The Reel Rejects - Jared Harris Shares UNTOLD Hollywood Stories! Tom Cruise, Robert Downey Jr, Robin Williams, & MORE!!

Episode Date: September 22, 2024

Jared Harris Breaks Down His Most Iconic Characters In "That's A Great Question" Interview With Coy Jandreau - while bringing us EXCLUSIVE stories of Tom Cruise, Adam Sandler, Robin Williams, David Fincher, Steven Spielberg, Robert Downey Jr, Guy Ritchie, & MORE!! He is currently on Apple TV's Foundation, Jared Harris is primarily known for his work in HBO series Chernobyl & Sherlock Holmes Professor Moriarty. His work expands unto Morbius, American Dad, Robot Chicken, The Crown (king george), The Man From U.N.C.L.E., The Curious Case Of Benjamin Button, Lady In The Water, Lincoln, Ocean's Twelve, Resident Evil, Lost in Space, & So Much MORE!  Follow Coy Jandreau:  Tik Tok: https://www.tiktok.com/@coyjandreau?l... Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/coyjandreau/?hl=en Twitter:  https://twitter.com/CoyJandreau YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCwYH2szDTuU9ImFZ9gBRH8w https://www.patreon.com/thereelrejects Follow Us On Socials: https://www.instagram.com/reelrejects/  https://www.tiktok.com/@thereelrejects?lang=en Support The Channel By Getting Some REEL REJECTS Apparel! https://www.rejectnationshop.com/ Music Used In Manscaped Ad:  Hat the Jazz by Twin Musicom is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution 4.0 license. https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/4.0/ POWERED BY @GFUEL Visit https://gfuel.ly/3wD5Ygo and use code REJECTNATION for 20% off select tubs!! Head Editor: https://www.instagram.com/praperhq/?hl=en Co-Editor: Greg Alba Co-Editor: John Humphrey Music In Video: Airport Lounge - Disco Ultralounge by Kevin MacLeod is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution 4.0 license. https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/4.0/ Ask Us A QUESTION On CAMEO: https://www.cameo.com/thereelrejects Follow TheReelRejects On FACEBOOK, TWITTER, & INSTAGRAM:  FB:  https://www.facebook.com/TheReelRejects/ INSTAGRAM:  https://www.instagram.com/reelrejects/ TWITTER:  https://twitter.com/thereelrejects Follow GREG ON INSTAGRAM & TWITTER: INSTAGRAM:  https://www.instagram.com/thegregalba/ TWITTER:  https://twitter.com/thegregalba Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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I'm not gonna say it! I'm not gonna say it! We almost caught him! We almost got him! Down to the wire! So close. Welcome to Second Home Hollywood. This is, that's a great question. We are here teaming up with multi-house studios

and I am honored today to welcome the great Jared Harris. In the Urban Jungle. In the Urban Jungle. I used to read comic books and I was a kid a lot. Did Garfield do three Spider-Man's or two? Two, he was supposed to do a third. I read the second one. Oh, okay.

Yeah, the one with the lizard man in it. Yeah, you were always my head canon for the MCU Dr. Otto Octavius. And then Alfred Molina's No Way Home messed that up because now he's already met an Otto. Oh, well, you can't, I mean, you wouldn't want to go in his footsteps. Yeah, Alfred Malina is a titan of that space. So, yeah, I haven't really seen those things. I mean, the one time that that happened is you have to go to an office and sit in a room, sign in, sit down. You can't walk out.

You have to have the script there. Read it while you're there. You can't make any notes. you can't take any pictures. Yeah. It's all like top secret stuff, which I think is kind of ridiculous. Well, that ties directly into my opening.

Those fucking comment books are out there. Yeah, we have the source material at the store. Yeah. So the fandom audience at Real Rejects is very strong, and you've been a part of the lot of fandoms with Resident Evil, with Robot Chicken, Sherlock Holmes became huge, and by way of Watchmen,

I consider you part of the big two because you did Morbius for Marvel and then you were a voice in The Watchman animated freighter. Yeah. So you're canon and all of it. I auditioned for, for Rorschach for the Watchman.

That's actually one of my regrets. It was the Watchman miss? I would love to have done that one, yeah. I was wondering about that. I heard you loved Rorschach and I always find I revisit that comic and he's a new person to me. Every time I get a little older, there's a different Rorschach coming back at me.

What draws you to Rorschach as you've read him over the years of those originals? He's a complete nut job, and yet he makes complete sense. In fact, he's the person who actually sees clearly what's happening and has an extreme response or an answer to it. And of course, because you know,

you find out a bit about what his background was that you understand what's driving that behavior, which is also fascinating. But someone who's that far out on the edge, but also has a very clear understanding and rule, if you like, about how they perceive the world. I mean, in a way, that's the same thing that works for sugar in no country for old men is that they have a, they have a rule about how they approach

what happens. They're the standard. Do you know what I mean? Yeah. So it kind of makes you feel as though you're fascinated by characters like that because they're not, it's not random, you know, and I said maybe one feels as though that if you can understand what the rule is, you have a chance of surviving. It's the same thing with Lector, you know? Yeah, it's beautiful through line. I always felt like he was my Tyler Durden where when I was a kid, I thought he was just cool, and then I realize the negativity of that insanity and how he becomes the antagonist as you mature in the book. And I always found like Hunter S. Thompson reminded me of Roershack and how I wonder when I look back at Hunter as I get older, how that perception is going to change. Because these figures

of madness you're drawn to, but like what is it about you that's drawn to them? And I feel like fandom is a beautiful thing for that, these morality tales with these villains. Is there any fandom that you're invested in that might surprise people? Like, is there anything that you're devotedly reading or wandering in? I just want to say this is a slight repose purposing of a quote in Northern Ireland, but madness is the only sane response to the world once you understand what's going on. I really loved the Histart material books.

Yeah. They were fantastic. They really, that was the first time, like, probably since I read the Lord of the Rings trilogy books, I just got so completely immersed into, you know, this fantasy world that just, it lived in one's mind in such clarity. Okay, fair. I want to stick with comics thing because I definitely know those and I love that you love them

I heard you love death lock. I love death lock. Deathlock's one of my favorites, man. He's so ridiculous. I can't wait for that to happen. Yeah. What do you think makes Death Lock so unique in that era of Cyborg 90s? Like Marvel did a lot of those but Deathlock like resonates and stays true to himself. What do you think his rule is like Shagor? Well, he he represents the conflicts, which is interesting in light of what's going on with all these union negotiations of a conflict between humanity and technology. So he's constantly at war with himself, arguing with his other side of his cybernetic brain, right, about how to pursue his goals and what the correct response is.

And each of them is, in a way, it's struggling to find, to reconnect with his humanity, which obviously he's lost because half of his body's gone and he's like this, you know, sort of weird mix of the Terminator and the $6 million man and he's like some strange mix of all this stuff. And it's an example or a cipher of what we are as people trying to come to terms with, which is how do we live with increasing levels of technology in our world as it's starting to do things for us, take over for us, remove us from experiences. And he's the physical representation of that, because he's physically being... Yeah. And then on the flip side, I know you love Swamp Thing.

And to me, he's the other side of that coin. He's nature to humanity. And I've always seen them as kind of like parallel in an interesting way that DeathLock is technology taking over humanity and humans are taking over the planet. And Swamp Thing, the Green, he's always fighting the green. What's your first memory of the moment Swamp Thing hit for you? Because he's like poetry.

There's like prose in it. Well, I mean, there's the Alan Moore ones. The first series was, you know, quite supernatural and dealt with the occult. And so, and it was, it kind of touched on those old comics that used to read like creepy and eerie and stuff like that. And then the second one is this sort of wild, metaphysical, existential journey. Yeah. Sort of not too dissimilar to the Odysseus' journey. It's the Odyssey, essentially, right?

Separated from the woman he loves and he travels all throughout the union. university trying to find his way back to her, which is Odysseus' journey over 10 years at the end of the Trojan War. But with Barry Windsor-Smith art, and just stunning storytelling in between. And I'm just doing some crazy things. You know, and of course there's also the element of the sort of Frankenstein monster, that he is his own monster. Yeah. And that he's, again, it's interesting as there's a theme in that he's, he doesn't have a perfect memory of who he was. And he's trying to discover that, which is what's bringing him to her. Yeah, that's the pole, which is beautiful for an actor to portray.

Like, that movie, it's been interesting to see a lot of actors come out saying, like, Swamp Thing's the one I want. Like, I just talked to Vincent Dinoffrio about him wanting to be Swamp Thing out for James Mangold. He'd be great. He'd be beautiful. And, like, the power in that voice. But what would you want to bring of yourself to a Swamp Thing if the D.C. stars aligned?

Well, they won't, but. I can see it, man. I want it. Well, the one that I was interested is the second half of that story, was that sort of the Odysseus journey. Yeah. But I think the first half of that of the Alan Moore thing would be quite tough to do. I mean, what that culminates in, I don't know if you remember, I don't know.

The end of the Alan Moore feels the almost. The first half of the, because it's two sections to it. Oh, right. There's two giant omnibuses. Yeah. The is the first ending. The first one is the conflict between good and evil. Right.

Right. And the ending kind of goes in a very Neal game in place. It feels almost sandmany in its abstraction, if I remember correctly. Incredibly abstract, but also you then go into almost like Eastern mysticism is like one can't exist without the other. Which I think could translate if they got the right visual director. Yeah, I'm not sure. It ends in a big handshake.

Yeah, I don't know if the audience would go like, we've gone through this. Hey, I forgot about that ending because I didn't accept it as a kid, I think. I think my brain was like, no, no, there's got to be more. We're talking about fandoms, and I adore the Dumbledore your dad played, and I think that that fandom is so powerful. Since you love fantasy and the fandoms, what was it like for you to watch your dad play? I think one of the best translations of a book to screen.

Yeah, I was disappointed. Obviously, he died. And I think that, and Gambon was wonderful. But I know that he would have enjoyed the part more and more as it became more complicated than you realized as how sort of deeply behind the events he was from the very beginning. I think he would have liked all that.

The storytelling was almost done through the eyes of the younger characters and one of this clever things that they did is as those characters aged and their perceptions of the world became more complicated, the story becomes more complicated and become nuanced

and became more dangerous. I think he would have enjoyed that. My favorite, one of the movies, is Goblet of Fire. Yeah, that book's my favorite of all of them. The actual scope of a Tri-Wizard tournament made it feel so real. But also, you know, somebody dies, and that's when it gets real. You know what I mean? And it's a kid who dies.

Right. I talked about this. I talked about this was people several times, which is the genius of the Spielberg endures is that he killed a kid the second person who dies and as soon as you do that everything all the rules are off the table because you know you're not allowed to do that you know i try to explain once to direct it was that while we're making a kid's movie or an adult's movie and i said let's imagine there's a swimming pool and the bottom of the swimming pool's full of piranha at the bottom of the swimming pool there's an adult there's someone trying to get out right and they've got

60 seconds of air left. If a child dives into the water to save them, they're going to get out, okay, because you can't have a kid eaten by piranhas. And if an adult jumps in, you know, okay, the adult could be killed. Yeah. That's the difference between the two films, and what Spielberg is, but no, everyone's fair game in this movie. I love that, because that's what I feel like the Marvel and DC approach finally is with comic book characters. They finally realize that there have to be stakes, and the movies that don't have stakes don't work. The movies that have the kid jump in, we don't see anymore. And the ones that are breaking your hearts our guardians.

Yes, you have to say that I mean, it's one of the problems that they got into eventually on Game of Thrones as plot armor for the characters, which is, you know, at some point you're going to have to start sacrificing people, characters to go so that you realize that nobody's safe in this world. That actually brings me to my next point.

I love this interview to have Tom Green on the Larry King show. It was a beautiful interview, and I love seeing Tom Green so focused and in, but you talked about things that frighten you should drive you, this force behind being afraid in your career. Do you use that thought process and other walks of life where you're drawn to things that make you go, like, I don't know, and it pushes you that way?

Well, I was younger. Fair. You know what I mean? Now you don't bounce. That's true, man. It's harder to get up every day. Do you find that that fear, when you're working, fades when you find the character?

Is there a switch when once you found it and it registers that the fear goes away and then you're embodying something else? No, and the reason is, I think there's just like a misconception, and it would be this, is that, you know, you can do all the research you want. You know, you can live as the character. If you're paying a sort of, you know, a Nova Scotia fisherman, you can go to Nova Scotia,

and you can work on fishing boats, you know, for months of time, whatever, and really feel you understand that well and everything. But you don't actually know who the character is until you do it. Yeah. And once you, as soon as you start doing it, it informs you, immediately starts to,

inform you with information about who this person is and what they're experiencing and what they're feeling and how they're reacting to, because you don't, you can't plan all that stuff. Right. You know, you've got an idea of where things might go. There's an excitement and a fear about what that's going to be like. I'm in front of the camera figuring this stuff out in real time and being recorded. You know, that's why take two and three are so useful.

Is that why you like the idea of fear and auditioning, like you're wanting to audition for that rush of the unique. This is my getting one chance to deliver these five pages that are the entire encompassing version of the character that I'm bringing. I don't think I was a very good auditioner. But yes. I mean, first of all, any day with acting in is a good day.

So if you're auditioning, you're acting. Yeah. You know, that's fun. And you don't know what's gonna happen. You know, again, you have a plan about how this might go, but then, Sometimes you do your plan and you're disappointed. Right.

And other times it goes off somewhere else and it's great. Yeah, the spontaneity of the room is so unique. I think Zoom was really tricky for a lot of actors for three years, just trying to get that energy. Yeah, and make a connection with people and talk to people. You know, I audition for Mad Men and I was given two scenes, I think, or three scenes. They changed all the names of the characters because they don't want you to get an idea because the pages are sort of, they're out there in the world.

So I didn't know who I was having these, would eventually be having these scenes with. They don't give you the script, so you've got really nothing to go on, and all I saw was this person who was offering the same job to two people. Right. So my mind, I thought, well, he's a Machiavel.

There was no explanation for why he was doing this, but he was fucking with these people. And when I auditioned, after I did the first one, Matt said, no, no, no. Why does everyone keep doing it like this? No. He goes, that's not what this is. What this is is, is you've been told to offer this job to these two people,

and you think it's a stupid idea, but that's what you've been told by your bosses. So you're doing it, but it's a stupid, it's a stupid, it's like some idea of, like, creating competition within the workplace, and it's a stupid idea. Yeah. Right? So you have to then immediately come out with a completely different, character, which again then goes back to when I was at drama school, the principal of our drama school said, you know, you aren't going to have weeks of rehearsal to

prepare anything. You have to learn how to sketch. Yeah. Because you might have 30 seconds or three minutes to come up with something and you've got to be able to like, okay, this is what this idea is and have an outline and then do it. So that's essentially what happened. I love that. You have to be so on your feet. Yeah. And it's, and it kind of suddenly the character was, there was a kind of humor to the character because he was in this stupid situation as well. But that wouldn't have happened, really, probably. If it was through a tape or a Zoom,

there's no opportunity there. Well, I want to land on the Mad Men Chernobyl of it all. But first, I was looking at the insane directors you've worked with. And it's a staggering Fincher, Ritchie, Mann, Soderberg, Spielberg, Jarmouche, Reitman, some of my all-time favorite directors. So I want to go back, like, reverse chronologically.

But I want to start with one of my favorite films that not enough people talk about. Man from Uncle is, I think, one of the best spy films ever made, including the bonds, the Borns, the Mission Impossible's. But there's this kinetic energy that Guy Ritchie has that manages to be on and off the rails at the same time, where you feel like it could tip, but he's got this pace. What are his sets like?

Is it more precision or more chaotic? Very relaxed. Yeah, I mean, he's not a person who flaps or is flustered at all. The Army actually plays beautifully on the guitar. So he was, the two of them were jamming together and he was helping guy learn. That's what we're doing in the tent, waiting for setups. On Sherlock Holmes, he was playing chess. So the opposite of the energy of the movie, he's just like a piece to him.

And he's basically, he really respects, he doesn't grind his crew down. You always end early on a Friday, you know, so they can have a weekend. There's just never any stress. Speaking of Sherlock. And it's fun. You know, the most important thing is, like he wants, there's always a sense of invention and fun happening, you know what I mean? And he finds things that make him have a little tinkle of humor and a response to it.

And so there's a lot of flexibility, certainly from my experience on those two, there's a lot of flexibility, I mean, including in terms of the script. I mean, on Sherlock Holmes, you pretty much shot the end at the first thing I did, about the second or third thing I did. And it was that, it was 15 pages long, unpacking the whole script of a story you haven't done yet. So you haven't lived the thing you're describing. Yeah. I mean, and so you're not, what are you referring to?

And, but he and Robert had a really clear idea about what it was they were going to be doing, you know. And we sat in Robert's trailer and we had lived and improvised for about five or six hours. And we came up with about six pages and then we started to shoot that. Wow. And then, you know, then we kind of rehearsed again over the next couple of days and got more of it together. But, and of course it was not the sort of exposition heavy thing that the 15 pages had been previously about explaining everything. Yeah, you found a flow with the creators all in the day. Like, that's a beautiful way to make art.

Yeah, I think that's an approach that Robert and Guy both had, which is, you know, remove the exposition from the plot as much as possible. so that you don't the audience aren't left confused but audiences are really smart and that's the thing that I think isn't given credit to in terms of the people approach that people have they tend to think less of their audience we've been watching narrative since we were infants yeah and and there's a natural human instinct to create narrative when you see something you see somebody who's you know doing up their shoe and and pick something up off the ground on the street is just your waking to cross the street and you immediately invent a story. Right. As you see it happen, we cannot help doing it. You don't need to give too many clues. Yeah. We are doing it.

And if you give the right clues, subtly enough, we'll be there. And in the meantime, they wanted to focus on the relationships between the characters. And that's why I think they worked so well. It was that brilliant dynamic between Robert and Jude. And I feel like Moriarty is one of the most iconic villains, but it was able to be so subversive in that it wasn't the exposition version. It was able to be about the relationship and wasn't able to be out that flow

that you guys made on the day. But when you first got the idea of playing Moriarty, how much of your preconceived notions of like what Sherlock is to Moriarty, what did you want to bring to it to make it unique since he is so iconic? Well, I remember the conversations that we did I had with them, which was a sort of very nervy conversation

to have was you're going to have to do something that you're not predisposed to doing, which is the only way this character is going to make stay viable throughout the story is he cannot lose in his encounters with Sherlock Holmes every single time. And that's the way that they would do it with, here's your main character, and then you meet off of the person and someone either has the last line or they beat them in some situation and that person keeps coming back. You go, you're not going to be able to maintain that credibility with the audience. He has to actually be on the same par, particularly

because at the end of the film, Sherlock decides that the only way he can resolve the situation and beat this person, is to take him with him. Yeah. So he actually has to be more dangerous than Sherlock Holmes. And the reason is he has no moral compass, which means he can do anything. And Sherlock's moral compass is a weakness because there's certain things he can't do.

Right. It's the venom to Spider-Man problem. He's more dangerous than Sherlock Holmes. Now, is that the draw for you as an actor to play? I know you like to be in a position that you've not played before. Was that a big, compelling reason to take on that role? You know, I hadn't done something like that before. I really loved Guy's movies and a big fan of Robert, so I knew Jude a little bit.

You know, the screenplay, I was told immediately, listen, everything's going to change, but here's the sort of the building blocks of it, you know? Yeah. And then I was told, listen, you're going to sit down with Guy and with Robert, and you'll be able to work this story out, this character out between the two of you and find a version of this character that makes sense for you as well. And Guy's thing as well was

this is the first Uber supervillain. You know, in literature, Conan Doyle creates this, this, the first Uber villain. He's the first version of Blofeld or whatever you want to make that. And in that sense, he's, we want him to be iconic. So going to Spielberg, another insane performance.

I loved your grant. This role is not an easy one. and when you play someone historical in fiction or non-fiction, is the script more important to you, or do you try to get so much of the non-fiction elements of the character that you can find to shape them? I mean, the most important element of that was Spielberg and then Daniel DeLewis, you know?

Sure. So, yeah, you're going to leap up and down at the opportunity. And then Grant, I had what everybody else has is this sort of completely misguided, conventional, wisdom understanding of who this person was and when I did the deep dive on him you realize that he's probably one of the most maligned historical figures in American history should be really the quintessential American success story you know I mean when the war breaks out he's selling firewood at the side of the

road to help feed his family and eight years later he's president yeah an amazing story but largely his story was written by the people who lost the war. Right. And, you know, a year after the war ends, J.G. Pollard writes the lost cause narrative, when it's the beginning of that, the reframing of what the whole war is about, which people are still confused about today. And part of that was to really, you know, trash and destroy Grant's reputation and his legacy.

But if you go to any military academy in the world, his campaigns are taught. And his Vicksburg campaign is considered on par with Napoleon's campaign, his Austrian campaign. Wow. So I went and did all that, did all this research, I read his memoirs, and then you come back and then, you know, similarly, well, the similar thing happened with the Warhol is, well, you have all this information, but you really only need about 5% of it. Is that a benefit for you, though, as an actor, to get to learn the 95% you don't get you you get to grow?

Yeah. I mean, again, the principal at my drama school said, when the pianist sits down at the piano, you don't play all the notes at once, you know? You play chords, you play notes, but the notes that you play resonate off the ones you aren't playing. Oh, I love that. Yeah, I love that, especially for gathering information. I love to have the butterfly effect of life because things you learn from that are going

to affect the rest of your work, not just that work. Was there anything all these years later, I think it's been like nine years since that movie, a direction from Spielberg that really struck a chord that resonates under your other work? Yeah, I mean, the thing that I, a couple of things I got for him. One was just pure joy. The pure joy of filmmaking. You can see that that, that enthusiasm and love that was there in his earlier work and as a kid almost, it's right there every single time. He's just so excited. Yeah. There is a pleasure and a joy and enthusiasm and excitement. I mean, I remember at one point they were resetting some of the background and this troop, a cavalry troop had to go

and reset. And as they whirled around and they went back, the guy had the flag flattering like this as the whole thing went by and he just went, oh boy, that just never, my heart stirs every time I see that. And he was incredibly accessible. I was really, I mean, the biggest star on a Spielberg set, it's always Spielberg, you know? I mean, everybody wants to talk to him because he's shaped these incredible experiences

of everybody's life. And he, you know, with, I mean, obviously he's got a job to do, but he's available, he's accessible, you know, and he understands that. And the other thing that I got from him was movement. always movement and he's looking to how he can describe what's happening through, I mean,

obviously through the dialogue and the character, but also through movement, either through the character or through moving the camera. But he's, he's constant, the story's always in momentum, always. There was one point where, it's a scene that didn't make it in and it's after they've had the vote and grants, it's been passed and he realizes that the war is going to continue and that probably means another million people dead or something, half a million people dead. And I knew that Grant was hoping for my research that Lincoln would agree to see the peace commissioners from the South that the war could come to an end earlier. He's told to keep them there. And that means more people are going to die. And the way that Spielberg decided to tell that

moment was he gets the message. He turns around, leans, leaned against the post, staring out, and then with his hand behind his back picked up his hat and turned around and put his hat on and then, okay, back to business. Motion. You know? Yeah, that's beautiful. I love that. Another director that I think really understands a frame in motion, maybe my favorite director, not to pick favorites, but David Fincher has meant the world to me forever. And I think that Benjamin Button is one of those films that will be rediscovered every take. 10 years by new people and the movie itself just has this this beating heart of open emotionality and I think that comes from the repetition Fincher does I think he finds things

in his actors did you discover anything about your process in the way he shoots since he does it so differently and so many times yeah I'm gonna go quickly back to the Spielberg thing because the other thing that I think people don't appreciate is he's got an incredible sense of humor oh yeah yes and and a lot of the things that you find I mean like the um when And Michael Stilberg, when he, as Yeoman, he gives his vote. I mean, I asked Michael about that. And he said, no, it was just written as I say I. And he was just one line.

And Spielberg said, like, okay, the first time, just mouth it. Second time, whisper it. And then the third time, leap up, you know? Right? Yeah. He's got great, and an understanding of how you can use humor to release tension. But if you've used humor, you don't lose all of that tension. Do you know what I mean?

You can come back again. It's that diaphragm thing where if you're too tense, you don't get to experience it, so either laugh or cry, and I think Jurassic Park really finds that, like, moments of brevity. Actually, someone, again, a fantastic sense of humor, quite wicked, his sense of humor, and incredibly protective. I mean, you know, obviously he's famous for doing all these takes and everything. I loved it, because you never went home feeling that you left an idea unexplored. Yeah. If there is any pressure coming onto the set, from because there's an expectation about schedules whatever doesn't get to

anybody else he's the person who says it stops here with him and you're all good don't worry about it and I was really touched by his friendship with Brad as well I mean they're there's very sweet they mean they had this really a very touching camaraderie with each other they had a sort of shorthand for talking to one another and you know almost like nicknames I think I felt that very really sweet I do remember my first proper seen there were about 40 cameras like that and I'm looking at it trying to figure out what this was the fucking camera like where do I where do I where do I pitch my

performance you know and he went oh yeah sorry it's a little bit like science experiment he goes yeah that's the camera these are all reference cameras and basically he said don't do anything for the first 10 takes just get a good idea of what's happening around you, you know, settle in because I erase all the first ones and I'm going to, I wait until I, you know, the camera's moving, I've got background moving, I've got picture cars moving.

So once I've orchestrated all of that, so it's happening in the way that I'm happy with, then I'll say now I'm gonna be keeping these ones. So just settle in and watch and have an idea of what you can use and then I'll let you know when to start like, because if you give you the performance on take four, I'm erasing it.

That's genuine play. That's really cool to be like in a space where he can almost like a stage in that way. The dark joy of David Fincher is one of my favorite things about his work. I think that Fight Club is one of the best comedies of all time. It's completely misread and I love that movie. But I find Captain Mike is very much a David Fincher type to me.

Like that character's got a dark joy to him and he's an artist. There's a lot of that to me. Was that a development with him? Did you guys go through that? When I auditioned and after I was given the role and I talked to him, He just said, I went and did a sort of camera test,

and he went and said, just somewhere here, you know, it's not here, somewhere right there, maybe you can't quite see it on your peripheral vision, is John Belushi and Animal House. I love that note, just off center. Just like, right, you can't quite catch it there, right there. Oh, that's perfect. What a great note to drive.

Yeah. Yeah, his work is so consistently, like the type of laugh you got out of his work, is so unique to his work. And another one that I love is Stephen Soderberg's comedy, I feel like, is also very unique to him. And it's almost like a play of an ensemble without leads, but he casts all leads.

And it's a really unique thing to see a director grab 20 of the biggest people and let them go at it. Is the set as spontaneous as it feels, or is it precise, and then you let him run? Yeah, I mean, I remember showing up, I mean, that was just one scene. And he operated the camera. to the camera and he just basically said I'm going to try and stretch this out to lunchtime.

Oh, that's what I want. That's what I wanted to hear. That's amazing. That's what it feels like. Yeah. And then we ad-libbed different things at the end because it was all about censorship and, and was he rapping. He was rapping, wasn't he? Yeah, it was censorship and like, you can't say this, you can't say that. And then I came up with that line like, well, now. that is gratuitous. And it was all to make you go to lunch and it all got to stay and play. That's amazing. Well, that actually, I was thinking Soderberg led directly into Mr. Deeds for me, for whatever reason. And I was thinking that same kind of chaotic spontaneity that somehow feels precise.

When working with the powerhouses like Adam Sandler and Winona Ryder doing comedy in that way, John Tituro, is it something where you come in with a plan and then you have to let it go? Or is it something where the comedy allows you to play the character you intended? Well, I mean, I do remember that really clear as well. I remember the auditioning for it. I had a pretty good idea of the ridiculousness of that character. Sure. It's a lot.

But then when you get to set, you know, Adam is, I think, very unusual in that for a comedian, in that he wants other people to be funny. You know, I remember auditioning for a movie called National Security, and I was told not to be funny because, you know, the main... I wouldn't like that. Sure. And I said, I don't know what to do. I prepared my audition.

Like, you know, I've got to do it the way I prepared it. You know, but I'll just, you'll decide. And I auditioned. He went, that was very funny, Jared. So. Yeah. But Adam's son wanted to be funny. He'd show up every day.

He wasn't in the scene. He'd still be there. He's looking for jokes. He's looking for jokes from other people. Like, if you say this, that'll be funny. If that person does this, this person who's just got one line, do it this way, and that'll get a lot. You know what I mean?

He was so excited when other people brought stuff and did stuff that helped keep the momentum going, keep the comedy ball up in the air, you know? I think that's pretty rare. Doing punch-ups on your day off is incredible. That's love. That's film. That's beautiful.

And that also brings me to Ivan Reitman, who notoriously was able to punch up on the day all the time. And you worked on a movie with not just Ivan Reitman, but also the geniuses of Billy Crystal and Robin Williams. I cannot imagine the energy on that set. What was it like to be? That's like the height of everyone's power and energy. What was that like?

Robin was just the king, man. He was just so lovely. Just such a, you know, I mean, I remember we were shooting a scene. It was in the casino, and I think it's in that room with all the slot machines in it. And it's taken a while, and we're doing it different ways. And Ivan's got a lot of different ways he might put the scene together. So he did it once on a steady camera.

that might go the whole way through, then he did some more conventional coverage because, you know, it's all about rhythm and you don't know what you're going to need at that point in the story. So, you know, he's giving himself options. So it took half a day to do. And obviously it's Robin Williams,

and he's sitting there and he's chatting to extras and stuff like this. And somehow one of the extras tools was leaving, he was like looking at his watch, he's hoping we get done because he had to get on the plane to go back east because his mother was sick or something like that. We had to reshoot this scene about, I don't know, months later. Robin saw that extra, went up to them and said, how's your mom?

Wow. That is beautiful. Oh, what a beautiful soul. That's amazing. I love that. I think that film is one of those ones that I told you this weekend. I went back and watched a lot of 90s stuff, and it's really beautiful to watch that era of comedy with those two

and just the heart of Billy Crystal and Robin Williams is so apparent on screen. Yeah, and they, you know, they improvise. and they'd get told off because they were improvising too much. And I would say, you know, can we just do the scripts? You know, okay, we'll do the script. You know, I'm obviously difficult reining these guys in because they keep sensing sniffing funny here, sniffing funny there, you know. And then, of course, it's difficult because, you know,

I think as a director, one of the object lessons that you would have is you look at Peter Sellers' later comedies because they don't work. and the reason they don't work is the first couple of takes he'd do the script and then he wouldn't do that again because he'd build on a joke and he get the laugh from the crew

and then he'd build on that joke and get the laugh from the crew then he'd build on that joke and get the laugh from the crew but so then you end up you've lost that narrative thread yeah the thread's not so you've got to there's like a discipline between finding the humour but also maintaining that tension of the narrative

you know and I just remember Ivan you know he obviously wanted them to improvise but the same time it's like you know we have to be improvised I guess he's trying to improvise with a sense of the need of the narrative

was yeah there's a vector back in that and then Louis Lombardi and I we were like oh we can improvise he got told if you're going off of this shit he goes you look like two actors who's just trying to get more screen time yeah we are that's pretty much

Well, I want to dip into drama before we head to TV because you also were in a Jim Jarmouche film and I feel like Dead Man is a wonderful bit of poetry. Dead man. Do his scripts read like poetry? Like the movies do. What script?

Okay, that's what I was thinking. Well, I didn't get a script. That came about because we, I did a movie called Blue in the Face. Blue in the Face came about because of the rehearsals for smoke. So smoke was about this sort of group of, there's a cigar store in Brooklyn. And the rehearsals were improvising. And Paul Oster and Wayne Wang said,

God, this is great, we should do this movie, right? So after we'd shot Smoke, they persuaded Harvey to give us, we'll give them half a million dollars, to go and do this improvised film called Blue in the Face based around these characters. And then of course, you know, Madonna is involved, RuPaul was involved, Michael J. Fox was involved, Roseanne was involved Jim Jarmouche was involved yeah and at the rap party I made a big

enough fool of myself dancing with Mel Gorham that he went I think this guy would be fun and he then asked me to come and do Dead Man and though basically all he said is there's no script what it is you three are like your fur trappers out in the wilderness and Johnny's character comes in finds your camp and there's a there's a fight over baked beans or something and then you shoot Billy Bob in the foot and then all of you die but there's a big argument that you die and it was really left to Iggy and Billy Bob and myself to come up with okay well who are these people but and then Iggy was in the dress so we were like some lunatic nuclear family out in in the American West so I was the truculent stroppy teenager Billy Bob

was the dad and Iggy was the mother in the dress and we decided that we were like complete lunatics and that we had a thing of when you came across somebody lost in the wilderness whoever found them they owned them and then they could far they could lend them to the other person for trade but the pleasure of killing them came to the person who found them because we were all fucking cereal, nutcase cereal. Yeah. Right? So then that's what the argument was going to be about.

It's like who actually was going to kill it whilst the guy's there. It's like what are these guys talking about? Who's going to, I found him so I get to kill him, right? That is a beautiful way to come up with the narrative just on the day like kids playing in the woods, because it is. And then we took what we had to Johnny and improvised with Johnny. And then of course he came up all this brilliant stuff as well. And around that same time, you're in two movies that I think have been on more college dorm room walls than Scarface. Between natural born killers and Iggy goes down, I don't think I've

ever seen more of the Blockbuster era. Oh, everywhere. Really? Igney. Is it? I'm from Boston, so I feel like that type of school kid loved that movie. And I'm not if it's unique to the northeast, but I saw more there. I hope Byrne knows that because that would please him so much. Oh, it did really well in my college just like experience. Because it was a sort of cinematic catcher in the wry. Yeah. Yeah. And it's like it's a good angry kid trying not to be angry experience. And I feel like those two movies were long enough ago. I know you watch a lot of movies. When you rewatch things from that part of your career, is it you remembering on set or do you get to actually watch them now? That is long enough ago that I can, the onset experience

doesn't intrude too much any longer. That era of filmmaking, I think, is so unique to the spontaneity of like the voyeuristic director, but also the people at the time because we were coming down from the 80s into the more aggressive 90s. And I think another movie you did, which I love as an Irishman, Patty in Far and Away, is this wonderful fantasy escape of like to be American

and have things work and not work. With your dad being Irish, was that something that pulled you to that script because it's so much about that story? No, I mean, at that point, I was just trying to get my, I mean, my first, I'd done a movie already, but I was just trying to do my first American movies

at that point. And I got Lascahans and Far and Away in the same phone call. Wow. So I was thrilled. And it obviously is working with Ron and I've seen a lot of his movies and obviously Tom Cruise is major, major, major, major.

Yeah, I mean, my memories of that are shooting in Ireland, which was great. On the West Coast, meeting Tom for the first time and he was in a parking lot and when he smiled, it was like this, oh my God, right in front of you. because you've seen it on screen so much

as such as a major part of his persona is just immense energy that comes out of him and very positive energy that comes out of him. You know, you don't feel like there's not much is going to get in his way, you know? And very gracious, very humble, and there's two things that come to mind. One was we were staying in this town called Dingell

and we were there over a weekend and we'd arranged to play a little football, match with the locals and I said to Tom you know we're going to go play footies you want to come play footies said I don't I know I can't I don't know to play I went don't worry about it we're playing with kids you know he said well I said listen we tell you they're still talking in this town about Ryan's daughter about Robert Mitchum and Trevor Howard sitting in those seats in the pub come and play football they'll they'll talk about it for the next hundred years yeah and he showed up

And he played with the locals, with the kids. And that night at the bar, one of the kids was standing by at the end of the bar, and his dad was the barman. And all night long, he went, Dad, Dad, Dad, Dad, Dad. He goes, what? I played footy with Tom Cruise. I know. Dad, Dad, Dad, Dad, Dad, Dad, what? I played footing with Tom Cruise.

And I guarantee he still talks about it. I guarantee somewhere in Dingle that guy attends bar. Yeah, I mean, it was just very sweet. And then the other thing that happened was we were doing this thing where it was that scene where we had the big fight on the hillside and we were trying to figure out how do we get from that field further down. And so we just came up with this thing that help us move the blocking. But in it, I did this thing where I ran down the hill and then leapt and kicked him, right? Yeah. But we didn't tell Ron and the producers that I was going to do that. So when they

saw me do it on a take because of their perspective it looked like I'm fucking belting him right in the stomach everybody leapt up behind camera going oh my god what's he done what the fuck's he done right and cut okay so Tom you're right he goes like yeah he goes with Chad he hit you the son he goes no he was five feet away from me because of perspective right you know he got oh great well we'll keep doing it and he goes yeah I got some great pictures and Tom says I just like a couple of days I said I'd like a couple as well and he goes okay I said I bet you you get them, and I don't. He went, I bet you you do get them. Where do you want to bet?

I said, a pint of Guinness. He goes, okay, a pint of Guinness, that you get the same pictures. Two days after I arrived home, a photograph album comes from Tom Cruise, with the pictures in. And a little note saying, you owe me a pint of Guinness. That's beautiful. So I met Tom not long ago, and I told him that the pint of Guinness is in my will. So I said, I know I owe you a pint of Guinness. So I don't know what I'm ever going to see you in other, but it's in my will. The long game. Really long game.

Yeah, I'm not gonna be a son. I'm a man of my word, post-mortem. Just like you. That's a 30-year pine again is to be delivered. That's wonderful. It's longer than that, man. Oh yeah, 92, yeah. I mean, a Michael Mann phone call that also

is a Ron Howard phone calls, a hell of a phone call. But going over to TV, those are the brief moments, but you've also lived in TV for a while, long gaming these characters, and Mad Men is, I'm gonna be totally frank, the first show that I ever formed a ritual around. I loved Mad Men so much that I started doing my laundry on Sundays and ironing and drinking whiskey and watching Mad Men. It became a tradition that I would like find like this piece and like it was just a wonderful ceremony for me.

Was there anything from that time that started to affect your day to day because you lived in such a specific period that was so clean cut that was so regimented in that world? Shaving, you have to shave every fucking day, you know. That's why you see a lot of the cast when they, in, during the. The, you know, where the break, they'd all grow beards. Just a reliever. Just the thing's shaving every goddamn day. Yeah, I mean, you know, there's a sort, you couldn't show up with dirty nails and stuff like that, you know what I mean?

And you had a, there was a very clear focus on the presentation, the visual aspect of it. And in a way, Janie Bryant was kind of the super weapon, the secret weapon of that show. because the just the way that she worked hand in hand with the set designer, they knew what color palette they were working with and they made this plan ahead of time so that they knew. I mean, if you watch it,

and you look at the way that they have play off one another, the production designer and Janie Bryant, it's just amazing. And then it was very strict in terms of the work and you weren't allowed to. obviously change anything and on my first day on set I had to do a retake because I'd left out an apostrophe. Wow that's incredible and I think in that episode where we get drunk and we and go and see the Godzilla movie and I

talk gibberish I had to do it again because I didn't say the gibberish that was in the script oh you fucking kidding me it's gibberish that's beautiful that's what it felt like and that's why the show I consider that the show So right before the streaming wars, like the Mad Men, Breaking Bad was what I think transitioned to this golden age of TV. Was there a moment you thought that? I mean, you know, the Sopranos was before that. People made plans for Sunday because of the Sopranos.

Yeah? You know, and what's interesting was the wire was on at the same time, and it was kind of, it was overshadowed by the Sopranos. And it really wasn't until the last season of the wire that people started to cotton onto how fucking brilliant the wire was as well, you know? So, yeah, I mean, I brought that with me to the Mad Men set, the understanding of that kind of narrative. Of course, you know, Matt Weiner worked on the Sopranos.

Right. And a lot of what he learned from that and working with David Chase, he brought that to either stuff that worked on the Sopranos and stuff that didn't work. So make sure they didn't make, from their point of view, similar mistakes. Was there a moment on the set for you all that you realize what does like I shift Madden? Well, I joined in three.

But it was already that. Oh, yeah, you're right. Okay, because I remember that being everywhere. I mean, to give you an idea of I go to the premiere episode of season three, which was done at the DGA building where they were going to show, I think the first two episodes. And I mean, there's a press line and everything like that. And I, no one had seen the show yet. So the press weren't that interested in me.

So I was standing next to the head of AMC and the head of Lionsgate. And they were absolutely jonesing on. They'd made a deal with the Banana Republic, the Banana Republic shops. Yeah. And Janie Bryant had a deal to produce clothes, mad men clothes, three outfits for men,

three outfits for women that were going to be sold all across the stores across America with Mad Men's signage. And they were going three and a half miles of storefront across the USA. Can you believe that? It got amazing. They weren't talking about, like, all the Golden Globes and Emmys and nominations that they'd received and stuff like that because we're in award season as well.

It was the three and a half miles of storefront across the United States. At the premiere. That's what they understood at that point what that was going to do. I've never thought of a translation from an executive standpoint of, like, how much space we've covered with our might. That is incredible. Now, Madman, I also think led beautifully, I said into the Golden Age of TV, but Chernobyl's got this. ominous power that when people talk about it, it kind of changes the tone of the conversation. We actually have this in honor of you, this Geiger counter right here. It's an actual Geiger

counter. 3.6. I'm not good. With the ominous nature of the show and the ominous nature of when it was airing, because it came out in 2019, what did you do to stay like joyous? Like how you're a very like, you enjoy life and that show and the world was dark. Well, you know, Stellan and Emily are just great fun. always just they go to that other place you know because you can't stay in that spot the whole time yeah because then you get numb so for you have to go and distract your mind in between setups I mean unless someone has got some like really really massively wrenching emotional thing and then you leave them alone you know because they they try and they try and

keep it like hovering near them, but not right there. But on that one, yeah, we would just entertain one another. And, you know, it was also during the, I think it was the World Cup, so England were playing Sweden. So there was a lot of good rivalry between Stell and Johann, Emily, and myself. Yeah, you just keep it light, you know, whilst you're on set. Also, it was fascinating because the sets were amazing. You know, we shot at an actual nuclear power station at Ignalina,

which is the same model as the RBMK reactor as the one at the Chernobyl site. It was also an intense schedule, so you also didn't have time to... Really dwell too much. Yeah, you had to get moving. You're on to the next one, onto the next one. I mean, I shot three quarters of my role

in the first four weeks. Wow. That's incredible. Yeah. That is a lot of intense work. Yeah. Now, you directed an episode of Mad Men. I did.

And you've also worked a lot of these directors, What? Do you want to direct again? Is there anything you want to do? Yeah, I mean, you know, yes, I do. I would. There's a few things that I'd like to do. I have total respect for what directors do, though. And I think the, as we sort of move forward into this technological, technological age, there's a greater and greater, you have to have a bigger understanding of what that is. I mean, you know, I, on foundation, I work with Alex Graves and just his understanding of what he wants to see. what he needs is just so exact um i mean he's a joy to work with he's great fun and he knows exactly what he needs and yet he's also alive too i didn't think you were going to do that hang on a second i'm going to have to just give me a second whilst i recalibrate how i'm going to get this

because i need to get that you know so he's alive to what's happening but as other directors they sit there and they go well i've got my storyboards so you know no if it's not you have to in the storyboard you're standing over there and you like you've looked to the right a bit where i can see silhouetted in the window. So learning from directors on the day is only going to improve the whole experience for the set answer, your view of it. Yeah, so yeah, I would. I would. Although, to be fair, to be honest, rather, you know, directing an episode of Mad Men in the last season, the show at that point is more or less directing itself, right? I would suggest shots to the DP and he would go, it's great, I love it, but I'm not doing it. Because I know Matt will never

use it. Oh. So it's going to take me an hour to set this up and we've got two hours to shoot this. Yeah. So I'm not doing it because he won't use it, but it's a good idea, you know? So you got your flowers, but not your shot. Like you knew the image was there. And again, that was the point. That's why Matt could let me do it because he knew the machine was built enough that, I mean, the train had left the station and they knew what the thing was supposed to be. And my role really is I'm not going to tell John Hamm how to play Don Draper or Elizabeth Moss how to play there. But they know those characters inside out. My role would be to help the people who are just coming on for this episode to get the deer in the headlights out of their heads

because they're going, oh my God, I'm in the scene with John Hamm or Christina Hendrix. Try and get them to calm down and then try and help them find what they need to find in the part, solve problems for them and then with the regulars because they would only have gotten the script the day before or something to go and I've had it for a month to go okay this scene relates

to the scene we haven't shot yet and it ties in because this is the narrative thread that goes to there and just help them remind them of that because they've read it the night before two days before and they have the whole thing in their head and they're still trying to piece together where do I need to place some value

what do I need to put importance on That's so many spinning plates. That is a lot of moving parts. Well, one last question then I got to speed around for you. But my last question, you've enjoyed so many types of art as an artist, be it plays, be it movies as a consumer and making them. But you played Andy Warhol, who I think has one of the most unique perspectives on art I've ever heard. How did embodying him change how you view art and how do you define art? Uh, God, that's a...

I'm not gonna say it! I'm not gonna say it! We almost got him! We almost got him! We almost got him! Down to the wire. So close. Here an interesting approach,

and that was that it was called the factory for a reason, and it was conceptual, and the execution was almost not as important as the concept. So in that way, maybe a little bit like Hitchcock, because he had already made the movie in his mind and now it was just the practicality of actually you know achieving that I think that he also understood

that art could come from anywhere and you're most likely going to have to steal it from somebody else so he did you know and the whole thing with Valerie was that Valerie was upset that he'd stolen pieces out of her screenplay or manifesto and he did yeah but at the same time his was, well, you can steal from me, I don't care.

You know, and that was the whole idea of the factory was they'd all steal from each other. And if you could make something out of it, well, good for you. Yeah. I didn't see that in there, but good for you. Yeah, that was an important, a really important moment for me in my career. And I do remember, again, that was one of those examples

where I did a load of research and then went back to the script and only needed about 10% of it. But what was useful was when something didn't work on set and Mary wanted to try and change it, I go, well, we could do this because you remember there was this moment when this happened with Warhol and went, okay, that's good. Now she, being a documentarian, knew all of the references that I was referring to. So she'd go, okay, yeah, that's a good idea, let's do that, change it slightly. But the other thing that I got out of that was he was a tremendous gossip. And for a while, I became a huge gossip.

And I'm not a gossip in real life. But I would sit on the phone and gossip with my mother a lot. I love that it affected your day to day. I would ask her questions about her personal life that I would know. She's like, what's going on? I'm having this conversation with Jared. You're like, yeah, I know. Because he loved to find out what people were up to.

Yeah. You know, he lived vicariously. As a person, I had the idea that he was quite timid. He's very vulnerable. You see when he's standing, he's always doing the fig leaf because he's got his hand over his nuts. Yeah, he's protecting himself all times. He's very protective, and I don't think that my feeling was that he wasn't physically able, didn't feel that he was physically able to confront what was going on in the world.

And that's another reason why he needed people around him to try, as barriers towards anything bad getting towards it. I feel like he always, I love the idea that art is anything that makes you feel. And I always love that he, even if it meant stealing, made people feel. And I love that take on how he just saw it as anything that gets you there. That's what it matters. I know you're, but I do, there was one thing, I went as research, I went to the, there's a Warhol Institute in New York, and I went to go and look at something there. So they have these time capsules. So he, so much stuff would come in every day to the factory that they would put stuff in these boxes and seal them up and the boxes would have the day, the day on it, right? And he'd put his receipts in, he'd put if he went to a play or he went somewhere to the museum, whatever, he'd put the, everything that he happened during that day, put into these boxes. boxes, put into these boxes. And stuff would come in as well.

So they're opening one of these time capsules and there's a videotape. They pop the videotape in and it's Warhol. And Warhol is sitting to have his portrait done. And at that point, I was still struggling to try and get a feeling for who he was inside of the facade. He's sitting on this stool and he's, you know, in this sort of neutral pose and he's gonna have his portrait done.

This guy comes in, he's kind of in jeans and they're chatting away a little bit. and it jumps forward and the guy gets this board with the paper on it and leans it against the wall at the angle and then he takes his jeans off right and he takes his underwear off and he sticks the pencil up his ass right rubber end first and then draws starts to draw warhol's portrait with the pencil up his bum and i was like okay if he doesn't laugh now now he's dead inside right because it's fucking crazy and he'd sit there and whenever the person turned away he'd look at the other person he'd just go okay there's there's someone in

there who's commenting and understanding and this is his wall you know that's beautiful i love that so much uh so my last thing for you is is there any question that you either ask someone to get to know them better or any great question that has changed who you are philosophically what's That's your great question. I'd rather do the speed round. That's my question. That's my question. Can I do the speed round?

All right, that's his question. Okay. What's the last thing that you watched? Andor. Last thing that you read? I am reading the word is murder by Anthony Horowitz. Last thing that you saw that made you nostalgic? Not last thing I saw, but the last thing I heard is Allegra listens to this

this YouTube channel that plays like 1940s music, but as though it's coming from the other room, or there's sounds of like surf in the background, or it's like a weird, very weird, evocative thing. That's cool. Yeah. What's your comfort movie? My comfort movie, ah, I love Tootsie.

Tootsie, what's a movie you love to share with others? Kuyana Skatsi. Ooh, what's a movie or play or anything that you've been a part of that you most want other people to discover? Well, I mean, I would like people to, because it's still kind of, it's an underground cult classic, the terror. The terror, okay? The terror. So that is it, everybody. Thank you so much for being here. Thank you so much. Thank you. Absolute pleasure. I love this whole journey.