The Ramsey Show - Slow Money Moves Still Matter

Starting point is 00:00:02 Brought to you by the Every Dollar app. Start budgeting for free today. Normal is broke and common sense is weird. So we're here to help you transform your life. From the Ramsey Network and the Fairwinds Credit Union Studio, this is The Ramsey Show. And I am Rachel Cruz hosting this hour with my good friend and co-host the Smart Money Happy Hour, George Camel. We'll be answering your questions. So give us a call at AAA-8-25-2-2-25.

Starting point is 00:00:37 and we're going to talk about your life and your money. All right, first up, we have Amanda in Portland, Oregon. Hi, Amanda. Welcome to the show. Hi. How are you doing? I'm okay. I'm nervous.

Starting point is 00:00:52 I've never done this before, so yeah. You're crushing it so far. You're doing great, Amanda. How can we help? Well, I guess I'm trying to gain an outside perspective on if my opinion on hiring an outside exterminator is warranted or like is justified because me and my fiance have different opinions on that. Okay.

Starting point is 00:01:23 What needs exterminating? George is not the rodent kind of fella over here. I mean, who's a rodent fella? That's a weird thing to be. Not to see. What needs to be, yeah, exterminated? Well, I guess we've just been doing with a rodent issue. Our house is kind of old.

Starting point is 00:01:38 It's been, you know, on and off for a few years now. I am a stay-at-home mom, so I deal with it. Well, you know, like if I see one. What's a one? What is it? Oh, a rat. A rat or a mouth. It's gotten into our pantry.

Starting point is 00:01:53 It's eaten through our food. When you say it's, I'm guessing there's more than one. No, there's usually just one, right? Is it the same guy? It's spursed out. So, like, I trapped one in our closet at the beginning of the year. It escaped. We patched up a hole we found.

Starting point is 00:02:11 Now one is back. I haven't seen it. My fiance has. It chewed through our pantry. We took everything out. They're destructive. Like, you'll get behind your dishwasher and, like, chew cord. I mean, all of it.

Starting point is 00:02:23 Uh-huh. I know. And so we have a small child. And so my anxiety is through the roof because I don't want our child to get sick. I don't want our child to get bit. they're young enough where they think it's fun like oh i want to play with the mouse and i'm like no you don't you scream and run um so i my anxieties through the roof about it i would feel better hiring someone to find holes figure out where they're coming in create a better plan and i know

Starting point is 00:02:51 it can be expensive so that like that's reasonable in my fiance's part um but he feels like what are they going to do that we can't do? But I feel like all of our resources weren't really working, like sticky traps, snap traps, rat poison. We did actually just catch a rat this morning. But it's definitely, I feel like put a strain on us, so it's made me feel very, like, distant and, like, my anxieties aren't being heard.

Starting point is 00:03:23 So it's just, like, I've kind of been, like, don't talk to me about it. Don't. Okay, I don't care. So he's getting dismissed. with you. Sorry. He's tired of you talking about it.

Starting point is 00:03:33 He doesn't want to pay for it. So he's like, we'll deal with it. We'll figure it out. It's going to be fine. And you're like, it's not fine. Yeah. And it's like, it's understandable. Like the finance aspect I understand.

Starting point is 00:03:45 How much does it cost? You're living with a rat. Like I feel like. Yeah. Yeah. And it's, you know, like I'm. Is it $1,000? Oh, no.

Starting point is 00:03:54 I was looking up, like, estimates. And it was saying maybe, like, like $3.50 in our area might be like the highest, but I think it could be less than that. I mean, I mean, so from his side of the fence, are you guys financially in a good spot? Do you have money that you were like, yeah, we can write a check and get this done with?

Starting point is 00:04:17 Or are you broke? Are you broke? We have like, we have cash in a safe that like we could use, but then there's like, you know, this is on the list of a million other things that need to be repaired or fixed or, You know, so then there's that, like, what does that money go towards first? How much money do you guys have to your name?

Starting point is 00:04:36 I think I, I, I mean, same, thank girl. So we have $1,000 saved in cash. We don't, I wrote all this down, sorry, we have $1,000 saved in cash, we own our house, we own our cars, we do pay rent on the land, so there's that. And we have more, like, roughly three. grand in debt just from like just credit cards. Okay. Combined.

Starting point is 00:05:04 This is all combined. Okay. So your total consumer debt is $3,000? Mm-hmm. Okay. And how much does he make? 3,800 a month. It kind of fluctuates.

Starting point is 00:05:16 Okay. So I think the real problem, I mean, obviously the rat is the real problem. So we'll give him that standing. The issue to me, Amanda, is there's a $350 swing. of you not feeling justified and heard and valued and what's important to you in this moment and your fiance is dismissive. I mean, I don't want to put words in his mouth.

Starting point is 00:05:41 Belittle, like, it is affected your relationship is what you said. Like, sure, the rat's giving you anxiety, but ultimately you're living in a household that you don't feel like you get a vote. Is he the same way with the other repairs in the house where he's like, I'll deal with it? I don't want to pay someone.

Starting point is 00:05:57 I'll get around to it. it's not that big of a deal. I mean, some of it, yeah, but I mean, yeah, yeah. And there's like a point where, like, because I, he's very handy. He can work on cars. He can build things. You know what I mean? Like, he's a real choice.

Starting point is 00:06:12 He can do all sorts of stuff. But it's kind of like, okay, well, when? When are we going to, you know, like get around to it? It's a lot of talk. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Or it's like to the point where, you know, until it's like, okay. okay, now we really have to because this is happening with the car now. Now we really need to repair this because this is falling apart.

Starting point is 00:06:35 You know, so. And then with winter coming up. Yep, yep. Okay, so I, no, no, no. I feel like the discussion needs to be had of the bigger picture of there's a, and I don't want to like throw this word out because I feel overly used. But like you, it's almost like you don't feel safe because we have to wait until something is an urgent. emergency to have any attention towards it.

Starting point is 00:07:00 And you want a life that is, you know, somewhat well kept, but that you feel like he's taking care of things. And when that's being removed, it starts to kind of shake this safety feeling that you have in general, right? It's more of a pattern. It's not this one thing. Yeah. Even though this is brought.

Starting point is 00:07:20 Would you agree? Mm-hmm. Yeah. No, it's okay. What makes that, why is that emotional for you? Is that? Yeah, it's just, I'm a worrier. I stress a lot.

Starting point is 00:07:35 Go play, please. Sorry, my toddler. I'm a worrier. I stress a lot. And so just, like, even he brought up the other day, upgrading my engagement ring is paid off. Go play. And I was just kind of like, I, like, what?

Starting point is 00:07:53 Like, are you serious? Like, why, how can you bring that up when, like, there's a million other things on our list that need to, get done, you know what I mean? So it was just like, and then he kind of got sad that, or like upset that I like dismissed that thing so quickly. And I get it, like he was trying to be sweet and wanted to do something nice. But if he's trying to be sweet,

Starting point is 00:08:18 he should value the things that you currently value, which is fixing these issues that are not wants their needs at this point. So you guys need to have a real conversation about what this relationship looks like, what the commitment looks like. I mean, I don't know how long you guys have been on the fence here, but we need to start really combining our lives and our shared goals and values. And let's start with the rat. And let's spend 300 bucks to remedy this thing before it turns into a bigger issue. When it comes to your health insurance, one of the biggest mistakes you can make is believing you're stuck in a one-size-fits-all plan that costs too much and covers too

Starting point is 00:09:11 little. That's why I recommend Health Trust Financial. They're the only Ramsey trusted health insurance partner because their advisors take the time to understand your situation and help you explore the coverage options that are available to you. Whether you've changed jobs, welcome to new baby, or had some other life event health trust financial shops, multiple top-rated insurance carriers for you. Then they help you understand your options so you can make a smart decision instead of guessing. I've recommended Health Trust Financial for more than 20 years because they work for you, not the insurance companies, so they offer unbiased advice.

Starting point is 00:09:53 Visit health trustfinancial.com to connect with an advisor today. That's health trustfinancial.com. Next up, we have Jessica in New York City. Hi, Jessica. Welcome to the show. Jessica, are you there? Hi, who are you? Hi, good. Welcome, welcome. How can we help?

Starting point is 00:10:26 Thank you. So I recently lost my job just on Tuesday and later my car broke down. So mother three starting from scratch. I've always had like entrepreneurship like once. And so I don't think I'm ready to go back to the workforce. I think I'm ready to start my own business, maybe acquiring a business or really maybe getting into real estate, maybe buying a property. I just need some guidance as to what's most profitable. Are you independently wealthy? Do you not need income? Oh, I need guidance, and you're going to hopefully help me with some of it. I don't know. Okay.

Starting point is 00:11:07 I'm just wondering, do you have money right now to cover the bills? Yeah, like, what are you going to do when rents do next month? Do you have money saved? Well, my partner and I live together. He pays the rent. Luckily, I don't pay anything towards that besides our HOA fees. and then I do have a lot of student loan debt, which is most of what I'm responsible for as well as groceries and things like that. But as far as living, you know, he takes care of that. Okay, but I am saying, though, you do have, you do need money right now to live off of like next month as an example, correct?

Starting point is 00:11:44 Right. You don't have, you don't have $50,000 in an emergency fund that you're going to use. No, so I do have about $20,000 in crypto. about $8,000 in the bank right now, and I should be getting some severance that I'm trying to negotiate because it's like one month's severance. But I'm hoping to learn more about, I don't know if a loan is the right way

Starting point is 00:12:05 or how to, you know, I was thinking maybe shadowing a person that does it to better, you know, get to know how to start something from the ground up. Okay. As far as real estate goes, or what? So that's the thing. Any, what is a type of business that... So you want us to help you figure out what business?

Starting point is 00:12:25 business you should do? Yes, and how to obtain the money for it. I mean, buying a small business, it could be, like... I've seen a lot of this on TikTok, so I think our algorithms are similar for different reasons, but I get a lot of these, just buy up small businesses, and it's great, buy a car wash, buy a boring business that generates 10,000 in revenue a month, so easy. It is not, and it's expensive, and we never recommend anybody take. on debt in order to finance a business, let alone anything else, but especially business,

Starting point is 00:13:00 because there's high risk. Yeah. Jessica, how old are you? I'll be 39 in November. 39 in November. Okay. What were you doing before? What was the job you had that you just got let go of? So stormwater management, like underground civil work and I have a background in architecture as well for many, many years. It's what I went to school for, design and pre-archection. Okay, perfect.

Starting point is 00:13:25 How much student loan debt do you have? About $150,000. Oh, my gosh. Is that your degree? It wasn't as much a degree as it was probably the lack of knowledge. And, you know, not knowing what we were getting myself into. I'm the first one in my family, to go to college here in the United States.

Starting point is 00:13:46 Okay. So I think, yeah, some lack of knowledge with regards to that. And also, since they were so high, they were supposed to be less. But once they graduated, I told me it was more. and, you know, income or interest for payment. How much were you making at your job? Six years, a year, about 100,000. 100,000.

Starting point is 00:14:08 Okay. Well, if I were to paint the next two years of your life, Jessica, of what I would recommend, it's probably not what you're thinking, but can I just say, if I woke up in your shoes, what I would do? And George probably has a plan of his own, too. but so I think because of this debt because and you do have you have some savings you have

Starting point is 00:14:30 8,020 in crypto I think my goal for you in the next 24 months is to be completely debt-free have a fully funded emergency fund in the bank and that's might take longer than two years and and to find a career path at which you are you're qualified and that you enjoy and that you're good at that can bring in a similar income. So that's a very, that's very, where I would probably take you for the, for the short term, meaning the next two to three years,

Starting point is 00:15:03 is very different than starting, going and getting a small business loan and starting up a business. Because what that's going to do is continue to add to the risk that you're already in of having debt. And then currently, as we're talking right now, not having an income at all.

Starting point is 00:15:21 So I would be looking to replace that income any way I could here in the next little bit, because my goal would be to get out of debt and not start something new right now. Because you're financially in the hole, and I would want you on solid ground before you start something. Yeah, that makes sense. So this might be, we're going to start this as a side hustle business three years from now, and we're going to do something that we actually enjoy doing, not something that we saw that could make money from social media. And so you love architecture. You love design. You love, you know, all the civil work that you've been doing. Find the thread in that and go, how can I turn this into something that I own?

Starting point is 00:16:05 That's a better path than I heard real estate is good. Let me go take on a $300,000 loan on an investment property. Right, right. Because I don't want you to fall in your face. Sure. The other thing that I had started prior to me losing my job was perhaps shipping like online sales taking a course in that, which was very economical. How much was the course? It was $500. Guess who got rich off of that? The person who launched a drop shipping course?

Starting point is 00:16:35 The person who sold you the dream that drop shipping is going to make you so much money. So how much money did you make drop shipping? Well, I haven't been able to start you because I had this full time that job that honestly was getting in the way of things that I wanted to pursue. So I feel like now I have the time to pursue something and maybe I could continue where I left off with it. I understand the entire work and there have mentors that guys you have stepped away until this day.

Starting point is 00:16:58 Please don't buy another course selling you on an entrepreneurial idea. And I don't know if you have time, Jessica, to start something new right now. Like, you need money. Right. Yeah. So I think A1 is finding a job, any job right now. And then what George is saying is on the side

Starting point is 00:17:14 at night or on weekends, put some of your time and energy into something else to see if we can grow that. But yeah, starting, yeah, the urgency of getting out of this $150,000 of student loan debt, let alone being able to pay for food next month, I think is what I would be, what I would be focused on. Right. So what's behind all this, Jessica? If I said, why are you urgently chasing after these business ideas of drop shipping or real estate?

Starting point is 00:17:47 What's behind it? What's the ultimate goal? So that's always been an interest of mine. I never thought I would be working in a 95th the rest of my life. I always saw building something. But what's been an interest of years? Working for myself, made perhaps sales. Since I was a very young child, I always had this entrepreneurial spirit where it was being 10 years old and learning how to do play to and teaching my friends and charging them or learning how to make all this intricate jewelry by myself back in my home country, Columbia, and making it and selling it there.

Starting point is 00:18:19 and then taking that here when it can to United States. Like, hence writing a lot. I love it. I think it's great. So follow that thread. What is the problem that you're trying to solve and who are the people that you're trying to help and what is your unique solution that can stand out in the crowd? If you just take that as a homework assignment and do not start another thing,

Starting point is 00:18:37 don't buy a course until you finish that homework assignment. Because right now I think you're just chasing after the wind and you're going to spend a lot of money that you don't have in order to start businesses that won't succeed. Versus taking the time to slow. down, pay off the debt like Rachel said, get a full-time job with benefits doing the work that you're already equipped to do, and then start this other thing on the side for fun, and then start charging. And then see if you get traction there to the point where you go, oh, my gosh, if I started doing this 40 hours a week and scaled it, I could outpace my current income.

Starting point is 00:19:08 Absolutely. And that's how it grows. I mean, the mistakes many people make starting something is they take out the loan, they try it, four years down the road. It's like, oh my gosh, it's not done what they thought. And so they're stuck with a failed business and still a loan to pay back. So move at the speed of cash. Jessica, go slow with the ideas. Now, I would say we should give her Ken Coleman's book,

Starting point is 00:19:31 find the work you're wired to do. There's an assessment on the back of the book and take that assessment and see if some ideas generate. And our team will pick up, Jessica, if you stay on the line. But yeah, I think A1 still is finding an income to get this. I'd get the crypto out and I'd start paying down the student loan debt and doing something on the side. So I hope that helps Jessica.

Starting point is 00:20:04 When you take your car to the shop, you're probably thinking two things. How much is this going to cost me and is it going to get done right? What you need is a mechanic who will give you transparent information so you can make the best decision for your car and your wallet. Christian Brothers Automotive is the official auto repair shop of the Ramsey Show because you can trust them to take care of your vehicle the right way. Their digital vehicle inspections let you see exactly what their technicians see, giving you confidence on which repairs are urgent and which ones can wait. Plus, every repair is backed by their nice difference warranty, three years or 36,000 miles.

Starting point is 00:20:44 With a guarantee like that, you can walk away knowing that your car and your wallet are taken care of. Schedule your service today and get 10% off your visit at cbac.com slash ramsay, or click the link in the description. That's C-B-A-C-D-com slash Ramsey. 10% off, up to a $250 value. See Store for details. Are you sick and tired of working so hard and having nothing to show for it?

Starting point is 00:21:27 Well, that is normal. And the sad thing is, normal is broke, but you don't have to live that way. Our every-dollar budgeting app is here to help you find extra money every single month and it builds you a personalized plan to beat debt and build wealth. So in really just 15 minutes,

Starting point is 00:21:44 find thousands of dollars of hidden margin, and it's going to feel like you got to raise. Just learning to be intentional and doing it all, and that's what every dollar is there for. So check out every dollar. You can start for free in the app store or Google Play. All right, let's go to John in Charlott. Hi, John. Welcome to the show. Oh, hi.

Starting point is 00:22:05 Thank you so much for taking my call. Absolutely. I hope this is a lifesaver. I'm in desperate need for some, to try to. to figure out how do I get out of this situation that I got myself in. Okay, my mortgage is 1587-88 a month. I owe $1.75 on the house.

Starting point is 00:22:27 Sorry, you're breaking up on us, John. Speak directly into your phone. I'm sorry. See if we can hear you better. So 1587, then you got $175,000 left on the mortgage. Correct. Okay. So close.

Starting point is 00:22:44 We'll try to get you a better connection, John, and jump back in with you. I know. You sounded, we will be back, John. Oh, let's try again. Hold on one second. Okay. Is that better, John? I mean, I can hear you. It was a good error. Okay. Yes. Shoot. He said he can hear us. We'll jump to our next call and see if we can get you connected. We'll have our phone screeners. Get back on with you to get a better connection. Okay. We will get back to you. But let's go to Ryan and Asheville.

Starting point is 00:23:08 Up next. Hi, Brian. Welcome to the show. Hi. Thanks for taking my call. Yep, absolutely. How can we hope? So my wife and I are on Baby Step 3. We're quickly approaching Baby Step 4. Just for quick context, between us both, we have two pension funds, two 401Ks, and two Roth IRAs. My question is, with similar rates of return, if I have approximately $32,000 in a company 401K, and only $9,700 in my Roth IRA, is it still better to prioritize my Roth? Roth IRA. Do you have a Roth 401k option? Yes. I contribute 120 a month as a Roth contribution.

Starting point is 00:23:55 What's the match? Are they giving you a match at your company? So it's not a match. It's actually, they contribute 5% regardless of what I contribute. So if you did $0, they're still putting in 5% of your income. That's correct. Yeah, I'm a first responder within a local government. and so that's kind of the standard practice. One of the perks. That's great. Okay. So let's talk about your investment strategy here. Is the pension, is that automatic enforced? Yeah, so it's 6% from my check into the pension fund. And of course, I can't change that. And then it's based on the average four highest consecutive years of salary at full maturity.

Starting point is 00:24:41 Okay. So we recommend 15% of your income going into retirement once you hit baby step four. So once you get the fully funded emergency fund. And the order you would do that in is match beats Roth beats traditional. So you said you get a match regardless. So that's kind of nice. It's kind of a moot point. But if you have a Roth 401k, you sort of get the best of the both worlds from your Roth IRA, meaning it's after tax money, but it's going to grow tax free. So that might help with your conundrum. What a lot of people do, if they don't have a Roth 401K, they'll go to the Roth IRA first, fill that up. That's $7,500 for this year.

Starting point is 00:25:16 And then if they still haven't it, 15% of their income, they'll go back to the traditional 401K. But in your case, you might say, I want to do all 15% to my Roth 401K and be done. Okay. But the good news is the balances don't matter. So you're going to see this. It's not like if you invest in the $32,000 401K, it's going to have higher growth than the IRA. Ryan, how much you make a year? So between my wife and I, the gross is 102 a year.

Starting point is 00:25:44 How about you, though? Because we're talking about your numbers and your stuff. Mine is 65 a year. 65, okay. Because I'm thinking the 6% of the pension that you have going in, we always say that half of the pension is what counts towards your 15% on Baby Step 4 because there is money going in, which is great. So you want to include some of it,

Starting point is 00:26:09 but you don't have a lot of control. And sometimes they put it in pretty conservative investment, so it's not very aggressive. So that would be, so 3% of your pension is the 15. Are you following me? So you got 12% left of your income. And you'll be investing a total probably of around $9,000. So you really could go fill up that Roth IRA at $7,500.

Starting point is 00:26:34 And, you know, that leaves you, you know, $1. You could just throw at the 401k if you wanted because you're getting 5% right. We don't count the employer's match or the employer's contribution in the 15%. But it's so good to know that would be close to, you know, 7% going in the 401K. It's probably what I would do. Yeah. And like here's what I did at Ramsey for a long time is just 15% into my Roth 401K here.

Starting point is 00:26:57 And that way I never saw the money. And so it sort of forces the discipline because it shows up before you ever get your paycheck versus some people going, hey, I've got extra money. Should I fund the Roth IRA or should I go on vacation? And so sometimes it's just nice to force yourself to eat the vegetables, which is kind of what you do when you dial up that investment in your 401K to 12% in your case. Yeah, but going from a pension to a Roth and then seven to 401K, that is great. And you guys doing that and your wife's, you know, your wife doing the same on her side of it all.

Starting point is 00:27:27 Amazing. Amazing. That's impressive to be at. So I'm 27 and she is 26. Oh, good for you guys. Well, you're going to kill it, y'all. Absolutely. All right, let's go back to John. Let's see if we got him on the line.

Starting point is 00:27:40 John, are you there? Yes, ma'am. Oh, you sound clear. Clear as day. Okay, perfect. Okay. So we have your mortgage, and then you're saying what you had left on it was about $175,000 on your house. So what is your main question?

Starting point is 00:27:56 All right. The main question is I have $23,000 and roughly $23,000 credit card. in loan debt. Okay. And now my social security is only 1561 a month. Okay. And I only get, and I only net around 500 from the rental property that I have. Okay.

Starting point is 00:28:18 So that average is out to about $2,000 a month. That's all of your income? So that's it. Oh, boy. How old are you, John? I'm an old man. Oh, my God. I'm 74.

Starting point is 00:28:30 Oh, I'm not too old. You're good. Oh, thank you. A young 74. A young 74. God bless you for that one. Thank you so much. I accept that. So you make a little over $2,000 a month between Social Security and this investment property.

Starting point is 00:28:47 What are your expenses every month between the minimum debt payments and your bills? All right. Now, well, I pay the – I have a rental – that I pay rent in North Carolina. That's $625 a month. Then I have – well, my credit card debt is $1,200. a month. And that's about it. What's the rental in North Carolina for? Because of the house that I rent. I don't, because the house that I own is in another state. Okay, so you have two mortgages. No, no, no, no, one mortgage and one rent. Okay, so who's in the

Starting point is 00:29:27 other house that has the mortgage on it? Oh, my renters. My rent is, you know, my tenants. Oh, you're making $500 a month between the mortgage payment versus what they're paying. Yeah, you're right. Right. Okay. Well, something's got to give here. Yeah, if you sold that house, how much equity is in that house? Well, it's worth, Zillow's got it up there for about 3, 310.

Starting point is 00:29:51 And you owe 175? Correct. You might net 110, 115 and after it fees? And you're renting for where you're living right now. Okay. Correct. Okay. Okay.

Starting point is 00:30:06 I mean, I'm... I wanted to do like a home equity or a cash out, but I don't know because I just basically, well, there's two mortgages on the house now. So I don't know if I can find anybody to take... Hold it. I don't know if I can... Anyone will take third place if I were to try to get a cash out, to pay off the credit cards. That's just moving around debt, though. What we need to do is get out of the debt, which is going to require.

Starting point is 00:30:32 deeper sacrifice. So I would be looking at selling this whole thing and using that proceeds to pay off the debts. And maybe you'll be able to at least get by. Yeah. And maybe you'll have Social Security and maybe some part-time work. And after everything's paid, hopefully it's a hundred grand left. And then the hope would be that maybe you can find something small. Yeah, that's probably what I would do, John, is probably sell this rental. And it's in another state. You don't want to be a long-term, a long-distance landlord. Hey, it's Rachel Cruz. I don't know about y'all, but I can build something up in my head until it feels way harder than it really is. I'll convince myself it's going to take forever, be super complicated, or cost of fortune. Then I finally sit down to do it and I wonder why I waited

Starting point is 00:31:27 so long. Making a will might be one of those things for you. That's why I love Mama Bear legal forms. They've taken something that can feel overwhelming and made it so simple. Their online wills are designed by attorneys and tailored for your state. And while you're on the Mama Bear website, it'll walk you through the whole process step by step so you feel confident that you're doing it right and that your loved ones will be taken care of. Plus making your will with Mama Bear only takes about 20 minutes. So don't make a mountain out of a molehill. Go to Mama Bearlegalforms.com and use promo code Ramsey to save 20% on your will. That 20% off is exclusive to Ramsey fans only. Mama Bearlegalforms.com with promo code Ramsey.

Starting point is 00:32:13 Well, if you're new to the Ramsey show, it's important to know the way we filter our questions, we give our advice, we think through scenarios, is in a pretty consistent manner, if you will, because there's a plan that we follow called the Seven Baby Steps. And it really is the plan to get yourself in control of your money, get out of debt, save, invest, pay off your house, everything you really need to do in your life when it comes to your money, and the order at which you should do it. So if you're not familiar with it, make sure to check it out. We'll put a link down below for those of you watching on YouTube or listening on podcasts

Starting point is 00:33:08 to check out the seven baby steps because this is one of the most helpful things that you can do for your financial journey. All right. Let's go to, is it Luis in Indianapolis? Hi, welcome to the show. Hi, thank you. Thanks for having me. So basically I'm calling because I'm trying to figure out whether selling my car is actually a smart financial business. or whether my partner is right about me being impulsive again.

Starting point is 00:33:39 So a little backstory, basically, in December, my old car broke down. I tried buying a cheap 2 to 3K car, but the very next day it wouldn't start. I got frustrated, made an emotional decision, and bought a $43,000 car, even though I always told myself I wouldn't buy a new. because of a new car because of depreciation. So basically now I'm considering selling it, but I'm not trying to upgrade or buy another expensive car. I started a side business, mobile detailing, so I bought a van. So right now I wouldn't be in rush buying a different car probably in the next month or so.

Starting point is 00:34:25 My partner thinks I should just leave everything alone because I have a history of making impulsive decisions, and sometimes you're getting them later. So she also thinks buying the detail event was also impulsive. So my question is basically what's selling the new car and going back to a cheap car, be me correcting a bad financial decision, or am I just making another impulsive decision

Starting point is 00:34:48 and should keep what I already have? A wonderfully phrased question. So so far, it doesn't sound like you think you're making impulsive decisions. So I want to know what Luis thinks about his own decision-making because so far just my partner thinks it's impulsive. Do you think it was impulsive to buy this brand-new car? I definitely think it was impulsive. Like I said, I did bought that. You know, I've always had that mentality of, like, I listened to your guys' show since I was in high school.

Starting point is 00:35:17 So I said I would never buy one because, you know, depreciation. So I made sure to buy a $3,000 car. But how much did you have to see you had the money? There's a middle ground here. You know, it doesn't have to be from a... Three to 43. There's a gap here. A $40,000 gap we can talk about.

Starting point is 00:35:33 Okay, did you... Is it on payments? So I actually bought it January, like I said, I don't know, December of last year. And I actually paid it off end of February. So that year, yeah, I graduated nursing school of January of 25, had about 15K in savings. And throughout that 20-25, I... I gave the total of like 35,000. So by February, I ended up paying.

Starting point is 00:36:04 I ended up paying. I am the car and I had a $24,000 student loan. So it was both of them. Oh, so basically all of my savings and earnings I spent on the car. Yes. So that probably is not smart. Do you have any other debt or are you debt free now? I'm debt free now.

Starting point is 00:36:24 I make sure, you know, I don't have a budget. I don't do it. budget or anything like that, but I kind of go every, my paycheck's every two weeks, so I just kind of go. Do you think, just spitball, and do you think a budget would help you make less impulsive decisions? I think so. I definitely think so.

Starting point is 00:36:40 I tend to be very, yeah, I just tend to be kind of go with the flow, and I usually like structure, but for some reason when it comes to budgeting, I think to find different kinds of budgeting apps, but nothing, I don't know, nothing really. address my attention, so I just end up going to, you know, just kind of mental budget. Clearly that one's not working. So let's try a downloaded app for now. I'm going to gift you one called every dollar. I'm going to give you the premium version. It'll connect to your bank account. That's step one. It was we got to make a budget and your partner can be your accountability partner and saying, hey, that brand new car was not in the budget this month. Now, if you want to

Starting point is 00:37:19 save up and get a car, let's put it in the budget and say a thousand bucks a month. We're going to put away in a sinking fund. And by the end of two years, we got 20. $24,000. Well, and how much do you make a year? So, I make a total of like $90,000. Pick up some extra shifts in the side business, so I'd say about $100K. Okay, okay. And the vans paid off?

Starting point is 00:37:41 Yeah, yeah. So, yeah, so, you know, this is impulsive too, right? In summer, I basically had a savings of like $15,000. I ended up putting $10,000 on, like, $4,000 or $5,000 on the van and the equipment. so then basically right now I have $5,000, you know, in savings. Okay. So I honestly, because you're under the, we say that you're, anything with motors and wheels that you own should be no more than 50% of your take-home pay.

Starting point is 00:38:10 But let me get this right, though. The car, the $43,000 car is different than the van, right? Correct. That's just more of the van I usually just use it to like go from. And how much is it worth, would you say? The van, I'd say it's probably worth about 3,500. Oh, okay, okay. You know, it's paid off.

Starting point is 00:38:34 At this point, I think you would, I don't know if I would sell it because I think that you're going to take the hit of it being a one-year-old car. And I don't know, you know what I mean? Like, at this point, the car isn't the issue. You're the issue now with your money. Yeah, if you may like, pay. You have to control yourself. A blood oath to yourself and God and your partner that no more impulsive to

Starting point is 00:38:54 decisions, we're going to budget for all these things, then it's okay to keep it. Now, it might be a stark reminder of your past decisions, and if that's the case, if it's going to keep you up at night, you know, slamming your head on a desk going, I shouldn't have done that, I shouldn't have done that. Then, sure, sell it as just so you can stop letting that live in your head rent free. But as far as our parameter goes, it is a lot of car for a young guy, even though you're making good money, but it's not violating the parameter so much that I would say you need to go sell this tomorrow, you're broke. It's not freeing up a payment. You're not needing it to pay off any other debt. So if you love the car, you can keep it. What kind of car is this? It's a basic, a

Starting point is 00:39:31 2025 Honda cord. It's a hybrid touring. Okay. Yeah, that's a sweet ride. I was obsessed with them, but now it's just kind of just sitting there, you know, just, I mean, I don't even want to put the miles on there, right, because eventually I do want to sell it. No, you got to live. Just drive it to the wheels fall off. Yeah, you bought it. You got it. That should be the pact you make, is I have to drive this thing for 10 years to prove to myself that I don't impulsively jump in and out of decisions. So your goal needs to be to build up an emergency fund of at least three months, put that aside, and then start investing your income. Because Louise, you can start making smart decisions today because the guy you've been at this point is a little bit, you know,

Starting point is 00:40:12 on a whim and an expensive will that you go on. And that's how you're going to live your whole life is kind of this like whim to whim versus saying, I'm a guy that does have structure. I have have fun and I enjoy my money, but I'm going to have a plan around it and some level of control when it comes to my spending so that I know what is going on. And that's what the budget's going to help you do. And you put all that together. You're going to do fine. Like you are. You worked hard. You mean, you paid off. Gosh, the car and $24,000 in student loans in a year. So you obviously have a strong work ethic. I think you're going to be able to make some great money. You just want that money to be put to good use. So I hope that's helpful. But yeah, stay on the line. We'll

Starting point is 00:40:51 we'll pick up and get you every dollar premium for free. I like these promises. I will not go into debt ever again unless it's a 15-year mortgage and I will not make impulsive purchases and I'm going to let my partner advise me and give me wisdom because they know me better than anyone. She's probably like, stupid, Luis, what are you doing again? What are you doing? You bought a business?

Starting point is 00:41:10 I bet he came home. That's what he said. He's like, listen, I bought a car dealing, car detailing business. Every time it comes home, there's a new decision in the driveway. And then he's like, I bought a new car. She's like, what? And it's jumping from extreme to extreme, which. can happen, but you go from a beater $2,000 car that won't start.

Starting point is 00:41:26 It sounds like you had money. We don't tell people go buy $2,000 cars for the rest of your life. If you have money, yeah, you could have gotten a great... If you're in crippling debt and you need something to go from where to B. Go get a $15,000 car. There's that middle ground there that's important versus letting your emotions take over, always so. Logic is going to help you, my friends.

Starting point is 00:41:47 Always move slow. Sleep on it. Just sleeping on it. It might change your life. whatever it is, $10,000, give it a rest first. When you're trying to hire, you don't have time to dig through stacks of resumes

Starting point is 00:42:21 hoping someone halfway decent floats to the top. That's the world's least fun game of Where's Waldo? What you do need are qualified candidates who won't waste your time because you can be sure they actually want your job, which is why I love the way ZipRecruiter is helping small business owners right now. ZipRecruiter has a new feature that finds the kind of people who will go the extra mile for you. Candidates can now tell you why,

Starting point is 00:42:43 they're interested, nay passionate about your role. And ZipRecruiter smart matching technology automatically puts the most qualified, most interested candidates at the top of your list. So instead of sorting through a pile of just okay, you're seeing the right people faster. In fact, four out of five employers who post on ZipRecruiter get a quality candidate within the first day. That's not a coincidence. It's because ZipRecruiter goes the extra mile for you, just like the candidates you want to hire. Try ZipRecruiter for free today at ZipRecruiter.com slash Ramsey. That's ziprecruiter.com slash Ramsey. Meet your match on ZipRecruiter. Welcome back to the Ramsey Show in the Fairwinds Credit Union Studio. I am Rachel Cruz,

Starting point is 00:43:33 hosting this hour with George Camel. And we are answering your questions at AAA 8255-225. So give us a call. We're talking about your life and your money. Up next we have Brooke in Salt Lake City. Hi, Brooke. Welcome to the show. Hi, how are you guys? Hi, we're doing great. How can we help? Good. I am just curious. How do you stay humble but stand up for yourself when your family members make comments about you not having money, but they don't know the whole story? Oh, what happens? We just, we tried a little humble lifestyle and, you know, use the every dollar app and we just get comments sometimes randomly, mostly for my husband's mother.

Starting point is 00:44:19 and she says things like, oh, I wish you did things like your uncle and you were smart with your money instead of buying this, I don't know, $2,000 hunting bow is what happened yesterday. Your husband bought a hunting bow for $2,000? Yeah, he's going to. Okay. And she said. She doesn't think that's wise decision. She doesn't think that we save for it and pay cash for things. Would that make a difference to her, or does she just think this is a story?

Starting point is 00:44:49 stupid purchase? Her comment was mostly like your uncle saves and saves and then buys what he wants when he wants to when he has the money. You don't have to respond to anything she says. She doesn't get a vote in your life. But did you not say that's what we do? Yeah, we did. And she just said, well, it doesn't seem like that.

Starting point is 00:45:12 And it's just hard like to when people say things like that and without wanting to be like, Oh, I have all this. Like, how do you just... Without needing to prove yourself? Yeah. Has she always been this way? Do you guys have this kind of relationship where most things she says bothers you? A little bit.

Starting point is 00:45:30 Okay. Yeah, a little bit. Just maybe par for the course with mother-in-laws, I don't know, but I think this is maybe tip of the iceberg of she just is kind of a judgyer person and rubs you the wrong way. And like Rachel said, she doesn't know your life. And super rude. Yeah, and just rude. Could you imagine telling your kid, I would.

Starting point is 00:45:48 I really wish you were more like... Why doesn't your husband step in and take her aside and go, hey, mom? Yeah. Listen, we don't get a vote. We don't need your opinion. Yeah, he did last night after the fact. And we've gotten comments sometimes from other family members that we have to. Not like to this extent.

Starting point is 00:46:04 It's been a little more subtle here and there. But he did pull her aside last night. But it's just he's like, how much do I tell her? Do I tell her how much we make? Do I tell her we have all this in retirement? Like she doesn't... Is she worried about us? You know.

Starting point is 00:46:19 I don't think he needs to show her a spreadsheet. I think he can just have a conversation saying, hey, mom, appreciate your comments. They are unneeded. We're doing fine financially. We don't go into debt for things. We save up. You can mind your own business. Like, I feel like she doesn't even deserve, I mean, on one extreme, I'm like, she doesn't even deserve a comment.

Starting point is 00:46:36 I'm just trying to shut this down. You know what I mean? Like, we don't need to have conversations like this. We're doing fine. If we need help, if we're struggling, well, you'll know. No, we'll let you know if we'll let her know. Well, if they want the comments. If we're looking for your opinions, we will ask for them.

Starting point is 00:46:51 That's it. I think it's that. If we want your opinion about money, we will ask. How is she doing financially? It's just a rude thing to say to someone. Do you think she's projecting? She definitely, I don't think she's doing amazing financially. I don't think she's doing awful, but I don't think that she's at a point where she should be at her age.

Starting point is 00:47:13 Okay. Yeah. Well, this is easier said than Dunbrook, but I mean, I honestly, you, your whole life when you try to dance around what other people are thinking and trying to prove yourself, that's just a long, exhausting life. So there does have to be a level of, which is easier said than done. I know, but where you have to be like, this is our story. This is what we're choosing to do. And other people can make judgments, make comments. But it is what it is. And we're secure enough in our plan. And we know what we're doing that we don't even need the affirmation of the outside people to feel good about what we're doing.

Starting point is 00:47:47 We don't need them to even know. Because it's none of their business. And that's usually what we're like. Yeah, yeah. But this just bothered you. This bothered you. Yeah. What other comments are made?

Starting point is 00:47:57 You said that this was the most obvious comment. Are there like passive aggressive? It's just been. No, it's just been things like where we make it a point to say in front of our kids instead of saying we don't have the money for that. We say it's not in the budget, right? So we say that to people when they're like, hey, do you want to go to St. George next week?

Starting point is 00:48:17 And we're like, oh, no, sorry, that's not in the budget. We didn't plan for that this month. And then they say, oh, okay. You know, like, so it's just little things like that where you can tell that they're like, oh, like, why can't you just do it? Sure. Yeah. And it's hard to. And you can't, right?

Starting point is 00:48:34 Like, you guys aren't at a point that. We could. Yeah. We're on baby step six and we have plenty of money. We make about like 240 a year. Okay. 18 to 20% away. Oh, way to go.

Starting point is 00:48:49 We're doing just fine. But we just, we just budget. Well, you're different priorities in other people. Some people want to go on vacations every couple months. And you guys spend your money on a crossbow. Like, it just, it depends on your personality. So as long as you're living out of your values and you're not, you know, sort of shorting yourself by saying, we can't spend.

Starting point is 00:49:11 Instead, go, here's what we choose to spend on. That's what I do want to make sure, bro, because you guys are enjoying. your life, but you're comfortable with the decisions you've made. You don't, okay, that's great. That's what I want. I don't, because sometimes we get people. And we go on trips and stuff all the time, but we just. The children aren't suffering.

Starting point is 00:49:26 Yeah. And, you know, to shift the language a little bit, just as a thought, since you guys are on Baby Step 6, and since you could technically put it in the budget if you wanted to, right? Right. I do wonder if the sentiment of it's not in the budget. usually means that we don't have the money for it right the second. But when you have the ability to, you could just say, oh, sorry, we can't.

Starting point is 00:49:57 And the kids start to hear more, we get to make decisions based on our value system because mom and dad have done so well and because we followed a budget for so long, we actually have the ability to do some of this, but we're just choosing not to. Does that make sense? Versus villainizing the budget, not to other people. I'm thinking more of the kids, even though I tell my kids.

Starting point is 00:50:15 time. I was like, we don't have the money for that. Stop it. Stop it. Shut up. Shut up. Shut up. It does. It does. But I always do wonder, because you guys are on this side, right? Like, it would be different, too, if you were getting out of debt and you're on baby step one, two, or three, and you're, then it really is not in the, like, you really don't have the money to do it. And that's a fair reality. But I wonder the narrative at which you, you talk. And again, this is less about other people, maybe more within your home and for yourself to give yourself, I don't know, the permission to be like, yeah, we're able to do this, but we're going to just, we're going to just choose to say no

Starting point is 00:50:52 because we don't want to spend the money there. Does that make sense? Yeah, you want, well, you want your kids and everyone else to see that you're making decisions out of confidence in who you are and what your value are instead of a place of weakness of this like, well, we just, I don't know, we can't, it's not in the budget. I do think the language matters. Yeah. And we always say more is caught than taught. So the kids will grow up thinking, well, we never had money for that. Instead of, well, we had the money, we just, that wasn't a priority for us. For mom and dad, yeah. And that they're, that they're grown up enough that they don't feel like they're having to be swayed in every situation. To do things because someone else

Starting point is 00:51:25 asked them or pressured them. That's right. Yeah. Yeah, I don't know, just a thought, Brooke. I appreciate the call, though. But yeah, yeah, the mother-in-law thing, I think there's just a point that you have to say, of course, of course she'd make these comments. It is what it is. And you keep moving on. Don't let it, don't let it pin you down and ruin your day. If you're waiting for rates to drop before you buy a home, here's what nobody tells you. When rates fall, every buyer who's been sitting on the sidelines makes their move at the same time you do. That means more competition, higher prices, bidding wars, all that. That's why I tell people to talk to Churchill mortgage before they do anything else. Churchill gives you a strategy

Starting point is 00:52:32 so you're not at the mercy of the market. They can show you what you can afford, not just what the bank will approve. And with their certified home buyer, your financing is completely secured before you shop, which means when rates drop and everyone rushes in, you're already ahead of the crowd. You're not scrambling for pre-approval while the house goes to someone else. My husband and I bought both of our homes with Churchill, and having a real strategy, not just a rate we were waiting for, made us ready when it really mattered. So, start your search with Churchill. Click the link in the description or go to Churchillmortgage.com slash Ramsey offer for an exclusive Ramsey audience offer.

Starting point is 00:53:11 Churchillmortgage.com slash Ramsey offer. Well, George, I think some of my favorite memories growing up were trips. It's probably my love for travel. Ramsey's love travel. We love, we do. We love to travel. And mom and dad, they would always, we would like, we went from like camping and tents as they were getting out of their, you know, trying to out of the bankruptcy and all of that.

Starting point is 00:53:49 And then by the time I hit probably late middle school, high school, we actually went on like vacations. We went on trips. And mom and dad made it a priority. They do love to travel and they still do. But one of the things we did all the time is we cruised. We were a cruising family. So you're either a cruiser or you're not.

Starting point is 00:54:06 So I hear. And we've done the, we did the big ships. Even as adults, we've done some in Europe. They've taken us before we had kids. But it was like Winston, my sister and her husband. And we did like a Baltic Sea, like a smaller boat. Like some really fun experiences. And there's some of the best memories.

Starting point is 00:54:25 again, I've had are these trips. And so thanks Dave and Sharon for that. But the great thing is, is that Dave's love for cruising has spilled over. It's infiltrated, Ramsey's Solutions. It's through Ramsey Land, you can say. And the idea of going on a cruise called the Live Like No One Else Cruise came about a few years ago. We did our first one. It was two, a year ago is when we were there, March, March of 25.

Starting point is 00:54:52 And this is for people in baby steps four or five and six. So once you're out of debt and you have a fully funded. And seven. You can come if you're on service. Oh, sorry. A lot of seveners. And sevens. We forget about seveners.

Starting point is 00:55:02 I know. Sevens, a lot of seveners, actually. And it was like this, hey, we talk about the sacrifice and everything you have to do to get yourself in a good financial position. And so you live like no one else. And then later you get to live and give like no one else. So let's do the live like no one else cruise for those people. And let's celebrate and have fun and create memories with your life, right?

Starting point is 00:55:22 And to enjoy it with other people. And so we are. We're so pumped because we're doing it again. And this next one coming up is in March of 27. And it is, it's filling up, George. Seven nights, Western Caribbean, Bahamas, Jamaica, Who I Want to Take You? We got Grand Cayman, Cosemel. The entire ship is Ramsey fans.

Starting point is 00:55:43 That's it. And the Ramsey personalities, Dave and all of us. And look at it. It's a beautiful. And it's a nice ship, Holland American. Dave had to approve. You know that. He had to say that he would enjoy this.

Starting point is 00:55:54 He doesn't want Walmart of the Seas out there. He wants it to be classic. It is. It's such a beautiful, nice ship. My kids, they're coming for part of it. I can't wait. It overlaps their spring break. I know.

Starting point is 00:56:05 And so, yeah, it just, it's so fun, you guys. And all the Ramsey personalities will all be there. Every night will be, yeah, hanging out during the day. We have all new content. We're going to do the world's largest dead free scream, live tapings of your favorite Ramsey shows, maybe even Smart Money Happy Hour. Who knows? Oh, look at us, Lord George, just laughing.

Starting point is 00:56:22 We got to make a drink live on stage. It was disastrous and hilarious. It was great. It was great. But yeah, join us, if you will. Again, if you're on baby steps, four or beyonds. And let's celebrate together so you can secure your cabin. And if you want to go to Ramsey Solutions.com slash events to book,

Starting point is 00:56:39 or we have a little QR code on screen if you're watching on YouTube that you can click on. But we want to hang out with you next March, March of 27, come cruise with us. It'll be some good memories. All right. Let's go to Houston, Texas. and we have, oh, Cormac? Is that how we would say? Is that it?

Starting point is 00:56:56 Did I pronounce it correctly? Just Cormac. Yes. Cormac. Okay, perfect. Hi, welcome to the show. That's exactly. Yes.

Starting point is 00:57:03 How can we help? So, my wife and I have over previous few years between bad luck and bad decisions. We've worked up about $120,000 in debt, not including our home. Feeling the pinch, trying to get things right. I've discovered the program a few months ago. have the 1,000 plus saved up, just trying to get out of debt. However, what I've noticed is because our minimum payments are so high, we're making such a small dent.

Starting point is 00:57:34 We're wondering if we're better off doing a Chapter 13 bankruptcy, just consolidating everything, or cashing out one of my Roth IRAs, which is almost covered a full debt, and trying to rebuild. Wow. Can I ask, what is the 120? What kind of debt is it?

Starting point is 00:57:59 A combination of vehicle and the mostly credit card. Vehicle and credit card. Okay. How much do you owe on the vehicle today? 20,000, and that's about what it's worth. 20,000, and that's about what you can get for it. Okay. Any money saved besides the thousand?

Starting point is 00:58:17 I've got a couple thousand saved. But I do have a, so I'm a federal employee, so I have my TSP, which is like the 401K. Plus, before I joined that, I had a Roth IRA saved up, which I have about $110,000 in. Okay. So it's $100,000 in credit card debt. Yes. Was there, did you try to start a business, or what was that used on? Unfortunately, I went through, over the past five years, there was.

Starting point is 00:58:48 was a divorce that was contested, sorry, that was heated. My grandmother and my father passed away within several months, a couple months of each other. Okay. Wow. And then good stuff did happen where I met my now wife and we had remarried and we have two beautiful children of our own. But those also cost money. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:59:09 You've had a lot, a lot happen. It's been an active couple of years. Yes. Okay. So how much money do you and your new wife make? combined about 250,000 a year. Oh, well, that's great. Are you guys investing right now?

Starting point is 00:59:27 At the exact moment, no, because I pulled my auto pull out of my paycheck. I went through all that, or see me, I stopped all that to try and get a handle on the debt. Good. And same with your spouse? Correct. Okay. So I'm just looking at all the options here. We never encourage bankruptcy. Of course. It will destroy your life for the next 10 years a lot more than it might help it,

Starting point is 00:59:55 especially with Chapter 13, where you're just restructuring and you're getting on a payment plan. And so I would look at this amazing income and then your expenses to go, what can we cut out of our lives, how do we make more so that we can get ahead of this? Because right now you're saying the interest alone on 100 grand of credit card debt, what is the minimum payment per month? And what's the interest every month? I've called my head the combined payments are well over

Starting point is 01:00:19 3,000 a month and the average the average out the interest is about 25% But are you guys taking home about 15K a month? No, I have a child support payment from my first marriage so that it has a good dip into it

Starting point is 01:00:38 and then just medical expense as well as we have a second home that we are trying to unload, but in the meantime, it's still costing us money as well. What will the proceeds be from that if you sell it? I mean, at this point, we're about to sell it for just cost, just to get out from under it. Okay. But that'll free up at least the mortgage payment.

Starting point is 01:01:04 Correct. It would be about including the tax payment about $2,000 a month. Okay, great. Would that help you get ahead? Would you be above water here if you freed up a two grand? My concern is my job has a mandatory retirement of 56 and I'm 38. I only have 18 years left to work. And because I do not have a college degree,

Starting point is 01:01:27 I don't feel like I'll be able to get a similar job pay scale-wise. So I'm just, why I am hesitant to drain my one retirement account is because I'm just not, I'm worried I will not have enough time to rebuild it before I am forced to retire. Sure. That is a concern. And we only tell people, if you're going to, if you're facing bankruptcy, it's the only time that you would ever even consider dipping into retirement. But I would still use that as a last ditch effort, not a let's go green light, drain your Roth IRA today. I would do everything in my power to use your current assets in future income to knock this debt out over the next couple of years. Yeah. Which I think if you took a good hard look at the budget, you could find some money. Yes. And that's what I'm wondering.

Starting point is 01:02:16 So I'm like, okay, say you guys lived off of 4K a month, which will feel very different than probably how you have with some child support payments, you said. I mean, I feel like you can, I feel like you guys could find four or five thousand a month. Yeah, so over the past six months, we've cut out, we sold the car. We, like so, we're trying to get rid of this spare house. We have cut all streaming things. We're chiming. I picked up the second job.

Starting point is 01:02:45 Okay, good, good. Because 5K a month thrown at this debt, you're done in about two years. Yeah, that's what I... So find 5K out of this amazing $240,000 a year income and plus extra. Maybe some extra, yeah. You can climb out of this without touching retirement. It's going to take some time, but do not touch retirement. Don't file for bankruptcy.

Starting point is 01:03:03 You guys have the income and the work ethic to get out of it. It may take two years. If you're behind on your bills, doing your money. more of the same isn't going to fix it. You need a different plan. And that's why I tell people about Guardian litigation group. If you've missed payments, if collectors are calling nonstop, or if you're getting letters about legal action, that's your signal. And it's where a lot of people wait too long, because the longer you wait, the fewer options you usually have. And once it turns into a lawsuit, things can get more expensive and more complicated fast. Guardian litigation is a

Starting point is 01:03:51 law firm, not a call center. From day one, you are assigned an attorney who represents you. So, if a creditor moves forward, you're not caught off guard and you're not hit with surprised legal fees. Guardian litigation only gets paid when the debt is negotiated and the client accepts the settlement offer. This is about stepping in early while you still have leverage. Don't ignore the problem. Take control of it. Go to Guardianlit.com slash Ramsey right now. That's Guardian, t.com slash Ramsey. Attorney advertising, results may vary and no specific outcomes guaranteed. So one of the sneaky things about debt, I would say, and building a life around it.

Starting point is 01:04:50 And we're talking everything from putting vacations on credit cards to financing furniture to all the above is you see the price of something and you assume that's it. That's it. But the problem is when you use debt, there's a little thing caught interest, George, that, uh, It'll get you, Rachel. It'll get you. People think, well, it's no big deal. And they don't teach this stuff in school.

Starting point is 01:05:15 Yes. They're not telling you what 20% APR actually means when it comes to that purchase. Yep. So we wanted to kind of do the math, if you will, on what it actually really is costing you, the hidden cost of this, quote, unquote, American life that people build. And when you do it on debt, again, the numbers change pretty quickly. Now more than ever, there's a way they'll get you. you out of there with that thing.

Starting point is 01:05:40 Yes. Regardless of what payment you can afford and what the interest rate is that they'll tuck into the fine print. So let's talk about sticker price versus actual price. Let's start with a new couch. That's a famous one. You go into any furniture store. They always have some deal happening with the interest.

Starting point is 01:05:55 Zero down. Zero percent for the first whatever. So let's talk about a new couch. Let's say the sticker price is $1,500. And it's 20% APR for 36 months. So when you hear the word APR, that's an abbreviation for annual. percentage rate. This is essentially the full cost per year of borrowing that money. So it's not just the interest rate. It's actually the interest rate plus whatever fees they have all baked into one

Starting point is 01:06:19 final rate. So 20% APR for 36 months. Well, you'd actually pay for that $1,500 couch is $2,07. Gross. So over $500 in interest alone. $500. But think about that. That makes the effective interest rate about 33%. About a third of that couch is paid extra in interest. to go. That's crazy. Okay, let's look at credit cards. Let's say you got a $6,600 balance and, you know, you have a 22.8% APR and you'll be paying about $300 a month. So if you do that, it's going to take you about two years and five months to pay off this credit card and the final price of the credit card is $8,628. So over $2,000 in interest alone just by

Starting point is 01:07:08 saying, hey, we're going to just we're going to live life on a credit card, may or may not be able to pay it off fully every month, so we're going to kind of just keep it around, and then it ends up with a balance of, you have, $6,600. Wow. Okay, can I say? That's not even minimum payments.

Starting point is 01:07:24 That's if you're paying extra. Okay, you're ready for this. So then option two we have here, same APR, 22.8%. And you just do minimum payments. Okay. The payoff time is 20 years and one month. And the final price will be 17,000.

Starting point is 01:07:38 $10,060. So you're paying $10,500 in just interest if you're just paying the minimum payments. That's wild. And if you are able to watch on YouTube, Spotify, we've got the charts up to visualize all of this. And it is staggering just to look at the numbers on this to think, now I hope nobody takes 20 years to pay off six grand. No, surely not. But listen. The fact remains. A lot of people are just making minimum payments because they can't or don't know to put extra on it. For years. Yeah, maybe not 20 years. But for a good amount for sure. Can you imagine? And that whatever that thing was you put on the credit card, you long ago, like the 20 years ago? That's a lot of stupid tax to pay. Let's go back 20 years. You got a little 2006 action. What did you buy in 2006? What decisions was I making at 17 years old? I had 18. I don't want to know the stupid stuff I was buying. Wow. Okay, now let's move on to a to a bigger one,

Starting point is 01:08:31 a car. Yep. So sticker price, $35,000, financing it 7% for five years. final price, $41,582. So an extra, we'll go $6,600 in interest alone. And think about this, that car is no longer worth $35,000 because we know that, you know, cars go down in value about 60% in five years. Yeah. So that $35,000 car, you'll be lucky if it's 15 to 20 grand. Well, what's hard is 35, and that's before sales tax, registration, dealer fees, warranties, all of that. So that easily could be out the door at 40, 42. Ouch. Yep. So you're watching what it is. It's why financing a car is one of the biggest wealth killers for the middle class in America today. You don't realize just how bad it is when you're paying interest on a depreciating asset going down in

Starting point is 01:09:22 value. All right. Finally, the house. Now, this one can feel like the least dumb decision because it's a house. It's an asset. It's going to go up in value over time. So let's talk about a sticker price of $350,000 for that house and you're going to put 20% down. So 70 grand down and you're going to do a 30-year mortgage at 6% APR. Well, the final price of that $350,000 house is $674,000. Around $324,000 in interest, which is almost as much as the house. That's crazy. Wild. Wild. And if you did a 15-year mortgage, then you'd pay $179,000. Less and in and $3.000. So almost $200,000 you save an interest just by paying it off in 15 versus 30. Which is why we always tell people.

Starting point is 01:10:11 Just get the 15. Don't get a 30 and think you're going to pay it off like a 15. Force yourself in it. Yeah. And I think what's hard is, again, in these individual situations, it may feel like a good idea. Like, sure, let's just put the vacation on the credit card. Or we need some new furniture. So in this one situation, we're going to do this.

Starting point is 01:10:30 But what happens is that this builds over time. and for a lot of people, you're not able to pay it off in six months to a year if you're just living paycheck to paycheck and not really making a plan for it. So to make another debt decision easily could come up nine months, 12 months after the other decision, right? And it just keeps piling up. And then you realize how much money of your money you're sending not just for the item, because it's not just the sticker price, but all the interest to the banks and everything. And these industries are there to make money. And they know how. to do it for in America especially. Oh my gosh. How much people take out debt for the stuff. The amount of

Starting point is 01:11:07 interest lenders are collecting every year would boggle your mind. So here's the thing to remember. Wealthy people earn interest, broke people pay interest. You want to be on the wealthy side, earning it instead of paying it. And remember this, the sticker price is never the final price. So anytime you see that, anytime there's a salesperson involved, they are trained to sell. They are trained to let you focus on the features and the benefits and how you're going to feel when you leave with that thing, not the fine print, not the APR, not how much you're going to pay in full, and the taxes and fees will add a little, the interest will add a lot. That's right. Yep, and minimum payments, it's a debt trap. Like that kind of system, that systematic thinking

Starting point is 01:11:45 of all just pay minimum payments for the rest of my life, that keeps you, keeps you, guarantees you in a cycle of debt for a really, really long time versus saying, hey, I want to get out of this. I'm going to stop going into debt, and I'm actually going to aggressively pay off beyond the minimum payments to get out of debt as soon as possible. And lastly, cash changes the math and the mindset. Yes, saving up feels slower. Yes, you're going to have to say no right now. But it's actually the fastest path to taking control of your money.

Starting point is 01:12:15 And it makes you think twice. When you were to save up and actually see that amount of money, leave your bank account, you think twice about that couch. A hundred percent. Can we find one on Facebook marketplace? Are we good? It took us three months to save up for that couch. I don't know if I want to let go of my hard-earned money.

Starting point is 01:12:29 Think about how much of your working hours are spent just giving it to a lender. That's crazy to think about. Absolutely. And I'll say this too. When you spend in cash and like larger purchases, you do realize, okay, I may not need that. Like if that cash is there, right, in our plan, we would say you can pay for it. Like if you have the money for it, that is fine. But so we've run into this with our van.

Starting point is 01:12:54 Even furniture. We've had our furniture for, gosh, it's going on how many years, seven years. And so there's a couple of things we want to upgrade, but you're kind of like, well, the kids are still, you all, I almost find myself being like, do we need to? I don't know. You know, because I don't know if I want to. It may hurt to spend that kind of money,

Starting point is 01:13:12 but you don't have that emotional attachment always with your money when debt is being used. It is just a sign of a, you know, a signature. You sort of bypass a big part of your brain that's the logical side and go straight to that, well, I want it now. It's the toddler in you. Yes, yes. Do not let the toddler win.

Starting point is 01:13:28 So the ever, average individual, the average American, the average broke person just asks how much per month, how much down? That's the problem. Financially wise people, wealthy people, they ask how much? What is the full cost, total cost? And if I don't have that amount, I'm not buying it. And if you do that, you will take control of your money. So we've got an app that helps you do this. It's called every dollar. You can create sinking funds for that next big purchase and do it with confidence and peace. We'll drop a link in the show notes if you're listening on podcast or YouTube to that app. Hey guys, it's Rachel Cruz. When it comes to life insurance, most people fall into one of two camps,

Starting point is 01:14:37 the ones who make a plan to protect their family and the ones who hope everything will just work out. But hope isn't a financial plan. When you get married or have kids, your money decisions aren't just about you anymore. Your income helps keep the lights on, pay the mortgage, and put food on the table. And if something happens to you, will your family have protection or uncertainty? Well, at Ramsey, we recommend term life insurance that 10 to 12 times your income with a 15 to 20 year term for the years that your kids are at home and your mortgage is still being paid off. That's why Winston and I have our term life coverage through Zander Insurance. They're an independent broker who works for you, shopping all the top companies to find the most

Starting point is 01:15:20 competitive prices on coverage you need. Get instant quotes online in just minutes at zander.com or call 800 at 356, 424.2,000. to get your family protected with term life insurance. That's zander.com or 800356-4282. Well, if you're listening, you're one of the best pieces of marketing we have up there in the world. When you share the show and you tell your friends and family about it, it is so helpful because we want to be able to help and talk to as many people as possible to get them in control of their money.

Starting point is 01:16:11 So if you will like, comment, subscribe, share the show. That helps us out a ton. Mention it at your next dinner party? Yeah, just throw it out there. Play it in the background and they go, what is that? What is that about? Who's that Sultry voice? That's George Camel.

Starting point is 01:16:26 That's what's happening. No, Eric Clapton playlist here. No, no, no, we got the Ramsey show. You got me. Yep. It's all you need. All right, let's go to Ben in Chattanooga. Hi, Ben.

Starting point is 01:16:36 Welcome to the show. Hi. Hello. How can we help today? So my main question is, Should I stretch for a $1.1 million family farm dream on $186,000 salary? My wife's grandparents owned a 28-acre farm in the Northwest Georgia Mountains. My wife has always dreamed about living on a property like this about six years ago.

Starting point is 01:17:08 Her grandparents put it up for sale. We found that we were in a position to make an offer, So we offered 500,000 for it. We were living in the Boise area at the time, and that would have been contingent on our house. However, they ended up selling it to someone who offered a higher price, close to the full price. It was 586K.

Starting point is 01:17:33 We believe the real estate agent kind of had some influence on that. And this has been kind of a lasting source of disappointment for my in-laws and the family. family. Now we've relocated to the Northwest Georgia area. The current owners have offered to sell us 17 acres of the farmland for 500K. However, the county blocked the lot split after we completed the survey due to a maximum number of six residences on a private road. We went through the variance process with the county. It was denied. After that, the owners offered us at least a purchase arrangement where we put up the price for the 17 acres, 500K with no payments, and then after 36 months, we would purchase the remaining 11 acres. I countered with just an idea of leasing the land outright for $300 a month and then having a first right of refusal that when they're ready to sell,

Starting point is 01:18:49 we could get the land for 1.1, which they said they like that. They're thinking about doing that in a year or two. My financial situation, I have about 700,000 in retirement funds, about 450K in cash from a sale of our previous house, about 50K in a stock portfolio, about 20K in an emergency,

Starting point is 01:19:13 fund at about 30K in HSA, in an HSA. And so that's about $1.2 million for my net worth. My in-laws have offered to pay $1,000 a month if absolutely needed to pay for this so that it can come back into the family. However, that would come out of their equity in their house at this time. And now I work it real hard for this piece of property. Yes, so everybody's working really hard. And so my concerns are just affordability for myself.

Starting point is 01:19:52 That's a big debt for my salary. Are you guys renting right now? 650. Yes, we're renting. Okay. Would you think about putting the 480 down as a down payment? Because that'd be almost half of it. Yeah, I would be putting down at least the 440.

Starting point is 01:20:13 50 and keep my emergency fund is what I would. What about the stocks? Could you liquidate those? I would like to keep those and keep them growing. Okay, my quick math. Tell me this, Ben, if you did put down 480, it looks like the payments, then, and this would be on a 30 or not a 15,

Starting point is 01:20:34 we recommend a 15, but it would be around $4,000 a month. And do you guys bring home around 15K? I'm just trying to figure out if we can make this mathematically work at any level. Yeah, what's your after-tax monthly income without any 401k contributions or health care premiums? What is your after-tax monthly income? So after-tax without any of my benefits would probably be around, let's see, it'd probably be around like 12,000. Okay. Or probably more like 11,000. So if you did a 15-year like we recommend,

Starting point is 01:21:11 be about half your take-home pay. And so you're worried about that legitimately. That's going to make you guys house poor. Now, what is the future hold? Can you buy this thing, can you set up an agreement where you purchase this thing, let's say two years from now and you guys just sock away cash? I mean, that is kind of what I'm thinking that I would need to do in order to. Because no one else is Joneson for this property. Right? And the people who own it don't really, they're okay getting out of it. Do you want to move to it been? Yeah, it's a beautiful property.

Starting point is 01:21:45 I'm sure. I mean, the North, gosh, North Georgia Mountains are gorgeous. My issue is always just, does the math add up? And am I going to feel like this is going to weigh down on me with that amount of debt for 30 years? Like, that's always my concern. Yeah, I would not do this today. I think there is a future where this can make sense and you're not stressed out about it. I mean, you guys have waited this long for the.

Starting point is 01:22:11 dream. So let's make sure the dream is a blessing and not a burden once we get into it. Now, do you guys have kids? Yes, we have five kids. Okay. I'm 12 and under. Does this move make sense for you guys? Like, if you just did this thing next year, would this work with your jobs? Yeah, so I would need to commute, but I'm already commuting. We live nearby. This is the whole reason we moved here. Yeah, well, I would see if you can set up a two. I mean, if this is really what you guys are wanting and you're like, this is going to be a long-term play for us, then, yeah, I would say give it two years because I think after stocking away some cash, and then maybe cashing out some, you may have to cash out some stocks just to make it work, because you have plenty in retirement. You guys have $700,000.

Starting point is 01:23:03 That's what you said. Yeah. Yeah. So your retirement's fine. I mean, all of it is you're just kind of, you're going to be really real estate heavy in general. after this, but over time, it's going to, it will even out, which I'll be honest, but that's what, I mean, when my husband and we built and we moved to 19, we're pretty real estate heavy.

Starting point is 01:23:23 Yeah, I was the same way. Yeah, and over years, you work to even it back out, right, and then have more cash and retirement and all of that. But, so I think that's okay for the short term. So if this is something that you both really, really want to, then there's going to have to be some sacrifices made and that's going to be putting away money seeing if you can get an agreement with them that a purchase in two years holding the value with it not going up like if you can hold the purchase price today and do it in two years and and then possibly having to cash out some stocks just to

Starting point is 01:23:57 make up a difference because I would rather have breathing room and rebuild in the market investments when you're not penalized like I'm not talking about retirement don't take anything out retirement but I would do that because it sounds like a dream. I mean, it just, it sounds amazing and beautiful and it's been in the family. Like it would be worth going in and sacrificing for two years to get it. And then knowing the next three to four years, we may be real estate heavy, but it's not going to, it's not going to sink us. It's not going to sink you.

Starting point is 01:24:28 Yeah, I mean, I would highly consider it. And then see what you guys can reasonably put away to go, can we put six, seven grand away for the next two years and have. and have 170 grand on top of what we currently have to make this thing make sense? And are you guys working with a good agent? We have not asked an agent yet about any of this. I would get them involved to see. Make sure the costs are right. Is it actually worth $1.1 million?

Starting point is 01:24:56 Are they just squeezing you because they know you really want the property? Is this thing really worth $800,000? Okay. So that's the part I want you to do your homework on, not just go, well, it's 1.1. It has to be 1.1. You might be able to get it for a lot cheaper if you have some negotiating power, and that's the power of a great agent. So ramsysolutions.com slash agent, if you want to get a second opinion, and I would to make sure that you save the most on this thing and don't get squeezed just out of, it's our dream. Let's just do it no matter what.

Starting point is 01:25:24 Well, and you've already played the emotional cards because I know it's a family property. You know what I mean? Like, you're going to have to, yeah, do some good negotiating with it. But yeah, the answer today, Ben, is no. It'll be 50% of your take-home pay, the payment, and that would not be worth it. But wait, two years, possibly. If you're already enrolled in a Medicare plan, you might think there's nothing else to do. You're good to go.

Starting point is 01:25:51 Wrong? The fact is Medicare premiums, networks, prescription coverage, and benefits can all change, even if your health doesn't. So doing nothing could cost you hundreds or even thousands of dollars a year. With annual enrollment time coming soon, you need to talk to Chapter right away.

Starting point is 01:26:08 Chapter is the only Ramsey-Terms. trusted Medicare advisor. And they save Ramsey fans an average of $1,100 a year. They explain your options simply and help make the smartest decision for your situation. And whether they find you a better plan or confirm you're already in the right one, Chapter Services don't cost you a thing. Medicare annual enrollment runs October 15th through December 7th. So review your plan with Chapter Now and avoid.

Starting point is 01:26:40 expensive mistakes later. To talk to the unbiased Medicare experts at Chapter, go to askchapter.org slash Ramsey or click the link in the description. That's askchapter.org slash Ramsey. Welcome back to The Ramsey Show in the Fairwinds Credit Union Studio. I am Rachel Cruz hosting this hour with George Camel, co-hosts of Smart Money Happy Hour with me as well. And we're answering your calls. So the board is full as we speak. But call in, AAA 825-5-2-2-25. We'll see if we can get you in in the next hour to answer your questions about money.

Starting point is 01:27:26 All right, let's go to Fort Wayne, Indiana, and we have Tyler on the line. Hi, Tyler, welcome to the show. Hey, thank you so much for taking my call. This is incredible. Absolutely. So real quick and short to the point. My job moved a year ago due to a building closure,

Starting point is 01:27:44 and my 15-minute commute turned into a, minimum 70 minute commute. Oh. So, yeah. So my question is, is it unreasonable to forfeit or to consider forfeiting our only debt of $100,000, which is our mortgage, a 3% interest rate, our payment's only $809 in exchange to get, you know, let's say 40 minutes or a half hour closer to my job? The issue we've had in making this is we purchased our home pre-COVID for 174, typical ranch out in the country, pole barn, etc. It's worth $300 to $350, depending on who you ask.

Starting point is 01:28:32 That's to keep our mortgage, the same moving closer to work. That same price point, I don't want to say less nice, but we wouldn't be happy with that. So we'd have to go up to 400, $450 to have an equal living situation, if you will. And we just don't really feel comfortable one of your expertise on that. What's your income?

Starting point is 01:29:01 Mine, this year, on track to make $140. My wife, around $40. So $180 income. Okay, $180 total. $1.40. thousand a month being home after retirement's taken out. How much would that be before retirement's taken out? What's to say?

Starting point is 01:29:23 My check's about 22, 2,500 a week. Her is about the same every two weeks. Okay. Nice. So here's the deal. Even if you moved up in house as much as it'll hurt because your mortgage payment is so tiny right now, it's still going to be such a reasonable part of your take-home pay. So if it's less than 25% of your after-tax monthly income, go for it, because you're going to increase your quality of life.

Starting point is 01:29:52 Yes. Because right now, 140 minutes round-trip every day is what you're talking about? 90 minutes, yes, an hour and 10, which ultimately translates to about 40,000 miles annually on a vehicle. I sold my truck I had because of the gas guzzling, you know, bought a paper cash. a little small EV car that cut that bill and, you know, just a fraction of what I was paying in fuel cost, but, you know, still my life has been ate away on the highway. Yeah. And what will your new mortgage be?

Starting point is 01:30:29 How much would you take on? To get an equivalent what we have out in the country just closer, it would be almost about 2,000. Yeah, I just ran the numbers. It looks like 1800. But you could go up. to 2,500 to stay even within the parameter. So you guys are still, it's still very conservative, Tyler,

Starting point is 01:30:50 just on a retrospect to, like, loosen a little bit of, like, you guys would be fine. I know it would hurt, but your quality of life, I'm like, oh, my gosh, if you could get 30 minutes close to work, right, or 20, you're saving almost an hour and a half, almost two hours. Like, it's pretty wild. Right, and it's been nice to just pay cash for everything. We have, we do.

Starting point is 01:31:15 We have one that just graduated. We're paying cash for her. Wow. Future endeavors is school. And then we have a first grader. That's obviously our next concern is we don't want to wait until we're, we'll say, totally vested with him being in school with a friend group to then separate him. Yep.

Starting point is 01:31:32 He's in first grade. So that's why we're wanting to kind of make a move sooner than later if this is what we want to do. Is the area that you guys would be moving to a good area? Like as it for a family and school system and, you know, life, like your life in general, not just the commute side? Would it be a good move? Does it excite you? I mean, I think we would enjoy it. I mean, we live out into the proverbial bonies right now.

Starting point is 01:31:59 So we don't want to go into town necessarily and have neighbors. But ultimately, that comes at a cost. Hey, listen. Pesky neighbors. And the way AI's going, so you may one be off the grid. So, Tyler, you might be. The boonies sounds mighty nice these days. You may end up moving back out there.

Starting point is 01:32:17 No, I'm just kidding. But the overall question, I found this to be true that the low interest rates are a curse for many people. It's become golden handcuffs to where they go, well, we wanted to move, but we can't let go of this low interest rate. I'm going, the way Tyler's going, you guys could pay off this house in seven years and have a zero percent interest rate. And so that would be my goal for you guys is to choose the life you want and, you know, date the rate knowing it's going to change. It'll fluctuate. you can always refinance later, and more than likely, you'll just pay the dang thing off by making extra payments to where it's a moot point a couple of years from now. But overall, it sounds like

Starting point is 01:32:52 this is the right move for your life right now. And very conservative still, just so you know. I mean, you guys, I wouldn't. If jumping to 6% rate was going to make this payment 50% of your take home pay, we'd say, well, it's just too much house in general. That's right. All right. All right. Let's go to Avery in Tyler, Texas. Hi, Avery. Welcome to the show. Hello? Hi, Avery, are you there? I'm here. Hi, how are you?

Starting point is 01:33:18 Doing great. How are you guys? We're doing good. How can we help? So I am 19 years old. I have a job that the payment is kind of different, and I make anywhere from $5,000 to $9,000 a month. Okay. And I'm kind of in the stage where I'm saving up.

Starting point is 01:33:42 for a down payment on the house. And I'm having trouble trying to, I guess, get myself to have a little fun with my money. What does that look like for you? What's something you know you should be doing more of specifically? Something I should be doing more of. Yeah, you're saying I need to have more fun. What does that mean? Is that going out with friends?

Starting point is 01:34:08 Is that going on a trip? Is that buying something, a car? Yeah, I mean, it's kind of like, I have a fun life. I enjoy my life. But I guess, like, tickets, like events, stuff like that, that I'm just kind of, I know I can't afford, but $300 for a ticket is also $300 away from a down payment on the house. So I'm just kind of curious if, like, my, am I supposed to do that, I guess? Well, first and foremost, I would not feel like you have to or should, you know, X, Y and Z.

Starting point is 01:34:44 I think it is what you want to do, what you enjoy doing. The problem people get in trouble with with money when they are of saver, which it sounds like you are, is they end up being controlled by money so much that any decision they make where they have to let go of anything create such anxiety that the money now is a burden. And it was supposed to be the thing that actually frees you to make decisions and have options. So, so yeah, I would say I would personally budget Avery a percentage of your income that you can just, spend and enjoy and force yourself to do it. Guilt-free.

Starting point is 01:35:17 But there's a limit, right? You could say up to this point because you have a goal for a down payment and you're going to need X amount saved each month for that to hit that goal. So if you map it out in a budget, you actually give yourself permission to spend. So I would. I mean, I would force myself to spend a percentage of my income to enjoy it because that's part of this whole holistic part of money with you. Hey, guys, Dave Ramsey here.

Starting point is 01:35:52 Every day on this show, we help people work through real money. problems and figure out what to do next. Now you can get that same kind of help any time with Ask Ramsey. Ask your money question and get answers built on Ramsey principles we use on the show. Whether you're making a decision or just want something explained, Ask Ramsey is here to help. It's fast, simple, and free to use. Go to Ramsey Solutions.com and try Ask Ramsey today. That's ramsysolutions.com. Our question of the day is brought to you by Y. Refi. Sometimes the hardest financial step is the one that you have been avoiding. And if your private student loans are past due,

Starting point is 01:36:51 Y. Refi can help you explore low fixed rate refinancing options and payment plans tailored to your circumstances. So go to whyrefi.com slash Ramsey. May not be available in all states. Today's question comes from Elizabeth in Nevada, or Nevada, as they say. Nevada, Nevada? Now I'm a Nevada girl, Nevada. Forever. Elizabeth says, I'm fortunate to work for a company that puts 15% of my salary into my 401k without me having to contribute anything. Once we wrap up Baby Step 3 and start Baby Step 4, should I add my own 15% in addition to my employer's contribution or direct that money toward paying off our house instead? My husband plans on contributing 15% and his company will match 10%. Goodness, gracious. These employer matches are crazy.

Starting point is 01:37:38 Well done. Elizabeth Nevada. That's a good plan. Well, the plan doesn't change. You're still going to invest 15% of your own salary, which I know sounds crazy. But you're putting 30, let's see you make $100,000. You're putting $30,000 away. Only 15 of that is yours. It's yours, yes. That's pretty incredible. So I always tell people, if you have too much money in retirement, you can write me hate mail, you can send me a check, whatever you want to do. It's up to you.

Starting point is 01:38:04 But I love the idea of building that muscle of investing because you may not have this job forever. That's right. And so it's great to just go, I can live off 15% less than I make. Yes. No matter where I work, I'm really good at investing. That muscle is built up. And I think it's easy to get a little acadaisical when the employer's doing all the work for you. That's right. And that's why we even say the employer match in general, even if it's 3%, obviously not 15%. If 3, 5%, it doesn't count towards your 15%. Because you're exactly right. George, there's something about putting your own money away and knowing that, hey, I can do this. You always say, eat the vegetables first.

Starting point is 01:38:40 Eat the vegetables first. And then you have like a lot of freedom then to say, well, we really can enjoy and be very generous. Like there's there's so much freedom and knowing that what is taken care of that needs to be taken care of is done. And I'm telling, I mean, I don't know how old they are, but if they've got a couple of decades on them and they're investing this much. It's insane. Does she say how much she makes? No, they don't say. I wonder how much they make it.

Starting point is 01:39:03 But I feel like this is a pretty, you're doing pretty well. This is a, this is not like a, I'm making 12. dollars an hour and my employer matches 15% of my salary. Right. This is probably, they're making good six figures together. Well done. Way to go. Good job, Elizabeth.

Starting point is 01:39:18 All right. Let's go to Valentina. Beautiful name in Nashville, here in Nashville. Hey, welcome to the show. Hi. How are you guys doing today? Hi, we're doing great. How can we help?

Starting point is 01:39:30 Yeah, well, I was calling because my husband and I just welcomed our first baby, a little boy. Oh, congratulations. Thanks so much. We're over the moon about him. But we currently have $33,000 in debt. And we've been working on paying off our debt. We don't have much in our savings. My husband works a full commission job,

Starting point is 01:39:50 so meaning that his income is like it's a variable. I do have a base pay. I go back to work next week, actually. I work as a paralegal. So my question is, how should we be prioritizing paying off our debt, saving money with his variable income as well? Well, it really, it stays the same with the baby steps.

Starting point is 01:40:11 So that $1,000 is still that starter emergency fund. And then everything else you guys will throw at that debt. How much do you guys make a year together? So together we make this year will clear. I just got a raise. So it'll be $160,000. Oh, good. Well, the good thing about this is you guys won't be in debt for too long.

Starting point is 01:40:36 I mean, how quickly do you think you could pay this off? Well, our goal is to have it within a year or sooner. Okay, yeah. And if you really ramp it up and you do it in nine months, then again, that starter emergency fund is only there for nine months and everything is being thrown at the debt. And then if something does come up, and this is true for anybody, regardless of, you know,

Starting point is 01:40:57 you have kids or not, if something comes up, then what you were throwing at that debt, which would have been what probably four-ish thousand, possibly, Yeah. A month, just if an emergency happens, don't throw it at the debt that month, fix the emergency. And for sure, that amount of money should fix most things, that $4,000. And if you have to pause for one or two months to fix whatever life throws at you, you do that and you just do it at the speed of cash. And so instead of it going to debt, you use that money to fix the emergency. But for you guys for nine months, we'll just, you know, you kind of, you say a prayer and be like, all right, I think we can. We can go through this. But I understand. Is he making zero in a given month or is it like it fluctuates between four and six? So for him actually, it's fluctuated between like $6,200 to $8,000.

Starting point is 01:41:49 Oh, okay. So he hasn't at a $0 month. No, that's correct. So here's what we're going to do. We're going to budget based off of the floor. His lowest month in the last couple months, we can say we know it's going to be at least six. Let's add that to yours. Let's budget off of that.

Starting point is 01:42:02 And then anything above that goes toward the debt. Yeah. So you guys will be budgeting your income with saying we're going to be throwing X amount of debt. And then if he makes extra, that's an extra two grand to throw out what was already budgeted to pay off the debt. So yeah, this could speed it up pretty quick. And I would have an aggressive goal if how are you guys with this awesome income and this small amount of debt comparatively. Just aim for six months. And if it takes seven, we're still going to cheer you on.

Starting point is 01:42:28 But that's $5,500. That's $5,500 going toward the minimums plus extra. If you can just say $5,500 a month goes toward the debt no matter what, then we're going to, We're going to make sure our bills are paid, of course, and insurance and all that. But if you guys can just focus as a team and go $5,500 must go towards debt this month, you'll be done at six months. Yeah, that's amazing. Incredible. All right, let's go to, I know, congrats.

Starting point is 01:42:50 Let's go to Daniel in Sacramento. Hi, Daniel. Welcome to the show. Hi, Rachel and George. How are you guys doing today? We're doing great. How can we help? All right.

Starting point is 01:42:59 So I have a question for you guys about whether it be wise to sell my house so I can cash flow nursing school to give you guys some. to give you guys some quick stats on me. I'm 37 years old, no kids, not married. 105,000 is my gross income. I do have $30,000 in a personal loan and $9,000 remaining on a student loan. My house is valued at anywhere from $525,000 to $550,000, and I owe $375 on it still. The two programs I'm looking at, they're both about,

Starting point is 01:43:35 of nursing programs. So one is a two-year state program that's about 30,000 for the two years. The other one is a accelerated one-year program that's almost $100,000 for the one year. And so that's why I don't want to go back into debt, obviously, for that. But it seems like the house would be a way to cash flow that. But also, I'd hate to sell the house and, you know, lose out on that. Because you'll be getting like $175,000 in equity to fix a $30,000 problem. It feels out of balance to me. Yeah. And with the salary being that, I mean, I make $105 as a nurse here in California.

Starting point is 01:44:16 It'd probably be, you know, $150 to $180 is what I've kind of researched around there. And obviously, that's a big enough jump. But I don't know if it's worth, it's enough to offset selling a house, considering how expensive houses can be in California. Yeah. What are you doing now for work? I work for the state government. I'm a manager. And what's driving the urgency around this?

Starting point is 01:44:37 Does this have to happen in two months from now, or can it happen a year in two months from now? No. So, I mean, I finished up most of the prerex. So right now, I'm kind of preparing for the application season. So if I were to go into a program, it's probably either the summer of 27 or the fall of 27. Okay. So do you have, I mean, if it's $15,000, if the $30,000 for two years, is that $15,000 then per year? year? Yeah, that's my guess. The 30,000 is a little. I mean, I don't know, Dan, I would just work

Starting point is 01:45:07 extra and save. Yeah, can you kind of just cash flow this thing and keep the house? Yeah, like a thousand bucks a month. We'll get you to the fall of 27. Well, because the only other thing is with these programs, given the nature of my work, I can only work money through Friday, 8 to 5, and these programs are full time. So I'd have to leave my job in order to do these programs. So you have no income for two years? Correct. Yeah. Yikes. Well, that's not really going to work. So you were thinking about living off of the equity of your home to do it.

Starting point is 01:45:38 Yeah, and I have an uncle that has an ADU. I've already talked to him, and he's considered letting me stay there for a year or two years rent-free, and then I just have to support myself. Can you work nights after doing school? Not at my current job. No, no, no, but while you're in school. That's possible. Okay.

Starting point is 01:45:56 I mean, if you could figure out a way to save up 15 grand between now and then, cash flow it, and then figure out, hey, can I work nights and live on nothing while I'm in school? I would consider it, but I would not be going any more in debt. And I don't think I would sell my house for this. No, I would try to keep it, man. You're obliterating your wealth-building plan by going backwards and having nothing to show for it by the end. People ask me all the time. George, what's your number one money-saving hack?

Starting point is 01:46:35 I'm glad you asked. Nothing makes me happier than helping another frugal friend. So here's the hack. Get on a budget. Seriously, how you're supposed to save money if you don't know how much you're spending in the first place? And that's what makes the every dollar budgeting app a game changer. With every dollar, you'll get a clear picture of your spending, and from there, it's easy to see where you can get more intentional, cut back, and save more money. How much money are we talking?

Starting point is 01:46:58 Well, the average every dollar budgeter frees up $395 in their very first budget. And if you ask me, I think you're way above average. So, why are you still listening to me? Go download every dollar for free and start saving more money right now. now. We wish we could get to every call and question here on the show, but it doesn't always happen, George. Alas, there's only so much time in the day. Only so much. I know. So if you do have a money question, though, when you want an answer to your situation, head over to our website and use Ask Ramsey. So this is our free AI tool that's built and trained on proven Ramsey principles. And you will get

Starting point is 01:47:48 your answer, your money question answered the way we would answer it here on the show. In fact, it's even so smart, George. It has some follow-up questions to get your specific numbers and exactly what you need. And it's even the questions we would ask you here if you were calling in. I said a lot of people there in the DMs. I'm like, hey, listen, ask Ramsey's going to be way better than me trying to fat finger and answer to the DMs. It's much smarter.

Starting point is 01:48:11 So true, I know. So go and ask your question today at Ramsey Solutions.com or you can click the link in the description if you're listening on podcast or watching on YouTube. All right, let's go to Lynn in Nashville, Tennessee. Lynn. Hello, thank you for taking my phone call. Yes, my husband and I had been married for over 40 years. We're debt-free. My husband still works. I'm not sure when he wants to retire, but I recently found that he has been taking money out of our CDs. We have a couple of CDs that are the step CDs and they mature at different times. And he takes the interest and the principal out of those accounts. And I don't know

Starting point is 01:48:57 what he's been doing with the money. He's been doing this for over a year. I just found out about it. When I have confronted him, he said he doesn't remember what he's done with the money. I went to the bank and I found out that there's another CD that he opened up. My name is not on it. and I know that there's a large sum of money in that. I feel like I'm, I just don't know what to do. This is just totally out of character for him. I just don't know what to do. I don't want to open up my own account and throw money in there

Starting point is 01:49:38 because that's what he might be doing, and that's not how I roll. Sure, sure. How much money are we talking? How much is in the new CD? close to 40,000. Okay. And how much is in the CD that you have your name on as well that he's taking money out of? Oh, there's a total, well, between, well, for all of them, probably 150,000.

Starting point is 01:50:03 Okay. And how much has he taken out of that 150? Is it 40,000 total? No, well, no. Out of the CDs the past year, he's taking $8,500 out. Okay. And I don't know what to do. Yeah.

Starting point is 01:50:27 He won't tell me that I don't think he's telling me the truth. And I don't, you know, the bank won't tell me if he has, you know, secret account somewhere. Yeah, so you're worried. Okay. All you can see is the withdrawals that are on the CDs. Your name is also on. Yes, because they're part of our trust. Okay.

Starting point is 01:50:47 So it comes out to be about $800-ish dollars a month, kind of is what he's been taking out of these CDs. Yes. Okay. Yeah. Is he taking cash? Yes. And then the cash is disappearing, and we don't know where it's going.

Starting point is 01:51:05 And when you confront him, he says, oh, I don't remember. Yeah. He said just stuff. And then you found a $40,000 CD that you didn't know about. And you've confronted him about that? Yeah. Have you asked him about that? that one? Yes, I did. And he's, well, it is, when we set up our trust in January, I asked him in front

Starting point is 01:51:26 of the lawyers, you know, do you want to, should we tag some of this money for our grandkids? And he said, no, we'll just, you know, our children can, you know, do that when we're dead. Well, this CD is for our grandkids, which is fine, but he didn't tell me about it. And my name is not on it and he's been contributing to that. And when I did ask him about that, CD for our grandkids, he said, I said, why did you do that? And he said, because I want to make sure that they get some money. So. How much you guys have total, your net worth?

Starting point is 01:52:11 Oh, golly. over probably 1.2. And does that include your home? Yes, it does. Okay, okay. Yeah, I mean, I guess my concern would be what you're probably calling in about, because $850 a month at this point. I mean, that's kind of like a, it's not the end of the world.

Starting point is 01:52:35 I just don't like that he's not being honest with you, and then there's a count over to the side that he, he's funding and says it's for the grandkids, which is great, but it's just that you, you feel out of the loop financially. Do you guys, do you have a history of talking about money? Do you feel like you were on the same page up into this point? Oh, most definitely. I mean, whenever we wanted to gift our children some money, you know, I would say, what are you

Starting point is 01:53:05 thinking? And he would say an amount, and I said, well, that's about what I was thinking. like 98% of the time we've always been right on. But this is just a stab in the heart. Does he know that you feel betrayed? Yes. And he does not, he has not often an apology. And that's, you know, that's a tilt sign to me as well.

Starting point is 01:53:39 Do you feel like you guys have been pretty distant in your marriage in general? Yes. Okay. For how long now? Yeah. Quite some time. How old are you guys? He's 70 and I'm 66.

Starting point is 01:53:58 Okay. Okay. Yeah, Lynn, I mean, I think what you've presented to him is totally fair and that you have a lot of fear is what it sounds like. Like you're scary, you know, that you're, he's scaring you because it's out of character. It's not how it's always been. And, um, and I would, and I would lean on that less about the amount of money here or there. And it's more about, um, keeping you guys unified, you know, for the, for the next, you know, hopefully, God willing, two decades, right? or more. Right.

Starting point is 01:54:39 And so I think that would, that would be my, my suggestion to you. I don't think you fix this by going and opening up your own account and all of that. But if there is a weird pattern, Lynn, and I hope there's not,

Starting point is 01:54:53 I hope he's just a seven-year-old man and he's just, I don't know, his head's in the clouds a little. I don't know. I want to give him the benefit of the doubt. But I also, we've heard crazy stuff, you know, on the other side of the spectrum, too, on the show.

Starting point is 01:55:06 and so I do want to honor your fear and not just brush it off, that if there does seem to be something weird going on pattern-wise over a period of time that I would, I'd pull in even a third party. I don't know if you'd go to counseling at 70 years old, probably not. But that or, yeah, I don't know, figure out. I would keep having this conversation to see how much you can actually extract from this, to see how much you can get to the bottom of it. if you just said, I need this to stop, I need to see everything, every account, the transactions,

Starting point is 01:55:41 the balances, no exceptions. I need you to rebuild the trust that was lost here. And if this is about something else, just tell me. We can be honest with each other. We've been married 40 years. If there's something going on, just give me the respect to tell me. And if he can't even do that, then you need to decide how are we going to move forward in this marriage. Do you need to go talk to a family law attorney just to know how to protect yourself out of fear? Yes. So that could be a step down the road if he is unwilling to budge. And that's him, that's him opting out. I don't want you to feel like you've done anything to deserve this. But I think you guys have just drifted so far apart that he's just in his own world at this point. Yeah, are you a big spenderlin? Like, would there be any

Starting point is 01:56:20 reason that he hesitates to like keep an account because he's scared your, you know what you mean? Like, has there been anything in that end on your side? No, I, I'm really conservative. Okay. And I've had part-time, you know, I've had full-time jobs. I was a stay-at-home mom for a long time. And I've had jobs. But nothing was good enough as far as income that I brought in. To justify anything else, yeah. Well, I think the rebuilding the trust at this point, from an emotional standpoint,

Starting point is 01:56:53 is going to be huge for you guys. But I'm so sorry. That does feel like whiplash on what a direction you thought everything was going. and then you kind of get this bump in the road. Hey guys, Rachel Cruz here, and I'm so excited to tell you that the brand new 2027 Ramsey Goal Planner is available now.

Starting point is 01:57:24 Guys, this is the only planner with exclusive monthly content from John Deloney, Jade Warshaw and me to help you set clear goals and actually stick to them all year. But here's the thing. These sell out every single year. So don't wait.

Starting point is 01:57:39 Order your new 2027 Ramsey Goll Planner for 49-9. at Ramsey Solutions.com slash store. That's Ramsey Solutions.com slash store. Our scripture of the day comes from Proverbs 1423. In all the toil there is profit, but mere talk tends only to poverty. Opportunity is missed by most

Starting point is 01:58:18 because it's dressed in overalls and looks like work. Thomas Edison. Amen. Just the overalls. I generally avoid overalls. I was going to say, I don't know if George would I think he may pass on that offer too.

Starting point is 01:58:32 I haven't had a reason to get a pair. That's all. That's all. That's all. All right. Let's go to Andrew in Charlotte, North Carolina. Hi, Andrew. Welcome to the show. Hey, you guys. How are you? We're doing great. How can we help? Good. Well, I have a move coming up likely next summer. I'm right outside Charlotte, moving up to the Northeast.

Starting point is 01:58:56 We own our home. We have about one. 80 left on. The question is, do we take the equity of the home when we move because we don't want to be long-term landlords and pay off debt, or do we save it for the next house? How much debt do you guys have? A lot. 250-ish. Oh, man, what's that in? Student loans is most of it. So about 130 is my student loans, 120 is my wife's, and then by the time we move, we should have, like, we have a car payment, credit card and taxes that are all due, and I expect those will be done in the next nine months. Whoa, so what's the total balance of all this?

Starting point is 01:59:43 So the car payment, or the car loan is 18. The credit card is about 55, and then the taxes is $3,000. $55,000 in credit cards? No, $5,500. Okay. Yeah. That's better. Okay, so how much equity do you guys have in the home? I'm thinking around 200 to 250. Okay, so you could clear most of the day. What is y'all's degrees in?

Starting point is 02:00:14 Oh, you don't want to know. Yes, we do. What is it? Education. What are you guys doing for work? My wife is an educator. She's in the admin side now, and then I am warehousing. or run a warehouse.

Starting point is 02:00:29 What do you guys make? I make about 110 and she makes about 80. Good. Okay. So you'll be making 190 when you make this move? And what's the reason for the move? So a promotion. So I'll be probably making 50-ish more.

Starting point is 02:00:45 Okay, great. She'll go up to 160 and she'll still make 80? Will she find a job? Yeah, she'll probably go up to 90 or 95. Oh, incredible. Well, that's good. What we're seeing comparable roles. So think about this future.

Starting point is 02:00:59 You guys sell this home. You take all the equity, dump it onto the debt. Now you're making $2.50, and you can knock out the remaining, what, $25,000? Yeah, pretty quickly. In a couple of months making that kind of money. And then save up for a down payment from there. Because that's really the order of homeownership is to be debt-free, have a fully funded emergency fund, and at least a 5% down payment.

Starting point is 02:01:23 And so you guys really would just be going into that. baby step order at this point. Which means a rental for at least maybe two years, max. Yeah. So that's kind of what I expected you guys to say. But one of the things I hear Dave kind of reverse engineer this a lot, say if I wasn't going to move, would I still sell the house and use the equity to pay off debt? I've never heard that exact analogy.

Starting point is 02:01:49 We just say selling a house is one thing you can do, but it's usually a last-ditch effort. but since you guys are already planning on moving. You're already going to have to move, so the home's going to have to be sold because of the situation. So the question is, what do we do with equity? Yeah, I don't know if we would... That's right. That's right. Yep.

Starting point is 02:02:06 Yeah, I don't know if we would make up that situation of selling a home if you didn't have to, but you guys are forced to anyways. And so at that point, yeah, there's going to be money there. And so if there's any extra money, we say apply it to the baby steps. And so that's what I would say.

Starting point is 02:02:22 I mean, even if you called in and you had like a lawsuit, or you got money from a relative, right? Like we would say, don't use that to pay off the home. We'd say use it to pay off your consumer debt. So any amount of money you get in your hands, you apply it to the baby steps. And think about freeing up all those payments. I mean, what are the minimum payments on all of those debts every month? So my wife's student loans are still zero because her last degree of deferment or whatever.

Starting point is 02:02:51 My student loan is $1,200. The truck payment's about $5. credit card is only like $300 and then IRS I'm paying $500 minimum a month but I'll pay more. So just a loan, you're going to clear $2,500 without her student loan payment

Starting point is 02:03:07 which I'm sure is going to be another you know, what, $1,500? Yeah, I'm sure. So that's $4,000 you'll clear. That's now back in your pocket every month for you guys to build wealth that you're not paying interest on. And to throw it at an emergency fund

Starting point is 02:03:20 and then finally a down payment. I'm like that's... Especially with this raise. You're going to be new people. old are you guys, Andrew? Mid-30s. Okay. It's great.

Starting point is 02:03:30 You got time to clean this up. And it sounds like a good career move, too, for you all, you know, all moving up and income. And I think it's just, yeah, it's just kind of reordering the priorities of where your money should be going. What's best, where's the best place for it? And at this point, paying off this consumer debt, getting that done with. Oh, it's going to feel so nice. I'm looking forward to it. Yeah, for sure.

Starting point is 02:03:55 Yeah, and I do think the battle of going from owning to renting can be really hard for people. It feels like you're going backwards. You're throwing away money on rent. I'm putting this in giant air quotes because I don't believe that. Yes. I rebuke that. I know. And I do.

Starting point is 02:04:11 What people don't consider, because we get this call to all the time, is how expensive homeownership is. You know, you are, unless you're living in a condo, I mean, you're in charge of so much, so much that can go wrong. We love homeownership. We want it. but you have to understand what you're walking into from everything from HVAC to roofs to landscaping and fixing stuff when it breaks. I mean, it's just, it is a... There's always something you want to do and need to do.

Starting point is 02:04:37 Yes. And when you got four grand and debt payments, on top of no savings, just to say we got in a home, it's not worth it. It's going to get stressful real quick. You'll call the show a year from now going, should we sell the house? We bought too early. This was a mistake. That's right. I don't want that for you.

Starting point is 02:04:52 Yep, because we get that call. All right, let's go to Stephen in Portland. Hi, Stephen. Welcome to the show. Hi, thank you for taking my call. I want to find out if you had any advice for somebody who's just turned 60 this week. And I'm literally starting over after a divorce and some really, really poor spending choices by Marie X, Y who was a real owner for 25 years, making incredible. money and then also making horrible choices expensive cars private schools only money to the

Starting point is 02:05:35 IRS since you was self-employed I won't go on to you know I don't want to bore you with all that but basically from going from a really nice situation speak directly in your phone Stephen we have a hard time hearing you I'm sorry can you hear me now that's a little better yeah I I have a bad cold, so that could be it. So anyway, I am trying to figure out I have a $27,000 forerunner payment and a $5,000 credit card. I used my retirement money to recently get my daughter through school, pay off $25,000 to the IRS. That was a debt that wasn't mine. I basically got out of a horrible financial situation.

Starting point is 02:06:26 Yeah. I was going downhill quick. Okay. How much do you have left from retirement? Not much. 40. What's the car worth? Oh, probably about what I want it.

Starting point is 02:06:40 And how much do you make a year? So I quit my job to go to a little less stressful job. So now I'm only making about 85. a year. Okay. I usually grow 75 and take home 55 monthly. Do you have any savings right now? Anything liquid cash? I don't. I literally have helped my kids with everything I have. So, Stephen, we got to stop that. Because your children will have to cover you in a retirement at this point. And that's not going to stop. There's going to be down payments for their first home. There's going to be weddings, all of it. You have to take care of you first. you've got to put your oxygen mask on first even.

Starting point is 02:07:19 So you can't afford to be helping anybody but yourself. So you need to take your income. You need to be paying off this debt. You may even want to sell the car and get a beater just to ease up the payment and then start refunding your retirement. And all of that has to be before you're helping anyone else. But I'm sorry. That sounds like a hard, hard year.

Starting point is 02:07:37 Oh, thanks for the call. All right. Thanks, everyone in the booth. George, always a great host, co-host. And remember, there's ultimately only one way to financial peace. and that's to walk daily with The Prince of Peace, Christ Jesus.

The Ramsey Show - Slow Money Moves Still Matter

There aren't comments yet for this episode. Click on any sentence in the transcript to leave a comment.