The Rest Is Entertainment - Netflix and WWE, a tag-team to take on all streamers?

Episode Date: January 30, 2024

Netflix sign up WWE in a multi-billion dollar deal, but why? Should people be as upset as they are about Margot Robbie's Barbie Oscars nomination snub and finally, inside Jeff Bezozs 60th birthday party. All that and a little bit more on The Traintors with Marina and Richard on this episode of The Rest Is Entertainment. Twitter: @restisents Email: [e-mail] Producer: Neil Fearn Executive Producers: Tony Pastor + Jack Davenport 🌏 Get our exclusive NordVPN deal here ➼ https://nordvpn.com/trie It’s risk-free with Nord’s 30-day money-back guarantee! ✅ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

This episode is brought to you by Peloton. Forget the pressure to be crushing your workout on day one. Just start moving with the Peloton Bike, Bike Plus, Tread, Row, Guide, or App. There are thousands of classes and over 50 Peloton instructors ready to support you from the beginning. Remember, doing something is everything. Rent the Peloton Bike or Bike Plus today at onepeloton.ca slash bike slash rentals. All access memberships separate. Terms apply. This episode is brought to you by Fidelity Investments Canada. Make investing simple. Fidelity's all-in-one ETFs are designed to do

just that. In fact, Fidelity does the heavy lifting, including rebalancing these ETFs to help navigate changing market conditions. Visit fidelity.ca slash all in one. Getting closer to your goals could start today. Commissions, fees, and expenses may apply. Read the funds or ETFs prospectus before investing. Funds and ETFs are not guaranteed. Their values change and past performance may not be repeated. Best Western made booking our family beach vacation a breeze. And it felt a little like... Good night, kids. Good night, Mama. Life's a trip make the most of it at best western hello and welcome to another edition of the rest is entertainment with me marina hyde and me richard osman hello marina hello richard how are you i'm really really well i'm more importantly

i'm going to ask how are you and, I'm going to ask how are you, and specifically I'm going to ask how are you, because anyone who listened last week will want to know whether you tried Brooklyn Beckham's pop-up delivery service on Saturday. It was on Friday that I had the items, and I chose the things that he'd made the most fuss about, which is the Nanny Peggy's breakfast sandwich. As I suspected, it didn't travel well.

And then what was the other one? It was a sort of long cut spaghetti bolognese. Again, I think that people who order pasta from delivery services are psychopaths. I was one of them. And I can tell you that that also didn't travel well but you know I've partaken in a revolutionary food delivery experience the sandwich was a disaster the spaghetti bolognese was okay I wonder if they'll release the numbers or say what a huge success it was I'm afraid I haven't seen any commentary on that so far but I will be going to have a look well I'm assuming as it was only two hours a night for two nights they probably sold out I'm guessing it would be do you know what I mean it was designed to sell out, wasn't it, really?

Pretty much. You know, if by the middle of Saturday, they're going, no, no more calls. They go, what should we, just Brooklyn in the corner with a whisk. Brooklyn's representative, of course, because he didn't do the cooking. Yeah, but do you know what?

In a sense, he did. He sprinkled his magic dust over the menu. Now, what are we going to talk about this week? It wasn't very good, what are we going to talk about this week? It wasn't very good. What are we going to talk about this week? We're going to talk about WWE, the wrestling federation who signed a big deal with Netflix, which is sort of revolutionary in lots of different ways. Which we'll be excited to.

And also, you came in saying, I've got a theory about it as well. So I'm looking forward to hearing that. My business theories. I'm sure everyone can't wait to dive into those.'ve also got the oscars nomination route over barbie uh ryan gosling was nominated and greta goig and margaret robbie were not not nominated in the director and actors category respectively and everybody's absolutely lost their minds on this one and we're gonna you're gonna help them regain their minds i will attempt to help people regain their minds on this one and what else we can talk about we uh we're going to help them regain their minds. I will attempt to help people regain their minds on this one. And what else are we going to talk about?

We're going to talk about The Traitors. We'll talk about that at the end, just in case people still haven't seen it. So no spoilers, et cetera, et cetera. But yeah, I think we'll talk about that. But we're going to do that for a tiny bit. But then we're also going to go back to our old friends, Jeff Bezos and Lauren Sanchez, because it was his 60th birthday. Returning podcast characters, Jeff and Lauren.

We're going to talk about who turned up and what went on. I'm assuming that Brooklyn Beckham did not do the catering. No, he didn't. Although the catering is interesting and we will come to it. I mean, that's a hook to keep people listening. The catering at Jeff Bezos' birthday. Yes, please. It's absurd.

Anyway, the wrestling is going to Netflix. It's a 10-year 5 billion dollar deal to bring mother night raw and other wrestling content to netflix this wrestling federation was basically started by vince mcmahon who is a psychologist's dream and nightmare in one he is made himself a billionaire by this he is a huge larger than life character with all that implies and we will get on to this now last year wwe merged with ufc and they created this big company called tko ufc is owned by endeavor we'll get over all these boring company names in a minute but the new name is tko now there are a lot of tlas in this story there are a lot of tlas that's three letter abbreviations yes there was the vinter mcmahon and the, who has joined the board of TKO now.

It means he's got his name back, The Rock, because he's been forced to trade as Dwayne Johnson ever since he left the warm embrace of the WWE. But he's now back within the fold and he's able to use his name, The Rock. He owns The Rock. He owns The Rock and he's back on the board. And they rang the bell on Tuesday

at the New York Stock Exchange to open trading. So it's a kind of big, splashy merger. It is a huge deal for Netflix, but there's been a huge plot twist, which we're going to get onto in a minute. This is something we've been talking about, Richard, isn't it? It's not sport, but it's kind of sport adjacent. Sports entertainment.

Sports entertainment. In fact, the WWE once went court to say that what they show is not sport, it is entertainment, just in order to save an extra 10% tax that you would have to pay if it were sport. I think that's fair enough. Yes. It's not like Jaffa Cakes being a cake or biscuit situation. I would say WWE are allowed to say this isn't a sport.

It's like ballroom dancing. It's an athletic pursuit. It's an entertainment. It's athletics meets entertainment. Yeah, with crafted plot lines. But in a way, that's what has drawn Ted Sarandos, the Netflix CEO. He said that this is absolutely in our sweet spot, which is about the drama of sport. And I think he sees this as a kind of inverse of Formula One, whereas Formula One is obviously big around the world, but not very big in North America. And now Netflix have got Drive to Survive, which kind of takes you inside the seasons and the plot lines and all the things. And it's a sort of great entry point if you're trying to take the sport more global wwe historically has been more sort of north america and they think it's sort of under exported in terms of the global market so this is huge for them it's also i mean it's not a sport it is entertainment but what it is is live which is

not something that netflix has got into before that's essentially what they said. We're not going to do live sport. Now, having this as a live event, and WWE has live events and could do a couple of times a week, that opens up the ad tier, which is what Netflix is slightly obsessed with. I mean, Netflix, by the way, just had their best ever quarter for subscribers. They put on 13 million subscribers in one quarter.

The sole reason being the password crackdown yeah they said 100 million people were uh were watching on someone else's password but what they want to do what they want to do for ages and i suspect it may take a good 18 months to two years is to introduce advertising so you get a cheaper netflix bundle if you pay less money and for netflix it's so funny how the world is turning into, oh, let's make television that's on a certain time of the week and have adverts in the middle of it. It's becoming linear. You're seeing a convergence between streaming and linear this year, and you will see a lot more of this.

And WWE is the sort of first move in that, in that you can sit and watch it. It will have to have adverts in it, and it's an absolute perfect thing for them. So $500 million a year, which is what it's costing them, actually it's a sort of lost leader for them because it will bring people and suddenly make people understand that they can bear adverts and there will be a whole group of people who will buy Netflix just for this and their Netflix experience will be one with adverts. So that for them is a huge deal as well but what is interesting is as i said i think it was last tuesday they rang the bell at the new york stock exchange there's vince mcmahon and it's all a great big thing within two days a lawsuit dropped in which vince mcmahon was accused of trafficking rape horrific sexual abuse and degradation that is genuinely too graphic for

a family podcast so i won't get into it He obviously denies all of this. But the Wall Street Journal published the details of the lawsuit. Now, over this period, we already knew that he had paid millions and millions and millions in hush money to lots of different women. He has now had to resign from the board of TKO, resign from WWE. He has completely stepped back. Now, here comes my theory okay Vince McMahon is a monster hiding in plain sight people already knew about this he's already resigned once in I think 2022 over these type of allegations possibly involving the same um complainants it's not totally clear but people knew about this he'd already made a statement on this but he kind of nominated himself back to the board and so when they originally did the Netflix deal last week,

I thought, huh, I mean, I guess, you know, wrestling is a law unto itself because you wouldn't imagine someone like Ted Sarandos kind of getting into bed with someone who has this much baggage because please don't tell me they don't know about this. You don't spend £5 billion and not do your due diligence. Everyone knows the kind of type of guy Vince McMahon is. Having said that, he is now out.

And I think that, this is my theory again, but I think that he has been outmuted. He is a liability. It's almost like what happened at Disney with Ike Perlmutter, the guy who sort of started Marvel in its current form. These are very, very difficult sort of executives and they want to get them out

so that they can have no more problems with their huge new property. Now, I think that the timing of this is so coincidental that I think he's been outmaneuvered by someone like, I don't know, maybe Ari Emanuel, who Endeavor, which owns UFC. So he owns sort of part of this merged company. And now they don't have to deal with Vince McMahon anymore. So he had sort of two days of being truly on top of the world. He's already made, he's been made a billionaire by this, but he had two days of being on top of the world and now he's completely out and it's really quite difficult to imagine to some extent wrestling without him he has created the form that in which we see it now that was a pre-done deal you think you do it but it has to be that I have no evidence because if Vince had been in court beforehand he might not

have signed the deal but he signed the deal and then was straight into court he signed the deal and like for it all to happen in one week seems to me quite extraordinary but anyway a potential enormous thorn in their side liability embarrassment is gone now Ari Emanuel was one of the people who said at the time of the Harvey Weinstein revelations came out that oh Miramax the board there should have acted a lot sooner they must have have known, everybody knew, they should have done something about it. And he was very, very vocal about that. Now, I think it would have been pretty hard for him to get into bed. And people saying, well, I mean, you can't tell us that people don't know certain things, certain accusations have been

levelled against Vince McMahon, because he already had to leave the company in a sort of slightly fake way once. So it seems to me that they have manoeuvred him out. Harry Emmanuel certainly could man could maneuver anybody out. He's the guy that Jeremy Piven is based on in Entourage. Is that right? I heard a story recently from someone who works in that world saying that they hide a very senior guy at William Morris Endeavour. But he was also called Ari. And the message came down that Ari, can he start calling himselfries so there's not two Aries in the company?

And so Ari said, okay. And so now he's called Aries even by his family. I'm sworn to is true. I'm told it's true. But yeah, he's a real operator. This is about as big a deal as you can get in Hollywood. And it's done between a company that used to

send CDs through the post and a company that was sort of we think of as just men in latex throwing each other around a ring. And it's done between a company that used to send CDs through the post and a company that, you know, was sort of, we think of as just men in latex throwing each other around a ring. And it's an extraordinarily huge deal. It means a great deal for what's going to happen at Netflix in the future. It shows their direction of travel. And I think it's just, I mean, I love the wrestling. I love it too.

I mean, and I don't know, is it worth five billion? I don't know. I don't know. People say, oh, you can't believe it. It's like, yeah, no, I know you can't. I mean, I watch the Olympics and I sometimes think, I don't think I believe any of this athletics. And plenty of others will think that.

Listen, I watched the Tour de France every year. Come on. I'm very happy to. I watched the Tour de France in the 90s. Even though you know. So it's, listen, it has an equivalence, doesn't it? But Netflix, by and large, seemed to make, there was a thing about 18 months ago saying,

oh, we've had peak Netflix, they're all over. And just time after time, they make smart decisions and do the right thing. And all these other streamers are having trouble and Netflix are just going from strength to strength. Revenues are crazy. Profit is crazy. Subscriber number's crazy.

As discussed here before, they have won the streaming wars, even if, rather sweetly, some of their competitors are pretending they haven't. So wrestling, sports or entertainment, Jaffa Cake, Cakea cake cake or biscuit i know which one my twitter will be full of yes after this podcast it's a biscuit by the way i on the i concur with you 100% agreed yes i know it's called a cake but bonnie tyler's called bonnie tyler and you wouldn't get her to regret your bathroom would you we should end everything on bonnie tyler always just five minutes to tyler we're five minutes out from tyler right i don't know how we'll get to her in this one but

can we please talk about the barbie oscars right yes we can i have had a total eclipse of the heart on this one i have to tell you there we go that's that's dealt with that's that's taken a lot of the pressure okay ryan gosling issued the nominations come out. He is nominated. Greta Gerwig is not nominated in the Best Director category and Margot Robbie is not nominated in the Best Actress category. Ryan Gosling issues a statement. The look of absolute sort of, you look so tired. Yeah, I mean, people are just realising that the Academy is disappointing to them.

I should think half of the films that have won best picture are the wrong choice but you know that showbiz that's what it's like okay but Ryan Gosling has issued a statement saying that you know there is no um Ken without Barbie all this stuff okay now he has been joined by they've tried to drag Michelle Yeoh into it she won best actress year, presumably on some kind of mutual discrimination ticket. I've seen John Stamos. The Australian State of Victoria's Police Department have got involved in this. They say Margot's been lobbied.

And here she comes, because Hillary Clinton has also tweeted on it. She said, while it can sting to win the box office but not take home the gold. Oh my God, here we go. Your millions of fans love you. You're both so much more than Ken Arf. OK, thank you, former secretary of state. OK, let me say two things. One, this is not about whether men are better than women.

It is acting categories at the Academy Awards. Also, it has nothing to do with the 2016 u.s presidential election and i'm confident in saying that okay now i guess the thing i do find really fascinating about this is okay as i say the academy of disappointed people forever and ever and you know how many years were steven spielberg's films overlooked mart Scorsese's. You know, they never issued a statement. So the issuing of the statement is new. And I honestly, his agent, Ryan Goldstein's agent, would have said maybe this will look bad for you, something, you know, and this would all have been agreed,

signed off, this is a high-level thing. It comes off as a little thing you've said on Instagram or Twitter or whatever, but it's not. It's a high-level thing. So something has changed. And I think it is that in this pious world, allyship is regarded as more valuable to his brand, financially valuable than not pissing off the Oscars, which, you know, he's been nominated before and he could be nominated again. In the old days, you would have never have said anything because you're not going to annoy them.

You're not going to sort of, you know, look gracious or anything. But this is the value placed now on allyship i mean i think if i'm all for ryan gosling making a statement i mean anytime there's a show you know it's like ant has been nominated and deck hasn't you know that would be an issue if any statements should have come from ryan gosling it should have been how on earth have i been nominated for best Actor. He's great in that film, but he's just Ryan Gosling. I mean, there's people doing extraordinary work out there in films around the world, which

would never get a look in because the Oscars is such a money game and everything has to be promoted. The fact that he's on the list of five best supporting actors is extraordinary. So Barbie up for Best Film, great, which means Margot Robbie is up there for producer. She's taken home $50 million because she had a massive back end on that movie as well, by the way.

So again, this feels very victimless, deeply victimless. And not being nominated for best actress. I mean, the five people I was looking through the list. Sandra Huller was better than her twice this year. She was better than her in The Zone of Interest. She was better than her in the zone of interest and she was better than her in Anatomy of a Fool, okay? But also all five of the nominations are women. Yeah.

I looked through the list. Yeah. So it's not like, you know, who's she knocking out? Yes. You know, it seemed... Women are getting nominated here, yeah. Director of Anatomy of a Fool is a woman and she was nominated in the Best Director category.

So I really think that this is an absolutely mad row. But what people will be wanting, because the conversation online about everything that happened, but bear in mind, Barbie has been, I can't remember a movie that's been as good as that and getting itself talked about right from the minute they started promoting it. It is unbelievable. And there have been something like 120% more posts.

This was like the day after, 326% more video views talking about this. All the search terms of things like, you know, Margot, Greta. I mean, if you're a financier at a studio, you'll be thinking, please can someone snub my movie next year? I am desperate for someone to snub my movie because then they're putting this thing back into theatres. It's absolutely mad. As we've said before, this is a movie that is made

in the service of a toy corporation, Mattel. I liked it very much. I thought the third act was a mess, but it was very jolly and we enjoyed it. Having said that, J-Lo, they've just announced this week that J-Lo is now going to executive produce another movie for Mattel,

which is Bob the Builder. J-Lo's doing Bob the Builder? J-Lo's doing Bob the Builder. So I want you to know that in two or three years, we're all going to be sitting here crying that the person who played Dizzy the Cement Mixer has been snubbed at the Academy Awards and probably in the best supporting category.

And I hope we'll be having... I cannot believe Sandra Oh was overlooked for being Dizzy. I can't... Oh, you think it could be a woman? Yeah, I think so, don't you? God, I mean, yeah, I i mean yeah i'm sure i'm sure they'll really reimagine the the toy property which they are making in the service of the toy do you know what i didn't realize dizzy was a gentleman well yeah no they're all guys my

memory no yeah the whole gang on every single one of those pieces of hardware isn't it is a man is it lofty and wendy mark and dizzy oh yeah lofty and wendy joined the crew I think they're late additions because they felt like we've got to have one bird in this construction. Wendy played by Margot Robbie. Yeah, of course. We'll wait to see. No, they're going to have to re-gender that a little bit, aren't they? Oh, yes. I mean, you know, best piece of hardware at the Oscars.

Where are we going with this? So J-Lo and Bob the Builder. That's a marriage made in heaven, isn't it? I think Bob is going down to Puerto Rico. He's going to become involved in construction there. I'm sure it'll become a deeply political movie because this is the only prison via which we are able to discuss issues in our culture now

is via the prism of Mattel toys. Can we fix it to Si Senor? I'm genuinely... Listen, I know you're using it to illustrate a point, but I'm very much looking forward to that. Yeah. Shall I tell you who I'd like to talk to about J-Lo buying Bob the Builder and about to do a big Hollywood movie?

Neil Morrissey, the voice of Bob the Builder. Do you think he'd be disposed warmly towards this? Well, I think Neil Morrissey would quite rightly say, I'm pretty good at playing Bob the Builder. And I'm a very, very respected actor. I've done Line of Duty. I've done a lot of good stuff. It's not crazy that I could be Bob the Builder.

It's not crazy that I could get that instead of Jesse Eisenberg. I think we'll see. I think they've actually already cast Bob, and it is a young Latino actor who I'm afraid I didn't know, but we'll wait and see. As I say, this will become the big culture war in 2025 or 26.

If Neil Morrissey doesn't get that job and then does not get nominated for an actor, I would absolutely lose my mind. By the way, America Ferreira is nominated for Best Supporting Actress

for Barbie. He's totally taken her thunder, hasn't he? She's like, hey, wait a minute. Sorry. But again, how is that? I don't know the Oscars. Sometimes you watch things on, you watch films

and there's people who are so amazing at acting and you would just never hear their names at the Oscars. It's always just the same old gang, isn't it? Yeah. With like one new person each year. They go, oh, you can come in. Yes. Do come and join us.

Yeah, so we're okay with the Oscars. Yeah. I'm calm with come in. Yes. Do come and join us. Yeah, so we're okay with the Oscars. Yeah, I'm calm with the nominations. Excellent. So we're going to talk about Traitors and Lauren Sanchez and Jeff Bezos' birthday party straight after this. This episode is brought to you by Fidelity Investments Canada. Make investing simple.

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Welcome back into the, let's say, unusual world of Jeff Bezos and Lauren Sanchez, friends of the podcast. Very much friends of the podcast. It has been Jeff's 60th birthday party. And Lauren has his intended. The affianced, as you know, has thrown a birthday party for him in their Beverly Hills place. Nice place. Yeah, I can imagine. I can tell you what the party was like.

It was vaguely space-themed because he likes space. You know, it took him 60 years to get a character note, but he's got one now, and so everything has to be basically space-themed. Like a five-year-old's birthday party. Yeah, like a five... Next year, dinosaurs. Yeah.

Now, guests were welcomed by a built-out office that was an almost exact replica of Jeff's first Amazon office that was in a garage. Oh, that's a nice idea. Yeah, lovely idea. And they were served McDonald's because he also once worked in McDonald's when it was his first job and caviar. Whoa. McDonald's and caviar? McDonald's and caviar.

Where were you putting the caviar? Filet-O-Caviar? I don't know. How would you do it? I'm not sure exactly about the mashups between the McDonald's menu, and I don't want to draw a lawsuit from the corporation. McCaviar. McCaviar.

Lauren was in something red, 800 hours of beading, and a space rocket handbag, no surprises. But it's the passenger manifest of this party that I'm quite interested in because, okay, it has the usual billionaires. But it had Oprah, Katy Perry and Orlando Bloom, Ivanka Trump and Jared Kushner, a load of Kardashians, lots of Jenners. And slightly disappointing, I have to say, Jay-Z and Beyonce. Really? Yeah.

I mean, that's covering all bases, isn't it? It is. I mean, these are celebrities that Jeff would like to know. What I always find very depressing when you see things like this, you used to see it was sort of Philip Green's parties as well. He'd have these enormous kind of parties for his 50th, 60th, whatever. And you'd get these celebrities who were not his closest friends. I can understand why he would want them. I certainly see why Jeff and Lauren would want them here. But don't we want something more from our great celebrities than that they want to sort of turn up to the boss

of the Everything Corporation's birthday party? I mean, I suppose it is. And this is always just very depressing. I mean, it should be beneath Jay-Z and Beyonce. I'm sorry to say. I think that they just feel like they love, people like to be near power and they like to be near money. And I mean, these are not the interesting,

but Jeff Bezos is not an interesting guy. He's not a sort of fun. I find it very depressing when money. And I mean, these are not the interesting, but Jeff Bezos is not an interesting guy. He's not a sort of fun. I find it very depressing when money dictates absolutely everything, including a sort of gas list of that. And people want to be near it. Had we been invited with our respective partners, I suspect all four of us would have gone. I'd go to just look at it. Yeah, exactly. But that said, a lot of it is I wonder what Jeff Bezos' house is like.

But you see it in London a lot. Celebrity and money, they have an equivalent. So very, very rich people can get access to celebrities. Yeah. And they like to get access to celebrities. It gives them a sort of glamour that they don't have. And celebrities, a certain group of celebrities, like having access to money.

I see Robbie Williams is there. I mean, he is... Was he? Do you know, a friend of mine was once at a wedding. And anyway, he did a film of me of the couple having their first dance. And they were dancing to Angels by Robbie Williams. And it's such a great video because then he just pans to the side and you go to the stage. It's like, oh, it's actual Robbie singing it on the stage.

Wow. He can be hard as a wedding singer. That's, yeah. Listen, talking of J-Lo. Yeah. So when she got married in Italy about 20 odd years ago, it's just after 9-11. So the entire cast list sort of said, I'm not coming. So almost all the guests from America pulled out.

They didn't want to fly. And so an emergency flare went up in London around like the Groucho Club and stuff. Can anybody get out to Italy for J-Lo's wedding and Alexander Armstrong went to J-Lo's wedding because there was an open invitation to anyone who was even vaguely known by anybody in London to go out

and fill the seats at J-Lo's wedding so they had to have a full church but also yes you don't want there to be like eight people out there. They tend to have like three friends at all and that's within the celebrity community. They've normally cut all ties with their childhood associates. There are certain celebrities in London who have parties that are only attended by other celebrities. And if you are ever invited there, it's literally everybody is a celebrity.

And you do kind of go, where are your friends from school? Yeah, I know. And there's a sort of sense that it's, and in a funny way, people are going because they think it might be good for their career. It's a kind of like, it's a sort of business decision all the time that you're doing business absolutely all the time,

even in your social life. But it's also that clever thing of thinking, well, I know at that party it's all celebrities, so I wonder who else will be there. And so, of course, you're in a room full of celebrities, all of whom have come along, so you're thinking, I wonder who else will be there and so of course you're in a room full of celebrities all of whom have come along so I think I wonder who else will be there that'll be an interesting story but yeah that that that world of high finance and celebrity I find fascinating

they both absolutely love access to each other I would say the the the few times that we sold endermore we were always selling it to someone when you sell a company that you know the people buying you're incredibly smart about your earnings and the multiples of earnings that they should pay for your company but if you've got a TV company the multiples go absolutely out the window because honestly they just think if we buy this company we'll probably get to meet Davina

you know and so suddenly your company is worth 8 times as much as it should be because it has like this halo of celebrity around it and the social circuit is exactly the same uh and yeah listen of course we've gone to Jeff Bezos's birthday I would have gone just to have a look of course but you see I would I would have had you had to have your phone taken off you and put in a pouch and then everyone was only able to talk about it afterwards online but they were

all saying there was also I believe that that it was probably lauren who tipped off the new york post saying in case anyone thought the mcdonald's and caviar and everything theme was sort of a grotesque and over the top she said you know it was a strict no gifts policy what are you gonna get my gift voucher by the way this is you at the party hi jeff i'm marina so nice to meet you well i would have wanted to talk to them for ages yeah I want to talk to these people for as long as possible always see if you're a writer you've always got the sort of slightly to get out of jail free card like oh I'm going along to see the horror

and in some in some way I'll write about it later but I assume at some point we have a wedding to look forward to as well between the two of them can you imagine she said we don't know whether it would be a small one or a big one and I thought thought, I do, Lauren, even if you don't know yet. I think I know which one it's going to be. They've had about three engagement parties already. It's going to be, it will be kind of grotesque and extreme. I mean, that will be in a rocket. Yeah. Oh, yeah.

I mean, you'll have three rocket rides around the back, like a donkey ride. But just go up in Blue Origin for five seconds. 20 minutes before Alexander Armstrong gets a call saying, everyone's pulled out, Zander, is there any way to which he would say yes let's do the traitors very very quickly if you have not watched the final switch off now it's been a lovely seeing you we'll see you on thursday for the question and answer one but if you have watched it i'm amazed you've been able to avoid the outcome but well done if you have uh right we're now talking about it so spoilers ahoy it was epic it was shakespearean it was everything you wanted to see.

This is what, we talked about this before, when reality TV mimics most dramatic things in fiction, that is what you want to see. That is at its highest form. I mean, if we were in a writer's room, we go,

how about right at the end, we literally see her write the H of Harry, and then she crosses it out. You go, oh, that's a little bit on the nose, isn't it? Poor old Molly. I mean, no ill crosses it out, you go, oh, that's a little bit on the nose, isn't it? Poor old Molly.

I mean, no ill will to her, bless her, but everybody needs a pet idiot, and that's what he had with her. He was able to use her as a shield all the way through. And I am very depressed that I have been seeing words like gaslit and groomed on social media, talking about this, saying this is why it was so disturbing. This is the most ridiculous way to talk about somebody who has entered a television program

with the title traitors, in which you have to sign up and say that if their hand goes on your shoulder, you behave like a traitor. I find it extraordinary that people have been talking about it in this way. I agree 100%. It was Harry was literally playing a uh a game which he did very very well i love how much there's almost a moral collapse every time at the end of the traitors you think oh he's gonna go or he's gonna share the money but no it's a game show and he he won the money and listen she has genuinely got herself to blame i mean there is no logical earthly reason why jazz would say this to another traitor here if he was a traitor but again he didn't have as we discussed before he didn't have that social capital at any stage

he was and i can see he's become a sort of cult favorite which is super and i'm really pleased for him but he didn't have within the group that was in the castle that social capital at any stage to have gone out on a limb and said it because if he had been a little bit more of a sort of you know just one of the most popular figures in the group as it were he was obviously liked but he wasn't sort of like a harry or paul or one of those things then he he could have gone out and he could have got it for himself but exactly he didn't have that main character energy so he was he yeah he did not have the ability to persuade molly i mean molly knew as well i know i mean that's the thing. You know, she knew she knew. It was mesmerising watching someone know and not be able to do it.

As I say, this was the highest form of the art form. It was, yeah. I absolutely loved it. I think, you know, absolute fair play to Harry. One of the things I love to see is when people put on social media, like an entire bar stopped and they've got it on a massive screen in the bar like it's sports and everyone is just like that with their drink going, oh got it on a massive screen in the bar like it's sports and everyone is just like that with their drink

going, oh! And jazz kind of came in. It's so great. I love footage from places where you don't expect people to be watching television. I've got a real weakness for it and we saw such a lot of that this weekend. And then you realise,

which I've said forever and ever, almost all reality shows are sport. I mean, it just is. It's personalities and people and gameplay. Someone once sent me a picture. There was obviously a World Cup game or something in the main town square in Swansea, and they'd set the big screen up earlier,

and Pointless was on, so someone just sent me a picture of my massive face just overlooking Swansea. Well, in the future, I think we should be in the show to everybody like that, and Pointless should be shown in all town squares. I have a business idea I might talk about on a future episode, which I think is a billion-dollar idea's uh it's sort of around that area but listen

we don't need to get into it now it'd be fascinating to see what happens next series because no one had really learned anything from the first series this time and that's absolutely fine and we talked before about the fact that they're in a very enclosed environment and everything feels so hyper real anyway so whatever sort of tactics you think you're going to have, slightly go out the window. But next time, it has got to occur to people that the getting out of the traders is not the point of the game. The point of the game is surviving.

And, you know, if you get them out. Stay in people's lipstream. Don't feel, it's, yeah. Which Evie did. And Evie sort of said that. She said, you know, I've been quiet throughout, but I was quiet for a reason. You know, I think Molly was quiet because she was just quiet,

but I think Evie kept quiet. But I think that next, and it's fascinating with her because she sort of got herself voted out because she was, there was that whole thing of the people who knew that Harry had the shield and she was one of them and she was like, well, the other two have been voted out, so now it was that whole thing of the people who knew that harry had the shield and she was one of them and she was like well the other two have been voted out so now it's me it has to be me she was frightfully reasonable even though she knew it wasn't reasonable she knew it wasn't her but she kept saying i quite understand i quite understand and

she made it easy to actually because a lot of it at that point is that you are sort of knifing someone and you're taking them away from the money and the emotive stories they've just told you about why they need the money and so but she made it easy to write her name down but she i mean it was a thing that happened three days ago which which in traitors thing might as well be the 17th century they literally if it didn't happen 10 minutes ago like then then then they're not interested uh and so yeah she absolutely got herself voted out there harry what a player i mean i throw roses at his feet. And the shield thing, at that point of the show

where it's very, very hard to keep your momentum up, which is when there's six or seven people left, he got rid of three people in a row with one simple ploy. Not simple ploy, with one clever ploy, which was the shield, and then was absolutely willing to lie barefaced to someone he cared very deeply about to win the money. It's all up all up there in the title of the show and that's how you win that show but yeah next series will be fascinating but congratulations to everyone who uh who worked on that show i thought it was an amazing achievement phenomenal claudia was phenomenal i mean the whole

thing was beautifully put together and lovely to see you know seven million people tuned in on friday night that'll go the catch-up go above 10 million, you know, it's really lovely, fascinating this is just a sidebar, but of course pretty slightly lower ratings than I'm a Celebrity get me out of here, but everyone talking about it in a different way than they do with I'm a Celebrity, everyone's going

I'm not watching this year, because Farage with Traitors, everyone's watching it it was exactly the same amount of people and it's the real high low of all sorts of people saying I don't get involved in this sort of stuff normally

and it's a real like kind of gateway drug for a lot of people who do not think they don't watch reality TV but will make an exception

for this show which is really I think that's quite interesting gosh we covered a lot didn't we yes we did that was rather a lot let's say that we are

coming back as always on Thursday for a questions... And answers. ...edition of this show. That'll be fun. It's largely going to be Bonnie Tyler-based, I think. Yeah. Do please keep your questions Tyler or otherwise related. Send them in to us at therestisentertainment at gmail.com. They are so good, the questions.

We absolutely love them and it's going to be quite hard to get through. Well, I was looking through a few. We've got got some great ones for this week some really great ones including that question of why do people on the traitors and bake off and that why don't they give away what happened to the audience beforehand so i have an answer for that and and many other things as well see you on thursday see you on thursday Thursday.