The Rich Roll Podcast - Surfing For Change: Buy Local, Surf Global
Episode Date: April 28, 2014So many things wrong in the world. Melting ice caps. Greenhouse gas emissions. Global climate change. GMO Frankenfoods. Depleted soils. Poisoned fish. Rampant childhood obesity. Unsustainable food s...ystems. Horrifying school lunch programs. Unprecedented hurricanes. Insane tsunamis. Constant forest fires. And oh yeah – how about that Texas-sized flotilla of plasticized garbage goo floating out in the Pacific somewhere? I could go on like this all day. We all could. Because in truth it's easy to identify — and become despondent (if not just altogether passive and nonplussed) about the state of the planet, the environment, our citizenship and basic humanity when you take an honest look at the havoc we have wrecked upon ourselves. F-it. I give up. It's too late. Then you meet a guy like Kyle Thiermann. Pro Surfer. Filmmaker. Public Speaker. Environmentalist. Humanitarian. 24 years old. Suddenly, all that despondency is replaced with hope – optimism for the future of the planet and humanity courtesy of the next generation. I had never heard of Kyle until a buddy of mine posted an image on Instagram a few months back that promoted Kyle's latest short film: Pro Surfers vs. GMO's : I immediately clicked to watch and was honestly moved. Sure, the film is informative and inspiring. But beyond the content, I was genuinely impressed to find such a young guy so passionate about our food system. Digging deeper I realized this doc was nothing new for this Santa Cruz kid, who was raised by documentary filmmaker parents and has been putting out short films on global health and environmental issues for years via Surfing For Change — Kyle's online YouTube series merging surf imagery & lifestyle with current global issues with focus on the power of individuals to create a better world through everyday decisions. Kyle's impact has already been substantial. Beyond speaking gigs at universities across the US and features in publications like Outside Magazine and Surfer Magazine, one of Kyle’s first film projects took a look at global bank funding and suggested that people divest from the Bank of Americas of the world and instead invest in local communities and credit unions. As a direct result of this specific project, Surfing for Change tracked over $110 million of lending power moving out of centralized banks and into local communities. That is serious impact. That is awesome. If that's not enough, Kyle gets extra cool points for being the only person I am aware of to ever deliver a TED Talk without a shirt on. That takes cajones. Be honest: if you were a handsome pro surfer in your early 20's whose job was to travel the world in search of the tastiest waves, how much time do you think you would spend on trying to make a difference in the world? Kyle doesn't have to do what he does. The fact that he chooses of his own volition to invest himself in serving a higher purpose makes his message all the more powerful and resonant. The millennial generation gets a ton of flack for allegedly being entitled and narcissistic. But Kyle upends this presumption as misplaced, if not altogether false. My experience — as both a father of two millennial teenage boys and as someone who spends quite a bit of time with people far younger than myself — is that there are countless young people out there a lot like Kyle. Enjoy! Rich
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Welcome to the Rich Roll Podcast, episode 82, with pro surfer Kyle Tierman.
The Rich Roll Podcast.
Hey everybody, welcome to the show, to the RRP, to the Rich Roll Podcast, where each
week we get up close and personal with some of the most compelling, forward-thinking,
paradigm-breaking disruptors in health, wellness, fitness, nutrition, environmentalism, spirituality,
creativity, art, entrepreneurialism, and above all, life transformation.
The goal is simple, to motivate and inspire you to take your life to
the next level, to help you blow through the glass ceiling on your innate human potential,
in a word, to help you discover, unlock, and unleash your best, most authentic self.
My name is Rich Roll, and if you're new to the show, who am I? Well, I'm a dad, I'm a writer,
I'm a husband, I'm a plant-eating, bike-riding, trail-running,
pool rat.
And today, I'll be your guide down this audio rabbit hole.
So what's going on in the world right now?
We got greenhouse gas emissions.
We have global climate change, melting ice caps.
We have unprecedented hurricanes, tsunamis, forest fires, unsustainable food production systems, the infiltration of GMOs in our food supply, the depletion of our soils, the obesity epidemic, the poisoning of our fish.
And oh yeah, how about that Texas-sized flotilla of plasticized garbage goo floating out in the Pacific somewhere?
All these problems, all these things that we have
created, that mankind has created. It's easy to, you know, be depressed about the state of the
planet and quite frankly, the state of humanity. When you take a hard look at what we've done to
the earth and where we're at kind of emotionally, mentally, and spiritually with how we're addressing
these issues and the debates,
I guess, that kind of spring up around it. It's easy to kind of just throw up your arms and say,
well, I'm powerless. There's nothing I can do to change this. I'm just going to watch Honey Boo Boo or just go on with my day and just give up. Everything's screwed up and it's too late.
Then you meet a guy like Kyle Tierman and suddenly that despondency is replaced with hope
hope for the future hope for the next generation the planet hope for humanity he's just one of
those kind of guys kyle is a pro surfer he's today's guest he a filmmaker. He's a documentarian. He's a humanitarian.
And I guess you would call him an environmentalist, of course, as well.
I'd never heard of Kyle until a few months ago when a buddy of mine posted an image on Instagram.
And it was a picture of a surfer holding a surfboard out in a cornfield holding a corncob. And he was standing next to a guy in a
hazmat suit that was holding a pitchfork. The surfer was Kyle. And the image was a still picture
from this short documentary that Kyle wrote and directed called Surfers vs. GMOs. I was intrigued.
So I immediately clicked to watch the video right away. And I have to say, I was really blown away, not just by the great content that this young man was offering,
but more by the fact that such a young person was so passionate about the environment,
the issue of GMOs and kind of spreading a positive message.
A guy who could just as well be surfing all day, pro surfer,
traveling around, enjoying the surf without a care in the world. And yet instead of that,
he decided to take some action to raise awareness and make a difference on the planet. And that's
pretty cool. Then I dug deeper and I realized that this documentary was nothing new for Kyle,
that he's been doing this for a while. And this
activism is really kind of interwoven with his pro surfing career. And I think when he was like,
maybe as far back as 22, I think he's like 24 now, Kyle created and hosts a YouTube series called
surfing for change. And on this channel, Kyle combines surfing imagery and current global issues to highlight the power of individuals in creating a better world through everyday decisions.
And the impact of this channel and the content that he's putting out has been pretty substantial. film projects, took a look at global bank funding and suggested that people might be
better educated about how our banking system works and the ills of centralized banks when
it comes to certain development projects.
And he kind of encouraged people to invest in their local community or put their money
in credit unions instead as an option.
And as a direct result of this specific film project,
Surfing for Change, the channel,
this specific film that he made,
tracked over $110 million of lending power
moving out of centralized banks and into local communities.
So that's pretty awesome in terms of how one young person
could have such a profound impact on our culture,
our economy, and the way that we're approaching what we do with our money and how we spend it.
Like I always said, you can vote with your dollar. And this is a perfect example of
somebody who not only believes in that, but has put that in action. So Kyle's our guest today.
believes in that, but has put that in action. So Kyle's our guest today. And before we get into it, I will just leave you with one thought, which is, I think he is the only person, at least the only
person I'm aware of who has ever delivered a Ted talk without a shirt on. And to be clear, he was,
he was wearing his wetsuit pulled down to his waist with no shirt. So extra cool points for that. Anyway, it was
really cool to talk to Kyle. The millennial generation seems to get a lot of flack. You know,
they take a lot of heat, like, oh, the millennials, they're lazy, they're entitled, they just want to
play video games. And, you know, they want instant gratification on everything they don't want,
they don't understand the value of hard work, blah, blah, blah. But Kyle is a guy who
really has shown me, who demonstrates that this assumption, this generalization is really
misplaced, if not altogether false. Because I know there are lots of young people out there like Kyle
committed to service, to making a difference. And if that's the case, which I truly believe it is,
I can sleep better at night. And I'm optimistic about our future, humanity, the planet,
the millennials, the generation to come, the young people, and our future. So without further ado,
let's just get into it. Hope you enjoy the conversation.
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a loved one, again, go to recovery.com. A friend of mine on Instagram posted the Surfing for Change, a little icon for the documentary that you did recently. And I was
like, oh, what is this? I'd never heard of it. I didn't know who you were. But I instantly checked
it out. And I was like, oh, oh man, this guy is onto something super cool.
And I think it was even that day that I emailed you and I was like, I got to have you on the
podcast.
So that was months ago, but we're finally here.
So yeah, it's cool to be talking to you, man.
And just to kick it off and to give the audience out there an idea of your vibe, I think my first question is, are you the first or are you the only person to have ever delivered a TED Talk without your shirt on?
Oh, man.
I don't know.
So I gave a TED Talk a few years back in wearing my wetsuit down to my waist.
few years back in wearing my wetsuit down to my waist.
And it was actually a really funny experience because the whole TED Talk is about this trip I took down to Chile and showing how multinational banks and Bank of America specifically is
one of the largest funders of coal power worldwide.
And we did a project on this little Chilean fishing village
that there was going to be a coal plant built right on the beach.
And all the locals were against it.
And I found out that the company called AES Jenner, the coal company,
was being underwritten by Bank of America.
So we made this short documentary about how when you
put your money into a bank, that money doesn't stay there. Banks actually lend your money
out and use it to make loans. So we made this little YouTube video about this story. We
went down to the beach and went surfing in Chile and then also showed the flip side,
which is when you have your money in a local bank or credit union, you can actually stop funding the problem and start funding
the solution all in one move because instead of your money being sucked out to fund, say,
a coal power plant halfway around the world, your money traditionally in local banks and
credit unions stays within your community.
Right.
That's interesting.
Yeah, as well as that local banks have a much more vested interest in the community doing
well, so they're less likely to fund things that are inherently going to destroy the environment
of the community.
Right, and this was really kind of what introduced you to kind of all the things that you're
immersed in now, right?
Like this was your first project. It was kind of an eye-opening thing where you went down to Chile
just to surf, which is what you do. You travel around as a pro surfer and get to, you know,
find the choice tasties wherever you go. And there was this coal plant going on, and it kind of
sparked your curiosity as to how this was happening. And then to understand that Bank of America was what was behind it.
And the whole kind of, you know, the machinations that take place in order for a global bank
to fund a project like this and the power of the individual, you know, the choice that
the choices that we all make about where to put our money and how to spend it and the
kind of individual power of the single vote to enact change.
And I mean, the results of this video and kind of what's taken place as a result of
that is pretty amazing, right?
Can you speak to that a little bit?
Absolutely.
So this was a video that I made when I was 18.
I'm 24 now.
And really, the goal behind it was to connect this one degree of disconnection.
Like you said, I get to travel to these amazing places all around the world.
And a lot of the best waves in the world are in developing countries.
And how this all started was basically just this question I asked myself about how is it that something that we do here in California is going to indirectly affect someone halfway around the world?
Because we live in this climate right now where we're so impactful, yet we are so disconnected from the consequences of our actions,
both positive and negative.
So this kind of felt like a really perfect project
because everyone has a bank
and your money is being sucked out of your community most likely
if you have it in a multinational bank like B of A or Wells Fargo or Chase
to fund something that you have no idea.
So we released this YouTube video.
And as I said, we released this video when I was 18.
And once it was released, I started getting emails from people who I didn't know who were
moving their money and companies ended up moving their money, people from all over the
world.
And since then, we've been able to track the impact of the YouTube video.
The impact as of now is that we've documented over $360 million of lending power being moved
out of Bank of America and other multinational banks that fund coal power and into local
banks and credit unions around the world. So that was, it was really cool.
It was cool for me to have that kind of success as a kid,
as one of my first projects.
But it also was, it was cool to see that when people know
that there's something that they can do,
they become a lot less apathetic to the big problems.
When there's something that they know that they can actually
take action on, and it becomes more simple, then people tend to do it, which was a really cool
thing because so many people talk about how it's really difficult to create change. And I just felt
like I kind of stumbled upon that one strategy of just give someone a simple –
Yeah, one actionable item that they can do that actually is – it's not just signing a petition to get somebody else to do something on their behalf or to give your permission for somebody to do something.
It's actually taking a very concrete, specific, but simple task that in the aggregate moves mountains.
specific but simple task that in the aggregate you know moves mountains yeah and that was really and that was really the basis for then the whole surfing for change series which i uh do now which
is essentially a a youtube series where we cover all different kinds of of issues um and travel
around and basically cover current issues through the lens of surfing.
So since then, we've covered everything from working conditions in Sri Lanka
and how you affect the people's working conditions over there
to the trash epidemic in Indonesia.
Yeah, I just watched that video.
That's amazing how much garbage there is in the water there.
Yeah.
So we cover all different kinds of issues, but the theme that, that remains true throughout the surfing for
change series, um, is that it covers an issue where that you may be one degree disconnected
from, but are most likely having an indirect impact on. But at the, at the core of it,
really, I mean, you know, the website is
surfing for change, but really kind of you go to that website and, you know, right in your face
immediately is the issue of GMOs. So that seems to be the first and foremost kind of like,
you know, predominant kind of issue that you're tackling at the moment.
At the moment, yeah, it's our latest video. So we make sure it's front and center. And we really, we come out with a couple videos every
year, but the video is just one part of a really more thorough campaign that we run with each issue
we cover. And the goal of Surfing for Change is not to be like the hub where you can
learn everything you need to know about GMOs and we'll be on this issue for years to come,
because we won't. We'll be covering other issues. But the goal of it is to really shine the light
on people and organizations that are doing the really good work. And that's kind of been our
goal from the get-go, is just to shine the spotlight on these people because we have a big, big young demographic, kind of like
your, your podcast of, of young people, um, you know, 18 to 35 who, who watch our stuff. And,
um, it really is movies for, for the person who won't sit through a two-hour long documentary.
So it's really cool to be able to kind of have Surfing for Change be a conduit to other people and other organizations who could really use that energy.
our last documentary, the Indonesia Trash Tubes, which you can see at surfingforchange.com,
we highlighted that group that was installing the liquid waste processor at Uluwatu, because Uluwatu is this really famous surf spot in Indonesia, and a lot of the kitchen waste
and sewage just goes directly out into the lineup.
So there's this local group over there there and they need to raise 50 grand to
install this liquid waste processing system. And it was really cool because I got, I got an email
from the guys over there who said that the video that, uh, we had made had gotten them a lot of
donations to help get the funding they needed to install this liquid waste processing system. So
that was really cool. And that, that video has, um, almost half this liquid waste processing system. So that was really cool.
And that video has almost half a million views on YouTube.
So that's kind of, I feel like, where the direct change can take place.
Like rather than us saying, oh, we're the experts on it,
we're more apt to try and just kind of shed some, some light on other people doing really
cool work. A little bit of light on it. Yeah. And I think that it's interesting. I mean,
you know, sort of conventional wisdom about, you know, the surfer, you know, what's the first thing
that comes to somebody's mind? Like, well, it's, you know, whether it's like a Spicoli character
or somebody like that, but in my experience and the surfers that I know, they're very conscious and they're global citizens, I guess is what I'm trying to say, in the sense that they're young people that have the opportunity to travel all over the world and get a different perspective on kind of how different cultures operate in contrast to this sort of American centrist idea
about how we live our lives. And that's given you the opportunity to kind of shine a light on
certain things that are not right, or things that we may not be, you know, innately familiar with,
so that we can enact change. And it's just, it's really encouraging to see someone like yourself,
who's so young, who could be, I mean, you could just be surfing without a care in the world and you're making this choice to say, you know what?
I can tie my passion to service in a way that gives all of what I'm doing more meaning.
I appreciate that. Thanks.
Yeah, I think that surfing as a sport is unique in a few ways.
Surfing as a sport is unique in a few ways.
Firstly, because as surfers, we're more directly affected by the state of the environment than almost any other sport in the world.
I mean, when it rains, we're the first ones to get sick if there's going to be a bunch of runoff going out into the ocean.
So we're directly affected in that way.
Another thing that I think is cool about surfing as you said is that we get to
if we're lucky enough to be the ones to get to travel
we get to travel to a lot of developing countries
a lot of places where a lot of Americans
or just white people in general don't go
so if we think about it consciously
we actually get to be ambassadors
for our country and, and represent, you know, hopefully ourselves, you know, in a way that is,
that's good. You know, I think that that's a really cool opportunity, just getting to travel
and kind of show that not all Americans are just stupid, closed-minded, fat people.
not all Americans are just stupid, close-minded, fat people.
Right. And also the ability to impact these underdeveloped communities. I mean, it's not like,
you know, a lot of these surf spots are in areas where, you know, it's not a four seasons resort. You're in a tiny village somewhere that's quite remote. And you get to see how, you know, sort of
a lot of people live, you know, which in ways that we may not imagine, you know, sort of a lot of people live, you know, which in ways that we may not
imagine, you know, sort of, you know, incredibly impoverished, etc. And it reminds me of a I have
a friend who's a pro triathlete. His name is Chris Lieto. And, and he's sort of doing something
analogous to what you're doing. He's got a nonprofit called more called more than sport.
And it was born out of a result of him traveling all over the world
to do these triathlons in all these phenomenal, beautiful locations.
And he would stay in a nice resort.
And then you're out on the bike course in the middle of the race
and you're riding through these kind of third world villages
and you get to kind of see how the people in these in these lands actually live and
so he started an organization where the athletes or whoever wants to contribute stays after the
race and they you know build houses or they contribute you know they dig a well or they do
you know they do some other kind of act that contributes uh to the long-term kind of you know
greater well-being of that particular community.
It seems very similar to what you're doing through your YouTube channel and your outreach, etc.
Yeah, I would say that probably the only difference is that we tend to highlight other people who are doing really good work.
I mean, more than anything, we're a media company more than anything, we're a, we're a media company more than, um, anything else. But I do,
I really agree with you just in the sense that like in our current society, athletes and celebrities
are the people who are the ones who everyone listens to. So if they're able to use their
platform on behalf of something bigger, it can create a huge amount of influence.
And I was talking to Dustin Barca, who's a pro surfer and MMA fighter over on Hawaii,
and he's heading up this whole GMO issue over there.
And there was a point when we didn't actually include it in the Surfing for Change video,
but I was talking about if there is, if, if there are, if there is another issue
in another community that people want to get involved in, what would you recommend to them
to get involved? And he, one of the first things he said was find an athlete or a celebrity or
someone in your community, um, and, and teach them about this issue. Because unfortunately, sort of unfortunately, sort of fortunately,
those are the people that the rest of the world listens to.
They have the microphone.
I mean, people logically should be listening to scientists and academics,
but they're not.
They listen to what LeBron James says.
They listen to people like yourself and Kelly Slater
and all those people have to say.
So I think that it's an incredible platform,
and it always makes me happy to see pro athletes using their platform
on behalf of something bigger.
Yeah, and the surfing community is really all about that. I mean,
Kelly takes every opportunity he can to spread healthy messages in a variety of forms. And he's
very involved in this GMO issue. He is. Yeah. I would say that it's probably one of his most
passionate issues because he's also very health conscious i mean he's the he's the youngest and
oldest world champion in surfing ever i mean he won his first world tour before he was he won his
first world title before he was allowed to drink a beer you know and now he's 41 and he's going
after it again i mean he won his last world title i think when he was 39 so it's it after it again. I mean, he won his last world title, I think, when he was 39.
Yeah, it's ridiculous. So it's ridiculous.
And I've had a chance to interview him a few times.
And he was talking about how he gets people come up to him,
and they're like, hey, man, I just turned 30,
and you're really like an inspiration for me as I'm getting older.
And he's like, you're not old.
I'm 41.
You've got some time to go before you can start saying you're on that end of it. But,
but it's cool to see someone who's, who's that health conscious. So it's obviously,
obviously an important, an important issue, you know, however contentious it might be,
because he takes a lot of heat for stuff that he that he says.
But I think that it's.
Oh, I didn't know that.
Why? Because he sort of preaches a holistic medicine approach.
Yeah.
I think it's it's with everyone who has that big of a microphone.
You know, people are going to it's there's going to be controversy around it.
But I'm proud of him for standing up for what he believes in.
I think it's awesome.
But, you know, I mean, GMOs specifically are such a broad issue, and there's so many just minute factors that go into it.
You know what I mean?
You could talk about GMOs for weeks on end.
And in our—
Go for it.
Yeah, no, I was just going to say, let's get into it a little bit. Why don't
we start it off by just explaining a little bit about what GMOs are. And then I want to talk about
Hawaii as really kind of like the battlefield here for this issue, because it's really, I mean,
Hawaii really is the epicenter of where this debate is really occurring. And that's where the activism is very, you know, prominent and where people really are educated and they're taking a stand.
And you've been on the front lines of that. So I want to hear about that.
so what is a gmo gmo is a genetically modified organism and it is the process of uh physically injecting cells from one species into another species. And it's different than crossbreeding, you know,
where you have, like, an apple and a pear to create, like, an Asian pear.
It's more like injecting a bacteria into a seed
to have it basically have certain characteristics or traits that are desirable.
It could be anything from wanting to change the color of a strawberry to making it bigger.
Predominantly, by far and away, what most GMOs are used for is to be able to withstand heavy amounts of pesticides.
So, scientists will create a GMO seed that will be resistant to a certain type of pesticide
that then a company like Monsanto will develop.
So then what farmers can do is they can plant this GMO seed, you know, like corn or
soy. They can monocrop for thousands of acres this one seed, and then they can spray it all
with pesticides and all the weeds and the bugs will die. You know, and there are various ways.
will die.
There are various ways.
One is to be able to withstand pesticide. The other is to
have there be an insecticide
directly
in the GMO.
So if a bug
eats the
plant, its stomach will
explode and it'll die. But that's
predominantly the main reason for
creating GMOs, so they can
withstand pesticides. And on the surface level, that sounds like a good thing, right? Like, oh,
well, here we can get greater crop yields, we can, you know, avoid, you know, all these problems that
come with our crops getting destroyed, you know, as a result of pestilence and all this sort of thing. So what's wrong with that? Right. Like, so explain a little bit about why this is perilous and why we as consumers should be concerned about this.
which is ground zero for GMO testing and development worldwide.
That's why we went to Hawaii to make our documentaries,
because the main GMO companies in the world,
like Monsanto, Syngenta, Pioneer, Dow, DuPont,
they all have their testing facilities on the Hawaiian islands,
and they lease thousands of acres out to basically just test and develop their products.
And the issue there is that they get to spray heavy amounts of pesticides
on these plants adjacent to schools and hospitals and neighborhoods,
so the locals get the brunt of the excessive use of pesticides
being used to test out their new products.
And there's no actual product that comes from it.
You would think that, like, oh, Hawaii must have a ton of agriculture then
because they have thousands of acres of these big companies doing their testing
there but it mainly is just for testing and development most of the seeds don't actually
go to market and the ones that do go to the market aren't human grade uh quality to eat they go to
basically a cow a cow to turn into your happy meal right and I think, correct me if I'm wrong, but these corporations, the Monsantos and the
like, are gigantic landholders across Hawaii on all of the islands, or maybe not all of
them, but I know Maui, Oahu, Kauai, the big island.
And the reason that they like to test out in Hawaii is that it is this perfect Petri dish sort of scenario
because it's isolated
and it allows them to sort of remove all other variables
from their sort of experiments with these things
and allows them to get sort of clean results.
So they like to perform all of their development
and testing on Hawaii.
And that's why there's so much activity in Hawaii that that's why this is really kind of like, you know, the front lines of this entire issue, because the community really is kind of taken up in arms.
And, you know, the protests that are going on in Hawaii are massive, like tons of people are showing up and, you know, protesting what's happening out there.
Absolutely.
So you're correct in that.
And then another reason Hawaii is ground zero for GMOs is that they have very lax regulatory laws.
So a company like Syngenta is allowed to use a lot of restricted-use pesticides that are banned in over 60 countries, banned
or heavily restricted in over 60 countries around the world.
So, for example, Syngenta is allowed to use atrazine in Hawaii, where in their home country
of Switzerland has been banned.
So they get to basically, a lot of the Hawaii state legislation is very pro-GMO and allows them to get away with things that they wouldn't be able to get away with in other places.
pesticides sort of blowing over into their communities and in schools and, you know,
what's in the air as much as it is about GMOs in the actual food that we're eating.
Yeah. So that's where our video really was kind of ground zero. And it all ties together, obviously. But we chose to focus on just this initial how GMOs are created, what's the initial process that makes it happen.
But I think that it is a good, actually, microcosm for even just the larger global issue of GMOs
because kind of our conclusion of the video is that there's a ton of secrecy around GMOs.
conclusion of the video is that there's a ton of secrecy around GMOs. You know, the, the big issue in Hawaii is that these companies don't need to disclose what chemicals they're using, uh, when
they're using them, how much they're using of them. So there's no, you can't do studies to see
why all these people are getting sick. sick um but people are getting sick close to
close to the the testing fields but then you can't prove any of it because there there's no uh
disclosure around what what pesticides they're using but i did are there anti uh are there uh
anti-gag laws that that apply as well Like, you know, in the livestock industry, there are these laws that exist that won't allow somebody to go in and kind of infiltrate.
Like if a journalist gets hired to go work in a slaughterhouse and then, you know, writes an article about all the abuses, that would be considered against the law.
Right.
So I'm wondering if that's the case with these companies out in Hawaii.
Yeah, I don't know.
I'm wondering if that's the case with these companies out in Hawaii. Yeah, I don't know. But really, my understanding of the movement over there right now is that the two main goals are to first get disclosure around what is being sprayed in the air, super close to schools and neighborhoods.
super close to schools and neighborhoods.
And secondly, to replace a lot of this testing land with small organic farms that will actually produce food for Hawaii.
Because as much as Hawaii has all these growing seasons,
a perfect place to grow food, Hawaii imports 90% of all of their food.
So they're highly unsustainable just in their ability to grow food right now.
Oh, that's surprising.
I wouldn't have thought that.
Yes, that's kind of the second goal of this whole movement really is to start producing food that will actually stay on the island and feed the people.
It's interesting, too, with the testing to develop these pesticides.
I mean, you're always reading about how suddenly there's some genetic mutation
and the insect that the pesticide was supposed to prevent from eating the crop, suddenly they found a way around it and now they're eating it again.
Whether it's Roundup or whatever it is, nature always seems to find a way.
And it seems to me that there's such an inherent human arrogance that comes into play with respect to these products, like as if we're going to finally figure out how to get the upper hand on nature, and we're going to develop the ultimate seed and the ultimate pesticide that,
you know, forever is going to solve this problem and allow us to kind of, you know, overfarm this
land and, you know, deplete the soil. And it's also very short-sighted and self-centered and
arrogant, you know, and it's not a sustainable solution to these problems.
The solution is to do exactly what you just said, which is to get back to the root of how we produce
healthy foods for everybody, which is organic farming and finding a sustainable way to
constantly enrich the soil as we reap it. Yeah, I agree with you.
It is so arrogant of us to think that we have it all figured out.
I mean, yeah, humans are great.
We're really smart.
But when we think that we can beat nature on a fundamental level
and that we know what's better,
you just run into all these problems, like you were saying,
where you get these super weeds and you get all the health problems that we're seeing from GMOs.
It is ridiculous.
I mean, what I heard recently, what does GMO stand for?
It stands for God Move Over.
Right. It's like having a water balloon in your hands and you're squeezing it. I heard recently, what does GMO stand for? It stands for God Move Over.
Right. It's like having a water balloon in your hands and you're squeezing it. And if you squeeze it, something's going to pop out. And then you push that part back in and then something else
pops out on the other side. I don't think that we're ever going to be able to sort of figure
this out through these means. They're all short-term solutions. know, they're just they're all short term solutions. Meanwhile,
we're depleting the soil at such a rapid rate that even if you go back to organic farming,
there's no nutrients in that soil, you know, so even if you, you know, the food that you would
pull out of that land would still be very nutrient poor, you know, and so we've got to find a way
to figure out sustainable solutions to create, solutions to create high nutrient density foods for an ever increasing large population.
And certainly, I don't have a solution to that.
It's not like I have the answer to it.
All I know is that we're sideways right now. I think it's important for everybody to educate themselves about what's going on in Hawaii and to get involved because if we lose there, then it becomes sort of like a domino effect.
And I think that to be able to prevail there sets an example for how this issue is going to play out in the other states across the country.
out in the other states across the country. Yeah, I agree. And, you know, on the hopeful side,
though, I've covered all different kinds of issues. And I would say that GMOs are close to hitting a tipping point right now with the with the amount of awareness that his awareness and action that is spreading around this issue, I think that things are moving for the better.
I just recently read a statistic that came out by the Hartman Group, and they showed that in 2007, 15% of people said that they avoided eating GMOs.
said that they avoided eating GMOs. In 2010, that statistic rose to 25%. In 2013, 39% of people said they avoid eating GMOs. I mean, the organic food market is growing at such a rapid rate. I think
that things are getting better. And you know, I'm not ignorant to the fact that Monsanto is a company that's so big,
they're never going to go away.
But I think that with the market decisions that are shifting right now, they may move
away from GMOs in the future, which is hopeful.
And back to what you were talking about on having these nutrient-depleted land, all this nutrient-depleted land and how it's not as sustainable.
It also just makes our food systems more brittle.
all of our food to a few companies that have very little, um, that are very poorly regulated, first of all, so they can do kind of whatever they want. And secondly, it's like, when your
food comes from thousands and thousands of miles away, what happens when a natural disaster hits?
You know, what, what happens when, when, uh, you need food quickly, you know? So that's, in addition to
local food being more sustainable, it also makes communities much more resilient,
just in the same way that when you have your money in a local bank or credit union,
it makes your community more resilient because the money stays within your community. So I think there's a theme there throughout a lot of different issues. Just the
whole decentralization of power also really allows for more innovation.
Well, I'm encouraged by your optimism. I mean, it's easy to be pessimistic about this. I mean,
even in the first couple frames of your documentary, you're just going around, you know, at the beach saying, hey, what's a GMO?
And people are, you know, absolutely have no idea what it even is.
simply an initiative to require food manufacturers to label their food products as to whether they had GMOs in them or not. It wasn't even an attempt to regulate GMOs in our food system. It was simply
a right-to-know initiative that through an enormous amount of money and lobbying efforts
on behalf of the Monsantos of the world, they were able to
defeat that. And that makes me sort of pessimistic, or it makes me realize how easily manipulated the
public is. Because if you just sat down with somebody and explained it to them, of course,
they would want to know, of course, they would want to label on their food, but through fear
tactics, etc. You know, these companies were able to convince people that this was not in their interest. And that definitely sort of is dismaying to me.
Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it takes all kinds, you know, and it's going to take people getting
involved as citizens. How did you get involved in this? Was this mostly just from an athletic
standpoint, you researching food?
I'd love to hear a little bit about how you got.
Yeah, I mean, you know, my story, I'm 47 now.
And my story is, you know, I was a corporate lawyer.
I was a litigator, just, you know, working hard and kind of trying to climb the corporate ladder.
And I'd been an athlete in college.
I swam for Stanford back in the 1980s, late 1980s.
But when that chapter was over, that was done. And it was just about my career. And, and shortly
before I turned 40, I had a bit of a health crisis. I got really, you know, I got quite overweight. I
was like 50 pounds overweight, and I've just been eating junk food and like, overstressed, overworked,
not taking care of myself, not exercising and just eating what a friend of mine
calls a window diet you know if they hand it to you through the window like cheeseburgers french
fries nachos pizza hut taco bell you know you name it and it just all caught up to me and i
kind of had an epiphany moment where i decided to you know change change my life change my diet and
i it's a long story but i ultimately ended up adopting a plant-based diet
and that gave me all this energy and I lost all this weight and I started exercising again. And,
and, and, you know, one thing led to another. And before I knew it, I was competing in ultra
endurance, uh, triathlons and did some crazy endurance stuff. And that, you know, that got
some press and I got a book deal out of that. And now here I am doing a podcast, which is and not practicing law anymore.
So, you know, when you think you have your life figured out and you know the direction that you're heading in, you always need to remain open to to newer possibilities about what you're supposed to be doing.
That's great.
I'm guessing you've read Born to Run, right?
Of course. Yeah. I was. you've read Born to Run, right? Of course.
Yeah. So I surf for Cliff Bar. They're one of my sponsors.
Sure.
And they do this athletic summit each year where they invite all their athletes up to Cliff Bar in Emeryville and you get to do see this guy and he's got a name tag. It's Scott Jurek.
I go up to him like, dude, you're the guy from the book.
Like, let me get your autograph.
It's pretty funny.
Yeah, he's cool.
He's a star, man.
Yeah, his book came out right around the same time mine did too.
He's a great guy.
I know him a little.
I don't know him that well, but I have met him.
Was Timothy Olsen there?
I can't remember whether he's a Clif Bar athlete or not.
He's another –
I don't know.
I couldn't tell you.
There are a lot of us.
They sponsor Olympic athletes and they sponsor action sports athletes.
But I'm always interested to hear what other kind of training regiments and that kind of stuff other athletes are doing.
I've been getting pretty psyched on surfing bigger waves this last year and on surfing Mavericks and that kind of stuff.
So I've been training pretty hard for that kind of stuff.
Actually, right before we started talking, I was doing pool swimming and do a lot of underwater
laps and that kind of thing.
I took a really fun course.
It was kind of fun. It was pretty
intense. Last year
it was an underwater
breath holding course.
A three day course.
It was really fun. They teach you how to hold your breath
for a really long time. A lot of
mental exercises and stuff.
But I'm always interested to hear about what other athletes are going on.
I had a guy on the podcast a while back named Tank Sade who's one of the world's best free divers.
So we had an amazing conversation about what it's like to hold your breath for that long and what that kind of sport and discipline involves.
It's pretty cool.
It is really cool it's it's also just you know something about i mean i've been a surfer my whole life but i've only practiced holding my breath for the last year basically since i've
gotten into surfing big waves and it's it's really cool to have something so quickly that you have to
mentally click into you know where it's it's just like automatically you have to mentally click into.
It's just like automatically you have to get into this meditative state and tell your heart rate to slow down and do all these kinds of things that are just really fun.
It's rare in just daily life to have to click into those states, but they're really rewarding when you get to do it. Well, that's really interesting because basically if you're going to get out there and surf
Mavericks, I mean, it's one of the most perilous situations you could ever put yourself in.
So then you're in this conflict between your sympathetic and parasympathetic nervous system
because if you get tossed and you go under, your life depends upon you remaining calm
and figuring out how you're
going to conserve your air and kind of relax and make it through, you know, this, this tumultuous
moment of getting tossed around by this enormous wave versus, you know, probably every synapse in
your body, which is saying panic and, you know, swim to the surface as fast as you can. And,
and, you know, I think it would take a tremendous amount of mental discipline to
be able to kind of manage that kind of crisis situation.
Yeah, it is. But it's, and yeah, I've been in a few of those situations, too, where
it's interesting, because I've actually felt like it was easier in the situation to click into that
state than it,
than it has been like in training.
Like,
you know,
just like I said,
like right before we were talking,
I was doing underwater laps in a pool and it's like,
you know,
you,
there's one time,
you know,
you don't get a good breath and you're like,
Oh God,
I kind of just want to come up.
But I feel like that's part of the training is,
is forcing yourself to believe that it is the real situation every time.
Because when it is the real situation, you don't have that timeout button to be like,
okay, I'm just going to come up because I got a little water in my lungs when I took that breath, that kind of thing.
But yeah, it's fun to be able to, when you can, click into that state.
I think it's a very empowering feeling, actually.
Right.
I mean, what's driving you to try to go surf these big waves?
You know, when I was a kid, I never was like, oh, I'm going to go surf the biggest wave
in the world. I've, I've always just, I think that what it is, is that
the more time you spend at something, the more your comfort zone, the more you always want to
push your comfort zone. Right. And for someone who has never surfed a day in their life,
pushing their comfort zone means surfing a two foot wave, you know, for someone who's,
pushing their comfort zone means surfing a two foot wave, you know, for someone who's, who's, you know, like the, the, the best of the best, like the Greg Longs or the Shane Dorians, like
surfing an 80 foot wave is what those guys push their comfort zone. For me right now,
it's like surfing like a 30, 40 foot wave, like really pushes my comfort zone. So I've always,
I've always prided myself on being calculated, you know, and,
and not going out in waves that I didn't think I could handle, but it is, it is fun and it's an
empowering feeling to, to push your borders and see, see how far you can go, especially when you
do it in a way that's, that's responsible. Um, so I really like that. And it's, and just, I mean, there is the rush
aspect of it. Like it's just, it's the most, most exhilarating feeling in the world,
catching a huge wave and then making it and kicking out in the channel is just like,
it feels, it feels really damn good. So there is that part of it. Um yeah, I think that that's just as an athlete, I'm sure that you can kind of empathize with just pushing yourself to see how far you can go.
What's the biggest wave that you've surfed to date?
Probably the biggest wave was like a 35 foot wave, like out at, uh,
Mavericks, like 35, maybe 40 feet on the face.
Um, and you're getting, are you getting towed out for that?
No, you know, you paddle into paddle into the waves.
Paddle into that.
Wow.
Yeah.
But it was also a really cool, um, experience.
My housemate is a guy named Tyler Fox, who's a pro surfer and he got, he, he's in Mavericks contest, and he placed fourth in the Mavericks contest this year.
It's like you're a product of your influences.
So we go out and we train together.
We do a lot of underwater exercises
just out at Pleasure Point in Santa Cruz,
where we'll go out and bring weights out
and have a mask and have the weights drop you
to the bottom of the ocean. You try and take have a mask and have the weights drop you to the bottom of
the ocean. You try and take like 10 or 15 steps with the weights and then come up. Right. Cause
that's, I found that that's really more helpful than, uh, than just doing static apnea breath
holds where you just hold, try and hold your breath for like four minutes or something.
It's more realistic to like do something where you're actually, your heart
rate is up and then you're holding your breath.
But I agree with you about the sympathetic and parasympathetic, um, nervous systems
because you're, it, it definitely, uh, really is, is an unintuitive thing to do.
Well, your ability to ride the wave is going to be completely dependent upon your facility to remain calm and focused in a situation where if you took a step backwards and actually evaluated what you were doing, any normal human being would absolutely panic.
Right?
So how do you do that?
I would imagine it's just incrementally the next wave you ride is a little bit bigger and a little bit bigger.
So by the time you're on the face of a real Mavericks wave, you've been there.
This is only a little bit percentage increase over your comfort level.
Yeah, yeah.
I mean Mavericks definitely – one thing about surfing that's kind of – I wish wasn't wasn't true is that like that you, you have to do
it when the waves are up and when there's a big swell. So it can go from being flat to having
there be a huge swell. So a lot of what I do to try and prepare is, is just doing exercises and,
and training in the pool because you could be surfing two foot waves in Santa Cruz the day
before, and then it's 40 foot out at Mavericks and you're like,
right. Okay. You know, but, but definitely I think that, that training is, it's good physically,
but also just mentally being able to, uh, to have that kind of confidence going into it, um,
is really important. Right. Right. Of course I got a leaf blower right out my window right now.
I want to do a podcast. Sorry, everybody out there that can't hear that.
How did this all start for you? I mean, did you did you grow up in Santa Cruz?
I did grow up in Santa Cruz. Yeah.
And did you have parents that were, you know, sort of encouraging to you to pursue this dream?
How does it all unfold?
Yeah, I did have very encouraging very encouraging parents you know i'm
the youngest of five all my older brothers and sisters surf and a lot of our family are
filmmakers so film was a natural median for me to get my message out um and then just yeah i think
a natural uh interest in you know what what is the influence that one person has in their daily life and just an interest in storytelling.
So it all just kind of – it all fit together in that way.
And I've been a surfer since I was a really little kid, so that it made sense to want to incorporate surfing, um, into my work. But I mean, I've always, I've always prided myself on being able to,
what I call stack functions, where it's like, if you love doing one thing and you
have a work doing another thing, like how can you combine the two? You know? So like,
I love surfing, I love filmmaking, I love traveling. Um, you know,
I loved researching all these different current issues. So it was kind of like I had all these,
I literally made a whiteboard like when I was 17 and wrote down all the things that gave me energy
and all the things that, that I really, really enjoyed doing. Um, you know, so surfing, traveling,
really enjoyed doing. Um, you know, so surfing, traveling, you know, media and filmmaking, um,
public speaking, covering current issues and, and wanting to have, uh, a, a positive impact on the world. Um, critical thinking, those were all just things that I valued. And then it all
just, my career kind of trickled down from that whiteboard, um, and,
and all those goals that I had set. And then, I mean, it's funny cause you never really feel like
you get there, right? You never feel like you're like, Oh, I've, I'm successful now. Like that
kind of thing. It's just this constant growth. But every once in a while I get to kind of just
take a 10,000 foot look at my life and reflect on the fact that like,
I'm so lucky that I get to, you know, surf and travel and do the surfing for change series and speak at universities. It's like, all these things have kind of manifested just from this
whiteboard that I made from I was 17. That's really amazing. And I think that's really – that's a really powerful message I think for my listeners.
I mean probably the overarching theme of this podcast is how can you access a more authentic version of yourself?
How can you sort of live more fully in a more – in a way that is more personally meaningful to you. And the idea that someone like yourself at such a young age, I mean, 17 years old,
it's like your brain is still forming, you know, and you have the wherewithal to say,
I need to map out, you know, how I'm going to live my life.
What are the things that are important to me?
What do I want to be doing with my time?
I mean, that's incredibly mature for somebody of your age.
I mean, you know, 17, I mean, when I was 17, that was not going through my mind. You know what I mean, that's incredibly mature for somebody of your age. I mean, you know, 17, I mean, when I was 17, that was not going through my mind.
You know what I mean?
It wasn't until I was like 40 that I had that kind of, you know, maturity to reflect on, you know, how I was spending my time.
So that's really remarkable.
You know, and I'm so, I admire, but also admittedly a little bit jealous of young people who can figure out what their passion is at such an early age.
Because then your whole life is in front of you to kind of tap into that.
And you don't have to be as afraid because you don't really have anything to lose.
You're not married.
You don't have kids.
You don't have a mortgage.
You have the ability to kind of sit down and construct the life that you want.
And to the extent that you are able to kind of do that and then actualize it, that's really super cool.
And I think it's rare.
Yeah, I appreciate it. privileges and a lot of things going my way that allowed me to kind of access what it is that I really loved at a young age, you know, and really, you know, have a support system to,
to allow me to go out and, and tackle it. Um, but I mean, at this point in my life,
really, like, I don't, who knows what's going to happen. I'm 24 now, who knows what's going to
happen in the next 10 years. But, um um someone told me something really interesting that i've been thinking about recently where they say in your 20s you learn and
then in your 30s you earn so it's just like at this point in my life like i just i i have the
opportunity to be able to learn about a lot of different things you know filmmaking current
issues and i just love that so whatever you know success or failures current issues. And I just love that. So whatever, you know, success or
failures come out of that, I'm just kind of just trying to learn as much as possible at this point
in my life, honestly. Well, I think you're on the right track. And, you know, the overarching theme
really is that you followed your heart, right? You followed your passions. And, you know, had you had
different parents or grown up differently, you know, despite a passion for surfing, it wouldn't have been surprising for a parent to say, hey, you know what?
Time to put the surfboard down like you got to get real about your life and, you know, forget about all that.
Like, you know, how are we doing? How are the grades? How are you know, all these sorts of things like we're sort of conditioned culturally to, you know, prioritize certain things above other things and kind of what
we're passionate about or that sort of childlike joy that we find in certain pursuits that
aren't necessarily careers by, you know, kind of mainstream parameters get pushed aside.
Yeah.
And I appreciate that.
And I will say, though, that, you know, I mean, it definitely hasn't been all rainbows and butterflies and like Kyle found his passion and then was able to do it. Like,
I mean, the amount of times that I've doubted myself, the amount of times that I am, you know,
sitting at the computer, like where I need to upload a YouTube video, I'm just like, oh,
God, like this thing is going to suck. It's not going to make any difference. Like I'm just like, oh, God, like, this thing's gonna suck. It's not gonna make any difference. Like, I'm gonna be ostracized by my friends, like, just the, the amount of fear that goes into any dream, I think is really important to, to recognize and that and that it never really goes away, was a big thing that I that I learned, because I thought that it was one of those things where it's like, oh, you're afraid and then you succeed and then you're never afraid again. But it's like fear
just continues to come up at all points in our lives. But I, I feel like one thing that I've,
I've put a lot of effort into, um, is just my, my relationship with my fear. Cause I have a huge,
huge fear of failure. You know, I've always had this
fear of failure, like even especially like kind of going out and at a young age doing this
unconventional life, like fear that it isn't going to work, that it wasn't going to work out and that
it isn't going to work out, like constantly crossed my mind. But, but just to what helps me get through that fear, I would say is just,
just understanding that everyone has that fear. It's not a unique, it's not a unique feeling.
It's not a unique emotion. And it's just about understanding what, what thoughts I'm having
are true and what aren't true and, and what are, what, what thoughts are healthy. You know,
I mean, I'm sure
that you can, you can relate to that, you know, when you're running an ultra marathon and you,
you know, you're halfway there and you're really tired, like certain thoughts, I'm sure like,
oh, I can't do this. I'm not strong enough. And to be able to, to have the mind control to put,
push those thoughts aside or just let them kind of go through and then focus
your attention on the positive thoughts of that like i will finish the race i can do this like
i right i mean i think it's yeah yeah it's about it's it's not about not having fear and i think
that that it's very kind of commonplace for people to look at their heroes or people that you know
they sort of aspire to model their lives after and assume that those people have lived, you know, sort of these charmed lives where they don't
entertain fear in the same way that we do. And I think that what you said is spot on, which is that
we all have fear. It's our relationship to that fear. It's how we choose to act or not act in the
face of it and to understand, you know, what part of that fear is pure illusion, you know, because
we tend to spend so much of our time in, you know, sort of recycling the past or projecting
outcomes into the future which don't exist, which very often, you know, are based on our
fears.
And so to be able to kind of walk through that and understand the difference between illusion and reality and to understand that fear is just an emotion and it need not control how you react or behave in light of it, I think is really powerful.
And I had a guy on the podcast a while back named James Altucher, and he's a very popular blogger.
You should check out his blog.
He writes these amazing posts that are really cool. But he said that he never hits publish on anything,
on any post that he writes, unless he's absolutely terrified about, you know,
what people are going to think, you know, because he's so vulnerable. Like he gives so much of
himself into what he's writing that it's a scary prospect. And unless he feels that fear, if he doesn't feel it,
then he knows he hasn't written it as well as he could.
And so sometimes the point being that that fear impulse can be kind of a reservoir
for also understanding that it's a good thing and you can be on the right path with it.
Yeah, I love that. That's great. You won't press publish unless you're terrified of what people
think. That's a good one. Right. So when you're uploading your next video, if you're scared,
what are people going to think? Well, part of that's good. It's sort of like if I'm up on the
starting blocks for a swimming race or you're about to, you know, jump into Mavericks, you're going to be scared, right? You're afraid.
And part of that is just excitement. And that excitement, you know, is a close companion to
all the preparation that it took to get there. Right. My stepdad says it's okay to have
butterflies. Just make sure they fly in formation. Oh, I like that. Yeah, that's cool.
The other interesting thing that I kind of wanted to raise was this idea of, you know, it's very popular right now to kind of bash on the millennial generation. I don't even like that
term to begin with, millennials, or, you know, like generation wuss, and everybody has their
face just, you know, in their iPad, and they're all self-involved, and what are we going to do
with this new generation? And part of that is just cyclical, like, you know, I suppose those kinds of
ideas come up with every new generation, and now that I'm older, you know, I hear a lot more of that.
And my experience has been quite different.
You know, because of what I do, I have the good fortune to meet a lot of young enterprising people.
term, sustainable health of the planet, and, you know, who are interested in permaculture and the environment and who are empowered to make change and who are optimistic about
the future.
And that's something that my generation, particularly, I mean, when I was 24, when I was in college,
you know, there was nobody studying permaculture and there was nobody who was interested in
organic farming.
And this is a huge paradigm shift that I'm seeing in, you know, people in their 20s like yourself.
Yeah, I think that it's really important as, as so many of the big issues of the world are
so seemingly audacious, I think it's really important to keep score, as you are keeping
score on a lot of these issues, you know, issues, and that we are moving in the right direction overall.
And I think that now more than ever what's unique
is that things can change at a more rapid pace than any time before,
largely due to the Internet.
If you have an idea that's juicy enough,
it can literally reach billions of people, which is unprecedented in that sense.
And that there are more people who have the opportunity to have microphones than ever before.
It used to be that you had to get on Fox News or in Life magazine to get an idea out,
whereas now it's just like you've got to make a juicy youtube video or write a cool
blog that people want to listen to and you can actually affect the hearts and minds of a lot
of people if you do it right yeah it's incredibly empowering you know it's that if the message is
good there's a way to get it out there and I think for young people to really intuit that and to really
understand that gives them a sense of, you know, self-determination that maybe didn't exist in
prior generations. It's amazing. So you are good. And yeah, I want to hear a little bit about what
it's like when, because I know you've been on this college tour, you've been speaking quite a bit at
all these colleges and what that experience has been like and kind of what you're hearing from young people across the country that you're connecting with.
Yeah, it's a great question.
I think that the interest is huge.
When I go out and give speeches, a lot of people have been showing up and a lot of people ask questions at the end. So that's very, very hopeful.
What's the crux of the speech that you give? stories and then the, uh, power to, to influence change through everyday decisions, as well as
the power to, to combine activism with your passion. Um, and really it's, it's, I would say
it's a big theme of it is just about rebranding what it means to be an activist. Um, and a lot,
a lot of my belief is that when you use your passion on behalf of
something bigger than you can actually be a more effective world changer than if you were to do
something that you didn't really like to do, but thought it was good for the world. Um, so
well, I would say that that is definitely a theme that kids are really interested in hearing that message.
I would say that kids are also really interested in hearing about the solutions rather than the problems. I think that, um, kids, I mean, students my age know that there are big problems in the
world. You don't need, you don't need to drum into them that there are big problems in the world. It's like everyone, you know, everyone knows someone who has cancer, right?
Like, and there, everyone knows that there are all these huge problems.
So I think that the message that, that people my age really need to hear are that there
are solutions happening and that there are bright spots in the world where, you know,
people are, are adopting these great solutions.
Because I think that that's what makes people like, oh, wow, I can do something,
or I can apply that to my own life in this way.
So that's where I tend to get the most claps is when I start to talk about that kind of stuff.
Focusing on the solution.
Focusing on the solution and really focusing on solution through storytelling.
I mean, that's what I do.
In the talks, I talk about other kids that are doing really rad stuff.
And I can tell that the auditorium lights up when they know that there are other people
their age doing this kind of stuff right that's encouraging to to provide all these examples of other people doing
it makes it it's it's sort of inherently giving them permission to do it themselves and showing
them that it can be done yeah um so that's really great i would say that a big kind of issue for sure is student debt and that, I mean, you got to pay the bills, right?
So as much as we all want to go out and change the world, like you still got to keep the lights on.
So I would say that that is the biggest thing that we need to – that you need to figure out, right? Because like you want to be able to
make money and, and, and have a talk about sustainability. Like you want to have a
sustainable life and lifestyle. So figuring out how to do good work in the world and make money,
I think is a really big question that my generation is, is trying to figure out. Um,
so that's, but that's something that really everyone needs to trying to figure out.
But that's something that really everyone needs to kind of figure out for themselves.
How can you have these two verticals at the same time where you're growing a business,
you're growing a career where you're making money, and also you are doing it in a way where you're helping the world on a local or globe on a local or global scale,
whatever it is that,
that you're most interested in just figuring out how to,
how to kind of tandem those two verticals,
I think is a really important thing that my generation is figuring out.
Yeah,
I think they are.
I think they,
we,
you know,
are all figuring it out and you see this sort of the ascension of,
of conscious capitalism all around.
I mean, whether it's Warby Parker or Tom Shoes or all of these companies that really are realizing
that the key to growth and success economically is to tie in service into the core sort of values
and principles of the company, you know, from the inception of it, right?
So that part of the entire equation and principle behind the business itself is the service
and is the giving back.
And I think that that's really a crucial aspect for the success of, you know, any new
companies that are coming up.
And to see these companies thriving who are giving away at the same time and to understand that they're thriving not despite that,von Chouinard, the founder of Patagonia
one time. He was telling me about how at one point they were growing at such a rapid scale,
he felt like he was needing to sacrifice some of the environmental and social beliefs that
the inception of the company was based off of.
And he made a really conscious decision to slow down that growth at one point
so that they could kind of reflect on where they're at, where they want to go.
And Patagonia just did a 100-year plan for where the company wants to be in 100 years.
I think that kind of thinking is what we really need because so often the biggest companies in the world are operating off of quarterly statements.
So it's really difficult to have that kind of long-term vision about what kind of player they want to be in the world in something like 100 years.
Right.
Yeah, it's interesting.
I mean what they've done at Patagonia is amazing.
I mean, that guy is incredible.
So you're – I know.
I was like, you must be stoked to have them as a sponsor.
So do you have one of those situations where you have the ability to travel?
Like, oh, here's where the waves are. And also here's where there's an issue that I could document. And you have the sponsor support to be able to go there and to create a film and put it out.
I mean it is – so that you're sort of – you have these corporate partners that are really allowing you to be able to do this.
Yeah, I – how it works for me financially is that I basically piece it together.
You know, Patagonia will contribute something to a video.
Cliff Bar will contribute something.
My skateboard sponsor, Sector 9, will contribute something.
And then if I still need more, because it is more than just paying for myself to go.
It's like I also need to pay for a videographer and pay for an editor and all that kind of stuff. So, um,
like with this, with the GMO video, I, uh, wrote a grant to the Newman foundation. Um, and they
helped kind of wrap up the funding that we needed to, to make that happen. But yeah, it's all,
it's all kind of project by project based, you know, if, if it's something that obviously like
something like GMOs is something that my
sponsors were really interested to to help get that story out there um but yeah i just
piece piecing it together man that's what i've that's what i've been doing all right man well
what's uh what's next what's the next video um next video um we are, I'm talking with a few different television networks, um, about
having, there'll be a kind of surfing for change ask show. Um, so I, I can't say that anything's
going to happen for sure, but that's kind of where I'm, I'm putting my, my emphasis right now because, um, my, I mean, my goal over the next two years
is to just really grow the, the amount of people seeing the stories that we create. And it's,
it's difficult to do it just kind of on my own. So my goal really is to kind of create a team or become a part of a team that, that has that media power to really get a message out to hundreds of millions
of people. That's kind of my ultimate goal. So I, I'm putting emphasis there.
Um, over the next couple of months, I'm going on just some,
some straight surf surf trips. Like I just got to do a, um,
a trip for a surfer magazine a couple of weeks or surfing
magazine, uh, a couple of weeks ago. And then I'm actually taking off tomorrow to go down to
Latin America again for another trip. So I'm going to do a couple, a couple of trips where I'm just
able to focus on my surfing and, and do that kind of thing. And then dive into, to a new project
when it happens, but I would love to come back on the show and we get a new video out there.
Yeah, absolutely, man.
Doors wide open anytime.
So cool.
So that's a great place to wrap it up, man.
I appreciate you giving me your time today.
Awesome.
And for anyone listening,
go to surfingforchange.com
to check out all of our short, digestible documentaries.
That's right.
And the YouTube channel is just under your name, right?
Or is there a Surfing for Change YouTube channel?
Just type in Surfing for Change on YouTube and all of our videos will come up.
Right.
And you're at Surfing for Change on Twitter and same thing on Instagram, right?
Yeah, Surfing number four change on Twitter and Instagram.
Okay, gotcha.
But surfing forchange.com for the website.
Yeah, and on Facebook.
Right, gotcha.
And it's cool.
Everybody should go check out the site.
You can see the short documentary about GMOs right up front.
And then there's all these action steps if you want to get involved and learn more from signing petitions to other kind of organizations that are involved in
this issue that you can learn more about. So I encourage everybody to check that out.
All right. All right. Well, thanks for the good conversation. That was really fun.
Yeah, man. Thanks so much for doing it. I appreciate it. And let's talk soon, dude.
All right. Thanks, Rhett. All right, Kyle. Thanks. Peace was really fun. Yeah, man. Thanks so much for doing it. I appreciate it. And let's talk soon, dude. All right. Thanks, Rich. All right, Kyle. Thanks. Peace. Plants.
All right, everybody. I hope you enjoyed that. Thanks for tuning in. Definitely go to
surfingforchange.com and check out everything that Kyle is doing on that site. Check out the YouTube series,
some great content there and ways to participate and get involved in the issues that he brings to you, specifically GMOs, but even it goes far beyond that as well. So can't encourage you enough
to go check that out. A couple of announcements before you wrap it up. We've got an app coming soon, a mobile app for iOS for your iPhone-type device.
We still have a couple hoops we've got to jump through.
We've got to get it through the whole Apple system, and we're still dialing in some tweaks.
But I'm pretty excited about that, and it's going to give everybody a great new way to enjoy the content and share it.
We're going to have the full entire catalog all the way back to Episode 1 available.
As you know, on iTunes, they only offer the most recent 50. So this is going to be a great way to be able
to enjoy, at least for the early adopters until later versions where we're going to offer premium
stuff for a limited time. We're going to have the entire catalog up there for free. The app
obviously is going to be for free. So excited about that, and I'll keep you posted on developments as we get closer to the release.
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that. So that's it. You guys, I'm getting ready to hit the road, uh, in a day. Um, Julie and I
are leaving for Canada. We're going to be there for, I think like seven days. And then I'm Julie's
going to come home and I'm going to head to the Middle East for two weeks.
I'm going to be in Beirut, Lebanon,
and I'm going to be in three cities throughout Saudi Arabia doing appearances,
and I can't tell you how excited I am about that,
to be able to spread the healthy plant-powered message to that part of the world,
which is pretty cool.
So I'll look forward to talking to you guys from there.
Don't worry, I'll be posting podcasts once a week as usual.
That will not get interrupted. And hopefully I'll collect a few interesting stories from the road
that I can share and impart with you guys. So until then, have a great week. Do something that
scares you. Live wide, love deep, and figure out how you can be of better service, not just to
yourself, but to your fellow man.
And I'll catch you next week.
Thanks, you guys.
Appreciate you tuning in.
Peace.
Plants.