The Ramsey Show - Nothing Destroys Your Finances Faster Than Broken Trust

Episode Date: November 28, 2025

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Brought to you by the Every Dollar app. Start budgeting for free today. Normal is broke and common sense is weird. So we're here to help you transform your life. From the Ramsey Network in the Fairwinds Credit Union Studio, this is The Ramsey Show. I'm Ramsey Personality, George Camel, joined by best-selling author Jade Warshaw, and we're taking your calls at Triple Eight. 825-5-2-2-25. Peter is in Philadelphia to kick us off. What's going on, Peter?

Hi, how are you? Just stressed about bills and thinking about bankruptcy. Oh, man. How much debt do you have? A little over $25,000. What kind of debt is that? Maybe close to the $30. Car, personal loan, hospital bills, gas bill and what's left on the car the car's 10 the personal loan is 11 and that's that's just you know

like personal loan just because I'm trying I'm trying to get myself out of a jam so I go back into it you're in a cycle what do you make? Right 126 base salary dude and I think last year

I pulled in about 180 for the overtime America just lost all empathy here. You make $130,000 and you're calling in trying to file bankruptcy over 20? Yeah, what else is going on? What else is eating your lunch? Because it's not $25,000 of debt. You could pay off this debt in less than six months. I mean, I do have other things.

I mean, I take care of my kids. Okay, tell us about that because right now we're trying to understand where there's the problem. Well, so I don't have a court order on the kids. I just, you know, whatever they need and whatever their mom needs, I just take care of. That's true. But again, if you were, if you were, I'm not going to lie, misspending. Okay, that's what it is. Because even if you were married with the kids in the house, taking care of them, you know, $125,000 income would still be a great income.

So it's not the kids. It sounds like you're overspending in other areas. Do you have any kind of budget that you're on? No, not really. Okay. There's the problem. So I guarantee you today, if you were to just do an old school budget on a piece of paper, if you just said, all right, here's the money I take home, my net amount when I take home my check,

and now I write down what I'm spending money on, and I'm just going to go back through my bank statement, I think you would see the problem. Are you dating anybody? No. Okay, so then you're just spending money on yourself. Is it food? Are you doing a lot of door dashing? If I looked at your bank statement, what would I see as the number one thing that you're overspendant? on? I don't know.

Maybe fast food. Yeah, I guess going out fast food. You go out with your buddies. You guys go have some drinks, anything like that? I don't have time for that. I work too much for work. Okay. So here's what George and I are saying.

If you make 100, and I mean, we could talk about taxes and nickel and diamond, but essentially, if you made $100,000 a year, 126, you could live on 100 and pay this debt off, right? At the basic level, in less than a year. Can you live on $100,000 a year? I think so. I think so, too. You're a single guy. I mean, yes, you've got your kids to take care of how many, two? Three. Three. Okay. How old are they? 16, 20, and nine. Okay. And the 20-year-old is she in college? Mm-hmm. Yeah. What do you put towards that every month? About 600. And what are you taking home? Like what ends up in your paycheck? Is it like $8,000? Oh, that's right. I also have a pension loan now. A pension loan? Tell us about that. Yeah. I didn't, I totally forgot about that because that comes out of my check automatically. So that

I think I have about probably about $24,000 left to pay on that. Okay. How much comes out of your check? It is $463 every two weeks. What caused you to take that pension loan? Oh, that's a long story. Okay. What about credit cards are you using those? No. Oh, glad you said that.

So I got about $6,000 on Capital One. Okay. Now it's starting to come to view. We went from 25 up to $15, now we're at 56. Anything else you want to tell us about? Like hand on the Bible. What else do you? have going on student loans that's i forgot about the capital one card did you forget about student loans

a year ago no i don't have any student loans thank god is any of this in collections uh the capital one card okay and the gas bill all right are you ready to like take control this as a grown man with three about grown kids and you're like dude i'm ready to clean up my life because if you're ready we can help you if not call us back when you want i go yeah i am okay i'm just too stressed out Starting tonight, you're going to make this budget and it's going to give you so much peace just to have the numbers laid out in front of you. Even if it's scary, even to go, ugh, I don't like what I see. At least it's not the boogeyman on all the unknowns.

I'd rather you be scared of the facts than the unknowns. So we're going to gift you every dollar to actually make the budget. It's a digital app you can download and you're going to list out your income for the month. And if that's $7,500, you list that in the income section. Below that, you're going to list every expense you can think of, including your minimum debt payments. And what you're going to see very quickly is if you're going over budget every month or under budget and you should have wiggle room to use that money to throw with the debt. And I want you to use your bank statement as a guide when you do this because I kind of feel like you have something that's living in your head of what you spend versus what's actual reality. So if you don't use that bank statement, you're going to say that you spend $400 on food, right?

When the reality is you might spend like $1,100 on food, right? So go back, get the bank statement for September and use that as a guide when you make this budget going into November. That's going to let you see, okay, now you're going to see, oh, yeah, this pension thing came out. Now you're going to see, oh, yeah, this is what I spend on gas. And it's going to take you, you know, you could do it. If I felt like you had an accurate picture, you could probably do it in 30 minutes, but I really think you need to look at these numbers. It's going to take you an hour or so to get this done. But it's going to give you, like George said, so so much peace.

And the other question is, are you investing at all? No, nothing serious. Just pennies on Robin Hood. No, boy. Okay. Let's delete Robin Hood for now. Can you promise me that? Yeah.

Okay, we're not really building any wealth over here. We're just wasting time. And what do you get every year when you do your taxes? What kind of refund do you get? I don't. Last year was the first time I owed. Okay. Okay, good.

Yeah. The budget, I mean, it's the blood work. It tells all. It tells everything that's wrong with you. Okay. So once you do this budget, you're going to figure out your main expenses. Here's like food, utilities, housing, transportation, insurance, minimum debt payments, anything beyond that, you're going to get real judicious and cut out. And that means eating out, that's got to go because we got to clean this mess up.

And we don't want it to take 10 years. Let's do this in 18 months. Does that sound better? Yeah. Well, think about this. You got 56,000 in debt, let's say, just using ballpark numbers, and you throw $2,500. a month at this. You're done in 22 months, less than two years. That sounds great, right? Yeah. And we avoid bankruptcy, which is going to implode our life for the next seven years

and hurt your ability to get jobs, to rent departments. It's going to hurt you in a huge way to file bankruptcy, especially over debts these small. Yeah. And so I don't think bankruptcy is your answer. I think you are the answer, Peter. So hang on the line. We're going to gift you every dollar. Make that budget tonight. It's going to give you a whole lot of clarity. And the new every dollar in that onboarding, that first 15 minutes, it's going to show you how much margin you will create if you decide to commit. And so it's like we're going to be in your pocket guiding you along the way on this journey. And we are rooting for you, man. We think you're worth it.

You can do it. You think those kids are worth it. And you're very capable. If someone's willing to pay you $130,000 a year, you are smart enough to make a budget and get out of this debt once and for all. But first, you've got to stop going into it. Debt is not a shortcut. It's not the answer, man. You are.

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Results vary and no specific outcome is guaranteed. That settlement may negatively affect credit and not all creditors will negotiate or settle. Savings vary and may be taxable. Please review our website terms for more information. This is The Ramsey Show. I'm George Campbell, joined by Jayette. Warshaw open phones at AAA 8255-225. You call us and we'll talk about your life and your money. Eli is up next in Indianapolis. What has happening, Eli? How are you doing, guys? We're doing well. How are you?

I'm doing well. So my question is, uh, I lied to my girlfriend. That's not the question. That's an admission. That's a confession. We appreciate the honesty here. Yeah. I'm not a priest, though. I can't help. maybe we can help financially for two years now that I can't afford stuff that I'm broke and that I like staying in I'm not I'm not broke I can afford pretty much what I want

I'm out of debt 100% I own my house and she thinks you're broke because for two years you were like hey listen I'm strapped for cash Yep, pretty much And she, it's not like I've been mooching off her or anything Like I I pay my way I don't I'm not trying to be worthless in that matter or anything

But Why then? I just like I've got a 95, 95 Toyota's coma She's always asking me why don't I get something else And I always tell her I can't afford it Why? Why don't I just tell her I'm happy with my truck

I mean, yeah What's yeah What's behind all of the pathological It was pretty stupid, wasn't it? Is it because you just said it? And then once you said it, you were like, I got to stick to it now. You got to play this weird character? No, I mean.

What is her financial situation? Is she bad with money? Is that why, are you afraid that if you tell her that you are good with money, that she'll start mooching off you? That's been my, that's what I've happened in the past. Ah, so there's some past baggage and trauma. And so you're going, well, I'm not going to do that again. That hurt. Yes.

And so now I'm going to lie because if she knows I have money, I could get hurt again. Yes. Is that a more accurate picture? Because usually behind every lie, there's a fear. There's a lie that you've told yourself long before you lied to someone else. Yes. And honestly, I didn't even realize it's been a lie until a couple months ago. And then I'm thinking, like, I'm wanting to get serious with this girl.

and I'm wanting to make things happen. So she's going to have to find out sooner than later. How long have you been dating? We've been about two years. So two years, and you've been saying this from the jump, here's what I want to know, because I know you're saying that you've been lying. I'm trying to, I want to go a little bit deeper on this.

So does she think that you have mortgage debt or you just haven't mentioned it? Does she think that you carry debt? She knows my house is. paid off. Okay. Okay. So I was, I was, uh, I was very proud whenever I paid my house off. I, she was the first one that I'd let know when I paid my house off about six months ago. But like when it comes to doing fun or what you might think of extravagant things, even though you're thinking, hey, yeah, I might enjoy doing that. You're lying and saying, no, I don't

spend money on that. I just like a simple life, right? Yes. Yes. Is it affecting your relationship? Is she frustrated that you guys can't enjoy experiences? and eating out. I mean, she's a very, very simple woman, and that's kind of what's... I would just have to come to Jesus' conversation. Take her to a different environment and maybe a different place, a date, whatever, and say, listen, I got to come clean because I want this relationship to be built on trust. I've done a poor job of that.

And then say, here's what I did, here's why I did it, and I am very sorry. Will you forgive me? Can we move forward with this relationship with honesty? Yes, okay. That's the only way forward. And her response is now that's up to her how she responds. She might say kick rocks, pound, sand, I'm done with this relationship. I just have a funny thought about this, though.

Like usually, okay, here's the thing, Eli. Usually if somebody says they've been lying, I'm like ready to go hard in the paint. But I'm listening to you. You have no debt. You have a paid off mortgage. Part of me is like, how much are you lying? Because I'm like, you seem like you are kind of a simple guy who doesn't want to spend a lot of money. because you've done all of these things.

So I'm trying to, I need an example of like what you said that was a lie. Like what you've been saying to her. Because I'm like, it sounds, you sound pretty simple to me. Basically, the most, the simplest example is, uh, I was working on my, my pickup truck. It's a 95 Toyota. And it's kind of a hunk of junk, but I grew up dirt poor. Okay. And I love, I love that truck.

I don't need anything else. Yeah. I hardly ever drive. She asked me, well, why don't I just get something newer and better? And I told her I can't afford it. Okay. When really you feel like the reason is I just don't want it. It's not a priority for you.

Yeah. Okay. But you felt weird saying that. It was easier for you to lie to have the guys of like, well, it's too much money for me. Yes. And then her family went on a cruise a while. back and I didn't go because I couldn't afford it, is what I said. But really what you're feeling is you came from being dirt poor and you're, it sounds like

you're afraid to go back to that. And so certain things that other people might splurge and spend money on, you're like, listen, I don't feel the need to do that. Yes, I really don't. Okay. So maybe it's just a simple thing of changing the language and next time you talk to her, you're saying, you know what, I've been telling you I can't afford things but I want you to know my heart I technically I can't afford it I just don't care about spending money on those sorts of things you know me I've got a paid off house you know I don't carry debt and my priorities with money I feel like sometimes our priorities with money are different and maybe that's the conversation because I you kind of painted yourself to be a lie like a liar

about it I don't know it doesn't feel like you don't seem like a terrible person yeah and it's the weirdest thing to lie it's most people would say I lied I'm actually in crippling debt Right. And she thinks I'm very wealthy. Yeah, it's just your motivation. You're not telling her your true motivation. But I would say, I think it's okay to just sit her down and say, I need to be honest with you. I know, like, this is a big deal to me. It may not be to you, but my phrasing and language has not been honest. Yeah. When I tell you that I'm broke, I don't have the money. Really, it's just, it's not a priority for me, and I don't care to spend money on those things. But it's my bad for positioning myself like I was some broke person when truly I'm not.

That's right. And maybe even line it up. with the next part of that, which you did let us know that you're kind of worried that if she knows that you technically can afford to do these things, you're worried that she's going to try to inflate your lifestyle in a way that you don't necessarily agree with or want to do. And I think it's important to have those conversations before you think about things like getting engaged or getting married because you do want to find out, you know, and it's, don't get me wrong. It's okay if she's different from you, but you guys need to start figuring out what that balance looks like. And to George's point, you being very honest in your communication

from here on out is going to be very important. Okay. I hope that helps, Eli. That's a very interesting conundrum. Thanks for trusting us with this situation. Yeah. Wow. All right, let's try to take a quick one here from Mike in St. Louis up next. What's happening, Mike? Hey, guys. Thanks for taking my call. Sure. How can we help? Hey, so I'm wondering if my wife and I can pause baby steps four and five to finish baby step six in under 24 months. And the reason I'm kind of feeling that way is because I'm looking at it the same way you guys look at baby step three, B, where you can pause investing for two years or less while you're saving up money for a house.

It's just I already have a house. So I'm trying to get your guys thoughts on that. Short answer is I'm always going to tell somebody to walk the baby steps in order. Um, how much do you owe on the house? What are we talking about? Just checked. Yeah, it's 137,000 left. And how many kids do you have? Just one. And how old are you guys?

I'm 30 and she's 28. Okay. And the child, I imagine, is very young? Actually, she's 13. She's from previous relationship. Okay. So we're talking. And what's the- College in five years? Do you have enough covered right now to cover? college or to help pay for it?

We have about 30,000, which would cover the first, probably year or two, depending on where you weren't. And you're doing no investing right now? Oh, no, we are doing baby steps four and five right now. We would pause to do this. I love your excitement to get the house paid off. I don't think the juice is worth the squeeze on this, to pause the investing, to pause college. I would just keep investing 15%, put some money towards college.

The house will get paid off probably a year later, big whoop. I don't think you need the gazelle intensity that you currently have. You're moving from intense to intentional in baby steps, four, five, and six. I'd stay that way. Thanks for the call. This is The Ramsey Show. Hey, guys, George here. You know I hate debt, and that includes sleep debt.

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That's casper.com slash Ramsey. Promocode Ramsey. Exclusions apply. Welcome back to the Ramsey show. I'm George Camel, joined by Jade Warshaw. The number to call is AAA 825-5-2-2-25. Well, it's time for our long-running segment, Jade. And by long-running, you mean.

This is the third time? Third time. Okay. That's long for me, you know. So it's called pick aside, and this is where we have two people on the line, and we have to help them kind of settle a debate, and you and I, at the end of it, have to pick a side after we hear them out and hear their case. I enjoy this thoroughly.

I pitched Judge George for the name of this segment. They didn't like that. Judge George? And I wanted a little gavel. Oh, just a little baby gavel. Then I'm going to pitch Judge Jade. Oh, dang, that's so much cooler. All right.

I give up. Here we go. Let's see what Jennifer and Joe have to say in Denver, Colorado. What's going on, guys? Hi. Yeah, I'm ready to buy a new car, and my husband thinks I'm fine with the one that I have. Ooh. Wow. All right, Joe, what do you have to say for yourself? Well, I do agree that she needs a new car. She just wants to spend way too much on a new car. What does she want to spend? $50,000.

Okay. That's a lot of money. And that's the most you guys have ever spent on anything outside of a house, I'm guessing? Yes. Okay. Where are you guys at financially? We're on baby step seven. Paid for a house, no debt, love it. And what's your net worth?

It would be what our house is worth. Yeah, $600,000. Plus retirement? $700. So not quite a million? No. Okay. All right.

And what's the household income? $150, approximately. Last year we did $150. Okay. And how much cash do you guys have in the bank? We have our emergency fund right now of $10,000. And I got $10,000 in my business account. So $10,000 and $10,000, if you were to buy this car, A,

is it, were you thinking of getting something brand spanking new, and two, how are you going to pay for it? I would want to save up for it. Okay. And I don't necessarily want something new. It's just what I want just came out. So I want to wait a couple of years until I can buy one a couple years old. What kind of car is it? Can you tell us?

It's the Toyota Grand Highlander. Highlander. Where's John Deloney when we need him? That's what he ended up getting. I need like a picture of a Highlander. I don't really know what that is. I'm going to Google it. They're beautiful.

Really great cars. Okay. So what is the car you're currently? driving? I have a 2007 Accura MDX and it's getting close to 200,000 miles on it. Oh, she's just getting started. That's a nice old ride though. The MDX is invincible. Okay, love that. And what is he driving? I'm curious. I have a 2004 GMC pickup truck. And then we also have a 2020 transit connect van. I'm self-employed and so I use that van for work. Cool. Okay. Might be time for both you'd upgrade baby step seven living like no one else i know that's right so i'm guessing you guys have a

sizable margin in your budget now to save up how much could you throw every single month just to kind of a side savings account oh i think we could have it saved in six months wow yes yeah that's pretty impressive pretty simple so yeah i mean we could save five six thousand a month that's great of our expenses okay so um tell us joe why tell us what you would do if it were your choice Obviously, we know Jennifer wants his $50,000 Toyota Highlander, slightly used. In your book, what's something a little bit more reasonable? 30, 35,000, maybe not the Grand Highlander, but the regular Highlander. That's what I'm looking at.

This one I'm looking at is like 30,000, 20203 Highlander, L.E. Is that not the one? No, I want the Grand Highlander. You want the big boy. They just came out in 2024. Okay. Got you. Joe, I'm curious. Where did you get that 35 number from? Just your heart? Oh, yeah, just my heart. I mean, I look on Craigslist, and you can find the regular Highlanders.

Yeah, I see one. 30,000 miles for 30,000 or so. Yeah, I see what's going on here. Okay, interesting. Oh, all right. We have a lot of information here. I feel like, you know, we've been doing Dave Ramsey's baby steps for a long time. I feel like I've been living like nobody else. When do I, we're on Baby Step 7. When do I get to live like nobody else? Listen, I feel that.

So tell me, when was the last time you did an activity that you would call a live like no one else, the latter, that you've done? Like at least a couple of grand, where you're like, we drop some money on this. We went to the Dominican, yeah. Okay. When was that? Last month. Nice. Okay, okay.

So you guys are enjoying life. Yes. So we would say you've driven. like no one else now it's time to drive like no one else you've driven the the hoopty Dave car now it's trying to drive the Dave car you know what I'm saying I've made up my mind I know what I'm I know how I'm gonna vote it's it got in a car accident a couple months ago so it's dinged up on the side oh man listen you keep you keep playing tell us more she's like really playing it up all these stupid little things don't work on it anymore like you cannot reset my clock

so you can't tell what time it is in there Jennifer I call special features. My seatbelt doesn't go back. Listen, I got my phone in the car. I got my Apple watch in the car. I know what time it is. It's fine. That's not a big deal.

But I'm with you. Okay, can I vote? I know what my vote is. Are we casting votes? I think we're casting votes. You guys ready to hear the verdict? Let's say it on three. All right.

Are the name of the person that we think is right? Yeah, say the name of the person you think is right on three. One, two, three. Jennifer. Yes. Jennifer, you just won a brand new. I'm just kidding. Toyota Highlander.

That'd be fantastic. Now, Dinette's it from Broi Hill. What do you think? Are you shocked? No. I'm shocked. Of course, Joe is shocked. Here's the thing, because I know this, we bought my wife a new to us car.

It was a slightly used luxury car, and it hurt my soul, Joe, to write that check. But I also knew this is part of living the plan. That's part of the plan. And I have a hard time letting go and writing a big check like that. But when you pay for it in cash, you go, oh my gosh, that was a lot. And then you go, this is paid for. This is amazing. This is a huge blessing.

And it's why we lived like this for so many years. And so I think you guys are doing the right thing. Just so you know the parameters here, you don't want all things with motors and wheels to be more than half of your annual income. So that's where I'm going, all right, $150K is your income. Everything you own should be $75K. Listen, Joe, you could turn around and get yourself a $50,000 car and be all right. Now, what is this transit connect worth?

About $20,000, I guess. Yeah. So even the $20 plus the $50 for hers, that would be $70. You still got some wiggle room there. Not too much. Not too much. And maybe you wait three years and you get the Highlander. But I think you go for it in two years from now and you get a two-year-old grand Highlander.

And if you can't wait that long, then just go for a normal Highlander. and you can always upgrade later. Nothing says you have to drive this car for the next 20 years, which is kind of how you guys have been living. Right. I feel like Joe is really disappointed unless he was waiting.

No, you shouldn't spend more than 30. But I think that will help you guys to go, okay, half of our income shouldn't be tied up in these things. That means we do need to scale back because this transit, plus the car Joe is going to get, plus the car Jennifer is going to get,

it's going to add up to be a large part of our world. And then once you hit millionaire status, you can go buy that brand new car and here's why it's not a you know fundamentalist thing it's just that too much of your world would be tied up in a depreciating asset but when you have a million dollar net worth you can stomach that hit on depreciation a little easier and so you guys will be there no time how old are you two i'm 45 and i'm 56 oh my goodness you got so much time to live and drive like no one else and you know what joe i think it should be time for you to upgrade after what is your dream car joe it's a 30,000

$1,000 car. We know that. It's the one he's got. I actually love my truck. He wants another GMC pickup. No, he wants to keep the one he has. I like the one I got. That's amazing. It's got an eight-foot bed.

It's got the diesel, and I'm good. Thank you, Joe. They don't make those eight-foot beds anymore. All these new pavement princesses out here got the tiniest little beds. I'm like, what do we even buying pickup trucks for anymore? So then, Joe, real quick, tell us, if you could spend $30,000 on anything, not a vehicle, what is your thing? Like, what's your live like no one else thing? I would do a boat.

Hey, okay. There we go. Now we got it. Joe's in the boat. Thank you guys so much for the call and for letting us have some fun. Exciter for you guys to make that cash purchase of that beautiful new to you car very, very soon. More of your calls coming up. AAA 8255-225.

This is The Ramsey Show. The holidays can come with a lot of pressure to spend. Family, friends, secret Santa at the office, all the things. But y'all, this season should be about peace, not payments. That's a big reason why I love Fairwin's credit union. They share the Ramsey values of helping you reach your money goals without debt. And with the Fairwin Smart bundle, Ramsey fans get a no-fee checking account, high-yield savings to grow your emergency fund and the exclusive Ramsey B Weird debit card.

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R-E-F-Y.com slash Ramsey. This may not be available in all states. Today's question comes from Alyssa in Pennsylvania. Oh, never mind. It's Courtney in Iowa. We had two. I'm going to go with Courtney in Iowa, final answer. She asked,

My ex-husband and I received a large inheritance during our marriage and set aside college money for both of our children. Now my ex is financially strapped and has asked our youngest son for his college fund, which he didn't end up needing to fund his education.

Our son is 24, and getting married soon, and I trust he will use the money responsibly. I can't believe my ex has put our youngest son into a terrible position. Is our son morally obligated to give his father this money? Short answer, I'm going to say no. There's no moral obligation. There's no legal obligation. No.

I have questions, though. I mean, my first thought is, okay, the parents put the money aside for the kids in the 529. They list the child as the beneficiary. unless there was a discussion that was like, hey, if you don't use this money, it goes back to us and they change the beneficiary back to themselves or the wife or whatever. I don't know. But if it's still in the son's name, I'd be like, this is my money. Or, I mean, he's about to get married.

How cool would it be to change the beneficiary to their kid? That's what I'm saying, yes. In a year or two or five or whoever. You know, I think that's, and part of this is we're enabling this ex's bad behavior for a grown man to just suddenly be financially strapped and he to rob his kids college fund tells me a lot about the character of this person. Right. Because a 529 is a gift. Like is you gifting the gift of education to your... Well, the confusing part is this came from a large inheritance during their marriage that they then set aside in a college fund. Yeah, but still, even if they had worked to save the money,

you know, it would still be money that they earmarked and said this is a gift to our kids for their education. So in many ways, it does feel like revoke, like, like, turning around on a gift. Yeah. I'm, I don't like it. Yeah, I don't like it. Yeah, I don't like this ex have it. I think he needs to find a different method to get this money than to rob the college fund, which, by the way, we'll come with a whole bunch of penalties. You got to pay income taxes plus the 10% penalty on top of that. And so I, I hate to see that when this money's been growing tax free. It can be used for future generations to allow them to go to college debt free. And who knows what college is going to cost, or 20 years from now.

Right, right, right. When this son has kids. Yeah. And if you're, I mean, let's just pretend for a second. Let's play this out, George. Let's say how much money would need to have been in there to pay for kids college? Maybe there's $70,000 in there to pay for the whole thing. If he didn't use it, then this is idea of my ex is financially strapped.

Like, you don't suddenly up in need $50,000 or $70,000. That's over time many decisions being made. so yeah my final answer is this whole thing just gives me heartburn just looking at it but I would say no your son is not morally obligated to give his father this money and I wouldn't if I were him and if I were the mom so I can keep going on this and if I were the mom it was both of their inheritance that's the we don't know where this came from and all that well she says my ex-husband and I received an inheritance I'm like part of this is on her too like she should get to decide And if she says no, this is our son's money, that on that.

You can figure it out. All right. Thanks for the question. That's a real, it's like a common core math problem. It hurt my brain. These are the hard topics that George and I go after on the Ramsey show. It's very hard-hitting content. That's what we do.

All right, let's go to David in Providence, Rhode Island. What's going on, David? Oh, hello. Hello? How are you? Hi. I'm good. How are you?

I like how Dave puts it. I'm better than I deserve. Okay. Love to hear it. How can we help today? Um, so me and my wife are in an interesting, um, financial choice right now. Um, and I think it's kind of like a pivotal choice. And I just need some advice. Um, so we have no debt, no kids. Um, Lord willing, we'd like to have kids in about five years. Okay. Um, and then at that point, you know, we would go down to like a single income. You know, we just would both value her being a full time mother. Um, so we have about 40 to 45,000 dollars saved up in the bank. Um, and we're currently renting an apartment right now.

Um, our rent is, uh, 1575 a month, um, which is sort of average for the area that we live in. Um, um, so our question, my, uh, my question rather is, um, do we buy a home that we can afford right now that would not really suit us when we have children, meaning we would, we would probably have to sell it in about five years. Or do we continue to rent for like another three to five years? And then buy a house that would be bigger, maybe, maybe suit us more as a larger family. Why would you need to sell when you have one kid? That's what I was going to ask. Yeah, I mean, we really wouldn't need to sell for like the first kid. We kind of both would like

to have more than just one though um but yeah i mean like but that stretches you to like five or that stretches five years to like maybe seven years no um as far as space because an infant is like this big yeah well so maybe i should define the space a little better i mean they don't make one bedroom homes or well what we're looking at is 200 200 000 for uh not really a home i guess it's more like a cottage. It's 650 square feet. That's like a tiny home. That's super small. Yeah. It's pretty small. Okay.

That does change in a little bit. That's tiny. So what if we got something more reasonable? Let's say it's a two or three bedroom to where you could grow into it even with two kids, even if it was a little bit tight. What would that cost you? In this area, I mean, there's nothing. It would either need such a large amount of repair that it's like really a huge undertaking. Like, more than that. just from average fixer upper. So what about one in good condition?

You don't have to do some HD TV show. Yeah, the price would be probably about like $350 or so. That's reasonable. And you're going to keep saving a down payment. Is 45 everything you have in savings? Does that include your emergency fund? Or is this just earmarked for down payment? That's everything we have, yeah.

Okay. That does change it a little bit too. So I would, and what's your household income? Yeah, so right now with both of us, it's about 160 to 100. $70,000 a year. But if, you know, after we have a kid and my wife would stop, you know, making an income, right, then I would go down to about, I don't know, 110 or so. I mean, it depends on with me getting a raise between now and then and whatever, but, you know, around 110. Okay. I would say you're on the path and I would just set the home budget that makes

sense and then go, okay, well, how much more down payment do we need to save up to make this affordable to where it's no more than 25% of our take home pay? And that, I would say, I would base that take on pay off of your income alone since you know that's the goal. Yeah. And the good thing is your rent is not astronomical. Like your rent is not far out that I'd be like, you got to get out of this rent. You're paying $3,000 a month for rent, right? You guys' rent is at a good spot.

And I don't think that I'd be interested. I know it's not an actual tiny house, but I don't think I'd get into this tiny house deal. I think I'd ride the wave and just go, you know what, we're going to take the, instead of living five years in this 600 square foot, house that basically is an apartment let's live in an apartment and let's save up this money and do this this 350,000 dollar deal okay yeah yeah that's kind of what we were thinking about I value the opinion thank you so much absolutely thanks for what it's worth our apartment is actually bigger than the house it's nothing crazy but it doesn't take much I know right 700 square foot apartment you just beat the cottage for sure so I would I would go slow there's no urgency or

rush on this and I would just stack up as much as I can while you have two incomes and no kids, now is the time. Yeah. And you might need to save up 100 grand or 150 grand to make this payment affordable for your solo income in the future. But that's what I would do. I would aim for that 350 house and try to get there as soon as possible because, Jade, like we know, it's a moving target. Yeah, that's right. Three years from now, that might be a 450 house. That's right. So you still want to move with urgency, still move with intensity. And of course, we never want that payment to be more than 25% of your take home pay all in. That's thinking about things like homeowners, all of it. So that's the framework

that we're working with. Hey, thanks for hanging out with us. That does it for this hour of the show. George and I will be right back with you before you know it. This is The Ramsey Show. Hey guys, you know those too good to pass up holiday promos? Well, they can be great. But with every spin of the digital wheel, the newsletter sign up,

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subscription. And Ramsey listeners can get 20% off those annual plans at join deleteme.com slash Ramsey with Code Ramsey at checkout. Do it today. That's join delete me.com slash Ramsey code Ramsey. in the Fairwinds Credit Union Studio. I'm George Camel, joined by Jade Warshaw this hour. And the number to call is triple 8-825-5-2-2-25. If you want to join the conversation and pose your question for the good of the group

and for the good of America. Chris has chosen to do that. He's in Washington. What's going on, Chris? Hi, guys. Thanks for taking my call. I really appreciate it. Sure. How can we help? So my wife and I were new parents,

well, relatively new. Our son's nine months old. I'm super excited about that. We made the decision to have her stay at home because daycare was too expensive. And we're just trying to figure out if you guys have any tips and tricks to managing our money going forward and making sure that we're setting ourselves up for success in retirement and setting him up for college and all that good stuff. Yeah. So what was she making before she decided to stay home? she was making about 75,000 a year okay and what do you make i currently make 110 roughly annually and then i have a side business that i run that brings on anywhere from 20 to 45 a year okay so we'll just say that you're at 130 you feel good about that yeah okay yeah and so have you guys done a new

every dollar budget with this 130 because how much does that allow you to take home every month you know, that's, that's been really, really new for us. And so, you know, if I had to put a number on it, I mean, we have our mortgage. We have no other consumer debt. We've done a really, really good job that all of our vehicles paid off and everything like that. And so, you know, our mortgage is roughly $2,400 a month. And then living expenses, you know, at another, you know, $300, $350. Yeah, I don't think your mortgage is going to be the problem. I think probably it's feeling. The unclarity. I'm wondering, it sounds like you have like a little bit of regret, like, ugh, should we have done this? Things feel tight. So where is that coming from?

Yeah, I just, I'm so analytical when it comes to, like, looking at our budget and we've, you know, both worked really, really hard coming out of, you know, roughly $95,000 in student loan debt, you know, over the past three years. And, you know, we've just worked really, really hard. and I don't ever want to put our family in a place where we're in need for money. You know what I mean? And we've been a really, really good job of that. We have a bunch of money put aside already, you know. So you're following the baby steps to a T?

Yeah, pretty, I mean, I would say so, yeah. You said that, but you didn't answer the question when I said how much you're bringing home every month. Oh, yeah. I mean, we bring home probably, let's see, 40, no, 60, 800 a month, roughly. So I'm going to challenge, I'm going to challenge you for your own good because you described yourself in one way, and don't get me wrong, it probably was the way that you were before you had an eight-month-old. You said, I'm very analytical and I'm really on this, but the truth is right now you're actually not on your numbers.

You're kind of guessing at them. And I have a theory that the reason that you're feeling that tightness or that feeling of like you don't like the way your money is feeling, I think it's more because you don't know exactly what's going on and you don't have a clear path and plan for it. That's why I asked about your every dollar budget. Because if you look at that tonight with your wife, once the baby's down, once you guys have had something to eat and you say, okay, we're going to look at every dollar tonight. We're going to plug in our numbers.

We're going to log on HR and find out exactly what the check is. And now we're going to plug in the mortgage, everything we think we're spending money on. What does life look like now with an eight-month-old? How much are we spending on diapers now versus when the baby was first born? All of those things are going to give you a much clearer picture on what it looks like today with the new lifestyle that you're in today. And I think that's actually going to help you because 130,000 where you live, I think you should be okay. Now, don't keep me wrong, to lose $75,000 a year is a lot of money. But that actually led me to my other point of it's just one baby, right?

Right. And you're telling me that it costs $75,000 a year to daycare one baby. That's not true. No, no, it wasn't much of that. It was, you know, more so, you know, I want, A, right it was expensive to do daycare and be for the for the for the amount of money it was going to cost us you know she wanted to stay home and wanted to okay uh raise our son and which is fine that's fine but the way you framed it was it wasn't worth it for her to go to work you made it seem like it was more of a cost thing so it's

just personal values yeah yeah i guess yeah you're right and that's fine i think all of that though what i'm trying to get you to is clarity and i think if you can clearly say we're doing this because we value mom being at home with baby, that is a whole different conversation than it's too expensive. We can't afford daycare, right? So now you're talking about real things, which is no, this is a value of ours, which knowing that is also going to reflect how you feel now about the budget being shorter because you've said, no, in our hearts, we want this. So now we're able to tackle a smaller budget or working with a smaller income. Do you see what I'm saying? I'm just trying to get real. I mean, George, you know how it feels to have an eight-month-old at the house.

Oh, yeah. I got a newborn, a two-year-old. old, life is chaotic. And that's where you and your wife sitting down looking at the budget every month and just going, okay, I want to bring seven grand in this month, and our mortgage is 2400, we're going to have a thousand left over. What are we going to do with this? And for you guys, you already have the emergency fund? Yes, we do. Are you investing 15% out of every paycheck? We are. Okay. And then beyond that, how much margin would you say you have at the end of every month, or is it disappearing into random spending? I would say more disappearing into random spending. I think that's what's making you feel out of control because you're analytical.

You're going, like, the math ain't mathing. There should be two grand laying around, and it's gone. And it's amazing. If you, like, take all the receipts of all the money you spent, it'll make a little bitty book of the reasons why we feel that way. And so that's where budgeting with the new every dollar with your bank connected, the transactions are flowing in, total transparency and accountability with you and your wife. And then you might decide, oh, you know what?

Yeah, we need to be spending more because she's like, dude, I'm spending it on things the family needs. We just need to up the budget line item to account for that instead of going red flag, red flag, you're over budget. So I think there's probably just some discongruity with like what you're actually spending versus what you think you're spending. Your life has changed a lot. And I mean, there's the kid and then there's, yeah, wife is at home. Money-wise things have changed and it's just like George said, reflecting your line items to updating your line items to reflect that change. Yep.

No, I appreciate that a lot. And that's something that we've actually embarked on recently is kind of combining our finances, just listening to you guys and kind of buying into that, buying into that idea of, you know, becoming a unit, you know, and we're, you know, working through those things. And so I really appreciate the feedback. I love it. I think you're doing a great job.

And I think that you're a... You're doing better than you think. Uh-huh. And you're a reflection of the fact that this whole thing is a process. Like, no one just in one day or in one live. listen or in one movement gets it all. It is like building blocks, stacking on each other. And like you said, first we did the combined finance thing, then we did the payoff thing. All of that is stacking up, and I just, I think you're doing fabulous.

Are you using a spreadsheet right now? Are you using a budgeting app? Yeah, we're using a spreadsheet because that's, that's, that's my MO. How many times has she said, hey, can I look at that budget spreadsheet? That sounds fun. Zero. Thank you. Final answer, Your Honor. I'm case closed on that one. We're going to send you the brand new, all new every dollar for you to have something that not only would a wife like to look at, but now she doesn't have to say, can I see that spreadsheet? You can just say, she'll open her own app and be able to see it. There we go. That'll help get her on board on top of combining finances.

Proud of you guys. You're making progress, man. That's all you can hope for. Dave, we got a lot of calls on this show where life happens. One day someone's healthy, they're working, providing for their family, and then a curveball hits. You know, we hear it all the time. A car accident, a cancer diagnosis, a heart attack, and suddenly everything changes. Yeah, and that's why you've always said that having term life insurance from Xander is essential because it protects your family if the worst happens.

Yeah, that's right. You need 10 to 12 times your income in coverage. No gimmicks, no whole life junk, just straightforward term life protection. But there's another piece that people often overlook, and that's long-term disability insurance. Yeah, it's important to understand the difference between them. Life insurance steps in when you die. Disability insurance steps in while you're alive but can't work. So it replaces a large part of your income so the bills still get paid while you get back on your feet.

Now, if your employer gives you free disability insurance, great. Take it. If it's discounted there at a better price, take it. But if not, Zander can help you find the right plan. Whether you're single or married, it's not optional. If you're going to be out of work for a while, then you need to make sure the money still showing up. And that's why Zander is our go-to. They make it super simple to get the right coverage at the best price, no pressure, no upselling. I've trusted Jeff Zander and Zander insurance for over 25 years. so is my family. So don't wait. It's fast, it's easy, and it could make all the difference. Go to zander.com or call 800, 356, 4282. Protect yourself, protect your income, protect your family. Welcome back to The Ramsey Show. I'm George. Camel joined by Jade Warshaw this hour. The number to call is AAA 825-5-2-2-25. You call us up. We'll talk about your life and your money. Jacob is up next in Los Angeles, California. What's going on,

Jacob? Hi, thank you for taking my call. Sure. How can we help? So I kind of need some, I guess, some direction in terms of what to do next to my life financially. My parents recently went through a divorce and so I kind of had to take over um as like the main contributor to the household financially um currently living with my mother and my younger sibling um so i'm kind of paying for mortgage uh you know all the insurances why why is that why is mom not working oh no no she is she is so um because uh you know cost of living in california is insane um I the way we set it up is I pay for I say I'm I want to estimate like 60 to 70% of my take home pay and then the rest is made up on my younger sibling and my mother how old are you from 28 right now okay so when you say 60 to 7% 70% of your income tell us dollar wise how much how much money is this costing you every month I would say maybe around 28 to 3,000 okay so you're spending 3,000 bucks kind of paying the the things that make the house go around and tell me again explain to me

again why mom is not contributing no no she is um but but how much is she contributing if you're contributing that much right now she's contributing maybe like 15 hundred and explain to me why that is well she doesn't really make much um so because i make the most in the household right now so I wanted to, you know, obviously... So did she ask you to take on the brunt of this, or was this something you sort of stepped up and went, Mom, here's what I'm going to do? Yeah, no, I definitely stepped up.

I mean, it isn't fair for her to, or for me to force her to try and find a job out of nowhere. The scary part is it's not fair for you to prop up a lifestyle that's not sustainable for them. Because let's say you go up and get married next year, you move out, you're not still paying all of their bills. And how old's your sister? My sister is 25.

I guess to give a little bit more information. So in terms of the unsustainable lifestyle, it more or less is the reason she got a job is because if me and my sister were to contribute 100% of our take-home pay, we would be able to afford all the groceries and everything else to live. But because she, as a wonderful,

mother she is she's like oh I don't want you or both of you to you know not have any savings for the future so she said I'm going to get a job to do it but because objection wait a minute let me let me jump in here okay couple quick questions you guys live in Los Angeles but it doesn't sound like it's for the reason of a career like nobody's like listen I started my my firm here and now this is where I'm at it sounds like you guys are kind of making ends meet to use your terminology, why are you still living in such an unsustainable to quote you in an inexpensive area? Well, my dad's business was here, so we all moved here and my mom does help with that. Even through the divorce, you know, it wasn't an ugly divorce, you know, now it was one of the

situations where, you know, they got married, you know, out of, you know, necessity because they needed to help each other. But that money's not filtering into your lifestyle now because they're now divorced and the two children are grown. So my question stands, it sounds like if this is an unsustainable situation for your mom, and I'm saying your mom because the two kids are grown, like you're grown. It sounds like she's got to decide where can she live. That's not Los Angeles, California, and afford her lifestyle, because here's my second part of this. You're 28, your sister's 25 typically the reason that somebody would say somebody your age would say hey I'm living at home is typically because they've got student loans they've got bills and it's cheaper for them to live

at home than it is for them to maybe do something on their own and in your case that's not really the case because you're paying for your mom's life and I understand that there's you know been something traumatic here with the divorce but it still doesn't place that ball in your court do you see what I'm saying and so I think all three of you have to go what does my life look like. Where can I live where I can afford to be an independent person? Because do you have debt? No, I have no debt. There's nothing that stops you from saying, hey, I'm going to go a further radius out from, you know, Los Angeles, California, wherever that is. And I'm going to figure out where I can live to do a job that I can make more money doing and support my lifestyle. What are you

earning now? And what is your job now? I'm an analyst for a film studio. And I'm a, I'm an analyst for a film studio. I earn gross is around $80,000. Okay, so that's great. To me, $80,000, you're doing good. Like, there's got to be a life that you can have on $80,000. Is that fair enough? Yeah. Okay.

There, Jacob, on my screen here, it says, how do I make enough to take care of my mom? Is that the ultimate question? Are you wanting to make more so she can stop working? Yeah. She's working right now to help contribute, but obviously, you know, she's kind of getting up their names. I don't know how to put that delicately, but because she, you know, English is in the first language, she's turning 60, but she does have some, like, health issues. So what is her plan for retirement? Because right now, you just, you're just going to stunt your growth as an independent person

to just, well, I got to take care of mom for the rest of my life. I'm going to live at home. What if she lives to be 90? Now you're 58 and still propping up her life? Because she didn't prepare? Yeah, that's because that's the kind of situation I'm in. Like, she does kind of have, like, a very loose retirement plan. I don't think it's as structured as I would like, personally. What is it? Lay it out for me. So she said that her plan is to, well, we'll still live in this house that we,

or this condo that we have. And, you know, when she. Did you say wheel, like all of you will still be living together for her retirement? No, my sister is planning to move out. And so it'll just meet me and my mother. but this is not good this is not good this is not good yeah and i know it just is not good but um but yeah once she is old enough to get social security she says she plans on finding like one of those um like i guess like apartments or whatever that is like income based or like low income

something like that and um kind of live there but i guess another piece of information is my parents do have a second property that's paid off and that's they're getting like rental income but because of the divorce they were debating whether or not selling it or just splitting what it's worth if they were to sell it what would they what would they take to have to split um i think collectively if they sold did they get maybe around a million okay so she'd get 500 000 and then have to take out fees and whatnot right yeah is she getting rental income right now from this property yeah right now it's already been paid off for years and they've been kind of How much is she making from that?

Now that it's split, she'll make around 1,000. And then what is she making from her job? Right now, she's only, she's in like LDcare, so I guess it's based off how many people she takes care of. She's only taking care of one person, so she earns around 1,500 net. But she says she is planning on, you know, assisting another person that would bring her income to me.

Listen, I don't mean any harm. You got to separate yourself from the situation. this is going to pull you under, dude. You're going to the opposite direction by saying, I'm going to work more so mom doesn't have to work. Because that becomes enabling. And you're going to have to keep that up for the rest of your life. Because mom's not going to up and get a job 10 years from now

if you decide to move out. Right. And right now, to your point, you're paying 60 to 70% of the household expenses. She has no reason. And in her mind, the plan is your sister can go on along, but you're going to live with me until I'm done. And that really puts,

you in a bad position. If I were your mom, I would be talking to ex-husband. I'd say, we need to sell this property because I need this $500,000 and I need it in my nest egg so it can grow for me for the next 10 years. And she still has to work for the next 10 years. That's right. Oh, my goodness. So, Jacob, we're basically telling you to do everything opposite the way you're headed right now. And it's because we care for you. We care for your mom. We want her to have a great life. And currently her loose retirement plan is going to end up stunting your growth for the next decade or two or three. And so we need to end this co-dependence right now. Otherwise, it's going to hurt both of you in the long run. So sorry to hear that, man. This is The Ramsey Show.

people counting on you, your team, your family, not to mention your customers. And when you're the one signing the paychecks, you can't afford to fly blind. But I'll be honest, early on, one thing that nearly sunk us was wasting time with spreadsheets that didn't add up because business units didn't talk to each other. I finally told my team, just fix it. And they did. We got NetSuite. That was years ago. And we've never looked back. See, NetSuite isn't just for tech giants. It's built for growing businesses like yours. Over 43,000 businesses already run on NetSuite, including a lot that started just like you. And now with built-in AI, NetSuite is helping them even more. It's one system connected to every part of your business for real-time insights, not guesswork. NetSuite AI flags

inventory issues, cash flow risks, even supplier delays before they become problems. So you can trust the data. Stop wasting time and make the right decisions faster. Take a free product tour today at NetSuite.com slash Ramsey. That's netsuite.com slash Ramsey. Welcome back to The Ramsey Show. I'm George Camel, joined by Jade Warshaw, open loans at AAA 825-5-2-2-25. Jessica's up next in Nashville, Tennessee, right up the road. What's going on, Jessica? Hi, thank you so much for taking my call.

Sure. How can we help today? So me and my husband recently started listening to the podcast and really getting into finances, and we only have about $2,000 left on our credit card, which will be done within the end of the year. We're looking at our student loans, and we just don't know what to do. mine are all kind of like little tiny like 2,000, 3,000 loans, whereas his is like a giant $45,000 loan and we don't know if there's a difference in who we should tackle first. Okay.

Well, I love number one that you guys are kind of on this road together. You've decided it's important for you both to pay off the debt and you've decided that it's important to work together. So kudos to that. For this, it really is just the methodology of the debt snowball. And all that is, is we list all the debt between the both of you in order from smallest to largest based on balance. So not payment amount, not interest amount, but by balance. So right now, you're kind of already doing that.

You've got 2,000 left on this credit card. And then what you do with these student loans is you both pull up your, you know, screen of your provider and you go through smallest to largest. Like you said, yours are busted up in little bitty guys. and so you list those smallest to largest. And the same thing with his. Is his a federal loan or a private loan? It's a federal. Okay.

And it's just one, right? Because sometimes you make one payment, but when you really go in there and look, it's still listed by semester. No, he had one loan that was going to go into collections, and they told him that he had a consolidate. Got you. One giant federal loan now.

Okay, got you. So that's going to be the final one that you pay, but the good news is because you've worked the snowball, you will have gotten back all those little bits and pieces of payments so you'll be able to hit it with a big shovel um what what's the combined amount that you have in student loans i have about 65 65 and he's got 45 yes okay and then uh what's you guys combined income a hundred thousand okay so you've got a little bit of a journey here you know you've got 112 000 to pay off and you're making a hundred thousand um have you jumped on to every dollar

because we have a really great financial roadmap that you can plug in all your numbers and kind of project what your payoff date is going to be. And then you can project when you'll be on Baby Step 3 and how long that'll take. Have you done that yet? We are on my every dollar fee premium expires today, actually. We just sat down last night and finally put all the numbers in there. You didn't pay for it yet, did you? No, sir.

This feels like a plant, Jessica. Did you call in on the day of the expiration, hoping we'd give you every dollar? I promised I did it. I just happened to look before I called and notice. Yeah, we're going to give it to you. We're going to give it to you. So hang on the line after we're done and we'll help with that. And what I love about every dollar at the bottom,

you're going to list those debts with the minimum payment, with the balance. And it will list them all for you, small as the largest. And it's a great way to keep track of how much extra you're putting on that little one and when it'll be paid off. So that's going to be a big help. But it really is, I think, psychologically motivating to see the little ones get knocked out. And I know you're going to get to that big one and go like, oh, gosh, we're in it now, $45,000 ahead of us.

But you're probably also going to be making more money a year from now than you are, right? Yeah, hopefully. Are you guys doing any side hustles or anything to supplement that $100,000? He does. He does a lot of side projects on the weekends that probably bring about $400 in every other day. Oh, $400 a month? Yes. Okay, great.

Okay, good. So, yeah, my recommendation, I think that if you have debt and this, this is not just for you, but anybody has debt, they need to be bringing in anywhere between $5,000 and $2,000. That for me is the... $500 to $2,000. Yeah, at least $5,000, but if you can get to $2,000, you're swinging for the fences. 500, okay. Yeah, I like that plan. And Jessica, the fun part for me, and maybe I'm a math nerd, I go, okay, how little can we live off of out of this $110? And that might mean we pause investing. It should mean that. If you guys are currently investing, let's pause

that to get some money back on our budget. And then with our take-home pay, we go, all right, it takes us $2,000 to cover all of our basic bills that should free up another $2,000 of our $4,000 take-home pay to tackle the debt. And now you kind of know the gap. Because if you do the math right now, how long is it going to take you to get out of debt at the current pace? Probably about 15 to 20 years. That sucks. Can we agree? Wait a second. She's saying if she makes minimum payments on all the debt, well-ed- month payments. Okay, okay, okay. But if now, now with Jessica's current plan, it's probably more like four or five years. I think so. And the Jade and George plan is like, how do we do this in two

years? Maybe two and a half. And that means there's a gap. All right, instead of throwing a thousand of the debt, we got to throw two thousand. Yeah. And here's what we're going to cut. And that's where the budget is going to be your best friend and show you the reality of where you're spending and what can go. And here's a couple of freebies. I mean, are you guys getting a tax return every year? It's only like two, 300 bucks. Two, 300 bucks. Okay. I mean, you can look at that and see if you can get it down. Probably not. That's pretty close. What about investing? Are you doing any investing? I only do the match my company does into my 401k. Okay. How much is that every month? It's 4% but I just started a new employer so it hasn't even begun yet because I have to be there for

three months. Okay. So let's just not start that because that's going to free up hundreds of dollars that could be going toward debt. And I promise you we'll get back to investing with a vengeance later on. But what happens for most people, Jessica, is they go, well, I want the match, and therefore I'm willing to stay in a debt longer. And I'm kind of comfortable here. And then they do three or four percent for 10 to 15 years. That's right. I'd rather see you do 15 percent two years from now. That's right. Next category, because I'm just trying to help you find money. I want this to happen fast. What do you spend every month on going out to eat? We have a budget that was $50. Okay, good. What about groceries? It's just the two of you?

It is. My husband does, he's like a gym guy, so our budget is about 800. Okay, that's not bad. You might be able to do it a little. Yeah, you might be able to do it a little less, but that's not bad, $800 for two folks. Get that like the boneless chicken thighs from Aldi? You stock up on those. That's plenty of protein. I don't know about a chicken thigh, George. Well, yeah, Jay's not, she's not dabbling on that world. I'm just, I'm a big gym rat myself, Jade. If you I could tell by your bulging biceps. But I do watch a lot of videos about protein for some reason. I don't know. I'm very intrigued by the lifestyle, Jessica.

But the point here, Jessica, is we're going through the budget with a fine-tooth comb. And this is, like I said, for anybody listening. Withholding is a great place to start investing. Look at that food budget. Cars, a lot of times people's opportunity is sitting in their driveway. So tell us about your vehicles. My husband's is in 2012 completely paid off. Okay.

And then mine was gifted to me by my father. I actually don't pay for it. Okay. So that's paid off to. Yeah, so 2018 Toyota. Okay, good. Another thing that's really, people don't think about is insurance. Across the board, reshopping insurance.

If you go to ramsysolutions.com slash checkup, we have a great coverage checkup. It'll take you just a few minutes to do the quiz. And I helped a friend here, actually, reach out to Zander. They reshopped their insurance, and they had better coverage while saving $80 a month. $80 back in the budget. So just doing something like that. just go with homeowners auto across the board could save you a hundred bucks 200 bucks a month yeah and then there's the utility type stuff you can go in call your cell phone provider and say hey

are you offering any deals if you still have cable and baby step two yeah what are you guys paying for your cell phone bill well i'm sorry can you repeat that what are you paying for your cell phone bill um so right now is ours is separate because i do own on my phone and that should be knocked out by the end of the year but mine is $87 a month and his is 60 but we plan on going to mid-Mobile where it's like $30 a month. I was going to say, Tello has been a great sponsor of the YouTube channel, and they're $25 a month for unlimited. You can't beat it.

Which is incredible. So that's a big savings. Some people are just paying like $120 a month for their phone plan, not even including the phone. So just some ideas, Jessica, along with every dollar, I'm going to send you my book Breaking Free from Broke. I want you to specifically read the margin is breathing room chapter. In there, I lay out a bunch of the ideas that Jade and I threw out and many more. just to get you going, because we're pumped for you guys to become debt-free.

Do you feel like it's closer, just on this call? Yes, I mean, we also made progress. We started with about $16,000 in credit card debt, and we're down to maybe $2,000,000, I think it's $2,400. So thank you guys so much. This is really helpful. Love to hear that. And you're right down the road in Nashville,

so come see us for your debt-free scream, looking forward to meeting you guys and celebrating in-person. Hang on the line. We're going to send you every dollar premium and my book, Breaking Free from Broke. those resources help you along the way. More of your calls coming up. This is The Ramsey Show.

The Ramsey Show, I'm George Camel, joined by Jade Warshaw. If you're enjoying the show today or any other day for that matter, do us a quick favor. The show is free. What I'm asking you to do is free. Just hit the subscribe button, hit the follow button, leave us a kind review, share it with a friend. Maybe it's a clip or a highlight from the show, a full episode, tell them, hey, you got to check out this podcast. All of that helps us get higher up on the algorithms, and it's not for our own egos. It's so that we can reach more people who may not know that this show even exists. And we're trying to displace all of the and nonsense out there in this toxic money culture. And you guys sharing, you're the best marketing plan we have. So thank you for doing all of those things. Danielle is up next in Houston, Texas. What's going on, Danielle? Hi, good afternoon. How are you doing? We're doing great. How can we help? Awesome. Awesome. So I'm in a little dilemma that I've almost been doing with for almost a year with my vehicle. Okay. After our intention to make a repair, I started having the same issue.

shoes. Now I need a new engine. Um, I still owe about $65,000 on this vehicle that I've only had for a year and a half. Oh, $65,000. What kind of vehicle is it? It's $65,000. Um, and it's an Audi Q8 2019. Um, I did buy it used. So it was a bad decision. I know now, but I do not know what to do. Um, on top of that, I do have been loaned up about, $32,000 and about $2,000 in credit card debt. So I'm looking at around $100,000 that I made it. So my question is, I don't know what to do with this vehicle. The warranty company only wants to cover about $7,000 for a total repair that cost $20,000.

So I would have to come out of pocket. I don't know if I should get rid of this vehicle. I don't know how much they would get me for the vehicle, the dealership. They haven't given any that answer yet, but I wouldn't give it to the dealership. What's it worth? If you don't repair it, what's it worth if you were to sell it? Now it doesn't have an engine, right? I would have to get a new engine.

So I'm thinking around $30,000. I honestly don't know. And it's going to cost $7,000 out of your pocket, you said, to get it fixed? No. The warranty company is willing to give me $7,000. Why are they only willing to cover? a third of it. I have no idea.

Either they cover or they don't. I'm confused why they go, well, it's kind of our fault, so I guess we'll cover seven grand. Audi made a repair. Two weeks later, I get my car, well, I get my car back after a few months,

and then two weeks later after I gave my vehicle back, I had the same issues, but now my engine went out. I would fight this to where they cover the full 20K. That's personally what I would do is I probably would not sleep, and I would just badger them and wear them down until they go, all right, she's a squeaky wheel. Let's just cover this repair. Honestly, we've been doing like a divorce company since November.

Speak directly in your phone, Danielle. We're having a hard time hearing you. Sorry. Okay. So they pretty much told me that I've been dealing with this since November of 2023, so as you can see, we're... What are you driving now? And, well, Audi gave me a loaner vehicle, so that's what I've been driving. Yes, I still have the loaner vehicle. Do you have any money saved? I do not have any money saved. Are you single?

Yes. What do you make a year? A 65K. Girlfriend, girlfriend, girlfriend, girlfriend. Oh, my goodness. What were you thinking buying us? How much does this car cost you? 70 grand?

Yeah, around 75 grand. Oh. Do you, yeah, I, okay. What's the payment on this month? I know, I know. The payment is high. What is it? So, I'm currently, it's about $1,600 a month.

Girlfriend, $1,600? I'm paying a, yes. What's the interest rate? 12%. Woo! Jane's stretching. She didn't, she didn't, she didn't need to take a walk. I need to take a walk.

I totally, I totally got screwed. No, you didn't get screwed. You chose this. Let's be honest. You chose it because here's, I just want you to know what I want to, I need to be able to sleep tonight. And so I need to understand that had you not had any engine problems, let's just pretend this last year was gravy and you had no engine problems. You're just paying $1,600 a month on a $75,000 vehicle when you make $65,000. I was hoping you were going to say, yeah, make $200,000. I think, okay, this tracks. Did you know it wasn't good? Like the first two months were you like, dang. Um, honestly, at first I was renting out that vehicle, so I didn't have those payments. You were renting it out, like on Turo or something? Yeah, yeah. So you fell for the scheme that I'm going to make money off this, and they'll pay the payment for me?

Pretty much. And then my other vehicle that I had, it ended up getting stolen for me. So I ended up using the Audi. And then... Someone stole your vehicle? Yes. And they never found it? They never found it, no.

Did insurance cover it? Yes. I got insurance and gaps, so they did cover it. And what did you do with the insurance money? Yes. They didn't give me anything because I had to owed on that vehicle. Oh, my. It's not your first rodeo making bad decisions.

Yeah, I know. So this vehicle, I don't know what to do. So tell me again, you said it before, but I was writing down. So warranty so far is only going to. pay 7k what are you on the hook for that would have to pay the difference they say the total cost would be about 20k just to get a new engine okay so let's play out let's play out both scenarios let's say you sold it as is and you get 30k that's what you told us that means you're in the whole 35k where you need to go out and find 35,000 dollars whether it's your own money or getting a loan

you need to go into debt another 35k the other option is you're in debt 13 extra thousand to cover this engine repair because the warranty company's going to cover seven, right? Yes. So on paper, option B is a better option. They're both terrible, but that's a better option right now is that you get the engine repaired. And then you're able to at least sell it. So that's what I would do if I was in your shoes. Whatever you need to do to get this engine repaired, do that and then sell the vehicle immediately.

But not to the dealer. They're going to screw you on this deal because they already did. So you'd have to sell a private party to get the most value out of it. And I want you to talk to, I want you to get with somebody on this because cars, I know you've been trying to make it your thing, but I don't think it's your thing. And so find the wisest person that you know, I don't know if that's dad or big brother or a cousin or your best friend's brother, whoever it is, get with that person when it's time to sell this vehicle and when it's time to get this vehicle fixed because I don't

want them taking you for a ride figuratively when it comes to the price anymore on this. I just feel like you've been screwed every way, which way possible. And I don't want that to continue for you on the fixing or the sale of this vehicle. And from here on out, George, tell her the rule on buying these cars from here on out. I think you should buy the cheapest car possible, Danielle, at this point. But the parameter, Ramsey, is you pay cash. It's a used car, unless you're a millionaire, probably four plus years old, and the value of the vehicle is no more than half of your annual income.

The value of all things with wheels and motors. So for you, if that's one vehicle, which do you have multiple toys or vehicles? No, it's just a mile in a vehicle. This is it. This only one. Okay. And so right now, that would mean with your $65,000 income, you would buy no more than about a $30,000 car. When the time comes in cash. I still think that's, you don't need to worry about that until you're out of debt completely. You get the student loans knocked out. The credit card's knocked out.

You have an emergency fund. Let's get the income up. Then let's save up and pay cash. So this could be years down the road. but for now we need to figure out a way to get that 13 grand. That might be you go to a credit union if your credit's not shot already and you go, hey, I need 13 grand to cover the difference to get this engine fixed to then. Do you have the car loan through someone? It's through Las Bargo.

Okay. You might want to go to them and say, listen, you got bad collateral on this thing because it's only worth 30 right now. I owe you 65. I want to get this loan paid off. It's impossible right now unless you guys loan me this 13K in a property. personal loan to get this engine replaced. Yeah, my credit's good.

I don't have an issue with that. Okay, then let's do it. I made a bad decision. Yeah. So that's what I would do, Danielle, and it's going to hurt. And God bless the USA when we can be $100,000 in consumer debt, but we have great credit by gosh. Look at that, Jade.

I got an $850, but I don't have $800 in the bank account, and I'm $100,000 in debt. That is the American way. I can't even respond. I'm shooketh. She hath been... shooketh what a way to end this hour of the ramsie show uh thank you to my co-host jade warshaw all the fuchs and the both and the booth keeping the show flow including kelly daniel filling in on the producing who's done a fantastic job better than james i might add we'll be back

with you before you know it normal is broke common sense is weird so we're here to help you transform your life and your money from the ramsay network in the fair ones credit union studio this is the ramsie show to get involved in the call scene today you can call triple 8 8255-225 to get your name on the line. I'm here hosting. My name's Jade Warshaw next to me, George Camel. George, are you ready to get it on? I've never been more ready. All right, let's do it. We've got Elaine from Indiana on the line. What's up, Elaine? Yes. Hi, thanks for taking my call. Yeah, how can we help? Yeah, so I am dealing with a little bit of financial infidelity from my husband. And I'm just kind of wondering, you know, how we can move past that. The original incident, well, I mean, it's happened several times, but the kind of straw

that broke the back was about a year ago. I learned that he had borrowed about $14,000 from his employer. Oh, gosh. I guess they offered to pay off a debt that was trying to garnish his wages. What was that debt? It was from, he had started a business several years ago, and so we're working on paying off a lot of the consumer debt that was kind of left over from that. Did you know about that debt before he got the loan to pay it off? I did, and we did get a notice about the, they had out the lawsuit, and it was a court date. He said he went to the court date, explained to them that the business had been closed, and they kind of just, said they were washing their hands of it, and I didn't hear anything else about it.

So did he made up that entire lie that they? I think he went. I don't know that it was actually, you know, white clean. I don't think you told me the full extent of it. Well, clearly it wasn't because then he turned around and borrowed it from his employer. Right. Well, somebody showed up that as a work, a deputy or something maybe, and with that order to garnish his wages. Instead of doing the garnishment, his employer paid it off, and they took a lump sum out of each one of his checks.

And I didn't find out until about nine months after his checks had been... So essentially, he tried to avoid wage garnishment by having his employer do it for him. Exactly. And so that was about a year ago. I found out that, and I actually, you know, we have kids, and I was done at that point. He's made a lot of stupid financial decisions in the past. But before you go, before you keep going forward, I want to keep pulling that first one. So they were garnishing the wages out of his checks, $14,000.

How much? Because how did you not see that? He got his own bank account. Got you. He separated all of our finances. Okay. So finance is totally separate. Okay.

So he made a lot of moves to hide this from you. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Like open another bank, then move the direct deposit to that new bank without your knowledge? And then, have you guys had separate finances in the past? No, they were together up until about two or three years ago, and ever since then, it's been, yeah. So you said this is not the first thing. Give us another example of something, because this one's pretty extreme.

Well, when he had his business open, I saw a bill in the mail for. were, you know, one of his, I guess, suppliers or somebody, and it was a lot more than, you know, I hadn't anticipated. I'm going to ask him about it. And he was like, no, what's wrong? It's wrong. It's wrong. It's like, it would say he'd take care of it. And then finally, when I call, they're like, no, like, we've been trying to get hold of you. This amount is correct. This equipment was never returned. Your bills, you know, $15,000. As opposed to what you thought would have been $15,000 as a couple thousand, yeah. Okay. So these are big numbers. Yes.

Have you asked him directly of why are you lying about all this? What's behind it? He says that he knows that it stresses me out and so that he's just trying to take care of it himself without me having to know about it. So take care of it means more lies, more hiding things. Correct. And you've made it clear that's not how you're going to rebuild trust in this marriage. Right.

Yes. Has he fully owned up to all this? Where is he at today? Well, that was a year ago. And, you know, and I said that I was done, and I was tired of him lying and hiding things from me. And I actually moved in with the kids with some family, and we, you know, he cried and hell never do it again. And so we decided to work on things, so we're living with family. And collectively, you know, we have probably about $90,000 of debt from this previous, you know, company that he had started a bit and work out.

so we said we'll tackle it together well a few weeks ago I found out that somebody else had tried to you know sue him or whatever it was and he got another loan from this company this was only $3,000 yep and that for the past three months he's been paying that off and it's paid off now and we were able to pay off the $14,000 one you know once I found out about it and I said let's put everything towards it and so we did that So I thought everything was good after that. But you guys, you never really sat down and counseled your way through this. It was kind of just like, let's try it again, let's try it again, let's try it again.

Right. I'm not really, you know, here's the thing. You're telling us this, I 100% believe what you're saying. You said he, you know, you left him and he cried and all this stuff. I don't know what the word is for that, but there's a word for the fact that he, He's making a mistake, but he's putting it on you by saying, I don't want you to be stressed. I don't want you to be the one that's upset. This is too much for you.

Like, there's a word for that. I don't know what it is, but I know I don't like it. And there's just part of this word. Yeah, you've outlined many instances, and yet he continues to do the same kind of crazy erratic behavior with his debt and with his money. Yeah, I would. I would sit down with a counselor. And in the meantime, yeah, I would keep the money separate.

And I wouldn't do much more on this until you can sit down with somebody and say, here's what's going on. I don't know why my husband is continuing to do this behavior. Maybe I, maybe I do have a hand in it. I'm willing to own if I do, right? And you guys both sit down. And until you've given this a fair shake with the help of a professional, you know, that's what I really want for both of you. Because something is, and I'm not apologizing or giving merit to what he's doing, but something's causing him to do this. whether it's some sort of scarcity mind, the way he grew up,

some piece of him is feeling like he's got to control this and hide it from you. I don't know why. And I'm not saying that it's right, but I hope you guys can get to the bottom of it. And if it were me in the meantime, yeah, I would set some really clear boundaries. George, I'd be like, listen, you have disrespected me and our family and our money and you've put us in an unsafe position. And because of that, I can't be linked with money because I got to keep our family safe. So my question for you, Elaine, is, do you earn any money?

I do. And, you know, combined, we do make a decent. I mean, we bring in about $135,000 a year. About 45 of that is from myself. Okay, so you're bringing in 45. So what I would say is this. I'd say, what would make me feel safe while we're in counseling is for us to put our money into this account. And I will give you full transparency into what I'm doing.

with the money, but you're taking our money and you're putting it on debt and you're making payments and you're putting us in an unsafe space. Will you go to counseling with me? And if he says, no, he won't and no, he won't combine the money, then now that's your chance for you to take that to counseling and figure out what you need to do next because you can't control him. Yeah, you need consistent honesty from him over time and prove through actions. Those are the two things that will rebuild trust. And if he's unwilling to do that, that is him opting out of this relationship. So you guys need to go through counseling and start to set those guardrails and boundaries and work towards healing. Hey guys, George Camel here.

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It's a live show. The number is 888-8-8-25-5-2-25. Christian will pick up and screen your call. Remember, this is a show about your life and your money. We're helping people build wealth, do work that they love, and create amazing relationships. That's what we're all about here. So let's go to the phone lines. We've got Olivia in Roanoke, Virginia.

What's going on? on Olivia? Hi. Yeah, so I called in just basically because I feel like I'm experiencing a lot of disagreement in my marriage as far as finances go. Tell us what happened. Well, we're both on the same page that we want to get out of debt. Like we both agree that we want to get out of debt. We want to have more money in our bank account and more security. I just, I feel like I'm the one of the sort of leading with that like gazelle intensity and right now I feel like one of our roadblocks in front of us is my husband's car we both have a car I have a more reliable American made car that it's up there in the miles but it's you know one of those ones that's

meant to last and then he has a 20 year old European car and it's something that he got earlier this year after he wrecked his reliable car during a snowstorm he paid in cash which is great. We don't owe anything on our vehicles, but ever since he got that car, which I never, I never wanted him to buy it. And I expressed that to him, but just let him do it because he was adamant and it was what he wanted. And he was just, how much did he spend? I was a $3,000 car. And I would say, considering how much we've spent, which I don't know exactly. He hasn't told me I can't access his receipts. He told me he hasn't even been putting their receipts together with the rest of the cars. What does that mean you can't access? Do you guys not

share a bank account so you can't see? No, we do. We do. But like, I don't have a place where all of this stuff is just compiled, like all of the receipts on what he spent on car parts. He's very handy and he does a lot of the repairs himself. But he's probably done at least five or six repairs since he bought the car. Are these for fun repairs? Like is he like souping it up or is he needing to keep this thing a lot? Okay. So you're also then then something also tells me you guys aren't keeping a budget because

if you're keeping a budget you wouldn't need receipts. You would see the transactions coming through. Okay, he went to advanced auto parts. He went to pet boys. He, you would see that come through. So is that right? There's no budget.

As of right now, no. I have like downloaded y'all's app before and tried to like get that going. but our financial situation has not been great. All the more reason to get into the budget. Okay, let's break this down. Exactly. No, I agree. I agree.

You're like he's spending way too much money on this $3,000 car. He's probably already spent more than $3,000 on the $3,000 car, correct? Maybe not quite. But we're in a position now where the car isn't working to where he's comfortable driving it, even to work. And so we're down to being a one car family, and he works 40 minutes. away. Okay. And you want to sell this car? I want to sell it and we literally can't even afford it. It's like $300 in parts that he needs right now and we can't even afford to buy that. Is it sellable? If you

sell it, what would you get? Or is it just scrapping? If we sold it right now, we would get pretty much nothing. But if he fixed it up, he might be able to get a similar price as to what he bought it for. So you're saying right now he would get 500 bucks. But if I put 300 bucks in, I could get three grand for it. And you wouldn't get three grand. You'd break even. You'd get the money back that you spent. Right. So we barely, we would technically, we wouldn't break even after everything he spent, but if you, well, I don't even know. Why don't you guys do a little math on this? Go back and do a little, do a little detective work, see what's been spent on this car. And then you guys can make the best decision, figure out what needs to be done, add, factor that in and then figure

this out. This is the smallest of the concerns in my mind, uh, this car. This is not what's holding you guys back right now. It's just the ankle biter. that's in front of your face. So what's the real thing holding you back? Is he not willing to make other sacrifices? Yeah, so I would say stubbornness is what's really truly holding us back. I tried to discuss this car with him yesterday,

and it just turned into an argument. Let's say we never talk about the car again. What else are we doing? Because just not dealing with the car is not the thing that's going to get us out of debt. So what are the steps you're taking? so I'm pretty much the only one doing anything to get out of debt I have I mean I don't know he's he what are you doing what are you doing to get out of debt let's talk about you yeah so I am working I'm a

full-time mom so I work on the weekends to clean for somebody and I've been setting aside that cash for a little while and I don't even have my thousand dollars yet because we keep running into things and I keep having to fork over my emergency fund because there's no money in our bank account. Let's halt right there. There's a couple of things that I hear that is really going to help. Number one, there's a lot of division here. I'm doing this. He's not doing that.

This is my emergency fund. I don't have access to the receipts. Like there's a lot of division that I hear that lets me know there's something there's something missing here. So there's some marriage things going on where you guys are feeling separate from each other. you're not able to talk to him. He's not able to hear you and probably vice versa. So I would want to do some detective work there

and maybe get into some counseling to figure out what's the hold up there. Number two, I think the problem that you're running into financially with when you are setting aside money and it's getting eaten up, you guys don't have a budget. So there's no way to know what's coming.

There's no way to plan for it. So before you get off the line, George and I are going to get you hooked up with every dollar because George, I think that's really the issue here, at least financial. the issue. Well, tell us about your take-home pay. What is the take-home pay for the month with your cleaning on the weekends, him working full-time? What comes in?

If I worked four weekends a month doing this one cleaning job that I'm doing, I would be bringing in, let me just pull my calculator up really quick. I've never actually done this math. This is exciting. This is great. This is part of it for everybody listening. Knowing these details, you got to know your numbers. You know your numbers. Then you know what you need to do in order to get where you want to get? So in just four days out of the month, I would be bringing in $720. Okay, great.

What does he bring home every month? That number, I don't even know. Okay, so, like, he had so many medical issues. No, but you know, you see, you have access to the bank, right? What does the bank statement say was his income? Yeah, when you see his check roll through. Is it the same check every month? No.

the average i would say that we get so like weekly is between three and five hundred dollars a week okay so maybe 2000 like 2000 a month why is he making so little so part of it was they cut his hours back at work because business was slow and then they recently brought his hours back up and when that happened he also got uh basically i what i would call a raise they allowed him to start receiving commission because he's an incredible worker he's a hard worker What does he do for work? He's a chimney sweep. But then he threw out his back pretty much right when that happened.

He has had back issues his whole life and he probably needs surgery one day. But he'll miss work because of stuff like that. Like this isn't just the first time it's happened where he throws his back out. It happens, I would say, once or twice a year where he misses a few days of work because of it. And then there's like sickness and all those like normal life things that throw. I think he needs a new job. Yeah. Is it fair to say that he can't be a chimney sweep anymore? I mean, when you said once or twice a year for a couple of days, at first I was like, that's, I mean, you get a cold and you're out once or twice a year, right? The people in the audience are like, yeah, Jade. So there's part of me that's like, how big of a deal is this? Like we're not losing weeks of work, you know, every couple of months. It doesn't sound like. It sounds like it's a day here, a day there. I'm, he needs to make more money. I'm with you on that. He needs to make more money. You need to make more money. You need to make. make more money. You both need to earn more money. I agree with you there. I think here's can I just

be honest with you what I think, Olivia? I think you're frustrated and rightfully so. And sometimes when we get frustrated, it's easier to look at the other person and go, here's what they're not doing. But I think this is both of you. I think there's something that both of you, I think there's more that both of you can be doing to make this better, even something as simple as knowing the numbers, right? And in these types of situations when you are married, here's the thing. You can't control what he does. You can control what you do. You can ask him and you can let him know, let him know, here's what I'd like.

But at the end of the day, Olivia can only control Olivia. So here's what you can do. You can get the every dollar budget. You can say, hey, let's do this together. And if he doesn't do it, you can still put the budget together. You can tell him, hey, for baby step one, I think we should save $1,000. And if he doesn't want to do it, you still save $1,000. Like, Olivia can be on her game and lead by example until your husband starts to get on his game.

This is The Ramsey Show. Hey guys, Rachel Cruz here. Today only our Black Friday one day sale is here with huge savings. All of our kids products are up to 50% off. Plus, our best selling hard covers are only $11. So titles like the total money makeover and building a non-anxious life are on sale now. And it gets even better. We've got audiobooks on sale for as low as $5.99.

Perfect for a gift wrapping session or your drive to a family Christmas party. This sale ends at midnight tonight, you guys, so don't wait. Go to ramsysolutions.com slash store today. Welcome back to The Ramsey Show. I'm George Camel, joined by Jade Warshaw. Open phones at AAA 825-5-225. You call up and we'll try to give you the right next step for your life and your money. Marcus has chosen to do so over in Denver.

What's going on, Marcus? Hey, how's going on, guys? Thanks for dick in my call. Absolutely. What's going on? Hey. So recently engaged, we are going through some premarital process, some workbooks, and some finance questions that I'm not sure entirely what to do. I know the rule is when you get married, then you combine your finances. I currently have about $100,000 saved up for a down payment on the home. She has about $80,000. My fiancé has about $80,000 in student loans and $10,000 on a car. So I know I could pay that off instantaneously when we get married and kind of push the house down the road. She's not necessarily totally on board with that. I'm just not sure what to do with that when we say the ideas. Why do you think she's not on board with it? Is it guilt?

Yeah. Yeah, it definitely is. You know, we both worked very hard and she knows how hard I've worked to, you know, get out of debt and save out for money. And it's kind of a little bit guilt-ridden that, you know, I'd give up all my, the cashier, save her down payment, just completely into her. You know, there's a part of that. That is very real. My husband and I face that. And, you know, he felt bad that he had more student loans than I. But there's part of that that you kind of, if you put it in any other term as far as cleaning up a mess ahead of time, any other personal mess, you can't make perfect before you get married.

Do you know what I mean? You don't feel the obligation to fix it completely yourself before you come to them. Like we're imperfect people and we make mistakes. And so I think when you frame it in that way of why are you categorizing money in a completely different light than all of the other aspects of our. marriage where we're basically taking each other as we are and we're working together to go forward. I think when you put it into that framework, it kind of changes the way you think of it it and you're like, oh yeah, okay, that makes more sense. You're taking me with my mistakes.

You're taking me with my flaws and we're working together to improve ourselves in our marriage. And accepting that blessing of, wow, this person worked really hard to save this money and they're willing to use that to give me a clean slate. I mean, not to get theological, but that's a beautiful picture of the gospel. We came in with all the debt and he's got on a limited savings account and he's like, I got you. And it's like, uh, I can't accept this. I need to work for it. Like, there's a piece of that that exists. And also, it's a lot easier to go into a hundred grand of debt versus saving up a hundred grand. That's right. So there's also that piece that she's feeling of he works so hard for this. But the truth is, if you looked at a cons list of,

okay, what she's coming to this marriage with, 100 grand, you look at the pros list, her. You know what I mean? Like, that outweighs any level of debt. And you guys, working together, this is going to be like a blip in your lifetime where you look back and like, oh, remember we cleaned up that debt real quick? And then we started building wealth together. And yeah, it delayed our home buying by, you know, two years. Who cares? And big whoop. And so I think this is harder for her to grapple than you, because it sounds like you are like, yeah, I'm willing to go ahead and pay off the debt and we'll restart the down payment process. And then, you know, for her, I mean, and I hope she does listen to this call, the

the flip side of it, which is the pretty obvious, is it's way better to have someone who says, oh, yeah, it's just money. Like, I'm happy to pay this off and start, you know, my money is your money and your debt's my debt. And I'm happy to be one with you on this. And, well, we're paying it off together with the money that we have once we get married. That's a lot better than having a jerk that's like, no, you got to pay off your debt. I'm not marrying you until you bury that debt. You know what I'm saying? Like, that is terrible. And if you were like that, she wouldn't accept that either. So it's like if you have to choose between A and B,

I'm choosing A with flying colors. All right. Well, you know how those guys roll? We're very directing to the point, so I'll try to frame it a little bit more differently. Have her watch this call. Also, I'm wondering, what will your household income be once you guys get married?

Once we get married, a year's time, I'll gross 220 and she'll be about 55 to 60. Ding, ding, ding, my friend. So think about that. Mathematically, if you want to help her out, Just go to a piece of paper, a napkin math, and go, all right, we're going to pay your debt down. It leaves us with $10,000. We still need a little emergency fund maybe. Okay, we make $2.75 at that point.

How quickly can we save up $100,000? Probably eight or nine months? Yeah, pretty quick. And so I think showing her how little of a problem this really is, it's not derailing your home ownership dreams for a decade. Nope. Yeah. You're just taking a step back to catapult forward. Yeah. Okay, well, I'll try to frame it differently.

Have you guys gone through Financial Peace University as part of your premarital? We haven't. We're doing a couple workbooks. We haven't done FPU yet. If I gifted it to you guys, would you go through it? I would pay for it because I appreciate your guys in services. Oh, that's so kind. Well, I can't let you do that today, but you know what you can do? You can pay it forward. You can get it for someone else. But I'm going to gift that to you today, Marcus, because I'm a Marcus fan. And I think Financial Peace University is a huge part of pre-marital counseling. It doesn't encompass everything with pre-marital counseling, obviously.

There's a lot of other pieces. But as far as finances go, I cannot think of a better way to get on the same page, learn that language by going through all nine lessons together. Because me trying to convince someone else about the thing I'm excited about, I'm like, Jade, you got to, this guy, Dave, he's just like sell the car. And you're like, what happens? Yeah, I know. And then you watch the lessons, and you're like, I got to sell the car. And it becomes your idea versus this thing they threw on to you. Yeah.

So that's a very different vibe. And that's why I encourage couples, whether it's premarital, post-marital, whatever, go through Financial Peace University if you're trying to get someone on board. And it's the most cost-effective way to make your marriage better and build wealth together. I agree. I concur. We nailed it. All right. Alex is in Chicago up next.

What's going on, Alex? Hi, guys. Can you hear me? Yeah. Loud and clear. Okay. So, yeah, my main question is debating whether I can leave my job in December or if I should sign out for another, like, little group of second shifts for kind of getting a head start on my emergency fund. Okay, so there's no debt you're working on an emergency fund. Is that what I understand?

Okay, so starting in November, I started paying down a lot. $82,000 of debt. It was 72. By the time I started the Ramsey plan, I had a total of 82. Okay. And now I have 19.4. Nice. And at the end of the year, I should have about 5.5. Okay. And if I quit my job in December, my debt payoff will be the same in February. Okay. I'm thinking about keeping it for, like, a head start on my emergency fund, but I'm also, like, completely exhausted and holding kind of, like, less... Are you saying just quitting your second job? Are you keeping your full-time job? Yeah, so right now I work about 52 hours a week. I work 40, and then I work, like, an extra four hours a week, and this is three times a month.

for my so I work about 44 hours and then I work an extra eight is it the work or the type of work is it that is it the fact that you have an extra job or is it the nature of the second job it's more the nature of the second job because um I'm a therapist in an acute care setting um and it's like a very physical job and I'm like what do you make from it? What do you make from it um yeah so my base pay and my primary job is 4.3K. And I do, I work weekends on my primary job. So I have 5K with my weekend pay. And then with my second job, I do 5.6. And then I do work overtime at my primary job. So that it's like 5.9. What, your second job is bringing in more than your full-time job?

No, I'm just explaining that I actually, like, that's my monthly income increment. as I add on more hours. Oh, so you're making an extra $600 from the side job? Got you. It's about $250 net per shift, and I work about eight shifts every three months. So go ahead. I'm just trying to understand.

Just give us really clear what you bring in from the side job every month. Because what I'm getting at here is if you're telling me it's the nature of the job, that's the problem, and it's giving you $1,200 extra bucks a month or $600 extra bucks a month, or 600, whatever that is, I'm pretty sure you could probably... It's about $750.50. Perfect. I think that you find another job and replace that income, because a lot of times the burnout is not on the hours itself.

It's the job that you're doing during those hours. It sounds like you've been going hard for a really long time and you just need to change a pace. Yeah, if you did something that was more enjoyable, even less, you'd be okay. But I wouldn't just slow down just yet. You're so close. Keep the gazelle intensity up until you're through Baby Step 3. But I do think we need a shift in the meantime.

Just shift the plan a little bit. This is The Ramsey Show. When you're tired of feeling stuck with money, there's just one solution. To get different results, you have to do something different. No one accidentally wins with money. You have to have a game plan, and that begins with our game plan. and that begins with our get started assessment. Go to ramsysolutions.com slash start, answer some questions, and we'll show you what steps

to take next. Don't stay stuck. Take control of your money starting today. Go with ramsysolutions.com slash start. Welcome back to the Ramsey Show, our scripture of the day, 2 Corinthians 12, 9. My grace is sufficient for you, for my power is made perfect in weakness. Therefore, I will boast all the more gladly about my weaknesses so that Christ's power may rest on me. In a left turn, J.K. Rowling once said, anything's possible if you've got enough nerve. I like that level of persistence. George, you got some nerve.

That's me getting discounts. That's my version of that. I've got the enough nerve to ask for the discount. Listen, I've watched you in these breaks try to get these discounts on these Seinfeld tickets. That's right. If anyone's got the hookup, I refuse. Jade's like, George, just go. I mean.

Just pay the stub. I'm like, I'm not going to let the scalpers win. Not on my watch. I'm going to get these tickets at face value if it's the last thing I do. Waving the white flag. That's my, that's my latest conundrum. If you're wondering what's happening in the world of George. It's a good problem now.

Yeah. All right. That's fun. Let's go to Joan in Jacksonville, Florida. What's going on, Joan? Make us happy. How can we help? Well, hi.

Thank you for taking my call. I have a situation where I have a couple of options, but I really don't know what to do. I'm 86 years old. I have only Social Security. I own home. I own the car. Good. But I have about almost $30,000 credit card debt.

Oh, my goodness. I know. I have making minimum payments, but I've only left with maybe $100,200 a month, to eat, put gas in the car. I do have help from a daughter. and an ex-husband that feeds me, you know, as I need it, if I make a suggestion, but it's embarrassing that I don't want to. I could, I think about selling the car. It's 17 years old.

I won't buy another one, but I'm pretty much going to be grounded. What's the car worse? Which, well, it's a crowned victoria. I don't think that's going to make a dent in your credit card debt. I'd rather you keep the car to get around. Yeah, true. Or sell the house. That's what I want to know.

Oh, boy. And get an apartment. Well, the problem is right now you have a fixed expense with this paid-for house. Right. So if you sold it to pay off your credit card debt, that leaves you with an expense that's ongoing and increasing. And with your Social Security, I don't know that you're going to be able to afford the payment of the rent. How much do you get every month?

11-198. Okay. Almost a thousand. So about 1,200 bucks a month. Yeah. And what are your monthly expenses right now? You're saying you have 100 bucks left over. So you need about 1100 bucks to live? All over.

No, no. The reason I'm in credit card debt is I always need about $200 more. And so I use the credit card and then I'll start paying the minimum payments and then the interest starts hitting on and the bill bill bill. Now the last two or three months I had like almost $3,000 in car repair and some other $700. to the dentist. Yeah. And so you just have no cushion. You have no cushion to pay for anything that comes up beyond your $1,100 a month, right?

And unless I beg it from either a daughter or an ex. I'm sorry. Oh, goodness. I'm so sorry. Joan, this is not a fun place to be. What is your house worth? My health. Your house.

What's it worth? well what do you mean by that if you sold it today what could you get for it oh the house yes oh the house is probably worth one ninety five maybe two fifty okay that's a big but on on either side the houses have built around me and there were six hundred and five hundred Why is yours so low? No updates? Is it in rough shape? No, mine is just old when I came here 21 years ago.

Oh, they built a bunch of new houses around you. Yeah, they built everybody around me and I don't have an HOA and everybody else. Are you at the point where you could move in with your daughter? Well, I could, but I'm not too sure about that. that, you know, personalities. I mean, it's kind of, it would be, I have some health problems, but they're under control. Well, the problem is, let's say if I stout my fingers and got you at a credit card debt, you're going to be back in $30,000 of credit card debt because you're using the credit cards to float your life and expenses.

Well, I promised her that from now on I would ask her after if I have to charge something. But you're still behind $200 a month. Which you're using credit cards for, you told us. So you've got your... Oh, no. That's not going to change anytime soon. You've got your daughter, and do you have other kids, or is it just her? Yes, but that wouldn't be possible.

Okay, so your daughter has said, Mom, let me know. Before you charge this credit card, tell me I'm going to try to help you out, basically, right? Yes. So, like you said, it's embarrassing and it's tough, but your options are you either reach out to your daughter and you say, hey, you told me that this lifeline is here. And the truth is, I need $200 every month in order to be able to live and not spend any more on this credit card. That $200 will help me make my minimum payments and not go over. If you said that to her, is she on board to say, okay, I'm going to help you in that way. And then because the other option is we might have to

look at this house, which doesn't really make sense because of the cost of living today. Like, there's not really an option, you know. That's what, yeah, that's one thing that's made it gone up more. Well, okay. Your expenses are $1,400 and you're bringing in $1,200. That's the truth at the end of the day, right? Because you're going $200 in a debt on the credit cards. Yes.

So we need to find a way to either lower our expenses somehow or increase our income. I don't know we're going to find a way to increase income. I wrote down every penny of, spent this past month and could you downgrade in house there's you know if you sold it for 250 could you go buy a place for 200 I'm not here in Florida right now I mean or even an apartment no it's a house I'm saying could you downgrade to an apartment oh well I could go yeah I mean I could but I'm 86 years old I mean I know, but we also didn't set ourselves up for a bright future in retirement.

No. So this is part of it, is we got to deal with the ramifications. I was a single mother since I was 19 years old with no child support, and I worked until I was almost 80. What were you doing for work? I mean, maybe I better not say. I worked in a pharmacy technician. Okay. Is there something you could do to make?

make a little bit of extra money right now? Are you able to get around and do that? Oh, yeah. I get around. I mean, I think we might need to find a little part-time job to clean up this debt and increase our income if you're able-bodied. It's not fun, but this might be your only option other than selling the house and downgrading to an apartment that you pay cash for, which allows you to clean up the credit card debt, lowering your month's expenses. Right. Well, I've leukemia. I've had it for 21 years. I don't really have a high energy level. And I have a dog. And the dog, I was going to tell you the expenses, the dog cost. The dog was the biggest expense. I bet. I know. I got two little French bulldogs, and they're the biggest line item in my budget right now. So, Joan, I'm so sorry. Yeah, it was $181 for the dog.

Every month? No, just this month. Okay. Just this month? Oh, Joan, I'm so sorry. You have been through it. I would definitely look at downgrading and house and going to an apartment you pay cash for, getting rid of the credit card debt.

If you need to rehome the dog, I'd rather you eat before the dog. So that's the hard truth. I hope it helps, and I hope your daughter or ex-husband can help. That puts this hour of The Ramsey Show in the books. Thank you to Jade Warshaw, all the folks in the booth, and you, America. We'll be back before you know it. I'm going to be. I'm going to be.

We're going to be. I don't know. Oh. We're going to be.