The Ramsey Show - If You Don’t Deal With the Core Issue You’ll Always Struggle With Money

Episode Date: April 1, 2024

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Девочка-пай Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, it's The Ramsey Show, where we help people build wealth, do work that they love, and create actual amazing relationships. Ken Coleman, Ramsey personality, number one bestselling author of the book Paycheck to Purpose, and he is our guy that helps you develop in your whole area of your work where you can be a better person and make more money. He's here helping us today. So you've got questions about jobs, careers, all that kind of junk.

Well, hey, we're ready. And we'll even talk to you about whatever it is you want to talk about that's what we're here for the phone number is 888-825-5225 mindy is in beautiful portland maine to start off this hour love your city mindy how are you i've been well how are you better than i deserve serious just walk down to the dock and get some fresh lobster anytime you damn want it's amazing yep how can we how can we help today so um my husband is a firefighter and i'm kind of young but will be but is actually um uh can retire at this time he's not going to be 50 until this summer um but he but he has put his time in so um they are starting a program at the fire station where it's a retire rehire so he will start to um so he'll stay basically doing his job but he'll start to get his pension

on plus his salary in talking to him we've been working the baby steps for the last, oh gosh, almost 10 years, I guess. And we are debt free. And he's saying he wants to put his pension straight into retirement. But we still have $112,000 on the house. So we still have a mortgage. And so I'm kind of wanted to talk to you about, is that really the right place? And the other background, I just think that's important to

know is I have a chronic heart condition. So I'm in my mid-40s. I was born with it. And it's something that I probably won't be able to, you know, really work for a long, long time. I'm not eligible for term life insurance because of it. And about a year ago, a year and a half ago, I had a big medical event. And it really made me weigh my life of I want to do more before I can't. So I'm hoping in the next, you know, five years, maybe 10, that our mortgage will be gone and I'll be able to go down in hours of my job. I do love my job, so that's not it. It's just a matter of the strain. Yeah. Well, good question. So you sound like you've been

listening a little bit and you know some of the things we talk about, but not the whole thing, based on what you're saying. I think I do, but I think he's off on this one. Well, he's off because you know the answer, then. You're setting him up for a fall because you know the answer. The answer is we're going to tell you to work the baby steps, and it sounds like you're debt-free with an emergency fund not counting your house, right? That is correct, yes. Which puts you at baby steps four, five, and six, and you're putting 15% away for retirement already of your household income? Yes, we are, both of us. Okay, if your income goes up because of retire, rehire, then you would raise the 15% up to be 15% of your new

income, but you would not put his entire new retirement back into retirement. We would continue with baby steps four five six kids grown and gone do you need to save anything for kids college no we have an 11 year old so we are working okay so kids college needs to be addressed and beyond that we pay on the house which is your goal so you already knew you won the argument with us yeah but you know what i didn't actually think of it as a new income because i was just kind of thinking it very separate so this is actually really helpful no he got a raise yeah that's all it is i mean he goes out on retirement he starts getting his

retirement and he goes back to work for the same pay because they need help that's why they're doing this they don't want him to leave they Mm-hmm. They're short of help, right? That's correct, yeah. It's really hard to find. And they're afraid he's just going to retire and not come back. They need him. So they're allowing him to retire and then come back. And that's a very cool thing for y'all because dadgum, that's probably a sweet income.

Mm-hmm. So what will your household income be after retiree hire? So he also does some side hustles because he's a firefighter and doesn't work. I mean, he works, but not hours. This boy ain't scared of work, is he? Yeah, good. No, not at all. Not at all. Probably works too much.

I would say we would probably be in the high 200s, low 300s. And your mortgage is how much? $112,000 right now. Okay, so you guys just need to sit down and say, what would it look like to pay off the mortgage in 14 months or 12 months? Yep. That's $10,000 a month. You can do that.

Totally can do that. And then we'll call and scream at you. Yeah, exactly. And you can scream and then you can do that totally can do that and then we'll call and scream yeah exactly and you can scream and then you can take less hours and you know enjoy it's only you're only 12 months from your goal of being able to chill a little bit with your condition right yeah if you frame it up that way maybe he's a little because after that you're at baby step seven and then all you've got left to do is enjoy life, be generous, and invest. And so he can go to investing a whole bunch of stuff after you knock this mortgage out, but he's only 12 months from that goal.

And I'm curious, what's his pension in relation to your take home? So I actually am the one that my hourly salary is about double his salary. What do you do? I'm a nurse program manager. I help with heart attack patients in the state of Maine. Oh, wow. So, again, the question still remains the same. I just wanted you to run these numbers out.

What's your take-home compared to his pension? Yeah, how much of a raise is he going to get to offset the fact you don't work as much so his pension will probably be about i don't know exactly but let's say 50 000 and i make about 100 000 okay so if you quit cold yeah and he got a 50 raise the household's only down 50 and you do that after the mortgage is gone. That's a very doable thing is what Ken's asking. That's right. That's where you were going, right? Yeah, because I want you to get to that place of enjoyment because you now can.

And I want you to be able to cast that vision to him. Hey, we're still going to be great on retirement. We're still fine with our baby steps. We've completed them. We've got a paid for house and I've got a better health situation. Or Mindy, the weird thing happens when you don't have to work anymore it's easier to work yeah that's right and so you know maybe you're putting in 60 hours and you can go to actually 40 or 35 or 30 and make a really nice living and you don't

have to be there so all of a sudden it changes how you walk in the building and the stress the you know the stress because what's your she said she had a hard thing and she works in a hard area it's very missional isn't it yeah there you go so i mean but it's stressful yeah and so yeah the um i i'm gonna guess and say you probably won't want to quit cold you'll probably you probably enjoy enough of your work to do some of it and the fact that they probably need you like they need him you guys have picked two great careers you're going to be multi-millionaires and um you know you will have enjoyed your life through the process and served your community both of you firefighter and nurse yeah these are these are uh acts of service both of them i love that retire rehire man stack man. Stacks of cash. Strong, strong, strong. I love it, love it, love it for you guys.

This is The Ramsey Show. This show is sponsored by BetterHelp. This is the season for Halloween. It's October. We're wearing costumes and we're wearing masks. If you haven't started planning your costume yet, get on it. And while you're thinking about it, I want you to be honest. A lot of us hide ourselves. We hide our true selves behind costumes and masks all the time. We do this at work. We do this around our friends. We do this around our families. We even do this when we look at ourselves in the mirror. I know because I've been there multiple times in my life and it's the worst. If you feel like you're stuck hiding behind masks and costumes all the time, if you find yourself hiding from your true self, I want you to consider talking with a

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for no additional cost. Take off the costumes and take off the mask with BetterHelp. Visit betterhelp.com slash deloney to get 10% off your first month. That's betterhelp.com slash deloney. Well, a big week around Ramsey Publishing over here. Two books going on pre-sale.

Rachel launched a number one best-selling children's book in the fall. I'm glad for what I have. The follow-up book, she's going to do a series of these apparently. Now I'm learning this but um there you go uh is i'm glad for where i am you'll be content with home and the other one's content with what you have only this one's about gratitude the other one's about contentment and uh fabulous illustrations award-winning illustrator, just really great. I read these to my grandkids this weekend.

I had different ones at different times for Easter. And the oldest ones, of course, don't let me read to them, but the little ones, just, Papa Dave, give me a book. So there you go, Papa Dave will read to you, because I tell you what makes you smart, when people read to you when you're little. So I read all the time I get, anytime I can. So there you go.

And increasing the intelligence of that next generation so they never live in my basement. And that's what we're trying to do. But, yeah, there you go. That one's coming out the 16th of the month of April, and it's on presale now. I'm glad for where I am. And Ken Coleman's got a new one coming out.

This is a different kind of book. Find the work you're wired to do. Now, he's done two number one bestsellers before. This one is more of a how to take the assessment book. That's right. Or how to interpret the assessment. That's right. The assessment and this short book together answer.

The get clear assessment. The get clear career assessment. That's right. So essentially, you get the assessment, and then this book picks you up with your results. So here's what it does in short questions. It teaches you to speak. I can't speak, but I can write. No, it's answering who you are, why you are wired that way, what you want to do professionally, and how you get there.

So that's what this is going to deliver for you. There's awareness. So you walk away with great clarity on direction, confidence that you can actually do it. And then how do I tactically get there? And so it's a combination of the assessment and this short book is me essentially guiding you, coaching you with your results. And there's nothing like it in the marketplace because it's not a personality profile, as you know.

No, it's not. There's enough of those out there. This is how am I wired? What do I do well? What do I enjoy doing? And then what motivates me? And this is the key, by the way, to winning professionally so that you win financially.

96% of millionaires, according to the largest study on millionaires ever done by Ramsey Solutions, 96% said they enjoyed their work. And that's essentially, if you want to boil it down to a money audience, that's what this product does. What's the work that I would enjoy? You very seldom prosper at something long-term. It's not sustainable if you hate your job. That's right.

And so if you hate your job or you hate the place you work and you're confused i want to do something different i don't know what to do i got to get out of here is all i know that's right whatever here is right it could be a whole new career path it could be a whole new job it could just be doing the same thing you do but not with toxic jerks it could be all of that can be revealed when you take the get clear assessment that's exactly right and this new book find the work you're wired Do, will help you analyze the findings of the Get Clear assessment. I took it. It was very interesting when it was in beta. That's right.

When we were doing it, just to see if it exposed who Dave really is. And it did. Yeah. It did. And I like these kinds of things. I like know thyself. Yeah. Let me tell you what this is.

In a day and age where people want results fast, this gives it to you. And it really does answer those questions. Who am I? And we're talking about the world of work. What makes you really good? By the way, if you know what makes you really good at what you do, it's going to help you convince other people who are going to hire you and by the way, pay you really well. So building wealth, the secret to wealth is in the professional side of it is knowing your unique role. Where do I fit? So the deal is the Get Clear Assessment has been available on our website for quite a while. Almost 100,000 people have taken it already. We've sold it to that many folks already.

And you can buy it today. Or you can buy this book in pre-sale. It comes with the Get Clear assessment in pre-sale. And you also get the audio book and the e-book of this as well with the pre-sale. So you get those two assets. Yeah, when you do pre-sale on all our stuff, that's what we do. And so that book actually comes out the 7th of May. We'll ship it to you, the street date on it.

It'll be in Amazon and Target and all those places during that time, starting then. And Rachel's book is 4-16, so just a couple of weeks away. Two new books coming out by Ramsey Publishing. Hey, I do want to say this really fast. If you're looking for a graduation gift for the high school grad or the college grad, I would just point out this is something really practical that the high school grad and college grad in about 15 minutes of the assessment and no more than an hour and a half of reading that book that's how quick it is it's a short read there it is i'm gonna hold it upside down there we go dave is auditioning to be the new vanna white yeah and he's flunking horribly yeah on so many fronts but yeah there we go open phones here at 888-825-5225 melissa is in ann arbor hi melissa how are you hi dave i'm good how are you thank you for taking my call

sure how can we help i'm calling because um kind of a long story of how we got here but the long and short of it is we have some debt, part of it's student loan, part of it's consumer debt. But our rent has gone up, you know, like 18% in the last two years. And we got offered to, my folks have a basement apartment, and in order to mutually help us and help them to try to better prepare for future, save up stuff, help them pay stuff down, they offered to let us move in and future, save up stuff, help them pay stuff down. They offered to let us move in and, you know, split bills with them.

And I'm just kind of trying to, we're going to talk it out together, obviously, but kind of trying to see what your take is on that. How old are you? My husband and I are 36. How many children? No children. Okay. What do you all do for a living?

We have multiple jobs, actually. My primary job is a medical coder. I also have a small business. I have a contracted job through our church. And my husband is a warehouse supply clerk and also has a small business. Okay. All right. I am not opposed to families jumping in together,

and that includes a grown child, quote, moving back home, which would be you. What I don't want you to do, and I don't want them to do, is I don't want you to use that move to mask the real problems. Okay. And so I'll just be, can I be real straight with you for a minute? Absolutely. Your real problem is not 18% increase in rent. It revealed the fact that you both have weak careers. Am I wrong? Not necessarily. I have a degree and a certification in my field, and it's taken me about 12 years to work my way up in a hospital to get where I am.

So what's your household income? So I pulled the after taxes and insurance is about around $70,000. And that's working four jobs, two each? Yeah, five, I guess, if you count the church. Yeah. So that's what I'm worried about, okay? You guys are working. Y'all are like a hamster in a wheel, man. Y'all go. You ain't afraid to work. Y'all work hard and a lot.

How much debt do you have? Right now, I originally gave them about $79,000 on the phone, but I forgot about there's about $3,900 that we're paying relative for a vehicle at zero interest. Yeah. So what are you, $83,000? Is that what I'm hearing? Yeah, thereabouts. Yeah.

That's a part of the problem, too. So if you go home, make it a plan to pass through there on the way to prosperity. Yeah. to pass through there on the way to prosperity. Not land there because the world is mean and rent went up and I can't make it out there. And, Dave, I'm also concerned about the boundary of helping them. So that's a safety net, not a hammock. Mm-hmm. And don't get guilted into helping them with their bills because i heard that too

so there needs to be a boundary there you guys aren't doing them a favor right um well that was what they they had said was that um you know this would be primarily to because i'm an only child so i want to live near them anyway because you know as they age. So we only live like 10 minutes away from them as it is. That's good. I want you to help them. I want you to be a good daughter. And I don't mind you going through there on your way to prosperity. But make sure you're addressing your core issues.

And I don't think you are because you didn't like what I said. I might be wrong, but you ought to look at that. This is The Ramsey Show. Buying your first home is a big deal and sets the stage for your financial success. So, work with a mortgage advisor you trust, not just some random website. Churchill Mortgage is Ramsey trusted because they help you avoid hidden traps and expertly guide you through every step. Learn more at ChurchillMortgage.com. This is a paid advertisement. NMLS ID 1591. NMLSconsumeraccess.org. Equal housing lender.

1749 Mallory Lane, Suite 100. Brentwood, Tennessee 37027. Ken Coleman, Ramsey Personality is my co-host today. Thanks for hanging out with us. Hey guys, thank you. We appreciate you. The number of you that are out there and the number of you that are talking about this show is apparent because we keep showing up in number one, two, three, four, five slot on Apple. Out of all the two million Apple podcasts, we're one of the top five almost every day, every every week oftentimes number one and so we bounce around with mr joe rogan which is an honor to be mentioned in the same sentence with him and uh certainly all the different murder mysteries that npr puts out they're all

over the place and so we uh we bounce around with those have you ever listened to one of those no i gave one of them a shot it's not my genre yeah we've got we got members of our family including my wife that are okay and blake thom members of our family, including my wife, that are. Okay. And Blake Thompson, too, our senior producer here. That's true. He's way into that stuff. But anyway, there's other stuff out there if you don't want that.

But thank you. Thank you. And thank you for the numbers. Our numbers on YouTube and on our radio stations are just in SiriusXM. All those platforms are just through the roof. And it's all because of you guys. Thank you. If you want to help us we can use the

help still we really can uh leave a nice five-star review click the share button or click a link cut a link out and send it to somebody say listen to this whether whether it's uh you know subscribe follow anytime you do any of those things it bumps those algorithms on those platforms around and pushes our show to the front and makes it offered to more people who've never heard of it before and it's our only marketing plan so you're it um we don't own like a football stadium or anything like so far uh so it's just us and so us and you it's me and you baby against the world so thank you thank you for all the help all right jasper is with us in Oregon. Hi, Jasper. Welcome to the Ramsey Show. Hey, thank you. Glad to be on. Sure. What's up? Good advice.

So basically, I'm a truck driver. I'm an owner operator. So I kind of hate this job, though, because I'm always on the road and to leave and go like take time off even for a few days costs me money. So I want to like get out of this business i've been in it for about two years how old are you i want to get a um i'm 20 uh 28 okay go ahead i'm sorry oh no worries um so my buddy chris he watches your guys's show and he told me because i got a new car and normally i never spend i never want to get a loan but i did so i'm about 30,000 33,000 dollars i owed on it it's about 633 dollars like uh a month for it it also is about 300 and something dollars for insurance um how bad do you want to quit your job oh man I feel like a slave. I hate it. Sell a stupid car.

I know, but I put like $50,000 down on it. I just asked you how bad you wanted to quit your job. Now you just told me you don't. Because you signed up for a $600 payment. You want to know what you're a slave to? You're a slave to the stupid car. That's what you're a slave to. True.

I regretted it as soon as I talked to my brother. Not enough to sell it. You started crawfishing on me. You lobstered right back into the hole as soon as I said sell it. You backed up, didn't you? How would I sell it? How would I go about it? Okay, well, let's finish the numbers.

You were saying you put how much down? I put about $15,000 down on it. Okay. And what's it worth right now if you sell it private seller? Well I haven't put much miles on it so I'm guessing probably about $38,000 $40,000 depending. What was the sale price when you purchased it? I was stupid and I got that extra mileage on it the dealer that tries to tell you so i probably bought it about for about 43 000 when it's because it has that extra mileage you mean you got an extended warranty yeah oh you can get the lesson when you cancel that you'll get most of that back right so you owe 28 and you think it's worth 38 i i think? I think it's probably worth, it's a Honda CR-V hybrid, so it's pretty popular.

I don't know how quick it would sell or for what people would offer me. Well, it doesn't matter. You're not upside down. So if you pull it up on private sale on Kelley Blue Book, kbb.com, you can find out what you could sell it to an individual for. If you sold it, you're convinced at this moment. You can find out in a could sell it to an individual for. If you sold it, you're convinced at this moment. You can find out in a few minutes with that analysis. But it sounds like you're going to put some money in your pocket when you sell it. Am I right?

Oh, yeah. I would get some money back for myself. So you could go buy you a hoopty car and quit your lousy job. Yeah, I could. Yeah. Okay. So now let's move on to quitting the lousy job because that's the only thing standing in your way yeah yeah and the other thing is is if i'm a truck driver and i hate my

job okay i am using all of that amazing amount of time when i'm behind the wheel of that truck i'm making phone calls i'm talking to everybody and everybody that they know, and I'm going to land a job while I'm in the cab, so therefore I don't have an interruption of income. But we've already solved the first problem. You can sell the car, get it back. You're in the truck most of the time anyway. So I would be landing something, making phone calls, learning. If I got to get a certificate program to move into something else i'm listening to that while i'm in the truck any idea what you want to do so i just want to go back to school is the issue why and i for what i to hide an engineering degree oh an engineering degree

because you want to be an engineer yeah i i'd like energy if if possible something to do some kind of electrical engineering. I figure I would get a better idea when I go into school. No, no, no, no. Let me save you a step. I want you to be on the phone, and when you're not in the cab and you've got some days off, you're hanging out with electrical engineers. It's the number one way to figure out if I want to do something. If I want to go into carpentry, I'm going to spend a day, at least a half day, shadowing a carpenter. Why? Because Jasper, I want to know the good, the bad. I want to hear him gripe about it. I want to hear him tell me what he likes. I want to know what he makes. I

want to know how long it took him to make that. The way we figure out if I want to go into electrical engineering is not to go to school for it. You go talk to those professors who have never done it. That's right. He's an electric engineer, except, I mean, he develops, like, weapon systems. So it's a bit separate from what I would be interested in. Well, again, I'm all for this. I'm just telling you, don't choose to go to school to figure out if I want to do something. Hang out with people that are doing it.

Do research on it. And then your head and heart will either say ding, ding, ding, or eh. And I'm telling you, I'm saving you time and money, my friend. I think you've got an idea, but let's go get confirmation on it. The best way to get confirmation is hanging around somebody who's doing it. A lot of people, Jasper, a lot of people, and you're a sharp young guy, so I'm trying to keep you from doing this. A lot of people go to school to hide from life.

And when my life isn't working and I hate my job, I'm going to go to school to see if I like it is code for I'm going to go over there and hide for a little bit because my life has sucked driving this truck. I don't want you to hide. I want you to embrace it. I want you to stand on the mountaintop and freaking roar. I want you to step into this, whatever it is, with gusto.

I mean, somehow when you were making the decision to be a truck driver, you didn't realize you were going to be gone all the time. You kind of missed that part. And now you hate that part. So I really would not go to school until you are a thousand percent sure the school is the only way to get to be the thing you want to be. It's not where you go to discover yourself at 28 years old. All you will discover there is student loan debt. That's right. So sell the car and begin to put together a process of discovery to see where you need to land and we'll participate. We're going to give you a copy of Ken's free – I'm going to give you a free copy of this. This is a nice gift I'm giving you.

It's the Get Clear Career Assessment. Hang on, and Austin and the team will pick up. We'll get you signed up for that. Take that, and then you can even call Ken back on the Ken Coleman Show if you want, or go to KenColeman.com. He'll help you with the whole thing but you got you you got to figure out a very clear wise adult process of discovering where you go next kids children go to school to discover themselves you're not a child anymore you're like a full-grown man and stuff so you don't have that option anymore you now need to be wiser than that kids should be too

but you need to be wiser that's's right. And just to, just to land this for a lot of you out there that are listening and watching, thinking through this, there's a difference between interested Dave and invested. And, and what I'm interested is great, but I got to know enough about it to where I go ding, ding, ding, and the tuning fork inside your chest goes that I want to do. And, and that's the difference interested yeah that's great but i'm not going to make a decision until i've tasted enough of it seen enough of it heard enough of it to go i want to invest time and money for the future it's a big deal go test it first yeah go sell your car either way yeah Yeah. Today. This is the Ramsey Show.

Are you working the baby steps? One of the smartest and most impactful changes you can make is to ditch your cash value life insurance plan, if you have one, and replace it with a term life policy. Listen, the only thing a cash value policy is good for is overcharging you for the life insurance and then paying you a crappy rate of return on your overpayment. Stop wasting your money and really focus on getting out of debt and growing your savings. For over 25 years, I've trusted and used Zander Insurance to find the best rates on term life insurance from the top rated companies. They keep the whole thing simple. You can apply online or over the phone, and they even have low-cost plans that don't require an exam. Go to Zander.com or call 800-356-4282. Even if you don't have a cash value policy, if you're one of the 70% of people who have no life insurance or not enough, it's even more important to get this done. 800-356-4282 or zander.com. Ken Coleman, Ramsey personality is my co-host. John is with us. John is in Chicago. How are you,

John? I'm doing well. How about you guys? Better than we deserve. What's up? So I appreciate you taking the call, but I'm kind of in a little bit of a blender here, and that's why I'm reaching out. But essentially, I got about $76,000 student loans. 63 of that would be private, 13 would be federal. I can give you the interest rates if you want those, but currently making around $45,000 a year. I graduated from school with a marketing degree, so I'm working at a marketing agency. And it's going okay, not necessarily enjoying it as much, kind of doing a half roll of sales, half roll of internal optimization for kind of Google Ads campaigns, et cetera. Come to have learned I do not like the sales aspect of it at all, but starting to cross

my mind, I should probably start looking for probably better jobs because there isn't really a lot of room to grow. And after asking for some help and training, my bosses haven't really given me that time after to do that. So kind of the situation there. Um, but essentially I got a, I'm just going to lay it all out. Sorry for rambling here, but got a, got a car that I bought off my grandma. It's got 135,000

miles. It's kind of reaching the end of its life, so it's currently in the shop today, actually, because I had a flat tire. What kind of car? It is a 2005 Buick LeSabre. Okay. Flat tire is not the end of a car's life. It's the end of the tire's life. No.

And 135,000 miles on a car is not that much today. No. So they usually reach the end of their life somewhere around $335,000. And Grandma took better care of that car than you have, so you're probably in pretty good shape. So what do you make? I agree. So I make around $45,000 a year right now.

And you just got out of college with a four-year degree in marketing. Correct. In Chicago. So I'm living, I'm an hour outside of Chicago. I'm in Indiana, but I'm a halfway hour drive around the lake. Yeah. And you've been out of school how long? I graduated in 2022.

I played golf in college, and so I gave professional golf a shot. How long have you been in this job? I've been in this job for about nine months. Okay. Yeah, it's entry-level. I'm guessing a small marketing agency. Is that true? Correct.

Yep, about 10 employees. So that's part of the issue. I'm just going to address really quick the income because I can do it in 20 seconds. You need, as a young guy, unless you're married and you're anchored with kids and all that, you need to be looking at a much bigger market. And I'm talking about a city where the marketing agencies are bigger and there's room for growth. And there's a good chance you might get about a $10,000 to $15,000 bump just by simply working at a larger agency in a bigger market. I think small-town Indiana is not the place to grow a marketing career.

No, I agree with you there. Yeah, so that I think, you know, addressing the income side of the equation, yeah, you're not making much for your marketing degree overall. No. You know, if you told me you were making $75,000, I would tell you quit your whining and go to work. But I'm tending to agree with you right now because I think some of the lack of attention you're getting is also symptomatic

of the fact you're in a very small firm, and they're just stepping and fetching, trying to make payroll on Friday. Bless their hearts. That's right. Yes. Yeah. I agree with you there. So I don't think they're bad guys.

They're just not large enough to have the income to pay you much or to be very sophisticated in their leadership development tracks. Yeah, and so I know I've learned all throughout college and growing up from family, friends, and everyone to always start working away at your 401K early. No, right now, whoever told you that's wrong, you've got to get this debt gone. Okay. So what I would have you do, talk about your income side of the equation.

We call it the shovel to hole ratio. You have a forty five thousand dollar shovel. You have a hole, you know, it's like 80 grand, 70 grand. Right. So, you know, that that's that's a pretty big ratio. So I would do what Ken's talking about. Let's talk about let's talk talk about changing jobs getting our income up if it means a move so what go do it go it's an

adventure nothing is forever so go give it a run go make some stinking money and don't do anything don't buy a car on payments for god's sakes drive that buick until it lays down and dies not as a flat tire and then then let's get let's get rid of this eighty thousand dollars so let's pretend you were making 80k and you lived on 40 you'd be debt free in two years and if you lived on uh 20 which is beans and rice and you worked a side job then you'd be out of debt in like one year yeah wow okay john i'm gonna shoot you straight uh rough math what do you have to do to be able to put three grand a month away at debt and that's going to get you right at the two-year mark on the 76 000 it's going to get you that's quick math but that's realistic right what do you have to

do as a young guy who's single to be able to put three grand a month towards the debt that's 36k a year and you're basically there in two years three three words with one of them hyphenated no more happy hour that's uh that's it you'll be you'll be working now john you'll be working we're gonna clean up this dadgum mess because when you don't have any debt then you build an emergency fund then you buy you a better car and then we start looking around to see how we can start our 401k and build the adventure that is called your life you're a sharp young guy you got a lot a lot of upside my friend a lot of upside and we're here to help you thank you for calling in nick is with us in connecticut hi nick welcome to the ramsey show well thanks a lot i appreciate you taking the call, guys. I've been a long-time listener.

Sure. How can we help? Well, just a quick question. I just sold my house about a week or so ago, and income property, rather, and I'm renting right now in a different state, moved here for a job, and within the past couple hours, I just paid approximately $100,000 of debt off. Good for you. That's fun. Wow. From your equity and the sale of the income property.

With all the equity plus I've been working like a dog the last year or so. So you wrote a check. Are you debt free? No, not yet. How much debt have you got left i me and my wife have a total of about 110 000 student loans left i have about 80 of that my wife has around 30 of it but you cleared off 100 more than that today correct so you were 210 before wow that's got to feel like feel like you lost a bunch of weight or something. I feel pretty great about it, but that's what I want to keep the feeling,

and I just wanted to pick your brains about, you know, I've been living in the new area for about a year and a half, and we've been renting, and rent is extremely high in this region, and we're looking into this region. Um, and it seems we're going to kind of get a, we're looking into possibly getting another house and I am a veteran. I have the VA loans and the rent would be equivalent to what I would pay for a PA loan pretty much right now. But here's the thing is I don't have the down payment for it. And so my question was, would I, should I rather,

or would I be better off paying off the student loans yes and okay you you've been listening a long time you knew what i was going to say uh yeah but i've never told somebody to buy a house who had 110 000 with a student loan debt in 32 years yeah ever i just haven't and so i don't want you to know and it's not about the monthly rent today it's about what is better for you 10 years from today and buying a house when you're a broke person you have to buy an extra bedroom for sally may for god's sakes and so no you can't do this you gotta stay clean i know rent's high Rent as cheaply as you possibly can because rent is throwing money away for the short term to be able to win in the long term. It's a price we pay

to win long term. And so I want you to just rent as cheaply as you can. I want you to get out of debt as fast as you can, work as many jobs as you can, spend as little money as you can, and get out of debt as fast as you can so that you can buy a house as fast as you can without any debt. When you're debt free and you have your emergency fund then i would save up my down payment and i would buy a house i would not do it i i know i mean you just spent all your equity money paying off debt so you're trying to get out of debt if you were if you're that joneson to buy a house you could have stayed in debt all that debt and turn around use that hundred thousand bucks to buy a house and you knew that wasn't the right thing to do.

You knew that you should pay it on debt. But now it leaves you broke, no money, and still got $110,000 to go. So just keep plowing, man. You're doing the right thing. Don't quit. You knew what I was going to say. You said, I've been listening, long-time listener. I heard you when you came on the air.

And so you knew exactly what Ken and I were going to tell you. So you're telling me there was a chance. No chance. None. This is The Ramsey Show. Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, it's The Ramsey Show, where we help people build wealth, do work that they love, and create actual amazing relationships. Ken Coleman, Ramsey personality, host of The Ken Coleman Show,

and author of the number one bestseller, Paycheck to Purpose, and another one called Proximity Principle. He's my co-host today. Open phones at 888-825-5225.allas starts this hour off with pat hi pat how are you doing well mr ramsey how are you better than i deserve what's up um i was just calling in appreciate you guys taking the call um i am just wanted to get your take in your opinion i listened to a lot of your shows and uhets here and there about shared finances, which is how I grew up in my life, my parents.

One bank account, one finance, one checkbook, so to speak. And I am currently about to propose to my soon-to-be fiancé. And, you know, we have sat down and talked about a lot of the life goals and kind of how we want to raise our kids and how we want to manage our life and everything. And sometimes we kind of butt heads on finances. And sometimes I guess I feel I'm about 11 years older than she is and, um, have worked very hard to get to the point I'm at now. And, uh, I worry about,

you know, is there some steps that I should take from, you know, possibly getting a prenuptial agreement to for assets that I have now. And then also a big question on, you know, I'm currently building a house and about to move into that. And then if we were to pay for that house out of shared finance, but it's in my name, it just kind of felt like muddy waters, if something were to ever happen down the line and we're going to divorce or, you know, of course that's never the goal, just um how to approach that and make the best decisions going forward what's your net worth uh probably about 1.7 how old are you i'm 38 okay which makes her 27 right uh yes sir okay she's about turn 27 all How long have y'all been dating?

About a year and a half now. What's the nature of butting heads over finances discussion? I guess when I think about kind of, you know, I had bought some property and held it for a while, and now I'm building this house on it. And just, I guess, going forward, should I pay for the house, or should she help out? She's just concerned because it's not in her name. You're butting heads over that. Yeah.

Or you're butting heads over anything else. Not a whole lot. We have different thought processes on, you know, vehicles, and I'm more of a I've had a couple cars in my lifetime, and she likes to lease cars and kind of do things that way. And, um, I've always kind of been more over the, I'll drive a car for seven, eight, nine, 10 years or something before I change, make a change. Okay. Um, well, here's what I want you to get to the bottom of in your pre-marriage counseling or pre-engagement counseling, whichever one you decide to do. Okay. Um, the house disagreement is a valid thing to

argue about. And we can talk through that in a minute. That's let's set that to the side for a second. Um, you don't borrow money. You're a cheapskate and you drive a car forever and she likes new things and nice things and she doesn't mind going into debt right yes sir okay yes sir for the most part she is very good with her money but no she's not people who lease cars are by definition not good with their money it is the most expensive way to way to operate a vehicle and it's the inability and immaturity to say no to myself so i go buy whatever the flip i want because i'm an immature child that's who leases cars okay regardless if you're 53 or you're 27 because you just want to buy something it is the least down the least a month

and the worst deal to get a new car that you can't afford so this is who leases cars so no she's not good with money but can we talk through that to her defense she she just recently purchased one about a year like eight months ago because i i kind of told her i was like man i feel like leasing money is a good way to waste a lot of money but so i think she's trying to make good decisions but now she leased it or more no she bought she bought her last one and pay cash for it but no no sir she has payments okay okay so i mean i'm resting my case here so here's the thing if i will not delay pleasure to win that is the definition of maturity so i'm willing to save up and pay cash for things. I'm willing to drive things longer to get the full value out of them

and pay cash for them. Thus, you have a $1.7 million net worth, and she's broke. Okay? And that's not to put her down. It's to put her actions down. And so that is what's concerning me about the marriage, not your 1.7 and not who gets their name on the house because the number one cause of divorce in north america today is money fights

and money problems you're not likely to have money problems but you are very likely to have money fights yeah because either she's a great lady which we suspect she is because you want to get engaged to her who has some minor adjustments to be made and needs to learn understand some things she doesn't understand about money and move along the spectrum a little bit to move into wisdom or she's a freaking princess and you're going to spend the rest of your life trying to keep this woman happy. She's one of the two. I think it's two, Pat.

Now, I'm going to tell you why it's not. You called us asking us if you should protect your money, because deep down in the dark crevices of your mind when you're laying awake at night, you are afraid that she might be a princess. And that's the truth. I'm just going to tell you. You don't call and ask that question. We don't know. There's a percentage chance. I didn't say she was going. I'm saying he's worried that she might be. And to your advice, Dave, Dave's advice is right. I would do premarital counseling to the nth degree and make sure that money are the first whatever sessions, because I think you're worried and I think you have some justification as to why you're

worried. You guys are on opposite ends of the spectrum on money. Yeah. So that's what you've got to solve for the sake of your marriage. And no prenup in the world will solve the disagreement. That's right. You got to get on the same page. You got to get aligned.

Right. Okay. And that's your protection more than a prenup let's change the let's change the discussion and pretend we're at a different place okay let's pretend we're four months from now you guys have been through financial peace university together they gave you some material which i'll give you as a potential uh engagement gift or whatever we call those things and so i'll give it to you free you two go through that together you two sit down with a pre-marriage counselor and work through this issue let's say you get through that and she's solid she's like i get it we're doing this okay you might look at a

prenup more to protect you from her crazy relatives than her at that point because your net worth's okay it's not like through the root it's not like you got 10 million you got one and but the house if you're going to ask a lady to share your bed her name ought to be on the deed correct right yeah she's right about that but you've got a reason for not putting it on there right now you got to solve for that reason as a marriage thing and then put her name on the deed and if you want to do a prenup or not it won't matter on the other stuff that's what i would do hang on i was going to pick up we're going to put you through financial peace university ken coleman ramsey personality number one bestselling author, is my co-host today.

Jane's in San Francisco. Hi, Jane. How are you? Hi, Dave. Thank you for taking my call. First, I'm going to try to talk real fast. My brother and I are co-conservers of my mom. My mom is in a facility.

Dad passed in 2020, and I'm interested in buying my dad's home. Rebbe tried early on to say he had a video of what my dad wanted done with his home. It was a visit to an attorney who said, home belongs to mom. So in light of this and what he's already tried, I want to protect myself. I've been told I need to see a probate attorney attorney somebody else said you need to see a real estate attorney then somebody else said oh no no you need to see an estate planning attorney i'm lost and i need guidance when i bought my you and your brother are arguing about the house is that what you're saying no no not yet okay so you want to buy the house does your is your brother on board with that yes okay now he is but he's tried things throughout the

past three three years um we were supposed to that's irrelevant to today if he's on board with you buying the house will he sign as co-conservator for you to buy the house? Yes. Then you sign as the other co-conservator and you buy the house. As conservators, your job under the law, and you can ask an estate planning attorney, whoever set the conservatorship up, can tell you this, but a conservatorship is you have the responsibility to act in your mother's best interest. So if, as co-conservators, you decide to sell you this house at half of what it's worth,

you would not have acted in her best interest, and that sale could be undone. Correct. So you would have to pay market value for the house. Correct. Okay, if you pay market value for it, and both of the co-conservators, you have power of attorney as a conservator, do you not? I am the main conservator, yes. Well, I mean, the two of you together acting as co-conservators

can sign to move any of her assets around. You're conserving, you're taking care of her assets. Am I missing something? No. Okay, then the two of you signed to sell her assets. Am I missing something? No. Okay, then the two of you signed to sell the house. It's in her best interest. She's never going to live there again. She has a pile of money to take care of her from the sale of the house.

As long as she gets market value for the house, no one could object to that. Okay. Because my brothers just pulled some things in the past with these three years that we've been co-conservators that I just don't trust in anything that he says or does. So that's why I'm wondering what sort of attorney I should choose. Why do you want to buy the house? Because I live on the third floor and I'm really tired of climbing three flights of stairs you know anywhere from eight or nine times a day so my and this is a single uh family dwelling and i'm kind of ready to leave silicon valley it's really expensive. Where is the house?

It's up near on the other side of Sacramento. Okay. Why this house? Why not just go buy you a house that you like and forget it? Um, I just want more reasons.

Yeah, just because you're fighting with your brother and you want to win. No, no, no, no. We're not fighting. You told me six times how he's trying to screw you. Right. Okay. I don't know where you're from. I'm from Tennessee.

We call that fighting. Oh, well, over here in California, it's just kind of the way people are. That right there was worth showing up for today. Ladies and gentlemen, you don't get that at your mother's 401k meeting. I'm just telling you. No, but you have deeper sentimental feelings about this house. You need to go buy a different house, honey. You're just chasing some kind of emotional rabbit trail here.

And if you don't want to live on the third floor, so move. Yeah. That's okay. It's not hard. There's lots of places you can live. So pick out where you want to live and go buy you a house. And then when your mom needs to sell her house for the good of your mom, then you and your brother sell her house for the good of your mom. There's nothing here that's holding this to you.

You're just, you're chasing some ghost in the past or something with your brother or some kind of a thing here, some kind of gyration. I'm assuming there's a will in place that causes all the assets to be sold upon her death and divvied up between you and your brother, and that's a standard probate process. You're very protected. You're fine. I think you're going to have a much better quality of life if you go buy a different house. I don't think this house is going to be a blessing,

and I don't think the process of getting it is going to be a blessing. It's going to put you in too many different conflicting conversations that you don't need to be in just to get off the third floor. Wouldn't do it. Wouldn't do it. Gray, open phones at 888-825-5225 today's question comes from jackson in pennsylvania i work for my parents family business which is worth over 10 million i've been working for them since i was 15 and we've all agreed that i am interested and

in position to take over the business one day so for now i'm in the process of learning and advancing this is fine, but right now I feel like I'm stuck in my career when I could be making more money at another company doing the same thing. I currently earn only $35,000 a year. Anytime I start doing side hustles to make ends meet, my dad gets frustrated and says he can't give me more responsibility until I'm more committed to the business. How do I balance wanting to make more money now and being content with what I'm making currently, knowing full well I will be financially set in the future when I own the business?

And my friend Jackson, you just about answered your own question there. You are not stuck professionally. You're stuck emotionally. And because you're a future owner, and you're young, you're full of hope and vigor and energy, and I want it now, and I'm much older than you, and I still struggle with wanting everything now. And I think this is a focus on the now. We win the now so that we can get to the next.

And you answered your own question. I mean, you have got to get to a point where you go, if I'm the owner one day, and I've got some frustrations i need to be a big boy sit down with dad and be a man and talk man to man owner to employee who is potential owner and share some of the frustrations but ultimately i think uh this is about learning and advancing and you can't learn and uh and and and advance and be stuck And be stuck. And be stuck. They're not the same thing. You're just not stuck professionally.

You're set up. Your own question says, I'm going to be financially set in the future. So I'll tell you, from my perspective, if I were in your situation and I didn't grow up with that opportunity, you're very blessed. You should be very grateful.

And my friend, welcome to one of the most difficult things of winning. Every person I've ever had a chance to meet and talk to or interview who was successful, they learned how to deal with the tension between patience and persistence. You got to get up and you got to show up. And you keep getting up and showing up. Eventually you go up. But there is a tension between patience and persistence.

And welcome to the game the i completely agree and um you know lean in work harder but i think it is fair to have a conversation with your dad one of the rules we teach when we're teaching an entree leadership and we believe it at ramsey we made it true here uh the ramsey kids the family members that work inside of our business get paid market value for their position. No more, no less. So Rachel Cruz has the exact same pay schedule royalty on her book that Ken Coleman does on his book. Now she might sell more or less books, but she's in the same royalty schedule. And so she doesn't get any leg up. She doesn't get double royalties because she's a Ramsey.

And she doesn't get half royalties because she's a Ramsey. We don't need slave labor here just because they're in the family. So if you're worth in the marketplace more than $35,000 for that position, your company ought to pay you market value, not a dime more, but not a dime less. You ought to be paid for the pay you market value not a dime more but not a dime less you ought to be paid for the position you are not for family you shouldn't be cheated because your family and you shouldn't be overpaid because your family and then from there you work on the transition the succession plan the learning and the processing and the growing and um we've got three ramses that work on this team. All three of them

are paid exactly that way. Not a dime more than market value and not a dime less. And that's what they've always been paid. When they came out of college and they were just worth nothing and it took a little while to get the college knocked off of them and make them valuable, they got paid what we pay a worth nothing just out of college student. And then they get the college knocked off of them, they're worth more and we can pay them more. And that's true of everybody in this what we pay are worth nothing just out of college student and then they get the college knocked off of them they're worth more and we can pay them more and that's true of everybody in this team this is the ramsey show well it's national financial literacy month this month so what are we going to do well we're going

to celebrate teachers teachers of all kinds. The teachers of America love our kids well. They work hard. They're helping to shape the future by making sure our kids get the education they need to succeed with whatever life throws at them. And here at Ramsey, we want to say thank you to our teachers out there with the Teacher Appreciation Giveaway, sponsored by Ramsey Education. One teacher will win a $5,000 vacation plus two additional teachers will each win a $3,000 vacation to wherever they choose. It's completely free and no purchase necessary. For more information, just go to ramseysolutions.com slash teacher. Ramsey Education, of course, is the arm of our company that puts high school curriculum out there on personal finance called the Foundations in Personal Finance Curriculum.

It's taught in most of the states in the United States now. 48% of the high schools in America have taught it at one time or another, and almost 10 million students have been through it. So we continue to have great teachers out there teaching that. We say thank you to you and all of you that enter the classroom at your own risk these days. Thank you for doing that. You should get combat pay. Oh my gosh. So hey, a couple of vacations, a $5,000 and two $3,000 vacations are out there. RamseySolutions.com slash teacher. No purchase necessary. Go and register and spread the word to other teachers that you know that they should register as well somebody's going to walk away

with those grace is in washington dc hi grace welcome to the ramsey show thank you for taking my call sure how can i help so um i purchased a home in 2022 um right now i well i've made a decision to rent the home i I'm currently living with my mom and grandmother. Um, the home needed, we need some repairs. Um, I've put some work into it thus far, but I need about 20 to $25,000 more to complete the repairs to get it rentable. Um, my question is, why are you not living in it well because i live with my mom and my grandmother my grandmother's 95 so my mom and i are kind of taking care of her together um and then just joint economics at this point i've been with my mom for this long and it's

kind of just works out this way you used to live in the house though i didn't no i have not lived in the house you've never lived in the house i've never lived in the house huh yeah so um now i have like i said i'm i'm need about 20 to 25 so you live with your mom because you don't have any money but you bought a rental house no no no i bought the house i'm paying the mortgage on the house. I know. You bought a rental house. Yeah. Yeah. But you live with your mom for economic reasons. I didn't have a plan when I bought the house. I really stumbled upon it, got it within 30 days, and then it was just like, okay, you

secured the property. Now what's next? Yeah. So I kind of grappled with what to do, whether move in or not. Sell it. Sell it? You're too broke to be a landlord. You don't have any money.

You live with your mother. Okay, but I could live in the house if I chose to. Yeah, but you don't choose to because you have economic problems. I wouldn't say I have economic problems. It's what you did say. My goal is to rent the property to make money because dc is a really hot market i am comfortably living with mom paying the mortgage getting things done there and plan to rent the house that will pay for the mortgage and i can say maybe i'm misunderstanding

let me let me back up one more time okay because maybe i'm missing something i thought you told me you lived with your mother for economic reasons, meaning you don't have the money to live in the house. Okay, that's not correct. What were you saying when you said economic reasons? Well, because I've been here and I've just been able to save while with my mom. That's not an economic reason. That's just I want to, okay. What do you make a year?

What do you make a year? I make $96,000 a year what do you make a year i make 96 000 a year okay all right and so you don't have the 25 000 and you make 96 000 a year and how long has the house been sitting empty uh coming up on two years in june why but all this time i've been making repairs. I'm repairing. I'm doing repairs on the home. So I have a few more thousand dollars needed to make those final repairs and get it rented. Are you saying it's uninhabitable, meaning that you can't get anybody in there until all this is done, the 20 to 25? Well, I need maybe about 10,000 to make it habitable. The house was habitable when I bought it. It just needed cosmetic updates. The biggest blow was I needed to put it in the new

HVAC system. That was the biggest blow thus far. But other than that, it's cosmetic. The reason for the delay, to keep it short, I'm working with a contractor who was working with me. So I'm working with his schedule and it's kind of like just a slow process. Yeah. What do you do for a living? I work in disability rights. Okay. I've been buying and selling real estate since I was 18 years old and I'm 63 on several hundred million dollars worth. I love real estate. Real estate is not a magic silver bullet to make you okay financially. And you have bet a ton of your emotional life and too much of your financial life on this one rental property. And it still has sat there empty for two years. Um, you, you, you suck at this. You've got to get better at being a landlord and managing the project.

Let me tell you, if I had that house, I'm not working on any contractor's schedule. They freaking work for me. They're working on my schedule. You better get the dadgum thing finished because I want rent. I'm not sitting here paying payments on this stupid thing for two years and collecting no rent because some contractor can't get out of his freaking pickup truck because he's hungover. Come on. This is stupid. You you got to get this thing finished and you so you've got to increase your landlording and project management skills or you shouldn't be in the business i really think you

should sell this house i really do because i don't think it's as big a blessing to you as you think it is okay i really think that and then take the pile of money that you get from it and decide what you, where you want to be 10 years from now and where you want to be living 10 years from now and what kind of life you want to build. But I would never tell someone as their financial coach to go buy a rental property while they're living with their mom. So what if I decide to move into the property? Because that's on the table as well. Okay, then fix it up and move into it and have a life.

But get that done now, not two years from now. I mean, you can do that immediately. So what is the house payment? The house payment is $3,600 a month. $3,600 a month for two years. Man, how are you not just screaming? Because I'm

comfortable. I mean, I'm able to pay the bills. Exactly. So here's the thing. This house, it's not going to make you the money you think it's going to make. You're not going to move into it. What do you think you could, let's, by the way, you don't have the money to actually

fix it up. That's why you called. You don't have the money to actually fix it. 20 to 25,000, correct? Correct. But you're right. And I think even with this extra point, you're still going to be right. I was really calling to ask about pulling from a previous employer 401k.

I have 48,000. That's an easier answer. Okay. I don't have to get that one. I think I can actually convince you of. Okay. So let's try this. If you pull money out of a 401k early before you're 59 and a half, you get charged a 10% penalty plus your tax rate.

Your tax rate is 30% at 96,000. And so you're going to get taxed 30 plus 10 is 40% of the money is going to go to the government in taxes and penalties. If you cash it out, never use a 401k for something like this. It's like calling and saying, Dave, I want to borrow money at 40% interest to finish the house remodel that I've been working on for two years for a house I'm not, don't live in. Um, no, absolutely not. that I've been working on for two years for a house I don't live in. No, absolutely not.

Please, for your sake, not because I'm trying to be mean to you or not because I think you're an inept person. I don't think you're an inept person. I don't think you're good at this, this landlording and rehabbing stuff. You've proven it. Your track record's horrible. And so for your sake, sell this house. And when you get ready to buy something later, buy something that you can just move in and that you're going to live there and you're going to build a sustainable life

for grace. Grace looks up 20 years from today and says, gosh, I'm really glad I bought a house. It's been a great place to live. I've made some money on it. I've been able to manage the cash flow on it. But I mean, you're sitting over there with mama and grandma doing nothing. Please don't borrow money at 40% interest. Please sell this house for grace's sake. Not going to affect me at all, hon. This is The Ramsey Show. Ken Coleman, Ramsey personality, is my co-host. Open phones at 888-825-5225. You jump in, we'll talk about your life and your money.

Mike is in Los Angeles. Hey, Mike, welcome to The Ramsey Show. Thank you so much for having me, Mr. Ramsey. How's it going? Better than I deserve. What's up? Well, my wife and I have been doing, we're okay. I think so.

Anyways, we've got about 200 in savings. Our house is valued at probably around $850, $875. We owe $400 on it. We have a business. We work for ourselves as a contractor, and we recently inherited some money as well as some property and looking for some direction on where to go with the property. It's a multifamily property across the country in New York, as well as several mortgage notes each month. And we're not sure if we should liquidate the mortgages, sell the building, and move

closer to home. That's kind of where we're at. Wow. What do you make of your... It's like an optional loan. It varies between $150 to $300. Okay, cool. Who passed away?

Father-in-law. Okay. All right. How long ago? Nine months ago. Okay. All right. I'm sorry. Uh, so, um, he obviously was a real estate guy. Yeah. And, uh, so he has mortgage notes that he had taken back on property owner financed, and so he was receiving payments. That's what you mean? Yes. Okay. And what's the total face value of those?

It's about $220,000. Okay. Well, it would be about $340,000, and then we've got some pricing to sell them off. Okay. So the discounted value is the actual market value is 220 if you sell them but the face is 340 yeah gotcha okay that's what i was moving about yeah and it comes in about 2500 a month and it just seems like we'd be able to probably do something a little bit more yeah but we're not living off of that money anyway it just goes right in the

savings and we're not touching it's like gosh well in 10 or 15 years when he's fully mature we'd be able to do a lot more with the one sum today yeah the um the apartment complex what's it worth uh 1.4 okay what's owed on it nothing okay all right so a good way to help you answer these questions and i use this with assets i use it with income i use it with everything anytime something lands in my lap or might i ask myself okay right now 1.4 plus 220 000 is 1.62 you with me yeah okay so if $1.6 million cash sitting in the middle of your kitchen table, and you and your wife are sitting there looking at it, would you go buy $340,000 worth of notes for $220,000 at an apartment complex in New York? The answer to both questions quickly would be no.

Correct. Correct. Now that's called a sunk cost analysis. And, uh, what it does is it makes you critically think only about the future, not about where the stuff came from. The reason you would not go buy those things there

is the same reasons you would sell them now. It's because you don't want to manage something from Los Angeles to New York called rental property. That sounds like a disaster. And what you said, I think I can take 220 and do more with it than receiving these payments over the next 15 years. You were correct on both things. Now, the trick is for you and your wife to have a clear discussion about this is to talk about we have $1.62 million sitting in the middle of our kitchen table from your father.

What an incredible legacy he left. What an incredible legacy he left. What an incredible job he did. How nice is that? How wonderful is that? Now, do we want to go buy an apartment complex with it in New York and some mortgage notes? You see how that changes your thinking? Yeah, yeah, absolutely.

It makes you sell both of these instantly sure and and so i even do this we used to do this with sellers when i was selling real estate for a living a thousand years ago so if a guy had a two hundred thousand dollar house on the market for two hundred thousand dollars and someone offered him 190 he'd be going i don't know if I want to take that or not. And I said, wait a minute, wait a minute, wait a minute. Your house is sold for $190,000.

If you had $190,000 in the middle of this table right now and you didn't own this house, would you come buy this house for $190,000? No. Well, you're getting ready to buy it back if you counter offer. If you jack around with this buyer and run him off and you raise the product try to get that 190 up you're buying the house back for 192.5 when you screw around with them it's the same thing and so you got to decide you know what is it i want do i want the money or want the stinking house and in some cases i look at the thing and i go well i like the thing i'll keep the thing yeah

if i didn't own that for that price, I'd buy it right now. So then you should keep that, right? So if you're like, man, we're thinking about living in New York and we wanted to manage these rental properties, we're going to pull up roots from California. We're heading out and, you know, we're going to live over there and we always wanted to have this. Of course, I would buy it again. Then you would keep it, right?

Mm-hmm. But long-distance landlording multifamily, that's like getting shot in the head don't do it this is exactly what it feels like yeah it's a bad it's russian roulette man i mean you're just asking for it okay so second question okay to allocate it where are we moving forward with it the only debt you have is a mortgage, right? Yeah. I'd pay that off tomorrow. So now we've got 1.4 again, right? And then we have some cash in savings as well.

Okay. So now you've got 1.4 plus the cash. What are we going to do with that? Well, then the only thing left to do is be unbelievably generous, enjoy your money, and invest your money. So what do you guys want to invest a million dollars in you need to assume real estate that's up to you i don't care some people don't need to do real estate some people love real estate i love real estate and i love mutual

funds that's the only two things i put money in but you can do whatever you want to do it's your money you know you but what do you want to do it's your money you know you but what do you want to invest a million dollars because you don't want to leave it sitting in a stinking savings account no of course not so you're 100 debt free you got 200 in the savings plus a million you know you pay off the mortgage of 200 that's about a wash and so you end up with about a million six clear give or take you got some expenses on selling the apartment let's call about a million six clear, give or take. You got some expenses on selling the apartment. Let's call it a million five. So I want to label some percentage of that money, an exact dollar amount. You and your wife discuss it, that we want to be generous in father's name. I want to do something in his name. What did he love? He loved wounded veterans. I want to,

I want to go help one of them furnish their home. A gold star family lost somebody in the military. We're going to take care of them for a year whatever label some money for generosity label some money for for hungry kids if that's what he was into i mean what is it that you know that kind of is in his honor let's be generous with some of this let's invest most of it and let's enjoy a chunk of it what is it your wife needs a new car a trip a cruise i don't know but some of this money ought to be spent on that it's a bit extravagant but you came into a million six so you can do a little bit of extravagant okay you just can't do a million dollars worth got it yeah yeah and we're

pretty full i mean we shot the television you've done a you've done a good job till you got to here so yeah i know that i think you've done a good job until you got to here. So, yeah, I know that. I think you've done a really good job. Still working hard. You know, we just look at the numbers. What does she drive? 2016 minivan. Buy her a car.

Toyota Sienna. Buy her a car. Yeah, okay. You're a millionaire. She needs a better car. Okay. She needs a better car. What. She needs a better car. What trip has she always wanted to go on but hardly talks about it anymore because she doesn't think she's ever going to get to go?

Yeah, all right. Start thinking like that. We'll talk about it. Because, I mean, all I'm spending here is less than $100,000 after we do a bunch of dreaming. And you've still got tons of money to do everything else. Yeah. And simple decision, Mike.

Just a little jewelry. A little jewelry. You know, something shiny. Put it on her finger, you know. What you're doing? Just a southern accent. I'm bored, I guess. I don't know.

The jewelry. I'm boring him. No, you answered that one great. I didn't have anything to add except for buy something sparkly for her and some jewelry. Just small things. Just enjoy this. Yeah, enjoy some of the great. I didn't have anything to add except for buy something sparkly for her and some jewelry. Just small things. Just enjoy this. Yeah, enjoy some of the money.

This is big. Be generous with some of the money. Invest most of the money. And that's what you do at Baby Step 7. You live like no one else, so later you can live and give like no one else. By the way, if you guys are smart with this, the million he leaves you guys will be worth $30 million when you retire. This is The Ramsey Show.

Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, it's The Ramsey Show, where we help people build wealth, do work that they love, and create actual amazing relationships. Ken Coleman, Ramsey personality, number one best-selling author of the book Paycheck to Purpose, is my co-host today. Open phones at 888-825-5225. Today we have launched a companion piece to Ken's Get Clear Career Assessment. Almost 100,000 people have taken the assessment and we are launching the

pre-sale on a book called Find the Work You're Wired to Do. Included with the purchase of the book is the assessment and this book will go on sale pre-sale today. You'll get the audio book and the e-book with it and you'll get codes for the assessment with each of them. So that's a pretty good deal. Uh, it's a great bargain. Actually. Um, it's like $200 worth of stuff for buying a book,

but the book comes out actually May 7th and the book goes on sale today. Presale Rachel Cruz. Also we're launching the presale on her new children's book today. It comes out in two weeks on April the 16th. I'm glad for where I am. Absolutely incredible kids books. This is the second in the series. The first one is I'm glad for where I I'm glad for what I have, which was about contentment. This one's about gratitude, about the gratitude of home. And so for teaching the kiddos contentment gratitude these are excellent things to teach the

kiddos if you teach the little ones that that's the opposite opposite of entitlement and it puts them in a completely different position they're the ones that say thank you and mean it please and mean it manners comes with gratitude automatically and that's why we teach manners at the ramsey house it's kind of old school i know but hey you that's why we teach manners at the Ramsey house. It's kind of old school. I know, but Hey, you,

that's not what we do around our places, ma'am, sir. Yes, Papa Dave, sir. This is how we do it. We honor,

respect, gratitude, contentment. These are character qualities of people who live quality lives. And so we want to teach the kiddos all of these things as we go along. Be sure and check them out. Ken, I'm excited about this new book. Find the Work You're Wired to Do. Yeah, I am too. This is really a coaching manual, very short, simple, and it's going to walk you through your results. Once you know what you do

best, what you enjoy doing, and what motivates you, this is going to come alongside and basically go, all right, now I know who I am and why I am that way. And now it's going to help me figure out where I want to go and how I get there, which is all about making more money, more freedom. There we go. Heather is in Madison, Wisconsin. Hi, Heather. How are you? Oh my goodness, Dave. I'm great. Thank you so much for taking my call. It's so to talk to you today. Well, we're honored to have you. How can we help? So my husband and I, we are on Baby Step 6. We are, earlier this year, we're sitting down and coming up with our budget.

We were trying to get an idea about our long-term budget, specifically with his older parents, if they wanted to live with us when they were unable to care for themselves. And they came to visit. We brought this conversation up with them. And during that conversation, we learned that they have never had or made a budget. They have considerably less in retirement savings than we do about. Their investment strategies are kind of wonky. They're investing in single stocks instead of ETFs or mutual funds and a lot of other kind of questionable financial decisions. How old are they? So his parents, they're both right

around 70 and both retired. So how much do they have in savings? How much do they have in retirement? In retirement, they have just under 700 and they do own a home in the la area and they may be able to get a million for that um but that's not liquid uh in terms of liquid savings i think they had about 30 and then they have 700 in retirement okay so so they have almost a two million dollar net worth yes i don't think that sucks too bad. I think they've done pretty good. They have done good, but we didn't really get an answer about if they wanted to live with us. Well, they don't need to live with you.

They've got $2 million. Why would they want to live with you? Well, when they're older and there's no family around, we want to be there to care for them. And we wanted to plan a few years down the line if we wanted to buy a multi-generational house so they would be comfortable and we could share the home together. They really didn't give us an answer about that. It's not a financial necessity. That's a lifestyle decision.

Yeah. And it's twice you said they haven't said anything. I think there's an old song lyric that says, when you said nothing, you said it i think there's an old song lyric uh that says when you said nothing you said it all or something along those lines and i think that's them saying nothing is all you need to know they don't want to live with you that's what i think yeah they got two million dollars i think they're okay i mean really they're gonna be i think the one thing that we are concerned about is that their their largest asset which is their house, is not fully insured. They don't have earthquake insurance.

There are other problems with the house that we learned about. Nobody in California has earthquake insurance unless they buy it from the state. Insurance companies quit issuing it because California has earthquakes. So everybody in California has that unless they buy it from the state it's socialized now like everything else in california but yeah so my husband and i then we should just operate under the assumption that like you said if they're gonna be okay nothing that means yeah we love you and we're here to help if you want to if you want some coaching on this stuff we've probably got some ideas because we've done pretty well with our finances.

You guys have done a great job, Mom and Dad, but if you want some coaching, I'm here. I mean, and really it doesn't need to be you because, really, for sure the daughter-in-law, but it would be a very unusual daughter-in-law that gives the advice. It's probably their son that says, hey, Dad, you know, those single stocks, man, you're taking a lot of risk there. You're 75. You probably ought to quit that. But owning a home in L.A., I mean, it's going to go nowhere but up.

So if they live 10 years, that's a $2 million house. Okay. And, you know, they can sell that and move to Madison Freak in Wisconsin and buy whatever they want and hire a full-time butler. They don't need you. Yeah. We just want to make sure that they're taken care of as they get older, and we're trying to lessen their risk. So we just weren't sure how we should approach that.

That's going to be up to them because they've done well enough to be worth $2 million. And if they want your input and will take it, it would be from your husband. It would be my suggestion. And unless you're just known as a financial expert i mean sometimes my in-laws will ask me stuff but i've also been married 43 years so it's like i'm one of them now so um but the um but by and large the the actual blood would be the only one that can get through and so if your husband took your dad to coffee and said, Hey, I noticed a couple of things here. You may not want my input,

but here's a couple of things I would do if I were you, but no big deal, dad. And Hey, if you ever want to be in Madison and you want to talk about doing something together at some point, we'll talk about that. Meantime, we're going to go over here and pile up some money to go with your pile of money. Great.

And I really, I really would not wring my hands over it, Heather. I, and I really would not wring my hands over it Heather I think they've done better than you feel like they've done is what I heard and I just don't know many old people that want to go to Madison Wisconsin lovely place but it's cold it's cold up there well they are in California that's my point LA to Madison I don't

see it two choices that's why a lot of these people go to Florida nothing Nothing against Madison. Florida. There you go. There you got mosquitoes the size of pterodactyls. I'd rather get a mosquito bite than freeze. Forget trash states. Let's just trash them all.

There's no trashing. It's just cold. Everybody in Wisconsin knows how cold it is. No, but that's just because your blood is thin because you're a Southerner. That's a fact. Madison, Wisconsin is actually a pretty place. It's just cold for Southern people. Well, I bet it's pretty in the spring.

That's true. In the spring. In spring is what happens for three days before summer. Exactly. You're so mean. I'm trying to read between the lines. Yeah. I think they don't want to live with you.

I think he's right. This is The Ramsey Show. Ken Coleman, Ramsey personality, is my co-host today. Thank you for joining us, America. We're glad you're here. If you've got a question about taxes, we get it. Taxes are confusing and, yay, even maddening. To help you get a better handle on them, let's unpack a question from one of our listeners.

Are there penalties for filing a tax extension? No. There's no penalty for filing an income tax extension, which gives you six months to submit your tax return. But your extension is for the tax return, not for payment. So if you owe money, you have to pay now, whether you file an extension or not. Now, is there a penalty for not paying your taxes?

Dadgum right. Your taxes are due April 15th whether you file an extension or not. So if you owe $50,000 in taxes and you file an extension to October, the only extension you're getting is the filing, not the taxes. So you pay the $50,000 now and wait till October to do the paperwork. That's what we're saying. If you, there is no extension on, oh, we're going to let you wait six months to pay your taxes. No, you'll get penalized out your freaking ears. So don't do that. So you request an extension. You have to estimate your total taxes owed, compare that to what you paid,

and make sure you're paying all taxes due by April 15th, whether you file an extension or not, and then you will avoid any penalties. You can file your taxes or file an extension with the help of a tax software or with a pro. If you have a simple return for your taxes, we recommend Ramsey Smart Tax Software. Very inexpensive, not a bunch of gotchas, not a bunch of stuff where they're going to try to sell you some stupid credit card like TurboTax does, all that crap. A lot of people leaving this.

So we've got about 100,000 people filing on Ramsey Smart Tax now. Pretty incredible, just using the software. If you've got a simple return, that's fine. And then if you've got a complicated return, you can go to ramseysolutions.com slash tax and get one of the tax pros, one of the endorsed local providers for taxes, and they can walk you through a complicated return and they're going to charge you, but it's absolutely worth every penny to have a pro in your corner when you've got something complicated. But no reason to pay somebody 400 bucks to prepare your taxes when you can do it for 20 30 bucks using tax software so if you've got simple a simple return so that's the thing that's what i do is

what obviously mine stupid i mean i've got llc's mine's as thick as a freaking phone book when i sign it all and so obviously i'm supporting this guy's this guy that does our taxes I mean he's wonderful and I've been a friend for years although the only time I see him is during the time of year that I'm angry but because he never brings me good news he never brings me good news it's always you owe money all right Nick is in Oklahoma City. Hi, Nick. Welcome to the Ramsey Show. Hey, Dave. Thank you for taking my call. Sure. How can we help? So I'm the main breadwinner for my family, and I'm just trying to get a better grasp of my understanding of my trajectory for the future. And I just wondering if you could help me out with that. We'll try.

Um, so I have about $50,000 cash saved up. Um, my wife stays home with the kids and our kids are still really young. They're one and four and she plans on staying home with the kids until they're 18. So I'm just trying to make sure me and her are going to be set up for retirement when we're 60, 70 years old. Okay. How old are you? I'm 35. Okay. What do you make? I make about 120 a year. Okay. And how much debt do you have? Zero. Your house is paid off too uh house is paid off yes what's your house worth i mean i guess if we sold it today it's probably worth 180 000 okay and we'll call it 200 for easy

okay and uh because we're not selling it so it doesn't matter um and you make 120 and how much do you have in your nest egg so far in retirement? So between me and my wife's 401Ks, we have about $120,000. She's got $61,000 each. Okay. Are you invested in good mutual funds in your 401Ks? I want to say yes. Okay.

It's whatever Fidelity has. Fidelity has some great ones, and it has some dogs too. So good mutual funds that have growth stock, mutual funds that have a long track record. We always suggest spreading it across four types, growth, growth and income, aggressive growth, and international. That's what my personal 401k is in. Okay. Okay. Now, so here's a rule of thumb.

If you earn 10% on your money okay your money will double if you don't add anything to it about every seven years not every seven years okay okay so we're dealing with 320 000 in a house and 401k today, when you're 42, it should be, what, 640, right? When you're 49, it'll be a million two, million three. When you are 56, it'll be 2.6. If you add nothing to it, right? When you are 60, what? When I say 56, I forgot where I was. I said 49, 56, so seven more would be 62, right?

63. When you're 63, when you're my age, you'll be worth $5 million. If you add nothing to it. Oh, wow. Okay. And of course you're going to add to it. You're going to continue to invest systematically and grow, and your income is going to continue to go up.

You will probably trade houses up and pay cash for the move up but the house will go up in value it may not make 10 a year but your mutual funds should easily make that okay okay so i could be a little off you might only have four million but you might have eight million but somewhere in there if you don't do squat except leave it alone and invest it well and never move right now if you move up and go get a mortgage and lease three cars you can screw this up right but you're not going to do that because that's not who you are no sir so if you will systematically continue to save 15 or 20 percent of your income into your retirement and stay out of debt and continue to be generous and say and

fund your kids college funds and you and your wife work a plan together and you're constantly being generous and and sitting down and going over this you don't have to do it every week like you're like you're about to be repoed because you're not you've done an amazing job you're in great shape for 35 years old you killed it way to go now if you'll just continue on somewhat the same trajectory, it's easy to estimate that you've got a $5 to $10 million net worth at 65 years old. Wow. I just really couldn't see that far in the future.

I just felt like I was sandbagging. Maybe I wasn't working hard enough. I don't know. I just didn't feel right. But that's good news. Yeah, you're doing a good job. And so what we tell folks when you get to this stage, you don't have to be intense and like freaked out, desperate feeling like you do when you're getting out of that. But you move from intense to intentional.

And so by intentional, I just mean every dollar needs a name. We're going to move, get mom a little better car this year and pay cash for it. We're going to go on a trip here. We're going to buy a couch here. We're going to fund the kids' college fund here. We're going to put money in 401k here. We're going to be generous to our house of worship or wherever it is that we're generous. So generosity, enjoyment, and investing in a regular set rhythm. Spouse knows everything that's going on. We're doing it together. And you continue to work your career and keep your nose clean, man.

You're going to end up very wealthy. You've done a great job. That's good news. That's good news. So keep following the system that got you here. Hopefully we had something to do with it. I think we did, or you wouldn't have been calling. Yeah.

You know, that's a great illustration. I think a lot of people's eyes were opened as you walked him through that, you know, just to understand compound interest. I mean, we hear it. I think we all heard a story here or there once in a while, but if you actually start plugging your numbers in, people don't realize how the consistency really does pay off. It was 22. I sat in a room and a guy with a whiteboard showed me that at 12%, if I invest $100 a month from age 25 to age 65, it's $1,176,000. Well, you can't get 12%. You won't if you're not investing it because you sit around and talk about your freaking theories all day. There's that, too.

This is The Ramsey Show. Ken Coleman, Ramsey Personality, is my co-host today. You're welcome to come by and visit us. We'd love to have you. We're just south of Nashville in Franklin, Tennessee. We do this show on the glass, the lobby of Ramsey Solutions. And so you can come watch Ugly Paint Dry anytime you want. And we're here from 1 to 4 Central every Monday through Friday. A couple of us, a couple of the Ramsey personalities sitting here and doing the show at all times.

And the homemade chocolate chip cookies, the coffee is on us. Come in as our guest. You come in here, it smells like mama's kitchen. It don't smell like corporate America, I can tell you that. And of course, right in the middle of the lobby of Ramsey Solutions is the debt-free stage, which is where Brad and Susan are. Hey, guys, how are you? Good. How are you?

Better than we deserve. Where do you live? We live in Pasco, Washington. Which is Spokane. Yes. It's near Spokane. Yeah. That's the closest major yeah good

good to have you man how much debt have y'all paid we've paid off 329,300 dollars in 46 months wow good for you and your range of income during that four years it was 176 to 242 cool what do y'all do for a living uh I'm a school teacher, a high school, a high school STEM teacher. And I'm a pharmacist. Ah, very good. Excellent careers. Well done. Well done. And so I got to stop a second. Rhinos on the t-shirts. Rhinoceros success. Yeah. All right. I love the little book. Yeah, that book was awesome. We sold a bazillion of those little books. I love that little book. Don't be be a cow be a rhino absolutely run through the jungle and knock stuff down cows eat cud i like it way to go guys cool so what kind of debt was this well we had ninety five hundred dollars for a camper um eighty two hundred for for Brad's master program. We have a rental home. It was $90,000.

And $221,000 was our mortgage. Oh, look at it, weird people. No mortgage. No mortgage. Rental or anything. Yes. Did you sell the rental or keep it and pay it off? Keep it.

I kept it. I love it. So what's the rental worth? The rental is currently $304,000. What about your home? $443,000. What about your home? $443,000. All right. Very cool.

All right. And then the next question, how much is in your nest egg? About $299,000. Okay. Nice. So you broke the million dollar mark. You're millionaires. We did.

100% everything paid off. Way to go. I'm so proud of y'all. Thank you. Thank you. Way to go. How old are you guys? We're i'm 41 nice move no that's a pro move by brad way to go brad keep guessing a year or two younger 40 year old school teacher and pharmacist everything's 100 paid off and they're

baby steps millionaires yes that's incredible i'm so proud of y'all how's it feel to be completely free oh it's amazing it's amazing thanks to your teachings it really helps us uh pave the path and how many millionaires in your family none you yeah i think you're looking at them i like it i like it way to go man thank you that is so cool and you're gonna at them. I like it. I like it. Way to go, man. Thank you. That is so cool. And you're going to be worth so much more because you're only 40. Oh, my gosh. You keep going. It's going to be worth a lot of money.

I'm so proud of y'all. Well done. Well done. Well done. Well, the number three in our millionaire study of 10,000 millionaires, the number three most likely to appear career field in the millionaire study is teacher. And a pharmacist wouldn't be far behind because you also fall in what we finally discovered after we looked at all these careers that were all, you know, accountants, engineers,

teachers. These are the people that are making it, attorneys, because they're all process people. They have a set of rules that they go by. You do lesson plans and processes. You don't mess up the filling of the prescription or somebody dies. You know, I mean, it's a big deal, right? Or at least they don't get well anyway, minimum, right? So there's a process.

You don't get to, like, it's not art. You don't make it up. You've got to do it the right way. There's one way to do it, and that's the right way. These are the people that learn to follow a process, and they're the ones that have a tendency that career field doesn't mean you can't be an artist and become wealthy but you but but you know artists just make it up right now you don't get to make this up there's a law of gravity you live on less than you make you live on a plan

you get your butt out of debt you build wealth you invest steadily there's things you have to do here that work every single time so way to go guys thank you all right now that you're completely free tell people how do you be a millionaire by the time you're 40 what are you going to do you just laid it out follow the process it's it's laid out there for you you just work hard go after it budget take care of business and i'm lucky lucky Brad came into my life because I was Dave-ish. I lived with a credit card. I thought,

I lived to my means all the time before meeting him. And then two years after getting married, our in-laws gave us a book for Christmas, The Total Money Makeover, which my dad introduced me to. Yep. When I was younger,

so I was Davish. But Brad read it while he was on Christmas break. I had nothing to do for two weeks, so hey, read a book. Yeah, why not? Even a boring financial book. And so he was all about it, but I was a little bit hesitant to get on the budget thing. I was kind of like, really? You want me to do a budget?

But it has actually been freeing because it's allowed us to communicate better. You know, the spending is easier when he knows what we're going to spend it on. Yeah. And we've agreed to it. Yep. As Rachel says, it's a spending plan. Yeah. That's what a budget is. It's a plan of how I'm going to spend my money. Yes. And in this case, you spent it on $ on 329 000 worth of debt in 46 months you're completely debt-free and millionaires i love you guys you're amazing you're heroes man never again absolute heroes wow way to go way to go so your parents gave you the book yeah okay wow and they're that's who's with you yeah okay very cool well they got to be proud oh yeah who was uh who was cheering you on and who

was telling you you're an idiot for doing this stuff i don't know that we ever got you're an idiot but we it's not really a popular conversation to have with a lot of people so but our family cheered us on yeah supported us along the way that's good that's good well you got good folks good people around you then yeah excellent excellent very good you know i'm struck by how much you paid off in this amount of time i mean this was getting with it i'd love to hear what was the most gazelle intense crazy season or thing that you guys did i want our audience to hear this we would throw our kids into the car and go do door dash or uber eats after work both of us just go and do what we can. He does a lot of after-school program for high school.

We just worked, Ken. We just got after it, and we picked up the hours if they were available, and we just worked and worked and worked. We had the vision. We don't want this for our kids. Our kids, we have the benefit right now where they're a little bit younger. So we can get after it right now. The older they get, the more difficult it's going to get.

Was it worth it working that hard? Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. Now you work like no one else. Now you get to work like no one else. Exactly. You live like no one else. Later you get to live and give like no one else.

No discipline seems pleasant at the time, but it yields a harvest of righteousness. Way to go, you guys. Thank you. Very, you guys. Thank you. Very, very cool. And you brought the kiddos with you. What are their names and ages? Amelia is six and Lincoln is three. All right.

We've got a little Amelia running around. And oh, check out the cowboy hat. Way to go, Amelia. Good job sporting that right here in Tennessee. I like it. Good stuff. All right. Brad and Susan, Amelia and Lincoln, $329,000 paid off. House, rental property, everything completely debt-free in 46 months,

making $176,242, a teacher and a pharmacist. They're 40 years old, they're baby steps millionaires awesome job count it down let's hear a debt-free scream three two one wow wow ken there's a whole bunch of folks stuck on tiktok and facebook yeah and instagram saying with the current state of the economy i can't get ahead can't win the house prices and the interest rates i can't get ahead i'm gonna have to live in my mother's basement i'll never be able to get ahead and yet brad stood up here made a very profound statement on how to fix that yeah work we just worked there's a great

place to go when you're broke to work this is the ramsey show our scripture of the day that's funny y'all leviticus 13 40 through 41 if you didn't think the bible had some stuff in it if a man's hair falls out from his head he is bald he is clean and if a man's hair falls out from his forehead he has baldness of the forehead. He is clean. Well, there you go. According to Levitical law, I am clean. So there you go. Larry David said, anyone can be confident with a full head of hair, but a confident bald man, there's your diamond in a rough. Wow. What is it with you guys in the booth? Everybody's having a party. Oh, it's oh it's april fools ah oh you know what i missed my opportunity wait a minute is that a real that's not a real scripture no it totally

is it actually is yeah i know there is a scripture where some two guys made fun of the prophet elijah for being bald and he called a bear out and killed him yeah so there's that so watch for bears next year watch for bears back there i'm just saying bears back there. I'm just saying. True Bible story. Really happened. I just can't stop looking at your head now that I know how clean you are. I just feel clean. Mr. Clean. Remember the old commercial?

Does that mean that I need to shave my head? No, it does not. No, some heads should be covered. That is true, by the way. Some barns need paint and some heads should be covered i'd look like a sunflower seed i think probably pointy i don't even want to think about that andrew is in kansas city please get us out of this andrew how can we help i was enjoying that one for a little bit guys uh all right yeah so my big my big dilemma right now is uh basically job job opportunity job

situation um the job i have right now it's a remote job so i get to work from home see my my two little kids i got a daughter who's three son who's one baby on the way um so it's awesome um but just recently how can you work from home in that circus uh it's actually well my wife holds it down real well so she gives man she gives me that hard for me to work from home i just have a dog okay anyway what do you make at your remote job so there's a few layers to this my i guess the base salary as of right now is a 97 000 base salary so what do you make so right now i make about 155 000 that's at the remote job at the remote i'm now it is but i'm not remote right now and that's why i'm in kansas city it's an on-site opportunity at a construction site so I'm working on-site for our client as of right now. Oh so it'll be 97 when you're back home?

Exactly yeah. Okay so we're going with 97 all right and what's your other option traveling? Yeah so the option is I'm here with the with our client and they want to hire me full-time which if I take this job I would I would keep the same exact position as of right now since I'm in person with this client, but I would just work for their company. Then you make $155,000. If I took it with, I'm at $155,000 right now. If I took it with them, I would bump up to about $235,000,

and that's starting. And you would be traveling. Why? Why would you be traveling? They're there. You you don't work there you're going to work all around the country at different sites so so yeah so right now they're traveling they're based out of louisiana the company that i have the offer with and it would it would mostly be um probably two to four year projects at a time so i would probably be here for another two three years and then i'd probably do one or two more um and they do have a few offices where i could kind of settle down and just work in their district how much would you be traveling in a given month no i see so i i guess it wouldn't be traveling so you would just

be at a workplace instead of working from your bedroom and you can move to kansas city make 235 000 versus 97 000 and all you gotta do is be willing to go to work yeah so so and i'm not i'm i'm absolutely not afraid to work i'm no i'm just saying all you gotta do is go physically to work you just have to walk over to the place and not have your child in the next bedroom it's tough so i mean yes i'm already doing that no no it's it's i'm i'm hoping i'm explaining well enough because i'm doing that now i'm going to work right now i know you don't currently live in kansas city though no i do i moved here for this on-site opportunity but i'm with my remote job and you would stay there for at least two or three

more years yes but i would just be switching to the our clients company and then from there i would yes after that after that job is complete you would have the option of moving to the next city with your whole family or moving to a district office and never having to move what's the question so and and that that that's where I'm at. I'm strongly leaning yes, because it's a huge financial jump. It could do wonders for my family, my children, our lives.

But my only kind of concern is, I value my wife and I's relationship and the way that my children see me, the father I am, not just the money. I value that over all of that. Okay. So hold on. Let me jump in.

Let me jump in real quick. Okay. Because I'm trying to speed it up. So if you take this job, you're working eight-hour days, 10-hour days? 10-hour days. How much? 10-hour days. Okay, great.

So right now I'm working two. So that would not in any way devalue your role as a father and a husband just because you're working those hours outside of the home versus inside the home. In fact, that's setting a really great example for your kids. And is your wife going to adjust? You said she's holding it down anyway. Dave said, how do you get work done? You said she's holding it down. Absolutely, she does. She stays at home, which I'm glad she does. She stays with her kids, and she's happy to do that. Let me ask you this.

Does taking this job, does it forward you significantly beyond the financial part? Does it set you up professionally to go where you want to go or be 15, 20 years from now? I think that's a tough question. I think it could because... Let me just tell you, the data says people that are working remote aren't getting promoted. People working at work are getting promoted because they're in proximity of the people that will promote them.

And I'd get the answer. Get the answer to that. I don't mind that you don't have the answer now. I'd get the answer because here's the deal. You don't just just make this decision this is a no-brainer as it relates to money no brainer yeah yeah it's a no-brainer as it relates to family you're not damaging your family i agree i agree with that i said you got eight hours a day in the bedroom or eight hours a day at the workplace so so yeah and and i'm not too worried i'm really not too worried about that either i've i've always been a hard worker, but I think my bigger concern was,

I guess your guys' input on, of course we all know, is the money worth it, which I think we all know it is, but is traveling with my young kids. You're not traveling. You're driving across town to an office. No, no, no, but I'm just saying after this, you know, after two years here, I go to a home state. Well, then you can decide if you want to move. But they're not putting you on the road even then. You just pick up your family and move.

Yeah. You sell the house and you move to Louisiana. Or you sell the house and you move to Abilene or wherever the next freaking four-year gig is. I get what he's asking. Or you don't. But you're not damaging your family. You could quit the job after two years and still be way ahead. But in the interim, your only question is, do I work remote or do I work in the office for two and a half times the money?

That's a no-brainer, and it's definitely not psychologically damaging your marriage. If it is, you didn't have one in the first place. It's certainly not damaging your children. Otherwise, you were damaging them when you were working at home so i mean if you unless you're not working when you're working remote you're not losing any time with wife and kids that's right because you're supposed to be in the bedroom locked in there working that's what you're getting paid for when you're working remote not out jumping on the trampoline for two hours a day okay so you not, you're not losing anything with the kiddos unless you've been stealing from your employer when you were at home.

Yeah. Which by the way, when you're supposed to be working and you're being paid for working and you're not working, that's called stealing people. For those of you that are remote and confused about that, that's theft. You're being paid to do something and you're jumping on the freaking trampoline, and you're calling that nurturing. Meanwhile, your children go, my dad don't work much. Right. And, Andrew, one thing I would say is the one- to three-year-old and then the baby,

moving from city to city over the next, they don't have a clue. Now, once they get into school, elementary, middle school, then I think that's a real decision. But as of right now, I would take this latter opportunity because the kids don't have a clue, and there's going to be a while before they're even the oldest. You've got at least two years before the oldest is even in kindergarten. You moved from Atlanta to take this job.

How old were your kids? Ty was a third grader, first grader, kindergartner. And they all prospered. They're fine. They're fine. And you work a lot. That's right. From here. This is our The Ramsey Show in the the books we'll be back with you before you know it in the meantime remember there's ultimately

only one way to financial peace and that's to walk daily with the prince of peace christ jesus We'll be right back. Hey, folks, Dave here. You want to hear even more life-changing content from Ramsey? Download the Ramsey Network app so you can catch all your favorite shows all in one place, like The Ramsey Show, Smart Money Happy Hour, and The Dr. John Deloney Show. You'll get real talk about life, relationships, money, and your career. Plus, the app lets you browse by topic like debt, business, or selling your home. Get the content you want whenever and wherever you want to listen. Download the Ramsey Network app today.