The Right Time with Bomani Jones - Domonique Foxworth on MLBPA's SHOCKING Scandal, Jesse Jackson's death, The KD Files | 02.18

Episode Date: February 18, 2026

Bomani Jones is joined by ESPN's Domonique Foxworth.  They start the show by reacting to Tony Clark's resignation as MLBPA director after an alleged relationship with his sister-in-law.  Later, they discuss Jesse Jackson's life after his death earlier this week and what people don't understand about the Civil Rights Icon.  Finally,  they react to Kevin Durant's reportedly vented frustrations with current & former teammates and coaches and what makes them so funny. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the right time, a wave original. My name is Beaumani Jones. Thanks for listening wherever you get your podcast. Thanks for watching us on YouTube. Subscribe, like, rate us, review us, give us five stars. You only give us four stars. I'm inclined to believe you are a hater. It is that time of week where we have a guest join us.

But like I feel like I got on two left shoes when I say that because it is Hup Days with Dowling Fossworth. I love it. I'm happy to be here on any day. I feel like I talk to you so much away from the show now. I don't miss doing the show as much as I should. But then when I get here and you started, I get excited. I was about just about it.

I was about to say that last part was starting to hurt my feelings just a little bit. And then it's like, all right, you brought it to play, baby. You brought it back around. You know, when the lights come on, it's something different. It's like you can play in the park. But with a game day, it's a little bit more fun. No, I'm saying you are absolutely 100% correct. My theory, of course, is that's why you should do the show more often.

however, different discussion for a different day. I want to start off. We're going to get to Kevin Durant in his situation, and we're going to talk about Jesse Jackson in a little bit. But on Tuesday, a story dropped that led to a question that I had never considered in my life, right? And so the story is Tony Clark, who played baseball for a very long time, who's also like 6'8.

That has nothing to do with anything, but. Like, he scored 40 points a game at high school in basketball. Now, he's an imposing person. I think it matters. When you see him, it's the ball head, the white beard, and he's six, eight. Like, yeah, he's an impressive dude to be around. Oh, that's right. I can't forget.

You are a union man. So, like, this is not, yeah, this is not a stranger to you. I met him with, I met him, we did the Bob Cost. We was doing the show with Bob Costas. Oh, yeah. And I met him there. So anyway, Tony had been, is ensnared the right word? Are we far enough for this to be ensnared?

there's an investigation that I don't fully understand, but all you need to know about it is in, I mean, he runs a union and there's a claim that he has used this union to enrich himself, right? You can look up the particulars. It's not as important as we thought it was 24 hours ago, and this is what I mean. So word had come out that he would be resigning because of something, right?

And so we've known about this investigation. It's also got the end. NFLPA involved. And so I think there was an assumption from some people that this is what ultimately did him in was this scandal involving financial malfeasance, right? Then we found out, no, it was because of an inappropriate relationship at the workplace with his sister-in-law who worked at the union. And that led to this question. And I saw people ask this on Twitter.

I don't want to pretend like I made this up myself. You know, it's very important to me that you guys know I'm not stealing from you, but I saw it. What is worse? If sister-in-law means your brother's wife or if sister-in-law means your wife's sister, which one is worse? I vote B. Your wife says, you think your wife's sister? you think your wife's sister is worse.

Absolutely. Yeah. My instinct is to go the other way because at least my defense is I got brand loyalty. I like the vehicles that GM makes, man. I just wanted to try out a different GM, my dog. No, I, I, I said you was pushing, you, you've been pushing the accord, but that civic was calling you. Is that what you're saying? This is what I see, man.

Sometimes I got a little small parking spaces in the street. I got to navigate, see what this other thing doing. I got to, I got to carry some stuff. You want the five series and three, huh? Oh, is it, it was it the, you want the drop, the six and the drop top? Okay. Why not? No, this is, this is my, my thing about the wife's sister is that makes your kids hate you even more.

Right. I guess that's the big, I guess my argument was one about setting up an opportunity to make that quality joke. But the other argument is you only have offended one person. Yes. Whereas the other way you've offended two people. But I guess if you throw the kids into it, but I guess the kids go be mad no matter what, right? Well, but, but, but, yeah, yeah, yeah, you're right. Like, like. Because I can call my brother and be like,

man, I really messed up. Yeah. But if I'm with my brother's wife, then who I'm... Well, I think the problem we're having with this relative scale that we're trying to establish, right? Uh-huh.

That is, what hurts more? Mm-hmm. If you were to take an axe and go halfway through my arm, or all the way through my arm. Yeah. And what I say, I think it probably feels the same. Yeah.

Right. Like it may be a little more jarring, seeing that you don't have an arm, but just the feeling, the pain is close enough to being the same that it's not really going to matter. It's the bigger loss, obviously, if his wife's sister for Mrs. Clark, because now she ain't got nobody. Yeah. You know, like, like, like, like, I hope you got other siblings, if it's the case there. I mean, when something like, obviously things like this happen. It's not completely unheard of.

But I always like go back to like the quieter moments that aren't reported on or discussed is like, how do you find this out? Like who sent the feeler out there? Who like sit that trial balloon out there? It was like, hey, look at, look at, I really like the way that beard is sparkling. Right, like who is the one that says, and then how do you respond to it? That's the part because, I don't know, I feel like it's,

especially like as guys, we're kind of notorious for not being able to pick up on hints that are being dropped. Yeah. I feel like I would have missed those hints, not only because we're oblivious to that stuff, but also because I don't expect it to come from there, right? And I wouldn't have the,

I wouldn't have the gumption to shoot it. Even if there, let's say the gumption is present, present, all of those things, right? Not one of you. Stop this, to yourself, hey, hey, this is the worst idea you've ever had. Right? Like not a single person

looked at this here and identified, not like this, not like this. It cannot be like this. No, nobody did this. And by the way, this is before we add in the office part. We're just talking about the general regular life situation. What a horrific idea. What came first did you think? Like, of course, this is all, none of this has been like, well, I don't want to get your podcast in trouble,

but like the investigation is still underway for the financial stuff. Yes. I guess this other stuff seems like pretty solid. But my question is, what came first? The job? Or, because my guess is he, because he's hired other people in his family. Yes, he has.

And that, by the way, has come up. Man, unions, man, they, they are a place that have some nonsense happening. But that aside, what came first? I'm assuming the job came first and then just being around each other. Or it's completely possible to be like laying up and bare like, Tony, I need a job. Or I need some money. How are you going to get me some money in a way? that don't seem crazy.

Right, but that's exactly what I was trying to figure out was did it start off with, hey, I think you might be qualified for this job that just came open at my office. Or was it, oh, you need some bread? I got you. Or was it, in order to keep you quiet, I think I need to give you this job.

Because one thing I also think that people who be getting down at the job don't realize. It's a BJ Chicago kid line for the Anderson Pack Joint. She swears she low key, but everybody know, right? Everybody that's doing this thing at the office, they all think nobody knows it, right? Like, did you watch, I don't know if you were much a law and order person, right?

But for years, there was the running thing with Jack McCoy and Claire Kincaid having a thing at the office, but it was never explicitly stated that they had the thing at the office. Nobody ever said the word, but you just see a whole lot of them walking in the office together in the morning, right? Like, all these things that were the sign to the viewer that this was going on. And the regular office is the exact same way. Somebody knows and once one person knows, everybody's going to know. And that's how it works.

We aren't as good at as high in things as we think. And I know that, of course. Well, also, and people are nosier than you'll ever imagine. And work can be boring. And whether it's true or not, if there is a little hint of something, what are we going to talk about? We're going to talk about that. And I know that, of course, you can have platonic relationships and you can have friends at work at whatever.

But you always eating lunch together? Right, right. You always walking together? Yes. And, and no one ever uses the Dodd's sensical phrase, work husband or work wife, right? Like, if you throw that one out there, people might be like, oh, okay, this has been established, right? Everybody knows about it.

But if you're not giving it that cutesy name, nope, y'all just do it. That is pretty funny. You're right. If you throw that out there, it's like a misdirect. Like, oh, no, we all together because that's how we do it work. We work, husband, work wife. But if you don't do that, it's probably because maybe you're a little too close to be

to be playing with monikers like that. Everybody knows. Yeah. Oh, my God. Like, it's, so anyway, they did it. investigation. They were doing an investigation about the money stuff and somehow this came up in the investigation and they were like, cool, we can go ahead and get this over here right now, right? Let's just, let's just go ahead, have this conversation and now you are out of here and now

you got to go home. It'd be like, I lost my job today. And your sister lost her job today. And, you know, I wanted to be the one to tell you before anybody else did. But you're going to read some things in the newspaper. And baby, they lies. They all lies. Like, you've got to ride that part out, right? Just like, you know, you know what they've been trying to take a brother down for 13 years. Yeah.

I mean, you got to ride that out. But I assume that there is like a, they said that there were messages. Those messages are going to be, my guess is those messages are going to be hard to deny. They will be hard to deny, but that lie, that lie will continue. That got to be strong. I don't know what the, I'm in like a defensive mood this morning, as you could probably tell from our group chat conversation. So if I were hired to be his defense attorney in this situation, I would be. point to the fact that the proximity was so close that it suggests that I ain't really

want to do this. Like, if I wanted to do this, I'd be in the streets. I had it's that other. Like, I slipped and fell in it. Yeah, yeah. Oh, I mean, would you be so audacious as to say, you know, she looks a lot like you. Yeah, I'm shooting all the shots, man. As his defense attorney, I'm rolling all all the defenses that I possibly can. First, we're, first, we're, started with the obvious one. Nah, they line on it, man. They planted the messages. Yes. Well, well, here's the, here's,

there are two things that we don't know here. We don't know anything about their marriage. Yeah. And we don't know anything about their sisterhood. Yeah. This could be part of a long tradition. This could be revenge. This, this could be,

this could be anything. Like, it, I know enough about this world. It is entirely possible that the wife has made peace with the Tony Clark of it all. And it's the sister that she's never going to speak to again. People do that one all the time. No, it could be a ton of different things. Like, I'm going to hope that they had an understanding in an arrangement.

That's what I'm going to hope. We ain't heard nothing otherwise. It can't be that arrangement, though. That the, the, I, I ain't never heard of an arrangement that didn't have an unsigned. spoken but not my sister. Yeah. I agree with you, but I said hope. You don't imagine that there's somebody. There's some

group out there. Like, I could Google it. I'm sure there's some. Oh, yeah, I don't want to Google it. I probably come up with a bunch of worse things than I'm looking for on my search history. But it's far fetched. It's probably not worth considering it, but I threw it out there as a possibility that it's like, yeah, we

cool with it. Yeah. Oh, my God. This is and it's the sister-in-law. I haven't seen it definitively said that his wife's sister. I've been told it was wife's sister. And we're just mapping out that scenario. Brother's wife is just not nearly as much fun to explore or to consider.

It's, I can't believe this thing. Like, in front of everybody, Dominique, that's bad, man. That's tough. And he took, he was in a tough, I didn't realize he'd had that job for that long. But he was in a tough situation because his predecessor was a beloved man. man who just had a brain tumor and died, you know.

And so they went with Clark. And look, this isn't, the union heads are often black in the black sports. Right? Like this one, you know it's a bunch of people that I couldn't wait to take him down. I would hate to see the group chats that involve the words. Try to tell you. We'll see what happens at their next. I know they have an intern right now.

We'll see what happens at their next election when they bring somebody new in. is the thing is unions are a it's like a social movement organization and there are some things about particular groups that find it I think a little bit more natural to find themselves in those social movement organizations I think that plays something that plays some role in the reason why you're right about the black sports thing but plenty of black athletes follow white coaches and they're white people in places I don't necessarily think that the black athletes are, or having black athletes is the driving force. I often think that it's like the mindset.

When you're like building a union, if you have like the proper perspective, it is like a social movement. It's organizing a disenfranchised group, right? Yeah. Well, I want to be clear. I did not mean to imply that, um, the driving force for the black union heads is the black membership. Mm-hmm.

what I was implied is that having a white membership does not, it's a bumpier road to black leadership in that regard. Yeah, I think that's fair. But yeah, I mean, ultimately is when you, if you get the opportunity to talk to the guys, it's the people, the person who you believe you can follow, which is, yeah, I mean, that could be anybody, but you're right. Like the membership, I think, is a little bit more open to,

black leadership when the membership is black, that's fair. But I also think this is a little trickier on the baseball side because, I mean, this has always been what I've read and understood, and I will trust you to verify or not, but I mean, historically speaking, the gold standard for American unions has been the Major League Baseball Players Association. Like, they went out time after time after time and won every single time, basically until the 21st century, right? Even the strike of 94, they came out more winners than they had losers. Now we're in a time we're nationally, you know, the way that we view unions as a country

is like union membership has fallen to some, I think something like 6% or something like this, some incredibly low number. The assault on unions by associating them with communism and everything else from the capitalist industrialist side, it won. They battered them. And the baseball union, the steroid thing kind of broke. to a degree. Like they wound up at an impasse with their membership in part because they couldn't quite figure out how they wanted to feel together about the steroids. From there, the owners got

to take more and more. They reached this place where revenues explode in baseball. Wage growth has not, just like the rest of America, has not ticked up in any place. We see these years where everybody gets offered the same free agent contract. All of these things have happened. And now this union that I don't want to say it's teetering. That feels a little unfair, but they're coming up with a CBA negotiation where a lockout is expected to take place. And this dude does this, right?

And I don't ever want to be the guy to be like, that's why they don't trust y'all because it's not why they don't trust y'all. And by y'all, I mean unions, just to be clear. However, this is not why they do trust y'all. I think your point about the, like, deterioration of, like, union support. And it's not a mistake. Like, it's a concerted effort.

effort. And when you talk to certain unions, of course, hold on to like the fundamental core ideals of what it means to be a union. But also like you talk to some unions and you hear them speaking the language of the ownership class. And like you saw it in the last executive director for the NFLPA. They go hire somebody who is from that world and doesn't fundamentally understand what it means to be a part of a union. And they try and try to build up their union in the same model as like the corporate structure and they believe that what we need to do to compete is to be more like them. We can't beat them at being them. And like that's why I said it's like a social organization. Like it's a it's about collective power. And I think the reason why some of

this stuff is so hurtful is because all you really have is like your legacy and your responsibility to the people before you and the people who come after you. If you have scandal and nonsense, sense, you know what ends up happening is the people in the union feel less and less like a part of the union and feel like the union is something separate from who they are. And in that case, when shit gets hard, if you're with family, you'll stand. You'll survive a lockout if you are standing with your family and you believe that what I'm doing is fighting for the future generation and protecting the sacrifices made by the previous generation. But if you turn the union into some corporate bullshit, when it gets hard, everybody's going to be like, oh,

whatever, I got to get mine. Let's sign this deal. Oh, we're going back a couple percentage points. Eh, it sucks, but let's sign this deal because I got to get this money. And every successive group does the same thing until we get to a place where shit is so bad that people come together again and say, we got to fight to get our shit back. You could just fight right now and never have to get to that point. Sorry about my little soapbox.

No, no, no, but it's important because it's very important to understand and everything, I think everything that you said was 100% correct, because it was always interested to seeing how Marvin Miller, the first president of the Baseball Players Association, would talk about every successful movement. It's just all like, eh, it's gone soft, right? Because this thing is we fight on everything. This is what you have to do.

And when nobody that I know of accused Marvin Miller are doing is getting over on that union, right? The truth is, the union has to be more noble than the other side, because the other side is not bound by a principle. right the union has to be grounded in a shared ethos right it has to be grounded in a shared belief and the person that is in charge of the union it is imperative that that person be upright and moral right because it is imperative and it becomes very it's very important because any failing in that regard and the whole thing falls apart and the only way that you can truly and properly sell yourself

to run a union or to be in those positions in a union is to say, I'm doing this for y'all. And it makes it even more heartbreaking, no matter what the accusation of malfeasance is, no matter what the transgression, especially if it's legit. Like once they find out that you got your hand in the pot, man, come on, dog. Right? Like, like, it affects your membership in a much different way, and it affects everything much larger. And that is why when you are at the top and you get caught, But it's so much worse than when it is the other people because for you it is not about you, right? We understand it's about them over there. On this, it is never about you.

And I put in there the dynamic that makes it a little bit more difficult for sports unions is a disproportionately young membership, which also doesn't have a whole bunch of like professional, like traditionally professional experience, but they do have a huge responsibility. And like the history of like successful union actions in general, like outside of the court, it comes from like the actual members being the leadership. And it's really hard when you're doing just fine and money's coming in and you're worried about your next contract to like get your hands dirty. Like I think that's the challenging thing for the modern sports unions is as, and I'm not

someone who would argue that like making more money is bad. But as the money gets better, the players become less engaged. And as the players become less engaged, you understand that they're going to be less likely to sacrifice. Because while the executive director of the union is like considered the head of the union, no union ever works unless it's the members. And all other like professional unions are different. Like often you work in, you work and you exist in this professional union for decades.

You understand everything that goes on in there and you take responsibility. You have your whole 20s and 30s to figure this out because the guys who are working in your industry that are in their mid 30s to 40s to 50s, they know they've been here. They're fighting. And you don't have that in sports, particularly football, where it's like, all right, you got to 24 to figure this shit out because when you're 27, you're going to be the president of the union or where you're 30. you're going to be on the executive committee of the union. And then you'll have someone who is the executive director who is making the decisions, which I get it, but I don't ever think that's healthy for a union.

The decisions have to be made by the people who are going to, like, we're going to experience the results of the decision. All right. And coming up next, I'm going to land a plane on this. Uh-oh. Ask me how. Ask me how. Don't ask me.

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or call 1-8-8-Hoplingh N-Y or text Hope N-Y in New York. All right, we're back with Dominique Foxworth and I was making the point earlier about if you're going to be

up top in one of these organizations like a union. It's got to be about the union. Like, it can't be about you. That's how this goes. The trick bag with that is, of course, it takes a pretty significant ego to be the person who decides

that you're going to lead a union. And look, we were talking about this of Tony Clark, early Tony Clark, big old 6-8 dude, you know, Major League Baseball player. He was rich before he showed up. That ain't nobody with no shortage of ego. okay like that's how that's going to go but the guy that's going to be in charge you're not going to

get that person generally without there being some measure of ego and that almost always becomes counterproductive to the larger aims of what that person is doing and that brings us to jesse jackson well done right because look jesse jackson uh died on tuesday morning uh you said you'd never been in a room with Jesse, right? Jesse a bad motherfucker, man. Like, there's, there's sometimes,

there's some people, that's the only way to put it. When I was, did the reading with Howard or the Fireside chat with Howard for his book at the Jackie Robinson Foundation, and I heard a gas for I was talking about

Paul Robinson and I was just like, look, man, that's bad motherfucker right there. Look, man, that's the, that's, only if you gas, you don't understand what I'm talking about here, right? Some people, that just simply fits that description. And the thing with Jesse was,

what makes Jesse interesting to me is Jesse comes in as the younger man, right, with that whole crew over there with, you know, with Dr. King and Abanathy and all those dudes, right? He's the younger cat, and he is also by far cooler than everybody else in the crew, right? Like, he's pulling up with the leather jacket and the sweaters and every, you know, just like, he's that guy. He is absolutely next. And he knew it at every time. turn. And it's a great quote here for Stanley Crouch that was used in the New York Times obituary.

And I'll paraphrase it because I can't find it right now. But I'll paraphrase it. He said, Jesse was ultimately doomed by his need to mythologize himself. Right. At every turn, there was a decision that what he was going to do is to create the legend of his life, right? he also managed to live a legendary life, right? Like I don't, I think people need to understand that a lot of you don't know that much about the good of Jesse and some of that is because of his own own goals, but also because there was work done to do it that way, right?

He was the last of the Titans of the Civil Rights movement. We don't pay enough homage to his runs for president in the 80s, right? Talking to Tana Hasi about this, this is very important. Jesse Jackson is one of the biggest reasons Obama could have won in 08 because his campaign in 88,

after it was done and Dukakis needed to bring his supporters into the fold, the trade Jesse made was, okay, but you guys have to change the way that you do primaries. Instead of them being win or take all, there's got to be some proportional distribution of the delegates, which is what made it possible for Obama to win in 08.

Like, this isn't just, the Jesse Jackson Walk so Obama could run kind of situation, right? Jesse is tangibly responsible for what happened later on top of the Jesse

ran, Jesse Walk, so that Obama could run situation. You have, I think that's all very well said, and I think this relates to sports in so many ways

where it's like the history is always kind of like, so much colored by whether you won or lost. And I think there's an underappreciation for the progress made. And one of my friends from school would say this all the time is incredibly smart guy. A lot of really advanced impressive degrees. And he wouldn't go to class and he wouldn't study. And he would get the equivalent of a B.

And then someone else will work their ass off and get an A. And he'd be like, well, the distance I traveled this morning. to when we had the tests and the grade that I got was much more impressive. It's not a perfect corollary to what Jesse is done, but like the distance that Jesse traveled and the environment in which he fought, the things that he accomplished, like you could argue despite the fact that it's not going to, there's not going to, the W for when is not going to be next to his name. You could make the argument that that was just as or more valuable than any other like real

success. because like in a time when there's a significant backlash to have somebody who's willing to fight that backlash. And of course, you're not winning to fight against the backlash. But you are giving somebody, it's the equivalent of forcing them to punt at midfield. Like you're giving yourself a better field position or you're giving the next generation a better field position than they would have otherwise. But nobody is going to write a piece the next day of the game about the third down stop in the middle of the third quarter. you're going to write the piece about the touchdown scored on the subsequent drive. And I think there's something to be said for breaking up that pass on third and six.

I think there's also the biggest thing with Jesse that I think can easily be lost by people who were but so aware of him is he has been perhaps the most impactful advocate for the broader working class of America that there has been. Like this is not, Jesse's work was not simply the work of black people. It was a broad, like the idea of the Rainbow Coalition was a, it's much more in line with the Fred Hampton type of situation or as much as anybody else, right? Same Chicago sort of roots. It's the very similar to the Harold Washington Coalition of 1983 that you put together. But it is working class people of all races and stripes, right, fighting for them, like Operation Breadbasket, okay?

Operation Push. It eventually became that Wall Street project, which is where it got a little weird for Jesse. because that's when you started having cronyism concerns and everything else is when it went over there. Jesse's argument was this is the next frontier of the fight. We got to be over there too. Once you start playing them reindeer games, right, you know, it's real easy people to get caught up in that. But the idea that Jesse was the fighting man for the working class, the 1988 campaign for Jesse Jackson is in large part the template of the Bernie Sanders campaigns that you saw later. If you go back and look at what he was talking about in 88, a lot of his sticks.

through and he was going out and winning. Like he won primaries in 88 making that happen. Now, you know America ain't what America don't live his rapes with a little shop man. My Gukakis was like this big. Ain't no way in the world in America. Man, this big run against a man this big. And the man this big wins. That's just not how we do things ordinarily, right?

Like basically longer to short, being white is like being a foot taller than you really are. Yeah. The impact, and I, so the funny thing is when you get older and read and learn more about it, like I feel like growing up, the Rainbow Coalition and Jesse Jackson's run was almost kind of a joke. Yeah. And I didn't read, like, it was a joke for me. Like, I'm born in 83. So, like, what I did hear about it was, like, how ridiculous and absurd it was.

And the idea that a black person could ever be president and how Jesse. And that was also, we started to learn more and more about his, his, his, off the field issues. Like those, like, it all coalesced to make that all feel like a joke. And now, like, going back and reading about all that stuff, like recognizing the impact that he had is not something that's going to be the, like, title of a chapter and a history book.

But the things that came afterwards couldn't have been possible without it. And it's, it's funny that we, history, we like the thing about history as fact, but it is like, I mean, it is fact, but it's selected. stories and we select people and the choices that were made around Jesse Jackson and the prices that he paid for his issues is inconsistent with the way that we treat just about anybody else because nobody I mean nobody really feels perfect like Obama don't got nothing on it on his jacket everybody else got something pretty significant on their jacket yeah

Obama was thinking Obama started playing the long game yeah before anybody else like yeah let me tell you who was not about to get caught up sleeping with his wife's sister at the office. Oh, hell no. No, no. Obama's not getting anywhere near that. I am going to point this out, by the way, because if you haven't seen it, this is the funniest thing to happen after Jesse Jackson died, the most incredible statement. I provided office space for him and his rainbow coalition for years in the Trump building at 40 Wall Street, responded to his request for help in getting criminal justice reform passed and signed when no other president would even try. Single-handedly pushed along and passed long-term funding for historically black colleges and universities with Jesse loved, but also which other presidents would not do.

Responding to Jesse's support for opportunities zones, the single most successful economic development package yet approved for black business men and women and much more. I am fascinated by the idea that Trump's people were ready for this, right? They were like the last thing anybody had on their bingo card is positive statement. They tried to act like black history muff ain't going on. And Trump was like, nah, that Jesse dude is all right with me. Hold on. Hold on. Here's where he did it.

Jesse was a force of nature like few others before him. He had much to do with the election without acknowledgement or credit of Barack Hussein Obama, a man who Jesse could not stand. He loved his family greatly. And to them, I said my deepest sympathies and condolences. Jesse will be missed. And the thing about that last party is, not one lie was told.

I don't root for the team, but that was one hell of a play. One hell of a play. Like, it was the surprise of it. And then, like, the accuracy and execution, because, like, there's, Trump has not written or put out a respectful eulogy of anybody. No.

Like he burns everybody, even people that were like, oh, like I feel like he went after McCain. Like this, he's on your side, man. And in this case, the shock that it was like a favorable one combined with the slights at the end. It's a well-executed play, man. It's well-designed, well-executed. He hates Obama so much. It is so dedicated to hating Obama that he was, he, he wasn't missing any opportunity, right? He was like, oh, this is a perfect time.

And I will note, I hope Obama's people, when he put that out, I was like, oh, boy, Obama better step to the plate. Because you can't, you can't let Trump outdo you now, dog. It's not an option. And by the way, he just set a fairly high bar. And he, and he preemptively cut off any, credit that you was going to give him. Like, you ain't give him no credit before.

Essentially, like, he ain't even like you. And you didn't like him. Dirty move. That was, I mean, I will say, though, I will never forget in, oh, wait, watching Jesse, who, like I say, them two men had their issues, right? It's, it's very,

it's a very similar situation to, like, Jordan and Isaiah Thomas fighting for the soul of Chicago, right? Like, like, Isaiah being like, you, I made it so that Mike could walk these streets. Perfect. And Mike don't give me no credit, right? Very similar, right? Yeah, it's a perfect analogy.

I think that your point is, like, Obama was like much more of the, I don't want to say Dr. King because Dr. King was different, but like Obama grew up in a world and separate from the experience that Jesse had. Like Jesse Jackson had a much more like, I guess stereotypical might be the word, like stereotypical, like, um, challenging. black upbringing. That wasn't, yeah. And his motherfucker ain't said,

thank you one time. That's like, that's, that's, that's, that's Jesse's situation, right? He's like, and he's not the only person who feels this way.

He's like, he ain't say thank you to me one time. Obama's people, hey, man, y'all better get that statement crack it. Hey, hey, hey,

you might want to, no, not what of your Harvard. Like, if it was me, not what are your Harvard partner's. Nah, nah, like,

nah, you need to get on the phone with somebody you ain't talked to in a while. And get anybody from On your team You and I both We read that from Trump

And we're like Yo, I can't believe This happened It was tough It's a tough comeback from that one man Sometimes You know what that was They put that one in the coffin quarter

No return There's no return No return You got to run your back Up ways You can't fair catch it Right Like you got to

You got to I don't think that there's a, yeah, you got a fair catch it and wait to the next one. We got to get you the next year. Trump put that dad and was like, now you go. Your turn. What you got to say about the editing?

Who in the office was like, no, we, I think we got a winner here. You know what I'm saying? Like, I think, no, no, I think we can win on this issue, right? And also, I get the feeling that Trump did like Jesse Jackson. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, yeah, far being for me to try to pretend like I can understand them.

But like, yeah, that, yeah, there was some, yeah, it was unexpected. And I think that there was some like mutual 80s celebrity. Yes. Yeah, like, yeah. They might have met backstage at Saturday Night Live. For sure. Have you ever seen the clip? Because Jesse's relationship with Saturday Night Live is interesting.

Like there was a self-awareness. Maybe part of this was also ego. But if you've ever, if you've never seen Jesse Jackson read after Dr. Seuss died, they had Jesse Jackson come a weekend update and read Green Eggs and Ham. And he never breaks Jesse Jackson character. Like he reads it like, like you imagine a comedian being like, can you imagine Jesse Jackson reading Sam I am? Except it's not a comedian. It's Jesse Jackson. Right.

And then there's the Eddie Murphy sketch that I don't think I can say the title. too, but just don't let me down. If you Google Jesse Jackson, I mean, Eddie Murphy, don't let me down. You'll get a great time. Rest in peace, Jesse Jackson. Oh, you, you've not seen that one? I saw the weekend update.

Oh, oh, oh. Ryan, we're going to do a two-minute pause in the record so that Dominique can watch Don't Let Me Down, and then we will cut it back in with Dobidique's reaction. don't let me down oh man oh gosh it reminds me a little bit

of the like Black Jeopardy sketch where it's like all the connections and the obvious points that no one else realizes until you put it in a sketch and is pretty pretty impressive Eddie Murphy

Hey man we both got big noses gold chains on our chest it's my favorite part that's what he's in that's so many other lines that I feel like I can't repeat I'm not going to take the risk Oh, yeah, no, no, my favorite one was the one right at the end when you called out,

the brothers and sisters. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And then it goes to the next one, yeah, man, no, I ain't willing, I ain't risking my career all this. Not on that one. It was, it was funny for Eddie back in those days. Yep, yep, yep, yep, yep, yep, no need for me to repeat. That which is no need not be said. And now, with the transition to take us home, I was not around for the All-Star gang.

I don't, it's President's Day. maybe like to take a weekend. It's not a great content time, so I typically go away. But at least this time where I went somewhere that was in reasonable time zone situation. So I watched a little bit of the All-Star game. And it is amazing that the biggest thing from a very good All-Star gang, it was two things. One, nobody wants to get their shit pitched on television. And the idea that the one guy taking this seriously is the Condor, that'll make everybody take it seriously. just because a six-foot-one guy

could not dictate the terms of this the way the guy that could pitch everybody shit could dictate the terms. But obviously the biggest thing about the All-Star weekend is every clip of Kevin Durant under siege on his phone because somebody decided to allegedly leak his various burner tweets

and direct messages and the likes, okay? I am operating on the premise that those things are true. I cannot say whether or not they are true. I am operating on the premise that they are true because it sure sounds like they are. Has he denied it yet? I have not, no, I don't think so because he hasn't had to do any media.

Yeah, but I mean, why, when has Kevin Durant ever waited for media to make his opinion known? Like, that was the thing. I had Jay Kang on my show, and we talked a little bit about this. And Jay pointed out at the time that it had been 48 hours, more than 48 hours since Kevin Duran had tweeted,

which was the longest period of him not tweeting since, I think, 2019. Yeah. And like this, the behavior, certainly is the behavior of somebody who is uncomfortable with what was happening in the world around him. It's not like, I imagine that if it was a hoax, which is not fair, completely fair to say, but like, wouldn't your first thing be like, hey, I'm a tweet out, hey, guys, that ain't me. That's some bullshit. Well, I mean, look, we could just simply say that boy was under siege.

Yeah. Right? He was under siege and you could perhaps extrapolate that he is still under siege from the fact that we have not heard anything from him. And I just have to say this. This guy is hilarious. Whoever this person is that is sending these things, I wish we could get a little bit more of him in front of the world. because, I mean, I felt like get off my Dickerson. That's a great start.

Heat. Also, get off my Dickerson, which is the handle that he uses, also hilarious. It's a great start. And the cocaine bear, I think, was the pinnacle of it. It was a perfect description. It demands a writer. Whoever it is, if it's him or not, he has the ability of a writer. Well, also, there was some, like, where he said about Steve Kerr, get off by

Dickerson, that is, where he says, since MJ Punch, Kerr, he don't fuck with dark skins. That's hilarious. Good joke. I swear I miss Ben Simmons. At least that N-word would pass me to ball. That is hilarious. He compared Frank Vogel and Devin Booker.

He called them two dictators, Stalin and Hitler, Mussolidi, and Kim Jong-un. In the face for trying to critique Steph during film session, like everybody looked at it. Oh, yeah. But see, I think the Phoenix stuff is the one. where like, let's talk about this a little more because the question with that team always was about the relationship between Durant and Booker,

which also had a lot to do with the relationship between Durant and the people around Booker. Like, there was a lot going on there. Kevin Durant, or excuse me, get off by Dickerson, clearly believes that Kevin Durant frequently is asked to compete with his teammates, including he felt, get off by Dickerson, believes that

Kyrie wasn't competing with him. He was just a little cuckoo for Cocoa Puffs. But that light skin that I would assume Get Off by Dickerson is referring to Steph Curry and that triple double cocaine baby. That's my favorite.

That's just good writing, man. I'm assuming Get Off by Dickerson is referring to Russell Westbrook. Yeah. Oh, okay. Like the mildest things, though one might think the most impactful are the things that he says about his own team. Excuse me. Get off Mike Dickerson says about the Rockets that he refers to as this shitty ass team.

The best part. They're second in the way or their third in the west, I think, or fourth, something like that. Wow. I'm realizing it's the first time that I'm realizing that all of the things that have gotten a lot of traction have been like obvious insults with the exception of the one that I find the most amusing. Like triple double cocaine bear

I mean it ain't clearly a shot. Like I mean say your man play like a cocaine bear like it ain't necessarily a compliment but it ain't calling them Stalin say to get a bunch of triple double. It ain't quite the same as saying that you don't fuck with dark skins.

Like this is the nice thing you said. Bear. I did not know that there was recently a movie called Cocaine Bear that was based on an actual cocaine bear. I, I, triple double, I mean, cocaine bear. Let me make sure I get this right about cocaine bear, which came out in 2020. I don't be paying attention to movies, but I really ain't paying attention to a movie called Cocaine Bear. Starry Russell, Carrie Russell, O'Shea Jackson, Jr. and has got the late great Isaiah Whitlott Jr. aka. Shee. He's in the movie. And it is based on an actual factual cocaine bear, a bear that ate 75, 175 pound bear that fatally overdose on cocaine because it came across a brick and it ate it up. 75 pounds were to Coke.

And they was like, what's up? I remember the movie and I remember hearing it's based on a true story. I respect myself too much to have watched it. I don't know if it was a good time or not. but I didn't know Carrie Russell was in it. And like, I enjoy the show on Netflix called The Diplomat, where she's in there. Oh, that's who she is. Yeah, acting her ass off and being all profound and important, she had cocaine bear.

How do you make these choices? That's not a good sign right there. Somebody do something like, say they end the cocaine bear movie and they've been in other stuff. That's when you start being like, you know, let me see your, you be gambling? like let me get a look up that nose why you always going to the bathroom. I had to double check, make sure that Carrie Russell is who I think she was

because I do get confused sometimes. Like a lot of the stars be, they follow the same template and I just get confused. Yeah. But, you know, so here's the thing about Duran. Duran's going to survive this for a couple of reasons. One, there's a big gap between the All-Star game

and when anybody has to like come across him, so it's not going to come up. Number two, we know we know him you know what I'm saying like this is

this is always on the board the only challenge is like he got to go back into that workplace it's not just all previous people it's current people too yeah but you know it wouldn't surprise me if he says those things to them all the time

you know what I mean like like this is this is what I don't know is these are only problems if he doesn't say these things to them out loud. I also want to point out something that is very interesting. He said he loved James Harden.

He said he's slightly delusional, but I understand him. James stay cool with everybody, except apparently for Kyrie with Kyrie. But James stayed cool with Russell after they went and played together in Houston and it didn't go well. They still super cool. He's still super cool with Durant.

And we're out my favorite James Hardin quote of all time because they truly aren't that many. Well, aside from, Darry is a liar. and I'll never play for a team that he works for. I repeat, or I said, Darryl Morey is a liar, is I'll give him the shot myself.

He was so mad at Kyrie. He was the only one that was like, don't you see what the problem is here? I'll give him the shot myself if I have to. But James Hardin seemed to be cooler than we realized. Did you watch James Hardin on the, like, Netflix basketball show? I didn't, but like, yeah, I feel like maybe we could get some insight. Right, because you're right.

He's been a bunch of different places, and he behaves in the way that I think turns off a lot of us and media and fans who are not the fan of the team that he is on or the team that he's trying to get to. But you're right. Routinely, I can't really think of other guys that are that big a star and move around that much. It'd have a distinct style that could,

it's a style of play that could be annoying to teammates and opponents, but everybody loves him. He a good dude, I guess, in some capacity. Are they any mess with him in Philly? They didn't love him. They didn't love him so much in Philly. The fans or the team? Yeah, but his thing about Hardin, though, he had a good time.

Yeah. I hear James Hardin parties be cracking. That's all we know about him, man. That's all we know. He liked to step back, and, yeah, he liked the shakers. He does like the shake. That's all we know about him, that. Those two things, and he got a beard.

He loves the Jake. Dret. He's so addicted to the telephone, man. Yeah. Like that was my thought. It's the All-Star game, and I get that you undeceived, but I guess it would be hard to put down the phone under those circumstances. But like he is on the phone.

It is your reminder. NBA players got a lot more time than one might think. Practice the same time, games the same time. The rest of the time, it's all in you. It's not that much different from being a professional podcast. I don't know what, yeah, it's a lot fun to have this conversation, but I think that there is something a little bit deeper and more interesting about the idea of these essentially child stars growing up in this like very different type of environment where they're kind of protected and like a lot of the issues that a lot of the immaturities and behaviors that other of us have. Like those get sanded off because we just ain't great enough to tell people to shut up and mind their business.

It's like interesting combining that with like social media and someone who's obviously a little bit like, unique and super talented. Like, who do you become in your 30s and 40s? That's the life that you led and your major, like, contact with the outside world is through to Twitter. Like, I don't know. I'm not pretending to be to, like, psychoanalyze anybody, but I think that that has something to do with the journey. Hey, man, that man got takes. It is amazing that he's the one guy that doesn't have a podcast like that.

Yeah. Right? Like, I would check his podcast out. Yeah. He clearly has, like, he's not the guy that we're like, yo, he retires, he's going to be on television, sounds to me like he would be excellent. He would be. I would enjoy it.

He's incredibly knowledgeable, right? He's very famous. Funny. He's trying to get a cut every week, right? Like, that's, that becomes his own thing. But, I mean, he seems like the takes are the hard thing to come by, right? Like, all these cats that have decided that they're going to be podcasters, that's what they've learned.

The hard part is actually having opinions about stuff. He has so many opinions that he already. argues with strangers. Like, a lot of this, get off my Dickerson guy, a lot of this appears to be arguing with strangers. The last thing that I want to point out, it's been a while now, so we haven't talked about this,

but I can tell you something right now that's real, okay? I've only been in like up close with Kevin Durant like a couple of times. One of them was at the office, at the seaport. the other was at a wedding and I don't know how exactly to refer to people that I like who also really like Drake

because like it's not appropriate to say OV Ho about people you know. You understand what I'm saying? And people you like. However, this wedding was very much so people firmly planted on the Drake in the Drake camp and not in the Drake camp just because they like the music

but people who knew Drake. and you wasn't hearing no no to no Kendrick anywhere there. Those people who were in proximity of that beef, it was real to them, right? Like they picked their sides and they got on their army. And Kevin Durant was clearly on the Drake side because we had a dude put out his DMs that seemed very clearly to be from Kevin Durant

and it's just all him going in about this beef. You talked to Kendrick today? Why you want, stop ignoring me, bro. I'm wondering if your daddy, Kenner. know as you exist. Like he, he was a infantryman in the great beef of 2024. He's incredibly interesting. You're right.

Like, uh, inside look like Kevin Durant, he might be the only player because as we get all these like documentaries from players that they put out that most people find a little boring because they're like sanitized and controlled by the players. Kevin Durant might be the one that gets to the point where he could actually give us like a real look at who he is that gets really interesting because he doesn't. seem, even though he hasn't owned up to this, whether it's him or not, he doesn't seem as, like, concerned about protecting his, like, air quotes, brand or image as so many other players are. Like, he feels a little bit more real than a lot of players, which is cool. I mean,

he is more honest about the whack things about him. Yeah. Because, I mean, it's, as someone who used to argue with a lot of people on the internet never under a fake name. Right? Get off my Dickerson is engaging in whack behavior. I mean, it's kind of hard to ignore that, right? Isn't it just

talking shit about your coworkers, which is like everybody does? To your friends. Do it on your name. Yeah. Like that's my thing is I have never trapped if there existed in an internet space that was in anything other than my name. Yeah. Like if you're not going to put your name on it, then it

trampled, it goes into the whack place. The only reason why I would defend that is because they were DMs. Like, he wasn't like trying to like propagate these rumors about players, uh, publicly without putting his name on it. Like, my understanding is while these people may not

be his actual like close friends, the people in the chat knew who he was and they're essentially his friends. And he's just talking shit about his co-workers to his friends. Yeah, yeah, that is fair. Like that was one thing when I did game theory that I recognized was I have no idea what these people are saying about me

what I'm not around, but they are because I'm the boss now. Right? Like all these shows that I've done is like, somebody got some shit to say about me when I'm not around because I know I got some shit to say about them when they're not around. And only because it would hurt their feelings if they were around. It's not because I am afraid. It's that it's bad for business.

But sometimes you just got to get it out. There's some things that just aren't like not socially acceptable, which, I mean, to be fair, part of the problem with the NBA is things that should not be socially acceptable have become socially acceptable like fucking tanking and foul grifting

and all the other bullshit that makes the NBA a little annoying I can't wait to the playoffs that shit be fun as hell I also love that you deem that those things are socially unacceptable and this is why I love you because I'm right there with you

like I had to say these because I got to be all for Friday, right? They're not anymore is the thing I wish they were Because like that's the thing that when we try to change all these things to incentivize players to do this, incentivize season, let's change the draft. Let's change incentivize. Like there was one thing that always worked for incentives in the past was you knew you would be shamed. And we dove into this on my show, but that's one of the big like results of like our optimization culture is that we've all turned into these tiny little GMs, which is something that I've heard you talk about before where we're like, well, It's the best way to win. Why don't you just think? Like, there was a time when you would at least pretend not to be cheating.

Like, you had enough self-respect to, like, put out a product that you could respect. But now we've all defended them as like saying, this is the incentives. This is the incentives. No, those incentives were there in the past, but there was a stronger incentive. You ain't want to be called a bum. We got a normalized calling people losers. Yeah. Like when they're actually losers,

we got to like normalize calling people losers. I'm with that, bro, boy. We'd be here another hour talking about this. This is Dominic Foxworth. Check him out on the Dominic Foxworth show available with All Fine Podcasts and giving away for free. My man had a live show.

He even did the whole thanks to my audience sort of thing. You getting a little proud of what you built there. Got your little community, got your tribe over there. You know what I'm saying? I will note this. When Charlie Kravich did not know if I was going to be there or not, he sent me and told me I could get in for free

but wasn't having me on the show. Okay. Y'all got big over there. Ain't no room for your boy no more. That is absolutely false. There's always room for you. Nah, but seriously, though, I think was that on your show where Marcus Spears said that he's afraid of cats because he don't want nothing walking around

his house that can sneak up all to me to can't hear it? It was a good point. It was a great point. I got a cat and I had to go ahead and give him that way. You're right. That's weird. He's ain't anybody tiptoeing it. First of all, there's no way anybody's tiptoeing in that house. No, no, no, no.

They all big and amazing. Yeah, y'all want to get in no 4-4-505 contest of any sort with Spearses. Like, I met his wife once because people don't know Mark's wife playing the WNBA and I met her at the office once. And it was, you know, the couple that J's together stays together, right? They both got their Jays on. She damn near his height. and their kids like with the I know their daughter was like top volleyball player in America in high school or stuff like that yeah top 10 basketball playing son the younger daughter better at volleyball she here like the younger daughter is also better I went to see Marcus his son play a little while ago and it was in one of those like tournaments where it's all these future NBA players and that boy special and also I put on top of it there's something about when we've talked about this before

and like the professionalization of youth sports and how a lot of these kids are they're like trying to get themselves in the right position to do that and trying to protect and work on this part of the game. And of course, all that stuff is true of Marcus's son also. But Marcus is a football player

and Marcus talks to his son like a football player, which I fucking love. Marcus is on the sideline. I'm sitting courtside with Marcus and his, everyone, and I was like, yeah, run the floor, get in position, set a screen. Marcus is like, put his little ass in the basket. That's the type of mandate racing.

So I think he's going to be all right. Also, keep in mind Marcus Cahookehoot. Oh, yeah. Marcus was a really good high school basketball player. I loved it. Yeah, man, brother, I appreciate you. And ladies and gentlemen, thanks so much for joining us here on The Right Time. We do this four times a week.

Ryan Brumley handles everything behind the scenes. Thank you, sir. Remember, follow the right time. Subscribe. Rate us, review us, give us five stars. You only give us four stars. I'm inclined to believe you're a hater. Talk to you guys in a couple of days. Take it easy.