The Rest Is History - 612. Nelson: The Final Showdown (Part 5)
Episode Date: October 27, 2025After two years at sea chasing the combined fleet of France and Spain, what was Nelson’s next step? Upon returning to his beloved Emma, how was the heroic Nelson received? What was the terrifying Na...poleon Bonaparte scheming for his fleet across the seas? And, would Britain finally face an imminent French invasion, and with it apocalypse - for both Britain and Nelson himself? Join Dominic and Tom as they discuss the build up to one of the most totemic naval clashes of all time - Trafalgar - and Nelson; the man behind it all. _______ Start generating your own greener electricity for less, with £500 off Solar. Visit https://www.hivehome.com/history for more information. T&Cs apply* *Output and savings varies by season, electricity usage and system size. Paid-for surplus requires an eligible SEG tariff. Offer for new customers only. Ends 17th November. This episode is sponsored by Anthropic, the team behind Claude. Try Claude for free today at Claude.ai/RestIsHistory _______ Twitter: @TheRestHistory @holland_tom @dcsandbrook Video Editor: Jack Meek Social Producer: Harry Balden Assistant Producer: Aaliyah Akude Producer: Tabby Syrett Senior Producer: Theo Young-Smith Exec Producer: Dom Johnson Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices
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Rince, it's time to be great.
When it was time to go, Nelson went up alone to the bedroom,
where little Horatia lay fast asleep.
For a while, he knelt in silent prayer by her bedside.
then very gently he kissed her on the forehead and went downstairs his boxes had been loaded aboard the coach emma was crying harder than ever now again nelson knelt on the ground in prayer and asked god to bless her for the last time he clasped her to his chest brave emma heroic emma you encourage me to go forth
he said gently.
If there were more emmers, there would be more Nelson's.
Then he climbed up into the coach and raised his left hand, and he was gone.
Afterwards, Nelson wrote in his journal,
Friday night, at half-past ten, drove from dear, dear Merton,
where I left all which I hold dear in this world to go to serve my king
and country. May the great God whom I adore
enable me to fill the expectations of my country. And if it is
his good pleasure that I should return, my thanks will
never cease being offered up to the throne of his mercy. If it is
his good providence to cut short my days upon earth, I bow
with the greater submission, relying that he will
protect those so dear to me that I leave behind.
His will be done.
Amen, amen, amen.
An unbelievably moving scene.
I mean, how I got through that without choking up, I do not know.
It's the last farewell of Horatio Nelson to his beloved Emma, Lady Hamilton,
and their daughter Horatia on the evening of the 13th of September 1805.
Dominic, it has been described many times.
But I doubt it has ever been described in more powerful and emotional terms than in that passage of prose, which comes from Adventures in Time, Nelson, Hero of the Seas, and you don't need me to tell you that you wrote it.
And can I just compliment you on giving proper credence to Emma's report of his parting words to her?
If there were more Emmas, there would be more Nelson's because there are some black-hearted biographers who have doubted that he ever said that.
It's the kind of melodramatic thing that Nelson would say there, isn't it?
I agree.
I absolutely think he said it.
The thing is, I'm not a massive Lady Hamilton fan, as you know, but it strikes me as
absolutely plausible that Nelson turned his departure.
Both of them actually turned his departure into this enormously sort of melodramatic theatrical
spectacle.
And actually, that's what this week's episodes are going to be, a massively melodramatic theatrical
spectacle, because it is, I think, the most dramatic, most exciting, the most
most emotionally charged story in naval history, arguably in all British history, Nelson's
last voyage to the Day of Destiny at Trafalgar.
And the measure of that is that we've already done it once. So this is, I think, is really
the only great story that we're retelling. But this time we're telling it with the focus
on Nelson himself, aren't we? Yeah, because last time, when we did three episodes about
Trafalgar, we looked at it in a sort of, we brought all our knowledge of naval military history.
rope, guns, ships of the line.
But now we're bringing our psychological insight
to discuss it from Nelson's own perspective, aren't we?
At least that's the excuse.
So the great man will always be in the foreground.
And maybe for those people who've been on this voyage with us from the beginning,
we can just do a little recap.
So last time, Tom, we ended July 1805.
And to quote Russell Crowe in Master and Commander,
England is under threat of invasion.
So after two years...
It's not a laughing matter.
No, it's not, actually.
I shouldn't be laughing.
I'm laughing to stop myself sobbing with patriotic.
Exactly.
So after two years at sea, Nelson has pursued the combined fleet of France and Spain
under Pierre-Charles-Villeuve and Frederico Gravina all the way to the Caribbean and all the way back.
And Villeneuve has holed up in the northern Spanish port of Ferrol.
So the threat has faded for the time being.
It's been bottled up, but it hasn't completely disappeared.
And that gives Nelson the chance, after all these years at sea, on his blockading mission,
to go home at last to see his beloved Emma, and he lands in Portsmouth on Monday, the 19th of August.
And when he gets there, there's a reprise of what's been a feature of his landing in England,
which is the determination of people
to unhitch the horses from his carriage
and to carry him, to pull him himself
while doing hussars.
And it's the measure of how desperate Nelson is to get back to Emma.
But this time when they try and unyoke the horses,
he won't let them because he's desperate to get off.
And he's not having any of this business.
You were telling me before we started recording
that you were hoping that Australians would do this for us
when we arrived in Australia for our rest of history tour.
That's right, isn't it?
We'd love some hussaring.
Definitely.
And people pulling us.
pulling the carriage. I think that's very important. Anyway, so he sets off, he rushes to
Merton, and early the next day, his coach turns into the new carriageway that has been built
at Merton Place. Now, Emma has been waiting anxiously for him for two years. She's been
sea bathing in South End on Sea, which has become massively popular in England. So Brighton
is the famous place where people go to do it. And Emma had actually become a fan of
bathing in Italy because Sir William Hamilton, her husband, had brought her a bathing machine
from England so that she could protect her complexion from the Italian sun. So she's
ferrier fay with bathing. How does the machine protect you from the sun? I think you drive it out,
don't you? And so you put your feet out and protects you. But you're basically covered by
some form of roof. I don't know. I'm being ambushed here by questions about bathing machines.
Yeah, yeah. You shouldn't have put that detail in if you weren't prepared to explore it. Yeah, I know, I know.
Well, anyway, she rushes home. She's incredibly excited. And she has arranged on hearing the news of his return to have Horatia, who is now four, brought from Mrs. Gibson, who is her kind of guardian. So Nelson, when he arrives at Merton, he is absolutely overjoyed to see. Horatia in particular, who he hasn't officially acknowledged as his own, has he?
No, but he really dotes on her. He makes arrangements for her to go to Sunday school. He is, of course,
course, the son of a vicar, so he takes that very seriously. I think there's an expectation,
don't you, that he would like Horatia to live with them permanently, and Merton from this
point onwards. And he's also thrilled with the house. I mentioned the new carriageway. Emma has
done a lot of work in the last two years on the house. Sort of grand designs have been in, and she has
got a new kitchen, there's a new library, loads of new pictures of Nelson and herself.
That's the key
The key thing
I mean basically
There were kind of two houses
And she's knitted them together
And she's bought up lots of estates around it
So that it's a much more
Pre-possessing place than when Nelson had left
And she fancied herself as a garden designer as well
Because Nelson I think said she was a regular capability brown
Or something of that ilk
There's no end to her talents
Yeah amazing
But actually Nelson doesn't spend as much time
At Merton as he would like
Because his main business is in London
The very next day
after arriving in Merton, he goes into London to meet various kind of big wigs from the government
and the Admiralty, Chief among them, William Pitt, Pitt the Younger, who is Prime Minister,
and the new Secretary of State for War, who is Lord Castle Ray.
And when he gets there, Nelson is quite anxious that people will give him a lot of grief
for failing to catch a feel nerve, because that, of course, was his ambition to catch up
with the combined fleet and to destroy it.
So he's a little bit anxious people will say, gosh, you've let us down.
But actually when he gets there to London, he finds that the newspapers are hailing him as the man who has saved the Caribbean for Britain, the West Indian colony, basically the sugar islands, which are so important to Britain's economic prosperity.
Well, I mean, also, I think they're recognising the scale of his accomplishment in keeping his fleet together under such grueling circumstances and ensuring that Villeneuve can't do anything.
Yeah, I think that's completely right.
I think he is now at this point.
We've talked in previous episodes about things like when he went to.
on a kind of progress around the countryside and people were hailing him and stuff.
He is a genuine celebrity.
He is the supreme patriotic hero.
So an American tourist afterwards described seeing him in the Strand.
His sunburned, of course, because he's been a sea all this time.
He walks with the sailors gate, so he has this amusing sort of rolling walk.
And this American said, when he enters a shop, the door is thronged till he comes out,
when the air rings with Hazars and the dark cloud of the populace again moves on and hangs upon his skirts.
He's a great favourite with all descriptions of people.
He's going to be like us in Sydney.
It is very similar scenes, actually.
And his mate Lord Minto, whom we've encountered previously being extremely disparaging about the menage of Merton and the interior decoration.
Lord Minto came across him in Piccadilly and found him mobbed by a crowd and actually went into the crowd to kind of get him out and said afterwards it was affecting to see.
see the wonder and admiration and love and respect of the whole world the moment he has seen.
It's beyond anything represented in a play or a poem.
And I think also for the Admiralty, they are also affected by this, aren't they?
The sense that he is something more now than just an admiral or an officer to be slotted
into a chain of command, that his fame and his charisma have transcended that.
that he is the person inevitably that they're going to turn to
when and if the great moment of crisis comes.
Yeah, he's become, from being a slightly difficult asset,
which he was a couple of years ago,
he's now more than that, isn't he?
He's the embodiment of the naval spirit itself.
Yeah, he's an icon.
Yeah.
Now, I think to make sense of this,
you have to see Nelson as part of a sort of a dichotomy.
You've got Nelson on one side,
and you have Napoleon on the other.
Because just as people are swooning before Nelson, hatred of Napoleon Bonabard has now reached an absolute peak in Britain.
So the newspapers paint him, which had actually not been entirely unadmiring in the 1790s,
now paint him as this sort of Corsican dwarf, as I quote,
a plunderer and murderer with a malignant spirit, a depraved imagination and a heart black with crimes of the deepest die.
Our prosperity and glory, our opposition to his schemes of universal conquest,
rankle in his mind and prey upon his heart,
exciting that deadly enmity which would drown our island with blood.
So Napoleon as the bogey man is now at his absolute height.
But I mean, it's kind of interesting because obviously there are people who still admire Napoleon,
and this will be the case right the way throughout the Napoleonic Wars.
So Byron is a kind of famous example.
But even Byron at Myers-Nelson, I think even,
the people at Holland House, the supporters of Fox and all these people, the Whigs,
even they sense that in Nelson they have someone who is a kind of transcendently charismatic figure.
And I think for the mass of the public, you know, the great sweep of European history
is reduced in their minds, as simplified in their minds into a clash between these two men.
And a lot of this is because London is now in the grip of a full-blown invasion panic.
So there are multiple invasion panics during the French Revolution and the Napoleonic Wars.
This one has been building since the war resumed in 1803.
It's fueled by all these kind of Gilray cartoons and newspaper articles and so on.
And, you know, you would see everywhere in London if you walk around pictures of all the French schemes,
sort of massive paddle boats and fleets of balloons, a channel tunnel, all of this stuff.
Yes, and I think that that's a kind of subliminal memory that carried right the way up to the building of the
actual channel tunnel that it's this now. People are kind of nervous about...
The French will attack us. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, they were. Completely they were. And it's
easy for us to laugh at it and say, oh, this is overblown because we know the invasion didn't happen.
But there were very good reasons for people to be frightened. I mean, just to get into the invasion
panic, you know, the mood that Nelson encounters when he returns in 1805. If the French
ever got across the channel, they would be pretty much unstoppable. Britain has only a tiny army.
What army it had, what professional army it had, had had been devastated.
by a failed invasion of Haiti in the 1790s, and has never really been rebuilt.
Napoleon's army, by contrast, the most formidable machine in Europe, they've destroyed every
enemy in their path, they've left a trail of blood behind them, plundering and sacking all
these towns and villages in Italy and so on.
And it's understandable that people think, if the French ever did get across the channel,
the consequences will be nightmarish for Britain.
But also, they only need control of the channel for a day to land their forces.
And then essentially Britain would be knocked out of the war.
So there was a marshal of Napoleon, André Massena, who said, we were never going to conquer Britain.
No one even dreamt of it.
It was just a question of ruining it, of leaving it in a condition that no one would ever have wanted to possess it.
And essentially, that would mean destroying the dockyards, so Portsmouth.
Well, Chatham, of course.
And Chatham would have been right in the pathway.
A place so close to your heart.
Yeah.
So I think it's not entirely unjustified.
I mean, the stakes are high.
If the Royal Navy loses control of the seas, Britain is sunk.
Yeah, that's marine metaphor there Tom. That's what I'm all about. So by August 1805, all of this has reached a climax. Napoleon assembles his invasion force. It's French, Dutch and Bavarian armies. They're camped along the coast, the channel, all the way from Boulogne eastwards to Antwerp, including the French cavalry and the Imperial Guard. So the very kind of cream of the Napoleonic War Machine. And on the 20th of August, so that's just the day after I think Nelson has returned, he has a formal
inspection in Boulogne. And there is a plan. I mean, the plan has been made, that there would be a
first wave of more than 100,000 men in 2,000 transports, and then a second wave of 50,000 men
in another 600 transports. Now, we know that they don't come, and a lot of historians say
it was actually never going to work this plan, but nobody knows this in Britain. And the newspapers
in August 1805 are telling their readers, and I quote, the movements on the French
French coast have given rise to the belief that the invasion of England will be attempted
immediately.
So there are all kinds of plans that have been made, a series of what are called optical
telegraphs to link the admiralty with Chatham, Tom, with Shieness, with all these.
So these are people like waving flags and stuff to communicate with each other on hills.
There are beacons.
There are coastal batteries.
They are working on the Martello towers, which actually don't get finished until after
the Battle of Trafalgar.
And, Domney, what about the sea fensibles?
Well, the sea fence walls are the absolute crack troops, aren't they? People with one leg, disgruntled fishermen, angers, whatever.
Touching heads. They've been called out. And actually, I have to say, almost 400,000 volunteers are drilling as Nelson arrives.
You know, so people genuinely think this is going to happen.
There are contingency plans to close the stock exchange to safeguard the gold reserves and the Bank of England, even to move the king and the government to the Midlands, should the French actually manage to land.
Now, William Pitt and Coe know that the control of the channel is what this is all about.
And that's, of course, why London had been thrown into panic by the news of Villeneuve and Gravina forming the combined.
fleet, because the combined fleet would outnumber Nelson's fleet.
And they were also furious with this bloke, this a bloke called Robert Calder, who had
intercepted Veilnerf on his way home and basically allowed him to escape to Ferrell.
And so everyone is saying, oh, this guy, Calder is useless, which is actually very unfair,
because the combined fleet should have been killed off.
It shouldn't have been allowed to get safe into port.
But it is a reminder of the absolute assumption that it's a duty of
a Royal Navy officer to attack, which has been the case ever since poor old Admiral Bing
got shot on the deck of his own boat to encourage the others, as Voltaire put it.
So this is all the context to explain why Nelson's return home is such a popular sensation
and why there is such a tremendous sense of mounting tension and excitement of events
speeding towards a showdown. John Sugden, in his brilliant biography of Nelson, has some
excellent lines on this. He says, nowhere that summer could Nelson escape the feeling that
he was in the center of a huge unfolding drama, inexorably gathering pace towards some
historic climax.
He was the country's champion, arming himself for the decisive contest.
And I think we talked about this before, but I think he genuinely feels that he is kind of
God's champion in this, that there is a kind of apocalyptic tinge to the whole drama that
is brewing.
I think so.
I think he thinks, listen, this is now, this is it now.
if I can destroy the combined fleet, that is it, the war at sea is over, it is done, Britain
is the mistress of the seas, end of story. And actually, in that case, the Royal Navy can
take over the French and Spanish trade, it can blockade their ports, and over time we can squeeze
Napoleon into surrender. And basically, that is what happens. That is what happens.
And that doctrine of annihilation, I mean, again, we've talked about this throughout the series,
it's one that Nelson absolutely upholds,
but it is also essentially Royal Navy dogma
and increasingly getting up close
blasting the enemy ships out of the water
this is becoming the orthodoxy
but it takes Nelson to enshrine it
and to reveal the full devastating impact
that it can have. Yeah, I think that's right.
I think all this time he's turning over the plan
in his mind what he'll do.
He knows when the showdown will come
and he's thinking
how will I do this?
There's a very, very famous story.
Guy who Captain Richard Keats visited Merton, and Nelson went for a walk with him and said,
okay, here is the plan.
I will go straight at the combined fleet when I see them.
I'll have two attacking columns to splinter their line.
He says, what do you think of it?
I'll tell you what I think of it.
I think it will surprise and confound the enemy.
They won't know what I'm about.
It will bring forward a pell-mell battle, and that's what I want.
So get in really close and go for it.
So Adam Nicholson, in his brilliant book on Trafalgar, describes it as the introduction.
of chaos as a tool of battle
because the kind of the traditional
naval battle is like a kind of a waltz
a minuet like the kind of thing that you see
in a Jane Austen adaptation
his plan is to totally
upend that and in the conditions of chaos
rely on the fact that British gunnery
is so superior that the Royal Navy ships
will inevitably emerge triumphant
but will he get the chance this is the question
so all the time he's waiting and waiting and waiting
for news and then a final
At 5 o'clock in the morning, on Monday the 2nd of September, a coach in four comes rattling down the drive towards Merton Place.
And out gets this naval officer, he's quite a stocky bloke.
He's come all the way by sea and by land, so he's covered with seawater and mud.
And this guy is called Henry Blackwood.
And he is the captain of the frigate Uriolus.
And he has come all the way from caddies with news from Admiral Collingwood, Cuthbert Collingwood, who's been keeping tabs on the span.
at port on the Spanish coast.
And this is what Blackwood says to Nelson.
He says, Villeneuve has left feral.
He left two weeks ago on the 13th of August.
He clearly was planning to head towards France,
but he was deterred by the site of British cruisers,
and he's turned around and gone south.
Villeneuve has now taken refuge in the port at Cadiz.
He and Gravina have almost 40 ships between them,
but they're very short on morale,
and they're very short on food and water.
and supplies generally. Now, in truth, Villeneuve is pretty much a kind of, is a very demoralized
broken man. Villeneuve has lost faith completely in his emperor's plan, which he always thought
was mad. To be fair, the emperor has also lost faith in him, which is also praying on Villeneuve's
mind. It is. Now, Nelson doesn't know this, but he does know that Villeneuve cannot stay in caddies
for long because there will not be enough supplies. He will have to leave to find supplies. And when he does,
You know, this is it.
But Dominic also, there's the risk, isn't there?
That he might go into the Mediterranean, which would cause chaos, or he might head northwards.
So there's opportunity, but there is also risk in Villeneuve and the Spanish breaking out.
Because there's another Spanish fleet at Cartagena.
And if Villeneuve was to link up with them and then to head into the Mediterranean,
who knows where he could go?
Sardinia, Sicily, Naples, Egypt again.
Or what if he then makes for the channel?
So Nelson thinks, right, this is my chance.
The stakes are very high.
If I can annihilate Villeneuve now, then the war is won at sea.
So within hours, he's jumped into a carriage and he is heading into London.
He goes straight to the Admiralty.
Then he goes to Downing Street to meet William Pitt and the first Lord, Lord Barham.
Nelson says, give me the chance.
I want to strike immediately, that will eliminate the threat of invasion, that will give us
command of the Mediterranean forever.
And as he later told a friend of his, George Rose, who was a confidant of William Pitt,
he said, it is annihilation that the country wants, not merely a splendid victory.
So this is going to be a different kind of battle.
The question is, will he get enough ships?
Lord Barham says, look, I've only got about 70 ships of the line fit for service to cover the
entire globe. But he says, I will back you, go back to Cadiz, take over the victory and take
command of the fleet. You can name your own officers. I will send you whatever ships I can.
You're probably going to get about 27 in total. And let us hope that is enough. And your
instructions, I'll leave it very simple to protect Britain's trade, to prevent the enemy getting
to sea. Everything else is up to you. You handle it as you see fit. And I think, don't you,
that this is the admiralty and the prime minister and the government buying into this sense
of Nelson's destiny, that fate has brought him to this point. And they are kind of going,
yes, go for it. Yeah, I think so. You can really sense the mood at this point, this sort of sense
that John Sutton described of events hastening towards an inevitable conclusion. And they were all
really buying into this. The very next day, it started to rain. This is a sort of fantastic
example of the kind of pathetic fallacy. It starts to rain, grey skies. Emma Hamilton has been
very downcast by the news that Villeneuve is out. She had hoped that Nelson would be
ashore for months, but once again, the clock is ticking. And she writes this letter, doesn't she,
to Lady Kitty Bolton. It seems as though I've had a fortnight's dream and I'm awoke to all the misery
of this cruel separation, but what can I do? His powerful arm is of so much consequence to his
country, but I cannot say more. My heart is broken. Of course, Nelson doesn't have that much time to
think about this because he's thinking about his plan. He is anxious whether he's going to have
enough ships. He's thinking about this business about smashing them into fragments. So he's
rushing back and forth across London, making all the preparations, getting all the stuff ready,
making sure they'll have enough supplies. You know, is he going to link up with the victory,
all of this kind of thing.
Interestingly, there is a sense of fatalism, I think, to Nelson, isn't there?
There's a sense that he knows this could be it for him.
And I think that that's not just fatalism.
I think that's realism, because, as we've been saying,
his plan is to form two columns that will drive straight into the French and Spanish lines,
which is ripping up the orthodoxy of how you fight a battle.
And I'm sure by this point there's no question that he, on victory,
is going to be leading one of those two columns, and that means that he will be directly in
the line of fire, because essentially he can't ask his men to risk such a dangerous course
of action and not himself be in the forefront of the fighting. So he must think, you know,
I'm going to be in more danger in this battle than I've ever been before. And doubtless,
he has told Emma this. And that's why she is, or lacrimos would be an unfair word. I mean,
that's why she's so devastated at the thought of him leaving.
Yeah, I think so.
So his last full day is Thursday, the 12th of September.
And again, he spends most of it in London.
He goes to see Lord Castle Ray at the Colonial Office in Downing Street, very famous incident.
Nelson is shown into an ante room to wait for Lord Castle Ray.
And another man is waiting there, who's a short man, another short man, who has a very distinctive kind of beaky nose.
And this other man makes some sort of polite small talk to Nelson.
but Nelson is tired and, of course, he's nervous and he's excited and distracted.
And the other man said afterwards, he could not know who I was, but he entered at once
into conversation with me, if I can call it conversation, for it was almost all on his
side and all about himself, and in really a style so vain and so silly as to surprise and almost
disgust me.
So that's the tone of Lord Minto visiting Merton and seeing all the Nelson memorabilia everywhere.
It is.
So Nelson just talking about himself, then the other man must have said something that made Nelson think, because Nelson then went out and he had a word with the clerk or the official outside, obviously to find out who this bloat was.
And then he came in and was completely transformed because this man is Major General Sir Arthur Wellesley, who is just back from India having been smiting the Maharata Empire and keeping India for the East India Company.
and he is, of course, the future Duke of Wellington.
And Wellington said, when this Nelson came back in, he was altogether a different man,
both in manner and matter.
What Wellington called his charlatan style had vanished, and he talked about strategy and
politics with a good sense and a knowledge that surprised me equally and more agreeably
than the first part of our interview had done.
He talked like an officer and a statesman.
I don't know that I've ever had a conversation that interested me more.
Or there you have the two.
I mean, obviously this is after the event, so maybe there's a tiny pinch of salt.
It plays very well for Wellington, doesn't it?
Because on the one hand, it makes him look good, but it also subtly makes Nelson look a bit of a coxcomb.
But that said, this is Nelson to a tea, right?
I mean, Nelson would have just talked about himself and being completely spain, self-interested.
Well, maybe.
I think Nelson has a capacity to take an interest in someone else.
He has lapses.
I mean, he's often had lapses.
Remember the time when he was going from Naples all the way through Vienna and Prague and whatnot?
And he wasn't always showing himself to his best side then.
Anyway, he's had that meeting with Lord Carcer and his very last meeting is at number 10 Downing Street.
And this is his farewell to William Pitt.
We don't know what was said, but we do know that Pitt unusually is said to have come down with Nelson and escorted him to his carriage,
which was a marked gesture, I think, of affection and respect because Pitt didn't.
usually do this. Actually, on his way out of town, there is one last thing. He stops to make sure
that the very latest signal book has been sent to the fleet. A good example, actually, of attention
to detail. Nelson knows these little things could really make a difference. Do you think he
already has a zingy slogan in mind? Well, a slogan that actually, as we'll find out,
has to be corrected by his signals, lieutenants, because he's trying to send a message for which
there's no code. Anyway, that we're jumping ahead. Back he goes to Merton.
he's there in time for dinner.
But it's a pretty sad occasion.
Lord Minto, who is there, said that Emma could not eat and hardly drink and was near
swooning.
Lord Minto, who's no Emma fan, found all this very over the top and very sort of showy and
performative.
So Emma is clearly very, very upset.
You know, Nelson is going away and maybe this will be for the last time.
He will have shared the odds with her.
I mean, you know, I don't think it's performative at all.
I think if you're in love with someone and he's going off and likely to die,
I think you're allowed the occasional tear.
Oh, you're a soft-hearted.
So the next day is Friday the 13th of September.
It's the last day of their lives together.
It's a cloudy, windy day and they are stuck inside and Merton.
Now, it may be today that there's a sort of celebrated incidents.
They took communion together, Nelson and Emma,
and they exchanged gold rings in what they called a private sacrament.
So, myographers often describe this as kind of unofficial betrothal or marriage ceremony.
Nelson, of course, is married already.
Tafani, his ring, which I think recently came up for auction.
It was mounted with a large H and was actually engraved with the date the 13th of September, probably
afterward, well, it must have been afterwards, I guess, which suggests that they did something
because they know, as you've said, this could be it.
This could be the last time they ever see each other.
You know, it's a very humdrum day.
Nelson's doing a lot of chores.
he's making a lot of arrangements to pay, you know, bills, bills for prints, no doubt of himself
and wine and whatnot and architect's bills.
The coach has been ordered for 10 o'clock that evening to take him down to the coast, to the victory.
Night falls, the hour approaches, the scene that you described earlier, he goes up to Horatia
to say goodbye.
The coach is loaded.
Emma is in tears.
She won't come outside.
Nelson comes back in four times from the coach.
And finally, he does this thing where he kneels and asks God his blessing.
And he says these lines that, Tom, you find very moving.
If there were more Emmas, there would be more Nelson's and all of this.
But that's not the last exchange, actually.
The very last exchange is with his brother-in-law, George Matcham, and his marriage to Nelson's sister.
And Nelson says to George, I'm actually really sorry that I haven't done more for our family.
You know, I should have done more, made more money.
Maybe this time I'll get some prize money.
And George says to him,
we want for nothing all that matters to us is that you're safe and away nelson goes into the night
and then he writes that moving journal entry that you read out where he's again thinking about his own
death if it's god's good providence to cut short my days on earth i bow with the greatest submission
and he hopes that god will protect those so dear to me that i leave behind and as we'll see
next time that's a running theme even in extremists before the battle and after the battle
Nelson is thinking about those people that he's left behind.
At six o'clock the following morning, his carriage arrives at the George Inn at Portsmouth.
Nelson writes a note to Emma.
My dearest and most beloved of women, Emma, Nelson's Emma, I arrived here.
Victories at St. Helens, if possible, I shall be away at sea this day.
God protect you and my dear Horatia.
Portsmouth is a port preparing for war.
Carts and wagons everywhere, loads of people.
I mean, this is a great dockyard.
It's one of the great motors of Britain's war effort.
And Nelson, actually, before he leaves, this is a lovely detail.
He has the time to visit a new manufacturing that is almost ready to kind of go online at Portsmouth, which is this block mills, powered by steam.
It's the most advanced factory on earth.
It has been designed by a French exile called Mark Isambard Brunel.
And it has machines basically to create these blocks, these kind of blocks.
I don't quite understand what these blocks do.
They're kind of to do with pulleys, aren't they?
Yeah, pulleys and ropes.
Yeah, exactly.
So brilliant rope work.
And the amazing detail that I remember from our previous series is that there was machinery
operating in Portsmouth when Nelson left on Victory that was still operating in 1982
when the Falklands Task Force left.
I mean, it's incredible.
That's a crazy detail, isn't it?
So he goes back to the Georgian after that.
He goes through a back door to avoid the crowds, and he's going to leave from the beach
by the bathing machines.
So a nice Emma-related touch there.
It is.
It's not the normal place.
He's trying to escape the crowds,
but actually there are hundreds of people waiting.
And as he comes down to the boarding point,
there are people kneeling on the ground.
There are people cheering.
There are people trying to touch his coat.
Some people are in tears.
And as his boat pushes away towards the victory,
they give him three cheers,
and he waves his hat in farewell.
And then very famously, Nelson murmurs,
I had their hussars before.
I have their hearts now.
And by 1130, he is on the victory and his last voyage begins.
Unbelievable drama.
My heart is beating so fast that I need to go and calm down.
But we will be back in a few minutes to continue the story of Nelson's journey to Trafalgar.
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Hello,
everyone.
Welcome back.
It is Saturday
the 14th of
September
1805.
Horatio Nelson
has been
reunited with
HMS
Victory
and he is
preparing to
sail south
to face the
combined fleet,
the French
and Spanish
ships.
And Dominic
he has
exactly one
month and one week left to live. So, the victory. The victory, and with which Nelson is
forever associated, is an excellent, Nick. It is, you know, how old is the victory at this point?
It's about 40 years, I think. Yeah, 40 years old. It was named after the victories in the seven years
war, wasn't it? It's had a full refit while he's been ashore. The rigging's been repaired,
the deck's been scrubbed. The guns have been taken out and checked and run in again. The crew
are pretty knackard. They haven't had a break, unlike Nelson. And Hardy, he's been flogging away
who sneaks up behind you. With his big feet and his stooped shoulders. Yeah, he is
absolutely exhausted. I mean, people when they saw him said he looked like he'd aged 20 years
in one year. And he already looked quite old. In their favor, they are very healthy.
So Hardy has looked after their health as Nelson has. They're tired, but they are fit and they
know they're, you know, as we would discover, they are the best fighting men anywhere in
the world. They know exactly what their goal is. And pumped by having Nelson. Of course, they're delighted
to see him. So now they sail south, banned for Spain. They make quite slow progress because it's
foggy and windy, not windy in a good way. Nelson all the time, as so often is writing to
Emma, entreating her to cheer up and saying, you know, we can look forward to many, many happy years
and to be surrounded by our children and our children's children. As I said, they move quite
slowly. They only glimpse
Lisbon on the 25th of September
11 days later and they only reach the
fleet of Cadiz three days
after that. When they get there
there is this tremendous sense
of excitement among the captains in Cadiz.
So many of these captains are
not familiar to Nelson.
These are not the band of brothers from the Nile.
These are often younger, much more
inexperienced men. Only five
of them have commanded
a ship of the Lion in battle before.
Some of these are well-known names.
You know, Thomas Hardy, Thomas Fremantle, Edward Berry,
Vice Admiral Cuthbert Collingwood, of course, Nelson's old friend from when they
were very young.
Collingwood, I mean, we talked about him in ironically the episode about History's
Grace's dogs.
We did.
His beloved dog bounce.
Yeah.
So Collingwood, who's been in charge of the fleet, he's a sort of, he's a really kind of
kindly and decent man, quite shy and retiring, but doesn't have Nelson's star quality, does
he?
He loves nothing more than his Northumberland.
garden. He does and planting oak trees there. But I mean, Nelson doesn't know many of the
captains, but of course the captains know all about Nelson. And for them, it's like the
arrival of a rock star. Very exciting moment. So Saturday the 28th of September that he reaches
the fleet and he immediately says, let's pull back the fleet, but you're over the horizon,
we'll leave the frigates to watch cadiz. We don't want to blockade it too closely because we
want Villeneuve to come out. But having the frigates there, he's learnt the lesson from when
the French fleet had escaped from Toulon. His blockade there had existed to encourage the French
to come out, but it had left a gap that they had then utilised it. He's not going to let that
happen now. No. So they're waiting for the French, but the weather is very fine, sort of dry,
hazy, there's no wind. The French and the Spanish are not going to move in this kind of weather.
The next day, the Sunday is Nelson's 47th birthday. He has exactly.
22 days to live. And that Sunday afternoon, he starts the process of building team spirit and
camaraderie among the captains. He invites them in batches to dinner aboard the victory.
And because they're younger and because they're not as experienced, he is very keen to make them
feel part of the story, part of the planning and whatnot. So he will gather them. This is one of the
things that makes him a brilliant leader, a brilliant leader and a model of leadership. He will gather
of them in his great cabin, you know, which you can visit today in Portsmouth on the
victory, they will sit around this big mahogany table. They will have dinner off silver plate
and wine and wine glasses and so on. It's very convivial and he makes them feel valued. It makes
them feel seen to use today's kind of jargon. Yeah, there's such kind of wonderful testimony.
So, Captain Fremantle, we dined with Lord Nelson, the juniors and I never passed a pleasant
a day. I stand with him until eight at night. He would not let me leave him before. And then
there's another captain George Duff, who never met Nelson and writes to his wife.
I dined with his lordship yesterday and had a very merry dinner.
He is certainly the pleasant as the Admiral I ever served under.
He is so good and pleasant a man that we all wish to do what he likes without any kind of orders.
And you get there the sense of the star quality, he's writing to his wife saying,
I've met Nelson, but also, you know, he's great.
He puts you with ease, and he makes you feel like you are part of a band of brothers.
And this is exactly Nelson's plan.
He wants them to feel calm and confident.
He knows that they will be outnumbered.
So they have to completely believe in what they are doing.
And what he wants to explain in particular is this thing that he calls the Nelson Touch,
which is a strategy that is based on speed and aggression, striking really fast and hard under full sail,
get in close for this pell-mell battle, and annihilate the French and the Spanish and settle the issue at sea.
for good. It is annihilation that the country wants, not merely a splendid victory. And of course,
the parallel there is with Napoleon on land. That's Napoleon strategy. And in that sense,
Nelson is the kind of the British Napoleon. You know, the comparison with Napoleon is an
interesting one because both of them inspire this extraordinary affection and respect among their
closest officers. Nelson described, and I don't think he's exaggerating, he wrote to Emma,
he said, when I explained to them my plan, the Nelson touch, it was like an electric shock.
Some shed tears, all approved. It was new. It was singular. It was simple. I think part of this
is Nelson's style quality, but also you mentioned earlier, this is becoming part of the culture
of the Navy. The Royal Navy over the last sort of 10, 20 years, has developed this new ethos.
No more of the sort of stately minuettes. You get in and you absolutely go for total destruction
of the enemy and that's something new in naval history. And what he's saying to his captains is
you are the best and your men are the best and my strategy reflects that. So it's very,
very complementary to them. But will they get the battle? September becomes October and still
they wait. Nelson's fleet has now been reinforced. It's grown to 33 ships of the line.
Most of them are two-decker 74s, the kind of standard, you know, battleship, warship of the day.
And there are another four frigates.
And these ships, to remind people, these are effectively huge floating gun platforms.
They are killing machines.
I mean, the firepower available to Nelson is massively in excess of, say, the firepower
that Wellington will have at Waterloo, I mean, by an enormous quantity.
And just a word on the men that he's commanding, 20,000 sailors and marines.
And it's not a kind of modern contrivance to point out, this is a genuinely multinational kind of force.
So on the victory, for example, there are Englishmen, but they're also Scots, Irish.
There are 22 Americans, nine men from the West Indies, Maltese, there's a Russian, there's an African.
There are even three Frenchmen.
Yeah, and you see that famously on the reliefs at the foot of Nelson's column in Trafalgar Square, very pointedly illustrated.
Yes, an African guy who people identified as George Ryan.
I might talk about him in the next episode.
So for Nelson, keeping all these different men fit and healthy is the absolute priority.
So actually what he's doing in all this, all this time, day after day, is the kind of, you know, the bureaucratic work that he'd been doing during the blockade. He's getting supplies. He's organizing fresh food and water. He's organizing drills. He's doing all this kind of thing. He sends Jane Austen's brother off to get oranges. That's right. And so he then misses the battle and is devastated. But of course, Dominic, what he's also doing is moping over Emma and writing poetry. Can I read a poem?
I think everyone would love that.
So this is his last love poem to Emma.
No calm at sea, this heart shall know,
while far from the midst lengthening hours of absence and of woe,
I gaze in sorrow were the boundless deep,
with eyes which, were they not ashamed, would weep.
I think that's very good.
I think it's solid.
I think it's pretty good.
Yeah, I agree with you.
I definitely agree with you.
And while he's doing this, his captains are also doing a very nice thing,
something will be very familiar to anyone who's visited H.
victory at Portsmouth, and that is they are painting their ships black and yellow
in imitation of the colour scheme that Nelson preferred.
I've read different things from his biographers.
Some say he ordered it, and others, in their gesture that I prefer, say that his
captains were motivated to do it voluntarily because they wanted to, as Captain Duff
put it, to paint their ships, a la Nelson.
Kind of swarm of hornets as well.
Yeah, this sense of being a team.
in pursuit of a common goal. I like that.
Now, still, the combined fleet don't come out.
On the 2nd of October, Nelson sent a squadron under Sir Thomas Louis to collect food and
water from Gibraltar and North Africa.
So now his numbers are down by six, from 33 to 27, six fewer, as it turns out,
than the combined fleet.
Still he waits.
On the 9th of October, he sends Collingwood his final battle plan.
And he says, I'm sending you this so you know exactly what I want to do, and so that you can
use your own initiative to carry out my instructions according to the general plan.
He says, we can, my dear Cole, have no little jealousies.
We can only have one great object in view, that of annihilating our enemies and getting a
glorious peace for our country.
No man has more confidence in another than I have in you, and no man will render your
services more justice than your very old friend, Nelson and Bronte.
It's Nelson reaching out to his kind of deputy.
So Nelson explains the plan.
Basically, there's two columns are going to attack and strike the enemy line head on.
Nelson, leading one in the victory, Collingwood leading the other in the royal sovereign.
Now, what is unusual about this is admirals usually like to keep their ships in the centre,
but Nelson says, no, I will lead from the front.
We won't fire until we're really close.
But, I mean, they won't be able to, will they?
That's the key thing.
Because the reason that you have this minuet is that the ship can only fire at an angle.
So if you're going straight at a line, you can't actually fire until you've broken through past the line.
Exactly.
But the danger is that if their side onto you, they will be blasting and blasting you before you can turn to get into position to repay the complement, as it were.
And so Nelson's presentiments of death, I think, are entirely natural.
I mean, that's what makes it so dangerous.
Yes, exactly.
However, still the combined fleet does not move.
Still, Nelson waits, and more than two weeks go by, and by about Friday the 18th,
he's beginning to wonder if the combined fleet is ever going to come out at all.
That day, the Friday, the wind off-cat is changed, and Nelson in his journal wrote,
Fine weather, wind easterly. The enemy cannot have finer weather to set sail.
Colleen would send him a message that day saying, surely the combined fleet will move now.
but the day passes and no news comes.
And then the next morning, Saturday the 19th of October,
9 o'clock in the morning, Nelson is writing a letter to Collingwood,
Dear Cole, to invite him for dinner.
And bounce on the dog.
What a beautiful day.
Will you be tempted out of your ship?
If you will, hoist the ascent and victory's pendants.
And then just a moment after Nelson has written that letter,
there comes a signal from the frigate.
And Nelson knows what that means.
Because 50 miles east in the port of Cadiz, Villeneuve's nerve at last has cracked.
And the French and the Spanish are going to put to sea.
So, Dominic, what has been happening in Cadiz?
Because you said that they can't really stay there because they didn't really have the supplies.
I suppose there's also the risk of disease.
If they don't have enough fruit, there's scurvy and all that kind of thing.
And they're ravaged by yellow fever.
Which they brought back from the Caribbean.
Yes.
Villeneuve has been basically skulking in Cadiz in a right misery.
About half of his men were not sailors, they are infantrymen,
and they had been supplemented by slaves from France's Caribbean colonies.
Villeneuve was very disparaging about the quality of his own men.
He said they were herdsmen and beggars.
Well, he is an aristocrat.
And a French aristocrat at that, the most aristocratic of all aristocrats.
So in early October, he'd received orders from the Emperor from Napoleon,
telling him to break out of Cadiz and head east towards.
Italy, because there Bonaparte was planning a new offensive against Naples.
Now, at first, Villeneuve completely ignored his orders.
He thought it's absolutely madness to try to break out of Cadiz with Nelson just there,
waiting for us.
Better to try to sneak out in bad weather, or to wait for the British to lose interest
and to divide their fleet.
But then a week later, Villeneuve had heard two items of news that changed his mind.
First of all, he heard this news that Nelson had sent Thomas Louis off to get supplies.
the combined fleet had a numerical advantage.
But secondly, and even more importantly, I think,
he was told that Napoleon was about to sack him,
that his replacement, in fact, was already en route to Cadiz, which is true.
And Villeneuve knew that armchair critics in Paris
were saying that he was a coward,
that he'd run away at the Battle of the Nile,
and he didn't have the guts to face Nelson.
And this is really his last chance,
if he's going to be sacked to clear his name and to go down fighting,
And he says to his officers, they will see if I know how to fight.
Because Villeneuve, to be clear, I don't think Villeneuve is a coward.
I don't think he's a bad commander.
I think he's actually a pretty honorable and in many ways,
and quite an impressive and admirable man.
And I think wanting to put to sea, you know,
wanting to, you know, roll the dice and see if he can clear his name,
an understandable and admirable thing to do.
So on the 18th of October, he said to Gravina,
this Spanish counterpart, with whom he actually got on pretty well.
He said, look, we're going to put to sea the way we will deal with Nelson if he catches up with us.
Because we've got so many infantrymen, we will turn this into a land battle.
Yeah, like the Romans.
Exactly, the Romans with the Carthaginians.
But the irony of this is, of course, this is exactly what Nelson wants.
Nelson wants to go in close.
So in a sense, Philner's strategy is playing into his hands.
Giving Nelson what he wants, exactly.
But it's the only way of Wilnoff could conceivably win, I think.
You know, if they had fought an old-fashioned sea battle, and Villeneuve would still have lost.
Anyway, Gravina, the Spanish guy, doesn't really, he's not massively convinced by this,
but his orders are to go along with what Villeneuve wants, so he says, fine and fair enough.
And so that's afternoon the 18th, a very, very cinematic scene.
The French and the Spanish officers walked a mass together in the church of the Virgin of Carmen,
the patron saint of sailors in Cadiz.
And then after five o'clock, these huge crowds have assembled on the quayside in silence,
because they know just how bleak the situation is.
they start to set off from the harbour.
It took them all night, and by the morning of the 19th,
the first French and Spanish ships
have reached the open sea.
And this is the news that that morning,
the frigates have transmitted to the victory.
That stops Nelson from getting calling it over.
Yeah, his dinner plans have been ruined.
So immediately he springs into action.
He orders a general chase to Windwood, i.e. to the southeast.
And within moments, the entire British fleet is making sales.
And the crews, some of them already are frantically clearing the decks for action.
They're rolling up the hammocks.
They're removing the bulkheads and partitions.
They're stowing the furniture.
They're slaughtering the animals or throwing them overboard.
But not the dog bounce.
No, bounce stays there, although he will be hiding in the bowels of Collingwood ship because he doesn't like bangs.
So I think it's very unfortunate for a nautical dog.
Dogs don't like fireworks, do they?
They don't like fireworks or any form of explosion.
In Nelson's cabin, you know, obviously, so all his personal,
effects are being stored away. And among those, of course, are his most treasured possessions,
the pictures of Emma and of Horatia and people who listened way back to our episode on
Emma Hamilton. We began with this moment, because even in the hurly-burly of preparations for battle,
he's still thinking about Emma and Horatia. Tom, I know you love to read a moving emotional tear-soaked
letter. Can I read it again? I think it would be a shame if you didn't. So this is Nelson,
and writing to Emma, as the preparations for battle at Trafalgar are being made.
My dearest beloved Emma, the dear friend of my bosom, the signal has been made that the
enemy's combined fleet are coming out of port. May the God of battles crown my endeavours
with success. At all events, I will take care that my name shall ever be most dear to you and
Horatia, both of whom I love as much as my own life, and as my last writing before the battle
will be to you, so I hope in God that I shall live to finish my letter after the battle.
And if that sounds breathless, it's because Nelson has picked up Emma's habit of never putting
any punctuation into her letters.
But I think the lack of punctuation just conveys the kind of the hurly, burly sense of his emotions.
But this is only one of two letters that he writes there, Tom.
So do you want to give us the second letter?
Yeah.
So this is to his daughter, Horatia.
My dearest angel, I was made happy by the pleasure of receiving your letter of September the 19th.
And I rejoice to hear that you are so very good a girl and love, my dear lady.
Hamilton, who most dearly loves you. Give her a kiss for me. The combined fleet of the enemy are now
reported to be coming out of Cadiz, and therefore I answer your letter, my dearest Horatia,
to mark to you that you are ever uppermost in my thoughts. I shall be sure of your prayers for my
safety, conquest and speedy return to dear Merton, and our dearest good Lady Hamilton. Be a good
girl, mind what Miss Conner says to you. Receive, my dearest Horatia, the affectionate
parental blessing of your father, Nelson and Bronte. Yeah, your father. He didn't often write that,
did he. While Tom is mopping his eyes, I'll tell you what happened next. So they sail all day
and all night. Overnight, the weather turns by Sunday morning the 20th. It is raining hard.
It's very misty, and there is no sign of the combined.
behind fleet.
Briefly, Nelson turns back towards Cardiz.
Have they retreated into port?
No.
A frigate from Henry Blackwood's inshore squadron signals to him the enemy are still
definitely at sea and they are heading eastward.
At 10 o'clock, that's Sunday, Collingwood is road to the victory with three other captains.
They have one last meeting and Collinwood says, when we find them, we should attack at once.
Nelson says, no, we're still too close to Cadiz.
they could fight till darkness and then they could get away and that's the last thing we want
let us wait till the morning when we're all further out we will only get one chance we want the
whole day to do this so we cannot waste it midday they're 20 miles southwest of cadiz now and
there is still no sign of the enemy and all afternoon they continue sailing and then at six o'clock
they get another signal from henry blackwood his frigates have spotted the enemy at least
30 of them, 30 ships to the northeast. So now you can imagine the tension. Darkness falls.
The last night of Horatio Nelson's life. He can't sleep. Out at sea, he can see nothing but
the blue lights, the frigates assuring him that they can still see the enemy ahead. And every
hour, Henry Blackwood fires a gun from his frigate to signal that all is well. It is a scene,
Tom, of unbelievable tension and drama. Now, many great historians.
have written about this moment.
But I think there's only one book
that truly does it justice, and we all
know what that book is. And for the avoidance
of any doubt, that book is, of course,
Adventures in Time, Nelson, A Hero of the Seas by
Dominic Sandbrook. And I shall read it
now. So I'm kind of giving a reading
from the Bible or something. Still,
Nelson paced the deck,
unable to sleep. Everything
he had ever cared about. His king,
his country, his friends and family,
Even his place in history hung in the balance.
This was more than a battle.
It was the final chapter in a story that had begun long before he was born.
Midnight came, then one o'clock, two, three, four o'clock.
The enemy fleet was close, somehow deep in his bones he could feel it.
Five o'clock.
The rain had stopped.
The wind had dropped to a gentle breeze.
In the east the sun was rising, the faintest.
hint of red spreading across the far horizon.
From the masthead came a shout, a sail on the starboard bow, and in the distance he saw
them, framed against the rising sun, a forest of masts emerging from the darkness, the awe-inspiring
spectacle of the combined fleet, the naval might of France and Spain.
it was Monday the 21st of October 1805 the day of destiny had come at last do you know
it's great that is oh god I can't wait for the next episode oh my word well this is going to be
our last episode you will know what it is it's going to be the Battle of Trafalgar will
Nelson survive it only one way to find out and if you are a member of the rest of its history
Club then of course you can hear it right away if you would like to join them go straight into
the battle of trafalgar then you can head to the rest ishisthistory.com and sign up there
oh it's all set we will see you for episode six of this epic epic account of nelson's life
the battle of trafalgar don't miss it bye bye
Hello, I'm Gordon Carrera, National Security Journalist.
And I'm David McCloskey, former CIA analyst, turned spy novelist.
And together we're the host of another goalhanger show called The Rest is Classified,
where we bring you the best stories from the world of secrets and spars.
It's right, Gordon, and our new six-part series tells the story of John F. Kennedy,
the CIA, and Cuba.
It's a covert war of botched invasions, mafia deals, and CIA plots to kill Fidel Castro.
The CIA has a secret army, the mob has a vendetta, and Kennedy is caught in the middle.
So what if the answer to the 20th century's most infamous assassination is found not on the streets of Dallas, but 90 miles off the coast of Florida?
And for our declassified club members, oh, you're in for a treat because we've gone even further.
They have an exclusive three-part miniseries that digs deep.
into these conspiracies. We've also got as part of that a jaw-dropping episode with Anthony
Scaramucci, the mooch himself, who says he has insider evidence that ties the mob directly
to Lee Harvey Oswald. All this sounds good to you. You can listen to The Rest is Classified
wherever you get your podcast. If you think you know who killed JFK, think you can.
