The Ramsey Show - Life Is Complicated. Money Doesn't Have To Be.

Episode Date: July 27, 2026

📈 ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Are you on track with the Baby Steps? Get a Free Personalized Plan.⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ❓ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Have a money question? Ask Ramsey is here to help.⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Jade Warshaw and George Kamel answer your questions and discuss: “We’re house poor, should we sell the house?” “I’m $28,000 upside down on my car, how do I get out of it?” “As a Christian, how do I go about starting a business without idolizing money or success?” “Should I go $3.5 million into debt to become a chicken farmer?” “Should I use the money I inherited to pay off debt or do something my late sister would have wanted me to do?” Next Steps: 📞 Have a question for the show? Call 888-825-5225 weekdays from 2–5 p.m. ET 📩 ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Email Dave On-Air With Your Questions on Debt and Finance⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 💵 ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Start your free budget today. Download the EveryDollar app!⁠⁠ 🏠 ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Get organized and prepared to buy or sell a home⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 🎟️ ⁠⁠Get your ticket for Investing Essentials today!⁠ 🚢 ⁠⁠Set Sail with Dave Ramsey! Book your cabin today! Connect With Our Sponsors: Go to⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Angel Studios⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ to discover entertainment you can feel good about Get 10% off your first month of⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠BetterHel⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠p⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Go to ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Boost Mobile⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ to switch today If you want your car to keep going and going, trust ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Christian Brothers Automotive⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠. Find a local shop and get an exclusive Ramsey discount of 10% (up to $250) off New members can receive a 50% credit toward their first month of membership. Go to⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Christian Healthcare Ministries⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ and use promo code RAMSEY Get started today with⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Churchill Mortgage⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Get 20% off when you join ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠DeleteMe⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Go to⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ FAIRWINDS Credit Union⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ for an exclusive account bundle! Debt collectors hassling you? Take back control of your life at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Guardian Litigation Group⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Find top health insurance plans at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Health Trust Financial⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Use code RAMSEY to save 20% at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Mama Bear Legal Forms⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Visit⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ NetSuite⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ today to learn more Try ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Quo⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ for free, plus get 20% off your first six months. Quo: no missed calls, no missed customers Sign up for your $1.00/month trial at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Shopify⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Get started at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠World News⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ OR use promo code RAMSEY for a 30-day free trial Get started with ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠YRefy⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ or call 844-2-RAMSEY Visit⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Zander Insurance⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ or call 1-800-356-4282 for your free instant quote today Explore more from Ramsey Network: 💸 ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠The Ramsey Show Highlights⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 🧠 ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠The Dr. John Delony Show⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 🍸 ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Smart Money Happy Hour⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 💰 ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠George Kamel⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 📈 ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠EntreLeadership⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Ramsey Solutions Privacy Policy⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Brought to you by the every dollar app. Start budgeting for free today. Normal is broke and common sense is weird. So we're here to help you transform your life. From the Ramsey Network and the Fairwinds Credit Union Studio, this is the Ramsey Show. I'm George Camel, joined by Jade Warshaw. We're taking your calls at AAA 825-5-225. Max is in Boston to kick us off.

What's going on, Max? Hey, how's it going? Great, man. How can we help? Yeah, I'm just, I'm recently married. My wife came into the marriage with some debt, and I'm just kind of trying to figure out who should be paying it. Ooh, juicy.

I like this. Okay, what does she think? So she actually wants to take on the debt. But my concern is it's just like, I don't think she's going to get anywhere out of the debt anytime soon, which I'm not a huge fan of. How much is it? So she's got about 75,000 in debt.

All student loans? So a little over 10,000 is in a car. And then the rest is student loans. 14 of that being fed. And then the rest are private. Oh, wow. Okay. What's she earned?

So right now she's bringing in. If she doesn't work any overtime after taxes, after investing in retirement and she's in the union and you know paying those dues it's about 4,000 and what do you make so after taxes I bring in 5,000 in my salary and then I'm in sales and so I make commissions some months good some month not really but I average it out and after taxes investment in retirement all that stuff I make on average about 6,200 in commission a So what other things do you plan keeping, what other things do you plan to keep separate from your wife in marriage? Like, not really anything.

Like, we're kind of in that process of, like, trying to figure out how to combine finances. And, like, when I saw that, I'm like, okay, should I help take that on? But then she kind of wants to take it on because she doesn't want to, like, make me feel responsible for it. Well, it sounds like based on your decision, based off of what you said when you answered that question, it sounds like the decision is made because if you said to me, well, Jay, there are a couple of things I'd like to keep separate. I like to keep my work separate or I like to keep my, you know, whatever. This might be a different conversation. But you said, I don't plan on keeping anything separate. So that tells us the answer, which is we definitely need to combine this. You definitely see marriage as a we thing, not an individual thing or at least, you know, pieces to be individual. And so I think. think that's a great framework to start with. And maybe that's the conversation that you have with her to help her understand that it's not a negative thing or it's not a weak thing or unfair thing for her to approach this as a we together with you. Yeah. Yeah. No, no, I think that makes sense. And I think that's a good first step. It just puts some perspective around it. If you go to her and

say, okay, it sounds like you're wanting to do this debt thing separately. Is there anything else you plan on keeping separate from me? I think she's going to go, oh, I get it. I see. Yeah. Yeah, I think, I think she might want to keep it separate because I don't know if she just doesn't want me fully looking into like how she budgets and how she, how long you guys are married. You're looking at everything, bud. Yeah. Money is the very least. So, Max, you're in Boston. Have you been through a Boston winter yet? Yeah, oh yeah, yeah. I've been up here my whole life. Yeah, I grew up there for the first 20 years of my life, and I would see my dad out there shoveling the snow. We had a steep driveway, and it was backbreaking work, and what would my mom do? She'd go out and help him. Now,

it's not her, she didn't cause the snow, right? But she sees him hustling out there, sacrificing, and goes, we're a team. Why don't we get this thing done way faster? So instead of taking three hours to shovel, it gets done in one hour. The same is true of this pile of debt. She can try to do this on her own, and it'll likely take seven years, and she's going to resent you secretly without ever telling you. Wow. Or you could get it done in three years, two years, by compiling your money together, going it's one checking account, one savings account, one team, one dream. And you guys knock this thing out and your marriage is better for it. That's true. Another thing to think of, and I know that we're speaking to her through you, you don't seem to be the one that has the issue with it.

But my mom told me, one of the best piece of marriage advice that she gave me was whatever habits you start in the beginning and whatever you allow to persist in the beginning, those things will continue on throughout the marriage. It sets the temperature. Yeah, you set the tone. So in the very beginning, start nipping things in the bud that you think will be problematic. And so I say all that to say, something else you can talk to her about is if we start, if we set the tone of whenever you're in trouble, you handle it by yourself, whenever you

do something you're ashamed of, you handle it by yourself, whenever you do something you think that, you know, I may not approve of, you handle it by, that's a tone that you're setting. and that is absolutely not the tone you want to set for your marriage. You want the tone of I can be fully known by this person. I can let them in on what I'm going through, good, bad, ugly, whatever it is, because that's what marriage is. And so really have this conversation and speak about it in greater terms, not just financial. And I think that's going to help a lot. Yeah.

Yeah, no, I think so too. I appreciate that. Yeah, I think I'm trying not to like come off as like, you know, I guess controlling over finances. I understand that. Yeah. I mean. So I'm trying to play that, like balance that with like.

So you think if you stepped in, she would go, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. You don't need to be controlling me. Yeah. Yes and no, a little bit just because she's had some like, I came from like a debt, like anti-debt family and she's come from one that wasn't, you know, crazy about having or wasn't, you know, anti-debt. debt at all. And then she's also had some, I would say, issues with her dad when it comes to money. And so she's almost like worried that I'm going to act a little bit like how he acted,

you know, with her and like finances. Okay. Does she feel judged? Not that you're making her feel that way, but if she feels that way. A little bit. Like we definitely a little bit just because I think it's just because it's a good amount of debt. So I think she's feeling a little bit judged. Okay. Here's what I suggest. Number one, I'm going to give you a copy of my book what no one tells you about money because I talk about this a lot. Going into my marriage, my husband had $230, 200 some odd thousand dollars of student loan debt and I only had 30. And so it was a hard, hard thing for him to accept us working together on it. It's like he just couldn't fathom it. And he felt really guilty. He felt a lot of shame about that. And I walk through all that in the book. So I think that'll be good. Number two, you want to know, counseling, It never hurts. It never hurts to just step in and have that kind of unbiased person in the middle because the thing is she's going to feel judged, I think, regardless of what you do, how you say this, because she's got personal baggage that's attached to this. And I think that's something that can only be worked out over time, probably with the help of a therapist. And I think

there's no shade on that, George. I think that's a fabulous thing. And now's the time to do things like that in the beginning of your marriage. And I always like to flip the script. If you were in her shoes and you had some debt and yes whatever it is student loans would you be like man i would hate for you to help me out as we get married and combine our money i want to do this on my own now some men do that because they feel like it's macho and they don't want to bring the woman into it but i think there is nothing more freeing than being that open with your spouse that vulnerable and accountable to go we're in this together you make a mess i'm going to help you clean it up i make a mess we're cleaning this thing up yeah that's the point man that's that's

sets the tone for the next 20 years of your marriage. So this really isn't about who's going to pay the loans. It's about what kind of marriage do you want? Yeah. Maybe play this call for her and let George and I be the explainers. I'll be the bad guy. I usually am. If you've worked hard to keep your car running, the last thing you want is stress when you're running the kids all over to summer activities or loading up the family for a well-earned vacation. That's why I trust Christian Brothers automotive. Listen, most people don't worry about their car just because it's older. They worry because they don't feel confident about what's happening under the hood or who's working on it. And that kind of uncertainty can turn a simple trip into a stressful one real fast.

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See stores for details. Ryan is up next in Philadelphia. What's going on, Ryan? Welcome to the Ramsey show. Hey, guys. How's it going? Great. How are you? Good. So I am calling to see if it's a smart idea to go $3.5 million in debt to start a chicken farm. This was not on my bingo card today, Ryan. I'm going to be honest. You said it so like it was no big deal, too. You just kind of slid it in there. From your mouth to God's ears. Is this a prank call? This is not. Okay. Is it $3.5 million off the bat? Like, tell us what that entails. That's you buying the land. That's you buying all the equipment. Tell us what the 3.5 million. That's you buying all the equipment. Tell us what the 3.5 million. $500,000 of that is for the land, estimating a little high for the prices near me. And then the $3 million is for the four chicken houses to be put up.

Four chicken houses? Correct. What about equipment? All the equipment needed to run that would be included in that, except for the skid steer loader, which is about a $50,000 expense, estimating high again. Do you come from a long line of chicken farmers? I do not, no. When I grew up, I learned how to drive on a farm and helped load hay trailers and stuff like that.

And I have been working with chicken farmers over the last year or so. I'm learning the business a little bit. So where did this dream slash opportunity come from? Did someone come to you or is this just you spitball and gone, man, I want to do this on my own? So I live in a pretty decent area where there's a huge chicken producer around. here and they need more houses and more birds desperately. And this is something that I would, I enjoy and I would definitely like to make a career out of it.

So if they need more, why don't they build more? They don't build their houses. I've asked that question before, but they like to have the farmers grow the birds. So they do a lot of the, they handle the feed, they handle dropping the birds off, picking the birds up. I just have to grow the birds and that they pay me for them. What's the incentive? That doesn't feel like enough of an incentive for you.

It feels like you're doing all the work right now. You build the houses, you grow the birds. Yeah. So right now I'm making about $40,000 a year working as a fire extinguisher technician. These houses, while I'm paying off the loans, I would still be making around $90,000 a year. And then once those loans are paid off in 15 years, maximum, I'd be making around $400,000 a year. And that's the assumption that everything goes right. Everything goes according to plan.

Nothing is thrown for a loop. So the company does have a lot of guarantees. So all the numbers I'm using are the minimum guaranteed numbers. So even if my birds would die from the bird flu or something like that, they still guarantee that I'm getting paid. So you make $90,000. But here's the thing, though, you'll make your salary, but the loans are still due. So if you don't have great years, it's going to.

take you more than 15 years to pay back this. Let me just start by saying this. I in no way am for this, but I just want to hear your side of it to understand it. We'll cut to the chase. We didn't have any spoiler alerts, but this is a hard no from us. And there's no world in which taking on any level of debt, let alone $3.5 million is a good idea. How old are you? I am 23. I'm married and I have a kid on the way. Oh. My goodness. To help you with the numbers a little bit, the estimated gross income before all the expenses is around half a million dollars a year. Right, but that's gross. Correct.

I think all you're looking at right now is the potential upside. Yeah. And then you're not looking at the guaranteed variable, which is I owe $3.5 million no matter what while I have a baby coming into this world. Uh-huh. That's just too much risk. And it's, and I don't mean any shade. There's no shade whatsoever to this, but I only mean it in comparison to the risk. It's only $90,000. You're acting like they're going to pay you half a million dollars a year to do this. And even still I wouldn't do it. But do you see what I'm saying? You're like $3.5 million in debt so I can make $90,000 a year. That just is not. You can go, you can avoid all the debt and just go make $90 grand doing something. Yeah, get a different type of job. Here's what I would suggest. Because I know we're, poo-poo and your dream a little bit. I'm thinking, can we start small and test how good you are at this?

Can we start with a homestead? Can we start with something that's a family farm that you and your wife and your, you know, soon-to-be children do and build that up? Is there something that we can do there? Because I feel like is the play here I want to be a chicken farmer or is the play here I want to make lots of money fast? So my overall goal is to have land that I can then reinvest what the land is making to set up future generations of my children. If this was such a great idea, why isn't every farmer in America going, I'll take on $3.5 million to go do this tomorrow?

Guys who have been doing this for a long time, guys who know what they're doing. We're 30, 40, 50 years old who have made a couple hundred grand millions. What's that? Around my area, most guys are. They're required to be within an hour of their production facility. So again, at the beginning I said, I live in a very fortunate area. What does your wife think about this? She actually gave me the go ahead.

Wow. Can I ask you this? Yes. And this is what inquiring minds want to know. What's the parachute? How do you get at it? Because when I'm making a big decision, Ryan, one of the things I do is I take some time and I look at the upside and I look at all the opportunity.

I think we should do that. I think that's great. But I also, I love to play out the worst case scenario because generally if I play out the worst case scenario and I realize, oh, I'll be okay in the end, that's a good indicator of whether I'm going to still try it or not. So we have not played out the worst case scenario, which in my mind, and you stop me if I'm wrong. In my mind is, worst case scenario, I make the 90,000, but the farm as a whole is losing money and it's losing money year over year. because by the way, I hear we have a lot of farmers that call in with that issue. It's losing money year over year. Maybe you don't like it.

Maybe you realize what the farming practices are. I don't know. I've read a lot of books on it. So maybe you're like, man, I can't do this. This is tough on me or it's hard on the soul or whatever. And you just don't like it. And you're losing money and you're four or five years in. And you still got $3.5 million of debt because the interest is high and whatever.

What do you do? I feel like Keanu Reeves. What do you do? that's a good question so i haven't totally thought of that um i'm just thinking of the minimum payment on a three and a half million dollar loan and then you've got to make that at least every month plus enough to live he he's guaranteed 90 and that's not going to be enough to cover that no who's servicing the loan so it would be a farm credit and maybe this might be a little confusing so i'm guaranteed the roughly half a million dollars a year 90 would just be what i'm

into my bank account. The other 200 or 188 or no, sorry, I'm looking at all numbers, or roughly 300,000 would be going back towards the loan to pay off the loan. Yeah. Not in it. That doesn't go toward, that doesn't go toward upkeep of the farm and just like, who keeps up the farm and repairs things that go wrong and just normal business wear and tear? Yeah. So these are the numbers I got from the poultry producer about their, what their growers are experiencing. And it does include miscellaneous repairs, insurance, electric taxes. I'd go talk to someone who did exactly what you are attempting to do and get the full picture. I'm not going to trust

the poultry producer who has a vested interest in you taking on all of this risk. Because I'm telling you, why would they put this on a 23-year-old? If it was such a money-making scheme, they would be taking on the risk instead of you. I actually did talk to a producer. He's about my age. He did only do half the size. So he put up two chicken houses. But I took the numbers over to him, had dinner, and looked at it. He said these numbers are pretty accurate for what he's making. Now there's

rougher months and there's better months. Let me put one more thing to you. And my husband says this a lot because he runs our business. When he's dealing with a major company like Disney or Carnival or one of these major overarching,

he doesn't take on the risk because they're billion dollar companies. So if you're working with Tyson or Purdue or whoever this big chicken house is, I'm going, $3.5 million, they eat that for breakfast. Why do you have to go into debt when they could throw up those four chicken houses in two seconds and simply just pay you a salary for running the farm? There's something about this that doesn't smell right. It's not passing the smell test.

I beg of you don't do it. Please. And I don't even know. We didn't ask about income and current debts, but you're making $40K. you are not in a place to be taking on this venture with a baby on the way. I would run far away. Let me tell you what I get asked all the time. When should I get term life insurance? How much do I need? Is it affordable? Those are the right questions to be asking. So let's take a quick review. The fact is, term life isn't a baby step. So if anyone is dependent on your income, you need to have 10 to 12 times your income in life insurance.

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Start every dollar for free in the app store or Google Play. Angela is in Washington, D.C. up next. What's going on, Angela? Hi. I have a question. Me and my husband are currently going through in fertility treatment, and we were wondering, would it be better to pay off some of our debts? We're going to be going through it in September.

to save up for future expenses with our baby in daycare. Wow. Okay. Where are you guys out right now? How much debt do you have? So we have my car, which is $25K, and then we have his first degree loan, which is $50K. Okay. And what do you guys make?

I make $52,000, and he makes $72,000. 2000 coming up in August. We're both teachers. So you're getting raises? Yes. Okay. So making 120K, great salary. We've got 75K in consumer debt. And what are these infertility treatments costing you? They are not costing us anything because we received the grant that pays for all of it in September. That's amazing. And that's guaranteed? How many treatments does that cover? What was that? How many treatments does it cover? Is it indefinite or is it for a certain amount? So it is for embryo adoption in September and it covers one treatment. Okay. So what you said earlier when you said should we pay off debt or should we save up money for treatment, are you

thinking that you could need treatment beyond September or beyond what your grant gives you? That could be a possibility considering that it's like a 50-50 chance. Okay. And if you did need money, what would it cost? Let me phrase it like that. It would cost about $8,000. Okay. Eight? Yes. Yes, $8,000. Great. Well, here's my vote. Jade may disagree, but I would just go full throttle, Baby Step 2, start knocking out these debts, and then let's say that it didn't work out, and now we have to pay for the treatment. It's okay to pause Baby Step 2 for a little while to save up that 8K and then restart. But I wouldn't just-

I don't disagree. I wouldn't just hang on to the debt indefinitely until we know. So I would make more than the minimum payments just to make some progress. You might knock out a few debts and then realize, all right, we need to pause for four months, save up for the treatment, and then hit play on the baby steps again. Yeah, and with your income, that really shouldn't be a problem. How old are you guys? I am 32, and my husband is 36.

Okay. So yeah, I 100% agree with George's plan. That feels like you're kind of making progress on your big goals, but you also have a plan in case you need the $8,000, and that's what I do. Okay. And to be clear, if you didn't have the grant, if this was costing you $10,000, we would say, hey, just pause the baby steps and save up. The goal is to not go into any more debt.

So that's kind of the step one. Is it going to cost us debt to continue this process? If so, we need a pause in cash flow. but because you guys have this grant, I would just go ahead and start knocking out some of these debts. Maybe you get halfway through by the time you realize, all right, we need to hit play on save up for the treatment. But I hope for you guys, it works out by September.

That's awesome. Best of luck to you. All right. Zephaniah is in Austin, Texas. You don't get those very often. What's going on, Zephaniah? Hello, George and Jade. Basically, what's going on is I'm $28,000 in some change, like in debt,

right now with a car that I got like six months ago. And I'm about to get married and I really don't want to go into the marriage like with all the debt. And so I was wondering like what were my options to kind of do to get rid of it. You owe $28,000 on the car? What's it worth? So the car, um, for private sale that I looked and seen it was like, I think it was like 18. It was like 16 to 18, I think, is what I could get for it. It's a 2025 Toyota Corolla. You can only get 16 for a 2025 Corolla? Boy, did you roll some negative debt into there?

Negative equity? I'm not totally sure. No, I did not. I didn't have a car before. Okay. Just a bad interest rate? Yeah, I'm at an 18%. Goodness, gracious.

That'll do it. How did you get screwed that badly? I was just really desperate for a car. I didn't have a car and I really needed one. And they let me put like $15,000 down. And they put me in 18%. Let me make this clear, Zephanai. You put yourself an 18%. Yeah. This is not to knock you, but I want you to own the parts. You just said, I needed a car. Did you need a $30,000 car? No. Yeah. There was too much of a part. there. It should have been the quickest know of your life. So here's the deal. Here's where we are. Here's the reality. You're $10,000 underwater. You've got to come up that $10,000. There's two ways to do it. Either you save up $10,000 or you go down to your local credit union and get a person alone for $10,000 plus whatever you might need for a beater car.

And I'm talking $4,000, $5,000 off Facebook Marketplace, Max. That's the only way out. If you said, hey, I want to get out by the wedding, that's the way to do it. How much do you make? I made about $40,000 a year in pest control. Okay. Is there upside there? Can you make $50-60 if you started hustling? I could.

There's opportunity for up sales and upgrades here. Get about $150 every single one. Okay, because I know you can make really good money in pest control. The guys who are crushing it are not making $40. They're making $100 plus. Yeah. So I would be aiming to make a $1.50. more money that's going to be part of this process.

Do you have any other debt outside of the 28K car loan? So we're like engaged. I have her ring two and then... Do you own it? Yeah, I did.

I did. How much was that? I think it was like 800, but like I wanted to get, I had the cash for it, but I wanted to get like the coverage for the ring and they were going to charge me more. So I was just like, okay, You took the deal.

Why do you have coverage on there too? Let's pull back because here's what I see what's going on. And you're not the only person, Zephaniah, who falls victim to this. You walk in the place and you probably have something in your mind, oh, I want to get a car. Oh, I want to get a ring. And then somebody says, well, if you get this one, we'll give you this deal. And you kind of, before you know, you're getting swindled into paying more.

You're getting swindled into paying in a way that you didn't plan to pay. In this case, you went into payments instead of using cash. you've got to decide who you are with money and don't let the salesperson decide for you. That's the one piece of advice I want you to take from this entire call is Zephaniah has to decide what is my money philosophy and my person who doesn't borrow money. If that's the case, it doesn't matter if I walk into a jeweler, a car lot or walk into Publix. I'm not borrowing money. I'm not putting it on a credit card. I'm not putting it on payments. That way, when you walk into those places, no matter what they say, you just go, no thank you.

and you just move on. Right now, you're kind of just going with whatever the salesperson tells you. So as you get married and as you grow into being an older adult, please, please, please, you decide who you are with money. Nobody changes that. So that's thing one. And thing two is, just remember, these people are sales people. They're not, the business they're in is not to do you a favor. Okay? Just remember that. There is a hero and a villain in every story. And I'm not saying that the person who sold you a ring was a bad guy. I'm not saying villain like, they're a bad person. I'm simply saying their point is to make money. Your point is to save money.

Your point is to stick to your guns and stick to your philosophy on money. So just understand the two roles when you go into those situations. And I think that's going to help you out a lot in the long run going forward. Yes. What does your fiancé make?

Right now she is not working. She just landed a job part-time at an after-school program. And she'll be making like 21 an hour. Okay. There. Cool. Well, you'll both be making about 40 at that point.

You'll have 80K. And so even if you went into the marriage and you still have this debt, you guys could knock this out fast and save up 10K and get out of it and get a cheaper car. You don't need to be driving a $30,000 car if you make 40. That is simply too much car. Health insurance is confusing on purpose. You call one company, get transferred three times, sit on hold for 45 minutes, and, end up more confused than when you started. That's why I recommend health trust financial. They're health insurance advisors who actually get to know your situation and help you find the

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Go to health trustfinancial.com today and talk to a real person without pressure or confusion. That's health trust financial.com. Jim is in Laredo, Texas up next. What's going on, Jim? Hey, what's up? I was just want to ask a question, should I pay my business loan

with my personal savings? How much debt do you have? I have 57 on a... Okay, I got 57 on one truck, 20,000 on another truck, 30,000 on trailers, and I got 82,000 in a personal and business. truck that I use as personal and business

truck. You got trucks on trucks. Are you the only employee? Are you the only owner? How's the business setup? I'm the only owner and I got another employee. Okay. What kind of business is this? It's a hot shot business. Hot shot, okay.

What's hot shot? You're doing like courier work? Carrier work, like trucking, but I don't have my CDL yet, so I'm doing hot shot for right now. So you're doing deliveries? Deliveries, correct. Got it. What are you making? Because I'm new.

It takes a, when you're new, it takes about three, four months to start getting that business. So now that I, right now that I'm new, me and my other driver running, I'm probably making, I want to say about $12,000 to $13,000 a month. Great. And Ronnie makes that too, your other driver? No, no, that's me and my other driver working together. We make up between $1,000. So what do you take home? $1,000.

$1,000. That's take home, that's take home, $12,000. But you're not taking it. You said it's split. No, no, no. I mean, both of them combined, because what I do, we grows about $25,000 to $30,000 a month. Okay. And after the expenses, it's about $12,000 to $15,000 a month. Uh-huh. And then who gets what? How much do you take home to your family and how much does your other driver take home to his family? Okay, well, it's a percentage deal. So for whatever he banks, I pay him 23%. And I usually just pay myself a salary of $1,000 a week. Okay, so got it.

So 4K a week is what you're taking in. How much do you have in savings? I have $320,000 in savings. Woo! Where I go. And I got $82,000 with a financial advisor that I just put in last week. So why all the debt? if you have all the savings. Why not cash flow this?

Man, it's because my credit started getting great, right? I have never had a good credit. My credit started getting great, and I just started piling and getting everything under credit. I do have rental properties that bring me in about $2,000 a month because I live in a small town, which rent is not that expensive, so it brings me in about $2,000 a month. How much debt is on those rentals? Zero. I got everything paid off. Way to go. So you're only debt is this business debt, all these trucks and trailers?

Yes, I got my house paid off. I got my rental properties paid off. Wow. The $320,000 I have, I have them in a high-year-s savings account, so they give me about $800 a month on it. Awesome. Okay. So we've got, if I calculated quickly, what is this around $190,190,000 of debt?

So you could pay all of the debts off and still be left with $133,000. in high-ield savings. Correct. That's pretty sweet. Have you done the math on what your cash flow would be if you didn't have any of those payments? It would be a boy, if I didn't have any of those payments, it will easily be about around, if everything continues as slow as it is right now, it'll probably be about $12,000 a month. Dude, I'm going for that life.

That's freedom. If things slow down, you're not stressing. Because guess what? The lenders don't care how slow things are. and you signed on that business debt, right? It's your signature? Yes, well, my question is this, because I wanted to pay all, everything,

except my personal business truck, which is $82,000. And I do have some cattle, right? I have about $13,000 worth of cattle on a property. I'm renting for $5,000 a month, and I was about, I think I'm selling that so I can put it in getting my debt over. Yeah. I would still pay off everything,

regardless of I can pay this off and then pay this off. You can pay it all off today. So if you sell anything else, that's just pure profit. You can do what you want with that. In your mind, what would be the, what's the upside of keeping the debt? What's the upside? Just on the personal and business truck, I want to keep that one because it's a motivation I get for working, you know. It's a motivation that I get for working.

You're motivated by the debt to work harder? On that business truck, on my business truck, you know, because it was, was the truck I always wanted. So that's why I got it. Well, we're not saying to sell it. We're simply saying to pay it off. So we're not saying get rid of it. It'll have just as much sentimental value without a payment attached to it. So here's the Ramsey principle. We recommend everyone start and run and grow their businesses completely debt-free because we have seen what the other side looks like. People call in the business didn't make it. Something happened. A partner wanted out and they are stuck because of these payments. It also changes the choices you make. When you have

on a business, everything is about making sure you're in line to make the next payment. Everything is filtered through the lens of risk and debt. When everything is paid for, it changes the choices that you make. I mean, take a moment. I don't know how easy it is for you to compartmentalize this, but surely you understand the difference of feeling you had when your house had a payment on it versus when your house became debt-free. When your rentals had payments versus when your rentals became debt-free. There was a reason that you worked so hard to achieve that. And we're simply saying take that same logic and throw it over to this business set. We think that you'll feel better about the state of your affairs if you do that.

And can I ask that after all that money, I also have, because I always had a system right to always keep $30,000 in my business account. Yep. So I also have those $30,000 on business account. Keep that there. And I do got toy trucks, you know, and people and like my family members, because I talk to a couple of my family members. They tell me to sell them, but they're like my toy trucks. I don't know if I should sell them or I should.

These are real trucks, but they're just entertainment for you. Correct. They're in cash? They're paid off? Yeah, they're all paid off. I have a, it's an 87 Chevrolet. I put in about 11,000 and last week they offered me 20,000 in it. I think it's up to you.

I think it's up to you. What feels better? Do you want to keep your toy trucks because you like them? or do you want to liquidate some of your savings? That's totally up to you how you do it, but maybe you sell the cattle in the land. You know, whatever you want to do, that's up to you. We just think that across all of your assets, you have the ability to pay off this $190,000 in debt very, very easily. And still tons left over. Yeah. Do it. After everything you said, Jim, I'm like, how does this guy carry this all in his brain? You've got nine businesses. There's debts all over the place, assets. Toy trucks. I would just want to simplify my life if I was doing as well as you.

part of that is getting completely debt-free. Appreciate the call. All right, let's go out to Landon in Rochester real quick. What's going on, Landon? Not too much. Thanks for taking my call. Absolutely. How can we help?

So, me, my fiancé, are on baby step number four. We just graduated college in December debt-free, and I'm just curious. I've been putting a lump sum into my Roth for the last couple of years at the end of my summer job in September. should I keep putting in a lump sum now that I got a big boy job out of college or do I spread it out and have a take out of my checking, you know, through the 12 months? So you're really asking, do I do lump sum or dollar cost average? Yes. Okay.

Well, here's the theory. And again, nobody knows what the markets are going to do. But the sooner you get the money in and the longer you let it sit, the better off you're going to be. So if you lump sum in January versus putting it January, February, March, April, May, and spreading it, you will likely do best. better if you lump sum at every January. Okay. There's also a psychological component of when you can set it and forget it, right?

It's automatically taken out of your check. It's not something that you're thinking of. My contributions come out of my check automatically. I never even count the money because I never even saw it to begin with. And if you do a lump sum, let's pretend the markets are up or really down, whatever it makes you feel awkward about investing. At the end of your summer gig, now it's September, and you're like, ooh, the market took a dip. and now I'm going to lump summit, well, hey, you're buying it on sale.

Or, hey, the market's doing really well. Well, you're buying it at the top. Right. There's that piece of it. And there's a piece of now you've got to trust yourself that I'm putting this money aside. I'm saving it. It has to stay there. And hopefully there's not a wedding in the Caribbean that sounds really good to me.

Right? And I use that money for that instead. You sound pretty disciplined in which you've been doing this for years now. Yeah. I mean, I pretty much owe everything to my parents for, let me do this. They're pretty big believers in you guys. I've been listening to this show since my dad was picking me up at elementary school and I was like, I'm glad Dave's not here. That'd make him feel real old. But I love it, man. It's a great problem to have. If you're even asking this

question, it tells me you are going to build generational wealth. So keep it up. Just keep investing no matter what. Here's what nobody warns you about. You're behind on payments. You signed up with some debt settlement company. You're making your monthly payments to them. And then one morning, a process server knocks on your door. Surprise, you just got sued by a creditor. And that company you trusted? Not a law firm. They're not built to represent you if things escalate. And now you're scrambling to figure out what to do next. And that's why I tell people about Guardian litigation group. Guardian litigation is not a call center. They're actual attorneys at a law firm. And from day one, you're assigned a real attorney who can represent you if a creditor takes you to court.

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Welcome back to The Ramsey Show in the Fair Winds Credit Union Studio. I'm George Camel here with Jade Warshaw, taking your calls AAA 825-5-2-2-25. Sarah is in Baltimore. What's going on, Sarah? Hey, thanks for taking my call, guys. Absolutely. My question is, how do I handle the stress of being the person in my family

responsible for making the financial decision? Wow. That was the nicest way to say I'm resentful of my husband for not being involved in the financial decisions. Yeah, why is it like that? So my husband is really bad with numbers. Like we're fairly confident he has like a learning disability with math. He's bad with numbers. Okay.

So there's something going on because the thing is he trusts me a lot. And he will do whatever I tell him to, even if it's uncomfortable for him. If I tell him it's a no spend week until bills get paid on Friday, he won't spend a dime. the first week where we really got serious about doing Ramsey plan and stopping with the credit card was the week of Father's Day. And I didn't have anything planned for Father's Day. And I said, I don't have anything planned if we want this to be like our last hurrah with a credit card to do something special for you for Father's Day because you did something special for me for Mother's Day. I can do that.

And he said, no, this is the plan that you said we're supposed to do. And so we're going to do it. Right. He trusts me a lot. It's terrifying. but okay there's two I'm seeing this in two ways though there's I'm bad with numbers meaning I don't like arithmetic and I don't like crunching numbers and I don't do you see what I'm saying like that there's that side of it and then there's the side of if you explain something to me if it has anything to do

with money I don't get it and it doesn't sound like it's that it sounds like he's just not interested in crunching numbers and doing the arithmetic part of it but it sounds like he's willing to be part of the plan, and it sounds like he's willing to go over the budget with you and agree to the numbers. Am I missing something? No, yes. He's willing. He just does whatever I tell him is the right thing to do. But I think what's happening is here is my wife calls this the mental load. There are things that he never has to deal with that are stressing you out, and you're feeling like, man, I'm carrying 95% of this in my head, and I feel like he should be pulling more weight. Yeah, and then, so we're, the debt picture's not pretty.

We've got about 87,000 in consumer debt and 217,000 left on our mortgage. Okay, what do you guys make? So what we are going to be making, I work for the school system, and I just got into a full-time position at the end of the year. he pre-tax brings in about 65 and I pre-tax I'm going to be bringing in about 67. Okay. So let's pan back just real quick. So George said it beautifully. You're feeling the mental load.

And it shouldn't be that way because what we teach is that both people should have a say in the budget. It's okay if one person's more of a nerd and likes numbers and the other person hates numbers. That's okay. but both people have to have a say and a vote. And for the person who tends to be way more relaxed, like, yeah, honey, whatever you want to do, that's not allowed. And the reason that's not allowed because right now, it may feel like they're checking out. And obviously right now, the mental load becomes more for you. But on down the road, you don't know when he's going to decide he cares. And he might wake up and decide, oh, gosh, I feel like I don't have a voice or I feel like she's lording this over me. Or I feel like she's lording this over me. Or I feel like. she's controlling. And now there's some resentment that has the potential to breed or on your side, man, I've been carrying this for years. He doesn't care. Right. So over time, the stakes on this get really high. And so today what you need to do is go to him and say, I understand that I'm more of the nerd. I understand that I'm more of the mathematician. But I need for you when we go over the budget, I need for you to

come to me with three suggestions every time. That's the only thing I need from you. So I know that you're asserting your opinion. It's important for me to hear your opinion. And it helps me feel like I'm not carrying this all by myself because I don't want to. And I think if you let him know that that could help, have you done that? So I have. And his response to that has been that I, his response to that has been I can help by doing. And so he does. He works his butt off and he gets all the overtime we can give him. He cares about it. It's truly, because I've heard the stories and I've seen the mayor. where the husband checks out, doesn't care. Yeah, whatever you want to do, I'm not really

invested in this. So what are you actually wanting from him? Yeah, then what do you want? If I waived a magic wand, what would he be doing differently in this marriage? Oh, what a, what a thought? I'm just wondering how much of this is on you to just own like you go to therapy, you know what I mean, versus there's, it sounds like everything you're saying like, oh no, he's great. I just, I can't help but think about all of this more than he does. Because it is stressful, Sarah. Being in debt is stressful and you do feel a weight. There is a physical weight that you feel managing this and carrying this until it's done. I'll be the first to tell you. And George knows about it too. So maybe that's just what you're feeling. And I will tell you, there are points where you do want to offload it onto someone else. And when you're carrying that stress of debt, anything that happens, I mean, you're talking to someone who was in 460. And so anything that would happen, I was looking for ways to blame Sam Warshaw. I was just looking. for a chance. So I totally get it.

Unleash some of this pent-up emotion. Yeah. The big thing there is that I blame myself. About half of the debt burden is directly my fault. What kind of debt is this, the 87? So about 10 of its credit cards and like small loans to my family. 17 of it is student loans, which would have been forgiven if I had actually applied for my employers tuition reimbursement and I couldn't figure out the process.

That's okay. You got to let it go. 22 is a helock. And we owe $36,000 to my parents because our house was built in the 50s and had asbestos sighting covered in lead paint. Oh, man. And it started to fall apart. And so we had to get the siting redone before my two-year-old stuck asbestos in lead

in his mouth. So. But my parents, we have like that formal loan set up with them, loaned us that money. 0%. So it's still a part of our snowball. We're still hopefully going to, you know, pay it off before it comes due. We're making payments on it. But what is the game plan here? Have you guys sat down and said, all right, we're going to be debt free in 18 months? So I've made it all out and we are going to be debt free by September of 2031. What? That's too long. I just did some math, Sarah. You guys bring home, you'll be bringing home 8,000 a month.

right i pay five hundred seventy five dollars a week in daycare i'm saying you bring what will you be bringing home bringing home we should be bringing home after taxes and insurance what i'm 32 he's 36 my guess was about 100k net yeah but i also am wondering do you need an every dollar budget because have an every dollar budget, you know those numbers, lickety split. So we're going to make sure that you have that because it's going to help you. You might be doing a spreadsheet. I'm not mad at you, but every dollar is going to help you more. So we're going to give you that for free. Also, I'm going to give you my book what no one tells you about money because the things that you were laying out are exactly to the T, the things that I'm talking about in the book, everywhere from

parents loaning you money to having student loans to feeling the weight, to feel all of that is in the book. So you're going to get that for free. And, um, September of 2013. No, I'm going 2028. 3,600 a month out of your 8K, you're done in two years. It was that simple. Now go for it.

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Hey, George. What's going on? Oh, we're losing you. Speak directly in your phone. A little better. Go to another room of the house. Yes. Can you hear me good?

Yeah, that's better. Awesome. I'm pretty sure taking my call, Jade and George. My question is, how do I make sure I'm going into business with the right motives? I want to make sure I'm not needlessly gilting myself over wanting to make a profit, but also want to make sure I'm not chasing a dollar every day. I just graduated college, no debt, and I'm a Christian, and I want to have the proper values about everything, but I just don't want to get sidetracked along the way. What are your thoughts on getting paid for a job well done, receiving what you earn for a job really well done?

I think that's a great thing. Well, then all right. Do you have a job now? Yes, sir. What do you do? manufacturing. And what do you want to be doing with this business? It'll be in sales. My family works in sales, and I've worked in sales. I enjoy it. I just got this manufacturing in college. I'm confused. You want to start a business in sales? What are you selling? Sheds, like lots, locations. I know the business

really well, and I know it'll do really well. Okay. So you want to sell sheds as a business? Yes, sir. Okay. So you work for a manufacturing company. How do you get paid? right now. Is it out of the profits of the business? I'm hourly. Okay. But I'm saying the way they pay you is they make money, they take a portion of that money and they pay you. Yes. Would you consider them to have bad motives in doing that? No, no. So where does the line come? What do you think? You described to us what it looks like. My screen says, how do I start a business without idolizing money or success? You explained to us what that looks like because then we'll know, if you know, if you know, it looks like then you'll know if you're venturing over into that territory so what does that look like

so um open one location i have where i have in mind i know it'll do really well it'll provide more than my basic necessities and needs and looking down the road five years and i'm like i'm knowing i could open possibly two or three or four of these lots yeah and when i question why would i want to and i'm like well i mean obviously it's going to make more money i can help more people i can provide good jobs for people but But I feel a small amount of guilt where I'm just like, the first thing that comes to mind is, oh, I'll make more money. And I'm just worried about if I go into that with that mindset that maybe lot two, three, or four, I don't know, I'm worried about chasing a dollar more than providing a good moral service. I see. I mean, I can understand what you're saying to an extent.

But one of the thing that I've learned about money, I know George has learned this and you've probably heard Dave say it too. But when you are really good at something, you do tend to earn more. And what money does to you, it doesn't make you bad, it doesn't make you evil. It tends to make people more of what they already are. And so you're already a kindhearted person. I can hear that. You're already a generous person. I can hear that. You're already a very thoughtful person. I can hear that. So it's probably going to bring more of that out in you. You're probably going to be more generous. You're probably going to become more thoughtful, all of those things. I can tell you this. And George, George and I peeked at the screen during the break, and we kind of read a little bit of what the call was about. And we thought to ourselves, gosh, the person who had the ability to idolize money would never call in saying, I'm afraid I'm going to idolize money. So they kind of solved our problem. Like, all right, Reese is not going to be an issue. You're not that guy. I appreciate that you're thinking about this. That was all I needed, I guess. So that's all I needed. Yeah, well, there's no scripture that says making a profit is evil. So the question is, who is being hurt in the process of making these profits? Do you treat your team well? Do you treat your customers well? Are you doing everything ethically? Then you kind of know, all right, this is above board. So scaling a business, it's not, you're not more, you know, better morally or have more virtue because you kept your business small. Yes. You know what I mean? That doesn't make you a better person than the guy who has scaled to 48 locations. So I don't want to look at scaling as the immoral thing.

I think it's always good to question, where is this ambition coming from? Am I actually discontent? Is it greed? Is it pride? What's driving this? And that helps you kind of gut check yourself along the way. But I'm excited for you to start this business. We need more good entrepreneurs out there.

And I hope you're one of them, Reese. I appreciate it. Thank you all. Absolutely. I love that question. I think that it's good that he's thinking about that. And I always think about the scripture. It's in Deuteronomy 818.

And it says, but remember the Lord your God for it is he who gives you the ability to produce wealth. And so that just reminds me, oh, like he's giving me the ability to do this. It's not a bad thing. It's not a negative thing. All of the things point back to character, which is what you said earlier. Are you being a good person? Is your character, you know, morally right? All of those things are kind of separate from the matter.

But producing wealth is a good thing. Yeah. I mean, profit equals abundance. And somehow we've confused abundance with evil. Yeah. And what you do with that abundance is very telling. That's right. But money is amoral.

I mean, you know, a brick can be used to build a hospital, can be used to break some windows. You get to decide. So I hope that helps, race. Appreciate the call. Joe is in Boise up next. What's going on, Joe? Not a whole lot.

How are you guys doing today? We're doing well. How can we help? Oh, just looking to see if I should sell my house. I've got quite a bit of equity in it. And unfortunately, we have to pull out of our 401K just to put a new roof on the place. I did have to work myself, but I just, you know, wonder when I should cut my losses

because we just are not going to be able to buy what we have locally. Can you not afford the payment or are there other issues? No, we can afford the payment. It's just those, you know, those homeowner issues, like in every, for instance, you know, like it's going in on. Well, like if an emergency fund solves your problems, let's not sell the house. Yeah. Yeah, well, that's just it.

We depleted it and then some, and then we get it up again, and then something else comes up. Tell us what you pay every month. What's the mortgage? The mortgage is 22. And what do you guys bring home every month? What's your after-tax monthly income? It's 70 a year before tax, so I'll call it, like 38. 38? That doesn't feel right. That feels way off. You don't live in Canada. Why are they taking half your taxes?

I got the before-tax members, not the after-you-say-you-you-have-partner. Okay, I'm saying don't count 401K. We're not investing right now while we got debt. Don't count health care. We're just saying what is like after your federal and state taxes are paid. We're bringing in, let's say, $4,500 a month. Yeah, that's probably closer to it. You have to pardon me.

My wife's actually the breadwinner and I'm the stay-at-home parent, yet I make all the financial decisions for us in the household. Okay. So based on that, your mortgage is half of your take-home pay. Correct. So I've already, it helps that there's multiple structures on the property, and I've turned one of them into a rental. So we're generating 1,500 a month from that. On top of your 4,500? Correct.

Okay. So that brings up to 6K. Now it's a little over a third of your take-home pay. We recommend 25% of take-home pay going towards your housing, whether that's rent, your mortgage. And so you're still over the line that's still, it's putting you guys on a slight pinch, but I'm guessing there's a lot of other debts as well that you're trying to, pay off? No, we actually have no debt. We have no car payments, no student loans, nothing. So we essentially took everything we had and invested it into this place. And it helps to note that we essentially paid half price. It appraised at 500 and we paid $2.90. So I mean, anyone would have jumped at the

opportunity. So then this is a monthly cash flow problem. This is a month-to-month cash flow issue because you know, a third is a little bit more than I'd want for a mortgage to be, but if you're saying you have no debt, nothing else going on, I'm looking and I'm thinking, and you're staying home with the kids so we don't have an astronomical daycare bill, I'm wondering if this is a budget issue. Do you guys have a budget? Yeah, we definitely have a budget. It just seems like lately all those costs keep going up and up, you know. All what costs? $4 a gallon here, you know, groceries. Just cost a little. It seems like every week now. Well, what's your margin?

When you do the budget, what's your margin at the end of the month? You mean like percentage-wise? No, what's left over after? Margin is money that's left over after your bills are paid and after- Yeah, sure. Mm-hmm. Yeah. So you bring home six, $2,200, the mortgage.

We probably have close to $1,000. Okay. Over and above all of the bills. And then so. So you do have margin. It also helps to note that the house that I'm living in, that I converted, is I'm fine, fine. Well, here's the good news, Joe.

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Our question of the day is brought to you by WIREFI. When past two private student loans keep pulling you backwards, it's hard to focus on what's ahead. YREFI helps borrowers with low, fixed rate refinancing options that fit your budgets so you can focus on the future again. Visit Y-Refi.com slash Ramsey may not be available in all states. Okay, dokey. Today's question comes from Brendan in Wyoming. He says, My wife and I are tackling our combined debt of $60,000. Her student loan balances total 9,000 and mine total 51,000. I keep telling her we should just tackle all her debts first

and then dive into mine. But she keeps saying we should list each and every one of the loans and tackle them individually. I would really love some clarity on how to do the debt snowball method, starting with her loans seems more doable to me and would give us a bigger shovel for the remaining ones. She is insistent that we should start with the smallest individual loan and work our way up from there. Who's right? Okay. As usual, it's her. Yeah, she's right. And, you know, Brendan, I understand what you're saying. There's worse things you could probably do in life than do what you're saying. So I'm not saying like what you're suggesting is bad or evil or wrong or anything like that. But if you're walking the Ramsey way, which is proven over millions of

people over 30 years that this is the best method, the debt snowball. And the reason for it is for people who really want to see it through the end and actually pay off their debt. The percentages are higher of people who actually pay off all of their debt, not just some of it. They're higher when you do the debt snowball method. So to clarify, with the debt snowball method, you list all of your debts by balance, not interest rate, not what you owe monthly. It's by full balance from smallest to largest. You pay minimum payments on everything. And the reason for that is we don't want to get behind. We don't want $1,800 pay me calling you, which are also bill collectors. So pay minimum payments. And then whatever is left over, after all that, whatever margin you have, you throw it at

the smallest debt. And what it does ultimately is, let's say you have a list of 17 different debts. You know, it feels really good to be able to knock off four of them, even if the balance was only $200 or $87 or $99. It just feels good psychologically to be able to, you know, cross those off. You feel good about it. You do get a dopamine hit and that makes you feel like you want to keep going. So that's kind of the nuts and bolts of how to do that. And George, I know you guys did it. You did it. Oh yeah. And I love, so I actually looked into this for my book, Jade, breaking free from broken in there, I found that Time magazine and Harvard Business Review came out and said, it turns out Ramsey is right. Based on the actual research, the data,

Here's the quote. People are more motivated to get out of debt, not only by concentrating on one account, but also by beginning with the smallest. So it's a both-hand. It's all about momentum. You need a quick win. It's more about behavior than the numbers. So we wish you guys the best in this debt payoff. Come celebrate when you're done. All right. Ryan is in Charlotte on the phone up next. What's going on, Ryan? Hey, big fan of you guys. So earlier this year, my sister had passed away in a car accident. Oh, so sorry. We'd recently received her AD&D and life insurance payout, and my parents had exploited between my brother and I. And so I'm trying to figure out what the best way to make that money, like what's the best way to put that money to work for me? I'm currently in babysat too.

Wow. Well, first off, we're so sorry for your loss. That sounds incredibly difficult. I hate to hear that for you. The second thing is, how much did you receive? So it was $20,000. Okay. And what do you have in debt right now for consumer debt?

So I just have student loans. They total up to just about $85,000. Okay. So if you took that $20 and attacked the smallest balances, how many could you knock out? Let's see, three, at least three, and then chunk another 10 into the big private one. Sweet. So you'd be making some progress and freeing up some payments right there.

And now you're closer to the home stretch by doing that. How much do you make? I make $65,000. Is that your household income? Yeah, yeah, I'm single. Okay. How old are you? I'm 25.

Okay. Private student loans tend to have higher interest rates in some cases, but because they're private, sometimes there's some wiggle room. So I might call over there and just see if there's anything that they can do about any of these interest rates. If there's any, just wiggle room, if there's any that they'd be willing to make a deal with you on. I know for Sam and I, we were able to make a couple of deals on some of our private student loans. we were able to get the interest rate lowered on some of them. Now, granted, we had them around a little bit longer than you, but it's worth a try. And a lot of times those get sold off anyway.

They get moved around between different private companies. And when that happens, that's generally the best time to try to make a deal. So call them up and try it, especially now that you've got some cash, you might be able to get a couple of those for a little bit less. Yeah, and I think the main thing that I'm wrestling with, I guess mentally and emotionally is it feels like if my sister were still here and just gave me that money, what would she want me to do with it? I know that you guys talk all the time about the sooner I get out of debt than the more I can do those kind of things. And I don't like, I don't know if I put, because she would really just want to travel and make memories and go on trips. I don't know if I take even three grand of that 20 and kind of sock that towards a trip fund, if you will, and then put the rest at work or I guess that's my main struggle with this entire situation.

Interesting, interesting. I mean, that's probably about a, like, it probably slows you down by maybe a couple of months, right, on your actual debt-free journey. If you threw 17 instead of 20. I've done the math, anywhere from putting 5K towards the loans up to the full 20, and I see how many months I'm saving

if I don't put any towards debt. There's also nothing wrong with attacking your debts and doing a trip once you're debt-free. That's true. Yeah. Yeah. I'll be honest with you, Ryan. You know, there's part of me that I hear what you're saying about the wanting to honor

what they would want. And there is something about a loss that you almost do need just a way to kind of unplug and restart. And sometimes taking a trip is the way to do that, sometimes getting away from your normal environment to just kind of reset. So I'm actually not opposed to it. $3,000 is a lot of money. maybe you do 2000 or 15.

Whatever you feel right about, I don't think that you're going to do anything reckless, but I probably, how old are you? I'm 25. I'm not opposed to something like that because of the nature of the money and how you received it

and wanting to do something that you feel like is honoring to them and also maybe helping you heal too. Yeah, and I think, I mean, having, like during this entire grieving and kind of healing process, I think having my, I guess, goals of, because I've been so aggressive on paying down this debt ever. I mean, I really locked in December of last year. Yeah, before this even happened.

I've paid, yes, I've paid like four federal loans off that were my smallest balances. And I just, I mean, there is light at the end of the tunnel for sure. And I know that if I really hunker down, then I can. can get out faster. Yeah, at this rate, how fast will you get out? Let's say through all of the inheritance at these debts. You got 65 left. You make 65. What would you be on track to do? The math that I did with how much I'm paying extra on top of the minimums, I'd come out October of 29. Okay. So we're talking about three years, which I mean, the debt to income ratio, I would have some urgency about this. Most people, we see.

see it's like half their debt to income ratio. So they make 100, they have 50k in debt. When I see someone making 65 who has 65 in debt, I kind of get some palpitations going, we need to get this income up. We need to get this done faster. The average is about two years. So if you're far off from that, you know, Jade had a story where she had almost half a million with her and her husband. So that took seven years. It looks different for everyone. But I don't want you to get comfortable either going, well, I'll take my time. But I do love marking her legacy with some sort of trip. It doesn't need to be a $3,000 trip. It could be a nonstop flight somewhere, and it's a solo trip where you get to kind of honor what she meant to you. So, so sorry for

your loss, man, and we are rooting for you on this debt-free journey. The Live Like No One Else Cruise is back. And for all of you who are living debt-free, we want you to join us in the Western Caribbean. This is the only cruise where you can hang out with us and Dave Ramsey for seven days in paradise, enjoying poolside chats, live Q&A sessions, and so much more. and I'm already packing jade I'm getting started early on this one I know it's not until March chats is what got me

you're not going to be pool side the pool side chats let's get into it we'll see it was a blast the last time we did it and so we're bringing it back and the ship's over halfway full already the Neptune suites have already sold out

so lock in your spot with a $600 deposit before it's too late click the link in the show notes or go to ramsysolutions.com slash events I gotta work on my base tan I realized what was your favorite thing last time?

I think watching Ken Coleman, who no longer are co-worker, but watching him play a pickleball for about four hours with a headband out there, that was the best entertainment money could buy. Oh, man. Oh, Ken. I'm going to hit karaoke pretty hard, and I expect to see you out there. I'll be there. Okay. I'll be there. It's going to be fun.

Rob is in Greenville, South Carolina up next. What's going on, Rob? Thanks for taking my call. I am looking to open the Roth IRA. and I'm just trying to figure out how to assess and figure out kind of what investments within that Roth IRA that I'm looking to do. Great question. And a good call out for anyone listening, people think, well, I put money into my Roth IRA. I'm done. And I go, did you, though? Because it might just be sitting in like the settlement account in cash and you need to actually go invest the dollars into something like a mutual fund.

So we recommend four types of mutual funds around here. And essentially, Rob, it's large cap, midcap. Small cap international. So we want a nice mix of companies to stay diversified. You've also heard of, you know, an S&P 500 index fund, a nice low cost, broad-based index fund. That's fine, too. But you don't get the same amount of diversification because an S&P 500 fund is just the top 500 companies. So you've got mostly large cap in there.

So you're not exposed to the smaller companies who might have some sweet, aggressive growth. And those international companies that help kind of bolster your portfolio when the U.S. market goes down. and can I do you one better, Rob? So I give you even bit. Okay. We're doing an event called Investing Essential, September 1st and 2nd. It's a virtual event, and I'm going to send you a free ticket. You don't have to pay for it if you'll actually attend it and watch it.

It's Dave Ramsey and I for two nights unpacking all of this, and we actually do a walkthrough with examples of how to select mutual funds within there because with a Roth IRA, there's thousands you can choose from. It's overwhelming. So we'll show you how to narrow it down by process. of elimination to choose the right ones that work out for you long term. That sounds great. Okay.

We'll hook you up with that. But it is, Jay, there's a lot of factors here. You want to be looking at how long has the fund existed? I was just about to say, what's the rate of return then? Has the management team been there for 10 years or has been a lot of turnover? What's the expense ratios? What's been the rate of return over the long haul? Yeah, and you can look that up.

Whenever you're looking for funds, a lot of people want us to say, just tell me what fund to choose. Tell me the ticker. And we don't do that because I think it's great. to learn. It's great to look it up, look them up. Mine has a, it's like a report card that you can look at or you can look at the prospectus either way. But yeah, you look at how long has it been alive, you know, inception date or whatever? Is this fun being around for a year or 50 years? Exactly. And then you can look at, you know, the past year, five years, 10 years on down the line. And all that's really good

to see. I'm always looking to make sure it's at least like 11, 12 or beyond for, you know, average annualized rate of return, which is what we talk about here on the show all the time. And you can see all of that in the fund. Obviously, if you look in the past years, it's going to be really, really great. But the good news is there's so many that you don't want that it really narrows it down pretty quickly. If you start looking at that stuff, you'll be able to see really clearly, okay, this is, I see what they're saying. Jade, as I do, I got in an argument on in the comments section, because this guy, you know, I say, hey, 10% is what you can expect. That's the average, you know, the average is 10 to 12, let's go 10. Yeah. And he goes, what are you talking about?

You need to plan for six. And so I messaged him. I said, hey, man, I'd like to know, like, Where's this coming from? What are you invested in? So he literally sent me his portfolio and half of it was in bonds. Oh, no. This kid's in his 20s. And a bunch of it was in, you know, Canadian stocks. I think he's in Canada and a little bit of it was in the U.S. market. And I want, well, don't complain that you're getting 10 or 12 percent when you're investing terribly. Yeah. It's not diversified. You need to be in mostly equities, especially while you're younger, to experience that growth. Yeah. Most people, and I still don't suggest this, but a lot of people do switch to bond funds when they get older, it's less risky, but

bonds are volatile in their own way. In their own way. That's true. And then you're going to call me going, hey, I'm only getting 6% what's going on. And when I look under the hood, I'm like, there's your problem right there, bud. So we're going to walk you through all of that investing essentials. You can get your virtual ticket for that at ramsyslusion.com slash events if you can't get it for free like I just gave to my friend Rob. But that's what he gets for calling on the show. He did the work. All right. Let's go to Nicholas in Pittsburgh up next. What's going on, Nicholas?

So I'm struggling to do step one, even saving $1,000. I racked up quite a bit of debt. So I feel like all my money is just playing catch up right now. And a little Robin Peter to pay Paul with cash advances. So I'm just trying to get to a good point so I can do the first step, save $1,000. So when you say you're trying to get to a good point before you save $1,000, does that mean you're trying to get current on anything that's behind? What do you mean by that?

Yeah. So it kind of just dug myself a hole as far as debt. I enrolled myself into a debt program about $41,000 worth of debt. Like a debt settlement relief company? Yeah. They tell you to stop paying the debts, tank your credit, pay us the money. pay us the payments and then we'll settle for you. How long have you been in that?

Yes. Two years. How much have you paid in? A decent amount of money. Okay. How much have they cleared for you? They take $300 out of every paycheck. Okay.

And how much is... Most of that is going towards their fees. Right. So we're going to probably stop that immediately. let's stop that program because, and here's why, whatever they're doing, if you wanted to do it that way, you could do it yourself. All they're doing is taking that $300, they're stacking it up in a pool while you're not making payments. And every time that you don't get a payment, that gives them more leverage to settle the debt. And so at some point, they're going to come in and then

try to settle it for, I don't know, a quarter on the dollar or whatever. If you wanted to do that, you could do that yourself and not pay the fees. So let's get out of that program immediately. And whatever they've got, you know, pulled aside, let them, you know, put it towards the debt or maybe they'll give it back to you either way. Get out of that. And let's talk about, are you behind on anything right now? No. All my bills are paid for. I just don't have much left over to start saving that $1,000.

What is your margin? When you do your every dollar budget, how much margin is left? Like, $200,300. Okay. So when we say Baby Step 1, which for anybody listening, baby step one is you get a thousand dollars saved now first off the purpose of that thousand dollars it's not to be the be all end all it's to be just a cushion between you and life it really is a small um insurance policy that ensures that you're not going to go back into debt so if a tire

goes out on the car instead of putting it on a credit card like you used to do now you can just pay cash for it right it's not going to solve all your problems but it's temporary and it should give you a lot of motivation to really work fast to pay your debt off because nobody likes only having a thousand dollars saved. So that being said, most people are able to do this and this should be your goal to Nicholas in 30 days or less. And that's not just with your normal cash flow margin. That's with you selling things. That's with you working extra. That's with you doing everything you can to get this money. Pausing investing if you're doing any of that. Just looking around for any creative way you can to free up more margin, whether that's spending less or making more

more. So how much do you make? Yeah. Um, 94,000. Amazing. And what, how much debt do you have total in the consumer debt side? Uh, I have about 60,000 in student loans, um, the 41,000 in credit card debt, 30,000 in a truck payment. Um, and then I also have my mortgage. Okay. Are you married or single? Okay. Okay. What's the? truck worth? Only 22,000. Okay, that might be something you look into to come up with the difference through just saving up cash once you threw baby step one.

Because you get rid of that truck. That's almost a third of your dead gone, or at least a fourth, to free up some margin to then throw. Because you free up that truck payment, now we can attack some of these student loans and eventually the credit cards, whatever the next smallest balance is. Hang on the line, we're going to gift you every dollar premium, which will help you find more margin to help you with this debt-free journey, my friend. Welcome back to the Ramsey Show and the Fairwinds Credit Union Studio. I'm George Camel here with Jade Warshaw taking your calls. Jordan is in Manchester, New Hampshire up next. Jordan, how can we help? So I got a truck repair coming up.

It's probably going to cost me about $1,000. And I got through Babysup 1 in the very, very early stages of Babyset 2. I have about $5,000 in a high-yield savings. account and I'm just wondering if I should wait until when I get paid next to pay for the truck repair or if I should pull from the high-yield savings to pay for the repair. Well, either way, the high-yield savings is just sort of a slush fund. What was that earmarked for? Say that again. What was the high-yield savings earmarked for? Because we would tell you, just take the five and throw it at your debts, obviously you have this truck repair. So let's use

a thousand of that to cover the repair. Is the truck drivable right now? technically yeah it's just got a really bad oil leak okay like if you keep driving it's going to get worse is it one of those situations yeah oh yeah okay yeah then i would go ahead and do the repair i mean it's why we tell you to have the thousand dollar emergency fund so even if you just had that you'd be in the clear and then we'd tell you to pause restock the baby step one thousand bucks then move on to baby step two again all right so it doesn't really matter where the money comes from you have six grand to your name let's cover the thousand dollar repair and then get on to these debts Okay. How much debt do you have?

Right now, about, I think I just looked at it today, about 33,000. Okay. And what do you make? About 62 a year. Awesome. Is it just to you? For my, I'm engaged, but we haven't fully combined our finances yet. Okay, that's good. And you shouldn't yet until you get married. What kind of debt is the 33,000? So I have two personal loans out.

And then I have a motorcycle alone. What's left on the motorcycle? Do you go under 16? Oh, wow. And what's it worth? Probably right around 16. Ding, ding, ding, ding. I mean, deal.

Do we need to ride this for now? Can we get rid of this thing and free up a payment? That's my main source of transportation. That's how I'm getting myself back before it to work. Okay, so you don't have a car? No, right now, no. So what about the- truck?

I wasn't driving it because I was afraid I was going to blow the motor. Oh, but once you get it fixed. Yeah, we fixed the truck and we sell the bike. I don't want to sell the bike, Joe. Come on. Thank you, George. Thank you for being honest. Because I was waiting for you to straight up tell me, I don't want to sell the bike.

I like the bike. I don't. You know, it's, you know, in the world of struggling a little bit financially, it's the one little freedom I feel like I can have. How fast can you have it paid off, though? 16,000 in debt is not freedom. I know it feels like it when the wind's running through your hair. But that's half your debt, man, and you're about to get married.

Yeah. What's more important, the future with this woman or having a bike you can go buy again later on? Does she have debt? I know. Yes, but not nearly as much as I do. I mean... It's not a competition. But that's the way I'd be thinking about it.

I know. If you have 33,000 and she has, how much? I would guess probably under 10. Okay. Okay, and that's a guess. So here's what I would do in your shoes. I would have the conversation with her tonight I would start having the conversations

about you guys' philosophy on money and now is the time because you know you're getting married when's the date? 2028 August of 2028. Okay, August of 2028. Why is so far away? We actually just recently got engaged about a month ago. But I mean it doesn't take two years to plan a party.

It's a long time. No, but one of the things that conversations we have started having is that we both want to be debt-free. Bologna, if you wanted to be debt-free before the wedding, you'd sell this bike yesterday. Right, because now, then if I was her, I'd be mad. I'd be like, wait a second, I got to wait another year for you to pay off your bike. What if you take on more debt? Does that delay the wedding further? What's that? I'm just saying right now, basically, you can ramp up or down this wedding and this new season of your life based on how aggressive you want to be with the debt. I understand.

And like I said, I just started the baby step two, and I'm putting as much as I can towards the smallest, my smallest debt right now. What about this? Let me place something out for you. Because like I said, I appreciated your honesty. And you're right. It sucks really bad to give up the things that we want, especially if we feel like they're things that we earned or we just have a special attachment to them for whatever reason. That's probably the hardest part of Baby Step two is the sacrifice. of saying no to things that we would so like to say yes to, motorcycle falls into that category. What if you sold the bike and then you paid off the $16,000 here really, really fast in the next couple of months, and then you saved up to buy another bike again in cash? And you bought maybe, and maybe you bought more of the bike you wanted. And let's be honest, you could do all of that in way under two years,

which tells me there's another reason you guys aren't getting married for two years. long you've been together? Just like a year and eight months. Okay. Are you already living together? We are, yes. That's why we're waiting. That explains it.

There's no urgency. There's nothing exciting on the other side except a piece of paper. The loins are no longer burning. If I can say that on the radio. Oh, that's fun, Jordan. We're having fun with you. We are. We are team, Jordan. We want you to win, and we're just showing you the best path forward.

Now, can you do it a different way? Yes. Will it take longer? Yes. I can't force you to sell the motor. cycle, but I think everybody listening to this is going, sell the bike, man. Why put yourself in more pain and suffering for longer when there's another bike? Someone else is going to be in your shoes selling a bike for 16K later on down the road.

Well, that's the other thing is that later on down the road, we're looking at buying the house, but we both want to get before we do that. So obviously... How old are you guys? I'm 28. She's 29. Okay. You know, I think what I'm hearing is somebody who, it's weird. On certain things, you're like, we have all the time in the world.

And then on the things that are less pleasant, it's like, well, we got to do it now. And I think the correlation there is on the things that are enjoyable and you kind of get the benefit of it, you got all the time in the world. Like, I can just drive this, I can keep this motorcycle. Like, we're living together. We don't need to get married. But on the things that are a little uncomfortable that really do require your attention, It's, you know, we need to flip-flop that a little bit. So I think that you're going to do what you're going to do.

But George and I would suggest if you really want to get out of debt quickly, if you really want to put yourself in the position to buy the house. And if you really want to do what you say, which is let's each individually be debt-free before we get married, which that's your prerogative if you want to do it that way. The best way to do that is let's get rid of the bike. Let's show that we're serious about it. and that's kind of like you pushing all your chips in and saying, I'm serious about this deal. Do you think she would find it romantic if you're like, hey, I'm selling the bike because I value our future together more than this toy?

Oh, because she likes going on it too. Oh. So now she's the one blocking this from happening. She's like, no, I like the bike. No, she ain't stopping me. Trust me, I'll tell you right now. She's not going to stop me. But it's, I don't know, it's just something that we can do together.

instead of staying at home when it's beautiful. You're right. You're right. You can't leave the house unless you have a motorcycle. Here's the thing. Here's what I would suggest. I would suggest if you don't need to wait two years. You do not need to wait until all your debts are paid off. And if you both really truly enjoy the bike, you can pay it off together when your funds are combined once you get married. How about that? At least we agree on one thing. We should pay a thousand bucks for the truck repair. Yes. I'm trying to find some silver lining in this call.

We agree on that. Dave Ramsey here, for more than 30 years, I've been talking to folks on the air, and I can tell you that most people are broke. Not because they don't make enough money, but because they don't have a plan. You need to give every dollar you earn a job, because when you do that, something changes. You stop guessing. You stop worrying. You stop stressing. Our every dollar budgeting app will show you how to find extra cash, pay off debt, and finally start winning with money.

But most people won't do it. They'll keep living paycheck to paycheck. Keep hoping things will change without making a change. It's time to say enough is enough. It's time to take control of your money. It's time to start your every dollar budget for free today. Go download it in the app store or Google Play. Welcome back to The Ramsey Show.

I'm George Campbell here with Jade Warshaw. We're taking your calls. Katie is in Raleigh up next. What's going on, Katie? Hi. So I am about... to start a new job, earning more income. So my question is, should I take that extra money and then put that towards my student loans, even though my parents have promised to pay them off,

or put that towards other things as me and my husband are wanting to start a family sometimes soon? Wow. How much are the student loans? So there's two loans. There's one federal loan that is $30,000, and then there's one private loan that is 24, but they're willing to settle for 12. When did your parents say it'd be paid off by? Like, when does that go into effect? They never said when it would be paid off. It was just always a promise that they would pay them off eventually, but I just turned 30

and I have been out of college for about eight years. And your name is on them. Yes, they are. Well, a promise with no deadline is just a wish. just hope. So we need to get some real tactical facts here of, hey, I got 42K here to pay off. You guys said you would. I'm not going to let it sit in accrue interest, knowing that this is under my name. So all the risk is on you right now. And until they pay it off, you're carrying that. Who negotiated the settlement of the private loan? You or them? I have. I have been, you know, and how it started is my parents were managing it and then ended up defaulting. So I decided to take it over and I coordinate in front all the payments. So can we trust their word at this point? It sounds like they don't have the money to pay it off even if they wanted to. Yeah, I'm starting to think that and they're getting close to retirement and they don't have a house and they're wanting to move into a house.

as well. I think that this is just going to be a dead weight around your ankles until you cut it loose by paying it off. And if they want to reimburse you, I'd be like... If one day they want to write you a $42,000 check, that'll be a sweet gift one day. And you can tell them that. Based on everything you've told us, there is slim to no chance they're going to pay this thing off.

And what's going to happen is the loan's going to balloon. It's going to create resentment towards them. and it's going to hurt the relationship even further. So I know it stinks because you believe them. You didn't take a whole lot of action because you thought, well, someone else was taking care of it. And now you're stuck going, I want to start a family. I got my own dreams and goals.

And you're stuck paying for the past now because your parents didn't make good on a promise. So you have every right to be resentful and hurt by that. But you also have responsibility to go, here's what's in my lap. I'm going to deal with it. And I'm going to take this raise that I just got and throw it all at the debt.

And that might delay a few dreams. But I don't want it to stop you from having a family either. Yeah. And, you know, my husband is in this equation now, too. I didn't meet him until after college. So, you know, I'm just trying to balance all the different relationships. Obviously, my husband is number one, though. So what do you guys make together?

Or what will you be making? I will be making 160, and my husband makes a little over 100 and some additional bonuses throughout the year. Amazing. So 260 and you got basically 42 on your side for the student loans. Do you guys have any other debts? Yes, we've just moved into a home with about a 500K mortgage and then we have two cars. One car has six grand left on it and the other one has 25.

Okay, and what are they worth? They're all pretty new. So 25K1. Yeah, we put about 5,000 down for the 25K1. Okay. Yeah, I think that you guys have a great income. I think obviously the cars are not a huge piece of your world, so I'm fine with you guys paying them off.

I don't see you need to sell any of them. But I do agree. You've got this deal with the private student loans. I think you ought to take it. Do you guys have any money saved anywhere, cash? Yeah, we have our $10,000, a merchant. emergency funds and then we have retirements and, you know, 401Ks, Roths, but don't want to touch those.

Okay. You said you have 10,000? Yeah, in emergency. So let's run this back because I think you guys are doing a lot of good work, but I think that you're not doing it in a very efficient order. And I think that George and I can help you be a little bit more efficient. Obviously around here, we teach a series of baby steps. And the reason that we teach them, the way that we teach them is because you're creating

a foundation that you can build wealth off of, that you won't have to go into debt. You won't have to tap into your retirement. You won't have to tap into credit cards. And so let's see if we can right size this with the baby steps. Obviously, Baby Step 1 is you have $1,000 saved. That's just a quick cushion between you and life. You guys have that. You're good to go. But the next baby step is Baby Step 2. And that's technically where you guys are. That's where you list all your debts smallest to largest. And you pay minimums on everything. But knock out, you know, you're your margin to knock out the smallest debt. And then when that one's done, you take the extra money, throw it on the next debt.

That is the debt snowball. And that's technically where you are. Right now you have an emergency fund, which is Baby Step 3. We suggest three to six months of expenses. You don't have quite that. But what you do have, you honestly should bump down to $1,000 as Baby Step 1 and take the other $9,000 and put it towards this debt. You could pay off one of your cars.

If you paid off the $6,000 car, how much monthly payment does that free? up for you? That monthly payment for that car is $400. Okay. So now that's how the debt snowball works. Suddenly you pay off that $6,000. You got the $400. You throw that back into the mix. And now very quickly we could probably gather up the money and pay off this settlement. How long is the settlement good for? It's every time I call them back, they seem to extend it. Oh, okay. That's good. So you've got a little bit of time. I think you can go ahead and pay off the car free of the $400, stack up the $12, $1,000. Stack up the $12. thousand and do that settlement. And then next thing you know, we're on to the $25,000 car.

And by the way, beyond that, let's talk about that. Because beyond that is baby step four, where we're investing 15% of our gross. Sounds like they're already doing that, George. For the purpose of paying off debt, we suggest temporarily pausing. Go down to zero. And for you guys, that might be for six months. It's going to be a nothing burger with your income. But think about this. You guys make 260 gross. Is that about 180 net? I would say you're probably right on that. So let's imagine that's 15K a month coming in, and let's just imagine your expenses are 9K. Okay.

Now you have 6K left over if you're doing a budget to throw out the debt. So if you do what Jade said, take your savings and pay off the 6K car loan, you're left with $67,000 total in consumer debt. If you throw $6,000 at $67K, you are done in 11 months. Woo! And that's probably not even making a lot of sacrifices. I mean, you're living pretty good on $9,000 a month. Yeah. So now let's go, okay, what if you guys said we're going to do it in six months? Well, now if we threw, you know, 9K at this thing, we're done in seven months. And so you can kind of figure out,

based on the intensity that you guys choose, how fast we want to be at a debt. But if you're telling me, I want to start a family, that's going to be my fuel to go, I'm not going to hang on to this for 12 more months. I'm going to free up all of those payments, stack up a big emergency fund. So when that baby's here, it's in a debt-free house with no money stress. And you could save up. up a lot. If you pay off all this debt in seven months, making $2.60? Yeah, you could have a nice cushy emergency fund in the next three months. So you've done really Babyseps 1 through 3 in a year, which is fabulous. Yeah, this is very helpful. I was just confused about, you know, obviously if we're wanting to start a family, do I just keep letting my parents pay, slowly pay it,

but no, you've got the money to do it. You've got the money to do it. And we're going to give you the total money makeover, it'll just reiterate what George and I have clarified here for you. And I think it'll give you some of the whys behind the what that we don't have time to explain on this call. But you guys are doing great. And what I love about this, let's picture one day, you make 160. It's an amazing income. Let's say one day you decide, you know what, this baby is, I value being home with the baby more than my 160 income. You could walk away from it. If you do it the right way, you have the margin, can you live off 100K with no debt? That's the question. Now, you got a five. You got a five, $500,000 mortgage that changes things.

So you need to figure out in the budget what that looks like. But that's the goal of the baby steps. It's not to be maniacal because Jade and George and Dave said so. It's to give you options, freedom, margins, so you can live out of your values instead of do things because you have to do it because a lender said so. That's the goal. You should not feel uncertain about investing.

And you don't have to. That's why we created investing essentials, A two-night virtual event where George Camel and I walk you through my playbook for investing and wealth planning. We'll simplify everything from 401Ks and mutual funds to passing on wealth so you can invest with confidence. Tickets start at $199. Get yours today at ramsysolutions.com slash events or click the link in the show notes. Ask Ramsey's our free AI tool that's built and trained on proven Ramsey principles. And today we're going to break down one of the questions we receive this week.

Here's the question. People talk about Roth IRAs and 401Ks. How do I know what fits my situation? Interesting. I like that. So the rule that we teach here is simple. Match beats Roth beats traditional. So that's kind of telling you your order of investing.

Obviously, if you have a 401K through your employer and there's a match, this is free money, George. I mean, you always want to get that. They give you $100. I'm taking it. That's a no-brainer. It's a magic money machine right there. Uh-huh. And then after that, you've got the Roth IRA.

We'd love for you to max that out. That's fabulous because you're paying the taxes up front, which means you or your errors won't have to pay taxes. And of course, the growth is tax-free as well. In 20-26, the limit is $7,500 or $8,000 if you're 50-plus, you've got the catch-up contribution there. And then, if you still haven't hit 15% of your income, now we can move back to any traditional accounts, like if you have a traditional 401k, you can contribute there. So that's the order. Match is the best. Let's start there. Roth is next best because you have this tax-free growth, and then the traditional side to hit that limit. So I love this plan. I know it sounds simple.

It can be confusing for some, so you can actually plug in your own numbers and ask Ramsey will walk you through the investing order for your specific situation. You can do that at Ramsey Solutions dot com or click the link in the description if you're on podcast or YouTube. Ryan is in Dallas up next. Brian, welcome to the show. Well, thank you for taking my call. I'm actually calling for some advice concerning my mom's finances. She's 94 years old. She has recently had to move into an assisted living facility.

She had been a full-time worker until age of 93, and she broke her hip. Oh, I'm sorry. She's accumulated like $500,000 in assets through that time because of being frugal with money, and she grew up during the Depression and so forth. Well, she's going to pay about $5,000 a month to live in the assisted living facility. And so she has enough to live if she were to live for 10 years in this facility. However, we're getting ready to sell her house for about $150,000. My question is, what do we do with that money?

Do we put it into her savings? Do we put it into a mutual fund? Does she gift it some to her children? Do we start trying to move money out of her account? There's going to, because her assets are too high right now, and she's not eligible for any assistance. But if that money was moved out, she would be. For example, my dad was a veteran in the Navy.

She could get some military help that way. Just seeking advice what we should do, particularly right now with that money. Are you saying for Medicaid purposes? Yes, Medicaid and veteran purposes, either one. Well, I know for Medicaid, there's a five-year look back. And so you can't just move the assets out and go, hey, look, we're poor. They are, they're looking for that. It's because people have tried to do that in the past.

And so that's not a great strategy. What I would do is just go, okay, we know, I mean, if she makes it to 104, that would be pretty incredible, right? Correct. But she's made it a lot further. She has broken both hips, broken on her neck, and she's just thriving right now. Is she a sound mind? Does she have sound mind? Yes.

Oh, yes. Well, what does she want to do? Go here. What does she want to do with the sale of the house money? She basically leaves it up to me and says you find out what's best. And so that's why I decided to call y'all. It feels like investing it, dropping it in a mutual fund so that it can have some compounding effect there and continue to pay for her life. Yeah, I might split the difference.

I wouldn't put it all in investments because if the market takes a dip, now you're ripping the money out at the wrong time to pay for her care. so I would leave a huge chunk in a high-yield savings account just as a buffer for her care. And then anything beyond that, you could invest a portion of it so that it's, you know, moving beyond just the rate of inflation at three and a half percent. So if you left, let's say, 400K in a high-yield savings and you put the other 100K plus 150 from the house sale, now you've got quarter million invested and 400K liquid. That feels like a good balance to me personally. Okay.

So don't try to move any money out of her. account that was pretty much true. I don't think it's worth trying to move it out of the estate. It's not like she's a, you know, a billionaire, and there's going to be all these estate taxes. Sure. And I don't think there's, you can look into the VA stuff. Again, I don't think there's any way you can just move money out. You know, she can gift money to you guys and avoid even the gift tax form of, you know, probably 19K a year if she's single to each kid. But I don't know that it's even worth doing that when you guys will inherit it when she one day passes. And I agree with that. That kind of thought the same thing. That's what we thought we would do at first, but I don't know that we really

have the time to move enough money out to where she can get any assistance. Yeah. Assistance wouldn't be the goal at this point. It's just how do we use this basically pile of $650,000 to make sure that we can cover her care without incurring any, you know, expenses on the kid's side. Yeah, I don't think she needs the assistance. If she needed it, that'd be one thing, but. And she's probably getting better care right now with her assets than she would be with assistance. Well, and that's why She's talked about that she worked this long to be able to have good care if she was able to live this long. So what you're saying is take $150,000 maybe divided up, put part of it in high yield and part of it in like a mutual fund. She already has some mutual funds.

Okay, great. Yeah, I was thinking maybe if you split it, $400K liquid, $250K invested, and I would connect with a smartvestor pro at ramesesolutions.com, because they can walk you through all of this for your specific situation. they know Texas law, and so they can walk you through all of the appropriate ways to maximize these assets and make sure that we leave the legacy in the right way with the state planning purposes. Okay, thank you. So much. I appreciate your advice. Absolutely.

Thanks for the call, Brian. Man, that's impressive at 94. I know. She's sharper than I, yeah. Oh, gosh. She'll outlive me at this point. Wow. All right.

Anna is in Raleigh, North Carolina up next. What's going on? Hello. How are you guys doing? Doing great. I just had a quick question. Me and my husband are under contract for a new build townhome that will be done in November. We are pre-approved through Churchill mortgage, which is great,

but the builder's preferred lender is actually offering $15,000 in closing costs, but they are asking us to self-report our utilities and our rent to generate a credit score. And I just wasn't sure about that since it wasn't technically taking on debt, but I didn't want to mess around before. we were trying to get a load and everything. So just curious you guys' thoughts. So they want you to turn in those kind of auxiliary things to generate, because your credit score right now is zero?

Yes, it's undeterminable. They want us to report it to the credit bureaus, which is interesting. I was asking if we could just send it over to him, and he was not, like, saying that was okay. Well, the problem with that is there's no guarantee that's going to give you a good credit score. It might cause something to pop up.

And I would hate if it was a mediocre credit score, because then Churchill is going to be looking at that. If you have a credit score, it has to be used. It's a stupid rule, but that's the rule. So you either have to have no credit score or a good to great one. And so I would look into this to make sure that if you do self-report, that it will give you an actual good score. And I would also look into these closing costs to figure out,

is this even a good deal? Because they could be screwing you in other ways. Because they always entice you with. Use our preferred lender, and we'll give you this kickback. But that doesn't mean it's a good deal for you guys. So I would look at the numbers, get an estimate from Churchill, and look over those numbers versus the closing cost with this other lender. Okay. That way, I appreciate it.

Thank you guys. Yeah, absolutely. It's a great question. That is. What they're talking about here is something called manual underwriting or a no score alone. I've done this personally. People are shocked every time I say it. We've done it too.

It's not that big of a deal. It's like a magic trick. They're like, wait, you did what? You can get a mortgage without having a credit score. Now, here's where people get it twisted. You cannot have a low score. This does not circumvent a bad credit score. So I get these messages going, hey, I heard you talk about these no score loans. How do I do that? I have a 400 credit score. I go, no, you can't, you need to get rid of it completely by becoming completely debt free, having no open trade lines whatsoever, no open credit cards, and after six to 12 months,

your credit score will become indeterminable. So at that point, you're going, well, how do I get a score? Lenders are looking for this. Not all of them. And Churchill Mortgage, who, we, we've had as a partner for, you know, decades and decades now, they are, they specialize in these types of loans because they help Ramsey fans get a mortgage without a credit score. So you do need things like a tax return. You need to show utility bills, rental history, on-time payments, all of that. But they essentially have a real person, look at all the numbers and go, yep, they qualify with the loan.

They use trade lines, your phone bill, utilities, electric to take the place of what other people would use credit for. Which, by the way, is exactly how it happened before the 90s. That's true. When the credit score came into existence. Yes. So your grandma didn't have to deal with this. They just went, I know, Jane, she's great.

Look, they have income. Give them the loan. I pine for us to go back to a time as simple as that. I know that's right. Where if you just have money and income, they'll give you the loan. That's good enough. If you pay taxes to the IRS every quarter or run a small business and you're not using a CPA, what are you doing?

The more complicated your tax situation gets, the more you need expert. help. With a Ramsey trusted tax pro, you can get top-notch service year-round for payroll, bookkeeping, quarterly tax payments, and of course, tax filing. Let an expert take the stress off your shoulders. Go to Ramsey Solutions.com slash tax to find a Ramsey trusted tax pro today. That's ramsysolutions.com slash tax. Our scripture of the day, Proverbs 12, 15. The way of a fool is right in his own eyes, but a wise man listens to advice. Ken Blanchard said, none of us is as smart as all of us. There we go. There is wisdom in numbers and community. Multitude. Hey, buying or selling your home is high stakes because one bad deal could cost you tens of thousands and you don't want

to overpay for your next house or sell your current home for less than it's worth. And that's where a Ramsey trusted agent comes into play. We can connect you with vetted real estate agents who have the experience to guide you step by step to make smart decisions instead of expensive mistakes. Connecting is easy. You can go to ramsysolutions.com slash agent, compare agent profiles, interview your top choices, and pick the right one for you. That's ramsysolutions.com slash agent or click the link in the description if you're on YouTube or podcast. Kyle is in Charleston, South Carolina up next. Kyle, welcome to the show. Hey, thank you for having me. So my wife and I are both real estate agents. We've done about 180 this year

on track to do probably 360 by the end of the year. Wow. No debt except that. Way to go. No, thank you. Thank you. No debt except the mortgage. I wanted to know about investing.

So we have enough right now to max out both our Roth IRAs that would be, you know, starting our Roth IRAs. And then, you know, some on top of that. Which you'll have to do backdoor Roth IRAs at your income level. Okay. Yeah. So know that. There is an income threshold to do the Roth IRA, but there is a very legal loophole called a backdoor Roth IRA, where essentially you make an after-tax contribution to a traditional IRA

and then immediately convert it. Okay. So look into that when you're ready. And I guess that kind of leads me to my next question. We're both 28, and I'm wondering, should we talk to a smart investor because I've talked to some of them just because I'm not good with all this stuff, I'm new to all this, or should we do it at our own since it's just a Roth IRA? Well, you're going to be doing more than just a Roth IRA because the way we teach,

we want you to invest 15% of your gross income, which making $360,000 a year, you could be putting away like $54,000 per year. So the two backdoor Roths will get you to 15K. We've got a ways to go. And obviously you guys are basically self-employed? Yeah, pretty much. Do you run it as an official business

to where you could open a solo 401K? It's an LLC right now. It's going to be converted to an escort for the next tax year, though. Okay, I would contact that SmartVestor Pro and ask about a solo 401K. If it's just you and your wife, you can open one of those. And what's really cool is you can contribute as the employer and the employee. So you can contribute way more than I can in that 401K. And that will really help you guys out.

And you can even open a solo Roth 401K to sock away all that money. And then you can also, beyond that, like let's say you guys wanted to have some flexible spending money or a bridge account. Let's say you want to retire at 55. You want to access money before 60. You can just open a taxable brokerage account and invest in there in some index funds and kind of create a nice little pile of money as well. And should we be investing, I guess should we be that 401K that you mentioned, how much is there a max on that that we can contribute as employer and employee? I think the lifetime match is somewhere around 54,000, which is right around where you would be after you do the, Roth. Double check that for me because it's always changing, but there's a lot that you can put in there.

Yeah, the total contributions are capped at 72. 72, there you go. So you can contribute your 24-5, just like any old employee, plus 25% of compensation on the employer side. Which is pretty great. Okay, and then, yeah, that is good. And then after all that stuff, is there anything else we should be investing in other than that? I know you mentioned brokerage accounts or mutual funds or... The other thing is an HSA, if you guys have a high deductible health plan. I don't know what you guys do for health insurance right now. What do you have? We actually don't.

We don't have health insurance right. Oh, boy. We got to get that. All right. New homework assignment that just flew to the top of the list. I would contact Health Trust Financial. They can help you shop for insurance if you're self-employed to find you the best deal. And the website for that is healthtrustfinancial.com.

That's a big one. I mean, health insurance, like medical bills are one of the leading causes of bankruptcy. And so that's really, you're exposed right now. So as you're building wealth, that's the offense part. You got to play defense. You want to have the right types of insurance in place. And health insurance is, that's the top of the list. So beyond that, you should be paying off the mortgage.

You guys said you own a home? Yes, we do. What's left on that? 2.2.20, I think. Fantastic. So let's say you invest 15%. That's 54,000. and you still had money left over,

let's use a big portion of that to start attacking the mortgage and set a very specific goal of, hey, if we put five grand on that a month, that's 60K a year, and within four years, this thing's completely gone. Okay, gotcha. And what's the, I mean, because we have, our thing, we've talked about paying off the home early a lot,

and our thing is, you know, it's at a, and I know you all here this a lot, it's a lot of two and a half percent interest rate. Yeah, I've yet to convince any real estate agent to pay off their mortgage. So if you do this, I will have a trophy in my house. But yeah, that's the thing. People look at the paper and go, well, two and a half percent, I can make more in a high-yield savings account.

The truth is, number one, we can only have that discussion if you actually have the full amount of the mortgage sitting in savings, which most people don't. And number two, you haven't factored in the interest savings. You have a forced savings plan here with a forced interest rate. So that two and a half percent, you're basically making that money by paying it off. And now you can invest that payment. and people rarely factor that into play on top of, hey, what if your wife, let's see you guys have a kid

and your wife decides to stay home? Not having a mortgage payment would really help out in lowering your expenses. So it also gives you flexibility on top of the piece, the freedom. He said, I'll consider it. So just consider it.

Again, I flew by that because I went, Kyle, this might fall on deaf ears here on some rocky ground, but it was worth the shot because that is the truth. It's exactly what I did, Kyle, and I have zero regret. I think my mortgage was out like, I don't know, a little over 3%.

And my friends were like, come on, dude, you can make so much. Life is not about a spread once you have a family. It's about, how can I just live peacefully, simply, not worried about money? So when my wife decided she wanted to stay home, we barely looked at the budget. Went, yep, all right, go for it. So that's the advice there. That's the baby steps. You invest 15% until the house has paid off.

Then you can start really going ham. You could invest 30, 40, 50% of your income and start to go beyond into those. taxable brokerage accounts as well. Okay, got it. And one last question before I go. They, um, after we, you know, say we do pay off the house after that and we start saving up, we want to look at, um, either, you know, fix or uppers or investing properties or land. What's the all the opinions on investing in those type of things? Love it. I mean, Dave Ramsey has a whole big portion of his net worth tied up in real estate. He's a big fan of it, but there's a very specific way to do it that again, real estate agents rarely do. And that is save up and pay cash.

Right, and that's how we would do it. The only mortgage we want, I guess, is our own. And then it becomes, hey, what kind of hassle do you want? Do you like the fixer upper life where it's sort of temporary but kind of high stress, higher stakes, and then you make some profit? Or do you want the sort of landlord life where, hey, we bought a property, we got a good deal on it, here's what we know we could get in rent. And when it's paid for, the cash flow is extra sweet. Are you guys covering real estate on investing essentials? We are.

Okay, this is for Kyle. So at night one of our investing essentials event, Kyle, it's happening September 1st and 2nd, Dave Ramsey and I are unpacking his wealth playbook. In the end of night one, we're going to cover real estate investing. So I want you specifically to tune into that and join us if you're willing. Yeah, even the first night, too, because you had all those questions about investing. I think that's just the perfect event for you. Oh, I love this, Kyle.

Join us. You just got a free $200 ticket. So don't say it in doing anything nice for you. Awesome. Even if you hated the advice, you got a free ticket out of it. Thanks for the call, man. Thank you. You're doing great.

Great questions. I cannot imagine, Jay, that like it 28, making $360,000 crushing it in real estate, and having no consumer debt. I know they're going to be wealthy, wealthy, wealthy. Like, I lit up like a Christmas tree to be able to talk about investing because they have the margin to invest $54,000 a year. Unheard of. They're going to have so much money.

They're going to be buying. at properties left and right like it's monopoly yeah but you know they they he started out saying something that I hear so much I think people are like oh I just want to max out my Roth IRA and it kind of in their minds it's like that's it that's it and don't get me wrong I think that's a really good thing to aspire to but the truth is you want to hit 15% of that gross and if that puts you over the $7,500 limit that's a good thing so if you're married making over 100k you got to go beyond just too Roth IRAs yeah you got to get into not just your Roth IRA but now if you have an employer based 401k, go there.

Yeah, and the HSA, that's why I mentioned it, is an awesome place to also invest. Kind of a life hack on that one, triple track tax advantage. All right, that puts this show in the books. Remember, there's ultimately only one way to financial peace, and that's to walk daily with the Prince of Peace, Christ Jesus.