at least um but i figured like that money could go towards debt instead you're you're in i i can't tell you how unsafe your position is right now. Yeah. You're living on the street. You got to get yourself a place to stay. This is not a two-month plan. You're going to be living in your car for four or five years at this rate. Even if you apply for an emergency housing voucher there in Phoenix, Arizona,

you got to find a place where you can have four walls over your head. If you have to go to a shelter, go to a shelter. I want you to be safe. And the thought of my daughter spending the night month after month in a car on the side of the road in Phoenix, Arizona, when it's about to be 118 degrees every day, it's untenable. I can't even, my heart stops thinking about that. What kind of car is this?

Such a great question. It's like a mattress in the trunk situation. You said you converted it. Yeah, no, I converted the whole thing. It's a Kia Soul. And I, originally I was around the country. I was exploring. I actually did get like a house sitting gig for the summer while I'm here so that I'm not in the heat and then I was gonna head back to the coast of California to continue like to travel right

now is not our time to eat pray love and travel that's a distraction from facing your real life yeah and we need to clean up this debt before we go on another road trip that means you're gonna have to get some stability and get yourself a full-time job and two part-time jobs and pay this stuff off. Maybe you get a few good gals and you have a few roommates. You don't have to keep doing this on your own. So how much money do you make? 44 a year with my full-time job. And I've done some Ubering on the side. So that probably brings in about 15 to 20. Okay. Well, Phoenix just moved all their Ubers to autonomous, didn't they?

I'm not sure. A big chunk of them? I do the Uber Eats. I don't do the pickup people. Yeah. So you're making about 60K and you have 100K in debt. What kind of debt is all this? $38,000 is for a student loan. $47,000 is another student loan. $17,000 is car and the rest is credit card. Okay. What was your degree in? Communications, broadcast journalism.

And what are you doing for work right now hr okay would you want to be doing something closer to your field yes i think it's possible i think you took whatever job was there which is totally fine but i wanted you to move into something that you're really passionate about because that's going to end up increasing your income over time and going to help you pay off this debt. Because right now, how much money can you throw at the debt every month between the payments and the extra? Maybe $1,000 or $2,000 a month. Have you done the math on that?

That's 10 years, not including interest. $1,000 a month is 100 months for you to become debt-free. Yeah, I should be definitely doing way more. We need to be throwing more like $2,000 or $3,000 a month. Okay. That's $33,000 a year. You're done in three years max. So that's where we need to figure out how to get that margin.

If that means you move back with some family or friends or you get three roommates, you do that. But we can't keep living in this car. Is the car loan on this Kia? Yes. I'm guessing you're underwater on this car. I doubt you're going to be able to sell it after you converted it like that. Very much underwater. Well, you're going to debt snowball all this and pay off the smallest balance to the largest. That means splitting up all the student loans, splitting up the credit cards, and paying off the smallest one first. And if you're going to keep living a nomadic life,

pick a place that's cheaper so you can get an apartment. Phoenix is incredibly expensive for somebody making $40,000 just trying to find two pennies to rub together. Move to Kansas. Move to Nebraska. Move to I mean, trying to find two pennies to rub together. Move to Kansas, move to Nebraska, move to somewhere that's cheaper to live. Yeah. And listen to me, you cannot outrun this debt.

You can't pretend it never happened and you can't just wander off, like wanderlusted away. At some point it's going to come for you. And my fear is you're not going to listen to the thing George and I say, and you're going to look up in five years, and that $100,000 is going to be $175,000 with penalties and late fees. And they'll garnish your wages.

They will come get their money. You're going to have to just stop and grow up and have a hard, hard couple of years. And then you're going to be free. And then if you want to drive around the country, drive around the country. I'm all for it, man. I'm a dreamer too, But man, you got to cut these chains. I was going to send you a book, but you don't have an address right now. So instead,

hang on the line. I'm going to get your email and we'll send you the digital versions of Breaking Free from Broke, the ebook and the audio book. I hope it helps you get out of this cycle. You're going to break it. You're going to break the generational chains. Debt is not in the DNA. We checked. This is The Ramsey Show. Welcome back to The Ramsey Show. I'm George Campbell, joined by Dr. John Bologna. Open phones at 888-825-5225. Our question of the day comes from Bethany in Connecticut. What does Bethany have to say, John? All right, Bethany asks,

My husband and I are in our mid-30s and self-made millionaires. We are debt-free and have a fully funded emergency fund, retirement accounts, education funds for our children, and we own three rental properties. Our combined after-tax income is about $600,000 a year. We could be investing more, but we're not on the same page on how to invest. I'm more conservative and lean towards mutual funds,

but my husband prefers to invest in venture capital funds, startups, and real estate. As a higher earner, he subtly... Oh, God, this pisses me off. As the higher earner, he subtly infers that his opinion holds more weight than mine and says that his lifetime earning potential is so vast that I shouldn't even care. Oh, geez. I'm afraid this attitude

could lead to the collapse of what we've worked so hard to build. You are correct, Bethany. From a relationship perspective, can you offer some advice on how we can find a mutually agreeable way to decide what we invest in and continue to build wealth. George, you can answer the question, but Bethany, this is not a retirement question issue. This is a, your husband thinks he's smarter and better than you. Your husband thinks you are dumb and your husband placates you and pats you on the head and says, pat, pat, it's all going to be okay. And then he goes and does whatever he wants because let's be honest, he makes more money than you. And these kind of guys make my skin crawl.

They make my skin crawl because it's so nonsensical. So until you guys get that part of your marriage figured out, that y'all are together on the same team 50 50 who cares how much it's all going the same pot and um y'all just y'all decide we're going to build something together and now we're going to we're going to disagree over what bricks we're going to use and what stucco we're going to use for the house or whatever or the siding whatever then you can have the conversation about investment vehicles yeah this is one part of a much bigger story, which is your entire life. And I love that you're at least on the same page with the fundamental principles of we're debt-free,

fully funded, emergency fund. We've got three, I assume, paid for rentals if they're debt-free. So you're doing a lot of things correctly, but I don't like the arrogance and pride that he's projecting with this idea that like, I know better. Listen, I know you want to do these cute mutual funds. I want to do these venture capital funds and startups, which, by the way, have a lot more risk. Now, they can have more reward, but he's getting starry-eyed here. And the prideful investor is the one that's about to get his butt handed to him. Do you have any data on startup funding?

I haven't looked into that to see like the percentage that fail or the percentage that you know the volatility of these yeah my understanding that it's kind of like the bill gates and steve jobs it's like you don't got to go to college you don't need to get any kind of training look at bill gates and steve jobs like well good guys um okay cool so everyone's just like well just go back and invest in uber 20 years ago it's like it doesn't work like exactly that that people are like man i made a trillion dollar like uh uh ashton kutcher made so much money you're right he did he's better at this than y'all are and he knew some friends and had some good questions and he's a he's a very savvy investor um but that leaves out

the billions of dollars that are lost every year by some guy with the next app and the next new idea, the next good idea. It's just, man. And like Dave says, you can out earn your stupidity for a long time. And you guys are probably going to be fine because you're not over leveraged. You don't have a lot of debt, but I would say, hey, let's have some guardrails about how we invest. You like to invest here. I like to invest here. Let's set a foundation. We're going to max out all of our tax advantage retirement accounts. We're going to invest in. I like to invest here. Let's set a foundation. We're going to max out all of our tax advantage retirement accounts. We're going to invest in mutual funds. Then beyond this percentage, X percentage of our income, anything beyond that, you can invest.

This is essentially play money. Oh, I like that. So let's say 15. What's 15% of 600,000? Is that 90? Let's say it's, let's pretend it's 90. I can't do math like Dave Kane in his head. I was right, John. Let's say it's 90, I can't do math like Dave Cannon has had. I was right, John.

Let's say it's 90,000. Yeah, so we're going to cover, we're going to do all the matches. We're going to max out both our 401ks. We're going to fully fund the backdoor Roth IRAs. And we're going to fully max out the HSA. And then beyond that, here's how we're going to spend our money. Go play. And I think being in agreement on that and letting him have, you know,

hey, you're going to have $20,000 in play money. Or maybe since we make $600,000 and we have maxed out everything and everything's paid off, I'll double it. Yeah, of our $600,000 a year, we're going to take home about $450,000 of that. Go play with $50,000 of it.

Go play with $75,000 of it. Go start up whatever. Go set it on fire in the front yard and go start a business we're going to continue to be conservative with these basic principles over time so i just like having a little compromise here i don't think he's doing anything wrong but he's not listening to her and she's not giving her a vote and that to me is the part that's wrong in all of this yeah so i bethany your question um can you advise offer some advice on how we can find a mutually agreeable way to decide what we invest in? Let's start with, okay, we're in our mid thirties and we've

made millions of dollars. Our marriage is now different. He's married to a different wife. You're married to a different husband. Let's rebuild and reimagine our marriage as one of two people on the same page, doing the same thing, working towards the same goal. Let's start there. And asking, what are we really after? What do we want this thing to look like? If we hit 5 million, what then? Yeah. If we hit 10 million, what then?

And most people find they just had an arbitrary number and it just was exciting to chase the next thing. And then you hit 10 and it's like, well, let's double the business. Maybe you're not the kind of business leader that can run a $20 million company, but you can dominate a handshake $10 million company. Awesome.

Be that guy and do it well. Or get some people in your life that can help you with it. But let's have those conversations. Don't let them accidentally happen, because then you're right. You're going to accidentally just keep rolling and rolling and fall right off a cliff. Yeah.

Hope that helps. All right, Eric is in Portland up next. What's happening, Eric? Good morning. Thanks for taking my call. Sure. I've got a nine-year-old daughter who is fortunate enough to have inherited about $7,000, and I'm trying to decide what the best thing to do with that is. I don't know if a college fund or a mutual fund.

Crypto, man. Buy crypto. Just kidding. Don't do that, Eric. Don't do that. Someone's going to clip that call. John Deloney said. Wow. So who gave her this? My father passed away a few years ago. And this money is now sitting in a bank account somewhere? Correct. Yeah. Not doing anything. And is it in your bank account? No, my sister was in control, and so it's in an account that she has at the moment. Okay. But you can do what you would like with this money now? Correct, yeah. I think college is a great place to store this money because of the tax advantages.

It acts similar to a Roth IRA, to where you put this money away, it's going to grow tax-free for college-related expenses. Worst case, after I think it's 15 years now with the new Secure 2.0 Act, you're able to roll that over to a Roth IRA with no penalty if they don't end up needing or using it. So a lot of people are spooked, going, I don't want to put money there.

What if my kid doesn't go to college? Well, now you can roll over a certain amount to a roth ira and then that becomes retirement money for her so that's one option the other option is if there's a more short-term goal let's say hey her first car this is going to be the money that she's going to use and we're going to park this let's say she's nine let's say she's driving by what 16 i don't know what the organ age is yep yep but this is going to be money that goes toward the car and we're going to put it in a brokerage account in a mutual fund or index fund or even a high yield savings account and make five percent because the goal here is the 7k is not we're not trying to become multi-millionaires off the 7k right now

it's just what can we do to set her up well as she steps into adulthood? And so I think car or college are the best things, and the best vehicles would be a 529 plan for college, or you could do a brokerage account. There's also UTMAs and UGMAs and things you can look into that are under your control until she's 18. And Eric, this is terrible money advice. This is just the heart behind it all i like thinking when there's some some sort of inheritance i like thinking what would make the

person who left the money just sit back with that shoulders drop smile like if your dad's a car guy and he'd love to see your daughter pulling up in a car that's paid for in cash and he would just sit back and get a big grin on his face i don't know man i kind of lean that way and if your dad was all about you go to college you're getting educated you're getting educated and the thought that that his inheritance that he left to his daughter is going to grow and pay for part of her first semester of like like whoever your dad was like just that sitting back and smiling i i like to let that guide me a little bit it It's not going to make the final decision, but I sure like to imagine that moment.

Yeah, absolutely. Now, you said with the Roth IRA, if she doesn't use it after 15 years, we can roll it into a Roth if she decides not to go to school. Yes. And so don't let that spook you about, what if she doesn't go to college? There's going to be room to switch that account over.

So I think the fact you're calling in tells me you're going to make a good decision with this money. You're a great dad. Thanks for the call. Welcome back to the Ramsey Show. I'm George Campbell joined by Dr. John Deloney. Ryan's up next in Salt Lake City, Utah. What's happening, Ryan? Hey, guys. How's it going? Can you hear me all right? Yeah, you sound Utah. What's happening, Ryan? Hey, guys.

How's it going? Can you hear me all right? Yeah, you sound good. What's your question today? Perfect. Hey, so just a little bit of background. Rather, my question is, how do I manage my finances in regard to vehicular repairs when I have a wedding coming up in the fall while I'm at the same time trying to save for a home. Sounds like you're trying to do a lot at once. A little bit, yes, sir. The wedding has

a planned date. Did you already sign a contract for the venue and everything? Yes, sir. Okay. That one is immovable. How necessary and urgent are these vehicle repairs? So it's fairly mild. It's more a question of if I have too much truck. So maybe to provide a little context, I was in the Army, and I'm utilizing the GI Bill right now. And all the money I saved in the Army, I used to buy a car. And the truck I have now, which has turned into a work vehicle, started as a toy and now I use it as a work vehicle. It's just a lot of repairs one after the other.

So the plan was once I get married, sell her car, keep my car because it's a little on the nicer side. But I'm just worried that I'm spending too much money on repairs because the differential needs to be serviced here. The other needs to be fixed. Do you have any debt on these cars, or is this all debt-free? It's all debt-free. Okay.

Getting nauseous at the thought of pulling out a loan. What kind of truck is it? It is a 1997 F-350 with the diesel motor and manual transmission. Bro, that truck will be alive at the end. You'll ride that through the apocalypse. That's the plan. Okay. Man.

So you want to hang on to this for now. I would keep doing whatever necessary repairs and ride it through the fall. But the goal right now, I don't think you need to be in home buying mode yet. Let's just get through this wedding season, and it through the fall. But the goal right now, I don't think you need to be in home buying mode yet. Let's just get through this wedding season. And it is a season. It's going to have its ups and downs.

Let's rent for six months or a year. And then we can look into home ownership with your new spouse. Yes, sir. I guess the follow-up question to that truck is, I mean, I'd rather keep this truck than spend $100,000 on a brand new one. I'd rather just keep fixing this one until they don't make the parts anymore. Well, I'm guessing it's not worth much. No doubt. At what point are the repairs?

Clean out that dirty mouth of yours. It's emotionally worth a lot, but what could you sell it for with the issues on it? Yes, sir. Could you get a few thousand bucks? What's that threshold that we crossed? Because I can do all the repairs on my own. I was a mechanic in the Army. George is just trying to put a price tag

on a piece of American craftsmanship like that Ford F-350. Just don't listen to a word he's saying. I'm with Dr. John here. The truck's a master. I'm sure they'll feature it on American Pickers one day, but right now we've got financial goals. Yeah, it's very expensive. I don't want you to sink $8,000 into it if it's only worth $3,000.

Yes, sir. And I think that's the heart of your question, is how much do I really pour into this thing before it gives up the ghost and I go, we had a good time. Right. I guess I'm thinking like the replacement cost, like if I had to get another vehicle for work, like I'd much rather spend three grand on the transmission than sell that and get five out of it and spend 20 on a truck.

Agreed. So it's okay to pour a bunch of money in this versus going out and buying a $50,000 truck. And because it's a work truck, I would not spend a lot of money on it. It's a very utility thing. And so once you guys are married, I think that's the time to start making those kinds of decisions and prioritizing, hey, when do we want to buy a home? When is it time to upgrade the truck? All of that will come into play once you guys combine finances. But for now, unless it's on its last leg and you have to upgrade, I wouldn't. I'd keep doing these repairs, doing them yourself to save money.

It doesn't sound like you're going to pour much more than a few thousand more into it. No, sir. No, it's just trying to – well, I was saying good graces with your fiance, if you understand. Dude, I drove a 96, and my wife was finally like, Hey, you got to choose us, me or the truck. And I was, I was a long night of sleep. I lost before I finally settled on my 15 year marriage, but Hey, but listen, uh, actually she didn't do that at all. I was the one that was embarrassed enough that I just finally get rid of it. But, um, you have a picture and you're a good guy and you're working real hard and you're going to school, um, on the GI bill.

You're a serviceman. You're working hard with your truck, your mechanic. You can do all these things. And you have this picture of a guy that gets married and buys his wife a house. Don't you? Yes, sir.

Yeah. Just that picture is beautiful and it's right. And if you rush it, you're going to crash the whole thing. So just keep that picture on the fridge and tell your wife, we're going to save up. Here's our plan. Let's do it for a year, and let's do X and Y.

Let's do everything in order. George nailed it. Don't do everything at the same time, man. It's a recipe for everything being a little bit lukewarm and nothing just what you want. You're going to buy a house that's kind of, your wedding's going to be a little. If you add home shopping to your fiance's to-do list, she will explode on top of all the details she has to deal with for this wedding.

Yes. Even if it's chill for you, it's not for her. And so I would get through this. Let's get married. Let's see how much money we come to the table with. Let's make sure that she's on board, that we knock out our debts if she has any. We've got this big pile of money now on top of the emergency fund. Then you can make a decision with peace instead of rushing into it because you're trying to be

a great husband no doubt so you're on the right path and i would just uh put as much as you need to for the repairs within reason you know if there's something that's like this is gonna be 10 grand reason i would just say you know take a picture with it and sing a song i don't know what you do for trucks john when you say goodbye you never, take a picture with it and sing a song. I don't know what you do for trucks, John, when you say goodbye. You never say goodbye. The truck says goodbye to you, George. Oh, wow. And then it floats away into truck heaven?

I mean, there's some who have said they've seen that. All trucks go to heaven according to John. Out on the range, all trucks go to heaven. Priuses go somewhere else. Ron is with us in Oklahoma City. What's happening, Ron? Ron, he knows about a good truck out there in Oklahoma. How you guys doing? We're good, man. What's happening? He knows about a good truck in there in Oklahoma. How are you guys doing? Good, man. What's up? All you guys do.

Thank you. Almost 62. I feel bad asking this. I'm good, but I don't want to be stupid with my money in retirement. I've, I've learned to live on $2,500 a month, but now my checking account is going up $3,000 a month, and I feel like I'm wasting it. The only debt I have is my home, 40 acres with a mobile home, $500 a month. That's my only, well, you know, utilities. But you owe $500 a month on the mortgage? Yes. Okay. About three years left on that.

So I feel like this extra money has a goal. Let's pay off this mortgage. Okay. What else would you do with it? Because it's not a bank mortgage. It's to the guy I bought it from. He's getting older, and I've been feeling bad. Especially pay him off. Especially pay him off. A bank is faceless. This guy I bought it from. He's getting older, and I've been feeling bad. Especially pay him off.

Especially pay him off. A bank is faceless. This guy's got a face. And he's going to die, and his kids are going to sue you, and they're going to make up, it's going to be a mess. Pay him off. What's left on the mortgage? Okay.

On the loan? Oh, probably about 15 grand. Okay. How much money do you have in cash in the bank? 65. Ron, what are you doing? Pay it off today. You'll free up another 500 bucks, and you're going to be fine.

I will call him up today. Oh, I love it. I love it, Ron. What's your bigger retirement plan? It's a personal guy. It's not like some institution. Yeah, that's great. I don't worry about him.

They're good people. Obviously, get the title in writing, of course. But, hey, I want to go back to something you said when you first called. And I've grown so sick of this in our culture that we just beat up, on one side, we beat up the people, the least of these in our communities. And on the other side, we beat up those who have done really well and who have taken care of their business and have gotten lucky and have just been good stewards of their money and their jobs, don't ever be ashamed that you've done well and that you have found yourself in a... Sadly, I didn't learn it from you guys.

My parents lived through the Depression. I know. I learned how to be cheap. Hey, I'm with you. You should have listened to the last call. I'm with you. But find ways to be generous with that money. Find ways to enjoy that money and find ways to bless future generations, people

in your community. You can do a lot of good with that money, man. But don't be ashamed. I do enjoy the fact that I have several charities that I give to. I love it. Good. Yeah. You don't want to flat tire, Ron. That's the big passion, etc. That's the lesson here. So you can spend more, you can save and invest some of this into retirement accounts or brokerage accounts outside of retirement, and then you can give. And that's really the only three things you can do with money. So learn to get really good at all three. This is The Ramsey Show. Welcome back to The Ramsey Show. I'm George Campbell, joined by Dr. John Dillon. We've got some new events happening. One of those is Dave Ramsey's Investing Essentials.

And good news for all of you in America, this is a virtual event. So you can tune in from anywhere. You don't have to travel. You can enjoy it from the comfort of your home online. And Dave Ramsey and I will be deep diving on investing. And for the first time ever, he's going to share his personal playbook on investing, including how he buys real estate. And this is a two-night virtual event, about two hours per night, May 21st and 22nd. And yes, you can watch the replay, I believe for a week after for the general admission tickets, which is great. So even if you can't make it on those particular times and nights, be sure to grab your virtual tickets because you can tune in later. And this is not only going to

be covering real estate investing, but also how to maximize your 401k, how to choose mutual funds, what investing trends to follow, which ones to avoid. You do not want to miss it. RamseySolutions.com slash events is the place to go. And I'll tell you, John, I was in a meeting with Dave late yesterday as the team worked on the content for this. It ended with Dave doing like beautiful mind math with charts and graphs to where our brains were just melting with these like real estate formulas. It was insane. So I'm excited to see this come to life. I remember it was a few years ago. I'd only been working here for a few months and he called us all in the room. He's like, hey, I need to run something by you guys just in case you'll get a question on the show um about how

bond prices are sort of backdoor connected to interest rates and we sat down and he started talking and i i remember just the over the overarching thought i had was oh my gosh this guy's really smart and i think we forget right? Because he just tells people to sell the truck and kind of does his day. The dude's a savant. He's so accessible on the air, but his mind, it's a beautiful thing. He is brilliant in an impressive and terrifying way.

So I love that he's doing these events. He did one earlier this year with a group of baby step millionaires. It was a private event. Like, here's how I've done life. They're like, I built all this wealth? What now? What do I do?

How do I not ruin my kids? He's doing this. He's kind of like opening up his brain for us and saying like, hey, here's here's my playbook. Here's how the playbook that I've used in my home for this many years at a deep, deep dive. And it's pretty impressive. So be sure to tune in along with the brain melting.

You're going to leave with some a lot of hope and confidence in your wealth building plan and some great questions to start working through with your spouse, with your financial advisor. So go to ramsaysolutions.com slash events. Join us for Dave Ramsey's Investing Essentials, May 21st and 22nd. Ana is in Dallas, Texas up next. Ana, welcome to the show. Hi. Thanks so much for having me.

I'm so nervous. Hey, it's just John and I. You're going to be fine. How can we help? Thank you. Yes, so I just, you know, started listening to YouTube Shorts and I found you guys about a couple days ago. Cool. And yeah, I actually wanted to know, I work full-time at the moment, and I wanted to see, I took my LSAT, I got a really high score, and I was wondering if I should go to law school full-time or part-time and work full-time as well. High like 170, high like 165 and above, or high 155 and above. I got a 173. Wow, way to go. You're like a prodigy.

Congratulations. All right, so here's your goal. I don't think you're going to be able to work, and it's really, really, really discouraged for 1Ls. Most schools won't allow it. But with that score, I want you to find a law school where you will go for free you should not pay for law school with the score that high okay they're lucky to have you so i was wondering um i know my undergrad jpa was absolutely horrible i didn't know the value

of school i was you got a 173 sweetheart i'm telling you right now any admissions person listening to this would be like uh okay okay cool um yeah you might have to take some study skills courses right because law school is really really hard i worked in i worked at law school for six years it's really hard it's amazing what those students can do um but with the 173 there's gonna have people knocking on your door and they're gonna want to talk to you about your undergrad GPA, but don't walk in the door already with your head hung low. Many of us did way better in grad school than we did in undergrad because we just got through

undergrad and then we realized, oh man, life's important, right? Yeah. I would love to go to one of the top schools, but because I know like the ending salary will be high. However, I don't want to get into that 250K debt. Yes. But I want that. Yeah. But I want that. I don't know if I, it's probably not worth it is what you're saying, correct? I'm telling you, if you were my daughter and she came home and said, dad, I took the LSAT and I got a 173. I would love for her to go to law school. It's a trying, hard, hard experience. And they teach you how to think.

They teach you a different way of seeing the world. It's amazing. And I would say go to the best school you can go to for free. Period. And yes, I would forego all the fancy. They won't give it to me for free. They will. I don't know if I'm crazy.

They will. I would go to a second tier or third tier state school with that score for free. Because here's what you're going to do. You're going to walk out with a JD, with a Juris Doctorate, a law degree. And if you want to go work big law and have 2,200 billable hours and not see your friends or family, yeah, you can get a big salary right out of the gate. And I've done, my research was on lawyer mental health it's not great or you can get a job go serving folks and you can do any job in the world you want if you

don't owe anybody any money you're gonna have options you're gonna be able to make decisions with peace instead of just rushing into the first paying thing that's right and you might go to law school and be like dude i love estate law or i really love um i want, I want to go be a public defender. I want to be a prosecutor. Like going to school with no debt allows you to take, follow your guts where you want to go. Not like follow your dreams, not like that. Follow like where you are pulled. And law school will show you where you're pulled because you got to really commit to it. So go in there. And if you get into big contract law and you want to do big law, amazing. Go down that road. The 173, that tells me you've got the

computational power. You're going to have to learn some study skills. And you're going to have to really buckle down on that stuff. But man, go get it. Go get it. Go to the best school you can go to for free. You got a 173. You have a Willy Wonka ticket, my friend. And let's say that, you know, it is either

Yale or Stanford, the top at the moment, but they don't give me. Don't go. They give me a little bit. I'm just telling you what I would tell my sister or my daughter. Don't go. Don't go. Okay.

The Stanford law degree will look awesome, and you'll have some great networks, and you'll make some good money out the door. There's no question about that. Okay. And there's no way that I can probably work full-time then, right? Absolutely. They wouldn't allow it. Yeah. I think many schools, if I remember correctly, the ABA had something to say about it. They may have shifted a little bit and changed somewhat,

but no, for a full-time program, you got to be there. And once you get into it and realize what it is, you'll realize you can't work. I mean, you're reading hundreds and hundreds of pages a day and not just reading them, but you're reading them so that you can recite them in front of a professor the following day. It's a tough, tough slog. Are you in a good place financially right now? I would say so. I have about $65,000 in savings. Oh, you're so far into the game.

You're amazing. No debt? Actually, I have a $24,000 car loan, which I could pay off, but I haven't yet. I only paid 11K in cash. Today. I want to borrow a home. Today. I officially know you're smarter than that. I know your LSAT score. You're smarter than that. Pay it off today. Okay. Okay. And don't worry about other big goals like home ownership and all that. That will come later on. Right now, your one focus would be let's apply let's do early applications let's perfect the application the personal statement

all of that stuff maybe consider those lower ranking schools in order to go debt-free okay okay that's going to be your best path you will never call in with regret that you didn't go to the xyz school when you're the first one to graduate and all your peers are drowning in debt going what are you going to do i got to go to work man i got 250 thousand dollars in loans and you know i get to choose let me tell you something great about the the the loan i mean the the law school ranking system uh george and i'm and i'm talking to you but george or on i'm talking to you but i'll tell this to george so they they were trying to figure out how important these things are and much of it is voting. So they actually mail stuff out to other professors and law school deans, specific people, and they say, rank these schools. And so it's a reputation score. What do you think about these

guys? Well, they stuck, I think it was Penn in there, Penn State, and it ranked very high, like top 15, top 10, like law schools. There was no law school. It didn't exist. It was simply a, oh, that's a pretty good school, man, yeah, and they wrote down. And so it tells you that the ranking system's very flawed, incredibly flawed. Would a Stanford law degree be good? There's no question about that. Anyone who tells you, no, it's a waste, it's not.

It'll be amazing. And I know some students that have changed everything in their family tree, going to second and third and fourth year law schools, and they went and worked their butts off helping people in the community, and they've done amazing things. Love it. Great advice there. Thank you so much for the call, Ana.

That puts this hour of The Ramsey Show in the books. Thank you to Dr. John Deloney, all the guys and gals in the booth, keeping the show afloat, and you, America, will be back before you know it. Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, it's The Ramsey Show, where we help people build wealth, do work that they love, and create amazing relationships. I'm Ramsey personality George Campbell, joined by bestselling author Dr. John Deloney. Open phones at 888-825-5225. You call us and we'll help you take the right next step for your life, your relationships, your emotional health, and of course, your money. Amber's going to kick us off this hour in Denver,

Colorado. Amber, welcome to The Ramsey Show. How can we be of service? Hi, thank you for taking my call. Sure. What's going on? I'm kind of nervous. That's all right. Take your time. My husband and I are in baby step number two. I just recently, like two months ago, started listening to you guys. And then I just kind of told my husband, here's what I'm going to do and here's why. I do the budget in our house. He just trusts me to do everything and he just kind of lets me do it.

But now I'm throwing all of our extra money at our debt. So we have nothing left, you know, like to do fun stuff with. And he says that he's on board and he understands why I'm doing it. But then like every weekend, it seems like he's like, well, we have no money and I work so much and I'm working for, where's all my money going? And so I just, I don't, I kind of wrote down the baby steps for him and tried to explain it. And I just don't know how else to, he says he's on board, but then again, it seems like he's not yeah he's he's not he's not um is your husband kind of a brat or are you are you kind of the the dictator in the house

both i mean i guess i don't i i's a brat. Was mama gets what mama wants? Is that the kind of house? Or is it, no, I'm trying, and your husband's just kind of a whiny baby? I think he just feels like he works 52 hours a week, and so I think he just feels like he works so much, and he's not seeing where it's going. Okay. But he knows it's going to debt.

He knows, because I tell him, yes. But that's not enough for him. Even enough for him even though he said well babe i trust you so you just do what you want until it affects my life exactly and all of a sudden i have opinions until i get poopy pants and then i'm gonna throw my little temper tantrum here's the deal most of the time we hear this call um when people go at some at their at their spouse with a plan it almost always fails i got this plan we're gonna do this thing and it's gonna cost you your truck or your minivan or your suburban or your fun time but we're doing this plan that almost never works what does seem to work time and time again is i'm so scared i can't breathe in this house. We owe this much money and if we want to have a family, if we want to go do these things, if you want to retire someday, if something were

to happen to you, I can't breathe. Can we follow this crazy plan with these crazy group of people out of Nashville, Tennessee? It's millions of people had done it and it's going to suck for two or three years. Can we hold hands and do this together? That's been the way we've seen it work. Two people have to be on the same page and commit to, yeah, it's gonna be a lot of Saturdays where we're staring off into space. We're going fishing with worms we dug with our own hands. Or if you're George, you're just going to use that same vape cartridge over and over and over again, right, even though it's empty. I just threw up in my mouth. You just got to – but you see what I'm saying? Like, that's how you get each other on the same page.

It's a shared common vision. It's not just another Tupperware plan or an Avon plan or an essential oils plan. This is like a life change. Does that ring a bell? Yeah. I mean, I did kind of explain that to him in that way, just not in those exact words. And he, when I, when I tell him, he does say he gets it and he, he's on board. It's just, he does some kind of... He's saying that with his mouth, but he needs to show it with his actions, his attitude, his behavior

that he's all in. Have you sat down with him and said, hey, we're three weeks into this or four weeks into this or two months in. And every time you say that on the weekends, it makes me just want to quit because I don't want to be the person all by myself trying to hold this thing together. Have you said that to him? I mean, I told him it makes me feel guilty because a lot of the debt is my student loan. Okay. It's not his and he makes more money

than me. And then I feel like I feel guilty. Like I'm taking all his money. No, he signed up to marry you, hon. For better or for worse. And how much he makes versus you make has nothing to do with it. If you stay at home today and produce zero income for the family, you still get just as much as a vote. And if that's how he's... I don't know. It sounds like you've put that on yourself. That he makes more money, therefore he can do what he wants and he can have his attitude.

But it sounds like you guys have not been on the same page since you've been married. Is that fair to say? I mean, I don't know. How long have you been married for? I know, I know. Hey, Amber, stop saying that, okay?

You keep saying he's saying it, but he's not doing it. He's saying it. Behavior is a language. What is he saying every Saturday when he gets after you for not having any money, for spending his money? Oh my gosh, I worked too hard for not, what's he telling you? He's telling you, I don't care what I agreed to.

I'm gonna make you feel bad for my discomfort, my short-term discomfort. Even though you're trying to save the family, I'm making you do it all by yourself. I'm gonna make you feel bad. That's what he's saying with his actions. And it's fair for you to say, stop hurting me like that. Quit. We agreed on this.

I don't want to hear you complain about it all weekend. And you have to stop carrying around this, I'm less than, I'm inferior, I feel guilty. Y'all both signed up for this deal, this ride together. How much debt did you bring into the marriage? I have two student loans. One of them is $32,000 and one of them is now $18,000, but it was at $25,000. Okay, so $50,000. And then how much did he bring in? He didn't bring in any, but then as we got married, we bought a car and he got a motorcycle. Okay.

So what's your total debt profile right now? About $90,000. Okay. What can you sell tomorrow? I don't know. The motorcycle? I have sold a lot. The motorcycle? I have sold a lot. The motorcycle? I won't let that happen.

Do what? He won't sell his motorcycle. Do you own it outright or has it got payments on it? We just owe $4,000. Just? This is how we get here. Well, it's just $4,000. It's just a student loan.

It's just a credit card. Is it your next lowest debt? It is the lowest debt. It will take us two months and it will be paid off. Okay. Will you breathe after that? After his precious little motorcycle that's more important to him than his wife's sanity? Will you

be able to breathe after you get that motorcycle safe and secure? I don't know. Okay. You just have the voice as though you've been dragging this thing all by yourself. How much money do you all make together? About $80,000. Okay. You got more debt than you do income. This is a problem. We need more shovel. If I gave you Financial Peace University, would he agree to go through it and watch all nine lessons

with you? I think he would. Done. I'm going to give it to you anyways. But you need him on the page. We're going to give you the EveryDollar app too, so y'all can be on the same page with all of your daily, your spending every day and every month.

You threw Ramsey at him, Now we need to walk with him and show him the journey instead of Dave being a cuss word in the house. I think that will change things. You went to the mountaintop, found the Ten Commandments, brought it back down, and all of a sudden he got a list of rules. We need to change that narrative. Hope it helps. This is The Ramsey Show. Welcome back to The Ramsey Show. I'm George Campbell, joined by Dr. John Maloney. You've heard us mention every dollar on the show, and that is our budgeting app that we created to help you make the most of your money. And you know, if you've heard the show, your greatest wealth building tool of your income, how do you control that income? Well, you got to do a budget.

And it makes it real simple to plan your spending, track expenses, and save for what matters most to you, all in an easy-to-use app. And you can download it on the App Store for free or Google Play today. I would highly, highly recommend it. Thomas is up next in Fort Collins, Colorado. What's going on, Thomas? Hi, thanks for having me. Sure. I'm Colin. I'm currently a college student at CSU. I'm 20 years old and starting in August, my college fund will be running out and I'm going to be having to be paying everything out of pocket. Currently, I pay for about half of my expenses. My current rent, along with my tuition, is paid for from this college account. But starting again in August, that will be completely gone. So I'll be adding around $800 to $900 a month in expenses for me,

not including cost of school. And I was wondering what I should do to be paying for those extra expenses. Who was paying? You said it was all coming from the college account? Is family helping out at all? Yes. So this college account was set up by my parents. So I was fortunate enough where, you know, they say they're a large sum of money.

However, you know, it's not enough to fully cover four years of college. Okay. And they knew that going in, did they have a conversation saying, Hey, when this money runs out, here's the plan? Or was it just be with God? Good luck. Yes. Um, it's, it's, you know, we've not really talked much about it. Um, I know the expenses are on me. Um, You know, they just don't have the money to throw at college for me. Okay, so they're unable to help at all. This is all going to be on you, and you want to avoid taking out loans. Where do you work, dude? So that's another point. So currently, I work for myself. I, I do, um, coins and precious metals sales. Um, do you make any money? And I do, I make around 15,000 a year at the moment. Um, but I am raised, I mean, that's

my pace averaging out this year. Um, I am on, you know, I'm increasing my average sales, you know, week over week, basically. How much time are you putting into that? It depends. So I directly in sales, I do around eight hours a week. Then that's another around six hours a week in shipping time, as well as another probably six to eight hours in inventory sourcing. You're talking like 22 hours a week? Yep. For $15,000 a year?

Yeah, but the advantage for me is, you know, I work odd hours, you know, because it's myself. And so the times that I work normally or at night, um, well, here's the deal, Thomas, this is a hobby and it's probably a hobby that you love and it's cool, but it's not a job.

You got to go get some job where you can make some money. You're about to lose your ability to go to college. Yep. No, that's my question was, do I ramp up this summer or just go and get a full time job over the summer to start building a nest egg as well before getting back into the school year where I can't work as much.

I was able to work full-time and have a family and go to school full-time as a doctoral student. I think you can figure it out, especially your senior year. Unless, are you an engineering student? No, I was, but I switched out of it. Okay, what's your major now? I'm in business. I'm undecided between accounting or finance. Yeah, you can work. You can work like mad. And if you get a job in accounting or finance adjacent, you can make some good money and do something close to or next door to what your major is going to be. When you graduate,

and you'll kill three birds with one stone. You'll make some money. You might even get some internship hours out of it, and you're going to have something to put on a resume for somebody to hire you one day. But yeah, I would put this thing on the hobby burner and go get some real jobs, make it some real money. Based on the math, you're making about $14, $15 an hour doing this on a good week, a good month.

And so if you can find something making 18 or 20 out there, that's great. If you can somehow scale up this business and make the same or more with less time, that's a different ballgame. Yeah. So basically my pace, as I said, was 15,000 averaging out. Over the past two months or so, I have basically doubled in scale where I basically make around 10% profit margins. But you can't put more time into it. You can't be spending 30 hours a week doing this. Correct.

And so that's the thing to figure out. And I'm not having more time. Okay. What's school going to cost per month? You said 800 a month for rent. What about school per month in order to cash flow? Sorry, as in like student loans for that? To avoid loans, how much extra do you need per month?

Too much. Tuition is around $20,000 a semester. So what's your plan? To take out student loans for college, but I'm basically just trying to avoid any other loans. It's $20,000 a semester? What are you talking about? More like $16,000 a semester. Are you out of state?

I am out of state, yes. Oh, geez, man. So why CSU? Just to get a general, you're not even sure what you want to do, maybe finance, maybe accounting. You know, I had initially picked here for engineering um and i'd switched my major as you know i just didn't but what's holding you at this college versus just hey i'm gonna take a pause i'm gonna go work i'm gonna save up some money i'm gonna finish

at another in-state school or whatever and finding a cheaper option yep i don't think it's worth dropping another $40,000 a year to finish this degree. No. Where's home, dude? New Jersey, but not for long. My parents are moving out of the country. Okay. That's where my kind of predicament is.

Here's the thing. Here's the challenge you've left yourself this was a math problem three years ago and you knew this math problem was going to be on you and now it's two months away and you're going i'm going to be broke yep so what was the game plan to cover the next three years of school um at the time um i was not aware. Expenses came up, and I thought that there was going to be more money than there was, kind of a miscommunication. Did you blow through the money? Was it supposed to get you through more time?

It was not, no. Okay. There was supposed to be more. I thought I was under the impression that there was more money than there was. So you didn't have the conversation with your parents to go? Yeah, I didn't have the... We did, but we didn't. So here's the conversation I want you to have.

I've never tried this. I don't know if it'll work, but I want you to give it a shot, okay? I want you to go down to the admissions office and or to your... Yeah, go down to the admissions office and ask and let them know I'm going to have to withdraw from

campus and they'll probably have some campus program for you some kind of student success program for students who are going to withdraw and tell them i'm going to have to withdraw for financial reasons unless i can get this move to in-state tuition and if it's in-state tuition then i can work like bananas and i can pay this thing as we go otherwise Otherwise, I have to leave. And here's the thing I'm wondering. If you drop out, if you leave for a year, and you've established residency in Colorado, can you turn around and come back the next year and get in-state tuition? And if so, take a year off. Do what? I need two years for it to be in-state tuition. Okay. And my problem has been that I haven't changed my residency to Colorado early enough. How many more years do you need?

So I would need another full year, which I guess to your point would work. Yes. And so ask them because they can flip a switch and move it from out-of-state to in-state. They can do that. Yep. Okay? Yeah. And I would go sit down with them and say,

my parents are leaving the country, and I'm about to be in a mess. If I can stay and graduate, which is a big deal to them. They need students to graduate because the graduate rates are dismal. And just use and see. Maybe you'll get lucky. Maybe not. Maybe they'll tell you, dude, you've got a 2.1. You don't want to be here.

We can tell you don't really care. And they're not going to help you out. But maybe you'll get lucky. But, dude, don't take out loans for a degree. You don't even know if you want it or not or where you're going or where you're headed. Don't do that, man. Hang on the line. Thomas, we're going to send you Ken's new book, Find the Work You're Wired to Do with the Get Clear Career Assessment, to help you make the right choice.

And I'll also send you my book, Breaking Free from Broke. Specifically, read the student loans chapter to fully understand the gravity of the situation and what could end up on the other side. Hang on the line. We'll send you those two books. Wishing you the best. This is The Ramsey Show. I'm George Campbell, joined by Dr. John Deloney. This is The Ramsey Show.

Open phones at 888-825-5225. Kevin is up next in Colorado Springs. Kevin, welcome to the show. Hey, thank you. I really appreciate that. Sure. How can John and I help? Yeah, so I've only been watching and listening to you guys on YouTube and, and the live show occasionally for the past three weeks. Welcome to the gang,

dude. Thanks. I know. Yeah. I'm a little late, unfortunately, but I'm here and I'm ready to get some stuff done. But I'm kind of ran into,

as we're doing baby steps one and prepping for baby step two, I ran into an issue with my truck. I know one of the steps is just sell everything. Um, and we've pretty much done that with the exception of, of my truck and, uh, my wife's vehicle. Unfortunately we're upside down on my wife's vehicle because she got rear ended and then a hell storm and we didn't have gap insurance. So we got an, got her a new vehicle and we were upside down on it. But in my genius, seven months ago, I bought a brand new truck. Thinking like, oh yeah, I deserve it and we're

fine. We got $3,000 extra a month left over. And now I have a truck that I can't sell because I don't think anyone's going to want to buy it specifically because why would they spend that amount of money on a truck that has 8,000 miles versus zero? You would be surprised. Yeah, you'd be surprised. Really? Okay. What's the loan on it? I have $43,000 left. And what could you sell it for, private party?

I mean, $43,000 is what they're paying for like a brand new one a 2023 model i haven't looked at the 2024 okay so you might be able to get 41 000 for it yeah and then there's the warranty that i could probably maybe convince someone to get you know you might be able to get that refund yeah you Yeah, you might get it refunded. Yeah, yeah. Just fight them. So I might be able to break even on it. Okay. I do have a family vehicle I could borrow for a while.

Perfect. But... Done. No buts, no buts, no buts. Done. Do it? Yes. What's your household income? Bro, you're drowning.

And if no... Well, I guess my concern is no one wants to buy it, right? You bought it. That's a fake concern. No one buys it. Yeah, that's a fake concern. Just admit you don't want to get rid of the truck. Yeah, it probably is awesome.

You bought the truck. 8,000 miles is nothing. Yeah, 8,000 miles is basically new. It's good. Many people go for that barely used vehicle. That's a lot of people out there. Barely used. Barely used.

And then with that extra money, so our mortgage is pretty clear, clean cut. We don't owe anything on the monthly payments because we have a few family members living with us and we actually make $800 extra a month on top of our mortgage. Would you focus on my wife's upside down vehicle so we can sell that as well or focus on like IRS or our credit card debt? What's your household income? 117 a year. And what's your total consumer debt, not including mortgage? Not including mortgage, about 120. Bro, you make too much money to be this broke yeah I agree I thought I was of the

until three weeks ago when I found you guys I was of the understanding that that's just something you do you get debt you fight for your credit score to be high and I totally bit the poison apple and just let it consume me. And now I'm trying to reverse all of that.

You are broke, right? Not really. We have, by estimates, because this is the first month, we have $3,000 extra left over a month after all our bills are paid. Okay, what if you had no bills? Yeah, we would have. And by the way, if one of you gets fired or laid off, and if you've watched the news lately,

layoffs are just coming in waves now. Yeah. It's over. You've built a house of cards. You're going to have to start a family eventually. You have built a house of cards and you're hoping somebody doesn't fart in the living room, dude. You're just so hopeful. You're broke.

Until you internalize that, you're not going to be able to go through the pain of what George is going to walk you through because it's going to be painful to get out of debt. It's going to suck. You're going to be driving a family car making that kind of money. You're going to have a cool truck. My wife and I are totally okay with it. I've already kind of shown her this.

What else can you sell in this debt? Is it just her car, your truck, IRS debt? What else is in this pile? Nothing else. We've sold everything else. I've gotten rid of a ton. No, you have $120,000 in debt. So 43 of that is your truck.

What else? Credit card. I would say credit cards like we bought a new stove. Our stove went out. A new dishwasher when it went out because we bought the house. What's the credit card debt total? About $22,000. Okay, what else is in that $120,000? The IRS is about $27,000, and then the other two large portions are the two vehicles.

Okay, the $43,000 and then the rest is your wife's? What's left on her loan? Yes, about 32, and we're upside down by about 3,000. I'll sell that too, dude. Go to a credit loan. It's only by 3,000? Do you have any money in the bank? We're at like 800, working towards the... So you're bragging about the extra 3,000. Where is it all going? Bro, call me. Well, this is our first month. We're going to find out at the end of May exactly how much we have left,

and all of it's going on something. Okay, scrape together the difference. What is that step? Scrape together the difference that you're underwater on in both of these vehicles, and then get rid of both. And if you need to save up a little more to get her a beater car, because you might have a hard time getting two family members to let you borrow cars, then do that and get her a beater car for now.

That leaves you with the IRS debt and the credit cards. You're going to do the IRS debt first. That goes to the top of the debt snowball. They'll come for your soul, brother. Okay. Okay. So you're going to tackle the IRS debt. Then that'll leave you with all the different credit cards. And you're going to tackle the IRS debt. Then that'll leave you with all the different credit cards,

and you're going to tackle those smallest to largest balance. And by then you will have freed up the truck payment, the car payment, the IRS payment, which means you're going to get a lot of steam and momentum on that final debt. Yeah, we were going to do credit card debt first because our IRS payment is like $200 a month. It's not much, and we were going to get rid of the credit card debt first because our assumption is we'll be done with that in eight to nine months, and that'll free up $2,000 extra a month. Now is not the time to do math.

Bro, has your plan worked? Just be honest. No, because I didn't really have one. Exactly. The other plan was the regular plan. We tell you this not out of arrogance, but because we've seen thousands of people, 10 million people have followed this plan, and we've got to witness the stories. And the debt snowball is the best way to do it, and it's going to take scorched earth and sacrifice.

And right now you're sitting on about $80,000 in cars. And depreciating assets. Yep, yeah, absolutely. So we are done living la vida loca. We're going to sell everything, and it's going to be a year or two or three of hard sacrifice, but you have a great income. You guys make 117 grand. So once you sell these cars, it's going to just go zoom, zoom, and you're going to be debt-free probably within a year if you buckle down. How much of a loss would you take on the vehicle? As much as you need to, because dude, let's say you take a $10,000 loss. You have $80-something thousand wrapped up in cars, and

now you're down to only owing $10,000. You win. You just knocked off $70,000 in depreciating asset debt. Okay. And it's only going to get worse over time the longer you keep it. The goal is you want to sell it for as much as you can. Do not go to the dealership and trade it in,

because they'll be happy to screw you on another deal. Absolutely. So sell it for a private party. You can check the Kelley Blue Book value, clean it up nice, take good photos, do your due diligence there. But you don't need to take a giant loss. From what you told me, you're only a few thousand bucks underwater on each of these. Yeah, that's about it. Yeah.

And make an extra $3,000 a month, you're going to be ready to do this deal within two months. Okay. And then George has on his... Put some of that on the trucks and the vehicles to get a little less underwater, get rid of them, and then everything goes to IRS. You can't sell the car until you clear the loan, and because you're underwater, you need to come up with a difference. I would rather you go to a credit union and take out a $5,000 loan at a credit union to get rid of the cars. To get rid of $80,000 in loans.

And you're going to go down to $5,000. Okay. All right. I never heard that before. I know. It's the only time we're okay with you going, quote, into debt because you're really able to get rid of so much debt. Hang on the line, dude. We're going to hook you up with Financial Peace University.

You sound like a good guy, dude. I know you work your butt off, and it sounds like you're just doing the next thing and the next thing and the next thing, and all of a sudden you're underwater. We're going to send you FPU, but you and your wife have to go through this class together. You've got to promise me you're going to use it.

We're also going to send you the best budgeting app on planet Earth for a year for free. It's the EveryDollar app, but you've got to use it, and you're all going to be you the best budgeting app on planet Earth for a year for free. It's the EveryDollar app. But you've got to use it, and you're all going to be free faster than you know it. Thanks for the call, man. This is The Ramsey Show. Welcome back to The Ramsey Show. I'm George Camel, joined by Dr. John Deloney.

Our scripture of the day, 1 John 3.18, Dear children, let us not love with words or speech, but with actions and in truth. Aldous Huxley once said, facts to not cease to exist because they are ignored. Interesting. Go back to that Bible verse real quick. Put that up there. That's scripture verse. That's 1 John 3.18. Dear children, let us not love with words or speech, but with actions and in truth. Yeah, this is the original way of behaviors of language, man. That's true. That's what you're going to say.

The OG right here. That's it, man. I love it. It's one of my favorites. It's all about the action. Just stop talking and go serve your neighbor. Show me. Don't tell me.

Stop talking. Go serve the widow, dude. If you're this or that, shut your mouth and go do the next right thing. It's just so good. That's a good principle to live by right there.

I love it. All right, let's go to the lines. Brittany is in Kansas City up next. Brittany, welcome to the show. Hi, thank you so much for taking my call. Absolutely. My question is quite weird,

but to make it as simplistic as possible, how do I go about not being solely responsible for the taxes and upkeep on inherited property? Who's involved here? Very long story short, my grandfather passed in November, and he's pretty wealthy, he made my sister and I 50-50 heirs on his liquid, stocks, bonds, and his house. The three properties that are undeveloped would be owned by me, my sister, and my uncles. How many uncles? Two. Okay. So there's three properties that are split between four of you, and then the stocks, bonds, and house is split between two of you, your sister and yourself.

All correct, except one of the properties is just me and my sister. Okay. All right. And so you're paying these property taxes, and you're saying, I don't want to pay this? Are you paying these on your own? Well, he just passed in November. So luckily this year, the state was able to pay for the taxes. But at the reading of the will, I had stated that I cannot be the sole person paying for the upkeep. Well, your sister's the other person on the, she's on the deed. My sister's on the house and my uncle's and my sister are on the property. But you're paying property taxes on all of it? I will come, what, next year? But that's, is that anywhere actually in the legal document?

I'm not, I'm not sure. Or did they, why did your family decide you're the person who's going to pay all this on your own and then they're not going to chip in well it's kind of unspoken like i said it's kind of a long story but my grandfather always took care of the taxes and always like took care of my uncle and my sister's living expenses. They would make $10 and spend $100. They've never been reliable on money. They've never been reliable to pay bills. Well, the beautiful thing now is you're not your granddad,

and you get to change that. No, and I told them that. I said, I don't make the income he ever made. Here's the deal. If they don't pay their share of property taxes, then they don't get the house. Yeah, it gets repoed. It gets taken away. And so that's part of the deal here.

And so could you just force the sale of all of these and have a conversation and say, listen, you guys are not in a financial position to actually manage this, and therefore we're going to sell it, everyone's going to get their piece, and we're going to be done with this. Is that a solution? I can, and my lawyer did bring that up, but they responded with, oh, well, this is three generations of inherited property. We can't let it go. But they can't afford it.

Here's the thing. It's going to go away. No, they can't. It's going to go away. Whether you all sell it, you can get some money for it, or it's going to get taken from you. It's going to go away, period. They can it, you can get some money for it, or it's going to get taken from you. It's going to go away. Period.

They can't afford it. And this is not your job. They would have to agree, right? You can force the sale of it. I mean, here's the thing. The more complicated it gets, the more expensive it's going to get for everyone. If you have to go to court for all of this. And so the best thing to do is everyone come to an agreement.

The next best thing to do is everyone come to an agreement. The next best thing is mediation. Then if that doesn't work out, you'd have to go to the court system and go, we got to figure all of this out and it's going to be messy. It'd be like a partition lawsuit on your hands. So it seems like at the end of the day, I'm still going to have to pay something, whether it's court fees or trying to buy them out. I think you need to show them what's going to happen if we don't make a decision as a group instead of just going, hey, we're going to fight this tooth and nail. You say, we can't afford this. You guys can't afford this. I'm not paying the property taxes on my own. So we need to come to an agreement on what we're going to do, on how

we're going to sell, when we're going to sell, who's going to get what. And let me ask you this. How much is this property worth? The house I know was worth like $275,000. And the land, like the three properties of undeveloped land, I don't know. I have not gotten an estimate or anything. I want to ask you something crazy, okay? And this is not going to make great fiscal sense, but I'm just doing this for your soul, okay? Okay. You have, how much did all the stocks and cash and all the liquid assets, what did you get? What was that inheritance for you?

A million. A million bucks? A million. Okay. Yeah. What's the soul tax for you to sign this over to your nearest uncle and walk away from this house you got a million dollars and i don't want to lose my family i don't want to fight it's going

to come up to 275 plus some land maybe it's going to be 500 000 total maybe 600 000 total divided up across all these different people you know what merry christmas I'm out. Y'all can figure it out. It's going to get taken from them. You know that. We know that. But then you're not spending money on attorneys and all that different garbage. I'm just walking away from it.

If I'm going to have a million dollars in cash and I have the legacy of my granddad that I get to honor, and at the same time, I'm not going to continue his funding of people who are just leeches off of him. I'm not going to do that anymore. I feel like it's wrong. I would take a hard look at walking away.

You know, to be honest, immediately after he died, I had said that. You all can take it, have it all. But then it was the whole, like you were saying, the emotional soul tie thing. And it's like, oh, well, you know, not to make it a race thing, but, you know, we're a family of color. And, you know, it's not really, you know, popular for us to have three generations of land and we can't let this go. And I'm just sitting there like, well, you're basically telling me you need to you need to pay for this you need and i i just think that's so unfair for i i i agree with you a hundred percent and i'm going to be honest with you i'm heartbroken that your family is putting you in this position because it's not fair and it's not right and it's not honoring

your granddad's legacy just not it's not it's manipulative and it's vindictive because you got the money and they didn't. And they should have got the money and not you. And they're mad. So now that you're rich, you get to pay for everything. And I'm just sorry that they are dishonoring your granddad in this way. I appreciate that. And me and my grandfather were extremely close. And he said that, you know, throughout his lifetime,

they spent their inheritance. There you go. There's a reason he trusted you to manage more of this, and you need to honor that. What an honorable thing. And if I'm in your shoes, I would get a mediator, because right now it's you against the rest of your family, and you need that neutral third party to tell them the facts,

and it can't be coming from you because it clearly is not going to go well i'm sorry sweetheart i would go that route before a lawsuit i'm proud of you and i hate that you've been put in this position jeez thank you thank you both i um like i said that was my immediate reaction was to just walk away from it all and i hadn't revisited that until you all just said that so i definitely will take it yeah and sit with your lawyer i'm not saying it's the right thing. And maybe that land is worth millions and millions, and this is a terrible idea, but I,

I'm just not going to cash in my soul over this. I'm just not, I'm just not because you're, you're fighting people that have no scruples. You're fighting people that have no, um, they're not trying to honor anything other than you give me mine and they're inventing day by day. They're moving the finish line of what mine is and you can't win that competition and dude i'm all about legacy land i'm trying to buy some for my family but also i can't control what happens three generations from now i can't and what's the end game here i mean what's the like you know 10 years

from now what are we doing with all you know seven of you involved in this process and who gets to decide what happens to the land, what gets built on it? It just feels like a messy thing. And for that reason, I would want out of this, whether that's selling it or you just opting out. Maybe they buy you out, but they're broke. So it's going to pose a problem. So it's not going to be fun. It's going to be messy. But I think mediation is the next best course of action before you make it even messier with lawsuits and more lawyers. But gosh, what a sad situation, Brittany. That puts this hour of The Ramsey Show in the books. Thank

you to Dr. John Deloney, all the folks in the booth keeping the show afloat, and you, America, thanks for listening. We'll be back before you know it. Hey guys, I'm Rachel. And I'm George. And you've probably heard our voices before on The Ramsey Show. And do we have a surprise for you. Yep, we have our very own show, Smart Money Happy Hour, where we talk about pop culture, current events, and of course, money. George, it's a great show.

And what else do we talk about? So much, Rachel. Not enough. And yet too much. We talk about guilt tipping because tipping is out of control and I won't stand for it anymore, which is why I'm sitting. I'm glad you're taking such a stand. And we also talk about something else I'm passionate about, Disney adults. Why is it a thing? Listen, some adults still find the magic. Sure. We also talk about toxic money traits and girl math. And if you don't know what those are,

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