The Rich Roll Podcast - Making It Count and How To Do More

Episode Date: February 24, 2014

Simple yet profound words from this week's guest, a man in full embrace of the ethos of living an impactful, creative, authentic life in overdrive. Uncompromising. Unapologetic. Filmmaker, photographer, builder, father, humanitarian, athlete. But most of all, an artist leveraging his boundless creative energy to tell personal stories that inspire all of us to find the adventure in life. To invest in experience. To be bold. And to do more — both for yourself and for others. I first became aware of Casey around 2010 when his show “The Neistat Brothers” aired on HBO and was immediately captivated by Casey's DIY sensibility. His fearlessness. His acute ability to find the wonder in the seemingly banal. And his refusal to await permission from the gatekeepers to create. I've been a fan ever since, eagerly anticipating each new upload to his wildly popular YouTube channel – 82 movies he refuses to monetize; a network that enjoys a quarter of a million rabid subscribers; and dozens of viral sensations with 50+ million views. At this point, many of you have likely seen his remarkable “Make It Count”. If you somehow missed it, please watch it now for context before listening to the episode (I've watched it at least 20 times and never get tired of it). Hired by Nike to create an advertisement to promote the Fuel Band, Casey audaciously ignored the agreed upon commercial treatment and instead brashly spent the entire budget traveling the world, all the while documenting his incredible adventure until the money just flat ran out. 34,000 miles, three continents, 13 countries, 16 cities and 10 million views later, the rest is history. This past December, Casey raised the bar. Contacted by 20th Century Fox to create a movie to help promote “The Secret Life of Walter Mitty”, Casey agreed, with one caveat: permission to donate the entire commercial budget to typhoon victims in the Philippines. Tying creative expression to service, “What Would You Do with $25,000?” became an instant viral hit, trending on Twitter to over 3 million views. Then just one day after we sat down for this conversation, Casey headed out in a blizzard to “Snowboard NYC”– a sponsor-less lark he posted within 24 hours of shooting that clocked 5 million views in it's first five days. In the words of Wired Magazine, “Casey Neistat’s bite-size Internet movies have so much viral potential they make influenza jealous.” But what is it that makes Casey and his work so irresistible? Sure, the movies are fun. Irreverant. Visually captivating with great music and personal storylines that always star Casey himself as the ever-appealing protagonist. But in my opinion, what makes Casey stand out, what gives his work permanent residence in my consciousness, is his devotion to authenticity — an axiom of conviction that infuses every single frame of every single work he produces — and the predominant over-arching theme of this podcast. Read more HERE...

Welcome to Episode 73 of the Rich Roll Podcast with Casey Neistat. The Rich Roll Podcast. Hey, people. Welcome to the show. I'm Rich Roll, your host of the Rich Roll Podcast. What do we do here? Each week, I bring to you the best, most inspiring, forward-thinking paradigm busting minds in health, fitness, wellness, diet, nutrition, spirituality, entrepreneurship, artistry, yoga, meditation. We cast a broad net. Basically, my only rule for this show and for my

guests is, are you living an inspiring authentic and extraordinary life are you of service to something greater than yourself can we as the audience benefit from what you the guest has to offer what do you bring to the table and in return you the audience you guys the tools, the messages, the inspiration that resonates with you and implement these ideas, these concepts, these tools, or just the general inspiration from the stories that I'm sharing with you. Implement them into your life. The focus is implementation. Osmosis, it's only going to get you so far. It's a two-way street.

So hopefully, as a result of these chats, you become better as a result. I know I have as a result of this experience of doing the podcast. So that's my goal, pure and simple. Today on the show, we are doing something a little bit different. Usually my guests are very health and fitness oriented doctors, we talk about food, we talk about all that kind of stuff. And today, we're making a little bit of a detour, but I am super, super excited to bring to you today's conversation. Casey Neistat is a guy who inspires me tremendously. And, you know, I find inspiration in all different kinds of forms. It isn't just athletes or triathletes

or ultra athletes or wellness warriors. It's all different kinds of people. It's people that show a spark, people that really are raising the bar, pushing the boundaries of what they think they're capable of, and people that are living extraordinary lives. And Casey certainly fits that category. He's a guy who chooses himself. He's a guy who is a man of bold adventures, I guess you could say. He lives his life on his own terms. He's very uncompromising in his art. He's incredibly authentic in his creativity. And he's an example of what can happen

when you devote yourself to something with everything that you have. When you work super hard, believe in yourself, stick to who you are, refuse to compromise, move forward in the face of all obstacles, have faith, and most importantly, have the courage to be bold, to make a statement and to really stand tall and say, this is who I am. So if you haven't heard of Casey, he is a filmmaker. I first heard of him, I think it was about 2008, 2007. I got a phone call from a guy I

went to high school with who I had not spoken to in quite some time, many, many, many years, a guy called Tom Scott. And we were catching up and he was telling me what he was up to. And he's like, yeah, I'm producing this show on HBO. It's called the nice stat brothers. And I'd never heard of it. And he's like, yeah, check it out. Which I did. And he sent me a link to a YouTube video that Casey had made the,

basically the, the HBO series was about Casey and his brother van as film living as filmmakers in New York city. And it's a cool little show. It only ran for, I don't know, eight episodes or something like that. But I think you can still get it on HBO.com

or HBO Go. So all you guys should check that out. But anyway, Tom shared with me this YouTube video that Casey had made and it was a video of him running through the streets of New York and it was kind of a branded video for Nike. And this was some years ago.

If you're familiar with Casey, he's made a more recent, extremely compelling viral video for Nike that I'm going to talk about in a minute. But this was years before that. And it was about, you know, just sort of his passion for running and getting it done. And I started following him then. And I've watched every video that he has made ever since. His YouTube channel is quite something. He's got about a quarter of a million followers, subscribers on YouTube, made, I don't know, 80 plus some odd videos. And every new video that he uploads raises the bar and you can see the progression in his

artistry with each new offering. And he's constantly uploading videos and they kind of span the spectrum. Some of them are very vast in their scope and some of them are very small and personal. But at the core of all of them is a very authentic message of a guy who's exploring his life and trying to find the adventure in the big things and in the small things. And there's just something really captivating about he is in his full authenticity, I suppose. And even if you haven't, if the name doesn't sound familiar, you still may be familiar with him. About a year ago, he made a video for Nike. Nike approached him, said, we're interested in having you create a video for us. We're launching the Fuel Band, and it's under the slogan of Make It Count, like hashtag Make It Count.

And he took the entire budget for this video and decided that he was going to travel around the world until he ran out of money and document it. What he didn't do was tell Nike that that was what he was going to do with the money. And so he essentially just flew all the way around the globe and filmed everything that he did, all the adventures that he had. And he cut this together into an extraordinarily compelling, motivating, and inspiring video called Make It Count.

It's got like 10 million views. If you haven't seen it, go to richworld.com. I'm going to put it in the show notes. You should definitely take five minutes and watch this thing. I guarantee you it will improve your day. And more recently, you might be familiar with Casey because he made a video for the promotional campaign for the movie The Secret Life of Walter Mitty. And essentially what happened was the marketing department at 20th Century Fox, the studio that made that movie, contacted Casey and said, listen, we're getting ready to launch

this movie. We have a marketing campaign under the kind of auspices of living your dreams. We're interested in whether you would like to make a video for us along these lines. And he basically responded and said, yeah, I'm interested, but here's my proposal. Send me the budget for the movie, and I'm going to go to the Philippines and give all the money away in aid to the typhoon victims. And that's essentially what he did. He went there. He documented it.

He filmed it. victims. And that's essentially what he did. He went there, he documented it, he filmed it. And again, he hits it out of the park with this extremely touching, poignant, and inspiring video that I think has like 3 million views at this point and only came out, I don't know, a couple months ago. He makes his living doing sort of branded entertainment or branded videos for companies, but his passion really is in making these YouTube videos. He doesn't monetize his videos. He just puts them up and they're just super cool. And I was going to wait a couple of weeks to put this interview up because I had other ones sort of stacked in front of it. But I was compelled to put it up earlier because the day after I visited Casey

in his amazing studio in New York City, which is sort of like this crazy loft with all this, I don't even know how to explain it. I think in the podcast interview, I call it something like a merging of Willy Wonka with some kind of Dr. Seuss sensibility. It's just packed with all sorts of things. It's incredibly organized, but it's really kind of the artist's lair in every sense of the word. But anyway, the day that we went in to do the podcast interview, he was extremely busy trying to complete a cut on a

project that he was working on and he didn't have very much time. So this is shorter than my typical interview. Um, but he was saying, Oh, I hope it snows tomorrow. I've got big plans, got big plans for the snow storm. And sure enough, it did snow the following day. And he went out in New York City and made a video of himself snowboarding all over Manhattan. And he hooked up a water skiing tow rope behind his Jeep and had his friend drive around New York City and tow him on this snowboard and made this video, which is really fun, super cool. And it just exploded. It went crazy viral. And in five days, it already has 5 million views. It was everywhere.

It got picked up by all the news stations and kind of published all over the internet. And so kind of to honor this sort of cool moment that he's having, I thought it was a good time to put the podcast interview up. So that's what I'm doing today. Again, this is a shorter interview. He just didn't have that much time, but it was super cool to meet him being a big fan of his.

And his message is really inspirational to anybody out there who is struggling, who feels stuck, who feels like they're not tapped into who they really are, because this guy is an example of truly living his life authentically in every single moment. And again, that's what inspires me. And I think that's a message that resonates with all of us. There's a lot to be learned by somebody who is refusing to compromise and who is living bold. And that is certainly the essence of who Casey Neistat is.

And I'm really proud and excited to share this interview with you guys today. So without further ado, ladies and gentlemen, enjoy this interview. Casey Neistat. We're brought to you today by recovery.com. I've been in recovery for a long time. It's not hyperbolic to say that I owe everything good in my life to sobriety. And it all began with treatment and experience that I had that quite literally saved my life. And in the many years since, I've in turn helped many suffering addicts and their loved ones find

treatment. And with that, I know all too well just how confusing and how overwhelming and how challenging it can be to find the right place and the right level of care, especially because, unfortunately, not all treatment resources adhere to ethical practices. It's a real problem. who created an online support portal designed to guide, to support, and empower you to find the ideal level of care tailored to your personal needs. They've partnered with the best global behavioral health providers to cover the full spectrum of behavioral health disorders, including substance use disorders, depression, anxiety, eating disorders, gambling addictions, and more. Navigating their site is simple. Search by insurance coverage, location, treatment type, you name it. Plus, you can read reviews from former patients to help you decide. Whether you're a busy exec, a parent of a struggling teen, or battling addiction yourself, I feel you. I empathize with you. I really do.

And they have treatment options for you. Life in recovery is wonderful. And recovery.com is your partner in starting that journey. When you or a loved one need help, go to recovery.com and take the first step towards recovery. To find the best treatment option for you or a loved one, again, go to recovery.com. It's super cool to be in your awesome studio.

It's this wild, I mean, everybody can see it on the internet, and I've seen all the videos and stuff like that, but even seeing those doesn't do it justice to being in here. It's this crazy Willy Wonka meets. It reminds me of like Dick Van Dyke and Chitty Chitty Bang Bang. You know, it's like this mad scientist. The Child Catcher and Chitty Chitty Bang Bang is the source of many nightmares for me. Oh, yeah.

Remember that guy, like the long skinny nose? Oh, yeah, I know, right? He tricked children with candy and then kidnapped them. Yeah. What a terrible movie for kids. Mathis loves it. Our 10-year-old watches it again and again and again. But the sheer amount of shit in here is extraordinary.

Thanks. And it's a little messy right now just because we're in the middle of three different productions. But I assure you it's normally much more organized. Cool. So I was thinking about you taking the cab ride down here. So I was thinking about you taking the cab ride down here, and I was remembering this interview with the Coen brothers, in which the interviewer was asking them, how is it that you've avoided selling out to Hollywood?

And I can't remember which one of them responded, but one of them said, actually, we sort of feel like Hollywood sold out to us. They get to do what they want to do. And Hollywood has bent to their aesthetic in certain respects. And I think that that is analogous to your situation, at least vis-a-vis Madison Avenue. In other words, the projects that you do, you don't bend to the system. The system bends to you, to your whims. They come to

you because they want that piece of you that seems to really capture, you know, the fascination of the public. Like you tap into this emotional nerve. Yeah. I mean, I, thank you. That's very flattering. But I think it's, I think that I am just, I happen to be in the right place in the right time. Um, that's not to say I haven't done a lot of work to sort of achieve what you just described, but I think that, I mean, if I had to just, if I had to give the most abbreviated version of how I'm able to do what I do and make a living at it. It's simply that via my YouTube channel, you know, I've got whatever 80 movies up there and 77 of them are just personal projects that I have to do for fun. But

via those personal projects, you know, I've reached an audience that's, you know, 50 million plus views and, you know, huge subscribership that's hits that market.'s like 13 to 34 year olds 60 male 40 female and that's that's something that a lot of the clients a lot of the companies that i work with they want to be able to speak to that audience um so that's nothing new that's existed for a while their desire to speak with that audience but what is new is is that i've been able to because of the internet because of youtube i've been able to prove my access, prove my reach, improve my ability to communicate with that audience organically. I did it via my personal work, and I did that without much intention. I just posted it online and it found this audience. So when you have a company, when

you have a Nike, when you have a Mercedes-Benz that comes to me, they don't come to me the way they would come to a typical ad agency or something like that. They come to me and they say, hey, we want to reach the people that you're already reaching. So that's the point right there. That's the precipice. That's the line right there that is me being a product of being at the right place at the right time. Because when they want to reach my audience my way, you there's no they would never suggest do do it exactly this way this way or this way like if they knew how to tap into this audience um if they know how to communicate with these odd this this an audience like this they just do it like what do they need me for right so if they're coming to me for the audience that i'm already communicating with so effectively um why would they ever suggest that they know maybe how to do it better than i do

but at the same time you see that all the time where for example hollywood will look at a director or writer and say we love this person's work now come and make this movie oh you know we like what you did but now we want you to do it this way. You know what I mean? And the system kind of wears people out and bends them to their own will. Yeah. Well, I think that it's probably headed in that direction. But because this is such a new model, I think that I'm able to sort of have a level of creative latitude that hasn't really existed in certainly in advertising that I'm more than happy to take full advantage of. Right. Well, I think that, you know, my own personal opinion about why you're able to kind of tap that nerve is that there is an undeniable

authenticity and level of honesty in your work. Like you're just sort of, I mean, on a surface level, you're just this guy, you're going to go out and you're going to tell this story, whether it's this sort of sweeping narrative with Nike traveling the world, or, you know, your issue with the microphone on your, on your favorite camera, it doesn't matter how pedestrian it is, or how large it is, there's this emotional vein, because're just, you're being honest and authentic to who you are. And I think people recognize that. And that is like, that's what, that's what resonates at least for me. I mean, I mean, is that fair to say? Yeah. You know, I, I talk about this idea,

um, of the bullshit detector and it's something I talk about a lot and what I think the bullshit detector is. And your son probably understands this or maybe don't, maybe you don't understand it, but I think you're more conscious of the bullshit detector than we are. My 15 year old son is definitely more, has a much more in tune sort of acute bullshit detector than I do. And what the bullshit detector is, is that, you know, when you and I grew up rich, like we watched TV after school or whatever it might be, and we were forced to watch these 30-second commercials and then get back to, like, you can't do that on television or Saved by the Bell or whatever you watch. We were forced to watch those 30-second spots, and we just dealt with it. But now you look at my 15-year-old or you look at me to a lesser

extent, and it's like everywhere. We are just inundated with media. It's not these 30 second clips that are in between, you know, five minutes of Saved by the Bell. It's a constant, constant, overwhelming inundation. It's Facebook. It's on our phones. Everywhere we go on the internet, it's relentless. And what that sort of relentless media marketing nonstop in your face has done is it's made your ability to figure out what's truthful and honest and what's bullshit much more quickly and much more effectively. So you dismiss 99% of what you see. You just see it, you dismiss it. You were on Facebook this morning.

Tell me one banner ad you saw running across the side of your Facebook profile. Yeah, I can't remember a single one. Yeah, you know, name one commercial that played in front of your last YouTube video. Like, you can't. It's invisible. And that's because your bullshit detector just dismisses it. So how do you penetrate that? How do you get through that sort of level of bullshit?

And that's by being authentic. And I think, for me, authenticity is just inherent to what i do um i think that if nike had come to me and they said hey we need to sell this exact product and want you to discuss the attributes of it and we want you to sell it and explain how it works and all that like i wouldn't know what to do with that and i'd have no idea but i can definitely represent the big idea behind that because that big idea is truthful to me it's this idea of like you know making it count getting out there and mixing it up. Like, yeah, I can talk to that ad nauseum. Um, so yeah, so that's the bullshit detector. And I think that the bullshit detector, um, and people's

understanding of it, again, just sort of enables me to do what I do. Because if you've got, you know, somebody coming to me and they want me to do exactly what's on this piece of paper, they want to follow this script to a T, um, you know know that's going to set off my kid's bullshit detector right and then he's not going to know that he saw it when you know when i ask him name three commercials he'll have no idea that he saw it right do you go home and quiz him about that kind of stuff no i mean it's you know and your your parent you know like you pick up on these things you notice these things and you see his behavior and i remember when he was old enough to sort of figure out the remote control was when I first realized that he won't tolerate TV commercials.

We had cable then. And the second a commercial would come on, it would change. The second, you know, Netflix on Netflix now. But the Netflix on demand came out, whatever, six, seven years ago. Then he stopped watching TV altogether. And then with Hulu Plus, he's got this. And when he's watching TV on the internet, he's got three tabs open.

The second it forces you to watch a commercial, one tab gets closed, the other tab gets open until the commercial's over, then he swings back to it. And it's like, how do you as a marketer possibly penetrate that? How do you get through that? Mm-hmm. I was watching your newest little opus this morning

about the Jeep getting stuck in the pond. Yeah. And it's funny because it's on some level, it's a silly little movie. You're like, hey, I wanted to drive my Jeep across the pond. This is what happened. It's like stuck in the ice and all that kind of stuff. And you're trying to back out of it. But you have this cool little kind of graphic voiceover that goes across it.

And you say, you know, when I that goes across it. And you say, you know, when I was a kid, I made a lot of really bad decisions. I guess I just forgot. I just, I guess I just thought I would grow out of that. And then you say, not considering the consequences of your actions is something kids do. And I'm okay with that. And I think that that's kind of a profound statement that really kind of encapsulates a big part of your ethos as a filmmaker, like sort of retaining that childlike, you know, kid mentality, you know, whether it's the aesthetic of your studio here or even the small little movies that you make that are very personal. that are very personal. Yeah, I mean, it's kind of become a mantra of mine, but if I had like a mission statement in life, it would be to realize all the promises I made to myself as a kid.

Because when you're a kid, or at least when I was a kid, I was really frustrated all the time, sort of always getting like held back by adults and not being allowed to do this, not being allowed to do that, and just always being in trouble. And it was like when I grow up, that inner dialogue was always when I grew up when i grew up i remember in fifth grade i was either suspended might have been thrown out of school for skateboarding in the hallways and the vice principal as he's screaming at me was like you think when you grow up you're gonna

have an office you can build a skateboard in um and i had a half pipe in my office here for two and a half years. Did you ever take a picture and send it to him or communicate with him? I mean, I'm not one for vendettas. But in a fun kind of way, not in a mean way. I mean, I will tell you that the high school that I dropped out of or was kicked out of sophomore year has invited me to come speak to the entire body. So all the administrators, the teachers and students in April. So it's a little bit of validation. It's important to understand. I want to talk about this.

Like you look around the studio and it's so, you probably have people that want to come in here and do tours all the time. I see the sign that, you know, please no solicitors or no drop-ins or whatever. But you are not to the manner born, you know, this is, this is a hard fought, you know, long road that got you to this place and a lot of work and not knowing where it was going to head. I mean, when you were 15, you dropped out of high school at 17, you had a kid, you were living in a trailer, washing dishes and, you know, trying to raise a child and on welfare. Right. I mean... Yeah, no, that's totally right.

And to get from that place to, you know, dinner with the president and making commercials for Nike and, you know, being in demand to the extent that you are is quite an extraordinary journey. Yeah, yeah, definitely. And it's... In retrospect, I don't know that it makes any sense. And it's like one thing, I don't know that it makes any sense. And it's like,

one thing you realize when you get older, is that it's like, it's, it's a whole bunch of tiny decisions that, you know, that lead you to where you are. And two things that I always say is like, whenever anybody asked me advice via email, which is great, because I can always dismiss it with like four words, which I always do, but I mean these four words. It's like work hard and be brave. And I literally think if you sort of distill life or any career path down to that, you'll find success. It's going to be scary and who knows what the outcome might be,

but working hard is something that most people are scared to do. They think it's their right or they're entitled to have a job that gives them free time and things like that. And, yeah, you're probably right. But don't complain and don't make an issue of it when you haven't achieved all of your dreams or accomplished everything you set out to do if you want to be home at 6 o'clock every night.

And then being brave is just about taking chances, like taking huge chances. There's only two decisions in my entire life that I look back on and just have no idea what I was thinking when I made those decisions. And one was moving to New York City. My only experience in life was working in a restaurant in a kitchen. No education, no resume, no career experience, no work experience resume no career experience no work experience

no friends I knew one person in the city he was my older brother and I had no money I had 800 bucks and a three month sublet and a two year old and like what I was

terrifying what I was thinking that I just I can't figure it out I can't I remember so vividly on a cigarette break with one of the cooks at the restaurant that I was working in standing out back. And he's like, well, you know, the good thing about this place is that you always have a job here when you come back.

And I was just so insulted. When did you come back? Yeah, I was like 18 years old. I turned to him and I was like, I'm never coming back. And I think it was that kind of conviction that you know that made me stick it out and the second decision was like quitting my three years after moving to new york i had like a really great job i was managing an artist studio and i don't know what how much money i was making but it was like 60 grand a year it was like a good job um i had a lot of responsibilities as a boss

had a lot of like people working me, and it was exciting. And I got the opportunity to direct some really shitty TV commercial with a tiny budget of like 10 grand. But in order to do it, I would have had to quit my job. And without any hesitation or batting an eye, I immediately quit my job. That's the second decision. I have no idea what I was thinking. See, when I look at that, though, I see somebody who was able to identify something that they were passionate about, filmmaking. And whether it made sense or not, whether it was based in logic, you knew that this was something you wanted to pursue. And you were willing to blindly step into the void and see what was going to happen. And I think when you do have that kind of passion and conviction

and you're willing to put in the work, and even if it doesn't make sense and you don't know where it's going to lead you, that the universe really does step in to conspire to support that in certain respects. I mean, looking back, it looks like a clean line, but I'm sure at the time it was pretty frightening. Yeah, I mean, I remember when I first moved to New York City and I met, for the first time in my life, rich kids. looks like a clean line but i'm sure at the time it was pretty frightening yeah i mean i remember when i first moved to new york city and i met for the first time in my life rich kids um kids with like trust funds like the hilton sisters when they were 20 like meeting these guys and just like

it was sort of unfathomable to me this idea of of you know them having everything in the world um monetarily anyways and i remember sort of like you know there's having everything in the world, monetarily anyways. And I remember sort of like, you know, there was a level of jealousy about that. I wished that I was able to live a life like they did when I was in my early 20s. And, you know, now I definitely like am so happy and so lucky to have been on welfare. I'm so fortunate to have lived in a trailer park. I feel so bad for these rich kids that they'll never get to experience that. Because the truth is, like, why would I quit my job? Why would I move to New York? I mean,

I still make sweeping, terrible decisions that just have no foresight whatsoever. But the truth is, like, when it comes to your career, if I were to lose everything, I mean everything, if everything were to fail, if it were to go as tits up as it could possibly go, like, what's the worst that could possibly happen? Like, I'd probably be back in that trailer park, maybe even on welfare, but, like, I had TV then.

I had PlayStation 1. Like, it wasn't that bad. It wasn't, like, you know, I was in Uganda earlier this year delivering morphine to late-term AIDS patients. That's bad. You know, I was in Afghanistan and, you know, saw some gnarly shit. Like, that's bad. You know, in Tacloban, those people, they literally lost everything

and they're sleeping in in you know they're sleeping in the dirt that's bad this like really polished american version of what the you know what the sort of end of the line is or what rock bottom is is you know luxurious compared to 99 of the population of this planet so when you put into that context it's like is it that big of a deal right he gives a shit well i mean this there's this weird like sort of pseudo dissonance in what you do because on on the one hand like being in sort of marketing and advertising it's part of your job to kind of sell a product or a lifestyle or a lifestyle aspiration but your message your inherent message and everything that you do is really invest in experiences.

It's not about the stuff. It's about these bold choices that you make, stepping out and testing yourself and making the brave choice. But it's weird. Sometimes those can be at odds. I mean, sort of inherently, those two things are at odds with each other, right, when it comes to like Madison Avenue, but you're able to find a way to get your idea across without falling prey to that trap, I guess. Yeah, I mean, just to speak to experience. Is that accurate? I don't know. But just to speak to experience, it's like, you know, I always try to spoil my kid with two things, and that's, like, love and experience.

Like, I don't really buy him presents. I don't think I got him anything for Christmas this year. Yeah, but you take him to Africa. You do these crazy things. Exactly. So, like, I think experience is everything. You know, I think that I don't know that I would be as brave as I am had I not been to Uganda. I don't think that I would take the chances that I take had I not lived in a trailer park. I don't think that I would live the lifestyle I live or do the things that I do or have been able to accomplish

or have been able to accomplish if I was that rich kid that, you know, they don't get experiences. They don't get those real life experiences. But to your point about Madison Avenue, which is such a weird, old-timey way to refer to the advertising industry. Right, I don't know. Is there a better way to describe it? I mean, I think it's probably accurate. I just, I don't know. I mean, are there even agencies on Madison Avenue still? I don't know. You know more than I do.

I have no idea. This is definitely not Madison Avenue right here. I typically don't work with... If Don Draper walked into here, you would have a heart attack. I mean, the good news is I don't work with Don Draper. I've been fortunate enough. I rarely, rarely, rarely work with agencies because the trouble with that is that's where sort of the creative lays it lies

is with ad agencies they're the creatives so for them to bring somebody like me in there i don't know it seems like there'd be a conflict right you could just gum up the works yeah i don't know that stuff but when it comes to dealing with a client then i sort of act as the agency and that's why it works out so well, because, you know, then I'm able to present my creative and it's not within the context of someone else's creative. It's just mine. And I'm able to kind of own it. What did you ask me? I don't remember.

Well, I mean, it all starts with this idea of investing in experience as kind of being your primary driver. Yeah, I mean, that's just because it's something I'm really passionate about. And, you know, when it comes to melding that with the work that I do for money, it's always like, you know, I think I literally said to Mercedes-Benz, I have no idea how to sell a car. And I've said to Nike, I have no idea how to sell a bracelet that tracks your energy expenditure. And, you know, I'm working with J.Crew right now. I have no idea how to sell clothing. But what I do know how to sell is ideas. And when I believe in those ideas, and those ideas are my own, I'm really good at sharing that. And that's why marriages like with Mercedes-Benz, which was very little about a car and much more about sort of, you know,

getting out there and living and, you know, youthfulness and excitement and just this idea of like delving into the unknown, given that's an abstract idea. But I know how to, you know, I know how to talk about that. I know how to present that. And I think for consumers, people like you and me, I look at somebody like my kid, and my kid only wears Nikes. And I think Nike makes a great shoe. But I also think Brooks makes a great shoe,

and I think Adidas makes a great shoe. I think there's a handful of companies out there that make really great athletic products. But why will he only buy Nike? And the reason is because he believes in the idea behind that company. As do I.

I mean, like, Just Do It shaped my childhood. Like, Just Do It is such an incredible thing. And the amount of marketing they do that's not about products, but it's just about

big ideas. Like, that's something I believe in. Apple, same kind of thing. Like, steve jobs isms are things i like think different i feel like apple is like uh you know this this wife of yours that you're arguing with all the time you know you have this love hate thing with them now because they're they're different now than they were i mean they in in many ways like apple ignited this flame that allowed you to sort of pursue these things that you're doing now. It was that first computer that you got, that first

camera, you know, the first editing software. And now they're in a different place than they were in your heart, maybe 10 years ago. Yeah, I mean, what's going on? I still, you know, I think Apple still may be one of the greatest companies out there. And I so believe in so much of what they do and all of that. And I don't know. I pick on them the most probably because I have the most intimate relationship with them. Like, you know, why don't I pick on... Have they ever approached you to do anything for them? I'm trying to think what that non-disclosure agreement that I signed said.

Uh-oh. I mean, they've never approached me to make a video for Apple. Right. There was a really fun opportunity to do something fun with Apple last summer, but I elected to proceed with my trip to Zimbabwe with my kid

instead of putting that on hold to do this project. But no, I like Apple. I totally believe in Apple. I still think they're making the best products out there. I just like, you know, like I want more, newer, better all the time. When I get that, I get mad. I want my cell phone screen bigger. Like, give that to me, Apple.

But no, I definitely believe in them and their message and the things that they do. Right. And even, I mean, your first true viral video really was the iPod battery video, right? Yeah. It's like 2003. It's like three years before YouTube. So how did that all, I mean, that was really, you know, when you look at it like in a Malcolm Gladwell, 10,000 hours that you put in, I mean, that was many, many movies ago. And it's funny because when you go back and look at those earlier films of yours, you can see the progression in your skill level.

They just get better and better and better and better. But they retain that same sensibility. When you see a Wes Anderson movie, you know immediately it's a Wes Anderson movie. When I see a Casey Neistat film, in the first three seconds, whether I know how I got to it or not, I can tell that it's your film. That sensibility stays true from beginning to end.

Yeah. When people ask me sort of how did I develop my style or how did I develop my aesthetic as if it's like some prescribed thing that I masterminded. I always explain like I was never taught the right way to do it. I was never taught how you're supposed to make movies. Um, so I was forced to figure it out. And when you have to figure it out,

like that's when you find really interesting things. Um, any beef that I have with art schools or film schools, it's just because of that. It's like to know a lot about art is very important. To know a lot about films is very important. But the idea that you can teach someone sort of the nuances of what it means to tell a story or to make a film that you can prescribe that, I think is misguided. Then, I mean, not having had that experience and then having to kind of overcome those own rules to find your own aesthetic. I mean, who are the people that you look to for

inspiration or who have been mentors to you? I don't know. You know, I like, I'm not even a big fan of his movies, although Bad Lieutenant, New Orleans, whatever it was called, is like one of the, is one of my favorite movies of ever. The second Bad Lieutenant? Yes. Not the Abel Ferraro? I mean, Abel Ferraro was great, but whatever. No, the Werner Herzog one,

I thought it was just so horribly underrated. Nick Cage is also my favorite actor. I'll see anything that he's in. So that combination was just a most brilliant film. But Werner Herzog, like... Even like the Ghost Rider stuff? Like you're into that? I'll see anything that Nick Cage is in. So that combination was just a most brilliant film. But Werner Herzog, like... Even like the Ghost Rider stuff? Like you're into that? Anything that Nick Cage is in, I will pay $12 to go

to the movies and see. He's just that great. But I really like Werner Herzog, even though a lot of his movies, like Fitzcarraldo, like... What am I supposed to do with Fitzcarraldo? But when he says a quote, like, every man should have to force... Every man should have to get a boat over a mountain once in his life. That's what I supposed to do with Fitzcarraldo? But when he says a quote like, every man should have to get a boat over a mountain once in his life, that's what I look to.

That's what I find inspiring. That's what I find amazing. The Burden of Dreams, which was a documentary about the making of Fitzcarraldo, which was a feature by Werner Herzog, was why I fell in love with Werner Herzog, not because of the movie itself. The movie itself I thought was kind of boring.

His docs, I think, are incredible. But in his book, Herzog on Herzog, he talks about if he were to have a film school, what would it be? And the application to get into his film school would be you'd have to walk from Berlin to Paris or Munich to Paris or something like that and keep a journal and then just send him that journal,

and that would be your application. And he wouldn't teach film theory or film history he would teach you how to box um so all those ideas are ideas that I so so so believe in um and you know emulate to some degree it's like I'm the last time i hired um an assistant i hired somebody to work in my studio with me like the most important questions are like how capable are you with with power tools how good are you with a circular saw do you know how big a sheet of plywood is if i tell you to get me like you know a three-quarter inch ac fur sheet cut into half like do you know what that means um you know i advertise it as a mop job this is a job where you're gonna be mopping the floor sweeping um taking out the garbage which is illegal here in my office you have to pay to have it picked up and i don't which means you have to walk it five

blocks away and hide it in a city garbage can which means all the paper has to be shredded before it gets thrown away these are the things i look for in an employee not things they teach in school well not things that they teach in school, but more importantly, I think it's just like a resourcefulness and like a willingness to undertake things that you might not understand, I think, is what's required to sort of succeed in any industry where there's no defined path. And how does that perspective kind of spill over into how you parent your son? I pretend to know a lot about parenting because I've got like this great kid who gets like, who's on the honor roll and like no trouble and runs track and cross country and indoor. I mean, he's, the kid's my hero, but, um, I don't but I can't really take credit for him turning out so good. I think it's just dumb luck. But my feelings on parenting have always sort of been,

they all fall back to one very basic principle, which is like, as a parent, it is not your job to raise a well-behaved kid. It's your job to raise a human being that will contribute to society in a positive way. And I think that's something that most parents lose sight of. I think that's why now more than ever, we're raising an entire generation of pussies, wimpy men raised by sort of their helicopter parents. Is that the right term? Helicopter parents? Hovering. Hovering parents, yeah. You know, Purell. It's like the downfall of manhood. I just think that like there's real risk in that.

There's risk in, you know, not to pick on anybody, but, you know, I like know friends whose kids want to go to college that are 15 minutes away from their parents' house so they can come home for a meal anytime they want. Like that's, you know, that's, I don't think that's okay. I think you need to, like, push your children out there, teach them to take chances. Like, how can you raise them to contribute to society in a meaningful way? You know, teaching your kids to always be obedient and always to say yes and never to question authority. Like, so what?

So they can get fired from their job at age 44 after 12 years at the company and, like, get six months pension or six months severance package, rather? I mean, that doesn't even exist as a reality anymore. So, yeah, I mean, how do you... I mean, so you have this great kid, and he's thriving within this system that in some ways you kind of were reared on the outside of,

and you have all this sort of counterculture question authority you know diy aesthetic that is very different from you know sort of being the good boy like how does that reconcile well i think that you know very quickly very very young um in his upbringing he realized that it's like it's up to him to sort of define boundaries and i remember his mother and i like we'd never let him get hurt. We'd never let him put himself in harm's way. But short of that, we'd let him do whatever he wanted to do. He wasn't allowed to be rude, wasn't allowed to be mean.

But again, like, whatever you want to do, however that might manifest. And it forced him to find his own boundaries. I remember when he was very young and he said a swear word for the first time, and I think he said it on accident. You know, I explained to him, I was like, look, it's, it's not cool when kids swear. It makes them look kind of gross and not smart. When you're an adult, you understand when it's appropriate and not appropriate to swear. But as a kid, it's, it's not a great look. And look around and watch your peers and watch when they swear when there aren't parents around and, you know, and, and see if you think it's not a great look. And look around and watch your peers and watch when they swear when there aren't parents around

and see if you think it's a cool look or if they look stupid. And he never swore again. But it was his decision. I never said don't swear. Empower him to make a decision. Yeah, and I think I've always tried to do that with everything with the kid in every capacity. But I think a bigger thing was like I I remember no matter what I did wrong, or what I did as a kid,

it was always me doing something wrong. I was always in trouble. It was always my fault. When the principal would call home, it was always, what did you do? Not what happened. And with Owen, it's always, I'll always, always take his word for it.

I'll always want to know his perspective first because he's my kid and I trust him. And that's a big, big, big deal for me because I never had that as a kid. No one ever listened to me. No one ever wanted to hear my side of what happened. Maybe deservingly, I don't know. But I was stuck in what felt like a very institutionalized system that just didn't work well with me. And it was my fault that I wasn't able to conform.

It wasn't sort of the establishment's fault. And that's why with him, like, we send him to kind of a pretty progressive primary school, and now he's in a high school that is also fairly progressive, and he has flexibilities and opportunities and options that I never had inside of that system. And the truth is, if he ever hit any walls, I'd just pull him out of the school, stick him in another school, try something new, send him to boarding school. Whatever options there were, I'd be sure to exercise. And the very, very last thing I'd ever do, if I'd ever do it, was sort of blame him for any sort of inadequacies he's having inside of a system.

And that's the antithesis of my upbringing. It was always like, no, no, no, be more like everyone else and fit in, stop speaking up. What you're doing is wrong. Do as you're told. Um, I just never did well with that. Right. And the irony being that, you know, being sort of that iconoclast, now you're embraced by the system that you were told you were, you needed to be more about when you were younger. Yeah, and I think there's truths in that that go so, so deep. And I think there are so many people that I look up to that at the time they were bad guys. And then in retrospect, people came to appreciate what they did. I don't know much about Jesus. I'm not a religious person at all, and I'm Jewish. But, you know, he was a guy who, like, had all these big ideas, and he was persecuted and then

killed for it. And now look, we have, like... The ultimate. Now look at him. Now look at him. So I think there's a lot of truth in that. And I think that, you know, it's why I take such pride in doing academic lectures and it's something i do all the time and i really enjoy doing um just this idea that i'm sort of able to inform can you talk about what you're going to be doing is it this spring or what at mit yeah yeah for sure so i was invited to uh do a residency at MIT this spring, and it's a fellowship within their media lab. So I'll be working with all these really great brains

within the MIT media lab. That's an incredible program that they have there, right? It's unbelievable. Just crazy brains there. Those guys are so smart. And they're experimenting with all sorts of crazy new ideas and technology and all kinds of things, right? Yeah.

I mean, last time I was up there last week, it was like we started talking about popcorn or lunch or something. And, like, conversation went straight to quantum physics and quantum mechanics. And it was, you know, it's like with me, no matter where we start the conversation, we'll always end it, like, either talking about cell phones or girls. Like, that's the denominator for me. And with these guys, it's quantum physics. So it's very exciting for me to be in a position to be surrounded by people like that. But what does that mean, residency?

Are you going to teach there? Are you going to, you're like a student there? I mean, it's somewhere in between both. I mean, the Media Lab is mostly PhDs or people that are there working on their PhDs. So there's a great deal of independence within the Media Lab where it's people focusing on individual projects to get done. And that's sort of the infrastructure that I will be within is that I'll have all the resources of the school and of the lab, including all the great minds that are there. But I will have like a great deal of autonomy and working on whatever I sort of want to work on. Are they going to let you make all sorts of videos about what's going on there?

Yeah, they're excited for me to do whatever. I mean, I have one idea that I want to do there, which is a preposterous idea, but I'll show it to you. I don't like to tell people ideas. I hate ideas. You're all about ideas, though. I hate ideas. I always say, ideas, though. I hate ideas. I always say, like, when somebody comes to me and says I have an idea, I cut them right off.

Don't want to hear it. Show me, don't tell me. I think ideas are cheap and they're accessible and they're easy. And it's like a penny for your thoughts because that's what they're worth, a penny. I believe in execution. Like, I love seeing things that are done. I love Elon Musk because he doesn't talk about how awesome electric cars are. He builds them. He doesn't talk about how space travel should be. He builds rocket ships. I believe in execution.

And I remember when this became something I was really conscious of was when I was talking to this dude who invented, he's a friend of a friend of a friend, but he invented, I think ZigZag. I don't know what the name brand it was. But they were rolling papers with glue on them. Before him, rolling papers were just a piece of paper. And he's telling this story about when he's rolling a joint in college and it wouldn't stick.

So he invented putting a little piece of gum. And that was his invention. And as he's telling me this and telling me about his other inventions and he invented a new pen and all this really interesting stuff, I was like, I have this great idea. And he cut me right off. And he's like, before you tell me your idea, it's going to take three to five years of research and development.

It's going to take a million dollars before you're going to bring it to market. He just was throwing this litany of realities at me that were all part of the process of realizing it, that were all part of the action, not the idea. And it was right there that I realized that my idea isn't worth shit because it's so far from being done. It counts when you make it. Before you make it, it doesn't exist.

So I know I hate ideas. It's a very sweeping statement. I don't mean that because I live off of ideas. But that sharing of ideas or that making ideas be precious or anything like that I think is all overrated and entirely misguided. I think execution is what matters. My least favorite thing in the world is

when people have an idea for a movie. Like, I don't care. I don't care about your idea for a movie. And I think if you pick apart any of my movies, you'll see the ideas are not that interesting. I make it count. No, it's all about execution. And that was one of the things I was going to say

was that you could take this tiny little thing that in and of itself, I mean, bike lanes or pulling your Jeep one of the things I was going to say was that, you know, you could take this tiny little thing that in and of itself, I mean, you know, bike lanes or, you know, pulling your Jeep out of the ice or whatever it is. These are very simple things. These are not epic ideas. They're tiny little things, but you make them personal, you make them honest, and then they resonate with people. Yeah, sure. If you reduce any of my movies to a single idea, that idea is not original, basic. I mean, like, make it count.

Like, well, let's just run around the world. Been done a million times before. Every one of my bike lanes is just me complaining about NYPD harassing cyclists. Texting and walking. Yeah, type that into Google. Like, a million people have had that idea before me. Texting and walking.

Everybody's had that idea before. There's nothing inherently original about my ideas. It's had that idea before. There's nothing inherently original about my ideas. It's the execution that matters. And the execution is the shitty part. It's the hard part. Making stuff is the hardest, hardest thing. It's like you're a runner. I'm a runner.

You're a much better runner than me. Not much. But I always say I celebrate when people show up at the starting line, not what happens at the finish line. Because to show up at the starting line of a race means you did it. It means you're there. And that's the hard part. And that's how I feel about ideas, whether it's movies or art or spaceships or anything. I think it's really easy to talk about.

And they're really easy to share. But to show up, to actually do it, is what separates them. I'll always watch somebody's video when they email it to me. If it's garbage, I'll watch the first five seconds. But I'll always watch it. They follow through. Right. But when somebody sends me their idea for the movie,

I just sort of delete the email because I don't care. Because one person put the effort in, whether it's good or not, they did the work. Whether it takes them seven hours across the marathon finish line or two and a half, they did the work versus just talking about it, which is, you know, it's basic. I think that's a great place to end it. I know you're busy. You've got to get back to your editing.

We're out of time already? I say that as if I didn't, like, force Rich to cut it off at 30 minutes. I'll go with you all day, but I feel guilty because I know you're busy. But before we end it, I would want to ask one final question, which is, you know, for people that are listening, that are feeling stuck in their life

or feeling like they're kind of living someone else's life or having trouble kind of moving forward on a dream that they have, you know, how can they, what are some sort of tips or maybe little nuggets of inspiration to help people, you know, make it count in their own life or begin to make that shift to start to, you know, actualize something more personal in their own life?

Well, I always say make something. I think that, I mean, it has a relationship with what I was just explaining, but I think making something will give you a sense of accomplishment. If that means that someday you want to be a big novelist, you want to be a big successful writer, just write something on some paper. Write it, but do it. If you want to be a photographer, then go take pictures.

Don't have a phone? Don't have a camera? Use your phone. Just do something. I always find that doing something is always an interesting step. My first movie I ever made was about my baby mama's birthday party, and it was terrible. It was absolutely terrible.

But if I hadn't made that first movie, I wouldn't have made the second movie. And if I hadn't made the second movie, I wouldn't have made the second movie. And if I hadn't made the second movie, and that's just how it works. The other thing I'd say is, and I'm sorry, none of these are super awesome quotable. Yeah, but it's just, yeah, sometimes the answer is not sexy. You know what I mean? It means get off your ass and start doing something, you know, write one page, write one sentence, you know, shoot one picture. We could spend another hour talking about just how much I believe in hard work.

I think work is everything. I think this country is built on hard work. And I think that you can do whatever you want with hard work. Like, there's this great quote that somebody said, but Ray Kroc gets credited for, and it's called the Tenacity Prayer. Ray Kroc, the founder of McDonald's. And the Tenacity Prayer is, I'm butchering it right now, but it's something like talents overrated, education's overrated.

The only thing that matters is tenacity. It's like persistence and tenacity alone are omnipotent. And I so believe in that. That's what Forrest Gump was about. He was a guy who had nothing but the willingness to put in the work um but the second thing i would say is uh is nothing in life happens with uh radical shift you hear all these stories of of overnight successes and you know you you will hear about the stories of like i don't know know, Flappy Bird, the iPhone app,

like out of nowhere, he's made a 50 grand. Or Instagram, you know. Yeah, right, sell it for a billion bucks, like all these overnight successes. Facebook, I mean, overnight successes. But that's just like a really awesomely bankable romantic notion of an overnight success. The truth is like everything takes time, everything takes energy. Nothing in life will happen via a radical shift. Um, it's all about, you know, slow incremental progress. And that's all anyone, um, that's all people are willing to accept when they're

receiving it. And that's, that's all you're able to do when putting it out there. So again, when I, you know, flashback to living in a trailer park and working in a restaurant, and now I have a radically different life, to compare the two is a huge stark contrast. But there was like 13 years in between there. Before I lived in the suite apartment. Toiling in obscurity. Yeah, before I lived in the suite apartment I had now, there were like eight other apartments that were tiny, incrementally better.

Before I had a house in Connecticut where my kid and I live, I lived in the attic of my dad's business. And after I lived in the attic, I moved in with my 90-year-old grandmother. And then after that, I rented a one-bedroom studio where my kid and I lived on bunk beds. Then after that, I rented this other apartment. Then I rented this house. It's all about incremental progress, and there's nothing romantic or sexy about incremental progress. But that goes back to the work thing.

I thought of a good quote that is romantic and sexy. Okay. I'm trying to reduce it down to something that you could write in a tweet. But it's this idea that this recipe for success that I've formulated, and it's guaranteed to work. It will only ever be one of two outcomes. And that is, if there's something you want to do, you want to be a movie star, you want to be a rock star, you want to build a spaceship, all you have to do is commit your life,

commit everything you are to realizing that, and one of two things will happen. You will either succeed or you will have died trying, which is in its own right a level of success. And when you reduce it to that it's kind of okay have you seen the movie anvil of course my friend sasha who made that movie is one of my best friends okay that movie anvil is about that's exactly what that movie is he never gave he's delivering box lunches to schools in canada he never ever ever ever gave up and the idea that

his career as a rock star would would would finally be realized because somebody has the foresight to make a documentary about how shitty his life is there's no way you can predict that there's no science there's no precedent but there's nothing but he never they never ever gave up ever and he was gonna die without giving up and then like you stumble upon success that was so not tweetable but i think some of that might have been that's pretty awesome though you gotta i think that might be a book you might have a book in you i know i just don't know how to spell real good so i can't write it's why i make movies there's ways there's ways around that yeah spell jet

all right well that was awesome i think that's a great place to stop. So thanks, man. Yeah, thanks for coming by. I appreciate it. All right, everybody. So if people want to learn more about Casey, the best place to do that is to go to your YouTube channel. That's first. Second is Instagram. Casey Neistat on Instagram. Yeah, it's pretty good.

Sometimes Twitter. Sometimes Twitter. I'm really bad. I wish I was better at Twitter. Yeah, you're pretty good. Nobody cares about websites anymore. You're a master of Instagram, though. I love Instagram.

If you guys aren't following Casey on Instagram, stop what you're doing right now. It's my favorite of the social networks. And then watch his little short film about why he loves Instagram. Oh, yeah. I forgot I made that movie. It's a classic. That was cool.

It was cool when that happened, too, because your Instagram exploded overnight when that went viral yeah i really regret not putting a um my own instagram handle in that movie which i didn't do you didn't do that i didn't even know that i mean if i'd known a million people were going to watch the movie out of you know put a little follow me plug at the end yeah what's next what what's anything exciting yeah i mean i have two really really exciting movies that are both coming out in early march um and if a movie shot on a cell phone of my car being stuck in a pond is the lowest end of my production these are the highest end of my productions i have a movie coming out the first week of march called my kid and me

and it's this movie that I shot over 12 years, but it's kind of the story of my kid and me. And I finished it like two years ago. So I don't know if it's any good anymore, but I remember it being really good. But I'm going to release that the first week of March. And then this project that I'm doing for J.Crew right now is just going to be so awesome.

We threw everything we had at it. Cool. Is that going to debut on YouTube? Everything always. YouTube is the only currency that I function within. All right. I love it. All right, man. Thanks. Yep. All right. Peace. Plants. All right, people, that's our show. That's it for today. I hope you enjoyed it. What a treat. I love that guy. It was super cool to be able to visit him and sit down with him. So I hope you guys dug it. Definitely check out his YouTube channel. Check out his Instagram. You will not be disappointed. as well as the Walter Mitty Philippines video that he made. And you should definitely also check out his snowboarding video.

Once you start watching his videos, though, be careful. It's addicting. You might be sitting there for hours because he's got lots of them up there. In any event, I want to support the podcast. Go to the Amazon banner ad at richworld.com. It won't cost you a cent extra on your Amazon purchases, but Amazon kicks us some loose change out of their massive coffers. And I really appreciate everybody who's been doing that. It's been awesome.

And you should feel good about yourself because it's allowing me to pay Tyler, my son, to produce this show. So by using the Amazon banner ad, you are supporting entrepreneurship. You are supporting youth. And I thank you, and Tyler thanks you. What else? The big announcement. Finally, we got the Plant Power t-shirts up at richroll.com. Super excited to now be able to make those available to you. I know there's been a lot of demand and we've got three initial designs up there. We've got a Star Wars themed one and then we have the original plant design with the hashtag plant power on it.

All 100% organic cotton. We have men's and women's styles and we got all the sizes there. So go check that out. Also, in case you didn't know, I wrote a book. It's called Finding Ultra. Sort of my inspirational memoir of my personal story. A lot of plant-based nutrition information in there too, but predominantly just a good read, if I do say so myself. And it's now available in paperback. So you can pick that up at Amazon, of course, by using the Amazon banner ad. It's super cheap too. If you want a signed copy, I've got signed copies of Finding Ultra in paperback at richroll.com, so you can do that as well. If you want to learn more about how to get more plants into notch it up a little bit whether you're a long-time plant-based person or just new to the whole idea not sure where to start we're really

proud of it and I stand by it so go check that out as well okay so that's it thanks for stopping by I know you guys have a lot of choices when it comes to content. There are so many podcasts out there and it really means a lot to me that you would spend a couple hours with me every week. So I am doing my best to continue to raise the bar and I've got some great guys coming up. So until then, I'll see you next week. Thanks for stopping by. I'm out of here. Peace. Plants. plants.