The Ramsey Show - Your Financial Journey Is a Marathon, Not a Sprint

Episode Date: March 5, 2025

📈 Are you on track with the Baby Steps? Get a Free Personalized Plan Dave Ramsey & Rachel Cruze answer your questions and discuss: "What should I do with my late daughter's estate?" "How would you handle the national debt?" "I'm nervous to combine finances with my fiancé" "Should I upgrade my car to impress the ladies?" "Balancing the Baby Steps with mental health". Support Our Sponsors: 🌱 Get 10% off your first month of BetterHelp 🏥 Learn more about Christian Healthcare Ministries 🏡 Get started today with Churchill Mortgage 🔒 Get 20% off when you join DeleteMe 🏦 Go to FAIRWINDS Credit Union for an exclusive account bundle! 🥗 Save 15% on your first Field of Greens order with code RAMSEY ⛨ Find top Health Insurance Plans at Health Trust Financial 💸 To find out more about student loan refinancing, check out Laurel Road 💻 Visit NetSuite today to learn more 🗂️ Use promo code RAMSEY for 18% off at The Nokbox 💵 Learn more about Timothy Plan 🏛 Get started with YRefy or call 844-2-RAMSEY 🔐 Visit Zander Insurance for your free instant quote today! Next Steps 📱 Watch the full episode for free in the Ramsey Network app. 📞 Have a question for the show? Call 888-825-5225 Weekdays from 2-5pm ET or click here! 📖 Preorder Build a business You Love today. 💵 Start your free budget today. Download the EveryDollar app! 🎟️ Get tickets to Investing Essentials and learn to invest with confidence. ❤️ Get Tickets to the Money & Relationships Tour Listen to more from Ramsey Network 🎙️ The Ramsey Show   🧠 The Dr. John Delony Show 🍸 Smart Money Happy Hour 💡 The Rachel Cruze Show 💸 The Ramsey Show Highlights 💰 George Kamel 🪑 Front Row Seat with Ken Coleman 📈 EntreLeadership Learn more about your ad choices. https://www.megaphone.fm/adchoices Ramsey Solutions Privacy Policy

Don't miss our virtual event happening tonight. I'm sharing my personal playbook for investing and real estate. Get your ticket at ramsysolutions.com slash events. Music Music Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, it's the Ramsey Show, where we help people build wealth, do work that they love, and create actual amazing relationships. I'm Dave Ramsey, your host, Rachel Cruz, number one bestselling author, Ramsey personality, co-host of the Smart Money Happy Hour with Mr. George Campbell on the Ramsey Networks and my daughter.

She's my co-host today. Open phones at 888-825-5225. LaTonya is with us in Michigan. Hey LaTonya, welcome to the Ramsey Show. Hi Dave and Rachel, Thank you for having me. Sure. What's up? I, um, was calling to ask, um, me and my boyfriend have been together for about,

um, two years. He was there, um, in Springfield in Spring Hill, Tennessee, and I live in Michigan. And we discussed getting married. Um, and he has plans on relocating to Michigan but he's not willing to relocate without securing a job first and he's been applying but his lease ends in June and I'm just wondering if you think it's a good idea to wait for him to secure a job to come to Michigan to find a place together or if I should

move out. I live with my dad, me and my daughter moved in after I got divorced and so I was just wondering what you both think. So I'm a little bit confused. So he's, do I think he ought to come to Michigan without a job? Is that the question? Well no he doesn't. Well I'm asking if you think I should move out of my dad's house like before he secures a job here or if I should just wait until he does secure a job here and me and him move in somewhere together? Well I think you know you're asking me so I'm gonna tell you I would get married before I move in together. Well before you move

in together. Yes like but once he comes. Yeah. Are you engaged? No. Okay. He hasn't asked me. Okay. Well, we're getting these things out of order as far as I'm concerned. I'm an old-school guy. So, um, my daughter is sitting next to me. If my daughter called me like this, I'd be going, oh no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. We're gonna get these things in the right order. Okay. And so we're gonna say these things in the right order okay and so we're gonna say okay what you said you have a you said you have a daughter yes okay you would not tell her to move in with a guy that she wasn't married to would you know I would tell her to get married first but that that is our. It's just like, I live with my dad and I've been living with him. We're not engaged.

Might be your plan, it ain't his. Yeah. So, I think what's, so to answer your question, just like point blank and then maybe we can kind of backpedal and talk through more of the why, but no, I would stay, are you paying rent with your dad or are you just living there? No. Okay, so I would live there with your daughter. He needs to come move rent somewhere, find a job.

Once he's stable or feels, you know, well enough to be able to say, okay, yes, now we're gonna get engaged. You guys have been dating for a long period of, you know, two years, you're both adults. You probably know, yeah, we can make this engagement faster. We don't have to be engaged for three years, right? We can have a wedding,

it may not be an extravagant wedding, but we'll get married. And then the next step then would be, okay, now we have formed a family unit and we're gonna live as that. And I think the problem is so often, we fast forward that process. And what's difficult too,

is we have found over and over and over and over again, and even more recent research has come out to show like even from, not even from a financial perspective, but just a quality of life perspective, the happiness among couples is higher with those who actually didn't even live together before married, married and then lived together

than those that lived together even before. And so, you just see all of this play out and I think too what's hard is we see the other end of that. We get the calls of people that- Everything screwed up. Everything messed up and you move in together and then he can't find a job and it's been a year and you're starting to pay his bills.

It just gets real messy real fast. And so from a relational and financial perspective, the cleaner those lines can be, honestly, it makes the process smoother. And it may not be like what everyone does or fill in the blank, but it does. It makes the process again, from a relational and a financial perspective, um, smoother.

So no, I would not move out of your dad's place. I think, you know, you probably have a great setup there. If you wanted to move out with your daughter and rent somewhere on your own, you could, but I would say, I would say put, let him move here, figure out the job and the place to live. And then, um, and that could all happen in a short period of time. I mean, he could get a job, he could get a job, you could get engaged,

you could get married and rent an apartment and move out. I mean, that could all happen in the next nine months, you know, six months. It could happen in one month. It wouldn't, I mean, if he got the job and moved up there and got married, you know, that doesn't have, it doesn't require this lengthy process.

But no, I would definitely not move out of your dad's place into an apartment with an unemployed guy who I'm not married to. No, that just, as Rachel said, that sounds like no fun at all. There's nothing in there that sounds fun from an old dad perspective. You know what I mean, really, that's just like,

no, daughter, don't do that. So for your sake, for the sake of your kid, you just went through hell with a divorce. I mean, on. So last thing we want to do is sign up. Let's just say, all right, get a job, get engaged, get married, and that can all happen in you know a 10-day period of time. I don't care, get an apartment and move in. That's just line the dominoes up and push them down. You know that's, but yeah there's, and I appreciate he doesn't want to come back there until he has something to come back to, job wise.

Sure, absolutely. That's responsible on his part. So, very, very good stuff. Open phones here at 888-825-5225. Rachel Cruz, Ramsey Personality is my co-host. George Camel and I did the first night of the Investing Essentials last night if you're listening to this live and today... It went great. It was a great night. George did an amazing job. The other guy I don't know... He's still out. He's struggling.

They'll put a survey out to the audience and let them grade. They will? Yeah, well you've done. I'll feel better when I don't look at that. Okay. So last night was night one of our virtual event, Investing Essentials. We covered all investing principles. We went deep into the mutual fund discussion, talked about all the traps and the bad stuff. Tonight we're going to do, and it's primarily me tonight is gonna do,

I'm gonna open my playbook on real estate. And here's how I decide to buy a piece of real estate. Here's what I want it to look like. And if you're wanting to learn how to invest in real estate, we're gonna go into more detail than you would want. I'm gonna nerd out. We're gonna unpack all the math formulas. We're gonna show you how it's really done in the big leagues

and not on Tic Tac. And so the guys on Tic Tac. And I would say, if people didn't know, a little insight, if you weren't doing what you're doing, you'd be in real estate full time. It's what you were doing before you were doing this. But you love, like real estate's your next love. You love all of this.

But your next love is, I mean, you love real estate. Oh, I've got a degree in real estate. I had an hour meeting with your husband who runs our real estate today. Winston's always like. We're looking at a piece of ground to develop right now. I mean, I had an hour meeting on it husband who runs our real estate today. Winston's always like... We're looking at a piece of ground to develop right now. I mean, I had an hour meeting on it this morning. I love it.

Winston will say, my favorite Dave is real estate Dave. He just gets like real like... He gets excited about it. You love it. And so you're one of the best teachers on the planet for it. So it's fantastic. And we actually do it. It's not theory.

So we own about 600 million worth. So if you want to talk about real estate, we're going to do that tonight. Go to ramsaysolutions.com, tickets are 199 and slash events at ramsaysolutions.com. Get your ticket, join us this evening. If you're late hearing this, there might be a way for you to do it anyway. I don't know, figure all that out,

but we're gonna put the material out there so you guys can get helped. This is the Ramsey Show. You know, one of the first things I discovered working in the financial world is how absolutely devastating it is when the breadwinner of a family dies and there's too little life insurance or none at all. Grieving families are suddenly left behind scrambling to pay bills and trying to make ends meet.

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you need them. Zander is the real deal and that's why they've handled all my personal insurance for over 25 years. I trust them and you can too. Visit zander.com for instant online quotes or for a more personal touch give them a call at 800-356-4282 Rachel Cruz, Ramsey personality, number one bestselling author as my co-host today. Shante is in Atlanta. Hi Shante, how are you? I'm doing well, how are you doing? Better than I deserve.

What's up in your world? Okay sir, about a year ago my daughter was killed in a murder suicide by her husband. Whoa. I'm trying to get through this. I'm so sorry. I have custody of my grandchildren. They left three children, one he had from a previous marriage, but I have two, which was theirs.

Wow. Because of this, they have a house in Texas. I've been paying on this house for almost a year. I'm trying to figure out if I should keep paying for it because it has to go through probate or continue to take care of myself and pay off my debt, which I have a student loan that is about $80,000, but I had to put that on pause in order to take care of the house. What is the house worth? Well, according to a young man I had to go evaluate it, it has a little over $100,000 to $130, hundred in equity a hundred thousand to a

hundred and thirty in equity why is the probate not clear a year later in Texas well I believe that's my fault because I'm living here in Atlanta and the houses in Texas so I had to travel back and forth of course to take care of things there and the babies are with you now. It was hard to find a lawyer. The babies are with you now in Atlanta, right? Yes. It was hard to find a lawyer. Well, $100,000 is a great part-time job. Sir? I said, making $100 thousand dollars for your new part-time job called getting this house probated and sold. That's a nice part-time job a hundred grand. I'm already twenty thousand dollars in and I'm getting

nervous. You're missing my point. If you sell the house you get a hundred thousand dollars in your pockets what you told me right? Yes. Ain't nothing else you're doing gonna pay you that. So I'm gonna make this a priority. But you're twenty thousand dollars in meaning from lawyer fees, travel, all of that. That's what you're saying and you're like I'm nervous. No, you've been paying the payment. Yes, taking care of the house, making sure it's still used. Yeah.

Yeah, you need to go, you need to, do you have any time off available from work or have you used it all up with this tragedy? Okay, I'm also a caretaker from my mother-in-law, so I'm home. So you're married? Yes sir. Okay, listen to me, if I waive a hundred thousand dollar check under your nose and say go get it, that's where you're sitting. You need to go get the hundred thousand dollars, which means you need to prioritize and say someone else

take care of mother-in-law for a week. I'm gonna haul my butt over to Texas, get a lawyer, get this thing run through probate, get it on the market with a real estate agent, get it sold, put $100,000 in my pocket for the good of you, your family, and these babies. Okay, may I say something else, sir? Sure. Okay, so when it goes through probate, a lot of the fees will eat into that, am I correct? There's not any big fees in probate in Texas. Okay. No big deal. Okay. It's a few hundred dollars to get a lawyer and get the thing before the judge. Tell the lawyer to tell the judge the story.

This is a tragedy. These children, these babies are dependent upon this asset to take care of them with their granny who's taken them in. We need to fast track this thing right down the rails. Judge and the judge will go, oh yeah, yeah I'm gonna take care of this one this one ain't dragging out stamp stamp stamp boom houses on the market and you're out of here Texas is not a difficult Texas is not a difficult state okay I mean I've been I call like ten lawyers hopefully I found

one hopefully I have not paid the fee. Okay, here's what I want you to do. Let's stop, let me help you. I'll guide you through it. But what I need you to do is make this a huge priority. If I told you I would hire you for one week and pay you $100,000 and you had to go to Texas for one week, you would go do that.

Yes, sir. That's what's in front of you. Okay, so I want you to go to ramsysolutions.com. I want you to find one of our smart vest, I mean one of our ELPs for real estate, our Ramsey Trusted Real Estate ELPs. What city in Texas is this? It's a city called Temple Texas. Alright, and what's that outside of? I believe, oh my gosh. What's it close to? Because I don't know that one.

What? Austin. Austin is like an hour and a half away. Alright, so I want you to get one of the Ramsey Trusted Real Estate agents, I want you to get on the phone with them today. I want you to ask them to help you find a probate attorney. Tell them this story. They will help you run this to ground. They can help you find an attorney. You can get on the phone with an attorney and the real estate agent will help you if you're going to list the

house with them, right? Yes. They'll know somebody in the area and they'll know an attorney that does probate work and the probate attorneys know the judge in probate they can pick up the phone and call the judge and go look here's what we got we got these two babies in a murder-suicide horrible situation and when these babies are about to lose their only asset if we don't get this done because granny lives over in Atlanta and can't get this household judge we need a little help and boom we're gonna get this household, Judge we need a little help and boom we're gonna get this thing done girl. Well thank you Dave, I hope so. You know you're gonna get it done. I'm saying you you're gonna lean into it. This is your new part-time job that

pays a hundred thousand dollars. This is your part-time job that pays a hundred thousand dollars and this is more important than taking care of your mother-in-law for the next week. When you say, when you say... Believe me, I've been there five times trying to get this done. Yeah. Believe me. So I'm curious what the, what you said, you know, I've been trying, you've been down there five, what holdups are you finding?

Like what are they telling you? Trying to find, trying to find them. I believe I found a lawyer finally. I paid the fees. I haven't heard from them yet, unfortunately. I don't know what's been done. How long ago was this? Right. About a month ago. Your jobs call them every day till they get their finger out of their ear. Okay. Yeah, okay. This is like my tenth lawyer. I'm telling you I've been trying. Okay. All right. You hang on or you jump on Ramsey Solutions, I'm

sorry, and get a hold of one of the real estate agents to see if you can get some help over there. Because the thing is your job is put pressure, heavy pressure, on this whole situation so that it spits out a hundred thousand dollar check. And you've kind of hit or miss, well the lawyer didn't do it, and well I did it a month ago and I hadn't followed up. See, you're not putting the pressure on.

I want you to put the pressure on, be mama bear. I want you to lean in and take care of this situation. Which too, no fault to you two. I mean this happened a year ago. I'm like, lean in and take care of this situation. Which too, no fault to you two, I mean this happened a year ago. I'm like you're probably coming out of this fog. I mean I can't even imagine. I can't imagine how much pain is involved. I mean it's just, yeah.

I'm like there's so, there's so much. But I hope this call for you gave you more of the confidence and the motivation to say, okay I am doing the right thing and push forward. Cause sometimes, and I could feel this, like you hear probate, you hear, I mean, it's a very intimidating idea. If you don't deal with lawyers

and you don't deal with judges on a regular basis, right? I'm like, there's a level where this can feel very intimidating and you almost can outsource it, which I think is what she's done. She's yielded a lot to these lawyers, but what you're giving her the permission and the mandate is to be like,

you can, you can, not that you can quote unquote do more, but like you can step into this role with more aggression. And that's, and you should. Most lawyers need, desperately need someone to tell them what to do. Often, often. And that's like my goal in life is to tell lawyers what to do often you need to boss them around they're not used to it and it's really

good for them when somebody finally does it so and it's good for you because this needs to get done this needs to get done because you're paying a payment that they're sitting there eating you alive instead of blessing you and it's's eating these, you know, when it's eating you alive, it's affecting these babies instead of blessing them. This a hundred thousand dollars to go a long way to take care of your family and therefore you being able to take care of these babies. I'm so sorry y'all been through this Shanta. It's horrible, but get one of the real estate agents over in the area to help you run point on

this. And then you lean into it. Growl mama bear go get them there's a hundred thousand dollar check laying there don't let anybody keep you from it go get it go get it don't walk away from this this is the Ramsey Show. There's a time in your life and in the baby steps for renting but you don't want to do it forever because when you rent you're still paying for a mortgage just somebody else's. Plus rent means instability in your budget because it always goes up never down. So when you're ready to buy make sure you work with a mortgage partner you can rely on. Churchill Mortgage. Churchill is Ramsey

trusted to help you make the move from renting to home ownership wisely. Churchill understands that when you buy a home the Ramsey way, your mortgage payment will be a consistent, manageable part of your monthly budget. Plus, when your home is paid off, that was your largest expense. Now it's extra money in your pocket and an asset towards turning you into a baby steps millionaire. So get started on the American dream of home ownership today at ChurchillMortgage.com. That's ChurchillMortgage.com.

This is a paid advertisement in MLS ID 1591 and MLS consumer access.org, Eagle Housing Lender 1749 Mallory Lane, Suite 100, Brentwood, Tennessee, 37027. Rachel Cruz, Ramsey Personality, Open Phone, is a 888-825-5225. Our question of the day is brought to you by Y-Refi, our defaulted private student loan payments dragging you down. Y refi can help you save thousands of dollars. Visit yrefi.com slash Ramsey. See how they can help. That's the letter yrefi.com slash Ramsey. Might not be in all states. Okay this is a funny one. I just read it. Today's question comes from Steve in Indiana. Would your snowball plan help get America out of $36 trillion of debt and how would you budget it?

I wish Trump had you on the Doge team. Yeah, no, I don't fit in with people that do stuff. No, I don't fit in in anything in D.C. It is kind of fun to watch them take a machete to the ridiculous spending. And you don't have to be of any political ilk to think that machetes to the ridiculous spending are necessary, this is out of control. For sure, I mean, it's a funny question,

but the truth is that running a government of any size, the state of Tennessee for instance, the last several governors I've been friends with and it's a different endeavor to run something like that than to run a business or run your personal account. The principle of being debt free still stands and it's a good principle and the principle of living on less than you make still stands and the principle of good management or good frugality still stands. So I mean I can give you an opinion but it's probably worth exactly what you paid for it.

I observed under, for instance, Bill Clinton was the last president that had a balanced budget that we actually did not run. I mean, he did it. Some say that he did some of that off of, I mean, the tax code that was in place at that point was put in place by Reagan. And so the lowered taxes, the Laffer curve, Art Laffer, famous for... Was the Reagan stuff all the way through? Wasn't Bush won and then Clinton? Yeah, yeah. But the, it was. But I mean, it was HW, I mean, H, you know, was running the

same camp, was running the same deal, except he raised taxes on one thing. And that got him baked. But the, anyway, politically, but the point being that there's, there's really good evidence that the Laffer curve is true. Art Laffer has the, it's, is known for the theory of as to a certain degree, as you lower taxes, the economy heats up because the people that are making money are putting money back into

their businesses and they make yet more money and they pay yet more taxes even though the rate is lower. Now there's a point of diminishing returns on the curve, it is a curve, it's not a straight line but if you lower taxes it heats up the economy and you end up collecting more revenue. So if you want to increase the federal government's income from taxes, income tax, then you would oddly enough lower taxes. It seems it seems oxymoronic. It actually does work. And so as the tax, you know, so if you want to get out of debt, one of the things we tell you to do is get an extra job, right? I mean increase your income

to get out of debt. So that would be part of the equation let's increase the income of the United States of America by increasing the revenues produced by the tax system by oddly enough lowering the tax rates to cause that to happen and stimulate the economy the and that does work and I mean people that have studied John Maynard Keynes and her socialists which John Maynard Keynes was a socialist Keynesian economics are taught in almost every economics class in professor land out there but I'm not a believer I'm an Adam Smith guy I'm a free market guy and I really do understand this stuff so

anyway all that to say you would increase the income and then of course you would do what Doge is doing, you cut the snot out of the expenses. So if you could ever get it right side up, where there was more income than outgo, in other words, there is no deficit. Not only is there no, because deficit means you're going in the hole every month.

And you gotta turn that to get out of debt. And then could you start to pay off the debt? Absolutely you could. And what's weird is the way that stuff works on a governmental level, it would happen. It would be really quick because of the way the thing would feed on itself. Because the other thing that's tied into this is there's what's called monetary policy, meaning that when the government takes a trillion dollars out of the economy by borrowing it, by issuing bonds to cover the deficit, that trillion dollars is not out there running around in the economy to stimulate the economy.

So when the government runs debt, it sucks the bone marrow out of the economy because it drops currency down. The amount of money that's moving around is shortened considerably. And when you start putting all that back, or when you just stop some bone marrow out, and then on top of that, you start putting some back into the economy, the thing could really heat up

and the revenues could go through the roof. You know, the thing could really heat up and the revenues could go through the roof. It could be rowdy. And so that's one set of theories that get you there. But this is the first time in my lifetime that I've seen anyone that had the political, didn't give a crap. The political don't give a crap in order to just walk in there with an axe and a machete and just start chopping down everything in sight. And it's, um, I didn't know if I'd ever see it. It truly had to be somebody that didn't care. Because it's so offensive.

Because it can't be elected again, so if you don't like it, screw you. You know? And it had to be somebody doing that because if anybody cares about being re-elected, then every little person you piss off by cutting one of these programs is a voter and you start worrying about being re-elected or not. But when you truly reach the point of I don't give a crap,

and apparently that's where this bunch is, I mean, it's interesting to watch. And by the way, that's also the thing that happens with individuals. You guys out there, when you guys get out of debt, you reach a point you don't care what your brother-in-law's opinion is about what you drive, because he ain't paying the payments anyway.

And he doesn't get a vote. And so you're gonna go do radical stuff to get your life back and get out of debt. And there is some correlation to this. Sure, sure. And that, it's interesting. It's an interesting discussion. Sure has got people, 44 days, 44 days he's been in office. This is wild. It's just wild. It's entertaining. Longest state of the union ever last night. Francisco is in Des Moines, Iowa. Hi Francisco. How are you?

Hey, Mr. Ramsey. Thank you for taking myines, Iowa. Hi Francisco, how are you? Hey, Mr. Ramsey, thank you for taking my call. Sure, what's up? Hey, so I have a question regarding a possible job change. So where I'm at, I currently make about 128,000 per year. I commute to work, so that translates to about 400 to 450 dollars per month in gas, and my insurance is pretty expensive where I'm at right now. The job offer that I got is where I live in town, and I would be saving an additional $750 per month.

My question is, is that enough to, I guess, warrant the job change? Me and my wife are currently on baby step number three. And we share that knowledge. I guess warrant the job change. Me and my wife are currently on baby step number three. You're making more money. If you're making more money and it's closer to home, what's the downside? The downside is as a body, auto body tech, work is pretty inconsistent here in town, but where I'm at, it's like, it's never dipped down. So that's the only thing that's kind of worrying me is like the possible, ruining possible steady flow of income. So you get paid by the job by the hour or not by,

so this might not be a raise. Actually, it is a $2 increase. I know, but if you get less work, the $2 doesn't matter. Exactly. That's kind of my concern. Have you asked around what people are getting? I mean, do you have a ballpark of like, yeah, this seems realistic and there's going to be high months, then there's going to be low months, but do you have a middle ground at

all from other people in the field? No, no, I don't really. How many people this place you're talking about going to employ in the field? No no I don't really. How many people this place you're talking about going to employ in your position? There's two other techs there. Are they staying busy? They're kind of for them yes when I talked to the general manager they're looking for someone that kind of can put out more volume to the techs they have right now or kind of just. Yeah but is he gonna is he promising you're gonna stay busy? He promised me that I was gonna stay busy.

He just didn't say for how long. Yeah, just tell him that he has to guarantee you financially that if we're not busy you're paying me anyway. And that takes the risk out of it. Negotiate a different deal with a potential employer. This is The Ramsey Show. This show is sponsored Ramsey Show. This show is sponsored by BetterHelp. Alright, so I was born and raised in Texas and I love the myth of the lone cowboy. You know, the guy who doesn't need anyone or anything. It's a fun story and it's a lie. In our self-obsessed society, we're

obsessed about our own diets, our own workout routines, our own jobs, our own social media feeds, everything. It's easy to forget that no one can do life alone. And I don't care if you're an introvert, an extrovert, or whatever you want to call yourself, we all have to have a community and a support system to do life with. It's time to shift the focus from doing it all by ourselves to knowing that we can only be well and whole when we ask for help. Therapy can be a great source of help and support for any area of your life.

And if you're thinking about starting therapy, try BetterHelp. BetterHelp is a hundred percent online therapy so it can fit with your schedule. To get started, just fill out a short online survey to get matched with the licensed therapist. And if it's not the right fit, you can switch therapists at any time for no extra cost. This month, start to build your support system with BetterHelp. Visit BetterHelp.com slash Deloney to get 10% off your first month. That's BetterHelp, H-E-L-P, dot com slash Deloney. Rachel Cruz, Ramsey Personality is my co-host today and they can is with us in

orlando i'm making welcome to ramsey show hi david thank you for taking my call sure what's up and that is so i've kind of gotten my self her my life into a big mess and I stumbled across your show and I'm trying to take steps to to get out of debt so I guess I would be in baby step too. Yes the problem I'm running into is before I came across your show me and

my fiance I, I was, I was really big on trying to get us to kind of put our money together and kind of tackle this together. Um, now that I've kind of came across that I learned it's a big no-no to put your money together before you are married. Um, and I am the breadwinner of our house. We have 10 people in my home. So between we have five children and and I just adopted my nephew and I have his big brother at my house too. So I'm feeling all of this pressure. I work two full-time jobs and I'm just trying to get control.

He works a full-time job at the hospital working on hospital equipment. Okay. And what does he earn? He annually probably about 50. And what do you earn? I want to say when I looked at his... Last year I made 160. Doing what now?

What do you do? I'm an ultrasound technician. You're working a lot then. Yeah, I do full-time nights and then I take call full-time days. So I pretty much do 24 hour shifts. So the two of you, and the two of you have five children? I had two from a previous marriage. Well, not marriage, just relationship. And then I put myself through school as a single mom and then I got my career and then I met him and

We got pregnant Quickly and and then since then we've been together for six years Okay, and you guys have three together and he's your fiance When are you planning to get married? Well at first like we put it on hold because my father fell ill and I was his caretaker. And then we just haven't done it. One, finances. I felt like it was silly to spend money for a wedding.

Let me ask you this. I'm just curious and I'm not trying to be sarcastic or anything, but you're functioning in every way almost as if you're married now and have been for some time. So what's the difference in that and getting married this weekend for $50? I'm scared because my... What are you scared of? You already have children, you live together, you support him. What is there to be scared of? My child from another relationship and my nephew that I just got custody of, they're not big fans of him. They're not what?

I don't know. They're not fans. Yeah, like I feel like there's red flags. They don't like him. They think I deserve better six years Yeah, two children Too late to ask some child their opinion of this guy Yeah, they don't get a we're in we're in we're in therapy together working on some relational issues Do you feel like you'll be with him long term? Do you want to marry him? I mean, most of the time I do feel like that, but it's more, we go through the motions of raising our kids.

So sometimes I wonder, like once the kids are grown up, the longevity, if that makes sense. Sometimes it feels like we're in this. You guys are fabulous can kickers. You've kicked the can, kicked the can, kicked the can, kicked the can, put it off, kicked the can, put it off, all these reasons and and then still functioning as if you're married. And the reason I'm bringing all this up is it's not working for you. I'm listening to you and there's no fun in your voice at all.

I think there's just a lot of fear. And I tell him a lot of pressure because he's coming to me now and he's like, okay, let's put our money together. And I'm like, we're not married. We're gonna get married is what we're gonna do. Or we're not gonna put our money together. And also, if I woke up in your shoes, what would I do?

That's how I answer questions here, okay? So my friend Henry Cloud is a famous psychologist and he wrote a book called Necessary Endings. And he says you end any relationship, whether it's your job, whether it's contact with an extended family who's toxic, whether it's a with an extended family who's toxic, whether it's a situation like you're in, whatever the relationship is,

you end it only when you lose hope that it can get better and be right. Does that make sense? And so I'm not going to be sitting here this time next year if I'm you in this exact same quandary wondering if this is going to be okay. We're going to get in there with this therapist and go, look, we're going to walk around this really, really hard for 90 days

and we're going to see some serious progress or I'm going gonna call this. Yeah, that scares you even more, doesn't it? It scares me because of the children. I don't want a broken home just because you're not. But you need to decide, don't you? This painter get off the ladder, right? Yeah, because you don't think the kids are suffering in this situation. Of course they're suffering. They're suffering from all this ambiguity. They don't know what the flip's going on because their mom doesn't know what the flip's going on because their mom doesn't know what the flip's going on and their dad doesn't know what the flip's going on. And we're all just running around in circles trying to make enough money and throw it in

the middle of a pot and we're in a little commune over here and it's not working relationally. Am I missing something? Yeah. I think I'm just afraid to get married and then he's... You're afraid of not getting married. You're afraid of getting married. Yeah, I just want to take care of my family and I think financial wise it makes sense for us to get married but...

No, it doesn't. Not if you're not going to be married. Because divorce is... I mean marriage is grand, divorce is fifty grand. No, we don't wanna go through that. But you guys relationally need to make a decision. Okay, are we the two adults in the household going to join forces and then take care of the little people? Or is it best for us and the little people to be separate? But if we're gonna join forces, we need to get six years and you guys are dancing and dancing and dancing and dancing and dancing it's you know because the other thing is you put all of your financial

dreams and everything on hold in the process too it's very difficult to make progress mathematically in this situation yes and that's why that's what that's what I'm like that That's what actually prompted your call. And then I got all Papa Dave on you. Yeah, I just downloaded the Every Dollar Budget app, which is tough for me because my income fluctuates. So I'm struggling with that. You'll be able to do that really, really easy when the two of you are married and you can

put $210,000 in that puppy and start crunching through this stuff. And you and him are on the same page and two grown-ups are running this house, not the kids. The kids don't get a vote. Yeah well it's new for me because he's never wanted to put our money together before. It's always just been very separate. You don't want to put your money together until you're married but you guys have got to make a decision about this marriage. You either money together until you're married but you guys have got to make a decision about this marriage you either need to make a decision we're gonna start working very hard on the relationship and by this point and that's just a marriage to be the outcome the marriage is the outcome or we're gonna call this we're gonna break this thing up we're gonna drop a grenade in the middle of

it because you what you're doing you're telling us we're not telling you you're telling us what you're doing The way you're doing life right now doesn't work Mm-hmm, I'm afraid to get married. I'm afraid to break up the house. I'm afraid I can't get traction with the money I can't get control. This is what you called us and start saying I'm just repeating it back to you And so you can't keep doing the same thing over and over again and expect a different result. That's the definition of insanity, right? Yes.

So that's what you're going to have to do. I'm going to beg you as my new friend that I love, for the sake of you, for the sake of him, for the sake of these kids, you two need to look at each other and look at this therapist and go, okay, we're going to make a decision. And in the next 90 or 120 days, we're going to see such significant progress in this relationship that it's not perfect. There's always going to be some fear.

Yeah. That's normal. But we're seeing progress to where we have hope enough that we can call this what it is a marriage. Yeah. And then you put yourself together and then you start managing those little people where we have hope enough that we can call this what it is a marriage. And then you put yourself together and then you start managing those little people

and you start managing those dollars and it all starts coming together in a much cleaner way. But this, you run around trying to mother hen everything from the outside with no connectivity, doesn't work. And no, you don't combine your money with him until you're married. This is the Ramsey show what does the future hold for business ask nine experts and you'll get 10

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Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, it's the Ramsey Show where we help people build wealth, do work that they love, and create actual amazing relationships. Rachel Cruz, Ramsey personality, number one best-selling author, my daughter is my co-host today. Open phones at 888-825-5225. Jim is with us in Houston, Texas. Hi Jim, welcome to the Ramsey Show. Hello, I'm honored you're taking the time to help me and millions of others with our money

questions. Thank you Thank you. How can we help I? Am a 40 year old widower and ready to date again However, my truck is 25 years old and I perceive the ladies I want to date will judge me based on the vehicle I drive It shouldn't matter but as a guy of average height and average appearance I don't have the charisma to overcome a poor first impression the question is should I spend five to ten thousand dollars to buy a car for the sole

purpose of dating to find my future wife Wow um there's a lot going on here. Jim, oh my gosh, I cannot wait to talk about this. It's a great question. It's a great question. Jim, where are you at financially? No debt, no mortgage, no kids. No debt, no mortgage, no kids. What's your net worth?

1.3 What do you make? 132,000. Regardless of women, you should get a better car. Oh, okay. Your car sucks, you're a multimillionaire, go get you a dad gum car, son. Oh. Okay, and then the women is a different issue,

but yeah, I mean really, you got a million dollars, you don't drive a 25 year old pickup truck I mean you can but there's no point in it and so I would go get a better car and but I would I would not ever purchase a car to attract a lady because you're trying to attract the wrong kind of woman at that point you don't want a woman who comes to you for the car not not a good a good, not a good, not a good connection. So, um, no, I mean we want her to love the Jim that Rachel and I already love. Dude, you're a great guy. I just need to impress one person. I just don't know who that is yet.

No, it's okay. You don't have to impress. If you impress them with a car, it's the wrong woman. Have you had dates, Jim? That's called shallow woman. And you've gotten feedback about it? I'm just curious what's causing you to think it's the truck. I have been on a second date that was going I thought very well the conversation was good and when we walked out to the parking lot she said oh you're driving that and I never heard from her again. But she doesn't. Now I try and I hide the truck on the other side of the parking lot. I'll walk her to her car, leave. But hey, listen, that's a good thing that you ran that one off. Okay, can I say this as a-

I mean, seriously, do you want to marry somebody who judges you by your- No, no, no. This is a shallow chick. Oh my gosh, can I, excuse me, let the woman talk for a second. Have at it, woman. Here's what I would say though, Jim. Not that it's shallow, but you would wonder, out of curiosity, like, oh my gosh,

am I gonna have to be the one that keeps this household afloat if it goes in the future? Like if she doesn't know your financial state, again, it's not a judgment on just like the car itself because there needs to be more conversation. But as a, I would think as a woman though, I'm like, I don't know. Am I, am I going to have to be the breadwinner for, you know what I mean? Like a level of, Are we going to be on food stamps because he drives this truck?

That's the question. Well, just, I don't know. Yeah. I mean like, so the first impression thing, again, it's not for a shallow purposes, but for her to to know like know you from it. You're responsible and you you know all of these line up Oh, then I don't care what kind of car you drive I just know the man that I'm marrying I'm entering into a relationship with That I'm not having to be the one to like hold us up financially right if you go to Branson, Missouri And you were to visit the Walmart Museum on the square in Branson, Missouri and you were to visit the Walmart Museum on the square in Branson, Missouri,

one of the things that's in there is Sam Walton's ancient pickup truck that the billionaire drove to work every week. Yes, which is great. And if you walk off from him because he drives that pickup truck, you would be known as a financial moron. I mean, seriously. I know. I mean, seriously. I know, I'm not saying not to date someone

that has a crappy car, it's not that. It's just to know that like, oh yeah, you are a guy that can hold life on his own. And you really do, Jim, because of where you are financially, I'm not saying to go buy a new truck for those purposes, I'm just giving another perspective to think, oh my gosh, is like, like is he doing anything with his life, right?

I'm not saying that you're not, Jim. Does that make sense, anyone? Am I making sense or am I sounding shallow? I'd rather have the opportunity to evaluate her character directly than she dismiss me based on a false perception. 100%. And if she's willing to dismiss you without learning more about your character based on

the truck, this is not marriage material. I agree. I agree. Send her back to the digital thing that she came from. That's all good. You know, go away, chick. And honestly, you dodged a bullet. The digital thing she came from. A dating app. You dodged a bullet the digital thing she came from a dating app

you dodged a bullet okay so but all that anyway all that aside I think you ought to go get a better car for you okay for you and you can drive the pickup all you want to drive it but I think you ought to have a better car in the driveway for you you've earned it you do not have to drive a piece of crap. You live like no one else and now you can live like no one else. Right, with the status symbol of choice, a BMW. No, that's not the status symbol of choice. The status symbol of choice was a pay off

more mortgage. Is a pay off more mortgage, which Jim, you've done. Taking the place of the BMW. But go get a better car. I'm not saying you have to go spend $100,000 on a car. But you don't have to, Jim. car but I mean you're driving a fifteen hundred dollar truck. Jim can be very content he may be fine. He ought to get a better car. He's Sam Walton. I tell these people all the time to go get a better car so but I wouldn't do it I would never do that to attract you the kind of woman you get the kind of person

woman or man if you're in a dating relationship that you attract based on your positions is not marriage material. Agreed. He looked at me again. I agree. When I was arguing, I don't know what this whole other thing you did a while ago was, but yeah. It was just to know, like, okay, I'm not having to be

the breadwinner, right? I'm like, I don't know. I don't wanna be on food stamps. I got that. I don't want someone that's like, yeah, that's like not working and making an income, right? At least ask a question instead of saying, see ya. I agree. 100% agree. I know. So you're driving this truck because you're a billionaire

or you're driving this truck because you're poor and don't work much. Exactly. Well, it's just the idea of like, I don't know. I don't have to like hold a man. You could ask a question. Yeah. I don't know. It's 40 years old. Jim, I'm rooting for you. You're a great guy. And I hope this Yeah, I don't know. He's 40 years old. Jim, I'm rooting for you. You're a great guy.

And I hope this call, I'm gonna just pray this over the internets that this call, maybe some lady's like, Jim, I'm interested. There you go. If you are. Houston's a little town, shouldn't be hard to find. Look for the old truck. Look for the old truck.

In Houston, Texas, Jim. Like there's the old truck in Houston, Texas, Jim. Like there's no old trucks in Houston, Texas. There's not a chance you're going to find one. I just appreciate him. That's so cool. And I really do. And I'm sorry you're a widower too, whatever that story was. I hope nothing but the best, Jim.

I'm cheering you on. Yeah, me too. I hope you find a great lady out there. Me too. We should do a Ramsey dating app. No, no. It would end up like this call. Terrible advice.

Bad advice from both of us. I think so. We flunked that one. That wasn't our best call, Meredith. It's worth what you pay for it, baby. This is the Ramsey Show. You spent years trying to get everything just right for your family. Now you need an easy way to make sure your important financial documents are as organized

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complete the quiz we'll show you where you are and what the next step is to move forward with your money Amy's in New York City. Hi, Amy. Welcome to the Ramsey Show. Thank you for taking my call, Mr. Ramsey. Sure. I am 55 years old in a divorce settlement. I got a simple IRA of $1.2 million. I cannot work due to some health issues. My concern is I'm kind of, I'm concerned about my burn rate and ways to mitigate my tax, my taxes. I know I'm getting a 10% early withdrawal fee because of my age and of course income tax. I'm not sure what to do. You said you're not able to work because of your health? Yes, I have some cognitive issues that I'm not getting hired. Okay. And the...

This is your only asset, your only source of income? Correct. I have no debts and I have no assets. Wow. Okay. And why New York City? Well, when I got the settlement, I decided to work on my bucket list. So I did a couple things like jump out of an airplane and move to New York City. And then I started looking at it. I love it. That's awesomeness. Your bucket list is both, Dave likes to jump out of airplanes and I love New York City, so you've check and check.

So I'm living my life, I really do love it, and then I sort of went, wait a minute, I need to make this last another 20, 30 years, and then realized that's probably not gonna happen the way I'm going through with my burn rate. The reason I asked is not because I hate New York City, but because it's one of the most

expensive cities in the world to live in and we're worried about a burn rate. So those two things don't go together. That's what was running through my head. So, you know, I'm probably going to locate somewhere near people I love and frequently visit New York City rather than try to live there. That would be probably half as expensive. You're quite right. That's an idea. Okay that's gonna affect your burn rate. There is, I don't know of a, I mean do you have a good financial advisor in your corner I have someone who's managing the IRA

but not a financial advisor no I feel like I want like a a tax strategist well there's not financial advisors go ahead go ahead Financial advisors want to make me save enough money so I'll have 1.2 million when I'm 100 years old and in a nursing home and I don't want that. I have no one to save my money for. I want to be able to live my life now. I'm in. I'm with you on that. So a good, the way we define a good financial advisor is not someone that tells you what to do, but someone that teaches you and then you can make good decisions.

So what you're calling us for is the same thing. You're calling us for good information. Is there some way I can get at this money and lower my burn rate because I did do a little math here and this is not working and that's the essence of your question. So I am not aware with your cognitive stuff there's no formal disability is there like you've not applied for SSI or something have you? I have but with everything that's going on they say it's probably gonna take a year or two years before everything might check out. Okay. Um, well that's, you're talking about the, uh, upheaval with the Trump administration? Um, no, this was even before.

It doesn't take two years to get SSI approved. Okay. Unless, unless there's, I mean, do you have medic, I mean, you have good, uh, doctor's opinions and so forth to submit to prove disability, correct? Yes, I mean, do you have, I mean, you have good doctor's opinions and so forth to submit to prove disability, correct? Yes, I do. Okay. There's just a long waiting period, I've been told.

There's no disability insurance anywhere in the whole mix of this discussion, right? No, I have to pay for my insurance. Yeah, okay, all right, I didn't think so, but I'm just fishing here, okay. So, what I want you to do, I want you to go to Ramsey Solutions, I want you to check out the SmartVestor Pros,

and these are investment advisors that we have vetted. They have to have the heart of a teacher or they don't become one of the people that we put in the SmartVestor program, okay? They don't work for me and they don't work for you unless they teach you something Yeah, and advise you rather than direct you Yeah, we I just had our meeting my husband

I meet with ours once a year and we just had ours yesterday and I'll tell you a great Financial planner or you know someone walking beside you an investment professional Their job is to help you live the way you want to live Amy So and how to do it responsibly. And they should have a basic knowledge, if not a pretty comprehensive knowledge on taxes as well. They're gonna see a holistic view of your life. And so a good, someone that's on your side

is gonna hear you, where you're not very risk averse. You're kind of like, yeah, I wanna live and jump out of airplanes and do it all all I don't want to die with that. I need to get I need to get you to 59 and a half with the laws that I understand because that gets us past the 10% all of that yes but you are going to get taxes on whatever you pull out income tax there's no avoiding that no but I'm just saying a good financial planner is gonna look at all of that know the ins and outs of it they're gonna be able to run a pro forma and be able to say okay okay, here's this, this, and this, and this throughout the years.

I mean, you're going to be, you're going to get a detailed plan with this person and that's what you need. So right now you don't, right? I mean, it's a little bit kind of all of them here. If you had a gross income of a hundred and thirty thousand dollars a year, minus taxes, could you live on that and do your dream? $30,000 a year minus taxes you could you live on that and do your dream? Minus taxes taxes that would put me in contact In now you put you down about 80,000 75 80,000 take-home pay It would be tight, but yes, probably not in New York City So yeah, probably not. Probably visiting New York City, but not living there.

Okay, but see, that's once you get to 59 and a half, because if you can produce 10% on 1.2 in good mutual funds, which I know you can do, then that's $120,000 a year, okay, minus taxes. And it is taxable. You're not gonna get away from that. This is a taxable event. And then if said also okay I'm going to plan out I'm 55 I'm going to plan to be broke at 90. Okay and so I'm going to let I'm going to

set up a 120,000 minus taxes plus a burn rate to hit me at zero at 90, then there's a formula that you can put in a calculator and do that. But it sounds like, I don't know what this money's invested in, but if it's producing north of 10%, you should be able without even touching the nest egg to bring that 10% out every year. You follow me?

Yes. And that's the kind of thing I want to start looking at and then I've got a then I've got a 10% penalty from 50 to 5 to 59 and a half and I've got my tax rate and that's going to erode this nest egg a little bit at a time. But I think you've been spending 200 a year right that's correct yeah okay and you're right you can't I was guessing but you can't you're right you can't do that mathematically because you're gonna end up on Alpo at some point in the story nice beans yes yeah yeah well no dog foods what I was talking about but yeah we don't want to do that.

We don't want to do that. I do think you've got a doable situation, because what happened, it sounds to me like, is you went through this divorce and you've got these cognitive things that you're dealing with, and you said, alright, I'm doing the bucket list, screw it. And you kind of got some of that in the last 18-24 months in the rear-view mirror and now you're kind of going okay now I got to get real about this. Did I understand is that is that what happened? Yes. Okay yeah I think I think you're ready to sit

down with somebody and not end up with 1.2 million when you die but also but you know let also, let's use some of it and hit the bucket list, but let's not have the burn rate, as you said. I think- And if you can jump on that disability too and get some income coming in, that's helpful to us. If you can get that SSI through, and maybe a SmartVest or Pro can help you run that SSI through.

If you happen to run into somebody who's got a little bit of knowledge on that, that's helpful. So anyway, hit the Ramsey Solutions website, find somebody to sit down with that's got the heart of a teacher to help you as Rachel said live your proposed life not theirs. This is the Ramsey Show. Listen guys I've heard just about every excuse for why folks think they can't get ahead with money so let's go ahead and settle this right now. You get the final say on what happens with your money. That's why you have to start telling your money where to go so you can stop wondering where it went. So if you're going to start winning with money, you have to get

on a budget. The easiest way to get started and stick to it is with the Every Dollar Budget App. It'll help you make a plan for every single dollar coming in and every single dollar going out every single month and guess what it's free so no excuses. Download every dollar in the App Store or Google Play today. In the lobby of Ramsey Solutions on the debt free stage, Philip and Heidi are with us. Hey Philip and Heidi, how are you? Hi, good, how are you?

Doing terrific. Welcome, where do you guys live? Indianapolis. All right, very fun. Welcome to Nashville. Thank you. And how much debt have you two paid off? $300,000.

Whoa. A little change. There you go. How long did it take to pay off $300,000. Well, a little change. There you go. How long did it take to pay off $300,000? Long six years. Wow. And your range of income during that time? We started at right around $100,000 and then we had the numbers there for 23 and it was like 219 at the end of 23. And then I finally did the taxes last week.

We made it over 250. All right, wow. What do y'all do for a living? I'm a physician assistant. I'm a nurse practitioner. Ah, okay, couple of medical folks. I was gonna say 300,000 might be a mortgage, but it could be student loans.

It is exactly student loans. It's all out there. All student loans. Yeah. Wow, you had a mortgage worth of student loans. We had a mortgage. Wow. Yeah, we owe more in student loans. That's all I want. All student loans. Yeah. Wow, you had a mortgage worth of student loans. We had a mortgage. Wow. Yeah, we had more in student loans

than we do on the house. Yeah. Very much, yeah. Wow. But you're out. We're out, yes. You're done. And now you're making a quarter million a year

between the two of you, so hello. Okay, that's a good thing. Wow, congratulations. All right, what started this whole journey? Tell us about six years ago. So six years ago, we actually went through Financial Peace University with one of our older churches. And then we moved to the Indianapolis area and got involved with our church now and decided that after Phil was done with school, that we were just going to pay it off and just

get it done and be rid of it. And through lots and lots of hard work, we started with the Envelope system and then went to the Every Dollar app. So we just, little bit by little bit, and we got it done. Well congratulations, that's a lot. I mean, this is like a lot of money. Yeah.

Wow, I mean when you sat down and looked at that and you went $300,000 in student loan debt, you had to have an old crap moment. Yeah. Wow. I mean when you sat down and looked at that and you went $300,000 in student loan debt, you had to have an old crap moment. Yes. We started off with little thermometers that we made because you know I was raised by two teachers so I need very visual aid kind of person and so we started having these thermometers of like coloring it and after six pages of thermometers we stopped that it was a little it was a little overwhelming. So much, so much going on. Golly. Oh man, okay, so during this time,

cause six years, I mean that's a marathon, right? I mean we, you know, two years is usually kind of average with consumer debt, so people that do mostly student loans, we see, that it's kind of the long game, right? So what was the hardest part in six years? Cause I know you guys are, we're probably tired, I mean I know you probably hit a wall at certain points

thinking, oh my gosh, we're still in this. I feel like we hit two walls. We have two kids. Yeah. Oh, so we hit two walls. We hit two walls. We hit two kids. So, our-

Thing one and thing two. Thing one and thing two. Exactly. And, you know, it was funny, like, our oldest is six, surprisingly. We started cutting off. Oh wow. It's like, oh hey, we're pregnant.

Yeah. Our oldest is six and our youngest is three and both of them started out lives with a little bit of medical debt. You know, just they're great now. Everything's wonderful but you know, keeping tithing, keeping everything, saving but also paying off debt as fast as we could, making sure they were okay. Those were some hard times of making sure that we stayed within budget but still were able to connect with the boys but also connect each other and pay off debt as fast as we could was a huge priority.

So the two walls were amazing, we love the walls but. We love them but they came, they came in strong. Yes. Yeah, I mean that's a big deal though for real. I mean like anyone that has a baby, like you're like it's a life-changing event. Let alone two happening during a process like this. So kudos you're like, it's a life-changing event, let alone two happening during a process like this.

So kudos to you guys, that's great, so great. So which of the six years did you make the most progress? The most progress? Probably the single biggest year was last year in 24. Just because the income went up? Income went up and there was some changes with some pay time off with work and all that that they ended up cashing out, both of ours.

So we had like two extra months worth of income just come in PTO and they switched over to a different plan. So then it'll lose out on any available time off for us. So that was a big one. Cause yeah, our final payment was like $46,000 in change that we just did all at once. That was a really rough two weeks of just like, no one can get sick, no one can get injured,

everyone has to be very cool for these two weeks until we get paid. Hold your breath, hold your breath. Hold your breath, here we go. Yeah, I got it. I definitely see the math part of that. I'm wondering, was your intensity up because you could see the finish line?

Yes. Absolutely. Yeah, I mean, we were saying for the last couple years, this is finally gonna be the year, but there is something different coming into 24 like this. This is finally gonna be time for this to happen, so. and I knew I was gonna have to cash out some PTO to make that goal by the end of 24 but I didn't know it was gonna take all of my PTO and all of hers at the same time but ended up being that with the workings that are everything

else with work that if I had done it earlier in the year it wouldn't have worked out. We had to wait on them to make the changes that we weren't in the place for them to even make those changes. So God really worked it out for us to make this come together at the end because when it all came in to the checking account, it was less than $200 that was in the checking account, more than what we had left to pay.

It was a total God thing. And we're done. We can be done tonight, but then we have $200 for the next two weeks. That's right everybody. And Merry Christmas. Literally, hold your breath. And Merry Christmas by the way.

Yeah, yeah. Thing one and thing two, we're out of debt. Wow, congratulations you guys. Thank you. There's a 24 year old couple listening right now, or a 26 year old couple listening right now, or a 26 year old couple listening, and they just looked up and saw

they've got $300,000 in debt. Talk to them, tell them if it can be done and what they should do. It can always be done, so. I mean, what can't be done? I think the other thing to remember is, the phrase live like no one else, you can live like no one else, that can't be done. I think the other thing to remember is, the phrase live like no one else,

you can live like no one else, and knowing that this is temporary. $300,000 is overwhelming when you look at it on six different paperwork of thermometers, but that little bit by little bit, keeping each one that slowly paid off, slowly paid off, it really does build that momentum of, oh, we're so close, and it sounds silly, but even going under 100 of, oh we're so close and you know,

it sounds silly but even going under 100,000, we're like, oh we're under 100,000, that's for so close. Almost like a half marathon or when they're like, Vial 10, you're almost done, you're like no I'm not. So under that 100,000 mark was definitely a huge moment of oh we're so close, we are so close. So yeah, I think just knowing that,

building little momentums and having those little victories and we have such a great support system with our families and our friends and just the ton of support was huge with us. What was the hardest part? Probably just the length it took. Just staying focused for that long. And just how little progress was being made early on.

Just knowing, no, just gotta keep with it. Keep going. Was it worth it? Absolutely. We laugh, we're like, we've been out of the my nervous phase for a month of not, everyone can breathe again. And our three year old can be absolutely feral again

and break any bone he wants. But it's one of those things where, someone asks, what are you gonna do now? It's like, breathe. We're just gonna breathe for a minute knowing that we can be done and start dreaming fun things again. And then now looking at our mortgage,

it's like, oh yeah, we can do that. It was less than after loans. That's crazy. That's crazy. Look at that little thing. Look at that little mortgage. That's great. It's all about perspective.

That's awesome. Absolutely. Well done, you guys. Thank you. Good job, you guys. Thank you. That's a lot. That's a lot and you did it.

Thank you. Amazing. Good stuff. You changed your family tree. We did, absolutely. You changed yourselves in the process. The work that God did inside of you while you were doing this is pretty incredible. Absolutely. You're different people than you were six years ago. Are the boys here? They are not. No, they would be running around the studio probably hitting every corner that they could find.

So especially our three-year-old. It's gonna be a peaceful debt free screen for you. Having not to juggle at all. It is funny, our six year old will say, do we have the, we call it the fun money. Do we have the fun money this month to be able to do this? Cause we would still do little things, but yeah, he would be like, do we have the fun money this month?

It's like, maybe next month. That's right. So great you guys. Where to go you guys Philip and Heidi Indianapolis Indiana three hundred thousand dollars in student loans in six years making a 100 to 250 count it down let's hear a debt-free scream one two three we're debt free! yeah!

oh yeah baby! Woohoo! No feeling like freedom. Wow. This is The Ramsey Show. It's the last call for our two-night virtual event, Dave Ramsey's Investing Essentials. It's set for May 21 and 22 and you do not want to miss this.

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georgia is in birmingham alabama high georgia how are you hi i'm good how are y'all better than we deserve what's up in your world uh... well i was actually calling because my husband is very obsessed with you in a good way and big on living like no one else so later we can live like no one else. I've always admired and appreciated the dedication but lately it's kind of taken an extreme turn and seems to be taking a toll on his mental health and quite honestly,

mine as well lately. So my question is, how do you suggest finding a balance between financial responsibility and unhealthy fixation? Well, we need Dr. John Deloney, I think. I don't think I'm qualified for this. I don't know. I mean, what in the world? How is his mental health slipping because he's extremely focused on a goal? That usually has the opposite effect of not mental health problems. I understand, exactly. So, it just seems to be the only thing that he can really think about and it seems like he sees that we're in And his mind he thinks that our financial situation is like Way worse or we're not where we should be in life right now, even though in my opinion

I think that we're you know in a good place. Okay how long have you all been working on this? Um probably recently like the last two or three years. So for three years he's been super intense. Very intense. And what about you? She's tired. Yeah, it has really been like I don't want to seem like I'm like ungrateful for his dedication and all the effort that he puts into it But it starts to kind of make me feel like should I be worried even though I don't feel like we should. Okay, so the two of you sit down and do a budget Following our stuff, right?

Yeah, we are on the every dollar budget. Okay, so when you guys sit down and do that, it's not a hopeful, yay, rah, we're making progress, instead it's a doom scroll? It's more of like, we should be doing more. He feels like he's not doing enough. Give me an example. He feels like, I mean, you're like, I want to buy some food and he's like, no! You can't have food!

Well, not that extreme, but if we do want to go out to dinner, it is still like, oh, we gotta tighten up. We don't have any car payments we we don't have any car payments we don't have any credit card debt we don't have any student loans we've got over a hundred thousand in retirement what is it what is it you're all right I'm sorry do you know what baby step you're on I do not okay so you're really not plugged in to all this. You're just watching him do it. It's, yeah, it's gotten to the point where it's like, I kind of dread talking about it.

So are y'all out of debt except your house? Yes. Do you have an emergency fund of three to six months of expenses? We do. Okay, then that puts you on baby steps, what we call four, five, and six, which means you should move from, we

teach that you, and if he listens this intently he should know this, that you should move from intense to intentionality in baby steps four, five, and six. Four is we're putting 15% of our income away for retirement. Five is we're addressing kids college. And six is if we have any other money after we live our life then we put that towards the mortgage because we want to get the mortgage paid off in the next five to 10 years. Um, and that is not intent.

We teach and live like no one else. Don't go out to eat. Don't go on vacation in the first three baby steps and you're that's getting out of debt and having an emergency fund, not counting the house and you're that's getting out of debt and having an emergency fund not counting the house and you're past that you should have moved from not going out to eat to going out to eat in your budget with no guilt yeah that's our teaching ok so what we're saying is, is he, you guys got past the emergency stuff of getting

out of debt in the emergency fund and he refuses to take his foot off the gas. Yes. Okay. And he's obsessing over every little thing and it's spinning him out is what it's doing. It really is. It's stressing him out more than giving him freedom. Yeah. Yeah.

Which is such an interesting, we talked about this on another show last week together, how money becomes an idol for so many people, and some people it's the chase of more, more, more, nicer, nicer, nicer, but on the flip side, it becomes an idol in this case, where you're so obsessed with it in a negative way, that it's like literally eating into the quality

of your life because it's all you're thinking about. And that's not how it should be. There should be a lot more freedom. And so there's something in him that this is happening. Yeah, at the baby step that you're on, he's doing it wrong. If he's that obsessed with our show and with what Dave Ramsey and Rachel Cruz teaches, we don't teach what he's doing. We tell you to be intentional. I don't want you being wasteful on this,

but it's not intense. Okay, the intensity is no going out to eat beans and rice, rice and beans, no vacation till you get yourself out of debt and accept the house, baby step two and finish your emergency fund. You told me you've done that, right? Correct. Okay, so now we're just saving for retirement, kids college, and we're working to get the house paid off, and that is

intentional. That's the stage you move up in car with cash. That's the stage you buy a new couch if you need one with cash. That's the stage you go on a decent vacation with cash. That's the stage that you go out to eat in your every dollar budget. All of those things should be in your every dollar budget and there should be room for them. What's your household income Georgia? Around 150 together combined. So you make plenty of money money to become millionaires and to change your family tree and do the things I just said in that last

series of sentences. So, okay, so what we want you to reach for and him too, him is what I'm talking to I guess is financial peace there's no peace in this discussion it's that as Deloney says let your shoulders drop and exhale and he's never done that yet right yeah and I mean, he's 25, so it's this intense here in this part of life. I can only imagine that if we don't do something about it, it's just going to get a lot more intense. I think you guys need to sit down maybe with a good marriage counselor or maybe with your pastor because this is kind of a spiritual thing at this stage. It's an emotional and spiritual thing. You just kind of learn

to enjoy the ride now. You've done a great job and you need to enjoy the fruits of your labor. My guess is this is an intense dude, period. That he probably is this way about a lot of things. I don't know anybody like that, but it could happen. This is the Ramsey Show. Hey, you're still here? What are you doing? You do know that the rest of today's show is playing right now over on the Ramsey Network app, right? All you gotta do to finish the episode is search Ramsey Network in the App Store, Google Play Store, or just click the link in the show notes to download the app for free. Yep, you heard me right, for

free. Then right there on the home screen, you can watch the rest of today's show. Bada bing, bada boom. All right, I'm getting out of here. Enjoy. We'll see you on the app.