The Ramsey Show - “My Husband Has Been Cheating On Me For 30 Years”

Episode Date: November 25, 2025

🤔 ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Think you’re good with money? Take our Money in America quiz!⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Rachel Cruze and Dr. John Delony answer your questions and discuss: "Should I leave my husband who cheats on me and won't contribute to our family's finances?" "We keep blowing through our emergency fund and now we're back in debt. How do we stop this?" "Should we stop tithing in Baby Step 2?" "Should I pay cash for my next semester or can I keep some money in order to live a little?" "Should my parents use $800,000 of their investments to get my sister out of her financial situation?" "I'm in $60,000 of debt, how do I get out of this?" "Should I do my Roth conversion all at once?" "Can we afford to travel to Spain for a wedding?" "I feel like my career that I love is not enough for me to provide for my family. What should I do to increase my income?" Next Steps:⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 📞 Have a question for the show? Call 888-825-5225 weekdays from 2–5 p.m. ET or⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠send us an email⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 🛒 ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Black Friday deals won't last⁠⁠, ⁠⁠get gifts for as low as $6.99⁠⁠⁠⁠ 💵 ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Start your free budget today by downloading the EveryDollar app⁠⁠⁠ 🏠 Find a Ramsey Trusted Real Estate Agent Connect With Our Sponsors: Stop paying more and start shopping smarter at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ALDI⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Get 10% off your first month of⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ BetterHelp⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Go to ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Boost Mobile⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ to switch today Go to⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Casper Sleep⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ and use promo code RAMSEY to learn more Learn more about⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Christian Healthcare Ministries⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠. Get started today with⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Churchill Mortgage⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Get 20% off when you join ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠DeleteMe⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Go to⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ FAIRWINDS Credit Union⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ for an exclusive account bundle Debt collectors hassling you? Take back control of your life at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Guardian Litigation Group⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Find top health insurance plans at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Health Trust Financial⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Use code RAMSEY to save 20% at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Mama Bear Legal Forms⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Visit⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ NetSuite⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ today to learn more For more information, go to ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠SimpliSafe⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Get started with ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠YRefy⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ or call 844-2-RAMSEY Visit⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Zander Insurance⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ for your free instant quote today Explore more from Ramsey Network: 💸 ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠The Ramsey Show Highlights⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 🧠 ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠The Dr. John Delony Show⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 🍸 ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Smart Money Happy Hour⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 💡 ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠The Rachel Cruze Show⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 💰 ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠George Kamel⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 🪑 ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Front Row Seat with Ken Coleman⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 📈 ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠EntreLeadership⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Ramsey Solutions Privacy Policy⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

brought to you by the every dollar app start budgeting for free today normal is broken common sense is weird so we're here to help you transform your life from the ramsie network and the fair wins credit union studio this is the ramsie show and i'm rachel cruise hosting this hour with dr john deloney and we are answering your questions about life, money, career relationships, anything, and everything. So give us a call at AAA 825-2-2-2-5. All right, first up in Vancouver, we have Sarah on the line. Hi, Sarah. Hi.

Hi, welcome to the show. Thank you for having me. Absolutely. How can we help today? So I've been married for 46 years, and my husband does not contribute financially to the household finances. And he's also not healthy. And I recently found out that he's been having an affair probably for about 30 years. Oh my gosh. Which has been able to go on because he's had a cell phone for a long time and he worked shift work, which made it really convenient to sneak around.

So I'm wondering, is it worth divorcing at this point in time or do I just wait until he dies because he's not taking care of himself health-wise? Holy smokes. Gosh, Sarah. Okay. So when you say he was having an affair for 30 years. Was it with the same woman, or it's been often on multiple? So he's been running two lives. Well, I believe there's been others, but I believe there's been one very long term. Wow. So he's doing shift work, but he's not contributing.

So is his money go to him, and then you take care of the house? Yes. I mean, you've been to vote. He did pay for the mortgage on the house, and I paid for everything else. But then once the mortgage was paid for, which has been more than 20 years ago, he's quit paying for anything let me let me reframe this little bit

you've been divorced for 30 years yeah you all just have been living in the same house yep yeah and I guess with all due respect I can't I can't give you that answer

because I can't carry the weight for you of what you have to do next you know what I'm saying Like, it's such a huge call. You have to make that call. Yeah. But Rachel and I can sit with you and tell you that you're not crazy. But you've been feeling this for three decades, though, right?

I thought there was something going on a long time ago, and when I confront him, he just said, no, we're friends. And then, of course, again, because of the shift work and cell phones, you know, they're able to sneak around. When did you find all this out, Sarah? when I came home from work more than a year ago I came home from work and I found him his girlfriend in our backyard Wow All right so here's the part that

Nobody will tell you about finding out You're being cheated on And by the way you've been cheated on financially You've been cheated on romantically Your whole marriage has been based in deception One of the things that nobody ever talks about Is that Scary, terrifying realization

that you don't trust you either because part of you knew something wasn't right and so what I can tell I have no proof I know I know but there's that intuition there's that something is off with this person that I pledged my life to

and over time it's like man I think I'm crazy and he confirms it right yeah you're crazy you don't know and what's your money that's your grocery like and it just you slowly go along with that and all of a sudden you find yourself three decades removed from that voice inside your chest, right? And so what I would tell you is the way I can help right here is for the first time

to actually sit down and be honest with you about what you know. And that's scary to do because you either have to choose, well, this is my life and I'm just going to sit here on the pile of rubble that was the marriage I thought I had, or I'm going to be about excavating this thing and building something new. And in your case, by yourself. But there's a reality to that. You know what I'm saying? And do you want this marriage to be healed, Sarah? Like if he came to you and said, I want to do the work and I want to, I want to repair this, would you want that or are you pretty much out? I'm out. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Which. And he's been out. blame you. Yeah. So from a, from the financial part of this era, yeah, I would be keeping everything

separate. And even if you wanted repair, I would still say keep it separate until there's a level of trust and healing within the marriage because the money's the symptom, right? You guys, it's a, it's a, it never will be because he's not healthy enough to, to do anything. Yeah. So is he not working anymore? No, he's retired. Okay. So, so why now? This happened. This all came to light a year ago confirming what you've known for years why now um good question i guess because i feel stuck what does that mean do i leave do i stay do i walk away from half of everything i've invested in like when i say invested in i mean like doing a lot of the work And then walking away from whatever pension he has and not being able to, you know, receive any of those benefits after all these decades.

Are you going to? Or are you sure that he's not leaving him to his mistress of 30 years? Well, I saw his will recently, and it has not been changed. Okay. But I do think there's a bank account that she might be. accessing, but I have no proof that either. Okay, maybe for the first time begin to trust yourself.

Okay. And it's worth asking questions. And the other question you have to ask yourself is, are you going to be able to sleep at night? If you leave him and he dies next month, are you going to carry that with you? No. It's not a reason to stay. You're like,

nope, nope. Like, that's not a reason to stay. Because I've dealt with some of this stuff. Yeah. And I've made decisions already. But it's that last final piece about saying or leaving. Yeah. I think anybody in our position, in Rachel Lines's position, that would tell you, yes, you need to go do this, is taking a really powerful and important decision away from you. And we're not going to do that.

But we can call it out and both of us will confirm. But I think you know, Sarah. Yeah. This is unhealthy. You've already made your choice. voice, as my boss, A. Ramsey always says, when your spirit leaves, let your body leave, too. That's a good one. But, and I think this is, this is why I'm hesitant just to say, yeah, you need to run, because

it's easy for me to say that, but that comes with very real financial implications, living arrangement implications, health, it comes at a cost that you're going to have to bear regardless of what you do. And so I can tell you, you're not crazy. You've been cheated on multiple times for a long, long time and dragged behind this marriage. I want you to reestablish yourself as somebody you can trust. And what I mean by that is, do you trust yourself not to squash that inner voice anymore? Do you trust yourself to write things down on a piece of paper and say, here's the reality with which I live in? And do you trust yourself to go get to professionals and friends and spiritual advisors next to you in this next season,

regardless of what you do, if you choose to stay or if you choose to go. It's just a heavy path. Yeah, and not doing it alone to your point. Having people around you to help wade through some of these decisions is such a gift. Yeah, I'm hardbroken for you. Sarah, we're so sorry. We're so sorry. If you run a small business or work for yourself, health insurance isn't just a personal choice, it's a business decision.

And the wrong plan can wreck your budget fast. Right now is health insurance open enrollment. And if you want your coverage to start by the first. of the year, you've got to sign up by December 15th, and I recommend using Health Trust Financial to help make your game plan. They've helped families and business owners for over 20 years, and they're the only Ramsey trusted health insurance advisors. Health Trust financial advisors cut through the confusion, explain your options in plain English, and help you find a plan that fits your life stage and budget. Most Health Trust financial clients say, hundreds of dollars a month, money you could reinvest into your business. So don't roll the dice this year. Protect your family, your business, and your financial future with the right

plan. Go to health trustfinancial.com before December 15th to get started. That's health trustfinancial.com. Up next, we have Sean in Fresno, California. Hi, Sean. Welcome to the show. Good morning. Thank you so much for having me. We appreciate it.

Absolutely. How can we help today? All right. So my wife and I spent the last couple years completely exhausting our emergency funds. We've paid about $20,000 in federal taxes over the last two years. in unforeseen tax bill, federal tax bills, because my wife's paychecks did not have any federal taxes taken out by the HR department. Even after we had talked to them about it, they missed it again, and we missed it too.

Okay, I was going to say, because you would know, I mean, when you get your paycheck to know this is what I made. Exactly. But you didn't, but you all didn't catch it. There was like a couple months, yeah, there was a couple months that went by where they were taking it out, and then it stopped for some reason or it changed. their HR department kind of, I don't know, and it was on us. Yeah, yeah, sure. That's bizarre. Yeah.

We never heard of that happen. That's frustrating. It was wild and yes, absolutely frustrating. We've also, so we live out in the country, and so that incurred some country costs. So this year has been the year where it hasn't been enjoyable to live out in the country. Our solar's gone out. Our wells needed fixed. Our cars have needed about $8,000 of repairs over the last two years as well.

So anyway, we have spent about $40,000 of our. emergency fund over the last two years and has ended up where I have a loan of about $7,000 left against my 403B. We are also still $100,000 in about, oh, and $95,000 worth of debt in both cars as well as student loans. And so we had started our marriage off about nine years ago, hardcore and Ramsey, and then we got lazy. And so we're trying to get back on track. And so I'm very thankful we had an emergency fund and it served its purpose. But we're trying to get back on track. And it just feels like we cannot get back. We keep exhausting our emergency fund and we just keep getting shelled. So I was just calling, I need some wiser wisdom than

I have. Yeah. How much you guys make a year? together about 185 okay is that before tax that is before tax yeah or before the taxes that weren't paid until later yeah okay i got you i got you um i think on monthly basis we bring it in um about 12000 post taxed okay okay perfect and out of the 95000 of debt and you said student loans and cars how much it's break those down for me what how much is the student loans and how much are the cars? 50 is in cars. 51 is in cars

and the rest is in student loans. Okay. The cars, two different cars? Two different cars. What are the ones on those? So one is 36 and the other one is 15. Okay.

So we, I have a third car. We have a third car. I have a truck that's completely paid for cash. But I also commute for work. And so getting 10 miles a gallon was killing. I was spending $600, $700 a month in gas. How far is your work? So I actually got an electric, yeah, to go to work.

So I got an electric car. I took out a loan on that. So that's the $15,000 on an electric car. But I charge for free at work. So my gas money is now. Yeah, but how much is your car payment? $350 a month. Okay.

You're just tripping a... Yeah. So, okay, so, yeah, some decisions I feel like need to be made. Where you guys are living, considering how much it just costs you, solar, the well, I mean, all of it, are all of those pretty sustainable going forward that you foresee? Or are they still like, yeah, we're probably going to have to fix that again? I think we're good for now for the next few years. but, I mean, those costs or those different things just pop up randomly. Sure, which they would for any homeowner, even if you're not in the country.

I'm just trying to figure out, Sean, you know, there's a little bit of this, like, we just want to be able to do everything we want. We want to live where we want to live. And so that means we have to drive so far to work, which means we have to get an electric. Like, there's a reality to life, and sometimes you have to pick and choose to make it make sense, if you will. And I'm not saying you'll have to, like, move by any means. saying having these thoughts that, you know, you guys are kind of used to doing a little bit what you want. I mean, to a degree. I mean, there's a little bit of like, yeah, we're going to just kind of keep moving. So everything you do going forward has to be at a 180 degree difference.

Like what you would normally do, I would stop and be like, okay, is this really the wisest decision right now? Or you have to live on a principle of, let me put it this way. None of this will change unless one of the chief principles of your home is we do not borrow money. Because I had a long commute in an old banged up truck that I made for five years and that putting gas in it was expensive.

But my wife and I had a anchor into concrete commitment we don't borrow money on depreciating assets especially. I would on a mortgage, but not on a car. And so that was never even in the cards and we would curse the gas bill every month but we're not going to go buy another car under the guys. Like, we're not going to rob Peter to pay Paul, right? Right.

And that's kind of where I'm feeling like, yeah, I guess it makes sense. Like, I've made it and made sense. There you know. I'm saving this money on gas. Right. It's justification is what it is. I don't want a car loan. I don't want a car loan.

And like, I have my truck and I love having a truck because I do use it as a truck. Sure. I don't work on the farm for the farm, but it's nice to have a, It's another tool on a tool belt, right? And it's like a convenience thing. It is. And I think what my truck, I don't know. Yeah.

And what John's saying, and I think what you have to get to before we even get to the baby steps of the $1,000 and you pay off the debt, is there has to be a value system conversation in your household, John. There is. That there is a principle that we do not, we do not spend more than what we make. If we can't pay cash for this, we can't afford it. Regardless, it's fixing the well, whatever it is. We are not going to borrow money. So what does that mean? If that is like a hard line in the sand, what happens is other options come up, harder options,

not as fun options, but options that you're able to actually have where when debt is an immediate answer because it just fixes the urgency of the situation, then you wake up, you're like, oh my gosh, look at all the payments we have, and this is how we've gotten here. So what the no debt policy does is it forces you to be creative to look at other options because there are always other options. Yeah, they come fix your well. I have a well out in the country and they come fix it and it costs eight grand or whatever and you say, hey, I can give you four right now and the next 30 day cycle. I'm going to give you the other four when the work is completed. And we're not going out to eat. We're doing nothing because we have $4,000. We've got to save up this month and I may have to work extra to get that bill. But in three weeks we're going to figure it out.

But we have water. Right. So like it's that kind of and it sounds extreme from how you probably making decisions. But it's the way you have to do it. So yeah. So if I were you guys, Sean, I would. I would sit down. Is your wife pretty on board? Is she feeling the stress and attention to? 100%. Okay. Yeah. So for you guys, we're going to, if you stay on the line before, don't hang up. So when we get done with the call, Christian's going to pick up. And we're going to give you every dollar for a year. And I want you guys to sit down and do a budget. Do the every dollar budget because what it's going to expose is how much spending is happening without you even realizing it. There's $12,000 where it's going. And so what you're going to see, and I want you guys to cut everything, but food, shall, utility, transportation, insurance, like the things that you have to have, everything else, Target runs, out to eat, I mean, literally subscriptions. I'm not kidding. Just say, if we did nothing

but what we have to have to survive, how much would be left. And then you guys got to look at that number and say, okay, there's that number per month. And I don't know what it is, $6,000, whatever it is. And if we did this for X amount of months, how quickly could we pay this dead off. Now, what if we sold the $36,000 car for $32,000? Maybe we had to take out a loan because it's underwater for a little bit. Okay, well, let's do that math. That $6,000, play it out, play it out and say, well, we don't want to do that. That seems too extreme. Okay, maybe it's $4,000. Whatever it is, you guys have to run out scenarios of your reality. But what I would push you to do is to do this in a short amount of time because you guys make great money. And I know

you're in California and all the taxes and everything. But, you know, there's something to be said doing a really strict plan and you and your wife saying we're doing this for a period of time and it may be a year it may be two years and it may be you work an extra she finds some extra income but getting out of this debt for you guys i think it's going to be a massive win but you have to do it so intentionally and so sacrificial and y'all haven't felt that in a while so it's going to be uncomfortable but that to me is the path forward for you guys so hang on the line christian's going to pick up and we're rooting for y'all i mean you can do it you guys are smart people you got this

This show is sponsored by Better Help. This time of year can be tough. So make sure you check in on your friends, checking on your loved ones, and reconnect with people you haven't talked to in a while. called one of my childhood friends. We had a great conversation. It was awesome. The conversation was hard, but we also laughed a little bit too. It can take a little courage to just send that message or go grab coffee or even get in the car and drive across the country to reach out with a

friend. And reaching out for a therapist can also feel hard, but often it's worth it. And if you're thinking about therapy, I recommend calling my friends a better help. BetterHelp has over 30,000 therapist. They're the largest online therapy provider in the world, and they've served over five million people globally, and they have an average rating of 4.9 stars out of five. It's totally online, and it's easy to fit into your schedule. To get started, just answer a few simple questions, and BetterHelp will connect you with the licensed therapist, and if it's not the right fit, you can switch therapists at any time for no extra cost. This month, don't wait to reach out. Visit BetterHelp.com slash Ramsey to get 10% off.

your first month. That's BetterHelp, H-E-L-P.com slash Ramsey. Up next, we have James in Dallas. Hi, James. James, are you there? Hi, welcome to the show. Hey, thanks for having me. Absolutely. How can we help? Hey, so my wife and I are on Baby Step 2, so we're working on paying down all of our dead other than a mortgage. We've been, you know, we're on a plan, so we're on a budget. we're Christians, and, you know, I've got to be honest, one of the things that we've really struggled with over the years is, I don't know, I guess I'm newer in my faith, maybe three or four years in, and we've never been great tithers, but now that, you know, I'm getting, one of the reasons

wanting to get out debt is because there's convicted about, you know, God tells us not to carry debt. And so my question is, should, while we're just really trying to attack all these debts, should we be tithing? Or should we just be laser focused on nothing but essentials and paying down the debt? Yeah, it's a great question. I feel like one that we get a lot because I think people are really motivated to do whatever goal they're in, whether it's getting out of debt or saving the emergency fund. But the way we kind of approach money, the way I see money, is it's very holistic and it's

very much a picture of who we are as people. There's something about our character, what we believe, our value system at which then money is then handled, right? So people that don't care about debt or whatever, like just want to have an urgent, you know, get whatever they want in the moment, that's right there, you know, whatever, no worries. But if you have a value system at which probably what you were feeling from a spiritual element, even an emotional, psychological element of carrying debt, it's very heavy. And you feel that. And you're like, yep, that's why God says no. Because when you owe someone something, it changes your life.

it changes the reason you go to work, it changes so much. So you would be free of that. And so I would put giving in that same light, James, from we could go the spiritual side or even the non-spiritual side. But for me, it's, you know, the giving side. I don't want it ever to be legalistic because I don't think that was the heart of God. I think the heart of God is when he talks about how to give, how to sacrifice, when Jesus gives us examples of that all through the New Testament. What that looks like is living life on the selfless. side of the spectrum. And we live in a world that is so selfish, right? And I think there's something to be said when we use our money as a tool, as a reflection of who we are and our character

and our value system, there's something holistically good about that. And so for me, that's giving. So yes, is it a commandment? Is there scripture around it? Absolutely. And as a Christian, like you said, but that can naturally kind of lean in a legalistic sense. And giving is like the one area of money that I'm like, I don't want you to be legalistic. I think you miss the heart of God in that. And I'm definitely not on the prosperity side that if you give, you know, there's going to be a brand new BMW sitting in your driveway. You know, I don't think that's true either. But there's something about living a selfless life and knowing the ownership of our money is gods and we're just the managers. We believe that as Christians. And when you actually physically

live that out, it changes who you are. It changes your view about money. It changes how tightly wound and controlled you are by it, it releases so much. And that's what really giving does. Not only helps what you're giving to, obviously, but who we are as people handling money. It's just a release that I think is really, really impactful to us as people, if that makes sense. So that's a long way to say, yes, I would be tithing and giving regardless of where you are financially. And I write in my book, Know Yourself, Know Your Money about, you know, give a little until you can give a lot, right? So for some people, again, we teach 10% at Ramsey if you do the every dollar budget, literally at the top, the very first category is giving, and it's 10%

is set there. So that is something that, you know, I stick by, but again, I don't want it in a legalistic sense. Yeah, no, that makes sense. It's a heart issue and wanting to, you know, that's the difference between the Old Testament, the New Testament is you should give what you feel led to and some of that. Well, and whether you're a Christian or not, I think as a culture, we could all use a reclamation of an understanding that money is a spiritual issue and work is a spiritual issue and your relationship with your wife is a spiritual issue. If you're a person of, if you're a Christian, then it goes with that lens on, right? But these things are all bigger than us. And I think culturally, we've reduced it into what, can I get for me and I like my personal belief is that is was us sitting at the top of the

mountain and that was the slide off the hill right and there's something powerful about saying reminding yourself every month or every two weeks when you get paid this is not my money and more importantly I am not the number on this paycheck I'm a person who fill in the blank I'm a person who gives I'm a person who is generous I'm the person who sees that exhausted exhausted waitress and I overtip her or I overtip him because that's who I am is I keep my eyes open for others, right? It makes it a, I keep using the word spiritual, not to be Christian, but it is a, it's an ethos with which you carry yourself in the world. And so again, like Rachel said, if you, if you don't have groceries, right, there's something about being sacrificial

that might not be this percentage, but it, there is something powerful about starting every check with this part is for others. You get what I'm saying? Yeah, totally. And I'm with Rachel. I will transform how you move throughout the world. Yeah, and I think to the money journey that everyone's on, which is more of a marathon than a sprint, this is all not, you know, you don't just, you know, do things with money for two years, then you're fine the rest of your life. It is an ongoing daily decision of what you choose to do. And as you earn more and as you guys get out of debt, James, and as you guys invest and you really do start to build wealth, because that's mathematically what's going to start to happen. We always say, Dave always says it, but it's so true,

you know, money is a magnifying glass. It makes you more of what you already are. And if you can create habits now when you don't feel like you guys have a lot or you have this big goal that is so noble and so great, but you still are doing things that are changing who you are, what is being formed today is the James that's going to be carried through the wealth building. And there's a challenge there. I mean, I think there's something really beautiful to say that that of like, man, you know, we could get out of debt, you know, I mean, honestly, what, two or three months faster maybe if we didn't get, you know, you could, it's, but at the end of the day, the change that happens within you guys as you are giving and you're sacrificing is worth maybe that

two to three months of being in debt longer because it's changing who you are that's going to carry you through this entire journey of money. James, can I give you an exercise I would love you to do with your wife? Sure. I want you all to go away. This weekend and y'all are in babysit up too so don't go spend a trillion dollars but um after thanksgiving if y'all have a chance to get away with just two of you maybe it's an hour maybe it's three hours or whatever go for a walk go for a hike sitting from the fire whatever come up with five to ten we are statements so let's pretend your last name is smith the smiths are people who and let those values frame your action steps not the other way around because so many of us live when

When I get X, Y, or Z, then I'll become, and what you find is that's not how the world works. But we, the Smiths are people who are generous, period. Well, that's going to frame everything. The Smiths are people who value a relationship with God. That's going to frame it. The Smiths are people who always invite people over to their house. When you have millions of dollars in the bank, that just means your table will be way bigger. You get what I'm saying?

That makes a lot of times. But if you try to go through life, plan first and identity later, that's a recipe for, this year I'm going to lose 40 pounds and whatever, you're never going to stick to that. If you wake up January 1 of 2026 and say, this year, I'm going to be a person who is a good steward of his body. Well, that's going to frame how you sleep, how you take days off, how hard you exercise, how you exercise when you're tired, because I'm a guy who takes care of his body. What was the book about how? It's James Clear. James Clear. That's right. I was going to say there's something about that identity that he

talked about yes. Yeah, most people try to go into life change with habits first. I'm going to wake up every day 45 minutes and always you run out of gas on that. But if you start with I'm a person who or we are a family who, then you have people over when you're tired. You have, you give money when you don't feel like you've got enough that month and you're like, you know what? We can do without ice cream or we can do without tipping or we can do without. It just changes who you are. So get together and come up with those identity statements and then reverse engineer the actions. steps that are going to back up your new identity. They've got USDA choice meats like beef, pork, and even your turkey, along with fresh produce, holiday desserts, and more.

And you'll find all of them at the lowest prices of any national grocery store. A family of four can save up to $4,000 a year by shopping at Aldi. You don't need a membership or some loyalty app either. So stop overpaying this holiday season. Go to aldi.us to find a store near you. That's aldi.us. Savings based on regional analysis of Aldi versus select competitors. Prices may vary by location, product availability, and the market.

The all-new every dollar is here, and now it's way more than just our world-class budgeting app. There are so many advanced features that make winning with money and your progress to actually see you win with money so much faster. The average person finds thousands of dollars of margin in just the first 15 minutes. So start every dollar for free today. You can get it in the app store or Google Play. All right, let's go to Oren in Maryland. Hey, welcome to the show. Thank you.

Absolutely. How can we help today? So I am basically a college student. I am currently going to community college. Do not go with the four-year because it was just too much. So right now my situation, I'm about halfway done. I definitely did not apply myself to scholarships like I should have. And I took a semester break just to work.

work and just to kind of, you know, absorb and try to reach out for resources. So I'll be going to school for an extra year. But I did find a lot of resources, a lot of scholarships. I talked to a lot of people. I'm currently about $12,000 in debt. And then obviously, if I were to continue, I have about $27 more credits. We're talking about $200 a credit. So my question for you is, is that should I pay cash? because I'm currently working part-time. Should I pay cash? I have the money to pay for a semester now. Should I pay cash for the semester and don't worry about it?

Or should I kind of, I know you guys hate this term, but live a little. We don't hate that term. I know, I know. Have you met Rachel Cruz? She lives a lot. We love to live in the right order, financially, though. So that's the only caveat. So, I mean, yeah, if you have the cash to pay for the semester, 100%, that's what I would do.

You know, and if you didn't, then I would tell you to pause like you have in the past and start to just work your way through. It'll take you longer, but at least you're doing it cash flowing it. Okay. So, no, I would be, no, yeah, I would definitely be putting that money. And I think you have a lot of life to live. And you're going to live better. Yes. And even more wonderfully, you know, once you like have a job and have a job and have.

an income and no dead and you're like oh great i get to go on like really awesome stuff now again it doesn't mean you do nothing you can still enjoy life and what do you think living it up is or living a little is i mean like my my brother always say like live simple i mean he like you know we're all into kayaking we love kayaking i live in the country we love kayak on the river we all own kayaks you know so we you know in the summertime we all love to go kayaking i'm huge into bowling I love bowling. I already have all my equipment. So like going out, doing stuff like that, maybe going out to the beach during like a random weekend, two-day trip. Yeah.

That's kind of like what I mean by like live a little. How old are you? 20 years old. Okay. All the things you just said are either quasi-free or especially in your situation, you've already bought all your gear, is free. That's number one. Yeah. Okay. So you can always just go run out into the water, or you can take your kayaking good on the water, or you can go throw the big heavy ball at the pins.

whenever you want minus lane fees okay so that's already solved the other thing is it sounds like you're not fighting that reality you're fighting an ethos okay you're fighting this idea that other people have it better than you do and let me

feel jealous in that way but I definitely like okay it's not it's not the actual things that are happening it's this older brother who's like bro you need to be and you started this call by apologizing twice with kind of like your head down

as though you've already lost something and dude I'm telling you you're not even at the starting line of the race yet which is awesome yeah if you will invest in one person and that's you for the next five to ten years you will have no idea what quote unquote living a little looks like

like to Rachel's point okay if you pay cash and get out of school and go put your nose You should have more than a part-time job right now is what I'm saying You should have a full-time job I'm in college

I know dude but I had a full-time job And two kids and I got a PhD at night And on weekends you can do it Okay so the counselor's telling me at college You should only work a certain hours week That's kind of BS in the sense I'm not going to put that on to the counselor I'm telling you

Yeah come on John blame the counselor Okay yes it's nonsense it's nonsense Okay, so here's the deal. You're in community college, work full-time, get another part-time job, and get done with your school. And there's always Saturday mornings, Sunday evenings, you can go knock out the stuff. You're right. Now, what is your brother doing professional? So, actually, I might have, I might have, I might have kind of. Yeah, he does. Yeah, I think he's chill. He has, he followed your guys' program. He actually introduced me to the Dave Ramsey program. He has, he has, everything paid off except for his house. And what do I mean by what I was telling you earlier?

So he's into kayaking. He already bought a kayak previously. He loves going hiking. So he already has all of his hiking gear. That's the stuff he has the most fun by spending the less. Ah, okay, gotcha. So he's like a good model in that way. Okay, so he's a good model in that way.

My back. Okay. Yes. You're good. You're good. How much older is he than you? 27. So it's seven years. Okay.

So it's very common that people are graduating high school, graduating college, and they want to move into the house the same size as their parents' house that they just moved out of. Yeah. They want to drive the car that their mom and dad drove him around to school in. And that's unrealistic expectations. So your brother has a seven-year head start on you where he lived very frugally, found love and going out in nature, very inexpensive activities on the whole.

Now, I'm in the middle of hunting season and I figured out a way to make that very obnoxiously expensive, right? But he's doing it the right way. And he's just got almost a decade head start on you. Yeah. So put your head down, work really hard. And I bet he would be a great one to be able to relate to you, though, to say, yeah, you're 20, you don't need that stuff. I mean, I bet like, you know, his, uh, his story should be one that. I've been kayaking with people who have fancy kayaks, fancy stuff, and I've got the rented one that's $15 and it's on, yeah, it's uncomfortable.

It's annoying. You know, it's not, Rachel. Yeah, exactly. Right. But, but listen, if you will write a letter to 50 year old you. Okay. it's a letter of gratitude for here's the things I'm going to do for the next six to seven years with my head down working my butt off so that 50 year old you has the life that you want to live 40 year old 50 maybe too long 40 year old you 35 year old you but dude I want you to put some money in the bank don't take debt off the table I'm a guy who never borrows money period establish that at 20 I drive in 1990 uh dog yeah okay so there you go it's what's up hey is

The 12,000 of debt student loans, is that what that is? Yeah. Okay. So I've, that was, so when my first half of college, I signed it for FAFSA, which is a student loan. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. And they were like, basically, they'll basically say, hey, we'll give you $500 in the semester for books. We'll give you $500 here and there.

You know, we'll give you all this money. But the catch is you got to pay like 8% interest once you graduate. The day you graduate, they start charging. I know. It's terrible. I can get out of it. but I would pay everything cash and that's, I really want to

because I don't want to be so I think it's that. So I think you have a couple of goals tactically is I want you to do a written budget. I want you to pretend that you do have two jobs. Like what John said. What if you had the income

you have coming in and an extra job? How much money will be there? How much money do you need to save per month to make sure you cash flow starting in August, right? Because you have enough money to cash flow the spring semester coming up. Yes.

So how much do you need to save between now and in August to make sure you cash flow the fall semester or summer classes whenever you're going to do it and then from there you're going to be able to see okay perfect that's how much I need to save that's priority how much is food how much is gas how much is my rent like go ahead and list out all your expenses and then get to the bottom and say okay how much is left and and to John's point everything you just talked about whether it's bowling or kayaking it's not going to cost a ton but if you had I don't know I'm just going to guess an extra hundred bucks a

month or something to be able to enjoy to be able to go do some of these things and things, then that's going to feel great. So I feel like there's a part of me that says you can probably do both. I don't think it has to be this extreme case of all or nothing, but you have to make sure it's at least in priority. You want to make sure that the school is taking care of because I don't want you going deeper than this 12,000. And then when you graduate, yes, those bills start coming and that's when you're going to start attacking those. But I would not worry about the past student loans until you're out of school. My number one focus would be to get through the rest of the without taking out any more loans and then anything extra you can have fun with but making sure

that that is covered first and foremost. Let me ask you something. Do you believe in helping people and doing the right thing even when no one's watching? Then you need to hear this. Churchill Mortgage is hiring loan officers, but they're not looking for just anyone. They only want people who believe in serving families the right way. I've been recommending Churchill for over 30 years because they don't trap customers in debt. They don't use slick sales tricks or take shady shortcuts. Churchill offers, smart, real-world mortgage solutions that align with Ramsey principles to help families win. And when you join the Churchill team, you'll get true mentorship and real opportunities to grow your career without compromising what matters most or mortgaging your soul.

So if you want your work to actually matter, this might be your next calling. To get started, go to churchillmortgage.com and click the join the team button. That's churchillmortgage.com. Because when your work and your values align, you don't just make a living. You make a difference. This is a paid advertisement, an MLS ID 1591, NMLS Consumer Access.org, Equal Housing Lender. Welcome back to The Ramsey Show and the Fairwinds Credit Union. studio. I'm Rachel Cruz with Dr. John Deloney, and we are answering your questions. All right, we have

Mike in Ann Arbor. Hi, Mike. Welcome to the show. Hello. Thanks for taking my call. Absolutely. How can we help today? Yes, I've got a, I think, a rather unique situation. Okay. But my sister, so I'm one of three children, I'm the middle child. My older sister is going through divorce, which is terrible situation, of course. She's got three kids. Her eldest, I think, is about three years away from starting college. Okay. And previously, like my sister, all three of her kids were attending private schools. Her and her husband driving luxury vehicles, fancifications, living extremely well.

And no judgment there, that's fantastic, happy for them, but appears from an outside that they had a very high burn rate. Recently, we've discovered as this kind of the discovery process going to figuring out how the divorce is going to play out, but they have under-fills. $50,000 in savings, and that includes retirement accounts. That's that. Oh, wow. Okay.

So my sister is expecting to buy her husband out of their current home and her dental practice, and she needs $800,000 to do that. She doesn't have $800,000. How is she expecting to do this? Great question. So she had reached out to me, and it turns out she had reached out initially to my parents, and they had agreed to provide her with $400,000. Oh, my gosh.

Do they have that money? They do in their retirement. They're retired, but it's their nest egg. Are they multi, multi-millionaires? Yeah, how much money do they have, your parents? It's a great question. I don't know the number, but it's... Okay, did it feel like that's a significant part of their retirement, like a fourth or a third?

Or is it like, oh, no, that's just like... 400, they wouldn't miss. Okay. They'd be our. Okay. Dang, Gina. It's great. I would.

I'd miss it a lot. A lot of lot. Definitely. And so my sister then reached out to me and asked if my husband and I had an extra $400,000 she could borrow. And we're pretty good with money. So we wouldn't have $400,000 sitting, getting destroyed by inflation. So I mean, I told her that, you know, without selling one of our properties, we wouldn't be able to get her to $400,000, but, you know, we'd still be willing to help. And then she called me back and told me, don't worry about it. She should make other arrangements. So I spoke with my parents and turns out they're the other

arrangements. Oh, no. They're going to give her the full 800? Full 800. So they claim that she's over leveraged on debt and she can't get a loan from a bank. She's got a mortgage and she's got a business loan. So we're going to let her go almost a million dollars in debt to us. Awesome. Great plan. Well, I don't even know. Is it going to be a loan or is it going to be a gift? Oh, okay. Okay. Okay. But, you know, my parents have this parental guilt. They feel that she's a victim of the situation. She trusted her husband to manage finances. This is where I disagree a bit on the point. We're with you, Mike. Yeah, I'm with you. Yeah, we're with you.

It's trust but verify at this point. You're an adult. Yep. And then they also want assurances that in the event that she were to get back together with her soon-to-be ex-husband, you know, they would want all of this money back immediately. Okay. All the strings attached. All the strings attached. Don't. Don't. Don't. Don't. Don't. Yeah. All this is a horrible idea. Okay. So what can we do to help, Mike? I totally understand. Yeah. So from my perspective, and first of all, I want to know if I'm crazy, but my perspective is my parents have worked hard and lived frugly their whole lives. They've provided us with fantastic childhoods. They paid for our college. I want them to, you know, enjoy their retirement and spend their money on what brings them joy.

Well, yeah, but you can't control that, Mike. You don't get a vote in that. Yeah, that's what they're choosing to do. Are they asking your opinion at all? I gave it to them because I also happened to be the executor of their will Nice, nice That's fair And we have similar financial behaviors And we're in similar situations Fine to see you

All right, but here's the brass tax Let's say 100% And Rachel and I take these calls So it does happen That your sister Was lied to Manipulated

And just got hit by a steamroller With this divorce the financial position she had no idea she thought everything was different and bam okay there is that mess and in my world we say not by her hand but in her lap she didn't cause this and boom here it is that doesn't give license to avoid reality moving forward and that what does that mean that means she can't afford the house she lives in she can't afford to buy a dental practice as much as she wants to own one. It's a, because I got screwed, I'm now owed X, Y, or Z.

And that's how our country is in almost $40 trillion worth of debt. That's how student loan debt is almost $2 trillion. Credit card debt set an all time. Yeah, I didn't get this. So I deserve to go to the college I want to. I deserve to have this. I deserve to have this program or that. And her world blew up.

And it sounds like her world before. it blew up she never was told no either right right she never has had to to rational face reality yeah of oh there's not enough money here my kids can't go to the school i want them to go to i there's not enough money to buy a car that i really want to buy so i'm going to choose a different one you know it sounds like her conditioning for years and years and years has been i kind of get what i want and we're going to use debt for it because that's that's exactly what the saving show they have no money saved they've put nothing away they've spent everything or more and so for her to want to these things to me is pretty obvious. I understand why she does because she doesn't have another

way of thinking. Well, and we all want our kids to go to the best schools on the planet. We all want fancy cars, big house. Sure. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But, but, but and then your parents to a degree enabling that by continuing to just, you know, fund a little bit of her not facing reality to what you're saying. Not a little bit. A million dollars worth of it. A million dollars worth of it. Here's the way to have this conversation with your dad. It's not about money. It's a, because he's going to say, I have it, it's my money, I can do what I want, and he's right on all counts. And he can, yeah. He is guaranteeing by his participation in this, in your sister's pain, not just sitting with

her in the pain and saying, this is awful. He's participating in guaranteeing that there will be a, there will be a rift in their relationship forever. And after him and your mom pass, that rift will get past to you guys, his other kids. guaranteed because when he gives her $800,000 and she shows up in a new car his first instinct is going to be why did she pay me back or where'd you get that money to buy that car yeah that was supposed to go to the house and that was supposed to go to this and what about that and then when this guy comes back a year later which happens a lot

and realizes his life's awful and wants her back and sees her thriving practice and she's going to be like oh well it is the father of our kids and then and in a wonderful way it's just going to blow things out. You know, the marriage is, if that's the case, and the marriage is redeemed in a healthy way, that's an applause. Yeah, but there's an $800,000 price tag on it. Now there's a million dollars, you know what I mean? That gets, that gets dragged into the middle of that into a beautiful redemption story. So I'm like, all the way around, it's not, it's not wise. But Mike, what sucks by your position is you have no control. You really don't. Like, he's going to, they're going to do what they're going to do. And you can say everything you want to say, say it in the way you think he's

going to, all the things. And at the end of the day, they're going to choose. And then you're going to have to, you're going to have to deal with yourself in that decision, whether it is pain and sadness and feeling like that's unfair to you and your other sibling. I mean, whatever it is, that's going to be yours to carry from then on now. Is it normal for her to call you and ask for money? I'm sorry? Like, her calling you and asking for money, that just, after asking mom and dad and then asking you and your wife, that feels like a level of desperation of someone who's scared that their

life is unraveling. And sometimes the greatest gift is to let it all the way unravel. and sit with somebody in the ash. more money right now is to stop overpaying for your phone plan. Boost Mobile gives you one low monthly price, just $25 a month for unlimited talk, text, and data. And that price never goes up. With Boost, there are no contracts, and they're so sure you'll love it.

They've got a 30-day money-back guarantee. So take the easy win and switch today at boostmobile.com slash Ramsey. That's boostmobile.com slash Ramsey. Restrictions apply. See boostmobile.com slash Ramsey for details. Well, it's that time of year. giving edition of the Ramsey show. It's one of our favorite shows that we do all year. And we want to hear stories from you about how you have given generously this season.

So maybe you've tipped a waiter, a waitress, like a ton, and you have an awesome story around that. Maybe you've bought someone Thanksgiving dinner. Maybe you bought someone a car, whatever it looks like. But outrageous generosity, we want to hear from you. Or maybe you are on the receiving end of a very generous gift. And then those are all obviously is wonderful. So we want to hear from you again, whether you have been the giver or have been given to we want to hear. So go to ramsysolutions.com slash ask and put giving in the subject line. And we do this, gosh, we do it once a year, always around Christmas time. It's one of the most popular shows that we do. We would always get so many listens because

it's just, it's kind of like faith in humanity. You see the good that's being done. And can I tell you, now that you've just read this, this, this like promo, like we're doing this. Yeah. It reminds me like back in 2007 and 2008. I was a part of this. It was like a men's group that met on Monday mornings. And there was a guy there who's a general counsel's name was Slate. And he was an attorney. He was one of the greatest men I've ever met. Every Monday morning, he would go around the table and ask us what's one nice thing you all did for your wives last week. The number of times, I'm a new married guy, Sunday night, I did a nice thing so that I could say something Monday morning. Okay, that sounded cheap and it sounded like not in the spirit

of. To this day, Sunday nights, I still look around. Can I go fill my wife's up? Car up with gas. Can I help with laundry before school? Whatever. And so if you haven't done anything outrageously generous, go do it just so you can call in. You know what? That's a great. But it's about, but it's about the practice. And you start, you will feel how good it feels and you'll be more likely to do it again. So if you haven't done something outrageously generous, let this be the call to go do a thing and then write in and tell us, and then why you're doing that thing, keep your eyes open, bring your kids with you, let them be involved with it, and it will transform, obviously, somebody else's life,

but it will transform your life and hopefully inspire you to give more throughout the year. I love it. So good. Yep. So that show is coming up December 18th. So again, start sending in your stories because we do want to celebrate living like no one else. So later you get to live and give like no one else. All right, let's go to Houston, and we have CJ on the line. Hi, C.J. How you doing, Ms. Rachel? We are doing great. You got another Houston.

H-Tone. Houston. What were you, a resident of Houston, I guess? I don't know, next to me. But, gosh, you're not a resident of Houston. You're from there. You know what I'm saying, C.J., you get it. From Houston.

Yeah, I get it. You get it. All right, CJ, how can we help? Hi, I'm currently 60K in debt. I'm currently 22 years old. I'm a college student, and I work full-time as well. 30k, about 25K of it is a co-sign. This was before I started listening to the show.

I co-signed a car from my mom that she had totaled. She totaled out her previous car and she wasn't able to get a car. Oh, yeah. I'm the only one of her children that has a great credit score and a little financially stable in their eyes, but I felt like I'm drowning. Did, is she, has she stopped paying on that $25,000? picking that up?

No, no, no. She's paying on that. I'm making sure she's paying on it every month. I'm currently... But you're on the hook for it is what you're saying still, which, yep. Yeah. I get that. It makes me uncomfortable.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. It makes me uncomfortable. Totally. What's the rest of the $35,000? Is it student loans? I have $10K in student loans. Okay. And I'm going to cash flow the rest of my time.

I'm currently in community college. I have like a semester. I'm going to be going to either UTSA or another college for cyber security. Okay, good for you. And then what's the other $25,000? 20 of it is my car. And then the other, I might be miswronged, but I have like 7KM credit card that. Yeah, okay.

Currently paying on. That's my baby step one. Jay, what kind of car are you driving around? I have a 2021 Honda Court. Mm-hmm. Not for... If you sold it, private party? Great cars.

I know it is. But listen, I rolled... I drove all over Houston. I'm a 6-foot-2, 200-pound guy. I drove all over Houston in an 88 Tricel EZ hatchback and moved up to a Corolla. Was it great? No. I'm 6'7.

I'm 6'7. I, like... The Honda is the only car that has enough space. You can't, man. I'm making it fit. Okay, CJ, though, we can find a, we can find a bigger car for less than 20. You have to, we do have to, oh, no. You can't fit in a Honda.

That's what my kids do. Six, seven, six, seven. It goes, push it all the way back, the last setting in the car. You got to take the back seat out of that thing. All right, good for you. Okay, how much money are you making, CJ? Jay? I'm making 2155 and we're getting a raise in about a month. How much are you bringing home a month? What's hitting your bank account each month?

About 3,500 on the low end, but I have opportunities to work. Right now it's slow, but next year, when a year starts, we're going to have plenty of overtime. Great. Okay, awesome. And I I currently have $5,000 in my savings. And I know we're supposed to have $1,000, but me and my family have went through a lot so yeah you're nervous yeah it freaks you out a little bit yeah more than a little bit I currently am talking to a therapist

I have anxiety and depression so the anxiety comes from stability when I don't feel stable it just my world rocks yeah trust me dude if you will make this a madhouse priority to get this dead out of your life I've been right where you are dude right

oh trust me I'm on the way to to. And listen. But you gotta hear me. But you gotta hear me. I know. I know.

Safety. I got you. But listen, on the other side of paying all this debt off, you're going to sleep like you have never

slept in your life. I promise because I've walked those same shoes. I know, but I just can't get rid of the safety blanket of that four thousand.

No, no, I'm with you on that. That's, I, you do what you want to do. I'm just saying, I'm just saying the whole get out of debt thing. The whole idea. Okay.

It's going to, it's going to, it's going to have, you're going to have peace in the way that you probably have no idea. You work in overtime, you go into school, you know all the stuff. It is worth it, is what I'm telling you. So what I would do, CJ, if I were you, because you're right on that cusp of that $20,000 car, okay, from a mathematical standpoint, regardless of height and all the things. So just, I mean, unless you're working overtime, can you afford this car? Because our rule of thumb is if you can't pay the car off in 12 to 18 months and or it's more than 50% of your annual take home pay, you have too much car.

And you're right there, CJ. So, I mean, I just want you to just look, just look, run some numbers and just say, okay, what if I did sell it private party? Because it probably is holding its value pretty well. It's a great car. So you may be able to actually, I mean, depending on when you bought it and how all of it's, you may be one of those rare cases that you actually may, you know, be able to sell it for a little bit more than what you owe, or you may be a little underwater. And then I want you to look around, CJ. I'm a little underwater. Okay.

I did a little bit of numbers. It's worth 18. Okay, perfect. Is that private sale or is that trade-in? That's private sale. Okay, okay, so CJ. The trade-in was about the same thing, but I think I could get a little bit more for it. Yeah, okay, so again, I want you to just run the numbers that if you, if you're underwater

2000, I want you to look around and just do some research on a $5,000 car, okay, just pretend, and maybe you find another older Honda cord and you're like, okay, great, I can get a crappier car, and that means you have $7,000 you owe versus $1,000. 20, which is going to fast forward this whole debt payoff so much faster so that you don't have to work overtime much longer, right? So again, it's a give and take situation that car is right on the cusp of being able to keep it and paying it off. It's just going to be a longer get out of debt process. So what I want you to do, so priority number one is I want you to stay current on all of your payments, okay? Stay current on everything. The second priority since you're

in school is I want you to make sure you're cash flowing that last semester. So save up enough to and make sure that that is covered, okay? Once that's done... I plan on class flowing with the rest of the school. Yes, that's great, yep. So it's making sure that that is true because I don't want you to go in any more debt. And then I want you to start working off paying out

that's $7,000 in credit card debt. So if you have multiple cards, start with the smallest, even if it's an $800 bill on one of the cards, whatever it is. Cut everything up and start working your way through the debt snowball, which is paying the smallest debt off first. It's going to be some of the credit cards.

And then your student loans won't hit until after you graduate, and then that car is going to be your second big one. So that's going to decide, hey, do I want to keep it? Is it worth working all this extra? And you'll get to decide that. But, CJ, we're so proud of you. You're changing completely your family tree, and we are here for you.

I've been doing this show for over 30 years, and some of the saddest calls I have taken are from situations that are completely preventable. Yeah, and what's so hard is I feel like one of those, especially, the ones that I'm like, oh, it's terrible. People that call in and their spouse has passed away suddenly, and they don't have life insurance. We actually took a question of a lady, and she had three kids, pregnant, and husband didn't have life insurance, and I'm like, I can't even imagine, or even if it was opposite, right?

If a mom passed away, there's a dad with kids and children. trying to figure out how am I going to afford child care, how do I, how do I outsource some stuff that maybe she was doing? And it just takes the grief and the sadness of something like a sudden death to a whole new level. Like when you have to think through how am I going to pay my bills in the middle of next week. Yeah. In the middle of all that grief. Like it's just, it is. It's terrible. And so life insurance is the one thing, especially as a mom with three little kids that I'm like so big on for people to get because it's inexpensive. Zander is the place that Winston and I actually get all of our life insurance and we keep reupping it because I'm like I just want it there like

there's something about that safety of knowing that you have money if something suddenly happens and it doesn't cost much because Xander shops among a gazillion different companies it doesn't cost much you just have to admit that someday you're not going to be here you got to say it out loud and you got to say I'm going to say I love you to my family by taking care of them and taking the time to put this stuff in place the cost of stinking pizza there really is so that is one thing oh to do to say I love you to your family. So we've used Zander for all of our family's needs for insurance for many years, including, of course, term life insurance.

To get a free quote, go to 800 356, 4282. That's 800, 356, 4282, or go to Xander.com. Up next, we have Lee in Omaha, Nebraska. Hi, Lee. Welcome to the show. Hello, thanks for taking my call. Absolutely. How can we help?

I'm 65, retired, and I have about $1.8 million in a traditional Roth IRA, and I have about $400,000 in a Roth. As I look ahead to the required minimum disbursements, it's kind of a lot. Yeah, now I'm making you feel great, yeah. So the last couple of years, I've moved $100,000 each year from the traditional to the Roth. Good. Would I be better off to keep doing that that way, or should I just take the pain, say, maybe move a million and be done with the pain or just piddle along at $100,000? What other money do you have? Yeah, do you have the cash to do that?

To pay the taxes. To pay the taxes on would have to come out of the account behind it, yeah. I don't have. Okay, so you'd be paying, yeah, so you don't have the cash for it. I've got proct me $100,000 in the bank, you know, but yeah. Right. Yeah. If you don't have the cash to be paying the taxes, I would not take money out of the account just to pay the taxes.

If you can do it, but you, yeah, Do you have any income coming in besides your investments? Yeah, I just, Social Security. Yeah. How much is that a month? Social security is about, oh, 2,300. Okay. And are you living off of money in the Roth or the traditional?

I am. I'm between Social Security and it's about $7,000 a month. I'm with total I'm living on a month. Okay. Okay. Yeah, I mean, kind of our rule of thumb is if you don't have the cash to pay the taxes. And if this is all you have, if there was a lot of money that you were going to have, the great thing about a Roth is, you know, not only are you not paying taxes on the growth, but when you pass it to your children, they're not going to pay taxes either. So it just like becomes even, you know, a bigger pass down, which is such an advantage.

So that's why we are such a fan of the Roth. but, again, having to pay the taxes on it each time, that's what's going to be key. And I'd hate to use your retirement investing to pay the taxes on something that's already invested. But how much are you having to take out every single year? How much is that? They're required. Oh, it gets up there in the, you know, three, four hundred thousand a year I got to take out if I live long enough. Yeah.

Do you know how quickly that's going to be? A year? Yes No, you don't have to take out $300,000 a year Out of your 1.8 Oh, you get there to be late 80s It gets pretty high according to the form the man gave me Of what it is with all the growth

I'm not sure Yeah, I'm making it right now My money is making about 12 to 14% You know, thereabouts Yeah Give or take Yeah So you know, I keep it's dumb to grow

Or you know Yeah I'm out over my skis on this mathematically. But that number doesn't sound right, but dude, I could be out to lunch on it. Yeah, I know. That required, it's a weird, it's a weird formula when you look at it. And so I don't, I don't, yeah, I can't do it right now. So, yeah, what I would say, Lee, is unless you had the cash to be able to pay the taxes because you had money saved elsewhere, that would be an automatic yes for me.

But you could look to see, okay, if I, if I rolled over how much from a, um, where you are in the tax bracket, how much would I pay in taxes if I took it out and that would come out of my investments versus if I left everything in and had to start pulling money out and pay taxes on that, you know, which you're gonna have to pay anyways

when they make you, you know, take it out. I would run some of those numbers and I would sit down with a smart vester pro as well because I would want this to be the most mathematical efficient for you, but usually converting to a Roth if you don't have the cash on hand, that's usually a sticking point

All right, let's go to Alex in Toronto Hi Alex, welcome to the show Thank you, hi, how are you guys? We're doing great, how can we help? My quick question, oh, hopefully good question is can we afford to travel? So we live in Canada, we want to go to Spain for my friend's wedding in May

And my wife and I were just wondering if we can afford it Dude, my friend got married at Arby's man Your friends get married at Spain, that's awesome well they live there it's my best friend from from like he's international Alex has friends all over the world John that's true you got you got cooler friends than me okay so uh Alex where are you guys at financially so um I make about 150,000 Canadian a year okay uh we don't have any debt or other than our home we owe to in our home about 4603,000 okay how much does your wife make does she work she doesn't work she's a homemaker okay wonderful um do you guys have money saved do you have an emergency

fund we have a small emergency fund of about 9000 our expenses are about 4 to 5,000 a month okay um we i have a pension with my current work that i contribute towards and my employer matches about 20% goes towards that tension. Then I have a retirement plan that came from another job that I had in the past that I took with me. There's about 100 grand there. Okay. And then there is... Do you guys have kids, Alex?

We do. Okay. How many kids do you guys have? Two kids. Okay. Okay. How much will this trip cost total? I'm expecting around 5,000.

Okay. Do you guys have 5,000 to spare? You don't have a great emergency fund. So I would want you to bump up that emergency fund to at least three months of expenses. Yeah. So for the last, sorry, for the last two years, we've been saving money, putting money aside. I was investing on my own, but then realizing that my pension is pretty good that I shouldn't be. I mean, I don't know. That's up to you're the expert. So do I continue putting towards another investment like retirement thing on the side or do I just stick with my pension that I currently have? So the investing is a little different in Canada, but I can tell you from here, we would always say that 15% of your income needs to go into retirement, and your pension would be considered, I would cut that percentage in half. So how much, what percentage is going into the pension? So my estimate is around 20%. Okay.

So what I would say is that would be, quote, unquote, 10%. So I'd be saving 5% more somewhere else. And again, the Canadian, you know, retirement, you'll have to look to see what's probably the better option. But I would put 5% of your income into that. So I'd have the pension at the 20% and then I would put 5% somewhere else. Because the reason we say the pension, it is included in that 15%, but it's half is because it is still a great place to put your retirement, but you have no control over it. And so that's always a little bit like, eh. So, again, 5% somewhere else.

But, yeah, if you guys can cash flow this trip to Spain, I mean, I would make it a goal to get your emergency fund up. I would be putting some money away there. But yeah, if you guys have the ability to cash flow it, and again, cash flow in it not stressed y'all out. Yeah, you have no debt. I mean, you guys are saving. You're doing great.

So I would say, yeah, I'd be okay with it. Okay, hopefully my wife can listen to this now and then. Oh, I don't know. John, would you go? John's a little bit more, not as... Yeah, no, I would go, but here's where I would fall short. The moment I deviate from a plan, right? Like if I'm trying to accomplish an exercise goal,

the one morning I don't keep my word to myself, I'm off it for the next four months. And so the only thing giving me pause here is how low... The fact that you got kids and how low your emergency fund is, and you were one kid doing one fun thing in the front yard from burning through that $9,000 in no time. And if you do choose to go to this wedding, it can't be, well, we've done it once and now we can do it again

and now we can go ahead and get this car, now we can go ahead and get this other thing. It would have to be such an anomaly and it'd have to be different than I'm able to do right now. Yeah, no, I totally get that. Yeah. Last time we traveled like that was two years ago. Yeah.

So it's on a constant thing that we do every year. And it may be a thing, it may be a thing that like only you go. And it would be cool to take your wife to Spain and then celebrate a wedding, whatever, but we can only afford, it to only make sense for us financially for one of us to go. So those are some more variables you can throw up there. Yeah, and your wife may be more okay with it if she knows there's more money saved. There may be more security knowing, okay, we have some, we have good money, you know, money saved. Okay, I can take a breath and go on this trip.

But yeah, you got to figure out how to get it. get this emergency funded and the trip. If you can do both, that's great. You already know the power of generosity and the best gifts make an impact now and eternally. That's what pre-born does. And you can trust them to do it well. They don't just offer free ultrasounds. They support pregnancy clinics across the country with ultrasound machines, training, grants, and evangelism tools.

They're faithful with each dollar so moms in crisis can see the life in their wombs. And here's the truth that brings eternal life. Because here's the thing. When a mom sees her baby on that ultrasound screen, she chooses life 80% of the time. and your gift of just $28 covers the cost of one ultrasound. Or if you're able, you can purchase an ultrasound machine

through Preborn and have it placed in one of their clinics so women will choose life for years. Your donation brings hope and truth when mothers feel alone and fear is loud. So I'm asking you to give to Preborn today. Even just $28 to provide one ultrasound.

Go to preborn.com slash Ramsey or call 855. 6.01, 2229, because every baby saved is more than a life preserved. It's a life changed. That's preborn.com slash Ramsey. The countdown to Christmas is on, and we have a ton of great deals for you guys for Black Friday and Cyber Monday. Plus, we're dropping a special one-day sale on Black Friday and Cyber Monday. So we're talking about hardcover books, audio books, assessments, some as low as $3.99. So don't miss out.

Go to Ramsey Solutions.com slash store. Or if you're watching on YouTube or podcast, you can click the link in the description. All right. let's go to Ricardo in San Diego. Hey, Ricardo. Hey, how's it going? Doing great. How can we help today?

I had a question and kind of wanted to give you a little summary about my life and see if you can help me out with it. I wrote it all down, kind of just compacted in a quick summary for us. Perfect. All right. So I'll start by saying I'm 28 and I'm calling from San Diego. I live in a rental home with my family, my two-year-old son. and my soon-to-be wife.

Living together is the only way to make San Diego affordable, and every rent payment gets us one step closer to actual homeownership. We all share expenses, so support each other, and we're working towards building something stable for our future. Currently, I work two jobs Monday through Friday. I'm an H-FAC, a career I switched into after a 10th month training program because I wanted long-term stability from my family. On Fridays and Saturdays, I work in a restaurant,

I used to have more hours there, but it's low season. So I learned that I had to lean more into the A-track to grow and stay consistent financially. I still work there in the restaurant, don't even wrong. I bring home about around 3,650 to about 4,200 a month after taxes, depending on my tips also at the restaurant job. And I follow Dave Ramsey's like baby steps. I've saved the $7,000 towards my emergency fund, budgeting, and trying to use the every dollar app and cutting back where I can. I'm working on paying off a $29,000 car loan that I just got because I needed to be mobile

in order to get me around, and the car I had before broke down on me, and it actually got totaled, and I got an accident in it. Right now, my student loans are also an administrator for parents, so interest is still piling up on them, but I'm staying focused and attacking them with the debt snowball. Yeah, I get right to your question, brother. You're right to your question. Yeah, yeah. Sure. So my question is, what do I do as of right now? Even though it's tough supporting my son, my finance, my family, dealing with a high rent, juggling two jobs, managing debt. I'm trying to stay committed and every sacrifice is about giving my son's security,

helping my family and providing that a discipline teamwork. The thing is that I recently had to go to the hospital. I have a ruptured eardrum. So it's very hard for me right now to see if what's going to go next in my life because they're thinking I'm going to need surgery. So I'm thinking I just put all this time into this career. I'm trying to build. And now I'm thinking, can I even go back to it? Because I'm going to be around loud noises and everything and high elevation. Okay. Well, on that end of it, yeah, you will have to figure out is that feasible? I don't know what that looks like. I don't know if there's protective earwear, you know, you can wear that helps you.

Because if you're able to stay, I think, within the industry that you have is great because you can only move up from there. But is 4K sustainable, Ricardo, per month for you? As of right now, because I have my family living under the same home, it is sustainable and it's the sacrifice I have to make because I make $20 an hour in the HVag job. and then I make 1725 plus tips in the restaurant job. Okay. So it's just more about getting my experience because I have no experience. I just have. Yeah, how quickly for the HVAC will you be able to start upping income?

Do you have, is there an income track that you can see? Yeah, yeah, there is. And as of right now, when I talk to my teachers and I also talk to my bosses at work, it's between like the one to two year mark just because I have to get that experience and I have the knowledge that's great okay so Ricardo I hate to say it you can't afford a 30,000 dollar car yeah yeah you guys sell your car today that's that's that's too high um yeah so you can still find a great $10,000 car that will not break down uh we had a guy on the show last week doing a debt free screen and he's driving a $4,000 car around and he's like listen it's got

200,000 miles but it's been great it's giving me no trouble so there still are great cars out there that are older, that will not break down, like what you experienced. So I would, first and foremost, yeah, put that car. Have you looked at Kelly Blue Book that if you sold it private party, what you would get out of it? So I just recently got a car. It's the 2025 Toyota Camry. Oh, man. You bought a brand new car.

And that's the $29,000? Yeah, and I'm paying monthly on it. Yeah, yeah. So I would go on Kelly Blue Book and see how much you could sell it for. and you may be underwater because it's brand new, but it won't be too much underwater if it is. So, yeah, that needs to be sold. How much is in your emergency fund?

Right now it is about $7,000, and I'm trying to get it to $10,000. Well, hold on. How much do you owe on student loans? On student loans right now, I owe about $6,000. Okay, pay those off today. My other question would be, is it feasible for me to do that? Because as of right now, since I don't have my ear, like, I can't hear from my ear. I don't know when I will go back to work. They haven't told me.

I don't know if it's going to take months, like, to get the surgery or to get to... Wait, do you have to... Okay, I'm a little bit ignorant. Can you not go... Can you not do your HVag work with hearing in one ear? It's more of the... I talked to the doctors, and they said that I wouldn't be able to do it soon enough. It would take a little bit of time.

so I'm not sure what time they're really given me. Can you flip over and go full time at the restaurant? I can't because it's slow season right now. They just cut everybody. Okay, so maybe another one. Like, you don't have an alternative, brother. You've got to find another one. Yeah.

And I hate that for you. I hate that with all my guts for you. And that's the reality you find yourself in. And maybe it's the season, right? So maybe for the next six months to get you through the spring, you're working two restaurant shifts and having to hold off on the HVAC because of your ear. Or you have to go through.

boxes at Walmart at night or whatever you got to do. Or Amazon driving for holiday season. You know, they usually are picking up tons of drivers. Is your girlfriend working? Yeah, she also works. She works two jobs. We're both hard workers. Yeah, no question about that. No question about that. We're just trying to be strategic with the hard work to kind of figure out. Here's a really uncomfortable question. You live in one of the most, if not the most expensive place in the United States to live. I know that for sure. What's, and it's beautiful. It's stunning. Every day is the great day is a great day and there's a mathematical reality you are you are working so hard and what you're doing is so honorable but you picked a place that very few people can afford to live day in and

day out especially seeking the kind of security you're looking for that I hear in your voice what does it look like to pack up and move to Texas or pack up to move to Kansas I'm being serious because you can't you can't afford to live yeah how you're how you're running it's Crazy because I actually made that, I actually tried to talk to my soon-to-be wife about that decision, too, of moving, like to Arizona or Texas just because I know since I'm in my field, I am, and I'll find work out there. You will, but here's a deal. It's less than emotional, it will become a very emotional decision, make no mistake. But right now, you have a math problem. You don't have a work ethic problem. You don't have a, like, wanting to love and take care of your soon-to-be wife and kid and all that. You don't have those problems. you have a math problem and I'm listening to a man

who's working himself literally to death and every month is a grind so you know okay so here's what I would do Ricardo as you get off the phone if I were in your shoes my goal would be to save $2,000 this month

and next month however that looks and then in January I would be putting my car up for sale if you're a little underwater, I think what that's going to give you is you'll have, you'll keep $1,000 in your emergency fund, and then you're going to have $10,000 cash. You're going to use some of that money to pay the difference. Get rid of that. Use the remainder to go buy a crappy $5,000, $7,000 car, okay?

That's going to, for me, that's step one. That's what you've got to do because this car is killing you. So I would get that out of your life. That's going to free up that car payment. And then you guys can start working on building back and figuring out for medical expenses for the spring. And then from there, you're going to work on paying off the student loans. But that's going to be possibly putting two restaurant jobs together. That's going to be, you know, it may look like.

Yeah, it may look like moving. I don't know what that looks like. But those would be my steps. Car number one, cash flowing a new car and paying the difference in cash. That would be my number one goal. And then we have to, yeah, figure out the lifestyle, which is a really, really, really big decision. But it's one that long term could relieve you guys a lot in the hard work that you're already doing. Welcome back to the Ramsey Show in the Fair Wins Credit Union Studio.

I'm Rachel Cruz with Dr. John Deloney. You can give us a call at AAA 825-5-2-2-5. All right, starting us off this hour is Cynthia in Miami. Hi, Cynthia. Yeah. Hi, how are you? We are doing great. How can we help? Hi, so I'm going to get you guys' perspective. So we have a house and we are selling it to clear out all our debt that we've been having plus the house because when we bought the house, we didn't do it the right way. We didn't put 20% down. It was an older home. And now there's like a lot of work that needs to get done. So if we are able to sell it, we're able to cash out. and then we'll have all our debt paid for and we'll be left with 160K around there left over. So I just kind of wanted to see what you guys think we should do because we were planning on renting for a little bit.

So then when we're ready to buy, we'll buy the right way and also just making sure we'll have money to fix things. And yeah, so I just kind of wanted to see what you guys think. And also, you know, we'll use that money for investing. Just kind of see what you guys think. Yeah, absolutely. Okay, so two questions. One, for you selling this house, because I just want to clarify, yes, 20% is ideal for a down payment. But we always say if you're a first time home buyer, five percent's okay. So I do want to make sure you're not rushing to move out of this house. Is it really drowning you guys financially? Like you're like, we got to get out. Because sometimes people are like, well, we can just sell, wipe out our debt and we're all okay. But sometimes that doesn't always fix the issue, you know, if, you know, does that make sense from like a behavior standpoint? point of course yeah so it does make sense we actually been trying to pay off a lot of debt like since we've been together for like about five years and then the thing is that we keep the house

it'll be an additional 25 can because it meets like a roof ASAP okay AC water heater and when we bought the house the money that we had we fixed it inside it was like a fixer upper kind of house sure okay we didn't do all the major things at first okay gotcha and the and the payments too much and all the expenses that are going to be with it. You're like, it's just too much for us to handle on our income. Yes, correct. So we were just thinking of starting fresh now that we know what we know and we're more, you know, we're more diligent with our money.

So we're like, we'll have a clean slate and we'll move forward. Okay, yeah. How much consumer debt will you guys pay off with the equity? $199,424.99. Oh, wow. What was that in? It was in, well, the house is $150,000. 3,000 and then the car credit cards all that where are you going to get the 160,000

in equity of selling the house you only owe 150 on it 150 yes okay so you're going to sell it for 330 340 something like that yeah 340 yeah are you confident that someone's going to come in and buy a 340 thousand dollar house that immediately needs a roof and a hot water heater and all that other stuff? Yeah, it's actually, yeah, it's already done. They put in the offer and everything. Oh, the offer's in and good to go. Okay, cool. Okay, great. So, well, y'all have great equity. I mean, you did well, whether you're aggressively paying it off or it was just the market, but well done. That's great. Yeah. Okay, so you're able to pay off the remaining mortgage and then about that $40,000-ish dollars of just consumer debt that you have, and then you're going to have 160 left.

Correct. 160 left or 120 left after you pay your debt off? After, oh, probably after, I believe, hold on, let me double check. I think it'll probably be like around like 1.30 we might have left over possibly the consumer debt. Okay. I know it's like over on that. All right. Rachel's going to tell you what to do with that, but I want you to make me a promise in front of all of America who listens to this show.

Okay. After you've paid off your consumer debt, this money goes into a high-yield savings account and you don't touch it for 90 days. I will make that promise You can't buy anything No new car Cynthia No we do not want nothing We're actually paying our car now

So we will have this car for a long time And we're going to take care of it I know but that money is going to burn a hole In your pocket Y'all have to You all have to like Like I don't know how you all do it in your marriage

Spitshake Contract Y'all go outside and etch it into the driveway you all will not touch this money because it is going to be so you're going to look up. A cruise is going to look good in December there in Miami. A friend is going to get remarried and want you to go

to Australia. A buddy's going to have a brand new car that you just has to sell it such a great deal. Your husband's going to want by crypto. It's just going to happen. You all can't touch this because otherwise you're going to sell this house and you're going to find yourself right back in the same situation. I promise you, we've

taken this call countless times over the years. Okay. Yeah. No, yeah, definitely. That's our goal. Like, I don't want credit cards. I don't want none of that. Like, if you can't afford it, like that's great. I'm going to believe you, Cynthia. I'm a believer. All right. I'm trusting you, and you're going to instruct my lightning or something like that. If you spend the money, okay? No, I've been looking today for a long time. Not one penny. It goes into a high-old savings account, and all your friends are going to be like, oh, my gosh, you can get higher rate. I know. This is a spiritual exercise for you guys, okay? Yes. Okay, cool. We're not touching it until February, March.

Yeah. Perjohn's delivered, yes. I think that's great. I think it's a great, I think it's a great principal to act. I think that's awesome. Okay. So, Cynthia, for you guys, month to month, when you go rent somewhere, if you factor in the new rent plus your life, how much do you guys spend a month?

How much you guys need an operating expenses a month? Yeah, so that's actually something we've been working on. So we'll make about like $4,700 a month. They arranged to 47 to 5. Okay. And what we'll do is now we factor in the rent, and we're also, like, factoring our groceries. We've been really, like, people working, Cynthia? Yeah, we both own a business together.

So we're both, yeah, we both run it together. How's the business going? Do you see, is there an upward trajectory of it? Okay. Yeah, it's going good. Because around 50, you know, I mean, you guys are 60K-ish in Miami. It's not a ton. It's an expensive area.

Yeah. So it's good and it's okay. We're not like in Miami. We're around that area. Okay. Okay. So doable for you guys. Yeah. Okay. Okay. Okay. Especially since we're cutting off all our expense, like those bills, like those credit cards, we're really just, what our goal is is to pay the rent. We'll get our groceries, pay the essential bills, and then all that money will be able to start saving. Yeah. Do you all have kids? We do. We have two kids. Okay. Great. Okay. So what? I would do for you all is probably more of a six-month emergency fund, which will be about 25K. So I would earmark around 30,000 of that of your new money just for an emergency fund that you're never going to touch unless you need it. And that leaves about 100K. So I would make that my baby step 3B because you guys will have no consumer debt. You'll have a fully funded emergency fund. And then I think the next step is getting into a home. Now you guys can start doing retirement.

Do you all have like a step or do you have any kind of thing within your business, a simple IRA? Yeah, we actually have a Roth IRA we've been investing to for a long time already, yeah. Okay, so depending on how quickly you guys want to be back into homeownership would be if I, so I would either have that $100,000 and then start saving on top of that for a down payment. And then if you're not going to buy a home within, I would say probably three years, I would start investing as well, 15% of my income into retirement. But if you think you could buy a house and around three years with the end, amount you can save, I probably would hold off retirement until I'm in the house and then fund

15% of my income into retirement. But if it's going to take longer than three years to buy again, I'd probably go ahead and just do the 15% to retirement and build on top of that down payment. But those would be my next goals for you guys. So yeah, excited for you guys for this next season. Hey friends. Our Black Friday sale is live. So if you're already feeling the pressure of holiday shopping, just take a deep breath. You'll find great gifts for everyone on your list. And with prices as low as $6.99, you won't wreck your budget. Pick up bestselling books like the Total Money Makeover or Baby Steps Millionaires for just $12. skip the shopping chaos friends but don't wait these deals won't last visit ramsysolutions dot com slash store So buying or selling your home is a really big deal. And with all the clickbait headlines out there and conflicting data, it's really hard to know what's actually happening in the housing market.

So we're here to make the latest trends easy to understand. So the medium home prices have held steady at around $424,000. And in October, about one in five houses saw a price cut, which means that buyers might have more room to negotiate. this winter, which is great if you are looking to buy. Mortgage rates have dipped slightly to 5.49 in October, giving some buyers some breathing room. But since rates are unpredictable, the best time to buy is when you are ready. So if you are out of debt, you have a fully funded emergency fund and a down payment for first-time home buyers at at least 5%. 20% is wonderful. Then you are ready to enter the market. So if you want to learn more about the housing market

trends and get some free tools so you can buy or sell with confidence. Go to ramsysolutions.com slash markets or click the link in the show notes if you're listening on podcast or YouTube. All right, let's go to Anthony in Texas. Hey Anthony, welcome to the show. Hello, guys. How are you doing? We're doing great. How can we help? Good. So my question is more a career question than financial. So I am a apprentice for a utility company here in Texas. I gross around 150,000 a year. My wife also works. She grosses around 60,000 a year. I'm on the road Monday through Friday, usually about four hours away. I've been working a lot of weekends lately. I have a kid doing February. So I'm wondering.

Congratulations. Thank you for that. I'm wondering, do I stay here and journey? out after and then it's almost like if i journey out what do i do next or do i go ahead and do a career move now and work towards something else if you journey out are you going to be able to have a more local uh gig or you is that just a commitment to be on the road forever so you can there is a chance to be local but everybody else is trying to go local as well so it's a competition basically so i couldn't say a month after i journey out i'm going to be local it's a year well flip that conversation around let me say it this way every single friend of mine in texas who's about my age is talking about the utility boom it's it's it's wild right

you know this they're paying you a bunch of money just as an apprentice right um yes and they're paying you to be away from any sort of life whatsoever right yes there's a premium on that right um the question I would ask myself is if I bit the bullet for another how close are you to journey and status two more years

it's a long time to be gone seven days a week here's my question is there a possibility that y'all are able to relocate once you get established because you're looking at one of those jobs

that everyone in the country is saying people need to start looking for yes So I could relocate, yes. I just did buy a house here. Okay. But in two years, yes, I could relocate if I needed to. Is there a way to not have to work weekend?

I'm just, man, it's a tough, that's tough sledding with a brand new baby being gone seven days a week for two years. And there's some, I just worked 18 days straight before. So, I mean, there's sometimes I worked longer. Yeah. What would you do if you weren't doing this, you know? honestly i don't know it's uh that's also a problem i have is i don't know what career path to go yeah um this career path kind of oh go ahead well is your wife going to go back to work or is it dependent is that dependent upon what you're making uh she is going to go back to work she said she'll

never quit working so what does she do come to go back to work she's a nurse okay so anytime i feel backed into a corner either i have to do this or i have to do that one of my personal rules of thumb is I throw a bunch of random ideas on the table just to a prove to myself I don't have to do this or that and give myself some breathing room on and maybe another idea will emerge here's what I mean is there a possibility that y'all go and you're doing this not for right now but you're doing this for 10 year from now y'all okay is there a possibility that she took a 24 month hiatus from nursing and she you all put her up in the nicest hotels when you travel or are you out in remote desolate

nowhere west odessa where there's i mean there's nothing on top of nothing um that's an idea could she go to travel nursing and go with you for a season is there i'm just saying throw a bunch of ideas on the table because what i'd hate for you to do is to take what every expert is saying is going to be one of the top jobs in the country for the next foreseeable future and for two years of misery, you let that thing go. And at the same time, man, working 18 days straight with a newborn is really tough. Although I will say, man, I've got buddies who got deployed, right, when their wives were pregnant and they missed the first. I mean, it's not ideal, but it's not the end of the world, but. Yeah. So after the two years, that's tough. After the two years, the job that you'll

have, is that what you want to do, Anthony? Like, do you see yourself being fulfilled in that career? honestly um probably not um this career kind of just fell on my lap and i took it because it's a great opportunity um everybody in this area would die for this career it's just it just happened to go that way i just don't know if i want to continue to do it how old are you local um 27 okay what'd you do before this uh i did insurance i was a like a third party for insurance companies okay yeah i would man, I would be tempted to explore. We can give you Ken Coleman's book to look at the work you're wired to do. There's an assessment in the back of it, a career assessment that's actually amazing.

That could even jog to John's point as you're starting to kind of think through other options could maybe, you know, create some ideas of, oh, gosh, I never thought about this or that. Because in a perfect, I mean, right, in everyone's perfect world, which we're all adults and it's not always perfect, is that you're doing a job that you love. and that you are passionate about it, that you're good at, and you're paid really well, right? Like, that's the ideal world for 37-year-old Anthony, right? In 10 years, like, that's what's ideal. So I want to start moving towards a path to create that. And if this is a job, even though it pays so great, and it's such a great opportunity, doesn't always mean it's great for you.

But I also don't want you guys to flounder financially by any means with any of it. Do you guys have a lot of debt? No, so the only debt we have is the mortgage, which is, 250,000. Okay. Yeah. I was also able to save 80,000. So I have 80,000 just saved in a savings account

because I knew this point was coming. So good. Yeah. That might be another question. Instead of looking at the work, instead of looking at the passion and that kind of stuff at this stage, could you and your wife sit down and agree on a number? I'm going to do this to we have 150 grand. Or to have 125 grand. And while we're

doing that, I'm going to be in my trailer or in my hotel room on my laptop working like mad to find other work so that when I make this jump, I'm not making this jump into nothing, but I'm making this jump to something. You get what I'm saying? Yes, totally agree. So, and another obstacle, and sorry if we don't have much time, but another obstacle I have is when I journey out, my pay will be significantly higher. It should be about $250,000. So I don't want to to get attached to the money if I do plan to leave. See what I'm saying? Yeah, but your character, as it is right now, you're not, I mean, that's not how you're rolling. If you, because we also talk to people who get this first job, make 120 grand. Yeah, okay, can I push back a little bit? Push away, yeah.

Okay, but I also don't think he need, they don't need it, though. Like, if you, if you had, if y'all had a ton of debt, Anthony, and no savings, I'd be like, sorry, you got to do whatever you can to get yourselves in a good position. Y'all are in an awesome position, you know what I mean? I'm just trying to give them a framework for, we're all. We're all. We're all. We're all going to be at peace when we cross, and that might be today. Your wife may look at you and say, hey, we have enough now. We're good now. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I want you home. But find that number that you're like, this feels right once we hit this number to make a transition to maybe something difference. And I'll tell you this, if you work for dollars, not for the life that dollars can

supposedly give you. Meaning, if you think you're going to find peace at a dollar amount, you will never catch it. So, but I'm not worried about that for you, brother, because you're already proving your person of integrity and stewardship with your money. You and your wife get together and ask yourselves, what kind of life do we want to live? Let's reverse engineer for that. And hold on the line. Christian's going to pick up. We'll get you Ken's book. That's why we only recommend Ramsey trusted real estate agents. They're hand-picked pros who know their stuff, listen to your needs, and have your back from the first call all the way to closing day.

To find a Ramsey trusted agent near you, visit ramsysolutions.com slash agent. Ramsey Solutions.com slash agent. Our question of the day is brought to you by Y. Refi. Defaulted private student loans don't define you, and they don't have to control your future. Why refi helps you start fresh with low fixed rate refinancing made for real people. Go to yrefi.com slash Ramsey. That's the letter Y, R-E-F-Y.com slash Ramsey, not available. in all states. All right, today's question comes from Mary in Alaska. Mary writes, my husband and I owe the IRS over $90,000 due to property sales. We are currently paying down that monthly. We also have $15,000 in credit card debt, car debt of $14K, and a $250,000 mortgage. We have over $150,000, oh, God, in precious metals, and $150,000 in a CD. We have, We are retired, and our income is about $7,500 a month.

I want to cash out the medals to pay off everything. Yes, you know why? Because you are wise. My husband wants to keep the metals because the value is increasing. Right this second. We have no retirement accounts except the CD already mentioned. My husband has been pilfering that account in order to buy more medals. Good gosh.

What should we do? Okay. I mean, this is an easy math problem. Precious metals are a speculative commodity. They go up and then they go way, way, way down and they stay down and they go up when people freak out. Then they go down. Sell them. Sell them.

Sell them today because you know what is going only up and more of a tighter and tighter chain around your ankle is this IRS debt. Get rid of this stuff now. And you know what's going down in value? Your cars while that debt stays the same. your credit card debt is going up because of interest just cash the stuff out but you have a bigger issue here rachel yeah i mean you guys don't have a lot of money mary well somehow they've got seventy five hundred dollars a month coming in i don't know if that social security i don't know what that is that's a pension or what so the consumer debt and the irs debt yes needs to be paid

completely um and then i would take money once the cd matures take that 150 out and then the precious i mean you guys will have 30 thousand dollars left after you pay off everything and I would then put all of that into investments. I mean, I would sit down with a smart vester pro and say, okay, aggressively, what can we do to do this? I would not throw it all at the mortgage right now because I would rather you have some money in retirement that you're slowly paying off the house. But I'm scared, you guys, Mary, that, I mean, you don't, you'll have $150,000 left, basically. And so that does worry me for you guys long term. That's not going to be enough money to retire on. And so the reality is, Mary, you guys are probably going to have to go back to

work in sub-capacity. Well, they're making $7,500 a month. Yeah, but they only have $150,000 saved in a $250,000 mortgage. Yeah, they may have to sell that mortgage and way downsize. You may, yeah, you either downsize and I don't know how much you could get. I mean, I don't know what equity you have in your home. That's an option or, you know, for a few years, Mary, of figuring out, you know, how do we make some money? Because you guys just don't have enough to cover what debt you have, like your liabilities versus what you have. And that's But to me, the scary thing here is your last sentence. My husband's pilfering our last remaining dollars to buy more precious metals.

This is a recipe for a disaster crash. Yes. A hundred percent agree. A hundred percent. Okay. So you got to address the lack of integrity in your husband. You got to address y'all's core marriage issues because I guarantee this isn't the only place where he's quote unquote pilfering things.

Y'all got to get on the same page there and come up with a unified. a plan moving forward. And I know that's easier said than done. You wouldn't be in these other situations if y'all had been united moving together. And to your point, John, I mean, if your house was a half a million dollar house and you had 250 in equity and you owed 250, you know, you could get out and go buy a 250, you know, 250 house free and clear. You know what I mean? If you just stepped down. So be thinking about that long term because I want you guys to be able to, yeah, to be able to breathe. All right. Let's go to Stephanie in Chicago. Hi, Stephanie. Hi.

Hello, hello. Welcome to the show. How can we help today? Thank you. I've been a fan for a very long time. I appreciate what you guys do. Thank you. Thanks for calling in.

My question is related to our retirement savings. So my husband and I recently bought what we hope to be our forever home. We sold our starter. And our mortgage has obviously increased as has the rate. So we're wondering if it's ever okay for us to pull back from retirement savings and just kind of give ourselves more margin for our increase in expenses. What percentage is your mortgage payment on this forever home compared to your income? So it's close. It's about 25% of our monthly income. So where's the rest of your money

going? So we do have our son does go to private, which is something that it was kind of of one of the reasons that we did move neighborhood. So it's very likely that he may be going to the local public school next school year. But we also have some repairs to do in this home that were a bit unexpected. And we do have some goals for the future as far as saving for a vehicle and paying off the home faster, which is something that has kind of been weighing on me. I was very comfortable with the mortgage that we had. But we're kind of at odds.

whether we should pull back, I'm kind of more on the, I think we should just keep saving where we're at and make it work. Are you all doing 15%? Putting 15% away and that's too much is what you're saying? So we're each doing 16%, not including our company match, which is pretty generous. Okay. And then we're also maxing out our Roth IRAs from our take home pay. Okay. Do you know percentage-wise how much of your income is going to all of those? Because that's going to be way more than 15%.

I don't. Okay. If we're including our company match, we're both each putting away 24% of our income. Okay, yes. And that's not including the rough IRAs that we're doing. Yeah, exactly. Okay, yeah. So, yeah, you guys are probably putting too much in retirement.

So what we would say is 15% of your income needs to go into retirement. How much does your company match? It's 8% total. 8%. Okay. So what I would do is go up. to the match and then the remaining percentage that you guys have, I would go then to the Roth, max out the Roth. And if there's any percentages left, go back to the 401K. But I would just do

15% of your income into retirement. Both your 401K, the 8%, not including the employer's match. So that's not 16. I don't count the employers of 16. I just count your 8% going in. And then the remaining 15%. percent take to your Roth IRA. And if you max that out, depending on what you're making, if you max it out, go back to the 401K. Or it may just be enough just to do the 8% and then maxing out the Roth. I'm not sure. So you guys will have to kind of do the math on that. But yeah, I would cut back your retirement to 15%. Okay. So you're saying just do the 8% to match the company and then put the remainder of that into our Roth.

Into your Roth, yes. But because how much are you? How much are you guys making a year? Combined, it fluctuates because we both have our base salary and then commission, but I would say comfortably, it's the most we've ever made. We're at about 160, 1.60, okay. Well, then, okay, so the max on the Roth this year, I think is eight. So what I would, 8,000 each. So, again, after you funds that 8%, if 7% of your income left fills up the Roth IRA,

then just stop. You guys are good. But again, if you hit that max and you still have one or two percentages left of your income to hit that 15% go back to the 401K, does that make sense? Yeah, it's hard for me because I know on paper, like what we have saved up looks good, but like my mind doesn't connect with, it just never feels like enough. I think I maybe worry too much about the future. What does enough mean? you know I wish that I knew I think it just boils down to the fact that we both grew up pretty poor and no one in our family had any financial literacy and I'm always like you know we're I feel like

we have a really good thing for eight how old are you guys Stephanie we're both 38 okay and how much you all have in retirement right now between all of our IRAs and 401ks it's just about 500,000. Okay, yeah. Sister, you're good. So what's crazy is, Stephanie, if you just stop right now and don't do anything, your money will double every seven years. Okay, so you guys are going to have millions every time right. If you didn't do anything from now, like even if you just stopped, and you're going to continue to contribute 15%. So the remaining money that you're going to stop putting in retirement, yes, upgrade the cars if you need to and pay the house off early. It's one of the best times of the year, but it's also the time of year when people let their money get totally out of control.

Everywhere you look, it's just buy, by, buy. So you start swiping the credit card, and suddenly it's January, and you've got a mess on your hands. Don't let that happen. Tell your money where to go instead of wondering where it went with our budgeting app every day. Every dollar. Every dollar not only helps you stay on budget and in control of your spending this holiday season, it also helps you find extra margin in your budget, thousands of dollars of it, and every day will coach you to build better money habits and attack your goals faster than ever. So while most people will be starting in January with a taste of regret in their mouth, you'll already be winning. Start every dollar for free by downloading the app today. Our scripture, the day comes from Isaiah 66.9, I will not cause pain without allowing something new to be born, says the Lord. Malcolm Gladwell says, a lot of what is most beautiful about the world, arises from struggle so good all right let's go to Ryan in Minneapolis hi Ryan

Ryan welcome to the show hey how are you guys doing we're doing great how can we help today um yeah I'm just I had a question of my um a relative just passed away and he by defaults because my father passed away, me and my brother are set to inherit what he has left, which is a house and a few cars and whatnot. But the only problem is he has a IRS debt of about $120,000. And so we're going to have to... sell the house. Do a cash out refinance to pay for the house. But what I'm wondering about is if me and my brother should spell it or if we should hold on to it.

That's what we're kind of at odds about right now. Yeah, I mean, yeah, the IRS lien's going to, how much is the house, how much is it worth? If you sold it, what would it be worth? Um, it's give or take 200,000 probably Yeah, somewhere in that In that range, yeah But if it was fixed up, it's worth

It's worth like Easily 400,000 It would double in value if you fix it up Yes, for sure All of this is good But it glosses over the main question here Which is can you afford to do that? like if somebody if somebody drove up here and said hey i got a brand new lexas and it's awesome

it's just going to cost a hundred thousand dollars and there was a two hundred thousand on a car that'd be a great deal but i don't have the money to go buy that thing right and i'm not i'm sure not going to take out a cash out refi with a house with liens all over it you know what i'm saying okay and co-share it with a brother who i already have difference of opinion on how we're going to manage stuff moving forward like this is just bad decision after bad decision after bad decision. Okay. Yeah, so the smart thing, Ryan, would be to, you got to sell, you got to pay the IRS debt, and then you guys split whatever's left in it. I mean, that's the cleanest, smartest way. And then you take that money and then whatever you want

to do with money, you know, whether you want to go and save and buy up a rental and have another second home to do whatever, you know, whatever that looks like for you, you can do that on your own terms. But yeah, yeah, John's exactly right. Sharing a property with a family member is so messy and then financially if you're not even in a position to be able to cash flow all of this then yeah it's not if your brother wants to buy you out then let him well see the only the only problem is there's also more debt as far as like credit cards and so I pretty sure the estate will it's going to become insolvent okay yeah you may not get anything from it and that's great I'd rather be out and not even be near it then I would not try I would not try I

I wouldn't try to make the deal work, Ryan. Do you have, is this an emotional attachment, too? Yeah, it's for sure. It's sentimental, for sure. So, dude, like, I'm all with you on that. What's important about this house to you? Well, it was the house my dad grew up in. My grandpa and grandpa, or my grandpa basically built the whole thing with his hands.

It's all everything hasn't been updated since he did it in the 50s and 60 so yeah so like your emotional attachment to this the sentimental value is very real and rachel and i don't take that lightly that's a real pain that's a treasure and that sentimental treasure is going to become like a weight around your neck making it very hard to continue to tread water in an already chaotic time okay do you have what what's your financial state ryan do you have money saved or consumer debt where are you at no i'm i'm fine no debt um i just got married a month ago and we're we're about yeah we're uh we're we're we're we're fine personally um you know we have we're on track for retirement um yeah do you have a lot of cash available um not 120 000 yeah yeah does your new wife have any um i know she hasn't obviously you guys are newly wed but does she have any thoughts in this sometimes an outside spouse you know that's new to the situation who's less emotionally attached has thoughts too what is what is she saying um i mean she would she would like to

for us to own a house eventually and me as well but she doesn't want to live there until it's fixed up, understandably. Yeah, and that's going to be more money going into it. And everybody who thinks it's going to cost X to fix it up, the rule of thumb

is double, if not triple that amount of money that you think it's going to cost. You're going to get into a 100-year-old home and find out it needs all kind of stuff. Yeah, yeah. And like you said, if you get into this estate and you keep this asset, they're going to come after you for, I mean, it's just going to be, it's going to be a mess financially of what you're going to have to do to get above water to be able to keep it and make it make sense. And then on top of that,

let alone the repairs and everything. Can I, can I tell you something that I, an experience I had a few years ago? So when I started working in universities, my granddad, who's one of my all-time life heroes, one of the greatest men have ever known. He brought me into his closet and he gave me this tweed jacket because it looked like a professor's jacket. It had like the brown patches on the elbows and everything. It has never fit one time. It never fit. But I carried that jacket with me everywhere, house to house to house to house.

And then one day a few years ago, I was packing up to move yet again. And I was, I looked at this jacket. I thought of my granddad who'd passed away. I smiled and I put it in the keep pile. and then for whatever reason I turned and I looked at that jacket and I said out loud without thinking about it wasn't some big aha moment but I just

said my granddad is not in that jacket and then I put my hand on my chest and I said he's right here and I picked up this jacket that somebody's going to use and it's going to use it well it will never be me and I put it in the donate pile

I did because it's a great illustration because somebody's going to need that jacket and I'm keeping it from them by pretending to hang on to a memory that is is is actually inside of me and it was sad it was heartbreaking and I've got a couple of keepsakes on my desk right now at my house where I'm writing it's it's it's it's right there but sometimes these sentimental things they become they become bricks we carry around and it's not like you're calling us and saying hey my my dad steward his money well

and his father's money well, we have a property worth $5 million, and we just want to buy new cars, so we're going to sell it. That's not what you're saying, man. You're saying that you've got an absolute mess, and there's a bunch of heartstrings attached to it. And so, man, I honor that, but dude, doing a bunch of unwise financial things, especially on the heels of a brand new marriage, this house is going to turn into a deep resentment. It's going to further put a gap between you and your brother's relationship. It's going to begin to build a space between you and your new wife because you're not going to be able to buy

the house you want because you're going to have all this outstanding debt on this house it's just going to cause a mess man just a mess and also dude

I get the heartbreak it stinks yeah yeah that's a well thank you for telling that story that's a yeah well and it's so hard too

because when it's the right thing to do even though it's the sad thing yeah that's that sucks just because it hurts doesn't mean it's not the right thing to do yeah but

That is the wisest path, Ryan. I hate it for you. Is that. And I know that it's heartbreaking. And, you know, and it shows, too, how much, we talk about this a lot on this show. Our emotions can drive so many decisions. And then we look up four years later and think, what was, why did I do that? Right?

Out of stress, out of fear, out of grief, like, whatever it is. And my fear for him is he's going to have $300,000 out on a money pit. Yes. And find himself in a. Stuck there. Yeah. Yeah. I know, Ryan.

I'm so sorry, but I hope that helps. You know, that's probably the answer you want. Pay off all the debts and... Yep, and you build a great, great life with your new wife. All right, well, thanks to our wonderful audience here in Nashville at Ramsey Solutions. Thanks to all you in the booth. John, thank you as well. And remember, there's ultimately only one way to financial peace,

and that's to walk daily with the Prince of Peace, Christ Jesus.