The Rest Is Entertainment - Hitler vs Hitchcock

Episode Date: April 22, 2026

Do celebrity petitions ever make a difference? How did Jess Glynne become a meme millionaire? And why is it so tricky to film things in LA? Richard Osman and Marina Hyde answer your questions about TV, film and celebrity doppelgangers. The Rest is Entertainment is brought to you by Octopus Energy, Britain's most awarded energy supplier. Join The Rest Is Entertainment Club: Unlock the full experience of the show – with exclusive bonus content, ad-free listening, early access to Q&A episodes, access to our newsletter archive, discounted book prices with our partners at Coles Books, early ticket access to live events, and access to our chat community. Sign up directly at ⁠therestisentertainment.com ⁠ For more Goalhanger Podcasts, head to ⁠www.goalhanger.com⁠ Video Editor: Max Archer Assistant Producer: Imee Marriott Senior Producer: Joey McCarthy Social Producer: Bex Tyrrell Exec Producer: Neil Fearn Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Like that pile of laundry. You didn't forget to fold it. No, it's a new trend. Rinkled chic. Feel the arrow bubbles melt. It's mind bubbling. Hello and welcome to this. episode of The Rest is Entertainment, Questions and Answers Edition. I'm Marina. And I'm

Richard Asman. Welcome one, welcome all. Hey, Marina. Hello, Richard. How are you? Yeah, I'm okay. Are you well? I am. There has been a significant response to your appeal for a question about actors and celebrities that people mix up. Yes, because we were talking about Bill Paxton and Bill Palmer and they both became famous at roughly the same time. And even now, I couldn't pick the two of them out of a line-up. And when I say significant, I mean, it is the biggest response of what I think we've ever had. Yeah, it's gone absolutely nuts. It's gone post bookshelves.

It is huge. Curely on the basis that she sent the first question, I am going to ask Heather Wolford's question on behalf of Heather. In my house, says Heather, there are two actors, Eddie Marsan, Ray Donovan, Sherlock Holmes, and not Eddie Marsan, line of duty, Ashes to Ash is the Thursday Murder Club. Recently, we have realised that not Eddie Marsan is actually Daniel Mays. The film Vera Drake was very confusing.

Do you have any actors or musicians? that you constantly mix up. Thank you, Heather. That's a good question as well. If you're going to be the first one in, that's a good one to do. I've got, I mean, so many. Can I say I'm so scared of doing this? Because the ones that I don't already have,

some synaptic malfunction will now happen, and I will forever think that, you know, which I will never get my Chris is in the right order again. Well, shall I go through some of the ones that are listeners have sent in people that get mixed up? Gene Hackman and Gene Wilder, okay, the one that most people have, the one that you can you guess the one that most people have had the that they get mixed up?

These are the similar name ones right so I feel like you're going to yeah the Ryan's we know the Ryan's are right at Gosling. Gosling and Reynolds are very very hard to and you know they also have a similar level of fame I mean they yeah and they're a similar age they got a clean cut American yeah I mean that's you're in the danger area there a similar vibe Barbara Streis and midler people mix up glen close from Meryl Streep I don't know I know Merrill Street when I see Merrill Street. That seems like Sacrilege. Callum Turner and Josh O'Connor.

Surely Callum Turner and like Harris Dickinson or not. I mean, don't get into that particular age of Richard Actors. A lot of Bradley Walsh and Brian Conley. Yeah, that's huge. That's huge. Although they recently went on tour with each other. That would have blown people's minds. Susan Sarandon and Sogorney Weaver.

Yes. This is one I have absolutely nonstop. I've seen the whole film by the second actor and thought it was the first actor. Matt Damon and Mark Wahlberg. Oh, really? Yeah. Is that not a blindness you have? Well, I was going to say Bryce Dallas Howard and Jessica Chastain. I thought that was the one that you were going to say.

No, no, no, okay. No, I don't have a Matt Damon blindness, but there are others that I just have to remind myself each time. I've definitively watched an entire Mark Wahlberg movie and at the end realize it wasn't Matt Damon. And you see, I mean, but it's weird, given how much hard work they put into those things. Yeah, it's great for Mark Wahlberg because he, Nolan's never giving him a call. Let me tell you. That's true.

Yeah, he does get elevated in my brain. I'm quite bad on Emily Blunt and Emma Stone. When I see them individually, I know what's going on. And well, I say nothing like a joke. Yeah, yeah, they don't. That's definitively not I get them mixed up when I look at them. There's something about their careers. If I see one of them as cast in a movie, I'm like, oh, which one, which one is that?

I can't immediately picture which one is which. So, you know, I don't get them mixed on when I look at them for sure. Steve Boshemmy and Billy Bob Thornton we have from a lot of people Really? Yeah That's so distinctive Brian Cox and Brendan Gleason Yes, fair enough

You could sort of imagine they might be the certain Same person, Brian Cox and Brian Cox Nobody said that Somebody here says Wes Craven and John Craven That I'm afraid is yeah, come on I have to give special mention to

Jennifer Amel Duke Divine Not only for the name Because Jennifer says though they are not both in entertainment when I read out the rest of this that is a real understatement Okay, carry on. Though they are not both in entertainment.

Though they are not both in entertainment, says Jennifer, I used to confuse Alfred Hitchcock and Adolf Hitler and used the names interchangeably. I just want to say I'm not speaking because I am speechless. Until I was about 14, I thought there was a single man who had committed absolute atrocities

but had made some insightful psychological thrillers along the way. Well, I hope this podcast is expanding, Finding your mind, Jennifer. A few more, Michael Sarah and Jesse Eisenberg. Oh, yes. A lot of people think they are the same thing. Yeah, that's really, really.

And also the types of movies they're in. That's the thing. It's when people have either a similar name or a similar look and are in the same sort of movies, like Bill Paxton and Bill Paulman could sort of interchangeably be in each other's films. So could Michael Sarah and Jesse Eisenberg, very different human beings, but they look very, very similar. The one that I was talking to, talking to, this week to somebody who, I'm very, very aware, gets called the wrong name, has been called

the wrong name her entire life, her entire life. And you can guess the name that she gets called because that person gets called her name. And that's Gabby Roslyn, who is constantly called Gabby Logan. And Gabby Logan is constantly called Gabby Roslin. Really? All day, every day. They are constantly mixed up with each other. Again, people know they're different people, but that's a name one.

get their names mixed up. Can I say the one to this day that I will never ever ever, or Stacey Solomon and Stacey Doody, by the way, we had lots of people talking about that as well, which they think they're the same person. But here's the one that I will never, ever, ever get right. And there are people in a certain country to whom this would be insane, but it just happens to be the case. And that is, I would not, at gunpoint, be able to tell you which one is which, if you showed me Jimmy Fallon and Jimmy Kimmel. Yes. Well, I think that's, That's a lot of people. I like which one is which, right?

And I can sort of, I can get it in my head for a bit if I see Jimmy Fallon. Yeah. And people say that's Jimmy Fallon. And I like, yeah, yeah, okay, I've got it. Absolutely. Don't suggest gunpoint in that great nation, of course, because it's so easy to arrange. Somebody will. And then the other one, who have I said, Fallon? The other one, Kimmel.

But that's, because I know they're both called Jimmy. I get that. We don't have their late night shows. Yeah, exactly. They're not in our lives constantly. But Kimmel and Fallon, I know they're. completely different names, but there's something about them that are also the same, which is they sort of, they sort of sound a bit familiar. Yeah, they're in a seat behind a desk. And they got

two syllables in the surname. Yeah. I don't know. There's something about it. So that's my, that's my number one is Falun and Kimmel. The Gabby's are the ones, I think, most constantly get called each other's names. But yeah, the, the, the, the Ryan's is, the Ryan's is big. That's the big one. I have to say the Chris is, keeping your Chris's straight has been, you know. So we've got Pratt and Hemsworth. And League 2, Chris, Pine. See, I think it's because I can just about deal with Evans, Pratt and Hemsworth. It's when you throw pine in it as well that I suddenly get them all mixed up because that's too much Chris.

It's too much. The equation's too complicated to consider it all the same time. And that roils the other three together as well. Yeah. In a way they weren't previously royaled as soon as pine comes in. There are some other funny name ones. Rick Whiteman and Alan Rickman. I can see it, though.

I mean, yeah. That's funny. Willie Russell and Willie Ruston, that's for people of a certain age. Ninety-th. Very similar names. And then Tim Curry and Tim Rice, which I... I think it's just a... I know it's the surnames.

I know, it's the surn names. I can sort of see it. I've got the feeling this will just jump off in some different area next week. But we hope we've covered some of your... All of that stuff, especially like British actors. People do you see on TV who you think are the same person. I mean, we've had so many emails. but I know for a fact that there are other great ones out there.

I know. But the two jimmies absolutely clueless, absolutely clueless. But if you've got better ones or people you spent your whole life thinking with somebody else, then absolutely do let us know. There's some poor person at Goalhanger having to spend their entire time going through your emails on this. A question for you, Marina, from Roger Lever. That's a good name. Very good name.

That's a strong name. Roger Lever. Yeah. He says, I've always wondered about Jess Glynn's song, Hold My Hand, which seems to have been used by Jet 2 holidays for years now in adverts and even on planes. How does that actually work financially? Is it typically a one-off licensing fee, an annual deal, or anything tied to usage? Because it definitely feels like they have an incredible value out of it over time. This is a very good question. There's a line in the first Bridget Jones movie about her friend Tom says, 80s pop icon who only wrote one hit record and retired because he found that one record was quite enough to get him laid for the whole of the 90s.

Jess Glynn had a hit 11 years ago and has discovered it is quite enough to get her paid throughout the whole of the next decade. She had other hits as well. I'm not suggesting she had a lot of hits. Yeah. She, but however, Jet 2 first used hold my hand in late 2015, which was the year it actually came out. And typically when you're doing a deal like that, it's for multiple TV and social ads.

By the way, now you still hear it on all their TV and social ads, on their booking videos. and when you get on the plane, they play. I know. Someone said that they were on a plane. Someone told me they were on their plane and they had to change the crew for some reason and it just continued to play. And people who work on Jack 2 crews say they just totally screen it out. They don't hear it any other. It must be like torture. Yeah. And that's nothing against the song, but to hear it all day every day. It is amazing though that it's endured so long. And originally it would have been a licensing and royalties deal and it's a sort of upfront sink deal, as they would call it.

And you get royalties every time the ads broadcast or whatever. And it's a licensing agreement. But it would certainly not have been for 11 years. So they will have renewed and renegotiated it several times. And she will have earned millions of it by now. Millions? Yeah. Because it's gone on for think.

And not just far this way in a way that I'm about to talk about. Because remember, in the old days, you know, people used to think that advertising music was sort of in for a dig and that you were kind of selling out. If you're allowing your band to allow their music to be used. in advertising. But I do think, as we've said before, that Gen Z, Gen A, they're so selling everything is so enmeshed in all of the content they watch. There isn't that stigma whatsoever anymore about giving your song. I saw someone doing, we talked briefly on, well, we talked on Monday show about influences. I saw someone on Instagram saying, amazing news, amazing news. I've just signed a deal with ex-car company. And, you know,

so, and all the replies were, oh, my God, this is incredible. Congratulations. rather than sorry. Sorry. Okay. You total sellout. It's just completely part. You got a free car and you want what you want us to be happy. But everyone was like, oh my God.

Everyone was happy. This is awesome. I just thought, okay. It's become, which is very interesting, which is a definite shift for kind of creative artists involving this kind of stuff. And as we've said before, those generations are kind of timeblind. They don't mind when they discover, when a song that they discover via TikTok or via advertising is from, if they like it, they like it.

And last year, I think it was the song of the year on TikTok. Really? Yeah. But it's become a trend in the meme. It's used on TikTok for people to soundtrack their sort of holiday mishaps or travel chaos or anything. You know, if you've got a massively long queue and you've got nothing to do in the queue other than post of TikTok saying, nothing beats a jet to a holiday. Posts using that song have been viewed more than 80 billion times on TikTok.

I mean, it's so not only is just been making money from the repeatedly renewed. negotiated deal with Jet 2, she is also getting all the halo effect from streaming, for download, all the other stuff. Yeah. And also, and amazing for Jet 2 as well, if you've suddenly got something that constantly goes viral on TikTok, even if occasionally it is likely poking fun at you, that's an incredible bit of marketing. You cannot, you literally cannot buy this engagement that they've had from this song.

It's just all come together in a way that it doesn't often, which is why they're keeping using it. And in the old days, you're right. by the way, when people use it as a soundtrack to their meme, they're not necessarily, in fact, probably more times than not, and not on a Jet 2 holiday. Now, in the old days, any firm involved in that sort of thing would have, if you open your window and you've got a terrible view of a building site

and you say nothing would be it to Jet 2 holiday, the firm would have said, hang on, this isn't even a jet, you're not even on a Jet 2 holiday. But what they've decided to do clearly, I don't know this, I haven't spoken to Jet 2 about it, but you can see because it would be, you couldn't police it. They've just decided to roll with it, which is actually pretty modern.

And to think, you can't police this. It's beyond, when something's had 80 billion, whatever, you can't get in touch with every single one. But actually what's happening is that your name is being mentioned all the time, to the point where Jet 2 has almost become in our national brain, synonymous with the phrase holiday. So you honestly can't buy what has happened with this particular song, and you can absolutely see why they can continue to use it.

For Jess Glynn, who's done brilliantly out of this and fair play her, nothing else can obviously be done with this song at all now, apart from it be sung in concert, because of this. And it's the sort of earworm, it's a national earworm, it's a cross-internet earworm. But it couldn't have worked out better,

I would say, for both parties involved. Yeah, and at a time where it's harder and harder to make money out of recorded music. It's not totally unique, but it's the kind of leading example of something unusual. And I do think it's interesting that they don't bother to take anything down because you're not saying Jet Two holidays are rubbish, because almost no one is on a Jet 2 holiday when they post the passport cue isn't Jet 2's fault.

But it's just become something that people constantly say your brand name and constantly. And also that has the word holidays in it. Yeah. Yeah. It's perfect. Right. Shall we now go to a break? Yes.

Wouldn't it be amazing if Jet 2 advertising here? Sadly, I don't think they are. But can you imagine? And everyone go, oh, that song. Oh, that's why they did the question. Oh, you mean. This is not a, this is not a sponsored post. This is hashtag not paid.

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Welcome back, everybody. Marina, a question for you from Ava McKay or Ava McKay. I just read that a bunch of Hollywood celebs, including Mark Ruffalo and Emma Thompson, who signed an open letter in opposition to Paramount buying out Warner Brothers. Will it make any difference? Yes.

This is the... Not yes, it will make a difference. This is the block the merger. No it. make a difference. Yeah, well, I think we know where this is going. This is the Block the Merger campaign, and thousands of Hollywood creatives have signed it against the David Ellison bid for Paramount Skydance bid for Warner Brothers.

A lot of the same celebrities who are saying, whatever you do, don't let Netflix buy it. Yes. Yeah, careful what you wish for. And they have got lots and lots of big people. They've got, you know, directors. They've got Denny Vileneuve, Celine Song, lots of actors, Mark Ruffalo. I mean, what hasn't he signed? Brian Cranston, Tiffany Haddish.

So they've got lots of those. They've got some showrunners, but not all of them have shows going at the moment. They've got David Chase, Damon Lindelof, JJ Abrams. And what they want is the California Attorney General and various other states, attorneys general, to block it. By the way, absolutely beautiful plural there. Your pluralisation of Attorney General. I did I do it right?

I'm just quite surprised because it was definitely 50-50 on that one. And I think that showrunners are sort of. of key. Shows runner. Shows runner. No, I'm not getting able to do a floral for the rest of the show. I think the show runners are key because lots of people depend on them. But as a result, because lots of people depend on them, you may not get people.

I personally don't think someone like Taylor Sheridan would sign it anyway. But when lots and lots of a huge ecosystem of people depend on them for income and mortgage and everything, I read it was tearing apart agencies and both companies involved as to whether you have or haven't signed it. Yeah. I mean, don't bother, all I'd say is, please don't bother tearing yourself apart because it will not make the blindest bit of difference at all. You can, I mean, I can't tell performers not to be performative

because you may never argue against gravity. But in my view, open letters are all performative nonsense. And I'll talk about, I'll talk a bit of slight about them in general and then probably my own experience with them. But there are so many of these in an era of click, far more than there ever were, when it's so easy to circulate them digitally and in the old days you had to make a call and say, I'm getting this letter together

would you be on board? And there was a whole thing. And you would have had to actually sign your name as opposed to saying, would you have your name on this list? And I think it's so sort of infantile, you know, the idea that this is tearing people apart because you haven't signed it.

It's like people saying, you know, oh, if you won't sign this letter or are you sort of pro the killing of people and guards? I mean, don't be ridiculous. This is so infantile. And I'm sort of pro being a realist. and not sort of performative self-importance. The open letters that have actually worked in the whole of human history are pretty,

I think are pretty short. The one Emil Zola, the novelist, wrote during the Dreyfus affair, someone who was wrongly accused by the French government. That worked. That's a signatory of one, though. It was open. The problem with the open letters also with many, many signatories, is that they're sort of watered down and they're in this kind of deniable,

wishy-washy language that every single, because you want the most possible people to get on board with them. I would say that I do think that the kind of letters that went on and on from climate scientists for a very long time. There was a point to that to say there are many of us and there is a consensus here. I think that moved the debate. Also, they're climate scientists and they're answering her question about climate science. I mean, it's exactly. Yeah.

Me too. I mean, even now when we look at the backlash against it, you have to say it's difficult. I would definitely say to you that celebrities make things worse. We know this overall, that they don't actually, people want celebrities not to do these performative things in general politics and in business and maybe even in something like Me Too where they were talking advisedly about their own industry. So I think that's on the fence. But in general, they don't work. I remember a huge strategy during the Remain campaign, which famously didn't do very well, was to get like open letters from 100 big business leaders. 100 small medium business leaders to the Times. It's like, I'm starting to feel that maybe

this isn't the format you think it is. There was famously one against Einstein. Oh, I signed that. Yeah. Yeah. I thought finally something, yeah. Finally, I can get back. He published his theory of relativity. And then this pamphlet came out, which was 100 authors against Einstein. Wow. And he said, the thing which I've just said, which is why? Why 100? If they were right, one would have been an And, you know, he understood maths, which is relevant to open letters, and he understood, as his theory, proved that frames of reference are subjective. I'm trying to think if I've signed any open letters. I'd really try not to. I signed one letter to the Guardian's letters page from other Guardian writers about not selling the observer,

because I thought there would be different ways if it were me, which it wasn't, of getting down headcount if you were willing to have a confrontation with the union, as an example. And I signed that. So that was, but I, I don't know. That's not really an open letter. It's not really, is it? It's not really, is it? It's a letter to management from workers. Yeah.

I've signed internal things at places and I've signed, but even not very many of those, but I have signed things. But I would always think it would be more effective to write alone. Yes. About something than, but I really think it's a way, so often a people in the public eye kind of ticking off. Like, look, I've said I'm against this or that. I'm set up against this war crime I'm witnessing.

I've said I'm against whatever it is. It's just a way of saying, of sort of addressing responsibilities. And I really think they do not make any difference. And I absolutely don't think they're going to make any difference in this whatsoever. Yeah, you do get asked to sign a lot. I tend to, the anything I was asked if I put my name in that blank book, which is authors against AI. And I thought, well, I am an author and it's a publicity stunt. nothing more, nothing there's. I'm not trying to...

But it's about your industry and it's about... I think there's something slightly different... I mean, again, you'll say, well, this is about their industry. I think it was something so specific and you have been a victim of an alleged crime. Yes, exactly. And why shouldn't you? Yeah, yeah. But it's... Yeah, they very, very rarely do anything. And I am with you. I think that it tends to turn people off things rather than the other way around. I think, you know, it's... It's one of those things that it's, it's, it's, it's very, very easy to use its weight against it. They're very welcome individually to say in all their interviews and all their

whatever. These are people with access to public platforms, I think we've established. So they're welcome to do that all. But I think in the general sort of, please don't tear yourself apart on it. It's a complete waste of time doing that. It wouldn't be an even worse trouble than you are already. But also not signing a letter doesn't mean you disagree with the letter. It just means you disagree with having your opinion put with 500 other people.

opinion and yeah, which is a different matter. Agree. Here's a good one about panellists writing notes from cat, no surname, which I know you'll disapprove of. Yeah. Maybe it's cat from eight out of ten cats. Maybe it is. Maybe it's cat from the new power generation and prints.

Oh, do you think? Yeah, I think so. Wow, she would say, wouldn't she? Well, she says she loves watching panel shows, so case closed as far as I'm concerned. Oh, may well be then. Okay, I love watching panel shows. My favorites are would I like to you in QI. I often see the comedian panelist writing down what's

seem to be notes when something funny has said. What are they writing down? I doubt they could use they could use the same exact joke again. So what will they do with those notes? It's been bugging me for years. Wow. Well, it's been bugging you for years. Well, let me debug you if you know what I mean. It's different on different shows, really. On what I like to, you'd never really take on notes. I mean, you might have a pen and obviously you've got bits of paper you can you can write on there. But with a show like QI. Why? Because it's happening so quickly that. Well, because what are you writing, I mean, there is the question, what are you writing notes about? Okay, so what you might do, and it's what I'll talk about now, because I think there's only one reason you write things

down on a panel show. So often you'll take on notes. So if you're doing, have I gotten used for you? For example, you're, you roughly know what some of the stories might be. And so you've noted down a line or something, you will see people very rarely look at their notes because, you know, if you're a new comedian on that show, sometimes you would have written jokes just to make sure you get off to a good start and occasionally you'll see someone just sort of glancing down at a written joke. But usually you wouldn't. Usually you would, you know, if I'm on, I'll just write one, two, three, four and they just go, you know, budget, Trump. It's just to know roughly, you know, what we might be talking about. The only time I take notes, I think is the same

as other people, it's a real comedians thing and it's callbacks. And that's the only reason you would write something down. So say I'm doing, have I, I've got news for you. And on round two, which is, you know, where they kind of look at the silly little stories of the week, there's a question about, you know, say there's, um, councillor Stephen Anderson from, you know, so and so on and so where who's the crime commissioner of a certain council has been arrested. Yeah. For, you know, stealing stuff or, you know, filletings expenses or something like that. And that's the story. Now, if that comes up, so that's a story no one knows.

That's a story we haven't heard, of course. but I know now in the show there's a story about a guy whose thing is that he's a thief. And his name is Councillor Stephen Anderson. So I will write down the name Councillor Stephen Anderson because later on in the missing words round, you know, might be something like experts say what can be seen from space. And you can just go, is it Councillor Stephen Anderson's expense account? You know, it's stuff like that. Or anything that comes up that is an interesting person or an interesting concept or idea.

during that show, you might just write down, just to a, remind yourself that it came up, or be, as I say, if it's someone's name, just remind yourself who that person's name is, just because it helps you later on when you're doing a callback. Because what you want to do is make the show feel like it's of one piece and that you're not just going in with pre-prepared jokes about something that, that, you know, you are aware that the show is its own thing and that Councillor Stephen Anderson can become a comic character in the rest of that show. But if you've forgotten his name, then he's not going to become a comic character at all. So it's just that really. There's no other reason to write stuff down. People sometimes will doodle. That's definitely the case because there will be moments of a little recording break or something. If you get when you're recording it, you record it for much, much, much longer.

So, you know, if you're on what I like to you and you've just said, I've once stolen Easterer from Jeremy Clarkson, I'd be like, okay, so we're questioning you for 10 minutes. And very early on, you say this is, you know, 1997. So I'll just write down 1990, 97, just so, you know, like a police officer would do in an interrogation. So that's very specific to that. But other than that, it is, yeah, it is literally just for the kind of comic conceit of what might be useful later on in the show. You're not writing down what someone said or someone else's joke or anything like that. You're literally going, oh, this is one of the characters of this show. I'm going to write that down.

But it is literally just a little aid memoir or... Comic mechanics. Or doodling. Yep. And those are the only things that can be, I'm afraid. or very, very occasionally, if you're asked to do a pickup, you'll write down what that pickup is, but you'd never see that in the final version of the show. Anyway, so Kat, I hope that is helpful.

Last but not least, Andrew, no surname. Andrew says, I am baffled, baffled by the recent decision, Andrew, this is, by Los Angeles County to revoke permission to film the reshoot of the iconic 90-show Baywatch at Venice Beach after only two days of filming. I note that Karen Blas, Logged Anzileysmire, has tried to row back, Nevertheless, what signals does this give producers who are deciding on which city to base their shoots? I'm sure that having to relocate must have cost a production of fortune. Who complained? And why was the complaint upheld?

Okay, this, I, by the way, I think this story is based on a false report from crew stories, which is an online forum where people sort of anonymise their experience of working on various shows, is almost always to say we're being taken advantage of, or look at the scandalous thing as happened. Oh, crew stories. Yes, yeah. But in Los Angeles, in state of California, you do, by the way, need a permit for absolutely everything. Every single tiny thing in life you need a permit for. And in this case, you needed one from the California Coastal Commission.

And they were given it. And actually, I think it has been updated because they needed more space. They need a larger footprint on the beach. They need to be able to do night shoots. Okay, so don't worry, it's still going ahead and it's still on the iconic Venice beach. They've got a tiny bit of the beach shut off. I mean, it's an extraordinary small piece. I read somewhere there was something like 300 square foot of beach that they can shut off at any more time,

which when you know that beach, it's very, very big. And also, I'm amazed how they'll have to make it look like lots of different bits of beach because that's a very small footprint. But it's interesting the question simply because they are, as you've probably read, they're trying to bring as much filming back to California and to Los Angeles in particular. and there's always been a sense that Los Angeles could end up like Detroit, you know, a place that was once a thriving center of an industry. And then it falls into decline in this kind of baroque, an awful way, really.

And Baywatch is a keystone of this, because you think of how many productions are filmed all around the world and so many now in the UK, but I say what you like about all weather. The one thing you're not going to be doing on just outside of the M-25 is Baywatch. It's not going to be cream. I'm sorry, yeah, Leaveson hasn't got it, I'm afraid. But they've given them $20 million in tax, $21 million in tax credits for 12 episodes, which is a lot.

One of the reasons they want to build it back is if you think of that particular city and particularly around Hollywood is that there's a whole ecosystem and there are lots of little small businesses, like drivers and florists and all the things that kind of make up a whole economy. and outside places none of that happens and there really are so many stories of unemployment in the business but the reason it may be difficult to do it is because once again I have to say that the reason LA is very expensive is unless they do huge tax incentives and we do in this country by the way which is why so much is now here is because of their labour laws they are so unionised it's so much more expensive to make something there

and that's one of the big stumbling box but the other thing is yes you are right It is massively bureaucratic and it is a lot easier to get permits here than it is there. But, you know, the sunshine and the weather may watch. But yes, that is one of the big stumbling blocks to it getting back. And they've had to have a lot of meetings and go back and forth to expand those permits. But they have got them. But the two stumbling blocks do remain their labour laws and the sheer amount of bureaucracy to get something done. If you're filming in a studio lot, of course, that's fine.

Yeah, but imagine how easy it would be to shoot that in South Africa, say, which often stands in for outside, outdoors America. Yes. It would just be, you know, they'd throw out in the red carpet would be out for you. The tax dollars would be there or the tax rans. And unpicking it all, given it's on the statute, but is actually quite difficult. So, I mean, I do think that they are going to have to, apart from offering the big incentives, I would not suggest that they went into battles with the unions,

but I would say that unpicking some of the bureaucracy is a big part of how they're going to, if they are going to bring more production back to L.A., they'll have to unpick some with the Biaruptcy. Put it this way, it's so hard to film a Baywatch that before it started David Hasselhoff

was called David Hoff. He was hassled. He was beyond hassles. Yeah, you see. That winds us up for today other than to say that tomorrow we have the final installment

in our epic Spice Girl series for members. If you would like to join for ad free listening and bonus episodes, it's the rest isentatementcom. Otherwise, we'll see you on Tuesday. See you next Tuesday.