The Rich Roll Podcast - Gabrielle Reece On Optimal Nutrition, Homeschooling & Life With Laird

Episode Date: December 19, 2012

Today on the podcast, Rich and Julie Piatt sit down with uber-athlete and fitness / wellness advocate Gabrielle Reece to talk about health & fitness, the importance of good nutrition, Gabby's general perspective on marriage and relationships (…and yes, sex), how she makes it work with her husband — famed big wave surfer Laird Hamilton– homeschooling her girls, female role models, failing “upward”, dealing with negativity, food & fitness tips for getting started in the right direction for the new year, and of course her upcoming book, My Foot Is Too Big for the Glass Slipper: A Guide to the Less Than Perfect Life* (Scribner, coming April 2013). Enjoy! Rich [NOTE: apologies for the audio quality. Podcasting from a warehouse has its drawbacks, particularly when it's pouring rain, as it was today. The background noise is showers on a tin roof. Did the best we could.]

the rich roll podcast podcasting from the warehouse welcome to the warehouse yeah episode eight of the podcast how you doing doing great rich roll i see thanks for back. Yeah, it's good to be back. It's been a week. We got to do, I think we need to up it up to like two a week. What happened? What happened to the schedule? Life happened. It's busy. But you know what? I'm really excited because we've got a wonderful, exciting guest today joining us. Who's that? The amazing goddess, Gabrielle Reese. Hi, you guys. Hey guys hey gabby it's really interesting to watch the interaction between the husband and wife team that was just kind of fun just to sit back

wait till we wait till we start arguing get going i know the kids are like yeah you have no idea i know just for the listener out there we have tyler manning the audio levels and my nephew harrison here there are producers it's a family affair absolutely julie and gabby and we're Tyler Manning, the audio levels, and my nephew Harrison here. They're our producers. It's a family affair. Absolutely. And then Julie and Gabby. And we're sitting in a warehouse that is kind of a semi-functioning warehouse. There's people coming in and out, and they were pressure cleaning a minute ago, and we had to shut it down. And so if you hear a lot of background noise, we're just going to have to live with it.

That's right. We really are in a warehouse, and we don't want Tyler to lose his mind. So we'll just deal with have to live with it. That's right. We really are in a warehouse and we don't want Tyler to lose his mind. So we'll just deal with a little banging. Right. It's like when you go to a yoga class and at the end there's the shavasana meditative part and everyone wants it perfectly quiet.

There's a car honking. Yeah, and there's a car honking and people get angry. Car alarm. But if you go to India, there's people meditating all over the place and it's the most cacophonous. There's no quiet space. What does that word mean?

Cacophonous? Is that what you said? Please educate me. Loud. Lots of different noises coming at you. That's awesome. I think you two should sit next to each other. No, that would be bad.

Not across. You need to mediate. I see why you really have a guest it's just to sit in the middle right you have to mediate we did get in almost a little bit of a spat a couple episodes ago well that's good that you're assigned to your mics and you can't really move so right i can't read i can't keep it real that's what we're here to talk to gabby about exactly being married 15 years oh yeah that's why i don't have laird here he is truly in a meeting because we don't want to get that real do we no that would be that's too scary we're

gonna keep our fingers crossed he would need a mic he could just sit over there and talk and we could all hear him i'm not kidding that'd be good actually because we don't i don't think we have another mic i know i get well yeah if you're laird you don't need... You just walk in and actually the listeners on the other end would actually be able to see him. Feel the vibration. I'm not kidding. I can feel the vibration before I actually hear him. It's a beautiful thing.

It is. It's lively. He's a man's man. And he's a lady's man too. Cool. That's great. So anyway, Tyler, there's a weird man too cool that's great so anyway Tyler there's a weird humming sound

in the background can you hear that what's going on alright whatever we're living with it I can hear the kawaii rain oh that's probably just the rain

yeah so we're on the north shore of kawaii and we're getting into the rainy season and it pretty much rains constantly and living in the yurts you can hear it's pretty loud at night banging around and everything like that well yeah we have a tin roof that's perfect

exactly i know it's great great audio it wasn't raining before so we thought oh we'll do it in the warehouse and now it's raining now i can't hear you your lips are moving across the across the studio but i can't well we're just do it anyway. I sometimes say that to my husband as a joke. What? Your lips are moving, but I can't hear you? No, I'm like, what? What? She can hear you. And actually, she reads your lips anyway.

You could be across the room having a conversation. She reads my mind. She just looks at my face and then she turns around and walks the other way. Exactly. We're brought to you today by recovery.com. I've been in recovery for a long time. It's not hyperbolic to say that I owe everything good in my life to sobriety. And it all began with treatment and experience that I had that quite literally saved my life. And in the many years since, I've in turn helped many suffering addicts and their loved ones find treatment. And with that, I know all too well just how confusing and how overwhelming and how

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Oh, it's my pleasure. That's cool. So you are a North Shore kind of semi-native. You're going back and forth between Los Angeles. How much time do you spend here? Well, we base out of here. So Laird grew up on Kauai. And on the end, you know, they call it the deep country.

And so we live here for his surfing season, which is winter. The low pressures that bring snow bring large waves. So we sort of make our way here in late October and usually stay here till mid to late April. And we've been doing that. And then we spend the other six months based out of Los Angeles. We've been doing that for about 17 years. And we used to go to Maui for about 12 or 13 years. And finally, about four or five years ago, had the opportunity to make our way back to Kawaii and so we we do that with our with our family right very cool i remember i saw that um there was that show on i think it was on the sundance channel iconoclasts where like eddie better came out and hung out and and you got a really good feel what i loved about it was just that it kind of took its time and you you kind of got to the

the sense and the feel of what your life is like. That was Maui, though, when you guys were in Maui, right? But it was really cool and just kind of a flavor of, you know, raising the girls and having this, you know, different kind of family life. And, you know, that's what really interests me, interests Julie, is, you know, really looking into and kind of experimenting with different ways of raising our kids in different locations and, you know, not just sort of saying, well, this is how everybody else lives. And, you know, we live in the cul-de-sac and we go to this job or whatever,

but saying, hey, maybe there's something more, let's take a step back and really evaluate how we're spending our time. And is there a different way? Is there a better way or whatever? And I think that, you know, you guys have something figured out that's pretty cool. Well, I'll be honest. I don't know if we have anything figured out. But I do know one thing through this experience is that the minute that you sort of see a system in place, you are beholden to it when you say, okay, I'm going to live by those rules. Like, okay, we're going to enroll in this school and then we're going to go through that system. But the minute that you, if you have that opportunity to step out of that, then you,

I stopped pressuring out about it. Like my kids, two, my younger two daughters are homeschooled with a teacher and, um, and, uh, my oldest is, is going to be going into university. Uh, but it was the minute I sort of said, this is how we're going to do it. It feels right for our family and, and this timing. Then I stopped worrying about that other system that's in place that I, that we weren't participating in. Um, so I, questioning if you were missing out on something or making a mistake. Correct. You know, I have a friend right now, for example, she lives in Los Angeles and her daughter is a freshman in high school and

a great kid and she goes to a really good school. You know, quote, good school. And it's not right for her. And the family has decided to take her out and homeschool her online through the school. They have an online.

And I think the minute that they all sort of made the decision and they realized that that is what is right for this particular child, they were really relieved. But I think it's difficult. I think it's really difficult because it comes from us at all, from all areas. You know, about where would they go to school and what activities and all the activities after school. Right, they won't be properly socialized or they'll be, you know. Or even like sports. It's threatening because it's outside of the norm.

And so, you know, when somebody hears that, people get defensive. And, you know, we talked about this the other day on the podcast when we were talking about homeschooling. We're homeschooling our kids. And, and I come from a very traditional schooling and education background. And, and it's a struggle for me, like just to kind of accept it or I guess embrace it really. Like I have fears or is this the right thing? I don't know. And I see my little girls and I know that it's right for them. It's not right for everybody, but you know, especially with Mathis, not right for everybody, but, you know,

especially with Mathis, our eight-year-old, well, she just turned nine yesterday. You know, I'm confident that we're doing the right thing for her. But it's also scary because you take on that responsibility in a whole new way. You're not abdicating all of that to some institution where you can just go to sleep at night and figure, oh, it's being taken care of for me. Yeah. And that is true. But then I think you can look around that the way I look at it is you see so many people that have gone through that system and even like, you know, went to an Ivy League university. And was that always the answer? Yeah, you're talking about me. I mean, that's my experience. Yeah, I did all that. And then I kind of got on the other side of it and I go, well, wait a minute,

you know, like, is this, I don't even know if this is what I want to be doing or, you know what I mean? Like, I never asked myself those questions or it was never sort of enforced upon me to really kind of, you know, get to know myself or what I want or what I'm, you know, what I'm kind of here to do. Or, you know, I think everybody has a certain thing that they're here to do. You know, not everybody's going to be Michael Jordan or Gabby Reese or Laird Hamilton, but everybody has something, you know, in their heart or whatever that is kind of their legacy or their mission on this planet. And I think as parents, it's our job to help the child figure out what that is and support that as best as we can. But I think what Gabby was saying is key though, is the school

being in a system that requires you to be at a certain place on certain days. And even a system that, for instance, I had a situation where my mother came into town, and she lives in Alaska, and we were living in California, and she's in her 80s. And so I told, at the time Mathis was enrolled in a school, and I told the school administrator that she was going to be out for four days being with her grandmother. And I got cited for truancy because it's a law. The only reason someone can be absent from school is, I think it's illness, grief, or pre-excused absence for some activity. They didn't hear you.

You said, my mother's coming in town. It's grief. Do you not know? I'm kidding. I'm kidding. So, I mean, I told them thinking that that would be a great thing. Of course. Of course, right?

We want to nurture them. How long is she going to be around? And then I was in trouble. That's right. I was in trouble. So, I think. Well, they encourage you to lie. They basically were saying, come back and tell us that she's sick.

Don't tell us that she needs to spend time with her elder. Exactly. So, then my children then saw me lie, you know, because I was like, Oh, I can't. Okay. That's interesting. Yeah. So anyway, I think, but what you were saying is when you let go of that system, I mean, talk, talk to me about the freedom that you guys have in your life. Well, it is freedom, but it, and also to your, to Rich's point, it is, it's a scary thing too, because you sort of go, it's up to us and we're making this choice. And certainly people are much smarter than us at this. But the other side of it is this, is what is liberating even more or reconfirming is I look around and you, in this day and age, you could go to the best school and the best

university, and it doesn't actually guarantee you quote a job, which was the point besides, university, and it doesn't actually guarantee you, quote, a job, which was the point. Besides, you know, my grandmother was an educator. Furthering your horizons is what I was told. And even when I was a teenager, she also told me, well, you know, university isn't for everybody. And she looked right at me, and I was like, well, what does that mean? And truthfully, probably the only reason I ended up going to university was because I won an athletic scholarship. So my point is, let's say we lived in a different time where it was sort of like if you got a four-year degree,

you sort of were guaranteed some kind of job, right? Now you're not guaranteed that. You probably would incur quite a bit of debt if your family couldn't afford to pay for that schooling. And so in a way,

it alleviates me because I'm like, hey, listen, everyone's rolling the dice on some level. If you're marching them through the door to go through this system and not teaching them to think for themselves. I tell Laird and I talk

about it and I mean this in a positive way. Our kids now, they have to be hustlers. You better understand what you're good at and what you are enjoy doing. And you better, when you see an opening, understand how you fit in that opening and be a hustler. Because the guaranteed of like, oh, you have your law degree or your accounting or business degree, that really doesn't mean so much. It doesn't exist. It doesn't, unless you're like a tech genius

and that only, you know, how long, that's always changing as well. So part of me goes, well, listen, it's all a risk at this point. So if we can spend time together and influence them and impact them as long as we can, because at 12 or 13, they start to drift away anyway, at some point, it's on some level.

And it might change, like, they might always changing. And I think that idea, you know, as a parent, you want your kids to be safe, and you want to want them to have choices and all that sort of stuff. But I think a lot of that sort of security that you imagine is illusionary and things are changing a lot. And of course, if you go to law school or medical school, you have a good chance of getting a job in those professions. But you better know that that's what you want and you're not doing it just because it seems like a good way to make a living. Or someone else told you to do that. The biggest problem is that the system, the biggest problem is that the system is set up so that when you graduate, you're in debt, you know, and for a

lot of people. And to start your sort of professional life, like owing a bunch of money, compels you to make decisions you might not ordinarily make about what you want to spend your time doing, you know? Yeah. But it is a luxury too. I always acknowledge that, that the opportunity to homeschool your children, if your schedule permits, if your environment permits, or to even be able to ask that question is still, it is a luxury. And I guess it's one of those things like, is it a luxury because we've said, okay, this is important enough that we're asking it. But I also know that most people are just trying to make it happen every day. Yeah, and it's hard.

And I think a lot of people out there are like, well, I'd love to do that, but I'm busy and I work two jobs or my wife and I both work and we don't have time or we don't have the resources to hire a tutor to come over or whatever. And I think there are still options available for those people if they're really,

really wanna explore it and are interested. But, you know, I acknowledge that it's not, you know, it's a difficult thing. It's not going to work for everybody's lives. Right. Yeah. I mean, I think that, again, as we go along this path and we're, you know, we're exploring it, that sort of new support systems will appear. And, you know, my favorite one that I've been calling in and asking for is just give me five families, just five. That's all five that basically have similar, you know, lifestyle. And let's have each of those parents donate four hours a month. Okay. Now I already know just combining our family and your family, Gabby's family, we already have a wealth of people, also the older brothers as well as the parents. So if people just donated four hours a month and then we hired a

teacher and split, and I'm a big fan of not splitting the grades. I like the whole tribe together. I think that that is an enriching life experience. It's something that I experience every day with my own family. And, you know, we're learning French as a family in the car listening to tapes. It's hilarious. It's fun.

And we're all doing it together. Yeah. It's amazing. Yeah, it's cool. So, but, you know, not easy. It's easy. It's easy. It's easy? Just let go.

That's what I was telling her. All right, I'll work on that. Because it's not easy. But I do think it's, you know, that I've learned from being with someone who's very, I always sort of said one of the things I really appreciate about Laird was that he, he's not going to be, you know, I'm not going to change him.

And that actually brought out of a good side of me because women have a tendency to try to mother change control situations. Um, even if we don't mean to, that's just in our nature. And so when you're with a male that you can't change, you put the energy to other things. And also you actually continue to respect them because they're not letting you change them. But, continue to respect them because they're not letting you change them but um is is that i think the interesting thing to study about domestic living as it's set up is men love their wives and their children um and they got to get out at the same time it's like this constant conflicted thing that you see like you see the love like you they come in and you're like oh there they are there's the children there's my wife i love her, like they come in and you're like, oh, there they are. There's the children. There's my wife. I love her. And then after a few moments, you're like,

oh my God, I got to get out of here. And I think it's so natural and it's so not to be taken personally, but I have really learned that over the 17 years that it's just in them. It's just a natural. So for a woman, it's like, yeah, let's all be together in homeschool. And the guy's like, oh my God, I got to get out of here. Keep speaking the truth. What are you kidding me a woman it's like yeah let's all be together and homeschool and the guy's like uh-huh oh my god i gotta get out of here keep speaking the truth but it's true it is true you know it's really and that's a that's like that that issue is a or that subject matter is like a huge thing in our family and it's a big part of our personal story in our marriage and in our family i mean i think that and we talked about about this a couple episodes ago too, but, you know, we kind of went through that where, you know, I was in a certain place and Julie kind of wanted me to be different. And we played that game out, you know, and that didn't really go in a great direction, you know, and that caused a lot of problems in our marriage.

And yeah, we did, you know, have a little, you know, we split for a day. a little, you know, we split for a day. But like we had, you know, we had, we had some, you know, we had some problems and then kind of Julie's evolution with, with coming to terms with exactly what you said and, and how that kind of changed our relationship and our, and our marriage. And so, uh, everything actually. And it's funny, it's like I wrote an article, it was posted on MindBodyGreen and, and, uh, itodyGreen and it was basically about bringing a divine awareness into the relationship. So you're talking about the human relationship which is basically a business agreement

because you say you meet somebody and you fall in love and you project your image of who you want them to be who they really were never, they were never that. But then when you find out they're not that then you get mad at them and it's this whole cycle.

So we had this big shift in our relationship, really after seven years of really everybody telling me how right I was and nothing was shifting. It wasn't shifting and I finally had to really look inside myself and see that the fact that I wanted him to change was in fact an energy that was paralyzing the entire transformation. And when I actually got that and I was able to let go and just go, he is who he is. I love him just for his essence, purely. He could do whatever he wants. Like it's not, it was at that moment that everything

shifted. Right. And I think it's, well, and I, I mean, not to be crass, but I think it's really important for men to keep their balls, if you will. And I think women that try to take them away, not only, again, she will no longer be attracted to him. Yeah, if she's successful in that, then she's not going to like the guy that she... Not at all. Not at all. And he'll resent her. And the other interesting thing I have found, well, and I think even with children, it's harder with children

because we're so responsible for them on some level, but I sort of have decided, and I've noticed that Laird has done the same on his side, is I'll worry about how I'm acting and being and treating you and what I'm bringing to the table. And I'm really going to hope that you're going to do the same. And I have found that that seems to be the best method because if the person isn't willing anyway,

you're not going to make them. And so then you don't have that struggle of, you know, I want this and I need that. It's like, no, I'm going to treat you with love and respect and honor. I'm going to try to have some fun and have a smile on my face when you come home and deliver whatever that expectation is, right? My family, in some ways, we're very old-fashioned. I cook and we do the thing, and if it's stinky and dead,

Laird's digging the hole and burying it, and we have that understanding. And that seems to help it flow better, you know, and every couple you guys have a different, you know, everyone has their own, what are we bringing? But I think the minute you sort of trust them that, oh, you know what? My, my girl or my guy, he's, to, he'll bring it from his side. Right. You know?

But you had to learn that through experience, right? I mean, this is not, you know. Listen, forget one day breakup. Try like six-month breakup. You know, I think we, Laird and I, I'd say we had two very, very challenging times, one in particular. and you know he always says if you don't stay together through the hard times you don't ever get to really enjoy that next sort of rebirth that you you really do you value because you you see the growth and people I think people don't realize too you can genuinely not like someone and not even feel attracted to them

and go through the really hard time and you can get through that. Absolutely. You know, you can, you can genuinely do that, but both people have to be willing. And I, I do think kind of fundamentally there probably has to be some connections there that can propel you through it. You know, there has to be a very good solid core, I believe, but yeah, absolutely. Yeah. And it's really, I mean, I always say now from where Rich and I, we've been together 14 years, so married last time and you guys have been together 17. Yeah. Yeah. Wow. Yeah. I'm bowing to you right now. Oh gosh. One day at a time. Yeah, no. So, but, um, you know, uh, uh, now where we're standing, it's like where we stand now, we've earned it. Like no one can take that from us or nobody can just, you know, fly into the room and have really

any effect. It's like, we've earned it. We've, we've stood together. We've been through the ups, we've been through the downs and we've had this incredible experience and it's, it's, uh, it's really very powerful and very deep. It's a very deep relationship. It is deep. I think it, I think the other interest, well, not interesting. I think another thing of it too, it's like your health, like you guys live this every day. The thing about a relationship is I do believe even when you go through it, um, you still have to kind of earn it every day, if you will. And so I, I kind of also take the, the attitude of, um, I I'll keep working for this. Not like, okay, we've been together. Um, now you're in my back pocket and we'll just go on. There's no stasis. There's no static point.

You're either moving towards a healthier relationship or moving towards a more unhealthy relationship. I mean, I learned that lesson in recovery. I want to be on cruise control with sobriety or whatever, but at every given moment, I'm either moving towards a relapse or I'm getting more healthy. But there's no place where you can just cruise and say it's all fine. It's, you know, a relapse or I'm getting more healthy, you know, but there's no place where

you can just cruise and say, it's all fine. You know, it's work. It's always work. And it will always, it will always be work. There's no, that, that work never ends. You can never. But I think it's good when it doesn't surprise us. I think when we kind of understand it doesn't, and work doesn't, sometimes I think work has

the idea of like, it's not a good thing, but I think work can be a really good thing. It's just, it is that, it is kind of a form of work. It's like, if you go ride your bike or you're doing your yoga discipline, it's like, but it's still, sometimes people attach work as like a negative thing instead of, I think, one of the things that really gives us a lot of real deep pleasure and fulfillment, which is to be working towards something. To be of service, really. It's to be of service to this relationship or this beautiful family. I mean, what else is more worthy than that?

Absolutely nothing. But I think that probably, I'm interested in how you deal with people that kind of project onto you some kind of fantastical idea of what your life is like, you know, like this, this notion, like this sort of Disney, you know, kind of fairy tale, Laird and Gabby, you know, living in Hawaii and living in Malibu and it's all perfect. And yeah, it's all perfect all the time. And, and, and, you know, whatever kind of either reverence or jealousy or whatever comes along with that. Well, I think, you know, I think, well, I grew up in the Caribbean. I grew up on an island and Laird grew up on an island. And there was something about that where, you know, as you know, from just even being here, the currency of living on an island is it's who you are. It's not what you are or what you have or what you drive or what you live in. Right.

So or even attractiveness like that's got a different it's you know, it's a different thing. So we I think both of us grew up and we grew up a little bit behind the eight ball separately and for different reasons. And so I, I, um, well, first of all, we're both very, I hopefully, um, kind of right there with it, you know, like, I don't think either one of us want to pretend that everything is perfect or we're afraid to show this is really who we are. Um, but having said that, it's like we both acknowledge that we have sort of these lives that we've been fortunate, you know,

doing sports for a living or living in two places and some of that. So I think it's more, you know, kind of other people's stuff. Even when it's good stuff coming your way, even when people are like, Oh, you're great. I think that's their stuff. That's still not your thing. And same with the negative. It's like, oh, well, you guys, it's easy for you or whatever. It's like, okay, well, that's your stuff too. And I think that's been an important thing is to not get caught up in the cycle either way. Because you know who you are and you're trying to get through your life and you're trying to, you know, reach your mission. And if people are singing your praises, you can't really let that influence you.

It's nice, but you have to go, I know what that is. And it's the same with the other. And, you know, Laird told me a story the other day where he was out surfing and it was a smaller day and he said, God, I had like two left feet, and I fell off the board or something like that, and then some guy comes up to him, and he goes, oh my God, like you're human, and you fell off the board, because you can go out there on some days, and he's spinning his board around or doing whatever. I mean, that's his, one of his gifts, right, and Laird looks at the guy, and he said, listen, he's like, I have fallen off more waves than you have ridden. He's

like, I've wiped out more times than you've ever surfed a wave. And I guess the point of that is that we have failed so much separately and together that whatever people say, you just go, oh, gosh, okay. Yeah, for sure. I mean, yeah, those projections you can't take on, negative or positive. And they're everywhere. All the time. For you, I would imagine.

Well, no, I don't even mean that. I just mean for all of us working in a nine to five job. It's just, it's all around us, right? And, you know, it's been interesting for me and very, very good to have a, you know, I've started working over 20 years ago and I've had like an up and a down and an up and back down. And there's something really good about that because you go, is my value in how busy I am

and how many people recognize or don't recognize me? And am I less valuable because I'm less busy? And you've got to come to terms with your ego and with that whole thing. And that's been a very good teacher. But it is cool that, I mean, essentially your professional volleyball career ended in like the late 90s, yeah? Yeah, and then I played a little bit in the 2000s for two different seasons, yeah. Right, and then you made a go at the LPGA for a little bit. Well, what happened is, is then I, before I started having, um, my, before my second

daughter, someone said to me, okay, we're going to pay you to play golf in this, um, with the certain technique because they say in golf, um, it's the only sport you can make money through intellectual property, right? Cause they, you know, people go like, Oh, new swing and a new technique, new technique or whatever. And I sort of thought, I was in my early 30s and I have a need that really gives me a hard time. And I sort of thought that would be interesting to be in an athletic environment that I could prolong being in a kind of that stress, which is enjoyable, like working hard and competing and stuff. So the whole idea was to try to get my card. And then I started having children and I was spending eight hours a day at the golf course.

And so it just wasn't possible. Um, so after my second daughter was born and then I, I went down and I, I started doing the long world championship, long drives cause it's one club. Right. And then that just, it just golf was a very hard sport. And, uh, and also the other thing I learned about that was I became good at volleyball because I fell into it and I, I really enjoyed it. And with golf, I ended up putting the goal first instead of like, I grew up as a kid golfing and I liked walking around and it was fun. And then I enjoyed it. And then the goal started, it was switched around. And I think that that was really, really prohibitive. Yeah. I think you see that a lot in professional athletes too, when the fun goes out of it,

gets drained out of it and the pressure is amped up and it's about the money and all that kind of stuff. And then the performance starts to wane. And I think it's relevant also just for, you know, anybody out there who's trying to get fit or maintain their fitness. And people ask me all the time, like, how can I get started? Or what should I do? Or what do you recommend? And my answer is always like, find something that you enjoy. You know, like if you hate running, then, you know, yeah, you could go out and force yourself to run for a while and maybe lose a little weight and whatever. But your chances are you're not going to stick with it.

And the point is to find something that's sustainable within your lifestyle so that you will continue to do it. So whether it's a skill or whatever it is, something that's active, that's exercise oriented, that you find that you find joy in. Right. Well, I think that's that's exactly right. I mean, I see people and I and I have people I know and they really like, they hate the gym. And I'm like, well, then don't go to the gym. Don't go there. Because that's, and it's almost, you see that a lot though, because we all sort of go, well,

I've got to hit that mark. And so what's it going to take to hit the mark instead of, well, what is it that I could do that I would enjoy doing along the way to the mark? And almost if the mark happens, great. And if it doesn't, that's almost the sidebar. Yeah, it shouldn't be about the goal. I mean, obviously, it's motivating. I want to lose 10 pounds or I want to, you know, my 10K time or whatever it is, those can, you know, compel you to show up on a rainy morning to do something you don't ordinarily want to do. But it's about the journey. If you're not enjoying, you know, if you're not lockstep into the day-to-day of whatever

it is you're doing, then it's not, the goal is not going to mean as much and you're not going to stick with it. I mean, it's not going to be part, it's not going to become part of who you are. Right. But we're not taught to try to really understand who am I. That's a really scary notion. That's the whole shebang. That's the whole... This is where Julie comes in. No, we've talked about that extensively.

I mean, really what we're supporting and what we're advocating and what we're sharing just by sharing our own experience is that very thing, how to connect to your own heart. And, you know, I always say that, you know, the divine consciousness that creates all things creates each being in a perfect design. And, you know, the big trauma is that we've all been hypnotized through greed.

And it's really mostly money-driven. You know, you're trying to, you know, be okay in society. And not that many of us have been nurtured to really find out who we are. And that, again, leads us back to my big support of our choices of education for our kids is, is at least I know that their self-esteem is intact. And to me, that's the number one most important thing because we are all smart. We are all creative. I mean, all humans. I mean, everyone, right? And each being has a gift. And I always say, I said on an earlier podcast, wouldn't it be wonderful if instead of trying to make everybody the same or study the same things

we started out asking please tell me who you are right please tell me what you came here to share but that but the person has to ask themselves that question first and they need tools to you know like even when we talked about this before i was getting emails like well what do you mean like i don't even know what are you what are you even talking about? Well, right. But I mean, in the beginning thing, one thing that really surprised us with Rich's transformation and how we were sort of organically led into this nutrition, I mean, I was never going to write a cookbook.

I'm an artist. I was just cooking for him out of the love of supporting him and his training and his newfound joy. But what we really notice, and from everybody contacting us, is just how much food plays a part in this awareness. Well, think about food. It's huge. It's celebration. It's depression. It's boredom. It's gathering. It's social.

And if you're an addict in any way of it, you still have to do it three or four times a day. So it's not like you go, oh, okay, I was a drinker and I'm not now. And you just bail it. You still have to find a way within it to function with the food. And it's the number one way of managing your emotions. Yeah. I mean, it's just, and even, I mean, you know, I go back and forth where I handle it very well. But every once in a while, a little stress, a little boredom, a little something, and I go, oh, check that out.

Where you can go for it. And like I said, and you have to deal with it every day. It's not like you can go, okay, you know what, that's it, no food, I'm going to walk away. I'm done with that. That is a dance. That's a dance. Yeah. Yeah.

I'm done with that. That is a dance. That's a dance. Yeah. Yeah. So, I mean, that's been really, really enlightening for us. And that's why we're spending a lot of our energy in that direction. Cleaning up your diet is the first.

What you're saying essentially is cleaning up your diet is the first step towards trying to create a greater relationship between you and yourself. You and yourself. That's the first thing. Exactly. relationship between you and yourself. Like that's the first thing. Because if you're sort of trying to manage all your emotions or suppress your emotions through food all the time, then you're preventing yourself from taking that first step of looking inward. Yeah, absolutely. Or if you're eating so many processed foods that have toxins in them, you can't feel yourself. You can't feel who you are because you're, you're not really you. You, you've got all this other stuff in your system.

Well, I always, I did a cleanse, um, like a couple of different times, a pretty extensive one. And I always have another friend that was considering it. And I go, but be careful because at the end of the cleanse, you'll get rid of all your bad friends. Cause all of a sudden you'll have this whole clarity and you'll just be like, Oh, wait a second. I can't be friends with you anymore. You know, I'm kidding. But it was like, you know, it was a pretty long, I mean, it was two weeks and pretty extreme. But of course, I think the drug of food is, it's powerful.

It's really powerful. Powerful. Yeah. And it's hard to get. See, that's the other thing is when you say people write in and they ask, what do you mean? If you live in certain places that the food is readily available, you're fortunate. If you live in certain places, you can barely find the food. For sure.

You can barely find the food. I had a thought that I wanted to take one of the doctors from, you know, like Forks Over Knives and just say, okay, listen, you and I, we're going into a Walmart and we're going to go into a Kroger's market and we're going to go into a Target, all the places they sell food. And I want you to tell me what we can eat. And I want you not only to tell me what we can eat, I want you to prepare three meals and how it gets done. Because also, that's the other thing is people forget that you drive down the road, you only have a certain amount of money in your pocket to spend, and it's what can you eat and where can you get it? Right. I mean, not everyone has a Whole Foods. Not everyone has a farmer's market. There's pretty

much Walmarts and Costco's and Targets and stuff like that around. And a lot of people, that's where they get their food. And there has to be a way to make it easier for the consumer to be judicious in their choices. And so I think, you know, yeah, if you took Dr. Esselstyn or T-Con camera. Yeah, that's exactly. I was like, I'd like to take Esselstyn and go, let's go, you and me right now, let's go into Walmart. What can we eat? I can, I can make, I can try to make that happen. Yeah, I'm just saying, I think that that, because at a certain point, you know, I mean, unfortunately, and I wish I was more right-brained, I'll be honest.

Like, my husband is very, like, artistic and, like, creative and inventive, and I'm, like, really linear and, like, pound through the goals. But there's a part of me that's like, I wanted to do a show, just call it Solutions, and go, okay, Issues, Solutions. Because we can, you know, I always say, people go, oh, well, well.

I go, all right, do you just want to, do we want to find the solutions? And just take someone like that who's so brilliant and dedicated their whole life to it and lived it, you can see it, and just go, all right, let's at least realistically figure out how can you do that. Right.

Because there's still always going to be people, there are people, though, who say they want to change or they want help, but they really don't. And they, they love to say, well, I can't do that. So what, I mean, you know, what would be just between the three of us what would be some ways like what what would i do what would i do if i lived in one of those cities where that was only available well i guess i would look to see if there was anything organic which there probably is maybe three or four items but even like but even if it's not like if you're if you're yeah it's better to eat produce than not eat produce that's but i'm saying that that's saying that that's one solution. Like, let's just pretend that I'm-

And there is, you know, that information is out there. Like, maybe it could be presented better, but like Jeff Novick is a great example Right, I was thinking about Jeff. about his DVDs. And he's like, you know, buy frozen vegetables because they're packaged fresh. Like, right after they're harvested,

they're immediately frozen. And so even if they're not organic, it's still great. And he has these DVDs where he makes these, literally in five minutes, he makes 20 different stews. And he has his rule of thirds, which is great, which is you make a huge pot of something, and he has all these recipes that are super easy. And a third of it you eat with your family. A third of it you put in the fridge for like later or the next day. And then the other third of it you put in the fridge for like later or the next day. And then the other third of it you freeze. And so every time you make a meal, you're doing that. And then

your freezer starts stacking up with stuff that's, you know, you can thaw out and eat. So you always have something in your fridge that's healthy. It prevents you from making that like, you know, bad impulsive choice. Yeah. That's a good solution in some scenarios. The other one is, have you guys seen those towers or those portable gardens where you can order, like they're vertical gardens, I guess. You can order one. I think they're like 500 bucks or something. And you can actually grow produce in your own kitchen

wherever you are. Right. Yeah, you hang these things. And I think it's pretty. Have you seen those ones, like the tomato one? That's really funny. It's like a 15 or 30 second spot on the TV. It's awesome. I haven't seen it. It's like, oh, tomatoes. You get it. I know like people in Manhattan are doing that, like growing food in their apartment. Right. Yeah. So I agree with you that it needs to be made easier, but I think it's almost like it's gotten so, we've gotten so far away from it,

but so now then the answers are all coming. I think, because before no one had to think about it, right? Right. They sort of go, well, that's not a problem. And now everyone goes, oh, wait a second.

Okay. Now it's a problem. So, and the fact that it's, it will affect, you know, healthcare and the taxes and everybody's pocketbook. Now it will, you know,

the discussion will get bigger. Absolutely. I mean, it's such a, we're in such a ridiculous situation right now. I mean, healthcare is absurdly expensive. It's a broken system. Heart disease, you know, is killing people like crazy, you know, 600,000 people a year or something like that. Diabetes, obesity, you know, diseases that come from being obese. And these are all, you know, preventable and reversible conditions with proper nutrition and a few simple lifestyle alterations. And yet we have this huge problem that is, you know, by all indications, it's this weird dichotomy because it seems to be getting worse. And yet, you know, there's resources like Forks Over Knives

and all these, yeah, there's all this information coming at us. And it's very, you know, and there is a, you know, like a willingness to pay attention to that. And there's an audience for that. And there is this movement, like it's never been kind of more in the zeitgeist. But at the same time, it seems like there's, I don't know if it's another segment of the population entirely or whatever, but it's like the problems are runaway train

nonetheless. Well, it's, it's, it's the, it's television and the internet. And I think it's like you were saying earlier, the system where we're sort of going, um, you know, we, we have to work, we have to make money, we have to get bigger cars and bigger houses. And so I think the focus of priorities has been crazy, but there's a huge time suck with TV and the internet and it's easy. And then I think even like, I know it sounds silly, but the kind of glorification of bad reality programming of like people thinking that that's kind of funny. You know, that sort of humiliation and that, you know, destructive behavior. It's actually just tragic.

Yeah, but it's seeped into our culture. Like somehow that's, it's like sort of okay. Not only that, like these people have become role models. Right, exactly. sort of okay you know not only that like these people have become role models which brings me into like another thing i wanted to talk to you about which is we don't you know like right now the female role models in our popular culture are kim kardashian and lindsey lohan and snooki and people like that and and you know are and you have three girls you have three daughters we have two daughters are these the women that you want your children looking up to? And, you know, and as much as you try to police it or control it, you know, short of turning the television off all the time,

I mean, in the grocery store, they're on the cover of all the magazines. And we really don't, we're not set up to adequately celebrate female role models like yourself, like, you know, the astronauts and the scientists and the, you know, the public servants or what have you to be role models for our girls? Well, I think here's how, and it's always gone back to this, and you guys know this in your house, it's really up to the parents. And I think, you know, like when you were saying, oh, have the kids go to school and that gets taken care of, nothing gets taken care of. You have to take care of it like you guys are taking care of it in your house. And so, for example, that stuff comes through our airways into my house and it just becomes a discussion. And not like me being a mom going, oh, I can't believe it. I don't get into all that.

I just keep it as an open flow. But because there's so much other discussion and so many other examples within the home, by the time my one nine-year-old, she sees right through it. My 17-year-old, she can't be bothered. It's like I think it's never taboo. I think it's certainly if we want to talk about it. And I think it's up to me and also the women I'm choosing to spend time with and who they're around, their aunties and such, that they see it. They kind of go, oh, wow, this woman over here is kind of badass.

And that girl, yeah, everything's slick and shiny and perfect, the eyelashes and the shoes and the handbag. But kids are smart. And as long as you're offering something else, I think it will feel right to them. But yeah, it's totally crazy because it's a train wreck and it makes everyone else feel better about themselves.

You know, they go, oh, you know, her life's a disaster. She's a disaster. I'm doing pretty good, you know? We must all feel really bad about ourselves. Yeah, but that's a real thing. It's true. And it's getting worse in this tabloid cult. I mean, living in Los Angeles, you're exposed to it in a way that you're not living elsewhere.

I mean, you go into town and you can see the little pockets of paparazzi following around somebody. And you see the hysteria that ensues with that. And people are making money. And it's not going to, unless they change the laws or something like that. I mean, I don't see it changing. No, but it really comes from within the home. I mean, it's the same thing as with, you know, our diet. It's like, you can't, you can't be eating, you know, fudge pies under your bed and then telling your kids to eat their vegetables. It's the same thing. It's like, we live a certain

vibration in our house and it doesn't mean we never eat a potato chip or there's never a time where a tabloid flies by, but it's like we don't buy those things. We actually turned TV off in our house some years ago. And has it been a year yet? That was tough. Yeah, Rich went kicking and screaming on that one. Wait, no TV at all?

No. Film? Yeah, films. We watch DVDs and movies and stuff like that. But you can no TV at all? No. Film? Yeah, films. We watch DVDs and movies and stuff like that. But you can watch everything online anyway.

Yeah. But we just, you know, just that incessant news program that just keeps... Well, we have one son, actually Trapper,

who would like to come over and watch football with you if he could. Yeah. He's a... Poor Trapper. Trapper... He's our one sports person.

Especially the playoffs. He's a football fanatic and he's been deprived. Like, I'm not kidding. He'll call you he's a, he's our one sports person. He's a football fanatic and he's been deprived. Like, I'm not kidding. He'll call you later. He can. He can. Like,

please. He's been going over to Chris's house. And we try our hardest to be enthusiastic, but it's really, it's a lie. I know. I, you know,

sometimes I, I, you know, Laird, one time we're sitting there and he's like, and he was dead serious. Um, he appreciates,

you know, obviously the athleticism and stuff but I heard him say oh these man on man sports and I was like did you like because for him right it's about the exploration and the whole thing he's like how can a referee decide

if that's good or not like it just blows his mind you know but listen I mean football they are kind of gladiators you get you know but anyway I've never been like a big and i can't like i my dad is a crazy you know like i grew up watching football games and my dad loves it and i went through a period of time where i was into it but just i don't know i'd rather be out riding my bike and well you'd rather be doing i'd rather be doing instead of watching the doing but you know i respect that trapper loves it and i want to support him and, you know.

That's right. So we're glad. We're glad to meet you. That's great. Awesome. Anyway. No, but getting back to, I mean, it's really, we were talking about girls and having good role models

and I think it's, you know, I think, again, it's nurturing. If you have a child and you respect that child and respect what that child loves to do or wants to do and they're seeing you live your heart also and express yourself. It's like that kind of stuff doesn't even really factor in. I mean, it's kind of like, oh, that's an interesting view. Yeah, and they'll go through teenage hormone, weird take over the body type stuff. I sort of think 13 through 15 especially for girls 12 to

15 is a bit we haven't gotten there yet intense i'm terrified oh you should be you should be be like who is this person that's moved into my kid's body but i think it's also even honoring and trusting um that too that like oh they because I remember, I came out of it. I mean, I have some of the dearest friends of mine that are the greatest adults and they were,

you know, lunatics for a couple years being teenagers. So I think it's also giving them their culture because that is also part of the culture that they share

with other kids. You know, like, whatever, you know, think about your social context when you grew up. It was, you know, I don't know. You know, like, whatever, you know, think about your social context when you grew up. It was, you know, I don't know. You know what I mean?

Like, those shows, those music. A way of communicating. Yeah, and then letting them, they're going to grow out of it. They're going to grow out of it. Absolutely. Absolutely. Yeah.

Well, we're hoping, I don't know, ours came in sort of in already, they were born in puberty. Yeah. That's what she's saying now. I don't know. I'm hoping that sort of in already. They were born in puberty. Yeah. That's what she's saying now. I don't know. I'm hoping that they're going to already be done with it. And like we've already done that chapter. We'll see how that works out.

We'll see how that works out. So I want to talk about your book. You have a book coming out this spring. Yeah, I want to know all about that. My foot is too big for the glass slipper. Yeah. So tell us about that. My foot is too big for the glass slipper. Yeah. So tell us about that. Well, that was sort of born out of, I was writing a blog for years called Death by Domestication. And that sort of concept was obviously to have fun with the idea of sometimes how tough domestic living and cohabitation can be. It can be not very creative you know you're you're sort of like we're washing the sheets again and um you know there you are again over there across from the table to you again

um could you tell your kids for the 50th time can you brush your teeth have you not figured that out and just kind of that running conversation about what what it is and how to have fun with it and, and kind of move through it. And also, um, so anyway, I got, I got approached by, um, Simon and Schuster and they said, well, do you want to turn into a book? So I had done a book in 97 with a very funny writer named Karen Carbo. And, and so she came to see me and she goes, Oh, your book's done based on all the blogs. She goes, I'll just help you help you build out the chapters and stuff.

And so the book is really kind of my, there's no finger wagging. It's just my observation and my experience in marriage, raising children, you know, the expectation of that. There's bits about exercise, nutrition, you know, aging gracefully, sex, you sex, kind of all of these things that you learn as you go. And I sort of think for a woman in her 40s, you can kind of have that conversation and have fun with it. But then also, hopefully, there's real takeaways. One valuable lesson I learned, and you might actually know this too, is... She's pointing at me.

I am. I'm pointing at Rich because I have, I can be feeling all kinds of things, but you can't tell on my face. I'm a very, you know, kind of level. We joke, you know,

I'm 70, moderate and sunny, and Laird's, you know, the weatherman, we call him. And I used to come home and drive home, and he'd see me, and I'd think to myself, I'd see him, and I'd go, oh home and and uh he'd see me and i think to myself i'd see him i go oh my god there he is i i'm so happy to see him i love him it wouldn't register

and so by the time i got out of the car he'd look at me and he'd go oh how was your day what's up and then it was it was done right the the right it started right there i'm like what do you mean like inside i'm thinking i'm you already shot the bed i was loving you i was didn't you feel it so i i wrote in the book, talked about shiny eyes, which means like when I see my husband, pretty much unless something serious is going on, I don't mean my kid's acting like lunatics. I just mean like a heavy thing.

I make sure I have really like an open face, shiny eyes. I'm happy to see him, even if it feels pushed. Because then what happens is he sees that. And when he sees me, he's like, Hey babe, you know, and then it's in the right cycle because he's, he is very transparent and very overtly loving. And I've had to work on showing, um, those emotions. And so I, I talked about how like a lot of women, a guy comes home from a long day of work or work period, and she's the kids and she looks at him and she's like, and it's whole thing that um you kind of have to learn that doesn't work uh not really

i mean so anyway that's just you know sort of an example and i talk about fitness and having a lot of strong female you know sort of tribe members because i think that's really healthy i learned it through sports women guys get it because they play together like boys go play right girls unless they're in sports they don't get that opportunity so much how to relate that way and also teaches you how to be in your male i think the more women can be a balance between male and female and same with men i think it's it sort of suits us. And not fight being women. I think now I see a generation of women

who they're confused and the men are confused. They don't know what to do. Should I open the door? Should I not open the door? Should I tell her she looks pretty? Should I not? Should I pay for dinner?

Shouldn't I? And it's created a really weird space. Yeah, there's definitely disorientation. I think in both sexes. I mean, I can only speak to being a man but yeah it's like do you want me to be the man or do you want me to be the sensitive guy and like where where do you draw those lines and i think it creates a lot of confusion i want you to be both yeah i know see but when that's great yeah at the same time when she needs you

too right exactly but i do i think it's hard because you see that the system has failed men miserably school systems and what have you. Absolutely. And on some level, women are thriving, but there's a harshness that's come to it. But they're actually... So anyway, so the book sort of is just that talk because I think people see me and I think I can have that conversation because I come from this kind of sport. So by saying, hey, listen, I serve my husband.

I do. I think men understand a few languages, one being sex and another being food. Food. Correct. So that is their language of service. So I am happy to serve him that way. And it's not because I have to.

It's because I understand that he enjoys that and that's good for the situation. And a lot of women have neglected that side of themselves because they think it's a weakness. And so anyway, there's just all those kinds of conversations. But it's like subservience or something like that. Yeah, and in a way, instead of, even like service, why is service as a community service?

It's like punishment. Instead of, even like service, why is service a community service? It's like punishment. Service, through your personal choice, is a great thing. And I think it should just be part of living. And being female and nurturing does not mean, the last bit of my book, I say be the queen. You know, princesses is like for amateurs. Be the queen.

You know, the queen will work harder than everybody. She's probably stronger than everybody. She's fair. She's just. You know, she'll listen. But amateurs. Be the queen. You know, the queen will work harder than everybody. She's probably stronger than everybody. She's fair. She's just, you know, she'll listen. But yes, she'll cut your head off. And so there's no confusion because I'm willing to make dinner for you and serve you and never speak to you in a disrespectful tone

doesn't mean I can't be strong. It's just choosing. And I think sometimes the art of that is getting lost. Yeah, it's true. And I mean, also, I mean, the women hold the pure mother frequency and the spirituality from the fire in the kitchen. I mean, that's actually where the spiritual teachings first came. And it's the biggest blessing to serve people food.

That's right. It's the biggest blessing and offering you could make from your soul to another being is to serve them food. But what you're saying, but you say that, and then it can be misinterpreted as saying, like, a woman's place is in the kitchen. No, but I'm not, I mean, obviously, you know, you're standing, you're sitting here with two very powerful women,

you know, between Gabby and me. It's, it's not that it's, um, it's a taking responsibility. It's a being the great mother. It's actually having the energy to say, I can hold this for others. And I can serve. It isn't fair. Like I have. Like I have a good friend who's an acupuncturist on Maui and he goes, of course women are more interesting. They suffer more. And I think what that means though, is that a woman's role, no matter how you slice it up, even if she's a breadwinner as well, is more. There's more to it. And I think when women are like, it's not fair. I say my nine-year-old knows that fair is at the fairground. Like life isn't fair. What does that mean? And sometimes that's in our favor. But I think for a woman to understand,

if you're going to take the role on of being a woman and decide even to have children, by the way, like Laird says, if I could give milk, I'd be worthy. Guess what? Just based on sheer nature and body parts, you have a different load, period. And so I sort of thought, well, let's address that and also be equipped, like going into it. Don't be, oh, he's going to come on the horse and save me. In essence, a really good female will save the male and hopefully produce an environment for the male to be the best male he can be. And I think if a woman wants a king, she has to treat him like that And I think if a woman wants a king, she has to treat him like that.

I think that's also part of the communication is like, hey, if you, it's like a child. You know, if you say, you know, you want them to do all these things, you have to treat them like that. But part of the conversation, I stick up for men a great deal in my book because I love men.

But also to men, it's like, but you have to show up. You know, like if my husband comes home one thing i appreciate about him is he's present when we're speaking and i don't need him to sit there you know all day like do you want to spend a lot you know let's play quality time i really don't actually i don't want to she just we talked about that the other day where julie's like i don't need you to go to like do run errands with me. I want a good date or like I want that quality. That quality connection. We don't have to hang out all day.

But what happens with women, the reason they're scratching for more is because when the guy's around, he's not present. He doesn't know how to, I sort of say, hit a hair with a laser. Like, how are you? You look beautiful. I desire you. Do you want to talk to me about something that feels important to you? And then they can go. If men understood that...

It's a fast in and out. They'd be fine. And if they have a chick who needs more than that, then they need to evaluate that situation. Right. Because that might be a hole you can never fill. So I can't help you with that. So I think it's understanding

that most women probably actually don't want to really hang around every second with their guy. But when he's around, if he can sort of express those few things, then he can satisfy those needs. If she's always like, it's because she's not getting what she wants. And also, I have good friends that aren't necessarily the biggest cooks in the world, and that's not what I meant.

I also mean it kind of figuratively as in the service part of it. But yeah, so the book sort of talks about that. Right, interesting. And I love that, you know, the title really is a clever inversion of this Disney fairy tale. And, you know, our daughters, you know,

watch those movies or, and it makes me crazy because it's sort of like the helpless female who literally is, especially in the older Disney movies where literally her life is on the line. Like she is going to die unless this prince rescues her. And then when he does, everything is perfect and they get married and it's, and the story's over happily ever after. And it. And it is a message that just enrages me and I think it's not a good message for young girls. It's been set up on purpose as well.

So all of those stories carry that thread. Oh, yeah. Very, very strong. Well, then the problem is you get into day-to-day life and then you're like, oh, wait a second. Nobody ever talked to me about this stuff. So it was just an attempt to address some of those things and the expectation to women living through their children instead of understanding that how do you simultaneously stay self-defined and be a good wife and be a good mother? Because otherwise, otherwise guess what she's pissed

she's 50 and she hasn't done that she gets spit out the man's continuing on with his life the children leave thanks a lot she's angry and i think that's because um she got forgotten but the problem is is the only one who can remember her is herself herself and so i think that that is you know just sort of small things large it's huge i mean it's funny because we we were on big island last year in december and we were on the beach um and somebody had gifted us laird's book it's a lifestyle book beautiful book with photographs oh the force of nature right right. And we were really enjoying it. And I was really feeling like I wanted more of you. Yeah, but it was Laird's book. I know. But I was like, where's the chapter all on you? So I was really happy to see that you wrote this book. And I think it's a perfect time. And I really feel like in 2013, we're really coming into embodying the feminine as being honored as that frequency.

And not only just women, but that energy, as you said, within men. So as we return our knowledge back to the support of the divine feminine, I think it's perfect timing for your book. And I'll be excited to read it. It sounds amazing. We were going to call it How Not to Impale Yourself on the White Picket Fence, I'll be excited to read it. Oh, thank you. It sounds amazing. We were going to call it How Not to Impale Yourself on the White Picket Fence, but that didn't translate so well. Oh, yeah.

I kind of like that title. We made it a chapter instead, because it's like, I'm just saying, you know, they go, no, no, no, you know. Right. But, no, it was fun. And, listen, people either really like it or they won't, but I thought if I'm going to do it,

I'll say my truth, because that's the other thing, too, right, is saying, hey going to do it, I'll say my truth. Because that's the other thing too, right? Is saying, hey, listen, it's just, it's what has been my truth and everyone getting their thing out of it. Well, that's the only way it's going to work. You know, like you said, people are going to like it or they're not, but you're speaking your truth.

And, you know, I experienced that when I was writing my book and I was like, I don't, you know, really, that's the only thing that those are the marching orders. Like it has to be authentic and it has to be coming from the heart and it has to be your truth instead of what's going to make me look good or what is the, you know, you can't, you're not, you're never going to write anything meaningful that way. No. Well, they say everything's the 30, 30, 30, right? No matter what you do in the life, like we're going to save the babies. Well, what about the babies in this country?

30-30, right? No matter what you do in the life. Like, we're going to save the babies. Well, what about the babies in this country? No matter what you do, 30% of the people will love it, 30% will hate it, and 30% won't care. No matter what. So you might as well make yourself happy. Absolutely. That's the worst, if people don't care.

You know what I mean? Like, it's better to have people... Like, if you're taking a stand, then you're going to ultimately divide people, right? There's going to be people that don't like what you're saying or whatever, threatened or disagree or what have you, but at least you're making a stand. That's right. Right? Yeah.

And so how do you deal with the negative? How do you deal with negative criticism or blowback? You know, I think years ago, probably in my late 20s and 30s, it was harder for me. Again, as a girl, you're taught you want to make everybody happy um and then you I think you reach a place where you accept that you cannot and so it's one of those things like you can't and you can't control it so you might as well I had a volleyball coach tell me I've got 12 people on the floor probably eight play so I look at the whole situation. I make the best decision I can for the situation.

And in the end, she goes, you know, at least one person's happy. And she's like, me. And I think if I do the best I can and I'm trying to do that, I sort of, I'm okay with that. And I also have learned through the years of being in a job that's a little bit public at times, um, that people are not going to like you for a number of reasons and it may have nothing to do with you. You know, Oh, your, your eyes are green or you're, you look like a girl that my husband left me for whatever. It's like you learn that with all that good, you're out of your mind if you don't think some negative's coming your way. And you just say, okay. Accept it.

It's hard. It's wise. It hurts. You know, when my book came out, I was in the public in a way that I'm not a seasoned, I'm not used to being, and I'm not like a, of course, I'm not like a celebrity or anything like that. I'm just a guy who wrote a book, but it did put me in the kind of public spotlight in a way that I'd never been before and wasn't used to. And for the most part, it's like overwhelmingly great and positive. And so the work is don't buy into that just as much as you, you know, like I go on Amazon, I see, you know, there's the reviews are great on the book for the most part but then there's the a couple one stars you only remember people are like personally attacking me you know and i'm like i wish i could tell you that that doesn't hurt or i or i don't

get upset about that but like i do you know they're talking about me as an as an individual and so but they're not they're it's through their filter and it, you know what I mean? Like it doesn't, they don't know. See, the thing is, is that they came up and shook your hand and spent the week with you and then wrote something. I'd be like, well, you know, it's personal. Right. They don't even know you.

And I, I went, uh, recently. It's pouring rain. Sorry. It's pouring rain. You can probably hear it. I recently saw Oprah Winfrey speak at something. A friend of mine is the editor-in-chief at her magazine. Anyway, you can imagine her realm.

And she says, yeah, somebody wrote something about her network going down and her going down. And she goes, all I can say is, come say it to my face. And Laird calls it, you know, internet courage. He's like more eyeballs, less emails. And really in the end, if you sort of say, hey, what affects us is what's happening here right now in front of us. And all of that actually has nothing to do with us. Even the good stuff. Right.

It doesn't really influence. It doesn't influence your relationship with one another or with your children. No. And so it's also separating the thoughts with the reality and good and bad. Right. Like, oh, someone goes, wow, you wrote an amazing book or your songs are beautiful. That doesn't make you a better guy or a better parent or a better husband. Just like, oh, you suck. And I don't believe anything you say doesn't affect that either right so that's how I I've learned to deal with it and and everything has a season it passes you know yeah that's wise that's true absolutely more eyeballs less emails yeah that's learned he he's so right there with it. It's like, whoa, buddy. I can't,

I have a hard time picturing Laird sitting in front of a computer, like responding to emails. That's probably pretty good. That's why you go to Laird's site and Laird's Facebook. It's all me saying what Laird's doing. Right. And then once in a while, some knucklehead will say like, well, it'd be really nice to hear from Laird directly. And I'm like, well, then you'd have

to come to where Laird is. Yeah. Well, that's not, that's not who he is. That would not be. Yeah, exactly. Like he's, you got to go where he, he's not going to make an appointment to go. Like, it's like, you know, he's going where the wind is blowing. He's doing, he's going. Exactly. That's why he's called the weatherman. What's it doing? It's amazing. Very cool. Well, it's good. I don't want to take up too much more of your time, but I do, I think we would be irresponsible and remiss to not at least get it, sort of talk about one more thing, which is, you know, we're coming up on Christmas, the new year. year, everybody's sort of, it's that time of year where everyone's taking inventory of what happened to them this past year and kind of laying grand plans for how to be better in the new year. And, you know, I sort of went on Twitter and I said, hey, you know, Gabby's coming on the show. Uh,

you know, what would you like me to ask her? And of course they're all like, well, you know, how do it's, it's, most of them are very general question. how do i you know what can i do to get fit and and you know i think you know people want the solution you know they want to be spoon-fed this this is do exactly this and you will be better but right if there's anything any kind of insight or or to get people kind of energetic and motivated for 2013 and kind of you know cleaning the slate and starting fresh well first of all what you just said know, cleaning the slate and starting fresh? Well, first of all, what you just said right there, cleaning the slate and starting fresh, I think what keeps people is it becomes such a daunting, such a daunting task. Like, oh, I have 30 pounds to lose or 50. That is, that in itself prevents them really from the first day. So I think if people think, okay, I'm going to do this,

the number one thing that they can do, quite frankly, is very few of us are strong to take it on alone. Maybe you know people who could. The reason I have these workout classes is because you have to have people around to do it. So I would say for them to enlist somebody who's either in the same situation or can help them. Because the only way really is to have some accountability. Really, no matter who you are. I think most of us need accountability. Maybe you're through it where you can do it on your own. But your accountability... No, I think I definitely do. And I think that it's important for people to understand that that accountability comes in both a positive and a negative form. Like you need to create community around that goal that is supportive and wants you to succeed. But you also need that pressure like, oh, if I don't show up, I'm going to get shit from my friend or whatever it is.

And that kind of keeps you honest. Yes. And so I think if they're serious in the beginning, at least, especially where it's a kind of a, I call it the faith period where people are working really hard and eating better and making better choices, but they're not really seeing big changes. Cause once you start seeing big changes, then you can roll, but there's sort of that window of time where you're making these lifestyle changes, but you're not really seeing great benefits and break great changes that during that time that they have this extra positive support like you're speaking of. But that I believe good health is like climbing a giant mountain and it's one step at a time. And I think if they take the whole goal on, if they say all 40 pounds all at once,

they're just going to sit down on the couch and grab a burger because they'll just go, oh my God, I can't do it. I think it's, okay, today I'm going to eat this, this, and this. And I think in the beginning, it's better to have a plan so you're not reacting when you're hungry, but that you've already decided what you're actually going to be putting in your mouth, in your system. I think that's helpful. You guys are disciplined enough and you have enough experience that you can go, it's lunch, I'm going to eat lunch lunch i think in the beginning i think people not need to sort of really say at breakfast i'm gonna eat this at lunch i'm gonna eat that and at dinner i'm gonna eat this i think that's very helpful in the beginning um and also if you if you blow it that's okay

right you know i think it's that pressure of trying to be perfect is is take yeah and then and then failing. We're human beings. We're fallible by nature. And we're all failing, and some of us are failing downward, and some of us are failing upward. I mean, you talked about failing so many times in your life. And that's just part of the journey.

But if you focus on that failure and sort, put too much emphasis on that. It takes you out of that game completely. And I think the other, you know, thing that I always ask people when you, like you said, what's more important than dedicating time to your family and your, and, and, and your children and such. At the end of the day, when we take stock into every single thing that we own, the most prized possession that we own, we live in. And we treat it so badly, generally. And, you know, Laird and I talk about this. You know who Paul Cech is, right? Do you know Paul Cech?

He talks about, you know, like, eat your car. And, you know, he talks about people driving Mercedes to the drive-thru at McDonald's. And he goes, how about get a cheaper car and eat better food? And I think sometimes we've shifted all around and I think when someone's laying on a bed, they're ill, they're not saying, well, gosh, I wish at this moment

I could get another car or a bigger house. They're just saying, I really wish I had my health and I felt good. And I always say to people, why do you have to lose something in order to appreciate it and value it? And so, that we're, it's an asset. It's such a valuable asset. And if we're 30 pounds overweight, we're still so valuable and our bodies are so important and should be treasured that every day when you look in the mirror, and even if it's not exactly how you want it,

that you love that and you love that body. And that the body is unbelievably resilient. And so it's never too late. The way that I've been able to transform myself, I mean, literally, if you start treating it right in a period of weeks, days sometimes, you will have a dramatic difference in how you feel about yourself. And if you can kind of set the stage and understand that, that when you treat it right, it will respond in kind.

I mean, it's a really powerful thing to experience. Yeah, well, I saw your old pictures. That's very impressive. I did. And, you know, I think for women, I always say say like, this is where I try to manipulate them a little. And I just say, listen, if you won't do it for yourself, you are the living example for your house, for your children. People say, oh, I inherited my, my, the family's genetics. I'm like, no, you inherited their lifestyle. You absolutely are not sentenced. That's so the easy way out that you hear all the time. It's genetic, it's genetic, it's genetic.

No, you just inherited their lifestyle. You eat what they ate. And so I think for women, you sort of want to go, hey, listen, by the way, you are also sentencing your children if you're not careful. That's when I play dirty pool. Right, yeah, that's getting nasty. It's kind of a scare tactic.

Oh yeah, gotta do it though, gotta do it. No, but this really speaks to, and again, it's like all of us just having the awareness of really loving ourselves, but I don't mean that in just, you know, like a cliche way. I mean, really understanding that, you know, I always feel like

if you ever doubted the existence of something, some amazing force or some God or some kind of consciousness, all you have to do is study the human body. It's a complete miracle in and of itself. I mean, complete, complete. So if you take food and you start shifting your awareness of food of that, I'm going to feed this machine of perfection, this amazing creation that I'm in, I'm inhabiting right now. And so food becomes not, well, I really feel like a double cheeseburger or I really feel like, you know, braised ribs or corned beef or whatever, you know, fried, whatever, but it becomes what,

what will fuel my body so that it can operate and function at its optimum level? And, you know, so for me, it's not about counting calories ever. It was always about choices and vibration and what am I taking into my body from that perspective? I always tell little kids, I go to schools and we do, you know, we jump around and we go, okay, what's another part of good health besides, you know, eating good? And they go, okay, what's another part of good health besides eating good? And they say, okay, exercise. And I always remind them and the parents, you gotta have some fun.

You don't have to work out when you're 10. You just gotta go play. And even when as a grownup, you have to find the way to play and capture that childhood spirit. But with the kids, I go, okay, so when you go to the grocery store, I mean, the gas station with your grandparents

or your parents, they put Snickers in the gas tank, right? And they go, no. And I go, okay. Oh, no, no, that's right. That's right. They put potato chips. And I go, no. And they say, well, I go, well, what do they put? And they said, the gas. And I go, oh, you'd never put the wrong gas in your car, right? But we certainly will do it to our bodies, which is fascinating. But we certainly will do it to our bodies, which is fascinating. You know, it's like we won't, you wouldn't walk, you know, with crap on your shoes in your house, you know, or put Diet Coke in your gas tank. But, you know, you would put it. So I think sometimes it's just putting it in almost where you say to people, take that power. That is your power.

Like, you make that choice. Right. You know, not like, oh, you should diet or you should eat this, but wow. Don't you want to be in charge of that? So it always goes, it goes back to self-respect and healthy boundaries and really kind of, you know, having greater reverence for yourself. That's right. That's right. That's the ultimate. There we go. That is, I think we did it. That's it, man. Yeah. That rocked. Thanks. You were cool. Thank you so much. Such a, such a pleasure to share this time together. Yeah, absolutely. So Gabby's book is called my foot is too big for the glass slipper. It's not out until April, but can people pre-order it now? Are they, I think they can start at the top of April. They can pre-order

because it comes out April, right before Mother's Day, like the 15th or something. All right, cool. But I saw it up on Amazon. So if you can go there and read a little bit about it. Yeah. And if people want to learn more about what you're doing and connect with you, what are the best places to do that? We have a few. I know you guys got a whole bunch of websites. I didn't know which one to say. Gabby and Laird.com, which is mostly our kind of movement, you know, exercise and stuff site.

And then I have GabrielleReese.com, which is my kind of just life one. There's no sort of lots of content. It's more of a life blogging and then lairds is lairdhamilton.com right and then gabby's on twitter at uh gabby reese r-e-e-c-e and laird is laird life right yeah wow you see yeah he's techie i'm on it we know where you guys are i know cool so thank you so much thank you and i hope you guys enjoy the rest of your stay yeah for sure pleasure and an honor to have you on the show and uh we'll be seeing you around common ground you will yeah or hearing me very cool all right cool so uh that's it for today's episode you guys thanks for stopping by thanks for listening we appreciate all the

support we've been having such a good time doing this podcast, and we'll continue to try to bring you great content. I've got some great guests lined up for the next couple weeks, so we'll be coming at you with some good regularity. If you want to find out more about what Julie and I are up to, you can go to our website, Jailifestyle.com, J-A-I-Lifestyle.com. We have some cool products up there, some nutritional supplement products. We have a vitamin B12 supplement that's coming out. I think we're building out the webpage today for that, actually. So it should be up in the

next couple of days. I'll make an announcement online. You want to check out Julie and her music, go to SrimatiMusic.com, S-R-I-M-A-T-I music.com. You can listen to her album, download it. She's on iTunes too. Julie needs more Twitter followers. She's always dropping the crazy mad wisdom. So if you got a follower on Twitter, she's Jai Seed on Twitter, J-A-I-S-E-E-D. So check her out. I'm at Rich Roll on Twitter. And I think that's it. Oh, my blog. This podcast and my blog,

you can go to richroll.com. And I don't know. That's it. Any other insights? Thanks so much for listening. No, we're out of here. All right, everybody. Thank you.

See you next time. Peace. Plants. Thank you. you you you you you you you you