The Ramsey Show - Stop Letting Money Conflicts Tear Your Relationships Apart

Episode Date: December 24, 2024

📈 Are you on track with the Baby Steps? Get a Free Personalized Plan 📱 Listen to the full episode for free in the Ramsey Network app. 🇺🇸 Watch United States of Anxiety exclusively on the free Ramsey Network app!  While we're out for the Christmas break, we've compiled some of our favorite Dave and Rachel calls from the past couple of years. Enjoy your day and we'll be back with a live show in the new year! Merry Christmas! Dave Ramsey & Rachel Cruze answer your questions and discuss: ‘Father-in-law is selling us whole life insurance’ 'Brother isn't buying us out of an inherited home’ ‘Open a food truck or a brick and mortar?’ ‘My wife & I don't share the same views financially' ‘Am I hurting my family's financial future?’ 'Will I even be able to become debt free?' Support Our Sponsors: 🌱 Get 10% off your first month of BetterHelp ◎ Get 10% off Byrna product bundles and more! 🏥 Learn more about Christian Healthcare Ministries 🏡 Get started today with Churchill Mortgage 🔒 Get 20% off when you join DeleteMe 🏦 Go to FAIRWINDS Credit Union for an exclusive account bundle! 🥗 Save 15% on your first Field of Greens order with code RAMSEY 💤 Visit Helix Sleep for special offers! 🗂️ Use promo code RAMSEY for 18% off at The Nokbox 💵 Learn more about Timothy Plan 🏛 Get started with YRefy or call 844-2-RAMSEY 🔐 Visit Zander Insurance for your free instant quote today! Next Steps 📞 Have a question for the show? Call 888-825-5225 Weekdays from 2-5pm ET or click here! 🏆 Take control of your money in 2025! Register for the free livestream. 🎟️ Get $100 Off Money & Marriage Getaway with code CHRISTMAS. 💵 Start your free budget today. Download the EveryDollar app! 📈 For help with investing, get connected with a SmartVestor Pro.  Listen to more from Ramsey Network 🎙️ The Ramsey Show   🧠 The Dr. John Delony Show 🍸 Smart Money Happy Hour 💡 The Rachel Cruze Show 💸 The Ramsey Show Highlights 💰 George Kamel 💼 The Ken Coleman Show 📈 EntreLeadership Ramsey Solutions is a paid, non-client promoter of SmartVestor Pros. Learn more about your ad choices. https://www.megaphone.fm/adchoices Ramsey Solutions Privacy Policy

Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, it's the Ramsey Show, where we help people build wealth, do work that they love, and create actual amazing relationships. Open phones this hour at 888-825-5225 Multiple number one best-selling author and Ramsey personality Rachel Cruz. My daughter is my co-host today. Open phones here. You jump in we'll talk about your life and your money. Victor is with us in Irvine, California. Hi, Victor. How are you? I'm doing well, Dave. How are you? I'm doing well Dave, how are you? Better than I deserve. What's up? Hi, so three years ago, me and my wife,

was buying a life insurance policy from our father-in-law. We both make a pretty good income, but essentially we're like three years in now. And I've just, I know we've maxed out our 401k, our rock IRA, but I was talking to my father-in-law and he essentially said, it's like a good tax free investment that we can do with our custom whole life policy. And since we already maxed out our 401k and our rock IRA, and we even like bought a house recently, we're just not sure if that's like the best way moving forward to put our money

in at least with our extra money. So that's our situation. Victor, you've been married three years, you said? Yeah, we've been married for about three years, yeah. Okay, alright. So you're in your mid-twenties I assume. Yeah, me and my wife are both twenty-seven. So we got married around twenty-four. Okay. Well, I have to give you full disclosure here, okay?

I have been trashing whole life policies and people who sell them for 30 years as being one of the biggest possible ripoffs in the financial world. So if you say Dave Ramsey to your father-in-law his face is gonna melt off. I know, I was afraid of bringing that up to him. I would not suggest you do that. Uncle Dave would suggest you don't do that to yourself with your father-in-law. I don't think there's anything to be gained by that. So basically, you have a guy in your life that loves you and that believes in these products. You have a guy on the radio that loves you and

says these products are crap. And so now you've got to decide as a grown man with your grown wife what you guys are going to do and then how to navigate that decision. I would never recommend that you stay, that you buy something or do something because when you're a grown person because your parents said you had to. To keep them happy, I would not do that, okay? But I would also not recommend

that you damage your relationship with your wife's father. I would want you to be kind and honoring and really avoid an argument if I were you. Okay? I have family members for instance that I've been married for 41 years, Victor. I have family members that vote the wrong way. Oh my gosh. They don't know how to vote. They pick the wrong party and they're just dumb about it and I love them anyway. I love them anyway. We have family members that have credit cards and that. And I don't create at Thanksgiving a

political argument with people who aren't going to change their minds. Or a financial argument. That I love. Or a financial argument. That I love. Or a financial argument. I don't give financial advice to people who don't ask for it and that includes everyone, family included. People who ask, I will tell you. So for Victor, talk through the different, why you don't like whole life insurance as

an investment. I just, well he knows, he already knows why I don't like it, don't you? Uh, I know that you, you mentioned that like the return over like 30 years is minimal. Yeah, it is and when you die, when you die the money that you have in there is gone, they only pay the face amount and there is no such thing as a whole life policy that is tax free if it actually got a rate of return. It is tax free because you are the only way you can get your money out is to borrow your own money and honey if you go over at the bank and borrow money they don't charge you taxes on that either. So of course it's tax free but it is not a tax and it is not a tax, good tax dodge, it

is not a good investment, it is not a good product. But now you can research, you know, a bazillion things that we have said about that and then you've still got this deep, horrible relational problem and I would recommend that you just be kind if you decide to not use this product which of course is my recommendation I would recommend you don't get into an argument with your father-in-law about it I would just say you know we've looked at it and

for us we've decided to go another direction and we sure hope adult to adult that you'll just respect our decision even though you think I'm wrong and I want you to respect my decision and so you know I have a friend who's so stupid that the other day he leased a car and he's even dumber than that he drove the car to my house to show it to me okay but I didn't talk to him about car leases. I just went,

Hey, my friend has a nice car. I'm going to be happy for him and he's happy about his car. And he didn't ask my opinion. And so I'm not going to just go adult to adult. I'm going to celebrate his adult decision, even though he did a nice thing in a dumb way, you know Right. I mean I can still be friends with a guy. A hundred percent.

I want you to be kind to your father-in-law. Yeah, I think the biggest thing is gonna be it could be I don't know your father-in-law But if this is what he does for a living it's a shot to the ego I mean like yeah, right I mean if he believes in it so much like if what we teach you believe so much that if we can't you know I mean, it's a shot to the ego. I mean, like, right? I mean, if, I mean, if he believes in it so much, like if what we teach you believe so much that if we can't, you know, I mean, it's a hard, it would be a hard thing to say they're going to go a different direction from what I not just believe,

but the work I do. So just be prepared for that. And you and your wife need to have a lot of conversations, Victor. And you guys really got to be in this. Yeah. And just really dive in and you guys have to say, okay, what's best for us and find the facts. the facts is what's gonna prove it to you Victor?

And you both have to be on that same page and say okay. This is what we're doing and I totally agree to keep it minimal I mean like just say hey, I think we're gonna pass Your wife has to be able to just look at her dad and which will be hard a smile and say I love you And we're going a different direction. Yeah, you know Dave. I love you. I I love you, and we're going a different direction. Yeah. You know? Dave, I love you. And we're going a different direction. But I'm going a different direction. All right.

That's the thing. You're announcing something on the air? No. No, but it's, yeah, this is where the, yeah, the relational factor of it is just, it can be messy. Yeah. But it's also a great practice, Victor,

for you and your wife. You've got to learn to do this anyway. Yes, that's right. Over other things. Yes. Because, you know, they're… The leaving cleavage is real. Otherwise, you know, they're going to interfere when you get ready to name your first child.

They're going to interfere when you get ready to buy your first house. They all do it out of love. And no, they do it out of love. They do it out of love. Don't pet me. I don't interfere in your kids' names. No, you don't. That's why we had to... That would be Mimi that does that. We don't tell our kids' names until they were born. Because you'll get a Mimi eye roll. We hand the baby to the grandparent and we say...

Just don't name him Moonbeam. It's all I request. No hippie names. It's all I request. This is The Ramsay Show. I've been doing this show for over 30 years and some of the saddest It's all I request. This is the Ramsey Show. I've been doing this show for over 30 years and some of the saddest calls I've taken are from situations that are completely preventable. Yeah, and what's so hard is I feel like one of those,

especially the ones that I'm like, oh, it's terrible, air, people that call in and their spouse has passed away suddenly and they don't have life insurance. When you have to think through how am I gonna pay my bills in the middle. How am I gonna eat next week?

Yeah, in the middle of all that grief. Like it's just, it is, it's terrible. And so life insurance is the one thing, especially as a mom with three little kids that I'm like so big on for people to get because it's inexpensive. Xander is the place that Winston and I actually get all of our life insurance.

And it doesn't cost much because Xander shops among a gazillion different companies. It doesn't cost much. You just have to admit that someday you're not gonna be here. You got to say it out loud and you got to say I'm gonna say I love you to my family by taking care of them and taking the time to put this stuff in place. The cost of stinking pizza. To get a free quote call 800-356-4282 that's 800-356-4282 or go to zander.com. Rachel Cruz, Ramsey Personality is my co-host today. Linda's

in Pittsburgh. Hi Linda, welcome to the Ramsey Show. Hi, how are you? Better than I deserve. What's up? Hey, we, my husband and I, are wondering how he can acquire his portion of the will that his mother wrote. So she passed away in 2006 and wrote a will giving the family home to her children. And his brother has lived in the house all of his life and still lives there. Was the will probated? The will was probated by their stepdad in 2007. She passed away in 2006. And so the stepdad had nothing to do with the house and the will, right?

Yes, it was just one of those where it was he had the right to occupy during his lifetime. The brother? Or the stepdad? The stepdad. Okay, so he had a life estate and the will was and the will left the property to your husband, his brother and whatever other siblings. And a sister who... Okay, was the property retitled at that time? Did Pennsylvania probate require you all to retitle it and put everybody's name on it? The house is in Colorado. And at the time of probate, it was retitled to all three siblings. Okay, so you each own a third, undivided interest it's called, okay? Right?

Uh-huh. Okay, is sister still alive? No, she lost her battle with depression in 2017. I'm sorry, I'm sorry. Yes. And did she have heirs? No, she did not. Okay, so I would suppose that your husband and his brother are now equal owners then. You would have to seek an attorney's advice to be 100% sure, but let's play this through. That's what it sounds

like. It sounds like they're now equal owners, okay? And he doesn't have to do anything to acquire it. It already has his name on it. The death of his sister left half of hers to him and half of it to his brother. And so now the two of them are 50-50. Okay. His name is on the title. If the property were sold, he would get 50%. Okay. Okay. So now what are you all wanting to do? So he had after probably it was two almost two years after the stepfather passed away, he approached his brother about either buying him out or selling the home. And he said, absolutely not. I have no interest in selling the home and

I'm not going to buy you out okay who lives in it okay he has lived in it all his life okay so he's living there for free yes okay he has a roommate there that pays him rent okay well here's the thing if you want to if you want to stir it up and cause this to come to an end, because this is not a fair situation, this is unjust. Agreed? Agreed. Okay. Then your husband, does he have any relationship left with his brother at all? Well, they love each other, it's just that there's... I didn't ask that, I asked if they had a relationship a mountain in the middle.

What? There's, there's, I said they love each other, there's this mountain in the middle. The house. Yeah. Yes. Well, it depends on how much your husband wants to invest in this, but if we want to try to save the relationship, you get on an airplane and he flies out there and he sits down with his brother and he says, okay, you living here for free is done.

I'm a 50% owner in this and you can't live here for free anymore. You have to move out. I'm demanding that. Or we have to sell the house or you have to buy me out. Now you decide which one you want to do. You want to move out and we rent it and we split the rents that we collect or do you want to buy me out or whatever. I'll give you a deal if you want to buy me out but you sitting here and me getting nothing and you living here for free ends I'm done I love you I hate what you're doing to me it's nasty and it's wrong and it's unjust and he says that to him in person to his face okay and then if the brother goes well I'm not gonna do that you say yes you are

because if you do not I'm going to hire an well. I'm not gonna do that you say yes you are Because if you do not I'm going to hire an attorney and I'm going to sue in circuit court to have this partnership Disbanded and the court is going to force the sale of the house to give me my half And it's gonna cost me five or ten thousand dollars, and you're probably never gonna speak me again, but I'm at the point that I'm tired of you screwing me over. This is how you have to handle it if you're going to handle it. Otherwise you just got to accept it and go on. And then you have to hire an attorney and the judge will demand that you sell the house to liquidate the estate.

And they'll sell the house and the brother will get half the money and you'll get half the money. Do what? I said liquidating the estate is selling the house. Yeah, yeah you sell the house. Okay. Sell the house and you get your half. Now or we can have the house appraised and at 80 percent, 80 cents on the dollar of the appraisal I'll take my half I'll give you a 20% discount if you want to buy me out how much is the house worth Linda what from what we can tell it's probably right around $400,000 yeah this is just wrong and you're your brother-in-law is a leech. He's a parasite. And you're tired of it. That's why you called. Is your husband as tired of it as you are or is he just going to let this

go on? Oh no, he's as tired of it as I am. He's just a super nice guy. Okay, if he wants to try to be super kind to his brother, he could fly out there and try to do this very calmly and just say, this is over. Okay, you're going to buy me out or the judge is going to force the sale of the house because when I leave this conversation, if we're not in agreement, I'm going to contact an attorney and we're going to court and the house is going to be sold. Because you living here for free is not right, it's not fair, you've been taking advantage of me and I can't let you do that anymore even though I love you.

That's wrong. And brothers, if you want to buy me out, I'll give you a discount on the appraisal. But I own 50%, you own 50 percent and you can't live here free anymore that's over fly take a plane ticket invest a plane ticket into the relationship try to do it nice and see if you can get him to move off he may just think that he your brother your my brother's a nice guy he's never gonna do anything and he might be right talking about your husband right yes I know I know he sees your husband as a target and he's using it he sees he thinks your husband's not

gonna do anything yeah and so if your husband don't want to do anything it's okay I don't care if you want if you want to just let this go on I'm not mad about it it doesn't matter but if you're going to do it, that's how you do it I would sell it to him at a discount Because if you sell it you're gonna pay expenses anyway, right? Right. And so if it's worth four hundred thousand, I'll sell you my two hundred thousand at eighty percent Which is a hundred and sixty. That's a great deal. You have thirty days to get me my money which is a hundred and sixty that's a great deal you have thirty days to get me my money if you do not get me my money in thirty days

i am going to begin a court proceeding that's going to force the sale of the house and don't you know and and that's the end of the discussion and then just go higher lawyer and do it and it'll take a dad gum year and it'll take ten thousand and it'll $10,000 out of your pocket legal fees. Is there a way to find a reputable attorney in Colorado? Sure.

That was our other thing. It's like, how do you find one there without you know? Call one of our real estate endorsed local providers. Jump on the line at Ramsey and find the real estate endorsed local providers. Tell them you need a real estate attorney local providers. Jump on the line at Ramsey and find the real estate endorsed local providers. Tell them you need a real estate attorney. Okay. They'll give you a recommendation. Okay.

That's the only way. I mean, you got to have somebody that you trust and these are high octane real estate agents that we endorse and they'll know somebody that's a quality attorney that can litigate this. But I really wouldn't, you know, it may be that when you hire the attorney and you spend $500 and he decides to send a letter to the brother, that that wakes the brother up and then the brother does it. Because the brother's probably, he's been living this way a long time, he's probably not going to take the first, he's not going to believe your your husband that he's gonna do anything cuz he's never done anything So he's suddenly a man of action. That's gonna be shocking to the brother

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over a decade and they now have over 100 million data removals, which explains why they have a mountain of rave reviews and an A plus rating from the Better Business Bureau. It's been great for my family and I love getting fewer targeted ads, fewer spam texts, and fewer creepy robo calls. So this holiday season, share peace of mind by gifting a Delete Me subscription to someone you love or even just like. Their individual plans start at just nine bucks a month and you can sign up today at joindeleteeme.com slash ramsey for 20% off. That's joindeleteme.com slash Ramsey. Rachel Cruz, Ramsey personality. My daughter is my co-host today. Open phones at 828-825-5225. Ashley is with us in Charlotte, North Carolina. Hi Ashley, how are you?

Hey Dave, oh my gosh, I'm so excited to talk to you guys. You too. What's up kiddo? So my husband and I are looking into maybe starting a new business. We are totally debt free with a paid for house. We have one year of emergency funds saved up. Wow. Nice. Yeah, we've been following you and doing you for seven years since we got married and so

we just got debt free not too long ago and paid our house off about a month ago. Oh wow, congratulations Ashley. Way to go. Thank you. So we are, I love food. I love making food. People really seem to like respond well when I post things on Facebook, sharing things, and they have actually come to us wanting us to maybe start a food truck or like a cafe of some kind. We talked to our CPA and he was leaning more towards a food truck. He said that like the overhead was less, they were less likely to like not go under because of all the overhead.

But my concern with the food truck, we have been looking into them is of course, you know, it would still be considered a depreciating asset, correct? Like even if we paid cash and saved up for it, it's still depreciating versus like a brick and mortar. I guess if we're owning, if we don't own it, we're still paying rent. So I just didn't know if you were going one way or the other. I would not decide my business model based on either one of those things or based on a CPA's advice. Okay. You need to decide your business model on what you want your dream is. What do you want to operate? Do you want to operate a food

truck? Do you want to operate a brick-and-mortar? And then let's figure out how to pay for it and how to make the money to how to make it profitable. Right. Got that. And is there another is there another in-between step like start catering as a start and it start to build up your customer base from catering I know several excellent chefs that have big operations now that started as catering. Gotcha. And what's your end goal Ashley? Do you want to be a restaurant owner? Yeah, like do you want to like have like is there a big dream or is it more just a passion

of yours and you love it and it's something to do on the side that's really fun? I've always wanted to be more of a chef like the food and part of it is more like my dream and passion. My husband was in the food industry for a while and he actually was the business side of it is more like my dream and passion. My husband was in the food industry for a while and he actually was the business side of it. So as far as that, I think the brick and mortar having like a small cafe, I'm thinking something kind of small scale of like the Cracker Barrel. I'd love to have like a little store inside and be able to combine healthy like whole food, plant-based foods with more like regular foods, like a blend of the two. So people that, my husband eats burgers and fries and steak.

I think the only reason you're considering a food truck is, it doesn't sound congruent with this dream. Gotcha. The cafe sounds congruent with the dream. It does, yeah. Now that you're talking me through that, it does, yeah. Yeah, it just feels like it the way you say it out loud. And here's the thing, your CPA is right about one thing, restaurants have a higher failure rate than almost any other business category. Really? Yeah, and so you've got to really lean in on the business operations part not just the food quality. Okay, if you make the best and healthiest food on the planet and no one is there, this isn't going to work. Right. And so there's the marketing and the

operations of this. And what I would do is I probably would start as a catering operation and build a customer base and then look for a place to lease, don't buy a piece of real estate and build you out a little restaurant and your leasehold improvements that you put in there will be a depreciating asset too. But Ashley, tell I mean, but Ashley, like, I mean, and tell me if I'm wrong, I mean, but this could be hundreds of thousands of dollars. I mean, this isn't just like a little thing.

And I wonder if that's why the CPA was like, yeah, food truck is gonna be way less expensive to get something going. Not necessarily. I mean, if you found a location that the building was there and someone else that had something in there. Had the kitchen in there, yeah, already. Some of the commercial kitchen items are in there.

You go in and renovate, you might spend less than a food truck to renovate it, it's possible. And, you know, upgrade it, get the fresh coat of paint, and, you know, that'll work. You could start with a food truck if you want to, but I just, the question is just what you want to do for the next five years of your life, and I think you want to cook and I think he wants to run a restaurant, and that doesn't sound like a food truck to me.

Yeah. That's a different gig. It's a different feel. And even Ashley, like, you know, we've been to a few places over the last probably two or three years, people's homes for events, and they have someone come in and cook. And the chef guy brings his card around, he's like, next time you guys have a party, I can do a dinner for eight of your friends, or like, you know, whatever it is.

And I'm like, if you get the right people in a room that taste your food, that then spread the word, right? Like there's ways to do it. So the catering, if that's what you were meaning, but even coming in and cooking for friends and having them bring friends. And you know what I mean? You can start small just to get the word out

about what you're doing because it sounds great. But also I just know restaurant, it's just a big investment. Like when you hear- It's a hard business. When you hear brick and mortar, I mean, it's just, you're gonna be having staff. If there's not already a kitchen, how much those appliances cost?

I mean, it's just, it's a lot. It's a lot. Not that it can't be done, Ashley, but it is, it is a, it's a feat to take on. So it's you guys really great story. You drop a hundred thousand dollars in a truck and you can drop a hundred thousand dollars into your leasehold improvements, either one. Yeah. Real quickly. Make sure you've got the cash and that way then the only overhead you've got is your lease and your payroll and your food. I just know there's like the, I mean, I just can think of probably three or four food trucks and I don't know that started as food trucks that ended up becoming restaurants because their brand was so big here in Nashville that they opened up a restaurant because of that.

So I'm just wondering, is that, is that a, that's not a stair stepping. It can be, but then you got, you still got, you're either continue to operate both or you've got this extra truck leftover. Yeah. Yeah. So I just, I, the question is what she wants to do. I mean, I'm with you on the idea of starting some chefing in home stuff. Um, we were at a high end, uh, charity event, your mom and I the other day, and, um, the food was incredible. She collects the chef's card and he's helping us

with the family reunion that's coming up. So I mean, you know, that's how you get the business out. And so it's, but you can build a clientele based on that. And then like we have friends that are chefs that have do in-home stuff. And if they ever open something, we'd be a customer. Right, right. You know, so because we're a customer now that kind of thing same kind of thing with this

guy and that's a process there that you can go through and pick up the book the E myth by Gerber and read that he talks a lot about work learning to work on your business not just in your business Because being a chef is one of the pieces you have to do to operate a successful restaurant. The other pieces are business orientation that your husband has apparently and I would lean into all of that. I really, really would. Open phones at 888-825-5225. Thank you for listening out there America, we appreciate you. If you are new to the Ramsey Show and you're trying to figure out what in the world are we talking about?

Dead snowballs, baby steps, what does all these words, all this vernacular mean? Well you can go to ramsysolutions.com and click on the get started button the get started button it is a free process to help you figure out what you're looking for in this ramsey journey and how we can best serve you on this ramsey journey where you are now and what your next steps are all those kinds of things. So click get started at ramsesolutions.com and we'll get you moving. And you know you become acquainted with the baby steps and the debt snowball and all those kinds of things if you just keep listening to the show. We'll keep talking about it and you'll start to understand what we're dealing with and you'll look it up and you'll watch a YouTube video

or some people go through. If you want to do the best thing you can do, go through Financial Peace University and that'll line you up and get you to, you know, get you on the fast track to doing everything and getting control of your money and changing everything. So all of that to say that we're here to help you. So check it out at Ramsesolutions.com. Hey guys, I've never done this before but I'm partnering with a nutrition company, at ramsaysolutions.com Health or field of greens will give you your money back I can get behind a promise like that go to field of greens comm slash Ramsey and get 15% off with promo code Ramsey field of greens comm slash Ramsey Student loan debt is an epidemic Pandemic and Defaulting on debt makes you feel even worse but our question of

the day sponsor why refi refinances defaulted private student loans and builds a custom loan based on your ability to pay you'll have a payment you can afford with a low fixed interest rate that you couldn't get anywhere else. Go to yrefi.com today slash Ramsey. That's the letter yrefy.com slash Ramsey might not be in all states. Today's question comes from Carter in New Hampshire. He says, my wife and I are avid listeners but we don't share the same views financially. I'm an analyzer when it comes to finances and it annoys her to no end. I have a two-year emergency fund and our home is paid off. Together we earn $200,000 a year. She likes to spend and wants me to

co-sign on a vehicle that's $80,000. She has $10,000 in credit card debt and she pays $15,000 each year for private school for our kids. If I mention anything about money, I'm the one who's wrong. I wish I could say that we pay for vacations, recreational toys and trips, but these funds come from my checking account and she gets mad when I say that I pay for them. Is it okay to have an account together

to pay bills and separate for spending accounts? I mean, I think you guys are disjointed completely when it comes to money. I mean, obviously this is like a pick and choose what we want to do together and what we don't. And I think the goal here is that you are a unified team with all of it, right? All of it together. So the spending, the saving, where your kids are going to college or to school, where you guys, you know, what kind of cars you guys buy

that you are in agreement together in those things. And so some, you know, she's a spender. So you guys are in a great position. You have no debt. You have great emergency funds. So if she wants to go spend a little, you can't be crazy. And be like, no, you can't spend anything, right? And you sound a little bit,

it sounds a little crazy to a degree carder that she just wants a little bit of freedom, but then she, on the other end, is not what it sounds like. $80,000 car debt. Credit card debt. That's crazy. The same value system though, is what's not being played out.

So I think that's the issue, is that you guys are functioning not on the same value system, and so it's looking like a mess like this. And the accounts, that doesn't fix it. People think that- I don't think they have a money problem. I think they have a marriage problem.

Right, but that's the problem is people think, is it okay if we just have separate accounts? And what that does is it sweeps the one issue that you actually need to talk about under the rug. It doesn't fix it. It actually continues to alienate you guys from each other. So no, Carter, I would not do these separate accounts. I would force you guys to work out of one account

because to your point, it's actually going to reveal other issues that are actually going on in your marriage. Yeah, and I'm the one that's wrong. She gets mad. You know, if you just change out the subject and it wasn't money and you were talking about something else and she acted that way, or you acted that way you over analyzed

everything which is what you're doing for sure and on the other hand then she's acting like a princess and stomping her foot with her little red face out till I get what I want and if you don't let me have what I want then you're wrong this is a marriage. You guys desperately need to sit down with someone because here's the problem. Okay, the probability that you have a high quality marriage going forward using this system is close to zero. You may or may not get divorced later, but you're definitely not having fun in your relationship. And the probability that

you build wealth with both of you pulling at each other the whole time instead of pulling the wagon? No, almost zero. One of the things we found when we study wealthy people is the data tells us that they work together with their spouse. They're unified in their goals. They're aiming at the same target and pulling the trigger together. That's what we're doing. And you can't drag along a princess. She can't drag along someone who over analyzes everything and has no fun left anywhere in life because you squeeze every dollar until George Washington screams. And no, you can't, you got it. You got to have something in here

We got to have some flow to this some relationship to this that's not in here And so yeah, this desperately screams of a need for marriage counseling to me For sure open phones at triple eight eight two five five two two five Bo's with us in Las Vegas. Hi Bo How are you? I'm doing good, can you hear me? Absolutely, what's up? So I wanted to know if I can keep using my credit card, and I know you're probably gonna say no, but I'm gonna try anyway. You're right. No. So, um. Do your convincing, Bo. Give it your best shot, Beau. All right. So this is a unique situation. I've never heard it on your show and I've been only listening for like five months.

Okay. So I have one credit card. I have a medical condition and my medication is insanely expensive and I can't afford it until I hit my deductible, which my insurance will cover, but my deductible is $13,000. And so the pharmaceutical company that makes it will reimburse me for it. And I've been doing this for two years. And so I use the credit card and I get cash back for the, and then they reimburse me in a few days.

for the and then they reimburse me in a few days. Is that something that I would keep it for? Why don't you just pay cash? Why don't you pay cash? I can. Why? But it's really expensive. Oh good. We'll pay cash. And then you still get reimbursed. It's really expensive either way dude you're out the money either way right? Yeah but I get the money back from the pharmaceutical company. Okay and so you use your cash and then you get your cash right back. I can do that but I get another 300 bucks. Oh whoop-dee-doop-dee. Okay. You're gonna sell cellular financial soul for three hundred bucks well it's i'd never met a millionaire said you know david made all my money on my airline miles it's not a lot of our time now is three hundred dollars cash for your box has

never created a millionaire i'd like to see i just don't make a lot of money so it's it's really well then that's a bit if if three hundred dollars make a lot of money so it's really short. Well then that's a different, if $300 is a lot of money then that's a different problem isn't it? You have an income problem then. Yeah I don't think I'm going to make more money. Why? It's not because I'm lazy, I'm not really worth a lot of money.

Why? Society would say I lack intelligence or education. They're different. You don't lack intelligence. You've carried on a very clear conversation in a high pressure situation. You don't lack intelligence. You've done a good job in this banter that we've had here, which was kind of fun. So you're not lacking in intelligence.

You might not have education. That doesn't mean you're not able to make a living. What do you do? What do you make? I make $26.35 an hour. Okay. That's not super bad. You were getting 40 hours? No, I work between 30 and 45 hours a week. It depends on what time of year. What do you do? It's kind of, I work for a distribution center I operate, the simplest way I could say it is I manage robots. Are you 24? Are you 24? No, I'm 42. I'm sorry? 42. 42. Okay, so here's the deal.

What I would do if I were you is I would say, hey, I can be anything I want to be. What are the steps to being one of those? And I could make twice as much money being one of those. And I want to go start working towards being one of those and I want to go start working towards being one of those and it could be an apprentice program, it could be a certification program, it could be a couple of classes at the local community college, I don't know, but you're capable of doing all of those things and so your issue is that you need to increase your income and have some career goals. We'll help you with that. I'm gonna give you Ken Coleman's and so your issue is that you need to increase your income and have some

career goals will help you with that i'm gonna give you ken colman's book uh... find the work you're wired to do only get the title rights a turn around looked at it uh... and it's got in at the get clear assessment i don't have to look at it because we've had over a hundred thousand people take this assessment

and will help you get clear on what your skills are and once you go work on that boat worth $300 to where you're no longer in a place where you think $300 changes your life. Don't be in a place where you think 300 bucks changes your life. You want to be in a better place than that and then you don't fall into the traps of these stinking banks and these stinking credit card companies and you get sucked in thinking they're actually there to help you. They're not.

So problem solved. Hang on. We'll give that to you as our gift. This is The Ramsey Show. You've got a lot to keep organized in life. Kids and calendars and carpooling and cleaning. I mean, it is so much. That's why you need a knockbox. That way, if

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Your family will thank you. That's knockbox, N-OK ok box dot com slash Ramsey. amazing relationships. The phone number here is 88825-5225. Rachel Cruz, multiple number one bestselling author, Ramsey personality, co-host of the Smart Money Happy Hour, and my daughter is my co-host today. Open phones at 88825-5225. Nicole is in Salt Lake City. Hey Nicole, how are you? Hi, I'm good. How are you? Better than I deserve. What's up? Well, I'm so grateful to actually get to speak to both of you, especially another working mom.

I'm concerned with whether or not I would be harming my family's financial future if I take an extended maternity leave with my second child. I didn't take that with my first child and I've had a lot of regret about that. And my husband and I are considering whether or not I could take a year or two off of work. If I did, we wouldn't be able to put as much toward our debt snowball as we have. We've paid off about $217,000 since 2020. Oh my gosh. Yeah. What are you doing, Nicole? I'm an attorney.

What do you make? Net take home for both of us. No, I said what do you make? I think my net take home is $120. What about your husband? His is about maybe 60 I think. No, it was 70 last year. His net was 70. What's he do? He owns some car washes. Okay. So you're going to cut your income by 60, 65 percent? Yes. Okay.

And then we would still have $86,000 of my student loan left. It's our only debt besides our mortgage that we still have left to pay on, but we've been paying on it. And so it's going to set us back. We'll be able to make the minimum payments and maybe a little bit more with distributions, but maybe inconsistently. And I guess I'm just I'm concerned because we started a family later in life. We'll both be in our early 40s by the time I wanted to go back to work.

And so obviously having that debt and then having not invested that long, I'm just concerned this is going to cause harm long term. I kind of want to like relieve you from that, Nicole. I don't think it's harm long term. I mean, I think, yeah, your goals are going to shift if your family goals shift, and that's a reality. But it's not like you're putting your family in massive danger here right I mean I have some other ideas that we can talk through here in a second but this so many women feel this and especially since you're the breadwinner of that I have to be the one to save everything

and it's up to me and I'm gonna put my family in danger I'm you know like this language that you're using, it's very heavy. And I think it's, what I would say is that it's, you're putting more pressure on yourself than needs to be there. Yes, getting out of debt is a huge goal. And it's one that I want you guys to work towards and one that you've made such significant progress to.

But like we said, the last hour of the show, we talked so much about how debt is a tool to create, or I'm sorry, money is a tool to create a life that you love. And you guys have to look at your family unit and your family is a priority, Nicole. I mean, your family is one that you're like, okay, what is best for us right now? And as a mom, I get it.

Like that, I mean, I pulled back from work after my third because I was like, I just, I wanna be home more. And so all of that is real. Now, does that mean we wanna stop everything I mean, I pulled back from work after my third because I was like, I just, I want to be home more. And so all of that is real. Now, does that mean we want to stop everything you guys have been doing and the progress you've made? No, I wouldn't suggest that either. And so I think a wonderful middle ground, Nicole, for you is to have, because I mean,

an attorney, I'm like, that is such a stressful job and the hours you work. I mean, I can't even imagine. So what does life look like if Nicole stays home and her career shifts and your career looks different for a year or two, what does that look like? And so I would start, you know, having that kind of conversation of, and I don't know this world, Nicole, so you probably can direct me better in this conversation

from this point on in this sense, but is there work to be done that you could do, outsource your skills at some level, some degree that is significantly less stress and less time than what you've been doing and still be bringing in some kind of flow, right? To offset the student loans that are there because of law school. Right. So let's use the law degree to clean up the law degree mess. But does it have to, does your life have to look like it?

Maybe not in a traditional attorney setting. Right. What Rachel's saying. And Rachel says she pulled back, she pulled back. But she's not out of the saddle either. Her social footprint has grown. She's still doing appearances. She's still on this show.

Still launched the number one bestselling kids book a few months ago And so and did all of that on you know less than a full-time Hours late in an office. Yeah, yeah in the office and so You know there but we just shifted around How what we're doing with her brand and how we're doing that? For a season here while the little one is there and so for you that's what I would present to you what does what does that shift look like right because there is a you know

there's a level of responsibility that you guys have financially right that you have to fulfill you have to make these payments and getting out of debt as you know lifts so many burdens right if you didn't have this debt then you could have the option to stay home full time if you wanted, right? So, but I do think, Nicole, that there's something there that there still can be money to be brought in. I think you have to think creatively,

and that's probably what I would encourage you to do, to have something. And then he, honestly, Nicole, will probably have to step up his game. If you guys keep this momentum with paying off debt, I just don't want you to think it's an all or nothing. Things can shift. Harm is not the right word. Rachel's right. That's an overstated word. A mom guilt word in this. You guys can't win, okay? You get mom guilt if you're at home because you feel

like you should be at work. And if you're at work, you get mom guilt because you feel like you should be at home. I mean, it's a no win. And there's always some more on either side of the coin telling you, you should be doing the other one. Right. And so, um, and so we're not going to be either one of those, but probably some kind of a, uh, a change, a hybrid approach, because I, I, there's a part of me that says, okay, that the, approach because I there's a part of me that says okay that the you went to all the trouble and the expense and the debt to be a lawyer to go cold turkey doing

nothing with that while you've still got 80,000 of it outstanding that doesn't feel right either okay but but also not addressing this need that you've got this desire you've got to be at home doesn't feel right. And so I think somewhere in there along Rachel's suggestion is the proper answer. But I want to take the, I'm with Rachel, I want to take the guilt thing of are you doing irreparable harm? No, you're not doing irreparable harm. You just kind of got to think through. I spent a lot of who I am in money, time, debt, effort, brain power to be a lawyer. And to cut that off completely,

even for just two years, feels pretty extreme. Yeah. And Nicole, and everyone's obviously created so differently, but considering what you've done and as you listed all that, Dave, I was thinking like, you know, you might look up in six months and be like, oh my gosh, I'm crazy. I'm not happy because I need some output. You know, so you may find that in you how you're wired, you're going to want to do something as well. And so that's a possibility too.

So you're doing great, Nicole. You're doing so good. You're going to be okay. You're going great, Nicole. You're doing so good. You're gonna be okay. You're gonna do good. You're asking the right questions. Hey you guys, I'm not a fan of the big banks and you probably already know which ones I mean. But I do like credit unions

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Aaron, how are you? Good guys, thanks so much for having me. I really appreciate it. Sure, our pleasure. How can we help? Well, my wife and I love the show. We've gone through FPU. We're in baby step six right now, so we're super excited about that. But a couple months ago, our situation changed. I'm currently in the process of being diagnosed with a very rare form of muscular dystrophy. Wow. So, just, we just want to say in the process, I've had a genetic test that's a possible match. My doctor is 90% sure and I've done a biopsy, but next week I actually find out the results

of the biopsy. And so we've obviously done the baby steps. We're in a good situation that way. But I guess my question is what insurance and what type of long-term planning would you suggest in this? And I guess am I too late to get to the party to get insurance in this sort of situation now? Life insurance? Yes.

Yes, you're too late to the party. Okay, all right. Sorry. The... Sorry. The, and then how you plan for it would be based on, I don't know anything about muscular dystrophy in this millennial. I mean I remember like the telethon when I was a kid or something and that was when the dinosaurs were on the earth and I don't know what this prognosis means for you. Do you? Or what do you understand so far? I know it's very rare

there's less than a thousand people in the US that have what I have and it's I'm fully functional right now but it's possible in the next 10 to 15 years I could be in a wheelchair and I could lose breathing function so I'd have to have a respiratory device. Oh Aaron, I'm so sorry. Wow. Thank you. And then that following that stage it probably doesn't end well I'm guessing. It's very possible yes. It continues to deteriorate or does it plateau off with the breathing device? It can plateau but more than likely it will deteriorate or does it plateau off with the breathing device? It can plateau but more than likely it will deteriorate from there. How old are you? I'm 46. Okay all right so we're talking about 60 years old give or take. Exactly. Okay all right.

I'm sorry man it's hard to face something like that. Do you guys have kids? No, we did not. How's your wife? She's so supportive. Very, very, very awesome. Yeah, she's great. Well, I think one of the things I'll tell you from working with families, I don't know anything about the medical world, except that they call it practicing medicine for a reason. They're practicing and so things in other words things change and extra opinions and continuing to study and continuing to argue with the what's in front of you is good not in a denial way but just not accept that that one guy says okay you is good, not in a denial way, but just not accept that one guy says, okay, you're going to be gone in six months.

And you go, well, maybe not. Maybe I'm going to try this and so on. So you're going to become an expert on this, dad, blame it, to be an advocate for yourself. So I'm going to tell you to continue to do that and don't just accept one thing and walk away. I don't think you were going to anyway. But second, third, fourth, and later on eighth opinions just keep working the problem. Now while you're doing that, there is, I have perceived in others, not myself, I've not experienced this, okay? So just like someone calls me up and says,

I've got a stage four, uh, cancer diagnosis and they're giving me four months to live. Okay. That call has come in here over the years several times, or I've actually sat with people in a room where they were telling me this stuff and they're, they're, uh, already have processed the emotions and now are going, okay what the flip do I do kind of thing, alright, so that's why you're calling. So in that case what I found is that facts are your friends and so there is a tremendous peace that comes from having

your spiritual house in order number one, but then number two getting your house in order, number one, but then number two, getting your house in order financially. And you say, okay, if this unfolds, I got about this many years and we're talking wheelchair and then I got about this many years on a breathing device and if it doesn't stop deteriorating, I've got this many years. And so you, okay, based on that I'm gonna lay out a plan and then if I get a different Result, I'll change the plan. But if you go ahead and make sure okay, I got a will in place I'm gonna investigate and find out and make sure Dave's right about life insurance. I'm going to

Say this is our wealth building plan. We're gonna continue to pay off the house We're to do this and this and this and you know, the more detail, it sounds ridiculous, but the more detail you say given this diagnosis, this is the exact plan, once that detail is in place, it gives you just like a release, you know, a sense of peace. But having the medical be chaotic and the financial future being chaotic simultaneously is almost more than some folk can bear so i'm going to encourage you to do what continue the journey you started with this phone call and that is really detail out exactly what how what is your version of the baby steps facing this rare for form of muscular dystrophy because it's almost chronic in that it's not it's not a one year or two year diagnosis it's a 15 year

or 20 year diagnosis right and so today it is anyway it may change next week and it may change for the better next week so facts are your friends, details in the financial arena are not you being cold, they're giving your wife peace and you peace and then you can turn back around and concentrate on being well. Does that make any sense at all? No it totally does and just hearing about this when we found out in March, and like you said, it's about, you know, emotionally trying to register it and then trying to figure out what the facts are. Yeah. And I feel like we're at that place right now and now I'm going, oh wait, I have to plan about the future now and figure that

out, which is why, like you said, I called. Yeah, and it's a different future than it was in March and truthfully there may be a treatment that comes a year from now, you know, and then the thing changes again because you're not going to stop studying this, you're living it, you know. Aaron, do you guys know medical bills? Have they given you guys any direction? Like your insurance, do you guys know financially at all what the costs will be at certain stages of this? We do not.

Okay. And it's because it's so rare. So rare. Yeah. They're still, I mean, it's just being discovered sort of thing. So I'm in a research study right now. Go ahead. That's put me in loan to

hopefully take care of some of the medical bills but also figure what this thing out and how it does in the long term. Right? Yeah. Well I could tell you this, you know, continuing a big old pile of money in your 401k and a paid forehouse is still gonna help the situation. So that part didn't really change, right? Right. I mean, if you live with this deterioration and disability or you don't and you leave her with the situation, either way a big old pile of money and a paid for house ain't going to be bad, right? True. So, you know, we could keep working four and six, you know. The only question is in between, like Rachel's saying, do we need

to pile up some cash for interim treatments or treat, you know, we're gonna fly to Czechoslovakia because there's a treatment there that's not covered by insurance. Heck, I'm going, man. Heck, we're paying off the house. Get on an airplane. Let's go, you know. And we'll redistribute that cash in a different way out of the budget and of course you're gonna anticipate your income changing potentially as well as you go along and so all of that goes with it but just you know keep adjusting the plan but the more detail the plan is the more peace she's gonna have you're gonna have and then you can turn in your energy around to fighting the disease instead of

fighting the money and that's what people that are like with a cancer diagnosis are doing as well so man I'm so sorry and Aaron we're here for you we're not going anywhere if you need something you call anytime well and tell your wife to call if you for some reason aren't able to get on the phone. We'll help any way we can. Thanks for calling, man. I'm sorry. Hey, what's going on? Dr. John Delaney here. I'm excited for our next Money in Marriage Getaway coming up over Valentine's Day weekend 2025. This is your chance to invest in your marriage, strengthen your communication, and get away from all the noise and chaos of everyday life together with your spouse. You're worth an incredible marriage, and trust me, it's way better than the chocolates and

flowers you had planned. Tickets start at $799 per couple. Go to ramsysolutions.com slash getaway to get your tickets. Rachel Cruz, Ramsey personality, number one-selling author is my co-host today in the lobby of Ramsey Solutions on the debt free stage. Stephanie is with us. Hi Stephanie, how are you? Hi, I'm good.

Dave and Rachel, how are you both? We're honored to have you. Where do you live? I am about 25 minutes away from Boston, Massachusetts. Awesome. How much debt have you paid off? About $105,000. Way to go kiddo. Excellent! How long did this take you? Three years and

eight months. Wow! And your range of income during that time? So I started at about sixty thousand and I ended at a hundred and fifteen thousand. Excellent! And what do you do for a living? So I work for a hospital manager in IT. Good for you. Okay cool. And what kind of debt was a hundred and a living? So I work for a hospital, I'm a manager in IT. Good for you. Okay, cool. And what kind of debt was the $105,000? So was everything, Dave. About $360 was medical.

I had $3100 in a car loan, $6200 personal loan, $7000 in credit card debt, and the biggest was my student loans. It was about $88,000. Wow. Okay, very cool. Okay. Tell us your story. What happened three years and eight months ago that put you on this journey? So I've been living with that since I was 18. So I, from the first time I got a credit card, I just... How old are you now? 36. Okay. So it took me 18 years to get here. Okay. But so 2018, like I said, I'd been struggling for

many years. And you know, I'd really have been praying and asking God to really help me, because I never knew how to budget just was out of control didn't know what to do. So September 2018, I was home on maternity leave, I had my third child. And I was actually searching for sermons really to watch on YouTube. And then in my feed, it came, this couple video came up and the title was Dave Ramsey ruined our lives. And so I never saw the couple before,

I never watched them ever and I never heard your name. So, but it was a pretty, you know, good looking couples, sharp couples. So I decided to watch and they proceeded to say how, you know, they said from the time they started your program, they were getting out of debt. I mean, you know, selling things left and right, living on rice and beans, not going out,

just, you know, making sacrifices to live the life that they wanted to live ultimately. And so I, you know, and I believe it was Divine Connection. I believe God led me to that video. And so as I was watching, I said, wow, like, they can do it. I can do it too. So I started searching for you on YouTube.

At that time, I just saw a lot of the short videos, the seven to 10 minute clips. I didn't know you had a show, but I just started digging into those, learned about the seven baby steps. I learned about just what you teach, what you practice, and it all made sense. Like I said, I was on maternity leave,

so I only had, I was making half of my income at the time because it was just using up my vacation time to try and spread the time out. So I downloaded the EverDollar app, and I couldn't really start the budget until October. That's when I went back to work, but I had the budget in place. I listened to Rachel Cruz and all the material

that you guys put out there and tried to do my budget as best I could. And so once I went back to work in October, my budget was set and I pretty much hit the ground running. I initially started out, I was picking up Instacart shifts, even with sometimes my little kids in the car, my daughter, I would work full time during the day and I picked up a temp agency job, you know,

at the evening, so we were home. It was during COVID, so, you know, kids running around in the background, but I'm doing a temp agency job. And I also, you know, delivered pizza for Domino's, you know, a short while. Fast forward to 2020, December 2020. I interviewed and got a position at another hospital.

So that jumped me up in my pay, about 20,000. And the next year, 2021, about November, I got a promotion to manager. So, and that jumped me up as well. So that has been my journey up through 2018 to now. Golly. You worked your tail off, kiddo. I was, and you know what?

I believed in the vision. I believed what you taught. And I, from that first, paying off that first credit card, just seeing how free, you know, how a little bit of space in my budget. And I said, wow, this really works. And I was determined, regardless of what people said, I was determined that I was gonna do it,

not just for myself and my kids, to leave a legacy. And that's really why I kept going. Wow, congratulations. That's a big. Very proud of you. That's a big deal. I mean, you know, we get all different types of debt-free screams on the stage and we celebrate them all. But you doing this with little ones,

over three years working all these shifts. I mean, you've done the hard work. You've done it. Congratulations. Thank you. Incredible, absolutely incredible. That's beautiful. What do you tell people the secret to getting out of debt is?

It sounds like seven extra jobs. Yeah. Well, and perseverance, but I think the biggest thing is a mindset change. You know, people that I talk to and I share my journey with, they're happy for me, but you know, a lot of what I hear is. You know, people that I talk to, and I share my journey with, they're happy for me, but, you know, a lot of what I hear is, you know,

you'll never be out of debt, you're always going to have debt. And I, by soaking myself into your show, you know, listening, watching all the debt-free screams that have come across the stage, you know, watching the everyday millionaire, you know, like, listening to all these people that have done it, and they live debt- free, it is possible.

So I think it requires a mindset shift, being around different people, listening, but realizing that it is possible. But also perseverance, I mean, regardless of what comes, I mean, I had life happen during those three and eight months, but it's perseverance, being willing to persevere through and trusting God in the process.

Because once you've committed to it, He will see you through the end. Amen, amen. Well done, very, very, very well done. Who are your biggest cheerleaders? I would say a little bit of everybody. I mean, my mom is here, my family, they all supported me through this journey.

My coworkers at work, at the time, when I could pick up on call shifts, they wouldn't know I was on this journey, and so they would help me out, send me there on call shifts. But I think the biggest one is my oldest daughter. During COVID, she was my babysitter. When I had to pick up the shifts, she was my babysitter.

And she sacrificed a lot, but she knew what we were after. She knew the reason why we sacrificed. And she was willing to delay gratification for a season so that we could be here today and become debt free. So I would say she's my biggest out of everyone, my biggest supporter, my biggest cheerleader. Was it worth it? Absolutely, absolutely.

How's it feel to be free? Amazing. I cashflowed this trip here, it wasn't cheap, but I didn't stress, the money trip here. It wasn't cheap. But I didn't stress the money's there. It's absolutely amazing and I wouldn't trade anything for the world. I would do it again if I had to. And you don't have any payments. That's the beauty of making $1,520,000 a year and the ability to pick up and do whatever you need to do because you're proving that to yourself and to your kids. So your kids got to witness a warrior princess. That's beautiful.

Amen. Yeah, you got after it kiddo. You really got after it. Well done. Amen. Very, very well done. Congratulations, you're a good mom. Absolutely.

You're a good mom. We got a copy of Baby Steps Millionaires for you. That is definitely the next chapter in your story. You are on your way. Thank you. And a copy of the Total Money Makeover for you to give away to someone who was inspired by your story you are on your way and a copy of the total money makeover for you to give away to someone who was inspired by your story that you run into because I'm sure you've talked about it and of course Financial Peace

University we want you to go through the class we just launched the new videos the best best class we've ever had at Financial Peace right now available so one-year membership will give you that as well if you've been through it you want to give it away that's fine we're happy to have you pass it on however you want to do it. It's very very good. Alright bring the kiddos up and tell us their names and ages. So I have Sanaya. Sanaya is 15 years old. Emanuela she is five and my youngest one, Tara, she's three years old. Alright love it. Beautiful. Very, very, very well done.

All right, Stephanie from Boston, Mass. Three years and eight months to pay off a hundred and five thousand sixty-three jobs. I'm exaggerating a tiny bit but not much. And some help from the teenage daughter. That's just beautiful. Sixty to a hundred and fifteen thousand income during that time. Count it down! Let's hear a debt-free scream! Three, two, one, we're debt-free! Yeah! Woo hoo hoo hoo! Well done!

Oh man! She made me tear up. She gets it. I got the st tear up. She gets it. I got the stifles. And she pushed it through. That's beautiful. Very, very well done. That lady's a force of nature right there, man.

That's what you have to do. Mom's like that though. And she said it beautifully. What's it take? It takes a mindset change. I know, I know. And you know it's not forever. It's a mindset change.

But in those moments and those nights, it's hard to leave and she still did. I'm gonna live like no one else so that later I can live and give like no one else. This is The Ramsey Show. Between Christmas shopping and holiday get togethers, investing might be the last thing on your mind. But there are certain things you might need to take care of before the year ends. And you don't have to do it alone. The SmartVestor program can connect you with a financial advisor near you.

Whether you've got questions about retirement planning, required distributions, or anything in between, a SmartVestor Pro will walk you through what you need to know. Head to ramsysolutions.com slash SmartVestor to get connected. Ramsey Solutions is a paid, non-client promoter of participating pros. Learn more at ramsysolutions.com slash smartvester. The best way to make the most of your money is to make your money do what you want it to do instead of wondering where it went. Tell your money what to do

instead of wondering where it went. Most people in this life live reactively, but people who are proactive, who happen to things intentionally, are the ones that we call successful people. In the wealth building world, if you're going to happen to your money, you do that with a budget. And every dollar is the budget that'll help you do it it's the app that's free in the app store and Google Play download every dollar get the premium version and while you're at it and start working with your spouse working the baby steps working paycheck planning there's all kinds of tools inside this thing they're gonna help you do the Ramsey system more efficiently and it really

Sets it up to win go to every dollar comm or download the every dollar app for free in the app store or Google Play Today Dorothy is with us in Fort Myers, Florida. Hi Dorothy. How are you? Hi, David. Hi Rachel, thank you for taking my call and I'm in Naples just so you know. Okay cool, how can we help today? Well I unfortunately am a widow. My husband committed suicide last year. Oh my gosh. Sorry. And I would really appreciate it if you'd let me borrow your Magoo glasses to see my way through my mess. I'm so sorry. Wow. Me too. Me too. It was certainly something that we weren't expecting. And now I'm, you know, I have a lot of debt and I want to get rid of it.

And I have some very specific questions for you. One of them is I have an IRA that has some money in it that was part of his, you know what the drop is? How much is in the IRA? It's not a lot, it's about 40 grand. About 40k? And it's not invested in anything that's earning us and earning me anything. How old are you? I'm 57. Okay. And what is your career? I don't have one. My husband wanted me to be his playmate when he retired. And we had a granddaughter who was born with some complications,

and so I stopped working to help, you know, get her through that. And he just didn't want me to go back to work, so I didn't. And so we played and we accumulated a lot of stuff and I know I can sell that stuff to get into a much better financial situation and it's just taken some time to kind of sort through. Sorry. It kind of sort through everything and I wasn't expecting to get emotional. Sort through everything and get some clarity in all of it. So I know I need to get a job. I do know that and I

want one and I've already started looking for one and it's kind of hard not knowing what to do because I have no technical skills whatsoever because I've been out of work for so long. I'm a personal person so I know customer service and things of that nature I should do pretty well at. So I plan on doing that right away and I plan on selling several assets right away. It's just taking me some time to get there. I already downloaded your every dollar app and so I'm working with that right now.

What is the most pressing thing you have today that we can help you with? Well, I, you know, I still have our two trucks that I have payments on and I have some credit card debt. And that was one of the questions I wanted to ask you. Do you have any cash other than this 40K? No, sir. Okay. How are you paying light bill and food bill and all that? His pension.

Oh, okay. Yeah. And that's supposed to die out supposed how much is this pension? I a year or monthly Monthly, it's Just under fifty five hundred and for annual. It's like sixty five nine. And how much is your house payment? My house payment is nineteen hundred. I buy how long thousand how long does the pension last? The pension is going to end in less than five years. Okay, good. So we've got a really good plan here. You can survive monthly,

you can survive and have been monthly on the 55 with the Every Dollar Budget. That's very possible. We may or may not use the 40. We'll see. Prefer to wait until after 59 if we can. Um, and you're going to get rid of the truck payments by getting rid of the trucks and getting you a car you can afford and you're going to start the next chapter of your life. You're a wee 57 year old. You have a lot left, lot left.

This is your chapter two. This is act two. After the curtain comes back up, we took a bow. It's an encore. Didn't turn out like we thought it was going to. The story takes a twist, a rather tragic turn, and the heroine steps forward with her shield and her sword. Okay? Thank you. Thank you. That's you. That's where you're going. And so what's going to happen is three years from today, you're going to be booming as the biggest real estate agent in Naples or whatever

it is you choose to do. Okay. And you're going to be laughing about this little tiny pension, but it survived you. It sustained you when it should have. And that was good, but it's certainly not your future. You are your future. Okay. Right. Mathematically you are emotionally. You are spiritually. You are. Yes. Financially you definitely are. So you're the seat. You're the secret sauce to the equation and you're up to it. You can do it. I can tell by talking to you. I mean you're, you're, you're hurting,

but any normal human be hurting with what you've gone through, honey. But, um, I think there's a lot going on inside Dorothy so how much debt Dorothy you mentioned that you know you guys kind of just traveled and and bought stuff and racked up some debt I'm just curious what all is the debt how much credit card debt is it I have about it's actually eighteen thousand three hundred and six dollars and thirty eight cents okay and what other debt is there I have the house is just a little over a hundred thousand that'll be under a hundred after September's payment I have two trucks totaling twenty one thousand and an RV that's at fifteen yeah so the

trucks in the RV are gone and get you a reasonable car. But that's it, right? Okay. And then we're gonna plow through the credit cards. Is there anything else? The credit card? No. I mean just monthly payments, of course.

Yeah. Yeah. All right. Here's what we're gonna do, okay? I'm gonna load you up with homework. Are you ready to go to school? Yes, sir. All right.

Can I ask you one more quick question? Yes ma'am. You might, I'll wait till you're done and then maybe I'll go ahead. Go ahead. Go right now. Well I had already taken one of the credit cards and put it on a 0% for 18 months and I'm plugging away at that one. The other one has an interest rate. It's the one that's only at 6,000. Would it behoove me to transfer that to a zero percent for 18 months? Doesn't matter. You can if you want. You can if you want, but that's not your problem. Your problem is getting the income up and having your future lined out. And once you see that, then you can turn up the heat and just get rid of them. And the interest rate doesn't matter

when you're paying aggressively on them. So if you want to, it's okay. It's not really the answer to your situation at all. So hold on. Christian's going to pick up. We're going to put you into financial peace university. We're going to provide you with a financial coach. All is our gift. Okay. We're people of the book and the book instructs us to take care of widows and

orphans. And we will do that today. Okay, so you're gonna get that. I'm also gonna send you Ken Coleman's book, the Find the Work You're Wired to Do. It has in it an assessment. I want you to take the assessment. I want you to start the process of dreaming about what the new future looks like for Dorothy. What is it you want to be when you grow up? You're just a wee 57 year old, just a tiny little one. You can do it, you can do it. And Dorothy, and I'm so proud of you,

can we just say too, you haven't messed anything up. When people go through tragedy, we even tell them just to pause for even a year, right? So like you're not behind all of that. I know it probably feels very overwhelming, but you've done the right thing. Hey guys, if you, I'm sorry. If you, if you want to hear the next 40 minutes of the show,

it's on the Ramsey app, the Ramsey network app. So you can download that for free in the app store or Google play. Make sure you jump over and get it there. If you want to listen to all three hours or watch all three hours, you can always do that on the Ramsey network app. It's completely free. Doesn't cost you a thing. So the last 40 minutes of the show now, if you're on talk radio, it's still there, right where it always has been.

But if you're on podcast or YouTube, it's on the Ramsey Network app in the App Store or Google Play. It's completely free. This is the Ramsey Show. What up? What up? It's Dr. John Delaney from the Show. What up, what up? It's Dr. John Delaney from the Dr. John Delaney Show with some amazing news.

The latest episode of United States of Anxiety is available right now exclusively on the Ramsey Network app. This docuseries follows real people from my show as they embark on a 90 day journey to transform their lives and I personally walk alongside them every step of the way. Okay, now here's a sneak peek of what the new episode is all about. And don't forget to click the link in the show notes to download the app. What's up, Kelsey? So I've lived with crippling anxiety for as long as I can remember.

How do I stop it from constantly coming up in different areas of my life? What does crippling anxiety mean? Paint me a picture of that. All right, so you ready to jump in? I'm ready to jump in. We're gonna check in with Kelsey 30 days, 60 days, 90 days. I cannot even function because I'm just crying. My mom left us when I was four. I truly felt like for a while I had no family. She's experiencing things that really hurt a long time ago. Tell me about this boy.

He triggers me a lot. Scared of losing Paul, scared of doing the wrong thing, scared of not being enough. It just feels like it would be exhausting to be Kelsey. It is. Whenever somebody's playing whack-a-mole with their anxiety, when it just keeps moving, that tells me the underlying system's not okay. How do I get my inner child out of this relationship?

Because I feel like she's running the show. One of two people that's supposed to never leave took off. I was just... I was just burdened. You're burdened, that's right. To the one person who should carry it. All of it. Did you ever tell that little girl that it wasn't her fault? I don't know what to do.

You either have to choose to let this guy love you, or you gotta choose to let this guy go.