The Ramsey Show - You Can’t Afford To Be Careless With Money

Episode Date: October 2, 2025

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brought to you by the every dollar app start budgeting for free today normal is broke and common sense is weird so we're here to help you transform your life from the ramsay network and the fair winds credit union studios this is the ramsie show i'm dave ramsay Dr. John Deloney, Ramsey Personality, Ph.D. and Counseling, a host of the Dr. John Deloney show, one of our most popular shows on the Ramsey Network, is my co-host today. Open phones at AAA 825-5-2-2-25. Jay is in Massachusetts. Hi, Jay. How are you? Good. Thank you. Thanks for taking my call today. Sure. What's up? Well, I'm wondering if I should keep a certain amount of cash at my house.

I had something that came up several months ago. Somebody asked me to transfer some money. I opened up my app, my Bank of America app, and everything read zero, all my accounts. And I'm looking at it, and I'm saying, well, maybe this is just, you know, I can transfer it anyway. And I tried, and it says insufficient funds. And so I call them, and I'm on hold for 25 minutes, and then it hangs up on me. I try calling back, and it's busy like the rest of the world is trying to call them at the same time. And finally, after about 45 minutes, it reset itself.

And I'm like, I didn't have any money. What if I really needed money? And I couldn't get access to that. Well, the problem is not whether you have cash at home. The problem is you're dealing with the world's worst bank. Bank of America sucks. As you have discovered, my friend. So, yeah, you need to get with a small town local bank or a good credit union like Fairwin's credit union.

and then somebody will actually answer the freaking phone on the other end. But Bank of America is, they're robotic and ridiculous. No, I wouldn't. The best thing you can do is stay away from them, like way away. Now, let's go back, though, should you keep cash at home, you can't keep enough cash at home to sustain life if the entire banking system collapsed and you could never access your money again, right? I mean, so there's not enough cash for that.

Besides that, cash probably won't work if that's happened because there's probably something else going on too. You'll probably just need bullets and water and gasoline at that point. But, you know, so I mean, it's like survival stuff, right? Prepping stuff, that kind of thing. But do you want to keep some cash at home just for access? Yeah, I mean, what's the biggest possible event that if you couldn't, if you had that happen again, that you would want to, how much money would you want to lay your hands on?

And can you do that safely in your neighborhood in a nice safe inside your home? home. How much? I don't know, maybe $1,000 to $2,000. Yeah. I mean, and so if somebody broke and stole that, it probably doesn't ruin your life. Right? Correct. Yeah. And, you know, get you a little safe of some kind. I've got a little safe. I thought I'm a redneck. I've always got a thousand bucks in my pocket. That's a redneck emergency fund, right? Ten, ten uncle bins, right? Just to say I can. And so that, you know, I need to replenish those after tips sometimes, and so I've got a little stack and a little safe. Nothing dramatic, but it just keeps, makes it a little harder.

But if somebody stole all of it, it really wouldn't change my life, and this wouldn't change your life. Would I tell you to keep, you know, half million dollars in home? No. No, I wouldn't pay you to do that. Sure. John, do you have a half million in your safe? Half a million nickels, maybe.

Nichols. Your grandpa left you. That's right, yeah. Now, Jay, I'm with you, man. I like, here's a thing. Most of the time it's an illusion and I've, here's a better example. I got a buddy who's a world-renowned nutrition expert and I told him I was taking some supplement and that I suddenly felt better. He laughed and said, well, the science doesn't agree with you, but here's what's more important.

The placebo effect. The fact that you took this and you feel better is actually a net benefit. so I'm going to tell you to keep doing it because there's no harm to it. And so I know that having cash at my house honestly is not going to protect me from the meteorite, but it's going to make me sleep a little bit better. And that is, in and of itself, is worth having it around, right? And also, I like to get the random kid knocking on my door, selling something. I like to blow their mind every once in a while. And so, yeah, it's fun to have a little cash around. You can have a good time with that. Give them 10 or 12,000. Not that much. Nichols, yeah. Here, kid.

There's a thousand nickels, carry on. Right. No, but I like having a little cash around, but, but I'm with you, Dave. Like, you can't have, don't have half a million dollars. Yeah. And again, if you're, it, it depends on the neighborhood, depends on who's in and out of your house. And I mean, if you got people coming in there that are helping you or something like that, I don't want to create a temptation for someone of those kinds of things. So yeah, yeah, you know, I would keep. It makes me feel better. And yeah. That's okay. And that, but, but I, if you take it too far, than you are, it is an illusion that it's real, that it really is going to fix everything. When I went to buy my third deep freezer, my wife's like, hey, you're, you're, you're

avoiding me out of control. Yeah, right. Your deer hunting and your prepping is both out of control, yeah. Yeah, yeah, that's a good thing. So, yeah, I would keep some around for that reason, but yeah, the big thing this whole call points out is you need to change banks. That's what the whole thing's about, really. I mean, really, at the end of the day, because honestly, that's the kind of experience.

people have had with the Wells Fargoes and the Fifth Thirds and the Bank of Americas and so forth. They're just mammoth. I mean, Wells Fargo had 200,000 employees commit fraud. Employees. I mean, to start with, you got 200,000 employees, but you have 200,000 that, I mean, that's cray-cra. Just how to put your head around that. And then you think they're going to notice you with your $8,000 in your checking account. They don't care.

This suddenly went to zero, which is your whole world. Yeah. And it doesn't even show up on their seismograph, right? So, yeah, I, no, I want to deal with enough of a click and mortar that I can get my hands around someone's throat. I mean, I get somebody on the phone. But, yeah. I want my money. I'm still old school, man.

I still like to drive down to the bank. Do you really? I do. I do. And it drives my wife crazy, but I still like to go down and meet with. somebody and those those lobbies are getting smaller and smaller and the number of the staff is getting smaller and smaller but i uh i i won't bank with somebody that i can't walk in and and shake their hand yeah or that i don't have someone's cell number like that's just a that's just

it's it's my money and for me it it's how i take care of my kids man and i think we are sometimes pretty absent-minded about it just throwing it up to whatever whatever online bank has the biggest you know the best deal or whatever yeah i don't know for me it's a big deal and i want to go shake somebody hand well it is why that we have partnered up with and now have even even expanded the partnership with fair winds credit union yeah dude that's why because they they're just so cool i mean they've even done this thing i just love this right here so then they've got a new debit card out with the ramsie bundle it's on the front of it it says dead as normal be weird now that's a piece of plastic that says dead is normal be weird i that that's my favorite thing ever right there so but i mean that's

that they're that they are not there to put everybody in debt they're there to just take care of folks. Take care of folks, yeah. And that means they're going to answer the phone, right? And by and large credit unions are really a good place to do that. And by and large, your small town, regional, local bank, that's a good thing to, that's a good place to park your money and keep it, keep your hands on it. But you need to be, like you said, thoughtful about that, not just, you don't have to be paranoid or weird or conspiracy theory or anything like that. But that's good. And I'm a bit of a lot. Like, I know I'm an old soul and I like to go shake someone's hand. And I know that's not a thing anymore. But.

But there is this idea. Just be thoughtful about where you're putting it. Yeah. I always remember. Yeah. You're about to say something to get yourself in trouble. Yeah. No, it just didn't.

America, you just watched Dave Ramsey. Just experience wisdom. No, that was just editing. Self-editing. It was good. It was really good editing. Tell me an old man can't learn. That's awesome.

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And do the right thing and teach you in the process, all that stuff. Go to Ramsey Solutions.com slash coverage and find the type of insurance you're looking for and then connect with a Ramsey trusted agent. You can click the link in the show notes too if you want Mason's in Huntsville, Alabama. Hi, Mason, how are you? Hey, Dave, how are you?

Better than I deserve. What's up? Hey, so my fiance and I are getting married in a month, exactly. Well, congratulations. I just have a... Thank you, thank you. I appreciate it. We're excited. I have a few questions regarding just making decisions, for our future, making sure that, you know, once we get married, we believe in what you guys

teach, you know, we're a family unit. We want to make sure that us as husband and wife are good as a family before, you know, we're, you know, prioritizing our, you know, extended family at that point. So my question would be, I have two-prong question if we have time. My first question would be my parents have a, basically a mother-in-law suite. It's a guest house on their property. They live on five acres. We have the opportunity to live there. one bedroom, one bathroom house for $250 a month for the foreseeable future, really. So my first prong question would be, what's your opinion on that? I mean, should we think about doing that, saving the money up front?

We have a pretty good income for our age. We're both one year out of college and we're 22 and 23. So that has, you know, nothing, you know, that would be a step up for us. I think you dropped your phone or something. So we don't sacrifice our marriage and live too close to my parents. I can't, wait, the last part, I think you dropped your phone. What happened? Can you speak directly into it again?

Yes, sir. Oh, there we go. Yes, sir. Okay. Can you, can you, yeah, stay with us. Ask that question again. Ask the last part of your question. What did you say?

I just ask your opinion on us living that close to my parents for, you know, it is a, it is, it is, a small amount to pay, but we don't want to sacrifice, you know, living too close for my parents and possibly, you know, entering our marriage because we're so close to them. It depends on the question beneath the question. It's costing you $250, but what's the real cost? If they're going to let you be married and not try to interfere with your life and your mom isn't going to try to add a daughter to the people she gets to boss around, including you, then no, I would say go get your own place. If they're going to rent you a place in the back of the or five acres and let y'all have your marriage and not require you to come to family

dinners every night and all that and they're cutting you a break to get you all launched out I can be a great idea right that would be more of the scenario that I think we would fall under because of course you say that it's your parents what does she say yeah what's wife say right she actually agrees she she we both agree that we would much rather have our own place but my parents and you know Haley my fiancee she gets along with my parents and I mean They don't have any quarrels or any kind. And, you know, we both agree, yeah. I think it's really important that you and your fiancé sit down and say,

okay, when we move in, we're only going to do one meal a week. And we're only going to do this six months. We're only going to do this. Y'all create some boundaries. And then be a, if you're going to be a grown man, you're getting married, you're getting your own place, sit down with your parents and say, hey, this is important to us that we establish this. Does this sound cool with y'all?

Right. It's the unmet expectation. the unmet, I thought you were going to say, well, you guys aren't, we're doing this for y'all and why aren't you doing this for us, that's what causes the problem. Right. So it's not the proximity. It's not having boundaries. And the proximity could be no issue if we set those boundaries in our firm with them.

Okay. Yeah, and, you know, the other thing is, if they become a problem, just jet. Yeah, move. Right, right. Our other part with that would be, I do have. a car payment that I am you know heavily thinking about getting out of I'm she has a small amount of student loans and like I said we have a fairly good income for what is your all's income you mentioned that twice um it's about 95 good good that'll be your combined income that would be

our combined yes sir and how are you like 24 you said right 23 yeah no sir I'm I'm 22 22 okay cool good for y'all well done I do owe 20,000 my fuck, it's worth about 24. And it's about $400 a month. But like I said, you know, I currently live with my parents and she's currently living in that house because she works closer to the city that I live in. But we aren't living together. But I am paying, I'm paying my dad, like I said, a very small amount, $250 a month. And I can't afford the $400. But, I mean, I've listened to you since I was young and it was, it's just been something on my mind to kind of get that out of the way before I get married and not have that payment.

Well, you're not going to make it by next week. Do you say you're getting married next week? Next month. Yeah, I don't think you're going to pay off 20 grand by next month, are you? I wouldn't, but it's a possibility of selling it and then getting a different vehicle. Yeah, you could do that. I mean, that's okay. So if you've been listening a long time, you know our general math rule of thumb is don't own vehicles,

things with motors and wheels that add up to more than half your annual income. and so if her car is 25,000, then you're there, and I don't think it is. So, you know, the second thing is, is if you can't be debt free, everything but the house within two years by keeping the car, then the car is too much. And neither of those are true in this case. You could be debt free in a year, easy, and your truck is less than half your annual income. But it wouldn't kill you to sell it and get a $4,000 truck as paid for, and you all start your life fresh and just start stacking cash, man. Just start stacking cash and start talking about

buying a house in a year and a half or two years and see how big a big old pile of money you can make because you're driving a lesser truck. That won't kill you. Either one is okay. Neither one is going to stunt your financial growth substantially. But, you know, what would I do if I woke up in your shoes? I'd probably sell a truck personally, but it's not it's not like you're in the stupid column if you don't i've done the i did the exact thing when i was a few years into being married sold the truck and had to take a check to the to the title company because i was underwater on it but i just i wanted to be clear of it so you know what i would do is this i would wait until you've been married three months and then make the decision it's a good call you don't need to make the decision right now

with all this other stuff swimming around let's just get married get settled in getting the rhythm of life then go yeah truck's gone or no i'm want to keep you it and knock it out. Either one's fine with me. And again, you need agreement from your spouse, not your parents on that. So, yeah, the big issue on your first question, I agree with John, is just can we actually have and set up an independent household emotionally and relationally with reasonable boundaries being in this apartment? Some people can. um truth is not many yeah not many what would you say one in 10 uh i don't know two and two and two and ten maybe maybe i mean it depends on so many different factors i think that

this is one of those things that rarely is this the solution to everything usually when people say hey i need help working on my communication with my spouse usually that means i want them to do what i say right in this case communication is actually the answer which is make sure you're communicating with your parents make sure you're communicating with each other And you'll set up these regular rhythms where you can look her in the eye and say, are we still good? We're still good to be here? And she's like, I got to go.

And you're like, cool, we're getting out of here because she's the priority, your new wife, not your mom. Yeah. Yeah. And where are you in the birth order? And you're the first one to leave home, break your mother's heart and all that kind of stuff. Yeah. All that stuff drives up in it. But $250 rent, man.

Pretty sweet. We can set you up for a totally different life. If you all can talk here with you, this and be wise about it. If you bank it, bank it. bank the difference stack the cash baby stack the cash that's pretty sweet yeah i'm just thinking our kids are and the eight grandkids are all within 25 minutes and i don't just show up on their doorstep nor are you mandated to do any family gathering unless you've committed to it if you say you're in you're in if you said you're in we expect you're ordering food yeah but don't just go i mean we're

freaking cooking for you it's not uh ray romano's family right exactly no popping out here that's popping in popping out stuff but Other than that, I mean, it's, yeah, we have not had any major issues with that knock-on wood. There you go. For way too long, I struggled with sleep and woke up groggy after tossing and turning all night. But now, I look forward to bedtime and I wake up bright-eyed and bushy-tailed thanks to Casper, a company that's been perfecting better sleep for over a decade using durable, high-quality materials that actually last.

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That's casper.com slash Ramsey. Exclusions apply. Maddie's in Minnesota. Hi, Maddie. How are you? Hi, I'm good. I'm so happy to be here. Honored to have you. How can we help? Okay, so quick baby step question. This is kind of flipping the script for us. We just started binging the show and starting the baby steps. I want to keep our somewhat new a Toyota family minivan and snowball it, but my husband wants to sell it to become debt-free.

We both have ADHD and get really into things, but then fail at continuing like new hobbies, for example. and I'm scared if we go for a quick sex and sell the minivan, we'll be like, oh, we're debt-free, we're good to go now, whereas if we snowball this, we'll have motivation and experience living like nobody else, we'll still have a more long-term car. Self-awareness is a pretty cool thing. Way to go. That's neat. It's very observant because that's actually a true statement about all of us that if we get a quick fix,

it doesn't stick as often as if we have to gut it out right um right and so yeah that that's that's true of all of us uh so the van is has how much owed on it 20 and how much debt do you guys have not counting your house um just almost down to student loans 4,000 left of student loans so the van and one student loan yep 24000 in your debt debt-free. Right. Not counting the house, yeah. Okay.

Less than a year, in theory. Right. And your household income is what? 160. Do you hate the van? No, we love the van. You should not sell the van. Yeah, keep the van.

Not because of your reasoning, but just the van is, it's not out of line in your situation. It's just represents a quick fix, but not because it's a quick, not, I wouldn't tell you, I think your reasoning is sound. but I think you ought to just keep this van just because it's a good van and you can pay it off pretty quick and because you're going to have to, here's what's going to happen. If you sell the van, what are you going to be doing? Saving up money and buying another van? Right, exactly, yeah.

You know, so and you make 160 and you'll be able to do that pretty quick. And so you're selling the van, why? So I can buy another one in a year or in eight months or something? No, that's a bad use of all your brain calories. No, I would just, yeah, no, I would just buckle down and pay it off. and you will get the benefit of the thing you brought up while you're doing that. Yep, yep. What do y'all do for a living?

What's the 160 coming from? It's a great income. Thank you. You'll be shocked by this. My husband is a social worker and I'm an artist. Okay. All right. Yeah, and so here's what's back to your original point then that is super valid.

um neither one of you are by your careers anyway are um process people okay you are you deal with a lot of subjective things not objective things and um in order to win at money you have to develop some processes that you stick to and that was in a sense what you said at the opening of the call you said the exact same thing with a lot of wisdom yep okay and so Thank you. I'll give you an example. We live in Nashville, and so a lot of the country music people are my friends, and there's two types of country music people, the ones that are pure artists, and then there are those that are artists and actually have some business acumen. The pure artists are the ones usually get taken to the cleaners by some crooked manager, and the ones that have a little bit of business acumen become household names for decades.

Oh, thank you. I guess artists turned business owner is my career. Oh, okay. Oh, you're running a business. Yes, yeah, you'll get a kick out of this. Maybe we sell custom paint by number kits of people's pets. So customers send us a phone. Oh, I thought you were standing in front of an easel.

Paint by numbers is a process. This is awesome. Okay. You're making my point for me. Okay, this is great. George Camel has 50 of your products for his little precious dogs. That's awesome. Good for you. Okay. Now, you're, okay, now I get it. Y'all need them. Have you all ever done a thing longer than your marriage? Have you ever stuck to a workout program,

a nutrition program, a, anything like that longer than your marriage? For me, being an artist slash business owner, but that's basically it. Okay. So that's a good point. Y'all, I want y'all to practice this like you're, like, like it's a new muscle. okay because you're going to find your marriage is going to get better on the back end of y'all grinding this thing out together yeah we're not talking seven years like most people like multiple years like most people who call y'all are talking like a few months you'll make a ton of money y'all can pay this off yeah so i want y'all to practice building this muscle so i i i completely made the wrong assumption about you obviously you are a systems in a process person and so um the very nature paint by number oh my gosh but i mean but also like i i i that's going to but that's going to blend to you to itself to the wisdom of her question the way she posed her question. And so, yes, go keep the van and you guys let that be the first part of your muscle of you working together, working money as a system, as a process, build that, let's build that muscle like John's saying. That's the answer. Yeah, it's a good, it's a good exercise. Very cool. Good. I love it, Maddie. I love it.

Software people. It's one of my favorites. Very well done. Nicole is in Ohio. Hi, Nicole. How are you? Hello, I'm good. Thank you. How are you? Better than I deserve. How can I help? Well, I'm calling because my husband and I got married a year and a half ago. It's both of our second marriage. So I was married for 20 plus years, sharing finances with my former spouse, and he was single for 15 years, or a divorce for 15. years when we met and so this month is our first month having our budget meeting and we make I wouldn't say significantly different amount but enough for it could be a difference and so I just wanted to find out if I could get some suggestions on how to go about approaching it so that we can start saving for our dreams and goals and things like that. Good for you. Good for you. Well the fact that

You've been through one that failed, and he's been single a long time with no boss in his life, except the guy in his mirror, makes it harder for the two of you to just go, woo-hoo, we're both going to throw in and go, right? If you were 22 and you didn't have any of these scars or any of these ruts where you were stuck in singleness for 15 years or anything like that, you would just jump in and go, whoa, let's go. But you guys, this is going to be hard for y'all. Teaching an old dog new tricks is tough, right? Yes, yes. But it's going to be worth it. It's going to be worth it. Jesus said your treasures where your heart is.

When you agree on your spending, you're agreeing on what you value, what you prioritize, you're agreeing on your fears, you're agreeing on your dreams. It's not the money that matters. It's that we're agreeing on where the money is going, and that that means we're agreeing on what's important. Okay. And that's a big thing, and that's going to be, there's going to be some polishing going on. There's going to be a couple of these rocks are a little rough, and they're not going to be smooth. Stone's easy. You're going to have to hold your breath a couple times, girl.

Okay, okay. Yeah, because he is the type where he wants to be, you know, he's a manly man, if that makes sense. And so I don't want to be, I don't know if we should do like percentages or No, no, no, no, no, you need to do dollars. Manly men work with their wives all the time. And manly men put their, their childish egos aside. for building something that's greater than themselves, which is one plus one equals one when you get married. Yes, yes. And you have to have the courage when you're putting your money in the same checking account to say the words.

This makes me very scared. Yeah, the last bozo messed me up, and you're not that bozo, but I still have that scar. And a manly man wants his partner to feel safe. Okay. Okay. Got it. But what you're saying is there might be a hunting rifle in the bull. budget somewhere. That's okay. That can be there.

And there can be a nice pair of shoes in there for you, too. I don't care. I just want you to be an agreement on it and not come in and go, look what I did, honey. No, no, no, no, we're going to be an agreement. We're going to decide ahead of time what we're going to do. We're going to walk together because, as John said, one plus one equals one. Actually, it equals probably about five because you get the power of synergy, the marriage advantage, all the data calls it.

Thank you. If you've listened to me for more than five minutes, you know that being normal with your money is not a good thing because normal is broke. And I want you to be weird. That's why I love what we're doing with Fair Wins Credit Union. Our friends at Fair Wins just launched a brand new Ramsey debit card, and it says debt is normal, be weird. Right on the front. I love that because every time you swipe it, you're choosing to live differently with no credit card payments and no debt. You see, Fairwinds has been helping people like you ditch debt

faster and bill wealth for years. They're not trying to shove credit cards or auto loans in your face like the big banks do. And they've worked with us to create the smart bundle for Ramsey fans. It includes a no-fee checking account, a high-yield savings account, a high-yield savings account to supercharge your emergency fund, and now the Ramsey debit card to help you stay focused on the baby steps. We're excited for you to try it. So check them out today at fairwins.org slash Ramsey. That's fairwins.org slash Ramsey, insured by the NCUA. The Ramsey Show question of the day is brought to you by Y Refi. Defaulted private student loans can drag on for years, but Y Refi helps borrowers explore custom refinancing with a low fixed rate and a payment you can actually manage.

Go to Yrefi.com slash Ramsey. That's the letter Y-R-E-F-Y.com slash Ramsey. Not available in all states. Today's question comes from Molly in Minnesota. Molly writes, my partner and I, I bought a house together, but I'm the one who made the down payment. I can already tell you we got a problem. He shares the monthly payment expense, but hasn't said anything about paying me back for half the money I put down. Okay. Should I ask him to take out a he-law? Just, Molly, no.

You all break up. Just break up and sell the house and move on. Should I ask him to take out a helock and pay it off to pay me back for his half of the down payment? You know, what's interesting is, is this is the actual first time I've seen the proper use of the word partner. Oh, like my... This is like a business partner. Yeah, and he owes me money. Oh, by the way, I sleep with it.

On the building I bought. Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, you're, Molly, y'all've got... Number one, don't take off a helock. You're like, you're trying to punish him. Don't do that. Because you all bought a house together. And so you're telling him to take out a helock that he has to pay back, actually puts your house at risk.

Don't do that. That's silly. The bigger issue here is you all have some major fractures in your relationship and you'll need to address those on the front end. You should have addressed them before you entered into a legal binding contract called the purchase of a house together, but y'all are already here. Yeah, y'all got big issues. I don't even know where to start with this, Dave, other than just to say, don't do that. Can I pull the pen and throw the grenade? Yeah. Okay, good. Here we go. You have two choices to fix this, Molly. Get married by Saturday and stop this shacking up crap because you're doing things backwards or sell the house.

Those are the only two ways you will survive this. Both ways you have a potential to survive it. But you're not going to survive it the way you are. It's not going to work. because you entered into a business arrangement with a person you're sleeping with with absolutely no written partnership documents and this is going to go sideways and you have no out when it goes sideways. He could just leave and you never see him again and you can't even find him to get the

house sold because you can't get him to sign the deed. He could be in a car wreck. happened to one caller and she called me up and said yeah now I own the house with his mom because by the way he doesn't have a will either because you people aren't real good about doing paperwork on stuff I can tell and so he didn't have a will so guess who his area is it's not his girlfriend that he sleeps with I can tell you that that be his mom and dad that'd be who gets this stuff if there's no will the blood heirs and so now you are partners in a house with the mother of a guy who didn't repay your or his portion of the down payment.

Oh, this is not going to go well, Molly. People never. Let me help you with this. The word was never. I didn't have a caveat. There was no except. It's a complete never. Capital N-E-V-E-R.

Buy a house with someone you're not married to under any circumstances. Period. everything that can go wrong in this life will go wrong at some time or another and you are stuck in a house with that guy you find out he's doing cocaine you find out he's got a secretary that he's more in love with you you find out and you're just stuck stuck stuck stuck stuck with no legal or business recourse to get your little butt out of this mess and you're just beginning to discover how uncomfortable that is when this one little tiny thing about the down payment didn't come up like you guys shouldn't have talked about that on

the front end i think they did and he's just not quote unquote paying her back oh but what happens when he doesn't do what he says he's going to do then he then he needs to go take out of helock yeah yeah off and put it and put it as lean on my house no this is dumber and crud yeah so i'm deadly serious there's only two ways to fix this i'm gonna i'm i'm gonna caveat you I don't think they should get married. I think there's too many issues here. I know, but I'm just saying to protect her. Oh, okay.

I see what you're saying. You know, but yeah, because, so at least when there's a divorce. Right. She has a, there's a, there's a legal mechanism. There's a process. There's a process. For getting rid of this stupid house. Jeez.

But right now, there's no legal mechanism for getting rid of this stupid house, except getting rid of this stupid house. So, and here's another prediction. She ain't going to do any of it. No. So we're just telling you all these stories so that the rest of y'all don't do what Molly did. That's the only reason we brought it up, because Molly ain't going to do anything.

except what Molly wants. I can tell? I wonder. Can I ask you this? This is just fun. I wonder if in the state of Minnesota, I wonder if he would have, like, eviction rights. Like, if she went and dumped him today and said, get out of this house.

Who gets the house? Who gets the house? Who has to stay? Who has to stay? And then I got to give you 30 days eviction. And then you got to get 30 days. And it's going to go to court. I got squatters right.

Like, this could get really messy really quick. Like, you know. Like spray. spray can lines down the middle of the hallway. This is my half. This is your half. My dishes. It's my half of the sink. No water on my side of the sink. That's your Tabasco. Yeah. Oh, my God. Yeah. What a zoo. Bad, y'all. This is people acting like they're married when they're not married. And the whole system in the United States is not set up for you. Sorry, darling. The English law does not, English law is what we're modeled after. And it doesn't set up with the exception of Louisiana, which is French law. And it's not set up for it either.

So just to help you all. It's the way the stuff is laid out, you're screwed in these messes. Oh, my gosh. All right. Carmen's in Colorado. Hi, Carmen. What's up? Hi.

How are you guys? Better than we deserve. How can we help? Thanks for answering my call. I'm calling in today because my husband and I need your help on what to do to get out of debt and start saving for a house. My husband is 22 years old. I'm 24 and we have a one-year-old son.

My husband is in his second year of a life. electrician apprenticing through a union. And I just went back to work in July as a dental assistant. So my husband gets paid weekly. His growth paid before taxes on a check is about 900, but after taxes is like $6.96. And then so for the whole month, it's about $2,784. I get paid biweekly. My pay for the month is about $1,800 a month. My husband pays all the bills, which all together our bills are about 2,753. So with his check, as you can tell, we're left with maybe a few dollars after his check, after the bills.

But including inside the bills, we have tithing, which is 240s. So every week we put in $60 from his check to tithe. I pay my car payment, and then the groceries and gas. How much do you owe on your car, hon? So here's the stupid thing that we just did. I had a 2021 Jeep Compass. It was about $22,000 that I owed on it. And the car was getting too small.

We couldn't fit the baby's car feet in there. How much do you owe in your car, honey? $44,000 now. You have to sell your car. That car is going to bankrupt you. That car is in the land of crazy. If you look up crazy in the dictionary, you're going to see a picture of this car. Yeah, okay. That's what me and my husband have been talking about, too, about selling his truck on top of my car.

You need to get a $4,000 car that you pay cash for. Okay. So that's one thing, too. We only have $1,000 in our emergency fund. Good. That's a good start. And you know your numbers. So even though he's been paying the bills, sounds like y'all are working on this together. That's really good news. You're doing a good job with that. Yeah, but the car is. like we over in crazy land. Are you going to sell it or not? Yeah. Well, you said to sell it. I know.

I said to sell it. I asked if you were going to do it. Yes. Okay. Good. This weekend. Yes. This weekend.

Put a sale sign on it. Let's go. Okay. The car owns y'all. You don't own it. Yes. And then that's going to free up so much. And then you guys keep doing your every dollar budget.

We're going to give you a free year for every dollar. And it's going to give you a step-by-step thing of exactly what to do after you get out from under this car payment and how you can walk your way into some savings out of debt and start talking about building the life because right now y'all don't make much money but you're just getting started and you'll get there and he'll be making more money as he gets out of the apprenticeship right now he's starving to death though y'all will get there but this car is way off the chain here's the deal america the big wireless companies are literally banking on you overpaying every single month

but not boost mobile boost flip the script you get unlimited talk text and data for just 25 dollars a month 25 bucks that's it no contracts no fine print traps just real savings that stay in your pocket where they belong and if you're thinking well george that sounds too good to be true here's the mic drop they've got a 30 day money back guarantee so you can try at risk for you free and see how much you save. Go to boostmobile.com slash Ramsey to make the switch today. That's boostmobile.com slash Ramsey. Restrictions apply. See boostmobile.com slash Ramsey for details. Welcome back to the Ramsey Show in the Fair Winds Credit Union Studios. Dr. John Deloney, Ph.D. in Counseling, Ramsey Personality, number one bestselling author, is my co-host.

I'm Dave Ramsey. Brittany is in Indiana. Hi, Brittany. How are you? Hi, great. Thanks for taking my call. Sure. How can we help?

I am calling. We paid off our house in 2023. Awesome. And we, yeah, we have no debt. We are following your baby steps and your advice as much as we can. The reason I'm calling is we don't feel the sense of freedom, I guess, that we kind of expected or wanted because we're currently saving for a big home renovation. Our house was built in the 70s and has a lot of the original exterior components and a lot of them are in need of being replaced. They're quickly going from a cosmetic need to those windows need replaced type thing.

and we're still trying to balance the enjoying freedom with our house paid off with staying intense so that we can get that renno done and then really feel free. And I guess we were just, I was just looking for some words of wisdom or perspective on how to stay patient while you're saving for a big project like that. Well, it is devastating that no matter what stage of money you get at, you'll find out it's finite. right it's just a pain in the butt um it doesn't matter what you're driving that there's always another one to drive it doesn't matter where you live there's always another one to live and you

never really arrive at that contentment is kind of a bully in the school yard it says step across this line and i'll punch you you step across the line it backs up and draws another line you know it's a moving target this contentment thing and um and that that's you know i've run into it too I completely relate to the feeling that you have. It's like you kind of thought when you got here it was going to be easy. You wouldn't have to worry about it anymore. You could just do whatever you want, right? Yeah.

You intellectually didn't think it was going to be unlimited, but emotionally you felt like you were going to feel like you were unlimited. Like I'm a millionaire. I don't have to budget anymore. What was that? It's like I'm a millionaire. I shouldn't have to budget anymore, right? well we we do still budget i mean and i know you do i'm just talking about the feeling the emotion

it's annoying yeah yeah it is annoying and it's also um it's hard because we thought well we would be able to use more of our our so-called extra money for things like bigger nicer vacations with the kids and things like that but i feel like well you could if you move yeah and i want to call that what Dave just said, here's my promise to you, the day these renovations are over, if you and your husband don't get together ASAP and change how you experience the world, you're going to find yourself in yet another self-created prison. Because you'll have it made the switch to we are choosing to live in an old house, which means we are choosing to update this stuff. Some stuff has to be done. Some stuff doesn't, but we're going to. These are all choices. You're not owned by it.

Right. Yeah, there's two ways to fix an old house. Fix it or move. Right. If we were to move, I even, I have considered that thought. Maybe we're, maybe we would be better off moving. But we, there's repairs that would have to be made regardless. So it's, we're kind of.

Yeah, but the point is this. I don't want to say. The point is you're choosing. You're choosing it. You're free. Choosing. You're doing what you want next. Thank God.

You don't have this window project and a house payment. Yeah. you know and two car payments and student loans yeah you'd be what's known as up a creek right no paddle yeah with all that right it's the whole thing i mean so you're you really are you know you kind of got to look back in your mirror and go thank god you know i had a heat and air system go out on one of our properties the other day and it was like 10,000 dollars or something way to spend and i went thank god that's an inconvenience yeah it's annoying it's annoying versus a freaking catastrophe yeah you know which is what it used to be everything was a catastrophe when

your life when you're broke your life looks like a country song you know keep the dog out of the street it'll get hit i mean come on everything that'll go on can go wrong and so yeah the the difference is something's annoying and has a i kind of feel cheated versus a dadgum drama it's an emergency it's that old c s lewis quote that hell is is locked on the inside like y'all have created yet another prison and then yet another prison and yet it's it's going to be a pattern until you all decide to exhale and say, we are free. We're choosing to live in this house. We're choosing to go through these renovations. And this is going to be a pain in the butt, and we've done it before we can do it again. And you laugh and you kind of get that snarl and then you go get it versus this is happening to us.

We are stuck here. It's a victim mindset. It's a scarcity mindset versus a, no, we can do whatever we want. And we're making this choice right here. It's just a totally different reframe. You're in control. You're making a choice. You chose to do the windows and delay the travel. And that's not. not a bad choice. No, it's a great choice. It's an annoying choice. It's a great choice. It's probably the right choice, even if you turn around and sell the house. Like you said, we've got to fix it up to sell it, even if we're going to do that. That's okay, dude. That's all a good choice. The great news is you have choices. Yeah, that's it. For two reasons. You've got choices. Two reasons. One is you put yourself in this position, and two is God chose for you

to be born in America, where you still have choices, as opposed to someone just dictating to you what you're going to do. So, yeah, that's the cool thing. And I got to tell you all, I one of the things that I distinctly remember this is it's a dumb metaphor but it actually happened because I'm the spender okay at my house Sharon's the natural saver I'm the natural spender and so I'm reading these scriptures and it says godliness with contentment is great gain and so I go down the rabbit hall start studying contentment because I'm like where do you find this I want to buy a box of it you know I need some of this because I I've been go get it go get it go get it acquisition, acquisition, acquisition, my whole young life in particular in my 20s, right?

So it's Jaguars and Rolexes and I'm going to, I'm going to acquire. I'll be happy when. I'll be happy when. I'll be happy when. I'll be happy when. And, you know, the bully in the schoolyard backs up, draws a new line, says, come on. And you come on. And he's a do it again, do it. You never really get to hit him in the nose. You never do. And so I, but after we went broke, I went to Costco where you can buy 20. pounds of peanut butter and you can buy 73 of anything you need one of and they check your little receipt when you're going out because it's federal law you have to spend $200 in there if you don't spend it they make you go back and finish right and so that's why they check the receipt and I distinctly remember I can take you to the Costco I had a spiritual experience I walked out of Costco buying nothing. It was like a breakthrough.

I think there's a statue of you in a Costco somewhere. You know, it was like, oh, you know, I was like, I don't have to have any of this today. And it was like something snapped. It was real. Yeah. It was real. And godliness with contentment is a great gain. And I became convinced that contentment might be the most powerful financial principle.

If you don't have contentment, you get into debt. If you do have contentment, you can save. If you don't have contentment, you're always at odds with your spouse about money. If you do have contentment, the two of you are just trying to figure out how much you can give away. It's a breakthrough. It's a financial breakthrough. It's true freedom. Like none of the other financial principles we teach.

It's true freedom, yeah. It's very powerful. It's a great call. I appreciate you calling so much. I completely relate to you, Brittany. I understand your feeling. but it's a very human feeling that it's just it's a it's a journey you're on and you'll get there Dave, we got a lot of calls on this show where life happens.

One day someone's healthy, they're working, providing for their family, and then a curveball hits. You know, we hear it all the time. A car accident, a cancer diagnosis, a heart attack, and suddenly everything changes. Yeah, and that's why you've always said that having term life insurance from Xander is essential because it protects your family if the worst happens. Yeah, that's right. You need 10 to 12 times your income in coverage. No gimmicks. No whole life junk. Just straightforward term life protection. But there's another piece that people often overlook, and that's long-term disability insurance. Yeah, it's important to understand the difference between them. Life insurance steps in when you die. Disability insurance steps in while you're alive but can't work. So it replaces a large part of your income so the bills still get paid while you get back on your feet. Now, if your employer gives you free disability insurance, great. Take it. If it's discounted there at a better price, take it. But if not, Zander can help you find the right plan. Whether you're single or married, it's not optional. If you're going to be out of work for a while, then you need to make sure the money still showing up.

And that's why Zander is our go-to. They make it super simple to get the right coverage at the best price, no pressure, no upselling. I've trusted Jeff Zander and Zander insurance for over 25 years. so is my family. So don't wait. It's fast, it's easy, and it could make all the difference. Go to zander.com or call 800, 356, 4282. Protect yourself, protect your income, protect your family. So many years ago, we came up with this great idea. There were these new things on your phones called an app, an application. So we decided that Ramsey should have an app that would do your budget. And we worked and we worked and we worked and we worked on it.

And we developed really over the last decade or so the world's best budgeting app without a doubt. It's called every dollar. Because every dollar has an assignment by you. you assign every one of your dollars a place to go, give it a name. Well, what has ended up happening then is that over the last three or four years, we've invested a bazillion dollars in programming and in brilliant digital minds inside this building that do things I can't even spell and have managed to integrate into it the whole Ramsey plan, the Ramsey way.

So like you guys call in and ask us detailed, nuanced questions about what you do with this baby step or what do I do there what do I do there and we've actually got almost all of that now answered inside of every dollar so the all new every dollar we just relaunched it the other day and it's a complete game changer you can watch the premiere on your on our youtube channel and see see it how it works in action what happens is when you go in if you've been there before do it again if you've never been go now and get get get get get into the the every dollar app because what happens in just the first 15 minutes or so you're going to find thousands of dollars of margin and then we're going to start showing you how to apply it using the

baby steps framework and the ramsie way so to speak and the ramsie way basically is we're going to take you from debt into wealth and generosity change your whole family tree we want you to get there and so imagine how much you could find to put towards your money goals the all new every dollar. It's here. Check it out. Jake is with us in Cleveland, Ohio. Hi, Jake. How are you? Good, guys. How are you doing? Better than I deserve. How can I help? So, me and my wife were 24, fresh out of college a few years ago. So we decided to build a home, our forever home. And the cost kind of got out of control. Our parents stepped in. My parents stepped in. Me and my wife been blessed to have our parents by her side. They actually followed

financial piece back in 2000. There's a different story behind that, but they've accumulated some vault over the years. They've handed us over a lump sum of money to help us build this house. And whatever is left over, we will pay back in a mortgage payment to them. Me and my wife make about $130,000 a year before taxes

with a commission bonus for myself at the end of the year. So my question is, and we do have a good amount of savings from the past years of working about $120,000 in savings. Okay, I'm sorry, if you have $120,000 in savings, why the flip did your parents have to give you money? They have been working so hard their whole life to set their kids up, and so they want to help every single one of their kids out. I'm one of three brothers. Yeah, but you may sound like you got in trouble and they bailed you out.

Oh, no, no, no, no, sir, no, no, no. So what happened with the house? You bought too much house? What's the deal with the house? Yeah, so we're building. Oh, you're still building? Yeah, we're still building. We're in the foundation phase right now.

Oh, you just started building. Yes, so the deal was with them was we can collaborate with them. They can help out. I mean, we have a really good relationship with our parents. I work for them, actually. And this is what they wanted to do for us, and so we kindly accepted it. And any cost after their initial lump sum that they handed over, we would pay back to them in a mortgage.

And so I guess my question is, is me and my wife are still young. We're 24. We're not thinking my kids right now. Do we give up a lot of that savings that we have straight back to them at the beginning? Or do we have some of that, keep most of it and travel and have fun in our early 20s? So do I borrow money from my parents when I'm newly married to travel? That's in essence where this lands. When I say it that way, does it sound as crazy to you?

as it does to me yeah a little bit okay yeah no you you you you're like did grown up stuff and went bought a house at 24 years old pay for your stinking house and then start talking about traveling do you have a good relationship with your parents very good the surest way the surest way to blow it up is to have money in between you okay and I know that's a weird hard thing to say at 24 especially when you got two people who are like no it's no big deal it's no deal just take it from two older guys clear the money between your relationship so that it can stay as good as it is right now i think i heard a two-stage deal here like they gave you a gift of a certain amount and that even wasn't enough and so then they loans you more is that right yes they

loaned us the full amount of whatever cost for the house we're paying for in cash um to build so they're not taking loan out from any they're they've been completely debt-free since 2008 I know, but you now owe them a mortgage payment. Okay, so that part where they went through Financial Peace University, they flunk the class, because we tell you not to do that, ever. Don't ever loan your children money. Oh, my God. Because it puts a wedge between the relationship.

Yeah, the borrower is slave to the lender. Now you have to eat dinner, hey, eat Thanksgiving dinner with your master. Yeah. That's going to be painful for your wife. Not going to bother you much because it's your parents, but it's going to be painful for your wife. understood oh so how much money do you owe your parents that you have to pay the mortgage on probably going to be around 200 to 250,000 okay and how much of a gift did they give you about 50% of the total cost to build so about 200 to 250,000 so you're 24 years old you make 130

and you got a 450,000 dollar house yes dang jean Yeah. Okay. It's a lot of house, dude. That's a lot of house. All right. Well, for sure, the answer to your question is, no, you don't need to go on vacation. Yes, you need to take the $130,000, but I'm even going to go a step further. I'm going to put the $130,000 with your mom and dad to limit the size of the mortgage,

and then I'm going to go get a commercial mortgage, not from your parents. Okay. Because I don't want this mortgage. I don't want you paying payments to your parents for any amount of money. for any amount of interest. I don't think you're going to do that because I think you guys have worked out this detailed thing in all of your heads

that this all works out to the point that you're ready to go to Europe instead of pay them back. Here's what I would see. I can see myself working really hard so I can bulldoze a path for my son and his new wife. I get that.

But if my son was to hand me a check for $130,000 and say, dad i've got this money saved up this is the part of the mortgage and then i want you to see here i'm giving you the rest of it i took out a commercial loan because i want to just stay your son i don't want to stay one of your like i don't i don't want you to be my banker i would be so proud and in a way you're kind of not showing him up but you're kind of saying i'm taking this by i'm taking the reins here it would show a level of wisdom and maturity i'm trying to give him as much grace as i can't dad because the arrangement he's put you in is madness.

It just ends in somebody wanting you to do something for Christmas and your wife doesn't want to. And it's like, well, after all, we've, it's just a recipe for disaster. But man, if you went and did what Dave just said, go get a commercial loan for the rest of it. And by the way, that's a tiny mortgage. It's a $120,000 mortgage. It's a tiny, tiny, tiny mortgage. Just go do that, man. You'll have that paid off in no time with as much money as you'll make.

If you don't go on trips. Yeah, if you don't go to Europe. And by the way, you're, I don't know, Dave, trips are more fun when I'm older now. I don't know why. They just are. Well, they're more fun because they don't follow you home. But in essence, that's what this ends up being. I don't have to increase the amount we borrow from mom and dad by the amount that we spend on the trips.

And so it's black borrowing on the trip, borrowing from mom and dad to go on a trip. And obviously that would be ludicrous. So moms and dads, those of you that graduate. from Financial Peace University with a better grade than that mom and dad got, which was an F. Here's the rule, okay? If you want to give your children some money and they pay cash for a house and part of the bargain is they never borrow money because you want your family tree to be completely changed, great. Never make your child, your grown child, your slave. you change your relationship with your daughter-in-law, your son-in-law.

You change the relationship in how you interact with each other. It's just you're adding layers to it that you're unintended, but they're very real. And no one is the exception. Even a nice master is a master. As a mom, I plan for everything. I plan the budgets, snacks, lunches, backup outfits in the car for the unexpected. I mean, everything. Because moms handle a million details every day.

So don't skip one of the biggest ones. What happens to your family if you're not there tomorrow? You guys, a lot of people put off. making a will because it can feel a little scary. But here's what we all need to realize. Planning for the future isn't fear. It's love. And creating a will turned out to be one of the most loving, protective things I could ever do for my family. And Mama Bear legal forms makes it so easy. No lawyers, no stress, just an online process that you can finish in about 20 minutes. And now my husband and I both sleep better because we have taken care of the stuff

that really matters. And it isn't scary. It's wise. It's what moms do. So if you've been putting off making a will, I totally get it. But don't wait anymore because you're a mom first, which means you're always planning. So go to mamabearlegalforms.com and use promo code Ramsey to save 20%. Mamabearlegalforms.com code Ramsey. Tim is in Ohio. Hey, Tim, what's up? It's Ken. Oh, sorry.

Hey, Kelly. It's Ken. Okay. Okay. I was just reading my screen. Pardon me. How can I help? That's no problem.

Yes, Dave. So a year and a half ago, I got into your program and stuff, and let me thank you from the bottom of my heart, because that completely changed everything for me. And I'm married now, and my wife is 62, I am 55. And I work for the state, and I have OPRs, and we have to, we don't have a choice, we have to put in 10%. of our gross income into that, and then the state also matches that 10% and adds 4%. My wife's 401K, they do not have any company match. Her late husband only would allow her 5% to 6% and not aggressive at all.

So there's not much in there, but we currently have 27,500 in debt. there's 44,000 in that account, and then we have our house and crunching the numbers and looking at things, if we take the $27,500 out of there and just wipe out that debt, that allows us to pay the house off in under five years and 18 months more of investing at $3,000 a month. Does that make sense to you? she's 62 62 how old is she she's 62 so

yes we understand we'll be on the hook for taxes but we are yeah the 44 it's going to take the whole 44,000 to clear 27 okay so or close I mean give or take a thousand bucks or two

but it's not I mean you're going to pay taxes on 44,000 dollars going to be at least 10 grand, right? Hello? We would be in the 12% tax bracket. Why, y'all don't work? Yes, we work. How are you in a 12% tax bracket?

Because of filing jointly, and you take the first 10% off of that, and then we go into the rest of it goes into the 12% then. What's your household income? about $75,000 a year. Okay. I don't think you're doing that right, but I'm not a tax pro, and I can't do it in front of it. I can't do it off the top of my head. Anyway, you're going to have taxes.

It's going to eat up a lot of the $40,000, and so you're basically going to cash out her retirement at 62 years old, pay the taxes, no penalties, and pay off her debt. Yes, I would do that, but make sure you set this money aside for tax. Okay. And have somebody else calculated other than you and me. me because neither one of us are very good at it. I don't think. Yeah, I don't think you're calculating that right. But anyway, yeah, but I think either way, you're going to use up most of it either way. So tell me the math behind that, Dave. Like somebody 62, you're going to go ahead and pull it. Well, I mean, if you've got retirement and he's got a bunch and they're going to, you know,

we don't tell people to cash out their retirement and pay before they're retired. But at 62, your retirement age. And so you can pull it without any penalties. And I don't want to pay that 10% penalty, but you're going to pay your taxes on it. But, you know, like if we have somebody called in, they owe $300,000 on their house and they've got $900,000 in their 401k, I'll pay off the house out of that. If they're 62 or older. Yeah, yeah, because no penalty on it, pay off their house. It's what you, it's what you saved it up for. And in this case, it's just a blended family, a second marriage thing, and it's just a weird little account. Yeah. It's not a big account. But it doesn't, it doesn't really change them. The principle is, yes, if you have enough

in retirement, and you can clear all your debts, even, and pay your taxes that you create by doing that, I would do that, as long as you've got some left over, and of course they've got all of his, and they're both continuing to work and are going to put $3,000 a month back into the program. So that's where we're going. Yeah, that's no different than, yeah, very, very good. Christine's in Virginia. Hi, Christine.

How are you? Hey, I'm doing well, Dave. Thank you so much for taking my call. Sure. How can we help? I recently discovered you about a month ago, and I'm hooked now on your little cult, which I'm happy to be. Yes, we're going to send you some, we're going to send you some Kool-Aid here in the mail.

Awesome. My question is, my husband and I are in about $87,000 of debt. I'm 60, he's 62. I want to start your program desperately. We both do. But my concern is that of that debt, $68,000 is in a debt. settlement program. Doesn't mean you can't pay it off.

Really? Yeah. I thought, well, aren't I obligated to them for the 55 months I signed up for? Nope. You've already paid them. They got all their money up front. The first handful of payments you paid them paid them. They did none of your payments, the first handful, went to the debt.

It went to them. And then what they've done has destroyed your credit and have, put you in default on everything and then set up payment plans with everybody. But, I mean, I would do it as a lump sum. I probably do it as a lump sum. What kind of debt, how much of the 87 is in that? 68. Oh, yeah, you said, okay, all right.

And what's your household income? We make about $100,000 together. Okay. Well, you may find that it's easier to just lump sum it and call them up and go, Okay, help me settle lump sums on this rather than payments. Ask the debt settlement company to do that. How many different debts are in the 68? Let's see.

I was just looking at it. My problem with them is that they're not doing very well. No, no way. You're kidding. I'm sure. I was hooked. I was hooked, blind and sinker. I will not lie.

It's been since January. How many debts? And they've only settled two accounts, probably ten. Okay, all right, and they've settled two of them. Okay. What I would do is call them up and say, hey, I'm going to start advancing some cash towards this and you're going to get more aggressive because you're going to feel my foot on your butt. I don't have any extra cash to send them, though.

No, you do if you're going to get out of debt. You make $100,000. Something's going to change. get on beans and rice rice and beans we're not going out to eat we're not going to see the inside of a restaurant unless we're working there we're not going on vacation we're not spending any money on anything because we're 60 years old and deeply in debt we got to get this crap cleaned up Christmas presents yeah we're sending cards this year instead of presents for everybody yeah everybody here we go the worm has turned times have changed it's about the change baby

I mean you got to get you got to get after it and because you don't you don't want to be 70 and be looking at the you know half is debt still laying there because you've been toying around with it. So, but going clear the other portion first, and then when you get to the debt settlement 68, then start being on the phone with them going, okay, I need to settle one more of these. Let's get some, let's get some aggression going here. And it doesn't take five years, then you can work through it in whatever period of time you work through 87, making 100, which hopefully would be working extra selling stuff could be as early as two years, probably a little more than two years to get through that but you're going to have to be living on nothing nothing nothing nothing honey

blankets blankets sweaters in the house all of it that whole thing turn the throne step turn it's it's a mind shift man you got you got you got to have to go and here's the thing as as you know you don't have a lot of time to do this it's not like you got 40 years to figure this out you got 40 months to figure this out so you need to get with it and you can do it you can absolutely do it. But the debt settlement companies, boys and girls, the way they work is they collect payments from you for five years. The first set of payments they collect from you, they put 100% of it in their pocket while letting all of your credit cards and other stuff go into default. Then they go to the creditors and say, oh, these are in default. What will you take

as settlement? And so even if you weren't in default, they put you there. That's their process. That's how they do it. And that's why we tell you not to do that stuff. If a washed up actor between a snuggy ad and a gold ad on cable TV is pitching you something financial, stay away from it. Well, it happens. Well, it happens occasionally. We've got one of our friends. stopped in here. The one and only Tim Tebow. Welcome, my friend.

Thank you, guys. So good to see y'all. Thanks for having me. Good to see you again. So we were just talking Papa stuff before you, as you walked in. Got a new baby? We do. Almost three months old.

It's crazy. Now I feel like I'm actually getting old. A little gray in the beard there. You got to be careful. A little gray in the beard. My one called the salt and pepper, though. But it's just been such a crazy blessing. You know, a lot of people.

ask, like, you know, being a dad, is it a different kind of love than you knew? And I thought a lot about it. And I don't know because the moment Demi said she was pregnant, I think I already felt it, but I'll tell you what hits you is the responsibility. Like when we get home, I was like, oh, we got to change this cabinet, we got to change this countertop. She could get injured on. She could do this. You're like, you're trying to think 10 steps ahead and five years ahead. And that level of responsibility is surreal. I always like to tell somebody it's, like somebody just adds two more plates on the squat rack and just it sits under you and you're like, oh, this guy's heavy, right? It is. So the Tim Tebow is a two-time national champion. Heisman

trophy winner, first round NFL draft pick, speaker, college football analyst, five times New York Times bestselling author. I think he's been on here four of those times if I remember. So I'll take credit for a little of that. He's the founder and the leader of the Tim Tebow Foundation. He and I have done some wonderful ministry work together in and around the sex trafficking world, preventing that, obviously. Yeah, anti-sense. Well, I mean, we've done, we both share a love of several people that are in that space, and your team is in that space big time.

And so we've had a lot of different things we've done together. New book out, look again, recognize your worth, renew your hope, run with confidence. Now, I do know you well enough to know the truth is, is that you don't just sit down and randomly go, oh, time to do a book, that something had to be burning and churning inside of you that you couldn't not say. And so where's that come from on this one? It was really inspired several years ago,

and I felt like I could put it off longer than I was called to. And it was really first inspired at a night to shine. It's our worldwide celebration for individuals with special needs. And we were at one of the Night to Shines in Arizona and it was during COVID. And so they're driving through the drive-through and on the red carpet. And we're celebrating all of these cars that are coming through. And a lot of them are corvettes. And so all the kings and queens are in the back and cheering for everyone as this massive crowd is cheering for everybody. And there's a young girl and a red corvette as it drives around. And she is just beaming the joy in her life.

and in her heart and just oozing out of her is so contagious. And as the Corvette pulls by, and I see the back of it, and I didn't even know our teams and partnerships with the churches were even making these bumper stickers, but I saw the bumper sticker, and on the back, it said royalty on board. And I just thought, man. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's somebody's daughter, right? It is. It's royalty on board. And so it really led us down this track of really studying. what does it mean to be made in the image of God? And so we talked to so many incredible scholars over the last few years and diving in.

A lot of people talk about the image of God is rational, relational, functional, right? We're a rational being, so logic and thought and all of this that God's given us, or relational, meant for relationship with each other and for God are functional to rule and reign. And I think all of those are part of it, but I think it's a step further

and a step that's even more important. And that's when you really look at the image of blank that was used over history, especially in the ancient Near East, it was always the term used for kings or for monarchs. So, Assyrian king was made in the image of Beller, an Egyptian king made in the image of Ra, gods that they believed in. And so when they would have heard that in the ancient Near East that we were made in God's image, what it would have come across to them is that it's a royal worth statement.

And we have forgotten that in our society, that when we're made in the image of God, it's not just what we do, but it's who we are. It's the worth statement that God has given us. It's a royal worth statement that he loved us so much. He would create us in his image. And we have just forgotten that. And if you look at what's happening in our societies and around the world, if you look at the boys and girls that are being exploited or trafficked

or the loneliness or the suicides or all of this, it's a royal worth statement. We've forgotten the worth of humanity. We've forgotten the value of every single. life. And I really, my heart and prayer for this book is that part of it would be one of the most encouraging things that someone would ever read. But the second part will also be one of the most challenging things that hopefully, prayerfully, someone will ever read. Yeah, so as you're talking, I'm thinking, A, the importance of hearing this, but that also means I've got a responsibility to every single person in my neighborhood. Everyone you ever meet. It's made in God's image.

And the encouraging part is we share so much. much biblical truth that should be encouraging to people. Man, I'm made in God's image. It's a value statement for me. It's a love for me. But it also is why we argued and challenged and thought over and over about the title. Why it's so important to look again is to look again at who God made me to be. But then it also applies to every single person that I see, ever of all time. Check that bumper sticker. Your friends and your enemies. Every one of them. Royalty on board. It's royalty on board. Man.

That's a profound call for this moment. I think that you just couldn't have written it or thought it for what's taking place in our society. For the divisiveness, for the demeaning and the diminishing of people that we disagree with, for the lack of value because an argument or because a disagreement or because of a political. stance or because of a background and and we diminish people and instead of having a disagreement but still valuing people you can do both and as a society we have to do a better job of valuing who God made us to be but then also valuing everybody else look again you'll see the bumper sticker if you look again recognize your worth renew your

hope run with confidence is a brand new New York Times bestseller I'll go ahead and predict that um from our friend tim tibo uh man dude i'm convicted sitting here man i just the thing keeps running through my head is i remember like even teaching teens years ago you're a king's kid yeah you're a king's kid you're a king's kid you're a king's kid i remember a pastor saying teaching us one time he said you know in the in the old testament in genesis it says uh god created the heaven's earth and the stars also that's the mention of the stars And then he spends 35 chapters on Joseph. You know, I mean, it's like, what's more valuable to God?

That individual. It's not even close. There's only, you know, it's not even the individual and the stars also. That's right. There's almost an afterthought. That's right. There's only one thing that Jesus as the son of God came to die for. People. And yet we put in place of people or above people our cars or our watches or our praise or

promotion or recognition and all of these things. And when you do that, what you are doing, what's implied is how diminished people are, right? That they come after all of those things. And this is a challenge that you are more important than all of those things, but so is every person you see. And especially when you see people that are suffering. And today, there are so many people that are suffering. And how could we know the worth that God has put on humanity and not do something,

especially when we know they're suffering? So bring it down for the person who, is the truck driver or the single mom who's balancing two kids and listening to the Ramsey show trying to figure out a pair of debts off what is the thing they can do in their community well it's like we can start foundations and big stuff but what's something that a person who is just grinding it out right now in their neighborhood don't look past don't look away refuse to look away refuse to look away um that person that you're when you're pushing your kids in their stroller and you want to ignore them say hi say value

them. Value people. If you're the truck driver, what's taking place? Well, how many kids are being exploited on that, right? Be aware of it. Talk to your teams. Talk to your supervisors. Understand the problems that are taking place and act upon them. And people say, well, what can I do in the macro? Sometimes it's hard to step into some of these fights because they're big. They're very hard. They're very difficult, daunting and overwhelming. But all of us see people almost on a daily basis. Value them. Love them. Show them the work. Because how do we know their worth. Well, it starts in Genesis that they're made in God's image, but then is brought full circle when Jesus came and died on the cross for them. And how do we know the value and worth of somebody

by what someone is willing to pay for him? And Jesus Christ, who has infinite value and worth, was willing to give his life in exchange for you and me and every person we ever see. That's how we should see them. And right now, we see them through the faulty lenses. Hey, guys, George Camel here. Do you ever feel like insurance companies only care about your money and not what you actually need? Well, there's a better way. When you, go to Ramsey's Insurance Resource Hub, you'll start feeling confident that you're getting the right coverage that's truly best for you. You'll find helpful info on everything from life insurance, health insurance, identity theft protection, and more. And when you're ready to get the coverage

you need, you can connect with a Ramsey trusted insurance pro who will only get you what you need at the best price. Go to ramsysolutions.com slash insurance. Ramsey Solutions.com slash insurance. Welcome back to the Ramsey Show in the Fair Wins Credit Union Studio. Dr. John Deloney, Ramsey, Personality, Ph.D., and counseling is my co-host today. Open phones at AAA 825-5-225. Kim is in South Dakota. Hi, Kim. How are you?

I'm great. How are you? Better than I deserve. What's up? Okay, so we lived debt-free, had purchased to use cars. We followed your program since we had our daughter 20-something years ago and had lived that way. But ran into a little naggle when we were part of a natural disaster. And we had purchased homeowners insurance with State Farm and had a really high deductible because our opinion was we had enough money saved that if something happened, we would pay for ourselves and not pay a huge premium. So that's how we lived our lives.

We got on the go on vacations. We have one child who was in college, and we were paying for that with cash. She's pre-med, so she has to go to school for that. And so that's kind of how we lived our lives until this storm came. But the storm made our house unlivable, and so we had to go into a hotel for two and a half years. and the insurance company did not pay us like they said they would. And so we ran up thousands and thousands of credit card dollars in debt to pay for food, housing, all of that stuff. And unfortunately, we tried to resolve this with them and couldn't.

So we have an attorney who's filing a suit against them to try to get our money back. But in the meantime, we're trying to dog paddle our way out of this. And at the same exact time, our child had to have open heart shirt. We had to take her to California to Stanford. And we spend a lot of time which I have no control over these bills at the Mayo Clinic in Rochester. So I never know how to budget because I've got hotel bills unexpected when they say you have to come to Mayo and you have to pay for those things. You have to pay for food when you're Mayo, gas. And so it's very difficult to budget.

So I just wanted to know if there's something I'm missing because sometimes you're too close to it to see it. What's the best way to manage this? because I don't feel like I have control like we used to have. And I just wanted some ideas. Okay. So for 20 years, you were completely dead free, and you didn't have any money? Well, we did have money, but we used a lot of that to do a pair at front. We became the Bank of State Farm.

Yeah, I know, but how much money did you have? we had a I'm going to say saved up and not used for college cash on him because we just bought this house probably about $100,000 that we had saved up because we had paid that off and so why did it take two and a half years and why were you not buying your own food while working well we couldn't pay in the hotel you can't you can buy food but you can't cook if there's no well I mean if it's going to take two and a half years ago why didn't you go rent something We tried. There wasn't anything available that met the physical needs that we had. We had moved our neighbor into our home who was 90 years old, not just 95, for end-of-life care, and we couldn't have stairs, and there were just requirements that we had that they could not meet. So we ended up in a hotel, and you had to pay for laundry.

You had to pay for meals for the time today. I mean, State Farm screwed you, but so did those decisions. Yeah. I mean, you quadrupled or five-ext your cost, and it doesn't take two and a half years to rebuild a house. Oh, it's not even done now. I mean, why? I built an entire house in 11 months. Why can you not build a house?

I've got family members that just lost their house in Texas, and last night was their first night back. But it was, it's been, what, four months, five months? Like, yeah, two and a half years. Tell me about that. It seems like they could have knocked the whole house down. One, it was a natural disaster, so there were lots of building going on, projects going on. So there weren't a lot of contractors available. It was also during the time where you had high gas prices and stuff,

and contractors didn't want to come out to look at the house if it wasn't something that they wanted to do because there was so much work. There was a lot of contributing factors. Also, the fact that State Farm was not accruing things, you kept having to work. wait, they would make us do another estimate and another estimate, another estimate. All right. So, but you stayed in the ditch rather than making a decision to do something completely different for two and a half years. So that's what puts you here.

My goodness. And now the health, your daughter that's studying to be a doctor has had open heart surgery? Correct. So she's not studying to be a doctor right now. She's recovering, right? No, there's schools letting her stay in school. and she's trying to do stuff, you know, online and submit things sometimes late. Did she have health insurance?

She has our health insurance, my husband's health insurance. And does it not cover the surgeries and the other stuff? It covers surgeries, but it doesn't cover any of the other things associated with it, like hotel bills and gas and soon when we go to Mayo or when we had to go to Stanford. We went Stanford for seven months. Yeah. So what is your household income? 188.

And you can't buy a hotel bill and go to Stanford if you make $188,000? Well, again, I mean, we did and, you know, put things on credit cards. Why? You make $188,000. Because we had a mortgage payment and we had college tuition and we had other things that we were paying. I mean, it wasn't, and we were paying, you know, for the house while we were in the hotel. I mean, there was a lot of people that could sit here and go over a single bill and you'd go, oh, that makes sense. But we're not extravagant.

I mean, we're not give you an idea like we've canceled our trash service and gather up our own trash and take the dump ourselves. Yeah, but run sprinklers. Here's the thing. Yeah, we're not trying to pick those apart. I think if I back all the way out of this thing, I think the part, for every emotional health challenge, there is this distance from this scary, terrifying life. line called reality and if you on my show I say this probably three times an episode which is the life you had is over and you got a new one now and what most people try to do is keep parts or the whole of their old life going while navigating this new reality and so for instance you were

in a position when you were debt free and had a hundred grand in the in the bank and y'all made $200,000 a year to fully fund your kids college. That's a dream you'll have. It's a priority for you. If you can't afford it, though, you can't afford it. And that's a hard conversation with your kid. That's what I'm talking about. Yeah. And, you know, the third month, not the third year. Right. I sue State Farm and I move out of a hotel. The third month. And if I have to pay for nursing home for the 92-year-old neighbor, just to make me feel good about that. I will or maybe not. Or I go to my church and say, maybe I can't do this. I thought I could help this guy. I can't help this guy anymore. I'm not in a position because only the

strong can help the week. And right now our knees are broken and we can't do anything. And so, no, we can't pay for med school. And no, I'm not living in a hotel. And no, I'm not putting out requirements for a 92-year-old neighbor that caused me to go completely broke and lose everything I owned because I stayed in hotel two and a half years longer than I should have. So I think you've got to start putting some limitations on some of these things that you keep declaring as absolutes in this conversation. The absolute is we got to have a place to live and we got to keep our daughters healthy. And outside of that, I think everything's got to be back on the team. And $188,000 will do those things. Yeah. Without credit card debt and without parsing it out

and parsing it out and parsing it out and parsing it out. Yeah. So, and, you know, just if it's any consolation to you at Allstate Farm has a horrible reputation on claims, you're not the only one. so soothe her butt, but I'm not going to wait around on them to fix my life either. if you can cover the bills. There's nothing left over. You work your butt off and you still feel broke. That's normal for most people, but you do not have to live that way. You can completely transform your money and your life with every dollar. Our world-class budgeting app is better than ever. Now every dollar coaches you to find extra margin every month so you can make real progress and change your family tree. The average person finds $3,015 in just the first

15 minutes. That's extra money. You could use to beat debt, to build wealth, to finally breathe again. Don't settle for living normal with money. Start every dollar for free by downloading the app today. John, I came away from that last call, feeling like I was too tough on her, because she's been through a lot. Bless her heart. And, but there's some kind of a thing that I guess you can guide us through from a counseling perspective. I could do it almost from a business acumen perspective.

But when tragedy occurs, not if, in your life, it's going to have financial implications. Correct. How do you, because I meet people and she had done some of this. I mean, bless her heart, she's been through hell. It's awful, okay? And so I should have been probably more sympathetic. But there's something that happens, and I did it, I think. I think I did it during bankruptcy.

It gives us permission to be illogical. in setting boundaries for ourselves. You know, it's like, okay, this has happened. And so now all the rules don't count. Does that mean, you know what I'm saying? Totally. It's like a human nature thing. I can think of times I've done it too, so it's not just poor Kim with what the hell they've been through.

No, I've done it, yeah. But there's also how can we coach folks that are listening to say, okay, well, what should you do when tragedy occurs? somehow you've got to put you've got to truncate the you got to cut off the damage not expand the damage yeah the only path and i've i've wrestled with this for a couple of decades sitting with somebody whose life was going one way and it was often started with my college students like they would be having a plan to go do a thing and then mom would get cancer and they want to continue their degree in you know molecular biology but also and it's it always came back to hey hey everything in your life is different now and we have to start here and but i don't want to you're right it's not fair you're right

this shouldn't happen you're right and yet here we are so the old phrase is you have a new normal you have a new normal and so the only thing i've seen people do to be successful in my own life and folks i've sat with is this word that we have an allergy to in our society which is grief you have to spend some time just morning this thing is over now and now I have to move forward I wanted to pay for my kids college but now my husband had a stroke and we've got to pay hospital bills and I got to sit down with my sophomore in college and say this blows up your whole life and I'm so sorry but here's reality and instead of I wanted to take care of my 92 year old neighbor I wanted to what a noble amazing thing and suddenly I don't have any money I wanted I kept thinking I don't have a house right I kept I kept thinking that in in two more months they're going to get this thing rolling again and then two more months after four months three months six months I have to say there's nobody coming and we are racking up bill after bill at this hotel we sure is straight farming have to do something different yeah right and I was telling you off air I had a family member that lost their house in the Texas floods

they lived in a hunting trailer for months because that's all they had not because they're noble or tough for anything. It's all we had. Or the alternative is I have to put myself in jeopardy in my older age and run up a whole bunch of deaths. I'm never going to be able to pay off. And it's that the folks that I see are able to experience tragedy, which we all will. And we talk about resilience. We talk about growing from. Or there's a big word post-traumatic growth, right? Those that I see make that move are the ones who can sit in that exhale, grief and say everything's different now what's my next right move and if you can do that there's it's an amazing trajectory if you don't you drag that past and it's this weird i have permission to

just go buy that meal i have permission just to stay in this place for two and a half years i have permission to keep doing the awesome work i was doing with my elderly neighbor um even though reality says you can't afford it it's not going to happen yeah we're using her as an example of You're not picking on her. It's all of us. No, I wouldn't wish what she's experienced on anybody. Yeah, I do want to go back and, you know, lighten that up a little bit. But the lesson, because one of the reasons you should listen to the show is the lessons.

Right, right, right. Not just the entertainment value of people's stuff. But you ought to say, okay, what's a lesson I can take away so I don't end up there? Well, the lesson is you limit the financial impact of the tragedy by restarting your life. with a new definition quickly. As quickly as you can get there. Yeah. And sometimes you don't feel your way into that.

You start acting your way into that. The feelings will come later up and down like a roller coaster, but I'm going to make the next right move, which is. Okay, I'll give you an example. Here's what I do all the time. Okay. Have for 30 years. We're getting a divorce and the lady calls and says,

I make 30,000. He makes 100,000, and I want to keep the house for the kids. I don't want to disrupt their life. I don't want to disrupt the kid's life. A thousand times out of a thousand, I say, honey, you've got to sell the house. Because the life you used to have is no more. You no longer have a $130,000 income. You have a $30,000 income.

Right. And you can't afford this house. The kids are already disrupted. Everything's disrupted. It's called divorce. Right. And so they're restarting. The best thing you can do for them is to restart them on solid ground, not a sinking ship.

And you're trying to keep this house as a sinking ship. Right. So restart, reset your vision of your life. And that's a little miniature one-off version of what we're talking about. Or we talked to folks all the time who I was making $120,000. My company did layoffs. And now I'm in month nine with no income. And they'll spin up a lot of activity.

I've got on LinkedIn and sent out 10,000 resumes via email. No one's getting back to me. So I think, yeah, when you're going back to that reality. Exactly. So when you are restarting, one of the things you have to do is take inventory of what is still there. What is still here? The income, this is the income that I do have. And this is, I have, you know, it's almost like count your blessings. Yeah. Okay. Here's what I do have to work with as opposed to what I used to have to work with. And what I do have is a situation in Texas where everybody got wiped out at once in that area. So finding a contractor, dadgum, near. impossible. That's right. And so I don't have a an overabundance of contractors to work with. Right. Okay. I don't have that. And so what do I have? I got a hunting trailer. I got an old hunting trailer with an air conditioner. I plug it in and we're going to make a go of it. And until we can

get the contractors to show up because everybody else is in line. And I can tell you this. there are, the city of New Orleans was virtually destroyed a couple of decades ago by a hurricane called Katrina. And there are Cajun restaurants all over the United States today from people who left New Orleans because they had to start over. Yeah. And they couldn't start over there. I was in Houston. So many people came and said, new restaurant, man, we got to start here because my home doesn't exist anymore. Yeah. My life as I knew it before, I have to restart. And in some cases, it's pull up stakes. and go to a whole other area. That's right.

Is that fun? No. Do you lose your family heritage? Yes. Is it a nut? Do you weep? Yes. And this thing reality just keeps chugging along.

Math doesn't change. And it's hard. And so if you're in the middle of a storm, like poor Kim has gone through multiple storms at once. Like the perfect storm is awful. The only thing we can tell you is take stock of what you do have, not what you used to have. And reset a new vision. that fits within those numbers. And the other stuff is you have to sadly say no to.

That's right. I can't live in this area anymore. You can't go to this school anymore. I can't take care of this anymore. I can't do this. And you're going to have a whole lot of can'ts. And that's what I mean by truncating. You're going to have to stop doing some things that you used to were able to do in order to create a new life with the new limitations and in the new situation that is healthy and that doesn't follow your own.

Because if you don't, you end up with two decades to clean up the mess. The tragedy goes on indefinitely. Until you stop. Until you stop. Yeah. Trying to recreate the old life. Yeah. And this happens if there's an...

It's not fair, by the way. It's not. It's not fair. No. And this happens if you have an affair in your marriage. This happens if you lose a job. It happens to all of us multiple times throughout our lives. The quicker you can exhale, sometimes getting out a pen and a piece of paper.

what is true mathematically what's true what do I have what am I grateful for I got a I got a trailer in the back I'm going to have to move in there and then that's the ash with which you plant the tree and man new trees can grow but you got to plant them in soil of reality Many of you listen to the Ramsey show because you're sick and tired of getting nowhere with your money. You work too hard to live paycheck to paycheck with no money in the bank. But here's the deal. Just listening to the show won't change that. If you want different results, you have to do something different.

We've helped millions of people save money, ditch debt, and build wealth. And you can too. But you've got to have a game plan, and that begins with our get started assessment. Go to Ramsey Solutions.com slash start now, take the free quiz, and get your free step by step action plan. If you've had it with money stress and are ready to take control of your money for good, go to ramsysolutions.com slash start now. In the lobby of Ramsey Solutions on the debt-free stage, Ryan and Amber are with us. Hey, guys, how are you? Doing great. Welcome, welcome. Where do y'all live?

Spring Grove, Minnesota, southeast Minnesota. Cool. Welcome to Tennessee. Good to have you. And all the way here to do a debt-free scream. How much have you paid off? $180,000. Very cool. Over 32 months.

32 months. And your range of income during that two and a half years? Started at 140 and got up to $180. Cool. What do y'all do for a living? I'm a construction superintendent for a general contractor. And I do ultrasounds. Oh, very cool.

Good for y'all. Very good. So what kind of debt was the $180? It's our house. Oh, look at it weird people. Young weird people. Paid off a house early. I love it.

Yep. So what's this house worth? We're selling right now and be right around $300. Good for you guys. Way to go. And how much you guys got in your nest eggs already? Your 401 case and stuff. It's a little over $200 right now.

All right. So you're about halfway to a millionaire already. And you're what, 30? How old are you? 28 and 27. There it is. Not even 30. Wow.

You all didn't get the memo. You're not allowed to do that anymore. You're not able to do that anymore. Yeah, it's different to be weird. But it's right. Well, congratulations. How long have you all been married? Four years.

Okay. And two and a half of that, you've been tearing into this mortgage. Yeah. So tell us the story. How did you get tied into Ramsey? My first employer had smart dollars, so got tied into that, and then followed the baby steps from there. So we originally bought the house

And we were working on like side projects in the house There's a little fixer-upper Working on our side projects And then the spring came around Like a year and a half into buying the house And we wanted to do some siding exterior updates And I was like, so we had some money set aside for that And I was like, ah, let's just pause on that

Let's pay the house off So actually it was What was it for the months that we paid it off? It was 13 months We paid off $132,000. So we just paused all our projects and then put 132 away in 13 months. Whoa. That last year was really intense.

Yeah. Very nice. Okay. I want to get to these projects. So we're knocking this puppy out. Yeah. Yeah. Wow.

Very cool. Yeah. I wasn't on board at first entirely. I really want to do that siding. But there's a point where it was projects that we needed to have done and projects that we didn't need to have done. And when we sat down and Ryan's like, this is how much we're spending on interest. It's like, oh, my.

gosh it's just insane eye opening up over the life of the loan how much you would pay you all don't realize it yet because you've been married four years but most couples get to the oh I didn't know we could get through this after a major crisis and you all decided early on let's tackle a big

monumental thing that nobody else is doing together y'all don't know this yet but you all have proven to yourselves there's not a thing that the two of us can't lock arms and and tackle together over the course of entire marriage together. It's so, I'm, I'm a smile all day because this is awesome. This is fantastic, man. Yeah, there's so many good things that have happened to you, what you've become while

you're doing this. So proud of you. Have you all got the siding done since you all paid it off? No, that's the next spring thing. First, I upgraded my car. I was driving at 08 Impala. It had, what, 210,000 miles on it. That thing was so loud. It was very embarrassing, but you learn not to care what people think. I love it. So, yeah, you needed a car. Yeah. I'm glad you did that. So first goal was that. Then we'll do the siding next spring. And so we just start laying out, now that we don't have payment in the world, we start laying out goals and knocking down goals, right? Yeah, exactly. Travel, car, siding, whatever it is, right? Amber, let me ask you this. Okay, I've had projects that start burning a hole. Every time I

pull in the driveway, that's all I see. I don't see the house. I don't see my wife kids. I just see that. But when you grind out another goal, I stop seeing it all the time. Right. Has it become less a burr in your soul? Yeah, it's like, it's worth it. It's like the house is paid for now. And I can wait a year on sighting. It's okay.

Yeah. Yeah. Very good. Way to go, you guys. All right, what do you tell people that are 25 years old and they want to pay off their house? It can't be done. America is dead. The capitalism is killing everyone.

It's a systemic problem. We're all stuck. Oh, wait a minute. And hold my beer, Ryan and Ember just paid off their house at 28 years old. What do you tell them the key to getting out of debt is? I would say by far the biggest key is to just forget what other people think about you. It's your own money. You're working hard for it.

Live your own life. Live your own goals. I think we were listening to the podcast a couple weeks back, and Jade said it best. She said, the biggest superpower you can have with money is not caring what other people think. That's so true. So you did have some other people that had some thoughts, huh? Oh, yeah. Yeah.

You definitely get weird looks, that's for sure. Yeah, because people know that y'all aren't starving, right? They know y'all are doing well, and then they can hear your car coming nine miles away. And they're like, hey, you know, you can get a new car. And it's hard. I mean, the temptation is definitely hard, but, I mean, at the end of the day, it's worth it. Because when you're making that kind of money, you can literally, on the way home, pull into a dealership and go home with a new car that day. Right.

With just a signature, right? and to just go home and grind it out. That's so cool, man. Who taught you both? Because this is a, and again, I'm kind of hijacking this call. I'm this conversation. Who taught y'all to sit down together and to say, I want this? And the other person say, well, I want this.

And we're going to talk about this not as enemies, but as, okay, we both want different things, but we're going to come to some sort of solution. that had to have been modeled somewhere for you or y'all just are you all even weirder than paid off house people where'd you'll get that from did your parents model that for you my parents definitely did for me yeah

yeah I'd say our parents were big models and that and somebody once told me it's not you and him it's not you versus him in a problem it's you and him versus the problem ta-da ta-da there it is right there people told me a lot of stuff when I was 24 I didn't listen to him

man that's so amazing That's good. That's very good. Well done, you guys. All right. So the secret is not caring what other people think that. Absolutely. And then that frees you up to just do what you think and decide who gets a vote. And if it's not one of us, nobody else gets a vote. So who was cheering you on? Lots of friends, coworkers, parents, of course. Our biggest thing is probably just how competitive we are, though. Because we, Dave, not to make you as an insult, but we would call each other Daveish if one of us started slacking. Oh, you're an ish. It's like a Dr. Zeus character. You're an ish.

Don't be an ish. It's just a wish. Yeah. I like it. That's good. Y'all are the only ones in America that uses the name. That's mean. He uses Dave as an insult.

So. Ish. You're a good company. That's good. I like it. I like it. I'll take it. My name gets used a lot of other ways.

I was going to say, y'all are the only ones that use Dave as an insult. That's at least a positive methodology. I'll go with that. Yeah. Good job, you guys. That's very, very, very good job. So when your mom and dad actually realize you're actually doing this, what did their face look? I mean, like, Mom, we just wrote the last check.

We're done. So my dad, I would meet him every week for lunch, and it'd always tell him, like, where we're at. And he'd be like, oh, I'm so proud of you. Like, that was huge just to have that reinforcement all the time. But my parents actually paid their house off in four years. So I was kind of like, we got to beat that four years. Oh, you are competitive. Dad.

Nah, na, nah, nah. Yeah, I like that. Very good. Gosh, can I just say this to all the dads out there? How proud is he of that? You want to have an amazing daughter that grows up into an amazing woman? Have lunch with her every week and never let her leave a table without you look at her in the eyes and saying, I'm proud of you. Yeah.

That's huge. That's huge. That's a superpower. I mean, your dad gave you everything. And you got to, man, you're going to have to get pants to go all the way to the floor now, dude, because you've got yourself a rock star you're married to. It's amazing. It's amazing. All right, you guys.

I'm proud of y'all. We're proud of you, too, just like your dad is. So proud of you, man. Ryan and Amber from Minnesota, $180,000 paid off in 32 months, house and everything. They're not even 30, and they're already halfway to be in Baby Steps Millionaires. They'll be there in about 20 minutes at this rate. Megan 140 up to 180. Count it down.

Let's hear a debt-free scream. Three, two, one. We're death-free! Yeah! Yeah, baby! That's how it's done. I'm going to be able to be. Our scripture of the day, Matthew 10.14, if anyone will not welcome you or listen to your words, leave that home or town and shake the dust off of your feet.

Thomas Sowell said, you can't stop people from saying bad things about you. All you can do is make them liars. That's pretty good. As you well know, by now, the Fed has dropped rates and mortgage. rates have followed slightly, they drop them slightly, and mortgage rates have followed a little bit. 5.7.1 right now for a 15-year fixed. If you're financially ready, now's a great time to buy or sell. Buying or selling an affordable home you love is possible when you work with a Ramsey trusted real estate agent. These pros are handpicked to guide you through the market and keep your financial goals top of mind. Find a trusted local pro for free at ramsysolutions.com slash agents or click the link in the show notes lanes in ohio hi lane how are you good how are you better than

i deserve what's up so me and my fiancee were 21 and 22 so let's live with our parents uh we're looking to move out probably in May when she graduates college and uh we don't really know if we should buy a car for her first or wait until we buy a house but i don't know if we buy a car if we'll have 20% down for a house. You can wait on the house. You need to get a car first. It's okay. It's okay to rent an apartment for a year,

and you guys save up some money, and if you use part of the money you've saved to buy her a car for cash, then you need to replenish that for your down payment fund to be full again. If that takes a year and you rent a little apartment for a year, that is not going to set you back in your life. You're going to be fine.

Okay. Do you, should we put 20% down on our house, or should we just do an FHA one? Well, FHA has MIP, which is much like PMI. PMI's private mortgage insurance. Mortgage insurance premium is what MIP stands for. And FHA is a much more expensive loan in all the fees and the interest rates than a conventional loan. So if you have the ability to put together 20% on your first home, you're better off to do. a conventional loan than an FHA loan.

But you don't have to worry about that right now for about almost two years from right now. Because she's graduating in May. You're getting married then, sounds like. And then we're going to get her a car and then we're going to rent for a year. And that puts you almost two years from now. Yeah. The thing you need right now is one of the fruits of the spirit, a healthy dose of patience, man. You want to give her the world.

You want to give her everything. And I love that. But slow down. Yeah. It's going to be good, man. Back it, back it off. Slow your roll. Nicky's in California. Hey, Nikki, how are you? Hi, John, I, Dave. Thanks for taking my call. Sure. What's up? I'm calling because my husband and I are in a little over $300,000 worth of debt. About 120 of it is IRS debt. and my fault, but I know you say, you know, do whatever you need to do to break away from the IRS. They sent notices for liens and levies and all that.

So we set up a payment plan, but I am wondering how desperate we need to get in this situation. Very. What's your household income? Uh, make about 350,000. Okay. Why, pray, tell, do you owe the IRS 120 then? Well, okay, so I was previously divorced, um, and at that time, I'm a nurse now. I'm making money now, but at that time I was not.

I had three kids. I literally just put my head down and worked and worked and worked just to keep a loop over our head. I did not file taxes probably for about four years. Okay, and now you've gone back, you've gotten remarried, and now you've gone and filed. Yes, I went and filed, and then our income together is just way too much, so obviously we owed that first year, so yeah. Yeah, okay. And what's the rest of the $300,000 in debt? So we've got about 100 in student loans, and the rest of it is credit cards and personal loan.

Okay. Okay. All right. And so you've got $80,000 in credit card debt? Yep, about that. How long have you been married? We just got married in 23, June of 23. Okay. And who brought the credit card debt? Well, so, I mean, we both had some. I had gone to... Has it continued to grow after you got married?

Oh, no. We've been paying it down since. So we've gotten rid of several. All right. So here's where we are today. Today you make $350,000. You've got $300,000 in debt. And what part of California do you live in? The Bay Area, the most expensive part. Yes, absolutely. You do. Okay. All right. And how much is your house payment? $5,000. And what's your house worth? About 780

We just bought it in 23 So we bought it for 750 That's probably worth more than 780 then If you bought it in 23 Oh that's with Zillow Well Zillow Zillow says Okay

Yeah So let's go with 900 And what do you owe on the house About 620 maybe Okay All right So you guys are living right on the edge on everything.

Everything's got a payment on it. Everything's locked down. We make $350,000 and we feel broke. Pretty much. Yeah. Okay. And it's not a super expensive house for San Francisco. I mean, that's a cheap house, really, right?

Yeah. Yeah. What do you do for a living? You're a nurse. What's he do? He's a manager. A manager. okay all right well uh what i'm going to do is buckle down and live on nothing pretend like i am

broke because you are and i'm going to cut up all the credit cards we're not going to use them anymore we're going to a written budget every month you and your husband you don't make 350 000 you make 50 000 and you need to pay off 300 worth of debt or you make 100 000 and you're going to pay off 250 000 worth of debt and be debt free in about two years you're going to pay off 250 000 worth of debt and be debt free in about two years starting with the blessed IRS and then work your way through a debt snowball on the other stuff after you get rid of the IRS. But you guys need to go pay them like your hairs on fire and get them out of your life because the penalties and the interests that they're charging you are the worst on the

planet and they have almost unlimited power to come and mess with your life. Even when you're on a payment plan, they might make a clerical error and put a lien on your house even though you're on a payment plan they can if they want to and so what i want you to is get them out of your life like your life depended on it so i think what's happened is is you guys are living a bay lifestyle and you're eating up your 300 grand and you're not making much progress on this debt and i want you to live a lifestyle as if you lived somewhere else and didn't have a life because you don't, you're broke, act like it, and attack this debt with a vengeance. Yeah, and I hear in your story, Nikki, and even in your voice, that fear of that single mom

who has just put her head down and try to keep a roof over the head of her babies during a really chaotic time, it would be easy to say you shouldn't have spent all that, yada, yada, I just want to say I'm proud of you for getting through that four years, and it's easy to think I got my degree, I'm a nurse, I married a guy who makes a good income together, we have a good income, and to take your foot off the gas. And I want you to let that woman who's been grinding it out finally be free. And that means you got two years of hitting the gas. And I'm telling you on the other side of this, with nothing but a house payment making $350,000, you are going to finally feel that piece you've been craving for so many years. But there's no other way than through this.

thing. So just get through it as fast as you possibly can. No restaurants, no fancy cars, and everyone's going to be like, I thought you were, yep, as for me and my house, we will not be owned by anybody. And I'll say it again, there's only one way through it, only one way and that's through it. Just get through it as fast as you possibly can. A Puzzle Sour the Ramsey Show in the books. We'll be back with you before you know it. In the meantime, remember, there's ultimately only one way to financial peace, and that's to walk daily. With the Prince of Peace, Christ Jesus.