The Ramsey Show - If You Race To Build Wealth You’ll Fall Flat on Your Face

Episode Date: August 20, 2024

📱Finish today's episode for free in the Ramsey Network app. George Kamel & Dr. John Delony answer your questions and discuss: "My wife's college is trying to over-charge us," "How do I buy an expensive house in California?" "How do I get my wife to spend less?" "I've spent almost $600K on gambling" Support Our Sponsors: Christian Healthcare Ministries: Find out more at https://info.chministries.org/dave-ramsey Zander Insurance: Go to zander.com or call 800-356-4282 for a fast and easy quote today. MamaBear Legal Forms: mamabearlegalforms.com and use promo code RAMSEY to save 20% BetterHelp: betterhelp.com/Delony to get 10% off your first month   Next Steps 📞 Have a question for the show? Call 888-825-5225 Weekdays from 2-5pm ET or click here! 🏘️ Free Tools & Resources to Reach Your Home Goals 🏠 How to Buy a Home Course 📈 For help with investing, get connected with a SmartVestor Pro. 💵 Start your free budget today. Download the EveryDollar app! 💸Enter The Ramsey Cash Giveaway for a chance to win $10,000! 📚 Shop the $12 Sale to get life-changing tools to help you make real progress! (including the NEW 2025 Ramsey Goal Planner) Listen to more from Ramsey Network 🎙️ The Ramsey Show   🧠 The Dr. John Delony Show 🍸 Smart Money Happy Hour 💡 The Rachel Cruze Show 💸 The Ramsey Show Highlights 💰 George Kamel 💼 The Ken Coleman Show 📈 EntreLeadership Ramsey Solutions is a paid, non-client promoter of SmartVestor Pros. Learn more about your ad choices. https://www.megaphone.fm/adchoices Ramsey Solutions Privacy Policy

From Ramsey Network, it's The Ramsey Show, where we help people build wealth, do work that they love, and create amazing relationships. I'm Ramsey personality, George Campbell, joined by my good friend, some would say best friend, Dr. John Deloney, best-selling author and host of the very popular Dr. John Deloney Show. And we are here for you to help you take the right next step for your life, your relationships, your mental health, your money. So give us a call at 888-825-5225,

and we will try to do just that. Joe is going to kick us off in Tampa, Florida this hour. What's going on, Joe? Hey, what's up, guys? How y'all doing? Doing well. How are you? Not too bad. So I got some frustrating stuff going on, unfortunately.

So in the spring of 2020, met the love of my life. She was finishing up college in a master's program. She had about a year left. And what happened was some life stuff happened, COVID happened. We kind of fell in love. I knew I was going to be a single income family once we got married. So I was like, it's time to withdraw. So she withdrew from the university online master's program. And at the end of 2020, she found out that she was charged, charged for the classes. And she's like, I booked my advisor, sent the information in and they confirmed, yeah, this advisor left. So we're still charging you,

basically is what happened. We sent them all the paperwork. Here we went through, never heard from the university, never heard from the professors. So it kind of went cold for like a couple years. So the end of 2022, what happened was we got something from collections. It kind of went quiet. And they said, you still owe us seven grand.

We're like, we never took classes. There was never a product, never a university professor reached out to us. Nobody told us the thing, right? So we got all the emails, all the communication with the advisors. And for some reason, this large university is still like coming at us for this money. We're like, we never took classes. We withdrew. We got all the, you know, all this information.

So then now, two years later, we get a second collections. Okay. So my wife, we're debt free. Life's great. And we have this $8, dollar check for something that we never she never did never was a part of and it doesn't really make sense and not only that it's really frustrating because she was a straight-a student in her undergrad they've held her transcripts she can't even look at her class records anymore she can never get a job with the degree almost

improve it and they've like froze all of her accounts. Okay. So really what I'm asking you guys is, I don't know in a legal way what to do in a circumstance like this. I'm in Florida, the university's in Pennsylvania. And obviously this is pretty stressful. And my wife, who's worked really hard with me to get that free. So I don't know if you guys have any advice on where to go and how to kind of get this to just end. Well, good thing you called two attorneys at law at the Ramsey show. So, hey, Joe, here's the first place I would start.

And I spent 20 years almost in university systems, okay? I know they can be a maze. And I can't count. I would say in the hundreds, the number of students who registered for classes at some point withdrew, but withdrew past the withdrawal date. Meaning the gift the university gave you was not to give you all Fs, but you bought a seat or your wife bought a seat on the bus that they couldn't sell to somebody else. Now, this doesn't always scale in online classes, but just go with me here. There's a deadline to withdraw. We let you withdraw, but once you bought a seat past the withdrawal date, and usually in the university system, it's a graduated. So

like one weekend, you get charged this much for the class two weeks through and you get to pay for the whole class and i would start there and you can't say i didn't get a product and you bought a seat just because you didn't get on the plane that's fine but they couldn't sell that plane that's plain seat to somebody else so they they're holding you responsible for the cost i would check the withdrawal dates first if you have a if you have the withdrawal paperwork and you have the catalog and the calendar from when this from when the the because those things change every year then all i would do is send it to the registrar i've never met a registrar who likes to steal money from ex-students i've never met that person okay it almost always is a hey here's a deadline and by the way in a graduate class

professors treat you like grown adults they don't always chase you down they don't baby you like you want to drop out of the class drop out of class the class. I've got other stuff I've got to do. But I would go look at those dates before you get indignant. And if you find out they are ripping you off, then call the registrar's office and say, I just received a note from collections. I need to know who to talk to about it. Gotcha. All right.

Sounds good. That's good advice. That's where I'll start then. And my thing is, every experience I've had in collegiate is there's at least one bit of communication, just like one. Like, welcome to class. Here's your online class. All of her undergrad was online, and she had taken online masters. So when she got that bill, she was like, I never received any communication from the university at all, that I was even actively, even on the bus.

You know what I mean? That I was even, there was even a seat for my name on the bus. You know, so that's like right there. I'm like, I get it. But dude, in a very strange way, this isn't Deloney, uh, Deloney story time hour, but I registered for a class and I totally forgot. I registered for a class at the beginning of a spring semester

for the summer, I think it was summer two session. I completely forgot about it. In the fall, I went to register. I had an F on my transcript, graduate school. I went and met with a professor and she's like,

I'm not taking the F off. You didn't show up for my class. And the class, I couldn't have up for my class and i the class i couldn't have another student here so in order to make up the f i had to go retake like that was on me man i forgot about it i did it seven months before but that was 100 on me i just had to take i had to say i'm hey i'm at your mercy will you help me out here um but but the other here's the other thing a lot of schools have switched to portals kind of like doctor's offices have they don't email you 500 times they don't baby you they say your responsibility to check your portal every day here's the meta here take full ownership of

this and get yourself out of a victim position until you have proof beyond a reasonable doubt that you are indeed a victim here assume that a giant institution isn't out trying to destroy you that they have just computer processes and i guarantee you this was a computer wipe off sent you to collections there's not one person in the room going ha ha it's it's just yeah yeah you know what i mean so get rid of the villain and the bad guy and the victim let's check the dates and if y'all didn't register i mean if y'all register for a class and you didn't pay for it just own it and pay your 8 000 bucks and move on or call and beg for mercy say we totally blew it totally blew it during 2020

life fell apart can we come to a settlement here right i mean that's what i would that's what i would do but take ownership of this thing um until you find out man if you're getting hosed and they're just like yeah doomed we're trying to get some extra money well then yeah then hire an attorney and go down that road um because they've falsely sent you to collections but man i've just been in a lot of these conversations george where injustice injustice injustice it's like hey you're rich for class you just never showed up oh my bad oh yeah i'd be filing an appeal with the registrar's

office you can try to send a dispute letter to the collections and just go hey this was a big misunderstanding but before you do that to clean it up before you do that go take full responsibility is there a chance that i'm at fault here i reached for class and i didn't show up for it and if it is then call and beg for mercy that's different than you screwed me vengeance that's right sorry this happened to you jo Joe. This is The Ramsey Show. Hey, when you go against what society thinks is, quote, normal, like avoiding debt, for example, it might seem weird at first, and that is totally okay. We want you to be weird if that means doing things intentionally, including how you spend your health care dollars. And one you to be weird if that means doing things intentionally, including how you spend

your health care dollars. And one way to be intentional is with Christian Health Care Ministries. CHM isn't health insurance. They're a health cost-sharing ministry that's helped hundreds of thousands of families like yours take care of health care costs without sacrificing their freedom. Find out more and join at chministries.org slash budget. That's chministries.org slash budget. Welcome back to The Ramsey Show. I'm George Campbell, joined by Dr. John Deloney. Open phones at 888-825-5225. Well, John, we just announced the brand new 2025 Ramsey Gold Planner.

It's officially on presale. And I love this because you talk about how we've gone digital with everything, and sometimes we need to go tactile and analog. Well, and yeah, like my wife used the same type of like old school, writes in it every morning planner. And I'm an old you know that too we talked about this off air all the time well if it's digital John has lost track I'm out I still like holding it and writing in the calendar

and this Ramsey gold planners it's it's a perennial seller it always sells out but this year is a little bit different we understand that everything's tight like everything's just tight in people's homes financially and so we're doing something different we're rolling it out early we're pre-selling it this year and by pre-selling it we can offer it at a much lower price and so this is the best price that's ever going to exist 35.97 if you buy this planner for your wife your husband if you buy this planner if you use this planner and you buy it every year i can't tell you enough.

Buy it right now. It's the best price that's going to be on it, and it's going to help you with your money, your faith, your relationships. I've got some writing in it. Jade's got some writing in it. Rachel Cruz has some writing in it. And, of course, there's the calendar,

which is probably arguably the most important part of the planner is the calendar part. But it sells out every year. Get it now. Pre-order it. And it just is another thing you can mark off your christmas list and it's just it's it's 36 bucks so go to ramsay solutions.com slash store or you can click the link in the description if you're listening on youtube or on the podcast easy but it's easy way to grab it go get it last day to pre-order september

looks rad it's got these little gold i don't know didn't ask me. I would love to see you try to explain the design work on this. It's got these rings that are cool. It holds it together. It's beautiful. It's got numbers in it, calendar, goals. It also has books I'm reading, which is a thing you don't do, George. That's cool. That's not true.

Maybe you should get this. I'm actually going through an audio book right now. I'm really enjoying it. It's a memoir. That's what I'm really enjoying it. It's a memoir. That's what I'm into right now. It's my thing. All right, let's get to the phone lines. Mike is in Houston.

You don't even know what that word means. What's up, Mike, Mike, Mike, Mike, Mike? What's up? Mike in Houston. What's going on? How are y'all doing today? Big fan. We're doing well.

Keep us on the track, man. How can we help you? Well, just to make it quick, I'm basically 33. I'm moving into Houston to get a better job and make more money. However, going through my debt, I'm trying to attract the credit cards that I have. So thinking about my vehicle, I owe $16,000 on it, and it's worth about $11,000. So would it be better to just give it back to the bank and just tell them I can't afford it? Or should I just use the $10,000 that I have right now that

I'll be using to secure my moving and pay the difference and just sell it? I would definitely not do a voluntary repo. Like you first mentioned, I would much rather you see you come up with the difference. Even if you had to go down to your local credit union and get a $5,000 loan for the difference. But good news, you have it in cash. And so I would use that difference. If you owe $16, it's worth $11, you have $5,000, you show up with the buyer to the lender's office and go, all right, I need the clean title. Boom, you pay it down with the check that they give you. You have your cash to cover the difference and it, all right, I need the clean title. Boom, you pay it down with the check that they give you. You have your cash to cover the difference, and it's over.

And I would sell a private party and try to get the most you can out of this vehicle versus trading it into some dealership. Okay, I agree with that. I might maybe get more if I – that's what I saw online. But, you know, the dealership will probably even go lower than that. Oh, yeah, they're going to give you nothing for that. They'll go, well, I'll give you $6,000 for a car that's worth $11,000 because they need to make some money too.

Okay. So that's what I would do in your shoes. What's your income right now? Well, I was kind of in South Texas, and my income used to be $32,000, but the job that I just got, I'll be getting about $65,000. Wonderful. So you just got the job, I just got, I'll be getting about $65. Wonderful. So you just got the job, and you're going to move to Houston soon? Yes.

Do they include any relocation packages, any money to help you with this move? No, unfortunately. Where I used to stay, basically, I did not pay rent. I owned the place, but I went ahead and sold it to just go ahead and get the new job because i've been here for about two years and a half and i couldn't really get any more income but just side hustle so i decided to just take another job to double my income and also possibly making commission plus bonus good for you excellent plus you get to root for the astros which is which is amazing. Arguably

the best part. Easily the best part. Okay, well, so I think I'll just go ahead and, you know, push myself and pay the difference and try to settle here within this month on a private party. Yeah, and then limit how much it's going to cost to move. How soon is the

move? Is it a month from now? No, it's actually in the next two weeks. Next two weeks. Okay. So I'd scrape together any money you can. Do you need a car in the meantime? How are you going to move? Well, I'm using the truck that I have right now

to basically move. But I'm thinking, you know, after I sell it, I'm just going to give me something cheap for like $2,500 and just, you know, drive it for two years till, you know, I save up and pay everything that I need to pay first and then worry about the car later. You are thinking correctly, my friend. That is awesome. I love this plan, and it's not going to be a nice car. It's going to be a beater. But make sure you get a good inspection on it so there's no major issues. If you buy something for three or four grand, you'll be able to upgrade probably within a year if you have no other debt to where you can then have a $6,000 car,

an $8,000 car. And that's what John and I have done for years, and it's the best way. I never think you should drive your nicest car at a young age. That ruins you. When I see 16-year-olds driving brand-new cars, it just hurts my soul. Yeah, man.

Mostly out of jealousy. Like, my car, you don't even know how to keep driving for three seconds you're gonna crash that thing plus i just like to i just like to go back to 1984 every once in a while 82 any car still on the road today is is a taj ma it's like a porsche compared to what people were like just we're fine everybody's fine we're so dramatic about our cars oh gosh now it's the leather's not nice enough or the well it's like iphones i look you know when the iphone 8 came out like this is the most amazing phone now i see an iphone 8 i'm like oh my gosh what a relic of the past that is and the iphone 1 was like uh it's like a spaceship and we're like oh

gosh are you poor like god get over yourselves people yes if we get you from a to z it's fine we sound like old guys john's not good all right caitlin's up next in saint paul what's happening caitlin hi guys um so i'm you guys are great i've kind of followed everything we have like our emergency savings we have life insurance we have have one child. We have a savings account for him. I have my retirement at 15%. And now I'm just trying to look at, like, paying off our big mortgage in a faster way. So I went to our credit union to kind of do biweekly payments instead of monthly. So we're paying more interest down faster and then trying to look at making extra payments as well. But they're telling me that they won't let me do biweekly payments,

that basically what they'll do is they'll put it into a savings account and they'll still only pay my payment monthly. Can they technically do that? They can do whatever they want. They make the rules for how the payments work on the mortgage. But here's the good news. The whole idea of paying biweekly to save some interest, you can do the same thing yourself once a month with your normal payment. Just add extra to the mortgage. But here's the good news. The whole idea of paying biweekly to save some interest, you can do the same thing yourself once a month with your normal payment. Just add extra to the

principal. Okay. And so that's a simple way. When you actually do the math, you're just paying an extra payment a year kind of accidentally. Okay. Because of how the weeks versus months go. Yeah. So however much it was in each check, just go, all right, we're going to double that and do that once a month on the principal. On a normal payment, that's how I paid off my mortgage early. If the mortgage is $2,000 and you want to put an extra $1,000, put an extra $1,000 with that principal. Just make sure you designate it, this is for principal. Otherwise, if you don't designate it, they'll often roll it into prepay interest or something.

Prepay interest. Okay, so principal only. Yes. And you can usually, I don't know how your credit union works. You can do that online, but if you're there in person, just say, Hey, I want to auto pay an extra thousand toward the principal every single month, along with my normal payment. And they should be able to do that. No problem. Never pay a fee for, for any of this. Okay. Sounds great. Thank you guys so much. Awesome. Way to go, Caitlin. She's calling.

She's like, I got the emergency fund. I got the life insurance. I'm investing 15%, which is, that's the steps, John. There's an order to the madness. Baby step one, $1,000 starter emergency fund. Baby step two, knocking out consumer debt. Baby step three, three to six months expenses in an emergency fund. Baby step four, 15%. Then you start to do these simultaneously. Well, hey, I'm a huge TikTok fan, as you know. Huge, huge TikTok fan. I don't even know how long again. But I've heard that over and over that you want to pay. There's some secret mortgage hack to paying every two weeks. That's not right. Well, here's the thing. You pay 26 payments, right? Which is 13 months worth instead of 12.

So you're just paying an extra payment. That's it. Oh, man. So instead of 12 payments, you're doing 26 payments. That really turned out to 13 whole payments. So just pay extra once a month. That's it, guys. That's it. Well, you ruined my TikTok dreams. Life hack over. I've been doing this show for over 30 years,

and some of the saddest calls I have taken are from situations that are completely preventable. Yeah. And what's so hard is I feel like one of those, especially the ones that I'm like, oh, it's terrible. People that call in and their spouse has passed away suddenly and they don't have life insurance. When you have to think through how am I going to pay my bills in the middle of next week, in the middle of all that grief, like it's just, it is, it's terrible. And so life insurance is the one thing especially as a mom with three little kids that I'm like so big on for people to get because it's inexpensive Zander is the place that Winston and I actually get all of our life insurance and it doesn't cost much because Zander shops among a gazillion different companies

it doesn't cost much you just have to admit that someday you're not going to be here you got to say it out loud and you got to say I'm going to say I love you to my family by taking care of them and taking the time to put this stuff in place the cost of stinking pizza to get a free quote call 800-356-4282 that's 800-356-4282 or go to zander.com welcome back to the ramsey show i'm'm George Campbell, joined by Dr. John Deloney. Open phones at 888-825-5225. Ava joins us up next in San Jose. Ava, welcome to The Ramsey Show. Hi, thank you. I am such a huge fan of Dr. John and you. This is amazing. That's so kind. Can you clear something up for us, Ava? Who are you a bigger fan of? Just kidding,

don't answer that. All right ahead what's up that's a tough one what's up what's up so i am a newlywed in the bay area of california and we make a pretty decent income but the housing prices out here are insane so i want some advice on how we can best save for houses when everything is upwards of 900,000. Okay. Okay. You have to, you get to choose your own adventure.

Do you want George and I to make up a pretty amazing story about what y'all could do? Or do you want us to tell you the truth? You get to pick. I think I need the truth. We can make up great stories. We're pretty good at it. Okay. Go for it.

It's the government's fault. It's not, I don't know. I was just trying stories we're pretty good at it okay go for it it's the government's fault it's not i don't know i was just trying i'm not good at it so the worst thing you're going to run up against and george is going to walk you through it math doesn't care how in love you are it doesn't care what the prices are it doesn't care about anything It's just math. The question you have to decide, the question that you have to answer is how unsafe and at risk do I want to put me and my new marriage and my new family

in the pursuit of this thing that everyone has told me I have to have in order to be complete? That's the bigger question. Okay. How old are you two? We're 23. Okay.

The last I checked in the Constitution, there's no law that says 23-year-old newlyweds are entitled to a home in California. They must be homeowners by 25 or else their life is over. You're the worst failure. It's not in there. How much do you make? Gross,

$140. Together? Together, yeah. Okay. Cool. So what are you taking home every month? About $8,000 net. That's after insurance, 401k, all that. Okay. And you guys are just getting started in your careers. Yeah. Yeah. I just started in February. So let's paint a broader picture instead of,

I can't buy a house in California today and go, okay, let's make a goal that three years from now, five years from now, if we want to stay in California, this is where our careers and family holds us. We want to be able to purchase a home. This opens your options. You go, okay, a home, that could mean it could be further out, might be a townhome, might be a condo. We just want to get our foot in the door of the real estate market and do it in a smart way. How much would we need to save up? Well, you might need to save up two or 300 grand if your income stays the same. But that's barring other things happening, like your income going up significantly. And so that kind of helps me go, okay, what are the

facts? So the emotions are, oh my gosh, I'll never own a home the american dream is dead or we make so much money we've worked so hard how do we make 140 000 we can't even buy a house i hate everyone the whole system's against us let's burn it all to the ground like like there's so much spent energy there that accomplishes nothing for your goal which is what you and your husband want to have a house, right? Yeah. Yeah, definitely. Our goal is to have something better than what we're in when we want to have kids. Amazing. And do you guys commute to work currently? I work from home most of the time. My husband commutes about an hour a day each way. And is that because where he works is an insane area to live? Yeah, it just isn't feasible. I mean, it's closer to San Francisco. We live south of that and we have super cheap rent. So we're just not willing to leave that and spend

$4,000 for something equivalent. It just doesn't make sense at this point. What do you do for a living? I'm an M&A analyst at an accounting firm and my husband is an assistant project manager for underground construction. Can I tell you something bananas? Go for it. I believe with all my guts that you could move to Dallas, Texas or Austin, Texas or Nashville, Tennessee and both of y'all could find $70,000 a year jobs. You know, it's funny you say that because I can keep my California pay and move to Dallas. I just picked those cities randomly just because I'm from Texas and I live in Tennessee,

but here's the thing. It's also where people are actually going when they leave California. Yeah, that's a huge, and that in Florida. But as George was saying, you guys want to ask yourselves in three years, what kind of life do we want to have? And I want you to throw in another variable, which is geography. And if you can bend on one of those variables, then there's suddenly a path emerges where people get stuck and enraged and angry

as they want everything all right now. I want it all the way exactly the way I want it and I refuse to bend. And so I'm going to burn all of your world down. I want it all the way exactly the way I want it and I refuse to bend and so I'm going to burn all of your world down because I'm not getting my way versus no, we want to have this size house so that we can have a family. Okay, can we do that in Dallas?

Or we want to live in California because that's where all our friends and family are. Okay, it's going to cost us so we might have a condo, which by the way, you can raise an amazing family in a condo right or we're going to rent like it just allows you some freedom it opens up george i love what george what you said that it just it opens up your mind it lets you step back a little bit from the current ah to okay and at 28 years old what do we want

our world to feel like and look like let's do the best we can to get there. Okay. Yeah, that makes sense. Do you guys have any debt? No. So we just paid off my car in May and that was our only debt. So we're all good there. Amazing. And you're starting to build up some savings? Yeah, we have about $25,000 in a high yield. That's great. So let's call that your emergency fund. And so now we're on to baby step 3B, which is this down payment land. And so the question becomes, how much can we save? How aggressively do we want to save? And like John said, is this where we actually want to stay put? Should we be searching in this area? Or do we need to search outside of here? Is it worth moving? Because to live in an ultra high cost of living area, which is where you guys are at,

you kind of need an ultra high income to match that. And so if you're going to work near San Francisco, yes, you might need to make 200 grand or more just to survive out there if you want to live right there. Yeah. And I don't know about you. I don't want a long term, you know, hour each way commute because that's going to eat up your life. Right. And so I think we just need to look further out. The goal is definitely to life. Right. And so I think we just need to look further out to move.

Yeah. Our goal is either to move closer to San Francisco and one of the, like the surrounding areas that's a little cheaper, or we were seriously considering Dallas because I could keep my job. Okay. Well, that's, that's fantastic. And so I, the other thing that I think a lot of 23-year-old couples make, 24, 25-year-old couples is any one decision we make is our future forever and ever. Amen. Right. And George and I both are in job, what, six, seven, eight since we were 23, live in different places. I'm in a different state. I think George is different. It's just hard to project where you're going to be when you're 40. So we're going to make the next right

move always knowing the coolest thing about our life is we get to choose what happens next. We can change this. That's actually a really good perspective. It feels like we've been moving at a million miles per hour the past year being married and trying to figure it all out. There you go. All you have to figure out right now is what's the next right move. And the next right move is cool. Let's start saving for a house because we both know that. We don't know where it's going to be, but we're making good money. We can both just start saving up for it.

Yeah. Yeah. That's a good perspective. And by the way, all this energy is going to be there. All the energy. And you can channel it into rage. You can channel it into how dare they you can channel it into entitlement or you can channel into all right i'm just gonna do the next right

thing but that energy's got to go somewhere and man i love people choosing all right i'm gonna go be proactive about this and i'm gonna go make it happen but But, and by the way, George, can we call this out? Have you ever been to San Francisco area? Yeah. It's stunning. It's beautiful. The weather is just perfect. The weather in Malibu, perfect.

I get why everybody wants to live there. It's easy to bag on it. Like, oh, it's crazy. Who would want to live there? It's amazing. And it comes at a significant cost. It's just both, both are true, right? It's like driving around in Rachel Cruises' Tesla versus your Tesla.

Very different experiences. One's amazing and one is a Tesla. I was like, somehow John's going to make this a dig at me. And he did it. It was a success. I can't even hate on that. Ava and anyone else listening who wants some resources on this, our team created a real estate hub.

It's totally free. Lots of tools and resources for those preparing to buy, wanting to buy right now, home selling, even real estate investments and tons of great tools as well. Totally free. If you want to find an agent, you want to use our home buying calculators, home payoff calculators. It's all there. Just go to ramseysolutions.com slash real estate. We'll also drop a link to that in the show notes. And we created this to be a resource for you to help you during these crazy real estate times to parse through all the noise, what's actually true to help you get to that goal. This is The Ramsey Show.

Hey guys, George Campbell here. As a new dad, I see a lot of things in a new light. The cost of diapers, the value of sleep, and how crucial it is to have a will. Because if something happens to me, I don't want my family stressing about the details. And that's why I recommend making a will with Mama Bear Legal Forms. A will gives you peace of mind knowing things will be taken care of the way you want, instead of a random probate judge deciding who gets your fine china or precious

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like me, go to mamabearlegalforms.com right now and save 20% with promo code Ramsey. That's mamabearlegalforms.com, promo code Ramsey. This is The Ramsey Show. I'm George Campbell, joined by Dr. John Deloney this hour. Open phones at 888-825-5225. While you're listening or watching the show, do us a quick favor. Hit the subscribe button. Hit the follow button. Leave a review. Text a link to a friend. Let them know about the show or your favorite clip, a highlight, anything that can get the word out because you guys truly are the best marketing tool we have to keep spreading hope in a world filled with a lot of noise and distractions and hopelessness. And so we try to displace all of that with shows like this, and we appreciate

all of your help getting the word out. Lester is up next in Dallas, Texas. How can we help you, Lester? Hi there. I was calling to see about some advice on how to talk with my wife about saving more than spending. My wife's a spender. I'm a saver. We're aligned on our goals, but she just spends a lot of things here and there. And so just some advice on that. Was there like a spit shake on, hey, here's how much we're going to spend. Here's what the budget says. Stick to it. Yeah, we've budgeted out a lot of different things. We even have a split to where we have our own fund money where it's like a hundred100 a month that we can spend it on whatever we'd like. But there's a lot of gifts and celebrations and things like that that my wife wants to make sure we're showing love to our friends and family.

And then just things add up very quickly and then things are gone. Is this a communication challenge or is your wife being spiteful? Cause there's two different ways to approach this. I don't think it's, I don't think it's either. Um, my, my wife and I communicate very, very well. Um, and frequently about it, but, and I don't think she's being very spiteful at all. She, she agrees that, um, we need to be saving and we want the, we want the things we want where a house and being able to retire as both of our families, um, are in that basket at all and don't have a retirement

even in their fifties and sixties. Um, and we don't want to do that, but she just kind of forgets about the things and it doesn't think about the $20 here or $20 there or a hundred bucks here. And it just kind of adds up. And so if there's anything that we can do to try something different, because we've tried like different cards that only have a certain amount of money on it each month

to help limit that. But obviously I don't want her stranded. So she has access to a card that has access to the main fund for gas and all that kind of stuff. Are you guys only using debit cards, or are there some credit cards still being used? No, no, no. We only have debit cards. I hate credit. I always have.

But, yeah, we only use debit cards. I don't mean to overly gender this, but this is just the way it plays out in the real world. Most of the time when I talk to men in your situation, they try to solve this with a plan, a strategy, a new card, a new spreadsheet, a new commitment ceremony. And the only way I've ever seen somebody be successful is if they are honest with their spouse about the story behind the story the story behind the

strategy and that would be you sitting down and saying i need to be uh open with you can i tell you something that's scaring me to death? And her say, oh, sure, honey, what's going on? And you say, I'm scared about not having any money. And I'm feeling like I'm not communicating this well because every month there's another $250 in gifts and stuff like that and $20 increments. And I don't feel like I'm being fully honest here at the table. And you notice I did two things here. Number one, I was honest.

I told you, you told her how you felt. You didn't throw a strategy at her. And number two, you use the word I, not you keep overspending and you keep doing that because when she does that, man, she's gonna go back to her childhood. She's gonna go to war. Yeah. My guess is she's going to go back to her childhood she's going to go to war yeah my guess is she's going to have to decide i would rather feel the short-term discomfort of

not having a gift for every single thing that pops up because i never could buy gifts for anybody or i never got any gifts for anybody and now i can so i feel like i have to she's got to give up that short-term pleasure for the long-term safety of me and my husband don't have to worry about not having anything to eat and that's hard and i haven't seen a way to get there without emotion without without a story without you saying this is how i feel yeah and if she looks at you and says i don't't care how you feel, I'm buying gifts for this thing, well, now y'all got a deeper issue y'all got to deal with. Yeah. Can you do that?

Yeah, most definitely. The other side of this, Lester, when it comes to the tactical, is that you should be sitting down with her before the month begins going, hey, what's happening this month? A birthday should not be a surprise. We know when the birthdays are happening. Christmas happens on December 25th every year. I check my calendar, still happening. And so you kind of know what's coming up and you adjust the budget accordingly. So if we need to add a gift line item in the budget, let's do that. If we need to add a miscellaneous sort of little catch-all

of 50 bucks or a hundred bucks, let's do that so it doesn't derail our plans. Well, that's often really important because that's when the $20 plus $20 plus $50 turns into 310 bucks. And she goes, oh gosh, I don't want to do that. Yeah. And the other thing is we check the budget before we make the purchase. So if we go to the gift and we go, oh gosh, I wish we're going to have to do a handmade gift. Let's make a little basket. Let's get some roses from the garden. Let's get creative. George made me a basket once. John still has it. He loves it. It was a great gift. So Lester, that's where we come up with a solution together and have the conversation. But there is a part of this that's on her as far as accountability going, you need

to check the budget before you make the purchase. That's how I do it. That's how you do it. We can't just hope that we lined up with the budget perfectly. We use that as our guiding kind of North Star. And I think when you do that, you start to add in these line items, it starts to be less and less of a surprise. You get to kind of align it a little more. And on top of that, what is your next goal? What is the thing you guys both agree to is the next thing that we're saving up for? Well, it's not necessarily saving up for, it's like being able to pay off our debts. So you're in baby step two. Correct. So even more in baby step two,

there's even more intentional sacrifice and intensity here where it's going, we can't afford to buy people gifts. We got to put our own mask on first. We're broke. And think about how many gifts we can buy people once we're debt-free with an emergency fund, we're preparing for our future, then we can look up for opportunities to give and be generous.

And so I think that's part of it is you need to have a plan together going, we're going to pay off $700 a month of debt, and here's how we're going to do it. Versus we really need to save more, really got to get rid of this debt. We need to get more specific so we can actually hit the target. Lester, have you tried any of these things we're throwing at you? Does it all sound crazy? No, no, no, no, no. Yeah, and these are conversations we've had, but I agree. I haven't been very specific with it.

My wife and I are blessed to be in the positions that we're in. I mean, I'm making more money than I ever thought I would before. And it's not been specific of, hey, we're going to spend X amount of dollars on our debt every single month because we have to, um, it's just been, we want to spend more on our debts. Um, and realistically we don't have a lot of debt, um, even student loans and medical debt and things like that included.

We don't have a lot. And so within a year we could easily have 80 of it paid off put that plan in front of her put that plan in front of her and y'all talk through it and then more importantly than that plan paint a picture for her of how you're going to be able to breathe in your own home how you and her are going to have something neither of y'all have ever had which is economic security let her just absorb that and feel her husband radiating this thing that you've probably never radiated before which is just peace man it makes it there's not a lot of gifts i'm gonna buy in exchange for my wife's piece, for my piece. You see what I'm saying?

Yeah. And then, by the way, once you get that piece, once y'all, like George said, you don't owe anybody any money, you can buy gifts for everybody. Mm-hmm. You could be kind of over the top and reckless with who you buy gifts for because you don't owe anybody any money. Mm-hmm. So this little plan, this one-year thing we're after,

this is just part of reverse engineering the picture you painted her. So instead of, we got to get on a budget, you got to spend less, it becomes, hey, remember, that's what we're aiming for. This is a little blip on that timeline of intentionality and sacrifice. Are you with me? Yeah. And I hope that helps. We're going to gift you every dollar premium, Lester. What are you using right now for a budget when you guys sit down together? Pen and paper. And then I use an Excel sheet, and that's kind of it. Yeah, you show a spender an Excel sheet, they implode inside. They die inside. They just die.

So we're going to gift you every dollar premium. It's much easier to look at, easier to use. You both log in. You both have accountability. So while she's out, she can actually check the budget versus Lester's spreadsheet at home. So hope that helps, Lester. We're wishing you the best as you attack this debt. That puts this hour of The Ramsey Show in the books.

Thank you to Dr. John Deloney, all the folks in the booth keeping the show afloat, and you, America, will be back before you know it. Do you ever feel like you're finally making progress towards your goals only to get quickly distracted by something else in your feed? Well, that's why we created the Ramsey Network app, your single source for content that keeps you motivated. The Ramsey Network app is designed to keep you laser focused on reaching your goals. Loaded with over 7,000 hours of Ramsey shows, this free app is the best place for uninterrupted content and no distractions. Plus, you can search specific questions to get more personalized content in seconds.

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Open phones at 888-825-5225. You call in and we'll do our best to help you take the right next step for your life and your money. Stav is going to kick us off in Toronto. What's going on, Stav? Hi there. How are you guys? Doing well. How can we help? Good. So I'm a 22 years old. I have $200,000 in savings,

and I actually got accepted into law school a month ago. Now I'm considering taking a student loan. No! No! No! Don't't do that so that's my question is what do i do do i pay for school outright yes forget about everything come out of school with um school's going to be 120 000 so come out i think it's like 80 000 left in my bank account yes or take a zero percent interest uh student loan because right now I'm getting percentage on the money that I have. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. Here's why. I was a dean of students at a law school. I've worked with young attorneys in training and then as they transition out.

And the number of students who had a vision of who they wanted to serve and who they wanted to help and who they wanted to go to war on behalf of got put in the trunk of a car because they had to go take the job that paid them the most money regardless of how unsafe uh how toxic how madhouse the culture was right and it i watched it um it ate people alive lee i want you to leave law school with 80 grand in the bank no debt you don't anybody anything and you are armed with one of the most one of the most um powerful credentials known to man which is a north american jd right a jurist doctor you know what you can do anything you can go serve the least of these you can go work at a corporation you can go be a an executive you can go be a member of the i don't know but i don't know if you're going to be

are you going to are you going to school in canada or in the states i'm going to canada i'm going to law school in the uk actually oh the uk okay so what are you going to do with that with a uk law school credential well i'm looking to either come back to Canada or come back to America and work there. But what? I'm going to be working with either or. So when you come back, when you go to law school in the UK, you have to do a test either in Canada or the UK, and then you can start working in either country. Okay. But then if you came to work in the States, you'd have to take whatever state's bar exam that you want to take, right correct is the barrister's exam in the uk the same as it is in canada it is the exact same oh wow there's it's more similar in the uk and in canada okay there's certain things that i'll have to study for uh the states but it's

it shouldn't be a problem at all okay and what job would you get right now and by the way it's going to change almost always changes but what job do you think you're going to get you know what i've been thinking about it and I'm looking to potentially do tax law or corporate law going to that section. But you know what? I used to think that I wanted to do family and then people are like, don't get into family. It's way too messy. And then I was thinking of potentially doing construction law and going into that. But you know what? I'm not sure yet. So I'm going to start law school, see what pulls me in, and then I'll go that route.

Okay. If your heart tells you to go sit with hurting families and help take care of people in their most vulnerable moments, man, do that. Yeah, it's messy, and it will tear pieces of your soul, and it's also good and right. So, yeah, whatever you're going to do. The only thing i would

challenge you on is to really consider why the uk unless you're going to live and practice in the uk right um i understand because it could be a cool time to go study law and you can go over there it's just different it's it's you're going to lose out on the networking opportunities on the local areas to getting plugged in and local places and local systems. You just lose all that when you go overseas, but is what it is, dude, but just don't borrow money. Don't come out owing. Um, cause man, that can make, that can, that can, you can end up sideways real, real fast. Right. Yeah. I understand. And that was definitely one of the factors that I took that

the networking is not going to be the same, But I know myself, I love talking to people. And what I'm going to do is find a job in the UK that also has a firm either in the US or Canada. So that way I'll be able to transfer over. But also, I've never really traveled Europe. And so I want to take the opportunity that now that I have the money and I'm young to also travel while being in law school. You don't know what law school is about, do you? I do, but hopefully I could take a Friday or Saturday and go somewhere close. I would recommend, dude, if that's the case, I'd recommend you defer for a year and go

travel, use some of the money and go travel. Law school is going to take your soul. It's just hard, man. It's all in. Right. It's all in. Right. It's all in. But you do what you're going to do. But man, if you want to go tour Europe, go tour Europe. You've got 200 grand in the bank. Go do that. If you want to go to law school, go to law school. Trying to combine both is going to be really, it's a recipe for being

pretty disappointed. Right. What were you saving the $200 for, Stav? I'm curious. What was this kind of earmarked for? It's always been something that I didn't know. I'm really good at saving and I worked at tech sales and I've just always been putting money aside. I've looked at the way my family is and I'm like, they've moved two countries and I really wanted to set myself up for success. So I've just always put money in savings. I probably saved all my tech sales income, probably 90% of it, and just put it straight. So you saved up $200,000 on your own? So I got $120,000 by myself,

and then it was $80,000 from a motor vehicle accident settlement. Okay. That's impressive, man. $120,000 on your own at 22. That's very difficult to do. So good on you for doing that. That kind of resourcefulness is what's going to get you through. Thank you. I worked a lot during university. That's why I'm hoping that potentially I won't be working in law school, but maybe I can take two days or something and go see Amsterdam or go see... Or take three weeks before you start and go travel. Yeah. I'm doing that as well. I'm actually leaving in a week. Wonderful. Well, have a good time. Congratulations. And what a way to tell people,

hey, I'm 22 and I saved up 120 grand. What are you doing? Because a lot of people, John, they go, well, I just have to take out a loan, John. I just decided yesterday to go to law school and it's going to be 300 grand and we don't have that money. So I'm going to go drown myself in debt and hope for the best. Yeah. If you even make it through law school. I'm going to be 300 grand and we don't have that money so i'm gonna go drown myself in debt and hope for the best yeah if you even make it through law school i'm sure those are the most depressing cases where you don't even finish the very expensive degree and you still have a debt to show that's the catastrophic is when when students are worse off having interacted with the university and that's when they leave and they don't get the degree and they but they leave with one semester two years of the lender doesn't care if you graduate or not.

They care less. Like, you owe. You can't discharge it. You owe. You're paying. And if you can't pay, we'll take it from you. Yeah, we saw those stories in our documentary called Borrowed Future, where a bankruptcy lawyer who focuses on student loan cases

was saying they want their pound of flesh. I'll never forget how she said it because it was so intense. And it's almost impossible to bankrupt on this, even through hardship. I mean, she was sharing the craziest stories of people who should qualify. Doesn't matter. And they didn't get it. They'll get it. If you got a hundred grand in cash, pay for it, man. Go to law school, do your thing, and then go on about your life. It's messed up. I encourage everyone to go watch the Broad Future documentary. It's free on our YouTube channel. It's 88 minutes. Parents watch it. Students watch it. Parents, students watch it together. It's free on our YouTube channel. It's 88 minutes. Parents watch it. Students watch it.

Parents, students watch it together. It's going to spark a conversation, number one, about how to avoid student loan debt, and number two, what the path looks like to go to college debt-free the right way, regardless of what your plans are. Woo! But you heard him say, John, I wanted to set myself up for success in the future. Well, that's what that money is then for. That's right.

Success to me means freedom and options and margin when I graduate, not chains to the tune of $200,000. And so parents, please have the conversation with your kids, even if it's awkward, even if you have your own baggage and shame and guilt and money mistakes. Do not continue to let this generation go deeply into student loan debt. Also, they go to mommy and daddy's alma mater. This is The Ramsey Show. This show is sponsored by BetterHelp. This is the season for Halloween. It's October. We're wearing costumes and we're wearing masks. If you haven't started planning your costume yet,

get on it. And while you're thinking about it, I want you to be honest. A lot of us hide ourselves. We hide our true selves behind costumes and masks all the time. We do this at work. We do this around our friends. We do this around our families. We even do this when we look at ourselves in the mirror. I know because I've been there multiple times in my life and it's the worst. If you feel like you're stuck hiding behind masks and costumes all the time, if you find yourself hiding from your true self, I want you to consider talking with a therapist. Therapy is a place where you can be honest,

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so it's convenient for you and your schedule. Just fill out a short online survey, and you'll be matched with a licensed therapist. Plus, you can switch therapist at any time for no additional cost. Take off the costumes and take off the mask with BetterHelp. Visit betterhelp.com slash Deloney to get 10% off your first month. That's betterhelp.com slash Deloney. If you own a small business and you like The Ramsey Show, then you're going to love the Entree Leadership Podcast. Almost 200,000 listeners tune in every Monday to hear me take calls from real business leaders and give tactical advice based on my 30 years of experience leading. This is not a podcast about business theory. It's real insight from a practitioner who actually does this stuff.

Find it anywhere you listen to podcasts, or if you're listening on YouTube or Podcast Now, just click the link in the description. Welcome back to The Ramsey Show. I'm George Campbell, joined by Dr. John Deloney. It is time for our question of the day, brought to you by YRefi. Now, we don't recommend refinancing on everything, but for distressed private student loans specifically, there's WhyRefi. We trust them because they help you with a low fixed interest rate you couldn't get anywhere else to help you stick to your budget and get out of debt. That's the goal. Learn more at whyrefi.com slash Ramsey. That's the letter Y, R-E-F-Y.com slash Ramsey. Might not be available

in all states. Today's question comes from Brooke in Kentucky. Brooke writes, I've spent close to $600,000 on gambling over the last nine years. I regret this habit and have become very depressed. The worst part is I still gamble, but much less and now it's controlled. I mean, it is there a way to put the stupidity behind me and not be angry with myself i mean this sort of pathological gambling and this continuing to gamble tells me brooke has not fully metabolized the depths of all of this and so i i mean anything i wanted to add here would just you got to go you got to go to gamblers anonymous you gotta go to Gambler's Anonymous today and submit to a 12-step plan. I mean, this is so much bigger than you.

And it's just gonna be tough. You can't just decide, well, I'm just gonna put this stupidity behind me and not be angry. You haven't fully owned all the decisions here, right? In most cases, John, with these't fully owned all of the decisions here, right? In most cases, John, with these types of any kind of addiction really is full sobriety.

The, the path. Is there a way for someone to go? Well, I still gamble, but now it's controlled. Like, is there a piece of you that is still out of control?

Um, I mean, there's, there's some actually been some movement there over the last few years in the addiction community. This idea that like, once you admit it, you have to be sober for the rest of your life the answer is no um and that's so individualized and it's so person by person um and this is i mean this is

in the alcoholic world this is the equivalent of drinking two or three bottles of jack daniels a day for 10 years right i mean probably not if you've burned through more than half a million dollars um then probably and you're still doing it probably you're gonna have to end up at a place where you're sober right but again i i can't make that call from this for not even talking to this person just reading their note what i know from this note is or what i believe i know from this note is um there just hasn't been a full she didn't really deal with ownership and here's the other thing um healing here will come in community with other people it will not come from some epiphany that you have in your head by yourself it has to happen i decided i'm gonna head by yourself. It has to happen. I decided I'm going to try to be different.

It has to happen in community where somebody looks at you and says, I see what you did and I still love you. I see what you did. I'm sad too. I'm hurt too. I'm angry too. I'm pissed off too. We're going to go build something new.

And that has to happen in a group. But I'd want to have a conversation with Brooke, but I think the most responsible thing i can tell brooke is call a ga group right now a gambler's anonymous group right now in kentucky and go go see somebody like right now right now um and for the first time in 10 years be 100 honest yeah that's a mess it's a mess thanks for the question brooke wishing you the best beth is on the phone lines up next in Sacramento. How can we help, Beth?

Hi, excuse me. My adult sons, they're 34 and 39, came to me with this question, and I wasn't quite sure the answer, so that's why I'm passing it to you. Their father, who I'm not married to, has taken out a reverse mortgage on his home, and they just wanted to know when something happens and he passes away or goes to a home, what they're responsible with inheriting a reverse mortgage. Okay. Well, their name's not on the mortgage, correct? Correct. Okay. So they're not going to be personally responsible. No one's going to come after

them for this, but it must be paid when he passes. And that might mean from the estate, his estate's going to go through probate, the house is going to get sold before they ever get an inheritance, if there is anything left. And so that's part of the process. So they can decide, hey, we're going to sell the house, we're going to take the proceeds, pay off the mortgage, and we share the rest. Or they decide we want to keep the house, we're going to still need to pay off this loan. That might mean they refinance and take out a loan, a new loan in their name to basically carry this loan to the future. But it needs to be repaid from that original lender. Okay, and now

in a reverse mortgage, they don't... I was reading where they give 65, they're able to get 65% of the equity out of that their father was able to get 65%. So is it normally

completely... I don't know how to put it. Did he take a lump sum or was this payments over time where it goes up to 65% or it's capped? Oh, that I don't know. Okay. Yeah, that I don't know. So the actual, we'll need to find out what the current balance is. Is he in good health? Yes.

Okay. So this could be a while. Right. I would still this could be a while. Right. I would still have a plan of attack. I mean, the fact that he went into a reverse mortgage, which is a terrible product, tells me he's not doing well financially. Right. And so likely this is just going to eat up all the equity in his home, and he may not have much of a nest egg or estate to be inherited by the children.

Right, right. And I think they had pretty much bet on that at the time when they heard that he had gotten a reverse mortgage. So they just weren't sure, did they have like a limited amount of time to sell the house? He lives in a different state than they do. So they were just wondering what kind of mess it is that they would have to clean up. I assume they'd have to go clear out a house. Yeah, if they're the heirs, there's going to be stuff to deal with. And typically, heirs would have about six to 12 months to settle their reverse mortgage. They might be able to request an extension because it's out of state. You can contact the lender for details on that. But it's not going to be a fun thing. i'd much rather leave my kids with no payments to deal with and they go all right here's the house here's the keys and so and and expect there to be significant

additional interest balloon interest fees like i can see them in their head doing the math on okay 65 so it's going to be this and this. Okay, we're going to get this much money out of it. Probably not. Okay, so on the back end of this. Oh, my gosh, yes. I'm sure the lender has all kinds of fine print on fees. Again, what I would guess a lender wants is the cake and to eat it too or however you say that thing the lender wants the equity

the lender wants that house when it's all said and done to sell it and the lender wants the interest that it pays on that loan or that earns off that loan and so the lender has a vested interest in claiming the home at the end of this thing. Yeah, so, I mean, they'd be happy to go, all right, it's going to be a foreclosure, and we own it. And so that's what I don't want to happen. So they're not personally liable. If they say, hey, we want nothing to do with it, well, the lender's just going to foreclose on it.

They're happy to sell it, take the money. So they will have kind of a little bit of a mess to clean up, but they already pretty much know that once the reverse mortgage was taken out that there's probably not going to be any, that was not their concern, and they just wanted to make sure that they weren't responsible for his debt. No, they're not responsible. If they didn't co-sign on any debt, and this goes for any debt for any human, if your name is not on the debt, you're not going to be responsible. Okay, good. But they might not get any of this home at all.

Right, yeah. They pretty much have figured that out already. That dad is not a secret billionaire. Yeah. Right. Well, I'm sorry. You're the one dealing with it. It's money plus interest plus fees.

Right. Are you calling on their behalf just as a kind of worried mom? I was. Right. Well, yeah, because they had asked me the question. And even though I knew a reverse mortgage was not a good thing, I just didn't know then what they were responsible for. How old are the sons? 34 and 39.

Okay. So they've got their own families and their own homes, but they were just, you know, trying to see in the future what, you know, I think it's best for them to be prepared. Absolutely. And have a conversation with dad. Call him up and say, listen, we want to know exactly what's going on with your finances because clearly things aren't going well and we're going to have to be cleaning up this mess. Oh, not the legacy I want to leave. That's for sure, Beth. Thanks build the habits that will make those dreams a reality. And we'll be with you every step of the way from your first budget to that retirement home on the beach. Download EveryDollar for free on the App Store or Google Play. Remember today, download EveryDollar for free on the App Store or Google Play today.

Welcome back to The Ramsey Show. I'm George Campbell, joined by Dr. John Deloney. The phone number to call is 888-825-5225. Well, John and I are hitting the high seas in March of 2025, along with thousands of our friends, the entire Ramsey crew, and a bunch of you guys. It's the ultimate debt-free celebration. We're calling it the Live Like No One Else Cruise. I thought it was the Cult Cruise. That's part of it. Okay. Because on all Ramsey Cruise, you've got to really want to be on that.

There's going to be big vats of the Kool-Aid. We're all going to drink it together. Big punch bowls. That's right, big punch bowls. Oh, my goodness. It's going to be a good time. So this is for those who are debt-free. So if you're baby step four or above, meaning you don't have any

consumer debt, you have the emergency fund, you're investing 15%, now is the time to celebrate. Some of y'all, it's time because you've been debt-free for a while and you haven't done anything fun yet. And so we're creating something fun for you to do. And we want to celebrate with you. More than 80% of the cabins are already booked up. So it will sell out shortly. It's seven days at sea, March 22nd through the 29th. We're stopping at Turks and Caicos, St. Thomas, Puerto Rico, the Bahamas. Dave, Rachel, John, Ken, Jade, myself, a bunch of special guests, Stephen Curtis Chapman, Manit Chauhan, Dina Carter, one of my favorite comedians, Trey Kennedy, just announced that he'll be joining us there.

Magicians, songwriters, comedians. I've heard Ken Coleman has challenged all of us to a cannonball competition in the big boat pool. Wow. I've never seen him cannonball. He's not a big guy. I can't imagine he can make a big splash. Yeah, but I think it's all technique.

And if there's somebody who's just got the technique dialed in, it's Kenny Dub Coleman. He needs the win. So I'm happy to let him have this one. He'll get the win. Well, you never know what's going to happen. But you have to join us to see it for yourself. So secure your spot with a $600 deposit before all the cabins are gone.

RamseySolutions.com slash cruise is the place to go to book your cabin and for more information. Can't wait. All right, Pete is in the great city of Lubbock, Texas. What's going on, Pete? Hey, guys. Thanks for taking my call. How can we help? I have kind of an advice. So,

I've been in the oil and gas industry here in Texas for about 20 years, and during COVID, I was laid off from a job. Well, right now, I just found out that I'm going to be laid off again from another company probably next month. What field is this? Oil and gas. Okay. Still in the oil and gas field. Still in the oil and gas, yes, sir. All right.

And anyways, right now I'm 43 years old. I'm recently divorced, but I am debt-free. My vehicle's paid off, everything. And I really don't have really much retirement, hardly anything. The only thing is, though, that this company that's going to lay me off is actually going to give me a very significant severance package. How much? Probably after taxes, it'll probably be around $200,000.

Wow, excellent. Well, that's some good news. And how much do you have in savings currently? Not your retirement, but how much do you have in a savings account? Not much. Probably like $2,000. That's about it. Okay. So, during this time, I've actually been contemplating, before I even heard about this news, that I've been wanting to change career fields. I've been wanting to get into, to be a realtor, to get my real estate license.

But my question is, is that should I, would it be okay to try this new field while I get laid off and take that money? And if I try it, then that means I might have to live off of some of it until I get my feet wet, until I basically learn what I'm supposed to do. And on top of that, I was giving my ex-wife, you know, child support payments and paying for, you know, medical. So now that my kids are going to be under her insurance, basically I'm going to have to pay for the medical insurance and still have to give her the child support money. Well, if I'm going to school to be a realtor and learning that new trade, I'm going to have to use some of that severance to kind of keep my kids afloat.

Or should I just suck it up, stick with what I know, and just find another job and put all that money into a mutual fund and just let that go? So anytime somebody calls me or asks me and they have distilled their next move down into two not great options, I always just want to tell everybody to stop. Because in your mind, you have said option one is suck it up, stay miserable, find another job out in this West Texas heat.

And by the way, i moved from lubbock i get it man it's hot you're down there in midland odessa and down there lomisa is hot man it's it's brutal i just gonna have to do that just suck it up or i'm gonna take this literal gift from god that fell out of the sky 200 grand that i can get an emergency fund i can begin retirement savings so my kids aren't gonna have to take care of me someday and i can go get a job a regular job that's going to float me while i go get certified because i'm going to get certified at night with real estate classes online and then i'm going to start hitting it up in that that west texas market that's what i would do i would not use this money to float you why because you're going to get everyone's going to tell you oh you

got to have this car you got to pay for this merchandising you got to go do this and add on this and you're just that money's going to be gone i'd rather see you put that money away and have it work for you downstream and i'd rather see you go get money away and have it work for you downstream. And I'd rather see you go get a job, a regular old job, not making what you're used to making out in the oil and gas field, but go get a job job and know that all I'm doing is funding my life right now while I go work on the credentialing to go be a real estate agent. Okay. That's a third option.

And you're going to have to pinch. It's going to be a totally different transition for you. You've been making good money out in the oil field? Yeah, at least six figures. Yeah, it's not going to be that way for a minute. Real estate takes a lot of time to build up and get some momentum. And so it's not going to be something you just go start tomorrow and make good money. And so that's why we're saying get a different job,

get the real estate thing happening part-time, and start to build up your kind of book of business, get a house closed, talk to people who have been in real estate, see what it's like in your area, make sure it's right for you. Then, as you get some traction, you can go, all right, now it's time to go full-time. Okay. Brother, I'm telling you right now,

you're going to look up in 18 months, and you will have no money left. And you may have closed one or two houses depending on what they do with the stock market, I mean with interest rates in the next few months. Okay. That's not true. You might do five or ten. You're a hustler. Do you have any real estate buddies that you can talk to who are actually in the business? I actually have a couple of people that I went to high school with that I just happened to see that they started in real estate maybe a couple years ago, and they looked like they were killing it pretty good.

Yeah, the key word is look like it. Real estate agents are great with the vanity plays. They can make it look like anything is happening. They're really good at that. Man, they get the best pictures. They get glamour shots. They get their nails done like anything is happening. They're really good at that. Man, they get the best pictures, they get glamour shots, they get their nails done, hair done, everything looks great.

Right. Let me ask you this. What do you think the real estate career shift is going to give you that the oil and gas field will not? Freedom. Basically, just the freedom to be with my kids

whenever I want to not have to be tied down to a Monday through Friday job and also really just what I do, I mean it pays really good but I'm pretty much hit the ceiling and I have financial goals that I want

and I'm not going to get there with what I'm doing I mean I can make a really good living but I mean I want and I'm not going to get there with what I'm doing. I mean, I can make a really good living, but I mean, I want more, you know, I want, I want more freedom and I want to be able to build wealth before I'm an old 65, 70 year old man. Okay. Here's what I'm going to do. Um, when we get off air, I've got a close, close friend who's a real estate, uh, does really well with real estate in the 806 area code. And I'm not going to do it on air, but I'll hook you up with her contact info and see if she can have a cup of coffee with you.

Because I think your picture of what that life is like is not accurate. Because the real estate agents I know that build the kind of wealth that you have in your mind, they're making deals at midnight on Saturday nights. And they're driving to show a house at nine o'clock because that's when the client could do it. That's right. They're going from Amarillo to La Mesa on Saturdays, missing games. They are working round the clock. There's a million real estate agents out in West Texas that do two houses a year. And it's supplemental income, and they go to their kids' games.

And really, they got their license because they don't want to pay closing costs on their home purchases. And they like to help out their friends and family every once in a while. That's not what you have in mind. You want to be a mogul. You want to crush it and move it. Just the real estate folks that I know out there, man, they are always on call, always working, always hitting the next deal. It's just, it's a lot. So hang on the line here, man. I'll get your contact info and I'll reach out to you personally. Hey folks, Dave here. If you haven't booked your cabin on the Live Like No One Else cruise,

now's the time because it's 90 something percent sold out. You do not want to miss joining me, the Ramsey personalities, and amazing guest entertainers for the ultimate debt-free celebration. something percent sold out. You do not want to miss joining me, the Ramsey personalities, and amazing guest entertainers for the ultimate debt-free celebration. We'll be sailing the Caribbean March 22nd through the 29th, 2025, stopping at the incredible Turks and Caicos, Puerto Rico, St. Thomas, and the Bahamas. Hurry to secure your spot with a $600 deposit today at ramseysolutions.com slash cruise. Welcome back to the Ramsey Show. Open phones at 888-825-5225.

I'm George Camel here with Dr. John Deloney. Ethan's up next in Washington, D.C. What's happening, Ethan? How's it going? So I watch you guys' show all the time, and I'm a big fan. Thank you. And my question to you is, I have zero debt. I have no credit cards, nothing.

And for someone who's never bought a home before, is taking out a big loan to buy a home a good thing or a bad thing? Well, let's define big loan. What are you taking out? Well, the thing is, is that most homes, you know, are $200,000, $300,000, you know, $400,000. And homes go for crazy prices. You know, so it's not that I've started to take out a loan. It's the fact, is it a good idea to?

Well, it's never a good idea. The only debt that we don't yell at you for is a 15-year fixed-rate mortgage. But we still don't like it. They would say the 100% down plan is the best plan. It's never going to be a blessing to take out debt. But if you are going to do it for a home specifically, if you do it on a 15-year fixed-rate mortgage where the payment is no more than a quarter of your after-tax income monthly, then it'll be a blessing and not a burden. That's the goal.

And even then, the goal is to pay it off early. And so if your goal is to hang on to debt for 30 years, then that's a bad goal. Yeah, and the thing is I'm 19 years old. I have $20,000 saved, and I'm really trying to go about it the smartest way and I don't want to dig myself in a grave here and I recently started a car flipping business and I made the twenty thousand dollars in the last two weeks selling cars and I'm just in a really complicated situation because I work for my dad and I've worked for him all my life but I started making all this money and I don't know exactly what to do I don't want to leave my dad high and dry, but I'm also making a lot of money doing this.

I work for him all week. You know, so my question to you is, how should I invest this $20,000? Should I spend it on a down payment for some sort of loan for some sort of housing? Or should I continue to invest it and double the money and keep buying and selling trucks and cars and making money with it. Are you living at home right now? Yes. What is the urgency to go buy a house? I am engaged and my girlfriend is 24 and she's ready to get married, settle down and have kids. Are you ready? Yeah. That was a long pause, my man. Hey, you seem like you're in a sense of panic.

Just take a breather for a second. I'm in a difficult situation, man. But listen, you had a good week. My promise for you is this isn't going to happen every week of your life for the rest of your life you had a good week it was awesome and i don't want to dampen it but it was awesome good for you it was amazing and then what you probably found at 19 years of age which is a blessing for you it took most of us till we were older is the next day you just woke up and had to brush your teeth and put on deodorant again and go about your day again. Right?

And so, do you not want to work for your dad anymore? I want to work for my dad, but the issue is I'm making, I mean, triple, quadruple the amount of money I have on the car. No, that's not true. That's not true. You did one time. If you show me over six months you're making 20 grand a week flipping cars i would tell you to sit down with your dad and say dad it's time for me to move on because i have i have a million dollars in the bank and i can run this whole thing with cash

and so when things get real dicey economically and people stop buying used flipped cars i'm gonna be all right like dad i'm good you had a good week, man. Yeah. So you think I should take the $20,000? Do you think I should get a house with her? I think you should just slow down. If you were my brother, I would say put in a high-yield savings account, high-five yourself, take you and your girlfriend out to dinner, and then go back to work on Monday.

Relax. So right now, high-yield savings account, just keep piling up money. You have no debt? No, zero. And how much money do you have in the bank right now? 20K. 20K. Okay, let's call that your emergency fund. So let's earmark it in a separate account, in a high-yield savings account and say that is Ethan's emergency fund.

Now, outside of that, you can begin to set up another savings account and go, this is a down payment fund for the future. And my goal is to save X number a year. Let's call it with the money you're making, let's say it was 50 grand a year. What if I could save 50 grand a year, three years from now, I have 150 grand. And maybe you're married at that point, right? Yeah. And maybe you guys rent for the first one or three years. Nothing, there's no one that says you have to get a house as soon as you're married, especially at 19.

And so I would just pause, slow down and go, what makes sense for me in the future? Well, I got to get an engagement ring. I'm going to upgrade the car. We need to plan to cash flow the wedding. Maybe I want to go to school for some, you know, credential. Maybe she needs to go to school. Maybe she has debt that we need to pay off. So you're going to have some upcoming life goals, and I just want you to pause before jumping into a thing just because you have a pile of money sitting there. Now here's my next question.

So my plan was my dad has a piece of property he's willing to give to me, and my plan was to take $10,000 of it, take a mobile home because I do construction as well, totally gut it and set it up on there and I might have 10 to 15 in it and we can live in there. And my plan was to build my house out of pocket and go to material auctions and build materials and do things like that instead of taking out a loan to buy a house. Do you think that that will be a more viable option? I'm not a fan of mobile homes because they're a depreciating asset. So that thing's going to go down in value

versus buying a normal home is going to go up in value over time. History has shown us. Or let's reverse the life you say you want to have. Let's say you find a place to rent for a year and it's, what, $2,000 a month? You get a real and it's what, 2000 bucks a month. You get a real nice place. I don't know where you are. Um,

that's 24 grand. And then you move on. You're it. Then you buy the house that you want. If you'd like to go to auctions and do that kind of stuff, more power to you. It's just, it's just going to take time.

What if, what if once I'm, I build my house out of pocket i can rent the trailer out though bro you've got you listen here's what here's what you you've got you got two old married guys on one side of the table and you being a 19 year old who just had a great week and a 24 year old fiance who's pressuring you to start your life faster than you're ready to start it and so you have a choice to make you can scramble and have this plan and buy this depreciating asset and take this piece of land and put a double wide on it and do this

and flip it and and slap it up flip it in reverse you can do all that dude or you can look at two old married guys i got two kids george has one we each got a couple of dogs and nobody could take our house from us and nobody can take our cars from us and we sleep obnoxiously well at night you see what i'm saying yes i just don't want you rushing through life because it's way easier to fall flat on your face. And you're so young and so successful that it's going to be really easy to do that at the pace that you're running. And everybody will have an opinion because you're a hustler. But I want you to hear what George said because it's really important. You got $20,000.

As far as George and I are concerned, you're at zero now. Now you're your own bank now you can begin saving money for a home for a truck for a piece of land for whatever start your business because i promise you something's gonna break you're gonna have a bad month yeah it's just life man and now you've got emergency fund. Millions of people in America, millions are not in the financial position you've just stumbled into. I'm not even gonna say stumbled that you worked your butt off into. Yeah. Don't go blow it. Just exhale. So I would wait until you're in the next phase of life where you've been married for a year or two, you've rented, you kind of got to know this person. I mean, I don't know how long you've been dating,

but at 19, I can't imagine it's been a super long time. You don't sound like you're even ready to take the next step. So I would just pause and reassess before making any money moves. Just keep making it. Keep piling it up and you'll be all right. Well, John, this show particularly is almost over. If you're on YouTube or podcast, it's about to end. But more calls are coming up in the Ramsey Network mobile app, and it's the only place to get full episodes of the Ramsey show. And if you're wondering if you're on radio, just stay right where you are, the show will continue as usual. And there's two ways to get the free app. If you want to continue listening for those on YouTube or podcast, click the link in the show notes, or search Ramsey Network in the App Store

or Google Play. And the team is continually working to make this app even better every single day. So don't miss what's coming up next. Go watch the full show in the Ramsey Network app for free. That puts this hour of the Ramsey Show in the books. Thank you. Hey, you're still here? What are you doing? You do know that the rest of today's show is playing right now over on the Ramsey Network app, right? All you got to do to finish the episode is search Ramsey Network in the App Store, Google Play Store, or just click the link in the show

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