The Right Time with Bomani Jones - Joel Anderson on Dabo Swinney's Likable Tirade: How Nick Saban Integrated the SEC, Is Miami Football Back? | 09.19

Episode Date: September 19, 2025

Bomani Jones is joined by The Ringer's Joel Anderson. First, they discuss Dabo Swinney's press conference and debate whether or not they find the Clemson coach likable. Later, they break down how Nick Saban integrated the SEC, Black people's experience with college football fandom, & if Miami is finally back under Mario Cristobal. 00:00 - Introduction 01:00 - Is Joel a Hater? 05:00 - Has Dabo become likable? 18:53 - Can Kirby keep up his success? 22:40 - How Nick Saban integrated the SEC 32:20 - Black College Football fandom 48:00 - How Alabama integrated college football 57:50 - Is Miami back? Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the right time, a wave original. My name is Beaumani Jones. Thanks for listening wherever you get your podcast. Thanks for watching us on YouTube. Subscribe, like, rate us, review us, give us five stars. You only give us four stars. You probably remind me a lot of today's guests. Coming to us live from the Rangor Tailgate.

A new podcast, College Football with Van Lathen over there at the Rangor. Joel Anderson, what's going on? I don't like the reputation I'm getting to be. as a hated. Because you know how like on reality shows, how someone doesn't realize they're being portrayed

as a villain until they come back home and then they're like, oh man, everybody hated me. So then they come back to the reunion show all mad. And that's me

because this is not fair. I'm a lover. Not a hater. I would even say that I'm a romantic. But people look like, dog, what you're doing?

What you're doing? What you're doing? I feel like, my word. I feel like my words, people are taking my words out of context. What? Because people will be on, in comments on YouTube or Instagram and they'll be like, oh, Joe, being a hater again. And I'm like, what are you talking about? I'm not a hater. Joe, Joe, Joe. I'm a lover. First of all, this is not like the reality shows where you don't realize you to bill it until you get home because I be telling you. That's number one. Number two,

I remember when I posted the pictures when I went to Taylor's wedding and I was in the tux and immediately people were like, where Joel at hating? And guess who was in the comments hating? And see, the thing was it wasn't hate. I was saying you looked like a pastor, which is not hate. No, no. That was what I went to Trey's wedding. When I was Taylor's wedding, it was in the tux and they was like, where Joel at hating? And you would immediately say that that would be the other picture in a funeral program. All I'm telling you is this. People expect it from you and you do it. No, I just, again, I feel like they're extrapolating a lot from our relationship,

our particular dynamic. No, no, no, no, again, I don't like, I don't like that. Because, you know, when I first started, when I first started dating my wife, and her and her friends called me Compassion Anderson, because I was just as a compassionate person. I really have a lot of love for the world. I'm a wanderer, a romantic, I don't, you know, the hater label does not suit me. Now, there are people I hate. There are things I do not like. Joel, you're the most vengeful person I've ever met by life. How could that ever be? I haven't even done nothing to nobody, man. Would you like to? Yeah.

Yeah. But I think that's what makes me, you know, I think that actually, you know what it is? It's your greatest achievement coming when you was 10 years old. See, if you all are looking at this, who's the one who's hated so far. Okay. For those who don't know, Joel was the past. fastest 10-year-old in America. Just so we clear, it was a pretty stupendous feat. I mean, I think, you know, I was talking about this with somebody the other day.

I'm like, so I'm 47 years old now. What difference does it make if you were great at 18, 23 or 10? You should be able to talk about their accomplice. When you were the best or you were great at something at any age prior to the age you are now, it should be something you're proud of. And people make fun of me for talking about being the fastest 10-year-old in the country,

But okay, great. You were a five-star recruit when you were 17 years old. Were you 43 years old now? So, okay, we can all move on. Yeah, okay, as if we don't make fun of them Al Bundy types also. Like, you just, you're a different brand to Al Bundy. It's cool. It's cool.

Hey, man. I was good in high school, too. Hold on, I know, man. Four touchdowns. Not in a whole season. You know, one gay. One guy. That is, by the way, one of the greatest running gags in the history of television.

is Al Buddy's four touchdowns in one game. I love it. Polka! Polka! I always say, though, if you'd ever score four touchdowns in one game, you'd understand why you'd be talking about 30 years later. I ain't gonna lie.

I wish I'd, like, if I scored four touchdowns in one game, like, and I guess maybe it's because I'm from Texas, so, like, what it means to compete at high school football at a high level in my brain maybe means something a little bit different. But if I scored four touchdowns in a varsity football game, like, you'd hear about me. Yeah. That's what I'm saying.

I mean, so people were hating on Al, but now I've kind of come to understand. I was like, oh, man, he needs to pop his shit. That was, yeah. And I mean, again, the fastest 10-year-old in America would be able to relate. Hey, buddy, I got to run something by you right quick. We go in a little bit too long,

talking about this other stuff when we got all this good college football that we can talk about. Oh, yeah. I'm curious. Where are you, like, I find myself evolving on this, but in the year of our Lord, our Lord, 2025, where are you on that boy, Davo?

So I think that Dabo, I feel, I don't feel sorry for him is not the word, but I look at him like a man who is rapidly out of place in the current environment in which he works, right? Like he just is no longer, he's like, like, I don't say, I don't feel sorry for Mike Gundy, but it's sort of similar to Mike Gundy. I'm just like, oh, like, you're just not built for this particular era of college football. and people want to hold you accountable for that. And you're understandably being like, what have y'all done before me? Like, who are y'all? Who are you to judge me?

You can go back to being, they used to say Clemsoning was a thing that people used to say about us. Is that which I want back? But that's not really what people are talking about. They're just like, hey, man, could you embrace the portal a little bit more? Could you do the NIL thing a little bit more? Could you be more excited about that stuff

and get us back to the level we were ever? But yeah, I feel sorry. What about you? Because please don't tell me that you're, you're warm into this dude. Yeah, I am. Come on, man. You get no.

You get no. No, it's not even this. Actually, Dabo did things at the time when everybody, like, super duper hated Dabo that made me be like, you know what? I'm with you there, right? And so the first time I looked up at something that Dabo did, and I was like,

huh. And I don't know if you remember this. I think it was 2015. And Dionne Kane was a freshman receiver on that team. And Dionne Kane was really good. And he failed a drug test. And so he did not play in the Orange Bowl, which I believe it was the Orange Bowl,

the semi-final game there, right? He was eligible to come back for the championship game. And Daveno did not put him back in. Now, I think it is preposterous, assuming that the drug in question was marijuana. I think it is preposterous. idea that they were even testing for it, the idea that he would misgame the first or anything. Like, that's how I view things. I have a respect for the fact that even in the face of his own

self-interest, dabble believes that that's the devil's lettuce that you out here smoking. And with the option of being like, but oh, well, we're going to bring you back? No. His principal belief is that you should not be playing, right? I don't agree with that. But I got to appreciate a man that stood on his square in that moment when most of us would have absolutely found ways to do gymnastics around it, right? I think I find very often that I can ride with somebody with whom I don't agree when it becomes clear to me that they mean that shit that they're talking about, right? And I think that the way in which he meant it in that case was probably something that was a little bit positive, but it made me have to be like, okay, I see where you're

coming from, right? I see that you believe some of these things that you are actually saying, right? So for now, the portal thing, for example, I think that allowing players to transfer and play immediately was something that they ultimately had to do because of the mobility between coaches, but I also believe is something that is very, very bad for the overall health of college football. I don't think, and that I don't think is nearly as beneficial to the players as we would like to think it is, right? Everybody in this country has the right to make bad decisions. And so you have to allow them to make those bad decisions,

but we are making it easier for bad decisions to be made. For him to make the call of, I want to build my team, I want it to be us, I want this to be continuous. I want us to have a unit, right? And I don't just want to be out here playing free agent football. Everything that he said before about how he did not want to coach a college football team, I feel like he is demonstrating that no, I told you this isn't what I want to do. This isn't how I think it should be done.

And I'm going to try to win this in the way that I want to win it. I have a respect for the fact that he's doing that. Now, what works against him obviously is he had one of the great runs in the history of college football at Clemson with the Sean Watson Trevor Lawrence years, right? Like it really, really goes into that particular time period. He exceeded what any of us ever thought was possible at the job that he has. I don't think that level of success that we're discussing is possible again at that job. But nonetheless, he did what seemed impossible.

He made it happen. Now people want that again. And he could get addicted to the we're going to be top three every year and do all the things. That ain't the way he wants to do the things. I get you if you're a fan and you don't like the fact that that's not what he wants to do. But I admit that I respect somebody standing on his square about it when I think that in this context, the square he's standing on is not a, it's not a bad one, right? Like, I think it is, at the very least, morally defensible. I mean, I disagree with him in his approach

to this. But I think the thing for me is that that is not his job. Like, he gets to hold that job, right? Like, that is a job that he has temporarily. But the job doesn't belong. to Davos-Sweeney, it belongs to Clemson, the athletic department, and the board of regents, and whoever else. And the job is what it is. If he brought in a recruit and they were like, well, you know, we're, you know, there's this whole new offense, you know, there's a whole new style of offense going on.

He's like, but no, man, I want to run a wishbone, you know? The kid, he would be like, no, man, when this recruit comes in, no, you got to play the way that I tell you to play. Like, this is what it takes to compete right now. And that's basically what he's. he's doing, he's like not doing what the job calls for now. And if you don't want to do that, that's fine, but you need to do that somewhere else then, right? Because that, again, the job belongs to the school, not dabbo Swinney. And he seems to believe that I'm Dabo Swinney,

this job belongs to me. Which, for what it's worth, a reasonable position to take if you're Dabo Swinney. I understand why he believes that. Right. I mean, that's, that's, that's, that's, That's all I'm saying. Like, I think when he got up there the other day, it was like, y'all want to get me out here, cool. But y'all tired of winning? I was like, hey, baby, I'm not even bad at you. You know what I called that? Like, all this winning we've been doing, y'all don't want no more of that winning?

You know, that's the old Nolan Richardson, you know? When you're dead, when you're dead under fire you're like, you're like, that's the thing. He didn't say that, right? Right, right, right. No one got us there. They can give me my money and I'll leave tomorrow. Yeah. Yeah, they're like, okay, get your black ass out here.

Yeah, yeah. Devil, I don't, I don't think that we truly give him enough credit for being the outlier that he has been in working at that job. I don't think we do. I mean, I don't, what else is he supposed to get? People say that he's great. He's won a couple of championships. But, hold on, how great. When you say that people say that he's great, I, I, I, again. He's the best coach in the history of Clemson. I mean, I think that's a no-brainer, right? I think we underestimate winning two championships in three years and going to three or four national championship games. He went to four national championship games at Clemson.

Again, at Clemson. Schools do not rise above their previous level very often, let alone do so consistently. You don't even remember that time that your little school went the national championship game, that little blip. You know what I'm saying? That just like, it doesn't work that way. This dude and what he pulled off, I think, is far more of a historic accomplishment

than we give it credit. He has as many national championships as Bobby Boughton. We do not think of Dabell Swinney in the context of Bobby Bouton. Now granted, Bobby Boughton had 14 years in the row in the top five, but we still don't, I still think that pulling out off at Clemson is a lot harder than it was to do what Bobby Bouton did at Florida State. Yeah, well, I mean, man, you know, Florida State used to be like a teacher's college, right? Like, it was a woman's school once point of time.

Yeah, but Joe, we know what Bobby did. It wasn't genius, right? It would, right, of course. But I guess I'm trying to think, I mean, again, I agree with you that, I guess I just don't agree that Daibo deserves any more credit than he's earned. Like, I felt like, you know, I think some of that is that he's not been there long enough to be on the all times when, all times. time wins listing, right? Like, I think that matters because that's what elevated Bobby and

Jopah. Like, they were there for, you know, 30, 40 years or whatever, and they got to be high up on those charts. And so people got sort of familiar with them in that role. But I also think that, like, what is, you know, he is responsible for the ways people sort of regard him, right? Like, he sort of played himself off as kind of the, you know, well, I'm just dabbo, blah, blah, blah, you know, he doesn't, like, hold himself out like he's some sort of coaching mastermind. And so I think people are treating him accordingly. Well, neither did Bobby Bowden. Right.

I don't think people, do people think Bobby Bowden is a coaching mastermind? No, but Bobby Bowden is absolutely regarded as a coaching legend. And I don't think that Sweeney, and maybe it'll take a while before people can, like, look, here's the thing I will say about Davo. I was there for the early Davo days. That old takes exposed dude used to go find all my old dabbo tweets.

And I'm like, were you watching that gang? Oh, yeah. It looked like he had no idea. like he does have a gomer pile sort of vibe right that's the thing yeah it seemed like he but all those things being the case i get why and look that's part of why people i don't part of why people quit that job at alabama is that nothing you did is ever good enough right right but this ain't alabama dog right like i feel like every and we talk one of the best things about college football is every job has different levels every job has different expectations right it is fascinating

that this job, just because they beat Alabama a couple times, they seem to be under the impression that they, too, are Alabama. They think they're a blue blood, and that's just not how it is and how it's going to work. You know, also real quick, that was 55 years old. He sure is. Good looking dude, you know, for his age. Well, he was also younger when he started that job that I realized. Yeah.

So I think that, I wonder if that's also sort of a part of it. Like, a lot of his, theoretically, a lot of his coaching resume is still yet to be, done yet, right? Although, you know, it seems like the way things are headed, there used to be a time when we were growing up, coaches were retiring their 60s. You know, like Grant Taft and Spike Dikes. You know, people, they would just leave. They wouldn't coach it. They were. Daryl left that 51. Yeah. You know, man, when they, when you were talking about the Cowboys documentary and people were talking about, oh, man, you know, I thought Tom Landry was like 90 years old, you know, the way people talked about him. And he was in his mid-60s when he left the game. And so that's just kind of how, you know, it used to be, people seem older, but. Like, Davos sort of a young guy, and people have this expectation that he's going to be coaching for a long time. And so people may look at this and say, well, that was sort of a historical blip. The coach that you actually are is this nine and three guy who struggles to adapt to the change in times. Like you got, you caught lightning in a bottle, but now, you know, you have the rest of your career to live up to that level.

And I guess that's a frustrating part. Would we then say that about Darrell Royal? They had that 30 game winery when they brought to Wishbone out there, right? that is a significant part of the legend. And then he went out on five straight terrible losses to Barry Switzer. I don't think we look back and say that what you really were was this other thing after this thing flipped up, right? Who do you think is the greatest coach in Texas? Do you think it's Mack Brown or do you think it's Darrell Roel?

I think you probably have a better argument for Roil than you have from Mac. Okay. Okay. So the tricky part in evaluating that obviously is the whole race thing. Right. Right. And I don't know exactly who's voted was to decide to stay in the Stone Age as long as that program. I mean, Texas was the last team to win a national championship with number of white players.

Like, I don't know that part. Mack was the first coach at Texas to have like a fully integrated team. And it's a lot underachieving, uh, that went on there and also the best team in the history of the school. Right. Also, yeah. I mean, I think the thing, some of that is it. And I think this is kind of what dabble is laboring under. everybody like because nick saban did it and we see this in other things too because tom brady

did it because lebron did it like we're seeing like longevity and greatness in ways that we just never saw before like people get to be great and had these amazing runs for so long things that are basically unprecedented in the history of sports and they think that that's just the way things are supposed to be and so like you you're right like clinson fans are looking at dabbo and they're just like, well, man, Nick Saban won a seven national championship. Why can't you be doing that? But the thing is, everybody's trying to do that. Like college football is extremely competitive.

You're only probably going to win one or two. Like you said, Bobby Bowden, only won two. The reason he only won two is sometimes he underachieve, but also is really hard, man, and especially the way they used to do college football, where it's like, one loss would doom you. One bad Saturday would doom you forever. So I just wonder if, like, you know, Dabo is laboring under these unrealistic expectations that we place on people that we that have experienced some greatness and we think

oh they're supposed to be doing this over and over and over again and that's just not really the way things work in coaching or sports or anything up next kirby smart he's the next guy hey look man um Georgia is another program that we could argue was a bit of a historical underachiever absolutely it is um the landscape now the Georgia as a state that exists now is different than the Georgia that existed as a state. You could argue when Vince Duly had the job. And actually, I think that is maybe the most interesting thing about this program, that the job that Ben's Dooley had is much different than the job Mark Rick had.

And the job Mark Rick took is much different than the job that Kirby Smart now has. Right. And look, that program still do weird things. Charles McDonald and I talked about this. Hadn't had a black quarterback in the last 20 years, for example. Was the last one, DJ Shockey? DJ Shacken was the last one. And I'm trying to think Quincy Carter was the one before him.

Yeah, Quincy Carter, man. Before him, I think it was some boy that I was running the bone. You know, like that's where I think that was. But with Georgia, Georgia is achieving in a way where all things held equal. You can make an argument that year in, year out, Georgia should, Georgia and LSU should be the two best schools in the SEC year in, year out. If you hold all these other things equal. They are Georgia. You know with Texas in there now.

Yes, because, okay, Georgia is in effect the only game in town in the state of Georgia. Yes, Georgia Tech is there, but you got to pass, you got to take calculus. You know what I'm saying? You got a whole football team that's good at math. Good luck with that. LSU is the only game in town there. where I always say the trick bag about Texas is that I've thought about more and more as years go on, is that Texas is now because of the money able to get guys from these other places.

But the truth is, the only players that geographically live close to the University of Texas are from Texas. It's the same way with Texas A&M. Now, they found some market inefficiencies. For example, no player from the state of Arizona wants to stay in Arizona. They all leave. It is the craziest thing. I don't know if this has changed in the last couple of years, but go pull up a rock.

Bejah Robinson, I want to say, went to high school in Tucson and wouldn't even go visit. Wow, man. At University of Arizona. You know what I mean? So, like, in Texas, you can really only recruit players from Texas,

and you're going to get some of them, right? Right. At LSU, you're basically getting every good player from Louisiana. And you can go a little bit over there and get some Texas boys. And you can go over there, over there and get some boys from Alabama and from Mississippi.

You see what I'm saying? Yeah. LSU is so spoiled that they were still mad at Joe McKnight. God rest his soul. You know, just because he had the nerve to turn them down and go to USC. And they are so spoiled that it makes you forget that they are a plus minus nine and a half win program. with a couple of blips. Man, I wish, I wish my, I wish my co-host, Van Lathen, was here.

So you could, so we could jump him together because I'd be telling him like, hey, man, LSU doesn't have a right to sit up here and talk to people, you know, with a lot of bass in their voice. Because when I was growing up, if Texas A&M beat LSU on a Saturday, it'd be like, okay, that's right. Yeah, yeah, they should be LSU. Like, nobody's, nobody, until Nick Saban showed up, nobody was scared of LASU. you anything like that.

It was, and say, but Nick Saban, Nick Saban is there Mac Brown, right? Mm-hmm. Is there Bobby Bowden? Is there Stellerberger, Jimmy Johnson?

Which is to say, hey, man, you see all these black dudes over here? Man. They might want to play for us. Bo. This is the one time we don't get along.

I'm gonna, I'm gonna, I have to ask you to come on to the show and have this fight with me, with Van, because I told him, I was like, in a manner of speaking,

Nick Saban sort of integrated to SEC, but certainly like the LSU. I'm not mean it literally, but I'm like, yo. Functionally. Yeah, functionally, like the number of guys, they started getting the people they were supposed to get. Like all the bad feelings that people had are the generations of people that had to go to Southern and Grambling instead of LSU.

Once LSU seemed like a viable option, they started going. And Nick Saban tapped into all that, right? I have talked to my good buddy, Marcus Spears, about this. And Marcus Spears was in that LSU freshman class of 2001. That's the first full saving class and the one that begins what we're talking about. And for those of you who don't know, Marcus Spears was like the number one tight end in America.

Like he was a serious. It was a tight end, by the way, too. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. He was a hooper too. Yeah, that's right. That's right. Like, he was a spectacular athlete. Like, that was the thing.

But he was that guy. And he is from Baton Rouge. he went to Southern University Lab High School, which is what it sounds like, the high school on the campus of Southern. And he told me, we sat in the old huddle room at the Seaport, and he was like, man, what I knew was Southern. I knew S.U.

Like the idea of going to LSU was not something that he immediately was like, hell yeah, that's what we about to do. That's not it. So if you go look at, look, even the saving error, it's like a plus minus 9.5 win, the less miles era, which we have to remember, was a lot longer than the saving era.

And good gracious, was that fun. I don't know what it was. We miss it, man. We miss it, man. Oh, yeah. But look, this is the Nick Sabin, I mean, the less miles run. Two loss, two loss, two loss, two loss, two loss, two loss, one loss, three loss, three loss, three loss.

That's like a plus or minus nine and a half. I mean, they won a national championship with two losses. Yeah, man. Yeah, that's right. With 2007, right? Yep. Yep. Yeah.

But they're like a plus nine and a half. Let me think of some other programs that I think generally speaking. Texas is like a plus minus nine and a half win program. That's the thing. See, this is what I'm saying. Everybody sort of gets it in their head that the great run that they had is a thing that is, should always be happening. But everybody out there, most schools with the exception of like Ohio State. And I guess I said I'm struggling to whether or not I should include Alabama in that.

because Alabama has had like great runs, but also when we were growing up, when we were talking about, like, when Alabama beat Miami in the national championship game, we're like, damn, I didn't know Alabama was good like that. Like it was sort of, it kind of came out of nowhere for our generation of people because we had not seen the Alabama

that everybody had been talking about from the 70s and stuff. Right. Now, so the thing is Alabama's had three runs, but it was like this one decade run, this one decade run, and this two decades run. Yeah, 20 years. Yeah, 20 years.

Yeah. Like, calling that a run feels like so. But again, we're going to find out. The thing is, Alabama has no built-in advantages, right? Right. So I think you and I would agree. The highest floor is at Ohio State. Absolutely.

Right. And that's why they're like anybody can do this. They're not that much in a rush to fire a coach. They don't sweat it too hard when it's time to hire a coach. The machine will produce. Right. Then there are these kind of high variant schools that have the potential for great highs, but also great lows.

And the one I'm thinking about in particular there is Auburn. Oh, my God. I was just about to say what you're going to say Auburn. Because that's exactly the school I think about. Yeah, right. Like they could be four and eight one year and they could be 12 and one the next. Yes, yes. Like Auburn is like that.

You get weird jobs that are like Florida, I contend. I think now at this point all three Florida schools, now that everybody knows that Florida has players, high ceiling but also a higher, I mean, a lower floor than you would expect, but also the ceiling has gotten tougher and tougher for any of those schools to achieve. Right? It's been over a decade since any of them won a national championship.

That's right. I mean, yes, they had the lock on the talent. And also, and I don't mean to diss Florida, but I feel like I have the right. I lived there for four years. Them college towns aren't as nice as people think they are. No. Like, Gainesville is not, you know. You could do worse.

When you're growing up, you think, oh, Florida, palm trees, beach, that is not what Gainesville or Tallahassee is, right? It is not. It is not. Now, Gainesville, I went to Gainesville. I gave a talk there earlier this year. And it's a little more, it's got a little more cracking than I expected. Tallahassee, look, man, South Georgia, North Florida, Lo Mismo.

Okay? Like, just, just let y'all know that. Now, that's part of what helped when Bobby was there because they could go get them boys in South Georgia. But, lo miso, I need you to understand. that lo mismo. They are to, I have had that happen to me before.

Why I see the state line? And I ain't even realize I made that flip. I mean, look, man, look, man. It's, um, it, the drive from Tampa to Tallahassee is one of the just most, God forbidding, just, you know, desolate, boring drives in the history of the, in the history of driving domestically. Like, it is really boring and bad. It is, it is a hard place to get to.

And when you get there, it ain't that special. But the one thing that they did kind of have, and, like, everybody. Florida A&M helps them overcome some of those issues as well. So that's an advantage they have. I just, okay. I just want to throw it out there. I am certain that that helped. But you and I both know one of the selling points that they use

in recruiting these boys, and it ain't what they got at Florida A&M. Well, everybody ain't Kendall Browns. you and I both know what they use as they sell them for. Oh, I know. I know. And it ain't what they got at Florida A&L. Yeah. That's fair. That's a bonus.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Like for those of you who was raised like that. Right. Yeah.

We can send you over there. Right. And we can make it, you know what? Let's take a break and come back before we get crack. crazy overheat. All right, we will get back to Joel Anderson in just a second, but first, Ryan, you got any draft king picks for the people? All right, yeah, Bo.

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All right, we are back with Joel Anderson, who just did. did one of those things. He says he doesn't do, but we cut that out of the show. Check him out at the Wranger tailgate show with Van Lathen. It is funny. You say you want me to come in there

and gang up on Van. You just be hating on whoever you do a show with. But I believe we talked about this. Maybe we didn't, but either way, I talked to somebody about this. I really do love the fact that Bill got two black dudes

and Tate Frazier. He'd be with y'all too. Talking about college football because they'd be acting like, we ain't on it. And you learned very quickly that that boy, is italic-sized on it.

Oh, man, I think the first team meeting I had with Van, and it was just like, yeah, well, you know, I watch, I got all the message boards. He's watching all 22 tape. And he was like, all right, are we going to, so, you know, one way that we can also learn the rosters, too, is by playing NCAA, you know, 25 or 26. And I was just like, I haven't played video games in 18 years. And he was like, oh, you know, just like the disappointment in his voice. She was like, oh, I guess you're not really serious about it.

And I was like, oh, no, man, I need to, like, get up on my, like, prep. Because he is, I mean, he really does take this very seriously. Like, I did. Hold on. We tried to record this episode yesterday when Joel, and Joel told us he could not record because he had to prep. Yeah, I had to. So he could keep up with Vann.

Yeah, man, Van don't joke around. Van's media diet is crazy because he'll be like, yo, I was reading this or I was listening to this. And I'm like, how do you, he's now starting watching a new show, the guild, you know, the Gilded Age, real housewives of the Gilded Age or something like that. I'm like, how do you have time to do all of that, to take in all this information? I just don't understand it. I go like, I kind of miss the days when I did this and I was that immersed, right?

Because one thing that people will talk about is as, I'll just use Stephen A. Smith as an example, right? more of a hypothetical, more using him as an avatar than a specific critique of anything about him, right? Right. But I think that you will see people who can make the argument that he does not follow sports as closely as he once did, okay? I cannot say specifically or definitively whether or not that's true. I can say with a pretty good guess that that's absolutely true because you have to go do more

stuff, right? Like you get into it and you start. by being immersed in the information, and then that then leads to more and more responsibilities, more meetings, more flights. Like, when I did the show on HBO, what I was shocked by was how much of my time was taken up by things that were not me working on the show.

Yeah. You know what I mean? Yeah. It was just like, yo, this is crazy. Managing all this other stuff around. Right, right. Like in your head, it didn't do a press availability and doing all this stuff.

But in my head, it was like, yo, all I'm going to do is just be knee deep in this show. And I was, but just not in the capacity. you know, that I thought I would be in. So, like, I remember when I worked local and when I worked for page two, where college stuff was my beat. Dude, I knew the recruiting.

I knew everybody's coordinators. Absolutely. Like, it's even harder now that's ever been because of the levels of player mobility. But I do miss that where I would just spend days. I just sit here and I just go all rivals. And I wouldn't even just start taking notes. But I would just pass time looking at this class, looking at that class, looking at this,

and just having it in my head so that one day I could pop up and talk about it. Bro, I would just read through this. Like, it took me like two weeks. It took me like a month. I ordered this. And it took me a month to finally get to it. Yeah, man. I have my Texas football down here.

I was just about to ask if you got Dave Campbell, Texas football. Yeah, I got it right here. And it still looks nice because I've not had as much time to read it as I would like. But yeah, man, it's just, yeah, I would love to be immersed and all that stuff too, but it just doesn't work like that. And plus, like, it used to be when I would be done with work, I kind of could chill. a little bit, but like, I'll probably work harder when I'm not at work than when I'm actually working.

So there is that. But to your point about Bill, man, you know, I'm really glad that Bill saw something in me and Van, and before I'd even got to the ringer, when you were saying, he's like, yo, I think a year ago, he was like, how would you think about doing a YouTube show with Van for college football? And I was like, hell yeah. Like, why wouldn't? And, and, and, and I think that that says something really good about Bill.

And I think partially it's because Bill isn't really a college football fan. He don't care about football. Like, yo, he knows who Arch Manon is and all that. But he don't give a shit about the stuff, the granular stuff like we do. But I think, if you allow me to make a generalization here, I think when white folks think of college football, they don't think of us unless we play in. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I've talked about this. Yeah.

Yeah. And for so many, it's because we're not really a part of their college experience no matter what. Like classes, dorms, Greek life, alumni. five-inch, we're not really there, right? So they don't come to think of us being at the tailgate. They don't think of us, you know, having a tradition at these schools. And that's kind of true because we, most of our affiliations or our fandoms with these, uh, powerful schools, that ain't got nothing to do with family. We didn't go, our family didn't go to another than them schools, you know? No. Well, like, you and I talk about this thing where I don't root for Texas

anymore, but because Joel struggles with coming up in new material. Sure, he don't root for Texas. You ain't, you ain't heard me say nothing at all close to rooting for Texas in five years. You're trying to be respectable. I get it. I appreciate you tucking it in, but that's fine. No, no, no. Like, for a moment, I need you to ride with me and understand where I'm covering from here, right? Like, it's just not the bag anymore. Joel gives me hell about rooting for Texas because Joel is more, is, is born in Texas, even though at his core, he from Arkansas. No, I don't, don't do that. At your core, at the core of who you are, don't do that. You from Arkansas. My mama don't even say she from Arkansas. She's from Arkansas.

That don't change what it is. Now do it. She's from West Monroe, Louisiana. Even better. Can't help what we're from. Shout out to Andrew Whitworth, by the way. Yeah, right. Can't help what we from.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. But anyway, I was not born in Texas. We moved to Texas when I was seven. So there's a bit of, it's easier for somebody like me to root for the University of Texas at my age because I'm not from the place, right? and my parents are not from the place. So there are things that you associate with that first and foremost,

like, yo, these are the races that are closest to us, that to me doesn't quite land because I grew up around Aggies. You know what I mean? Like, it doesn't land with me in that same way. I say that simply to say, we in the first real generation of black people rooting for the home team. Right. When it comes to these schools.

And being able to do so without any sort of like moral conflict or quandary. Now, you still got Mississippi where Jackson State with Dior, without Diyadh, is selling 40,000 seats. Yeah. Because, you know, a little part tide, you know what I mean? I mean, Ole Miss is a tough sell even today. I'm sorry. Can't do it. Yeah, I can't do it.

I don't know. If you say your Ole Miss fan and you black, I'm like, mm-hmm. Yo, look, bad, everybody want to love a crib. I understand that, but. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Can't do it. That's tough.

But, like, the idea of my daddy rooting for LSU. Yeah. Dude, I was in a bar in New Orleans. I forget how long ago it was. Man, I heard these two white men arguing about who, between two different players that definitely played before they had black people on the team. And they felt like they was too young to be doing that. You know what I'm saying?

Now, on this show, we have already talked about, Steve Van Buren was a running back, but he should have been a quarterback because somebody was passing. Right. You ever looked at a picture of Steve Van Buren? I don't think I haven't. And for those who don't know, Steve Van Buren was the all-time leading Russia in the NFL, I want to say before Jim Brown.

Steve Bambier playing for LSU in the 1940s. Yeah. Yeah, you're looking at him right now. I see that look on your face. Yeah, yeah. He said he was born in Honduras. Yeah, that's what I'm saying. How did he get through?

Yeah, man. How did they not, first of all, how did he have a little curl in me? That snitch on him to get him over to them. Look at that curve. He looks like, um, that's, Does he look like Stan Verrett? He's an Apalusus's all-star. Yeah. He's what I like to refer to them boys' ass.

He, uh, he wanted them. You know what I'm saying? But no, but what you say is true is that my point that I was making with that is that the culture of white colleges, to me, it's amazing how segregated it remains. Mm-hmm. Like from top to bottom. And when you look at those clips are like the student section at the games. Now, when I was at Carolina, I felt like black folks was going and doing it.

doing that stuff, right? But when I look, it'd be one black person that I know I wouldn't hang out with surrounded by a bunch of white folks that I know don't want me hanging out with them. Oh, look, man, I mean, why do you think those viral videos outside them sorority hot? Like, that is a message to white folks about what they think the college experience is like, you know, all the sorority girls dancing and all that stuff. And people got all mad about it, but it's just like, yo, like that actually is with their college experience. for a lot of them at those big state schools. It does not involve a lot of black people.

We are not a part of that experience. And so it makes, yeah, like, have you ever tailgated? I see, I've never tailgated it like a game like that. I have at Carolina, I have. Okay. I did it at UAPB. Okay, but that's it. I've never telegated.

Even at TCU, I've never done that. But like, that is not a world, and I'm in no disrespect to my alma mater, you know, but like that is not a world that I felt that, yeah, that I was, should be over it. So I did it at Carolina, and the people I was telegating with are a little bit different, my good buddy, Joy Powell, and this won't mean nothing to those of y'all who ain't from North Carolina, but joy from Fayetteville. So the crowd is going to be a little bit more of a hodgepodge of humanity.

Because that's how, that's how Fairville gets down. Is Fayetteville the Port Arthur of North Carolina? No. Kenston is the port author of North Carolina. Fairville got the base, though. Okay. Fayetteville, aka Fahenna. Yeah.

So, like, once you get to base, now we start, we mix it in some, some different stuff. Okay, okay, that makes it. When we started talking about that, Fayetteville, you remember my man Joe and Riley? Yeah, of course. Joe from Fayetteville. Oh, is he really?

Yeah. Okay, okay, okay. So, like, Pianville goes a little different. But no, the cultures are, it's so wild to me, the cultures are so segregated. And, like, to me, I always looked at the cast that went to the white school, I'm like, y'all better be out here hanging out with white people.

Otherwise, I don't really understand why you put yourself through this. I know, but man, you know, I just think a lot of parents, you know, I mean, you had the same thing. My parents went to HBCUs and while they had a good time, they thought they would deny something in terms of education. They just thought, you know, the white man's ice was colder, I guess. Yes. You know? And so they were like, they were adamant. My parents never let me go to school in my neighborhood or, or, you know, the college I wanted to go to, which I know you'd be clowning me.

But Morehouse was like my dream of school. You know, I grew up. That explains it. School days really put me, like, and I knew that Michigan was. School days, which was filmed at Clark Atlanta University primarily. Okay, my bad. Respect. Did you know that Spike Lee took all his mass courses at Clark College?

At Clark College, excuse me. I know that because you've mentioned it before. I was mentioning it until I'm blue in the face. I ain't a hater. I even told Spike that. And Spike was like, you know what? You're right. I need to talk about that more.

Okay. I mean, has he done it? But, I mean, look, I wanted to go to a black woman. Hold up. Did you see? Do you see? That's, just slip that hate in there. And they try to keep it moving. Has he done it?

And then just keep all moving. Like, they didn't even let it go nowhere. See, that's the thing about it. You try to be slick with it. I'm not even like, again, I feel like I'm going to have to put out a poll. Like, you know, do you think of me as a lover or a hater? Because I feel like there's people out there that think, that see my warmth, my fundamental warmth for humanity.

and my compassion. The one person who thinks you a lover don't love you enough to go so far as to listen to my pie just because you want it. I mean, hold on. She listens to this pie. Oh, tell her I said thank you.

Yeah, uh-huh. She'll listen to what I'm on it. You know, she'll listen to my football pot neither though, but that's okay. She watches it because I'm handsome. So just so we clear. She don't watch it when it's just you talk about your stuff

and when she knows me and you're going to be having substantive discourse. I was talking about. I was talking about you. She also watches The Tailgate, too, on YouTube. Oh, she's a fan of Van also. No, she's a fan of me. She's a fan of me.

She's a fan of me. She might like Van. I don't know. I haven't asked her about it. She did like Tate. She did think Tate was very nice. You know, a very nice white boy. And he did, and you know what?

Tate is cool. Like Van said, Tate got something like, like Van said, Tate got something where, you know. I guess that's in North Carolina. Tate went to Carolina, right? He went to Carolina, yeah. Yeah, Tate's good with my guy, Charlie Hume. Oh, yeah.

Who would be hilarious if he was on the pod with you guys because that would be like a sitcom. Oh, really? Oh, man. I love Charlie, but we are all, we are from different worlds that Charlie Hugh was from. Really? See, man, I don't know Charlie that well, so I got to.

Oh, money, Charlie. You probably heard him refer to as that on the Levitart show. That's Charlie Hugh. That's Charlie Hugh. Oh, okay, okay, okay. That's it. That's it. But yeah, no, man.

You know, yeah, I mean, I'm just, you know, because Van went to Southern. His father was in Southern, but he became an LSU fan. I just thought, I became, I never, I never looked at those games. With the Texas A&M, probably because I didn't have any proximity to it. I didn't realize Texas A&A was that close. But in the late 80s and 90s, I'm looking at Texas A&M.

And I'm like, they seem to have all the brothers. You know what I mean? Like, I was like, they had a black quarterback for people that don't know, Kyle Murray's daddy was cold. Like Kevin Murray was like a two-time Southwest Conference offensive player of the year. He probably should have played in the NFL. with those different times back then. And so I looked at them and I was like,

oh, U of H seems like, you know, close to home and whatever else. But like I looked at UT or SMU or Baylor, any of them other schools. And I'm like, oh, I don't, even looking at the crowd, looking at all that, that didn't look like anything that belonged to me. And so I'm much more related to like the HBCU environments and stuff like that. And yeah, I mean, obviously it's changed. I had to go to TCU and stuff changed.

But yeah, man, we just don't. that that those caught even even even even the schools that are allegedly integrated are not that integrated no no and and it's only going to get worse oh i mean dang going i mean it it seems like our presence will be suspect going yeah i don't know when it would be safe to talk about these things um the point that i always make about diversity any standpoint A, it's always come through some measure of force or necessity. And B, always for the express purpose of operating in service of white men. Right?

Like the move has never been because it's the right thing to do. If you go look at like the affirmative action paperwork for the lawsuits in the Supreme Court and stuff like that, the argument is that diversity is a noble goal if it is better for the campus at large, which is to say if it is better for the white people who are already there. Otherwise, nope, no thanks. Well, I mean, one of the most notorious desegregation stories in college football history is like, if you really think about it, it's really ignoble. And where Baron Bryant gets his ass kick by Sam Bam Cunningham at USC, and he's like, well, I got to get me some of those. It ain't like, well, I think it would be the best thing to do.

And of course, like, that story is possibly apocryphal. It's a problem. Well, they already had a brother on campus on a freshman team. Yeah, right. They already had already kind of started. But like even the stories we tell ourselves about like why school would want us is about, well, we got to compete because they get, they bring it in some now too. It ain't never because, oh, this would be enriching. We could all benefit from this.

And other people and other parts of our communities could benefit from integrating these institutions. Yeah, there's just always like you say, like, you know, we need you to come over here and help us with this. Yeah, I will say this, though, for a school like Alabama, right? So let's like, when you think about the schools that have been historically ahead of the integration curve, and the University of Texas, I mean, excuse me, excuse me, they were definitely not ahead of any integration curve. The University of Houston, got to do what you got to do. Right. Yeah.

Right? Like, this is the only chance we got. They were ahead of football and in basketball. In football, they were head in integration and a head in scheme. Right. And in basketball, kind of sort of ahead in scheme when the scheme was running joke, running joke. but at a time when people are afraid to run and jump, right? Right.

But like, Houston in football, they invented the veer, right? The invention of the veer is at Houston, the run and shoot in the late 80s, and the Arbrowse offense in the mid-2000s, right? Like, they've been at the forefront of three significant offensive paradigms in the sport, because you've got to do what you got to do. They've always had to innovate, right? Right, right, and their innovation, like Bobby Bowden, what was this great innovation? Why don't we get so many black guys to play 14?

I hear some of them can throw. Right. It took Miami a while to get around to that idea where that was also their innovation. What I do say, I appreciate, and I look at this with a school like Alabama, for example, and as much as we look at it as, man, you only came and got us because he needed us. And there's a deep down, we're not going to get out inwarded if that becomes the game. But Alabama did, in fact, decide that they would not get out inwarded and they were handsomely rewarded. Yeah, once they had to do it, they did it.

You know, it's another school this like that? That we ain't Oklahoma, man. Oh, Oklahoma's at the top of the way. Like, oh, what are we talking about here? We got to be serious about this if we're going to do this. Like, you got to think about this, right? I know that when my mother got to owe you in 1960, that they had already integrated to football team.

Now, keep in mind, my mama gets there in 1960, and she and the group that she worked with, the first order of business was to begin to desegregate North, right? So, like, let's not act like everything was sweet there. However, Texas, I think, still has the all-time, like, the lead in that series. But if you go look at the day that, oh, were you integrated? Yeah. The, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, it's

and they would have got, it's really, part of it is Oklahoma in general. What we were really talking about is Switzerland. Right. Twitter, as is off the case with white men of his particular ilk, was like, Who would love me, baby? And he was right. He was right. He was right.

I mean, that Cowboys dock, I know you weren't a huge fan. But one of the things... Oh, that was good. Yeah. And one of the things that really comes through is that, like, in spite of whatever his political choices are now, he seems to care about his players and his players. really seem to care about him. Like he seemed like he was fundamentally a good dude, right?

Yes. Yeah. And so people could do that. I think in late life what happened to Switzerland is, and I think that this happens to a lot of guys, you see it happen to a lot of white liberals at points. Deep down, man, they just like us. They want these white people to love them.

You know what I mean? That's right. Right. Like they don't ever want to get too far afield. Okay, I'll put a better example of this. is bourgeois black people who deep down inside still want the hood to love. Yeah. Right?

And when they come and they get around those dudes, I don't know if I ever told you about the time that I met Roland Friar. It was very clear. Oh, this is like 20 years ago. It's an amazing story for another day. Okay. And it became very clear to me he wanted the hood to love him. And then I went to a dinner with him where he wasn't with the hood.

and, well, let's just say he sounded a little bit different, right? Yeah. He tried to tell you said, I grew up with my grandmama, you know, and I just, I just want to do this for black people, right? You know, but like deep down, them cats all still want us to love them and when they're put in those situations. And a cat like Barry Switzer is the same. We're Barry Switzer out here hanging with us,

and we all know his story. His daddy was the bootleg of living on the black side of town, kicking him with black women. Everybody knew all those things. But there's a part of him that always wanted the acceptance. of these other people. Right. It's really funny.

You say that in the same week that this Alfonso Ribeiro clip of him at the tunnel is going viral because it's just like, oh, what, Alfonso's from New York though, you know? But I can't tell what's what?

Yeah. And if you haven't seen this clip, if you remember the episode of the Fresh Prince where Will left Carlton and Compton and he came back and he had on a du rag and a silk shirt.

Yes. And Will told him he looked like a pirate. Yeah, uh-huh. Well, that version of Carlton was at the tunnel in New York, and he just turned on a whole new vibe. It was a lot closer to the Alfonso from, what's it called? Silver spoons? Silver spoons.

Yeah. The break dance at Alfonso. The funny thing, too, is he still came in like a Carlton uniform. Like, he was in the tunnel in his car. It wasn't like he had street, you know, street wear on. Oh, my God. I feel bad for him because I think he probably just didn't know that's where they was going that night.

First of all, that's how you know which was the real maybe? Right. I mean, by the time that happened to be in Pablo. Uh-uh. Somebody invited me and Pablo to some party in, I want to call it 2017, right? And I'm like, cool, let's roll. But I remember my good buddy, Ken Gibbs told me that when you moved to New York, it takes you two years to get your gear right.

And I didn't really understand what that meant. But then you live here and you get it. Like, if you're going to be a type that goes to stuff, you've got to have so much gear. Because there's so many things, right? Right. And so I did not have adequate gear, but I just, I needed to look like I had something. And so I had on a buttoned up shirt and like an argyle pullover sweater or something.

Because I just thought it was like a reception of some sorts. Yeah. But I didn't realize it was fashion week. Oh, man. And so what made it worse is not simply that I was not dressed properly for the occasion, is that I was clearly trying to dress for something. Oh, yeah. Right?

I clearly, to the naked eye, thought I looked cool. when I walked in the spot. And then a photographer from the New York Times was like, yo, can we get a picture of you guys? Oh, man. And they were like, can we get a quote? And I said, yes, I wish I had known it was Fashion Week before I picked out my clothes.

That was what I had picked. And Pablo, like, Pablo didn't look like necessarily cooler than me, but he did look like he had a style going. Yeah. Right? Like, he looked like he had his own thing going. Man. I looked like it was lunch,

for sale. You were like, you were the, I ain't fresh guy. You know what I'm not fresh? Yeah, that was exactly it. And so I felt like I knew that's what happened to Carlton. On that case, he went somewhere where he had to be dressed up as Carlton. And then it was like, yo, you try to go to the tunnel. He's like, I got to change clothes. Man, you good? No, man. Carlton. No, man. When I was, when I moved to New York when I was 35 when I had to work at the new bus feed. And so I've been wearing clothes. I considered before this, I've been living in Tampa and Shreveport. Okay. Those are the places I lived. Then I moved to New York. at 35, I'm broke.

And I remember I coming into work. And my boss, shout out Shoney Hilton, man. Shoney is great. And she was just like, you know, she said something about my clothes looking kind of dusty. And I was like, oh, man, I look, I look like raggedy up here. Like these clothes are not, like, these clothes don't hit. Like, if I have a crease in my pants, like, people are going to make fun of me. Yes, yes.

You know? The other night, I got invited to something. that was cocktail attire. And I had planned to go, and I fell asleep before I could go, unfortunately. Old. Like, it was a Wednesday night, baby. But anyway, I was really struggling with that cocktail attire

because, you know, after I put on a little bit more weight, I had those things, but now they don't fit, and I never re-uped them because that stuff don't be coming up no more. And then I was just like, I don't have adequate gear. And it took me back to the days of what you was talking about. It's like, oh, my gear is simply not up to, snuff. Yeah, man. You know, you just be like going out and buying clothes. I'm not like,

there was a time of my life when I used to love to go out and buy clothes. I'm like, yeah, I'm going to get that. I'm going to put this on. I don't want to do that no more. You know, I just don't, I don't have that kind of energy. And I don't want, if you tell me I got to dress up to go someplace too, I would probably be like, I'm probably not going to go to. Yeah, well, lucky for you, buddy, you're married and therefore it doesn't like the, the urgency around such matters. This is fair. It's a little, it's a little different. I got to, I got to figure something out. I want to do one last college football. thing before we go, because, you know, we wound up going places.

It's all good, though. Is the you back? So I was having this conversation with somebody. So I think Miami is really good. They might have the best defensive player in the country. Like, Ruben Bain seems like he would have been right at home on them old Cain's teams. Didn't his daddy play for him, right? That's right. That's right. That's right. He's Tobin's son.

That's right. I think that's right. I think that's right. But so I think the thing is, is when people talk about is Miami back, they don't mean it's Miami good. They mean, how can I say this? By the way, he's, he's Ruben Bain Jr. So he's a nephew at best. Oh, definitely. Okay. All right.

It's in him. Like, you can see that the cane is in him. Like, he's got the whole, you know, Alvin Mack kind of personality about the name. Yes. But when people are talking about is the U back, I'm still trying to figure out. I'm just going to say it and y'all bleep it out if I need to. Them teams were niggerish, Doug.

You know what I'm saying? And like, that's what I like. When I'm thinking of you and all that fun stuff, I'm thinking of, you know, Randall Hill running all the way through the Cotton Bowl tunnel. I'm thinking of Michael Irving getting up dancing on you and all that stuff and the, you know, elaborate hand celebrations. Do you think of the old one Keynes, though,

because they did not have that personality? So that is interesting. But, you know, they still kind of had a little bit of an edge to. I remember the seventh floor crew and the... Well, that was there. That was the later guys, but yeah. The 2003 team. I don't, you know, I think maybe they were still living off the fumes of that.

And because they were so great, like they were in arguably amazing and they were so talented that it felt like they were sort of like heirs to that era. But no, I don't, I don't think, I didn't love them in the same way. And you can never love a sport or a team in the way that you can never love a sport or team in the way that you do when you're 11 or 12 years old. And that's what Miami was great. And that left the thing. But is that,

do you think of them as back with just because they're good? Well, no, because being there, it's kind of like when people say it's Texas back. I'm like, oh, they're going to win 10 games, nine years in a row. Right? Like is that like, is that like, you're not going to, you're not going to establish that in a year.

Like Texas is as good as they were last year. Right. That is not an establishment of batteness. Though the roster looks, the roster looks like those MAC rosters. And let's not get a twist. Those MAC rosters were like monstrous. Oh, yeah, absolutely.

Earl Tyler. What I find interesting about Christobal coaching that team is that he is like the forgotten sion of Sabin because he's not in the SEC, you know, so we don't think of him in the ways that you think about Kirby or even Jimbo where Florida State was at SEC school, not in the SEC, right?

But Kirby, Will Must Chip, Lang Kiffin, you know, we can rattle off more like these. Mel Tucker. Yeah, there's that. You know, but, but, but the Sabin guys, right? What makes it interesting for me is that Christobal is a cane, first of all.

Yes. But he is absolutely a saving guy, which is Compton and Long Beach together, now you know you're in trouble, right? You are putting together two of the most dominating traditions that you've had, right? And so where Mario, the other difference between Mario, or the big difference to me,

between Mario and the saving guys is, they are known much more for being tactful. that Mario is. And that is not what Mario's giving you. But Mario is getting them boys and they go line up. And they got some access to some cash. And look, the Miami football program has never been based on out scheming you. No. We're going to get really good players and we're going to rush four and we're going to drop seven and we're going to run the ball a lot. And then we're going to throw it when we need to because our receivers are faster, but we're going to get you that way. So you take a great offensive line coach.

and put them in the fastest state in the country, and you have a chance to really make something happen. Yeah, that's the thing. I mean, that's the thing about Miami is that even right now, they're great along the lines. I bet like it's just kind of funny for Carson Beck to have been in Georgia, which is we think of like one of the bad, you know,

one of the most badass programs of recent vintage, but he was running for his life last year and not looking good and didn't really have anybody to throw to that he was excited about. And now he goes down to Miami. And he's like, oh, this is what it's like to have, little bit more space back here. You know, I got a little bit more time back here. And that's because that's what Mario is all about building up those offensive. They are not, they are not going to be soft. They may be stupid. They may make mistakes.

Don't. Mario, Mario, Mario be doing things. He played, he played for a 40 plus yard field goal against Notre Dame in that game. And I'm just like, you won the game, cool, but you thought that made sense to put the game on the foot of a guy that was a fairly new kicker. And it was like a 40 plus yard kick, that didn't make any sense to me. So they may do dumb stuff and time management stuff and they may drop a game. But yeah, like, they're going to be tough as shit. Like, they're going to have the boys out there, for real.

And look, man, the ACC will give you some warm up competition before you come out, you know, to play the games. But in the end, it's still a really good place to get players. Oh, man, yeah. You know, and it's not what it was when nobody had figured out that they had the players, right? and they just had a complete lockdown of the area and an ability to go get the guys they needed from out of state.

Having a Down University of Texas, which is always helpful in helping you. A lot of that run, like the late 80s, early 90s, down Texas, down OU. Right. So now you could go get down's boys. Yeah, like you could go get, get, what's his name? Jesse Armstrongstead, for example, right?

I think Kevin Williams is, I'm not mistaken, was another one of those. but you could go get those guys. Now everybody got in there. Like they're still doing, they were still doing great business recruiting South Florida. Yeah. You just got to get a little bit more than that.

Yeah, I mean, now you got to do that because everybody takes South Florida kids. I mean, I remember Amari Cooper going up to Alabama stuff like that. Well, that was the thing Saban was going down there. He's like, oh. Jerry Judy. Yeah, he's like, oh, I know they down here. The thing about Miami that is tough is that they just don't have the same pageantry, the none of the stuff.

Like, if you go to a game and, LSU or you go to a game at Alabama or Auburn and then you go to a game down there in Miami, you know, it's just going to, it's just not going to feel the same. And so I bet if you want, you know what? So when I was in Tampa, I covered a kid named Vernon Hargreaves. If you remember Vernon. He was the best high school player. Right. His daddy was a coach for those, Miami. He was a linebacker's coach, I think, for Miami during that Andre Johnson and Ed Reed run. And so he wanted to go to Miami, Vernon Hargreaves. And he was just like, man, when I went down there, it looked like it did when I was growing up.

Like he used to say, all the facilities were old and they didn't have everything. And he's like, I just couldn't go down there. And so, yeah, man. That's because they would like to be good, but they ain't want to be good. Right. Right. But that also happens, those schools that have a built-in advantage. New York Carolina basketball has suffered this fate multiple times.

Yeah. They're like, yo, people grow up wanting to come here, right? They commit before they get here. Why do we need to do this? And then you look up one day and it's like, wow, this carpet's really old. And then you wind up having to like turn everything open. And I was the same thing with Miami. They're like, what are you talking about?

These boys just want to stay home. Yeah, they won't come to here. Right. And then they also reached a point where they're like, no, actually people trying to get the hell out of here, dog. Like it's a little bit like Brian Pater is a, you know, like those sorts of stories. I don't think they did Miami any favors. Absolutely. Yeah, it looked a little, just a little, like, grim and dangerous.

down there, right? Because they had another guy that got, they had another kid that got killed on that team back in the 90s, right? Like Ray Lewis era, they had like, yeah, man. Here's the thing, man, if you was from, you know what I'm saying? Yeah. If you're from there. Yeah.

Whether you should stay or whether you should go, is this a very interesting question depending upon who you are and what your reasons are, right? But like, take New York City, for example, these kids are using basketball not to stay. Right. Yeah. Well, they're trying to get down to, Atlanta.

Remember when they try to get anywhere. Yeah, out of that town. Anywhere but to crib, you know? So, no, I think that program is so interesting. And now let's see where it is because Mario is not a cane by personality per se, but he's of it, right? And I will say this, the last thing I'll say about this before, you know, we got to give Joel back his time.

When the players looked like they was about to set it off in 2020, uh, against the colleges and all that, I wound up, on the phone call with Javon Holland, who now plays for the New York Giants. He played for Oregon. Crystal Ball was the coach at Oregon at the time. And look, man, Holland was a dude that had, like, he was a ringleader, this sort of thing.

The Malcolm X posted on the wall, all of that stuff, right? Which may not seem to be the case. He real zoomy when you look at him, right? But, like, I was so impressed with Holland in that interview that any time something good happens to him to this day, I'll send him a text. Oh, that's what's like, hey, man. I see, you know, I see what you're doing, right?

Because look, man, that dude said in 2020, when they was looking like they was going to set it off, he was like, I know exactly what I'm stepping into. And if this cost me, whatever, I did it for the right reasons. That's somebody saying that at 21 years old. I like that, man, that's a stand-up dude. That's a stand-up dude. And that stand-up dude could not have loved Mario Cristobal more. Really? Okay. In a really sincere, profound way. Like, he had an admiration for the fact that Christopher didn't necessarily agree with everything that he was saying about how he wanted. wanted to handle that situation, but the way he listened and entertained everything that everybody had to say in that time. Like, Christabal, from that, I came away from that feeling like, he's what you want a college coach to be, you know, as in terms of leader of men, molder of men type of guy, right? I just don't know, you know, if he can coach, coach.

Right. It might not even matter. And, you know, I mean, I guess that's part of the legacy of being part of those Kings teams. You have to learn, man. Like, sometimes when those guys were in the locker room and you exposed to all these guys and you in the game, games that they're in and the experiences they're in. Like Mario probably picked up a lot living with those dudes. And so, yeah, how could that not impact him when he has to get to coach those guys later, right? Right.

Like, that's the- Like Kirby, you know? Look, look how Kirby can talk to them boys, man. Kirby was in the DB room. Yeah, man, yeah. You gotta remember. Kirby, was in there. I think he left before this, but like Kirby in there with champ.

Yeah, man. I mean, you got it, you're going to have to learn some things when you're in those rooms, man. You learn how to talk and move in certain kind of rooms, man. And look, Kirby played, right? He was, was a good player. I don't know if he was all SEC, but he was like, you know, really. Was he all SEC? Yeah, he was a very good college football player, man.

Yeah, Kirby was a good player. Will Mustchamp. It didn't seem like it, but he clearly knows some things about talking to these boys. Yeah, man. Yeah, man. I mean, look, man. I mean, Nick Sabin, I mean, it was a different era. But Nick Saban is a DP coach, man.

Yeah. You know, and it gives you a chance. That's why you saw Nick Saban doing line dancing in people's homes and looked like he do all the steps. Like, he didn't know how much to walk him through it. I'll tell you right now, obviously, we talked about this on here before. He knows the election slide. He know the bus stop.

He know the haul of him shuffle. You know the Chachai slide. You ain't sneaking nothing past Nick. Oh, he's seen it all. He's seen it all. And Ryan hit it correctly. Yeah, Kirby Smart is Senator Patent Matt. And Kirby Smart was as a junior.

second team all SEC as a senior first team. See? All the SEC. I knew it was good, man. Yeah. I mean, Kirby could talk that pregame speech, man, I guess it was before Florida. I was like, man, that shit got me hype.

He got me want to go out there and run into something, you know? Yeah. Hey, man. He got it done. But look, that is Joel Anderson, who probably a two, maybe, on his capability of hating and what he did not do. You know what I'm saying? You was in a good place today.

I appreciate you for that. I tried to do the right thing. We had to restart a few times, but that's okay. Always trying something, man. Check out the Ranger Tailgate show with Joe Anderson, Van Lathen, and Tate Frazier. Right? I feel like I got to have Tate on the show at some point. Otherwise, they're going to think I'm discriminating.

We could bring Tate on with us. Maybe we could do it that way, too. I ain't going to lie. Your co-side on him is going a long way. I like Tate. He's good dude, man. That's good to know. That's good to know because it's going a long way.

That last name, last name combination. You know what I'm saying? Yeah, yeah. I never know what to do with that. Yeah, he got, like Van said, he got a little shit to him, man. It's all good. Okay. Okay. That's good to know.

Brother, I appreciate you. Always, brother. Anytime. All right. Now, ladies and gentlemen, thanks so much for joining us here on the right time. We do this here three times a week. Ryan Brumley handling everything behind the scenes. Thank you, sir.

Remember, follow the right time. Subscribe, like, rate us, review us. Give us five stars. The four stars I'm inclined to believe you are a hater. We'll talk to you guys in a couple of days. Take it easy.