The Reel Rejects - ECHO EPISODE 4 Breakdown & Review

Episode Date: January 10, 2024

BEST EPISODE YET! Save Money and cancel Unwanted Subscriptions By Going To https://rocketmoney.com/rejects  Echo 1x4 Reaction, Recap, Breakdown, Commentary, Analysis, Easter Eggs, Spoiler Review, and ending Explained for the MCU series where we get the return of Vincent D'Onofrio as Wilson Fisk (Kingpin), Charlie Cox Matt Murdock (Daredevil), & of course Alaqua Cox as Maya Lopez as we explore the aftermath of Hawkeye, the origins of the Choctaw nation, as cast members from The Bear into the fray with possible tie-ins to What If Season 2. Marvel Studios Echo is apart of the Marvel Phase 5 which will feature Deadpool 3 with Ryan Reynolds & Hugh Jackman Wolverine, X-men, Fantastic Four, Avengers Secret Wars, & MORE.  #Echo #Daredevil #Kingpin #MCU #MarvelStudios #Netflix #Avengers #AvengersSecretWars #MarvelPhase5  Become A Super Sexy Reject For Full-Length T.V. & Movie Reactions! https://www.patreon.com/thereelrejects Follow Coy Jandreau: Tik Tok: https://www.tiktok.com/@coyjandreau?l... Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/coyjandreau... Twitter: https://twitter.com/CoyJandreau Support The Channel By Getting Some REEL REJECTS Aparrel! https://www.rejectnationshop.com/ Music Used In Manscaped Ad:  Hat the Jazz by Twin Musicom is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution 4.0 license. https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/4.0/ POWERED BY @GFUEL Visit https://gfuel.ly/3wD5Ygo and use code REJECTNATION for 20% off select tubs!! Head Editor: https://www.instagram.com/praperhq/?hl=en Co-Editor: Greg Alba Music In Video: Airport Lounge - Disco Ultralounge by Kevin MacLeod is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution 4.0 license. https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/4.0/ Ask Us A QUESTION On CAMEO: https://www.cameo.com/thereelrejects Follow TheReelRejects On FACEBOOK, TWITTER, & INSTAGRAM:  FB: https://www.facebook.com/TheReelRejects/ INSTAGRAM:  https://www.instagram.com/reelrejects/ TWITTER: https://twitter.com/thereelrejects Follow GREG On INSTAGRAM & TWITTER: INSTAGRAM: https://www.instagram.com/thegregalba/ TWITTER: https://twitter.com/thegregalba Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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This video is sponsored by one of my personal favorite services, Rocket Money. More on them after the reaction, people. Citizens of the Reject Nation, we are Reject Merched out today, looking like Kingpin out of the greatest Marvel series, Hawkeye. All righty, well, we have made our way to episode four. If you didn't catch our reactions to episode one through three, that is up here on the channel, of course. How are you guys enjoying this series?

You liking it, I see mixed reviews on social media. We've got to watch the first three early. We were watching this in real time with everyone else, maybe just two hours ahead. John, how are you? Buttered like a biscuits. Gee, how are you? I get it. All right, Coy, how are you?

I don't get it, but I'm excited to be explained it later. I was lying to him. All righty, guys, we'll leave a like on this video. That I mean a lot. Also, be sure to subscribe and click that notification bell, of course, as we got one more episode to get through. Thank you to prep for helping us out of down these highlights. And thank you to all who have already joined us at our Patreon page.

I'm assuming so. I'm time traveling here. That's where you get the full interaction. watch-along where you sync up with your own copy of Echo, available for Super Sexual Rejects, and, of course, we cover several things exclusively over there with highlights and watch-alongs included. I'm ready to check this out. I'm excited. Let's do it, guys. Oh. Sir, you broke the plane. We're going to have to switch to a whole new plane.

Dope sauce. Dope sauce. We got some thoughts. Then we got out one more episode. I want to appreciate this one in the meantime because that was the best one of them all. I hope five doesn't ruin it with its really short runtime like Disney Plus usually does. But before we start talking about that, I did want to share with you guys how Wilson Fisk managed to get all his finances in order to maintain such great wealth over New York City. probably with the help of today's sponsor. One that I actually use and has really helped me out with tax season. So please give it a listen and support the channel by getting yourself some Rocket Money.

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All righty. All righty. Well, since John, I got to give it to John. He kept pointing something out that I did not. read into that I was like I don't know why he's harping on this so much about it. Why didn't he learn? It had to happen sometime in life even the reaction highlights. I think I like even cut out one one of the things I'm like we need to keep the rhythm going and he keeps harping on this thing

damn he's totally like there was such an emphasis and it was so important to the character here about the sign language of him not learning how to speak sign and I thought it was just kind of a like a detail that I agreed with but I didn't think the show took note of it in any way of him not learning it seemed like an oversight so John please you take away the thoughts first

we do have to film five so you know you know be a miraculously efficient yeah I love when shows I love when something can put a detail in there that you know it rides on your patience but yeah that you think is just an oversight or a flaw and then actually becomes

an intentional choice I think that's a good example in a universe that's been kind of marred lately by lack of consistency and within project foresight, like, that's a beautiful example of that. And this episode, across the board, I mean, you've said it throughout the whole thing, like the scene work, the character beats, and just the nuance that we got to explore was really affecting and really lovely. My apprehension about this whole experience is that, yeah, it doesn't feel like it was

cut up in a blender. However, it does feel like certain things were probably expanded in the fine. to 10, whatever that original episode count was supposed to be, it feels like there was probably a lot more time allowed to breathe within this world. So I feel like in hindsight, four episodes now, it feels like we've gotten kind of like one major scene or sequence or beat or something with every major part of the greater ensemble, you know, her friends, her family, those people. It feels like everybody got like an episode to do a thing or have an impactful moment. Yeah. And so, yeah, I'm a little worried about the totality. But,

I think across the board, the show has demonstrated terrific work, and this did a really nice job to me of representing how lovely it can be when you integrate culture and, you know, new kinds of faces and voices into popular media like this, because this is doing it to me in a way that doesn't feel like it's been tacked on or like it's been studio noted or like it's pandering. It just feels like part of the DNA of the show. I would just love to see it, especially like, you know, in a world where reservation dogs exists and where this kind of borrows, you know, qualities of that show and clearly demonstrates that it can embody them. You know, like, I would love to, I would happily watch more of that.

But I think what we've gotten is quite solid and speaks to a lot of great talent on display across the board in front of him behind the camera. Absolutely. Absolutely. Coy, son, I got to upload a video here. All right. So, why don't you start talking about your thoughts? Why don't you start talking? Am to hear a lot of what John said. I agree that it's an ensemble piece in front and behind the camera,

especially with it being a more nuanced show. And I think maybe that's why I think we all mentioned a couple times during this episode because this is the first we're filming in real time. We did get to review the first three a little earlier. But this is the first since we've seen some other people's reactions. We were blessed to watch the other and avoid, which is always nice because I don't like other people's opinions. To cloud my own or just generally.

I just don't generally care for other people's business. infect your brain. Well, it's just like it's, I think Marvel has become synonymous with critical critical thinking implies a positive. Whatever the opposite of critical thinking is. Either you're blindly in love with it or

blindly hating it. And that's really, really dangerous because it is, regardless of it being comparatively smaller in scale, it is still a behemoth of pop culture. It's not doing the numbers it was, but it's still like, when you look at the top 10 worldwide box office film for 2023,

three were comic movies. 30% to this day is still a foundational part of pop culture. So I know everyone wants to talk about the bubble bursting because it's popular to do, and I know everybody wants to complain because that's also very popular. But it is still dangerous to have something as prevalent in pop culture to have a knee-jerk reaction. To knee-jerk love something without seeing it

or knee-jerkate something without seeing it defeats the purpose of art. Like art is about the experience. So I had a really interesting time watching this episode because this is the first one that was tainted by people. And I really don't understand a lot. of people's perspective on the show. Oh, thank God. I was like, where the hell is he going with this tangent?

I circled back. Damn, he is just going and going off about them. I thought you might need time with the upload, Greg. And now you're like, oh, now it makes sense. Vanessa. I was listening to every word. The white rabbit. I was getting, I was kingpin monologuing.

I've returned. But no, I think it's interesting to watch something through the lens of having the blind experience of something like we used to with art versus watching something with anyone's perspective. And I immediately found, because of the. seen the first three with my own journey and with these guys' perspective, all of us enjoying it, for the most part, going, yeah, it's got its flaws, but overall, greater good, enjoying it's a good time.

I found myself defending it more this time, and that also felt weird, because I think this was by far its strongest episode, and instead of just being able to go, like, this is what I like, this is what I like, there was a little voice to meg of the head going, and like, fuck that. Like, I didn't like that I was reactionary to the other world of that conversation. So I think it's really interesting when you have a binge show like this, how people will perceive it by the time it's done. Since you've got five hours at once, you're going through the whole journey, how people are going to be reacting to it online. I'm really curious how people

are going to be reacting in the comments to this, how people are going to be seeing the show through their own lens versus the pop culture lens of the great Twitter sphere of conversation. Because that does affect your viewing. So I think this episode was my favorite, but I also think this is the episode that won't be for a lot of people. Really? That's interesting because I feel like Disney did themselves a disservice by not releasing all five when the show is clearly designed to be. binged because I think every episode you get to helps complement the prior

episode. I agree. So it helps make the episodes feel more complete because of the overall narrative they're telling. Even these character moments I was trying to pull it up. I would have like this one earlier in the season. What is I need to just get everyone's names in front of me. So there's

Maya obviously. Bonnie? See, this is what I mean. There are some things that I feel like are would have been more fleshed out in a longer season. And I think there are things that I've been dropped. I'm waiting to reserve

some of those potential criticisms, depending on how the next episode goes. So in the meantime, because I'm like, oh yeah, Bonnie. There's so much of this emphasis on Bonnie. I'm like, no, right, the final episode. Yeah, it's just like there's one episode

where it's the Bonnie episode, and now we've moved on the field. Yeah, I was like, okay, cool, you guys patched things up. Kind of. And this was the Chula episode. I'm looking for, okay, Chula. And then who's that? Who's the guy who runs the roller skating rink?

Oh, Black Crow, I think, is his name? I'm trying to find the names. That's the name of the skate ring. Is his name also Black Crow? I think it's part of it. Because it's like his ownership, like John's Pizza Shop. Why can I find? Freaking IMDB.

Okay, let's call him Black Crow, whatever. All right. So I do think that the actual episode itself, one thing that I loved about it so much was how this, as much as we got like great moments from Kingpin here with his manipulation, tactics as you know watch me be

because he is like a violent he's like we all know him to be this violent kingpin right but he's also a domestically violent father of sorts where he can be soft and welcoming and nurturing

but if you he's got that temper though that if you don't fall in line he's going to take out his rage somewhere or on someone and I like the way he's illustrated that way you saw him as a lover portrayed that way via and even though and like beat Vanessa or something,

but he takes it out in other ways. He's, he, you see him as a lover like that and in the Netflix shows and here you're seeing this from the father illustration that I,

even though he's called uncle, it's definitely like a father-daughter dynamic, right? And then, and the way how you got like scenes with Chula, fleshing out the backstory with the Choctaw lore and then what was in Black Crow?

I think it's like Henry Black Crow or something like that. It might be, I think it's Henry. Henry. I think this is just the bowling alley's black crow, but I could be wrong. I don't know. We're at odds here, but we should fight it out. Yes.

But there's scenes with Henry as well where he is talking about how, like you see Maya's disdain here. You see Maya's pain as well. Like there's so much unresolved pain because I'm bringing up all the other supporting characters. Whereas before this episode, I would feel like I think everyone's great, but I'm really not attached to Maya. And this episode maintained and even expanded upon our supporting characters, and it was the first time where I felt like it magnified Maya so much. Like I felt for the first time out of four episodes, and maybe that's not the best compliment to give the show from my subjective viewing experience. But this is what I mean by how it's gotten better each episode. I really felt like this is the echo episode, even though everyone else is like phenomenal as always.

I really felt endeared and connected to her. And I thought for using an actress that is actually, not I'm telling her, I say hiring an actress, casting an actress who is deaf and who has to rely solely on, you know, speaking sign language, her eyes, her expressions, body language. Maybe it was editing. Maybe it's the specific scenes.

Or maybe it's actually her acting this time. I don't know what it was. But this particular episode, I was like, okay, we got three scenes here. where one is with two are we kingpin one is with Chula one is with

the roller skating and rinkman my favorite superheroes we'll just call skates you got three distinct scenes with Maya and each one

I did not feel like was a repetitive performance from I don't forget a locker Cox from a locker Cox I did not feel

it was repetition I thought like oh here's variety here and and each scene i thought brought different depth and i felt to quote coy the dichotomy of the situation she's in of now she's unpacking you know unresolved shit with her family she's got this past traumatic shit with kingpin and she's being pulled in two different directions right now and i really don't know where this so it's credit i don't know how episode five is going to resolve I don't know what the plot is ultimately going to lead to.

But this was a very character nuanced episode. And the thing that I have criticized most about it is the one I felt least connected to was Maya. And this was the one I really genuinely felt connected to her. So, yeah. I want to add something to what you just say, because I really, I think you bring up a really good point with how she's portrayed in this episode. I think there's an element of every, like, familial, but in a more direct line, mother or father figure in this episode.

Because the father figure element of Kingpin is, obvious. The maternal element with the grandfather, the grandmother is obvious, but I really like that there's like the dad that she didn't have, like, he seems like the dad of the town. He kind of like runs things, and like Henry seems to be like this paternal energy to her, even though it's not her

father. Or like a brother almost. Yeah, there's like an uncleness, but I think what we saw in this episode from her is, it's the first time we don't have her being stoic as a defense mechanism. She's consciously letting her defenses down because she wants to figure something out as opposed to pushing everyone away. So I think it's

first time we've narratively allowed for Echo to kind of get to open up those parts of her acting repertoire. Like Equalizer got to shift a little. The first three episodes, the Equalizer was kind of at like, defense, stoic. And I get from the character perspective, why that's necessary. But I said earlier when you were talking, I think that I would have liked this episode earlier in the season. It wouldn't have worked from the storytelling standpoint. But I think what I would, would have liked is to have some scenes of her with her defenses wavering. So we could have seen some of these elements. So I could get those, the colors in the palette. of Aliqua Cox's acting,

because here is one I loved for the most. So in addition to my earlier rant about just the general release model, what I loved about this episode was it gave us the most colors. It gave us the most acting style choices of actors we've already loved, and we've seen them grow,

and this felt like an exponential, like, as we entered the third acts, which I really liked. And the thing I am concerned about, I just can't, you can't ask me just to eliminate it from my brain. It's not the way my brain operates. I don't think either of our brains operate this way.

There is an awareness that, It's that of the history with Disney Plus shows, the Marvel shows. How it ends. How it ends. And I'm having the hardest time believing this is really going to stick the landing. I really am. Because I'm like, oh, there's so much. Left.

There's so much left. And they're also not known to give us season twos, like Loki in What If? What If is an anthology show with a slight different, a little bit of a serial connection, right? It's not dependent on that. Loki was the exception and that took a long time to get to you know and with this I'm already seeing like okay well clearly this was underdeveloped I did find myself at certain points with Kingpin already feeling like you know they keep saying how important you know Maya is to him but I really feel like we should have seen some like flashbacks I really feel like we should have got some history here instead of them just talking vagary about it and it because there's a fine line between you know actors provide uh writing assuming the audience like we're going to give the audience credit and let them you know fill in the blank here extract the subtext yeah like however i i don't think that is actually the positive effect i think i think it negatively affects some

of the scenes where they could have more impact or there could be more tension and more of a internal debate for her if we got those flashbacks. A young adult training scene, a scene of her killing someone for him. Like in the comics, there's so much like lore between the two of them. It would have been nice. I gave it crap because it was like flashback, lesser flashback

modern day before the opening. But the rules of threes, I would have even preferred one more flashback instead of just two if it was like young adult before we get to modern day. So we could have had that moment. Or even just in that scene of dialogue, have a moment where we see her do something for the criminal underbelly that kind of like puts them together as

similar before he full circles. Yeah, I could see like two versions here where I think it just made me need it one more episode. I think so I know we haven't finished it, but I'm already at the point where I'm thinking one more episode probably would have helped save this a lot so that way you get a lot of that additional meat that you really need. Like honestly, seeing Bonnie's name on IMDB just made me go, because there was so much emphasis on this Bonnie shit.

They don't give you the time it takes to. One thing I've learned lately is you learn a character. When the show is doing its job to the utmost, it's like, you know, if you give us enough Couple of moments to connect to them, we'll remember their name. And I feel like I like everybody here, but they haven't really just given enough to connect to the point where you remember the names and stuff like that. And with Kingpin, oh, I totally had something. And now it's, it's floated away out of my mind. Why? Because I opened the computer. It was the opening of the episode. I have to make the watch along public. I am multitasking here, John. I actually was kind of frustrated by that and I thought that while the alleyway flashback is striking the way that moment is handled was pretty eh-he-ha was pretty muddy because like there should be some kind of a bit of a conflictory nature to the punch of like when she comes

into the alley and kicks the dude and like Kingpin has that response of like oh shit you saw that but like there's there's a lot in that moment and you guys commented on that feeling like it was like a 90s daredevil movie kind of experience at that point and I think that is because it's like it's undercut where there should be flat like we should see the conflict of her being indoctrinated as a child into this life she says that thing later about like you isolated me and you know essentially brainwashed me into this life you just gave me a huge epiphany in my overall experience of comic book films john what's that 90s and 2000s comic book films showed us scenes from comics because they knew that comic fans would connect to him and they knew audience would

get just enough to move on and that's what this was that's why it felt like it it was like let's show them as when she was young because that audience will understand new comic stuff shows us like regular movies where it gives us an emotional scene based on the character that happened to be named the comic book characters and that's why you've got things like dark night you've got things like Logan that are just stand-alone movies because they're acting and then there's moments of iconography but when you've got something that feels like 90s or 2000 it'll just show the shot and it won't do the follow-up it doesn't give you the day new mom and I think that's why I like the Sony movies because sometimes

there's that well sometimes I'm like I just want to have the fun and not the you know I want to sometimes my steak needs to be from Outback well that's for the disappointment of some of these little like sometimes we'll know and it's probably it's probably things people and it's not inconsistent so much of the point where it it's like ball like you can have like stretches of this show that are like 10 minutes long that are like great and then like they'll just do this one thing you're like what that rush that face just happened right here it reminded me of what you said because you said there's that thing and that are like great and then like they'll just do this thing of like, it's not that the show isn't giving you stuff to go off of, but there are times where it's important to show versus trusting like, oh, yeah, we know what her backstory is from this one moment. We can just fill in the blank because we know the broad strokes. And in certain points that undercuts you, like it, I think does here. We do have... This should have been the Kingpin and Maya episode, like in the past. Yeah, and I think two episodes really would have helped. Yeah. Like, I think a lot, especially when so much of the hindrances on, like, you know, her getting in touch with her origin, her roots, her people.

And I honestly think the, the envelopment of the world with the Choctaw people in present day is so well done. Like, it just feels a part of the community naturally. And I love that. I don't feel any of those like Common Vandervers kind of commentary. No, it's a lot like Miss Marvel where it feels like, oh, I just get to experience a culture. I think more so than that. Because she's a little white-red culture and now she's learning about her own heritage. So her eye line is our line in a more unique way.

Yeah, it's a city. And I think, but I think the bookends were great. And I think the performance, like the performances, I remember watching Secret Invade. Man, we really do got to watch next episode. I do remember watching Secret Invasion and feeling as if I can objectively tell these actors are doing a great job, but I can't feel for it because everything else is not working for me. Yes. And here, I can find myself being very much forgiving of a moment that doesn't work or something that's not, but it doesn't undercut, like, wow, the acting here is so good. And then there's also generally a great sense of mood, there's a great sense of atmosphere.

The dramatic feels are really felt like they really let their actors perform. And I'm very appreciative of an episode like, I don't think there's any action here, right, other than the opening scene. There's not really action. Oh, the birth was so... We didn't even talk about the birth scene. I was so emotional. I don't even... I almost cried, Greg.

I don't know. Emotional constipated. One day, Corey. You gotta learn to cry, Coy. You gotta learn to cry, Coit's from my teardust. You need it. I want it. It's not a thing I don't want.

I need it. I think all this like Twitter rage is so much constipated emotionally. It's just another version of a boy inside who wants to cry. He knows. You've covered your sadness. Both of us know. Both of us know this is us And I have no outlet left

Sterling K. Brown abandoned me in my time of need And then K. K. Coy immediately begins to weep. Sterling! So, yeah, that's what's happening with Koi. We're out here. Anyway, yeah, we got to watch the next episode and we'll probably have the longest discussion there. But thank you guys so much for being here.

I don't know if I'm going to come out in a little bit or this is kind of a jumbled schedule here. Never done this before. put us in a pickle um damn you disney damn you for helping us out with watching the first three early but now is not knowing how to manage my editing tasks and everything else yeah oh thank you guys so much and uh let's send this with a patron of the day shout out Danny pancakes you have entered the era of 2024 where you would now get to shout out yes and it is January 24 so we got to fathom what your resolution will be and I think your resolution this year

will to get yourself on on therapy I think I think you're going to want to go to therapy Danny look I've got it to know you really well see I've talked to my therapist extensively about you my therapist constantly like why do you know so much about this Danny pancakes kind I'll be like it's not your freaking business to know why I know if I tell you you're going to send me to jail. I know exactly how this therapy session goes down. So just know, I know some things about Danny pancakes. And Danny pancakes, he needs therapy.

Because here's the thing. His legal last name is pancakes. And you know why? He changed it to that. Because the guy can't stop coping with his depression. He just keeps eating pancakes. Ben, cheating wasn't enough. I had to personify myself as.

constantly drowning in pancakes and syrup because he just avoids his pain and then what does he do he works out hours in the morning to burn off those pancakes it's a vicious cycle and he has no time to get to work it's just eating of pancakes and a bunch of carbs and sugar at night then he gets a terrible night's sleep because of all that sugar and cards nightmares And then he's having to work out in the morning. So go to therapy using betterhelp.com slash real rejects and get yourself 10% off and some other deal promo. Yeah.

That comes along with it. I don't know. Yeah, a year of therapy for free. I don't call me all that. I feel like that's a bunch of bullshit. He'll fix your life in one year for free. I think you use the promo code. They'll perform brain surgery on you because they're a promo code.

Yeah. Any medical procedure you need with our promo code for the next. 365 days you can get all right daniel well take some fiber man because you got to poop those pancakes