The Reel Rejects - TERMINATOR ZERO 1x5 & 1x6 Breakdown & Review!!!

Episode Date: August 31, 2024

JUDGMENT DAY BEGINS!! Terminator Zero Series Reaction Watch Along:  https://www.patreon.com/thereelrejects   After an incredible trailer, we continue with our Terminator Zero Reaction, Recap, Commentary, Analysis, Spoiler Review, Theories, Easter Eggs, & Ending Explained!! Building from the Bedrock of the previous Terminator films, Terminator Zero takes an alternate look at the Future + the events of Judgment Day - depicting both the Future of 2022: ravaged by a decades-long war between the few human survivors and an endless army of machines & Japan in 1997: in which engineer Malcom Lee works tirelessly to develop an AI system intended to compete with SkyNet.. As Judgement Day approaches, Lee finds himself and his three children pursued by an unknown robot assassin voiced by Timothy Olyphant..  The series features animation from Production I.G (Ghost in the Shell) and a voice cast that includes Timothy Olyphant, André Holland (Moonlight), Rosario Dawson (Ahsoka, Sin City), Sonoya Mizuno (House of the Dragon) Ann Dowd (The Handmaid's Tale, Hereditary), & MORE! Support The Channel By Getting Some REEL REJECTS Apparel! https://www.rejectnationshop.com/ Music Used In Manscaped Ad:  Hat the Jazz by Twin Musicom is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution 4.0 license. https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/4.0/ POWERED BY @GFUEL Visit https://gfuel.ly/3wD5Ygo and use code REJECTNATION for 20% off select tubs!! Head Editor: https://www.instagram.com/praperhq/?hl=en Co-Editor: Greg Alba Co-Editor: John Humphrey Music In Video: Airport Lounge - Disco Ultralounge by Kevin MacLeod is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution 4.0 license. https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/4.0/ Ask Us A QUESTION On CAMEO: https://www.cameo.com/thereelrejects Follow TheReelRejects On FACEBOOK, TWITTER, & INSTAGRAM:  FB:  https://www.facebook.com/TheReelRejects/ INSTAGRAM:  https://www.instagram.com/reelrejects/ TWITTER:  https://twitter.com/thereelrejects Follow GREG ON INSTAGRAM & TWITTER: INSTAGRAM:  https://www.instagram.com/thegregalba/ TWITTER:  https://twitter.com/thegregalba Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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crazy got only the finale left to go the last two episodes left to go does feel like you know kind of one of those somber chapter breaks right before some type of finale this is going to be only one season do we know I don't know if it gets an abuse well here's hoping for season two but moreover what did you

think of these two episodes what happened again in the last one that a takeover in the episode five yeah it's like Skynet fully pops off all the Enoes get repurposed and stuff

or they start yeah there isn't it it's funny a thing about binging me especially doing multiples in the same day yeah blurs together yeah I think it's I mean I feel like it's still

really good and strong and I am a bit concerned that it might be is it like doing a little too much right now because it was sort of like the first half this is going down the path that we were saying it might go

where the first half is pretty much like a Terminator anime, and then they open the door to do something very different, which they are, like they're dealing with, like, the actual discussions of what time travel really is in the Terminator universe. They're truly dealing with what is artificial intelligence, which has always existed, of course, in the DNA of Terminator. Skynet itself as AI, but they don't really delve into what is AI in the Terminator franchise that much.

it's sort of just broad strokes and I like all that and I think Masaki is a really cool addition I feel like they've come up with a lot of new Terminator characters and she's one of the coolest ones they've come up with you know is this like warrior protector design just to look after these specific children

like thematically ties in well with Terminator 2 especially with him being like a father figure designed to protect John Connor and now she's like designed literally to protect the chosen children is really cool and uh yeah i mean the stuff with kokoro and malcolm is getting is better i just kind of forget about i don't know it's like i thought it was really emotionally stronger when it was kind of just simpler and now that it's way more complex, it's appropriate

and I'd rather have a show that's attempting something different and it's still really good. I just don't know if it's going to be as strong, while it's bigger and a little bit darker, like a, it's an adjustment I think. For me, it's an adjustment because I'm just so used to a return mirror movie being

Skynet, bad! And now yeah, yeah, now we've got those like a hole. We're not going to poke that much beyond just the fact that it's sentient robots that, yeah, I want to kill us all. C.S. is the ultimate threat. Yeah, yeah, I like the ponderings, and it's still a really good-looking show. I'm into it, and I'm really into it.

Like, I really care about the characters, and I'm enjoying it a lot. I guess kind of waiting to see how, well, the last, I feel like the last couple episodes would really be more of a telling of how I feel about the direction of it. Yeah, more than stopping it. Yeah, of course, of course. I mean, I feel like this, as the stuff with Kokoro and Lee has gone on, I've appreciated it more and more when it became clear that like, oh, this is where this guy's going to be for the whole show, you know, and I sort of calibrated my brain to that. I liked, like, this is my favorite has been so far. I like their kind of chess game moving back and forth, and I'm seeing a little bit better, like how and why they maybe chose to do these.

intercutting. Not that I don't still have certain you know anything I said in the previous you know little review here certainly kind of stands still like there's certain dynamic tweaks that they could do but I do in a Terminator really appreciate that like

it's just the same goddamn no it's like the same tone it's the same tone always yeah it feels like you're watching like the same kind of scene all the time it's so detached and like chaos is happening as kids are in the streets

and even like I understand Kokoro's detachment it's it's his portrayal it's like he's so detached as well it's like I like how it feels like a watcher situation like a biblical sense but it does feel like there's nothing pulsating about their conversation if it was me I might have added some element of him being like

no I just got I gotta leave now I gotta go to the kids and then her being like, no, you're going to stay here and we're going to figure this out, or something maybe like that. I think that's a game of fate. Right now, the lives of humanity, the fate of humanity rests in this conversation, and I have to remind myself of that

because the urgency in the conversation is not present there. I felt it the most I've felt it in this episode, the sixth episode here, but I don't disagree. because like the more that they clarify like when it becomes very clear what she's done and the fact that she's got all the Eno's and he's got all the crazy footage of everything that's happening out on the streets and it's very clear to us the audience that this is all her doing and this is what's happening right now like those started to bridge that gap for me and I do like whatever turn that took of ultimately they had some turn in the conversation that ultimately well them up with the whole like you've lost somebody and the the whole like you know the the love element of humanity and and you know the ability to like i love that whole speech he gives about like you know we love to put so much meaning on these things and yet i had to kind of realize

that you know this loss that has been such a you know looming presence over the show thus far is just like a random thing and in a franchise certainly that as it's gone on has you know been largely predicated on those sweeping moments of like, ah, the big grand sacrifice and like this meaningful death of some kind. I like the way that was touched on in their

conversation and the way that that's been touched on sort of like out in the streets and stuff like that. And the, like that little exchange they have with Misaki and like the dudes in the graveyard with the robot strung up. Yeah, it's a great scene. And that's one of those things where it's like it's kind

of a happenstance and it's like, well, we could talk through this but oh we're probably not gonna um and so like the way they capture elements of human nature and the you know interplay as much as like sometimes with the one sun it's on the really on the nose the way he talks about all the you know ayes or robots or anything that's supposed to kind of have a sentient quality like they're just you know hunks of machinery like beyond i think i feel like it's more nuanced out in the rest of you know the depictions uh with other characters but uh yeah this was a show where like part way through i was sitting here going like man this is so well-paced and like they're doing all these nice philosophical things i

really like the conversations they're bothering to have it doesn't feel like they're having these at the expense of like the cool moody stuff that we want the actiony stuff that we want i like that the terminator is sparing and is always like really distinct in each episode it seems like they choose something unique to do with the terminator's presence um but this was it's weird in this chunk of episodes I had a thought of like wow this is so well proportioned like I'm really enjoying this and I'm really enjoying how the overall structure of it has been and then we got to the end of episode six and I was like oh but we only have two more and it's going to wrap up now and part of me is wondering like how that's going to feel and if it's going to feel again like the entire season as well with a proportion or if they're going to need two more episodes or if they would have needed like I feel like the length of a lot of these short series and stuff like right now you know eight to ten episodes is a great kind of length for this kind of a story and yet i often feel like shows in the streaming age don't quite nail the episode count for the overall like pace and tone of whatever the story is which i this has been

good enough so far that i'm optimistic that it will stick that landing but partly because where we are with uh the the lee character and the philosophical kind of uh point we're at there part of me feels like there's more than with all the other stuff we got to do there's more than two episodes worth to really bring that to some kind of like actual emotional slash philosophical conclusion

but I don't know this far it's been a really great ride and I appreciate just the amount of like you can tell somebody sat down and was enthused to play around in the Terminator sandbox but also really thought how they could tell like an actual interesting story that's about these

like as much as alien and I feel like Alien and Terminator often get packaged together, and they have these very similar qualities as franchises. And I think this, like in the same way the alien branches beyond just being, you know, like a slasher movie or a haunted house movie in space or whatever to having these grand philosophical ideas. You know, and that even if the movies aren't always great,

like the want to do that makes a lot of sense and really complements that series, and I think it also does this. So I think the blending of those two qualities, playing a lot of the action hits, but also digging in for the philosophy and having actual care and interest in that is just really cool.

I guess I just don't really find the philosophical discussions as strong as it could be. They're not like getting past... There's still like a threshold of like profound. Like it would be nice to be caught off guard with like... They get close. And as the episodes have gone on, again, as of like an episode like this, they've gotten closer than they have in the past episodes towards something that feels legitimately somewhat either profound or at least like thought provoking, thoughtful in a way that's striking.

But I wouldn't disagree that it would be nice to get, it's hard to do that. Like, it's hard to truly write something profound or striking. And I think they've like, they're getting closer to that. But I wouldn't disagree that like they haven't fully gotten to a place where I'm like, oh, wow. I think what's missing is I think it should be a cat and mouse game of the debate rather than just characters talking in a room. It should feel like their allegiances are constantly like, yeah, they're ebbing and flowing and we're getting closer and further from, you know,

either agreement or, you know, huge disagreement. Yeah, and like the conversation's pretty much like it's the typical AI conversation because it's, uh, AI is intelligence. That's what it is, artificial intelligence. and which she seeks is consciousness, you know, the ability to feel. People are like Masaki in a way, but there's Masaki program, you know. It doesn't matter. But that's what Kokoro is talking about, is wanting to achieve consciousness.

And that's what makes humanity unique is the, what makes life unique is the ability to experience, to feel. That's how we correlate our memories and what we correlate as a true experience, is our emotions attached to it. and emotions can dictate how we memorize anything. And I really like the idea of this discussion, but I keep feeling like it's very kind of basic. Like whenever they pose a lot more interesting, it's almost like a Damon Lindelofrompe. They pose a lot of questions,

but without really going into a super interesting debate or answer. I hate that like most of our discussions, it was like stuck on them when like so much of the episodes are not that but they're in like I enjoy like I literally like really enjoy the hell out of everything else yeah I really do I think everything else is like awesome and then I find myself like just really harping on the I think I harp on it because it is that it is like a biblical debate it's like watching like I don't know something something akin to like God and the devil having a why do you deserve to be you know yeah exactly there's a there's a bit of this like biblical debate

happening here, which I think is really cool in concept, again. That's interesting. I just keep kind of like gnawing for it. I want to like do something that's a little bit more like exciting in conversation. And again, I think it should be like a bit of a cat and mouse game. Because now we ask about smartest creation.

Yeah. You know, but well, and I mean, it's interesting actually. I mean, it's cool at least that we can get kind of different takeaways Because I don't, I haven't taken away so much that Cocoa really cares about like, oh, I want to experience human emotion or, you know. She literally says that. Uh, but she's, but the whole point of what she's doing is the whole like convince me that mankind is not that, A, I am not only a weapon, you know, that you're not only trying to make me your slave and just to carry out one particular command that you should have just programmed without the AI element if you wanted that outcome. And also, why should I, why should I turn away from Skynet's conclusive?

conclusion here. Yeah, that was earlier. But in this last episode, she's saying, she flat out says, like, I want to experience something deeper. And that's why she harps on the feeling of loss of losing someone you connected to. Because she doesn't have that, she's never had, she's never possessed that feeling. And she feels like that's what makes humanity unique. So in order to achieve this, she has to feel. Got to see that rather than making out the decisions without that input. And she, and she herself's declared. I want to experience, like, how you desire deeper meaning, Malcolm, I desire to experience something deeper as well. And that's, she's talking literally about the human experience. So to understand what makes humanity unique and really understand what humanity is, you have to understand what human experience is.

And, yeah, I don't know, I feel like we're debating better than they're debating. I mean, like, yeah, like, I, this is a, better do i think it's i you know why i think this happens is because they're doing like a better more interesting more nuanced debate than you're used to seeing anyone attempt here and yet now that we're here you're like but go all the way though like go like truly take me to a place where i'm like damn that terminator show was cool but you know it's even cooler it made me think you know and yeah like i i can't argue that as much as i've grown you know increasingly to appreciate it It's not, you know, super profound, truly yet.

It's got the tone of that. Yeah, it's got the tone, but I think that it loses the chase and ticking clock of it. That's my main, that's really my main problem with it. Also, you can keep the dialogue the same. It's just the emotion behind the way it's going down is kind of lackluster to me. Whereas everything else is, fortunately, ingrained in a lot of emotion. And it's important. Yeah.

Everything with Masaki is very much like. A way more compelling situation to watch than anything with Kokoro is, weirdly enough, it is. It's probably, it's more relatable. It's more understandable. It's easier to envision yourself as one of the kids in a situation like that. Like, oh, what if I discovered this about someone and what I just view them as a machine? What would it do to my questioning? Even though the kid, the boy who's always like, here, I'm a fucking machine.

He even at one point posed something when they're in the, the, um, the what's that fucking called when you're in the place for all the junkyard and then the junkyard they he even starts laying out some points of why not to trust and I was like actually that's fair you know first I was like this is annoying and cliche and then I went into actually that's a really great point

the only thing I don't I think all that's yeah I agree the only thing I think I would have changed if it was me I would have changed the character notes so that he's not just doing the I'm angry at you now like if it had been if they've given him a little more like I'm scared

And I know that like fear A fear response is often anger But I feel like it's that In the early stages It feels like the trope of You didn't tell us you were a robot Now I'm mad You know like when the little brother

Was like wailing on him And thought he was gonna die Like I was getting me emotional I was like yeah this is actually effective And they're real characters Those two Like the boys are real characters The sisters too

Like they're all real characters And they could easily have not been I think the question of why time travel to a past that ultimately doesn't affect your your experience, your true memories. Like if you're not really going to be able to alter

the present timeline that you come from and those people, because that's what human experience is, is like the connections you make along the way and all these things. If you're not going to be able to alter any of that, why do this? I'm like, what a fucking fascinating question.

Like, is I'm like either going, I don't know why I would do it either. Like, so I can selfishly live in the present timeline where I don't have to deal with this. Like, that would be my first answer is to do that. If I succeed, I get to see the promise land. You don't get the benefits. And then if I succeed also, you guys won't exist to have to feel these things. So, like, maybe that's better.

But you're also not erasing them from experiencing those things. They're still going to, that's what they're saying is that it's, you're creating a different timeline. So they would still experience those things. Like, wouldn't their timeline still carry on? I don't think so. in the, she said that one thing about once you go back, you're swapping out this timeline for a different

one. So I took it as sort of like I think there's still room for question, but what I got from that is none of us will exist. So it's still that thing of like everyone you love will still be gone and now they just will not have none of this will have happened.

If you go back to the past, unless I feel like, no, I feel like that was what Caico's, Ico, I feel like that's what Ico's, that's conflict was, was that if she was posed with that, that if I go to the past, then none of this will happen, then of course she would go to the past and change it. Her question was, what's the point of me going to be going to the past? All this is still going to happen in your timeline and the timeline I come from. I did. The thing I don't know how to, I don't know what the,

the only question mark I left that exchange with is what is the state of, because you deal with this timeline, how multiversal are we talking here? Because yeah, when you leave, I guess as the time travel, all you have to assume is we are doomed, they're going to suffer and die. But if I can create a new timeline then because it would be

harder for me if it was multiversal because then I'd be like, wow, I create one good timeline and every other timelines is terrible. I got the idea that you're just kind of changing the one timeline to something different. Well, I think, no, I think there are multiple timelines because she even says when the

Terminators were sending back machines to stop like the resistance leaders that they're flat out acknowledging the other movies I can't think too hard about time travel I mean no I feel like they laid it out pretty I think they laid it out really clear is that they I thought it was really crystal clear to me is that they they made they they were pretty much acknowledging like the other movies in a way of yeah there's multiple timelines for it but you're they're saying she says that it's not a straight line that you're not going to go back and change our time that you're going to literally hop to a different timeline when you go to the past. Yeah, you just leave this timeline to run out. Yeah,

this timeline is still going to keep going while you're fixing some other timeline. Yes. So that's why she was like, why should I even go back? Which made me go, yeah, why should you go back? Yeah. If you're not going to fix the thing you've been suffering with this entire time. Yeah. I mean, I thought it was clear to me when I was listening to. I thought it was like, I was like, that's a really fascinating like discussion to have. I mean, no, totally. The only thing, again, the only thing I was and 100% clear about it was just, yeah, how is it always that you're rewriting and revising a timeline

or, yeah, is it just there? Oh, there's a whole bunch of timelines. I think they're saying there's a whole bunch of timelines. I think that's what's happening with people's memory. I think that's why these premonitions and shit can happen. That makes sense. Because, I mean, that's at least why what I'm like, oh, the fuck else. To me, that felt like it was from the one time.

Oh, no. To me, that felt like it would be a byproduct of changing so many things near, the same point during the 90s would probably create a bunch of like competing overlapping. Like if you have so many things happening around the same few

points of time, I could see how you would have those premonitions, memories, whatever, bleeding over from each other. Because this isn't, I mean, especially if it's playing canon to the Terminator universe, this shouldn't be happening then because they prevented

Judgment Day in Terminator 2. Terminator 3 is saying that judgment day happens later. Judgment day happens like not in 1997 but like the 2000s or whatever. Like that's what it's supposed to happen. Okay. So if you're in 1997 and judgment day's about to happen that would mean that. So Terminator

1 and 2 are one story and then every other Terminator movie. Every single other Terminator thing is its own separate time. I have no idea. So no matter how many times they're like this is the real sequel. If I start if I started thinking about like Terminator 1

if I started thinking that way then I'm going to like confused but in terms of just watching the show sure sure okay so you leave us all to suffer and die but i'm saying that drives the point home that it's a different timeline because i heard i think i read that this is supposed to be canonical to the terminator franchise so for them to go to term if they're going to 1997 this shouldn't be happening if terminator two happened because the terminator two they prevented all this yes and so 1997 august 299 should not be happening and uh So that's why I was like, are we watching a remake now? But then that episode, like, cleared it up for me that I was like, oh, that's why we're able to watch.

We're watching a different timeline. But this is still leading up to Judgment Day happening. No, no, no. But okay, look, no. Terminator 2, I believe, is 1994. They do the whole lava scene. They prevent Judgment Day from happening. Rides in the Machines comes out, Terminator 3, which is this continuity of that timeline.

Okay. Rising their machines comes out, and that's in the 2000s where they say Judgment Day is about to happen again. But in the show, they're going in 1997, and Judgment Day happens on August 29th, 1997. But if they're in the Terminator 2 universe, the Terminator 2 timeline, that shouldn't be happening. Yeah, that timeline's already been rewritten

because they succeeded. Yeah, so that shouldn't be happening then. Or maybe that's why there's also this guy. Well, you didn't see Terminator 3D. It's the only Terminator I haven't seen. Kind of just ruined the ending of Terminator 3. But that's... I mean, you saw salvation, so we fucking know what's going to happen.

I'm not that concern. I will catch up. I've seen Sergeant William Candy. I've seen that. Well, the multiverse is a problem. Oh, I know. But then they have that line with the old lady being like, it's a complex science and no one truly understands just to alleviate whatever.

To alleviate this. What's happening? But I feel like, yeah, I'll go rewatch the scene again. But, yeah, either way, it's a good debate. And the idea of how either way, both versions, and I'm going to imagine that you are correct and that it's like, yeah, this. We just continue. Like, I feel like that's what they were saying.

That's what I got from the scene. I feel like that was they were laying it out, like, clear. I'm like, oh, that's a really clear. That's how she was in conflict to go back because she's not going to actually fix her timeline. Yeah, it's like you go back to a different past and then by going back into the past at all you've just made it a different path just by being there at all and then

You're making a new present for yourself You're making a new present for you For you and yeah You're just taking everybody involved now on a new It's not like back to the future You know Well yeah I guess that Back to the future has the straight line theory

Yeah and you just go back to the past There are two of you and yeah Anything you do if you kill you and now Then you'll die later Yeah, or you'll disappear from later where so, okay, so every... I mean, back to the future works by fixed points

in a straight timeline. Yeah, whereas in Terminator... It's like, oh, they have to kiss in order for Marty to be born, you know? Like, it doesn't matter how it happens, but they just have to get this. So every Terminator future is basically people going, hey, we're going to suffer and die.

We are all just going to continue this war until we die, but you might be able to go on to one timeline out there and create a better world where this doesn't happen. Yeah, I guess so. I mean, that would also explain the paradox of like Kyle Reese, I suppose, which is always confused the hell out of me. As much as I'm a big fan of the Terminator franchise, that's always, that's been like, my

number one question is like, wait a minute. I guess, how is Kyle Reese, the father of John Con? I guess the big question I have is, is I think boils down to if it's a true multiverse, why would you send anyone anywhere? Because all you, because you can just count on well, in half the timelines, we probably won and everything's fine. Like, why send anyone anywhere in a true multiverse? And that's why they said, once you know that question, Ico, then you will know something about being human or whatever the fuck she said. And where I was here to go.

Just because you have to act. Where I was like going like, I don't know why I would do it. I really don't know why I would do it either. It doesn't make, like, I wouldn't be compelled. I wouldn't be compelled again if I, if I. I really compelled for selfish reasons. Just be like, I don't want to live in this timeline. This timeline sucks.

I, yeah. Like, I feel like there's a compelling debate to be had about like, do you remain here and fight? directly where you can see the results for the people you love right now or do you go back and like change the entire slate and now and you'll never see those people again

and those people might not even come to exist in the same way but at least it won't be this hell. Yeah. I don't know. I guess that's the interesting nugget of the debate regardless of the mechanics. But hey, I like that this show has enabled us to at least sit here and like pull

apart things that we didn't expect to be pulling apart. I think, like, of all the terminator thing. I said that with, like, so much confidence. Like, I know, John, this is what it is. No, the thing is? I could be way off here. I, but I think we're probably somewhere, it's probably somewhere in between the both of us. I'm sure someone in the comments

will get it, like, and I'm sure I've got to, like, I have never been more certain of a debate where I'm like, I'm sure you have a significant portion of the right way of looking about this, and I'm sure I have at least a couple beats that might be the right way. Either way. I'm glad that this has given us some food for thought and is very

cool like easily this is the most i've been excited to be engaged by both the fun and pulpy action stuff that you want from terminator but also like from the implications of terminator yeah it's been a long time coming do you have anything else for the people before we get out of here no gang what do you think of the show we're almost to the end leave us your thoughts and we'll catch you for the finale in the next episode last two be well catch you next time Chase Gardner. Wow. You know, for a show that's about chasing people,

it's appropriate to shout out Chase Gardner. Ooh. You can just imagine it, right? Take it away, John. Sowing the seeds of a new generation, growing a more hopeful, optimistic future. My improv never runs out. And you're being chased down by the people.

who don't want you to grow that future for us. He's totally doing what I was going to say. You're training the advanced AI that will eventually lead to our self-veillance. You are the gardener of good tidings and of benevolent growth for humanity. This is like a premonition of a shoutout that I had of what he's doing right now. We would continue down our savage, war-mongering path. But now-miss a little more sexual. You know what?

We can go there. We'll smack your cheeks around, you know. Why don't you drop it low for us? Chase those booty cheeks to the flow. Chase is a visha, isn't it? These shizzle for Gizengar. Yo, happy birthday, Chase. Love you.