The Rest Is Entertainment - The Secret PR War Over Graham Norton's Sofa

Episode Date: January 22, 2026

Is there a secret formula to who sits where on the Graham Norton sofa? Has the Salt Path scandal actually changed publishing? And is the Marty Supreme marketing campaign the greatest of all time? Richard Osman and Marina Hyde answer your questions on chat show hierarchies, mockumentaries and more. WIN TICKETS TO 'THE TRAITORS LIVE EXPERIENCE': To celebrate the launch of the new series of The Traitors we’re giving you and a friend the chance to get a taste of the ultimate game of deception and tactics. Sign up to our free newsletter by visiting ⁠therestisentertainment.com⁠ and you’ll be automatically entered into our competition to win two tickets to The Traitors Live Experience in central London. T&Cs Apply. Join The Rest Is Entertainment Club: Unlock the full experience of the show – with exclusive bonus content, ad-free listening, early access to Q&A episodes, access to our newsletter archive, discounted book prices with our partners at Coles Books, early ticket access to live events, and access to our chat community. Sign up directly at therestisentertainment.com For more Goalhanger Podcasts, head to www.goalhanger.com Video Editor: Joe Pettit & Imee Marriott Assistant Producer: Imee Marriott Senior Producer: Joey McCarthy Social Producer: Bex Tyrrell Exec Producer: Neil Fearn Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hello and welcome to this episode of the Restis Entertainment Questions and Answers edition. I'm Marina Hyde. And I'm Richard Osman. Hello, Marina. Hello, Richard. How are you? I'm very well. Thank you listeners and viewers, as always for your wonderful questions.

Yes, I feel almost viewers in preponderance should be coming first now. But anyhow, we will begin immediately for you with a question about Graham Norton's show. So many people have asked this. I know, it's funny, isn't it? There are certain questions crop up again and again. And this one seems to do a particular obsession of people. Yeah, it is. Dean Evel in this instance says,

how is the guest order decided on the Graham Norton show? Is there a hierarchy from left to right? Is it at all to do with money? Or is it designed for the best possible level of interaction? Wow, that little bit of everything is a truth. It's been asked so many times. And sometimes with producers of shows, I'm like, there are secrets that you don't really want to give away.

One of those might be who you put in what positions, because there are reasons. but I thought I would ask Graham Stewart, who is Graham's long-term producer, and also, by the way, doing Claudia's new chat show, which I'm sure we'll talk about at some point. Oh, my gosh, we certainly will. But Graham gave me the exact answer. Oh, great.

So this is absolutely from the person who knows. Graham says, first you says, interesting question from one of your media savvy listeners. It's good. See, that's how you do a chat show. You make sure people feel good about themselves. My answer can be summed up thus. Welcome to show business where all stars are equal, but some are more equal than others. Media hierarchy is primarily driven by publicists.

And we've talked about that many times. And seat one, which is the seat next to Graham, is the primary aim of all of them for their clients. I've been on that show a number of times. I do not have a publicist. No one ever talked to me about seat one, Graham. But seat one is the one. He says, and he's absolutely right. Our sofa is so star-packed that those publicists have to work very hard to get what they want.

And you're right, there are certain shows where, I mean, literally. Is it a trial by combat? They're fighting each other, the publicists? There are huge amounts of people, huge amounts of big stars. Yeah, these publicists have to work very hard to get what they want. Here's where we draw the curtain a bit. I leave it to you to imagine how long that process can take. Wow.

So, you know, different publicists saying, we must be seat one. We must be seat one. After that, we aim to arrange the order to maximize chemistry. So you've got seat one, which would be the one next to Graham. So that is the primary of the state. Seats 2, 3 and 4. And that is chemistry based. And not hierarchical.

Not hierarchical. It's absolutely just what works best. He says, seat 4 is interesting. So seat 4 is the seat furthest from Graham. Same on House of Game. So on Seat 4, actually, you feel like you're slightly further away from somebody. The same on the Graham Show. Seat 4 is interesting.

Traditionally, the birth is for a funny person, but it can also accommodate an artist we know will play the talk show game correctly and help create the right kind of conversational flow. Now, by saying someone who knows how to play the game, it's literally someone who is fun in conversation and who wants to hear from other people and you can throw in their own things, which are funny and fun,

but also can be sat a fair amount of distance from Graham. And also can look a skence within the spirit of the show on proceedings and deliver sort of acid asides or whatever. I think that that works as well for that person. Well, there's an interesting thing if you're sat in that seat is that the camera angle on you, you can look off. Yeah. And you can look to the audience in a way that you cannot do in seats two and three.

So you can absolutely be, what's going on here? Yeah. Oh my God. Johnny Depp and Tom Hanks are having an argument. You know, it's... If you're competent in some way, it's the safest seat because you get to be the most yourself. It's the most fun seat.

You're not having to sort of... You're a no-one slipstream. You're not having to nod at Arnold Schwarzenegger and then sort of look the other way and nod at Scarley-Hansson. You know, you can... Which I hate at dinner parties. You can look off at the band and say, are you hearing this, guys?

So the seat form, as I say, someone who knows how to play the game, he said, but the key factor in all of this, and this is why Graham is absolutely right about this, Graham Stewart. So the key factor in all of this is the extraordinary ability of Graham Norton to ringmaster a soft furnishing base line of giant egos. Nobody does it better. He is brilliant. I couldn't agree more. And by the way, I think when Graham said giant egos there,

he's not saying anyone's a diva. He's just saying that people are there to do their own. They're working show business. Whenever I go on other TV shows, I'm playing a different game to other people, I think, a little bit. You have to go on and you have to promote things. But I'm always watching how it is presented and produced. And sometimes you go on shows and you're like,

okay, well, I guess I'll fix this in the edit. But on that show, I'm watching the brilliant art of Graham Stewart and Yo Magnuson who produce it and also how brilliant Graham Norton is, because I can see the production that's gone on. I can see the stuff that's prepped. I can see the rhythm that they want. I can see the kind of structure that they put together. But then I can see how, when you get a host like Graham Norton, how they can riff off the back of that and how they can turn it into something different. But the seat one stuff is fun, isn't it? It's really fun. I just really want to imagine all the publicists having to do incredibly vicious tasks versus each other. But also now you have to look back over every episode of Graham Norton and see when two people have a similar level of fame and you just go, and then you just have to imagine the conversation.

We talked about it once before, the old Concord seating arrangement. It's very, very difficult. Who goes in 1A? Oh, yeah. Like Jagger and Rupert Murdoch, what do you do? I mean, I know what I'd do, but I would head back to the Ryanair queue immediately. A question for you, Marina, from Danny Miller. The Marty Supreme Marketing Campaign has surely succeeded in terms of getting an indie flick about a table tennis player from the 1950s into the cultural zeitgeist.

What are the greatest movie marketing campaigns of all time? Yes, Marty Supreme has become A24's most successful movie via the North American box office, which is what they really can't and care about. It's been helped by a very, very willing star who's willing to do unusual things, Timothy Shalameh. and he's obviously some funny behind-the-scenes campaign videos which they put on like the whole thing the orange clothes the Kylie of it all the Kylie Jenner of it all He's a Graham Norton seat one. Yeah, he's absolutely seat one. The last one we really saw like that was Barbie with Margot Robbie who absolutely hauled that film around the world. They had premieres, every which we turned up to every premiere in a different and amazing kind of pink outfit.

Again, it's sort of costuming, but it's fun and it's knowing. But there were many other things with that. they spent, I think it cost 145 and they spent 150 on marketing, so more money. Million. Yeah. And that colour, remember, they ran out of that specific pink for set painting in the UK, that specific shade of Barbie pink. But they had saturation marketing for that, you know, like everything from Google,

changing its name on, all of those things. But the thing that you couldn't really predict was the Barbenheimer phenomenon. And that came up organically and that was great for both that and Oppenheimer. Do you think there's better for Oph-I-B, I know that Nolan, is a huge filmmaker and has made a lot of money in his time. But do you think it boosted Oppenheimer more than it boosted Barbie? Yes, I do. I really do.

And I think that you didn't see Killian Murphy or Nolan trogging around the world. I mean, she was everywhere, Margaret. She absolutely dragged that movie around the world. And I think she did brilliantly. And she was really out there. I've got a huge amount of Simon for her. I think she's fantastic. Yes, agreed.

Okay, we talked about, I will just do this one quickly. Jaws was amazing because it opened coast to coast and it had a lot of TV ads, which was crucial, and that poster is iconic. So Jaws was one of those. Going to further sort of Stephen Spielberg monster films, Jurassic Park was incredible because that campaign was all about something. I mean, he obviously learned from Jaws that, you know, maybe the anticipation and not seeing the monster, the shark in that case or the dinosaurs, it kind of gets more out. It serves up more suspense and it serves up more drama. You never saw the dinosaurs. You could hear them.

You might hear the footprint, but you never saw them. And there was such an expectation for what do these things look like because it was obviously going to be the CGI triumph. So that brings me to my next one. No one knew. Avatar, as always when someone takes a big swing, you know, there's always these people out there saying

this is going to be a complete disaster. It's going to flob, it's going to tank so badly. You know, what's James Cameron thinking of? And that was definitely the narrative about Avatar. which was it was all going to be a big disaster. And so I remember what they did was that they got lots of journalists and whatever, and they gave them a 15-minute screening, and they gave them a look at the world, and it completely destroyed the disaster narrative overnight,

because those people, we would not have even known what the word influence meant at that time, but they effectively were cultural influences, and that turned everything around overnight. Again, Star Wars, everyone thought that would bomb. There was nothing in popular culture that said, oh, there's a Star Wars shape gap missing in this particular thing. So it was a really big swing. I think in a way, the marketing for that was brilliant. The campaign for that was fantastic. But also what George Lucas did was that he got all those toys ready.

He believed in it so much. He got all the toys ready in advance. He understood that merchandising was part of the law, was part of the way in which young people were going to understand the world. And not as a sort of afterthought, but part of actually. the world, the universe building. Well, I was six years old when Star Wars came out, and we went to see it. We were not a family who ever went to the cinema when we were not a culturally rich family.

But I just remember just the assumption, of course you would go and see Star Wars. It's like jury service. It is now my weekend to go and see Star Wars and the excitement of the thing. And absolutely no idea where that came from because they weren't influencing me particularly. And my mum is almost uninfluencible. But there you go. Something worked, yeah. Well, okay.

God, I loved that film when I went to see it. So amazing. What a lovely film to have as your first, you know, like a film that's so brilliantly made and has endured. Listen, I can, you know, buy or leave the rest of the Star Wars universe. But that as a, as a... But the toys then serving as a sort of, because the toys were so big, serving as a sort of iterated campaign, by the time you played with them and you're in the world. I can live without the toys.

I can live that all about. But they were a huge thing. Oh, for sure. And they were away. that by the time the Empire Strikes Back comes in, you've been playing with these things for three years or whatever it was. I think I was still on action, man, at that point. Okay, Deadpool was great.

That was a brilliant sort of Marvel campaign in a kind of peak, to try and do something different within that universe. For me, I love things like this. So the Blair Witch project was unbelievable. That movie cost $60,000. It created the idea of found footage, as we know it, which now is so hackneyed as you can't even do it anymore. But it became a cultural emerge.

People were completely obsessed with it. They created fake missing persons posters. It had a website. Wow. Wow. Yeah. You know, this is 99. It had a website.

It had fake newsreels. It had police reports on the website. It was something completely different and ultra, ultra avant-garde and modern in terms of anything. And people were obsessed with it. As I say, the movie costs $60,000. And so there are lots of great horror ones, actually. That's one where you can't say that movie costs 60. No.

And they spent 70 on marketing. You're quite right. You're quite right. But there are lots of horror ones that are good. Hitchcock did it by accident with Psycho because he really didn't want to give away any forms of twists that may or may not be in the movie. He didn't want to give anything away.

So he said to the theatre owners, no one can be admitted late to this film. And they let it be known that he'd said this. And so it created this whole kind of idea of but why. And so they had all these. There were long cues and people could see in real life there were long cues around the cinema. So that was a big one. Blockbusters.

Yeah. Cloverfield, which is a kind of horror sci-fi. I think this one was an amazing one. It was a viral ARG game, you know, alternate reality game. And it was so clever. That was just JJ Abrams movie. The Dark Night did this too. And they involved sort of MySpace pages for the characters.

There were fake websites. There were all these kind of lovecraftian elements. And it was sort of possible to people. pieced together the idea of what the monster might be from what there was out there. And again, the Dark Knight did this, you know, to make the fans players before they have ever got to see it is incredible. Which now we take as an absolute given. We do.

I credit all of those with having had amazing habits. Sometimes it's just a slogan and I've talked before, so I went bang on about it, like, you know, in space, no one can hear you scream, all of the sort of alien thing. The alien thing, which was just an egg on the poster. Again, what's in the egg. That sort of anticipation. but I would say in terms of actually really quite concerted and clever campaigns or in Hitchcock's case, almost accidental, although he's so calculating that it's hard. But Marty Supreme has certainly, in a time when we've, you know, press campaigns are getting quite tired and they're not doing, that has broken out of the strictures, which means that essentially you can spend all this money and it not really, and things not even really get noticed.

That has broken out of that. And a huge amount of it is credit to Timothy Shalameh and the way he did it and the way he leans into. to those things because most stars don't want to promote their movies. And it's fascinating as well that thing of when something enters popular culture and you haven't worked out how it is to be able to sort of cross that Rubicon into mainstream popular culture, which is very, very, very hard to do. I remember, I must have been 21, 22 or something. And I remember Reservoir Dogs.

Oh, yeah. Okay. And I don't know anything about the story behind that marketing campaign. I remember seeing that poster and I remember everyone going Oh, I'm so excited for that film coming out I cannot wait for that film coming out And this is a movie by someone we'd never heard of before

It had people you knew in it But you know, so Most people didn't know those people Yeah, exactly It wasn't kind of, it wasn't a new Tom Hanks movie Yeah, just had that black and red and white poster

With sort of people wearing sunglasses You know, was kind of walking towards you. And everybody wanted to see that movie. And the music, the soundtrack took on a complete cultural life of its own, and that's always very helpful. Yeah,

it's amazing, isn't it? And it's got a how, that alchemy is quite something. Yeah, so Star Wars and Reservoir Dogs both had that effect on me. And I think this Christmas said it,

Marty Supreme, you're just like, oh, of course I'm going to go and see that. I don't really. have an option not to. Yeah. You know, it's a, I mean, that's just the next thing that I'm going to go and do. It's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's,

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Learn more at adobe.com slash do that with acrobat. Welcome back, everybody. Well, here is a question after my own heart from Nick, Richard, about the salt path. Have sales of the salt path been affected in the aftermath of the observer's investigation? This was the one that cast doubt on the stories behind this unbelievable bestselling book. any sense it's caused lasting damage in the publishing industry. It's a story that really caught light. Isn't it interesting? And stories don't often catch light in the publishing industry is the truth. It's quite hard for publishing to get on the front page. And this was a story about a book that in publishing

was big, but in the wider world, you know, was still relatively small. So a phenomenon within the world of publishing, but outside the world of publishing didn't have the name recognition, which it now definitively does. Something about the story that really caught people's attention, It's something about the lie of the thing, something about... By Rainer Wyn, and it's about going off on a walk when they're sort of made homeless, apparently through no fault of their own in the telling of the book. And her and her husband, who has a seemingly terminal illness, go on this walk around the south part in Cornwall,

and he is semi-cured via this journey against the elements. And yeah, all sorts of inconsistencies were shown up. And so it became a big story. By the way, I met someone. who knew the Raina Wyn's husband. So this is one of the nicest guys you'll ever meet. But I mean, it doesn't help with our narrative here. So, yeah, it was a big story.

So what effect does it have? And again, we have to talk about the thing that the publishing industry is an ecosystem all of its own. It doesn't work in the same way as talking about, you know, marketing campaigns for films and stuff like that, where there is a place for them to be essential in our culture. It's not the case with books. And if you look at something like the rise of Freedom McFadden, that has not come through traditional... No. So she's the absolute biggest name in publishing, self-publish, but it comes more via

Facebook and just word of mouth and things like that, which happen with books. The other side of that is you can have a huge scandal like this, like the saltpard thing. And it was a big story. You know, if this had been TV story, if it had been the BBC, we'd never heard the end of it. The people who would have resigned would have been absolutely crazy. But the net impact of it, I would say, across, say. sales across the culture of the publishing industry is literally zero. It is nothing.

Sales figures didn't really get a bump particularly when it came out. I guess the amount of people who suddenly thought I'd like to read that was offset by the amount of people who were suddenly going, ooh, I don't know if I should read that. So sales had sort of no impact whatsoever. The sales chart is exactly where it was before. has had an impact on Raina Wynne's next book, which hasn't come out, and I don't imagine we'll come out anytime soon. But her next next book, which I imagine will be about this, I suspect we'll do rather well.

But it's had no impact there. And I've talked to various agents and editors about stuff that goes in on submission now and what publishers are looking for and what commissioning editors are looking for. They say it never comes up. What, fact checking? Not even fact checking. Just the idea that this might have had, an impact on an industry whatsoever. There are a couple more legal queries than usual on some

submissions, major. But certainly no commissioner is going, oh, I don't know about doing real life stories because, you know, it's a lot of hassle and, you know, people now sort of doubting everything they read. No one is doubting what they read more. No one is saying, we can't do a thing about walking along a path, a couple more queries from the legal people. No one has resigned. no one's lost their job no one's really all that fussed about it and it has had no impact whatsoever on sales it's had an immediate impact on Rainer's career

because the next book is not going to come out but that will be substituted by the fact that the books she does next course will be about what happens when you become the centre of a media storm what happens to your family what is your truth a metaphorical storm this time as opposed to the other types of the elements exactly where you were sitting in your farmhouse in France rather than walking down a coastal path like you said you were going to.

So yeah, it's had no impact at all really. The Salt Path movie Julian Anderson and Jason Isaacs did neither well or badly. But yeah, when all this story came out, there were people saying, actually, this is going to send people into the bookshops to buy this book. It's going to go crazy. It did not go crazy. Other people saying, well, that's it. She'll never set another book in her life.

She is still sending books. So it has had absolutely zero effect whatsoever. I find publishing a fascinating sort of bubble in the middle of things where different rules apply. You cannot, you cannot apply the rules of other bits of culture, television, film, music even to the world of publishing. It exists in an entirely different sphere. To answer your question in a way, it has had no impact whatsoever. I love that answer. Yeah, tells its own story.

Yeah, that story happens to be true, which is rare these days. Marina, a question from Ila Carragon. Like Marina, I am obsessed with the idea of the Charlie XXXX. mockumentary the moment coming at the end of the month. What are your top three mockumentaries? That's a really good question and I really like the form. The first time we ever heard that word was in the opening sort of monologue by Rob Reiner. I mean, he created that word for us. At the beginning of spinal tap. Right, the beginning of spinal tap. So by the way, I've divided these into cinema and TV. I'll do kind of TV first, I think. What is it about the form?

I love it. It's fun to write. It's really fun. It's a fun sleight of hand, isn't it? I tell you why, in some ways you like it, because it's a format. And it's always funny to play with a format. So you're saying, here's a set of rules for how we do these things. And as a writer, yes. You know, they're moving parts. They're talking heads. There's found footage.

There's all of these things. And then we put it all together. It's a little bit like doing a play within a play or something like that, is that you can play with a form and you can make it. But writers love it. So there have always been, you know, mockumentaries is an absolute favorite of writers, especially comedy writers. Yeah.

Yes, exactly. All of mine are comedies. my TV ones. She's not in there yet, but she probably will be in a series or two. All the cunk ones. She's just outside the top three and four. Yeah, all of those.

Number three, I'm going to put summer heights high, which I think may have aged really complicatedly in some departments, but it's genuinely hysterical. So that's Chris Lilly, the Australian guy. Yeah, and it's a sort of documentary

behind a story of just a high school where a girl from a private school doesn't exchange with a girl from their school. We never see her. I find it hysterical. Number two, I'm going to put them two equal, and I almost feel they're not really mockumentaries. So is this number one and number two?

No, this is number three I've just done because I've done it properly. Well, you haven't if you're doing joint number twos. Oh yeah, you're right, I can't. You can haven't because if Summer Heights High is number four. No. And these two are joint number two. You can't relegate one to behind Summer Heights high. It's almost like I should be picking a genre because those ones that came in the wake of documentaries, of mockumentaries,

the TV comedies, like modern family, like. like Parks and Recreation. They sort of are because there's a lot of people looking at the camera. But let's be quite honest, you're not sure where on earth this documentary would be. I'll say parks and recreation because you can conceivably imagine that someone would do a documentary about local government in Indiana or whatever. They very quickly, like the office, they very, very quickly forget that it's a mockumentary. And also they have to, the ways in which they have to go, oh, we do actually need to see this scene. Why would we see Chris Pratt and Rashida Jones at home? Yes. Why would we ever see that? So I suppose that genre, which just shows you how beloved

and what a brilliant shorthand it was for a certain type of, especially when you're making shows that are essentially in American network television kind of 22, 24 minutes long. Abbott Elementary does it so brilliantly now, which is it allows you to get lots of information out there quickly. It allows characters to talk to camera and say what they're doing. And it just really allows for a sort of slightly more dense. That's the thing as a writer that's fun.

In the same way with Thursday Murder Club, I get to, I have someone who writes a diary. It allows you to put information in a way that is, fun and entertaining in a way that feels real. But that as a writer of a long-form narrative, you're like, hold on, how do I get this across? Yeah. You know, you have to do a lot of exposition in writing.

And if you've got a documentary maker saying, what just happened there? Yeah. Great. Okay, done. But at number one, I have to say, because it just completely reinvigorated the form and made it something that all of these things copied is the UK office, which, because there were only two seasons, it felt like a documentary from the beginning to the end. And obviously the US office by the end, it spun off into so many different things.

It's moved away from that, but it is totally brilliant, the US office. But Ricky Jervais and Stephen Merchant, I would say that is, it did completely stick to that idea of docu-soaps, as they were called, which is another, you know, with these kind of narrative documentaries about sort of everyday life. But isn't it fascinating how, you know, the office comes out of what you think is like driving school or airport, which were a very, very specific time in British television? that Ricky and Stephen then make that show. And then the Office US, which, as you say, spins into something completely different. I think it's one of the greatest works of art of our century. Yeah. Okay, cinema.

I'm missing things like District 9. I mean, you could just do solely the ones that Christopher Gass and Michael McKean have done. I love all of those. But given that they're going to appear in this elsewhere and this top three, number three is not a comedy. When I was thinking about this question, I remembered it. It's really dark, by the way, but it's brilliant. It's called Man Bites Dog.

documentary crew follow around a serial killer and then they become sort of involved in the crime. It's absolutely brilliant and it shows you that it doesn't always have to be comedy. That's Belgian, right? That's Belgian. I just wanted something on the list that wasn't comedy because possibilities of the form are not totally limited to comedy. This is a sidebar. I was watching an episode of Fraser the other day. I was just thinking, you know, when we did our episode about BTS and how, you know, everything now is non-American, there was an episode of Fraser I was watching and Fraser has the hots for a very, very, very, intelligent woman as so often. And she invites into the cinema and she goes, this film I'm watching, I'm afraid it has subtitles.

And Frasier goes, I prefer it with subtitles. And literally the laugh it gets that someone could prefer something with subtitles. It was beyond. Whereas now the news is being watched with subtitles. Anyway, so I fear less recommending a Belgian film than I might have done 30 years ago. Oh my God. I mean, just forget about it. No one cares, right?

It's brilliant. And really dark. Okay, so it's not for the faint-hearted. Number two, Zellig, the Woody Allen, because you almost feel did this person really exist? And at number one, this is Spinal Tap, because how could it be anything else? And anything that Chris have a guest, Michael McKean, any of them are in, and they've done so many brilliant ones that could have been any of them. But it has to be Spinal Tatt. It's where we got the phrase, mockumentary.

Yeah. And it is, it's just, it is literally faultless. It is a faultless work. And so that's my top three. Because I know you didn't want to put two of those movies in the top three, which is absolutely, You're absolutely right in terms of the format. So I will also add how much I love Best in Show. I was just about to say.

I mean, that's the one I had to leave out, obviously. They were going to be Best in Show and Man Bites Dog. Yeah, which is. Both Dog in the Dog genre. But if you've not seen Best in Show, that's an absolute joy. But the cast in these things are so completely brilliant. And of course, all of these brilliant actors are still with us and have just, you know, like Eugene Levy. Oh, yeah.

I think I might have heard of a little show. You did, of course, it's creak. Parker Posey's become so much bigger. Jennifer Coolidge, Jane Lynch, who then went on to being glee. I mean, all of those people, it's completely brilliant. They're all in Bestin Show, actually, all of those. Fred Willard, commentating on Best's amazing. Oh, my God, I love him so much.

It's an amazing scene where he goes to talk to the guy who is someone who negotiates with people when they're standing on ledgers. If they're going to jump and this entire life's career has been, no, I'm the guy. If someone's going to jump, I'm the guy who comes to talk them down. He goes, you want to know a secret? They all jump. Okay. It's so good. Anyway.

No, Sasha Baron Cohen. It's interesting. I just feel like there, I have said before that I really believe those are comic performances that in some cases should have been nominated for an Oscar because it's so hard to do improvisational comedy in a genuinely live and in some cases actually genuinely dangerous situation. So I almost don't feel they're in the mockumentary category. It feels like, yeah, weirdly. It just feels like a genre of one. As I said, I do think that some of those performances are Oscar worthy. But they also, the Academy also don't know what to do with that. Speaking of Oscar worthy, the Oscar nominations are out later today. And tomorrow, wonderful Chris Lockrey and Ollie Richards, who our members will know very well.

Both the great film experts will be giving an immediate reaction to those Oscar Nogs. They're going to live react to the Oscar nominations as they come up. They've seen every single one of these titles already. Yeah, they've seen every film that's ever been made anywhere. in the whole world and also they're very, very, very funny as well. And if you want to sign up for those bonus episodes, it's the rest is entertainment.com. You get ad-free listening. You get the bonus episodes.

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