The Rich Roll Podcast - Marco Borges’ 22-Day Revolution: A Plant-Based Mission To Transform Mainstream Culture

Episode Date: November 23, 2015

Maybe you know Marco Borges because he trains people like Pharrell. Perhaps you know him as the guy who inspired Jay-Z and Beyoncé (who he also trains) to adopt a plant-based lifestyle, then partnered up with them to launch 22-Days Nutrition – a plant-based nutrition products and meal delivery service that shuttles organic, plant-based gluten-free, soy-free and dairy-free meals anywhere in the U.S., right to your doorstep. I had never met Marco. In fact, until this past Spring, I had never even heard of him. But all that changed in April when this Miami-based celebrity fitness trainer, exercise physiologist and plant-based evangelist was suddenly everywhere: the TODAY show, Good Morning America, TIME magazine and even places like Vogue, Entertainment Tonight, Ryan Secrest and Perez Hilton. A Jay & Bey infused media blitz that launched this guy from below the radar to massive mainstream popularity, fomented a plant-based zeitgeist frenzy and skyrocketed his new book, The 22-Day Revolution: The Plant-Based Program That Will Transform Your Body*, to the top of the New York Times Bestseller list. When the most culturally significant and influential entertainment couple on the planet embraces the plant-based perspective (even if imperfectly or temporarily), it's a big deal. The seismic impact can't be underestimated. People don't just notice — the tectonic plates of popular culture shift. Conventional attitudes and habits around food change. Our social paradigm forever altered. So who is the man behind all this? In full disclosure, my biggest fear was that Marco would be just another trainer leveraging celebrity relationships for personal notoriety and fortune. But contempt prior to investigation is a recipe for ignorance. I was delighted to discover a remarkable man. A man that completely defies the stereotype and put to rest any questions I may have harbored about the motivations behind his mission. Marco Borges is true blue. The real deal. A husband and father of three young boys who — at his very core — is about service. Truly passionate about educating and informing mainstream culture about the benefits of plant-based nutrition; doing his very best to spread a message of conscious, compassionate and sustainable living; and working his butt off to provide innovative exercise and nutrition programs, tools and resources to help people – every day people – get fit, healthy and happy and transform their lives for the better. This is a super fun and informative conversation about Marco’s uncommon, extraordinary life and his most worthy mission. Specific topics covered include: * self realization and the impact on consciousness * Marco's background in Miami spin/club culture * Marco's catalyst to plant-based nutrition * becoming the best version of yourself * lifestyle choices, empowerment & education * effective plant-based training * breaking bad habits * the importance of incremental & consistent improvement * entertainer influence in plant-based movement * developing a friendship with Jay Z & Beyoncé Enjoy! Rich

I don't think that people purposely want to live a life full of cruelty or necessarily want to add more greenhouse gases to the earth. But there's something that happens that you don't realize while you're going through this process that you become more conscious. And then it's not until you become more conscious that you can actually see what's in front of you. That's exercise physiologist Marco Borges. And this is The Rich Roll Podcast. The Rich Roll Podcast. and dad, students, and podcast hosts, of course. And this is the show where I commune with the paradigm-shifting outliers, the big forward thinkers across all categories of positive culture change, everything from health and fitness to nutrition, academia, medicine, entrepreneurship, tech, mindfulness, consciousness, and spirituality. The goal is lofty, but it's also simple and I think very worthwhile. And that is this, to help all of us unlock and unleash our best, most authentic selves. So thank you so much

for subscribing to the show on iTunes, for taking a moment to give us a review on iTunes, and of course, for always using the Amazon banner ad at wishroll.com for all your Amazon purchases. for always using the Amazon banner ad at wishroll.com for all your Amazon purchases. That is just a great, simple, and easy, and free way to support our mission here. So thank you so much to everybody who has made a habit of that. So today I'm coming at you from the bustling metropolis that is Elkhart, Indiana. It's a little small town not too far from South Bend. Elkhart, Indiana. It's a little small town, not too far from South Bend. Yeah, baby. I'm on the third leg of this sort of four-city little mini tour. I was in Atlanta last weekend for the Food Equals Medicine Conference, then I went down to Athens, Georgia. What a great town. I'd never been there before. Super cool little college town there. I had the opportunity to give a talk to

the University of Georgia varsity swim team, which was amazing. I had the opportunity to give a talk to the University of Georgia varsity swim team, which was amazing. I always love meeting college swimmers. I did that in the afternoon. And then later that evening, I gave a larger talk to the student body, which was fantastic. And now I'm here in Elkhart. But by the time you listen to this, I'll probably be in Miami for the Seed Food and Wine Festival. Hopefully I'm going to meet some of you guys there. I've been on the road for a little while. I really miss my family.

I love to travel. It's hard to be away from my kids and my wife but I've met so many cool, super cool people and I just want to thank everybody who made a point to come out and see me speak, hang out, shake my hand, take a selfie, let me sign your book and share a few words with you guys. And it's funny because I keep thinking I have a grip on who the audience for this podcast is, you know, the demographic.

But it's only when I travel that I realized that I have it all wrong because I'm meeting people from all walks of life, blue collar, white collar, super fit to those dealing with disease or life crises, mothers and daughters, fathers and sons, old, young. And it's amazing to me to see how the podcast really is speaking to so many different kinds of people. And it's really cool to connect in person with all of you, everybody who has been in some way positively impacted by this show. So I just want to thank everybody for that. It means a lot to me. And it's what inspires me to work harder and be better, not just with the podcast, but in all aspects of my life. So today on the show, I've got Marco Borges. He

is an exercise physiologist. He is a New York Times bestselling author. His book is called The 22 Day Revolution. And you might know this guy because he trains people like Jay-Z, Beyonce, and Pharrell. He's the guy who inspired Jay, I call him Jay, and Beyonce to adopt a plant-based approach to their lifestyle, and then ultimately partnered with them on his new company, which is also called 22 Days Nutrition. It's a plant-based nutrition products company and meal delivery service that delivers organic, plant-based, gluten-free, soy-free, and dairy-free meals to your doorstep. This is a great talk. It's a fun talk.

And as always, I have a few more things I want to say about Marco, but first. Okay, today's show, Marco Borges. In full disclosure, I gotta admit, I wasn't quite sure how this one was gonna go. I didn't know Marco. I'd never met Marco before. And perhaps, let's just say, I might have had a few judgments.

Judgments based on nothing, really. I just saw a guy who is now very much in the media, a guy who somehow became the trainer for Jay-Z and Beyonce, and seems, with an emphasis on seems, to have leveraged that relationship into a book that sold like crazy, and this really successful plant-based nutrition delivery service. I mean, how does that happen? How does that really work? But as they say, does that happen? How does that really work? But as they say, contempt prior to investigation is a recipe for ignorance. And I'm so happy and pleased to say that the guy that I met really defied my preconceived ideas about who he might be. And I'm just really delighted to discover

that Marco is true blue. This guy is the real deal at his core, truly passionate about just helping people, spreading a legit healthy message, and working his butt off to provide innovative exercise and nutrition programs, tools, and resources to help people, everyday people, get fit, healthy, and happy, and transform their lives for the better. So like I said, this is a fun and informative conversation about Marco's life and his most worthy mission. So let the magic begin. We just had the podcast, the epic podcast before the podcast, which I'm always trying to avoid, but I always fall into. That's right. You know, it's unavoidable. It's so nice to meet you. Likewise, man. It's cool that you could make this happen man i know you're a super

busy guy thank you um and uh yeah i'm looking forward to getting into it with you man your life's crazy right now it's uh what is it what is the day in the life of marco borges look like you're seeing it yeah we're in a beautiful hotel room in beverly hill so it's not so bad right but i know you're all over the place. Yeah, it's been fun. You know, we were just talking about you picking what you're most passionate about in life and being able to do it well.

And I'm just excited to no end to know that this pendulum has started to swing and it's really picking up momentum. And we're just right smack in the middle of it. And it's really exciting because every day you go out there and someone new is empowered with the information they need to be able to live the life they want, not just the one they're living, you know, so it makes you feel really good about what you do and the message you're putting out there on a daily basis. Yeah. Well,

it's definitely great. And the pendulum is swinging in the right direction. There's a lot of momentum and there's a lot of excitement and, uh, and, and, and, you know, a lot of people's lives are changing and improving. So it's certainly gratifying in that regard to feel like you're contributing to something that's actually making a difference. So I know that you wake up every morning with that feeling. But you've got four kids, right? Four kids.

Back in Miami. Marco, Mateo, Maximo, and Mila. Mila's the youngest. Yeah, she's our baby girl. She's almost three months. So it's gotta be hard to be away that much. It is. You know, people always ask me, isn't it tough to travel so much and to always be on the road? And to be honest with you, it really isn't. I love traveling. I love meeting new people. I love experiencing new things and learning new cultures. And I love to be on the road. I always dreamed of traveling when I was a kid

and I never knew how I was going to do it. But it was one of those things that I guess I manifested because I really wanted it. But as a kid, I never went anywhere. So I love to travel. But the only difficult thing is being away from my family. I wish I could put them in an Airstream and just travel the world with them.

Yeah, I agree. I mean, people say that to me all the time. Like, oh, doesn't the travel wear you down? I'm like, I get energized from it. I love it. Like, I'm in the middle of like a big jag. Like, just got back from D.C. I'm going to Frankfurt, Paris, Boston.

Then I'm going to Beirut, Lebanon. I'm riding the marathon there. Oh, nice. Then I'm going to be in Atlanta doing an event there. And then University of Georgia. Then South Bend, Indiana. And then going to Miami for the SEED event. Yes. You're going to event there, and then University of Georgia, then South Bend, Indiana, and then going to Miami for the SEED event. Yes. You're going to be there, right? Absolutely, yeah. Are you speaking there, or what's... I'm just going to be enjoying the event. So we'll be there. We'll

have some presents there, and we are meeting with a lot of friends, making new friends, meeting, seeing old friends. So it's a great event. It was really fun last year, so I'm waiting to see what they're going to pull off this year. Yeah, I can't wait. It looks like it's a great event it's a it was really fun last year so i'm i'm waiting to see what they're going to pull off this year i can't wait like it looks like it's really shaping up to be something cool so if people that are listening out there in the miami area uh come yeah absolutely come join us november i forget the exact dates like a second or third it's on my website just click on appearances there but anyway um so what is it? I mean, look, this is you've, you've tread, you know, a long road past just being kind of like a personal trainer to, you know, being this crazy entrepreneur who is at the tip of the spear of this, this movement,

you know, with 22, 22 days nutrition and everything that you're doing in the book and all of that. And we're going to unpack all of that. But, you know, right now you're in LA, you're in Las Vegas, you're in New York. Like what is the, what is that day in the life look like? Like, what is the, what is the kind of, um, typical experience, you know, that you're undertaking to, you know, be the CEO of this burgeoning, you know, nutrition company? Um, it's, company? Every day is different. Every day is a new day with a whole new set of adventure to it. So yesterday I was in Las Vegas for Supply Side.

So I got to meet a bunch of my ingredient suppliers. I got to see a bunch of people. What is Supply Side? Explain that. Supply Side is the world's largest ingredient convention. So I get to meet all the guys that I'm buying ingredients for for the first time, or I get to see old friends, so people that I buy all my organic ingredients from, all converge in Vegas for a couple of days. So Expo West could not exist without Supply Side, right?

Exactly. Everybody who makes products for Expo West has to get their stuff from the guys. Somebody's going to supply side for them. So I like to go there because I do all my own sourcing and I love to meet the people that bring the ingredients to me. And I love to hear about how they're grown and the whole process that goes into it because it means a lot to me. We don't make any compromises whatsoever in making our products. And I want to ensure that our ingredient suppliers feel the same way about it as I do. So yesterday was supply side. Today, it's here, you know, working, seeing you. Today's a treat. So I get to see you and hang out

with you for an hour or so. But every day is a new day of just trying to continue to spread the message, working on a cookbook now and doing a lot of different things. But it's all related to the same thing. So while it may seem like I'm doing a million things in a bunch of different directions, the reality is, as I'm sure you feel on a daily basis, it's all very, very focused, extremely focused. While it may seem like it's super fragmented, it really all is about the same thing. It's all about empowering people with the tools they need to live a healthier life. When you see how people feel, last week we shot the Steve Harvey show. Oh, cool.

And we got to bring a couple of people with us that had transformed their lives with a plant-based, or with our program, by adopting a plant-based diet and when you see how people change their lives and how they can take control of their actions and become much more conscious about what they're putting into their body how they just start to change and how it starts to affect not just them but the people around them their family their kids their friends the people they work with and it just starts to it's like um touching a piece of white linen with the tip of a pen and you see the ink just start to spread out onto that you know linen and you realize that it's very impactful it's not just that one person and what's cool is that someone is empowering themselves and

a lot of times it starts off with something super selfish like they look in the mirror they're like man i look like crap i want to feel better about myself. Yeah. Right. And, um, and it's that first symptom or that they get to see, or that they're constantly reminded of, which is that carrying around a lot of weight, that excess weight. And then that sort of selfish action turns into something really selfless because they start to become more conscious about what they're doing to themselves and they start to feel better about themselves. And then they realize that they're living a cruelty-free lifestyle. And then they realize all of the other things that they

didn't know. We sort of touched on it before, but you start to realize how much of an impact the things that you do affect not just you, but the people around you and the world around us. And I think that we live in a world that's pretty scary these days, and it's really angry. And there's a lot of violence and there's a lot of stuff that doesn't need to, you know, be happening. And when you know that you're part of something that just makes people happier, right. And it makes the people around them happier. It just makes you, you know, really excited. It's a beautiful thing. I mean, it's almost like it starts with with, you know, solving the equation of, you know, one plus one doesn't equal two. It equals five. And when you can put help somebody put that together. I mean, that was my experience of like just realizing like, oh, like what I eat actually doesn't just impact like how I feel and my health, but it's changing my consciousness.

And that shift in my consciousness is impacting absolutely everything about my life experience from the way that I interact with people, from the decisions that I make about how to spend my time. And, you know, literally the energy that you're putting out into the world in the most micro sense and also in the most macro sense. So it really is that inkblot just spreading out exponentially. It's crazy. And then when you work with someone else and you see that happening with them, it's the coolest thing. It is so gratifying. So gratifying.

I remember being in school and the dean of my college says to me, wait, I'd gone into change majors, right? So I was a pre-med biology major. And then I was, yeah. And then I go in and I'm like, Dr. Lopez, I want to pick up another degree, maybe like an exercise phys or something. And he's like, why would you do that? And I'm like, well, I'm not so sure I want to go to med school anymore. I mean, medicine, Like, why would you do that? And I'm like, well, I'm not so sure I want to go to med school anymore.

I mean, medicine, I'm looking and everything I'm seeing is super reactive. And I'm a really proactive person. Just my nature is I'm just not a reactive person. And I don't think I'd be happy. So I want to perhaps keep people from getting sick rather than treat them once they're already ill. It's a lot easier to keep someone healthy than it is to get them to recover. And then he looked at me, I was like, I don't know if that's a great idea. You're probably not going to make a lot of money and you're going to be working in a lab somewhere or working with, you know, rehab patients somewhere. And I was like, yeah, I have an idea that I want to do something different. Um, and that different was that, you know, sort of that

spark that created that fuel in me to, to want the difference that I wanted to see in the world. I just thought people would be so much happier if they were empowered with health. And it started off sort of in the fitness space. And I went and became a trainer. And then eventually I opened up my first gym and then grew that. And then through doing all of that, I realized that fitness was just but a small component of the really big picture, which was multifactorial. So let's unpack that a little bit. I mean, was all this unfolding in Florida? Is that where you grew up and went to school?

Yeah. Born and raised in Miami. My parents are Cuban. They came from Cuba in the late 50s. Oh, wow. So my mom came as a kid. She I think she was seven when she came to Miami. So I was born and raised there. And yeah, I went to grade school there, went to high school there, went to college. Right, right, right. And so all right, so you start off as a trainer in a gym, but then you know, you have this, you must have this sort of inbred entrepreneurial streak about you because you turn that into like you own like a like a chain of gyms right i don't know if you still do is that yeah i sold it off but yeah but you know it was more of a um i wanted to do something that didn't exist and it wasn't really there and i've never been one to allow people uh to to define me uh with their paralysis right so you know a lot of people don't

think they could do something and then they're like, because they don't think they could do it, they don't want you to think you could do it. You know? I have no idea what you mean. You know that expression is so common and I really think that it's so untrue with, you know, jack of all trades, master of none,

which is, I think people, they get that stuck in their psyche and they think that they have to do one thing that can only be great at one thing. And I think it's such a crock because the truth is you could be great at as many things as you want to be great at it just takes focus um and uh when i when i jumped into training um i i remember going to a club and i basically walked in and said you guys need to hire me because i know you're you're hurting it was a fisher island um in florida You've heard of Fisher Island. So I went there and

I said, I know you guys are doing really bad, but I can turn this place around. I can create a personal training program for you guys and I can, I can help you out. I have a lot of really great ideas and we can do some really exciting things here. They must've seen something in me because I started the next day at six in the morning. And then that created an opportunity for me to do some really exciting things. And I, you know, I went from like a club that was very much just a gym to me taking people kayaking on the island and doing things that no one was thinking about. But it was right there in front of them. Like I thought you live on an island. Why not use the water, right? So why not do things outside? So I started doing that.

And then I got invited to come out here by Johnny G and his crew to come and see this program. These guys that were training for Ram, you know, race across America were training inside of a garage and they wanted me to see this program that was going to revolutionize fitness. And I came out and I fell in love with it and it was spinning. So I went back to Miami and I was like, I've got to figure out a way to open up a gym. I've got to do it. I went back to Fisher and I said, you guys have to buy me 50 bikes. We've got to, they were like 50 bikes. Are you crazy said, you guys have to buy me 50 bikes. We've got to. They were like, 50 bikes? Are you crazy? Where are you going to put 50 bikes?

That'll never work. Cycling inside of a room? People cycle outside? That doesn't make any sense. And I was like, please, please, please. You've got to do it. You've got to do it. They're like, all right, we'll buy you six bikes.

One for you and five for the residents of the island and for the members. And I was like, it's not gonna work guys it's really not gonna work they're like yeah but everything you've asked us for what year is this 94 right okay um so i had already asked for kayaking they'd said no so i went out and bought two kayaks on my own and i put them on the island it became a huge hit i'd said let me go cycling with the people on the island they said no so i went out and bought two bikes and i started biking with everybody on the island i just started doing things on my own. They were like, this guy's on a streak,

but maybe this is the one thing that's not going to work because it doesn't sound like it's going to work. They were a little reluctant, but they did. They bought six bikes. Then the first day, it was, you can imagine, 10 people show up for a class with five bikes. They're like, what the hell? Why didn't you guys think of this?

I was like, okay, I've got to do something. This is going to be really hot. I went and basically I saved up as much money as I could in a very short period of time, helped a friend paint murals at night, worked during the day, went to school. And three, four months later, I went and opened the first freestanding spinning studio in Florida. Oh, you did? Wow, that's cool. I didn't know that. What was it called? M-Cycle. M-Cycle? Wow. I feel like gym culture in miami kind of set the tone i don't

know if it still does but it there was that period of time in the 90s like with david barton yeah like he didn't he he was at the he had his gym at the delano and and there's a cool spot it was like he was one of the first guys to make like the gym like sexy and fashionable and then miami kind of that was at the same time that like South Beach was starting to emerge as like this destination place. And so a whole culture was created around there that kind of, you know, set the stage or the tone for the rest of the country. I mean, meanwhile, like Johnny G or whatever is doing his thing out here in LA, but I feel like there was a lot of attention on Miami and that whole kind of like fitness culture that spilled out across America.

So there was right there in the middle of that. Yeah, there was. And you got to remember that at that time it was like the beginning of the supermodel era and they were all on South Beach. So you had all the models flocking to the beach at, you know, any given point in time during the year. And, um, there was a lot of really cool clubs, a lot of really, that was when the gym became a club, not just a gym, not just like a muscle head place, but a really cool place to hang out. It was like Equinox before Equinox, right? Right.

And we had like three or four of those just all over Miami, which is a lot of fun, and it was great to watch because I was living there. Equinox would not be what it is without what was going on in Miami at that time, I think. I agree. Yeah. Interesting. was going on in Miami at that time, I think. I agree. Yeah. Interesting. So at the same time, there was like this dovetailing of party culture with gym culture too, right? It was all like one thing. Like if you were, I haven't been to South Beach in a while. I'm coming in November soon. But I mean, I remember, I think, you know, around that time you would go and it didn't feel like

you were in America. Like you felt like you were in South America or something. You know, around that time you would go and it didn't feel like you were in America. Like you felt like you were in South America or something, you know, it was like, this is not the United States the way people, I mean, it was a totally different cultural experience of being there. Yeah. They say the best thing about Miami is that it's so close to the US. So you parlay that one spinning studio into like a little mini gym empire is that how it goes or yeah so then um i you know we fortunately i i think it was just a a series of serendipitous events i opened the club don't have a dollar in the bank i've got to make it work i've spent every dollar right so there was no business plan there was just no planning. I just needed to get this place open.

You're a hustler now. Yeah, so I opened the doors. I don't have a receptionist. So basically you can imagine this, right? Envision me opening the door, letting all the people in, signing everybody up, taking their money,

putting them on the bike, teaching a class, getting off the bike, going, open the door, saying goodbye to everyone, letting the new crowd in and doing that eight times, back to back to back to back. So it's a little bit of there's a crazy guy teaching eight

classes back to back which one of the classes will knock you out so part of it was you got to see this guy he's a freak just go check it out so the word spread really quickly and people were really enjoying the music and it was the first time that people were in a setting that wasn't intimidating in that back then it was a lot of step aerobics and you couldn't just go to a class because if you walked into a class in Miami, it was like a cult, right? So everyone knew all the steps. And if you didn't do the steps right, they wanted to like throw you out the gym because you were in someone else's space. It's not very democratic. Yeah. So this is the first time that people are like oh i could do

that i'm sitting on a bike and i'm just pedaling i could do that that's easy and it was a lot less intimidating so it brought down a lot of walls and guys for the first time were like it's not girly or it's something that i love to do or that i already enjoy doing and we had this really big um tri-geek community in south florida particularly in miami in the area that i opened and they all started you know coming and they were like man this is awesome this is great training because it rains a lot and sometimes it's not easy to ride outside so they were like i'll come and you know put in hours work whatever so um then the word got around and really quickly we we developed a really incredible following we had 65 bikes i think um and there was like 10 15 people waiting in every

class so so all of my friends started hearing about what i was doing and then a lot of developers that i knew in the area were like uh you're the smallest gym in town and you're doing a lot of business and you're really there's a lot of noise every other week there was a write-up or something so it became a really fun process and and i wasn't looking at it as you know this is going to be the launching pad i was just having a great time i was a kid who was just looking at this like yeah like how old are you at this time um when i opened the doors i was 22 i think i was um so you're teaching every class yeah i was teaching every class it was it was so much honestly so much fun i look back people like wasn are like, wasn't it scary? Weren't you worried?

And the truth is, I really wasn't. I mean, I really, really wasn't scared at all. I was so excited to be able to do what I love to do. And to me, it was like, if it lasts a week, it's super cool. If it lasts a month, it's great. So I got some developers to come into the gym and say, man, we love what you've created here. This is a really cool culture. Can you come and build it at one of our buildings? And there were a lot of buildings popping up around Miami.

Like they started to build out South beach, like South of fifth street. And they were starting to build out sunny aisles and a lot, a lot was happening. And, um, I thought, yeah, this could be fun. What would you like me to do? And they're like, well, we'd love for you to come in and just design the whole place and just keep the club, just, you know, run it, do whatever needs to be done. Um, so I thought, wow, this is really exciting. You know, people are enjoying what I'm doing. So, um, I developed like a management company from one day to the next and just, so they're kind of like, so the, like on a business level, the idea is they underwrite it, but you still have autonomy to do whatever you want. And it's like your place and your Exactly. Like, yeah, it's good. So that's kind of like how it,

is that how it works mostly when you have these sort of name brand gyms and these fancy hotels or, or like these you know, restaurants that are kind of chef driven in, you know, casinos or what have you, is that the way those deals work? I don't, I can't speak to every deal, but I've seen that there's a lot of times where there are subsidies to have really great services. So like if a hotel has, I don't, I can't speak to every deal, but I've seen that there's a lot of times where there are subsidies to have really great services. So like if a hotel has, I don't know, pick an Equinox inside of it, there's some really sweet deal that keeps them there, right?

Because there's just not enough business for it to make sense for them to be there on their own, especially if they don't allow memberships. They wouldn't choose to be there if they were just canvassing where to have their next location. Exactly, Exactly. So it presents a great opportunity because the hotel gets to have a really great brand and then the gym owner gets to have a really great hotel to call their home. So it's, it's, I think it's a win-win for everyone. Um, and, uh, and it was sort of that to me, um, uh, gave me an opportunity to have multiple locations and to do something much bigger, uh, into, and then I got my foot into South Beach and we opened the club on South Beach. And I remember meeting with a developer. They were like,

you know what? We want to have the coolest, the most different, unique space that there has ever been. And I was like, well, if you want to be different, you have to have the gym outside of the building. It can't just be another, you know know take an apartment and just make a gym out of it let's build like a really cool freestanding building let's make it three stories let's put a pool in there let's make it just really and they're like whatever you want i was like really really whatever i want they're like yeah design it so i went into the architect's office and i sat with the art architects for months and we designed like the cool it's still the coolest freestanding space in South Beach.

So it's still there? Yeah. What's it called? Well, it was called the Sporting Club when I had it. It's the Continuum. Right. I have to go check it out.

Yeah, it's really cool. I'll bring you by. It's the southern tip of the beach so you can't go any further south. If you went any further south, you'd be leaving the state space. So yeah, really cool location. You know, rooftop pool,

just really incredible movement spaces and a weight room, just a really great, really great environment. So did that just blow things up for you that got built? Yes, sort of. Well, like the guy, you're like the guy in South Beach. Not really. You know, it was more, more along the lines of, I really love what I do. And I was in a space where I think that a lot of people go into training because sometimes they don't know what they want to do. And they're kind of like transitioning. And it's sort of transient in the kind of people that move in and out of the space all the time. And I really just wanted from day one to help people be healthier.

I feel like I was put on this planet to help people, period, just to help them, whether it's help them bring something upstairs or help them be the best version of themselves. And I just chose to make it be the best version of them. And in doing what I was doing, people realized that I wasn't just one of those weekend certification trainers and that I was doing, people realized that I wasn't just,

you know, one of those weekend certification trainers and that I was doing a lot more for the space. And having been armed with, you know, tools that were really unique in what I was doing, I was able to help athletes to recover and, you know, train harder for the next season. And through word of mouth, people just started asking, you know, more and more about me. And I got really lucky. Right. And so were you working during this period of time? Are you working one on one with people doing the doing the doing the training? Right. So you're you're sort of running this like series of gyms, but you're also still hands on with individuals. What was what I really wanted to do, right, was to work with people. It wasn't so much that I you could have easily sort of transitioned into suddenly you're a guy who

manages people. Yeah. And I didn't what got you into it. Yeah, I didn't want to do that because it I don't think it's in me. Like I'm not a micromanager. I love to manage myself and my time really well. But I never really wanted to manage like, you know, 500 people or anything like that. I just wanted to do what I was really excited about which was getting in the gym getting you know to do stuff with people that were a lot of fun and how's that working now yeah you'd be surprised uh you know i'm still to today i'm not a micromanager i just can't i can't do it i just surround myself with really great people who are super talented and really bright and get my, get my vision. Is there like a headquarter office? Yeah, Miami. You'll come when you get to Miami. Hopefully you'll stop by and visit us. So I'm, I'm really fortunate that

I have a really great team around me and, um, they get the vision, they get what it is that I'm trying to accomplish and we all have a common goal, right? So it, it makes it a lot easier and a lot more fun for me. Cool. Uh. So when does the whole plant-based nutrition thing start to enter your consciousness? At a certain point, I started traveling a lot and I was finding myself on the road all the time and I had already moved into a plant-based diet. So I'd slowly been transitioning.

What catalyzed that? What was your sort of you know well i had i had a i had a my first moment was when i was like in uh when i was in fifth grade exactly i remember as if it was yesterday um i went to it we would go to a cuban bakery every morning for breakfast and my mom was a single parent and and would drive my brother and i to a baker and we would buy like these little pastries these little cuban pastries that came in like this little plastic wrapping and i remember eating one one morning and i was never really a big chocolate guy but for some reason i chose a chocolate one that morning and by the time i got to school i

started to itch my arms were itchy and my chest was itchy but i just i didn't think anything of it and um like two hours into school i had like hives all over my arms and my chest and my neck and i went to the bathroom i'm like oh my god what's happening to me i went to the nurse and she's like well it looks like you might have had some kind of a reaction to something that you ate and i was like man i knew it that stuff it can't be good for you you know it's junk i was 10 years old um so i was just like i know what i'm gonna do i'm just not gonna eat that stuff anymore and then the next day my mom was like you're not gonna eat anything i was like no i'm not hungry and i skipped breakfast and like a week later i'm running a pe and all of a sudden i i don't know what happens and i open my eyes

and i'm like on the grass facing the sun and I passed out and some guy walks up walks by me was like dude are you all right and I'm like yeah what happened he's like you just passed out I was like okay second aha moment I was like all right I can't eat junk but I've got to eat something so then that curiosity just is like a little spark inside of me I was like okay I gotta I gotta figure out a way to learn this stuff and obviously back then there was no internet so I had to figure out how to get the right books and how to get my hands on the right things. Microfiche. Yeah, microfiche.

Library time. So then I just started researching. And at that point in time, it sounds crazy, but I just wanted to learn more about what I can put into my body to make myself feel better. And I, at a very early age, became very conscious of what I was putting into my body. Fast forward a bunch of years. very early age became very conscious of what I was putting into my body. Fast forward a bunch of years. I was always tweaking and tweaking and tweaking to get to the point where it wasn't about, you know, trying to live a cruelty free life. I'm not gonna lie, there was no altruistic, you know, condition or reasoning behind it. It was just me wanting to be the best version of me.

So I gave up milk, all dairy, when I was like in, I don't know, before high school, like junior high, because I knew that I just always had a stomach ache my whole life. I remember my entire childhood always having a stomach ache. Like literally, I was the kid in the car, Mommy, I have to go to the bathroom. You know, anywhere we'd go, I have to go to the bathroom. And it was just, it was weird because you're not supposed to feel that way. And as a kid, I knew that there was something wrong

because why should you always have a stomachache? That doesn't make sense. Then I gave up milk on my own and realized that the stomachaches completely went away. Wow, that's amazing. And removed all dairy from my life. Do you think you're lactose intolerant or just had some kind of-

I think I'm dairy intolerant. I think everyone is, is by the way i don't think i'm the only one but i was just it doesn't it didn't agree with my digestive tract and my digestive system so i just did away with it and i felt better and then that was just a one one of the steps in a continuous journey on tweaking and tweaking and tweaking my life and um right around the time when I got married, I decided to go, I was like, I'm going all the way. And then before my first son was born, I was like, I want to go completely plant-based. And I was traveling a lot and I was always in the road. And I was looking for products that I could take along with me. And then I was like, oh, this is great. And then I realized that a lot of the stuff that you find on shelves is like, you know, they reverse engineer the stuff,

right? So it's all formulated for label copy, right? So it says, you know, vegan on the front, and then you turn it around, it's all like brown rice syrup or something, I don't know, whatever. And I just was frustrated. And I thought somebody should do something better. And then at that moment in time, I was like, I could do something better. And I just was always very curious very curious so I thought to myself I could make some stuff at home and start you know sharing with my friends and my family members and I did that and I by that point in time I'd already moved into 100% plant-based diet and and you know it was just fun for me to learn something new every day and then to be able to play with ingredients and then to be able to learn where they came from and what I was. And then the more you learn, the more you

know, the more you want to know, right? So you, you know, better you do better. So you, I just wanted to learn more and my appetite just kept growing and growing, growing, pun intended. And I just was really, um, you know, just like super curious about nutrition as a whole. Right. But the, so the decision that when you went fully plant-based, that was like, what, like 10 years ago or something like that? I mean, was there some books that you read? What was the research or kind of the mental calculus of making that leap?

Because as somebody who, you know, owns this chain of gyms and is a trainer and in Miami Beach, which is very much like a muscle culture. You know, there's a lot of beefy dudes at the gym, you know, like for like a well-known, well-respected trainer to go, yeah, I'm going to be plant-based now. I mean, that's pretty iconoclastic, right? I mean. Yeah. I mean, I don't know if I go that far.

I just, you know, I was, I've never made a decision based on what someone else wants me to do. I've just never been that guy. I just do my own thing. I'm very, there's a process that goes on inside of me. And I'm a big time researcher. So I just kept looking and everywhere I looked, all the arrows were pointing in the right direction. All the studies were coming out. If you consume X amount of meat, you increase your chances of cancer. If you stop consuming animal products, you not only decrease, but you can slow and even reverse heart disease. You look at the Blue Zone studies, you look at the China study, you look at all the stuff that was out there and it was already there. It wasn't as prevalent or as popular as it is today, but it was already there. And for, you know, the only regret I have

is that I didn't do it sooner because I just, I guess I was busy, you know, doing other things and I wasn't really focused on it. But I think that that should be our number one focus to be the best versions of ourselves because it's not until you are the best version of you that you can give the best of you to someone else. That's the theme of this podcast. That's it. Unlocking the most authentic, best version of yourself, man. And I always say, you know, it begins with what you put on your plate, but that's really the first step. Like, you got to go beyond the kale, right? And so for me and my experience, and I believe this was your experience as well, when you start to make that shift, it changes your consciousness, right? And it takes you on this journey and suddenly you're starting to get interested in things you didn't think that you were interested in before. cruelty-free lifestyle or being concerned about, you know, your carbon footprint or,

you know, how green your choice is. Like all these things that kind of come with it. You're like, now I care about that? I didn't used to care about that. Life was a little easier when I cared about that stuff. But, you know what I mean? But it's a beautiful journey. Yeah. And I don't think that people purposely want to live a life full of cruelty or necessarily

want to add more greenhouse gases to the earth. But there's something that happens that you don't realize while you're going through this process that you become more conscious. And then it's not until you become more conscious that you can actually see what's in front of you. You can see what you do. And, you know, I was the guy that, you know, I've always been, I just, I like to be kind to people. I'm always happy and I just like to be kind to people in general, whether I know them or don't. I like to say hi to everyone and I'm just really friendly.

I love people. But I never wanted to look at like, you know, PETA videos or animal cruelty videos. I was like, I don't want to see that. But not seeing it keeps you ignorant to what's going on. And it's not until you see it that you can understand that you can be a part of it. You can either fuel it or you could stop it, right? So you can help be, you know, the cause or the cure, right? So it wasn't until I started to really immerse myself in all aspects of it that I realized that, wow, not only am I feeling better about myself, I'm reducing my risk of a lot of the diseases that a lot of minorities, Cubans, Hispanics have, people in general in the US. I mean, the fact that heart disease is still the number one killer in 2015, but we can call someone like, here you go. My son is calling me

on FaceTime right now, as I'm saying this to you, right? And this is like surreal that this could happen, but we still manage to kill ourselves by our lifestyle choices. That makes no sense to me whatsoever. And I think that we need to do everything in our power to continue to educate people to show them that there's a better way. Because when people don't feel great about themselves, they're just not great, period. I mean, it's that simple. Well, there's a lack of empowerment, too, and a lack of education as well. I think that most people think that they're just predestined to have these illnesses. And we kind of, as a culture, have acclimated to that. So it's like when you have a friend who goes in for a stent, it's just

like, oh yeah, you got a stent, like that's what you do. Or, you know, well, I'm just genetically predisposed to high blood pressure and all these sorts of things. And the truth is, no, you're not. Like maybe you have a genetic predisposition to it, but how you're moving your body and the foods that you're putting into it have a massive impact on the expression of that genetic predisposition or not, right? And so it's about helping people understand that they have a lot more control over these things than we've sort of been, of that genetic predisposition or not, right? And so it's about helping people understand that they have a lot more control over these things than we've sort of been, you know, led to believe, right? Because we just don't think, well, you just see people,

when your consciousness starts to expand, you start to see how easily manipulated we are as human beings, that if you just, like I was in Las Vegas, I told this story before, but it's like, oh, you create this box that like chimes bells and has flashing lights and makes a noise that coins come out of it, and you can get somebody to sit there all day and feed money into it. We're pretty primal beings that give us a few little things, and we'll just lead wherever you want us to go. And it's about stopping and saying, let's look at this objectively. What are we doing? How are we investing our time and our money and our energy? And is this making

us healthier and happier or the reverse? Yeah, the great Dr. Dean Ornish says it best, our genes are not our destiny. Yeah, I just was in Washington,C., and I interviewed this wonderful doctor, Dr. Robin Shutkan. Do you know Robin? She's an expert in the microbiome, and the stuff that's going on in the research of the microbiome is so mind-blowing.

You know, it's crazy, and how much impact that has on our moods, our decision-making, our cravings, like all these sorts of things are impacted by the nature of our gut flora. And that extends to, you know, the expression of genetic predispositions as well. Like, so the science that's going on there is crazy. But the truth is still that, you know,

if you treat yourself right, that you don't have to become one of these statistics that is, you know, plaguing our country and killing us by the millions. So true. So true. And hence why what you do is so important and so powerful. And yourself as well. But, but I mean, so how does this, so you, so you have this, your son's calling you. Do you have to, do you have to talk to him? No, no, I'm good. Yeah, no, I just, I just turned it off. All right, cool. So you have this, you make this transition to a 100% plant-based diet. Is this just your journey or do you get to a place where you're like, I want to share this.

Like I think this could be helpful to the people that I'm working with, you know, my clients and, you know, the people in the gym. Or is this, you're just thinking of this as your own thing? No, I, you know, I had read so much and I knew enough to know that I wanted to share it, that it needed to be shared, but I didn't want to preach it. I wanted to, I wanted to live it first. I wanted to walk the walk. And I always say that your kids don't learn from what you tell them. They learn from what you show them. So I wanted to be able to show people. And did you, was there, was there a fear at all? Like any reluctance, like, well, I'm going to do this because I know that, you know, all the studies show that this is in my

best interest in terms of long-term health and longevity and disease prevention. But as a guy who has to, you know, walk the floor at his gym and look fit, did you feel like, well, I might not be able to be as strong or, you know, physically do the thing? Like, was there any of that like protein myth stuff swimming around in your mind that you feel felt like you had to overcome? Or were you like, I'm not even worried about? No, yeah, not at all. It wasn't even a second thought. I just knew that it was the I knew at that point in time, I knew it was the right thing to do. I knew it would be best for me. But I was excited about being able to show people that I wasn't going to change physically, right? Or on an athletic performance level.

Right, you're not going to lose all this weight and suddenly look spindly. Right, exactly. So, I mean, I literally have weighed the same exact weight since I was 18 years old. I'm 43. I've weighed 152 pounds since I was 18. So it hasn't changed at all one bit. I didn't lose any muscle mass, contrary to popular belief.

I can still bench what I benched when I was 18. I still run as fast. I could still, yeah. And the beauty is that I don't feel any overuse pains. I don't, I rarely, rarely feel sore. I mean, I really have to go into the gym and really crush myself to be able to feel sore because my body just recovers a lot faster.

Not that I didn't feel great before, I just felt extra good when I went this way. That's the thing that always gets me. And that was the biggest thing that I experienced when I made this shift. I was able to just, you know, work out really hard and bounce back so much more quickly than I was used to. It was an amazing thing. So, you know, people always say, oh, you did these

crazy ultra endurance races, like, do you think you would have done better if you were on a paleo diet? I'm like, you don't understand, like, I think that eating plant based is actually like the secret weapon, it allowed me to, you know, train harder, push myself, you know, harder, longer, without, with less risk of getting injured or overtraining or getting sick, and thus allowing me to have a much more efficient training season in which I could pack in, you know, sort of the maximum impact of training in a shorter period of time. Yeah, and I think that that's where the magic really is, because, yeah, sure, everyone wants to reduce the risk of disease. But it's not until you're sick that you really think about that.

No one ever really thinks about that on a daily basis. But they think about being tired. They think about being overweight. They think about the way that they sleep. They think about their energy levels throughout the day. I have a friend that just – his daughter just started school and he says to me the other day, man, this school life. And I was like, school life what? And he's like, you're like wiped by know five o'clock because you just get up earlier

does that ever happen to you and i was like no he's like no and i'm like no he's like when do you get tired i'm like well i don't really get tired i mean i really don't um it's the truth i mean i hate to have to say it but but the reality is I just, I never feel tired because I sleep so well. I sleep really well. I don't toss and turn, you know. I'm fortunate, I guess, but I think a lot of it has to do with the way that I live my life and what I put into my body, how I choose to fuel myself. And that's what I think gets most people because people are like, well, I started trying these testimonials that are coming up every day now. They're like, you know, the biggest thing is that I'm sleeping better. My energy levels are constant throughout the day.

I'm not having these lows after lunch. I'm just feeling great about myself throughout the week and on the weekends. I don't feel like I have to be sitting on a couch recovering from a week's worth of work. I want to get out. I want to get out. I want to do things. And that's what I think more people would enjoy knowing that are thinking about a plant-based lifestyle, right? So it's not the people that are reliving it. We already know what we feel like. It's the people that aren't living it that you're like, but wait, because sometimes people are like, whoa, you know, you got to die something. So, but what about living a fuller, richer life every day? But the thing that has to be overcome is this idea that if you're going to adopt this lifestyle,

that it's deprivation-oriented, like that you're giving up all of these things, right? And as you know and as I know, you're gaining so much that I don't look at it as deprivation-oriented at all, but I think the average person does, right? They're thinking, well, life's not worth living if I can't have my steak or my cheeseburger or what have you. So when you're working with people, like how do you address that issue? I don't, yeah, I have a very similar thought process to that. To me, the way I look at it is I've never eaten so many different types of foods as when I went completely plant-based. So I think your taste buds and your desire for food changes, the healthier and the cleaner you eat. People always ask me, well, what's your cheat? I'm like, well, I mean, I really enjoy

whatever. I'll come up with something that I really like. And they're like, that's not a cheat, man. Come on. give me what your cheat really is. I'm like, well, I'm being honest with you. I mean, I don't crave a Philly steak sandwich. That's not just in me. I just don't. I look at it and I get disgusted because I just know what it does. And to me, food is fuel.

While I love it and I'm a foodie at heart and I love great. I mean, I really love great food. And a lot of times people find it difficult to believe that you could be plant-based and really, really love food and appreciate food. I appreciate the food, not just for what it tastes like, but where it comes from, how it's prepared and what it's going to do for me, all of the things combined. So it's not just about what it's going to taste like, you know, the 30 seconds that I'm eating it. I want to know what I'm going to feel like 30 seconds after I finished eating it and how I'm going to feel the next day and what it's going to do inside my body. And then once you start to wrap your head around all of that, your taste changes. It just happens. Yeah. People don't believe that, but it's true,

right? Like people have a hard time wrapping their head around the fact that your cravings could change. And, you know, I know from my conversation with Robin that your cravings are going to change just because the microbiology in your gut is going to change. And that's what is dictating a lot of your, your cravings. Like the, the flora in there needs to feed on whatever it is that you've been eating. And that's what, what you're going to desire. So you have to weather the discomfort of breaking an old habit, and that's what we're going to get into the 22-day thing. And there's no way around that. But, like, get over yourself. Like, just get through that, and you can get to the other side, and there's this freedom that is almost inexplicable.

Yeah, I like to always make little analogies comparing food to money, right? analogies comparing food to money, right? So like, it's cool to spend every single dime that comes into your, you know, pocket, right up until the end of the month comes, right? And then you realize that you may not have all the money you need to be able to pay for all your bills and to be able to take care of the things that are really, you know, primal necessities, right? So it's not until you develop a habit around saving money and not spending at all that you really can feel great and you feel even greater knowing that you're not going to be in trouble at the end of every single month, that you're not going to be living check to check every single week, that you have a little bit of a cushion where you, if goes wrong you're going to be okay then you

realize that living on the edge and what you thought was really awesome was really reckless and it's not until you can see those things that you understand why it is so important for you to take control of your health because it's the only area of our lives where we have so much autonomy right like we do what we do really well but tomorrow someone could say hey man no i'm not buying your next book or i'm not you know doing x y or z and it doesn't matter how much love and how much effort you put into it maybe it doesn't you know maybe maybe you have an accounting job and tomorrow you know you've been on time every day for the last 35 years and tomorrow there's cutbacks and they say to you hey bob um sorry we've got to

let you go and it just happens you're not, Bob, sorry, we've got to let you go. And it just happens. You're not in control of that, but your health, you're almost completely in control of. We already know that. I mean, and science has proven without a shadow of a doubt that how you live your life greatly affects how you feel and your disease or lack thereof as you get older. So, yeah, for sure, man, for sure. So that's a beautiful testimony, you know? Just the empowerment alone that's sort of packed into that is really powerful, I think, you know? And so the challenge is trying to get people

not only to understand that, but then to implement that, right? I think it's easy to, you know, you can give people the information, but actually getting that to translate into action that then becomes a sustainable habit is that's the hard, that's where the hard work is, right? So, you know, before we even get into like 22 days and everything that you're doing with that, like, what is the approach that you take with clients to try to help them break a lifetime of old habits, whether it's around food or movement, exercise, etc.? Are there certain tools that you rely on to help people get over that hump? to help people kind of get over that hump? Yeah, I'm a big believer in kaizen,

which is the Japanese word for continuous self-improvement. So there's a little story I like to tell. Imagine there's a guy that's in charge of keeping bathrooms neatly clean in some big hotel, right? And he walks in the door and he realizes that there's paper towels thrown all over the door because people wash their hands and then they don't want to touch the doors on their way out. They grab a paper towel and they open the door and then they just toss it near the door because there's nowhere to put it. So because he practices Kaizen, he's like, oh, I can fix this. I'm going to put a garbage can next to the door so that when someone opens the door with a towel, paper towel, because they're going to keep doing it, they'll just throw the towels in there.

So he comes back a week later and hence no more paper on the floor. There is now a wastebasket full of paper towels. And then he looks at it again and he's like, ah, this is great. It solved it, but it didn't solve it all the way. he looks at it again and he's like, huh, this is great. It solved it, but it didn't solve it all the way because now I have an enormous amount of paper that I can tell is being wasted. What else can I do to continue to improve this situation? And then he looks at the door and he realizes that the hinges are set on the inside of the door. And he's like, hmm, I bet if I flipped the hinges to the outside and I pushed the door out, people would stop and realize that they don't, they no longer need a paper towel. So they'll stop grabbing a paper towel. And hence

a week later, after he flips the hinges, there's no paper towel next to the door. So it wasn't just that he improved enough to get rid of the problem. It's that he had enough, um, desire in him to want to continue to improve on a daily basis. And that's what it's all about. It's not about perfection. It's about progression, right? So when I speak to anyone, it's really important to get them to understand that it's okay to be you. It's okay to interpret it any which way you find works best for you. Because I feel that a lot of times what happens with people who want to explore a plant-based diet is that they're intimidated because it's all or none. It's black and white.

It's right and wrong. And if I decide that I want to do cheese on Saturdays and Sundays, people are going to look at me like, you know, that's not really plant-based. But the reality is it's okay because the more people move in this direction, the better they will feel. The better they feel, the more they want to do it. And the more they want to do it, the better it is for the planet. So when you look at, and for their health and for all the people around them, so when you look at someone who's looking at trying to start a program, the first thing I tell them, it's okay to figure it out.

It's okay to figure it out along the way, and we're going to try to develop habits to make it easier to figure it out, right? It's okay to figure it out along the way, and we're going to try to develop habits to make it easier to automate it because our brains are basically wired to make everything easier, right? So it makes you think less about stuff. I don't know about you, but it wasn't like I was struck by lightning

and overnight I went 100% plant-based. It's an evolution. Absolutely. And I think there is that. There's a very hardened idea out there that, that, uh, you know, the people that are vegan or plant-based, like they just, they do it instinctively and perfectly, uh, you know, one day they're not, and then the other day they are, and that's all she wrote. And that's not, that's not human. It's not, I mean, maybe there are

somebody out there that has had that experience probably, but that is not the common experience. The common experience is one of toil and two steps backwards for every step forward. And I think that as somebody who is an ambassador of the movement, I love that approach because for me, it's about providing a welcome mat for somebody who perhaps is intimidated or is not so sure. And to say, hey, man, it's cool. Come on over here, man. The water's warm. Let's start. Let's see how this works for you.

And let all the other stuff go. It's all dogma. All these labels and all that kind of stuff that are really preventing people from accessing something that could be helpful to them because there's so much baggage that comes with it. You see the statistics all over the place, but one of them that comes to mind is if every American dropped a meat one day a week, it would be the equivalent of removing 7.6 million vehicles off the roads. And you'll see numbers go up or down. But when you see that,

and you really understand that you realize that you can be part of a much bigger solution without being perfect, right? It's one day a week. So you encourage people people to try and I've encouraged a lot of friends I'm like try going plant based for breakfast more often than not people do the same exact thing every single day for breakfast so find something that works for you find something that's delicious and it's plant based and then they realize that it's much easier

than they thought it was going to be and they feel better about their actions oh my god I ate a meal that didn't have meat in it and I didn't die oh no I'm actually functioning and PS I felt better about their actions. Oh my God, I ate a meal that didn't have meat in it and I didn't die. Yeah, oh no. I'm actually functioning. Yeah, and P.S., I felt better about myself so that while I went to lunch or during lunch, I made a better decision because I felt like I already started the day right. It's one of those where a good choice begets another good choice.

where like a good uh choice begets another good choice and if you started the day with like you know some sugary cereal you're probably gonna think at lunch well i already messed up breakfast i might as well have this whatever you gotta you gotta water and fertilize the seed that's it you know you can't just step on it and crush it you know before it has a chance to blossom and everybody has to come into that kind of you and consciousness and realization on their own time. You can't compel somebody to have that realization. And you can't make people feel bad for not doing it the way that you think that they should do it. We're all projecting our ideas onto other people,

and that's not helpful. No. I think it's, I think it's up to us to, to put the information out there and to encourage people to try it in whatever way makes most sense for them and their families. You know, we have families,

right? A lot of people out there want to do something different, but then they're thinking, well, what about my kids? My kids don't need any vegetables. And what about my wife? My spouse is also trying to lose weight. Like I am, or also struggling with this or that. What are they going to say? It's, it's tough. well, what about my kids? My kids don't eat any vegetables. And what about my wife, my spouses,

also trying to lose weight like I am or also struggling with this or that? What are they gonna say? It's tough. It's not easy. No, it's not. And it's an imperfect world with imperfect lives and imperfect families. None of us are perfect.

And a lot of times I think when people look at someone like a vegan or a plant-based advocate, oh my God, they're perfect. I mean, I don't wanna eat around them. You have many times I've walked into a restaurant, someone says, oh my God, don't look at what I'm eating. Don't look at my plate. You make me feel so bad, so self-conscious. I'm like, I'm not going to judge you. Like, chill. I'm okay. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's an interesting thing because it is evolved out of, I mean, originally the idea was, Oh, if you're plant-based or vegan, like you're like a hippie, right?

You're a dirty hippie. And now if now that's sort of that, that perception is shifting into more of like a mainstream, you know, idealization of health. And there's a certain sort of glamorous fashion, fashionable aspect that goes hand in hand with that a little bit. And that's both good and bad. Like there was a, I don't know if you saw, there was a New York Times article a couple of weeks ago that vegans go glam. Yeah. And my family was, was a big part of this article. And, and, you know, part of my advocacy and I would imagine

yours is to show people like, Hey, this doesn't have to be like a hippie thing. Like this is cool and modern and hip. And you know, this is what's happening now. And it's, it's like, hey, this doesn't have to be like a hippie thing. Like, this is cool and modern and hip. And, you know, this is what's happening now. And it's like, look, I've got kids, we're all healthy, we're enjoying our lives. And I try to portray accurately and authentically, like that we're, you know, that we are healthy and vibrant living this lifestyle, because I want to dispel that, like, you know, hardened old myth. But then the pendulum swings the other way. And then people project onto you, oh, like, well, you're this, you know, you're, I can't live up to that standard of what you're doing, which is not what I'm intending, you know, so it's in the same way, I would imagine people think like, well, I can't be Jay-Z or Beyonce, like, so just forget

it. You know what I mean? Like there's a, that barrier then becomes the unexpected next hurdle to kind of address and overcome. Because I want people to feel good and excited and feel like this is accessible to everybody. Well, when I read the article, by the way, it to me was a very cool article that seemed like, man, right on. I love that. You know, that's so cool that you and your family are living that way. And I think that more people should be living this way. It's really cool. And there may be some people that read the

article and interpret it differently. But I think that in life, you either see obstacles or you see opportunities, right? So some people see obstacles and no matter what they read, it's just going to be, you know, something negative to them. And other people are going to see an opportunity. Other people are going to look at it and say, we can do this. We can do it as a family. And they're going to hunker down. And I guarantee you that there's a lot of people that read that around the world that looked at it and thought, this is the first step that we're going to take. The first step was reading this article in the right direction. So congrats for that, because I think that's great. And it really continues to empower people. And I don't think that, you know, you or anyone else living this movement should ever

step back or hide in the shadows because someone else may misinterpret the way they're living or think that they can't live up to your standards. You're living your life. I mean, what cooler, more authentic way for you to be you then to do what you do best, right? Yeah. And I have to be honest and authentic to that, but I'm also conscious of always trying to be, um, you know, somebody who can be, uh, uh, available and accessible as somebody who is, you know, living this plant-based lifestyle so that, you know, people feel like they can kind of connect to the journey a little bit. You know what I mean? Absolutely. That makes sense. No, absolutely. I mean, look, we get it all the time. People always

look at us. Um, and when I say us, I mean like my wife and my kids and say, well, you guys are so disciplined or you guys are, you know, you're lucky because of X or Y or Z. Um, and then there's a lot of people that are like, Oh, this is a reason why I did this. Um, I felt so great about what you guys did. And I noticed that you guys are living a life that's really true to what you guys believe in. But at the end of the day, really, it just comes down to being true to yourself and doing what you think is best for you and your family and understanding that there are so many miraculous benefits to living a plant-based lifestyle, that it's something that, at the very least, you should be curious enough to want to give it even the slightest try,

imperfect as it may be. Yeah, absolutely, man. So let's get to the celebrity stuff. Everybody wants to know about this, you know? So when does Pharrell and all these guys start coming into your life? Is this just because you're sort of the guy in South Beach with the happening gym? Or when do you start working with the people that are cultural influencers? When does that begin?

I'd love to believe that it is because, not because of where I'm geographically speaking, but where I am spiritually and where I am as a person and what I do. I really love what I do. And I guess the word started to spread and people started to find out about what I was doing. And I was helping a lot of, like I said, a lot of people were losing weight and a lot of people were feeling better about themselves. And I was helping people make better lifestyle choices. And one thing led to another and I started working with a few athletes, and that led to a few more.

And then before you know it, I got introduced to a couple of entertainers, some musicians, and I never stopped to think. Even today, I never really stopped to think, how did this happen? How did I get to where I am? I think it was a lot of luck and a lot of hard work. I've had people come up to me and ask me, you know, young trainers that are getting started, well, how do I do this? I want to do exactly what you do. And I'm like, well, I'm not so sure there was a real roadmap to it. I mean, I just, I wanted to do what I was really driven by. And in doing that, I think that that attracted people to me. It wasn't

that I was going out to try to find celebrity clients. It was just, yeah, that was not your agenda. Like what I'd like, what you just said was that, you know, it was because of where you were at spiritually. So, you know, what does that, what does that look like for you? What does that mean? Um, I was never really motivated by, uh, money or by, um, uh, everyone wants to be successful, right? So you definitely have that. Um, it comes into your list of priorities, but it was never number one or number two or number three or number four on my list. Right. So, um, when you do something that you really love and you know that as you know, um, my dean said, you're never going to make any money, but you're still going to do it anyways, you start off, I think, with the right intentions

and knowing that I was put on this earth to do something other than just be, right? So I knew that I could serve and that I could do so in a way that would make people feel better about themselves and to be healthier. And in doing that, I think I was in the right place to allow these really great things to happen. But it was only because I was really enjoying myself. I wasn't trying to find anything else. I was happy and content with where I was and what I was doing. And in, I guess, that happiness, these great things started to happen and they just sort of manifested themselves, right? Yeah, that's very powerful. You know what I mean? I think that that's a really important lesson to people out there that are like chasing whatever dream that they're doing. It's like you have to

do the inside work to make sure that whatever path you are on is really the one that you can invest yourself completely and totally in. That is the thing that is getting you up in the morning excited about what you're doing, not because it's gonna bring you a certain result, but it's the process of just doing it detached from the result, right? So what I hear you say is just, it wasn't whether or not you were gonna continue to do it

had nothing to do with where it was leading you. It was the simple act in and of itself that was giving you the fulfillment. Yeah. People still ask me today, what is it about what you do that you enjoy the most? I still love working one-on-one with people. I love people and I love to work one-on-one, especially when you see the transformations take place, right? Just a couple of weeks, actually more than a couple of weeks ago ago maybe like a month ago now was at pcrm conference you know the physicians can be yeah dr neil barnard um another rock star in this space and and uh they invited me to come to a one of their conferences and they asked would you be

willing to teach a class for us i'm like are you kidding i'd love that so i i taught a group exercise class for a bunch of clinicians doctors and um experts in the plant-based space. And to me, it's just so much fun. And people ask me, well, don't you get tired of doing that? I'm like, no, it's what I really love to do. If you said to me tomorrow, come out to Malibu and teach a whatever class for me, I'd be like, I'm in. Let's go. I love it. So are you still teaching classes and working with clients one-on-one? I mean, it can't be so much anymore, right? No. Honestly, I don't have as much time as I wish for that these days.

I'll do it whenever I can. So I'll be speaking at a corporate event in a week, and I'll do as much as I can one-on-one and then small group settings and sometimes larger group settings because I just love to work with people. But the reality is that when I embarked on this plant-based movement and I realized that there was so much more to it that I had to share with the world, I realized that in order for me to have the greatest impact, I had to be able to reach the greatest amount of people. And in reaching the greatest amount of people, I had to create a platform so that I could speak to these people. So it would be much more powerful

to share the message with many people at once than to just be sharing it one-on-one because it's just far too powerful for me to keep to myself and my clients that get to work with me one-on-one. Because I guess it goes back to the point where I want to be able to share it with people that wouldn't ordinarily be able to hire a personal trainer, wouldn't ordinarily be able to, you know, have someone working with them one-on-one or,

you know, flying someone around the country or around the world. Right, right, right. All right. Well, I'm not going to let you get out of, you know, sort of weasel out of the Beyonce Jay-Z story because we got to tell this. So as the story goes, right, was it Pharrell that introduced you to them, and you start working with them, and this, you know, quite auspicious relationship flowers that has, you know, blossomed into this amazing thing. I mean, it's kind of an incredible thing, right? So you start working with, you know, two people who are arguably have the largest cultural impact on the planet of anybody else. It's kind of a staggering thing. It's amazing. So you're working with them as a trainer,

but at some point, the nutrition component of what you do starts to creep in. Is that a fair representation? I don't want to put words in your mouth, but tell me how this all developed. representation or, you know, I don't want to put words in your mouth, but tell me, you know, tell me how this all kind of developed. Yeah, that's pretty, I guess, pretty accurate. I'll share something with you that I haven't shared with anyone before. I was working in Miami with some athletes. And then I remember I was working with a football player. And he says, you know, I have a friend who's really, really talented. Um, and he, uh, he was like, you know, an incredible player in college and he just didn't get drafted and he, he could use your help. Um, he's like hit a really low spot and he basically doesn't have a job and he's, you know, trying to get into the NFL and he just, uh, he's in a really low

place right now. Would you be willing to speak to him? And I said, yeah, man, absolutely. Um, and I, I met this guy and we totally hit it off and I was like, why don't you just start coming to the club on a daily basis? I had the place on the beach, um, start coming to the club and we'll, we'll train together. He's like, well, but I can't afford to come here. And I was like, oh, don't worry about it. You know, just, just come. Um, and he started coming to the, to the gym on a daily basis and we training and and and he had I mean like his performance improved like light years in a very short period of time was just a really hungry really hungry kid and just an incredible soul really really nice guy incredible human being

he happened to be friends with someone that he had played with years back, who, but he bumped into the guy one day, we were walking out of the club, and he bumps into this guy. And he's like, Hey, man, what's up? And he, and he says, Hey, what's going on? How are you? Oh, this is Michael. I'm introduced to Michael. So introduces me to this guy, Ben. And, and then, you know, Ben and I just, you know, chatted for a few minutes and then he went his way. I went my way. And then, um, my friend took off. Um, a couple of days later, I see Ben again and I'm like, Hey, what's up, man? How are you? And, uh, a week later he says, Hey, I want to introduce you to someone. Um, and I said, yeah, no problem. He's like,

this is Pharrell. This is, um, the guy I work for. I work for. I thought Ben was a football player or something. I had no idea what he did or who he was. We just, he was a really sweet guy and we hit it off and we just started talking on a daily basis. And before you knew it, you know, made an introduction to Pharrell. And Pharrell and I started, we hit it off and he's just another really amazing human being. And we just, we hit it off right away and we started working together.

And sometime down the road, he says, you know, I have a friend that's coming into town, um, that I'd love for you to meet. And I said, yeah, no problem. And that friend was Jay-Z and we met. And again, another guy with, I mean, just a really, really special guy. Um, the minute we met, I just, you know, we, we hit it off and I knew he was someone special just from the few words that we shared. How do you, like, if you had to articulate what that is, that makes like him so unique and special. You know, I, I was, uh, I want to say that I was born with a special, um, um, I don't know what you want to call it a gift or, um, I have the disability to be able to just walk into a room and I can tell

people I just you know I just get this feeling in my stomach I just know people you just get this feeling and I think that everyone has it I think we suppress it and and I think that a lot of times we don't listen to it and we do so many things to our bodies that we beat them up so a lot of times they're not as as in tune as they should be but just people that are kind and then that are kind and you can tell just by body language. They're looking you in the eye when they're talking to you and the way that they speak to you and the words that they use and how they think and how they act and how they treat others and you. I'm very observant.

I'm like obsessed with watching everything in the world, right? I'm just obsessed with life and I'm obsessed with watching how people handle other people and how they, you know. Curious. I'm really, really curious, eternally curious about everything, but people being one of them. But people being one of them. And I think that this just allowed me to develop a keener sense of feeling for people, for individuals. And when we met, we just hit it off. And he said, hey, would you be willing to come to New York for a couple weeks to help me out?

And I said, sure, man. Just like that? Yeah, well, we spoke for a little while. And the next day we saw each other. And then he said, would you be willing to come to New York for a couple weeks? And that couple weeks turned into a 10-plus year relationship. Right, wow, wow, wow. So during that period of time, you would kind of come and go from Miami to wherever they were? Yeah, so I just got married at the time, and I said to my wife,

I'm going to go to New York next week. You want to come with me? And she said, yeah, I'd love to. And we just started, you know, traveling just about everywhere together. And so I would fly out of Miami on like, let's say, Monday. And I'd fly back on Friday. And eventually, we started having kids. So my wife started staying in Miami. And I kept traveling.

She's like, this is not fair. I think I got the short end of the stick interesting um and then where does where does the you know curiosity on their part about the diet you know begin and and this sort of you know 22 day experiment of them kind of adopting a plant-based diet that became this major news story well i think that you the more time you spend with your friends the more you get to know them. And being that I travel or was traveling a lot at the time with them, you get to see how someone lives, right? So it's not just train, train, train, train, train, and then at night I go and whatever. I get wasted or I go and eat a big steak dinner or what have you.

They were watching me. I mean they get to see me on a daily basis how I live. Right. And are you like living with them or you have your own hotel room? No, no, no, no. I live my own life, but you know, you, you spend time with your friends. Like you and I are spending a good amount of time today. If we go to dinner, you'll see what I eat. And then if tomorrow you see me for breakfast, you'll see what I eat for breakfast. And then you'll see if I train or I don't train. And you got, the more time you spend with your friends and more,

you know, they say you really want to get to know your friends, travel with them. Well, to your friends and more, you know, they say you really want to get to know your friends, travel with them. Well, we're traveling together, right? So I think that in and of itself develops, you develop a curiosity for what other people do, not just because I'm, you know, their trainer or their, you know, life coach or health coach or nutritionist or whatever it is you want to think it is. The reality is that you're friends. You just watch them and you see what they do. And I think that in watching, you become curious about what it is that they do and why what they do works. And I live a pretty clean life.

I don't drink. I don't smoke. I don't do drugs. I'm a really clean eater, and I love to work out. And when you see the benefits of that right in front of you on a daily basis, I think that it sort of piques people's curiosity. So they start asking questions? Yeah.

Oh, and then one day I said, hey, you know what would be really cool if – we had talked about plant-based nutrition for a while and then one day I said, hey, you know what would be really cool is if we added a plant-based nutrition for a while and then one day i said hey you know it'd be really cool as if we um if we added a plant-based breakfast to um to your day he's like yeah i think that would be really cool um let's try that i could do that i could do breakfast i'm like yeah of course you could do breakfast so we added a breakfast and a couple of months later it was so easy that i don't think anyone thought anything of it. Jay just called and said, hey, you know what? I've been thinking about this.

I remember it was in Miami. He called me. I was sitting in my office. He says, I've been thinking about this. Why don't we do something? You have that program, the 22-Day Vegan Challenge. We had put up when I when I started with 22 days nutrition, I didn't want to just be a company that was going to benefit people who bought from it, right. So I didn't want it to be like you buy one

thing for me, I give you one thing you buy one thing for me, I give you another thing, I wanted it to be a little bit more, more, I don't know, inclusive, a little bit more accessible so i created a platform online and i wanted that platform to be a really robust engine to help people live a healthier life so to create a plant-based lifestyle solution if you will so we wanted to share recipes we wanted to share ideas with people here's what's great about goji berries here's why you should do b12 this is why you should do methyl instead of cobalt. You know, so like a lot of different things that ranged in anything that, you know, I was curious about or that I thought people might be interested in. So we started developing this

sort of archive of really great content. And I thought to myself, let's create a program. Let's create a program around the whole 22 day concept where we help people, give them all the tools they need to go plant-based for 22 days. So the name 22 days comes from the idea that it takes 21 days to make or break a habit. So if it takes 21 days to make or break a habit on the 22nd day, you're armed with a new tool to live a healthier life, right? So it's on the notion that it takes a certain amount of time to create that synaptic pathway, to create that path in your brain that is like riding a bicycle. You don't forget how to ride a bike once you learn it. And I thought to myself, if we help people, if we arm them with the tools they need over the course of 21 days, once they reach the 22nd day, they'll be able to keep this going. This will be something that's incredibly sustainable.

So we put this program online and we just gave it to people for free. We just thought it'd be really fun. So we gave them recipes, we gave them tips. And if you put your email address, we would send you basically messages of the day, tip of the day with what you should have for breakfast, lunch, and dinner, suggestions, right? And then exercises.

Then I threw the exercise component into your workout for today. This is what you should have for breakfast, lunch, and dinner. Suggestions, right? And then exercises. Then I threw the exercise component into it. This is your workout for today. This is what you should be doing today. And then Jay's like, this is really cool. You have this platform. Why don't I use that? Why don't you set me up on it? And we take this 22-day challenge.

And it was getting close to his birthday. He's like, I'll do it for my birthday. His birthday is December 4th. He's like, I'll do it starting my birthday. And then by the time I finished 22 days later, it'll be Christmas. So it'll be like this whole really cool spiritual cleansing, health, empowerment. He was 44 at the time, right? I think he was 42 when he did it. 42 or 43. Can't remember now. But I remember that I was like, wow, that's really cool, man.

That would be awesome. And then he says, yeah, and what I want to do is I also want to share it with my friends, my fans, people that know me. And I thought, wow, this is incredibly powerful because we're sharing something that matters, right? So a lot of times you realize that the magazines are like you know have all that celebrity fodder put nonsense out a lot of the times 99 of the time is not true and it's just stuff that doesn't really empower anyone but i thought here's someone with a really big platform doing something to really empower people biggest platform right you know except for you know maybe a world leader yeah i mean like but in terms of of literally influencing uh you know, maybe a world leader. You know what I mean? Like, but in terms of literally influencing,

you know, kind of opinion on cultural matters, like there's arguably nobody who is more powerful or potent than that couple. Like, it's incredible. I agree. So that's a huge thing, you know, that they would say, hey, we want to share this. Like this, you know, this notion of Like this notion of taking more control of your health and the relationship that that has to diet.

Like that's not a small thing. No, and if you know them, you know that they're always about giving back. Always about giving back. Always about giving more than they receive. And the truth is that what better way to give back to someone than to arm them with health. I mean, that's just like incredibly powerful. And you said it earlier that for many years,

it was this notion of this, you know, Birkenstock, no deodorant worrying, dreadlock, you know, hippie in Colorado. That was the vegan. That poster child is anyone right now it's an amalgamation of color race sex i mean everything right so there's no one person that fits that who is a vegan like if you walked into a room now and said okay pick out a vegan you'd never be able to pick them out because it's he or she comes in many different shape sizes forms ages um and and it's really cool i And I think that a big part of that

is that people like J&B have gotten behind it and have said, you know, this is what we do. This is why we do it. Use it in a way that makes most sense to you. I think that's incredibly powerful. Yeah. And in fairness, you know, they're not 100% plant not 100% plant based, like they did the 22 day thing. And they're, they're very upfront and open about the fact that they're not living a 100% plant based. Today they are, by the way. Oh, they are today. Okay. Well, good. I'm glad to hear that. Today, meaning today, meaning, you know, for this 24 hour period, or today, meaning like they're now they're back on the program.

Yeah, they like to, you know, like I said, it's whatever works best back on the program yeah they they like to you know like i said um it's whatever works best for you right so they like to do it in in waves and they they find uh success and getting on getting off getting on getting off i think it'll be a matter of time before they feel so great um they realize that they're so great when they're on it that um they want to do it all the time yeah it's It's interesting. I mean, I think, you know, everybody's different. Um, for me, like I can't rubber band, cause like rubber banding in going in and out and in and out of like doing what I know is best for me. Just, it's, it creates like dissonance for me.

You know what I mean? Like I, I don't, uh, I don't know what it is. I think it's because i'm in recovery for alcoholism like i i have to approach it almost like the same way i approach drugs and alcohol and i can find like comfort and security of just saying this is my rule you know and i just adhere to this rule of my life is better um but if i like i can't do cheat days or go on and off like then because then i start craving those foods and before you know it like i'm just completely off the reservation altogether but i know not everyone's like that you know what i mean well the truth is i'm very similar in that i i'm 100 100 of the time

and it's not because of fear of anything other than that I just, I know better, right? So I'm like, why would I, you know, why would I go back to? Well, also with that consciousness shift also, and you realize like what goes into all of this, like now I can't, I just, I can't, there's no way I could go back. Yeah. And then being a parent, I think also places an extra amount of pressure or awareness in you that you just want to be part of something

bigger and greater. And you want to be the change, right? That you want to see in the world. And to my kids, like, I don't know, because they're so young, I don't know that they would get it if I wasn't plant-based today. And then tomorrow I was, I don't know that they would get the meaning of how powerful it is to be focused on something. And the reality is that I think it's so incredibly powerful that it means that much to me to be committed to it 100% of the time. It's not just, oh, today I care about, you know, breast cancer awareness, but tomorrow, eh, not so much. I mean, it's something that I'm always going to care about, right? So if I care about it all the time, I should be able to commit myself to it fully and completely. Yeah. And as an ambassador,

you know, for you to be a hundred percent is to say, not only, you know, is it possible, it's plausible and you can be an example and show people that, you know, it's accessible for them as well, you know, that they can aspire to this, you know, to this lifestyle and that it's not something that is out of reach. To kind of get back to, you know, Beyonce and Jay-Z, you know, a sort of cynical person would say, well, 22 day revolution, but then they went back to eating meat. So, you know, oh, you know, so much for that. You know what I mean? Like that sort of would be like kind of a typical kind of pop culture negative reaction to what's going on. So do you have to like weather that kind of reaction? Like how do you speak to that? I'm incredibly optimist.

I'm the eternal optimist. I don't pay attention to that. But the reality is that I have seen and heard so many great comments and compliments come from, you know, I didn't think I could do it until I saw them do it. Or I didn't think it was possible until I saw that, you know, she could do it. Or I did it because she's my queen. I did it because I love him and everything he does is perfect. Right? So when you see that and you hear that, you get really excited. So maybe there's someone that says that and you hear that you get really excited so maybe there's someone that says that you know whatever a naysayer or you know glasses half empty guy and you know that's

like i said you can either you can either see an obstacle or you can see an opportunity and i see opportunities every day i believe that their heart is is in the right place with it too i mean i remember i don't know what video it was but beyonce is wearing the kl t-shirt like as she's 7-eleven yeah it's like she didn't have to wear that shirt. You know, like that's kind of an amazing, that's kind of an amazing moment in the plant-based movement. Just that one act alone. And when you see that someone has such an incredibly powerful and diverse platform and they use it to do such good, I mean, how could you not applaud that? Seriously. It's not just about plant-based, but about everything that she does and that he does. I mean, it's just,

it's about the bigger picture. What do people not understand about, you know, who those people are? Like, you know, you could read the magazines or whatever, but obviously, like, we don't, you know, we don't know them like you do. I mean, what is, you know, what do you, what do you notice about them that you wish people could kind of better understand? Honestly, I look at all of my friends and my loved ones with the exact same set of eyes, right? So I don't look and see a celebrity super couple. super couple. I just see great human beings that are just really kind people that want to leave this earth better than they found it. And that's like a common trait in the people that I love. Maybe it's something that I gravitate towards, or maybe it's something that I want to be a part of. But the reality is, greatness isn't defined by success success or by how much money you have in the bank or by how many followers you have on Twitter or Instagram.

Greatness is defined by who you are and what you do on a daily basis. It's not about what you wear or who you know. It's about who you are as an individual. You could be a great landscape architect. You could be a great waiter. You could be a great, um, landscape architect. You could be a great waiter. You could be a great musician. Um, and the success, I think that that's like the one biggest, um, um, the, the one biggest issue we have, uh, as a country is that we have, um, we have misinterpreted success with the amount of money someone makes.

And success has nothing to do with money. Everything to do with who you are, what you do, how you make other people feel, you know, on a daily basis. And when you look at that, they're extremely successful. They make people feel great. They treat people well. They're good human beings. You can look at it however you want to look at it,

but the reality is at the end of the day, we all put on our pants one leg at a time or take them off one leg at a time, and the rest is, I think, just nonsense. Yeah, that's super interesting. In reflecting on your kind of trajectory, I sort of see this person who, you know, being yourself, somebody who knew very early on and very clearly, like, what your personal truth was and is, and just has consistently stood in that. And as a result of kind of being that lighthouse, so to speak, an amazing confluence of events has occurred to kind of precipitate this amazing situation that you're in right now where now you're in a position through this new company and your books

to influence people on a mass level, going from that one-on-one training situation to really being able to, you know, change paradigms about health and nutrition. It's really kind of an amazing thing. Thank you, man. Thank you. So let's talk about this. So Beyonce and Jay-Z, they do the 22-day thing. You guys decide to collaborate on this 22-days nutrition company that then kind of blossoms into not only food products that you can find at the store, but also a food delivery service, right? And then the book, and the book was insanely – I mean, like, I remember when the book came out. Was it number one on Amazon? Was it number one, New York times? Yeah. Yeah. It was, you know, you've been through the process and you've done it all. You're the guy.

Yeah. But like to, to be like at that strata is like, that's insane, man. So your life must have been crazy. I've been floating to be honest with you. I still haven't come down. I mean, it's, it came out like it was like April, right when it came yeah end of april uh-huh and then we had you did the talk show circuit and all of that but like i mean like the number one selling book in the country you know and you're not going to believe this but um we did all the big shows right and it wasn't until i think that what what clicked was a lot of times people think that vegan or plant-based living or vegetarianism is like, okay, it's healthier, but it probably tastes really bad and I'm going to be eating really terrible food. And it wasn't until we went on The View and had like this incredible offering of all the different kinds of food so we went out we i basically made all of the recipes or a bunch of recipes from the book and i brought them to the view for them to try and they were

just blown away they were just like wait this is what this is oh i could do this every day and it wasn't until people saw that that it was like i mean like it just took off that was the one thing that it was the it was the one thing that just everyone just went bananas i mean it's such a weird thing too because you think like oh it's going to be that today show appearance yeah it's going to be this thing and then and then and then you see like oh some things just miss like it doesn't like it can be a huge thing and like it's not connecting or whatever yeah exactly exactly we did you know good morning america today show and you just see everything going on dr oz i mean and everything it's not connecting or whatever. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. We did, you know, Good Morning America Today show and you just see everything going on.

Dr. Oz, I mean, and everything was amazing but it wasn't until that happened that people saw the food and they connected with it and they were like, and then all the girls and then the girls from The View

were eating the food and they were loving and they'd warned me. They were like, look, we're going to be really honest with you. If you bring something they don't like, they'll spit it out. I mean, these girls are really honest and i was like i'm i'm not scared i mean let's let's do this i think it's gonna be fun and sure enough we did it and they just they enjoyed it so much that i think that it translated well you couldn't we could not have

planned that i mean we weren't trying to orchestrate anything it was just like but did the book come out at the same time that you launched the food delivery service no were those no and and and i think a lot of people think wow what brilliant what genius marketing and and the truth is that as much as i'd love to take credit for all of it i just i can't because it's not in me um the reality is what happened was when b and j did the program a lot of people jumped on with them. A lot of their fans jumped on, and then we started getting people emailing us on a daily basis. Oh, my God, I feel so good. Oh, my God, I've slept better than I've slept in the last 10 years. Oh, my God, my cholesterol went down.

Oh, my God, I no longer have arrhythmias. You know, you hear about it, right? My blood sugar went down so low that I had to get off my diabetes medication. Oh, medication. Oh my God, this happened. Oh my God, that happened. It was all beautiful. And then there was one comment at the end. Every single email had a very similar comment. And it was something like, but I wish somebody could make this food for me. I don't know how much longer I'll be able to, you know, cook breakfast, lunch, dinner every single day. Just, it's a lot. I wish someone could do this for me. I wish someone can make the foods. Why don't you guys make the food?

I wish someone can make the food. I wish someone. And then after reading a thousand, thousands of emails, I was like, well, I guess we could make food. Why not? Let me look into it. And I just started looking around. I started trying to find.

I was like, I know we have really awesome recipes. Maybe I can find the kitchen that we can make something happen. If not, we'll go out and build the kitchen. How do we do this? And then we spent about 10 months trying to figure it out. Yeah, it's tough to find recipes that are going to be able to scale and that are going to keep and how you're going to ship them. That's not easy.

It's so difficult. You have no idea. I don't. But no preserv them like that's not so difficult you have no idea like no but no preservatives it's not frozen it's all usd organic non-gmo gluten-free soy-free and it's all fresh so it's like incredibly difficult you can make a dish today and it tastes great but if you the minute you put that in a container and you just seal it there's i mean it's got to keep fresh for you got to ship it to gotta keep fresh for you gotta ship it to someone then how do you ship it and how if you're if you have a kitchen on the east coast

how do you get to the west coast if you have a kitchen on the west coast how do you get to the east coast and it's how much is it you know i mean it was very it was a super complicated process but it was a lot of fun to know um i was just focused on i'm going to be able to satisfy their needs i think this is going to be a lot of fun. This is going to be a big game changer because, and when I say game changer, I don't mean like our company's going to blow up. That was never the thought that drove me to do this. It was more of we're going to be able to affect more lives.

We're going to be able to help more people be healthy. We're going to help people get healthier. We're going to help people get off their meds. It was about if we're really truly going to live this and if we really want to be these ambassadors of wellness, we have to be able to help people wherever they need most help. Where they're at. Yeah. And how did you, so how did you execute on this? I mean, did you start off just like doing it in Miami and then blowing it out gradually?

No, we launched nationally day one. Miami and then blowing it out gradually? No, we launched nationally day one. I guess that's how you can just go big or go home when it's like B and J. That's my motto. We said, let's just... I didn't want to put myself in a position... Where are the kitchens and where are the distribution facilities? I wanted to be here. I wanted to be here in California, hence why I'm here so much. But I wanted to be here in California because it's just we know that, you know, demographically speaking, there's just so many people out here. I mean, and we thought that it would probably be the easiest to get food. And then I met with a lot of kitchens around the country, and I found, to me, the best kitchen with the greatest resources, the best setup, the the cleanest and i'm like a neat freak and i'm a maniac for detail so i wanted everything to be absolutely perfect and i want to be able to

source this stuff and i wanted to know that the sort of stuff was going to be sourced locally and they met they like checked all the boxes um so uh day one we launched um nationwide and uh it was uh i mean it was it was I mean it was incredible it was really incredible I think we had something happened right in the beginning where we got a little bit of like press because somebody something had gone on

and I think around that time Bea came out with some sort of an announcement well we wanted to make it really clear to people we don't want people to think if she ever says anything that there's like some hidden agenda. So we just made an announcement, hey, we're partnering up to do this. And just putting out that one message, people just started going bananas. And it was an awesome start.

It's been an incredible year. Yeah, so it hasn't even been a year yet, right? We launched in January. Right. All right, so here's a question that would be on my mind, and I know some of my friends, like actually a buddy of mine just posted on Facebook the other day. He's a friend of mine, my friend Gordon.

He lives in Venice, big, super athletic dude, does Spartan races, really fit, and has been traditionally on different kinds of diets. And he's super interested in exploring plant-based, uh, but he doesn't cook and he doesn't want to cook. And he's like, he put it out on Facebook, like, Hey, I'm looking for, uh, you know, I need, I need a great plant-based meal delivery service, but I don't want to have to like order three entrees. Like, am I going to get enough food? Like he's worried about whether it's going to three entrees? Like, am I going to get enough food? Like he's worried about whether it's going to

satiate him, you know, can you get, can you solve his problem? I think we can. Our portions are huge. Are they are? And I don't know if he's already plant-based. I haven't tried yours yet. No. Well, he's like, I don't know if he is yet either. I mean, he's tiptoeing around it. Like he wants to check it out. Well, you know this from experience, right? So when you move to a plant-based diet, you realize you're eating a right? So when you move to a plant-based diet, you realize you're eating a lot more food than you typically eat because just its volume, right? So it's like you're looking at the calories per fat and protein and carbohydrates. So you're going to have a lot greater volume of food for fewer calories.

So it just depends. If he's huge, like a bodybuilder type huge, like 200 plus pounds, maybe he needs a little bit more but the reality is i haven't had one person come back to me yet and say there's not enough food and as a matter of fact i have people call me that know me they're like hey i just ordered you from like you dummy why'd you order the food i would have sent it you're like no no i want to support the brand i'm like okay i would have but i have a question am i supposed to eat all this stuff i'm like yeah like no way i'm like yeah okay and they try it and they're like wow i'm i'm losing weight or i'm

you know exactly where i need to be and i think that a lot of times we think that there's like this you know there's so much science behind it and you need to know like you know how many grams of fat and how many grams of carbohydrates and how much protein. We get so caught up in the numbers of it all that we just don't eat the food. Like when you look at Dan Buettner's work, right? You look at the Blue Zones. Those guys that are living to be 115 aren't looking at how many calories they're consuming on a daily basis. Do you think they're there with a pencil and a piece of paper? Their ratio of carbs to fat. They're not thinking about it. They're just living. They're just eating really good, clean food and predominantly

plant-based diet. And when you look at all of the other studies combined, you realize that the people that are living the lives that we want to ultimately live aren't looking at the numbers of it all. They're just enjoying great, clean, healthy food. And that's exactly what we're sending people. Yeah, I love that. I get emails like that all the time, people wanting to. And I'm like, I don't know. I never think about that.

And you shouldn't, by the way. Oh, but do you think I'm going to need another 400 grams of protein if I want to maintain this much? I'm like, look, everyone is different, but the reality is jump in, and then you'll figure it out very, very quickly if you think that you're at the right place or not. And more often than not, you find that people jump in, and in the beginning they're thinking about it all the time,

and then they just stop thinking about it because they realize it's something they shouldn't have ever worried about to begin with. Right. So I'm sure you get the protein question every day. So how do you handle that one? Well, the reality is that we consume way more protein than we need to, you know that. And I just have to share that with people because most people don't realize that the typical American diet has almost double the amount of protein that they should be consuming on a daily basis. And when just that one fact alone, people are like, oh, really?

I'm like, yeah. And we've seen, you know, studies like the Harvard study, and we've seen a lot of studies come out that, you know, just increasing your, you know, animal protein intake by just a little bit increases your risk factors for cancer and diabetes by X, some as high as 50%. And when you look at some of the numbers, and you realize that we are consuming, you know, far too much protein, and a lot of that protein is coming from animal sources. So when someone moves to a plant-based diet, it's usually something

they don't have to think about. But the truth is that if you're a really hardcore athlete, and you want to feel like you're doing something better, like added insurance, if you will, like, you know, I want a post-workout, I want a recovery drink, you could do a plant-based protein. I mean, that's super clean. As a matter of fact, we have really clean plant-based proteins for that specific person. What's the source of the protein? We have a really unique formula because we're the only guys in the world that have USD organic pea protein that's grown and processed in the US and no one else has this pea protein. Most of the pea protein that you see out there, even the USD organic stuff is grown in Canada, shipped to China. It's processed in China. It's like an amalgamation of stuff. And then it gets

shipped back here. So it's incredibly expensive for us to buy our stuff, but I formulate for myself. I don't, you know, formulate for label copy. I formulate for function. So when I go out there, I want to make sure that I'm putting the best ingredients. And like I said, in the beginning, there's no compromise. That's one thing we don't do. We don't compromise. So we want to make sure that we put the best products that we can on the shelves to be able to help people ultimately live the life that they want to be living. So to get back to the protein question then, I mean, basically, don't worry about it. Yeah, I'm not worrying about it. I don't sit around thinking, man, did I get enough protein today?

And when you start living it, and it's hard for someone that, I get it, it's really difficult for that guy that's been supplementing four times a day with whey since he's 18. It's hard for you to tell them not to worry about it because it's the habit that they've ingrained into their daily lives. And it's not until they just let go a little bit that they realize that it was something that they really didn't need to worry about to begin with, because you realize you're not going to lose any muscle mass. You're not going to perform, you know, whatever at sub optimal levels because you're not consuming enough protein. Because if you're on a plant-based diet and you're eating the right amount of foods with the right amount of diversity, you're going to be just fine. right amount of foods with the right amount of diversity, you're going to be just fine. Yeah, it's tricky with guys because the idea that you would adopt a diet that potentially,

you know, in their mind, you know, fallaciously or otherwise could lead them to a place of being weaker is almost an assault on identity, like your sense of who you are as a man and, you know, masculinity, etc. So it's a very loaded thing. Like, I understand why everyone wants to know the answer to that. And it's almost like they have to experience it for themselves to get past it, to realize, like, it's a red herring. Yeah. You know, do you know Dr. Garth Davis? I think he was at that PCRM conference. I know.

Yeah, I've known his work. Oh, yeah, yeah. So his book just came out this week called Proteinaholic. It amazing yeah i gotta check it out so i mean he did an unbelievable amount of research on this subject you know like you know the whole protein question is like a whole book devoted to it it's pretty cool it's yeah it's funny because when you go to like the pcrm conferences or the conferences where these guys are all converging, it's almost like laughable, right? When you ask these guys about protein, you're like, come on, man.

You're not asking me about protein today, October whatever, it's 2015. No way. Are you kidding me? But then again, you can look at, I looked at Dan Buettner's Instagram feed today and he's taking pictures of the breakfast at some other conference that he's at where it's just bacon and eggs and, you know, like the other medical conferences where that still is very much an issue.

Like the PCRM conference is the anomaly. Those guys do it right. By the way, every single thing is plant-based. I mean, that was like the greatest buffet that I've ever seen in my life. Hats off to Jill and the team at PCRM. Yes, for sure, man. And you have to live it, right? You have to be able to walk the walk. If you're going to be able to preach it,

you have to be able to live it. And these guys are doing it really well. Yeah, cool. All right. Well, I'm going to let you go here. But before I do, I thought it would be cool if you could just leave some people with, you know, maybe some of the tips that you would convey to somebody who's new to this lifestyle, who's interested, you know, maybe some of the tips that you would convey to somebody who's new to this lifestyle, who's interested, you know, whether it's getting fit for the first time or the first time in a long time, or switching up their diet, you know, but they're intimidated, they're not sure where to start. I mean, what are, you know, some kind of, you know, tactile takeaways that you can give people, you know, besides, you know,

obviously reading your book and checking out the websites, which we're going to give everybody all that information. Well, everyone's at a certain place in their lives today. And I think that you're not defined by what happens to you in life, but rather by what you do when these things happen to you, right? So it's really simple in that we know today more than we've ever known about the benefits of a plant-based diet. And we've spent a little bit of time talking about there's really no right or wrong way to do it. Once you start to lean, you realize that you become fully immersed in it very quickly because you just start to feel better about yourself and when you look at something that i say that there's no

there's no single thing in your life that you can do that will have a greater impact than adopting a plant-based diet and when i say a greater impact in your life, in the life of the people around you, in the environment, in promoting a cruelty-free lifestyle and creating more kindness in the world, there's no single act that you can do that would have greater impact than adopting a plant-based diet.

When you know that, and you know that you can reduce the risk of many of the diseases that affect us today, heart disease, diabetes, stroke, cancer, dementia. And you know that you can sleep better. And you know you're going to have improved performance not just on the field but sexual performance as well. well. And you know that you're, you're going to get rid of whatever mood swings you had, and you're just physically and psychologically going to feel like a better version of yourself. How is that not enough to inspire you to take that first step or to take that first bite out of something that can heal you from the inside out? Well, that's just crazy talk. I mean,

the inside out. Well, that's just crazy talk. I mean, that was beautiful, man. Thank you. Thanks for your time, man. I appreciate it. Great talking to you. Likewise. Uh, if you're digging on Marco, uh, and want to connect with him further, the best way to do that, your website is Marco Borges.com and 22 days nutrition.com. And the book is the 22 day revolution. Yes. Thank you. Anywhere else? Facebook and Twitter, 22 Days Nutrition is like on all those places, right? Is that the best place?

Yeah, exactly. Cool, man. Thank you. Very kind of you. Let's do this again. Absolutely. Maybe we'll do dinner tonight. We have a spot

already picked out for you. Oh, yeah. Not to Kenny's place. I'm going to have to call the wife and see how that goes. But I'd love to, man. That's cool. And we're going to see each other in Miami in November.

I'm looking forward to it. Cool, man. It's going to be great. Awesome, man. Thanks so much. Thank you. Peace. Plants.

All right, we did it. I hope you guys enjoyed that. Don't forget to check out this week's comprehensive show notes at richworld.com, I hope you guys enjoyed that. Don't forget to check out this week's comprehensive show notes at richworld.com, a robust compilation of articles, books, materials, and resources related to today's conversation. And make a point to check out Marco's book, The 22-Day Revolution, the plant-based program that will transform your body, reset your habits, and change your life.

Use the Amazon banner ad, of course, for that purchase. And you can go to 22daysnutrition.com to learn more about his nutrition products and meal delivery service. Also, don't forget to subscribe, subscribe. Did I say that right? Subscribe to my newsletter and download the free iOS app to access the entire RRP catalog for free.

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both framed and unframed, all kinds of really cool stuff to take your health and your life to the next level. Keep sending in your questions for future Q&A podcasts to info at richroll.com. And if you want more, I got two video courses at mindbodygreen.com, one on goal setting called The Art of Living with Purpose, and one on nutrition called The Ultimate Guide to Plant-Based Nutrition. Just go to mindbodygreen.com click on video courses uh you'll find me there and lots of additional information they're very affordably priced and i'm really proud of them multiple hours of streaming video content uh it's good stuff thank you so much for uh the support of the show by telling your friends sharing it it on social media, all that good stuff.

I really appreciate it. And for always, of course, using the Amazon banner at richroll.com for all your Amazon purchases. I am signing off from Elkhart and I'll see you guys back here in a few days.

Make it great. Peace. Plants. Thank you.